Talking Jersey

Gerard Mooney
I totally disagree with Deputy powers comments. I have been living in Jersey continously for the past 9 years and I am fedup linig greedy Jersey landlord's pockets. Why can there not be a seperate law for rentals as unqualified properties are extortionately priced and the choice is few & far between. I feel strongly about this as my wife & I who have just had a child are placed under immense financial and emotional strain because of this discriminate and archaic law!

H Horse
What we need is an immigration policy, work permits - for all jobs. Police record checks and an ability to speak english. Similar to Australia in othe words.

Allan
The current cost of accommodation causes other problems, I know people in failed relationships who are staying together because they'd be homeless otherwise. That isn't right. We need to get rid of the ridiculous practice of allowing non-residents to own residential property; that would reduce demand for share transfer flats etc and prices would settle to more affordable levels for residents.

mr b
I hear jersey people going on about keeping the rif raf out surely if you are rif raf you cant afford to buy anyway

Dan
keep it at 12 there isn't enough room here!

Norman
Deputy Power says he himself has lived in some of the worst accomodation in Jersey. Shouldn't he be directing his efforts to stop greedy landlords charging outrageous rents for substandard accomodation, with the States legislating that the tenants should have no rights? Look through the ads - rooms to rent, share facilities, suit quiet couple, £165 per week - PURE GREED. What difference is reducing the qualies age down to 10 years going to make - insignificant, the market is overpriced and no funds available.It's not only potential homebuyers who would like a 10 year qualy period, there are many tenants out here who would like security of tenure and acceptable housing standards. There has to be a better way of regulating migration, other countries manage it.

John
This has to be the funniest article I have read for a long time. What a great example of the meaning of qualifications in Jersey - a thread of comments written with poor spelling, punctuation, grammar and lack of understanding of your own politics, laws and rights. In my day qualifications were awarded for a good education.

I am not 'local' and do I need to be, there is plenty of property available to rent unqualified and buy share transfer. You just can't normally live in the property you own without the long wait. People in the UK and abroad own thousands of Jersey properties without any sort of 'quallies'. Your qualification system is exactly what makes it so profitable to buy your property and rent it back to you. Ask any estate agent here, half of all Dandara properties are buy to let and it is only profitable because the qualification system helps keep prices artificially by creating an incentive for those with more money to speculate on the price of property so easily and rent to those with less money and access to mortgages.

You can make your 'quallies' 2 years or 20 years again, nothing will stop the over-due house price crash here and all house price volatility is bad for communities whichever direction it goes. Perhaps you need a genuine immigration control procedure here and to stop naively supporting the outdated system that causes as many problems without solving the real issues it pretends to address. You are all concerned with and that is the quality and acceptability of your neighbours, that is good but the current system does not work so you need to campaign for one that does. Perhaps look at the Australian migration system and get some advice from professionals that have more experience and resources to make a real working system instead.

surferking
People claim that the qualification system is a means of population and house price control? Nonsense - think about it...

Why is it that so many people with or without housing qualifications can own more than one property in Jersey? Who do you think owns all the property being rented?

House prices are out of control because of massive buy to let ownership. Ban second home ownership on the island and you would very quickly find that every single local and non-local could afford to buy a house.

If so many people are renting in Jersey, that means that someone else owns their house, that means those houses would then become available to buy for families that wanted to commit to the island because they are prepared to by and invest in a piece of it. Why do you think your town looks like one of the rougher areas in England, why would a landlord want to paint a property when it is not necessary to rent it out. Wake up, rural England has far better quality and looking housing and towns because the people that live there can take pride and improve the place that they can own a small share in.

Housing qualifications don't work. You need house 'ownership' qualifications.

ONE FAMILY, ONE PROPERTY!

If you really want to control migration you need a proper application procedure for Jersey citizenship to assess and know about every single person living here, not just those that choose to buy a house.I don't know why people would want to buy here when there is such draconian government discouraging people from investing in the place they live. Rents are cheaper than mortgages here so you are better off renting and watching the house prices fall. People rarely 'own' their house, they merely rent if from the bank with the benefit of profiting from any rises in prices. However, in a falling market, you are better off renting from a private landlord where you will not lose from the fall in property prices.

Jersey is just a very small place with some nice things but the only people who think it is the greatest place in Britain obviously haven't seen anywhere else.

I'll await with interest to see what happens. My prediction is that until second home ownership is addresses you will always have a house price problem, which is exactly what the second home owners want.

If you don't have qualies, no problem, rent from a landlord that is charging less rent than the property would costs in mortgage payments so you same money each month and if you really want to own a property, fine, buy any one of the thousands of share transfer properties and rent it out to a locally qualified person that can't afford to buy because you can buy somewhere but just can't live in it.

Come on people, wake up, the loopholes are numerous and the policy doesn't work. You are all debating a policy that is just awkward and protects a few better off people. If you can't beat them, join them. Rental prices are the true supply and demand measure of the value of a property because they are so quickly adjusted. So take advantage of you local multi property owner and rent from them at a rate well below the mortgage on the same property at todays prices. Then if you really think you want to own somewhere, buy it share transfer and pay an over-inflated price to lose money each month on the mortgage but rent it to a person with qualies because they can't or won't buy.

Until the family unit is protected and promoted with a policy to prevent multiple home ownership on the island I think this debate will continue forever.

Good luck everyone local and those coming here to work hard to be a part of the island. Don't let this divide family and friends. You all pay the same taxes so lobby your elected representative that you as a tax payer employ to prevent multiple home ownership and if they don't listen, sack them by finding and voting for someone that will help change the island and policies for the better and help bring us all together again to work for a better island for all that work, live and pay tax here.

jonno
Hardship??? Wait for 20 years lik I did, then you will know the true meaning of the word

monica conlon
the 13 year residency rule is very unfair.my parents like my grandparents were born and bred in jersey, but had to leave against their will during the war. my aunties and uncles remained, and are now buried here. i have recently moved to jersey,and feel like i have come home...but i cannot buy one! i could...but i could not live in it! so, should i do what wealthy investors are doing? buy a big house...fill it full of tenants, make alot of money...without even having to live on the island!is that fair?

