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AUDIENCE COMMENTS
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HYSTERIA
Eliz. hysteria
These hysterical conditions - the rising mother (womb), burning chest,the devil's grip, globus_- sound exactly like reflux, so I'm sure that all those patients have had endoscopic examinations to make sure that the symptoms aren't unexplained at all. Reports of the Leeds conference will be worth looking forward to, imho.
Hepsibah B
In Our Time has several uses: it is educational, entertaining and great radio... and also the perfect cure for insomnia. I record the programme every week, so that when I am unable to sleep I can listen again. It's interesting enough to distract me from my thoughts and worries, but Melvyn's soothing tones also ensure that I am always asleep before the end of the programme. (The downside is that I'm left with a comprehensive knowledge of the ancient greeks, but am never conscious in the 19th century).
Liz Pounder
Thank you for the fascinating programme - only switched on in my car as I was waiting to collect someone last Thursday evening. I would like to share the fact that I am currently undergoing hypnotherapy treatment with a responsible private practitioner. I had been suffering from severe digestive problems and had lost a lot of weight. Medical tests had shown there was no physical cause. While on a waiting list to see a gastroenterologist (and feeling increasingly desperate) I came across the contact details for hypnotherapy. Since I made the initial appointment my symptoms have completely ceased and the hypnotherapy sessions have greatly improved other factors in my life, such as my self esteem. The word hysteria always denoted "over-reaction" and "lack of self control of feelings" to me, but as I listened to this programme I saw hysteria in a different light and realise that my symptoms were probably a form of hysteria.
David Howdle-Smith, Hysteria
During the discussion as often happens, the experts reach a point where it seems that in order to explain the subject they need to move things to another level. There is usually a pause while they consider how to achieve this without introducing a set of new concepts but still carrying the layperson (Melvyn and the audience) with them. Sometimes, although an apparent gulf exists, taking into account the time constraints they have no alternative but to skirt around it until the time is up. I sensed one of these gulfs opening up at the mention of "mythology" and "science". I think this could be an excellent candidate for a future programme. How do we think?. Images? words? I remember reading Einstein describing the formation of his theories, he maintained that his main idea would come to him in almost as a sudden insight which he would percieve as an image in his head. The difficult part, communicating it to his peers through the language of mathematics may take decades. Science like mythology and thought itself is made up of symbolic systems. If you look at the history of phylosophy which consists of a series of theories postulated by our greatest thinkers. And yet each generation sweeps away the preceeding ones or adds to it, as seemingly ever higher totering towers are constructed.
Zonker Harris Hysteria
I found the program hysterical, I've never laughed so much...The idea that you can "understand" human emotions in such a simplistic way shows just how little we have evolved form the first ape.
hysteria - vincen oliver
is multiple sclerosis seen as a conversion disorder?
Steve Reynolds Hysteria (and Chinese Medicine)
Thank you for an amazing discussion on a subject that has confounded Western thought for so long. I was taking copious notes on the background to hysteria in support of my Continuous Professional Development as an Acupuncturist. It was an excellent reminder of how something so obvoius to Chinese thought can be made so complex through a diferent perspective. There are two syndromes in Traditional Chinese Medicine (TCM) that relate to this condition: 'Plum Stone Throat' for globus hystericus and 'Running Piglet' for the outmoded concept of the womb ruuning around inside the body. However, TCM takes seiously people's subjective perceptions, hence the quaint names given to the syndromes by the Chinese. As Acupuncturists, we encounter these syndromes regularly, usually in a mild form but sometimes as a more serious condition. I guess my amusement with the way it merits a whole programme to itself, is that we treat it successfully with a simple presciption of Acupuncture points in a few treatments. Not a lifetime of the 'Talking Therapy'.
Chris Jones - The cathartic method
What happens, physiologically when a) we talk to ourselves (think) and b)we talk to another (speak)? Why is the latter, supposedly, more 'healing'than the former?
