posted Jul 18, 2009

Monty needed an excuse, got one and used it. What's his excuse for the past few seasons?

I back Lyle 100%.

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posted Jul 19, 2009

I back Lyle too.
That he has been by-passed as a Ryder Cup captain is a disgrace. A poor poor poor decision.
The committee should bow their heads in shame.

Montgomerie is widely unpopular with the golfing public. Yes, the BBC team seem to love him and gloss over his petulant behaviour.

Many of us who follow golf however have a different opinion of the man.
I can truly say I have not met one person who has a positive opinion about Montgomerie the man.

The decision to nominate him as Ryder Cup captain is a bad one.

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posted Jul 20, 2009

Sandy has a poor memory when talking about cheating.

At the Kenya Open, Nick Faldo reported Lyle for a rules infraction, which resulted in Lyle's being disqualified. On the 2nd hole of a round in which they were paired, Lyle had placed a piece of tape along the head of his putter because the glare of the sun on the metal was distracting him. In doing so, according to the determination of the tournament committee, he had altered the playing characteristics of the club during a round, in violation of the rules.

Maybe this incident is what is really playing on his mind?

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posted Jul 21, 2009

Shelbyuk -

said Monty had been alrgely silent since the Monday. The quotes you record were all made on Monday (as far as I'm aware but do correct me if I'm wrong)

bobjonesjr - Paramor may have done so if he was in charge but he wasn't in charge. The people on the spot - among whom are not numbered Sandy Lyle or that evans guy who really stirred all this up - made the call, at the time.
And Monty effectively fined himself far more than the Tour would have done. He didn't have to, btw - the event Committee had already come to its judgement and found no reason to proceed.

Unlike the occasion a few years ago, when Sandy Lyle was disqualified for altering a club during a round.

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posted Jul 21, 2009

Irrespective of whether Montgomery fined himself or not he was made aware of the issue, certainly he studied video evidence after the event and chose to forfeit the prize money. He did not forfeit the most important reward - the points that ensured his entry to the Masters.
There was an infringement of the rules, it was there for all to see and his forfeiture made no difference, he should have disqualified himself.
The Pro community is a very close-knit family and incidents like that particular one remain indelible, it is of little wonder that at the first enticed opportunity it would be re-kindled.
However, it is sad that Lyle raised it for the ears of the World, highly embarrassing for him, and even more so to get himself out of it with dignity for both parties.

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posted Jul 21, 2009

Lyle inadvertently broke the rules and was disqualified, rightly.

Monty broke the rules and wasn't disqualified. Did he really forget that his lie had changed from unplayable to fairly easy? Watch the footage and make up your mind.

Faldo behaved badly in the Lyle incident. He said nothing to Lyle at the time and then reported him at the end of the round - pretty typical of the man.

Watson's brilliant performance at Turnberry was one in the eye for the European Tour Committee. Their ageism was already evident nonsense (Lyle made the cut at the last three US Masters and Norman was great last year). Now they know that writing off quality older golfers (with modern equipment) is just garbage.

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posted Jul 21, 2009

Lyle and Faldo were kids at the time, I recall it was c1979 when the incident arose. Both of them, in Kenya as I recall, were under the tutelage of experienced (very) pros who were also trying to establish themselves in the hierarchy.
I am sure Faldo cringes every time he thinks about it now.
Monty has no excuses, he was already a many-times past winner of the EPGA merit award and well aware of his position in the incident.
Despite his brashness I am certain he would make a different decision today given the same circumstances, but then again, he has matured even more.
I am still annoyed with Sandy though, he should have been more aware of what he was saying, it was whimpish and pathetic and has been the catalyst for the furore.

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posted Jul 24, 2009

"He said nothing to Lyle at the time and then reported him at the end of the round"

True, but it's a difficult one. If he had said nothing at all, he would have been conniving at what Lyle did and liable to the same penalty (see the Rule: players cannot agree to waive any Rule). If he had said something, then he could have been said to be giving advice - and if Lyle had then removed the plaster he would not have been 'rectifying' the matter, he would have been liable for DQ twice over.

The moment Lyle did it - and it's really, really hard to argue that it was inadvertent, imho - he was liable for DQ. If Faldo saw him preparing to do it and said or did nothing to try and prevent it, then it could be suggested that he was a bit of a tartar. If he didn't see him preparing to do it but noticed later, then the only - the ONLY - course of action open to him under the Rules was to report Lyle to the officials.

We don't know - and will never know - if Faldo saw Lyle preparing to do it. What we do know is that the Rule about altering a club has been around for decades and is something you teach kids in their first few months in the game.

Fact is, Sandy did something against the Rules that gave him an advantage. So he should be somewhat circumspect before accusing another player of 'behaviour that could be described as cheating' - especially as he was not there at the time, did not witness the incident and was not even (as far as I am aware) playing on the European Tour. He has reappeared recently, as his name was mentioned as a possible RC captain. Coincidence?

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posted Jul 24, 2009

Hold on a second. Let's compare apples with apples.

Monty won a tornament thanks to his 'mistake'. Lyle lost a tornament due to his.

Lyle placed a piece of tape over his club to prevent glare from the sun. Monty, on the other hand, dropped a ball from a lie where one foot would have had to have been placed in the bunker to play his shot, to a location where he had a perfect lie. There is no comparison between the two 'mistakes'.

I always liked Monty up to now. Both have now confirmed to me however that, great players they might have been, but neither is captain material. The committee should review it's decision.

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posted Jul 24, 2009

IRN, it doesn't take a great deal to see that Monty is by far the more perceptive and sharper character of the two but, if it comes down to that word,'integrity', then my vote is for Sandy. You have only to read Monty's autobiography to see what a petulant chap he has been and if I may say so, childish.
I agree with you about the drop incident, it was so blatantly clear that Monty should not have had any hesitation but to DQ himself, never mind being so by the officials.
I recall the Faldo/lyle event very well, I had just started playing golf and it was a talking point at the evening golf school I attended. There was fierce rivalry between the two of them at the time and, in hindsight Faldo should have asked Lyle to accompany him to the officials. Immaturity took precedence. Faldo must be very embarrassed by it now.
I put that down to pure innocence by Lyle but it does illustrate that he has never been the most alert guy on the tour.
Monty will now go forward with brashness into battle, but inwardly embarrassed, Sandy will never be Captain. Too many people on Monty's side I believe.

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