Alumini
Jersey has a great education system, and students fair better than their uk conterparts with a high % going to University. However, they lose many many of the graduates because of high costs and housing. This is a shame as in turn the Finance sector has to source outside of the island to fill the seats in their firms. I remember when the majority of university grads return to jersey, I would say the return now is well below 50%! Jersey's loss alround. Don't think there is a solution. Imagine in 20 years when there's no space left to build let alone buy a house. Still with the Jersey Tomato growers retiring, only think going now is the cow, will the states release more green to help the first time buyer

Andrew
OK for the Senator, he'll be all nice and cosy. Maybe him and his cronnies have unqualified accommodation that they rent out. Why doesn't he look seriously at the rental cost differences, and other factors which make the unqualified sector people suffer a higher cost of living than those in the qualified market. What a waste of rent too that may have gone to a mortgage. Yes, some sort of population control is needed, which is fair to those already here. I've been here 10 years now, very happy with the quality of life, but it would be even better if the housing situation was dealt with.

Manx Bean
To be honest, I don't know if 'qualies' has ever worked. I was born in Jersey (as had many generations of my family), educated in Jersey and only left for 5 years to serve Queen and Country. When I returned and got married in 1986, I simply couldn't afford to buy anything. Back then, the situation was so desperate that you could only apply in writing to view a house (I kid you not), and a 3-bed semi was over £90k. I know its all relative - but that it my precise point. In the 22 years that have elapsed since then, nothing appears to have really changed. And yes, I gave up in 1988 and moved to the Isle of Man where I bought a 3-bed bungalow for £40k and have lived here ever since. So, as much as anyone else has, I have tremendous sympathy and empathy with the young people of Jersey who are so desperate to have their first home. Good luck to you all.

Flash
If all the outsiders left, would it be possible to re-identify farmers from St Ouen and St Brelades by the colour of the Jerseys that their wives knitted for them at home?!

Sarah
Although this debate is a year old i will add a comment.I am a uk born who is engaged to a jersey born. When i moved over here i took jobs that 'only the poles take' like cleaning holiday apartments, and receptionist at a hotel. My fiancee who is jersey born worked with a factory full of poles for play.com last christmas. So saying that the locals wouldnt do those jobs is utter crap.Yes immigration should be stopped at a certain point. flooding the island with people isnt a good idea and the rules should be introduced in the uk.

Sevans
I agree with Mr Le Mains comments in respect of loyalty to the Island. I waited 20 years for my qualies. That is the way of life in Jersey, first bedsits, then flats and then if you are lucky enough to be able to buy a place of your own. This is a very small Island and we must have an immigration deterrent in place. Ten years is not too long.

Darren
This Island is built on racist, xenophobic, them and us values and anyone who was raised elsewhere can see right through it !! Quallies will never drop below 10 years because a lot of the 'businessmen' that run this island own the property that is rented out. Le Main knows this and therefore common sense will never be applied because pity any politician who rocks the boat.

The funny thing is apart from a few proper inbreds the true Jersey bean doesnt exist. It would be interesting to see exactly how many Jersey families havent been 'watered' down by English, Irish, Scottish, Portuguese or French people.

You SAD bunch of whingeing racist hypocrites, why cant you stop moaning about 'immigrants' ? They have made this island profitable for you. Perhaps you would like a return to the days of brother sister love and brocolli farming???

Andrew
Too many people equals disaster. Just ask anyone who lives on the UK mainland.

poor graduate
I'm from the UK and I'm currently debating whether to take a job working in Jersey. Frankly I'm put off moving here by the housing policy that Jersey has. I understand that there is a need to limit immigration to such a small island and that local people need places to live to, but your housing policy is draconian in its effect against non quals and although it obviously works, as evidenced by my questionning whether to move or not, must have the effect of putting off some of the world's most talented graduates fom moving to jersey, and thus denying Jersey the benefits that they generate economically.

frustrated
I am from the UK and been in the island for 10 years working in the finance industry, i do not mind the wait for quailies, but what does annoy me that during the wait I have to put up with poor accomadation standards, high rates and worse of all no rights. Why can't we have equal rights for all tax payers, but more importantly the right to privacy and better standards for non-quailified people!!!

student
Terry le Main is old-fashioned and narrow minded! When i rang to ask him about alternative solutions other than ending up homeless he said there was nothing in his power he could do to help me or my family. I have lived on this island for 5 years. During this time i have been accepted into Hautlieu (a free grammar school) and asked to join the school for Gifter and Talented Youth because of my high grades. Senator Frank Walker had an interview with me telling me i am a great asset to this island, but it seems that im not good enough to be able to actually live on this island. I'm fed of of Jersey's stupid way of looking at things!

poormanhighrates
when we looking into houses average prices 350tds to 500tds for 3 bedroom?and the cost of life in Jersey,why care about Qualies

nuno correia
bobqualies should be raised to thirty years, and only given to people who pay alot of tax!no portuguese or polish should get them ever. ahahhah did you see wat caind of comment this so call de bob the ...? made?is this the way to go being racist??? can only bee from some narow minded person .wat is the diference from portuguese or polish ,englishs,irish ,bean,or any of the other race .i ask ??? maybe my english money is not has good as bob~s money . so the money that i pay two tax man is not good but he never complain?im just gona say someting that not many english people now? the first portuguese person on this island whas ,in 1936 so that must mean someting .and we are still here doing the jobs that most people dont ?????? and who are the oldest friends of the english?since 1437? i just wana say that people need people ?and there is no need to be racist two any caynd of race or bellevye.we only live once.and next time all see bob the ??? im gonna make shure that all give him a pice of my mind , take care everybody and try dosentwo be nice. we are all in the same island

mr b
jersey people who do they think thay are.most of them arnt full jersey anyway they think they own the island people from outside work vey hard to make a good life for them selfs ,is the right to buy a house such a big stink for the locals or are the just trying to cling on to a vanishing thing (a true jersey been)

