Comments for http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html en-gb 30 Sat 12 Jul 2014 10:06:51 GMT+1 A feed of user comments from the page found at http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html leoRoverman http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=99#comment300 290, you obviously have never read any of my posts before. Of course Ive seen Hull after the wreckage, my own Great Uncle died in the 1 November 1940 in Bromley. The point is the wreckage of Hull and Bromley are no different to that of Hamburg. My true point is that both sides tried to win the war and failed to do so with this strategy. For heavens sake its 70 years ago and I have lived in both countries for the last 60 of them. Do people not realise that this artificial jingoism is created to unite this country to mask the ineptitude of successive Governments and keep us tipping the forelock, not mention keeping is in a position where we justify the unjustifiable on both sides. Sun 12 Sep 2010 21:47:44 GMT+1 Randolf Sheepdip http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=99#comment299 If the Germans hadn't lost the war - we'd probably all be speaking English. Sun 12 Sep 2010 21:09:41 GMT+1 2squirrels http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=99#comment298 At the moment the spirit of the blitz does not exist as everybody wants more and instantly plus mostly they don't care who gets pushed aside as they make there way. However, if really hard times are coming again it may force people to examine there actions and a little more barter trading may bring back the old reliance on each other and neighbours could find themselves getting to know each other over their garden fences as they start to grow more food to help make ends meet. Unemployed tradesmen can do jobs for each other or for food and eventually it may become natural for evertbody to help each other again but I won't hold mt breath. I will give anybody a hand but I don't see a lot of reciprocation and luckily my husband & I are pretty self sufficient with our joint skills. Sun 12 Sep 2010 19:10:35 GMT+1 Hairy Gnome http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=98#comment297 @9 Andover Cenotaph; If you're going to write an essay, try breaking it into paragraphs, you never know someone might even find the will to read it! Sun 12 Sep 2010 18:27:56 GMT+1 new_germany http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=98#comment296 To comment Nr. 296:It is actually a personal thing which country one thinks is better than the other, but I would not choose criteria like "bureaucracy", "wages" and the situation of immigrants as decisive.The thing with the Bundesbanker Mr Sarrazin is that he publishes a book called "Germany abolishes itself" in which he critisises that immigrants don´t want to learn German, but they insist to speak their own language. The problem here is that therefore their chances on the German labour market are often worse as well sa their social integration - no wonder that their social mobility as a logical consequence is actually a problem. I think there is nothing specific "nationalistic" in discussing such problems of integration! But I agree that his remark about Jews can´t be accepted - the point here is that Mr Sarrazin quickly put himself in a position of isolation with a storm of protests across all media, just like the foolish remarks of Mrs Steinbach - both have in common that they are blamed as outsiders and this speaks for Germany, doesn´t it?My personal impression is that in general that Germany is the better modern welfare state, for people that are unemployed or ill the support is higher than in the UK, and there are more social problems in the UK, fe the teenage murders.My impression is that the UK media are on about the WWII; this is not a bad thing as such as I actually think history is important, but in my opinion there are clearly overdoing it, some stories are ridiculous for me and they appear out of the context.Anyway, Germany´s image in the UK seems to me reduced to two thing:Firstly, Germany are the old enemy of WWII.Secondly, they are Europe´s largest economy.Am I right?! Sat 11 Sep 2010 20:19:05 GMT+1 nickinfrieda http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=98#comment295 IN reply to Post #291Sorry, but I don't know where you get your image of modern Germany from, but I've been living here for almost 14 years, and its not much like you describe. The rich are still rich, the poor are still poor, and I would say social mobility is no different to the UK. Yes, the Germans have more holidays and earn more than UK workers, but they also pay much more in taxes to support this (I lose 52% of my wage!). And ask any of the millions of Turkish and other immigrant workers about social mobility and you may also get a different very response to that which you stated (unless of course they are any good at football). As for bureaucracy... well I've only lived in one country with worse bureaucracy than Germany and that was India! UK bureaucracy is mild in comparison! And as the BBC News has shown this week, there are still plenty of people in high places who have strange, almost 'nationalistic' ideas (Bundesbanker dismissed due to anti-jewish comments, and one of the CDUs top executives to resign after blaming Poland for starting WWII!!).I'm not saying the UK is any better, just wanted to point out to you that 'your' version of modern Germany is a bit of a fairytale...To answer the question, I still thank that the UK Blitz 'spirit' would revive if ever the need arose again (but lets hope it never does) Sat 11 Sep 2010 14:17:58 GMT+1 Mr Max http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=97#comment294 "250. At 2:39pm on 08 Sep 2010, The Bloke wrote:We're way more diverse, meaning that whoever the enemy would be, chances are, a fair few people claiming to be British would actually be batting for 'them' rather than 'us'."This was the same during the Blitz. There were hoards of people saying things ranging from appeasement, to surrender, to out and out support for the Nazis. Don't forget Moseley and the Blackshirts, and the BUF. Sat 11 Sep 2010 14:10:36 GMT+1 Michelle Lenoir http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=97#comment293 This post has been Removed Fri 10 Sep 2010 20:46:57 GMT+1 new_germany http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=97#comment292 I have other historic facts than comment Nr. 291 claims:1. At the German election (05.03.1933) 43,9% voted for the Nazis, Hitlers was therefore forced to a coaltion with another national party, DNVP (8%). All five parties in the parliament accepted a law with a qualified majority that established Hitler basically as a dictator with the only exception of the Social Democrats that voted against it. 2. The public actions against Jews can´t be compared with the British, two most outstanding examples are the so-called "Racial Laws of Nuremberg" in 1935 and the criminal organised public actions against Jews in 1938 (so-called "Crystal night"). Therefore the Nazis didn´t hide their racial ideology ("final solution" of the Jews) in a secret chamber!3. The "Republic of Weimar" stood in the aftermath of WWI as a "construct of emergency" because the majority of Germans distrusted a republic and they had no experience to run a system parlamentarism (in contrast to the UK!), the German army of the Empire has become a "state within a state", the movement of right wing extremists become considerably strong ahead of Hitler because they gave the Germans an illusion of a "strong state" they sought for in a climate of extreme political, economic and social problems after the world economic crisis in 1929 - a dangerous mixture! The Nazis aimed for a revision of the humiliation of the Treaty of Versailles and gained supporters from civil and National Conservative parts of society. 4. Hitler´s aggressive foreign policy, aiming for "space for the people" has been evident: Germany left the federation of nations (later UN), "expansion for new territory": annexation of Austria, Munich conference, annexation of Czechia); as a reaction the "politics of appeasement started already in 1935 to 1939.5. The fact that Germany had much more to suffer for aerial bombing in comparison to the UK is not the theme here as we only look at the situation of the "Blitz" from September 1940 to May 1941.This has been a time of uncertainty as in summer 1940 it actually looked like as Nazi Germany will win the war, occupying Western Europe. The UK has been close to defeat, there were problems in the Empire and with India, the UK has been almost bancrupt, and, most important, it stood alone in Europe against Nazi Germany with the US providing only little military support at this time. Churchill´s person has been controversial and people still doubted if he would be right.6. The legacy of the "Blitz" is still visible in London: the National Firefighters Monument at St. Pauls (that remained undamaged during the blitz), the monument for the women of WWII at Whitehall, the Churchill Museum and so on stand for the UK´s collective memory.They actually didn´t deserve it to be put aside! Fri 10 Sep 2010 20:18:30 GMT+1 mac http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=96#comment291 266. At 09:31am on 09 Sep 2010, Miss Ann Thrope wrote:254. At 4:20pm on 08 Sep 2010, mac wrote:I lived through the blitz period,and it is obvious whoever thought this question up for the BBC should be sacked for incompetence.There is no resemblance between the people inhabiting Britain today and then.Then they were lions and saints,people willing to be martyrs,people who believed and trusted in God,great people.Only a few of that type remain today.I would not waste my time or energy describing todays lot.Looks like this poor chap magnified the zoom on his nostalgia goggles at least seven..... -------------------------------------------Misanthrope...a hater of humankind...you are right,my nostalgia for days gone by,my lovely wife,my old friends all now sadly gone,nice memories.Perhaps one day you also will look back with my magnifying lenses.Good luck and best wishes. Fri 10 Sep 2010 16:32:24 GMT+1 Peter Bridgemont http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=96#comment290 This post has been Removed Fri 10 Sep 2010 15:55:50 GMT+1 nickinfrieda http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=96#comment289 286. At 10:01pm on 09 Sep 2010, leoRoverman wrote:LA Londoner it may have escaped your notice that German cities were TOTALLY obliterated in a retaliatory Blitz that lasted until the last days of the War against British, American and Russian Airforces.