Amazon Marketplace offering dangerous goods
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In just ten years, Amazon has become one of the most trusted names in shopping. It has a reputation for being cheap, convenient and, usually, reliable. But the company has branched out, and unless it's careful, it could lose its hard-won reputation. Watchdog reveals the biggest - and perhaps most respected - name in online shopping is selling goods that are counterfeit, dangerous, and even banned in the UK.
Watchdog researchers used the Amazon website to purchase CS gas and pepper spray - both of which are illegal to buy, sell or carry in the UK. But on Amazon, they can be bought for as little as £1.70.
The team also found that some of the items advertised on the site's 'Marketplace' section - which accounts for a third of its sales, according to Amazon - were non-existent, and advertised fraudulently by third-party sellers to obtain cash.
Amazon's Marketplace allows anyone from around the globe to advertise goods for sale alongside Amazon's own stock. Clicking on 'Used and New' takes you to the Marketplace section of the company's website. Goods advertised here are for sale by third parties, but still appear under the Amazon banner. Indeed, Amazon takes a cut from every purchase.
Trading Standards officer Paul Miloseski-Reid was shocked that the CS gas and pepper spray - sent from a seller in Germany - were so easily available on Amazon.
"We're talking about something that's officially classed as an offensive weapon. It's not a grey area, it's black and white. The law says you cannot possess these items in the UK. Certainly for things that are clearly illegal there should be systems in place to stop them even getting on the site."
Amazon even sent Watchdog its usual email saying that the CS gas and pepper spray had been dispatched.
We began our investigation into Amazon Marketplace after hearing from viewers who had been ripped off while shopping there.
Rupert Joel replied to an ad for a 40-inch Sony Bravia flatscreen TV. It was advertised for sale by a third party seller and was priced around half what it would cost from Amazon's own stock.
Rupert says: "I emailed the seller and said, why is this so cheap? He replied straight away and said it was ex-demo, boxed with a 30-day guarantee, and a 12-month guarantee as well. I had no reason to doubt it because it was all on the Amazon website."
Rupert got an email that appeared to be from Amazon instructing him how to pay by MoneyGram.
Rupert contacted the seller to question why he couldn't pay through the site and was told that Amazon's payment system was not working. Rupert agreed to use MoneyGram and paid the money, but it turned out the email was a fake, and he'd been scammed out of £300. When he complained to Amazon, it said it was nothing to do with them - even though the scam was done through its site.
Eloise Burke told Watchdog she bought some hair straighteners from a seller on Amazon Marketplace. Six months later they broke, so she returned them to the manufacturer. She was horrified when they told her that her straighteners were counterfeit. And when she took it up with Amazon, it told her as she was now outside the Marketplace's 90-day return policy, there was nothing they could do.
She says: "They haven't vetted their sellers properly, and they haven't realised that their marketplace is selling fake items to people who trust the Amazon name".
Two years ago, Watchdog revealed that fake goods were being sold on another major shopping site, eBay. But an online security expert told us that Amazon has less protection.
Max Vetter, from the Counterfeiting Intelligence Bureau, says: "The systems that Amazon has in place at the moment to stop counterfeit goods on their site are woefully inadequate. Compared with eBay, Amazon doesn't seem to have any system in place that could quickly remove counterfeit goods from its sites".
A recent survey claimed that Amazon - who last week launched a new music download service - is likely to be used by around 70 per cent of shoppers this Christmas.
In the past, Amazon has compared the Marketplace to a shopping mall - it provides the framework for other people and businesses to sell its goods, but it is not responsible in any way for the individual sellers, or what they sell.
Fake, dangerous, and illegal goods have no place in UK stores, on the high street, or online. Marketplace has the Amazon name on it, which makes it Amazon's responsibility. It's about to have one of its busiest Christmases ever, it's just a shame it seems to have no idea what it's actually selling.
Brian McBride, managing director at Amazon.co.uk, came into the Watchdog studio to speak with about selling counterfeit and dangerous goods on the internet. You can watch Nicky Campbell interview him in the video clip at the top of this page.
Watchdog update Monday 22 December 2008
Earlier in December we exposed a serious problem with Amazon.co.uk. Some of the sellers on its Marketplace were advertising fake and even dangerous goods. We bought CS gas and pepper spray.
It's a problem Amazon has now addressed. Since then we've seen no adverts for any of the products we'd been able to buy.
© MMIX~RS~q~RS~~RS~z~RS~22~RS~)
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I've recently bought some headphones from Amazon marketplace. These turned out to be fake. The trader has disappeared. This is only damaging Amazons good reputation.
Close market place until you have measures in place to weed out these rogue traders, before the Amazon brand permanently damaged.
Barry,
Manchester
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Never had any problems with Amazon marketplace. Always check out feedback given. One item I ordered didn't turn up, Amazon gave me a refund. Another sensationalist story.
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I used to work for Amazon.co.uk and I have to say even as an ex-employee that if you stay clear of marketplace sellers you are guaranteed a first class service.
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If an item is half price and the seller wants you to pay using a non Amazon system then if you have an ounce of common sense the alarm bells should ring.
After all if it is too good to be true then it probably is.
