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Message 21 - posted by sarahdoublet
(U11974315)
, May 16, 2008
BrentwoodChildminder - EYFS is not confusing - please have a good read through. Try it out. Ofsted have a job to do and they have to regulate us. All jobs involve change, all jobs have rules, regulations, guidelines - that is life ! You will not be spending hours arguing with Ofsted, EYFS is not a minefield. Have you actually read it through ? Have you actually attended training or a workshop and had it explained to you ? As for being left to get on with your job to a degree I agree, but you have to be regulated !! You are looking after children and you must be seen to do the best for them. That is why we have these guidelines. You work to the National Standards now, they are in there, you will probably work on birth to three even if you don't realise it that is in there too. I was not moved to tears by Pam - and if that makes me a bad person in your eyes then I am sorry. But I think that Pam is ill informed about EYFS, and needs someone to explain it to her properly. No job you ever do in this world will be the same as it was 5, 10, 15 or 20 years ago - that is a fact of life. It is called change, and change happens every where. I expect alot of people made a huge fuss when Ofsted took over from social services, but they are still childminding.
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Message 22 - posted by Celyn
(U2199514)
, May 16, 2008
I entirely agree with Sarah. I'm a registered childminder, too, and I am sick and tired of this patronising attitude of "poor childminders who are going to be so overwhelmed by paperwork" from those opposed to the EYFS.
The EYFS is being brought in for ALL early years practitioners. Why single out childminders? I am comfortable with the EYFS: I already do planning, observations and records, as do many of us, and it's not hard. My parents are very happy with what I do.
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Message 23 - posted by sarahdoublet
(U11974315)
, May 16, 2008
Most of the paperwork we do - present tense ! We do it now, I do not charge extra for this it is part and parcel of the job.
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Message 24 - posted by BrentwoodChildminder
(U11974726)
, May 16, 2008
From what you say you are obviously NOT a childminder as you would know that the rules and regulations regarding childminding are covered by the Children Act and it is this is the basis of countless other rules and regulations which childminders also have to abide by!!
When you say
"It was sad to hear such negativity about the EYFS which is aimed at supporting all early years providers to offer children rich and enjoyable learning experiences - playing and finding about the world. It offers childminding the chance to raise its status to the same level as other forms of provision, shaking off its Cinderella image."
You can't seem to grasp that many many many childminders already offer and provide children rich and enjoyable learning experiences and they do it through play without writing it all down. Just because it is deemed by some to be useful to jot things down doesn't make that something upon which to base a totalitarian draconian law and inflict it upon everyone without the slightest regard for their specific competences. I take issue with the "Cinderella" image - thats just spin to brainwash the gullable! As I have said before anyone who wants EYFS can have it if they wish I have no problem with that. I simply wish to choose to opt out as I don't need it - and I know I speak for many others from all walks of life (7000 or therebaouts who have signed the petitionagainst EYFS for instance!). Whatever happened to freedom of choice? This Government and its accolites appear to have forgotten what that is!!
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Message 25 - posted by hermeline
(U4006263)
, May 16, 2008
sarahdoublet <<It is called change, and change happens every where. >>
Change is fine - providing it is change for the better.
I'm not convinced that this iS change for the better.
Change for change's sake, more like.
<<You are looking after children and you must be seen to do the best for them.>>
Ah! So it's about being SEEN to do the best.
That is different from doing what IS best, methinks!
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Message 26 - posted by Arfa
(U226445)
, May 16, 2008
The OpenEYE group, which is a group of concerned academics (including Penelope Leach PhD, the president of the NCMA) who are concerned about the statutory and overly prescriptive nature of the EYFS have a petition on the No 10 web site. They are also concerned about some of the goals in the learning and development section of the EYFS. Please note, they are not asking for the EYFS to be scrapped. Instead, they are asking for it to be downgraded from statutory to professional guidelines. You can find the petition at petitions.pm.gov.uk/...and read more about the OpenEYE group at openeyecampaign.word...
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Message 27 - posted by savingchildhood
(U11974480)
, May 16, 2008
There are a number of issues that stand out for me from this thread. First, childminding (and nurseries too, come to that) should be as close to family life and as non-institutional as possible: they are NOT 'pre-schools', and the schooling mentality has no place in the lives of young children. The over-professionalised and 'audit-driven' approach of the EYFS is singularly inappropriate in the lives of our youngest children, and it can only detract from the kinds of high-quality attachment experiences that all research shows to be crucial at this age. The grave danger being that 'heart', warmth and emotional presence will be severely compromised in this crassly utilitarian framework.