----------------------------------------------------------------leoRoverman,I take it you've never seen any pictures of what 'remained' of Hull at the end of the 1945??? My father lived there, and was 8-years old at the time (and to this day, still has German bomb shrapnel in his legs). It was an awful time for ALL sides in the conflict. Fri 10 Sep 2010 14:57:21 GMT+1 Nina Szombately http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=95#comment288 This post has been Removed Fri 10 Sep 2010 13:51:35 GMT+1 new_germany http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=95#comment287 The 70th anniversary of the "blitz" war is supposed to be an occasion for Germany to deeply regret this awful series of air raids across the Uk and particular to London.Germany knows that it is responsible for the outbreak of WWII in these days of commemoration and the time between September 1940 and May 1941 is a time of determination in the history of the UK to stand against the Nazi tyranny and its antisocial goals.The spirit of the "blitz" is a spirit of an unbending attitude and a spirit of never giving up that is still a strong inspiration to all of us.It is not the case that Germany leans back by an indifferent attitude in these days, it is also the generation of old Germans that deliberately backed the Nazi dictatorship that are morally responsible for this. They can´t be left alone and they must be asked to reflect their behaviour critically.SORRY! Fri 10 Sep 2010 06:25:34 GMT+1 DPB http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=95#comment286 No. With immigration and lack of discipline in schools and at home the chances of Britain surving a similar problem would be zero. You can thank the PC crowd and liberalism for that. There is limited zeal for national pride because one would be classed as a racist, hence many such situations in England today. Fri 10 Sep 2010 00:59:51 GMT+1 leoRoverman http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=94#comment285 283; gegen dumheit kaempfen the Goetter umsonst. Literally translated against stupidity the gods fight in vain. LA Londoner it may have escaped your notice that German cities were TOTALLY obliterated in a retaliatory Blitz that lasted until the last days of the War against British, American and Russian Airforces. These kinds of attacks are unthinkable today but the the Blitz ( gawd how I hate that word, it means lightning) only went to cover criminality and to justify retaliation. I was born in 51 and most German cities today have huge hills made from the debris of attacks in their vicinity. Today they are earthed over and covered in grass. Those who never saw Germany in the early 50's really have no concept. Thu 09 Sep 2010 21:01:55 GMT+1 Martin Swift http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=94#comment284 The type of war my parents had to endure is totally different to what our troops and their families and communities have to endure...in a small way that spirit will still be there...but never in the same vein.However...should the whole country be brought into a war like WW2 and not the fighting as in IRAQ & AFGHANISTAN...then that spirit would most likely return and woe any enemies at the door... Thu 09 Sep 2010 20:33:06 GMT+1 jr4412 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=94#comment283 LALondoner #283."..how do you know that the Germans suffered more from our bombing than we did from theirs???"I think that if you have to suffer being bombed out of your house, and family members die, your nationality won't make the blindest bit of difference."..keep your dumb ignorant opinions to yourself.."wow. pot, kettle, black, eh?? Thu 09 Sep 2010 20:23:04 GMT+1 LALondoner http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=93#comment282 281 - Ian Cheese, how do you know that the Germans suffered more from our bombing than we did from theirs??? Were you there? - no thought not!! Ask anyone from Plymouth, Coventry or the East End of London - and then keep your dumb ignorant opinions to yourself - with many thanks... Thu 09 Sep 2010 19:48:25 GMT+1 LALondoner http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=93#comment281 HOw could the British show the spirit which carried them through the blitz? No one knows what it is to be British these days......Thanks you PC contingent - your work is done. Thu 09 Sep 2010 19:43:45 GMT+1 ian cheese http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=93#comment280 We must also remember innocent Germans caught up in the RAF bombings which deliberately created firestorms in Dresden, for example. That perhaps was worse than the blitz we had to endure. Thu 09 Sep 2010 17:41:47 GMT+1 Rosie Bryant http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=92#comment279 To Paul (comment no 4): I totally agree. Have you ever seen 'Threads'?! Terrifying! Thu 09 Sep 2010 17:14:39 GMT+1 devilzadvacate1 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=92#comment278 I am slightly more optimistic than most here. Hopefully we will never again have to endure what people went through during the blitz. The only reason the blitz spirit ever existed was because of the blitz - I know it sounds obvious but what I mean is that it is only because of the hardship that people had to endure at the time that this spirit ever came into existence.I would like to think that should a similar situation ever occur again we would again lift ourselves and the spirit would be rekindled. Thu 09 Sep 2010 15:23:49 GMT+1 jr4412 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=92#comment277 ed_butt #277."..how fortunate you are to have the privilege of free speech.."oh we do, don't we?! what good is freedom of speech when you're not being listened to?like by a New Labour government, elected by a minority (less than 45% turnout), who took the country into an illegal war; or by the current government who 'need' to cut public services when there's reasoned oppostion and counter-argument.no, Mr ed_butt, some of us may be lucky but when you look around in this country, and in the wider world, the situation has not improved since WWII; we still have wars all round the world, we have ever increasing numbers of people without access to potable water and/or food, destitution is on the up.maybe you are one of the lucky -- well, good for you. imagine, you could have been born in Pakistan (and be displaced by floods) or in Haiti (and have your livelihood destroyed in a moment).the "all fought a terrible enemy" fought by our (grand-)parents has not gone away -- people are still greedy, callous, inhumane. Thu 09 Sep 2010 14:37:58 GMT+1 ed_butt http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=91#comment276 Several posts seem to have a lot to say on this topic.Just bear in mind how fortunate you are to have the privilege of free speech and all the other freedoms you enjoy today. None of this is there for you "by accident" or just because you think it is your right.You enjoy these freedoms today because people of my parents' generation fought and died for your freedom, so you may care to bear that in mind the next time you feel like blasting off at someone you disagree with.Also, bear in mind that, for many people all over the world, the Second World War did not end on 8th May 1945, because many people the world over still carry the scars, mentally and physically, from that terrible time.They all fought a terrible enemy and endured terrible hardships to ensure a better future for everyone.That includes the likes of you "jr4412" and "europhile". Thu 09 Sep 2010 13:35:06 GMT+1 jr4412 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=91#comment275 me me me #264."One of man's biggest problems is not learning from history."rubbish, inspite of war memorials, D-day, Blitz, what-have-you commemorations, our spending on arms and munitions is increasing not decreasing; war (and oppression) is big business and people get killed when they get in the way, whether they learned from history or not. the constant "lest we forget" achieves the exact opposite. Thu 09 Sep 2010 12:48:11 GMT+1 europhile http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=91#comment274 No it does not, neither does it need to, it is 2010 now and we are a United Europe. Thu 09 Sep 2010 12:06:28 GMT+1 Roy Solihull http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=90#comment273 What we have to remember is that without the past we would not be here today. If we had lost the Battle of Britain then no one born say after 1950 may be alive today. It is due to the Battle of Britain that we are aloud to live our lives today, and more importantly that we are here today. There would be no P/Cs I-pods no fredom of travel, or fredom of thought.Just ask yourselves, "what if" Also Churchills words are more true today than when he actually spoke them we (The so many) do and alway will owe so much to those few. So never forget it take no time to remember, and think "But for they there would be no me" Thu 09 Sep 2010 09:48:21 GMT+1 gereatricgeorge1932 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=90#comment272 i was 8 when i saw 100s of german bombers coming up the thames? in a massive diamond formation (ilived in erith kent 12 miles from london) all the nieghbours were out the front of there houses watching (not realising the danger?) when they passed over they started bombing?woolwich arsenal 4 miles away killing many girls working there? we saw them bombing the shell avon refinories the other side of the thames, that night after another air raid warning i looked out the back with mum and dad? and the skies were glowing red everywhere in the distance towards london? we never used to go in the shelter? it was damp and water all over floor? we like many used to shelter under stairs? i was never evacuated? my dad said if we go we all go together? he was injured in 1st world war and was a fire warden "gereatricgeorge" Thu 09 Sep 2010 09:43:08 GMT+1 Roy Solihull http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=90#comment271 My belief is that is depends on your ethnick back ground. It may sound wrong but if your family are not based in the UK then you would turn to hem for shelter. We who are fully based in the UK would have to stay and put up with the hardship. And as before we would band together and overcome and manage,thats what people do. Would we come out as better people not to sure we would be stronger for sure. I just hope it never happens, my mother used to speak some times of the blitz, and some of the things she saw where just horrific. But man is a greedy animal and always wants more........ Thu 09 Sep 2010 09:37:09 GMT+1 Wilberfalse http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=89#comment270 Name: John (C) Vetterlein (1935 - )Spent the war years at Redbridge on the Eastern approaches to London. Father in Royal Air Force, uncle in the Fire Service.From my personal perspective the V1 and V2 attacks were the most terrifying, though had we lived closer to London no doubt the blitz would have ranked higher in one’s list of fears and frights.Implications? A life dedicated to the discussion and arguments over armed conflict with many publications. Just run a search.Conclusion? As a species we are incapable of releasing ourselves from the tyranny of war. Thu 09 Sep 2010 09:15:55 GMT+1 Cronk http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=89#comment269 266. At 09:31am on 09 Sep 2010, Miss Ann Thrope wrote:254. At 4:20pm on 08 Sep 2010, mac wrote:I lived through the blitz period,and it is obvious whoever thought this question up for the BBC should be sacked for incompetence.There is no resemblance between the people inhabiting Britain today and then.Then they were lions and saints,people willing to be martyrs,people who believed and trusted in God,great people.Only a few of that type remain today.I would not waste my time or energy describing todays lot.Looks like this poor chap magnified the zoom on his nostalgia goggles at least seven times. Poor guy...................................................Oh look, another condescending liberal with an over rated view of today's chavy youth!Mac. I agree with you 100%. Thu 09 Sep 2010 09:06:03 GMT+1 citizen42 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=89#comment268 do feel free to put me right on this but was it not the east end (cockneys)people of london who had to take the full force of the blitz.for it appears the beeb have put some what of a middle class spin on it coverage. i am speaking as an outsider of course and if the eastenders are happy with the coverage so am I. Thu 09 Sep 2010 09:03:07 GMT+1 Cronk http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=88#comment267 There's Jewish Schools in Manchester that suffers from regular racial attacks.Guess who the aggressors are? Go on!My Granddad lost loved ones during the war, killed on the battlefields in France, injured himself. Apparently they fought against the Nazis, how strange then, that we feel the need to import a new breed of Nazis. Utter sacrilege to the memory of those who fell for us. Even worse, the BBC hides their crimes and forbids debate. Thu 09 Sep 2010 08:57:38 GMT+1 Ian http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=88#comment266 Whenever the 2nd World War is mentioned, you can bet that the focus will include the Blitz or the Holocaust. Didn't anything else happen? Thu 09 Sep 2010 08:54:56 GMT+1 Miss Ann Thrope http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=88#comment265 254. At 4:20pm on 08 Sep 2010, mac wrote:I lived through the blitz period,and it is obvious whoever thought this question up for the BBC should be sacked for incompetence.There is no resemblance between the people inhabiting Britain today and then.Then they were lions and saints,people willing to be martyrs,people who believed and trusted in God,great people.Only a few of that type remain today.I would not waste my time or energy describing todays lot.Looks like this poor chap magnified the zoom on his nostalgia goggles at least seven times. Poor guy. Thu 09 Sep 2010 08:31:50 GMT+1 Cronk http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=87#comment264 149. At 2:00pm on 07 Sep 2010, Peter_Sym wrote:104. At 11:33am on 07 Sep 2010, Cronk wrote:Here's a better question than the one presented:If we had to face another WWII but with today's Britain, what would happen?The BBC might collaborate as they already hate Jews (I mean Israelis). Would people stick around to fight for 'their' country, or would we see immediate and mass emigration back to former homelands until things cooled down and the benefits of living here were established again?Frankly in a fight I'd rather trust a Pole or a Sikh to cover my back than a Brit these days. Far, far too many people on this board are either pig-ignorant of the contribution of other nations to our success in WW2 or choose to ignore it. 2.5M Indians of which 600,000 were muslim fought for us in WW2. The Sikh and Ghurka regiments won far more VC's than similar British units. The Polish 303 squadron during the battle of Britain shot down twice as many German bombers than any other RAF squadron and it was Poles finally captured the abbey at Monte Cassino and dropped on Arnhem even though the battle was obviously lost at that stage.Frankly its far more likely that the Poles and Asians in Britain would dig in and fight to defend the UK than the natives would.Hi Peter_Sym,Your disingenuous post is astounding, not so much for what you say but for what you don't. How many divisions of middle eastern origin (read Egyptian, Palestinian) helped with the extermination of Jews in concentration camps? How many muslim Indians collaborated with the Nazis and Japanese? They call it the World War not the British one! Thu 09 Sep 2010 08:30:01 GMT+1 makar - thread killer http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=87#comment263 jr4412 wrote:"It is the 70th anniversary of the blitz"and sometimes it seems more money is spent on the commemoration of these events than on the now -- why are our schools in such poor condition when there's money for Spitfire monuments and whatnot.--------------------------Ever heard of the term "lest we forget"? One of man's biggest problems is not learning from history. Thu 09 Sep 2010 08:17:39 GMT+1 Stephen http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=87#comment262 My mother was 11 when the war started, initially she was evacuated to Windsor, but later came back to live with her parents in Clapham. To the end of her days, she could not enjoy a firework display, even on the television. When I was teenager, someone had a old moped, that used to "put-put" round the streets late at night, probably delivering pizzas, everytime it passed our house, my mother would go to the window to check that it actually was the moped, apparently it sounded just like the motor on a V1, just before the engine cut out and it fell to ground to explode.So no, how can the "spirit of the blitz" live on in subsequent generations, how can those who never experienced the bombing claim to have understanding. Wed 08 Sep 2010 22:22:58 GMT+1 th3_0r4cl3 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=86#comment261 September marks the 70th anniversary of the onset of the blitz - a German bombing campaign that continued until May 1941.+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++it was 70 years ago move on let it go. It is totally irrelevant to today. Wed 08 Sep 2010 19:46:55 GMT+1 Magaroo http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=86#comment260 My Mum lived her entire teenage years during the war, from the age of 13 to 19, not that there was such a thing as a teenager in those days. On leaving school at 14 she went into the only available occupation for most working class girls, which was Service. Initially this meant leaving home and moving to Bradford to look after a Vicar and his family as a Maid of All Work. This entailed cooking, cleaning and looking after the children, all for the princely sum of 5 shillings per week (25p),out of which she also had to buy her own uniform! It must have been a tough time. She also worked in Service in Bingley at a Teacher Training College which she really enjoyed, but had to come home when the Blitz started and Bradford and surrounding areas were bombed.Living roughly 13 miles from Sheffield, which took a real pounding during the war due to the steel industry, she says she can remember watching the bombers go over at night and seeing Sheffield blazing in the distance. There was an Anderson shelter in the back garden, but the family never used it, neither did anybody else apparently and luckily the town, or at least the bit she lived in, was never hit.She tells me that everyone had to carry a gas mask at all times when they were out, even though no gas bombs were ever dropped. If the wardens saw you without your gas mask you were reprimanded. Because everybody had to carry them, they became a bit of a "bling" thing and girls used to make their own "designer" gas mask cases - knitted I would guess.I think it is probably the little touches like this that contributed to the so called spirit of the Blitz. In reality I think it was just about trying to get through things in the best possible way, because nobody had much of a choice, unless of course you were rich and could leave Europe. So people adopted a way of behaviour that was not to make a fuss about things - there was always somebody worse off than yourself. Also, the adults would have remembered the First World War and the kind of sacrifices made there, so to make a lot of fuss about the hardships would probably have seemed wrong to most people.Do we still have the same spirit today? I think in adversity we still do. I know in my lifetime the British have dealt with the threat of nuclear anhiliation, the troubles in