Huge wake-up call for England
This was a deeply chastening experience for England cricket lovers. I really hope it was for the players, too.
I am absolutely sure that they believe they tried their best on each and every day, but they came at this series from such a low level of preparedness that, in those circumstances, their best would never be good enough.
This has to be the biggest wake-up call in English cricket, and if attention is paid to this thrashing, then something good will come from it.
If there is simply a fudged inquiry in some locked room at Lord’s, it would be an insult to everyone that holds the interests of English cricket dear to their hearts.
Australia learnt from their mistakes in 2005.
Senior and well respected former players were called in to give their views on what had gone wrong, and the right mechanisms - including the ‘poaching’ of the bowling coach, Troy Cooley - were installed.
Similarly, England must look very closely at themselves.
Discipline has to be restored. For a start, this includes reminding the players that being on tour is a job - and a very well paid one at that.
If they do not want to be away from home, that’s fine: don’t come. The pandering to the players union, the PCA, has to stop.
Tours must be structured properly, with the right balance between preparation, hard work and down time.
There has to be a spell at the start of a tour when the team builds its spirit and character without the distraction of the families.
It is absolutely impossible to structure a strong team with the presence of wives, girlfriends and children.
There is a time on every tour - when that ‘bonding’ has been achieved - that the families can come, but not before. This is a serious job, and the priorities have been lost on this trip.
The practice matches on tour must be competitive. I firmly believe that Australians are naturally more competitive that we are - so what chance did the players have of stopping the Australian juggernaut at Brisbane when all they had in terms of serious preparation was a single three-day game in Adelaide?
The 14-per-side outing against New South Wales was a joke and Steve Harmison - hopelessly out of form - was allowed to wander off the field to get his feet up during the second innings after bowling just 5 overs!
I fear for England in the one-day series. Unless they start strongly, particularly against New Zealand, they could get a battering.
And with the World Cup just around the corner now, the most high octane winter of international cricket England have ever faced could turn out to be a nightmare.
Couldn't agree more Jonathan. This series has been an embarrassment to English cricket - not so much for losing as Australia were clearly and consistently the better side - but more the manner in which we capitualted.
Leadership was muddled at best and preparation was atrocious.
The bottom line is that lessons must be learnt immediately otherwise that nightmare may well become a reality.
-George Martin, London
Complain about this postWhere should the English players drop off those MBE's?
Complain about this postI have been an ardent England fan ever since I can remember. I had paid to watch the current test series with Australia and also spent a lot my time watching the matches on pay TV.
Regretfully I must say that the current England team is bunch of useless cricketers with no pride, inspiration or backbone.
The Captain and the Coach seem not to know how to motivate the team.
in my opinion the fans have been cheated and should not waste their time and money watching the English Cricket Team unless the players show pride and the will to win in future.
I do hope that the management will name a captain and coach who can inspire and motivate the team in the future
Complain about this postAnd the comments are backed up by the columns written (or ghost-written) by players. It seemed that partying and drinking featured as heavily as playing. Regardless of the sun and surf, this is not a backpacker's holiday but a job.
The performance of the summer was one by a certain Mr J Agnew. Once again he delighted the Australian public with his warmth, wit, charm, humour, modesty and intelligence. It's worth listening to every moment of an Ashes tour to hear his dulcet tones, and it's always sad when he leaves our shores.
Complain about this postAt least Peterson did not have to bat with the tail this time.
Complain about this postAggers - England were extremely poor, but at least the XI who took the field had the courage to try. This is more than can be said for Michael Vaughan and the other senior players who completely bottled the tour.
If an Australian captain hid in the dressing room while his mates were being flayed on the field, he'd never be forgiven. But apparently that's OK with the England fans. Speak up Mr Vaughan, the silence is deafening.....
Complain about this postWhat a fitting result for this series and a perfect way to send off the Aussie legends. Goes to show it was only bad umpiring, bad weather and injuries that cost Australia the Ashes last year. It's time for MBE's for the Aussies now.
Complain about this postWe NZers are looking forward to administering a "battering", we all know how inept England are at ODIs...
There are a number of lessons from the tour. The inner circle containing Geraint Jones (not even in the starting XI in the series before) was a joke, and his selection ahead of Read who had been playing so well must have undermined some players confidence.
They (Mahmood, Read, Panesar) did so well against Pakistan, and then they were dropped so that England could re-live past glories with a team as close to 2005's as possible. Australia didn't live in the past(except to be motivated by it), and England were punished.
Amid all the hype, England were totally underprepared. Hopefully with the Ashes tour in England next time that won't happen again.
There was hope for the future. Pieterson was consistently good. Cook looks promising, contributing a good hundred. Bell was gritty and dogged and came away respected by the Australians. Panesar bowled well on pitches that didn't suit him. And Read's glovework was supurb. England have some building blocks for the future, hopefully they get it right next time.
Complain about this postEngland have suffered some humiliating defeats in the past two decades, but this ranks as No1. But the English public and the press bear some responsibility because we aided and abetted their transformation from cricketers into celebrities. So boys, put an end to your showbiz parties, to your appearances in Hello magazine, to your highly-paid autobiographies, and get back to playing some cricket. And, while you're still in Australia, try and find a few spare backbones.
Complain about this postAs an Australian supporter, England's win in 2005 was the best thing to have happened in a Ashes series in a long time - the interest in the 2006/7 series was enormous. That's what we need. I'm glad we've got the Ashes back, but really, 5-0? Couldn't England do better than that? All those over-the-top celebrations in 2005 must feel a little stupid now.
Complain about this postWhen you ignore the hype from the english media you are left with this.
England(like india in 01) played as good as they can ever play and snuck home 2-1 vs australia who weren't at their best.
When on song the gap between england and australia is massive as this australian team is up with the top 2 or 3 from all time while this england side wouldn't even be in the top 10 or 15 sides of all time.
if both teams were full strength and firing the career stats tell you there would be only 1 winner.
Complain about this postWhy do England persist with Flintoff at 6 and playing with 3 quicks and a spinner - leaving a long tail. Anderson + Mahmood weren't bowled much and were rubbish when they did get the ball. We should play 6 batsmen, Freddie at 7, then Read and the bowlers.......South Africa have Pollock in at number 8!
My team - Vaughan, Strauss, Cook, Pietersen, Bell, Joyce, Flintoff, Read, Hoggard, Harmy, Monty........
Complain about this postHello Aggers. Do you get to talk to people in high places inside the ECB and PCA? Is there any hope of getting your message into the skulls of those people that make important decisions about English cricket? We need an overhaul, not a quick fix. What a sorry, pathetic series from England. I'm ashamed that we showed so little fight after the drama of 2005. Very sad. dd
Complain about this postYour comments are great to hear but as ever, will the english press just gloss over this awful performance and not follow through with the enquiry? If the playerd can't even admit that they were totally substandard, what chance have we of any change?