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Hi,
I tried to buy an apple laptop for £500 on amazon market place but at the check out I got an error message, wrong destination address. I got in touch with amazon and the seller via amazon and got emails from amazon and the seller directing me to pay by money gram. The seller asked me to change the name on the money gram a couple of times so I got suspicious and called amazon. They had not sent the emails and were not interested except to say I should have paid by credit card within amazon. They had forwarded my email to the seller and said the seller would contact me directly so they should be responsible for the actions of the seller. I went to the post office and cancelled the moneygram but lost the charges that moneygram make. I was lucky to get te majority of the payment back though. I never got the laptop and have only had automated responses from amazon. I have been in touch with consumer direct via trading standards and they are looking in to it.
Regards Roland Smith
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What a brilliant piece of investigative journalism, congratulations. It's possible to buy counterfeit goods from eBay and Amazon Marketplace. It's a good job Watchdog are there to protect us.
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I am a computer engineer and do domestic computer repairs, a customer recently provided us with his operating system cd and license which he purchased from amazon, they were clearly fake/counterfit. Not only that but becuase of the OEM licensing amazon shouldn't really of sold the software to the customer as this breaks microsofts licensing law.
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As a consumer affairs programme I have to ask why you failed to mention how consumers could easily avoid falling for these types of scams.
Wouldn't that be more of more benefit to viewers than simply asking presenters to make silly and patronising remarks to a company representative.
A missed opportunity to "help" the public I feel.
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I purchased Lost Series 4 from the Amazon.co.uk marketplace for a friend, the item's description was the same the one sold by Amazon themselves but was £2 cheaper. When I recieved the item it was nothing like described by the marketplace seller. It was Lost Series 4 BUT it was recorded off the digital channel ABC HD as seen by the logos during playback! The box it came in was the wrong colour/design and badly made. The region code also states region 1 but the box states region 2. Overall I am very unhappy as I made the purchase safe in the knowledge all was OK on Amazon... I will never use the marketplace again. I have filed a claim but am awaiting a refund.
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I liked this report, but don't people realise that you need to check who your emails are from?
People are really ignorant to online scams and should search out the information.
I think the MD from Amazon was 100% right - if you choose to go off and do your own thing then you're a little silly. Have used the Amazon marketplace as both a buyer and a seller and not had a problem. Think the problem is with people asking the seller a question - not sure why anyone would to be honest - but guess this is the nievity of people who don't use the internet much.
Ah, and Watchdog researchers, I think you will find that CS is CS spray and not CS gas - nearly always incorrectly reported by the BBC.
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I feel you have totally sensationalised this story out of all proportion.this was a poorly researched ,biasedpiece of reporting
The vast majority of Amazon marketplace transactions proceed without a hitch
The vast majority of Amazon marketplace sellers are honest relaible booksellers most of whom strive to offer an excellent servicve.
However as with any internet transactions a prospective buyer should analaise the risks and employ safeguards which are usually a matter of common sense eg check the sellers feedback - ,if its too good to be true it probably is ,
As an Amazon marketplace seller ,who runs a busy internet book selling outlet I can assure you that Amazon do have stringent safeguards in place and have always run a tighter "ship"than ebay
All amazon purchases are backed by an A_Z guarantee However the highlighted cases were purchased not on the Amazon website via an email agreement between seller and buyer - ie Amazon did not process the payment - -
Carsebooks - An amazon marketplace book seller
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I have had no problems with Amazon. I feel that watchdog should allow the guests to answer questions asked so that anyone who has had a problem will receive an answer, do not just fit them in at the end and then cut them off, it is so annoying.
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i have dealt with amazon marketplace and had a number of e-mails through about items i am selling. saying the payment will be added to my account when proof of postage is sent to people. you have just to be careful and not buy anything or sell anything with it going through your account. and i do not think you can blame amazon if you do not go through the correct channels.
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Not all marketplace sellers are bad, thinking about it I purchased the Die Hard box set from a market place seller which was fine and I had no problems with, however as mentioned in my previous post (referred to the moderators), this is not always the case!
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i bought a games console from what i thought was amazon.co.uk,it was ordered from hongkong.the box arrived without the console.not knowing wether it went missing during transit or was never posted,we asked amazon what we should do,they said it wasnt from them but from a third party who advertise on their website and we should take it up with them,we have tried this but to no avail.this as been going on for the last 5/6weeks,amazon/third party/and royal mail all deny responsobility.we now feel we have lost £147.00 for my daughters xmas present and have to pay it out again to avoid her dissapointment on xmas day.i will never use amazon again..
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When people get greedy, they get scammed. Nothing new.
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I brought a car on Ebay last year. Only had it 10 months & it ran out of petrol. They refused to give me a refund. beware.
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I'm an Amazon Marketplace Seller. Every Seller has a feedback rating. Every buyer has the opportunity to rate the service. Most Sellers have a rating of at least 95% positive. Mine is 99%. Do Currys/Dixons/Comet/PC World make public to any prospective new customer the percentage of happy/unhappy customers that they have? I'm fairly sure they don't.
All I see here is Watchdog trying to boost it's reputation at the expense of Amazon, who on the whole are one of the best run retailers in this country.
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i feel so sorry for the lady who was scammd on amazon.i was also scammed in the same way.i am new to amazon and i was selling an ipod touch to make a little money for my family for christmas.i recieved emails which i thought was from amazon.when i emailed amazon to see where my money was.they told me this was a scam and they could do nothing to help me.i am disgusted with what has happened.was only doing this to make money for xmas as i turned ill this year and now classed as disabled.this all happened only last week.
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After watching Watchdog on BBC tonight, I decided to have a check around amazon and came across a sort of protection spray, and a variety of different pocket knives.
