We came for a weekend, and stayed in the Dee for 22 years
My earliest memories of living at the Dee Inn, Flint, are of a gas lamp situated on the corner of Sherratts Shop where the TSB Bank now stands, writes Charles Ley. Its warm glow into the bedroom was a source of comfort until the lamplighter came to put it out. Sherratts was a grocers and provisions shop, the front facing Trewlawny Square, but down the side (lower Sydney Street) he sold second hand furniture. Lower down there was a paint and decorators shop known locally as 'Jones Stink'.
Noises were very familiar. Steam trains, some stopping, and other express trains going through the station like a roaring lion. Men going to work in
Courtaulds wearing clogs. Another memory is of other children shouting to their mothers in the 'back room' for pennies so they could go for chips, probably the only meal of the day.
I attended the Muspratt Church School in Chester Road, and I can recall reciting the times tables, and the Ten Commandments, Miss Collier was head teacher. Mirrors advertised Lifebuoy Toilet Soap in the cloakroom. My grandfather would take me, calling at a sweet shop on the way.
In the 1930s another brother and sister were born, making a total of 10 of us living in very cramped conditions. I was born in Chester in February 1929. My grandparents had taken the tenancy of the Dee Inn earlier in the year.
We were invited to spend Easter weekend with them - and never left. Mum, dad, myself, two brothers and a sister. My grandparents were in their 60s and admitted during the weekend that they could not cope on their own and, having sunk all their savings into the Dee Inn, were worried about their future. My father, as their only child, felt he had no option but to give up his job as a commercial traveller with Dixon's the Seed Merchants, Chester, and we moved to Flint to help to run the Dee.
We lived in what can only be described as a back kitchen. My mother cooked on a Triplex Grate guarded by a fender and the top of a gas stove. Food preparation was done on a table, and the draining board. There were no easy chairs to sit upon, and to go to bed we had to go through the public bar.
The bedrooms were filled with the foulest tobacco smoke. You put off going to the toilet because of having to trip through the bar. How my mother coped with a family of 10 and helped in the business till late at night six days a week I don't know, but we had the best mum and dad and grandparents it was possible to have.
The bedrooms from the Dee were a great vantage point from which to observe the services at the cenotaph on Armistice Day. The dignity of the occasion was something that has never left me. It was also great to observe carnivals and the Whit parade. Lorries all dressed up, carrying queens and their retinues. Flint had plenty of characters on parade.
All of us had jobs to do, no excuses allowed. My father used to buy railway sleepers, we had to saw them into six inch blocks and chop them into sticks, enough to fill a 36 gallon barrel. There were five or six fires a day to be lit. Windows to be cleaned, cellar floors to be swilled, pumps pulled through, and shelves to be stacked. Other jobs were to put the cinders from the fires through a riddle.
We also kept chickens, and rabbits in the back, and they had to be cleaned out. They proved a useful supplement to the stew pot, especially during the war years. We used to bottle our own sherry, port and rum during the run up to Christmas, and this called for real team work. It was a mini production line; one to wash the bottles, one to fill them, another to cork, one to put the tin foil tops on, yet another to put the labels on, and yet another to wipe and polish the bottles.
Another job was to deliver cases of beer generally to families who had suffered bereavements, but firstly we had to borrow a heavy truck from the railway station. Only then were we allowed out to play. I played with the rector's son in the Old Rectory in Sydney Street. It was an old building with lots of out houses and stables. It was a real adventure playground.
As a young boy, I can remember the men in the bar talking about the dreadful conditions they worked under in Courtaulds, showing me coins that had changed colour. I also remember them going on strike, and the dole queues at the Labour Exchange in Swan Street. Poverty was all around to see.
Both my father and grandfather had been professional rose growers, and their expertise was very often called upon to judge shows, I can remember shows being held in the Dee, there was very keen competition among customers. Allotments and gardens were very popular in those days. Men had to provide vegetables, for their growing families. My grandfather was in big demand to graft roses on to briars taken out of hedgerows and to graft apples onto grab apple trees.
