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Panorama North Korea controversy

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Messages: 1 - 50 of 109
  • Message 1. 

    Posted by ashleyhr (U14203741) on Sunday, 14th April 2013

    This programme has been filmed. Inside the vilest regime on the planet where the population have been brainwashed, terrorised and brutalised for 60 years - and where the leadership is now threatening regional nuclear Armageddon (or simply posturing for its own ends).

    There is no question whatsoever in my mind that the programme should be SHOWN (at 20.30 pm or 10.35 pm in Wales, tomorrow).

    www.bbc.co.uk/progra...
    www.bbc.co.uk/news/u...

    I am trying to remain on-topic here. However, should this thread have to be closed, please do not hide this post as well! I am not 'having a pop at the BBC' but making a plea that the BBC does not give in to today's demands for censorship (because students may have been put at risk).

    Report message1

  • Message 2

    , in reply to message 1.

    Posted by Johnnymol (U14690244) on Sunday, 14th April 2013

    Yes it should be shown. But honestly is it going to show us anything we didn't already know smiley - erm

    Report message2

  • Message 3

    , in reply to message 2.

    Posted by ashleyhr (U14203741) on Sunday, 14th April 2013

    You may be right, but I'd like to be able to see it, in order to draw my own conclusions (I suspect journalists from other parts of the media would too). What's likely to be of most interest in the programme is the situation outside of Pyongyang - ie the North Korea that the outside world rarely if ever gets to see properly reported (any tourist trips made there are rigidly controlled by government minders).

    One suspects that the regime itself would prefer the programme not to be shown.

    Report message3

  • Message 4

    , in reply to message 1.

    Posted by MicraManUK (U13682787) on Sunday, 14th April 2013

    I can't believe it, you are happy that students may have been put at risk, just so that you can watch TV? I really give up, I really do. I hope that this is a wind up.

    Report message4

  • Message 5

    , in reply to message 3.

    Posted by ashleyhr (U14203741) on Sunday, 14th April 2013

    If needs be, blur the students' faces and disguise their voices (or edit the film so that, although the fact that reporters accompanied students needs to be mentioned, the students themselves do not feature - unless some of them have stated that they are happy to be featured).

    Report message5

  • Message 6

    , in reply to message 4.

    Posted by ashleyhr (U14203741) on Sunday, 14th April 2013

    Message 4

    I am trying to discuss the programme and whether it should be shown. Not the wider news story (which of course can be discussed elsewhere).

    So, no, my thread is not a 'wind-up' if that's what you are suggesting.

    You are also, I suggest, attempting to put words into my mouth.

    The programme has been MADE. It should not be censored (in my view).

    Report message6

  • Message 7

    , in reply to message 6.

    Posted by MicraManUK (U13682787) on Sunday, 14th April 2013

    Are the two not interlinked?

    Report message7

  • Message 8

    , in reply to message 7.

    Posted by Johnnymol (U14690244) on Sunday, 14th April 2013

    I don't understand this idea of students being at risk. Firstly any foreigner going to North Korea is going to be closely watched and therefore are in the hands of those doing the watching (for the life of me I can't understand why students from the LSE would want to go to North Korea)

    I do accept the BBC's argument that if caught the students and journalists would have been deported - As with other recent cases where foreign journalists had been caught, they were initially held as prisoners, but were then deported.

    Also I do not understand the LSE's huffing and puffing over the matter as I believe this was a student led trip and was not sponsored through the LSE, and are students so naïve

    Lets show the programme and be grateful non of us live in a country like North Korea where censorship is so strict

    Report message8

  • Message 9

    , in reply to message 8.

    Posted by Semisatanic (U2611151) on Sunday, 14th April 2013

    "Lets show the programme and be grateful non of us live in a country like North Korea where censorship is so strict"

    Oh the irony!

    Said by someone posting on a pre moderated message board. smiley - smiley

    Report message9

  • Message 10

    , in reply to message 9.

    Posted by santapup (U14659366) on Sunday, 14th April 2013

    "Lets show the programme and be grateful non of us live in a country like North Korea where censorship is so strict"

    Oh the irony!

    Said by someone posting on a pre moderated message board. smiley - smiley 
    Which it is not -it is post moderated .

    If you seriously think that you have no free speech in this country as compared to elsewhere -think again

    Report message10

  • Message 11

    , in reply to message 9.

