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Big thank you to the Ouch Team for their hard work over last 15 years

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Messages: 1 - 29 of 29
  • Message 1. 

    Posted by Otter25 (U14189455) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    Look no one likes what is happening and I do not suppose for one minute that any Ouch Team member has any control over the decision to close the boards anymore than we do.

    The Ouch Talk Show is coming to an end and the ground breaking Ouch TV programme finished in the 1990s, then Ouch message boards are going to fall fowl of a top down decision to close outlets which no longer reflect the content of programming.

    Aiming anger at individuals who are disabled themselves and on our side is grossly unfair and regrettable.

    So please take a step back and thank the Ouch Team for setting up the site and messageboards in the first place and giving up their time alongside their own full-time jobs, activism and the affects of daily disablism on their own lives, to build, monitor and keep the site ticking over for the decade or so it has been going.

    Otter

    Report message1

  • Message 2

    , in reply to message 1.

    Posted by KizzyKazaer (U14253092) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    giving up their time alongside their own full-time jobs 

    I thought running the whole Ouch! website *was* their full-time job? They're certainly not unpaid volunteers, they are employed by the BBC.

    Report message2

  • Message 3

    , in reply to message 2.

    Posted by Otter25 (U14189455) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    no Kizzy its not, some are employed by the BBC but are in a variety of roles, others are from other professions and have a contract to say write a blog, or a column etc once a month

    Report message3

  • Message 4

    , in reply to message 3.

    Posted by KizzyKazaer (U14253092) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    Ah - I was just thinking of Damon, Emma and Dan. They are definitely BBC employees (Hosts). We used to have Vaughan as well but not sure what happened to him...

    Report message4

  • Message 5

    , in reply to message 2.

    Posted by jockice (U1828467) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    Indeed Kizzy. It's paid work for them, they're not doing it out of the goodness of their hearts (a phrase my mum used to use whenever anyone tried to 'help' me, no matter the results.)

    Having said that, as a (former-ish) media professional you do sometimes get held responsible for mistakes/decisions made by others. It's happened to me plenty of times.

    However the Ouch team seem to be trying to be burying their heads in the sand and hoping the whole furore will just go away. The problem is there are just too many very intelligent people with enquiring minds using this site and the more the team prevaricate the more obvious it becomes that there is some sort of deceipt going on.

    Anyone fancy actually coming clean about the real reason for the board closure? My betting it's just a financial thing and if it is I'd rather hear that than all the guff about it not being what the users really want, and so on.

    Report message5

  • Message 6

    , in reply to message 1.

    This post has been temporarily hidden, because a moderator has referred it to a supervisor, BBC host or the Central Communities Team for a decision as to whether it contravenes the House Rules in some way. A decision will be made as quickly as possible..

  • Message 7

    , in reply to message 5.

    Posted by jockice (U1828467) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    And regarding Otter's other point, I also assume that the bloggers/columnists get paid for their efforts. They should do, but as freelances I don't think they will have had any say in whether the messageboards are open or closed. The staff may not either, but it would help if they tell us about any decisions made over their heads, rather than just pulling the sheets over them.

    (PS, I know I spelt deceit wrongly in the last message. Nobody's perfect).

    Report message7

  • Message 8

    , in reply to message 7.

    Posted by JLRRAC (U14373280) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    "(PS, I know I spelt deceit wrongly in the last message. Nobody's perfect)."

    I know I am, that's just one of my faults :o)

    Report message8

  • Message 9

    , in reply to message 1.

    Posted by Gallifreyian_Chronarch (U14914113) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    I would like to appologise for my initial response about Ouch! boards closing. It was not fair on the Mods, and tbh it isnt their fault that cut-backs have killed the boards. I'm sure Damon and Co are feeling this just as much as we are.

    So, a big THANK YOU for Damon and Co. It was lovely while it lasted. I hope whatever life has in store for all of you that it is all good. And a billion million curses on the BBC! smiley - smiley

    Report message9

  • Message 10

    , in reply to message 9.

    Posted by warner - a new era of cooperation (U13687269) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    Yes .. a big THANK YOU for Damon and Co.
    and all the best with 'Ouch News' in the future smiley - smiley

    Report message10

  • Message 11

    , in reply to message 10.

    Posted by Ironic John (U14258694) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    Sorry but their thank you appears in their bank accounts every month and its paid out of our licence fees, and that will continue.



    John

    Report message11

  • Message 12

    , in reply to message 11.

    Posted by auntieCtheM (U14260383) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    I, as well as many others, think that this Ouch Board has had quite an effect on our lives, in a very positive way. We have started up a number of threads saying this - we have had practical help, made friends, been given emotional support, laughs and spills, etc etc.

    But did you not see the thread where the top BBC management, I think it was, said that it was the Ouch team that decided to close this site? and the Ouch team member who said it was being closed because we criticised the site, wanting to make it even better?

