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Serenas not happy . . . . again

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posted May 11, 2009

She's nothing but a whinger.

When she finally decides to hang up her racquet it will be a loss to the women's game, but no tears will be shed, as she's a thoroughly unpleasant lady.

Perhaps she should take some lessons on how to conduct herself from big sis.

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posted May 11, 2009

Are they in fact fined for injury withdrawal ??

I can never make head nor tail of the dreadful WTA site - perhaps one of our WTA buffs can help ?

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comment by yowwow (U4481513)

posted May 11, 2009

I can never make head nor tail of the dreadful WTA site - perhaps one of our WTA buffs can help ?
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Whilst they're at it I'd love to see a rankings breakdown page, if such a thing exists in WTA-land. I tried quite hard to find one on their website and failed. doh

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posted May 11, 2009

I can see nil points or missing out on a bonus pool - but I would be very surprised if there were direct fines - mind much of the WTA is beyond my comprehension smiley

I do get fed up with Serena's whingeing though.

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posted May 11, 2009

Whilst they're at it I'd love to see a rankings breakdown page
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My constant criticism yowwow grr

Its a labour of love to do it via player activity yikes

Dreadful, dreadful site !!

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posted May 11, 2009

She is definitely the real number 1...whinger! winkeye

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posted May 11, 2009

Surely it can't be as bad as the official Madrid site?? Sideways scrolling drives me loco!!

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posted May 11, 2009

Dunno Marcus - you would expect the actual WTA site to provide a readily accessable breakdown of ranking points each week - the ATP is so easy to check it all out.

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posted May 11, 2009

The WTA rankings page isn't even working properly today (at least not for me). I was trying to work out why Roberta Vinci had to go through qualifying, but Anne Keothavong didn't, when their rankings are more or less the same. In fact, last week, Vinci was one place higher than Keothavong. Anyone know?

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posted May 11, 2009

Do the WTA have a formula to work out the rankings?

I thought there was some chap in WTA Towers with a blindfold and a pin to determine the latest weeks world #1.

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posted May 11, 2009

Ah, I think I've just found an answer to my own question from the draw PDF on the Madrid site. Anne K. was the last direct acceptance at a ranking of 51, so this must have been based on a few weeks ago, when Roberta Vinci was ranked lower.

Anyway, back to the subject of the thread: is Serena playing in Madrid (she's seeded 2) or is she sulking?! winkeye

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posted May 11, 2009

In 2008, players were allowed 2 medical withdrawals without penalty or fines - this sounds fair but not sure if this is still true in 2009. Also the mandatory events have been lowered by 2 events. I don't understand how the strongest player has a problem with this schedule. Plus the prize money has increased $15 million this year. Venus is on the Players Council and approved the WTA rules - so what's the problem?

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posted May 11, 2009

Jeepers. She'll be complaining about altitude and the colour of the clay next.

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posted May 11, 2009

Well, Serena is playing, but she lost the first set and has now retired. I bet she'll have something to say about that in due course...

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posted May 11, 2009

Clearly she is injured. I do think it's misleading the fans. If a player is clearly injured, they should not play. Why put the players through more pain by forcing them to play when clearly they are unable to. It's all about the money!!!

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posted May 11, 2009

Her "real number" one comments were unnecessary, but correct, imo. She probably has more talent in her thunder thighs than Safina has in her entire body.

DISCLAIMER:I'm not sure which is bigGer

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posted May 11, 2009

Well Serena has withdrawn again with injury, losing after the 1st set - Serena can say she's the best but not #1 in ranking as she hasn't played enough tournaments like the other girls. But I'll bet she plays RG with or without injuries. That will be interesting to see how that one will play out!

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posted May 11, 2009

It is heartening to see that Serena despite being a multimillionaire realizes the value of money.

Good onya Serena!

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posted May 11, 2009

Serena can say she's the best but not #1 in ranking as she hasn't played enough tournaments like the other girls.
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Sure about that tennisbro ??

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posted May 11, 2009

The world number two - second seed in Madrid - said she was currently remodelling a house and said: "I don't know about anyone else but $75,000 is a lot of money to me.

"That's like my whole furniture bill, and some stairs, rugs." - Can she be serious?