Ireland and all the terrorist fall out, many wars and conflicts in far flung lands that have seen our troops become the most experienced in the world, the most recent terrorist threats and still we remain, in my opinion, a well balanced and rational nation, cool under pressure and with a sense of humour second to none. Wed 08 Sep 2010 19:23:55 GMT+1 nickinfrieda http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=86#comment259 To #253,As a Brit who has now lived in Germany for almost 14 years, I can tell you the Germans do teach their kids about WWII, but the emphasis is strictly on 'the Nazis did this, the Nazis did that', no mention of 'Germans' at all, and this is basically modern Germany's attitude to WWII whenever it is brought up in the Media ('It wasn't us, it's nothing to do with us and anyway Hitler was Austrian...').That is, until Dresden gets mentioned...but that's for another debate...It would be like the Brits saying that anything done in the name of the British Empire is not 'our problem' as 'the Victorians' did that.We even had the absurd situation a couple of years ago that a Minister in Bayern suggested stopping teaching kids about WWI & WWII, saying 'it was no longer RELEVENT to modern Germans' and they would be better off learning about Vietnam & the Middle-East conflict.As an ex-pat, it really does sadden me that the BBC allows these HYS Forums to become a voice for all the nay-sayers and UK-bashers the world over.Thats my 2p. Wed 08 Sep 2010 16:45:34 GMT+1 RitaKleppmann http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=85#comment258 The spirit of the blitz existed while there was a blitz i.e. an extremely threatening external force. In such conditions any society pulls together. In peacetime it looks different. Wed 08 Sep 2010 16:29:25 GMT+1 RubbishGirl http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=85#comment257 208. At 5:01pm on 07 Sep 2010, Adriang1963 wrote:.....and I was indeed expected to have read and absorbed a ~100 page booklet on the history and culture of Australia.=====================================================================Aw, c'mon dude, everyone knows that book's only 4 pages long ;) Wed 08 Sep 2010 16:07:30 GMT+1 adelaide http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=85#comment256 My mother lived in Coventry during the blitz and the whole city was demolished, except for the three spires of cathedral and church, in one night. She remembers those that died and the fear and anger at the losses that people suffered. Homes gone and prized possesions destroyed. She worked 14 hour shifts, six days a week, to help with the clean up and to keep supplies going. Yes the English spirit was strong but she fears it would not be so today. She feels that people have no love for their country and their history. She gave a lot to see it being thrown away 70 years later. Wed 08 Sep 2010 15:57:05 GMT+1 eddieburnham http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=84#comment255 In my view it would be difficult to measure the 'national spirit' today against that which existed during the devastation of the Blitz. We are a much more diverse country and life has change, mostly for the better. We should celebrate peace and victory. We should remember the atrocities of war and those who died in it. We should honour and support those who fought and died for our country and continue to do so. But, most importantly, we should take lessons from this - the key one being the importance of tolerance in a civilised society. Wed 08 Sep 2010 15:54:52 GMT+1 The Bloke http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=84#comment254 //253. At 4:03pm on 08 Sep 2010, Steve Davidson wrote:I think the Blitz/Dunkirk/Hallelujah-we're-British spirit DOES live on, mainly evidenced by the fortitude we who were born after the war have had to interminably summon up to deal with the many varying memorable anniversaries(Blitz/Dunkirk/Battle of Britain/El Alamein/D-Day/VE Day/VJ Day etc etc on a 5 to 10 year cycle each) that seem to just go on and on and on and......Yeah, great, nothing will ever match WW2 for excitement and suffering (well possibly Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan might but I don't want to stir up those pots either, I've had enough of commemorations!) and we're all terribly grateful for their sacrifice and the chance we've been given to throw all the benefits away. But really, can't we move on with our lives and not have to be continually reminded of the past?I'm sure that I'll be pilloried for saying this, but someone has to give another view.And has anyone thought what impression we give - for example to modern day Germans - with our obsession with a war that might even conceivably be blamed on us (to an extent) thanks to the way we treated them in the Treaty of Versailles? //I kind of agree. In fairness, the UK isn't alone in banging on about the war, but I think it's time to move on.We shouldn't forget our history, far from it. But we shouldn't obsess about it, either.Interesting you mention the Germans. They obviously teach their kids about the war, too, and with a big emphasis on the holocaust.They are getting a problem with muslim immigrant kids, who obviously want all the benefits of living in Germany, but don't regard German history as their history. The muslim kids don't take kindly to being told to feel sorry for jews, and the Germans are worried that they imported a new wave of anti-semitism.Ah, the joys of multiculturalism, eh. BTW - if you want to check it out - Bayern Radio, programme called IQ, available off iTunes as a podcas. Wed 08 Sep 2010 15:42:58 GMT+1 mac http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=84#comment253 I lived through the blitz period,and it is obvious whoever thought this question up for the BBC should be sacked for incompetence.There is no resemblance between the people inhabiting Britain today and then.Then they were lions and saints,people willing to be martyrs,people who believed and trusted in God,great people.Only a few of that type remain today.I would not waste my time or energy describing todays lot. Wed 08 Sep 2010 15:20:39 GMT+1 Steve Davidson http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=83#comment252 I think the Blitz/Dunkirk/Hallelujah-we're-British spirit DOES live on, mainly evidenced by the fortitude we who were born after the war have had to interminably summon up to deal with the many varying memorable anniversaries(Blitz/Dunkirk/Battle of Britain/El Alamein/D-Day/VE Day/VJ Day etc etc on a 5 to 10 year cycle each) that seem to just go on and on and on and......Yeah, great, nothing will ever match WW2 for excitement and suffering (well possibly Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan might but I don't want to stir up those pots either, I've had enough of commemorations!) and we're all terribly grateful for their sacrifice and the chance we've been given to throw all the benefits away. But really, can't we move on with our lives and not have to be continually reminded of the past?I'm sure that I'll be pilloried for saying this, but someone has to give another view.And has anyone thought what impression we give - for example to modern day Germans - with our obsession with a war that might even conceivably be blamed on us (to an extent) thanks to the way we treated them in the Treaty of Versailles? Wed 08 Sep 2010 15:03:12 GMT+1 The Bloke http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=83#comment251 //237. At 8:14pm on 07 Sep 2010, SHEILA JONES wrote:West Ham South which took an almighty pasting throughout the entire Blitc and was the most bombed borough in London - see bomb plot map, is now 65% populated by Asian and African immigrants who have no history in the Borough or memories of their own or family members of the war let alone the Blitz. Unfortunately, so little local history is taught in schools and once the proud inhabitants are dead the memories die with them.//Indeed - and remember, we are now told there is no real indigenous population anyway, apart from when we're being told we're racists.I was even at an RAF Museum not so long back. Full of the usual stuff you'd expect to see, but the only individuals picked out were the ethnic minorities who'd served in the forces.It's quite ironic that the BBC has run this thread, about Brits pulling together in adversity, considering it is at the forefront when it comes to telling us that immigrants are great, and we are useless. It seems many of our minorities regard us and this country as the enemy. Wed 08 Sep 2010 14:16:44 GMT+1 Small acts of defiance http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=83#comment250 Bring back National Service. Young people of today, don't know they're born. Things were better in my day. Blah, blah, blah.Are rose-tinted spectacles available on the NHS? Wed 08 Sep 2010 14:01:27 GMT+1 The Bloke http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=82#comment249 I'm not sure just how real the Blitz spirit was, anyway. Like most people, I wasn't there.That being said, I don't think Britain would react as well today as it seemed to back then.We're way softer. No harm in that, we just are, because of the increased living standards I'm sure we all welcome.We're way more diverse, meaning that whoever the enemy would be, chances are, a fair few people claiming to be British would actually be batting for 'them' rather than 'us'. Our politicians are widely loathed, meaning we would all think twice about following them into a conflict.Our pc fascist élite has spent a generation telling us that a - we don't actually exist as a peopleb - we're crap.And continuing on that theme, the BBC would be cheering for the enemy, just the same as it does now with Afghanistan. The BBC would be describing the enemy as 'resilient' and 'cunning', and as having a justified agenda. Every successful enemy attack would be greeted with relish, disguised as mourning over the failures of our defences. Enemy failures would be ignored.So basically, no, the Blitz spirit doesn't live on. We've been weakened by diversity and prosperity, and our politicians and the BBC are more likely to be on the enemy's side than ours. Wed 08 Sep 2010 13:39:41 GMT+1 Adriang1963 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=82#comment248 215. At 5:33pm on 07 Sep 2010, LoonyLiberal wrote: 208. At 5:01pm on 07 Sep 2010, Adriang1963 wrote:YES, REALLY REALLY, and I think it is a disgrace! You make my point for me. I can’t make a comment without you assuming I have a prejudice.