    The style of management here has been so patronising and so dismissive of our concerns, our feelings, and been so condescending on so many occasions, (and continues to be like this, right up to the last, extended, moment), that I do find it hard to thank them for the work they may have put into the site.

    However, I would like to thank the top management of the BBC for starting up this site and for keeping it going for so long.

    Report message12

  • Message 13

    , in reply to message 5.

    Posted by SashaQ (U9936370) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    Anyone fancy actually coming clean about the real reason for the board closure? My betting it's just a financial thing and if it is I'd rather hear that than all the guff about it not being what the users really want, and so on. 
    Yeah - I would bet it is a financial thing, too. www.bbc.co.uk/ouch/m... The messageboard was seemingly described as "12 people having a bit of fun at our expense"...

    And calling it an editorial decision is a good one (!) - makes it sound like if it were some other sort of decision, then it would have impact on us, but it's only an editorial decision, so it isn't responsible for any feelings of being utterly gutted, or anything like that, oh no...

    Makes me feel like I committed some sort of crime joining the messageboards and actually enjoying sharing my thoughts on all sorts of topics with like-minded people...

    I, as well as many others, think that this Ouch Board has had quite an effect on our lives, in a very positive way. We have started up a number of threads saying this - we have had practical help, made friends, been given emotional support, laughs and spills, etc etc.  
    smiley - ok Well said, auntieCtheM. We made a difference to each other. Long may it continue in cyberspace, whatever happens.

    Report message13

  • Message 14

    , in reply to message 13.

    Posted by myrtlemaid (U7171398) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    Im more than happy to thank other OUCH members for the good times here and for the information, advice and support that has been shared..


    Im not sure why he OUCH team deserve thanks over and above that which is purely civil, ( much in the same ways as you say thanks to a shopassistant ), because both full time and part time staff on monthly contracts get/got paid to do their jobs.

    Frankly Im not convinced that in the time ive used the boards they did them particularly well, but maybe Im turning into a female version of Victor Meldrew.

    Id like to be ableto thank them but Id feel like a hypocrite especially as they were, at least in part, responsible for it being wrenched away from us.

    Still have received no reply even an aknowledgement of receipt of the petition I sent the Director General...


    Report message14

  • Message 15

    , in reply to message 13.

    Posted by Otter25 (U14189455) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    okay- they are being paid for their efforts, it is part of their employment ok.

    So its their job

    but, it is not their life

    and we should not expect it to be- to do so is to exploit

    they are not accountable to us, they are accountable to the BBC

    the fact they have attempted to explain, shows actually that they really do care

    they would have known full well what the reaction would be

    Report message15

  • Message 16

    , in reply to message 15.

    Posted by Offworld (U14593555) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    >>>>
    the fact they have attempted to explain, shows actually that they really do care
    <<<<

    But which explanation was that?

    Report message16

  • Message 17

    , in reply to message 14.

    Posted by KizzyKazaer (U14253092) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    Good lord, Myrtle, that's shameful smiley - grr

    Why should we be surprised, however? smiley - erm

    I too am finding it hard to be grateful, but I will say this much - thank you to whoever it was on BBC staff who handled my time of acute illness last year more professionally and compassionately than in 2008, ie not banning me from the boards this time round for making too many 'disruptive posts'. It hasn't been forgotten smiley - smiley

    Report message17

  • Message 18

    , in reply to message 15.

    Posted by Otter25 (U14189455) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    also I am concerned that this hellish episode may be being compounded by disablism at work

    if a company can make patronising remarks about disabled people in letters to service users, how is it treating its employees?

    Report message18

  • Message 19

    , in reply to message 15.

    Posted by hossylass (U3749845) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    Problem is, the "I'm alright Jack" attitude has always been there.

    Remember when I asked about what provision there was at a certain disability roadshow for people with fatigue and pain?

    A road show that was being pushed on here by the hosts as the greatest disability roadshow around, and how much fun it would be?

    Turns out it was only "fun" if you were able to get around, and if you were not bothered by crowds.

    It was not wheely accessible, or illness accessible, or nervous disposition accessible, or "triggered easily" accessible, etc, etc.

    But the host was adamant that it was the greatest thing for disabled people apart from those listed above.

    Turns out it wasn't, and only about 6 people went.

    But the point is, the hosts have never aligned themselves with disability, or disabled people, or people on disability benefits.
    Thay have never fought our corner, I dont know that they would even reconise we have a corner to defend.

    When we were fighting the original Labour welfare reforms, which we did with some gusto on here, we kept having posts pulled which made an action plan difficult.
    We complained, and they told us that we couldn't post political issues on here.

    Then a week later they had a poll "Are dfisabled people political enough".
    Makes you want to smack your head against the wall really.

    And then they followed it up with a thread on here, saying the same thing!!!!!!!
    Arghhhhhh............ critisised for not being the one thing they told us we couldn't be.
    Ironically at that moment in time some 11 posts on the front Talk page were regarding political policies.