Another typical commentfrom the boorish, classless, poor loser - The sooner Serena toddles off into retirement the better doh

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posted May 11, 2009

Another typical comment from the boorish,classless,poor loser-

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And that statement makes you ....a class act,interesting,happy loser...?

You are just filled with envy.

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posted May 11, 2009

I had a look through the rules. Clear as mud they are. However, what I (think) I've been able to figure out is that:

1) Yes, players can be fined for withdrawing through injury, and top 10 players get no exceptions (lower ranked players get 2 exceptions provided they meet certain documentation rules). It reads a little as if you can avoid or reduce fines by turning up at the event for press related activities, but I'm not certain about that.

2) (And this is the crucial one) Although the WTA and everybody else calls these "fines", the truth it appears is not quite the same. Players get *paid* to attend the minimum events to which they have to commit each year, and it seems they get paid *extra* "incentive bonuses" when tournament directors request their attendance at non-commitment events. Top 10 and so-called "marquee" players get paid substantially more than their lower ranked counterparts. These bonuses are tallied up and paid once a year with the fines reducing the amount of the bonus.

If this is at all close to the truth, then to me it seems entirely reasonable. You're being given money just for showing up and playing (and I'm not talking about prize money here). Why should you get to keep that money if you don't uphold your end of the bargain? Whether it's due to a wilful premeditated decision or forced by something beyond your control, such as injury, is not particularly relevant.

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posted May 11, 2009

I think thats a good summary random - much my understanding - not so much a direct fine but losing out on "attendance" payments.

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posted May 11, 2009

Serena is awesome when she's on, but I think that part of the problem was the frequent withdrawals and last minute cancellations that she and Venus would do, especially early in the season in years past. The WTA is trying to help the sponsors that put on the tournaments have a product to sell to the public. Not "See #1 Serena Williams!" and then a day before they get the W/D and a lucky loser. Not that she's the only one, but the stars pulling out of smaller tournaments is the reason behind the rule, I feel.

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posted May 11, 2009

The WTA (rightly or wrongly) has decided they need a system to ensure every event is sufficiently attended by big name players, and something like that has to be organized well in advance. The best players basically get paid $50K to play, and they get fined $75K (from their year end bonus) if they don't. Upon withdrawal of a player, the tournament director will then look for a replacement who wasn't already committed to that tournament and that player will get the appropriate bonus for their ranking. So on average, it mostly balances out. Although it seems harsh at first, you really need the fine to be larger than the bonus for this system to have any chance of working.

Serena looks way out of line here to be honest. She is not *entitled* to this money for doing nothing, and frankly, who the hell is she trying to kid that it's really that big a deal to her? You don't see many other players, who are *far* lower paid overall when all income streams are taken into account, abusing the system by turning up when they're injured and withdrawing after a set.

What really annoys me about this is she seems to be dumping on the WTA without a second thought to how her actions affect the fans.

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posted May 11, 2009

In my opinion this is a battle between Serena and the WTA.

At the moment the WTA has only three worldwide superstars; Serena, Venus and Maria. With Maria out, the WTA has to rely on the sisters to promote the tour. Serena has made a statement here, by pulling out of her match.

I expect Serena to be ready for Roland Garros and, having not won a match on clay this year, expect her to do well. We all know she performs at her best when doubted.

Think Australian Open 07

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posted May 11, 2009

It seems the Williams' sisters should switch names, Serena is never possessed of any serenity. And Venus looks the same, day in, day out. I wish the younger sister would let go of all the drama, get in better shape and concentrate on her tennissmiley

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posted May 11, 2009

'who the hell is she trying to kid that it's really that big deal to her?You don't see many other players,who are *far* lower paid overall when all income streams are taken into account,abusing the system by turning up when injured and withdrawing after a set'.

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Isn't that a bit harsh?How can you be sure that it was her plan to play a set win or lose and withdraw not to lose 50k or pay 25k?OR just projecting what will do in similar situation to her?Its not her problem that the WTA needed to offer bonus to players to play and fine them more when they don't turn up even if injured.I believe she went there to do her best but being injured is finding it frustrating to say the least .After all if it was all about just the money she would have played more tournaments in the past while injury free and on top of her game.