Kate
I leave here from 3years, came over just for 3months to improve my English and believe it or not I fell in love with this island!!!i'm Polish with a degree,however having small chances to find a better job I started from hospitality..after 1.5year I moved into finance....I'm not selfish and in a way understand that you want to protect your island but I feel that some people should be given a chance to get those quals earlier...or maybe prices should drop down a bit...It's really said when I hear that people who were born here are buying flats in my country while I can't do the same over here. I want to contribute to this island but having to wait for 8more years, I'm not sure whether I'll still be here...as being here can't be called a normal life. And if it comes to racism...I'm proud of where I come from and I think that in each nation we've got those "good" and "bad" people...please don't forget about English people going to my country...can they behave during a night out??? Exactly...so please don't judge all of us..as everyone is different!

Sarah
Good it shouldnt be dropped anymore. Drop it anymore and its an open invitation to anyone who wants to come over here. And i DONT have qualies

H Horse
With the ongoing crisis in banking, banks like UBS and Citigroup writing off billions because of poor lending in the US, Jersey will be affected. There will be fewer jobs. Jersey has been 'booming' for the past few years which has added thousands to this over crowded island. So I think things, including the overpriced housing market are going to change this year

Rita
Having read nearly all of the answers to the "qualification Topic"i could go on and on and probebly repeat a lot of what has been written, BUTi agree wholeheartidly with those that say DO NOT DROP THE QUALIFICATIONS they are low enough already ys that's what i said low enough i to had to do my time 10 to rent 10 to buy but by the time my twenty yrs came around i circumstances had changed, needless to say i have worked and lived here for 30 plus years why should they be lowered? as has been said most imigrants come and work here and send there money back home (fact) and also most of the imigrants Have caused more trouble Drugs fighting etc sinec there arrival some 2years since the eu opened there gates!!!! i could go on babies being born mothers able to claim benefits etc its pretty disgusting what jersey allows really no wonder we are all becoming disaisfiedliving here the best thing is although i have lived here so long if i left for any length of time (5yrs) i would lose my housing qualifications and decided to return at a later date i would have lost my qualifications how bad is that?

Phyllis
I was born in Jersey in 1941,I left to train as a teacher in 1960. I always hoped to return but I know that it is now impossible for me to do so.I visit whenever I can, what can be better than walking along the causeway at Corbiere on a glorious day at any time of the year?

bob
qualies should be raised to thirty years, and only given to people who pay alot of tax!no portuguese or polish should get them ever.

pe
I lived on jersey for six years did my best did'nt get anywhere moved to Oz have great family two new car's own my own house, just get out once those small minded beans are off your back it all comes good.It's great to look from the outside and see what a beautiful island it is but is spoilt by the local's. get out and live life.

Claire
If the average price of a 3 bedroomed house is in the region of £340,000 - £370,000, how much do you think it would rise if the qualification period is lowered and hundreds/thousands more people come onto the property market? Property prices would go through the roof. People can't afford to buy at the moment as it is. Unfortunately the quallies system is a necessary evil and Senator Le Main is taking the only approach possible.

Tony B
They should have to live like we do, over priced accommodation full of damp and draughts, Landlords that live with their girlfriends and turn the heating down so that we have to have electric fires on to keep warm in the winter, making us have yet another overpriced bill to pay.These are not ministers, they don't have to worry about bills, these are rich dinosaurs and the sooner they go the way of their close brothers and sisters the better. Since I started to live and work over here (4 years ago now), I have had to spend over three quarters of my savings, mostly moving from one damp and cold accommodation to another for the health of my wife (5 times so far) so now I don't even have enough for a deposit back in England. If that is not commitment to the island I don't know what is.Jersey use to be a nice place to live, but with the growing problem of unruly children over here, drunks on the streets and attack incidents that the police never seem to attend until its too late, it aint that great any more.

Emma
your housing policy stinks, I spent my childhood in Jersey holidaying many times a year and I have friends in Jersey, but seeing how they struggle with housing put me off accepting a job in a place I fell in love with and could contribute to. I now live in Poole which is just as lovely and my friends from Jersey are planning to move to the mainland, surely you should want to encourage new blood to your beautiful island?

Kev
Jersey has it right - just look at what the influx of foreigners is doing everywhere else. There can be no argument. The facts show this.

Osvaldo Silva
The world Do not know the descrimination, the suffer of the emigrants in this Island, land lords switching off fridges for two months on the summer time for minor incidents etc etc.

Peter
Jersey wants to do business with the world, so it should expect people from around the world wanting to come here. Everyone should have the right to live here, and as long as they contribute to the island, say by paying tax etc. they should be entitled to buy. If Jersey were so concerned about keeping properties for the locals, then why do they allow the "rich" to purchase multiple properties here. Some people own hundreds of properties. Restrict people to one property, and there would be enough for all.

angela
I think there shouldn't be a wait for genuine Jersey born people to come back.My father would like to return to the island, he was the only member of his family to leave. He left to join the RAF. And now this barrier to him returning is sad.

Dean
We seem to have to keep on repeating ourselves "this is a little island 5 miles by 9"; it is low tax (well supposed to be); there are lower crime rates because it is a heavily policed little island and everybody wants to live in it....Jersey was a good place to settle perhaps in the 60s/70s but no more. If I had a child and was paying silly money for sub standard accomodation I would go. You only have one life so why spend it living like that?

Cyranno
Although anyone choosing to spend ten years or more in Jersey should perhaps be denied property rights due to insanity, it is outrageous that such racist and anachronistic practices should be allowed in an ethnically British island while the rest of europe live in modern, open and democratic societies.

palo
shut up

Niamh
I am shocked by some of the comments below particalry the coldness of some of the locals views towards immigrants. My partner and I have been here for 8 years have served our time doing low paid jobs and have both worked hard to improve our skills, having had a baby last year we are struggling financillay , my partner now has to work at night time while I work during the day as we unable to afford £2000 for rent and day care.

the accomdation we have is not worth the money we pay for it , we have been looking for new accomdation but with prices now about £340 a week and most places not taking children we really dont have much choice but stay where we are.

