posted Mar 21, 2008

what about jake white and johnson, ashton can play with ballshat all he likes then

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posted Mar 21, 2008

Johnson was great with the media... dont know what your talking about paddy. Nothing can be worse than Ashton with the media.

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posted Mar 21, 2008

As long as we get someone who can really handle the media, after all that is what really matters in rugby...!

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posted Mar 21, 2008

I think this is a good idea because it will take the pressure of Ashton and allow for perhaps a more motivating team talk then we have perhaps had recently.
In addition i feel that it will allow Johnno to get to grips with the international coaching side of things which i am sure he would love to get involved in. And finnally he would defintely have the support of the public after being such a popular and succesful England captain!!! Hope it gets organised!!

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posted Mar 21, 2008

A thug and not even a subtle one - just look at his disciplinary history.........

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posted Mar 21, 2008

i think this would be good, and apparently they want to add a Backs coah too, this would be good, so that the coaching set up would be much more in depth, it might even be worth approaching annother former player to take annother team role like thes to help add experience and inspiration but not as a coah, aka someone like Will Greenwood, probs wont happen but its an idea!

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posted Mar 22, 2008

A thug and not even a subtle one - just look at his disciplinary history.........

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earlier in his career this may hav bn true, but as he got older this aspect of his game died away - you only have to see how devestated he was when he gave away penalties in world cup 03 to see that

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posted Mar 22, 2008

I read this board regularly,as an Englishman I am aware of several things.English rugby has the most money,and a bigger player base than any one else in the world.But Rugby union is no longer a sport but a business.Since about 1900 England could claim the best team in world twice 1935[wavell wake field] and 2002-4[clive wood ward].The world cup is not the be all and end all of things.Like it or not the hardest competition in the world to win is the TRI _NATIONS .The 3 Best sides in the world[by there records against all comers].The World cup can be won by the side who enjoys the easy side of the draw[England,South Africa].It took clive woodward 6-8 years to build a great team.Surely a new coach needs same chance whoever he may be there are no quick fixes.no amount of baying for the blood of certain players or coaches if they do not win every tournament.or match.Johnson may have been a good or great player /captain,but is an unknown as manager/head coach.The best side in the world[by the record since 1905]THE ALL BLACKS have automatically sacked there coach after world cup failure.this year they have re appointed the best coach in the world[by results in last 4 years.GRAHAM HENRY.Ashton deserves the same loyalty with the help of Martin johnson if re quired.All the top nations are in rebuilding stage now.The long term aim is World cup 2011 where New Zealand will finally win it .[when was the last time they lost at home?].In july England will enjoy country before club [to the clubs chagrin].then we will at last see if club players can step up or not consistently i hope they do , but I am old enough to have heard it all before.

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posted Mar 22, 2008

Mayo4wasps
YER

v soz in joke

YER!!!!!!!!!!!!

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posted Mar 25, 2008

roddersrugbyref
'It has become open knowledge through senior players, the coaching "team" themselves,the RFU, and the press.'

It has become open knowledge? No it hasn't - it's become an article of accepted faith. I used that phase deliberately - faith is about belief in something, no matter how irrational, despite their being no verifyable of empirical evidence for it. A small, almost miniscule, amount of circumstantial evidence has crept out - largely substantiated and expanded by nothing more than internet gossip and speculation to the effect that the various members of the coaching team are pulling in separate directions. And become cannon in inventive minds such as yours. I'd trust my own experience of Wells over any amount if message-board tittle tattle and blind faith.

Your argument that Ford, by briefing against Farrell, was relevant to pulling in a separate direction from Ashton is a) irrelevant to Wells' position and b) in no way evidence for what you say - when asked a question about a specific player he, perhaps inadvisedly gave a view which may differ from the head coach's but indicates nothing more than a concern in that individual's mind at where that player was at that stage in his carreer. It did not necessarily indicate that he disagreed on Af's inclusion - on a best available basis - only that it was unfortunate that AF peobably wasn't quite good enough. Oddly enough it appears that Ashton, shortly after, came to the same conclusion and dropped him!

'As for loyalty, Ashton is the Head Coach, if the two below him can't or won't follow his requirements, then they should leave. Staying is only destabilising and non productive.'

I don't know this Ashton that you describe; one who states his requirementsand expects them to be followed! This is not the empowereing Ashton that we are always told of! I would think it a damn sight more likely that Ashton takes a similar view where his coaching team are concerned as he does with his players - 'here are the tools (in this case the players) you decide how to get the best out of them'. A scenario in which, if the selection is wrong, you cannot blame the coaches.

'If a team manager comes in hopefully he will grasp the nettle, and keep only those prepared to do the job his way.'

True - and in fact this is the only way forward that I can see - but that's the problem Ashton is a coach (and one of debateable quality at that) and not a manager. That's why he doesn't seem to manage his coaches which is why there appears to be this drift. I say appears because I actually suspect that Wells and Ford are doing their utmost to try to adapt their roles and tactics to Ashton's confused, laissez faire approach.

But again you go on about 'their resistance to Ashton since during the RWC.' I'd argue that you have presented no evidence of this but have simply filled in the gaps to mould the situation to fit your argument.

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