All found on Amazon.co.uk and they are bought via the marketplace.
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We retail in 14 different channels as a large E-tailer in the UK, one of these includes Amazon Marketplace and can verify Amazon offers one of the best policed systems way above other online trading sites (which we also trade).
It's sad to see people been ripped off by certain sellers however if you make your payment THROUGH the Amazon system and you do not get your goods delivered search A-Z claims in Amazon and contact Amazon directly. There is a very strict code of conduct all sellers MUST adhere to and if you paid through Amazon you ARE protected.
I have no sympathy for anyone who is paying by "Moneygram", "Western Union" etc, these are scams which have been on eBay and many other sites. As another BBC program suggests "If it's too good to be true it probably is !" so if you follow this path, you will be ripped off.
Ensure your seller has been trading for a considerable time, view their feedback. View the "Trading Since" and stick to sellers (I personally do) which have a feedback of 100 or more, this means they are established and have generally completed over 200+ sales on the platform and always pay through Amazon payments using their secure system. Never deal directly.
Remember, it's not just Amazon - you can be ripped off anywhere if you are silly enough to circumvent payment and go direct - even if it is a good deal.
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Although there is no doubt that Amazon should have more safegaurds in place to protect customers, look at the problems eBay had reported through Watchdog, common sense should have come in to play here. If an offer is to good to be true then it usually is. If you are asked to pay for goods or services other than the retailers preferred method of payment then you just shouldn't do it!
Also e-mails should never be trusted, if you need to check something with an order or service, you should type the address in the address bar in your Internet browser and ask at the website, not through eMail.
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Your report was very one-sided. Marketplace is neither a 'backstreet' nor a 'jungle'. There are hundreds of thousands of decent honest sellers on this site in the UK and elsewhere.
Making up one third of Amazon's sales, Marketplace provides for an alternative avenue of purchase than Amazon direct and the other online selling platforms.
Anyone ordering items via Marketplace have to purchase through the Amazon payment system with their credit/debit
If an item does not arrive or is faulty, etc. the buyer has a full moneyback guarentee from Amazon. To purchase any other way is foolish.
You made it sound like it was dangerous to buy through Amazon Marketplace and your statements were offensive statement. You should redress this issue with a full appology to all decent Marketplace sellers such as us.
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I got really angry watching this report on Watchdog this evening. IT was clear from the report that the people higlighted in the programme, were clearly stupid and not following Amazon's procedures. AMazon tell you as a seller and buyer that they process all payments, therefore if they were stupid enough to send money and receive money via moneygram, then it was completely the individuals fault that they were scammed and nothing to do with Amazon at all.....Amazon and Amazon Marketplace sellers provide a first class service and they want the buying and selling experience for both buyer and seller to be problem free and without hitch, Amazon is a much better service than Ebay- Amazon care both for the seller and buyer whereas Ebay totally take the buyers side even if buyers lie....Well done Amazon for providing great answers when put on the spot......
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Despite all you say I have absolute confidence in Amazon. It is obvious that when you use the Marketplace you need to have your wits about you. This does not in any way detract from a thoroughly reliable service. I suspect you are trying to undermine confidence in an an established e-commerce site.
[Personal details removed by Moderator]
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If I walked into a supermarket on the high-street, and someone said "Don't pay at the till, pay me instead here", would I? No, so why do we allow airtime to a few select individuals who did exactly this, pay someone through a back pocket instead of through the normal "till"?
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I was looking for a Canon EOS 450 on Amazon and had the exact same happen to me with the excuse the site payment system was down I smelt a rat immediately and contacted Amazon who informed me that if I proceeded with the purchase I was not covered by their protection policy I was pestered with emails asking if I had sent the funds via the money transfer I reported this as a scam to Amazon over a month ago so I was shocked to see the same scam for the same product still on the site and covered by watchdog.
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I wish to object to the watchdog report on Amazon as it gives a very false impression of both the site and its Marketplace sellers. I use Amazon regularly both to buy and i have sold things -books-.
Of course you have to be careful but that applies in every purchasing situation anyway.
Yes there are scams and there are guidelines to help you avoid these scams.
Watch dog made it sound as if Amazon market place is full of crooks.This is most definately not the case most market place sellers are honest and law abiding .Often people getting rid of items they no longer need.Also small businesses.
Amazon sellers also get scammed.Sold despatch now emails apparently from Amazon do get sent to sellers and there are details in these emails that are simply not genuine for instance the "buyers" address-this never appears in a genuine sold email, if the "buyer" wants to pay or indeed if a bogus seller wants you to pay by any other means other than Amazon payments these 2 things should scream scam.
All these Warnings are mentioned in Amazons guidelines which are there to help sellers and buyers.Provided you stick to common sense and follow a few guidelines you will be fine.
Amazon is an internet business and it is true it comes with its obvious dangers.But on the whole it is a good place to buy and sell things.
I feel that the watchdog report unfairly implied that all market place sellers are out to scam their buyers.This is not the case.
Buyers also get scammed .You also make it sound as if any tom dick and harry can sell on Amazon.There are codes of conduct and rules governing how a seller behaves.If there are too many complaints ,refunds or problems ,sellers are banned .
You have put Amazon in a very unfair bad light.
Yes there are scams happening as there are on every internet selling site .The high street is not immune to such things either.
Selling or buying on Amazon is the same as anything else .Follow the guidelines and common sense and you will be fine.