Complain about this postMr Agnew your views are entirely correct particularly regarding families. No matter what people say about this being able to combine the family life and work in this day and age it is impossible.
One only has to look at senior professionals in the business world (not mediocre middle management) to understand this. How much time are the best senior executives able to spend with families? These top performing business professionals are the people this shoddy English team should be comparing themselves with. It may not make them such intereseting pals or drinking companions but it does make them succesful.
You say you hope that England will learn from this experience. If history and others sports in England have taught us anything, and I think it most likely has, nothing will come out of this thrashing. Players and management will continue to live and perform on there small cocoons, protected from reality by hefty, undeserved salaries and sponsorship deals.
England got exactly what they deserved in this series. Hats off to Austrailia for the professionalism they have shown. One supspetcs there may be a little more control and modesty as would expect from a team of genuine professional as they wllow in their victory.
The rest of the tour and World Cup, I imagine, will continue in the same vein with England stumbling from pitiful defeat to pitiful defeat accompanied by the same collection of feeble excuses. At least we will be able to give Engand credit for one thing, thier consistancy!
Complain about this postcomiserations to the english team. They DID play some good cricket, they just could not match our Amazing team. I kook forward to 2009 as i know it will be a different team and a whole new ball game. But we Aussies will produce a great team, I have no doubt. The 5-0 whitewash was a moment in my life that Im unlikely to see again and Im am so proud of our boys.
Complain about this postI cried at the end when Langer was teary. Im gonna miss warne, langer, martin and magrath but I look forward to the next group of exciting young players who will be very good cricketers as well. The team left in the hands of its captain Ricky Ponting, with Lee and clarke bowling as well as they did and the superb fielding of Clarke and Symonds will be a force to reckon with. Ponting as far as im concerned is one of the best and most motivating captains Ive ever seen. He copped too much flak last year and I hope he is enjoying this moment
Cricket was the loser overall.
Every cricket fan wanted to see an exciting series-it never happened.
The second test was the deciding moment-England losing it despite being 460-4 at one stage.
The great thing about Australia over the years is that they have always kept their best players fit.
England without Simon Jones, Trescothick and Michael Vaughan (who had a great tour here four years ago)-and with Ashley Giles, Flintoff, Harmison who were not 100% fit-would always struggle.
Geraint Jones has been out of form for a good year-so that only left KP, Bell, Collingwood & Hoggard from 2005 who all had their moments on this tour.
I still believe if England were all fit and better prepared then it would have been a classic series.
As it is cricket fans were denied and the game of cricket has sufered.
The ICC must take some blame for this.
Well done Australia-simply awesome.
Complain about this postOh and I have forgotten Andrew Strauss-a good player who was not allowed to get a score by poor umpiring.
Complain about this postwell I must say the eng team are a likeable bunch and worse eng teams have been here without losing 5-0.
Why didn't eng play an extra bat, as it just didn't make sense to anyone. If FF isn't fit don't play him.
There was too much made of the 2005 ashes where aussies had a bad series, and these mistakes could be patched up. Remember the media was saying aus cricket has no one to come in , the national team will really struggle from now on blah blah.
It WAS that extreme at the time.
Maybe we are being too extreme on eng because next series they will have Jones,Vaughn and an extra bat, and the swing factor.
Complain about this postSo long and thanks for all the fish.
Yes Aggers they did try their hardest, let's not forget that, but their best was never even close to the dedicatio, skill and match readiness of the aussies.
The MCC needs its head read for its absurd comments that the ashes are too fragile to be transported, get real you bunch of old time losers you have done more to harm the game and the credibility of English cricket than anyone else, gow up you pretentious creeps. And as ofr the ECB, what a disgrace!
Perhaps we should give back the greeks marbles too. At least it would show we have some dignity left. Sack everyone and start again and England GROW UP and start acting like a mature country instead of a bunch of arrogant wanna be's trading on a long dead past. and btw sack Tony Blair too! lol!
I'm going back to drinking now, so should the rest of the shameful english cricket establishment.
Complain about this postNow the nightmare is complete, althoug I too fear that Aussies will feast on England's forlorn cricketers one more time during the One Day series. Jonathan is spot on that, if this is just shrugged off by the powers that be, then the next embarrasment may not be so far away. As I drown my sorrows this evening at Kingston Cricket Club, a sad and disconsolate Englishman in the Caribbean, I find that even my West Indian friends are gleefully rubbing their hands together at the prospect of playing us next summer at Lords! Who would ever have thought that a year ago !
Complain about this postBarman - more ale !!!
I agree with Aggers. There needs to be far, far better and more detailed preparation before the next test series and certainly an inquiry into the preparation, selection and performance on this tour.
Furthermore, it is not enough for players to be selected on reputation or previous performances - players have to be selected on current form. To play certain players who have been out of play or practice for a length of time without giving them provincial or sufficent warm up tests is ridiculous.
The way in which so much seemed to rely on England (us) repeating the form and atmosphere of the last Ashes tour, on waiting for certain players to return and on ushering in untried or underperforming players is an indictment of a poor administration and corporate management.
There seems to be a belief in English sport that over-hyping team performance and having a nostalgia for past glories will allow teams to glide through any sea of troubles. It happens in Rugger and Footer as well (media harping on about 'a repeat of '66 etc) - so perhaps the English media should take a look at itself as well.
This is a tremendously dissapointing tour, and so let us hope and confide that REAL, LASTING and EFFECTIVE changes will result at:
managerial;
players;
coaching;
preparation
and yes, A COUNTY LEVEL.
Perhaps the use of more Australian style management and coaching practices will assist a change in these areas.
England needs to perhaps get a bit more steel into their playing, and we have two years to acheive this.
Lets hope this is a turning point, and the lowest ever ebb of English cricket.
Complain about this postThe point you make about the upcoming One Day Series is an interesting one. At the moment Ashes euphoria will be in full swing, but soon enough someone will have to 'officially' switch attention away from the Ashes and towards the next series, which for Australia is vital preparation for the World Cup.
In the back of his mind, I don't think Ricky Ponting is quite satisfied with simply regaining the Ashes. If Australia were to win the World Cup for the third time in a row, it would mean victory in the ICC Rest of the World series, Champions Trophy, Ashes and World Cup all within two years. It's an opportunity not to be missed, and a fitting way to end the supposed Warne-McGrath dynasty.