With all these "rules" concerning compulsory tournaments and penalties involved I see the Williams's sisters retiring in not too distant future and I for one will not blame them because as it is its like very few people like seeing them succeed and anything Serena says which is not worse than what some players have said she is labelled very unkind names which is not right.When she was playing fewer tournaments for one reason or the other she was said to be abusing the system and now she is "forced"into playing more tournaments than she is used to albeit injured and pulling out she is conceived as having "sinister" plots behind her withdrawal.

'what really annoys me about this is she seems to be dumping on the WTA without a second thought to how her actions affect the fans'

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You mean fans like you that has not given her the benefit of doubt before condemning her or the ones that said they can't wait to see the back of her or the ones that label her "boorish,classless,poor loser,or the ones that can't stand her and want her to fail and get angry bacause she doesn't which are legion in her case.I don't think so.Serena knows that She is popular because of her tennis and not generally liked except when she plays in US,and Wimby .She is human first and a tennis player second.

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posted May 11, 2009

She comes across as horrendously mercenary. 75K is a lot less to her than most people! Grrr.

If she was genuinely injured then she'd be able to get a sicknote, surely? If that's the case, it seems pretty obvious why she turned up for her set of tennis.

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comment by shivfan (U2435266)

posted May 12, 2009

To fine players for withdrawing thru injury is quite ridiculous....

I'm totally with Serena on this one. She played, because she didn't want to get fined. She felt a pain that was of concern, and felt the need to protect herself for the French Open.

I totally agree with her on that one....

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comment by yowwow (U4481513)

posted May 12, 2009

These bonuses are tallied up and paid once a year with the fines reducing the amount of the bonus.
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So would I be right in thinking that she won't see a penny of this until the end of the year, when what she will she is a massive cheque for more money than most of us are likely to make in a decade? Yet she is complaining that she had she not turned up to play the tournament, she'd have got a slightly smaller massive cheque? That's not ideal credit cruch talk... winkeye

It sounds like she's complaining that if she did nothing she wouldn't get paid the money she would have got if she did something. Poor girl. hug

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comment by xpat73 (U1677334)

posted May 12, 2009

The world number two - second seed in Madrid - said she was currently remodelling a house and said: "I don't know about anyone else but $75,000 is a lot of money to me.

"That's like my whole furniture bill, and some stairs, rugs."
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Serena, you should have stopped at, "I don't know about anyone else but $75,000 is a lot of money to me."

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posted May 12, 2009

Well, i'm not happy with Serena's behaviour (and, to be honest, i knew beforehand that she would either pull out of this match or expend very little energy competing while playing *in* it)....

However, i'm also very unhappy about the WTA and the way it treats its players.... as Martina Navratilova has said, the Tour has become a global business and player and 'player support' has essentially been thrown out of the window a long, long time ago...

From what i have heard, Serena is carrying multiple injuries - knee, thigh (strain) and calf injuries.... all since Miami [semi-final versus Venus]. Serena claims that she
has been 'forced' to play the [three] Tour events since.... and this is entirely down to monetary reasons. Not for her, but for the Tour.

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posted May 12, 2009

I'm just curious.. why is *everyone* here talking about {Serena} and there doesn't seem to be a single thread about the the WTA Madrid event, where most of the top players are playing, here on 606 ?!?! It's a little odd....

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comment by Enrique (U3485961)

posted May 12, 2009

Why is Serena complaining? After all those rules are well designed to penalize players like her, who is only interested to play grand slams and first rate. Otherwise she always finds an excuse to pull out ... or she sorts it out with her poor sister, who has to endure the same family name!erm

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comment by feisty (U12606032)

posted May 12, 2009

drivevolley09

'I'm just curious.. why is *everyone* here talking about {Serena} and there doesn't seem to be a single thread about the the WTA Madrid event, where most of the top players are playing, here on 606 ?!?! It's a little odd...'

Probably because this is a thread that I created for a discussion about Serenas comments before her 1st round match yesterday. If you created a thread following the WTA madrid event, im pretty sure 'everyone' on it would be talking about the tennis.

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posted May 12, 2009

No, no, no....!! I didn't mean anything against you, or this thread, per se.

Nothing wrong with a thread like this - i just wondered why no-one had created a main Tour (event) thread...
normally this happens, especially for the premium (equivalent to the old 'tier I' events).... I never had to create threads like this because they used to appear before the event began.

