posted Nov 25, 2008

i wouldn'y pay too muck attention to Guscott. After all, If i remember correctly, he quit during a championship. As with most clowns, always has loads to say . Should just keep his trap shut

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posted Nov 25, 2008

I believe Guscott is on the right track. The changes made by Johnson are right however we will find out on Saturday whether these players will stand up and face the challenge ahead of them.
First of all, good decision to drop, the off beat, Cipriani. Any England player not performing should be dropped and the fact is Cipriani isn’t performing however he’s a professional athlete who will work on his performance and eventually get better.
I still can’t understand why this queue jumping is evident the England team! Matt Stevens, the poor sod, has sat of the bench every game, and due to Sheridans injury, Tim Payne goes ahead and takes a starting line up, one word – bizarre. Payne didn’t perform in the scrum against South Africa and the pack needs Stevens rough mentality to beef up the front.
Tom Rees is the most questionable drop; he is the only consistent performing player in the side – an out and out dog that loves everything a flanker should love! I disagree with the article, as who else is taking the lead and running the ball into contact?? It’s about time players like Borthwick & co, lead from the front as Johnson did in his rein as captain.
The English pack need to be ruthless once more and take on other packs in world rugby! Players like Simon Shaw with his experience and toughness to battle and fight in the contact area, can gear up the forwards and be a never ending presence on the field.
If there is a problem with the coaching staff then Johnson will sort it, I have every faith that Martin can look after his own. This England team will be guided to best one of the best again but reality is that at the moment, their not world beaters and not a world class team, there are a developing team that needs time to grow.

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posted Nov 25, 2008

Personally I feel that Guscott is a little off the mark in saying that we have no world class players. This may be true if viewed solely on the basis of the last outing, but need I remind him that this current batch of players is young, inexperienced and ultimately trying to find their feet in International rugby. The back row pairing of croft, rees, and Haskell(at 8) will in my opinion become the best in the world, but with all of them under 25 they've got time to develop and reach their peak in 3 years time. Same goes for the back 3 and for our incredibly talented half backs, who have shown glimpses of the great things they can do. As these players get older and used to the physicality of the international set up the sky really is the limit.

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posted Nov 25, 2008

I would say that he is spot on the anlysis. We do not have any world class players in our current side, we do have a lot of average to below average. There is no southern side who want any of our players in their side, with perhaps the exception of Sheridan. The english have never be big on fizzing sparkelling creative spontaneity and when we cannot even do the basics slightly well then we fall away badly in the face of top competiuon. Southern sides are far more dynamic and intelligent, aggressive and creative then we are or ever will be. You have to ask the question why is this?. Grass roots, clubs, national coaches?. This problem is not actually confined to Rugby Union either it pervades thoughout most of our favourite team sports. I would be interested to know whether there is slow down in the amount of candidates coming into Rugby Union nowdays, more or less than years ago. Is there a steady decline/increase, who is that gets them first and shapes them and their thinking. Do we need a national academy like the football team were once having before the F.A. thought that wasn't a priority anymore at Lilleshall. England lumber and if they win, its against inferior not so well funded opposition or they get lucky. Who was actually in charge of and running the team that gave itself the last throw of the old dice in the last world cup. Its always blood and guts but never big on skill or confidence in hand

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posted Nov 26, 2008

"I don't think that England can use this as a practice series. If they want to prove that they were good rather than lucky in the World Cup then they need to back it up with some performances.."

Okay, when do we blood new players? In some mickey mouse friendly against an amateur team?

At very least, all players that feature in this series will begin to undertsand what they are up against at the top level and hopefully make the step up.

Lets be straight, folks like Dave "the fool" Campesi and the celtic/ antipodian anti English lobby, will always say england were lucky to win WC 2003. So who cares what they say.

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posted Nov 26, 2008

It’s disappointing to hear Guscott damning the quality of English players at the moment. It’s also galling to hear Sir Clive mouthing off about poor player development – even if he is correct - this from a guy who won a world cup by relying substantially on golden oldies at the expense of new talent.