To compare the preparations and attitudes Australia, England and even New Zealand take into this series will be intriguing. Australia will find it tough to refocus on the One Day game, and complacency may be an issue that could prove costly come the World Cup. On the other hand, England will somehow have to shake off the psyche of damage-control that currently encapsulates the team, and focus on maintaining a positive approach to the game.
Funnily enough New Zealand, typically the dark horse in the One Day arena, should be favourites to take out the series. They are one of few teams legitemetly capable of beating Australia in Oz, and provided they don't choke against a resurgent English side, they should have the focus and preparation to take it out.
Complain about this postI suggest that england place less importance for the ashes coming in the two and a half years later in 2009.
There were only two problems that contributed to this whitewash.
1. English bowlers were not fully fit and bowling like an attack, in combinations like Jones-Flintoff, Harmison-Hoggard.
2. Batsmen did not get technically suited to the australian pitches, and partly due to the lack of experience, sicne the bowlers did not show attacking initiative, huge pressure placed upon inexperinced batsmen.
Suggestion to Flintoff:
DO NOT TALK ABOUT 2009 BECUASE YOU MIGHT NOT BE THERE.
Concentrate on the WORLD CUP, more important right now.
5-0 is the best thing that happened to england. Young players like bell and cook will learn what it means to get thrashed and whitewashed.
Rotation policy must be developed to give international experience to 2nd string players.
Get rid of friends and develop a team of winners and not losers, by that i mean people who dont lose by a whitewash.
And pray the next australian generation is not as good as the present one.
And drop Harmison if he doesn't want to play.
Hope ponting and clarke break their hands or legs, go out of form before 2009.
Finally, be happy warne, mcgrath are retired, and dont expect a walkover next time round. If you want to in earn it and rub defeat into australia every time in years to come.
Complain about this postI agree with much of Aggers's comments.
However, i feel one major point has been missed.
Although the England team struck a purple patch in the Ashes series of 2005, there is a basic flaw in technique in this team. This can be covered up by the likes of Troy Cooley, but has been horribly exposed by the ruthless (and fantastic) Australian team.
It is not coincidence that KP has been the top batsman in both the Ashes series he has played in and the fact that our bowlers could not bowl out the Australians twice each test when our bowlers can't put the ball in the right spot consistently was again proof of flawed technique.
What I'm surprised about is that not many people have linked this to our dismal form in the one-day game.
One-day internationals put serious pressure on basic techniques and this is why England have been found wanting in both the batting and bowling department in that form of the game as well.
I'm afraid it all goes back to the grass roots and the lack of competitiveness in the domestic game.
Enough said.....congrats Aussies!
Complain about this postIf Mahmood's display of brilliance when offered the chance of running out Shane Warne- is "their best" then no amount of post thrashing analysis will be of any benefit. You can tell when a sportsman is putting in 100% and only on rare occasions did we see an English shirt doing this, most of the time it was half hearted and some of the time deplorable. The great thing about the Ashes of 2005 was that 2 teams went at it hard, not this time.
Complain about this postAggers,
I totally agree with you that this is a job and that playing test cricket does actually matter.
Complain about this postToo many of these players think its a holiday and personally I would not have the players' families out until Christmas. You are spot on when you say if they are committed to touring overseas then they should not be pro
Totally in agreement.
Complain about this postYou are absolutely right. One could see the intensity in the Aussies even during the post match celebrations and more importantly, one could see the bonding between the players. England needs to emulate the Aussies in the depth of their preparation. The time also appears to have come for former England players to stop getting on England's case and put their money where their mouth is. Apart from earning big bucks elsewhere, why cannot some of them use their time to set English cricket back on track.
Complain about this postToo much superstar behaviour,not enough star quality.The aussies were not flash or flambouyant , they were just professional . Our boys went designer shopping wearing diamond studded earrings whilst their men went to work .
Complain about this postI've posted lots of gloating on this blog, but it's all good fun. Very little of it is serious at then end of the day. The Ashes is simply a nice distraction.
To England, seriously, the 5-0 did not reflect the difference between the 2 sides, I didn't think. There were plenty of times I felt England might get up. The more tests they lost, the more they went down psychologically than anything else. Anyway I'm sure it will be a lot closer in 09. Enjoyed your comments. Cheers.
Complain about this postHi Jonathan
Complain about this postI do watch more of crickets being played by Australia than by India. For the last 2-3 years I suddenly have developed more taste in the Ashes Series. I try watching as much as I can.
Well, I do agree with you on the seriousness factor of the English team which indeed is lacking in the entire series. This may very well be because of the nostalgia. I would like to add that the side MUST have a killer instinct to fetch the match the way the Aussies do!! I will say that it is more of a mind game that Aussie play. You see when your 2 men are there on the crease playing for a long time, Aussie upset, suddenly any one of them give away his wicket. Then you see the attack by them, they wont even allow you to get even a single thereafter. If they are 9 down for 100 McGrath will come and lead the team to victory by is batting. Thats all about the psychology and ofcourse keeping the basics right!!!
If attention had been paid to the 2 narrow wins, 1 big loss in Ashes 2005;
If attention had been paid to the disastrous 2-0 loss in Pakistan immediately thereafter... despite the presence of Vaughan and Trescothick;
If attention had been paid to Flintoff's meagre captaincy skills on the India tour...
If attention had been paid to the manner Tresco conducted himself during the tours of Pakistan and India...
If attention had been paid to Fred's persistent injury in the home series...
If attention had been paid to the indifferent performance against Sri Lanka..
If attention had been paid to the questionable decisions that got England a win in Test 3 vs Pakistan...
If attention had been paid to the good performances of Monty, Shah... and the inconsistencies of Harmison, Bell, Anderson and above all, Flintoff...
If attention had been paid to the sub-standard batting skills of the 'keepers...
If attention had been paid to Fletcher's dubious selections and proclivity to running away from blame.. etc. etc.;
If attention had been paid to people like Boycott who've been saying this for a long time...
the 5-0 might not have happened in the first place.
And the ridiculous selection of Nixon, the ambivalence over Vaughan, and lack of new batting faces in the ODI squad a few months from the World Cup...
HAVE SHOWN BEYOND DOUBT THAT THE LESSONS WILL NEVER BE LEARNT... NOT IN THE NEAR FUTURE, WITH THE PRESENT MANGERIAL SETUP.
Complain about this postSad. So much of what went wrong was so avoidable. Sadder still ? Its pretty much the same story across the board in English sport. We continue to live in an era of amateurish incompetence .... except where payment is concerned of course.... its all very professional when wages are concerned....
Complain about this postOf course, what might make the ECB wake up a little and take notice is if the Barmy Army and associated loyal England supporters had walked out of the ground en masse.