Not every seller on Amazon is a crook infact i would say they are a very small minority
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I dont see the problem its only a spray to stop an attacker? in America its gun cultrue gone too far, in Uk its defenslessness gone too far! why does the UK not allow its own people to defend themselves? is my question to Watchdog
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If the moderator is n9ot able to answer me? should wathcdog ask them why not? lol
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I think this article was very one sided and biased against Amazon Marketplace Sellers. I have bought and sold a lot of items on Marketplace and have NEVER had a problem. If you read the Marketplace seller board you will also see that sellers can be scammed too. If people have a mind to scam people they will you cannot expect Amazon to police every transaction that takes place. I think the BBC's report was biased and unfair and I really hope it doesn't have a serious affect on the honest Marketplace sellers!
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I also was a victim of this scam. I wrote to Amazon asking them to take some share of the reponsibility, as they allowed fraudsters to use theie site, although up to a time unknowingly. But even when aware and they took the products off the site, they didn't even notify all those that had shown an interest, had they done, some customers would have been saved a lot of grief. I also feel that Amazon do have a resposibility, duty even to check all prospecrive Market Place sellers out.
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I am a Marketplace Seller and I found your report very misleading. So long as customers buy through the Amazon system then they are fully safeguarded. I have had 10,000 very happy customers over 4 years who ALL had their payments covered by Amazon if there had been a problem.
The comment from an "ex-employee" of Amazon STILL showing on this page is nothing short of libellous and I wonder why you are still allowing it to be seen.
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"What a brilliant piece of investigative journalism, congratulations. It's possible to buy counterfeit goods from eBay and Amazon Marketplace. It's a good job Watchdog are there to protect us."
Says it all really.
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Yet again Watchdog has sensationalised a story for it's own good. Would it not have been better to comment on how to avoid being scammed as well as the very one sided story that was broadcast? ALL scams are avoided if you follow the rules.
Trying to highlight the problems only serves to tar everyone with the same brush.
Any customer that buys something like that SHOULD read Amazons conditions and guidelines first, that way there is no way they would end up being scammed in the first place.
The old addage seems to be very approprriate here.
"If it looks too good to be true than it probably is too good to be true"
Common sense should prevail sometimes.
Also Marketplace sellers are subject to feedback comments from their buyers. Read this first to get an idea about a seller first. Isn't it also funny how Amazon themselves don't allow buyers to leave feedback for their service, although their subsidiary warehouse deals uk is currently sitting at 95%, most Marketplace sellers would get a big slap on the wrist for this level of service.
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Excellent report but it has made me very worried because I didn't know about all this. I use Amazons marketplace a lot but the report didn't tell us how to spot the swindles just that they exist. How do we spot these fake emails arent from Amazon???
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This was a completely pointless piece. Why was Campbell prancing around some docks in a reflective jacket?
His condescending attitude was also entirely inappropriate, given his lack of expertise in this area.
To hold ebay up as the shining light due to their "filters" betrays his ignorance.
The problem lies with customers who refuse to heed advice relating to payments and potential fraud. Never use Moneygram for payments for goods - simple.
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I bought an XP disc from a market place seller, and it was a fake counterfeit, quite obviously, compared to the real thing. (Visually and it would not load).
The seller sent me 2 more fake copies, one with the label peeling off.
I informed Amazon in no uncertain terms that I had been sold conterfeit goods.
All they said was to contact the seller, and resolve with him. (Reply received this morning).
This seems totally at odds with their senior spokesman on last night, regarding counterfeits.
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Not only dangerous and Illegal goods but also illegal software!
Last year I ordered what I thought was a genuine copy of Adobe's Photoshop Elements from a trader on Amazon, at least that was what it was advertised as. On receipt it turned out to be part of a bundled package and was marked clearly- 'NOT FOR RE-SALE' I initially took this up with the trader who was adamant that this was a legal copy despite being marked as not for re-sale. After much to-ing and fro-ing the trader re-funded my money, but not without some veiled threats and demanding his softwareback! By this time it had been passed on to Adobe in the US for investigation by their piracy department. Needless to say the dealer then accused me of stealing from him and that he suspected me of having this intent form the outset.
I then took the matter up through Amazon's on-line compliants procedure, only to be met with complete appathy and disinterest. I attempted to contact Amazon by telephone in an attempt to have the matter bottomed out, I think I would have had more luck trying to get through to MI5. After multiple attempts to make direct contact, I resigned myself to the fact that Amazon did not have appear to have adaquate safeguards in place to prevent issues such as this arising nor did they have satisfactory systems in place to allow resolution of customer complaints. This all flies in the face of comments offered by Amazon's representative on your programme. Whilst I still use Amazon, I only purchase directly from Amazon and do not use ANY of their trader.
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I've used Amazon's main site for 5 years and Amazon Marketplace for nearly 4 years. The only time I had a problem with a Marketplace seller, I contacted Amazon and they sorted it out for me. I have also sold items on there without any problems. I agree with the poster who called this item "sensationalist". Nicky Campbell was more interested in scoring points than listening to what the Amazon representative had to say. Very unprofessional!
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I found the watchdog story to be poorly balanced. There are problems with Amazon but not the ones detailed in your program. Amazon keeps close watch on its market place sellers and at the first complaint they tend to suspend sellers and investigate. Amazon have a very strong customer is always right policy and sellers are always assumed wrong until proven otherwise.
