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How do we do this?

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Messages: 1 - 31 of 31
  • Message 1. 

    Posted by I am not an organiser etc (U11351618) on Monday, 9th February 2009

    Hi Jem,

    I’ve just had a roam about and can see that you aren’t happy with what you perceive as people going off topic and using the boards as some form of a go at you. I don’t think anyone means to do that, but your original offer of engaging with the debate and passing on views to whoever’s in charge doesn’t appear to have been fulfilled.

    Listeners have genuine concerns about a station they care about and don’t want to see it destroyed because they love music, want to have their expectations challenged and after (let’s face it) John Peel’s death they’d found a place to come with great scheduling, no adverts (important) and no gimmicks. They were enthusiastic supporters who evangelised all over the place, encouraging new listeners (remember the days of genuine rising figures) and felt they could contribute to a broadcasting phenomenon that they were paying for.

    Things changed somewhat with the shake up around 15 months ago and this was the obvious place to come to discuss that. So if not here, where?

    I’m sorry to restate this, but what should the people who love the station (albeit, as was) do to get their message across? It’s clear you’re keen on audience feedback, so what next? Twitter is not going to get intelligent people with a genuine point to make as 160 characters just aren’t going to do it most of the time. Blogs (and I’ve blogged myself – years ago) are entirely within the control of the blogger. Not democratic, or even anarchic, at all.

    So – what should we do to get heard? Any genuinely inclusive mechanism will get my vote 100%.

    John

    Report message1

  • Message 2

    , in reply to message 1.

    Posted by glitterball-ninja (U13639813) on Tuesday, 10th February 2009

    Jem

    It's inevitable that in the current state of things, if you choose to put your head above the parapet, several people will take the opportunity to take a pot-shot at it, particularly in light of your very visible presence at the time of Ms Douglas' departure. It is also inevitable that much of the frustration felt by many long-term listeners to 6Music is going to be coming your way, when there is so little evidence that any notice is being taken of the correspondence and suggestions being made on these boards.

    A question - Do you ever listen to 6Music, particularly daytime 6? If you don't it might be an idea to take some time out of what is an obviously busy schedule to just listen. It probably needs a week's consistent listening to truly understand why there is so much concern about 6's output, but it may take just a day or two. Maybe a day, before that Lily Allen song really starts to grate. How many times could you have heard the Adelle/Weller hub session, on constant repetition, before you realised that she was totally unable to sing in tune. How many times would you have to hear Chris Martin's current acoustic set before it clicks that really all his doing is playing two chords on the piano whilst whining tunelessly above them, though the whole episode is being breathlessly described as if it were the second coming. How long before you realise that you can't stand to hear the Airborne Toxic Event/Killers/La Roux ever again. How long before you just have to switch off.

    If you are a regular listener to 6, can you honestly state that you are proud. as a BBC employee, of what the station is producing. Every time you hear a Shabba or an air horn does your heart skip a beat at the thought of a job well done? Or when yet another c-list celebrity/comedian/author, or whoever is flogging their latest product has spent 20 minutes in inane chatter without a note of music being heard, do you think yes, that's what a real music station should be doing? That's really closer to the music that matters.

    Put yourself in our shoes, we actually have to listen to it.

    I am aware that 6's audience is made up a disparate assortment of people and that it is wrong to generalise about them, but I believe it's safe to assume that an abiding interest in music is what unites them. I believe it is also safe to assume that it is not just any music that unites them either. Think of us as the awkward squad, the refusenicks, the cynics, but above all as music lovers. We are not going to be happy with a diet of Lily Allen, nor do we want to hear about her on 6Music news, nor are we particularly thrilled when her appearance on Steve Lamacq's show receives constant trails not just before the event but after it as well. We are not going be dancing in the streets at the prospect of an 'exclusive' airing of a new U2 record and by and large we don't give a toss about the Ting Tings.

    Forgive us for getting annoyed when it just seems as if you are prepared to broadcast whatever cr@p has come to hand with no regard for our tastes whatsoever. We know you are just marketing to us, but excuse us if we choose not to buy into the product and your 'better understand for the music industry'.