Young children will gain far more from warm, natural, unhurried emotional engagement than they will lose by not having every last thing they do observed, monitored and recorded. There is a chronic "developmental-obsessiveness" about the new EYFS framework, founded on a fundamental ignorance about the way young children develop and learn (the more you try to measure and control it, the more you disrupt it). There is also a measurement-obsessiveness, too, that is at root anxiety-driven (largely unconsciously), with adults projecting their own unprocessed anxiety onto children and then manicly trying to get rid of it - not remotely realising that it's actually their own. Young children then get left to deal with all the anxiety that is being needlessly projected onto them, which then greatly complicates and intrudes into their very being, and distracts them from their natural and essential developmental tasks. Children’s developmental paths then become far more complicated to negotiate than they should be or need to be (e.g. their healthy physical development will suffer) – and this is precisely the effect that this new framework is already beginning to have across the country.
Just as the noxious SATS testing regime is thankfully about to topple, I predict that the worst excesses of this misguided framework will pretty soon be laid bare for all to see – and that day can’t come too soon.
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Message 28 - posted by BrentwoodChildminder
(U11974726)
, May 16, 2008
sarahdoublet Sorry Im not twisting anything of the kind if you don't explain yourself properly but if you could see my lips move you would see me say EYFS should be for them that want it - you obviously do - but I don't!
Let's not forget that this whole programme was about THE DRASTIC DECLINE IN THE NUMBER OF CHILDMINDERS and the effect the imposition of EYFS is having on their numbers. Liz Bayram (CEO of NCMA)was totally out of order saying that childinding numbers "ebb and flow" when Ofsted themselves produced figures recently for the last 5 quarters showing a continuous and drastic decline in numbers - this fall is directly related to the inception and build up to the EYFS. Similarly if you take it back even further to 1995 when there were 107,000 registered childminders - now there are just over 64,000 - thats over 40% down most if not all has been due to the ever increasing pressures put upon childminders by a Government hell bent on controlling every aspect of childcare good or bad. (Sorry Liz Bayram but you seem to be the only person who has not noticed that the tide has gone out and will not be coming back!)
So what on earth IS this Government doing when on one hand it promises to help mothers get back to work by providing more childcare places for them and on the other hand it is hell bent on driving the very people whom it wants to recruit away!!
Someone either wants to rid the childcare sector of childminders completely or has a very warped sense of directiom when implimenting Government policies.
My advice would be to have a moritorium on EYFS, stand back and have a real look at what it is actually doing to childminding as a whole. I can honestly say that unless something is done to stop all these very able and committed childminders like Pam from leaving in their droves then by 2015 when everyone is ALSO expected to have an NVQ3 in childcare (without taking the slightest noticed of everyones years of experience in childminding) - then there won't be many childminders left to care about!!
This Government has been accused of creating a NANNY STATE well it certainly will have to be just that as there won't be a childminder in sight!
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Message 29 - posted by allotment30
(U5485402)
, May 16, 2008
What about the people that pay for all this (i.e. the parents (and taxpayers who subsidise it all)?)
My children are 3 & 4 and have a fantastic childminder but I don't want any of this stuff. I talk to my childminder and find out that way what's going on.
I'm not averse to risk-assessment - it's sensible, and there have been unfortunate incidents which might have been avoided. And maybe not all mothers can be trusted to chose suitable childminders for their children (there may be little choice). But all this?
A recent Ofsted inspection at a fantastic local nursery school (15 children, 5 staff) came back as "inadequate" for the most ridiculous of reasons, all justified by the words: children, and risk.
E.g "Written permission is not sought from parents for seeking emergency medical advice or treatment if the need arises. This places children's health at risk in an emergency situation".
"The written planning system is not closely linked to the various aspects of the early learning goals, so staff cannot be certain that all aspects are covered. Similarly, children's records do not clearly link to all the aspects either, so again there is a lack of monitoring what is offered (sic)".
"There is no written complaints procedure and staff lack knowledge of procedures to be followed in the event of parents submitting a written complaint. This places children at risk through the provider not identifying and addressing a possible failure to meet the National Standards and contravenes regulations".
It's madness. The lady who runs the nursery has been running it for over 30 years but I'll be surprised if she doesn't retire soon.
Parents don't want all this rubbish. It's meaningless.
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Message 30 - posted by sarahdoublet
(U11974315)
, May 16, 2008
Yay Celyn ! Thank you x
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Message 31 - posted by MissMZ
(U11987379)
, May 17, 2008
"It is called change, and change happens every where. "
Change can be good but not when it just for the sake of change. You argue that EYFS isn't different from what it is replacing so why replace it? If it isn't broken don't fix it!