My grandfather's brother had served in the Zulu wars in Africa, and brought back souvenirs of his time there. They were displayed in the bar; a Leopard skin tom tom, a spear complete with notches and human teeth and an old musket. What spirit of adventure they conjured up in a young boy's mind.
I can remember old ladies in shawls and cloth caps, smoking their clay pipes. My father would not allow women in the bar, only in the back room. As the evening wore on singing became a feature, Nellie Dean, Sospan Bach, Run Rabbit Run, and all the old songs from the First War were rendered with great gusto.
Best Mild was the popular drink of the day. No one drank a lot of spirits, too expensive for the average working man. I have no recollection of bad language being used, it simply would not have been allowed.
There was very little trouble in the Dee, my father was very strict and, having served in the Grenadier Guards during the First World War, was not a man to be trifled with. However one incident I recall was a policeman having his helmet knocked off, and it rolling across the street like a hard boiled egg. Needless to say that customer was banned for life. The police would call very often at closing time, 10pm to make sure no customers had been served after coming off the afternoon shift.
We had a radio. I remember singing the popular songs of the day, including one about Mussolini, 'Will you come to Abyssinia, will you come'. Bi-planes flew from Sealand aerodrome, and droned like big bees in the sky. We waved to the pilots in the hope they could see us.
The war came in 1939, and air raids began in 1940. I can recall the first one. My mother shepherding us into the cellar, making sure we all had our gas masks. We sat on deckchairs for hours. My grandfather, however, refused to come down, saying if he was to die, he would prefer to die in bed!
The war brought shortages of food and clothing, it has been a family joke ever since that the first up in the morning was best dressed, and had socks on that had not been darned.
Times were hard but a different attitude prevailed. We were all in it together. Work became plentiful, and many families had fathers and sons called up for active service. My own father became a firewatcher and, after a 14 hour day, would spend the night fire watching.
Beer became short, but the pub had to remain open to the public. Five 36 gallon barrels would often be sold in one night.
VE Day stands out in my memory; dancing in the streets, and every one rejoicing, the Dee was so packed you could not get up the stairs to go to the bathroom.
Looking back, we came for a weekend, and stayed in the Dee for 22 years. My parents worked their socks off to provide for their six children with very little return for themselves. What they did provide us with was a happy, loving childhood.
your comments
Dave Ledward
Charles Ley. Very interesting, your comments on the shop at 3, Chester St being run by two sisters as a jewellers back during WW2. My salon - Chiq Hair Studio - has now moved from that site to Church St but I'll always have fond memories of the little shop next to the Dee, how it must have seen some changes over the years.
Mon Mar 9 10:06:39 2009
Brian Leighton, Flint
Hey, anyone remember Ned Bowen? He used to do the cellar in the Dee in the '60s up until he died. He used to open up as he used to sleep on the benches. Good old Ned.
Fri Jan 30 09:47:13 2009
Vicky Perfect
Hi Irene. I remember your family. I was born in 185 Chester Road, my mother was Prudy Aldridge (Jones) and my father was Frank (Sandy) Aldridge. Yes we did not have much when we were growing up but we had love in abundance and encouragement from our parents to do well, they were tough times but happy.
Thu Jan 29 10:04:33 2009
Emma Morgan
Reply to Gaynor Simpson's comments, I think the lady you're talking about was my gt gt grandmother. My mother spotted the post and said that was Granny Sarah Gunther all over. Would you have any photos or more memories to help with my family history?
Tue Nov 11 08:13:17 2008
Gaynor Simpson
I was born in Mumforth St in 1943. I remember a Mrs Gunther who smoked a pipe and wore a flat cap and shawl. We would have to walk past her house and I was fascinated by her as she was so different from my nain.
