Education Essex's Mr Drew on school uniform being cool
28 August 2014 Last updated at 10:02 BST
School uniform will never be cool, and it is not meant to be, says Brentwood County High School headteacher Stephen Drew.
Better known as Mr Drew from TV's Educating Essex, he hoped young people would continue to push against the boundaries.
On Today with John Humphrys, he debated with style blogger Lily France as Marks and Spencer starts to market school uniform as looking cool without breaking the rules,
First broadcast on BBC Radio 4's Today programme on Thursday 28 August.