    And that is why I wont say thank you.
    Because they are not part of this community, they are not part of the disabled community of the UK, and they dont give a damn about us as a group.

    Politically and morally inept.
    And paid for it.

    Report message19

  • Message 20

    , in reply to message 18.

    Posted by Otter25 (U14189455) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    well as an explanation - 12 people having fun at our expense...is telling -

    so 12 people using the board maliciously at expense of genuine disabled people,

    that with talk of closing the service would certainly have broken the camels back.

    It also explains why the Ouch Team have been attempting to guide users to

    social media sites where in most cases they can see a picture of the person they

    are talking to and judge for themselves if that person is bonafide. They can also

    warn other users of their concerns

    how absolutely awful for those who have worked so hard to create and maintain

    this site

    Report message20

  • Message 21

    , in reply to message 20.

    Posted by KizzyKazaer (U14253092) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    I think the '12 people having fun at our expense' was just a reference to a thread in which some posters were taking the pee out of the podcast, not an explanation for closing the boards!

    Report message21

  • Message 22

    , in reply to message 20.

    Posted by hossylass (U3749845) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    No Otter, it was 12 posts to a blog about closing the boards.

    Someone chose to turn those personal opinions into a sneer at their opinions.

    And then added the topped hat on it by telling lies.

    That someone is a host.

    Not 12 people being malicious at all.

    Report message22

  • Message 23

    , in reply to message 22.

    Posted by hossylass (U3749845) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    Those 12 posts didn't cause the closure of the boards, they were a reaction to the boards closed, and were actually asked for by Ian, who orchestrated the closure.

    They asked for feedback on the blog and got it.
    But this was months after the decision was made, but only days after the decision was announced.

    So the posts are not relevant to the closure.

    Just a host trying to score points by saying that the podcasts are listened to by "thousands".

    Bending the truth somewhat, the BBC podcasts in total may be listened to by thousands, but the Ouch ones aren't, otherwise disabled people all over the country would be talking about them.

    Ever heard them mentioned out there in the real world or on other disability sites?

    Report message23

  • Message 24

    , in reply to message 23.

    Posted by Otter25 (U14189455) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    ah, I see

    I will catch up with you I'm sure in a forum in the real world

    Otter signing out for the last time

    Report message24

  • Message 25

    , in reply to message 24.

    Posted by hossylass (U3749845) on Thursday, 7th July 2011

    Otter, no offence meant, it has been pretty hard to keep up with the politics of this board closure, and I am pretty sure some of us haven't come out of it bathed in glory on either side.

    smiley - sadface

    Report message25

  • Message 26

    , in reply to message 12.

    Posted by BBC Ouch team (U11138240) on Friday, 8th July 2011

    Thanks for any good wishes coming our way.

    I think it's worth addressing something before we close.

    In this thread it stated that "top management" posted here to blame the Ouch Team for closure. I think you need to ask yourself: do things actually happen like that in the workplace? Are 'top management' ever likely to randomly send out an email blaming someone lower down the chain in that way? No, I don't think so either. It clearly indicated where it came from, the Communities Team who run the software and social side of this board. They're a good bunch with an incredibly good heart, but they're not top BBC management. They still maintain other social services on the board and were keen to point out that it wasn't they who made the decision. They went an extra step by saying it was the Ouch! Team - who you know as Emma, Dan and Damon - but the team had no reason to believe this and won't have had any knowledge about decisions made. Indeed we've received an apology from the team about it.

    There are no grand conspiracies pending though. earlier this year cuts of 25% on BBC websites were widely covered in the media. Members of this very board wondered aloud whether this would affect Ouch! at the time. And I've spent a lot of time in the past few weeks pointing you at the new strategy that has emerged partly as a result - a BBC wide strategy which has led to many messageboard and website closures with more to come I believe.

    Focus on this. There's been a lot of discussions around this subject but focus on the above. It's the most believeable.

    There are some very positive things in Ouch's future, especially compared to some of our coleagues whose sites were closed entirely. We look forward to working at it and doing the very best we can for our disabled audiences, their friends and 'stakeholders'.

    There's nothing else to say that hasn't been said. So we wish you well and am sure we'll see you around. Our blog remains open and we've got some very interesting things lined up.

    Remember that YOU are the community. We helped bring you together with our software but you can carry on. I'd like to ask owners of any new messageboards that have sprung up to drop me an email ouch@bbc.co.uk as I close.

    Cheerio

  • Message 27

    , in reply to message 26.

    Posted by Offworld (U14593555) on Friday, 8th July 2011

    >>>> and 'stakeholders'. <<<<<


    Aaaaaargh!!!!!!!!

    Report message27

  • Message 28

    , in reply to message 27.

    Posted by hossylass (U3749845) on Friday, 8th July 2011

    Thank you my ARSE!!!!


    smiley - winkeye

    Report message28

  • Message 29

    , in reply to message 28.

    Posted by Offworld (U14593555) on Friday, 8th July 2011

    "That would be an ecumenical matter."

    Report message29

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