    I use the following example because it was the last straw as far as morning 6Music was concerned for me; but did anybody at 6Music stop and think, when booking Paul McKenna to appear on Shaun Keaveney's show recently, about what it means on a station that is ostensibly a music station to do this. If I want banter and chat I wouldn't be listening to 6. If I want to listen to someone flogging their new book I can listen to Start The Week over on Radio 4 or I can read a review of it in a newspaper. I don't tune into 6Music to be sold books, films or television programmes. I just want to listen to good music.

    Just think about what the playlist does to your loyal listeners. Do you really believe that we want it. Message 183 on the 'Dump the Playlist' thread sums up the situation perfectly. Go and look at it, then look at the current playlists for Radio 6Music and for Radio 1. In 2003 there was no duplacation between the two stations, 6Music featured albums in the playlist and with very few exceptions those bands that featured on the playist were not exactly household names. AND EVERYONE WAS HAPPY!

    Compare this with today's playlists, look at the duplication between the two stations, look just how much of 6's current output consists of major artists on major labels and try to understand the frustration that there is out here.

    A truly wonderful thing is being destroyed, so excuse us if we have to temerity, with what little means we have at our disposal, to try and stop the rot.

    Go on Jem, just listen for a week, and then come on these boards and say you are truly proud of 6Music.


    Report message2

  • Message 3

    , in reply to message 2.

    Posted by dmc911 (U3533541) on Tuesday, 10th February 2009

    I wish I could add to the above messages but I can't really top them. A round of applause if you please, bravo sirs/madams smiley - ok

    Report message3

  • Message 4

    , in reply to message 3.

    Posted by brownsauce (U2503657) on Tuesday, 10th February 2009

    Perfectly put Glitterball. You should send that message to Bob Shennan. Seriously. If you don't, I will!

    Report message4

  • Message 5

    , in reply to message 4.

    Posted by U6679583 (U6679583) on Tuesday, 10th February 2009

    Jem doesn't reply to any nicely worded posts.

    It's the classical example of poor parenting.

    Report message5

  • Message 6

    , in reply to message 5.

    Posted by Mozo (U10059077) on Tuesday, 10th February 2009

    Sorry to have to post this here but as Jem closed the threads he posted the following messages on, I thought this was the most appropriate place. He’s made it clear I have to watch my step, so I don’t want to be accused of being off topic or being disruptive.

    Oh well. Gentle reminder to Mozo. I'm really not sure why repeated personal references to me across many threads are taking up your time but ill leave that to you.

    But repeated attempts to make the same point again and again and again about the station across many threads is disruptive to other users, breaks our house rules and will mean we'll have to look at your membership on these boards 


    I’m not making a repeated point Jem, I’m asking the same question and as you keep refusing to answer it, I ask it again. I’m being persistent, sorry if you feel that’s a personal attack but I can assure you it isn’t. I don’t think there’s anything in the rules that say I can’t ask for an explanation from a BBC employee is there? Especially when the issue is so important and especially when it concerns your work at the BBC. That’s a professional interest, not a personal one. I don’t know you personally, but I have encountered you in your professional capacity and its within those terms of reference, as a licence fee payer, that I feel an answer is due.

    I’m concerned about your self titled job description. Its an image of you that is widely seen across the web on several sites and one I assume you are seeking to promote by repeated reference to it. I can post up the cached links but I’m sure I don’t need to. In my view it puts what you are doing at the BBC in a somewhat negative light. I admit I’ve made light of it in the past and for that I apologise, so lets get serious about it then. As a description of your involvement with the BBC communities team, these message boards and future media and technology at the BBC, how does your own term ‘Black ops’ apply?

    You know and everyone else knows that the phrase has some very nasty and potentially serious connotations, so if you feel they are a description of the work you do at the BBC I’d like to know why. If someone in your position can’t see that’s a fair point then I’m very surprised. It's not a personal attack on you, its simply a request for you to explain what you mean by it in a professional capacity. It may not be your description, and if not who's is it? I obviously need to direct my enquiries to them. If I’m misinterpreting the reference I’m happy to be corrected and have my mind put at rest. If you'd rather not answer on a message board, let me have details of an offline contact point and I'm more than happy to take it up with you and/or your line manager. But seriously Jem, as someone who is concerned about where the BBC is going, it worries me. That’s why I’m persistent.