Jon Stone, Hysteria
In choosing three psychoanalysts to discuss hysteria, ‘In Our Time’ failed to convey the breadth of thinking both in the past and now about 'symptoms unexplained by disease' or hysteria. Anyone listening would have no idea that physical symptoms unexplained by disease such as paralysis, attacks that look like epilepsy, headaches, chest pain and breathing problems remain extremely common in medical practice. They account for around a third to a half of patients attending general practice and medical outpatient clinics and are known as functional somatic symptoms or somatoform symptoms. Up to one half of all patients taken to an intensive care unit thought to be in a severe epileptic state are actually having ‘hysterical’ seizures. Very few of these patients will ever see a psychoanalyst. It was revealing that Brett Kahr’s case of ‘classic’ trauma in a case of globus was nearly 20 years old. As an NHS neurologist I see someone in my clinic with a disabling functional neurological symptom every week. Melvyn Bragg sounded audibly frustrated at the failure of his guests to answer his relevant questions and their tendency to wander off the point. At one point he asked whether there are any studies examining biological correlates in hysteria with a negative response. There are many such studies of functional symptoms for example in 2002 in the journal Brain, Vuilleimier and colleagues elegantly demonstrated that some patients during a state of ‘hysterical’ paralysis have a corresponding decrease in the activity of motor areas on the opposite side of the brain. This does not mean the problem is organic after all but hints at the need for a much wider and complex model of hysterical symptoms that includes biological, psychological and social dimensions. This is what was missing from the programme. Anyone looking for a clear account of hysteria based on clinical reality which encompasses the psychoanalytic perspective (but does not allow it to dominate) could look to Halligan, Bass and Marshall. Contemporary Approaches to the Science of Hysteria. Oxford University Press 2001 or attend a forthcoming conference in Leeds on ‘Medically Unexplained Symptoms’ called ‘Mind and Body 2004’.
Hysteria - Patrick W.
Dear Melvyn, Back to Top form this week, and congrats on well-merited Sony Award (shows what a Wadham education can do?). You all said much of Freud, i.e. Sex. But there is another explanation for 'blocked' breathing, to which Jung if no one else came quite close: viz. the third of the great governing instincts of evolution (after those two other Fs, feeding and f...ing), which is Fear. In other words, hysteria approximates to (is the same as?) what it is now fashionable to call 'Panic Attack'. Try breathing very fast yourself, you'll find that the outgoing air in effect blocks the incoming. If and when you get around to 'Alcoholism and other Substance Abuse in history', as I devoutly hope you soon do (big subject, what about 'Demonic Possession' and indeed 'Heckyll and Jyde'?), you'll have to think about Fear again; it's in my (not inexperienced) view a primary factor in this ultra-serious disorder. Back to 'Bede and the Celtic Church'...!
Sian Morgan - Psychotherapist
Your programme on hysteria this morning illustrated very aptly why little has moved on in the general public's mind about mental health and its treatment. The preoccupation with abstract freudian concepts such as the oedipus complex is of little value to someone who is suffering with severe psychological, emotional and physical symptoms - after all, you will hear few people, professionals or patients referring to their suffering from hysteria. They may however talk about suffering from post-traumatic stress disorder, panic attacks, anxiety or depression. There are clinically validated treatments for these disorders which do not rely on freudian analysis. One of these, now used widely in the national health service and by our own trauma centre is EMDR (eye movement desensitiation and reprocessing). It may sound rather whacky but unlike prolonged freudian analysis which may take 3 times a week for up to 10 years and beyond, it relieves patients of debilitating symptoms as the result of trauma in a matter of weeks! While we continue to talk about the mind and the body as two different entities we are putting up barriers to the development of the treatment of trauma (erstwhile known as hysteria).
Felicity Kaal - Hysteria
I greatly enjoy the In Our Time series. Hysteria is a fascinating subject. It was interesting to hear the history of hysteria and the views of the contributors. However I was disappointed the discussion did not move beyond the paradigm of the mind-body split to a more wholistic view. The work of Candace Pert shows how feelings/emotions and physical symptoms are linked through the neural pathways in the brain. So it is no longer a mystery how feelings produce effects in the body. I feel Freud is outdated and a better psychological model is Carl Jung's. Jungian analyst Marion Woodman in her books takes the subject much further. Hysteria has been primarily associated with women and sexuality because patriarchy repressed both women and female sexuality - Jung's the Feminine. Everything associated with the downward flowing energies, everything below the waste was demonised. This is enough to explain the internal conflicts experienced by sufferers. [It might also be interesting to explore the right/left brain issues in relation to this conflict.] Marion Woodman explains the literature/metaphor link and the sexuality/Feminine suppression link. Then there is another whole discussion to be had about how this links with energy flows through the body....