I know I will get comments back from people saying "well leave , you dont have to be here" , but it is our home now , we have frineds and family here and I want my child to grow up in a safe place. Why cant we all have the right to rent good quality property and property that can be a home for your child? I understand the idea behind having restrictions on buying but on rentals it's crazy, we all do our bit for the island.

Matt
Nearly £500,000,00 for a starter home??? I wouldn't even bother waiting for quals there is no point anymore, Jersey is being reach for most now.

Garry
People seem to be moaning and moaning, but why are they in Jersey in the first place? Is it because the wages are higher and 20% is the maximum tax? It is all economies of scale.

I hear many Polish complaining these days, and whilst I agree that some prices of bed sits in Jersey are obscene, there only contribution to Jersey is to take money out of the economy and send it back to Poland. Many are coming to Jersey and having children in the Island after a couple of years and stupidly expecting to get special treatment for it.

I think before they make any changes to the housing qualification period they have to view the long term effect on accommodation, social services and most importantly jobs, because I don‘t believe people just want to live in Jersey for it‘s beaches.

nuno
hello amigos .i cant belevie .on wat this island is turning in to.this caind ot tretment of housing rules .i can be trown out on the street by my lanlord .because i cant find a flat.for me and my wife and baby to born in october.end of the story, housing sorry cant do anyting, the states ,dont care, of wat happens

Dr C
I am a recent 'import' to Jersey (12 months) and am set to be here for a further year before returning to the UK to complete my training. I love Jersey, it is a beautiful island with some of the friendliest people I've ever met, but at no stage have I laboured under teh misunderstanding that I should have then right to stay here forever! On the contrary, coming from an area of Dorset (Poole) where houseprices have rocketed due to 'rich city-types' buying second homes and buy-to-let properties for the holiday market I feel more places should adopt a Jersey-like policy. Even as a junior doctor on a supposedly reasonable wage I can't afford to contemplate living near my parents in the area I grew up in. If they adopted a similar, 'show-some-dedication' scheme (!) to Jersey then maybe less people would be forced out of there home counties in the UK! As as someone else pointed out, us 'immigrants' knew the score before we moved here so we should either enjoy what time we do have here or just shut up and go home! No one forced me to come here, but I'm very glad I did :-)

nuno
hello just a few words.

we are all human beans. we brethe the same air an drink the same beer, so way not be equal im from madeira and to say that im not comited to this island is rong im on this island 11 years never been of work always paid my bills tax social etc etc i start my working live where away from my country my friends, familie culture etc etc etc so if thats not committment y dont not wat committment is??????

thats live over ir ist turning in to a place that im not shore if y want to raise mi kids over ir. there is noting more than,greedness. racist abuse. and much much more...lovely island for the polish. portugese no longer welcome but i can say this jersey be carefull the future is not brithe

John
NO HOUSING QUALIES? JOIN THE EQUAL HOUSING RIGHTS PEACEFUL PROTEST ROYAL SQUARE SATURDAY 30 JULY 2007 11h00 a.m.

Without residential qualifications: ·

We are not entitled to enter into any form of lease!·

We are not entitled to security of tenure!·

We can be asked to vacate our homes at any time without notice!·

Our landlords retain exclusive rights over our accommodation and maintain the right to unrestricted access to our accommodation at all times!

Bring your posters and banners and show your support for people without residential qualifications.

We demand: · Recognition of our rights under the European Convention on Human Rights·

Equal rights for all tax payers·

The Right to respect for private and family life·

Security of tenure

STOP THE INEQUALITY!!

Claire
Jamie, I'm in the same position as you having been born on the Island but lived most of my life on the mainland. Whilst I agree with the concept that one must show committment to the Island before gaining quals it is difficult to do so whilst being ripped off by the sky high rents. However I've decided to bite the bullet and make Jersey my home. Ten years of drudgery will be worth it to finally be back were I feel I belong. If the time limits are reduced to 10 years for all immigrants though, i would like to see a shorter wait for Jersey Beans!

Carol
I think it should be lowered to 10 years max, with a view for renting purposes only. If people want to buy property here, then leave it as it is. There seems to be a fallacy about, if it wasn't for immigrants, we wouldn't have a 'Jersey'? Rubbish! We managed long before they came on the scene, and will continue to do so long after they have gone. Pubs etc have nothing to do with it. Housing has a ruling, , women & children go at the top of the list, ill-health people and then Jersey people over 50ish. Least that's how's it's been at the beginning.

Nick
Hopefully the UK can arrange a reciprocal arrangement. Our island too is over crowded with 60 million plus people, I propose to Westminster that Channel Islanders have to live in the UK for 10 years before they can buy property here.

Dave A
I arrived in jersey 33 years ago,like most people i have worked hard raised a family and am fortunate enough to be able to afford to buy a home,however before this i have lived in some really poor accomodation with landlords who do not seem to care about the state of the properties they let out. The housing minister should devote some of his time in bringing in legislation to combat these bad landlords. Most decent landlords look after their tenants and provide decent conditions .as for lowering the qualifying period i think it is set correctly but a small change in the law where you can have say a 6 month break to travel without losing the time you have lived here counting towards your qualifing period

Jamie
I was born in Jersey and although I only spent the first two years of my life there I believe I should have the right to live there as I feel it is my home and every time I've visited it I want to stay. I would do anything to qualify but it's hard to live there for ten years with out a anywhere to stay.

Alan
This isn't rocket science. The Island is 45 sq miles. If anybody could live in the island, accomodation, jobs and social services would be hammered. A typical narrow minded comment saying "Racist" from a Poster that is blind to the bigger picture.

