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Manchester United 6 - 0 Newcastle United

12 January 2008
Old Trafford
Premier League
Player of the match:
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Man Utds scintilating attacking display was shown through and through today with a display to scare any football team.

A deserved hat-trick for Ronaldo and other goals from Ferdinand and TevezX2

The first half was a very frustrating one which brought no goals.

All of the goals came in the second half and When one went in they all started to come.

Absolutley amazing game.

It can only get better for Newcastle.

I do not see them losing like this ever again for a long time, the game against Man Utd was very unlucky for them as they were in such a vulnerable position.

Man Utd: Van der Sar, O'Shea, Ferdinand, Vidic, Evra (Simpson 67), Ronaldo, Carrick, Anderson (Fletcher 72), Giggs (Nani 72), Rooney, Tevez.
Subs Not Used: Kuszczak, Park.

Booked: Rooney.

Goals: Ronaldo 49, Tevez 55, Ronaldo 70, Ferdinand 85, Ronaldo 88, Tevez 90.

Newcastle: Given, Carr, Taylor, Cacapa, Jose Enrique, Milner (Viduka 64), Smith, Butt, N'Zogbia, Duff, Owen (Rozehnal 82).
Subs Not Used: Harper, Emre, LuaLua.

Sent Off: Smith (90).

Booked: Duff.

Credit where it is due, many of you 606'ers are quick to praise Ronaldo and rightfully so, but I would like to praise Shay Given, he is not a goalie that deserves to have to get the ball out of his own net 6 times. Well played Given. He made one person on the Man Utd team unhappy, Wayne Rooney. Could not get a goal due to Given.

A Good Point:

I think Man U have a FAR better Goal Difference advantage which could be CRUCIAL. Coolnafs

Thanks all, now discuss the amazing events of today.

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posted Jan 14, 2008

Chelsea are very ordinary, even though they will blame injuries. (yes the same Chelsea that boasted at the start of last season that they had two world class players for each position).


Yet some of the back up players for each position have also been injured. ...

...Now what i'm implying is that Chelsea missed not only key players but also back up players for long periods this season and last season which forced players out of position and weakened the team.

Although Utd have had some players injured they always have their back up players available." If Ronaldo ever got injured there is still Giggs or Nani. If Rooney gets injured there is still Tevez. Yet Chelsea had to call on 3rd choice options for most of this and last season. Hilario 3rd choice keeper had to step in throughout the Christmas period and also for large amounts of last season. With both Terry and Carvalho injured last season Chelsea saw Ferriera and Essien playing out of position because Belarouz also was injured. Without J.Cole and Robben last season Chelsea struggled in wide areas whilst SWP and Kalou was coming to grips with their game. Ballack missed most of this season as well as Lampard so some of the passing creativity has been missing. Without Drogba Chelsea's best option was Kalou this season which spoke volumes of Pizzaro and Shevchenko. Crespo was indeed awesome cover for Drogba but he wanted to go back to Italy. Makelele too has been missing for so many games so although realistically Chelsea have very good squad if you take out so many key players which unbalances the team you are less likely to play expansive football. Chelsea has had to grind out results through sheer effort and togetherness which has been commendable due to so many problems.


Surely you address all your original points here? Although a couple of seasons ago i believe you did have two world class players for each position, Mourinho decided to go and sell a load of them and replace them with dross.

As you say, "With both Terry and Carvalho injured last season Chelsea saw Ferriera and Essien playing out of position because Belarouz also was injured. " That's because you only had 1 backup centre half (who was woeful), to cover two positions. even if he wasn't injured, you would still have had to play players out of position.

"Without J.Cole and Robben last season Chelsea struggled in wide areas whilst SWP and Kalou was coming to grips with their game."

EXACTLY! Your replacement players just weren't up to it, whereas, as you point out, we have Ronaldo, Giggs, Nani (and Park), any combination of which i would be happy to see starting, with others who can come in and do a job if needed.

"Ballack missed most of this season as well as Lampard so some of the passing creativity has been missing."
And yet " If Scholes is injured like he is there is still a choice of CArrick, Hargreaves, Anderson." (and don't forget Fletch). So we could cope with losing two central midfielders.