As an Early Years teacher and a parent I chose to send my daughter to a childminder simply because I wanted her to be in an environment as close to that she would have in her own home, with a "special" caring person who would give her the same sort of attention and experiences she would have at home. I didn't want anyone keeping notes on her development I wanted a friendly face who knew my daughter well enough to chat to me about her day without needing to refer to "diaries". I know a lot of good childminders who won't be taking children in September what a pity!
I was one of the early signatories to the OpenEYE petition not because of any worries I have as a teacher but because as a parent I do not want "babies" to be subjected to a statutory curriculum and believe parents should have the choice as to the type of "curriculum" their young child follows.
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Message 32 - posted by Arfa
(U226445)
, May 18, 2008
After reading through all of the responses on this thread (and also the Parents Anticipation thread) it would appear that parents don't want EYFS, most childminders don't want EYFS and only the politicians and a few childminders are really in favour of it. Unfortunately, at the moment, it's coming in whether we like it or not. Although parents will just have to like it or lump it, childminders who don't want it can only respond by leaving and that is exactly what appears to be happening. And it's not just the odd few either.
Since the EYFS was announced, we have lost nearly 7,000 childminders. That's nearly 10% of the childminders who were registered in December 2006. There are 2 more quarters' figures to be announced before the EYFS becomes law so I would expect to see that figure continue to drop as childminders attend the EYFS courses being provided by their local authority and find out just how much extra work they will be expected to do.
A fully employed childminder can expect to work singlehandely for 50+ hours a week without any real breaks or lunch hour. Once they start the planning, observing, recording and assessing required by the EYFS they can then probably add at least an hour a day. Couple that with the time they already spend keeping their accounts up to date, doing their tax returns, writing and then keeping their policies up to date (as required by Ofsted), attending courses (which will become compulsory once the EYFS is in place) and childminding suddenly becomes less and less attractive as a job. For a job where you are supposed to be your own boss or, at the very most, employed by the parents, who are childminders really working for?
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Message 33 - posted by SavingChildhood
(U11996127)
, May 18, 2008
Just for the record on this message board - the original EYFS primary legislation, as officially passes by our legislators and Queen, allowed for exemptions for settings which had other educational principles. By stealth, this was subsequently removed, making it compulsory for ALL preschool settings and childminders. Owing to an uproar starting end of last year (e.g. OpenEYE groups), the Government now says parents can individually apply for exemptions, but they have not publicised this. Childminders note: If anyone objects to following the weighty requirements, please exercise your rights and ask your respective parents to apply to the DCSF for exemptions - now. In my mind, it's all like a SatNav that only charts some roads, but is made compulsory to have: some people end up directed into rivers and drowning or sent over bridges which collapse!
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Message 34 - posted by SadPat
(U11984255)
, May 18, 2008
I am a childminder who, like the childminder in the programme, will also probably be giving up at the end of August purely due to the introduction of the EYFS.
I have read though the literature and attended the EYFS workshops and the more I find out, the less I like it. I already do a lot of what will be required of me, but I don't do any forward planning and I don't record my observations or do any assessments of the children. I am also very angry about the statutory nature of the EYFS and think that the goals expect too much of the children before they start school.
Of the 11 people who attended the workshop with me, only 2 were entirely happy, while 1 was for EYFS, but unhappy about the additional work. The remainder of us were very unhappy, but, except for me, were reluctantly going to go along with it. This is not to say that we were bad childminders, because most of us had been doing the job for a good number of years with good reports from Ofsted.
I have shown the EYFS literature to the parents I mind for, 3 of whom are teachers and 1 is a careers officer, and they all think it is far too much and can't see the need for a childminder to record anything about their children.
Luckily, my parents are all prepared to apply for exemption for their children while they are in my care so I may still be able to continue looking after those children. That is, as long as the Secretary of State grants them exemption. If exemption doesn't happen then that will be 4 families and 6 children that will need to look for alternative arrangements come September.
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Message 35 - posted by Poppy Woman's Hour
(U6667965)
, May 19, 2008
Hi, Thanks to everyone for all the comments on this thread. It is likely to be a subject we return to on Woman's Hour, to see how things are developing, and we will be looking for people to contribute to the future discussion. Brentwoodchildminder and sarahdoublet, I would be really interested to talk to you both about your experiences. If you would like to, please e-mail me via the link on the home page. www.bbc.co.uk/radio4...Many thanks Poppy x
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