Allen Esterson, on hysteria
In the context of the discussion of the relative occurrence of male and female, Brett Kahr stated that Freud “began with a cohort of eighteen hysterical patients, all women” on whom he reported in his 1896 “Aetiology of Hysteria” paper. Of course Freud had treated numerous patients in the years immediately prior to this time, but the important error lies in the fact that six of the patients on whom Freud gave a general report in the paper in question were men (Standard Edition, vol 3, pp. 207-208). This is not a trivial mistake, because Kahr’s error occurred in the context of a discussion of the relative numbers of men and women who were believed to have hysterical symptoms at that time. Rachel Bowlby referred to “Breuer’s first patient, ‘Anna O.’.” In fact Bertha Pappenheim (“Anna O.”) was the *only* patient with whom Breuer used the “talking cure”. Bowlby also said at one point that “there was one bit of sexual abuse in one of the cases” in “Studies on Hysteria” (1895). In fact there were two cases of attempted sexual assault on patients when they were teenagers, that of “Katharina” [whose “analysis” consisted of an afternoon’s chat while Freud was on holiday (SE 2, pp. 125-134)], and “Rosalie H.” (pp. 169-173), which case was discussed briefly in the middle of the chapter on “Elisabeth von R.” Juliet Mitchell came up with the story that Freud came back from his period of study in Paris with the notion that there is such a thing as male hysteria and “got a very poor reception”, as “there was a great denial of male hysteria”. This story, told by Freud in “An Autobiographical Study” (SE 20, p. 15) has long been shown by the historian of psychology Henri Ellenberger to be false. He traced the documents pertaining to the meeting at which Freud reported the reception to his report on male hysteria, and found that Freud’s account was the opposite of the truth. Far from rejecting Freud’s report, Ellenberger reports that no one denied the existence of male hysteria. In fact the chairman of the meeting, Bamberger actually said “All this is very interesting, but I see nothing new in it” (Ellenberger, 1970, p. 441). All contributors were credulous about the claims of Breuer and, especially, Freud about their alleged “cures” in this period. Rachel Bowlby acknowledged that Anna O. spontaneously “talked off her distress” prior to Breuer’s directing her treatment along these lines. But she also said that this process showed the therapeutic effect that could be got from finding the origins of where her troubles had come from”. Now Albrecht Hirschmüller, Breuer’s biographer, traced the original case notes, and found that this is account bears little relation to what actually happened. First, some symptoms partially or wholly disappeared spontaneously. Second, the relief from distress that Bowlby describes did not come initially from “finding the origins” of it. The spontaneous talking that Anna O. did at that stage of the treatment was the recounting of fantasy stories, in which process Breuer then started to assist her.
Mary Todd - Hysteria
Good old Dr Freud, still relevant after all these years when there is so much discussion about the effects of mental stress on the body and the effects of trauma on mental and physical. Interesting about the globus hystericus and breathing difficulties - could this be connected with the rise in cases of stress related adult asthma we hear reported? Pity Freud gets downgraded to one or two lectures on psychology courses these days. His ideas on the effects of child abuse and how it can affect people in later life must be more relevant than ever now that the cat is out of the bag about the levels of abuse to children. His ideas about the unconscious too are beginning to gel with evidence from neuropsychology - events go on the in brain which guide our actions, even though we are not consciously aware of them. He may not have discovered the unconscious, but he was certainly its best spin doctor and his ideas must provide a starting point for thinking about the phenomenon. OK he may not have the answer to everything, but what a relief to hear his ideas debated seriously for a change. More of the same please....
A.D. Normal State
The normality of trauma? Then it's no wonder everyone should have their own counsellor! We ought to be very grateful to Sigmund Freud for inventing "the talking therapy" It's just a shame that many who really need it either can't afford it or would be stigmatised if they were talking to a counsellor/therapist. Mental illness is so debilitating and sad that we still want to treat it physically in the hope that a pill will cure the ill. A word in time.......clears the mind (and the globus hystericus).