John
How RACIST are some of you!? Jersey residents have all the advantages of holding UK passports including the right to live work and buy and sell property on the UK mainland and in the EU and yet this freedom and privildged is not reciprocated. Why ? I suspect that someone will eventually challenge this anomaly in a European court. What is so special about Jersey that it has to be protected !? In my experience its an exclusive club that likes to take much and give little. And the businesses there charge so much and yet standards are incrdeibly poor compared to other EU country. All talk and little substance.

wendy
I think that jersey is a lovley place my home I dont think the housing law should drop below 10 years we just dont have the room to house everyone, im jersey born and I cant afford to buy here and I have worked hard all my life I do not spend all my time down the pub like paulo thinks, how rude can you get.Jersey has a limited space and we have to protect it for the few locals that are left.

P Lee
The poplulation of the island is too high. The qualifcation period should never be reduced below 10 years. Immigrants should never be given states housing. If you do not have suitable accommodation for children - do not have them.

unowho
I have been resident in Jersey since the very early nineties and have "had a break" of my continous residency for personal reasons to return to my "home" (I mean where is my home I have lived in Jersey longer than from where I was born ***where is my home?***) I have recently been refused my qualies and have been told I have to start my residency from 2003 when I returned, like it or lump it ive been told, which means at the current status of 12 years residency to qualify I have another 7 years till I can qualify which means I will have lived here for 23 years with one short break of a few months. If thats not committment then what is???

Keith
If the Polish and Portuguese left, then Jersey would just invite other nationals to do jobs in hospitality, horticulture etc. Jersey has always enjoyed good employment levels for decades and the idea that Finance will go down when we have a recent 30% rise in deposits is nonsense. The only thing that will change in Jersey is the cost of living here. This is already making locals look elsewhere, never mind the people that come here to work because they cannot get employment from the places they came. People will always come to Jersey to work, no matter what the accommodation is like. They will whinge and whine like they have been doing for decades, but on the face of it, as a Post said before, they are unskilled. Working in a shop or driving a lorry is hardly highly skilled employment, but many believe they are which is daft really, in comparison to some of the jobs people are needed for.

Roger
It is the usual self protectionism. Any other free democracy would leave it to a supply and demand situation. If there is enough work on the island then there should be enough housing. If there is no work, then people would look elsewhere and the housing would not be required. Those in Ivory Towers should not penalise the less fortunate just to preserve there excesive way of life. Jersey will eventually go into a major decline for this shallow self centred attitude. The tourism now regarded as expensive without the quality of its European competition is already in trouble. That leaves the finance sector which eventually will be frozen out by major players overseas. I would think a major overhaul is necessary to prevent Jersey from slipping behind and becoming an uninteresting backwater like so many other isolated islands.

paulo
if portuguese an polish people sudnly leav jersey for any reazon . shurly will be the end of jersey ...the hardest jobs like - agriculture , restauration , cleaning e.t.c. in fact 90% of the dirty and hard jobs are done by immigrants . because locals are lazy and unable to do it .they rather spent every singel days on the pubs holding a pint while immigrants are cleaning their mess ...

Jason
The housing law is to stop over crowding. If you goto any other small island you will find similar laws in existance. I think it is pretty daft to come to a small place and expect to have preferential treatment to the 100's of 1000's that have done the same over the past 3 decades. If everybody could buy then prices would be sky high (which they are already) and people born in the island would be stuffed even more.

HMJ
As a recent arrival to the Island I am still coming to terms with the blatant discrimination that exists here. As the housing departmnet so kindly put it 'we knew the score before we arrived'. We did know that we would not be able to buy a property, what we didn't know is that we'd be paying 150% more than a qualified person to rent the equivalent house. I can buy a house on the Island tomorrow but I can't live in it. Where is the logic? Does anyone else see how this conflicts with the new Human Rights (Jersey) Law?

David
Mark Reed, I think you will find that the UK has a little more space than Jersey.

Mark Reed
If people from Jersey can take UK jobs with no need to show commitment to that island, why do UK people need to do the same. This is discrimination by the back door and islanders should be ashamed.

Craupaud not on the rock
I am Jersey born, (my family has been on Jersey for about three hundred and eighty years), and left the the Island to go into the Army, to fight for my country having left the Army, I was told by housing not to "settle in Jersey as there is not enough accommodation”, okay I thought I'm off...Thirty years later I own four properties, had a great job live in a great country in EU, I had no probs with passport stamp...can travel any where I want with out paying exorbitant prices to get on to a boat live in Jersey? I would not live in Jersey for all the Tea in China…….Holiday in Jersey? Up until about three, or four years ago I would take the trouble to travel to Jersey at least twice a year (for about forty years) ………..now? Its far too expensive, went to Australia a couple of years ago, cost about what it would have cost to get to Jersey…..Leave the Island to the Immigrants get out while you can……..

Tania Hacquoil
I am also Jersey born but left because I couldnt afford to live therea any more. I hope to return one day.

karen marie
I am Jersey born and would love to live there again one day,but looks impossible if I want a council house.

Ram
Housing qualifications should exist only for people who would like to live on the island for over a period of time. Why should qualification exist for rentals. There is a basic need for people to have good place to live in and not lodging houses or Hotels.

Al
I am surprised the States are even looking at changing the housing Qual period. Reports of over 10,000 Poles here (not including family that have come in), Bulgaria soon to join the EU, no census done for a few years now, and worries about job competition. Jersey has hit it's peak on immigration and don't forget that the States lowered the requirements for 1.1.K people 3 years ago. If they lower it now it could be a disaster. Jersey should start looking after it's own.

James
Too many people here and I do not believe the qualification period should be altered. ID cards and a census should be done first anyhow.

JONO
SPOT ON GTR!!!

Jane Hill
I wrote an interesting letter in support of GTR. I can see however that it isnt here. I hope your not sexist at the BBC? Anyway go GTR your the finest simply!!!