Tue Nov 4 08:11:28 2008
Irene Kett-Riley, Norfolk
Enjoyed reading and looking at the old photagraphs of Flint, it brought back so many memories to me. I was born in Flint in 1942 at 207 Chester Rd. I wish I could relive those times again. Life was tough, no one had anything but people were real people, there was always someone there for you and I shall never forget the kindness shown to my sister and myself when we lost our dear mother. I was aged 13, my sister was age 11. I had to look after my sister and cook and clean but I would never change the life I had. I worked in the Abbey Works for while, it was hard. Used to walk, couldn't afford the bus fare, so I put a deposit on a bike. By the time I gave my dad my keep and I paid some off my bike I had nothing left, but I was happy. It would be great if someone out there remembers me, please get in touch.
Tue Sep 9 10:46:58 2008
Vicky Perfect
Hi Sue, Everyone is welcome to come along to the History Society at Flint Library. We meet the last Friday of the month from 4-6pm. Come along, we have a speaker and talk about most things Flint.
Mon Apr 7 09:43:54 2008
Sue, Flint
Message for Vicky Perfect and Charles Ley. Can anyone come along to the meetings at Flint Library for the historical society - new to the internet and find it all quite interesting. Born and bred in Flint 1954!
Tue Mar 25 09:56:36 2008
Nick Elias, Ak NZ
My Granfather, Joe, ran the pub, I believe, in the late '70s and '80s with Massie. I'm Nick the son of Jacky and my Uncle is Paul Griffiths. I have fond memories staying in The Dee in 1980 when we were back visiting for 3 months from New Zealand. The paint shop down the road mentioned at the beggining of this article was also run by grandad in the 1960s and is where my Uncle Paul and mother grew up. Having spent all my life away fom Fflint I would love to hear from anyone who remembers my grandparents and how Pluto the dog used to take Massie for a walk every evening. I have been told there's no one better at clearing a pub at last orders like Massie, all 5ft nothing of her. If anyone knows where and how to get hold of Paul Griffiths as well please advise.
Fri Mar 7 09:05:43 2008
Charles Ley, Flint
Dave Ledward,The premises you now occupy was a jewellers in the period I wrote about. It was owned be two sisters named Schwarz, related I beleive to the Opticians in Holywell.Bass Breweries who owned the premises forced them out, at the end of the 39/45 war on the pretext that they were going to expand the Dee. As you can see it never happened. It caused a lot of distress to my parents. The sister then moved to a shop (now demolished) on the other side of Chester Street.
Fri Nov 16 10:24:11 2007
Charles Ley
Mr Ken Cocking has been informed of your enquiry, and should be in touch via the website.
Thu Nov 8 09:08:44 2007
T.C. Flint
To W. Bassford, Australia. We have read your request re the Cocking family and have spoken to Mr Ken Cocking who remembers you well. Hopefully he will get in touch.
Thu Nov 8 09:08:34 2007
Paula M (nee Cocking), Flint
Mr Bassford - very surprised and pleased to see your email. I am Ken Cocking's daughter (no 3 of 4). He is the only surviving member of the Cockings of Henry Taylor Street. My aunts, Mary and Kitty, passed away some years ago and sadly Joe passed away in 1998. Joe had one son Kelvin who is currently living in Llanarmon with his wife Fiona, they have one daughter. Ken and wife Betty still live in Flint as do 3 of the 4 daughters. The other daughter lives in Wrexham. They have 4 grandchildren. Ken would be very pleased to hear from you. We'll just have to give him some lessons in email!
Thu Nov 8 08:39:46 2007
W.A. Bassford, Australia
I would like to contact anyone who knows or knew any member of the Cockings family late of Henry Taylor Street, Flint. I would like to hear from any person who was a member of 1st Flint scout troop late 1930 to early 1940.
Fri Oct 26 09:17:36 2007
Dave Ledward
Hi, I couldn't help noticing the write-up on the Dee pub (Flint) and how Flint used to look way before I came to live in the town. The Dee's of interest to me because I own the hairdressing business next door (Chiq Hair Studio). My landlord to the premises (Enterprise Inns) is the same as the pub owners because it's part of the same building. I'm very interested in the history of the building as I'm sure, many of our client regulars are also.
