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Discussion:

When did Cornwall become England?

Messages  161 - 180 of 565

 
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Message 161 - posted by Yodeller, Sep 20, 2006

The Henersons were very 'H'

Just how the local men like it. Ramspit and Sanifen either side of Phillup (he being the little weeed)
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Message 162 - posted by Kenver, Sep 20, 2006


"The move followed a MORI telephone poll commissioned by the county council in six Cornish districts which revealed 72% in favour of holding a referendum on the issue"

Instability, what can i say, if i was there with you maybe i could help, i could pass you a cloth to wipe the egg of your face.

You silly little boy.

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The Beaufort Research Survey (June 2002) showed 46% in favour of a Cornish Assembly, 34% not in favour of any assembly, 12% in favour of a “south west” assembly and 8% don’t knows.

In Feb 2003 a Cornwall Council MORI poll showed that the number of respondents in favour of establishing a regional assembly for Cornwall had risen to 55%.
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Message 163 - posted by Brian, Sep 21, 2006

Thank you kenver,

"The move followed a MORI telephone poll commissioned by the county council in six Cornish districts which revealed 72% in favour of holding a referendum on the issue"

Instability, what can i say, if i was there with you maybe i could help, i could pass you a cloth to wipe the egg of your face.

You silly little boy.

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Please don't bother, as, yet again, either wilfully, or by sheer stupidity, you lot have just done it again!

You see I asked you to;
Show me the facts, show me the figures, show me the referrences, show me the validation, show me the controls, show me the analysis.

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And what do you come up with as answers? I'll tell you, (and I don't mind admitting I'm having a bloody good chuckle at your response,) instead of hard facts, or referrences to quality material, I get;

Links to BBC news items!
Links to Wikipedia articles!
More totally unreferrenced and unqualified statistics!
Not a single bit of verifiable evidence!
Links to "the campaign for an Assembley" website, (and how unbiased is that then? <doh>)

Ok, seeing as you are scared of the truth, here is something that will shake your very roots! Here is real evidence.

If you go to the MORI website, and type in "Cornwall" into a search, you will get several replies. (Of course what you won't get is this mythical "55% of Cornish want devolution", as it's just not there, you've made it up)

One of the most pertinent and apt statistics can be gleaned from this;

www.ipsos-mori.com/p...

MORI interviewed 1,304 British adults aged 18+: 500 across England, 200 in Devon & Cornwall, 200 in the West Midlands, 202 in East Anglia, and 201 in Kent

Interviews were conducted by telephone on 27-29 April 2000

Based on all unless otherwise stated

Data are weighted to the known population profile

An '*' indicates a finding of less than 0.5%, but greater than zero

Poll conducted by MORI on behalf of The Mail on Sunday


Q4b What are the most important local issues facing your part of the country?

Devolution/constitutional reform 0% (Devon and Cornwall)

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So there you have it.

The only referrenced, verifiable, validated, properly published, and controlled study you will find in this debate, and the only one you need pay heed to, and what does it say?

I says; NO ONE ASKED THOUGHT THAT DEVOLTION AND /OR CONSTUTIONAL REFORM WERE IMPORTANT IN DEVON AND CORNWALL.

With those sample sizes, if ONLY ONE persona asked had found this "devolution" nonsense of any value, it would have been statistically indicated and prominent, but no one cared to rate it.

When you people can come up with some substantial, substantiated, and verifiable evidence I will believe you, untill then I'll just have to believe you are living in cloud cuckoo land!
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Message 164 - posted by geoTamar, Sep 21, 2006

Instability, predictably you have made a complete ass of yourself again.

You demonstrate completely ignoring results of the Mori Poll commissioned by Cornwall County Council in 2003. You have a self-imposed blindness to statistical data, supplied by a reputable company, that do not indicate what you preconceivably want to show. You are not worth communicating with further.
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Message 165 - posted by Kenver, Sep 21, 2006

Instability, predictably you have made a complete ass of yourself again.

You demonstrate completely ignoring results of the Mori Poll commissioned by Cornwall County Council in 2003. You have a self-imposed blindness to statistical data, supplied by a reputable company, that do not indicate what you preconceivably want to show. You are not worth communicating with further.

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<laugh> I suppose he will claim that these are also incorrect !

"In 2001 it presented to Mr Blair an audited 50,000-signature petition."

5. During the period 2001-04 a number of surveys showed public support for devolved governance for Cornwall and the Isles of Scilly growing from 46% in 2001 (Beaufort) to 55% in 2004 (MORI). This degree of positive support is unique compared with other parts of the Country.

www.publications.par...

...it was resolved that the Council send a copy of the extensive opinion poll conducted by MORI to the Office of the Deputy Prime Minister

www.cornwall.gov.uk/...
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Message 166 - posted by Fulup le Breton, Sep 21, 2006

No but Kenver, can't you just picture this instability character rabidly tapping away at his key board until his mum says its time for bed?