---------------------------------------Your entire post was a rant against immigration. You are of course welcome to your opinion on such matters but it is blindly obvious you have a prejudice. If you didn't want to be pulled up on such matters you could have easily dropped the word immigrants and extended your history/culture necessity to anyone living here, regardless of homeland.================================In my original piece I did not use the word indigenous, and I was, whether you like it or not, stating a fact. You have taken what I have written, interpreted it for yourself, spinning an inaccurate characterisation of what I was saying into your response, and I do not see the point. If you look at my previous pieces you will see in recent days I have spoken up in favour of both Pakistani’s and Palestinians in relation to the less favourable treatment that they receive from the USA than others. That is inconsistent with me having inbuilt prejudice against people on the basis of their race! In previous pieces I have also emphasised the importance of immigration for the benefit of the UK, but that it should be done in a strategically managed way, which it never has been. This is a whole separate topic, but includes only admitting people with skills that we need, rather than letting in people who are educated, but merely duplicate skills we already have in plentiful supply and dont need, thereby diminishing the opportunities of those already here, including prior immigrants! My point is that I think it is tragic that anyone living in the UK should be totally ignorant of WW2. I do not accept that many (if any) kids brought up the UK (whether they be of immigrant families or not) would have no idea what WW2 was or that it even happened. I have dealt with different people during the course of my work since 2007 that did not even know it happened. I think that is wrong. I fail to see how that makes me prejudiced. Of course people have different ideas about what British Culture and history is, but the thread of this debate is has the UK changed since WW2. I think any normal person would accept that a citizen of the UK should have at least a very basic understanding of WW2. To not have this, apart from showing ignorance, is an insult to the memories of the many many millions of people that died in that War, (10% of all Germans, 16% of all Poles, 14% of all Russians died, and our own citizens!) so that democracy with all its frailties, and a free society, could live on. And you think it is ok for someone to come and live here, and not even know about that? Wed 08 Sep 2010 12:00:32 GMT+1 panchopablo http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=82#comment247 242. At 9:53pm on 07 Sep 2010, Tomás de Torquemada wrote:233. At 7:54pm on 07 Sep 2010, panchopablo wrote:231. At 7:24pm on 07 Sep 2010, Tomás de Torquemada wrote:227. At 6:58pm on 07 Sep 2010, panchopablo wrote:204. At 4:53pm on 07 Sep 2010, Tomás de Torquemada wrote:189. At 3:58pm on 07 Sep 2010, panchopablo wrote:Good job those poor souls didnt have the anti-war brigade in those days or they would have be brainwashed into thinking it was Britains fault for the war and Churchill would have labelled a war criminal and the Nazi were misinformed people fighting because its the Jews fault.///If they had the BNP / NF / C18 etc in those days they would have opened the borders and invited the Nazis in with open arms. HMM,wasnt Oswald Moseley and Nazi ally and he didnt get very far did he.///Yes. But your statement limps just as much as much and that's what I highlighted with mine. Not really,i was doing "what if" the AWB where about in the most destructive and decisive war mankind has ever faced.You just needed to responsed for some reason."??????? You don't understand what I wrote and now you don't even seem to understand what you wrote yourself. Next!"You have tried counter my suggestion by using the usual garbage and i correced you,unfortunately decided to just badger on for arguments sake.Run along along now. Wed 08 Sep 2010 11:28:48 GMT+1 jr4412 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=81#comment246 citizen42 #246."remember this with out british iventors we would still be riding round on horse back and using the trade winds to traverse the oceans of the world..."LOLwhy stop there? would we have crawled out of the oceans "with out british iventors"? Wed 08 Sep 2010 10:46:25 GMT+1 citizen42 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=81#comment245 history of britian is unique and full of defining epochs in any field you wish to choose,the arts,engineering, politics,medicine and, we have to admit to it, warfare,we are a people who should take pride in the gifts we have given to this world our laws and political system are the greatest of these, along with the concept of sportmanship are the bed rock of the modern civilised world,anyone who as little time for the history of this country as little time for mankind.i know we have our faults(i do my share of whinging)but on the whole taking every thing in to consideration,we are a fair and decent law abiding nation.we have religious tollerance of all faiths, even those who have little tollerance for us.we have wellcomed other cultures admitedly with some difficulty at the ofset,but we eventually got there.remember this with out british iventors we would still be riding round on horse back and using the trade winds to traverse the oceans of the world... Wed 08 Sep 2010 09:50:06 GMT+1 chrislabiff http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=81#comment244 Does the spirit of the blitz live on?The question illustrates the level of brainwashing still prevalent in the UK, so yes I’m afraid it does.Tally ho !!! Wed 08 Sep 2010 06:00:08 GMT+1 leoRoverman http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=80#comment243 I echo the sentiments about the looting having first hand evidence of such goings on as a result of the fact that My great Uncle died in the bombing on Bromley on the 1st November 1940. Archived papers that I have unearthed seem to have involved council collusion and rarely do checks seem to have been carried out by people identifiying bodies. It opens up a completely different viewpoint of the so called collectiveness of the Blitz. Of course having a Mother who came from Germany and who suffered the same privations as millions of others of her age group at the time she recalled the nights when Lancaster bombers pounded Hamburg Bremen and her home town of Oldenburg. by the time she was 18 she had endured six years of war, her father was dead and her family had already been plundered by the Nazis ( no she wasn't jewish) and had learned how to smoke during an air raid by an eastern front survivor who offered her a fag. I grew up in the rubble heaps of both countries. No I never lived through them but I can tell you one thing in those conditions its dog eat dog to survive. Togetherness, well both countries had it to a point and the bombings never ended the resistance in either country. Time we started to stop mythicising. Tue 07 Sep 2010 21:02:13 GMT+1 Phil http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=80#comment242 My mother was a young Nurse, and would be escorted by the police, while on duty nursing people in the East End of London. My father was in RAF Bomber command, taking the fight to the Nazi's. It is a great pity that Bomber command do not get the credit they deserve for helping to destroy the Nazi war machine. Tue 07 Sep 2010 20:56:07 GMT+1 Ralphie http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=80#comment241 233. At 7:54pm on 07 Sep 2010, panchopablo wrote:231. At 7:24pm on 07 Sep 2010, Tomás de Torquemada wrote:227. At 6:58pm on 07 Sep 2010, panchopablo wrote:204. At 4:53pm on 07 Sep 2010, Tomás de Torquemada wrote:189. At 3:58pm on 07 Sep 2010, panchopablo wrote:Good job those poor souls didnt have the anti-war brigade in those days or they would have be brainwashed into thinking it was Britains fault for the war and Churchill would have labelled a war criminal and the Nazi were misinformed people fighting because its the Jews fault.///If they had the BNP / NF / C18 etc in those days they would have opened the borders and invited the Nazis in with open arms. HMM,wasnt Oswald Moseley and Nazi ally and he didnt get very far did he.///Yes. But your statement limps just as much as much and that's what I highlighted with mine. Not really,i was doing "what if" the AWB where about in the most destructive and decisive war mankind has ever faced.You just needed to responsed for some reason.??????? You don't understand what I wrote and now you don't even seem to understand what you wrote yourself. Next! Tue 07 Sep 2010 20:53:32 GMT+1 jr4412 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=79#comment240 Davesaid #240."