Mon Sep 24 09:04:57 2007
Rachel
I'm just wondering if anyone remembers a shop in Chester Street, where Pleasers is now (or used to be, not been for a while!). It was my great auntie's shop and her name was Ginny Renshaw. She was originally from Bagillt and I'm wondering if anyone remembers her or her shop? Any pics or info would be gratefully received :-)
Mon Jul 23 10:28:30 2007
Peter Hooson Off Flint but now Devon
Can't think of a better place to put this so here goes. Can anyone remember the British Legion trips to Rhyl? Every year in the summer, the Club would charter a train for the children of members to go to Rhyl for the day. By today's standards, it wasn't much however, as kids, we used to be so excited by this annual event. We would be waiting anxiously on the platform at Flint station, constantly staring down the line looking for signs that the train might be coming. The signals (or 'flags' as we used to call them) going up were the first indication that something was happening. Whilst on the journey, a committee man would walk through the train with a bag of Half Crowns and hand each child 3 coins. The seemingly huge amount of 7 shillings and sixpence! The views across the River Dee and the unusual pictures through windows as the train trundled through the many villages en-route were captivating for a small child who never left the town. After the seemingly endless journey we would arrive at Rhyl and I was always taken aback by the size of the place. Massive. There were always boys with modified old prams waiting and offering to take any holiday makers and their luggage who spilled out of the station to their hotel. This never affected us as we were only staying for the day. My earliest memories were going down as a family and walking along the prom. The beach seemed jam packed with people and deck chairs all vying for a good spot. A funny moment was when someone from the family looked over at a huge banner on a pavillion type of building on or near the beach and said, "I see Tommy Trinder's here", to which my younger nephew replied, "and we're here". The frontage back then in the early sixties was probably Victorian but the memories of candy floss, toffee apples and shops laden with gifts and souvenirs that you 'had' to buy, remain vivid. Each year, certainly for a few years, I always seemed to buy a small plastic boat which had a clockwork propeller mechanism that you would wind up with a detachable key and a rudder that you adjusted manually. The hull was always white but the superstructure came in a choice of red, green or blue. My brother and me would always have a different colour and we'd spend hours once home, 'steaming' them around the bath. Later on when boats became a bit silly and childish, we always seemed to come home with an identity bracelet that would have been engraved with our name. We were so cool with our chic jewellery which invariably we'd lose before too long due to a faulty catch! Happy days.
Tue Jul 3 16:37:14 2007
Fred Dolman, Adelaide
Michael Jones, Yes, I remember you both & your family. Melville and I were very good mates. Michael lives in Melbourne now, near his sons, after living in Adelaide many years. Hope you and your family are keeping well, say hello to Mellie when you see him. Fred Dolman
Mon Jul 2 08:32:19 2007
David Rowe, Mold
I am currently researching Flintshire pubs and would like to hear from anyone with any stories, photographs and memorabilia.
Thu Jun 28 16:28:05 2007
Wynne, off Flint
Born in '64 on Prince of Wales Ave, I'm off Flint. My dad Brian was from the so-called bull ring - Maes y Dre. I've seen it change so fast it's scary.
Tue Jun 12 08:25:06 2007
Paul Alex C, Northampton
To Peter Shaw from Peterborough, my mother's maiden name was Florence Jones, she was born in the early 1930s when her father was the landlord of the Dee Inn in Flint, he was known as Bob the Dee, he also ran the Dee Inn at Bagillt, my mother's younger sister, Elizabeth, was actually born in the Dee pub, they're both alive and well, my mother lives in Bagillt and Elizabeth in Halkyn.