    Posted by Dover Soul (U14934992) on Sunday, 14th April 2013

    "Lets show the programme and be grateful non of us live in a country like North Korea where censorship is so strict"

    Oh the irony!

    Said by someone posting on a pre moderated message board. smiley - smiley 
    Post-moderated at the moment, not pre-moderated now as it was last week, and normally reactively moderated.

    Report message11

  • Message 12

    , in reply to message 11.

    Posted by bounty-is-back-from-the-dead (U14258254) on Sunday, 14th April 2013

    Well I looking forward to this programme. The only thing I don't like is that here in Wales it on after the news.

    Report message12

  • Message 13

    , in reply to message 4.

    Posted by Annie-Lou (U4502268) on Sunday, 14th April 2013

    Given the recent history of the LSE vis-a-vis despotic regimes, I would have thought they would have welcomed the chance to be on the side of the good guys for a change!

    Report message13

  • Message 14

    , in reply to message 8.

    Posted by PoochJD (U2534501) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    Dear, oh dear.

    I'm sorry, Johnnymol, but you haven't half written a lot of rubbish there.

    1) You claim to not "understand this idea of students being at risk."

    I would have thought that the simple fact that ANYONE going to North Korea, even South Koreans, are likely to be at potential risk from the North Korean government. You then complained that: "(for the life of me I can't understand why students from the LSE would want to go to North Korea)". Maybe they are trying to look at Korea's economic progress / success / failure, as part of their Economics studies? Maybe it is a requirement as part of their courses? Maybe they chose to visit Korea? Maybe they were invited to visit by a North Korean educational or government establishment? To just wildly exclaim that you don't know why they wanted to go there, shows how naive you are demonstrating yourself to be. Try thinking before writing!

    2) You then said: "I do not understand the LSE's huffing and puffing over the matter as I believe this was a student led trip and was not sponsored through the LSE, and are students so naïve"

    Jeez, you really do seem even more naive and ignorant than I thought you were. Neither you, nor I, nor anyone else know much about WHY these LSE students went to Korea. Until we do, then - to be quite frank here - it's not for us to judge or condemn them for doing so. However, that ignores the fact that you seem to be under the wilfully misguided notion that it was acceptable for the BBC to potentially put these students in danger, purely to gain a news story.

    Have you not read the papers or seen the news in the past 12 months? Have you not heard or read anything about Press Ethics, about the Leveson Enquiry and his subsequent report?

    Surely as it was wrong for the hacks at the News Of The Worlds to use phone-hacking in order to gain tittle-tattle for them to publish in their prurient wrag, so it is wrong for the BBC to deceive (or at least not be wholly truthful) with the students going on this trip, to inform them, their School, and their parents/families of what the BBC's intention was, so as everyone could make an INFORMED CHOICE on whether the students and their families were happy for the PANORMA team to potentially endanger them - a danger, that may have included deportation, incarceration, and/or execution!

    I'm assuming you don't have kids, otherwise your callous attitude wouldn't have been made so abundantly clear in your post. If you did have children, and one of them was an LSE student on their way to North Korea, would you be happy that a BBC journlist was happy to put your child's life beneath that of a story? Would you be comfortable that the BBC was saying that your child's life was less important, of less worth, than getting cameras into a secretive country, so that the rest of our nation can see what life is life, even though most people have a good idea already of what life is already like there?

    I seriously doubt that you'd be happy. And rightly so!

    I don't have kids, but I know that it is dangerous, stupid and arrogant for anyone to use students (or anyone else for that matter) purely to gain access to a country, in order to get a story. That is inexcusable behaviour on the BBC's part. As adults, they should know better than to abuse the trust of those students and in the trust the LSE placed in the BBC too.

    No journalist has the right to potentially endanger ANYONE, just to gain a story. We don't need to see what Korea's like in a PANORAMA documentary. We can already see what Korea's like, on any BBC News bulletin, at any time of day or night! There are plenty of books, historical, travel guides, newspapers, online blogs, etc, that also inform UK citizens of what Korea is like.

    It's clear from the BBC's PANORMA editor who appeared on the BBC News on Sunday morning, that - in his eyes - that UK TV audiences had a desire, a need to see what North Korea was like, was far more important than the lives of any/all of those students. That's a heinous belief, and one that I hope gives the BBC a lot of negative comeback!

    Report message14

  • Message 15

    , in reply to message 14.