If teams realise that they have to work to gain fan confidence, then maybe the players will take notice and play harder.
Complain about this postFor as long as England remain the only Test nation not to have an off-season, we will continue to find it hard to prepare properly for Ashes tours.
The ECB expects England to play seven Tests and a growing number of one-day matches every summer.
You cannot prepare properly for an Ashes tour while playing a Twenty20 in Chester-le-Street in September.
Complain about this postThe elephant in the room of course is that Austrailia have far far better players than us.
All this navel gazing about lack of preparation is a bit academic when you take this in to consideration.
The underperfoming players in the 2005 Australia team have been replaced with the likes of Hussey and Clark, whilst we have scraped the barrel as ususal.
County cricket is rotten and has been for most of my life time (I am 40). It is a retirement home for overseas stars and ageing country pros. It clearly does not produce any where near the quality of Sheffield Shield.
Everything else is mere detail.
Complain about this postThe fact is the English team did NOT play at their best. They were not hungry for success. They did not function as a team at all. It is a sad reflection on English sports and one that needs an urgent overhaul before you guys host the Olympics. Dont fall into the trap of playing the blame game. Show some team spirit by accepting collective failure at almost every level. Identify area's for improvement and formulate plans for achieving said improvements. As for 2009, dont say we might win, you need to take a leaf out of the aussies book from 2005. Your expected attitude should be, we will do whatever it takes to make sure we can and do win in 2009. Do NOT even entertain the thought that you may not win. Then everyone can enjoy ashes cricket that is tough and close and up for grabs.
Complain about this postThe responsibility lies with the coach and the captain. Their all right jack attitude even when thrashed comprehensively shows Duncan Fletcher and Flintoff remain clueless. The coming one day series will cause an another thrashing for England unless their attitude to age gane changes.
Complain about this postAggers,
You are quite right about the issue of touring. If you are not committed to playing overseas then dont make yourself available.
Complain about this postTest cricket is a job and an important one at that and the sooner the ECB realise this the better.
OK, time to reflect on what has happened and what the ECB should do to fix it.
Firstly, well done to an excellent Australian team! We are all left wondering how they could have coped under real pressure - sadly England exerted none and the Aussies did everything expected of them and a little more in Adelaide. They deserved to win the series as convincingly as they did.
I agree with Aggers' comments re: preparation. England needed more tour matches and longer in Australia before the first test. If they had suggested scheduling matches against every state side, I doubt any would have refused the chance to play the tourists early on.
Selection - plenty has been made of the decision to bench Panesar, Read and Mahmoud. For my money, the first two should have been definites from the start...and Mahmoud would not play again for a while if I was selecting...failing to back up his bowling and missing a run out (and not seeming to care) told us plenty about his character. Panesar and Read did well in their specialties and also showed promise with the bat at times, something to build on there. Cook is in for the long run, Vaughn was unlucky but is a damn fine player. Pietersen should definitely bat at four, but less charging up the pitch please. It's not entertaining and it gets you out pretty fast too. Gilly didn't play many unorthodox shots in his quickfire hundred at the WACA - KP should watch and learn and become even more effective, rather than a short-lived sideshow.
Anderson is a good bowler but too inconsistent to play at this level. Until he can group the ball in the same area for six consecutive balls, he is no use to us. If he is the most consistent young bowler we have then we have real problems. Australia spotted McGrath's potential long before even he did and they built on the potential to produce a great player. Our coaches should be looking to emulate that approach - players who have the right temprament and consistency for the long version of the game deserve to play Tests for England - the rest can stay in their pyjamas.
The tail - obviously it is too long but we get the worst of both worlds at the moment - not enough batters and too many poor bowlers. I would suggest playing an additional batsman e.g. Joyce, dropping the extra seamers (probably Mahmood) and having Freddy bat at seven, Read at eight, Panesar at nine, Hoggie at ten, Harmison (or Jones when fit) at eleven. We can easily get more overs from part-time bowlers like Collingwood (who only had a single spell in the whole series) and get KP to practice his off-spin. When fit and firing, three seamers of Hoggie, Harmy and Freddie's quality plus an attacking spinner in Monty should get us enough wickets.
Finally on the subject of the captaincy, Freddie has done great things for England in the past but he's a naive Test captain - his field placings and strategies were unimaginative, set way too deep and lacked variety. He sowed no seeds of doubt in the minds of the Aussie batsmen. If Vaughn is not fit, Strauss must regain the captaincy and let Freddie concentrate on destoying the opponents with bat and ball, as he has shown himself capable on many occasions.
BRING ON 2009!
Complain about this postRe Wags on tour - totally agree with Aggers on this...most of us who earn a living are not accompanied by our wives and/or girlfriends. Wags attendance should be restricted to the last day of the tour at most. A clause should be added to players' contracts so it becomes part of their commitment to the game.
Complain about this postAh well, that's over.
Now the tears have passed that our legends are retiring, maybe we can dare to hope that England will shape up and give us a contest next time. The Ashes is the most important sporting contest in existence to Australia, and our players are passionately dedicated to playing for their country.
England, meanwhile, seem to view the Test matches as a bothersome distraction from their Australian holiday.
We wanted to win this, but we were looking forward to a tough fight. If our own side weren't at least giving us good cricket to watch there would have been blood on the grass - come on, England, do your part for once. Give your fans as well as we Aussie fans something to appreciate. Maybe if the players make believe they think they can win, they'll have a shot at looking better than useless.
Complain about this postThis England team is an embarisment to the country and their cricket followers.Today none of the players showed any guts and folded like meek little lambs.The coach and captain must be replaced and 90% of the team as they are not up to test standard.at the moment they will struggle to beat Zimbabwe.
Complain about this postthis team must hang their heads in shame,go home and decide their futures.The aussies were good but 5 nil is no excuse.
I agree with post 17 about Boycott. When will he be given a chance to become a selector for England? It feels like Brian Clough and the England football manager's job. We can see someone who has been there and done it successfully, consistently predicts outcomes and accurately links them to an analysis of the players strengths and weaknesses. Isn't that what you want from a selector/coach? He may be a difficult person to get on with, but he knows his cricket.
Complain about this postBRILLIENT AS USUAL YOU ARE RIGHT ON THE BALL AGGERS. I USED TO ENJOY THE GAMES AGAINST THE STATE SIDES THEY MUST BE REINSTATED. I WONDER IF THESE GUYS REALISE WHAT IT IS LIKE TO LIVE HERE AS AN EX-PAT. WHEN THESE THINGS HAPPEN. SOME OF THEM SHOULD BE FORCED TO ENDURE IT.
