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Amitabha Centre monk Kelsang Chonden was in the city to talk about Geshe’s latest book, "How to Solve Our Human Problems".
Matt Gibson: It's unusual to have a book event without the author!
Kelsang Chonden: Well, Geshe Kelsang is an elderly Tibetan now, 72 or 73, and he doesn't do many public events, just two or three teachings a year. He trusts his followers to present the material in a meaningful and beneficial way.
MG: How long have you been one of his followers? Was it a real change for you?
KC: I was ordained 12 years ago, after three years of practising, and getting to understand Buddhism. I used to be a hippie, smoking plenty, then I went for a tour of northern India for a few months, and that moved some things in my mind. I came back and met one of Geshe’s teachers. I went to the centre where she came from and moved in after a few weeks. About five years ago I was asked to come here to the Amitabha Centre.
MG: How long has the centre, now at Upper Belgrave Road, been running?
KC: Amitabha was started in 1992. Geshe's been here in the West since 1977. It was slow going to begin with, with very small numbers coming to listen, but gradually they became more devoted and more hardworking, books were published, and teachers were trained who would take responsibility for new centres. Solving problems It started to snowball a bit at that time, in the early 90's Now there are more than 800 centres and groups around the world.
MG: How big is the local Buddhist community?
KC: At Amitabha, there are 18 residents. Other people come to study and at weekends we probably get 20-plus people coming in. Then there are about 20 branches around towns in the south west.
MG: The new book is about "How to Solve Our Human Problems." Can you give me an idea of the basic method?
KC: The essence of Buddhist teachings is that everything depends on your mind. If your mind is in a good state, peaceful and pure, then your experiences will be peaceful and pure.
We all know that on some level when we're angry, the worlds a horrible place, full of enemies, with no enjoyment.
But on the other hand, if your mind is light and easy-going then even if something goes wrong, you can sit and look at the flowers or something like that! If you let yourself get angry, then it destroys your happiness and peace.
This book gives advice that allows us to train our minds in a systematic way. Methods for controlling anger, for controlling desire, so that you can be at peace, and enjoy a peaceful mind.
MG: Could you give me an example of how you might reduce anger?
KC: Well, the larger part of the book is about patience. First of all, we need to understand the faults of anger, that it's a bad mind, that it never benefits anyone and is very destructive. If we know we don't want to be angry, we can determine not to allow ourselves to get angry, and that's a good start. Even as a damage limitation exercise, count to ten, for example, or simply take your mind off what you perceive to be the source of your mental disturbance. | "Or we can develop the even more far-reaching aspiration, to obtain liberation for ourselves." | |
MG: There are hundreds of self help books on how to solve our problems. What's different about this book?
KC: Buddha was there 2,500 years ago. And what gives me confidence about Geshe is that he is a very pure, spiritual practitioner who's not interested in anything worldly. He has relied upon his teacher, who relied upon his teacher, who relied upon his teacher... right the way back to Buddha.
MG: Would you say there are more or fewer people following the teachings of Buddha now than there were 2,000 years ago?
KC: Pure Buddhadharma, the teachings of Buddha, is on the decline. There's lots of false teachings which are taking parts of the teachings of Buddha and presenting those as useful advice. To some extent it may be, but the complete path to enlightenment, to complete perfection exists only in the minds of masters like Geshe Kelsang, and his teachings.
The Buddhas understand all of the levels of mind: if you want, badly enough, to leave suffering appearances behind you can purify the mind at very subtle levels and change all your future lives, be in control throughout any experience, through sleep, through death, and have such control over your mind that you never suffer again: that’s Nirvana.
You can even go as far as to remove the obstructions towards omniscience, which are the stains of having had delusions, and your mind opens up completely to knowing all phenomena, past present and future. And then you're a Buddha. MG: Am I right in thinking that one of the fundamental teachings of Buddha was that you shouldn't take his teachings a rote, that you should try and discover them for yourself?
KC: He said: "Don't just believe it because I'm Buddha. Test it, see if it works in your own experience."
Buddhism has a complete understanding of the mind, how it works, and that hasn't changed in 2,500, and never will. Mind will always work in the same way. It's either deluded or undeluded.
Bodies are a different entity to minds; there’s a relationship between the mind and body while the body lasts, and then the mind goes on to the next body.
Generally in the West, we focus on bodies very much. The accepted view is that the mind is a function and product of the body, but that's wrong. So bodies can evolve, apes to humans and whatever, but the mind isn't evolving in the same way.
With a human rebirth, we can make spiritual progress, develop our minds, so that we protect ourselves from falling into lower rebirths, and can at least get another human rebirth and make more progress, and keep going forwards.
Or we can develop the even more far-reaching aspiration, to obtain liberation for ourselves, or the best motivation: to attain enlightenment for the sake of all other living beings. Those kinds of motivations take a long time to develop, because they don't come naturally.
MG: We have to override our fundamentally animal nature?
KC: Yes, because it's only gratifying in the short-term. If I eat a meal, I feel good, but tomorrow I'm hungry again. I haven't solved anything. Whereas if I could get a pure mind, and with that develop a pure body then I can solve all mental and physical pain, which deep down is what we all want. An end to all our suffering, and lasting bliss. |