..the mainstay of the British moral in these dark times were these mothers.."and what happened after the war?women were pushed back into 'the home' and, today, too many men judge women by the inches of her high heels and the size of her breast implants alone. some progress. Tue 07 Sep 2010 20:40:38 GMT+1 Davesaid http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=79#comment239 The majority of posters on H Y S were not born when London, Southampton, Portsmouth etc had to withstand continual bombing night after night. Every morning seeing families who survived the onslaught being evacuated to other areas having had their homes destroyed. Most of these families were headed by very brave women whose husbands had been mobilised to serve in the forces. They were not sure whether they would ever see them again. Yes their were brave emergency service personnel rescuing the injured & fighting fires, etc but the mainstay of the British moral in these dark times were these mothers desperate to keep their families intact. Their bravery can never be over estimated. Tue 07 Sep 2010 19:46:53 GMT+1 Carol Mitchell http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=79#comment238 My mother who is 90 in a couple of weeks lived through the Blitz and recalls stories all the time to myself and my family. We live in Swansea which was badly bombed during the war, you would have to speak to her yourself, I heard you were going round the country speaking to various people about their experiences, she has a lot of stories and I mean lots to tell. Tue 07 Sep 2010 19:41:24 GMT+1 Edward_de_Bonehead http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=78#comment237 Here we go again..The London centric BBC. London this..London that..Many other cities in the UK suffered during the blitz as badly as London ..Sheffield / Hull / Liverpool / Coventry to name just four. How I wish the BBC would take the blinkers off and recognise other parts of this country. Same old BBC!! Those of us behond the M25 should get a licence rebate. Tue 07 Sep 2010 19:32:48 GMT+1 SHEILA JONES http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=78#comment236 West Ham South which took an almighty pasting throughout the entire Blitc and was the most bombed borough in London - see bomb plot map, is now 65% populated by Asian and African immigrants who have no history in the Borough or memories of their own or family members of the war let alone the Blitz. Unfortunately, so little local history is taught in schools and once the proud inhabitants are dead the memories die with them.When I went to work in the City in 1948 there was nothing left above ground north of Morfields from Cheapside to Ropemaker Street - the site of the Barbican, except St Paul's and Cripplegate Institute. The boys in the office used to play cricket in the huge basements left in view. When I went back in 1971 it was all built up with widened London Wall, Fore Street that had been a lane and Chase Manhattan Bank occupied Woolgate House on the site of the Wool Exchange which had been criminally pulled down. As for the docks, who would recognise it all from 1940? I don't think we will ever get that chummy relationship in London again. Too many cultures all selling their wares, ours has been lost. Shame! Tue 07 Sep 2010 19:14:45 GMT+1 new_germany http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=78#comment235 The tiem of the Blitz is a great time of determination of the the British nation because Britain stood alone in time between May 1940 and May 1941 because the US entered the war in December 1941 with the Japanese attack of Pearl Harbour and the Soviet Union has been an ally of Nazi Germany at this time.Nazi Germany occupied Western Europe including the West coast of France and so there has been the danger of a German invasion Churchill feared as he thought about every possible place for this invasion.Churchill lifted up the courage of the nation with his famous speeches"We shall fight on the beaches, on the streets, on the hills") and he sent the English language into battle, as President Kennedy stated.Although King George VI. and Queen Elizabeth I. have been popular during that time for visiting the bombed areas of London and breaking through class differences and uniting the country; the people were determined to fight and they didn´t panic.For the situation of a German invasion the famous red poster of the British ministry of information ahs been prepared; it said, under the crown of King George VI.: "Keep calm and carry on."However, this feared situation didn´t happen.Some points of Churchill´s attitude remain however controversial:- his role in the abdication of King Edward- the bombing of Dresden, a city full of woman, children and refugees, just a few months ahead of the end of the war, as well as the bombing of the city centre of Würzburg- his attitude towards India- his agreemnet to stalin to push the Border of Russia and Poland to the west and the off driving of Germans out of their homes as refugees Tue 07 Sep 2010 19:12:33 GMT+1 1L19 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=77#comment234 Total illogical debate, reading these comments the “spirit” is whatever you want, not based on anything other than “individual” opinions, and how your “individual” opinion is more important than the topic, totally stupid forum. Tue 07 Sep 2010 19:02:29 GMT+1 reflector2 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=77#comment233 The Blitz spirit is still here by god! I will fight PC on the beaches on the ferries and on the landing grounds. I will fight them in the lorries, at ‘Clacketts lane’ motorway stop, in the fields etc for the BRITISH way of life, it’s scruples, its morality, its loveliness!!On a serious note, the ‘Blitz spirit’ is what is inside you. If we are attacked by an Islamic state we will defiantly have to watch out for the fifth column. I told you I would fight PC!Go on, publish and be damned! Tue 07 Sep 2010 18:56:46 GMT+1 panchopablo http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=77#comment232 231. At 7:24pm on 07 Sep 2010, Tomás de Torquemada wrote:227. At 6:58pm on 07 Sep 2010, panchopablo wrote:204. At 4:53pm on 07 Sep 2010, Tomás de Torquemada wrote:189. At 3:58pm on 07 Sep 2010, panchopablo wrote:Good job those poor souls didnt have the anti-war brigade in those days or they would have be brainwashed into thinking it was Britains fault for the war and Churchill would have labelled a war criminal and the Nazi were misinformed people fighting because its the Jews fault.///If they had the BNP / NF / C18 etc in those days they would have opened the borders and invited the Nazis in with open arms. HMM,wasnt Oswald Moseley and Nazi ally and he didnt get very far did he.///Yes. But your statement limps just as much as much and that's what I highlighted with mine. Not really,i was doing "what if" the AWB where about in the most destructive and decisive war mankind has ever faced.You just needed to responsed for some reason. Tue 07 Sep 2010 18:54:23 GMT+1 Colquhoun http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=76#comment231 "Why? What is the difference between this event and any other that happened in Europe? Do the Scots celebrate the butt kicking given to the English way back when with Robbie Burns.Or do the same celebrations go on in Britain in the war against France(or vice versa)? Different time periods and different wars. People still died whether it was by a arrow, or a cannonball, or burning or starvation. I see, on a documentary that ole Henry VIII was not above killing his own. Do you celebrate that event?You seem to forget that Germany and England were once(twice, thrice-I don't study your history much) joined together with the royal families(who ran the country).Just because you got some film reels on the war(which must be pretty worn out by this time) does not mean that conflict is continuing. Everyone(99.9%)involved in that war have died from old age. They are the only ones who remember (or chose to forget)those days.It is time to move on. It was all politics. "Freidemann,1. The Scots still celebrate Bannockburn which was a lot longer ago than Robert Burns.2. We still celebrate victories over France e.g. Trafalgar but not so much as ww2 - ww2 is much more recent after all. France hasn't been ruled by a blood thirsty dictator for 195 years, Germany's experience was much more recent.3. Unlike Germany Parliament has ruled Britain since the Glorious Revolution of 1688. The Hanoverians were constitutional monarchs. Tue 07 Sep 2010 18:39:43 GMT+1 Ralphie http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=76#comment230 227. At 6:58pm on 07 Sep 2010, panchopablo wrote:204. At 4:53pm on 07 Sep 2010, Tomás de Torquemada wrote:189. At 3:58pm on 07 Sep 2010, panchopablo wrote:Good job those poor souls didnt have the anti-war brigade in those days or they would have be brainwashed into thinking it was Britains fault for the war and Churchill would have labelled a war criminal and the Nazi were misinformed people fighting because its the Jews fault.///If they had the BNP / NF / C18 etc in those days they would have opened the borders and invited the Nazis in with open arms. HMM,wasnt Oswald Moseley and Nazi ally and he didnt get very far did he.///Yes. But your statement limps just as much as much and that's what I highlighted with mine. Tue 07 Sep 2010 18:24:13 GMT+1 Rupert Smyth http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=76#comment229 99. At 11:29am on 07 Sep 2010, paul wrote:Lots which I read fully. :-)----------------------------------------------------I hear what you are saying Paul and fully understand where you are coming from. Having said that I lived in London for many years and had lovely neighbours and met many very decent nice people. Although no longer living in London this still applies.My belief is that wherever anybody happens to live there are nice people to be found and not so nice people. My own experience has always been that the majority are decent at heart and trying to get through life as best they can.I think it is fair to say that nobody is likely to find either one of us on a lynch mob or for that matter most of the people here. It is true that if asking for directions you may initially be looked upon with suspicion but then again most people once you get chatting are friendly. Don't know about yourself but given that I am six foot tall, over 16 stone and a horribly ugly article I sometimes frighten myself when looking in the mirror. If I was a little old lady then probably they wouldn't view me with so much caution.The world is what we as individuals make it in our day to day dealings with others. Nobody has managed to destroy my faith in humanity yet. I am talking about the real world here of course and not HYS which is somewhat reminiscent of stepping in a gladiatorial area on occasions. :-) Tue 07 Sep 2010 18:14:38 GMT+1 panchopablo http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=75#comment228 214. At 5:27pm on 07 Sep 2010, RitaKleppmann wrote:"The Germans may have started with the bombing of non-military targets but the British/Allies learned pretty quickly. The bombing of German cities resulted in the following casualties - Hamburg: 50,000, Dresden: 25,000, Pforzheim: 18,000These were all civilians.Britain is not only covered with honour and glory."We do not celebrate the deaths of all those poor civilians who perished in the German cities.We celebrate the men and women who stood up a fanatical regime hellbent on domination and extremination of any who did fit Ayran model.Sadly the British hand was forced by Nazi Germany. Tue 07 Sep 2010 18:09:46 GMT+1 Dave http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=75#comment227 Ah, those were the days you could leave your front door open, when people genuinely cared for others and we get asked Does the spirit of the blitz live on? Gotta be joking, today you dare not walk down the High Street with your purse in your pocket nor let alone leave the doors open.Folks were even poorer in those days. I put it all down to greed and society. Tue 07 Sep 2010 18:05:00 GMT+1 panchopablo http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=75#comment226 204. At 4:53pm on 07 Sep 2010, Tomás de Torquemada wrote:189. At 3:58pm on 07 Sep 2010, panchopablo wrote:Good job those poor souls didnt have the anti-war brigade in those days or they would have be brainwashed into thinking it was Britains fault for the war and Churchill would have labelled a war criminal and the Nazi were misinformed people fighting because its the Jews fault.