    Posted by Peta (U24) on Monday, 15th April 2013


    BBC head of news programmes Ceri Thomas said the North Korean government was the only party the corporation had deceived.

    He said the students had been informed of the risks on three separate occasions and authorisation for the trip had gone "right to the top" within the BBC.

    "We think the risks as we explained them to the students were justified... but had we had any suggestion that lives were at risk... we wouldn't have gone anywhere near this," he said.

    So, no - the BBC are not saying journalism is more important that lives.

    The students were fully informed.

    Related news stories

    www.bbc.co.uk/news/u...

    www.bbc.co.uk/news/u...

    www.bbc.co.uk/news/u...

    Report message15

  • Message 16

    , in reply to message 15.

    Posted by tremendousknowledgedave (U15629598) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    And does the BBC expect any reaction from the North Korean government to this deceit? I understand this wasnt the first visit by students. At the very least they surely wont allow any future ones to take place. The BBC can be very selfish at times.

    Report message16

  • Message 17

    , in reply to message 15.

    Posted by Huckerback (U14411634) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    ...So, no - the BBC are not saying journalism is more important that lives.

    The students were fully informed.  
    I listened to a BBC manager on Today this morning (he may have been 'head of news' but I'm not sure) - he said the BBC had nothing in writing to backup the assertion the students were fully informed.
    I was surprised they hadn't been asked to sign some sort of consent form.

    Report message17

  • Message 18

    , in reply to message 17.

    Posted by Radioactiveoldduffer (U4768882) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    Panorama reporter John Sweeney said the majority of the students he had travelled with supported the programme.

    What about the ones who didn't ? Were they given the chance to travel back to the UK and any extra expenses incurred paid by the BBC or were they in a no win situation after arriving in China enroute to North Korea.

    Here's what I think is the most worrying aspect about the whole endeavour:

    Sweeney said the BBC’s ‘high risk team’ had wanted the students to be kept in the dark so they could not be accused of being complicit in the subterfuge if it was discovered by the North Koreans.

    ‘If we got into North Korea and I got busted and I’m a journalist, then we were worried, properly and rightly, for the students.

    Now if the CIA have gone on record as saying how unpredictable the North Koreans are how can the BBC 'high risk team' know what would have happened to the students?

    Read more: www.dailymail.co.uk/...

    Report message18

  • Message 19

    , in reply to message 17.

    Posted by henryhallsdanceband (U1639084) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    But surely those reporting for the BBC would have been in the same groups as the students and would only have been taken or gone where the NKs had allowed them to go? Or were somehow the BBC folk able to sneak away from the main party of students - unnoticed by the NK authorities to wander hither and thither art will? I doubt it.

    It is absolutely appropriate for the BBC to try and provide the public with a view of NK life given the escalting tensions. In this compter age some folk do tend to forget that many do not have access to the internet or would know how to find footage of NK life even if they did. Their view of the world is presented by TV. And as our public broadcaster the BBC has a duty to let us know what is currently going on in NK as best they can.

    And since this is being shown after the party has returned then none of the students are at risk. And anyone planning to go to NK in the near future can take this current situation into account in their own personal risk assessments.

    Report message19

  • Message 20

    , in reply to message 19.

    Posted by Radioactiveoldduffer (U4768882) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    But surely those reporting for the BBC would have been in the same groups as the students and would only have been taken or gone where the NKs had allowed them to go? Or were somehow the BBC folk able to sneak away from the main party of students - unnoticed by the NK authorities to wander hither and thither art will? I doubt it.

    It is absolutely appropriate for the BBC to try and provide the public with a view of NK life given the escalting tensions. In this compter age some folk do tend to forget that many do not have access to the internet or would know how to find footage of NK life even if they did. Their view of the world is presented by TV. And as our public broadcaster the BBC has a duty to let us know what is currently going on in NK as best they can.

    And since this is being shown after the party has returned then none of the students are at risk. And anyone planning to go to NK in the near future can take this current situation into account in their own personal risk assessments. 
    It has been reported that some of the party will not be able to return to North Korea. If journalists wish to risk their own necks then that's up to them but believe me there are many ways the North Koreans could have reacted to serve their own ends - remember Saddam Hussein patting childrens heads in a hostage situation:

    news.bbc.co.uk/onthi...

    Lets see if the programme is truly revealing to those who follow current affairs.

    Report message20

  • Message 21

    , in reply to message 15.