Wed Jun 6 09:47:39 2007
Brian Leighton off Flint
I can remember the Coal Tar pub, opposite the sailors' home, there is now going to be a restaurant there. My dad used to go to the Coal Tar, and let me have a few sips of his mild. That's why I drink like a fish now, ha, ha. I was only 5. Good days. Isn't it funny, you never forget, all them years ago.
Thu Mar 22 09:50:44 2007
Claire, off Fflint
Loved reading all the comments about Fflint. Does anybody have any memories of The Antelope at the bottom of Queen's Avenue? Or photos would be even better.
Mon Mar 5 14:16:06 2007
Vicky Perfect
Charles Ley you have written a very good article and should expand on your life story. Also, if anyone is interested in local history why not join Charles at our local history group on the last Friday of the month at Fint Library 4-6pm where you can all be involved in local history.
Thu Mar 1 08:41:38 2007
Frank Ward, Dornoch, Sutherland
I am trying to discover the origin of the song mentioned above:
"We had a radio. I remember singing the popular songs of the day, including one about Mussolini, 'Will you come to Abyssinia, will you come'.
Can anyone remember who sung it, the lyrics etc?
Wed Jan 31 15:12:00 2007
Michael L Jones off Flint (now Ruthin)
Fred Dolman, I'm Mellvile's brother. I was in school with your Michael, happy days. Is he still in Australia? We lived in Chester Road opposite the council school.
Mon Jan 29 09:52:39 2007
Fred Dolman, Adelaide, South Australia
I was born in Queens Ave, Flint(1941), moved to Australia in 1960. I too share the memories of Cyril Bowler and still remember him and many other school friends and just generally growing up in Flint. Bill Jones, London Rd, Flint, is my uncle.
Mon Jan 15 09:29:29 2007
WENDY
Uncle Charlie, what a lovely read that was. I thoroughly it. Nigel
Mon Jan 8 10:28:23 2007
Cyril Bowler, x- dee cottages, Flint
In 1939 I was born below the line in Dee Cottages and very definitely come off Flint. My grandfather, Charlie Bowler, kept the drill hall in Flint and I am told was a bit of a character in military terms. Hearing about Phoebie and Mary Martin brought back fond memories of my childhood those being two characters everyone knew from what we knew as the ranch (Empire Cinema). I remember Castle Street and Roscall Square because I was the paper boy and I covered these streets in my daily round including Henry Taylor street and the bungeys, which was the pet name for the dee corttages. I learnt how to swim in the gutters on the marsh on high tides as did many others. It was like Rhyl to us with times being so hard as many of you will remember but good times were to be had free of charge. No television, we made all our own entertainment. If we wanted to go to the ranch which, if I remember correctly, was seven pence and thruppence for an ice-cream, we used to go collecting beer bottles to take back to the pub (sailors home) and the Dee. As well as my paper round I used to work for Jenny Renshaw the green grocer next to bretts for half a crown on a Saturday. I left school when i was 15 to work at Balnfourth Engineering in Connahs Quay. Then for the north Wales tarmacking at Garden City which gave me a better education than I ever had at school. I moved to Scunthorpe when I was 19 following my girlfriend Wendy Pearson and have lived here ever since but I still visit home regularly to see my mother and sister and walk the marsh with my dog.
Thu Aug 17 10:00:42 2006
Pete Shaw from Peterborough
I am tracing my family history. Can anyone help with landlord ? & Florence Jones from the early 1900s?
Mon Aug 7 08:43:18 2006
Francis M
Fflint was the best place to grow up in. One that was born in 57. All born in Fflint are off fflint and not from fflint as one born in the bull ring 46.
Tue Apr 18 09:33:12 2006
Jim Davies
Very interesting account, enjoyed reading it. I used to frequent the Dee in the 1980s it was probably the last pub in town full of real characters, the world was certainly put to rights in there.
Tue Mar 21 11:24:30 2006
Thomas H Off Flint
Charles, what a well written and informative piece you have wrote, as good as thousand photos to the mind. Thank you very much.
Thu Feb 9 18:05:58 2006
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