Complain about this postGRAHAM
Well said Aggers! Look on the bright side though, it'll only take them a hour and a half to trash us in the 20-20 match, not 5/4/3 days......
Complain about this postc'mon aggers - you should know that a team can only play as well as the opposition allows them. 'Poaching ' Troy Cooley - really. He's an Aussie isn't he? And isn't there some story about the skinflint and ungrateful Pommy cricket authorities not offering him a decent contract after his efforts last year? Wake up, England was thrashed by the better side, out played, out thought, out gutsed
Complain about this postI recall Neil Young being sued by his record label in the mid 80s for releasing albums that were not up to par. I wonder if the English Cricket Board will consider suing the English players for breach of contract for under-performing? They have a fair case.
On another note, this isn't the best Australian side - it is the worst English side to ever land on Australian shores. You don't win cricket games when your number six only averages 32 with the bat and all your bowlers average over 30.
Speaking as an Australian I am very disappointed with the abysmal performance of the English side.
Complain about this postShell Be Right Mate’s…
Commiserations TO ALL OUR BRETHERNDS, BROTHERS & SISTERS IN ENGLAND...
SORRY FOR THE THRASHINGSSS!!!...WE ARE TERRIBLY EMBARESSED FOR YOU AOLD CHAPS & CHAPES!!!
Now for our suggestions:
1. As Shane Warne has retired and he is playing in England, I would seriously consider employing him as an adviser to the England team!!! Mind you he would demand a hefty fee!!! Or better still get
2. Glen McGrath and Justin Langer!!! To do the same!!!....
Simple solutions to England’s problems!!!
See YOU ALL IN 2009!!!...
And better still in the 1010 football world cup where Australia will beat England and get to the FINAL!!!...
That is our ultimate goal…And We Will Achieve IT!!!
Complain about this postReally two very different teams played each other and the better organised won....
Complain about this postThe problem seems to be the schedule, preperation and the captaincy.
Schedule - England played about twice as many tests than Aus since the 2005 Ashes...why?
Preperation - The Aussies showed their commitment by going on a 'Boot Camp' before the series. This was mocked by many but it worked! The warm-up games in Aus were totally hopeless....no one cared...not even the crowd! And then suddenly the heat is on in Brisbane and the whole team looks like it has not got a clue! The Aussies were so focused it was frightening...men and boys!
Captaincy - Botham could not do it...and neither can Fred. I think a batsman who goes in early is the answer as they have time to plot and survey the situation...this is critical. Freddie would have played a great deal better if he was driven rather than being the driver!
You have to be playing really well to beat the Aussies; anything less and its murder! I have no idea what we can do about he World Cup...could be painful!
"Funnily enough New Zealand, typically the dark horse in the One Day arena, should be favourites to take out the series. They are one of few teams legitemetly capable of beating Australia in Oz, and provided they don't choke against a resurgent English side, they should have the focus and preparation to take it out."
One of the biggest myths in cricket is the Kiwi hold over Australia. Since the Champions Trophy in Sri Lanka (02/03), Australia have won 18 of the last 20 games against New Zealand! The 20/20 is a toss of the coin game but if Australia get up there I would not be backing against them going undefeated through the entire summer - Shane Bond is about the only man standing in the way of the whitewash continuing over into the limited over series.
Complain about this postRe David Drew post #9. To make sure the powers that be get the message, simply link this article vis email to the PCA. You will find a David Graveny address there as well!
Complain about this postHave done this already on behalf of a mate who has spent a fortune "down under" watching this horror show.
As a Brit. abroad I am bitterly disappointed. Not only do we under perform at football, we elect to do the same at cricket! National pride must be at a an all time low.
Complain about this postPerhaps we should take on the American attitude of demanding/expecting results regardless of the situation?
What annoys me is when England say they are optimistic about 2009 ashes. There is so much cricket between now and 2009 including the world cup. They were so focussed on ashes during champions trophy and screwed up at all ends. Get a grip and play hard cricket. And stop complaining and cribbing about conditions , injuries , lack of practise etc etc . Sack Fletcher , make strauss the captain and let Flintoff focus on his batting and bowling.
Complain about this postSorry, not post 17, was referring to the enlightening post by SwamyCricketAnanda
Complain about this postAs a Brit. abroad I am bitterly disappointed. Not only do we under perform at football, we elect to do the same at cricket! National pride must be at an all time low.
Complain about this postPerhaps we should take on the American attitude of demanding/expecting results regardless of the situation?
Tony Greig, he said it yet again, the 1921 Whitewash, "that was after the war."
I'll write it again and hope that he might read this or that someone might read it to him.
The Australians were in that war, as they were at the Sudan, at the Boer war, the Second World War, the Korean War, Vietnam and currently they are in Iraq.
60,000 dead in WW1 and only 300,000 went, all volunteers, that's 20% killed in action Tony.
I would like someone to give me similar information about the South Africans; but I know this for sure the Australians held out in Tobruk in WWII, not so the South Africans, all tail-enders from what I read.
Get over it Tony; A Whitewash is a Whitewash is a Whitewash.
As for OBE and MBE awards well the Compton-Miller medal, now that is an award, well deserved, and Tony, in case you missed it it went to an Australian!
Complain about this postA message to this bunch of wasters, including Fletcher and Graveney:
"You let your country down".
And Flintoff ain't no captain (predictably).
Trite, inarticulate and banal, he was tactically bereft on the field.
Mahmood's lazy missed stumping on Day 3 in Sydney summed this bunch of so called "professional sportsman" up.
And the only success of the Tour is a self publicising South African who plays more for his next deal in "Hello" than any love of the Old Country.
The ECB should refund the Barmy Army, and Fletcher, Graveney and Flintoff should walk.
An absolute disgrace.
Complain about this postIts hard being an englishman in aussie during an ashes series, we never have learnt the meaning of the word proffesional like the aussies have, and after your among them for a while the difference is stark, the training and fitness even at the lower levels of the game matches the competativeness and attitudes of professionals elsewhere.
Complain about this postYoungster are well catered for and EVERYONE gets a game, the system works and the truth is Australia coulld put out two or three competative sides any day of the week and give anyone esle a good game, so maybe the "inquiry" should be looking outward for a change, you see our experts, ingrained in our system, just dont cut the mustard and our best could be better if nurtured properly from and early age.
It has been a joy to listen to the English commentators like Jonathan, mixed in with Skulls dry wit on the ABC. I agree with the review process, as any good 360 degree feedback should i.e., it promotes continuous improvement.
It was an absolute joy having the Barmy Army provide oodles of spirit and colour to the game.
Not so much a joy; it was a pity the English players didn't live up to expectations; and, I think our Aussie stadiums/cricket grounds will HAVE to provide dedicated bays for the Barmy Army and Aussie Fanatics to come together to enhance the majesty and colour of the occasion.