    I closed the last thread on this topic because it ended up with two regular users (Fist and Mozo) responding to me contributing to the thread with links to iplayer etc with v.lengthy posts that were off topic, abusive and repeated yet again points that they had made elsewhere 


    Exactly where have I been abusive? What’s wrong with links to iPlayer? Haven’t you just posted some up yourself? I agreed with you that we might be off topic on the original ‘Hidden Gold’ thread and perhaps we could take the discussion somewhere else. You responded by closing down the thread, threatening me on another one and then closing that down as well. So who’s abusing whom?

    If you aren’t prepared to do what I understand a host is supposed to be here for (I.e. get involved in discussions, answer questions, foster topics) what do you see as your role? A while back on the George Lamb thread we proposed a forum and you seemed to give an initially positive response to that. So what happened? Where and when shall we have it? You have the whip hand, we can only follow you, not the other way around.

    As for threats to remove my membership simply for asking the ‘wrong’ questions, I guess that’s up to you. If you have some overriding reason for wanting to shut me up I suppose that speaks volumes in itself. As far as I’m aware I haven’t contravened any of the ‘house rules’ and would not deserve such action. However I’m sure there are other channels that I could pursue my request for information through if I had to.

    On a positive note, even if you don’t want to talk to me, I hope you are prepared to engage with some of the individuals on these message boards at a level that is a little less perfunctory than your actions have so far indicated. I’m sure if you show us respect as concerned individuals, we’ll return the favour. I think the posts on this thread already show that. But I guess if I’m not able to post tomorrow, I and everyone else will have their answer.

    [P.s sorry for another 'v.lengthy' post - I'll be sure to curb my enthusiasm in the future]

    Report message6

  • Message 7

    , in reply to message 6.

    Posted by steve_swift (U2177659) on Tuesday, 10th February 2009

    Great stuff!!

    Unfortunately the more cogently the case is made, the more likely it is to be ignored.

    Says more about them than us, though.

    Report message7

  • Message 8

    , in reply to message 7.

    Posted by I am not an organiser etc (U11351618) on Tuesday, 10th February 2009

    Well, Jem?

    It seems people are being reasonable, helpful and constructive. So what next?

    From where I come from, it’s bad form to ignore such well intentioned and well argued points when you are in a distinct position of power. In fact, to behave badly in these circumstances could be viewed as a distinct abuse of that power.

    That’s not to say you have bad manners. But your behaviour indicates a lack of respect. Respect to the people who contribute to your wages and have an attachment to the station that, given your late arrival, you possibly don’t share – although it appears you do have an interest in music.

    So what do we do? Serious question. Help us out here.

    John

    Report message8

  • Message 9

    , in reply to message 8.

    Posted by Jem Stone (U517591) on Wednesday, 11th February 2009

    Yep. Thanks for the constructive suggestions above. I'm reading, sharing and will respond. But not necessarily today. Soon.

  • Message 10

    , in reply to message 9.

    Posted by Ethalrocks (U10136879) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    *whistles*

    Report message10

  • Message 11

    , in reply to message 10.

    Posted by purrmeister (U11445326) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    Ethalrocks - I agree, been waiting for ages! D'you reckon he's snowbound and can't get to work?



    I'm being ironic here - but not in an 'inane bantery' sort of way........

    Report message11

  • Message 12

    , in reply to message 11.

    Posted by Mozo (U10059077) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    I think he's busy in the office ripping the guts out of our posts for the past 2 days. I'm on about my 5th notification this morning. One of them has apparently been removed TWICE! Now that’s thorough.

    It was actually a fairly balance comment about how friends of mine no longer listen to 6 because of its ‘new’ direction. It had nothing that contravened the holy rule book, but as usual we're censored with no explanation and no recourse to appeal.

    Still I suppose if it makes them feel better about themselves. Self delusion is one of the saddest afflictions to be burdened with though isn’t it?

    Report message12

  • Message 13

    , in reply to message 12.

    Posted by LoudGeoffW (U11943874) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    I noticed that pattern with my posts on POV last week when things got 'heated' , Mozo.

    One simply suggested that the Birdsong DAB broadcast was preferable to Lamb. That's it.

    Note to moderators - I'm posting it in the right 'controlled' thread now. Okay?

    Report message13

  • Message 14

    , in reply to message 13.

    Posted by U6679583 (U6679583) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    [cough]

    Report message14

  • Message 15

    , in reply to message 14.

