Comments for http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html en-gb 30 Sat 31 Jan 2015 09:38:22 GMT+1 A feed of user comments from the page found at http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html dennisjunior1 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=99#comment252 I think it was in a tail-spin; so, what could have taken place to stop this problems from getting out of control... Thu 25 Dec 2008 03:14:25 GMT+1 Scribesolomon http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=99#comment251 McCain vs Obama verbal duel (debate)-a knockout punch for McCain?I certainly think it is so. On economic issues as well as other issues like health care, McCain sounded much more pragmatic thanObama.Also McCain was brimming with confidence-with a confident smile-and was quick on theuptake for almost every one of Obama'sprobes and thrusts. There was no evidence of the so-called "temper" that some mediacommentators were mentioning about. Hewas no doubt surprisingly energetic, considering the fact that he is 'not-so-young'. (Justin, the look of his hands could be attributed to the beating he got from theViet Cong and not because of any other suggestion.) McCain looked and talked as you would expect from the President of the mostpowerful country on earth-no affected posturings, like some others for him. Thu 16 Oct 2008 16:54:40 GMT+1 jacksforge http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=98#comment250 dc i know but I'm starting to think the opposition ids too stupid to think for themselves and so they spend a lot of time trying to find something, by trawling for ideas.(not a very creative group that is for sure) Wed 15 Oct 2008 16:52:52 GMT+1 Scribesolomon http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=98#comment249 Is Mrs Arab an 'agent provocateur'?It is unimaginable that a charitable mindedMcCain-who has an adopted daughter fromBangladesh-would countenance such slanted arguements. Despite the fact that he was placed in an embarassing situation he did his best to deflate it, while covering his rear.Therefore the question may very well be asked whether Mrs Arab was indeed an 'agent provocateur' from you know whichcamp.Secondly, politics is a different 'kettle of fish'from being an Air Force pilot. These need quite different abilities. In any case you cannot go by hearsay evidence of perhaps disgruntled elements. What really matters in war is whether McCain conducted himself in the best military tradition of heroism, andof that there is absolutely no doubt. Wed 15 Oct 2008 14:05:37 GMT+1 J_in_SEA http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=98#comment248 Just wanted to chime in on the Palin factor. The fact that McCain's camp thought that putting in any woman would equal the Hillary factor is an insult to all women. Palin has nothing in common with Hillary Clinton except her gender. Palin is dangerous with her ignorance, almost proud of it. Former Hillary supporters will not give their votes to Palin. My concern is that some Hillary supporters will withhold their votes or give Hillary the 'write-in' out of frustration that Obama did not fully vet her as a VP. Though if the polls even out closer to election day, I doubt that a Hillary supporter could stomach the risk of allowing McCain/Palin to take the presidency by not casting a vote for Obama. Ah, politics. Wed 15 Oct 2008 04:02:14 GMT+1 David Cunard http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=97#comment247 #238. british-ish: "I can only say that reading jeers straight from the primary school playground rather reinforces my reasons for not participating any further."In the event that you read this, even if you do no longer participate, you really must grow up and learn to take the hard knocks with the rest. Your post has the tone of a spoiled brat who says 'it's my ball and I'm not playing with you any more." Sulking about it doesn't do anything - come back and fight - that's what a really big boy would do, but perhaps you're not man enough. Give it try anyway - and learn to say "I was wrong"; you'll be astonished at how easy it is and, more importantly, how much your standing rises with others. Honestly, it's true, try it - you'll like it! Tue 14 Oct 2008 19:36:07 GMT+1 David Cunard http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=97#comment246 #245. SamTyler1969: "Apologies. 222, Your guy Larry."Sam, not my guy! But he is still out there and appearing at McCain-Palin rallies; desperate campaigns can take desperate measures, the truth be damned. Tue 14 Oct 2008 18:19:47 GMT+1 David Cunard http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=96#comment245 #43. jacksforge: "DC you previous support for the Clinton is showing up in the choice of subjects you raise."We have to be vigilant and anticipate what the other side will raise - no good ignoring the possibilities. Tue 14 Oct 2008 18:14:51 GMT+1 SamTyler1969 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=96#comment244 #235David,Apologies. 222, Your guy Larry.Sad Sam Tue 14 Oct 2008 15:45:42 GMT+1 SamTyler1969 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=96#comment243 #239Cabernet Sauvignon.Endorfin, I agree. But your discussion is at a different level to the one with Marcus.Accountant Sam Tue 14 Oct 2008 15:36:25 GMT+1 jacksforge http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=95#comment242 222 DC you previous support for the Clinton is showing up in the choice of subjects you raise.241King of the hillCotton Hill = J mc cain Tue 14 Oct 2008 14:12:11 GMT+1 jacksforge http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=95#comment241 218" for instance her drive and positive energy. "does not Obama have drive and energy?"Taxes from rich oil companies going back to the community people, in flush times she did not over spend but reduced budget spending"the tax back to alaskans is a deal long standing she just carried it on, and the town she left in Debt because she wanter a sports hall in a town that has no sewerage treatment(BTW Crap takes a long time to break down when frozen) Tue 14 Oct 2008 14:09:02 GMT+1 SunshinePlus http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=94#comment240 The quality that is most evident in McCain's reaction to the fact that he is losing the election is his volatile temper under stress and his inability to handle two things at once. He cannot think clearly on his feet and maintain balance. This clearly precludes any thought of being President of the U.S. Tue 14 Oct 2008 13:13:47 GMT+1 john-In-Dublin http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=94#comment239 230 DougTexan wrote "Yahoo search,... Obama+friends, got my space, got political friend got nothing that john states. "Well try GoogleAs I didAs I said.In my postingJust tried it again. Got same result. Article I referred to was 11th article to come up. Tue 14 Oct 2008 12:09:00 GMT+1 endorfin http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=94#comment238 #202EBITDA? Sam, have you been at the crystal meth?EBITDA is a useful measure, certainly, but it's Emmental-like in it's holiness. In a non-religious way, obviously. I will grant you that capital-intensive companies use this to give their shareholders a feel for cash flow before loan payments, taxes, depreciation, and amortisation charges reduce the income statement to ashes - which they usually do - so it certainly has popularity on its side.Thing is though, EBITDA leaves out so many expenses that to think of it as a complete measure of profitability is to have a mind as closed as Sarah Palin on the issue of mooses rights. It's not even slightly difficult to stretch, tweak, and generally shoehorn accounting policies to fit your given situation and boost EBITDA. I know, it’s what I’ve done for the last couple of decades. Beating up the auditors and reinterpreting GAAP and IFRS were always a fun part of the job, though, like pulling the wings off flies, somewhat sadistic. In my experience, the analysts almost always adjust EBITDA to add back various elements – different ones used to add back different bits, mind you – so that there’s never one totally accepted measure of profit. The one thing that all of our banks and investors agreed on was the primacy of cashflow and, specifically, our recurring cash conversion ratio. And that, for me, is how you measure a business. Tue 14 Oct 2008 09:40:50 GMT+1 british-ish http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=93#comment237 237 was an apology over my mistake over the protocol of flag-flying ay Buck House (I'd forgotten it had changed). I quoted the last para of 235.I can only say that reading jeers straight from the primary school playground rather reinforces my reasons for not participating any