Lastly, why shouldn't the Urn stay with each winning side, but naturally not exposed to the celebratory bubbly champers.
Complain about this postAs far as I am concerned, this is English cricket's worst moment since it took wooden spoon honours in 1999 aganst New Zealand. That was the nadir of a decade of inept cricket, and hardly surprising. But years later, with all the best ingredients of the Hussain-Vaughan-Fletcher era well-mixed and highly successful too, this farce of an Ashes is a thorough diappointment to all who witnessed England's resurrection over the years. That the same same team which contributed one of Test cricket's greatest memories last year now gives us one of England's worst ever is astounding. A whole generation of so-called lesser England players managed to avoid such humiliation since the 1990s, but this team has outdone them, deservingly or not. Mr. Agnew, I find it hard to believe any hopes of English cricket picking itself up in the near future are realistic--with all the hard work since 2000, what more needs to be done for England to be consistently world-class?
Complain about this postThe professionalism, determination and focus shown by the Aussies was admirable from beginning to end.
Complain about this postThe ECB should take note, winning the ashes back was a mission from the day it was lost and it accomplished with pride. I can't help but congratulate the Aussie team.
My only wish is we take our heads out of the sand and understand coming second is actually last place.
Putting on a good show is just not acceptable
england were never going to win -
i mean which english player is good enough to make it into the Australian team?
NONE!!
Complain about this postIn the past the convicts in Australia were given a flogging for doing anything wrong.
Any minor indiscretion. I think that the Australian cricketers have decided
that when England stole the Ashes last year that it was Australia's turn to
give the English a flogging.
I hope the English cricket team hav learnt a lesson. Don't even think about winning the Ashes again.
Complain about this postIt has been consistently written that England didn't prepare well enough for the series. I agree with that fact and I can't understand that the England Hierachy didn't push for a better prepartion from the beginning. To my knowledge the decision for scheduling warm up matches are arranged between ECB and the ACB prior to a series taking place, therefore why should the blame go to the team and coaching staff.
While on tour though, all players should be continuously fine tuning themselves to the conditions, whether playing in a warm up match or just bowling, batting for long spells in the nets. Eg Harmison bowling everyday in the nets, and getting the confidence from bowling down the pitch until he knows he has it. Harmison was showing signs of his rythm problems in the Pakistan tour in England as well as the ICC Champions Trophy in India. There were no surprises with his results from the series.
Was it possible that Giles was ever bowling better than Panesar prior to the Ashes. Panesar had proven himself to be the best spinner Engalnd had selected in a long time.
To be honest everyone will make a comment in hindsite, it happened when Australia lost the Ashes 15 months ago. Everyone were calling for Ponting, and Buchanan's resignation after that series.
I don't think England approached this series correctly, but that has been the case in previous series of Australia anyway. The difference this time is that they had a team to be competitive.
A perfect example is what India have achieved under Chappell. He has re-established the team in terms of the structure of leadership, and ignited the fighting characteristics for a team to compete over five days every session. Coaching is so important to the team. Fletcher has been around and he should prepare and/or assist the players psychologically for most situations. I didn't see evidence of that.
I believe England have the ability to regain the winning attitude they had before and after the Ashes of 2005. I hope they can now focus on the World Cup to do that. There is time.
My final comment is that whatever the result in the World Cup this year, or even Ashes 2009 or even 2010, the fact is Australia will fight with that ANZAC spirit. We have England to thank for that.
Complain about this postAs an outsider looking in (i'm South African) I take my hat off to the Aussies. When it comes to Test cricket they are bullet proof. Their mixture of street smarts, professionalism and uncanny ability to get under the skin of their opposite numbers is an awe to watch.
The English seemed not to care one bit. The interviews with the English coach and captain before and after each test showed a picture of non-chalantness. Where is the emotion? Yes, 2005 was a bit overdone and over-celebrated for such a narrow win but at least you could see and sense the passion. For a foreigner to be your best batsman and be the only one fighting back says a lot for the English side and the current development structure in England.
Although we Saffers are even more pathetic than England at the 5 day game we are using our strong points to be clinical in the one-day version. We beat both Aus (with one game being "the greatest one day game ever" 438/9) and Eng in 2006. Maybe England could follow suit. One Day cricket is a true test for bowlers and fielders and could be the key to getting the spirit back. In 2006 England seemed to be focussing solely on the Ashes and didn't care about any of the one-day tourney's. A key maybe to their demise in the Ashes?
Complain about this postSo why are Aussies more naturally competitive than the English?
The thing that really stood out in these matches was that if Australia found themselves in trouble, someone would stand up and come to the rescue with a 100 or more. When England found themselves in trouble, they'd just dig a deeper hole for themselves.
Obviously Australia was the better team, but this England team seemed to lack any confidence and belief from the word go. The Ashes were lost on the first Brisbane morning
Complain about this postI have read Justin Langers comments about his pride and honour on wearing the Baggy Green .
If only it meant as much to the England players to wear our cap as it does to Australia.- This is the impression that is given
There are those of us who love the game who can only dream about playing it at the highest level, and would kill to have the oppurtunity to do so, and fight like crazy to to do our best.
Those with the ability and who get the chance need to have this kind of attitude. Only then will we achieve success
Complain about this postif you remember 2005 England only just one the Ashes. Even on the final day with Pieterson dropped, the urn could still have gone back (not literally) with the Aussies.
Complain about this postComing in under prepared, with out Vaughan, Tresco and Jones was always going to be very very difficult, however they didn't give the impression they were up for it.
Yes - there are benfits of Read, Cook etc but simply not good enough....you couldn't imagine the Aussie team doing the same...
A key question in the washup of this Ashes blitzkrieg is this: Did England's lack of preparation stem from arrogance or mismanagement?
Complain about this postThe biggest disaster that could come from this series is a wholesale purge (of players not necessarily ECB and other manager types).
Once the team failed early in the series there was no way Australia was going to let them get up off the mat. it is like expecting a relatively novice boxer to get up off the mat after Tyson has thumped him for a couple of rounds.
This Australian team is one of the best of all time. In the end, it was a pleasure to watch the Australians play irrespective of the pain felt at the way the English played.
Flintoff captained in the same way he plays - with his heart, he is learning to use his head. Some of his field positions were "interesting" at the SCG but he changed them and got on with it.
Vaughan should come back at Captain but leave Freddie as vice captain. Let him learn like Ponting did from Waugh.
The best thing management could say to the team is "that was painful, now get on with it". If they go in for an extended navel gazing exercise then they will merely compound the problem.