I was surprised that your program did not emphisise that the people scammed were conned by not following Amazon's clear advice. Customers should ALWAYS use the Amazon payment system and sellers should ALWAYS check they orders on the AMAZON database before shipping.
Any seller or customer following these simple rules will never be scammed and Amazon will always ensure the customer is happy.
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We almost ordered a TV which cost £500 on Amazon and £250 on market place. We placed the order then got an email saying we had to put money in Western Union bank rather than via amazon. At this point we backed out and informed Amazon who gave us a £5 gift voucher and said we should never pay any other way than via their account. My husband noticed that it was also a fake email address - it had all the icons on the email but none of the links worked.
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I agree with some previous comments. If you buy something for a price that sounds too cheap and you are asked to pay outside of the Amazon payment system, you are asking for trouble. I do wish Amazon would remove its marketplace. If I want to buy items from third-party sellers, I'll go to eBay. Not only has the marketplace tarnished Amazon's great reputation but, as a buyer, I only want to buy from Amazon (due to their free delivery and good customer service) and find it frustrating having to filter out all the marketplace sellers.
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I feel the story sensationalized an issue, without emphasizing the need to use the Amazon site properly.
I have used the Amazon Market Place quite often, without any issues except on 2 occasions, but because I used the Amazon email system and the Amazon A to Z guarantee process, the issues were resolved fully, quickly and to my satisfaction.
If you follow Amazon's procedures, they will support you and make sure your money is safe.
If you go outside of the Amazon guidelines that is what the people carrying out the scams are all about.
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I have bought many DVD's and electronic equipment from Amazon Marketplace
and I have full confidence in Amazon's payment system as its just the same as buying direct from Amazon.
Once you buy a item any e-mails only confirm what has been bought and at a later stage the seller may send a ' shipping note ' but at no stage would a seller demand payment as the item has already been paid for.
As I place on average five orders per week there has been a few times that items
are lost in the post and when the seller is notified they will normally replace the item pronto but if not a full refund is issued.
All the DVD's I have bought were 100 % genuine.
Occasionally I will buy secondhand DVD's and I find the sellers description to be ' spot on ' although I tend to buy ' Used - Like New ' and they are in excellent condition.
As long as you follow the procedure and use Amazon's payment system you cant go wrong.
I am sure that if a seller gets consistent bad feedback Amazon will block them from selling.
I have full confidence in Amazon Marketplace and I have saved a great deal of money into the bargain.
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Thank You Watchdog!!!!
I myself also purchased a Pair of FAKE GHD Straightners from Amazon Market Place, and mine too became faulty and broke within 6 months. As part of Amazons 90 day garentee I was told I wasn't allowed a refund, even though the product was FAKE, and also according to GHD themselves breached health and safety regulations.
From finding they were fake back in October, I had battled with Amazon trying to get my money back. It went as far as the head of amazon supervisors who gives the go ahead for refunds. This didnt work, they told me my only option was to take them to court by going to their legal department.
With the help of tradings standards I made a last ditched attempt to get my money back by asking there legal department by a recorded delivery letter. I waited the 2 weeks I gave them with NO response.
I couldn't believe it when my exact story was aired last night on Watchdog. I rang Amazon this morning explaining the information again for what seemed like the 100th time, this time mentioning the Watchdog Story. This time the operator I spoke too seemed more upbeat rather then seeming to be reading from a script and I was told they would deal with it more seriously.
In a matter of hours I got an email this morning saying I had received a full refund.
Thank you Thank you Thank you Watchdog.
I'm never buying from Amazon Marketplace again!!!
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I am outraged by this item and I shall be wary of any of Watchdog's sensationalist reporting from now on.
My partner sells books on Amazon and he is reliable, honest and fair in all his business dealings. Maybe the purchasers have a responsibility to check feedback before they purchase, my partner has 100% therefore can be relied upon to offer a first class service.
To tar all sellers with the same brush is outrageous if not libellous!! Please retract your sensationalist statements, this is not a 'back street' at all, it is an honest way for some people to make an honest lving and your programme has put that way of making a living in jeopardy - you could have caused many hard working people to take a considerable drop in sales, how irresponsible of you, in fact SHAME ON YOU!!
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I would say that this report was just to make Amazon look bad. It was not Amazons fault that people paid to scammers, Amazon will tell you that you are on marketplace and not in Amazon shop. As UK is becoming a nanny state, Watchdog is becoming nannying program. What annoys me most, is that Nick always puts some degrading comment towards the company boss at the end
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Watchdog - I presume you still want to educate consumers. Does sensational biased commentary give anything whatsoever?
What an absolute joke of a report. Yet another example of awful programming to add on the BBC scrapheap that we pay our license fee for at the moment.
For the record, I'd not watched Watchdog in some time. After the debacle of the other night, I'm not likely to again.
I'm glad that the majority of people seem to have seen through Nicky Campbell's feeble attempt at a story. Perhaps the producer or researchers are to blame--either way,I really hope the presenters on Watchdog don't consider themselves to be journalists after that piece. There was no journalistic integrity whatsoever.
Just a few of the first issues that spring to mind:
1)Totally biased article:
Falling the way the producers obviously wanted it to, against the company in question. No useful advice was offered on how to protect yourself against online fraud - in spite of the fact that this was the reason why the vast majority of people had problems with orders.
2)No mention of competitors
The article made no coverage of other sites or other problems on the internet with regards to rogue and illegal items to balance the story. It was going for Amazon's throat, and came away with blunted fangs by the responses on this board.