further.I'm pretty weary of the moderators here, as well, since they won't allow me to link to an mp3 of a song which expresses my views nicely, even though it is copyright-free.Readers will just have to google 'Bandiera rossa', 'marxism.org' and 'lyrics' instead. I recommend, given today's US announcement, stanza seven . . .Now, if the moderators will only let this past, it is my final goodbye. Tue 14 Oct 2008 08:23:21 GMT+1 british-ish http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=93#comment236 228, Sam:I 'weturned' to make two apologies, one to any of those with whom I have had both entertaining and instructive and interesting exchanges, in case they thought I'd included any of them in my complaint about ranters.The other apology was to be about my error over flag-flying, intended, however, for the person who wrote this:"And don't feel too sorry for 'Ish-ish; he's gone to have his liddle wounds and bwoozes bathed by Mandy and Reinaldo who live so near and den, when he feel better, baba may wesurface to tell us more tings about the Bwitish an how he appwooves of Shawia."But I've decided not to bother about that now, only to say sorry to any other readers I may have misled over that. I'd simply forgotten the protocol had changed.Now, 'newbriton', can you blame me for finding a resort to the jeering of the primary school playground entertaining?Really, I can't be bothered when people resort to that kind of silliness. So I leave you with [Unsuitable/Broken URL removed by Moderator]this invigorating little ditty. Tue 14 Oct 2008 07:30:35 GMT+1 everyoneiscrazy http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=92#comment235 115Have you actually read the posts? I can count dozens of posts critricizing Obama. It depends how you do it wether or not you get heard. what did you say you naughty boy? Tue 14 Oct 2008 07:25:20 GMT+1 David Cunard http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=92#comment234 #232. SamTyler1969:#227A felon with a 27 year record of balckmail and no supporting evidence? Forget witnesses, he doesn;t even have dates and locations to be checked?The number you refer to doesn't mention anyone, let alone a felon! What number/person did you really mean? It must be late at night for you since your typing is usually immaculate.And don't feel too sorry for 'Ish-ish; he's gone to have his liddle wounds and bwoozes bathed by Mandy and Reinaldo who live so near and den, when he feel better, baba may wesurface to tell us more tings about the Bwitish an how he appwooves of Shawia. Tue 14 Oct 2008 04:42:28 GMT+1 Orville Eastland http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=92#comment233 Kirin:Have you read any of Greg Palast's reports for the BBC and other media outlets on the 2000 and 20004 election? How about Jake Tapper's coverage of the 2000 Primary and General Election? It appears to me that Bush stole three elections (2000 South Carolina Primary, 2000 General, 2004 General).** Legal disclaimer. I will not state who I am voting for, due to the fact that I am a poll worker. I will state that A. I am not voting for Obama. B. I did not vote for Gore or Kerry. C. I did vote for McCain in the 2000 SC Primary.Also, not all the questioners of the official 9/11 theory are "liberal". Morgan Reynolds, a Department of Labor Economist under George W. Bush and Paul Craig Roberts, Assistant Treasury Secretary under Reagan, as well as a number of people further to the Right. Tue 14 Oct 2008 03:57:12 GMT+1 Offworld_Observer http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=91#comment232 Coulda, woulda, shoulda ... many people seem to think that politicians should have minds that work at computer speeds when presented with information to which they must respond rapidly. Analyse your *own* reactions when *you* have been on thin ice, and you knew that your derriere was on the line. The roads to either political perdition or salvation present many forks -- and yet so many folks believe that McCain should have been able to finesse his remarks as he was taken by surprise by that "(Obama) is an Arab" sneak attack? COME OFF IT!!! That woman was likely a Democratic Party plant anyway.As an extraterrestrial observer, I think you Earthlings are far too touchy about skin colour and religion, not to mention political affiliations.As far as we Offworlders are concerned, you all look alike, and behave alike. And even with infra-red vision, at night all cats are grey.Find something *real* to get irate about, won't you? You can thank me later. Tue 14 Oct 2008 03:55:34 GMT+1 SamTyler1969 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=91#comment231 #227A felon with a 27 year record of balckmail and no supporting evidence? Forget witnesses, he doesn;t even have dates and locations to be checked?This would be funny if Palin brings it up. McCain could never do it but Sarah may be that crazy.The funniest thing today was watching McCain defend his rallies when interviewed by Dana Bash. Apart from looking like he wanted to smack her when she asked the question his response of 'People have said the same thing about me at Obama rallies' was incredulous. 'Terrorist'? 'Kill him'? She should have said 'Can you name one incident so we can check?'. But maybe she thought he would hit her. The poor old guy has lost the plot.Sad Sam Tue 14 Oct 2008 02:53:30 GMT+1 SamTyler1969 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=90#comment230 #197Belson,You miss the point that Doug gets. Creationism is nonsense as a Science. Science being simply a method used to describe the natural world. Creationism and the existence of God are two entirely different things. To argue that God does not exist because Evolution is an observable mechanism is like arguing fish is better than beef. You can buy into the Dawkins arguement that asking questions about our maker are irrelevant because he doesn't exist but that is a rather tedious circular arguement.God can exist, evolution can be the mechanism. If you wish to prove God does not exist through science, then you must take that hypothesis and elevate it to theory through measurable, observable, repeatable experiments. My bidy isn;t attractive doesn't cut it.Theologist Sam Tue 14 Oct 2008 02:29:00 GMT+1 DougTexan http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=90#comment229 216. At 11:30pm on 13 Oct 2008, john-In-DublinYahoo search,... Obama+friends, got my space, got political friend got nothing that john states. Whoop, no big whoop Tue 14 Oct 2008 01:54:53 GMT+1 SamTyler1969 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=90#comment228 #163Thanks Doug,As for knowing Jesus, I am Episcopalian, one of God's frozen people. Knowing Jesus implies a personal relationship that would just embarass us. The Austin Lounge Lizards had something to say on that subject.pax vobiscumReligious Sam Mon 13 Oct 2008 23:48:30 GMT+1 SamTyler1969 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=89#comment227 #205Ish-ish. We will miss you, ish.Sad Sam Mon 13 Oct 2008 23:44:18 GMT+1 U12831485 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=89#comment226 205, british-ish wrote:So, I'm going to read a few good books instead. Goodbye.____Come on, don't be such a chicken, a sound European point of view like yours is important.Every single discussion on US politics on the Internet is spammed by Yank cave men, they seem to have some sort of radar for anything anti-stone-age.Probably a homeland security thing.____Fritz Kraut Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:46:41 GMT+1 jacksforge http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=88#comment225 179 new briton, welcome to the world of mostly erroneous. Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:46:26 GMT+1 jacksforge http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=88#comment224 177 marygrav YEEEEEHHHHAARRRRR.saw it .Question though,did she have to throw the puck in and did she do it right?I thought hockey was played on a field.:) Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:45:17 GMT+1 newbriton http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=88#comment223 #205 british-ishI didn't realize this forum was for your personal entertainment. Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:41:56 GMT+1 jacksforge http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=87#comment222 Ah timmy got the post wrong way round, there, I had not taken you for one of the local sentimentalist wishing for the old days there(MA).Now re reading I still don't.phew Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:41:42 GMT+1 David Cunard http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=87#comment221 #199. DougTexan: "Not a single past friend, girlfriend, classmate nor neighbor have come forward to say anything, good or bad."I'm surprised you haven't read the scurrilous things written and posted on line by Larry Sinclair, a supposed friend of Mr Obama in the most intimate way imaginable. Perhaps the McCain campaign is holding this in reserve in case the other personal attacks do not work. But they wouldn't stoop that low - would they? Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:41:04 GMT+1 newbriton http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=86#comment220 #212 nessie1945Welcome aboard. Better late than never! Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:38:38 GMT+1 U12831485 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=86#comment219 199, DougTexan wrote:I have question for you. Actually, let me state what I'm having a problem with, and maybe you can help me. All my life I was raised with the "You are known by the company you keep" paradigm hanging over me. ___Maybe I can be of assistance.While you seem to be concerned about knowing nothing about Obama, even though his past seems to be no secret, what exactly do you know about McCain ?In the middle of the campaign turmoil, it's really hard to tell fact from fiction.However, isn't it true that McCain's public image heavily depends on his 'war hero' merits, which appear to be forged ?Isn't it correct that McCain owes his success solely to him being born with the proverbial silver spoon in his mouth ? Just like, hmmm... GWB ?Is it possible to consider Sarah Palin acceptable as VP, or your local dog catcher , by any 1st world standards ?Isn't it safe to say the McCain campaign used lies and misinformation from day one, to discredit Obama, while the Dems remained fairly civil ?Not that the Dems are completely innocent, it's politics after all, but they still appear to hold the moral high ground.___- Fritz Kraut Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:35:59 GMT+1 jacksforge http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=86#comment218 176. At 8:45pm on 13 Oct 2008, allmymarbles wrote:61, ubermensch."But ACORN did endorse Obama and they are engaged in electorial fraud."If a lunatic endorsed Obama would that mean he was mentally unbalanced?If you endorsed Obama would that mean he was an Arab hater?-----------------------------------I endorse Obama and I'm crazy. Does that mean I have to hate arabs too? Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:35:52 GMT+1 Justaline http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=85#comment217 Regarding comment No.199 Actually MarkfromOxford I having the same problem ... Is this guy an alien or what? I have noted that the press are pro-Obama, hollywood look at him like some guru, there does seem a strange amount of hush hush. Also I really am trying to understand his Change policy. Yes we all want change, but he is not putting all his cards on the table. I would like to believe like 50% of the US voters that all he says is true!, unfortunately I have this sixth sense feeling, that something is missing, yes HELP. Not that I am a big fan of Palin although she does have some qualities that I like, for instance her drive and positive energy. However her short term record from Alaska is quite impressive. Taxes from rich oil companies going back to the community people, in flush times she did not over spend but reduced budget spending. If you manage to read through the fog of the bias press, it looks like something we are all looking for, a piece of the cake. Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:35:01 GMT+1 jacksforge http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=85#comment216 176 timmy the goodreally you know it's not a real county anymore. more of a local postal address allowed so people don't have to feel like they were moved.:) Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:33:23 GMT+1 john-In-Dublin http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=84#comment215 # 199 DougTexan "That said I now have a canidate that has thrown everyone, friends, associates, reverand for twenty years and family off to the side for expedience because they are less then mainstream. Not a single past friend, girlfriend, classmate nor neighbor have come forward to say anything, good or bad./ I like his party plans, tax incentive, health plan, but he doesn't seem to have any history, almost like he was made up for the canidate, even Michele,.. no girlfriends, boy friends, nothing. No former people like Kerry even had from the college and Military. Like Bush had from the skull and crossbone from college, old oil freinds and investors talked badly about Bush."You keep repeating that [a] Obama has abandoned everyone he ever knew and [b] no one he has ever known ever speaks about him.What, exactly, is your evidence? If any?Yes, everyone knows he severed links with Rev Wright and his church. People can and will draw their own conclusions about whether he should have, whether he should have been linked with him in the first place, etc etc. So who are all these other people he's 'thrown under the bus'? You say his family. Didn't his sister [possibly his half-sister - he has a complicated family background] give a speech at the Convention? And his brother-in-law? I've seen plenty of comments from people who have known him, in high school, at university, and after. I don't recall seeing anything about McCain or Palin's old girlfriends or boyfriends. I didn't assume from this either that [a] they never had any or [b] they've been mysteriously silenced. I did a quick Google for Obama + friends. Surprise, surprise, the first few that came up were right wing...enthusiasts, enthusiastically promulgating their theories that all his friends are terrorist, commie, Muslim, Marxist pinkos etc. But I did come up with this one quite quickly - link . I also watched a half hour documentary on him this evening on the BBC. Quite even handed, not to say sceptical, I thought. They had more than one person who knew him in his earlier years. They were far from universally laudatory. He's human - who'd have thought? They even suggested - heaven forfend - that he's an ambitious politician. As I recall you announced you were 'saved' a few posts back. Doesn't your religion have something about 'judge not...'? Obviously that doesn't forbid you from making judgements about people - especially those who run for office. But I assume some evidence is required? Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:30:46 GMT+1 David Cunard http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=84#comment214 #205. british-ish: "I really have no interest in seeing yet more voluminous repetition of the same old stuff, the same old outdated views, the same rants from people who will never learn anything new, the same old personal abuse . . . "As the late President Truman once said, "If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen", advice he (she?) has apparently taken. Poor baby . . . Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:29:36 GMT+1 Simon21 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=84#comment213 198. At 9:57pm on 13 Oct 2008, MagicKirin wrote:ref #193It seems the US will be ruled by a black man, get used to it."Actually Simon Obama is a multi ethnic individual."Never said he wasn't."It's too bad you can't see past his skin color."Its a great pity that's all you see Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:15:48 GMT+1 allmymarbles http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=83#comment212 205, ish-ish.I hope your realize that you have hurt our feelings. Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:15:07 GMT+1 Cassandra http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=83#comment211 When McCain was going to challenge Bush in the last election (I would have voted for him), but instead gave up and began to campaign on Bush's behalf, I sent him a Message: "You have sacrificed your honor on the altar of party loyalty."Still, after Obama was chosen by Super Delegates over Clinton, I considered McCain one last time only to see that he was no longer the man I'd once thought he was - if he ever was that man. The more information that comes to light, the more it becomes obvious that "maverick" was more strategy than truth.When Sarah Palin hit the fan, I bailed out forever. Hate mongering and assassination by innuendo is unforgivable. Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:14:55 GMT+1 newbriton http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=83#comment210 #199All my life I was raised with the "You are known by the company you keep" paradigm hanging over me.A common admonishment to those who in the view of some did not keep the right company. You probably were a naughty boy and had to be kept in line. It's rather old fashioned though isn't it? Don't let your daughter on the stage Mrs. Worthington (actors were regarded as loose and dissolute). Officers not encouraged to associate with enlisted men, etc. Today we have a different view and appreciate the value of all individuals. But what has this to do with the fact that Obama is not trotting out all his school friends to join him on stage? His personal life is one of public record. Are you suggesting that during his life he has alienated everyone he came into contact with and not one person is willing to openly support him? On the other hand I do not hear multitudes of associates disowning him. Your assertion that he has "thrown everyone, friends, associates, reverand for twenty years and family off to the side for expedience because they are less then mainstream," stretches the truth more than a little. You want a cast iron guarantee that your candidate is going to fix it all. It's not going to happen. Your job is to vote for the candidate best equipped to lead this country forward. That candidate is Obama. Your assertion that he has no history is rot. You already know about his childhood. He went to Columbia where he earned a BA in Political Science and International Relations. He then earned a scholarship to Harvard where he was editor of the Harvard Law Review and graduated at the top of his class. His work in Chicago is also well documented. Come on! He's bright, intelligent, eloquent, by your own admission you like his policies. Are you just complaining that the tabloid press has not been able to dig up anything juicy in his past? You can get all the titillation (sex, drugs, nepotism, insubordination) you crave by reading McCain's life story, this is just part of what differentiates the two men. Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:13:29 GMT+1 Gary_A_Hill http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=82#comment209 MK (#198), practically everyone in the US is multi-ethnic. Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:04:37 GMT+1 U4466131 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=82#comment208 #201 MagicKirin"But some people care more about wether the canidate has a d or r in front of his or her name."I think he's finally lost the plot.With that I'm going to bed. All you people over there who have only just got up have a good day. Mon 13 Oct 2008 22:01:57 GMT+1 jdbonehead http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=81#comment207 As an American, I feel that, as much as Obama/Biden are really the only choice, it's clear that a large percentage of Americans have not learned their lessons from the previous 8 years of GOP misdeeds in the executive branch and Congress, or the 8 years prior to that of a GOP controlled Congress at odds with a Demo executive, or the 12 years prior to that of GOP executives. (I'm going past my memory to recall the congressional flavor during that time).That being the case. I can only hope that the old man and the pretty(?) girl win. It seems that a complete meltdown may be that only thing that can restore reason to the 25 percent or so of this country who are seriously deluded. Maybe. Mon 13 Oct 2008 21:57:53 GMT+1 allmymarbles http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=81#comment206 200, Timothy.Saturday Night Live has Tina Fey. But that's OK, we have Magic ubermensch. Mon 13 Oct 2008 21:49:29 GMT+1 U4466131 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=81#comment205 #199 DougTexanWas that question directed just at Mark? Mon 13 Oct 2008 21:46:28 GMT+1 british-ish http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=80#comment204 Goodbye to all that . . .Thanks to the handful of people who contribute here who have kept me amused and provoked me into the odd joke or two; thanks also to those few who have given me something to think about in the long watches of the night when I can't sleep.However, I really have no interest in seeing yet more voluminous repetition of the same old stuff, the same old outdated views, the same rants from people who will never learn anything new, the same old personal abuse . . .So, I'm going to read a few good books instead. Goodbye. Mon 13 Oct 2008 21:36:47 GMT+1 newbriton http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=80#comment203 It seems the same people who characterize McCain as a hero because he failed to take the prescribed evasion action when a SAM locked on to him in Vietnam, are now hailing him for taking the microphone from an obviously, misinformed, uneducated, bigot at one of his rallies. Unless the media are seriously falling down on their job I don't recall the same type of mindless behaviour being exhibited by Obama supporters. What was the alternative? Should McCain have seriously considered this woman's perspective and answer whatever question she may have had - he's not that stupid. What does resonate is his response, which has attracted many comments on this blog. He could have said so much more, but he didn't. Meanwhile the other half of his ticket continues to spread the venom - sounds like a McCain strategy to me. Mon 13 Oct 2008 21:36:44 GMT+1 U4466131 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=79#comment202 #197 BelmonsI feel that you are trying too hard at this point. Most of the posters to this blog are intelligent and those who have declared their Christian beliefs have also made it clear that Creationism isn't too high up on their list of "must believe in's"How about the lady's other more dangerous attributes such as her apparent belief that she can fire who she wants. As a Vice President that would be scary as a President that would be just................................ Mon 13 Oct 2008 21:33:06 GMT+1 SamTyler1969 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=79#comment201 #145Marcus,Actually no, I'm not an economist. I employ quite a few though. That's as far as I am going to go because I will start to give away who I am.You are confusing business strategy with measuring results, again. I'm not surprised, it is a common error made by the small investor and amateur.Yes investors meet and review quarterly results (accounting results) and there are some penalties should you miss target. Typically some will sell and in the extreme case the board may replace some or all of the executive team. However, this is not what drives the long term investor, nor the institutional one. They are interested in long term growth not quarterly results. In fact the folks who concentrate on just the numbers generally flame out as businesses, because they don't look ahead to their future in terms of people, services, products and so on. They wake up one morning and they have been left behind.It is easy to manipulate and maximize short term financial KPI's (Key Performance Indicators), infact companies like Enron made a good run of it for quite a while. But long term they collapse because they obsess over the accounting and not placing the right bets on where their future lies, they don't manage their corporate risk exposure and they don't invest in their employees. These are all things which drive down the short term profit, but establish the foundation for long term consistent growth. The thing that mature investors look for.To dumb it down, it's like growing a vineyard. Accounting tells you how many vines you have, how big they are and how many grapes they produce. All needed. But business strategy and leadership is about deciding where to put the vineyard, will it be organic, what varietals to grow, whether to irrigate, what vines go where in the landscape, who to employ as pickers, when to consult with others and who to sell your grapes to. Accounting without strategy and mission is useless. Building the business long term is all strategy and business, measured risk taking and governance. This is the whole reason companies used balanced scorecards internally to drive behavior rather than simple accounting measures. Shareholder value is about more than quarterly results. Unless you are a day trader. And no one listens to them anyway.As for economists saying this mess was going to happen, they have been doing so for years. From the Economist magazine and FT editorials to folks like Paul Krugman (congrats on the Nobel prize, Paul) have been telling us for years. The problem is that for the past 6-7 years politicians, and the markets, have done the equivalent of sitting in the corner of the room with their fingers in their ears singing 'La la la la la I'm not listening'. This is mostly down to the current administration doing their usual trick of not listening to anyone who doesn't say exactly what they want to hear.BTW, important safety tip. If you want to try to look smart by throwing out a