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Terry Sessford - Renaissance Astrology
An entertaining programme, but slightly depressing in that it highlighted that there are those who still consider astrology to be credible. But perhaps I should not be surprised since in recent years we have seen a resurgence in a whole raft of whacky and irrational beliefs. When the discussion strayed from treating astrology purely as something of historical interest, it desperately needed input from a physicist and a statistician in order put the 'astrological forces' and 'astrological predictions' into perspective (ie. insignificant and no better than chance, respectively). But, in their absence, well done Melvyn for bringing the studio guests 'down to earth' from time to time. As the eminent chemist and physicist Sir John Maddox commented "astrology is a pack of lies ... There is no evidence that the positions of the planets can affect human behaviour".
Your views: astrology with melvyn Bragg
It was a very interesting prrogramme and as an avid astrology fan at least was treated more seriously than usual by the media!!I have studied this subject at evening classes and try and keep up with things.
Harry Tadd - Renaissance Astrology
I appreciate that the speakers are very constrained by time but since they mentioned Pico della Mirandola it would have been interesting to hear from his compatriot Marsilio Ficino. As an astrologer, doctor of souls and doctor of bodies he had much to say on the influence of the planets, the humours and philosophy in his written works. Perhaps the programme could revisit him at some propitious time.
S.G.K. Astrology
I wish the speakers had had a chance to give their own framework of ideas on this subject, which they clearly all held. I am as ardent a listener to these excellent programmes as anyone but it could be so worthwhile to hear present ways of looking at human communications with the world, from such thinkers. Of course much can be learned from the past, but our experiences and our problems are more complex now, and we need all the understanding to be found if we are to move sanely through the existing conflict and confusion into a wider realm of thought and being.There is a real need and want of other discoverable systems of communication in the space between things, between ourselves and, reciprocally, between our concepts and behaviour. For instance 'internal coherence' benefits greatly from Ockham's 'mental language', which wasn't discussed last week.This programme is a wonderful platform for present day thinkers concerned with now and us. We exist in a spatial (cosmic) medium of communication in which the perpetual flow and shaping grace, can generate new resonances.
Angela Benson
Like many of the contributors to this page, I really enjoyed programme on Astrology. It was a change to hear Melvyn sounding as if he could not believe what his "experts" were telling him. I would like to have heard the Arab ideas on Astrology and also feel that mention should have been made about the importance of Astrology to people in India and how that came about. Like Melvyn, I think it is fanciful to believe that the heavenly bodies control individual lives. I do accept, however, that they affect life in general: the tide and sunspots are just two examples of massive influence upon the earth and all its inhabitants. And the idea propounded in Lyall Watson's book "Supernature" that lunatics might go mad at times of the full moon because of the gravitational pull on fluids in the brain is intriguing (although easily disproved I feel).
Astrology
Fantastic programme. Made me wonder whether you could do another whole programme about the Four Humours. Huge subject with lots of links into other areas: medicine, philosophy, classic understanding of the natural world, personality typing, psychology (as well as astrology). References to them litter our language. Also, they spans the ages from Greek (or earlier), through Renaissance to modern times (Rudolph Steiner). We hear so much about classical systems of oriental medicine, but nothing about our own ancient western systems. I'd love to know what parallels there are with Chinese and Ayurvedic medicine. Just a thought.
Anne Williamson - Renaissance Astrology
Although not religious, I listen to this program religiously. I found this episode particularly thought provoking. I found the discussion concerning astrology's renaissance roots with astronomy most engaging. As a result, I began to ask myself if Spinoza's arguments against free will were not also arguments against a belief in astrology - coming at a time when scientists and philosophers were beginning to separate the two disciplines. A most entertaining program, Mr Bragg.
In Our Time- Renaissance Astrology
Two beautiful moments from the astrogy programme: the casual starting of the programme without one of the intended participants who had been misdirected to the White City and who later contributed so forcefully and amusingly. And Melvyn Bragg's 'hacking cough', a wonderful joke, partly induced, I feel, from the pressure put on him by the challenges to his authority! John Marden
MELANIE REINHART - Renaissance Astrology
I so enjoyed the debate about astrology, and it was wonderful that such articulate and interesting people were participating. Also a pleasure to hear a discussion without too much of the usual sneering and 'witch-hunt' attitude that often characterise the discussion of astrology in the media. Prejudice is directed at astrology because to really see it working is an experience that confounds the cosmology of scientific materialism and attendant secular ways of thinking that have dominated world culture in the West in recent centuries. The astrological view is one congruent with a holistic philosophy which thus endorses respect for all life and its natural cycles. What could be more urgently contemporary than the need to change our limited thinking towards this more healthy direction, before we destroy our 'home planet'?
Dr Colin Huntly - RENAISSANCE ASTROLOGY
This week's programme was terrific. The recurring themes of analogy and the relatedness of the human body with the cosmos made me recall the earlier programme on alchemy with its "As above so below" focus. The influence of that world view on things such as the development of English common law is something that could perhaps form the basis of a future programme. Common law has a strong focus on the individual person as its building block and analogical cornerstone. Interestingly, courts of Equity with their origins in the Church used a more cosmological basis to solve disputes between parties.One of the modern legal developments to have flourished as the focus on "man as the measure of all things" has lost its attraction has been the modern corporation. Common law struggles as never before to impose order in a chaotic and ever-changing universe based on a pre-Copernican world-view.