Jane Hill
I know GTR personally and i can tell you he is the nicest person you could meet Ok he dosent drink or smoke but he is always there when anyones in trouble.You wont find him in the pub ever and perhaps the best thing is he never runs anybody down.Broad mindedness is shown in tolerance no matter what the size of the island,and like he quite rightly points out it,s just insular "bumpkins" that cant intergrate that pick on others from differdent backgrounds.I promise you this is a very clever guy and a pleasure to know,Jane x.

Keith
I agree with Dave, everybody wants to live in Jersey, Polish, Portuguese, English and many other people from the E.U. But how many more people can this island take? Accusing people of being racist when all they are doing is preventing future social problems is very narrow minded.

J.J FAIRLIGHT
IF YOU ASK A LOCAL TRADESMAN JERSEY PARTICULALY TO DO A JOB EXAMPLE BUILDING PLUMBING OR WHATEVER,THEY CANT BE BOTHERED TO TURN UP FOR DAYS OR EVEN WEEKS. AT LEAST THE POLES OR ANYONE ELSE FROM ELSEWHERE TURNS UP DOES A BETTER JOB AS THEY ARE MORE INTELIGENT AND WORK AS HARD. AS THE LOCALS DONT APPRECIATE THE MONEY AS IT OBVIOUSLY COMES TO EASY TO THEM. THEESE PEOPLE ARE KEEN TO DO THE JOB AS MONEY DOSENT COME SO EASY LIKE TO THE SPOILT JERSEY PEOPLE.

Dave
I think GTR is going off on a tangent, poor immigration has created divides in the UK its all over the news. How many times do I have to say this, the island is 45 sq miles. It is not the size of Warsaw its small. If people like GTR were in charge of this island it would be forced into a state of decadence. People living in harmony as he puts it would change into dispair. The whole point of the housing qualification period is to stop the population going into over kill. If you cannot see that, then you are perhaps the type of person that Jersey could do without. I am fed up of hearing people moan when they always have the chance of returning home. For a person born here, that is not an option.

GTR
I ALMOST FORGOT,TOO ALL MY FRIENDS OUT THERE MENTIONED IN MY LAST POST,HAVE A WONDERFULL CHRISTMAS AND A HEALTHY NEW YEAR.MAY YOUR "GOD" GO WITH YOU GUIDE AND PROTECT YOU. SINCERELY "GTR"XX.

"The art of honesty"
Why is a seagull writing an opinion on theese pages? Seagulls are full of mouth birdbrains,and as the old addage goes empty vessels make the most noise.

GTR
I THINK AFTER SPENDING THIRTY YEARS MIXING WITH SO CALLED OUTSIDERS AS THEY ARE REFFERED TO I CAN VOUCH FOR WHAT RACISIM IS.I HAVE THE GOOD FORTUNE TO BE FREINDS WITH TWENTY SIX NATIONALITYS FROM AROUND THE GLOBE WHICH I FEEL IS AN EDUCATION IN ITSELF.ONE LEARNS ABOUT CULTURES TRADITIONS AND OTHERS FEELINGS WHICH I MUST SAY ARE GENERALLY THE SAME. HENCE EVERYBODY HURTS IN ONE WAY OR ANOTHER.THERE IS GENUINLY NOTHING BETTER THAN INTERGRATION TO EXPERIENCE HARMONY AND WELL BEING.PEOPLE SHOULD NOT BE PERSECUTED FOR TRYING TO BETTER THEMSELVES BY COMING HERE.IF I NEED A DICTIONARY DAVE THEN YOU NEED AN EDUCATION.BY SINGLEING OUT THE POLISH AS FOOTBALL HOOLIGANS PROVES THAT YOU ARE THE VERY POINT OF THIS DISSCUSSION "RACIST".IF YOU AN MANY OTHERS HAD AN OUNCE OF SENSE YOU WOULD BE ABLE TO SEE PAST SOMEBODYS RACE OR COLOUR,LOVE IS UNCONDITIONAL AN INTERNATIONAL LANGUAGE. THE FACT IS,SMALL MINDED BIGGOTS CANNOT HANDLE OTHERS SUCCESS,JEALOUSY IS A TERRIBLE THING INDEED!!!

Dave
I think GTR had better get a dictionary for a definition of racism, this old nutshell is forever brought up whenever people talk about immigration, it’s a weak defence. Jersey is a small island and everybody wants to live here. We do not force people to come here, they come on their own accord. If people are dumb enough to live in sub standard accommodation for 13 years then it must be much worse in the place from whence they came. As for racism, the Polish are notoriously racist, you only have to read the reports on their football matches to work that one out!

Phil
Everybody still wants to live here, yet they say "we pay taxes etc" but you pay taxes everywhere! Jersey is a small 45sq mile island and we should be tightening the qualification period now with the amount of poles that have just been let in. Perhaps it should be raised back to the old 20 years now like back in the 80s?

No Qual
I utterly agree with you, Sqn Leader C Gull!!

TL
Being in the island for almost six year now, paying Taxes, transferred several key skills to Jersey born people aswell as my children being born in Jersey, it is still not enough for decent accomodation at a fair price.

GTR
WITH REGARD TO JASON AND A.J AND ANY OTHER RACISTS OUT THERE,FIRST OF ALL NOT ALL POLISH PEOPLE HAVE CRAP JOBS MY WIFE IS FROM WARSAW AND IS A BANK MANAGER AT A RESPECTIBLE LEADING BANK. SECONDLY ALTHOUGH I HAVE A JERSEY FATHER I WAS BORN IN ENGLAND AND WE BOUGHT A NICE FARM HOUSE THIS YEAR THANKS TO MY POLISH WIFES HIGH EDUCATION AND GOOD JOB. SO YOU SEE FOR THE BENEFIT OF THE IGNORANT OUT THERE AND BY GOD THERE ARE PLENTY. YOU DONT NEED TO MARRY A "LOCAL" AND YOUR OFFENSSIVE STEREOTYPING TOWARDS OTHERS JUST SHOWS HOW IGNORANT YOU REALLY ARE!