few financial ratios it helps to know what they are, and not use two that are the same thing. Net Profit After Tax is the 'Bottom Line'. Personally I prefer EBITDA. There are many many others. Keep that money under the mattress, it's safer there for you. Executive Sam Mon 13 Oct 2008 21:29:16 GMT+1 MagicKirin http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=79#comment200 Is there a reason why people can't talk about the Presidential election on issues and qualifications.Why do so many posters bring up race as an argument instead?To quote Deng Xiaping "People dont care if a Cat is a Black Cat or a White Cat they care if it catches mice.But some people care more about wether the canidate has a d or r in front of his or her name. Mon 13 Oct 2008 21:21:34 GMT+1 U4466131 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=78#comment199 #178 AsaScotEasy now, you might upset him, he's a sensitive soul and could easily stop posting and then where would we be? Mon 13 Oct 2008 21:17:28 GMT+1 DougTexan http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=78#comment198 161. MarkfromOxfordI have question for you. Actually, let me state what I'm having a problem with, and maybe you can help me. All my life I was raised with the "You are known by the company you keep" paradigm hanging over me. That said I now have a canidate that has thrown everyone, friends, associates, reverand for twenty years and family off to the side for expedience because they are less then mainstream. Not a single past friend, girlfriend, classmate nor neighbor have come forward to say anything, good or bad.I like his party plans, tax incentive, health plan, but he doesn't seem to have any history, almost like he was made up for the canidate, even Michele,.. no girlfriends, boy friends, nothing. No former people like Kerry even had from the college and Military. Like Bush had from the skull and crossbone from college, old oil freinds and investors talked badly about Bush.There ya are, HELP Mon 13 Oct 2008 21:15:22 GMT+1 MagicKirin http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=77#comment197 ref #193It seems the US will be ruled by a black man, get used to it.Actually Simon Obama is a multi ethnic individual.It's too bad you can't see past his skin color. Mon 13 Oct 2008 20:57:59 GMT+1 Belmons http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=77#comment196 Belmons wrote: "What really horrifies me about the whole Palin thing is the fact that apparently nobody in America or on this blog seems interested in her religious convictions. For Pete's sake, she is a CREATIONIST!" {Christian} "I've found it difficult to confirm but it seems she is probably a Young Earth Creationist to boot."Whats horrific is that even though he can't confirm it, he tells us anyway,... and it horrifies him. :)Doug, you are deliberately misunderstanding what I said. I said it horrifies me that she's a Creationist, as it does. Nobody, I take it, denies that she is. I THEN said she was probably a Young Earther too. That would make it even worse. As for that point, when someone asked her about the age of the World, she did say something about human footprints being found together with dinosaur tracks. If she believes that old yarn, she is even more ignorant than I thought.As for the abortion question, it's clearly pointless to try to argue with someone if they believe a tiny blob of cells is a human being, so I won't try. But I'd like to see what would happen if a woman who'd suffered an early spontaneous miscarriage, took the result to church in a jar and demanded a full funeral service. Not a fringe church, not Palin's (or maybe Obama's!) church, but a mainstream church.To say that in the Bible the six days are undefined is to pursue the line taken increasingly by Christians in modern times as their core beliefs have been rendered more and more tenuous. As you know well, for most of the last two milennia, Christians took Genesis quite literally, and would have been pretty unpopular had they publicly revealed any other attitude.As for God's special intervention in the creation of Man, well, why did he make such a botched job of it? There are any number of flaws in the "design" of the human body, which are perfectly explicable in terms of evoultion by Natural Selection, but which do not suggest a benign and intelligent designer.My original point stands. Creationism is nonsense (as others have said here) and if Palin really believes in it she has betrayed the human reasoning power which you and she believe God gave her. Mon 13 Oct 2008 20:56:00 GMT+1 OnlyHereForTheFood http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=77#comment195 Emails,flyers (unaffiliated with campaigns) and good old fashioned gossip are how most rumours are spread. Mon 13 Oct 2008 20:52:38 GMT+1 newbriton http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=76#comment194 #186 magickirinWhere are you moving on to? Perhaps the unknown? Terrorism cannot be justified but there are reasons for the current waves of discontent. There are sources of this hopelessness that many people experience and express in violence. Do you not think it behooves us to attempt to find out what can be done to prevent this type of expression in the future? Education seems to work. But as we can't do that very well at home there's probably not much hope of doing it beyond our shores. Mon 13 Oct 2008 20:46:19 GMT+1 Simon21 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=76#comment193 "186. At 9:16pm on 13 Oct 2008, MagicKirin wrote:ref #185I do 48 years ago, and 100 years ago there were seperate water fountains for blacks and whites."The 1940s being a hundred years apparently.And some want to bring them back"Let's talk about the present, I know you like to go back to justify current terrorism, frauds and other misdeeds."Lynching not a form of terrorism? Mon 13 Oct 2008 20:45:23 GMT+1 Simon21 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=75#comment192 "189. At 9:25pm on 13 Oct 2008, MagicKirin wrote:ref #178First I am an independent"Whatever that means"And how I am regarded by you and moon bats like Jacky and Lost mean nothing to me."So why resort to abuse? Obviously you are quite upsetSecond - Acorn is being prosecuted.Is it? Far right blogs but is the whole orgnaisaiton being prosecuted?"The diebold safe company never was.Bush 2000 campaign never was"Yes, rather the point eh. But members of Bush's cabinet were prosecuted.And the stacked, right wing, Supreme Court protects its own."You may now go back to your regularly scheduled Obama worship"It seems the US will be ruled by a black man, get used to it. Mon 13 Oct 2008 20:43:46 GMT+1 U12831485 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=75#comment191 80, gunsandreligion wrote:There are several distortions in the article, which?show that its author, Tim Dickinson, is unfamiliar?with the sacrifices that any serviceman has to?make, and the extreme ones that any POW may?be called upon to make.??As Churchill once said in his history of WWII?of a Japanese admiral who blew a battle,?"Those who have endured a similar ordeal?may judge him."________I wasn't aware there are sacrifices being made by 'any' serviceman.My understanding is, that 5-10% of the armed forces, which are deployed to a war zone, will actually get involved in combat missions.The rest do suffer from boredom, the local climate and lack of drive-in KFCs .I guess it's no good for a marriage , either.As for the Churchill quote, that was about leadership in battle, and has nothing to do with common troops whatsoever.___- Fritz Kraut Mon 13 Oct 2008 20:40:41 GMT+1 john-In-Dublin http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=75#comment190 The following posting was 'referred to the moderators'. I have changed the only possible reason I can see for this. So - here goes nothing.....[So, just to be clear, Cindy McCain has never, ever ever had a problem with any kind of prescription dr*gs. Any statement to the contrary, even from Cindy McCain, must be considered inoperative.]