Instability, predictably you have made a complete ass of yourself again.

You demonstrate completely ignoring results of the Mori Poll commissioned by Cornwall County Council in 2003. You have a self-imposed blindness to statistical data, supplied by a reputable company, that do not indicate what you preconceivably want to show. You are not worth communicating with further.


<laugh> I suppose he will claim that these are also incorrect !

"In 2001 it presented to Mr Blair an audited 50,000-signature petition."

5. During the period 2001-04 a number of surveys showed public support for devolved governance for Cornwall and the Isles of Scilly growing from 46% in 2001 (Beaufort) to 55% in 2004 (MORI). This degree of positive support is unique compared with other parts of the Country.

www.publications.par...

...it was resolved that the Council send a copy of the extensive opinion poll conducted by MORI to the Office of the Deputy Prime Minister

www.cornwall.gov.uk/...

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Message 167 - posted by Brian, Sep 22, 2006

Instability, predictably you have made a complete ass of yourself again.

You demonstrate completely ignoring results of the Mori Poll commissioned by Cornwall County Council in 2003. You have a self-imposed blindness to statistical data, supplied by a reputable company, that do not indicate what you preconceivably want to show. You are not worth communicating with further.

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Oh, I'm not further worth communicating with? Good.

Seeing as you haven't brought one jot of information to this debate, or done anything other than castigate others like a prissy maiden aunt, what will we miss?


I suppose he will claim that these are also incorrect !

"In 2001 it presented to Mr Blair an audited 50,000-signature petition."

5. During the period 2001-04 a number of surveys showed public support for devolved governance for Cornwall and the Isles of Scilly growing from 46% in 2001 (Beaufort) to 55% in 2004 (MORI). This degree of positive support is unique compared with other parts of the Country.

www.publications.par...

...it was resolved that the Council send a copy of the extensive opinion poll conducted by MORI to the Office of the Deputy Prime Minister

www.cornwall.gov.uk/...

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They may be correct, but what do we discover on clicking on the links? Nothing yet again, empty of any information,they merely give the most base data. (All the Cornish can cope with I suppose, hence their miniing obsession.)

Here's some questions for you:

What were people asked in these surveys?
What facts were they given to inform their choices?
What controls were put in place to stop people signing the petition multiple times?
What controls were put in place to stop people from outside of Corwall signing it?

And the answer is: "we don't know", isn't it?

Why?

Because even though you laud these polls to high heaven, you haven't a scinitla of an idea what they actually are. If you had any evidence of their validity, you'd post it here.

But you do not, you have nothing.

You're building castles out of sand here, and you know it.


No but Kenver, can't you just picture this instability character rabidly tapping away at his key board until his mum says its time for bed?

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Coming from the man who spends so much of his time spamming the internet with e-mails, to all and every organisation under the sun, one who has posted more (and more tripe) here than anyone else in this forum, I'll treat that remark with the distain it deserves.



I think it reflects quite clearly how devoid of substance this whole Cornish nationalism fraud is, that when ever the proponents are challenged to produce hard evidence they cannot come up with any (apart from insubstantial links none of which give the actual facts), and then resort to name calling.

Still, as long as the Cornish nationalists are represented by the likes of Geotamar, Fulup In France, and Ken, then I suppose the rest of the UK can carry on enjoying relations with the real Cornish, safe in the knowledge that the nationalists have no case, and are bluffing on an empty hand.
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Message 168 - posted by Fulup le Breton, Sep 22, 2006

Oh dear i do remember a sad character like you called stroppygob who ran away from the board.

What has been provided are links to reliable information and actual figures, many of the links provided by the government or BBC.

What have you provided? Nothing!

If you had even one poll to show the contrary you would post it here. If you had one piece of evidence to discredit the polls or petition you would have posted it, but no, just one big red herring.
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Message 169 - posted by Kenver, Sep 22, 2006

They may be correct

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Changing your tune now ! If you're that interested try contacting Cornwall Council - I'm sure they would help !
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Message 170 - posted by Kenver, Oct 6, 2006

If you want to argue that between Athelstan's victory over the Cornish in 936 and the Norman invasion of 1066, Cornwall became a shire (county) of Wessex (later to contribute to the formation of England), then you will need to address the following points.

Of a cultural nature.

*Cornwall would have spoken Cornish, with Saxon being a tiny minority.

*From this period nearly only Cornish pottery is found in Cornwall.

*The Cornish had different measurement systems than the Saxons at this time.

*Cornwall showed a very different type of settlement pattern than Saxon Wessex

*Places continued (even after 1066) to be named in the Celtic Cornish tradition not Saxon tradition.

*Saxon architecture is very rare in Cornwall.

On a legal Front

*Cornish religious institutions at this time paid no Saxon land tax.

*Cornish industries like fishing and tin paid no Saxon tax.