C
This Islands [...], the states should of had an imigration policy years ago. They must stop the population increasing any more. If not local people and High/Medium Tax contributers to this Island will imigrate to other countries. All that will be left behind is a void of excess amounts of houses, shops and not much else. Stop the Polls/Eastern block coutry people coming here, they are just making this place an unemployment black spot for the locals who were born here.

E
Jersey born folk should be able to buy as and when they want - it's their island after all. I have been on the island for nearly 12 years and looking forward to the day when I can rent a decent property for a half decent rent unlike at the moment where I am paying through the nose for a bedsit and having to go to a laundrette for my washing. non-qual accommodation should be regulated and inspected with certain standards as there are some really awful places that landlords believe they can rent out for huge monthly rentals. I have worked in the finance industry for 9 years and have paid taxes and social security since the day I arrived on the island. I have moved accommodation over 11 times. I agree with the ruling on non-residents buying, but 10 years is enough to wait for anyone - surely if you are still on the island it shows you are committed?

Sqn Leader C Gull
The answer is simple. Marry a local. Although you will have to put up with their laziness and stupidity at least your will have a decent roof over your head. 

John Avery
As far as I am concerned the moment you pay your taxes, are eligable to vote then you should have every right to purchase and live in a house in Jersey. As a person who lived 15 years in Jersey being fleeced by dodgy landlords before I could finally own my own home I think it is an outrage that people are still coming here and living in rented substandard accomodation. The Housing Minister should be ashamed that mothers and their children still live in apartments with one bedroom, probably paying half her salary to someone local who cares not a jot about them. The problem with Jersey is that our rich fat cat Jersey Politicians are more than happy do dish out J "Cats" for any "rich" person who wants to own a property in the island, but be a worker in a shop etc, no chance, they have to go home to their bedsits. The Housing policy in Jersey is a disgrace. The sooner Senator Le Main and his kind are concined to the Political dustbin the better.

Paul
Immigration is an acknowledgement of the success of the island. Most of the immigrants are young, single people who do not take away much from the Government in terms of education and healthcare. There are exception, which no doubt, attract most of the headlines. The poles are getting the jobs that the youth of Jersey choose not to do; the regulation and undertakings act says if a Jersey person can do the job then it must be given to the Jersey person. At the moment the Jersey person chooses not to do this job so it is up to the immigrants to fill this void. We should be grateful for this as it allows our hotels and agriculture industries continue.

mary
i dont agree that jersey born should have to do 10 years! why? and i dont agree with the qualifications keep being dropped either when i arrived here a long time ago, i had to wait 10 years to rent with a further 10 to buy i to had hardship living in rotten places and unscrupulas landlords exploiting me and others i have no doubt, but jersey was a different place then! and to me has gone down dramatically so the answer to the question is yes we should keep the housing qualifications why not?

Phil Reeves
I think we seem to be forgetting that this isn’t the UK or Australia but an island of only 45 sq miles. Both rental arrangements are governed by supply and demand. If the housing laws were dropped altogether then rents would have to go up for all accommodation because anybody can move in. House prices would also go sky high because there are simply more buyers. As for doing jobs, locals don't want to do, this goes on throughout the world, and people that come to Jersey must be coming from a place that is disadvantaged in the first place. Either that or they have never worked hard enough to get a career of any sorts. I also believe people must be daft to start raising families when they know they have to wait for 13 years to get residence. People must stupid. I am weary of watching truck loads of people coming to Jersey, believing that a basic job in a hotel or in a restaurant makes them more special. In the end, as they earn little and thus pay less taxes, they are a burden if staying for the long term

dave
Phil Reeves please can you elaborate on your statement that rental prices will go through the roof if everyone has the same accomodation rights. If you go to the UK there isnt a clause saying that you will be charged more to rent a property because you weren't born there. Non qualified accomodation over here is appalling in many instances and it creates a divide.

Nobody should get an easy ride if they come over here and if they do not contribute to Jersey in a positive way then they should leave. However, I think its about time the whole 'non qualified' dinosaur was made extinct. After all, everybody knows that its just a way for greedy beans to make money.

Combine a workable housing policy with a workable immigration policy.

People who come over here to do the jobs that Jersey people will not do should not be saddled with renting badly maintained property at sky high prices.

Surely you can't disagree with that? Although I would expect a Jersey landlord who is fleecing immigrants to pick a hole in it.

Michelle
I also agree that an open door approach wouldn't necessarily work but what about the merit of a points system similar to that which is in place in Australia? Cases should be judged by what people can bring to the island. Generations of my family are from Jersey and my Mother and siblings live there now. I however am not allowed to buy a property for ten years which is ridiculous. Ultimately I am told that I cannot live close to my family, how is that fair?! The system is not right and should be reviewed, many people are in disadvantaged positions because of the rules but the current way of dealing with things doesn't actually seem to benefit anybody.

Phil Reeves
I don’t agree with giving all people the same accommodation rights because then rental prices will go through the roof. There should be a fair rental in place for non-qualified people with minimum standards set. As for people coming to Jersey and paying taxes, it doesn’t matter where you go in the world you still have to pay tax, either directly or indirectly, but becoming a fulltime resident there is a total different kettle of fish. Poland for example has hardly any Social Services and Jersey to a dead beat from Pole is a luxury. But if we carry on allowing more and more people to use our services then the standard will drop quickly, and we will be paying more and more tax in order to keep these services. I am weary of a lot of people that come to Jersey, thinking that the island owes them a living after a small amount of time. Why did they come in the first place? Unless they really do have skills and qualifications that are not around locally, then their worth really is debatable in the long-term if you want my opinion. Housing qualifications will have to be better means tested in the future if they want to avoid the island being over-run by people that are useless back in their home towns, be it Poland or anywhere else.