Hysteria - A Lost Opportunity
Dear Melvyn Bragg It was a pity that the discussion of hysteria took a backward turn into Freudian, psychoanalytical and sexual backwaters of history and academia. Had it been taken forward, to include innovative ideas to its actual place in the misunderstanding of psychological aspects of physical health and well being today, it would have been a ground breaking discussion. Although it is now recognised that 'state of mind' affects physical health - and that physical conditions affect ones thinking, mood, perception and behaviour, it has not occurred to most people that these links explain many hitherto supposedly 'mysterious' phenomena. I have written on the way in which psychological techniques (Induction, conditioning and reinforcement) work through normal human physiology, the main purpose of which is to maintain health and well-being. My work explains its relevance, not only to physical and mental health - psychosomatic disorders, panic attacks, obsessive compulsive disorders and phobias, but also other phenomena so loved by the mystery- loving media. These psychological techniques affect bodily systems - the Auto-immune System, the Endocrine System, the Sympathetic Nervous System, and other aspects of body and brain chemistry, which explains - The Placebo Effect, Brain- washing, Religious Fanaticism, Crowd Behaviour, and the apparent working of Alternative Therapies. It also explains the effect of good psychology in parenting and conventional health care, the doctor's bedside manner, and the confidence factor that enhances trust and reduces stress and anxiety, that contributes to the efficacy of their treatments. Above all, this lateral thinking explains how intelligent, educated and otherwise rational adults continue to believe in the supernatural - religion - long after they have given up the frightening and comforting fantasies of childhood. Religious induction, rite and ritual are exactly the same techniques as used in hypnosis. They use sensory triggers as regular reinforcement techniques, visualisations, constant repetition of stories, responses hymns and chants, inducing fear and offering comfort. See 'Understanding Belief' & 'Body & Soul' first published in 2000
A Slittercombe - hysteria
The panel of experts seemed unaware of the huge leap they were making from certain individual cases to a whole theory developed more as a philosophical take on the human condition than as a scientific investigation. It was frightening because a person having such strong convictions as to the source of a psychological problem must inevitably influence,( because of the power relationship involved) the patient, even to the extent of persuading them that they would not be cured unless they admitted that their problem had sexual roots. Didn’t we have an outbreak of this with the recovered memory cases. Although the experts were presumably there to describe the history of the development of ideas associated with hysteria they actually seemed to be promoting a view. That is fine, but a challenge to some of the assumptions would have been nice. I would like to hear a debate include people with more critical of Freud included. Didn’t Elaine Showalter write a book on hysteria a few years ago? How do Freud’s ideas fit with the hard science being done on consciousness? Can a universal theory of anything be built by studying the abnormal? Is there any evidence from everyday life or scientific research for the contentions about the importance of sibling rivalry or the existence of an erotic attraction to the parent? Are psychoanalysts actually better at getting results than other people, or is it just a banal truth that people feel better if someone listens to their problems? What social and intellectual context was Freud inhabiting? Did he actually ever cure anyone/ what did his patients say?
Victoria Flint
I only heard part of this pogramme - but will listen to it again. I was fascinated as my 9 year old daughter has been suffering from this - she didn't walk for 9 months - although is now walking, is still not coping with issues in life well. The programme was amazing in that I felt very alone when this happened - she did see, and sees ocassionally, a clinincal physciologist - but to hear about this on the radio was fascinating.
Steve Flinders - Hysteria
Following a recent illness and mild stroke I had a panic attack while in a MRI scanner. Following six months cognative theorpy at the JR Oxford and two years of further related tests i have now just about learnt what symptoms are real and what is hysteria driven. Its been a trip I wouldnt wish to make again and mostly alone. Should anyone else out there be making that journey you have my respect. I wouldnt wont to make it again.
Hysteria - Paul Ancill FRCS Consultant Accident and Emergency
The devils grip is not a hysterical but a physical condition also known as Bornholm disease (from the Isle of Bornholm where there was an outbreak it is caused by Group B coxsackieviruses.I see it regularly!
Hysteria - Giles Rocholl
Dear Melvyn, Your contributors made some valid points but introduced alot of confusing ones too. For an easy understanding to emotional health and clear thinking, please interview Joe Griffin and Ivan Tyrell of Mindfields College. Their book and courses on 'Human Givens' are the unifying tools for healthy living and emotional well being for any human being.
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