Comments for http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html en-gb 30 Sat 23 Aug 2014 16:53:41 GMT+1 A feed of user comments from the page found at http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html horsedolphin http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=94#comment18 What a good subject heading to take me into my comments. Carol Thatcher, what a fantastic person. No crawling or pussy footing around the idiots who overeacted about her G word. She knows she did not offend many people and lets be honest, it is impossible to say anything without offending someone. I bet that Jonathon Ross's disgusting comments upset more people that Carols. Sun 19 Apr 2009 14:45:20 GMT+1 dennisjunior1 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=89#comment17 Mark:Apologies are often given when the political class in government, knows that they did something wrong....and, they want to repent for their misdeeds....I am not accusing Number 10 of any MISCONDUCT...~Dennis Junior~ Sun 19 Apr 2009 02:22:51 GMT+1 Smujsmith http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=84#comment16 I don't need an apology, I need the announcement of a General Election. The following petition on the government website needs support to prevent Mr Brown and his crew spinning the line that "there is no public interest in an election presently". I ask anyone who would like to restore our failing country to back this petition.http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/GoToCountryNow/ Sat 18 Apr 2009 10:59:17 GMT+1 SSnotbanned http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=78#comment15 '''...after being visited by the ghost of John Smith,Gordon Brown returns from his studies.....''' Fri 17 Apr 2009 17:22:28 GMT+1 SSnotbanned http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=73#comment14 It's a bit like Faulty Tower Hamlet isn't it ??''I said ''sorry'' once, but I think i got away with it''. Fri 17 Apr 2009 17:17:39 GMT+1 FrankCowell http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=68#comment13 I don't think that it was the lack of a "fulsome" apology apology that was the problem in the Haringey case. "Fulsome" means "sickeningly obsequious." We do not want obsequiousness from our public servants. But we do want them to take responsibility and to apologise fully when they are at fault. Fri 17 Apr 2009 16:00:42 GMT+1 jon112uk http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=63#comment12 I would still take a bit of different slant on this whole email thing.There are a lot of serious things going on, both for ordinary people in the UK and also worldwide.When will the media be saying 'sorry' for taking a few childish emails from some bloke no one had ever heard of and escalating them into item one news? Fri 17 Apr 2009 10:09:16 GMT+1 LippyLippo http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=57#comment11 So the media demand an apology, and the PM is supposed to behave like a performing seal and say 'sorry' so that they'll stop writing horrible things about him? A 'sorry' is only valid when it is meant sincerely. When it is an expression of regret over something YOU have done or you personally have control over. You say it when you truly mean it and when you mean to change your ways in the future. Mr. Brown would be apologising for what, exactly? Employing a Machiavellian aide? Using personal matters to attack or smear people that they wish to portray in a bad light? Then he might as well get rid of all of his staff! And the newspapers who huffed and puffed in their editorials spend virtually their whole energy smearing people in exactly the same way.His apology is about as valid as the Tories' and the media's faked anger over the smear campaign. Both were quite clearly overjoyed that they had something to carp about when they know full well that they are often guilty of exactly the same things. Why can't even the PM stand up against the media and tell them where to stick their rotten articles and their hypocritical braying? Fri 17 Apr 2009 07:13:12 GMT+1 John1948 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=52#comment10 Currently 'sorry' is about the most meaningless word in the English language.It starts off in Primary School: "Say you're sorry for kicking Damian," demands the teacher. "Sorry," comes the mumbled reply."Now go off and play nicely," smiles the teacher, thinking that they will be able to tell the bruised Damian's parents that an apology was given and that the incident will not be repeated. Experience tells every parent about their own children that saying sorry is at best a devalued action.Living in Bristol you hear about ongoing discussions about saying 'sorry' for the slave trade. Well, of course, everyone is sorry that it ever happened. But for present day citizens of Bristol or even the Council to apologise by saying 'sorry' is ridiculous. They were not responsible, they probably do not even have roots in Bristol or if they are Bristolian they probably lived and worked in conditions which, although 'free', were little better than slavery. Present day Bristolians saying 'sorry' further devalues the word.Any politician, manager or parent can offer an apology for the actions of those in their charge. They can say 'sorry' for not keeping a better eye on those they have responsibility, but they cannot actually stop people from doing something which custom and practice dictates is unacceptable.I suspect the conversation in Number 10 went something like this.Brown: Cameron's crew have a clean cut image which is helping boost their rating.Minion: There's always a lot of gossip to the contrary around.Brown: Gossip or lies?Minion: The thing about gossip is that it spreads so quickly.Brown: I don't like lies and unsubstantiated gossip can be very damaging. Now about the forthcoming announcement on ....Perhaps Brown was not explicit enough. Perhaps he was deliberately vague. Only he knows the extent to which he was responsible. What I do know is that the belief that demanding a politician or anyone else to say that they are sorry is the same as asking them to be insincere. 