England does not want to be blooding a whole new group of players in 09 at the ashes. They need to build on the current team and give them a few more years experience.
The worst thing about this Ashes will be reading all the column inches written by "horrified" and "dismayed" overweight journalists who filled the pubs of sydney for most of the Test and whose sole achievement in life is to destroy too many trees so they can write page after page of absolute cr*% about: the need to stand up and be counted, true spirit, the Botham spirit and such like. The only spirit most of them know comes in shots.
Complain about this postAccept that we saw a great team demolish a mediocre team and leave the players to work out whether they are going to win the next Ashes or go back to their traditional role. I can assure you the Australians will not give them up lightly even without Warne.
Well I wouldn't count on there being a radical overhaul in the game. The counties have too much control. I watched England go down to 3 consecutive 5-0 defeats to the WIindies in the 1980s and I don't remember any great changes then.
Complain about this postAlso I remember a senior English administrator in 1999 when England were bottom of the pile saying that there was nothing wrong with English cricket. It may even have been David Morgan himself.
This was a victory of Aussie professionalism competence, team spirit, confidence and excellence over english arrogance incompetence,mediocrity.disunity and over hype.
Complain about this postThe Ashes series should be played more frequently so we can rub your noses in it more often.
Just you wait and see what the KIwis are going to do to you in the Rugby World Cup
Agree with you Jonathan.
However have to disagree strongly with you Victoreen .
"cocky, rude and lacking in good breeding"
- I am humbled by the way the Australian captain Ricky Pointing was gracious in victory, he didn't laud it over Freddie and the team. Lets not confuse rude with aggression, as I'm sure a few replays will show Monty being rude to the umpires on a few occasions. And as for breeding, hhmm, football supporters in the UK come to mind as a fine example.
"Collingwood could have replied that Warne got a cap and gown, an honorary accolade from the University of Southampton, despite the fact that he does not read. Warne publicly said that he does not read.
- I thought Warnes exchanges with Collingwood were quite amusing and witty especially for a man that doesn't read. Warne is not afraid to show his weakness. However what a general on the field. I am sure being an anglophile you can roll out the various greats of history gone past that didnt read.
"Too many bad decisions against the English
- We must have missed all the bad decisions against Australia in 2005 and this current series. Bad decisions don't loose a game. Its all swings and round abouts.
Well at the end of the last fours years the scorecard is Australia 6 England 2.
Complain about this postThe harder i practice the luckier i get, said the great gary player....nuff said
Complain about this postI wonder if England believed all the hype and talk from English supporters and media that Australia were too old, etc.? Considering the English team's record since the 2005 Ashes, why wasn't it thought that that series was a bit of an anomoly? And it seems that they were ambushed by a much more hungry and determined foe who was playing on their home patch. This means Aus were used to the types of balls used, weather conditions, pitches, travel experience, etc. which was never going to be overcome with the miniscule preparation they were scheduled on. And what little preparation time there was, was squandered on 14 a-side games. Fletcher's justification for these games was that they worked in the past - but that was against weaker opposition. Fletcher's smarmieness during and after the 2005 Ashes (remember his reaction to Ponting's run-out?) and his immense failure this time (selection of patently unfit or unsuitable players for example) should be enough for him to seriously consider handing back his gong.
It will be interesting to see if Aus can beat their 16 wins in a row next summer.
Complain about this post5-0? A fitting result after the over the top celebrations England put on last time. MBE's? they'll be wanting them back I think and like in the UK will Australia issue an Ashes postage stamp that conveniently is the exact cost of sending a postcard to the UK? Ahhh revenge is so so sweet. Will the Aussies rub it in or just let the pack in England do it for them?
Complain about this postAggers great coverage a joy to be a part of. Thanks mate.
I for one never understood why this series held so much promise. Before arriving here for the defense of Ashes, England had done nothing right. Their batsmen were patchy at best. The bowlers were even worse. Their attitude in the last six months spoke volumes about their ability to put up a fight. Winning is a habit and it’s carried from one series to the next. England put a predictably dismal performance in India for the champions trophy while still maintaining that their focus was with the Ashes. This is a silly attitude to have where one decides in their mind which series they are going to perform and which series is merely an exercise in futility.
The selection of Giles and Jones ahead of the more promising Monty and Read was baffling. After the Perth test Monty contribution was minimal, however his exuberance and sheer enthusiasm was enough indications that he bowled with a view to take wickets. Giles was merely a tourist recruited to impart some non-threatening bowling and occasionally spill chances of key opposition batsmen.
England should take the first flight out of Australia to avoid any further humiliation and work hard towards the next Ashes which in all honesty they will loose………
Complain about this postEngland should now challenge the Aussies for a 5 game Soccer series to settle score.
Complain about this postI fail to see how Messrs Graveney and Fletcher can retain their positions. At the age of nearly 60 I am well used to England's sporting failures, but nothing has been such an embarrassment as this. England capitulated at every turn and displayed a lack of moral fibre. Anybody who maintains that the team was adequately prepared physically and mentally is in a state of delusion. The ECB was also in gross dereliction of duty in failing to re-engage Troy Cooley; but they're probably happy in their ivory tower.
Complain about this postNotice how Harmioson improved the more he bowled. Statham and his ilk bowled hundreds if not thousands of overs in a season and were consistent. Tobe good at something you must do it all the time. Gym work and resting are no good to achieve consistent good results at bowling. There must be a link between all this non cricket relate exercise and the injuries that modern cricketers are bedevilled with. As for non walkers I used to tell children I taught that if they cheated they were only cheating themselves. If I have an8 on a hole at golf and put down a 6 that would not make me feel good. Similarly if I knew I was out scoring 10 and went on to get 70 odd I would not feel right.
Complain about this postAs a dual citizen of both countries, well done Aussies, I lived in the UK during the 2005 series and have taken great pleasure watching Australia take their revenge. I'm looking forward to seeing the English respond and I'm certain it will be more level next time.
Re : the comment by Victoreen Patrick, 06:29 AM on 05 Jan 2007
I'm sure Warney can read, otherwise where did all those alledged text messages come from ?
Oh, if someone was born and raised barefoot in a hut in a 3rd world country settled by white imperialists would that mean that they had good breeding ? Grow up!
Complain about this postOn the money Johnathan!, as an Englishman living in Perth Western Australia it was even more humiliating to see a young underprepared yet talented England side capitulate at several key moments during the five tests.
Complain about this postAs the father of two boys who are passionate about Englands football team (16 year old) and Englands cricket team (12 year old)it is hard to keep their interest in English sport up as they both are let down by the aparent lack of intensity and passion shown by Englands two premier sports teams.