///If they had the BNP / NF / C18 etc in those days they would have opened the borders and invited the Nazis in with open arms. HMM,wasnt Oswald Moseley and Nazi ally and he didnt get very far did he.195. At 4:23pm on 07 Sep 2010, Mr Cholmondley-Warner wrote:189. At 3:58pm on 07 Sep 2010, panchopablo wrote:Good job those poor souls didnt have the anti-war brigade in those days or they would have be brainwashed into thinking it was Britains fault for the war and Churchill would have labelled a war criminal and the Nazi were misinformed people fighting because its the Jews fault.------------------------------------------------------------------------"There is a difference between being anti-war, and being a pacifist. There is such a thing as a just war. But I fear both concepts would be lost on you."I can understand pacifist as they are against ALL wars,sadly the AWB just select the wars they are against. Tue 07 Sep 2010 17:58:21 GMT+1 paul http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=74#comment225 Spirit of the blitz today.We'd probably devote all time trying to decide if the war was legal or not. Tue 07 Sep 2010 17:51:08 GMT+1 friedemann http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=74#comment224 Why? What is the difference between this event and any other that happened in Europe? Do the Scots celebrate the butt kicking given to the English way back when with Robbie Burns. Or do the same celebrations go on in Britain in the war against France(or vice versa)? Different time periods and different wars. People still died whether it was by a arrow, or a cannonball, or burning or starvation. I see, on a documentary that ole Henry VIII was not above killing his own. Do you celebrate that event? You seem to forget that Germany and England were once(twice, thrice-I don't study your history much) joined together with the royal families(who ran the country). Just because you got some film reels on the war(which must be pretty worn out by this time) does not mean that conflict is continuing. Everyone(99.9%)involved in that war have died from old age. They are the only ones who remember (or chose to forget)those days. It is time to move on. It was all politics. Tue 07 Sep 2010 17:47:46 GMT+1 Colquhoun http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=74#comment223 "The Germans may have started with the bombing of non-military targets but the British/Allies learned pretty quickly. The bombing of German cities resulted in the following casualties - Hamburg: 50,000, Dresden: 25,000, Pforzheim: 18,000These were all civilians.Britain is not only covered with honour and glory."Sow the wind reap the whirlewind. Hitler was elected democratically and made no secret of his plans from the start. My sympathy is with the millions of civilians and soldiers killed by the Germans during ww2.If it meant that less Allied service men died then it was worth it. Tue 07 Sep 2010 17:22:01 GMT+1 Lenispal http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=73#comment222 Let us not forget that the people who survived the war and the blitz had a fine sense of humour and were aware that their politicians, like todays, had limits, to say the least. My father used to do an hilarious rendition of Churchill's 'Fight them on the beaches' speech. It ended with the audience echoing his improvised last line.'And if the Nazi's invade this country...... And where will I be?''In Canada!' yelled the audience. And aunt Martha used to tell how she through the frying pan at the wireless when Lord Haw Haw said there was a shortage of bacon in Britain. Tue 07 Sep 2010 17:16:48 GMT+1 friedemann http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=73#comment221 Should you not be calling this a "rememberance" because it was a bad time, rather than an "anniversary" usually in connotation of a happy memory? Tue 07 Sep 2010 17:15:28 GMT+1 rifak666 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=73#comment220 bit of a daft question HYS, the demography of London in general has changed so much, the white Anglo Saxon population that inhabited the area have long moved out to be replaced by a mix of the ethnic world so it's not really answerable unless it really happened again which it won't, in all probability the next time anything is dropped it will be a hydrogen bomb so nothing will be left anyway. Tue 07 Sep 2010 17:04:11 GMT+1 braveraddish http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=72#comment219 only in London Tue 07 Sep 2010 17:03:18 GMT+1 No Victim No Crime http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=72#comment218 There is no spirit left successive governbents have battered it out of us. Tue 07 Sep 2010 16:57:29 GMT+1 OfficinaSans http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=72#comment217 I am Trillium! Tue 07 Sep 2010 16:55:57 GMT+1 Miss Ann Thrope http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=71#comment216 I've lived in Germany and society isn't any better than it is in the UK. Just a Daily Mail myth to stir up outrage at 'broken Britain'.People are the same as they have been since the dawn of civlisation, not as if suddenly one generation loses all sense of compassion and reason. Makes me laugh when you think about it. Tue 07 Sep 2010 16:54:33 GMT+1 Miss Ann Thrope http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=71#comment215 These days many children of that age have nothing more to think about than kicking a football along the street and behaving stupidly - they seem such pathetic characters. I cannot see them coping as well as children in earlier generations should a similar situation arise. -zrzavyUmm, no. Clearly you don't know many young people. Tue 07 Sep 2010 16:51:28 GMT+1 Loony Liberal - http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=71#comment214 208. At 5:01pm on 07 Sep 2010, Adriang1963 wrote:YES, REALLY REALLY, and I think it is a disgrace! You make my point for me. I can’t make a comment without you assuming I have a prejudice.---------------------------------------Your entire post was a rant against immigration. You are of course welcome to your opinion on such matters but it is blindly obvious you have a prejudice. If you didn't want to be pulled up on such matters you could have easily dropped the word immigrants and extended your history/culture necessity to anyone living here, regardless of homeland.You also failed to respond to the second part of my response. Once again; culture differs from person to person, place to place - how do you plan to install a generalised culture into everyone coming into the country. Why should they anyway? Are you going to completely change when you go to Australia?And what about the actual importance of knowing detailed history. You know, is their a real need for it beyond general knowledge? Should it be more important than focusing our young into Maths/Physics and Engineering which (with a bit of Government nouse anyway) might go to providing a better future for all? Tue 07 Sep 2010 16:33:07 GMT+1 RitaKleppmann http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=70#comment213 The Germans may have started with the bombing of non-military targets but the British/Allies learned pretty quickly. The bombing of German cities resulted in the following casualties - Hamburg: 50,000, Dresden: 25,000, Pforzheim: 18,000These were all civilians.Britain is not only covered with honour and glory. Tue 07 Sep 2010 16:27:37 GMT+1 Mary Chambers http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=70#comment212 Swerdna, message 206.On the contrary, many thinking people were opposed to the bombing of Dresden at the time.With regard to the unthinking people, I was utterly appalled that when my children started school in the 1970s they picked up some anti-German jokes and expressions, 30 years after the end of the war. Where did that come from? Parents? Grandparents? Truly shocking. Tue 07 Sep 2010 16:25:21 GMT+1 Christine Harrison http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=70#comment211 I wasn't alive doing the blitz, but I remember by parents telling me stories of how the German bombers would empty their remaining bombs before they crossed the channel on their return journey. Many of these bombs landed on Bournemouth, one in particular landed on a building in the Lansdowne area of Bournemouth where many American Airforcemen were stationed. I believe many were killed.I am now the Business Manager of Portchester School in Bournemouth and in our archives we have a daily Log Book written by the Headteacher during the war years. It starts on November 5th 1940 and finishes on the 5th July 1965. There are some incredible entries for the war years. examples are: 5.11.40: .....teachers are expected to supervise the welfare of 38 Southampton evacuee scholars who form part of the school. 