posted Jul 24, 2008

it was a brilliant race eh. very entertaining, had something for everyone. even had something for the hamilton haters to get excited about ... that safety car! we did see something v unusual as a result of this tho. someone on another forum described it perfectly and with humour 'LH won the german twice'

while the safety car made the race more exciting i do agree with you about its effect on the race. surely there has to be a way of not penalising a driver who has built up a huge lead and still maintain safety. first across the line is the only way to go. tho perhaps something like awarding a bonus point or 2 to a driver who was in LH's position, if they lose their deserved huge lead and first place as a consequence. that way the result stays the same and the one who would have won gets the points they would have got. ofc there will be times when it will be a judgement call ... further controversy. possibly a bad idea not thought through properly but isn't that the case with the safety car already?

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posted Jul 24, 2008

Some good points shaft120

i'll address them one by one
(this what I would have done previously to icecool If I was not flamed be him/her to start with)..

"I can apreciate some of your points of view, for example I thought there wasn't enough "deffending" done by Massa in trying to keep track position. However, to try and turn this into a I've watched F1 longer argument is petty."

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We agree will massa and yes I'm guity of stooping to a much lower level that I would do normally due to being deliberatly flamed previously. I like balanced debate (without the football rants/intimidation) from people that have the same and different opinions.
More on that later...
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"If you have been watching F1 for the last 30 years, you'll know full well nothing has changed in terms of team orders or politics. It may not have been so obvious, but wether you realised it or not, was going on in every race. What makes F1 so intersting is that the teams objectives are often not in line with that of their drivers."

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I agree with the politics but thanks to the sums of money involved it seem that the teams are encouraging their drivers to yield more quickly than what we were used to - Imo due to the the way the cars shed more carbon fibre bit these days which brings out the dreaded safety car.
I also think that they are being too cautious in this respect due to previous incidents where drivers simply have not seen the other and have colided. If it is the case where there is a design fault with F1 cars, that means that they are sacrificing driver visibility for aerodynamics i.e wing mirrors being too small etc, then they should be addressing this and not handing out overly cautious orders prior to the race.

On the subject of safety cars - they are a neccessary evil for safety issues but they are deployed for far too long due to the way these cars explode into a million pieces of sharp carbon which means that the cleanup takes longer. This again is down to the way the cars are designed. If they can all be engineered not to do this and not compromise driver/crowd safety at the same time, then we would see less of the safety car, which does rob a driver of any lead they have worked hard for. Then everyone is happy?.

How many times has the safety car been deployed due to the car being in a safe/acceptable position but the track is littered with scrapnel ??
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"I for one absolutely loved the last race - my only dissapointment was the safety car, which replaced elements of driver skill with chance."

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The last race was marred for me due to Massa (which we agree on) and McLaren team orders which I thought was unessessary. The race at Germany was excellent apart from my team messing up.
As I posted previously, I had no doubts that LH would have got past Kovi and won - such was his great pace/driving.
Contrary to what Icecool believes, I have enjoyed this season especially more so after last years events (spygate) and the fact that again (2 seasons running) it is so close. I just dont want it degenerating back to the days of ferrari's team orders situation.
Hopefully it never will. My first thoughts when I saw LH overtake Kovi so easily was "oh no - not that nonscence again"
For obvious reasons if it was another car other than the front runners who match McLaren on pace, i wouldn't have bothered by it.
To me I thought that situation demeaned LH's efforts - the same as a safety cars do - imo.
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"Also, I don't buy your argument about supporting a team over a driver. I've always followed the sport for the drivers skill over the engineering aspect. The football analogy doesn't fit here. I have teams I admire, but it is great drivers that I'll follow through their careers and will them to beat other drivers, be it because I don't rate them as highly or because of their personality."

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To be honest with you Shaft120 my team preference is more of a Legacy/loyaly thing as I love racing in general and I once did follow a driver and as a youngster and it broke my heart when he died - such was my admiration for Villeneuve.
It probably is part psychology the fact that I stuck with the team that my hero died with. I freely admit and accept that!
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"Charisma and audacity, for example, cannot be measured."

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Beautifully put. P.s Apologies for the length of my post and for your refreshing one.

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posted Jul 24, 2008

lololol, i obviously got right under your thin skin given that you can't resist numerous pops at me, most of which put blatently false words into my mouth. such is the way with people who have no argument.

commet by maseratty : "i'm waiting!"

by the way, did you hear the one about how to keep an idiot waiting?

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posted Jul 24, 2008

Icecool - They are not pops at you - they are references to our previous posts.

I offered you a freewill choice after all the ranting and raving that we BOTH did previously and the Peacedove was intended as the starting point for that and also an offer.
If that was unclear I'll apologise on that count only!

Reasoned debate or flaming - you choose.

But after this I will not entertain the flaming. Make your choice - hence i'm waiting.

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posted Jul 25, 2008

>"by the way, did you hear the one about how to keep an idiot waiting?"



You have the Ferrari Fanatics on tenderhooks...

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posted Jul 25, 2008

Ha ha haaaa!

Oh well with that in mind and
Seeing the way that you post it is clear that you dont have the mental faculties to give reasonable debate with out flaming and P**s taking. There always will be idiots like you who use the internet to bolster their pathetic ego's and insecurities because they cannot do so in everyday life. And that is because there is repocussions to be met when it it face to face.

Truly sad!

Keep it up anyhow. freedom of speech and all that. Reap what you sow!

BTW - did you hear the one about the pathetic little LH fanboy that who got ignored - period! ..............

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posted Jul 25, 2008

>"Truly sad!"

No he isn't, despite being in a backmarker team this year. Wrong as usual.

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posted Jul 27, 2008

Rumour on the paddock is that McClaren has a kind of traction control device operated by a mini-lever on the back of the steering wheel, hence why LH was able to lap 1 sec faster than anyone else

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posted Jul 27, 2008

>"McClaren has a kind of traction control device operated by a mini-lever on the back of the steering wheel,"

Yawn! There has been lots of discussion of this on these boards. It's not traction control, traction control is against the rules. It didn't help Heiki go 1 sec a lap faster than anyone else did it?

And there isn't a team called "McClaren", it is "McLaren".

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posted Jul 27, 2008

I love the anti LH nutters on here. Most enteraining...

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