'Sorry' said sincerely is a valuable word. Its 9mis)use as demanded by poltical opponets and others robs the English language of the ability to make a powerful statement. Fri 17 Apr 2009 07:03:50 GMT+1 Euloroo http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=47#comment9 Mrs Wick makes a good point. It's the media and political establishment who seem to decide who should apologise for what these days. Of course the BBC itself came a cropper itself recently after the Daily Mail ran with the Sachs story. Ironically that apology wasn't for the vulgar nature of the broadcast but for "invasion of privacy". In this case I'm not entirely sure what Mr Brown is sorry for - employing the bloke in the first place, I guess. Another interesting example is the jailing of Wigan Councillor Joe Shaw. Despite the court giving him five years for an illegal weapon and one year for child porn the BBC decides to headline with "Abuse pictures councillor". The beeb has decided this is the moral ground they should be taking. And with this case and the recent resignation of the veteran Cumbrian Councillor, Ronnie Calvin, for using racist words, the beeb decide not to tell us that they're Labour councillors. So who do you think decides the standards Mark? Fri 17 Apr 2009 03:50:53 GMT+1 impassive http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=42#comment8 A forced apology is no apology at all. And opposition pressure for one will only ever be understood as part of everyday political shennanigans.But when did politicians throw up a chance to seek profit from adversity? Thu 16 Apr 2009 22:46:47 GMT+1 muriel wickenden http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=36#comment7 If one is personally responsible yes, say sorry. but for goodness sake do not accept responsibility for the errors of others. Just sack 'em and say why you have done so and be damned to the idiots who bay for "sorry" just to see someone abase themselves. That is power gone bad; and we have a lot of that in the politicians and media right now. Jon Snow of ITV seems to be the only presenter with some obvious moral decency in him. He considers the obverse side of the coin and the very nub of the situation. who else has done that? Thu 16 Apr 2009 19:57:59 GMT+1 alexandercurzon http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=31#comment6 THE APOLOGY?REALLY??GORDY? NOT SINCERE! Thu 16 Apr 2009 19:06:10 GMT+1 kaybraes http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=26#comment5 Hardly a heart felt apology, more an attempt to get the press off his back by pretending humility. The man , in spite of his church upbringing has no sense of right and wrong and certainly humility and integrity do not play much part in his character. The apology was tardy , grudging, muttered without conviction and immediately negated by the blame being shifted to his underlings. Thu 16 Apr 2009 18:32:20 GMT+1 newsjock http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=21#comment4 Our beloved prime minister may have said "sorry", but of course he didn't mean it. He meant "now shut up and let's move on".If only Big Gordon had simply said "sorry" at the outset, this matter would already be sliding into history.Bad move Prime Minister ! Thu 16 Apr 2009 18:00:38 GMT+1 delminister http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=15#comment3 it seems these politicians are using the word sorry as a try and get out of jail free card, if they continue to cheapen the word it will become a joke.as in this email slur case they say they are sorry but are they sorry for the act or sorry they were caught ?.i personly think the latter but there is an element of doubt just not enough sadly, this whole affair has put me off wanting to vote for any mp in this country as they all seem as corrupt as each other the expences cases the bare faced lying and all the other rubbish the members of the house seem to be pulling so does saying sorry resolve the issues no it seems to make it worse thats poor spin doctoring. Thu 16 Apr 2009 17:26:47 GMT+1 george_dickie http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=10#comment2 Who amongst the electorate, rather than the people in "The Westminster Village", actually care whether Brown said "sorry" or "I deeply regret". What we care about is those with their snouts in the troughs. Give us an election so that we can get rid of this bunch. But will the next lot be any better? Probably for about as long as they find out how to work the system. Thu 16 Apr 2009 17:26:05 GMT+1 Ernie http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=5#comment1 Sorry doesn't cut it. From the "Brown 'sorry' over email slurs" article here on the beeb I got this quote -"I take full responsibility for what happened. That's why the person who was responsible went immediately."What kind of doublespeak is that? In the space of two sentences he's contradicted himself and passed the buck.If he took full responsibility for what happened HE would have done the honourable thing and resigned. The truth is that he murmur's "s'ry" like a chastised 5 year old whose pride won't allow him to apologise for his incompetence, all the while blaming others.No, that's no apology at all, this current crop won't genuinely apologise or mend their ways even when legal rulings go against them. Just look at what happened with the DNA retention scheme, the european courts and the total lack of subsequent action by the home office for further examples.Too much pride. Thu 16 Apr 2009 16:25:30 GMT+1 stanilic http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/04/the_politics_of_apology.html?page=0#comment0 The best approach when giving instructions is to conclude with the words `any questions, any suggestions'. Someone might just come up with a better way or they usually just want to explore the proposal so they can understand it better. This is the sign of confident leadership: one that can accept constructive criticism.The tragedy in Britain today is that confident leadership is quite absent. We don't just have political problems we also have psychological difficulties. These seem to start at the top so how one can expect those at the bottom to function properly is beyond belief.In my view this is all because those in charge want to control, to micro-manage the lives of everyone to make sure that nothing construed as evil is done. Fat chance. The best method of control is not to control but set an example.There have been too few examples of positive leadership from the current government. If they are not leeching off the taxpayer for sink plugs and porn videos, then they are having people arrested for thinking differently and even for just opposing the government.This latest episode is just a further instance of a clearly defined decline in our public affairs. To think naughty thoughts is one thing, to project these onto your political opponents is another, but to conflate these two psychological disorders with an actual conspiracy to smear people is quite something else. One is left asking what goes on at No.10.The Prime Minister is right to apologise. The question we all now have is why did it take him almost a week to weasel out those words? The man at fault was his appointee, his confidant and thus his responsibility. The Prime Minister clearly feels soiled by this business and so he should. The fact he did not apologise from the outset soils him even more. No leader he. Thu 16 Apr 2009 16:03:42 GMT+1