    Posted by Spinning_head (U10049943) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    The students were fully informed. 
    The students MAY have been informed, but did they approve of the BBC doing this?

    Will the LSE trust the BBC in anything anymore?

    Report message21

  • Message 22

    , in reply to message 21.

    Posted by santapup (U14659366) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    The students were fully informed. 
    The students MAY have been informed, but did they approve of the BBC doing this?

    Will the LSE trust the BBC in anything anymore? 
    Your question makes no sense-they were not forced to take part

    Report message22

  • Message 23

    , in reply to message 22.

    Posted by Annie-Lou (U4502268) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    Blimey the student body of the LSE must be a bunch of wusses. It seems they are happier cosying up to dictators (giving them degrees and taking their money) than exposing them!

    Report message23

  • Message 24

    , in reply to message 20.

    Posted by onmyiPad (U13182464) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    Didn't The Sun do this last year? They sent a couple of low rent journalists behind the bamboo curtain and exposed almost next to nothing. I'm not expecting anything different from tonight's Panorama.

    They didn't gain written consent from the students involved, only a nod and a wink conversation. Did they fully explain what they were attempting to do or is it yet another case of Auntie knows best.

    Anyway I'm looking forward to North Korean TV's exposure of the BBC over the last couple of decades. They too have a culture of secrecy (SIR Jimmy Savile)., doing the governments bidding(WMD/45mins), they also like a parade for former leaders(Thatcher).

    On balance I think NKTV's programme might be more interesting.

    Report message24

  • Message 25

    , in reply to message 24.

    Posted by Stokey Sue (U14258170) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    Since the footage now exists, I think we should see it - that is quite straightforward.

    Whatever the information exchange between the LSE, the students, and the BBC, it seems to me that what chiefly put the students at risk was travelling through N Korea

    Is it normal these days for student field trips to go to such dangerous places? It seems extraordinary that such a trip would go ahead in the current political situation, endoresed by a university institution

    Who approved it, and who funded it, with or without accompanying BBC reporters?

    Report message25

  • Message 26

    , in reply to message 24.

    Posted by meddaboy (U15031418) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    am looking forward to tonights prog, over the years i have back packed in several war torn countries, afgan, irack, etc i have been in some scary situations, but the place i hope to visit this year is north korea, ive heard its different aand im looking forward to trying the food ,seeing the sites and maybe get to visit their camps,so im hoping tonights prog is not to negative.

    Report message26

  • Message 27

    , in reply to message 25.

    Posted by Annie-Lou (U4502268) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    Sue, according to today's paper, it was not an official field trip, but one organised by the LSE's "international relations club"

    One thing's for sure they've done the Beeb a big favour by making such a public fuss. You can't buy that kind of publicity.............

    Report message27

  • Message 28

    , in reply to message 25.

    Posted by Huckerback (U14411634) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    Is it normal these days for student field trips to go to such dangerous places?   Is North Korea a dangerous place to visit?

    Report message28

  • Message 29

    , in reply to message 26.

    Posted by Annie-Lou (U4502268) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    am looking forward to tonights prog, over the years i have back packed in several war torn countries, afgan, irack, etc i have been in some scary situations, but the place i hope to visit this year is north korea, ive heard its different aand im looking forward to trying the food ,seeing the sites and maybe get to visit their camps,so im hoping tonights prog is not to negative.  Please tell me this is a wind up...........(irack??)

    Report message29

  • Message 30

    , in reply to message 29.

    Posted by smiley (U14357686) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    This seems like another case of attacking the BBC for the sake of it.
    I am looking forward to tonight’s programme and congratulate BBC and their journalists for bringing us something that other broadcasters don’t. I hope the programme doesn’t disappoint.

    Report message30

  • Message 31

    , in reply to message 27.

    Posted by onmyiPad (U13182464) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    You are far more likely to be followed around China than NK, in fact you are far more likely to be followed around Russia than NK.

    From the interviews I've read today and the reports about the programme, we will learn the sum total of nothing about NK that we don't or didn't already know.

    It's tabloid/shock journalism at its very worse, pretty much par for the course for Panorama. It smacks of UK government propaganda.

    Report message31

  • Message 32

    , in reply to message 8.

    Posted by Essential Rabbit (U3613943) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    for the life of me I can't understand why students from the LSE would want to go to North Korea 
    That's what struck me.
    The complaint from the LSE seems to be that the BBC journalists put the students at risk of being arrested and sent to a labour camp.