Ian H Thain on Astrology
Tonight's programme was great fun! I wish to correct just one small point: the church's opposition to astrology rests simply on the fact that the practice of it is forbidden in scripture. Deuteronomy 18:10 commands - "There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch, or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer. For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee. Thou shalt be perfect with the LORD thy God. For these nations, which thou shalt possess, hearkened unto observers of times, and unto diviners: but as for thee, the LORD thy God hath not suffered thee so to do." "Observing times" is astrology, and it is linked here with all the black arts which had their origin in Babylon. I think that at least part of its falling out of intellectual favour was due to the influence of the Reformers, and their insistence upon obedience to the scriptures, which had only recently been translated into English by William Tyndale.
Melanie Renaissance Astrology
As an astrologer, I applaud Melvyn Bragg for introducing astrology on to this wonderful programme, In Our Time. However, my spleen was almost bursting at some of the remarks, presented as "facts" that some members of the esteemed panel were making. For example (and I don't have space to cover more than a couple), introducing spirituality into astrology is not "wacky", indeed, if I had to define astrology it would be "spiritual law in action." Astrology is transcendent of religion, the politics of God, but it is inseparable from a spiritual framework, and for this reason does not lend itself to reductionist, quantitative scientific enquiry. I'm afraid the so-called Age of Enlightenment resulted in the baby being thrown out with the bathwater. Quantitative scientific investigation is left-brained and of course, necessary, but it is not sufficient. Medical science is a good example of how very inadequate the scientific method actually is. Astrological symbolism is the paradigm par excellence of wholism - this in itself is a topic I would like to see In Our Time cover. And wholeness is essentially a blending of left-brained quantitative data AND right-brained qualitative data, mirrored eg by feminine/masculine, yin/yang, positive/negative, light/dark - Life is essentially a dance of dualism. Astrological interpretation can only be accessed through qualitative means, and "holistic science" is now an emergent area of scientific enquiry, I'm very pleased to say - I cannot end without also saying that astrology is NOT, I repeat NOT, about making predictions, although of course this is how it has been prostituted. Thousands of years ago, astrological knowledge was part of the "Ancient Wisdom", and it was kept hidden - is of course an "occult" science - and only learnt by initiates, and for good reason: a little knowledge is indeed a dangerous thing, and there are those who will fall prey to the seductive powers of the ego and will wish to "show off" their knowledge and "play God." Any astrologer who claims to be able to make predictions is in my view both a charlatan and a fool. It is true that one can advise when it may be an appropriate time for certain endeavours, but I would say that we do of course have free will, and in fact, it is your vote of consciousness that always is being tested by the Divine Mind. We have the power to change anything - the stars impel, they do not compel.Thank you Melvyn - now please can we have some top astrologers on the programme to continue this sorely needed exploration of Man's place in the Cosmos and his relationship to our Earth?
Both halves of Europe
I'm halfway through "Europe. A History" by Norman Davies and I have to say that as much as I enjoy and admire the In Our Time series, I feel the selection of European topics bears all the hallmarks of the good old West-centrism, so clearly pinned down by Davies in the introduction to his monumental work. A couple of programmes on Russia and Bohemia, scattered remarks here and there - one could think that Eastern Europe has no history of ideas! That's obviously not the case. A few suggestions: Poland-Lithuania, a great multinational state of the 14th through 18th centuries that at one point stretched from the Baltic to the Adriatic to the Black Sea and utilised a unique political system of "Nobles' democracy". Together with the Austro-Hungarian Empire it is sometimes considered a step leading to the European Union, the idea being that independent countries cede some of their sovereignty to an overarching entity. Slavs, the most numerous ethnic and linguistic family of peoples in Europe, could make for a great topic as well. The spread of Soviet communism throughout the Eastern Europe also deserves exploration. I could go on.
Hedley England Renaissance Astrology
What a wonderful debate about astrology. It is good to see and hear that astrology is still taken seriously by academics and not dismissed out of hand as gobbledegook. I have carried out a lot of research into astrology, looking specifically at aircraft and how it can be a practical help in determining the future. I published a book called Degrees of Flight which explores the astrology of aviation and develops new methods for prediction. The point is, Astrology is above human ego and desire, and represents a universal truth about the world Man inhabits. It is the interface between the known world and 'other' and astrologers gain new insights into the human condition.
Peter - Astrology
From what I can surmise, Inigo Jones in 1615 was made general surveyor to King James under whom masonry flourished. Jones, himself, again from what I can gather, became the Grandmaster of England. It would appear the zodiacal signs in the roof of the Royal College of Surgeon’s hall, referred to on ‘In Our Time’ this morning, would have had more to do with the room being designed by a Freemason, than the medical profession, then entering the precise experimental fields of anatomy and other practice, believing in astrology.
I much enjoyed the Astrology programme. I think it is the first time I've heard Melvyn at odds with his experts. That's what happens when you rubbish an academics 'specialist subject'!Re next weeks show, I hope there can be a reference to Bayesian statistics - check it out.
Diana Sneezum - Astrology
What fun today's programme was. It was lovely to hear the contributors enjoying themselves so much. Experts discussing their subject amongst themselves can sometimes be rather dull, but not today.
Bernard, Whitby on Astrology
The parallels between Astrology/Astronomy on the one hand and Accountancy on the other are notable. They each start with precise, pedantic calculations where there is great angst over the finest part of a degree or penny of a pound, then along comes the interpreter and, within very few constraints, creates new pictures with enormous brush strokes where one interpreter can create a view that is the reciprocal of some other interpreter. |
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