Ebay's safety is apparently "better" from an "online expert" who probably hasn't even tested the system, and was used for a cheap quote.
Ebay are currently in the news due to their legal battle with Tiffany and Co over the sale of fake goods on the site.
Tiffany have got the case re-opened--their case is that Ebay should be better at policing their listings and products.
Sound familiar? My point is not to argue that either Ebay or Amazon are better or worse. Simply put - this wasn't even mentioned in context. The reason is pretty obvious - total jingo journalism to spin a sensational angle on the story as possible.
3)Awful interview with Amazon representative.
This is more down to personal style, but the attempt to interview Bryan McBride made Nicky Campbell look cheap and petty. I hope to god he was given that scripted and not as his own preparation.
The attempt to hand the Amazon rep the "Ebay" terms and conditions on paper was cringeworthy--see my Ebay / Tiffanys reference above.
Constant interrupting does not a good interview make.
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To those who have suffered, I honestly feel for you.
However, it is totally apparent that the vast majority of people posting here or on the program haven't taken appropriate measures to protect themselves or are naive.
Research who you are buying from.
Read the terms and conditions of the website you are using.
Understand what your rights are.
Then, and only then, do you have a valid right to complain.
The internet is a savage place, so don't be like a tourist in a busy flea market flashing your cash.
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I won't be surprised if my long post doesn't make it past censors, so if so moderators, please tell me why!
I wish to post it in a form where it is readable ;)
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I received an obviously home-produced copy of a McAfee security product from an Amazon Marketplace supplier (it was ordered and sold as new). Amazon's response when I phoned them was to return it to the sender (who hadn't supplied a return address) for a refund. I honestly thought Amazon would take it more seriously - after all, it is their reputation that is at stake. I then phoned Consumer Direct who gave me a reference number and said Trading Standards would contact me within 7 working days. Four weeks later and two follow-up calls by me have still produced no result. I have even filed a report of pirated software on McAfee's own website and had no response from them either. The upshot is I still have a useless piece of software which I have paid for on my credit card. I await a reply from Amazon requesting a refund from them as they are the company that debited my account. Watch out for pirate copies - why bother? I have been using Amazon for quite some time, including Marketplace suppliers, and have previously found them to be an excellent company to deal with so this can only hurt all those genuine Marketplace sellers who are providing an honest and reliable service.
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This is an astonishingly weighted view of Amazon. It is very irresponsible of the BBC to tar all of the Marketplace sellers with the same brush on the basis of a minuscule number of illegal products being sold (according to the Amazon representative, very briefly at that) and of a tiny number of scams only carried out successfully because buyers fail to read the conditions clearly laid down on the Amazon site. The programme should also mention the Feedback system which definitely contributes to the safety of using Amazon. It is also distinctly unhelpful to potential buyers not to explain the basics of how to avoid being scammed. Pertinent advice on this would, moreover, be useful to thousands of people on a daily basis on many, many other Internet sites! This would be a much better use of the minutes the presenters spend finger-wagging and talking to company bosses like naughty schoolboys, and would also fulfil the BBC's remit of being a public service.
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This was the first time I had seen Watchdog in years and was really disappointed with the 'hatchet' job Campbell and co did on Amazon. This was 'Daily Mail' sensationalism at it's very worst delivered by supposedly impartial, educated people.
The sad thing is that the many millions of people who no doubt saw this programme will not have the benefit of reading these excellent well considered posts. And will Watchdog redress the balance by mentioning any of the comments made here? I doubt it but maybe, just maybe they will surprise me and show their viewers that Amazon is the most successful online retailer for a reason!!
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I've used Amazon for years with no problems that couldn't be sorted quickly and easily. So, someone on the Market Place sold pepper spray. No doubt some women who use late night car parks etc would have liked to get their hands on this. And they can still do it through other, less reliable, sites. Anyone who's offered a new £600 tv at half price should think twice and if they then get a message asking for alternative payment method they should just walk away. What planet have these people been living on?!
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Those who say victims of such scams are idiots and that the article is simply being sensational appear to be showing both arrogance and ignorance of monolithic proportions. It is easy to say its being sensational until you are a victim.
I was a very happy customer who used amazon marketplace regularly until I was scammed out of £300. The price was good, for the laptop but far from too good to be true.
The seller had a 98% feedback rating and I went through all the checks I was advised to as a consumer. I no longer use Amazon as it simply isnt safe.
I thought I was fairly saavy to these type of scams, I regularly trade on ebay where I have always been well protected and while Ive been targeted before, its always seemed to be glaringly obvious that its a scammer.
In my case the police said it wasnt worth there time investigating as there was an international element, while giving me a reference number - but looked in disbelief at the apathy and contempt amazon had shown me.
All of there replys were automated and told me it was a police issue. It wasnt until I asked for an address to write to that I received a personal reply.
The scam works when an honest amazon trader has their account hacked so the scammer is able to advertise fake goods on their behalf. I had no possible way of spotting the email as a fake. Amazons advice (which I have in writing)was to look for grammatical errors, in my case the fraudsters English was unfortunatley exemplary.
Traders who are upset that Watchdog has highlighted the issue should be looking to Amazon to protect them rather than ruling it out as a sensationalist media story. Amazon were all too quick to tell me that ultimatley they werent responible for the advertised product and that it was the private trader who was not aware that there account had been tampered with who was.