"Without Drogba Chelsea's best option was Kalou this season which spoke volumes of Pizzaro and Shevchenko" Again, if your backups are no good, surely this supports the point made by the original poster that your squad isn't as good as was made out?

The only really valid injury crisis you mention is losing your top two keepers, i think any team would struggle with that.

I think united need to strengthen in cover on the back line - if we lose 3 or 4 of the first choice, we could be struggling, but we would still cope, and the rest of the squad provides two good options for each position, which just isn't the case with Chelsea any more.
I guess i just don't really understand the point you're trying to make?

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posted Jan 14, 2008

I think united need to strengthen in cover on the back line - if we lose 3 or 4 of the first choice, we could be struggling, but we would still cope, and the rest of the squad provides two good options for each position, which just isn't the case with Chelsea any more.
I guess i just don't really understand the point you're trying to make?


The poster was saying Chelsea fans claimed they had world class players for each position which on paper should be but not it seems. Also when he said back up that refers to 2nd call up yet Chelsea for the last 2 seasons has had to call on 3rd call ups and playing players out of position.

Now you agree that Chelsea had poor cover in central defence last season and that's so true. Belahrouz was pants anyway yet also was injured which saw Essien and Ferriera playing central defence. Not only is that inexperienced and weakened but also weakened other areas of the pitch like midfield without essien. So under the dire circumstances Chelsea has actually done very well considering all of this.

To be brutally honest with you Chelsea and Utd's first team if all fit are very equal. Chelsea possibly have a better defence with Cech in goal and stronger midfield in terms of defensive cover but Utd have more flair players in wide areas. In attack Chelsea have Drogba and now Anelka which is some prospect.

Looking at the squad though Chelsea are looking stronger this season. The sudden found form of both Ballack and SWP is also key. Chelsea certainly look better at the back this season in terms of cover. Malouda, Belletti and Alex have added some quality whilst Ten Haim is perhaps just another Belarouz. Pizzaro and Sidwell aren't good enough imo. When Lampard, Terry, Drogba and Essien return Chelsea will be strong again and perhaps be able to play some expansive football.

I would like to see this team although struggling between Alex and Carvalho in central defence which is a good problem. I feel Carvalho edges it with consistency.







Malouda and Alex on the bench.

This team whoever is in would challenge any trophy. The important factor is keeping your key players fit and available where Chelsea have struggled.

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posted Jan 14, 2008

Chelsea Logic...

I think we generally agree on most points!

I think the original poster was talking about a few season's back when Mourinho(?) said he wanted two world class players in every position. and i think that for a season you did. And were brilliant. And also, ironically, lucky with injuries!

My main point is really that mourinho is at fault for destroying your squad, and i feel that when he arrrived, and especially after the first premiership win, you truly had an awesome squad, with quality cover all over the park (i remember the discussions on here then tended to be how it was grossly unfair that chelsea could go and buy world class players to sit on the bench) However, it was always going to be nigh on impossible keeping everyone happy, and you lost too much quality, and didn't replace it with equally gifted players. And i really think mourinho had a poor record in his transfer dealings as a result of getting rid of the players who weren't happy to be squad players.
Boulharouz being the best example, but others mentioned above also illustrating the point.

It's a good point about dropping essien back weakening your midfield, as i think he's a cracking player, but the fact remains that he was back there because you only had one centre back in reserve, and he was woeful (i think i'm correct in saying that even when he was fit he was picked behind essien to play there!)

With regards to the relative strengths of the teams, i'm in two minds whether to agree with you! I see your point regarding Cech, but i don't feel he's been as solid this term as previously. I think Carvalho is your most important defender (like ferdinand is ours), and i think his partnership with terry is as good as vidic/ferdinand's. Full backs are probably on a par. However, the fact that United have let in less goals this season would tend to support the argument that united are better defensively, esp with hargreaves being crocked almost as much as saha! However, there's little if anything in it. I think you're right with regards to attacking potency (i would, wouldn't i?!) but equally, i don't think anyone in their right mind wouldn't want Drogba in their team, and the combination of him and anelka could be phenomenal. I also think grant will be better able to exploit this than mourinho, as he will play two up top.