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posted May 12, 2009

Maybe big Serena should buy her furniture at Ikea. $75k goes along way in place like that!

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comment by feisty (U12606032)

posted May 12, 2009

drivevolley

no offense taken in the slightest. I too am unsure as to why there is no WTA matches of the day thread. I think the probability is that as the mens event is running parallel, that most people are watching that. Its a sad fact that womens tennis isnt as exciting as it used to be, while the mens side of things is in the middle of a very exciting period right now. plus the fact that many of the top names are missing this week from the WTA Madrid line up (Sharapova, S. Williams, Ivanovic etc). I think that as the week progresses we will see a few more threads on the WTA play once the better players start matching up.

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posted May 12, 2009

I can understand the concerns of a venue when a big name drops out, as it can have a major effect on revenue.

As for the fines, well there has to be some element of discouragement to stop people just dropping out if they're feeling a bit under the weather.

Perhaps there needs to a general insurance premium paid by players as part of inclusion in the initial line up of a tournament, then those who have to drop out through genuine injury - have their 'fine' paid for through the insurance.

All said - I have little sympathy for Serena's plea given her earnings.

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posted May 12, 2009

Serena is smart to save her body for the biggies she always has and always will. It pays off usually and being a big draw helps her.
Henin protested the schedules which caused her health and fitness problems and she decided to retire at the top.

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posted May 12, 2009

I just find it so hard to believe that a player would actually be fined for not playing (provided they had a proven injury). Has anyone actually confirmed that this is indeed fact or are we taking the word of Serena, a fantastic player but temperamental when things dont go according to her plans ?

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posted May 12, 2009

Let me get this straight - she crys when she has to play Master tournaments like all the others and snarls at the same players in the slams - she is the strongest WTA player but is injury prone in all tournaments EXCEPT the slams. Is she playing on a level field with her ranked competitors - I don't think so. Is she not strong or healthy enough to compete on all the WTA tour events - what's wrong with this picture? If Djokovic can take the flack and rise to the occassion, then why cant Serena?

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posted May 12, 2009

BTW, the reason why everyone's talking about Serena is because that's what this thread is all about - if you want to talk about other WTA matches then you should start the thread instead of criticising this one!

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posted May 12, 2009

In my personal opinion Serena was bang out of order yesterday, especially with her post-match comments about 'needing' to refurbish her house. As mentioned above, in the current financial climate her rant afterwards was in particularly bad taste.

She has nearly ten years of 'previous' where she's constantly withdrawn from tournaments at the last moment, often without any viable reason for doing so.

Yes, she does appear to be injured at the moment, in which case, don't play, it's that simple.

As far as I am aware, the players only have to play 10 out of 20 of this level of tournament throughout the year, and the actual amount of total tourneys required has been reduced since 2008.

Maybe if she actually did some fitness training (she's been very outspoken about her adversion to this), she wouldn't spend so much time injured.

At this moment the WTA Tour is in trouble, the last thing they need is one of their few remaining star names acting in such a petulant manner.

Given a free reign over her schedule as in the past, Serena would play the slams, a warm-up before each one, and the two or three biggest tournaments outside of this.

That's simply not good enough, in my opinion.

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posted May 12, 2009

I think the WTA really needs to respond to this. They should clarify their rules, because looking around various internet sites, it's clear people are confused about these fines.

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posted May 12, 2009

Player withdrawal fines range from $10k - $80k, depending on how late the notification is and what the degree of injury/illness is. But if they are able to do the Tournament PR, the WTA often allows this to compensate or reduce the fine. That's why you see Maria doing PR at events she's not actually playing - and Maria has been given extremely high fines - over #100K for not showing up for the PR sessions and these are where the really high fines are given - not the injury fines that Serena was whining about.

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posted May 12, 2009

I honestly doubt whether the WTA has the legal right to fine players with verifiable injuries. If Serena feel so strongly about it then she should take them to Court. Otherwise she should either not play and take the fines or play and stop complaining about it.
That would stop people inferring that her injuries are a convenience when she is losing .

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posted May 12, 2009

According to her latest interview, Serena has already determined and planned to be well for RG for both singles and doubles matches - she really is practically psychic to be able to see that far ahead into her medical future. I wonder how she does it?

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