After I was scammed I found hundreds of other victims online, its happening every day to everyday people. I have to work over a full time week to get that money back, while amazon continue to make millions and do nothing to follow up complaints.
I believe if amazon released figures on the number victims of the scam we would be staggered by the numbers.
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This SCAM works because it uses the good feedback rating and site of a legitimate seller on Amazon Marketplace. So if for example you have a legimate marketseller selling books with a 98% feedback rating, the SCAMMER highjacks this seller with his own fake items, normally hundreds of TVs, Cameras, Computers etc. Because the seller has good feedback, from the items he normally sells; this gives reassurance to the buyer who may be seduced by the low prices. If you search on the web you will see a blog where hundreds of internet savy people have been scammed by this. To find it search rome 00142 scam. (moskalyuk)
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I am an Amazon marketplace seller. I have been selling books for about 3 years now and have a 100% feedback rating. The vast majority of Amazon marketplavce sellers are decent hard working sellers trying to earn a living, and i'm sure many are as horrified as i am that in this these difficult times our good name is being tarnished by this biased account. I very much hope that watchdog will correct this at the earliest opportunity.
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I tryed to sell an item on Amazon, i got a confirmation letter saying the payment had been made and to send the item. I sent the item (my phone worth £300), after 3 days I still hadn't got the money. So i contacted Amazon and they said they would get back to me. I heard nothing so I tryed to call back but they have a new system so i cant get through to talk to anyone.
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I would like to comment on the EXTREMELY one sided/biased portrayal of Amazon Marketplace. There are many thousands of Marketplace sellers who conduct their business in a totally professional and legal way, complying with all the regulations and rules laid dowm by Amazon.
The examples used in the programme were of users who did NOT stick to the guidelines, and T & C's as issued by Amazon - Amazon do NOT allow payment for goods outwith their own payment system, so even though the buyer 'thought' it would be OK, he immediately put himself outside Amazon's payment protection.
Sadly scammers have infiltrated (probably most prelevant in the electronic and more expensive item sector), what was, and on the whole still is, an excellent market platform for both buyers and sellers. Shamefully, 'Watchdog's' portrayal of Amazon Marketplace has tarred every seller with the same brush, which will have a devastating effect on those sellers who run efficient and customer focused businesses.
I trust that in a future programme the balance will be re-dressed, and that you put the record straight, by confirming that all the examples used were not trading/conducting their business within Amazon's very clear Terms and Conditions.
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I work from home as an Amazon Marketplace Trader and I am appalled that crooks and scammers are giving us honest traders a bad reputation. A lot of people do not read descriptions given and should always read feedback before placing orders. Any one with any sense reads the information given about payments before they part with any money. I am sorry for people who have been duped, but in my experience a few of the sellers with the huge feedbacks going into the tens of thousands do not describe fully the condition of the goods they sell and sell items for 1p which a lot of the time are not as they describe. My advice for anybody buying from Amazon is read all the information available on the site about buying and keep those pennies safe.
Buy from the smaller traders as they tend to offer a much better quality product, service etc.
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re amazon selling fake items i purchased a betty boop t shirt and the picture looked lovely when it arrived it was a tiny badge i could have got for 20p anywhere and i paid £5.70 i have also purchased a bench watch for a third of the price it hasnt arrived yet and i await with baited breath to see what does come! just the strap? if it comes at all
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i will only use Amazon, but not 3rd party sellers. I think there is more risk using Ebay as they are all 3rd party sellers.
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I have used Amazon lots of times and when buying direct from them service is top quality.
However last month, I purchased an easy to use portable printer from an Amazon seller. When it arrived it was french, with a plug adapter and no English instructions. I would not have ordered it, if I had known this was the case, so I contacted the seller, to be told I could return it but would have to pay for delivery and admin costs. I sent several emails explaining how they had missold the item and they said they had stated the printer was french on one particular page. I checked and they had. The only problem was that I would have no reason to look at this page to buy the item. Furthermore, I had read two of three pages about the item, to make sure I was getting the right printer. There was no mention of it being French anywhere, in fact it said it came with a standard power supply and instruction manual. So as the compnay was in the UK, I didnt for one minute think the power supply and instructions would be french!
I told them this and they said Amazon only allowed them to include these details here(which I find hard to believe having read so much about the item elsewhere) and that I should take it up with amazon, I replied saying that was their job.
A few weeks later (just last week) they sent an email to offer help to set up the item, but it was too late. It is a gift for my techo phobe parents and the printer not being english would not be suitable.
I know others have given poor feedback on Amazons site to this compnay for the same reason.
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Have to say that I have frequently purchased goods from Amazon and have never had a problem. I think they have great products and prices which are much cheaper than the High Street. They have fantastic customer service which I can't find a fault with.
It has some problems which it needs to iron out as they become aware of them but which business doesn't. I personally buy from Amazon and don't deal with the market place since I don't know who I'm buying from.
I watched Nick interviewing the MD and was not happy, I believe that he was a bit over the top and tougher than he should have been.
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I ordered a game with game_stores via Amazon's marketplace.Paid for the order on 24/11 and still waiting, sent the seller 6 e-mails with no reply.I informed Amazon who told me that they do not really deal with marketplace sellers and to e-mail the seller again.Amazon basically washed their hands of it but i did get an e-mail stating that a refund will take over 2 weeks to process!! Your report was spot on Amazon do not care !