Ballack and Alex have been great for you so far, i'm not convinced by malouda, and i don't know enough about belletti defensively to form an opinion. SWP for me still needs o improve his consistency.

You're absolutely right though, when your injured players get back, you should be playing some good stuff, and i reckon you've got a better chance of seeing it with grant than with mourinho.

I'm looking forward to a tight finish this season, with us, you and arsenal all fighting it out. (unless arsenal get a defensive injury during ACON, in which case they're screwed!)


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posted Jan 14, 2008


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posted Jan 14, 2008

Madam i'm adam

Thanks for a top reply.

I grant Utd's defensive record this season is better than Chelsea's but missing Cech, Terry and Carvalho again for many games hasn't helped. However, without Terry Chelsea have coped better this season and I am surprised how well Alex has settled in and the amount of clean sheets we have mustered in a tough period.

Although I agree with your assessment of Chelsea breaking up a quality winning squad but there are many factors.

Crespo - didn't enjoy life in England and wanted to go back to Italy for family reasons. Can't blame Jose for that.

Duff - Injury prone and spent more time on the sidelines. SWP was purchased so Duff could be off loaded. Since joining Newcastle Duff has only played a handful of games so the decision on him was spot on. SWP however struggled to play well under Jose but recently has shown why Chelsea shed out 20 million on him.

Tiago - Strange decision to let him go at the time. Lots of promise and played well under Jose. If I can remember he was used in some deal to bring Essien to Stamford Bridge which saw Tiago going in the opposite direction at Lyon. It was a peculiar transfer saga that one. We sold Tiago for 7 million after spending 8 million for him the season before yet then splashed 25 million on Essien. Must admit though Essien has been a top signing and a good one by Jose.

Gallas - The most telling of all was the saga surrounding Gallas and A.Cole. Gallas fell out with Jose because he felt he should have been partnering Terry in central defence yet Jose preferred Carvahlo and to be fair was a tough choice. Gallas did play however mostly as full back where in all honesty he did rather well. Gallas had 1 year remaining on his contract and could walk at the end of the season. A.Cole fell out with Arsenal and was valued at 20 million. Both clubs had a discontent player at the club and both clubs wanted each player. Chelsea paid 5 million and offered Gallas for A.Cole. I feel Gallas was a bigger loss for Chelsea becuase of his versatility across the back four which cost Chelsea that season. The problem was he wanted to leave as did A.Cole so the agreement suited both clubs at that time. Could Jose be blamed for choosing Carvalho over Gallas? A player should be content with where they are asked to play and player power is getting out of hand. A.cole has had an indifferent time at Chelsea. He started off shaky but got better last season. This season his form has been erratic and Bridge has fought him for a starting role. Chelsea kinda got 15 million for Gallas seeing he was a free agent in less than a year. Some would say that was good business seeing Henry went to Barcelona for less. Gallas certainly was a loss for Chelsea.

Gudjohsen - Now Eidur was a top player for Chelsea. Not just because he scored important goals but because he linked play well with the midfield. Eidur had a chance to join Barcelona and took it with both hands. 8 million was a snippet of a price for me seeing Bent went to Spurs for 17 million? Gudjohnsen was like Chelsea's version of Solksjaer. A good, reliable performer who rarely let you down. Did Jose really have much say in Eidur's decision?

Robben - Again another player who spent so much time on the sidelines through injury. 24 milion was a good price for Cheslea who saw Malouda come in as replacement for 13 million so money saved here. Robben again has played few games for Madrid so the deal could be perceived as spot on. Robben had an explosive first season at Chelsea but after so many injuries lost the plot for me. Shame but good decision.

Geremi, Veron, Jarosik, Smertin, Kezman, Parker was all sold on but didn't really prove much for Chelsea. Jose was correct in letting these players go.

In came Del Horno (8 million) Belahrouz (7 million) Bad signings.

