Scottish independence: 'Deal agreed' on referendum
Nicola Sturgeon and Michael Moore spoke on the phone on Monday
The basis of a deal has been reached between the UK and Scottish governments over the independence referendum.
In a joint statement Deputy First Minister Nicola Sturgeon and Scottish Secretary Michael Moore said "substantial progress" had been made.
But the BBC understands that although a few minor details need to be ironed out, a package of measures has been agreed.
It paves the way for a meeting between David Cameron and Alex Salmond.
This is expected to take place on Monday in Edinburgh.
The prime minister and the first minister are expected to agree on a plan which will involve a referendum which asks a single yes/no question on whether Scotland should leave the United Kingdom.
It is understood the agreement will also extend the vote to include those aged over 16 in Scotland.
Mr Moore, who is currently on holiday, and Ms Sturgeon spoke on the phone on Monday night and are due to do so again on Friday.
'Further work'
It follows a series of face-to-face meetings and negotiations between the pair in recent weeks.
Scottish Office Minister David Mundell said there would be a single question
A joint statement issued by the Scottish government and the Scotland Office after Mr Moore and Ms Sturgeon's latest conversation said: "Further substantial progress towards agreement was reached this afternoon between the Deputy First Minister Nicola Sturgeon and the Secretary of State Michael Moore.
"Officials have now been tasked with doing some further work on the final detail of the agreement.
"We are however on track for the full agreement, including the terms of a section 30 order, to be presented to the First Minister and the Prime Minister over the next few days."
The BBC's political editor, Nick Robinson, said the deal - if it is finalised - will be presented as "a compromise involving concessions by both sides".
The SNP is understood to have accepted a single question referendum, as opposed to two questions including one on greater powers for the Scottish Parliament, whilst the UK government has abandoned its opposition to giving 16 and 17-year-olds a vote.
One questionScotland Office Minister, David Mundell, who has been involved in the negotiations, told the BBC there will be one question and confirmed the vote will be held before the end of 2014.
He said: "It won't automatically be the case that 16 and 17-year-olds can vote in the referendum.
"The UK government, certainly the Conservative party, oppose that change.
Scottish Finance Secretary John Swinney said it was vital for young people to participate
"It will be up to Scottish Parliament to determine who can vote in the referendum in Scotland, and also the date and the nature of the question."
Scottish Finance Secretary John Swinney said progress had been made but "further ground" had to be covered before a final agreement is reached.
He added: "The Scottish government has always made clear that we preferred to have a single question on whether Scotland should become an independent country.
"But we also recognised that some people in Scotland want to consider other options to strengthen the powers of the parliament.
"That is a question we have consulted upon, it is one we have discussed and it has been an important part of the discussions with the UK government, but throughout all of this our preference has been to have a single question."
When a final agreement between the two governments is formalised legislation to set up the referendum is expected go before both the Westminster and Holyrood parliaments.
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Comment number 512.
ConnorMacLeod10th October 2012 - 12:46
399.scirop
... does not mean Scotland will have a relatively similar economy.
The Norwegian people are hard working and determined
No - but it's quite likely that they would.
The Scots are hard working and determined too. You shouldn't stereotype...
Link to this (Comment number 512)
Comment number 511.
pokemon black teh10th October 2012 - 12:46
If we're Better Together then why aren't the Tories, Labour and LibDems canvassing for a Federal Europe? Or is it only some people who are better together and others are better very far apart? Let Scotland govern itself for crying out loud, the entire Westminster outrage over this whole issue is related to fat greedy politicians' careers and a desire to cling on to oil wealth. Disgusting.
Link to this (Comment number 511)
Comment number 510.
Sagacity10th October 2012 - 12:46
@454.Graham
What will happen to the Scottish economy when all the English businesses relocated there move away again?
Why would they, if they're an English business that currently has a need for a prescence in Scotland theres every reason to believe they would continue to have that need after independance, especially given SNP policy would be to have lower corporation tax than England
Link to this (Comment number 510)
Comment number 509.
Ralphie10th October 2012 - 12:46
235.insurgence2012
Thankfully, the rest of Europe like the Scots, and particularly the French and Germans.
/////
I thought it was particularly the Swiss and the Norwegians.
Link to this (Comment number 509)
Comment number 508.
xyriach10th October 2012 - 12:45
There you go. Scotland's tax income in 2010 was £42.2 billion where as it's expenditure came to £59.2 billion.
Self sustaining, obviously. SNP widely publicising this fact are they? Plans to fill the immediate £17 billion hole? Not to mention existing debt.
http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Publications/2011/06/21144516/0
Link to this (Comment number 508)
Comment number 507.
Drunken Hobo10th October 2012 - 12:45
491 revolutionnow999 - People often miss the point that after independence, Scotland will begin to have its own elections and that the SNP will almost certainly split apart into separate parties (there is a wide range of ideologies within the SNP). The traditional Labour voter would likely get a party far closer to old socialist Labour than the Tory-copy New Labour that currently exists.
Link to this (Comment number 507)
Comment number 506.