    So why expose themselves to such an appalling regime in the first place?

    Report message32

  • Message 33

    , in reply to message 26.

    Posted by Essential Rabbit (U3613943) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    im looking forward to trying the food 
    If you can find any food there, you'll probably have to fight off a few starving Koreans before you get a chance to taste it.
    maybe get to visit their camps 
    To visit one of their camps, all you will need to do is say something that is not 100% positive about the little plump Un. They are so hospitable that they won't let you leave again for years.

    Report message33

  • Message 34

    , in reply to message 33.

    Posted by William Blessing (U14578406) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    The ability to launch a nuclear missile from an orbiting platform is hinted at as the real threat.

    Report message34

  • Message 35

    , in reply to message 29.

    Posted by Ria_H (U14999558) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    am looking forward to tonights prog, over the years i have back packed in several war torn countries, afgan, irack, etc i have been in some scary situations, but the place i hope to visit this year is north korea, ive heard its different aand im looking forward to trying the food ,seeing the sites and maybe get to visit their camps,so im hoping tonights prog is not to negative.  Please tell me this is a wind up...........(irack??)  Just a 12 year-old hoping to impress.

    Report message35

  • Message 36

    , in reply to message 14.

    Posted by Johnnymol (U14690244) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    Really Pooch you do get hot under the collar

    I think its you who needs to get your head around your own lob-sided arguments -

    1. You say " I would have thought that the simple fact that ANYONE going to North Korea, even South Koreans, are likely to be at potential risk from the North Korean government" - If this is your view why complain that I raise the simple question of "Why are the students going in the first place" and then you follow up by waffling on about why they could have been going to NK and it's not for us to judge them.

    Perhaps you're more naïve than these students - You cannot say people going to NK are at risk and then complain when I question If there is such a major risk why go

    And then laughably you say of the students " it's not for us to judge or condemn them" but by your own admission you say going to NK is a risk and then you also say you've no idea yourself what reasons they had for going - So people can't criticise them?

    Perhaps a parent of one of these LSE students might be wondering What the (beep) are you doing over there?

    Then you call my attitude callous - and go waffling on about how the BBC put these students in danger - This ignores the simple fact that these students were going to a country which in your opening sentences you admit "ANYONE going to North Korea, even South Koreans, are likely to be at potential risk from the North Korean Government" - Perhaps the students were thinking of their worried parents when they rushed off to get their passports stamped - The fact you're thinking of the students who were going willingly to NK and not their parents gives me an idea of the type of person you are.

    So to put it simply for you to understand:-
    1. The students had volunteered to go to a very risky country
    2. They were aware they had at least one journalist with them travelling undercover, and yet they still went.
    3. To think now that they were more at risk because there was 3 BBC employees with them is ridiculous
    4 Leveson is not about attacking all undercover journalism, and as far as I'm aware these students were not unhappy knowing a BBC journalist was with them.

    So Pooch "try thinking yourself" before writing that way you won't contradict yourself
    Simple basics I suppose smiley - winkeye

    Report message36

  • Message 37

    , in reply to message 15.

    Posted by Johnbee (U542312) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    Mod, I am afraid that is all completely off the point. We assume that the students on this trip will have returned by now, and will not go back. So they will not be in 'danger'.

    Ths point is that all over the world,, for ever, students will visit other countries from all over the place. I assume that some of us think that this international exchange of university learners is benficial for international understanding.

    In fact I would go so far as to say that the more 'foreign' the countries concerned, the more benefit will be gained from such student visits. The more isolated and fearful a country is, the better it is that they should send their students overseas, and welcome our students, as a step to gaining trust and pehaps a start to understanding.

    Journalists using such visits as cover tp spy and intrude and make knocking job videos on a country work against such laudable aims.

    The BBC no doubt thinks that North Korea is parts of the axis of evil and should be undermined and opposed, not dealt with as a civilised country. That is certainly how the BBC is nacting anyway. If so, they should say so and not hide behind all that guff about how these particular students knew the dangers.

    If that is not the case they should answer the real point, which is the potential undermining of student exchanges and visits. Is that what the BBC wants? Is that what us taxpayers want?

    Report message37

  • Message 38

    , in reply to message 37.

    Posted by FowPah (U1746998) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    I shall wait and see if all the students were told before going and that all agreed to this.