Sure there were some youngsters in the 2003 squad but the pressure of the world cup build-up seemed to blow them away and their form never came back, Steve Thompson, Ben Cohen, Josh Lewsey, Ian Balshaw etc. If these guys had managed to maintain their form they would still be in the team guiding and encouraging the newer younger generation. Their dip in form after the World Cup reflects a lack of player management and motivation. The players I suspect where physically and mentally exhausted after the massive commitment and lifestyle compromises they had to make to be the best in the world.

Woodward is right though about the development of players and the real problem here is the RFU. It’s more about money and ego than rugby and sound management. Sure money can help to build a good team but when you look at the Pacific Islander and other improving nations you realise its not just about money but more about world class experience, passion, commitment AND improving coaching. Sir Clive was good but one dimensional in his approach to the game on the pitch and single minded in his target of the 2003 World Cup and not beyond. After 2003 England needed a coach to build on firm foundations but sadly the foundations were mostly reaching their sell by date or had been spoiled.

England fans and Guscott must try to be realistic now. This generation of players has not had the benefit of learning alongside a core of experienced internationals. How can we expect them to be World Class when they have so limited World Class experience and on the face of it World Class coaching.

Get used to it, it will be several years before English rugby can expect to win at the highest levels. The first target has to be improved coaching and fitness, more experience and just to become more combative.

I am hopeful that Johnson, with some changes in coaching staff, is the man to achieve this.

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posted Nov 26, 2008

England has the largest player base of ANY country. We are about 8th best in the world.
Something seriously wrong.

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posted Nov 26, 2008

Ah the truth hurts !

England just do not have the players they once had and of what i have seen you will really struggle in the 6 nations, for once i am looking forward to us playing the " chosen ones " we could and should have beaten South Africa however no doubt you will say they raised their game to play England ! i dont think so, be afraid England you have been caught and passed by the other 6 nation teams and the only thing you will be playing for is the wooden spoon with Italy ! i just hope Dallaglio is there to see it

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posted Nov 26, 2008

"Great teams have half a dozen world-class players and we don't even have one" Jerry Guscott

Normansbite is on to something. With a player base as big as the rest of the world, the law of averages surely states that we should be in the top 3 at all times.

So something is going drastically wrong with the way England manage their international rugger.

And I think player development is the key. It could be that the class of 2008 just doesn't have the stars of 2003. But can the 08ers be developed into contenders for the world title??? Or are they potential-less???

Since 2003 and Johnno's retirement from playing, he has made the point many a time that there is nothing like enough emphasis on player development. Up here players are used like cannon fodder to keep the turn styles ticking over at the clubs.

The class of 2003 developed themselves over a period of years by exposing themselves to more high quality rugby. Given the power of the clubs in England that's about as much as Johnno can hope to do with the class of 2008.

With this in mind I have so far been impressed that Johnno has not yet panicked. There have been no knee jerk selections. Johhno states boldly that stability is key, and I agree, it's the only hope we have of allowing our players to develop into anything like world class.

That said, I think Jerry could qualify his statement above. Perhaps rather than simply writing the class of 2008 off, can I ask Jerry what he thinks of the potential of the 2008 class??? And how can these boys best be developed within the current English game??? Or is the English club scene incompatible with successfull test rugger? Unless you have a Wilkinsonesque edge?

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posted Nov 27, 2008

Why appoint Johnno in the first place he has no coaching experiance - but we have so we have to live with it.

For me the most important think is to gel the team and get them enthusiastic about winning. They didnt seem to care that much about the kicking they got at the hands of the Springboks at the weekend or at least not care enough to stop it happening. The Boks were not that good , we were rubbish and that was the problem.
Im a Bristol fan so know exactly what a unmotivated team that play with little or no confidence or organisation looks like, and last week that was England.

These players are good enough week in week out to play at the top for their clubs they just didnt re create it for England.

As for the comment by my Scottish friend above about the truth hurting, i would remond you of just a couple of things.

1. We played bad and lost against SA, You were really good but still lost.
2. They were good against us but got slated in the african papers for their poor performance against you....yet they still won.
3. We are unlikely to get the wooden spoon in the six nations as we wont lose against italy like you did last year.

If we come below you in the six nations ill walk to scotland and appologise to you face to face.
However if you lose......well you are used to losing so it will just be business of usual of clapping all the other countries for beating the English as you lot never beat us at anything, excetpt curling....well done for that

lol

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