MadTom10th October 2012 - 12:45
How will the Scots survive without all those banks to prop up?
Link to this (Comment number 506)
Comment number 505.
Joyanblu10th October 2012 - 12:45
Want to be separate? FINE as long as after it happens ENLAND has effective border controls, SCOTS will be regarded as illegal immigrants the same as any other European if they want to come and work in England and will be deported just the same.Separation is separation...they want it not us so let them take the consequences and not us. The whole thing is stupid and just headline grabbing
Link to this (Comment number 505)
Comment number 504.
Richard10th October 2012 - 12:45
Not sure if the Dilbert URL gets through, if not its the 7th October 2012 page
http://dilbert.com/strips/comic/2012-10-07/
It appears that many have opinions, how many are informed opinions?
Has the Scottish (or Welsh/Irish for that mater) government shown how much "income" is from the rest of the country. I don't just name England, as until each leaves the United Kingdom, they are all funding
Link to this (Comment number 504)
Comment number 503.
ThomasWoods10th October 2012 - 12:42
On the subject of voting age.
At 16 you can currently:
1.Marry
2.Legally have intercourse and create life
3. Join the army and take life in the defence of your nation
4. Leave School
5. Get a full time job and Pay taxes.
If you can create a life, fight for your country, work and pay taxes WHY be denied the vote? It's these young people that will have to live with the decisions made in 2014.
Link to this (Comment number 503)
Comment number 502.
Removed10th October 2012 - 12:43
All this user's posts have been removed.Why?
Link to this (Comment number 502)
Comment number 501.
JPublic10th October 2012 - 12:43
I must add that although I feel it a great shame for both Scots and Welsh to vote for independence, I confess to be slightly hypocritical because I want us to have a referendum on the EU!!
I want us to be in the EU with an updated EEC-type agreements but absolutely do not want an EU Superstate but Scotland and Wales I hope will remain British!
Link to this (Comment number 501)
Comment number 500.
hew-and-cry10th October 2012 - 12:42
Given that most of the benefits are required in central scotland, and that the hardest working and most non-reliant are at the peripheries, what will happen if/when Shetalnd/ Orkney/ the borders vote to stay UK? Will salmond accept it and have a small rump Scotland? Will the islandsa dn Borders be allowed to keep "their" oil? Big silence on this...
Link to this (Comment number 500)
Comment number 499.
BullCats10th October 2012 - 12:42
I'm Scottish and British first Scottish second. The SNP are pathetic. Blatant gerrymandering giving 16 year olds and 17 year olds a say. Regardless, this crazy plan for independance will be rejected - just as 2/3 of the Nation who recently took part in a consultation against Homosexual marriage rightly rejected that as well. By at least the same margin.
Link to this (Comment number 499)
Comment number 498.
leftrightleftright10th October 2012 - 12:42
Being English I personally don't really care about Scottish independence, I hope that if there is a yes vote independence lives up to the expectations of the Scottish people. I also hope that here in England we will then only have English MP's voting on English issues!
Link to this (Comment number 498)
Comment number 497.
ontheroadscot10th October 2012 - 12:42
The separatist arguments simply do not convince. No post-separation vision, no tolerance of debate, bribing the electorate with free but unaffordable pre-referendum goodies, manipulating schoolkids, refusal to release crucial legal advice, the list goes on and on.
Ok many Scots don't like the Tories, but that is a rather petty reason to destroy the United Kingdom.
I will definitely vote No.
Link to this (Comment number 497)
Comment number 496.
Sword of Truth10th October 2012 - 12:41
@488
You do not. But you cannot deny entry in ports of other NATO members ships and submarines.
You need to read into it a bit more.
Link to this (Comment number 496)
Comment number 495.
bloodpressure10th October 2012 - 12:41
@435 'Martyman'
~~
Good post. 16-17yr olds are affected by tax laws if they are earning money. There can be mature heads on young shoulders. The right to vote still discriminates against the above age group.
If Salmond/Sturgeon wants these young voters, on an independence referendum, then they should be promising a vote after, whether independence goes through or not. Otherwise, hypocrisy?
Link to this (Comment number 495)
Comment number 494.
Trout Mask Replica10th October 2012 - 12:41
"davidmelamedoff
Switzerland has been forced to agree over 120 treaties with the EU"
Switzerland hasn't been "forced" to do anything. It has as a sovereign nation agreed to treaties where it gets some benefits in return for some costs. Just like all EU members.
"Which model for Scotland?"
And which for the UK? As you listed there are quite a few variants of "out"!
Link to this (Comment number 494)
Comment number 493.
Lagerlord10th October 2012 - 12:41
150 Bentianavaig “Scotland won't have to sign up no more than Ireland had to”
Ireland joined the EU in the 70s. Scotland didn’t.
J Barraso, 11/2011 “no more countries would be allowed to opt out from the single currency” – would probably apply to Schengen too.
The EU support Schengen and all would have to agree to Scotland’s opt out of the Euro and Schengen before Scotland joined.
Link to this (Comment number 493)
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