Ron Webb from Tywyn, who took these photos, explains: "During December the heavy seas and winds exposed the pre-historic submerged forest and peat beds on the beach to the south of the prom.
"Two large areas were exposed each side of the land drain water fall pipe. The site is rarely exposed to this extent."
your comments
Ian from Tywyn
You can see heavy wheel marks on some of the peat workings which were probably made by the heavy tracks of DUKW's and military vehicles stationed in Tywyn during the war and before.
Fri Aug 7 11:51:36 2009
Gwyn Jones from Conwy, now in London
An excellent posting, with good photos proving what many people of but were laughed off by the 'experts' - for decades. No surprise either that it has generated such an intelligent enthusiastic discussion. Like Gareth Jones, I'm from Conwy and grew up (60 years ago) playing at low tide on the submerged forest's tree-stumps at Morfa Gonwy.It's very much about 'Cantref'r Gwaelod' - 'the settlments on the bottom of the sea'. Your university student researcher is spot-on bringing up climate change, for since the great two-mile thick ice-sheets over Britain melted from 10,000 years ago, the average sea-levels around Britain have risen by at least 400 foot, turning Britain into an island where previously there was no North Sea/English Channel as we know today - and animal-herds and humans migrated/walked across from mainland Europe. 5,000 complete Mammoth skeletons have been found in the North Sea floor gravels by just one gravel-dredging multinational.Natural, as opposed to fossil-fuel corporation-driven global warming of today, has happened repeatedly in history and land movements vary its impact on sea-levels at different coastal regions. It's not just Cardigan Bay, West Mon, Conwy, Pembroke & S Wales that have vast submerged forests - and more - in the seas facing their sea-fronts. Research has shown details of the same 'drowned lands' in the Solent off the Isle of Wight and a once extensive land-shelf around all the Isles of Scilly (which used to be one island). The sea-level rise threatens us all today (so that a few oil-billionaires can stop renewable solar/tidal power replacing the obviously planet-destroying fossil-fuel energy/power systems) and we should take note of what the 'experts' laughed at for decades: Cantref Gwaelod. It was passed on to us by oral tradition over generations - great uncles and aunties in my case in Conwy - to explain a childish sounding song: 'Clychau AberDyfi' - the Bells of Aberdovey - mysterious bell sounds said to be heard from the bottom of the sea at low tide. There's no mention of bells in the oral memory I heard, but a very definite at least '16 sunken settlements, drowned when the sea-level rose'. Stupid myths about a drunken dyke-keeper are just concocted by the C of E/W. It was globally warmed sea-level rise that led to the building of the half dozen huge dykes like Sarn Cynfelin, Badrig etc reaching upto 14 miles out into Cardigan Bay - which was once a fertile agricultural plain populated by farming humans after the Neolithic turn to settled agriculture instead of hunter-gatherer society. A few young academics are now rejecting the top professors' contempt for this oral memory as the scale of the submerged once lived on, worked, farmed extensive lands becomes more and more apparent.
Mon Jul 20 16:13:02 2009
Gwyn Jones from Conwy, now in London
Dear Ron Webb, An excellent posting, with good photos proving what many people of but were laughed off by the 'experts' - for decades!
No surprise either that it has generated such an intelligent enthusiastic discussion. Like Gareth Jones, I'm from Conwy and grew up (60 years ago!) playing at low tide on the submerged forest's tree-stumps ar Morfa Gonwy. For, in response to Anne-Marie, yes it's VERY much about 'Cantref'r Gwaelod' - 'the settlments on the bottom of the sea'.
Your university student researcher is spot-on bringing up climate change, for since the great 2-mile thick ice-sheets over Britain melted from 10,000 years ago, the average sea-levels around Britain have risen by at least 400 foot, turning Britain into an island where previously there was no North SEa/English Channel as we know today - and animal-herds and humans migrated/walked across from mainland Europe. 5,000 complete Mammoth skeletons have been found in the North Sea floor gravels by just one Gravel-dredging multinational.Natural, as opposed to the Oil-/Gas/fossil-fuel corporation-driven Global warming of today, has happened repeatedly in history,%! 20and land-movements vary its impact on sea-levels! at different coastal regions.
Mon Jul 6 09:39:49 2009
Julia from Tywyn
Please let me know if any of the peat formations locally are revealed at present.