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I have also been a victim of the amazon Market place scam. I had been ordering items and getting auto replys from Amazon. Amongst these was one which related to a TV I wished to purchase. I am usually sceptical about paying for goods other than bt card,but this email seemed to be an abive board one from Amazon.
Since the scam Ive been to the Post Office but they cannot help as they are an agent of Moneygram. Moneygram told me to report this to the Police. I did this and they said i Needed to report to Amazon and then they would consider doing something. Amazon have still to respond to my email-funny no auro-reply this time.
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As an Amazon Marketplace seller with a positive feedback rating of 99% (who has also had Paul Heiney in his shop) ...
I would give Watchdog's report an accuracy rating of 2 out of 5.
Golden rule of Amazon: check the seller's feedback - actually READ it before buying, and only pay through the Amazon checkout.
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Looking back at comments 63 and 64:
Occasionally, as an Amazon seller, we get e-mails asking us to relist items (usually TVs) or to log on to reactivate our account. These are just like any other phishing messages. You don't need to check the spelling and grammar (bad) or even notice that the links go to web pages with Russian, Chinese or Taiwanese URLs. Amazon does not send messages like that and they've got "scam" written all over them.
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I have been buying from Amazon for 4 years. In that time only twice did I not receive the goods and each time Amazon have refunded my money...I always buy from Amazon themselves and have no complaints, I steer clear of the third party selling.
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I also got caught with fake GHD straighteners from Amazons marketplace. They were found to be fake after they went wrong and I sent them back to GHD. I contacted Amazon who were not interested and told me to speak to the seller (who was no longer a registered seller). They seller did actually answer but told me that Amazon do did not permit him to give refunds after 90 days. With much persistance, I finally got a refund from Amazon.
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I have nothing but praise for Amazon, having bought many items from them without any problem. Any complaints (2 out of over 150 items this year), are swiftly dealt with - no argument, replacement or refund. The problem seems to be when payments are made outside Amazon - don't do it! Pay only through Amazon and you will not have a problem.
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I thought i could trust amazon!, but there are all just the same! Take ebay, i posted a for sell item (two ipods), got a buyer, but it turned out to be a scam! He sent fake paypal emails claiming he paid for the item, even though he hadn't, whats even more odd is that he wanted it shipped to south africa for his "son", even though he lives in switzerland and i said UK only... luckily we (im only 16 so can't sell anything on ebay so my dad did it for me) didnt fall for it, and rang up paypal who then cancelled his account, but he can just make a new one and do the same to a lot more people, who might not be so lucky! Very annoying and time wasting!
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I bought 'GHDs' off the amazon marketplace and my experience was exactly the same as the girl's on the programme. I was refused a refund from amazon eventhough i had proof that the straightners were fake because of this 90 day period. After the seller failing to get back to my emails stating that the starightners were fakes, i phoned amazon.co.uk and they refused me any kind of help as they seemed to think it had nothing to do with them eventhough i'd payed through their website. In the end i had to sort it out emailing the seller myself threatening to go to trading standards and the police.
It's ridiculous, if they have this service on their website they should monitor it properly. The seller is still on the website dispite me informing amazon that they sell fake goods and requesting that they be removed.
I definately won't be using it again.
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I purchased rechargeable batteries in amazons marketplace prior to watching this story. I recevied them in next day delivery, but they were faulty and the packaging looked as if it had been opened, meaning the batteries were used perhaps? I contacted the marketplace seller and was told it was my problem now, and no refund would be issued as the item had already been opened. I then contacted amazon, and they are currently investigating the matter. Just goes to show, be very weary of whom you buy from
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Although a bit late I was away at the time of the programme.
I have dealt with Amazon over the years without a problem, but this time I have been shocked by their attitude to their sellers, basically a seller has no rights and will get no help from Amazon.
I sold a Zumo through Amazon and followed their instructions to the letter, the post office claimed to have tried to deliver it, neither the buyer or Amazon would ans. my emails about the delivery, in the end the buyer finally came back, he had full tracking and parcel info, claimed to have no knowledge of the delivery, it took him a further week to go to the post office by which time the
Post Office claimed to have miss laid it.
The out come to date is; Amazon have blacked me from selling on their site, saying I've not kept to their image, the buyer has been given his money back, the post after telling me the parcel was fully insured now claim I will only receive £36 in compensation. Amazon have never asked me for my side, they have ignored my requests for help, before and after the loss, instead the seller is guilty.
I will not deal or recommend any one deals with this company.
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I purchased a so called Nikon remote control for a camera bought at christmas. When it arrived, it was marked "for Nikon" "made in China" I contacted the seller who claimed the item wasn't counterfeit. He refused to do anything about it. So I contacted Amazon, three times since I received the item. They have not replied.
Stearman65
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If AMAZON accept my credit card payment and I purchase goods through their site my contract should be with AMAZON regardless of whether the goods are supplied by a "marketplace seller" or not.
Does anyone know what the legal position is in this case?
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On the 15th Jan I ordered a flashgun through Amazon Marketplace. The £153 was taken at once. Received emails with a range anticipated dispatch/delivery dates spanning about 2 weeks. Still nothing arrived. Complained to the Marketplace vendor and filed a claim with Amazon. No response from vendor and a 2 week wait anticipated by Amazon. The company involved has now got a 10% negative feedback on the Amazon site mainly due to late or no delivery. Why do Amazon let them continue to sell through Marketplace?
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