# 144 MagicKirin wrote:"I disgree it was primarily the intellect of the voters that gave us George Bush./Geroge Bush had stated positions when he ran. Agree or disagree he had them./Al Gore and John Kerry had no positions or flip flopped worse than Mitt Romney./This electiion Obama has stated his positions but as thier were two main issues the Dems blasted Bush on 2000 intellect and experience./It's hypocritical for them to say in Obama's case it's not important."Where to start?A posting or 2 ago I had the rare honour of being censored by the Mods when trying to reply to Mr Magic. I'm assuming it was due to a reference to the current wife of one of the candidates [hint - not Obama] having had a deleted deleted deleted. I was replying to a post from Magic announcing, with his rare and Godlike insight, that Michelle Obama's soul needed to be repaired.This is basically what I wrote - "A while ago, when JohnyAAA was posting about 10 times an hour, someone did a rather droll spoof of a typical JohnAAA postingAs far as I can see a typical Mr/Ms Kirin posting is a few lines of sweeping generalisation (almost always badly spelled), devoid of evidence, or even supporting links, where words mean whatever Magic wants them to - people s/he dislikes are invariably 'terrorists' or 'hate groups' - and in which Israel and the Reps are good, Everyone Else and the Dems are bad."He has kindly persisted in proving my point. So, Magic, Gore and Kerry had "no positions or flip flopped worse than Mitt Romney". And your evidence would be? Your links to the articles proving this? They had manifestos and agendas, and I am aware of no evidence that they flip flopped on them any more than any other politician. [Except for Romney who was blatantly 2-faced even by political standards, on abortion to name but 1 issue.] And as I recall one of the principles of GWB's platform was to be less interventionist abroad than the Dems....As for the Dems saying intellect is not important - which Dems? When? This is blatant drivel. Whatever the criticisms of Obama, I haven't even heard the Reps trying to claim he's not intelligent. And if any Democrat has indeed said experience 'isn't important', they're foolish. Experience is one factor in appointing people to any post. It's just not the only one. Obama has some experience - he also has intelligence, knowledge, clarity of thought, and calmness of character.The leader of the UK Conservative Party pointed out recently that experience isn't everything - if it was there would never be a change of government. He's never held Govt office, and there's a v good chance he'll be the next UK PM. Then again the same was true of Blair - and whatever people think of him now, I don't think many would write him off as a complete failure. Mon 13 Oct 2008 20:36:11 GMT+1 moderate_observer http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=74#comment189 so now they are calling mccain's ampaign maccain 4.0 a new version. how many new directions is this guy going to take? he is giving weight to the the 'erratic' claim. He still have not provided any new ideas , particularly on the current economic crisis.i think mccain's biggest weakness is his campaign advisors. they represent the old republican party, when the republican brand is not very popular. their ideas represent the same ideas that have made them very unpopular and currently they have no new ideas for mccain to run with. hs cliche speeches about tax and spending which right now is so old its falling on deaf ears.(maybe because of the way the reppubs went on a spending nspree with Bush).If mccain was reealy a change agent he would have not had these people giving him old ideas. Mon 13 Oct 2008 20:34:26 GMT+1 MagicKirin http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=74#comment188 ref #178First I am an independentAnd how I am regarded by you and moon bats like Jacky and Lost mean nothing to me.Second - Acorn is being prosecuted.The diebold safe company never was.Bush 2000 campaign never wasYou may now go back to your regularly scheduled Obama worship Mon 13 Oct 2008 20:25:48 GMT+1 U12831485 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=73#comment187 101, DougTexan wrote:Okay, the 'idiots' part aside, the informed few look at the 'whole' known aspect of this mans life. His leftist voting record, his associations of questionable characters and groups, (Rezko, Rev. Wright, Rev. Flandder, Ayers, Acorn and others)._____The 'associations of questionable characters and groups' aside, all of which have been proved to be circumstantial, there is no such thing as a 'leftist' voting record in the US.Trust me, it doesn't exist, the established US socialist movement.The US Democrats are to the right of every major conservative party in Western Europe I'm aware of.Italy doesn't count.- Fritz Kraut Mon 13 Oct 2008 20:24:33 GMT+1 U12831485 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=73#comment186 126, DougTexan wrote:??Okay, so because I'm a Christian just like Obama says he is, I assume he and I both believe in the Bible and in it Genisis where the 'creation' of the world is written. That would make both he and I "Creationist".______As it has been said above, the Old Testament is not exactly the foundation of Christianity. Not even the Pope gets away with beliefs based on those tales these days .- Fritz_Kraut Mon 13 Oct 2008 20:16:57 GMT+1 MagicKirin http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=73#comment185 ref #185I do 48 years ago, and 100 years ago there were seperate water fountains for blacks and whites.Let's talk about the present, I know you like to go back to justify current terrorism, frauds and other misdeeds.Some of us move on Mon 13 Oct 2008 20:16:52 GMT+1 allmymarbles http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=72#comment184 159, ubermensch."The U.S is not Venezuela or Zimbwabwe where elections can be stolen."Naive. Naive. Do you remember the Nixon-Kennedy election - Chicago and Mayor Daley? Mon 13 Oct 2008 20:12:37 GMT+1 newbriton http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=72#comment183 #161 markfrom oxford"Before he began campaigning, I thought of McCain as worthy..."Like many US voters you must have relied on mass media soundbites to arrive at this conclusion. You could not possible have researched his life and career which has been filled with decisions aimed at nothing more than to further his own personal agenda, including dumping his first wife who no longer met his requirements. Admittedly you do eventually arrive at the conclusion that Obama is the best choice - a conclusion I must say was self evident to most people who made some effort to cut through the propaganda surrounding McCain's campaign. It is no exaggeration to say that McCain may actually surpass the level of incompetency and duplicity achieved by Bush. According to the records Bush was a better pilot. Mon 13 Oct 2008 20:07:28 GMT+1 RedWhiteandermblue http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=71#comment182 "If I may, personally I think the whole idea of being in Iraq or Afganistan is deplorable, wrong and ill guided. But we are there, because the Government put us there, not GW alone, the whole package shares the whole blame. "I'll go along with that, except perhaps for the people who were against both wars from the beginning. And even those, few of us as I remember there were, did not, it could be argued, do as much as we could to stop it. Though I think that mildly voicing my opposition did lead to being called a friend of terrorists...The larger point is that the vast majority of congress were for both wars, and so share the blame. I personally never felt the cries of "He misled us on WMDs!" by congressional members held much water. Their studies in military history alone should have convinced them both wars should not have been fought.And if they hadn't studied military history, what the $%# were they doing voting for war or peace, on which the fate of their country depended? A larger issue here is that most people reject the idea that you actually need to know something about a topic to make a good decision about it. Mon 13 Oct 2008 20:01:29 GMT+1 eightypercent http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=71#comment181 # 171 - TimothyMarcus has had such a lovely time today popping up with his nonsense all over the BBC sites that I decided it was time to call him out.I'm sure he'll pop up again with a new moniker - maybe Marcus Aurelius III ?Anyway - I'll think we'll recognise his unique and illogical mindset when we see it again. Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:59:33 GMT+1 mary gravitt http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=71#comment180 McCain has the nerve to always want to engage in warfare and claim heroship. Considering he spent the war as a guest of Hanoi because he did not know not to fly too low, it is difficult to figure out why he is a hero.Flying 50,000 miles over a city and dropping napon only makes him a hero to Dupont. What did the North Vietnam people do but ask the US to let them have self-determination? This is the same thing that Israel insists on. Why is self-determination OK for white people, but not for Colored people?Where I come from a hero ain't nothin' but a sandwich. Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:52:34 GMT+1 moderate_observer http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=70#comment179 #167- its obvious these days that corporations are the new government of the 21st century. Our politicians have sold us the idea of not trusting government and elected officials with our well being but instead trust unaccountable corporations to look after our wellbeing. and we have bought it with an apparent smile on our face with the hope of getting some wealth in return. All that apparently has done is leave our politicians with less responsibility to us and more responsibility to the highest bidding industry. If you want anything done politically, get the top corporations in the world behind it and its done. I suppose that is due to globalisation.so politicians follow the money and go where the CEO tells them to go. to protect interests and assets. Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:52:07 GMT+1 newbriton http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=70#comment178 The idea some have floated that the Clintons may vote Republican to give Hillary a better chance in 2012 is one of the most jaundiced and cynical views yet to surface. The Clintons resonate with the electorate because they believe in the democratic policies they espouse. They have also thrown their considerable weight behind Obama's campaign. The Obama ticket represents a desire of the Democratic Party to put the USA back on the right track, to right the many wrongs perpetrated by the criminal Bush administration, and to reestablish the USA as a nation worthy of respect. Conversely McCain is pursuing the goal he has pursued all his life - to gain for himself personal prestige and recognition. The McCain campaign has been built on deceit, misrepresentation, unsubstantiated personal attack, and fearmongering. McCain is an angry old man. The prospect of him in the position of commander in chief, with his finger on the trigger should put fear into every US citizen. Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:51:06 GMT+1 Mike Mullen http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=69#comment177 #159 Magickirin"Let see I still hear Democrats complaining with no proof that Bush stole the last two elections.ACORN is engaged in an election fraud, so yes I am concerned.The U.S is not Venezuela or Zimbwabwe where elections can be stolen.as far as Israel is seems you Jackforge and Marbles are bringing up"It's always the same with you isn't it? any accusation about Democrats must be gospel truth, any accusation about the Republican's is just a vile slander. It's not your Republican leanings that have generated so much emnity here, it's your fundamental intellectual dishonesty. Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:50:08 GMT+1 mary gravitt http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=69#comment176 I don't care about anything McCain or Palin do from now on because my home town, Philadelphia came through for me. They BOOED PALIN. Hockey Town was not fooled by this woman who claims to be HOCKEY MOM OF THE CENTURY. The found her out and booed her. Now there is joy in Philly, Mighty Palin has struck out. Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:46:17 GMT+1 allmymarbles http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=69#comment175 61, ubermensch."But ACORN did endorse Obama and they are engaged in electorial fraud."If a lunatic endorsed Obama would that mean he was mentally unbalanced?If you endorsed Obama would that mean he was an Arab hater? Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:45:40 GMT+1 U4466131 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=68#comment174 #160 jacksforgeIt certainly does the but as for your #158 it has no towns or villages merely a homeless cricket club. Sad but true. Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:36:34 GMT+1 allmymarbles http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=68#comment173 32, ubermensch.Yawn.......... Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:34:27 GMT+1 U4466131 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=67#comment172 #159 MagicKirin'The U.S is not Venezuela or Zimbwabwe where elections can be stolen.'Now there's a thing, there are no Chad's in Florida. Of course not silly, Chad's in central Africa.Jeb Bush wasn't the Guv'nor of Florida either and Bush's first election didn't look like a bad repeat of something in a banana republic.Magic where do you come from? Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:33:29 GMT+1 malcolmd3111 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=67#comment171 Belmons 107 Creationists are a wonderful example of what we can call instrumentalists. They will believe in anything if it serves a purpose. Instrumentalists are unfortunately in the majority. They are intellectually lazy and cannot do the intellectual legwork to seek truth.The truth seeker walks a lonely path, but one that is ultimately rewarding for he or she joins up the dots, to view a picture with clarity and understanding. Yes it is messy in DC right now, but the right thrive on mess and confusion. They are afraid and rarely have the stomach for a real mental tussle.The web is a rich source for garnering information to verify, prove, disprove opinions and accusations. Unfortunately people often just react to what their emotions tell them and not their mind. We all need to do better at connecting up the dots. Hard as it is for me to say, I felt let down by Bill Clinton, not by his private life, but because he put his own ego ahead of the needs of the country.BTW When Reagan was President a number of his utterences were linguistically analyzed, resulting in meanings of total zero. SP would run him close. Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:32:32 GMT+1 U4466131 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=67#comment170 #157 eightypercentSpoilsport, it won't be half the fun without MA11. You'll be wanting to take Magick away from us to soon. Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:28:41 GMT+1 David Cunard http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=66#comment169 #159. MagicKirin: "The U.S is not Venezuela or Zimbwabwe where elections can be stolen."I don't think the many voters for Al Gore would agree with that statement. Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:28:40 GMT+1 Gary_A_Hill http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=66#comment168 moderate_observer (#154), I agree that putting Patraeus in charge in Iraq was a significant factor in improving the results there, and would add the removal of Rumsfeld as Secretary of Defense. Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:21:31 GMT+1 gunsandreligion http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=66#comment167 And, just for those of you who were suspicious that perhaps regulators were interfered with by special interests, there is this interesting article. Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:15:02 GMT+1 DougTexan http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=65#comment166 154. moderate_observer If I may, personally I think the whole idea of being in Iraq or Afganistan is deplorable, wrong and ill guided. But we are there, because the Government put us there, not GW alone, the whole package shares the whole blame. In the aspect of 'currently' working in our favor to leave is all I want from the surge.In my humble opinion we should have military bases here, in the states and no where else. Of what use is a base in Germany? Kuwait? Japan? A navy that rules the seas? "not" I see our political figures so intwined with business interest that one is nearly undefinable from the other, as to the why we are where, follow the money. Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:11:58 GMT+1 john-In-Dublin http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=65#comment165 # 123. SamTyler1969 "#60,Thanks for keeping me honest. For some reason I had 69 locked in my warped little mind.Interesting scenario though, isn't it?Corrected Sam"Well - keeping you (pedantically) accurate maybe. Honesty I can't speak for (g)It is an interesting scenario. Then again if you'd predicted say 5 years ago that the probable President-elect in 08 would be a youngish black guy with a funny foreign-sounding name whom almost no one then had ever heard of...PS I have absolutely no idea why that particular number got stuck in your head.Now, this Cindy v Michelle wresting match - will it be free-to-air or pay-per-view?? Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:10:02 GMT+1 john-In-Dublin http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=64#comment164 This post has been Removed Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:01:54 GMT+1 SamTyler1969 http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=64#comment163 #142Good question, I have been trying to hear what he is up to on the grapevine and there is a lot of silence. Hopefully he will act soon and inject some more confidence.As for the other part? I am merely an admirer, not a single dirty thought has passed my mind. Welll none that i am going to share, that would be ungentlemanly. Plus she could kick my ass. Sordid Sam Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:01:17 GMT+1 DougTexan http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=64#comment162 # 147 SamSam is wise, is a good take. My mocking the instant take on evolution is just that, a mockery. The same bunk that is being put to Govenor Palin because she is a Christian. Specifically by this piece of work:107. Belmons wrote:"What really horrifies me about the whole Palin thing is the fact that apparently nobody in America or on this blog seems interested in her religious convictions. For Pete's sake, she is a CREATIONIST!" {Christian}"I've found it difficult to confirm but it seems she is probably a Young Earth Creationist to boot."Whats horrific is that even though he can't confirm it, he tells us anyway,... and it horrifies him. :)Wait till he finds out Palin is pro-life and believes life begins at the beginning, e.g. conception.To believe in the bible is not to believe there was no 'big bang' beginning, or to believe there will be naught when we are long ago gone. It is to believe in Divine intervention in the specific creation of man, with that said though, it follows God created all life. The six days are undefined, were they a billion of our years that equalled each day? As to define "God", within parameters set by limited vision of mankind, I may ask which dimension must I stand in to perceive him? I do know,........ this one.To believe your brother is swimming at the river is quite different from knowing. Sam, if I may be so bold, "Know Jesus"just words, just speechesfrom a saved Texan Mon 13 Oct 2008 19:00:26 GMT+1 gunsandreligion http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=63#comment161 #99, 80%, that's a very interesting article thatyou referenced - thanks for sending it my way.I don't know how many readers of this blogare familiar with the complexity of the Chicagopolitical scene, but, to summarize, it is a country within a country. MAII, a good team is the basis for any successfulcompany, so please stop beating up on Bad Sam.And, Sam, I think that you might as well forgetabout getting invited to any White House parties;a few drinks, and you'll be drooling all over the place.Oh, and #142, 80%, I think that what is happeningis that Paulson, Bernanke, and Bush took onelook at the looming CDS crisis, and concludedthat they had to raise the hammer and sickleover the White House just to get through.Their original plan of buying up bad notes formore than they were worth, and leaving holidaygifts for the banks in their place is just notgoing to be acceptable to the oversight committee.In any case, I have noticed that GW and hiscommie pals are now making regular withdrawalsfrom the bank of G&R. Mon 13 Oct 2008 18:49:29 GMT+1 Mark http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=63#comment160 134, DougI'm glad to hear that you are still open as to how you vote: I wish myself that Obama had paid more attention to Texas, not because he would win it, but because of what such a statement would symbolise. Although I think Obama is the better candidate, I suspect he will have to be more prudent than his aspirations suggest, and I don't think that is a bad thing: the present incumbent has got the US into an awful mess and whoever takes this on will have to drink from a poisoned chalice with a strong antidote.Before he began campaigning, I thought of McCain as worthy but dull, but he has made so many crucial mistakes in tone, content, and act that his candidacy involves a far greater risk to the West than does Obama. For a start, both his health and the consistency of his judgment must be held in question, but what really marks him down is Palin and her atavistic instincts. As a President in waiting she looks like a significant economic and foreign policy risk, if only because her record (in asmuch as one can tell) suggests somone with a very high regard for own abilities and a profound ignorance of the world with which she would have to deal. I think it is too much to place her a stroke away from the presidency.I understand, of course, that some feel uncomfortable about Obama for cultural reasons, others because they don't know how to quantify his judgment and achievement. All I can say is that the first time I saw him speak, long before the demise of Hillary, I knew that he was the greatest politician of his generation. That is, of course, a double-edged sword; but his maturity and calmness of demeanour, his willingness to set the agenda but leave the implementation to others except when his imprimatur is the most important thing, and his capacity for both compassion and tolerance, mark him out as the person best equipped to face the future rather than the past. When Ben Jonson wrote of Sir Francis Bacon, he remarked:In his adversity I ever prayed, that God would give him strength, for Greatness he could not want.And of his eloquence he affirmed that:The fear of every man that heard him was, lest he should make an end.Churchill famously remarked that Americans always made the right choice having exhausted every other option. My own view is that the US has already exhausted its options, and McCain is not a choice. Mon 13 Oct 2008 18:30:03 GMT+1 jacksforge http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=62#comment159 middlesex cricket club does. Mon 13 Oct 2008 18:26:35 GMT+1 MagicKirin http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=62#comment158 ref #146Let see I still hear Democrats complaining with no proof that Bush stole the last two elections.ACORN is engaged in an election fraud, so yes I am concerned.The U.S is not Venezuela or Zimbwabwe where elections can be stolen.as far as Israel is seems you Jackforge and Marbles are bringing up Mon 13 Oct 2008 18:25:22 GMT+1 jacksforge http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=62#comment157 145 mostly erroneous . As for the few who said they saw this coming, they certainly weren't out spreading the alarm to every Middlesex village and farm were they..No we weren't, middlesex does not exist. Mon 13 Oct 2008 18:24:36 GMT+1 eightypercent http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=61#comment156 # 145 ~ Marcus - aka Richard-HeadGoodness you've had a busy day ! I urge bloggers to just click on your name and see all the BBC blogs that you have had a lovely time sounding off on - most of it totally contradictory and nonsensical.Marcus, Richard-Head, you are a one-man student rag day.Marcus - you are voted off this site. Mon 13 Oct 2008 18:24:16 GMT+1 moderate_observer http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=61#comment155 watching a mccain rally on tv, i can never understand folks at these events, do you cheer even when you know your candidate is teling a lie? (both candidates) Mon 13 Oct 2008 18:22:54 GMT+1 Belmons http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=60#comment154 Chicoan, that's an interesting anecdote. I hope there are a lot of people like the person you describe, who don't really believe nonsense. I wasn't simply having a poke at Americans, I was going by the various polls which suggest that vast numbers of Americans don't believe in evolution.DougTexan, I'm not quite sure what point you're making. Surely you're not somehow equating belief in evolution with revolution (which no doubt means - shudder - socialism)?In case you didn't know, the Soviet authorities didn't like the Darwinian natural selection scenario, and a man called Lysenko was given great power and influence because he followed a form of Lamarckism.You and Obama are not Creationists, unless you reject evolution and believe every species was specially created by God. Am I to take it you don't believe in Evolution? If so, please tell me why God went out of his way to plant so much evidence pointing to its truth. And then we can tell Sarah Palin! Mon 13 Oct 2008 18:13:41 GMT+1 moderate_observer http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/justinwebb/2008/10/pilot_in_tailspin.html?page=60#comment153 dougtexan post #119.the 'surge' as we know it is nothing more than political football, it has been oversimplified for political purposes and possible just a temporary solution (bandaid) to a long term problem in iraq.so calling the 'surge' a sucess is a very hollow statement.more on this here:http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/meast/10/07/holmes.surge/index.html?iref=newssearch Mon 13 Oct 2008 18:08:31 GMT+1