Fri May 15 14:11:10 2009
Chris Willans Kidderminster
With regard to the peat cuttings, they were apparently cut for fuel to heat the Corbett Estate. That's one theory I have heard. The trees are old pine and some oak are lying there too. I took the opportunity to look at these a few times during low tides when I lived in Tywyn. Hope I have been of some help.
Thu Jan 17 09:17:47 2008
Wendy Whitby
My friend Jane and I posed this question to the Making History programme on Tuesday 24th April. I believe it can be heard on the web site. We were slightly disappointed by the answers and would have liked more info on who cut the peat, what happened in the years before that and when the sea covered it up. We wondered if the archaeologist could pass on any more information. We too were amazed that more interest has not been taken in this site.
Wed Apr 25 09:15:43 2007
The Jones family from Manchester
We visited the exposed peat on the 9th April 2007 and were fasinated by it. We must have speat 3 hours walking over it and studing it. It looked to us as if it had been cut/worked at some point in the past. We assumed it was 'peat digging' for fuel. Does anyone know when it was laste worked and by who? It must have been worked and has since been covered up. Ian
Tue Apr 10 11:05:46 2007
Lee
I am doing a study for university at tywyn beach, looking at sea level change and if the defences in places will be adequate with global warming and rising sea levels. I shall focus some of my work on the peat bogs and will let you know what conclusions i come to about them. I need some basic info on the beach, though, which i cannot find on the internet or our libary. if anyone knows the length of the beach and how many groynes are in place it would be much appreciated.
Mon Mar 26 10:40:42 2007
daibech TYWYN
having lived in tywyn all my life ,we used to play in the peat rooms that were all over penllyn side of the beach. people should put there pictures on Flickr so that othere people can see them ,i have some on there of tywyn,my flickr nickname is daibech27
Mon Mar 19 10:52:52 2007
Ron Webb Tywyn
The storm during the last days of Jan. have revealed even more of the peat workings and forestry on the beach. The exposed site must run for more than a mile on the south side of the Prom, towards Aberdovey. Some of the peat 'cut-aways' stand over one metre above the sand and appear to be on a clay base. Surely there is someone who knows about this interesting prehistoric forest and peat workings. If it was in any other part of Britain there would be direction signs and more publicity I'm sure.
Tue Feb 6 09:33:03 2007
Anne-Marie, Tywyn
I have been interested in Tywyn beach for the last 3 year and have noticed the extent in which these peat cuttings have changed. I too think the cut outs look as though at one time they could have been buildings. I have done research but have not found anything mentioning the beach at all. I also wonder why the "Coast" prgramme on BBC2 last year was more interested in the submerged forest at Ynyslas than Tywyn. I have photos of the changes over the last 3 year but am not clever enough to put them on the internet. If someone could tell me how to do it that would be great! So does anyone know what these cuttings and trees are? Is it anything to do with the legend of Cantre'r Gwaelod?
Wed Jan 24 12:37:38 2007
Ken Wright Tywyn
Thank you for explaining this strange sight. Ron, you have produced a very interesting set of photographs and answered my questions.
Thu Jan 11 09:55:51 2007
Gareth Jones
I am from Conwy. You can see similar on the Conwy Morfa, just north of the golf links by the old shooting butts. The root systems from some fairly large looking trees are still there in the mud at low tide. You can also do some anique prospecting. There are numerous "rubbish" artifacts there at low tide which were dumped by the military between 1914 and 18, when they were based there for weapons training.
Not very environmently friendly, but you can find jars, bottles and metal goods there.
The forest must have been covered by the sea at the same time as Llys Helyg, a building (Bishop's palace?)which stood to the west of the Orme between West Shore and Creigiau'r Diawl.
Thu Jan 11 09:55:29 2007
Mel Erskine-Richmond - Sydney, Australia
Regarding the Tywyn Underwater 'Forest', it looks as if at least two of these remarkable photos show clear indications of rectangular formations -- ie. Photos 1 & 4. Perhaps there has been a log-cut walkway, and a few buildings as well. It would be helpful if the photographer would provide details with each of his photos. If he would like others to add comments to each of the photos, it might work to put this collection onto Flickr which is now a vast global Encyclopedia focii for photographers and commentators! This collection from Rob Webb deserves closer examination and comment. Thank you so much! for bringing it to our attention. Melcir
Thu Jan 11 09:54:23 2007