*Vast ares of Cornwall paid no Saxon land tax.

*Only a very small tribute was paid to London, the rest probably going to the native Celtic ruler.

*There is next to no evidence of Saxon manorial law in Cornwall at this time. Cornish law was probably in operation.

*There is next to no evidence of Saxon moots, Saxon justice, centres of Saxon administration or the collection of Saxon customary dues in Cornwall.

*The Normans then created the Earldom of Cornwall and governed it with a viceroy (colonial governor), usually a Breton noble, England on the other hand was governed directly by the King. Cornwall was therefore treated as part of an empire but separate from England.

*Cornwall has never been a shire and indeed had shires of its own.

"""John, by the Grace of God, King of England, Lord of Ireland, Duke of Normandy and Aquitaine, Earl of Anjou confirmed the aforesaid, and Richard, King of Germany and Earl of Cornwall, in like manner, confirmed the aforesaid"""
Treaty of Bretigny 1360.

*It is clear from this address that refers to nations of Europe not counties of England, that when Richard was viceroy (1227-72) Cornwall was not part of England.

If Cornwall had been part of England at this time it would have been incorrect to devise such an address.

I would be like saying Elizabeth II, Queen of the United Kingdom and Scotland, the latter have being redundant because Scotland is part of the United kingdom.

www.kernowtgg.co.uk/

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Well, I see the Cornish Stannary Parliament are taking action on this in the European Court of Human Rights over violations of the European Convention of Human Rights.

The case for Cornwall, in respect of alleged violations of the European Convention of Human Rights, Articles 6, (independent and impartial courts); 8, (respect family life); 10, (freedom of expression); 13, (violations by officials); 14 with Protocol 12, (discrimination on the grounds of association with a national minority, property, birth or other status); 17, (the official destruction of rights); Protocol 1 Article 1, (property rights) with 385 supporting documents, has been submitted by members of the Cornish Stannary Parliament to the European Court of Human Rights and on the 13th April 2006 the Court stated that it: "will deal with the case as soon as practicable".

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Message 171 - posted by grum_back_seat_driver, Oct 6, 2006

.....the Court stated that it: "will deal with the case as soon as practicable".

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Uh-oh.

A european beaurocratic source said THAT?

I wouldn't hold your breath<laugh>
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Message 172 - posted by Fulup le Breton, Oct 6, 2006

The case is logged with the European Court of Human Rights and will be dealt with, so you can laugh now if you want but it make s you look a bit foolish.

Contact the Cornish Stannary Parliament to find out more than if you still feel like laughing go ahead: www.cornish-stannary...
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Message 173 - posted by Enoch_P (2), Oct 6, 2006

So if European Court of Human Rights decides in your favour what will that achieve?

Explain to me how that will improve the life’s of Cornish People?
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Message 174 - posted by Enoch_P (2), Oct 8, 2006

It seems the Cornish lobby posts endlessly, but one simple question seems to have left them looking blank.

I am so disappointed in the minority link posters?
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Message 175 - posted by c_jenkin, Oct 8, 2006

So if European Court of Human Rights decides in your favour what will that achieve?

Explain to me how that will improve the life’s of Cornish People?

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It means that Cornish people will have the same rights, respect and protection afforded to other peoples of Europe. This will certainly improve my life and my children's lives enormously.
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Message 176 - posted by Enoch_P (2), Oct 8, 2006

Care to expand and offer forward any facts?
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Message 177 - posted by c_jenkin, Oct 8, 2006

Care to suggest why this wouldn't be the case or do you think that human rights legislation is irrelevant ...
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Message 178 - posted by U5980963, Oct 8, 2006

The cornish stannary has made a joke of itself at every level of the English courts with a singular predictable and invariable lack of success.
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Message 179 - posted by Enoch_P (2), Oct 9, 2006

Jenkins I am not sure if your comment was directed towards me, but if it was.

I asked anyone to give an example of how European Court of Human Rights case would help anyone in Cornwall, you gave a nice personal example which is highly indistinct, and I have now asked you to expand. Give firm details and facts, but remember the question is improving every Cornish person’s lives.

Lets debate, but supply hard facts not hear say.

Sometimes I wonder if the harder you guys push home this Cornish independence stuff you don’t do more damage than good, how comes people that love Cornwall and Cornwall history need to take the opposing view to help keep this realistic?
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Message 180 - posted by grum_back_seat_driver, Oct 9, 2006

The case is logged with the European Court of Human Rights and will be dealt with, so you can laugh now if you want but it make s you look a bit foolish.

Contact the Cornish Stannary Parliament to find out more than if you still feel like laughing go ahead: www.cornish-stannary...

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Oh FLB have you been watching Will & Grace again?;-)

The laugh smiley was a good natured post intended to illustrate that those less than punctual types in europe have given a meaningless timescale on the cornish case which does not fill me with optimism for a prompt resolution.

You're so prickly!
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