Ballack and Shevchenko - 30 million for Shevchenko at that time seemed just. Sheva was the most prolific European striker at the time. 8 goals in the champions league the season before proved this. It was a massive gamble that sadly went all wrong! Did Jose really have much say in Sheva's signing? It is no secret that Roman wanted Shevchenko before Jose's appointment anyway. I say Shevchenko was really forced on him. As for Ballack, that is a strange one. He came on a free yet walked into the club as highest earner alongside Sheva. This told me he was more of a board room signing rather than a Jose signing. Big name players seemed priority at this time and perhaps a new dimension was ordered by the club in the transfer market. Chelsea wants to be a big club they must be able to make big signings and attract the very best. Both of these signings were against the Jose methodology of the type of player he normally would go for. Jose liked up and coming potential talent such as Drogba, Essien and Swp. As soon as this happened there was going to be trouble ahead. Jose wanted full control of team matters. Not anymore he did.

Now perhaps the free signings of Pizzaro, Sidwell and Haim this season was a clear indication that Jose was off. He had little money to spend and decided to land average (his words grade 3 eggs) players to the squad. Alex was again not really his signing for the club already owned him and was brought in through the back door. Balletti came for 3 million because the club refused to pay Seville 30 million for Alves and rightfully so. As it happens Belletti has been a bargain.

Another twist in the tale was Frank Arnesen's involvement with signings. he was appointed as chief scout for the club and it is rumoured he had the say in Belahrouz and Kalou's signatures. If this is so then you can see why Jose got the hump. It is also rumoured that Arnesen stabbed Jose in the back by telling the board that Jose was incapable of producing expansive and free flowing football and recommended Ten Cate. Kenyon was allegedly ordered to appoint Grant as football director and close friend of Roman to eventually take over as manager. Jose's days was numbered when he questioned the board about signings and transfer budgets. The same could be said of Benitez now at Liverpool.

So I think Jose was relatively good in the transfer market but of some of the lemons signed I feel perhaps his hand was forced.

Frank Arnesen seems to be a huge interfering disruption behind the scenes and can take some blame for some discontent.

I would like to congratulate Avram on the signing of Anelka. I think this could well be a massive signing for Chelsea. Anelka was crying out for a big club playing champions league football to come and get him because he is hungry to prove himself in what i call his last chance to settle and win things. 15 million is a snippet compared to 17 million for Bent.

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posted Jan 14, 2008

Hey! Manchester United is my favorite team. Great article.

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posted Jan 15, 2008

Chelsea Logic.
Thanks a lot for the well thought out, informed opinion. Many on here would just have slated me for daring to question the special one, and a reply like yours is as welcome as it is rare! It's also much more interesting :o)

The ability of Chelsea to defend in the absence of Terry doesn't surprise me hugely. As the saying goes, Carvalho will get you through times of no terry better than terry will get you through times of no carvalho! All you need is some lunk who'll do what he's told and is willing to put his face on the end of someone's boot for the cause (i realise terry's much more than this, but it's carvalho who organises the defence)
-it's like United against Milan last year, one of the main reasons we were found out was because vidic (himself fresh back from injury) was responsible for organising the defence, and he's just not as good at it as ferdinand

Put in the context of the boardroom wranglings, some of the signings are more understandable. i feel Gallas was the biggest loss for you, but he always was a bit of a whinging get when he didn't get his way, and i can see why it was worthwhile letting him go, but surely a more versatile defender would have been a better swap, esp with Bridge playing so well. Robben and Duff, judgement call, but i would have liked to see one of them stay, just for the extra dimension they give you when they are fit. When Robben went, i felt that Mourinho was giving up any idea of playing the scintillating football we were presented with at the start of his tenure. It'll be interesting to see how Malouda turns out, and how grant handles the summer market - do you know how much involvement Arnesen still has, and whether Grant's used to working under that kind of system?

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posted Jan 15, 2008

so your blaming the fans for newcastle not having a leader eh premplus2much? im guessing your someone who knows nothing about football

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comment by Niqriol (U6756299)

posted Jan 15, 2008

Well, well, where is that buddy who tried to make an unbalanced comparison between Ronaldo and Torres. Ronaldo got his hat-trick finally and still every bit in contention for the golden boot, and Torres isn't in sight! Frankly, I would rather have Ronaldo in the team than Torres. I have a feeling Man U have finally decided to go for it and keep their rightful place at the helm. Their play can be fearsome sometimes.

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comment by U11455251

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