    Report message38

  • Message 39

    , in reply to message 38.

    This posting has been hidden during moderation because it broke the House Rules in some way.

  • Message 40

    , in reply to message 38.

    Posted by zen humbug (U14877400) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    Total waste of time. Told me nothing I didn't already know, and there was no BBC balance. Mr Sweeny's sub-Whicker drone made for a very unsatisfactory 30 mins.

    Report message40

  • Message 41

    , in reply to message 39.

    Posted by onmyiPad (U13182464) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    As expected. Second or third hand accounts. Shaky camera work, lots of prepositions about a leader no Western journalist has ever been in a room with let alone met or interviewed.

    We've learned nothing new. Apart from the BBC will use anybody to get a story, even when there isn't one.

    The ending was hilarious. A film montage of Kim Jonu Un with his armed forces declaring him to be "the most dangerous man in the world today". I've seen very simpler pictures of Blair, Brown, Cameron and even Wee Clegg meeting HM forces here and abroad. Do we consider them to be "dangerous" simply for meeting troops and watching preplanned manoeuvres?

    Blair invaded Iraq. Blair invaded Afghanistan, Cameron supported regime change and borderline genocide in Libya and we are arming various groups in the Middle East and beyond.

    Who's the dangerous one's?

    If you go to rural China you'll see poverty on the same scale, in some places even worse than we saw tonight. Will the next Panorama sneak into China to report that? No of course they won't. The want Kim Jong Un to be the next boogeyman under the bed.

    Disgraceful reporting, but I didn't expect any better.

    Report message41

  • Message 42

    , in reply to message 1.

    Posted by Johnnymol (U14690244) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    And what did I learn from this programme that I didn't already know...........Absolutely nothing

    A total waste of Panorama's time and effort.

    Report message42

  • Message 43

    , in reply to message 40.

    Posted by O Tempora O Mores (U14540735) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    A very shoddy piece of journalism. Mostly library footage. Real footage could have been filmed anywhere, including UK. Conclusions drawn from scant evidence. Was it worth all the hype?

    Panorama has losts its way and should be put out to grass...

    Report message43

  • Message 44

    , in reply to message 1.

    Posted by Nick_1080 (U15696701) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    Firstly the report contained within it absolutely no new information, and was therefore an unacceptable risk for all involved...

    I would like to ask two questions: Did anyone involved in the program think about what would happen to the North Korean guides once it was shown?

    Are they going to find out?

    It strikes that - in the program - no mention was made of LSE, so nobody would have found out other than the North Korean government. The argument about academic integrity seems to have been started artificially by LSE.

    The real cause for concern is the disregard with which Sweeney et al have shown towards the freedom (or even lives??) of their North Korean chaperons.

    Report message44

  • Message 45

    , in reply to message 44.

    Posted by U15636942 (U15636942) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    A thoroughly inconsequential 30 minutes of television. Of no journalistic worth or merit whatsoever.

    Quite silly, actually.

    Report message45

  • Message 46

    , in reply to message 45.

    Posted by mhepton (U1847458) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    saw the programme. ...good have done with being longer.

    but much better was the doc a few years ago by Ben (?) "Holidays in the Axis of Evil" which showed more and in my view more interesting

    Report message46

  • Message 47

    , in reply to message 6.

    Posted by ashleyhr (U14203741) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    The whole country (large parts of which are largely invisible to outsiders) is a sham and a rather frightening one. One suspects that the new leader could not reform anything, even if he wished to, because of the brainwashing and militarism. And the place is still 'ruled' by a dead Kim the grandfather - dead men don't ever change their mind and tell their descendants to close the gulags and feed the poor (do they).

    Horrible vile regime.

    Glad the group got out OK and didn't have their film confiscated.

    Report message47

  • Message 48

    , in reply to message 47.

    Posted by FowPah (U1746998) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    Did we learn anything new?

    Report message48

  • Message 49

    , in reply to message 48.

    Posted by mhepton (U1847458) on Monday, 15th April 2013

    you can watch "holidays in the axis of evil" abut north korea on youtube

    www.youtube.com/watc...

    Report message49

  • Message 50

    , in reply to message 49.

    Posted by Guv-nor (U7476305) ** on Monday, 15th April 2013

    you can watch "holidays in the axis of evil" abut north korea on youtube

    www.youtube.com/watc... 
    Until the lawyers get wind of it, copyright and all that stuff.

    Report message50

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