16.11.40: On Saturday morning the Alma Road School was destroyed by a German Airman who bombed the building. This necessitated the Girl's Senior School making use of this building. From the 18th, salvage equipment was brought to tis school, and an effort made to find accommodation for the Girl's department. It has been arranged that the girls attend in the mornings, the boys in the afternoon. 28.03.41 Owing to damage done by the enemy bombs we were unable to be in attendance at Lowther Road this morning. Windows etc were blown in.A facinating read! Tue 07 Sep 2010 16:24:39 GMT+1 MrWonderfulReality http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=69#comment210 Does the spirit of the blitz live on? Probably, but probably in Stella Artois!!!! Tue 07 Sep 2010 16:16:22 GMT+1 Mike http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=69#comment209 What a joke. Today if we would end up in a similar position, the militant left would riot and hold peace marches and everybody else would be far too busy working off a mortgage and trying to feed their families to care what was happening. And that is just what the govenrnment want, a people with their eye off the ball. Tue 07 Sep 2010 16:12:09 GMT+1 Steve http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=69#comment208 Britain went through some terrible times pre 1945, the country came together as one to survive. Most of those who gave their lives for our today are now forgotten; those who still exist have been betrayed by our Government a Government who forgets the sacrifices that where made so that we may all live in freedom and peace today.Placing flowers and speaking words of no substance can be achieved by the simplest of minds, we can even shed a tear when the camera requires us to do so, but what did these brave men and women of our homeland fight and die for. Take a look at Britain today, a broken society, gangs on our streets women and children living in poverty, a welfare state in collapse to feed the election votes of the forthcoming second Conservative Government, ethnic religious insertion into our Christian society, demonstrations against those who now fight wars for our protection against the terrorist cowards whom we now give sanctuary, a transport system and road network that is well below standard, industry in decline our great steel mills and coal faces closed or in foreign hands as will be our ports, our banks, our nation should we allow our Government to peruse the overall control of our state by manipulation.Remember the words of Sir Winston Churchill “Never in the face of human conflict has so much been owed by so many to so few”This is happening now in the Gulf and Afghanistan, but what praise do we give the brave men and women who give their lives today so that we may live ours in peace tomorrow? NONE.Greed, Money and Wealth have taken over our society, we don’t care for one another anymore, you can lay dying on our streets and people will walk past, our ministers are fiddling the books to get richer and our Government now plan to attack the unemployed and the poor to make the rich richer and the poor poorer, did Adolph Hitler not perceive the same goals?Maybe our country would have been greater should Germany have succeeded, but alas our strength came through, unity as one our nation took on the devil and won, I think we need to take a leaf from the book of those we now forget, for they made this country great, all we have done is destroy everything they lived and worked for?We shall never surrender, and even if, which I do not for a moment believe, this Island or a large part of it were subjugated and starving, then our Empire beyond the seas, armed and guarded by the British Fleet, would carry on the struggle, until, in God's good time, the New World, with all its power and might, steps forth to the rescue and the liberation of the old."Great word spoken by a great man (Sir Winston Churchill) unfortunately we have no great men anymore so what are we to do? Tue 07 Sep 2010 16:04:36 GMT+1 Adriang1963 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=68#comment207 180. At 3:27pm on 07 Sep 2010, LoonyLiberal wrote: 164. At 2:47pm on 07 Sep 2010, Adriang1963 wrote:I have worked with immigrants who do not even know that WW2 happened, or who Adolf Hitler was, let alone what the blitz was about!-----------------Really? REALLY? Or are you just making something up to simply have a go at something you don't like? Maybe those immigrants just liked winding you up, it certainly looks pretty easy.==================YES, REALLY REALLY, and I think it is a disgrace! You make my point for me. I can’t make a comment without you assuming I have a prejudice. I suppose it would be trite of me to say that I have many immigrant friends and they DO know about WW2 etc. I think my point is clear enough. We HAVE had a hopeless migrant policy, which has let in people we do not need, who sometimes (not always) can not speak English properly.I suppose it would also be trite of me to tell you that I am soon to become a migrant myself when I go to live in Australia. I can tell you that the only reason they have accepted me is because I have a ‘skill in demand’, i.e they cant find enough Australians to do the job. I can also tell you that despite English being my mother tongue, I still had to sit an English test, and I was indeed expected to have read and absorbed a ~100 page booklet on the history and culture of Australia.I was impressed by their procedure, and feel it is a pity that the UK has not had a coherent policy itself. So the UK lets in Accountants, IT workers etc etc from all over the World, when we have people already here, who may even be prior immigrants themselves, who have these skills and are unemployed in a difficult labour market, whose situation is made worse by adding to the number of candidates totally pointlessly.I might also add, that when I looked into migrating to Bermuda, that it is common practice for Job adverts to contain the phrase ‘preference will be given to indigenous citizens’. (I was very careful not to use the phrase indigenous in my original piece!) Of course the ‘indigenous citizens’ of Bermuda could be black or white, so it is not the race that matters, it is the principle of safeguarding the interests of those already living there. Is that racist or just common sense? Tue 07 Sep 2010 16:01:24 GMT+1 Ralphie http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=68#comment206 202. At 4:48pm on 07 Sep 2010, Edwin Schrodinger wrote:'Oooh the Tories destroyed this country, oooh Labour destroyed this country... It's wike watching whiff whaff, or little kids going "it was him", "no it was him". And that's exactly why you lot need a nanny state. Grow up.'People just don't care what has happened to this country, or who was responsible. I'd sooner be an interested child than an an adult who pretends.///Good for you. I, on the other hand am perfectly happy to have matured and evolved into an informed, mature, educated adult. Tue 07 Sep 2010 15:59:40 GMT+1 swerdna http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=68#comment205 184. At 3:46pm on 07 Sep 2010, ScottishDavie wrote:'It always amazes and appalls me that Britain sacrificed the lives of over 50,000 airman in the bombing of Germany (which culminated in the war crime at Dresden) in the belief that Germany could be bombed into surrender when the blitz had so conspicuously failed to bring about such a result in this country.'I don't think that anyone living in this country through WW2 were against the bombing of Dresden (home to a major rail terminal that Russia wanted destroyed) anymore that anyone around at this time blinked when the Atomic Bomb finally forced an early end to this horrific war. The loss of our airmen verses the military gains from the bombings is a completely different argument and for a different forum. Tue 07 Sep 2010 15:58:26 GMT+1 Enny2012 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=67#comment204 The spirit lives on in our hearts, not in statues. Tue 07 Sep 2010 15:56:15 GMT+1 Ralphie http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=67#comment203 189. At 3:58pm on 07 Sep 2010, panchopablo wrote:Good job those poor souls didnt have the anti-war brigade in those days or they would have be brainwashed into thinking it was Britains fault for the war and Churchill would have labelled a war criminal and the Nazi were misinformed people fighting because its the Jews fault.///If they had the BNP / NF / C18 etc in those days they would have opened the borders and invited the Nazis in with open arms. Tue 07 Sep 2010 15:53:04 GMT+1 swerdna http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=67#comment202 Post 192 is, unfortunately, correct. This once great country has lost its national identity and its backbone. We are now a nation of poorly led wimps. We will now stand little chance against any major country that wants to invade us or otherwise wants to bully us - we will just not have the courage.However, I am not sure that Germany won post 1945 - it is more that the UK lost (with more than a little help from the USA as well as from internal forces).I have just finished reading Andrew Marr's depressing A History of Modern Britain that I think that just about touches on some of the reasons for our demise - and expands much on Post 191's rant. Every would be politician should read this book as should everyone else interested in seeing how our recent history repeats itself and how and why defeat can be snatched from the jaws of victory. Tue 07 Sep 2010 15:48:57 GMT+1 Edwin Schrodinger http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyoursay/2010/09/does_the_spirit_of_the_blitz_l.html?page=66#comment201 'Oooh the Tories destroyed this country, oooh Labour destroyed this country... It's wike watching whiff whaff, or little kids going "it was him", "no it was him". And that's exactly why you lot need a nanny state. Grow up.'People just don't care what has happened to this country, or who was responsible. I'd sooner be an interested child than an an adult who pretends. Tue 07 Sep 2010 15:48:09 GMT+1