Neil Little - Southampton
my girlfriend is from Jersey and I holidayed there this summer. It's really a gorgeous place and I think well preserved given the population explosion of recent years. An open door approach wouldn't work and Deputy Le Main is spot on in his assessment as to whether persons are committed to living there for the future good of the island. It's a pity the mainland didn't approach such matters with the same vigour. This is a man with hhis head screwed on.

lj
well lets get rid of the old fashioned minister then.

*aj*
We should throw out any Polish person that has caused an offence, I am sick of the island being crammed full of free riders. The housing qualification period should be left alone. Everytime they lower it, there are more buyers in the market, thus higher prices.

dave
Its right to have a housing policy but it needs to be coupled with a workable immigration policy. Mr Le Mains comments of 'not on my watch' are so typical of many of this islands blinkered, biased and out of touch policies.

I disagree with any 2 tier society eg; qualified and non qualified housing. I dont agree with having to prove your commitment. If you have a job, pay your tax, buy local produce and contribute to this islands existence then why do you need to prove anything?

What about the people who are born here who have 2 or 3 kids by different dads and then expect housing and benefits without even attempting to get a job or the young smackheads or vandals......they dont need to prove their commitment because they're locals? We all know that this side of our society exists. The teenagers who commit assault and run amok on the weekend evenings are locals, they arent't schoolkids that fly over from the UK for a bit of weekend aggro. What commitment are they showing?

Jersey chooses its xenophobia and racism to suit its own needs. If a Polish or Scottish footballer or a Tongan rugby player is good enough to represent Jersey then why are they not good enough to have accomodation at the same price and standard as somebody who is born here?

Jersey is a wonderful place that is slowly being ruined by overdevelopment and greed and the whole issue of commitment is an amateur attempt to address a problem that many of our politicians are simply not equipped to deal with.

I say Common sense and a fair deal for decent hardworking people and suitable sanctions for those who believe they're entitled to an easy ride.

David
Even though many people point out that the island needs Eastern Europeans to fill jobs, I know of locals that have been put out of work by salary competition already by this “open door” approach, and these are people that have been paying taxes long before any Poles arrived. I also know of locals that have married young Polish women and have ended up adopting other members of the family. Personally I think Jersey has allowed far too many people in over the past 3 years and there have been numerous reports of crimes committed by Polish immigrants, which is hardly beneficial to the island. Work permits, criminal record screening and a census should be carried out before any change to the Housing qualification period is even considered.

Tony Whincup
Islanders are right to be protective of their wonderful island.

However, as an 'immigrant' working in Finance who contributes substantially to the island though tax, I should like to highlight a couple of misconceptions.

Many immigrants are highly skilled. Those who are not do work for wages and in conditions many Jersey-born people would NEVER consider to do. As with the industrious Portuguese, now with the Industrious Polish. Next time you sit sipping a coffee at the Wayside or have a bite at the Roseville Bistro, see who serves you. These are not jobs which would be otherwise filled by locals. This refutes totally the points made by Jason below.

There should, of course, be a limit to immigration. But the basic premise is that no-one could exist in Jersey without working and there are many jobs to be filled. It's an economic reality. The question is how best to preserve the cultural and environmental fabric of the island whilst not subordinating people like me to a secondary housing market of fixed prices. Many locals earn less than I and yet share in the rewards my taxes provide. The Island's current policy smacks of Rackmanism and lacks a vision of a sustainable future.

Sean
Housing quals should be lowered, to under 10 years. Jersey's population is aging fast and within 20 years these immigrants will be needed to support our economy. Coupled with that, so many young Jersey teens go off to Univeristy in the UK and do not return to take jobs in Jersey. Jersey is heading for disaster if it does not sort out its immigration and housing policy. It is time for the Bigotry (and underlying racism) of Jersey people to end and for them to join the 21st Century. This Island would be nothing without the Immigrants who have worked here in Jobs that others do not want to do. Lets make sure they feel welcome and stay.

james
Theres to many people on the island already and with eastern europeans looking for a better life we will be flooded with people which will put a strain on our resources i would like to see work permits introduced and checks on peoples criminal records. Jersey is beautiful but it is slowly being eroded by big developments.

Brands
When I was born my immigrant parents attempted to get onto the property ladder and failed, not because of economics, but legislation.

As my parents couldn't cope with the high cost of renting, they had to "emigrate" me to my grandparents' place until they could build up their finaces to rent a small place privately.

I spent my entire childhood in "caged" accommodation, like many other of counterparts.

Some of my Jersey friends keep asking me if I want to return to the island. I do toy with the notion; but realising that the average house here now costs circa £350k, and that the alternative would be to live in a cage, I would rather remain in Kent.

As for the desperate folks from Eastern Europe who work like slaves for pitiful wages and live in tiny,cramped and overpriced accommodation to fulfil the unrelenting greed of local landlords,I do not envy their plight.

I only hope that the local xenophobia brigade realise that, provided the slavs work, pay their taxes and respect law and order, their presence on the island is positive.

If the States had no need for the Slavic immigrants, they would not let them in. They are here to fill gaps in the local employment market.

Jayne
I'm just very worried that if we lower, or even get rid of altogether, housing quals Jersey will be flooded with people and hundreds of new buildings will go up all over our beautiful island.

Jon
The lowering of the qualification period should be reversed. There have been so many Eastern Europeans let into this island and more to follow, it appears that the States have no concerns about the ramifications of such a flimsy immigration policy. The Policy seems to be a case of keeping the developers happy and keeping the House prices high for first time buyers. This island is in for a catastrophic uproar at the next economic down turn and because so many people are being allowed in, job security is just too dodgy to take out mortgages anyway.

Jason
I think we seem to missing the amount of polish that have arrived (over 5,000), taken jobs that our young people have missed out of and are here to stay. Jersey should be rasing Housing Quals not lowering them. Its only an island of 45 sq miles.

Michael Jones
People born in Jersey should not have to wait to receive their housing qualifications, they should have them as soon as possible, as to people coming into the island, it would be a good idea to now start requiring work permits and make sure there is a job for the people that come into Jersey, this would cut down on the amount of drugs on sale over here and give our children a better start in life