    Posted by I am not an organiser etc (U11351618) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    Shhh!

    Report message15

  • Message 16

    , in reply to message 15.

    Posted by purrmeister (U11445326) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    Pin dropping..............

    Report message16

  • Message 17

    , in reply to message 16.

    Posted by Mozo (U10059077) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    [Parp]


    Sorry


    smiley - blush

    Report message17

  • Message 18

    , in reply to message 17.

    Posted by U6679583 (U6679583) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    They should provide some magazines....

    Report message18

  • Message 19

    , in reply to message 18.

    Posted by purrmeister (U11445326) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    The 'Out to Lunch' sign hasn't dropped of the door handle - has it?

    Report message19

  • Message 20

    , in reply to message 19.

    Posted by Mozo (U10059077) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    Didn't someone write a play about this?

    Report message20

  • Message 21

    , in reply to message 20.

    Posted by purrmeister (U11445326) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    Waiting for Godot?

    'To occupy themselves, they eat, sleep, talk, argue, sing, play games, exercise, swap hats, and contemplate suicide — anything "to hold the terrible silence at bay".

    "Silence," says Beckett, "is pouring into this play like water into a sinking ship", arguably both true and ironic, given the play's wordy banter and patter.

    Pity the last bit is one sided it seems! smiley - winkeye

    Report message21

  • Message 22

    , in reply to message 21.

    Posted by U6679583 (U6679583) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    [fidget]

    Report message22

  • Message 23

    , in reply to message 22.

    Posted by hank plankton (U4792100) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    www.youtube.com/watc...

    Report message23

  • Message 24

    , in reply to message 22.

    Posted by Mozo (U10059077) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    Maybe we could do our own version and call it 'Waiting for Modot'.

    Lets do the show right here kids!

    Report message24

  • Message 25

    , in reply to message 24.

    Posted by Mozo (U10059077) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    Hankplankton - Careful now. You'll only get the BBC commissioning a series called 'I'm a celebrity, make my paint dry' introduced by, wait for it...

    Mind you, Fisty could be a contestant, well he could provide the paint anyway.

    Report message25

  • Message 26

    , in reply to message 25.

    Posted by hank plankton (U4792100) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    Mozo,
    Call me Hank. Don't feel worthy to be at the coalface with you folks. I just flit about looking for a decent radio station and appreciate what you're trying to do. Keep it up.

    Report message26

  • Message 27

    , in reply to message 26.

    Posted by I am not an organiser etc (U11351618) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    Hi Jem,

    Thanks for returning. Really look forward to your feedback.

    Be useful to remember you did make this offer during the Ross/Brand panic, which was months ago now. I understand completely that it was all hands to the pump at that time and risk aversion was the name of the game then. (Remember how all the contributors to this feedback forum were put on pre-mod? What larks?)

    Anyway, please don’t interpret attempts at levity while you garner information from the higher-ups as insubordination. You’re the ‘guy in charge’ and I think all contributors to these boards are aware of that.

    So... should we be suggesting a time limit on this? ‘Soon’ is one of those words that can be interpreted a number of ways. It’s a word like ‘reasonable’ when written into criminal law. Always looks absolutely fine when going through Select Committees in both houses, but only serves to fill lawyers’ swimming pools with pound notes when applied to real life.

    Would, say, next Tuesday look OK from your perspective? I think it would be a week then, which rounds it off nicely. If that’s a problem, could you let the good people who contribute to 6Music’s improvement around these parts know - and offer an alternative timescale? It would be helpful.

    Thanks in advance,

    John

    Report message27

  • Message 28

    , in reply to message 27.

    Posted by Mozo (U10059077) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    If you could see me now, you'd know I was saluting

    Report message28

  • Message 29

    , in reply to message 28.

    Posted by I am not an organiser etc (U11351618) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    So if I got a webcam, would that be all I could look forward to?

    Report message29

  • Message 30

    , in reply to message 29.

    Posted by Mozo (U10059077) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    You temptress!

    Did I mention that I'm naked?

    Report message30

  • Message 31

    , in reply to message 30.

    Posted by I am not an organiser etc (U11351618) on Thursday, 12th February 2009

    Stop that, now!

    This is a serious message board for serious people.

    So, what was your website address, again?

    Report message31

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