My 12 year old plays cricket in Perth and is a very talented opener/number 3 batsmen as well as a genuine r/arm offspinner (he does have dual nationality if your reading this Mr Graveney). He plays in a side that has at least two or three genuinely good young Australian prospects, the system here encourages that even at this early age you are to play with intensity and from this comes a passion for the game and your team.
I wonder if English junior cricket is played with the same ideal or is it purely 'just for fun', and from this comes Englands'play' for your country compared to Australias 'win' for your country approach, it does appear to produce a very competetive type of player even from a young age, by the way this approach seems to be in all forms of sport.
Englands 2005 ashes victory in my opinion was enhanced to some degree by the fact that the nation and the crowds got behind England and somehow transfered their passion and pride into to the team and this along with gutsy and determined play (ala Punters boys this time round) achieved a more focused and sharper unit
As you said hopefully it will be a lesson learned keep up the good work.
No excuses, England were dire. It will take a while for the extent of this situation to sink in with me. BUT, the idea that Vaughan is hiding and shirking (Post No.6) is offensive. I'm surprised it was posted. As for the Adulation of Aggers, wasn't it he who opted for Giles over Monty!
Complain about this postCant believe that Flintoff is talking about revenge in 2009.
The gap between these two teams is so enormous any catching up will take a great deal longer.
The first thing to do is to admit that we were totally outclassed.
It is also pointless talking about Trescothick, Vaughan and Jones as if they will make all the difference. Trescothick should not be chosen as he has twice let the side down; it is gighly ublikely Vaughan will ever be a force as a batsman again, and Jones will always be injured!
Complain about this postWhy has that "idiot" Flintoff thought it acceptable to state in an interview that "Things can only get better"? How do these people sleep? I work in engineering and I know for certain that if I performed as consistently bad as those fifth rate, under-active under-achievers I'd be out of a job in seconds flat. How many times do we have to listen to, whoever in the England set up says it, "We'll do better next time" Absolutely pathetic England, a shame on you all.
Complain about this postMake no mistake though, a more deserved victory was never won.Well done Oz! Fantastically well played.
"England should now challenge the Aussies for a 5 game Soccer series to settle score."
Do you really need to be reminded!!!!
Complain about this postEngland should now challenge the Aussies for a 5 game Soccer series to settle score
Al - using the last Football World Cup as a measuring stick me thinks the Aussies would win that game as well. :-)
Trueblue, although i think "Vicki's" comments were utter rubbish and hogwash they weren't racist per se...unless you're saying Aussies are another race from the conventional caucasian, african, asian, aboriginee etc. races.
Interesting comments from all though.
Complain about this postWILL THE REAL CRICKET TEAM NOW STAND UP.
Complain about this postNot this lot of ill prepared name in the right place squad.
17 PERSONS REQUIRED.
PLS NOTE.
You will be required to bowl at least 150Kph
score an average of 60 with bat.
catch ball when fielding.
keep mouth shut when required.
take directions from a captain who came from another suburb other than yours.
and above all.
ENJOY PLAYING FOR ENGLAND.
"England should now challenge the Aussies for a 5 game Soccer series to settle score."
Do you really need to be reminded!!!!
Complain about this postI don't agree that they were trying. The body language was all wrong - this was as gutless and limp-wristed an effort as I've seen. Even Graeme Hick showed more bottle, that's how bad these losers were. As for the Aussies trying to frustrate our batters into wayward shots - let Boycott come in and teach them how to defend. Let the Aussies have 10 maidens in a row, if they stay wicketless, they'll chenge lines and can be attacked. It's a mind game, but our players don't seem to have the basic intelligence to play. Shocking. Totally shocking.
Complain about this postHello Aggers,
Congratulations to the Aussies on a series of fine, professional perfomances. As for England, from Harmison's first ball, to Giles's dropped catch, we have been the unfortunate witnesses to a lack of dedication, a lack of fight/guts/steel
which is frightening for the future. The low point must surely be the loss of the 2nd test, when, after declaring at 551-6 at lunch on the 3rd day, England still contrived to lose the match in a display of incompetence which was mind-blowing.
Where do we go from these devastating defeats?*Flintoff must give up the captaincy and concentrate on his batting and bowling
*The following players must be axed : Harmison, Hoggard, Mahmood, Read/Jones, Collingwood
*The management team must all go
I shudder to think what our 2nd XI will produce in the ODI's.
Conclusion : A thoroughly depressing tour and an insult to those supporters who took time off work and paid good money to travel across the world to support a bunch of second-rate, over-hyped, overpaid, incompetent, poorly-motivated and ill-prepared, so-called "sportsmen."
What a contrast to the Australian "Dad's Army" team, whose will to win was apparent from the very start.
Ian.
Complain about this postproblems: 1) flintoff struggles when captain. 2) missing simon jones and did not take broad. 3) should have taken mark butcher. 4) flintoff's ankle still is not right. 5) anderson played. 6) mahmood played. 7) both keepers ar second rate batsmen at best. 8) did not play monty in vital test matches. 9) cook not ready yet, thought he was poor when we needed big ppening stands. 10) strauss out of form. Warny summed it up MBE for Collingwood its is a joke, its not the players fault they got given it, but now they should be stripped of them. They go to work just like anyone else, they have a good year at the office and they are heros, then a bad one, well they should be treated the opposite! if i performed that badly at work i would get the sack. Best get it right lads (not just the players) for 2009.
Complain about this post"Where should the English players drop off those MBE's?"
Complain about this postand where should the australians pick up theres from?? if england get an MBE for their 2005 victory surely the australians should be knighted for their 2006-07 performance
In my view there was only one England star this Ashes series: Aggers.
What an absolute champion! Congratulations on a fine job.
Complain about this posttetley asks "A key question in the washup of this Ashes blitzkrieg is this: Did England's lack of preparation stem from arrogance or mismanagement?"
Complain about this postAs an Aussie, I say that England's defeat has come from a total lack of professsionalism on the part of the England management and players. Part of Australia rebuilding under Alan Border was that our team had to develop a professional attitude in relation to fitness as a no 1 and then developing their skills. But it strikes me that one area that really showed the difference was in fielding. As an aexmaple look at Symonds' hitting the middle stump. Any England players up to that elvel - I think not.
Why did England lose this test series? A lot of theories have been postulated about lack of preparation, lack of key players, lack of the captain, picking the wrong players in the first two tests, etc....
Has anyone considered that England may have lost this becuase they were totally outplayed by a better team?
Far from being the has-been 'dads army' we expected we found that modern fitness techniques and professionalism means that cricketers can play on very effectively into their mid to late 30's? Have we forgotten that Gooch was opening for England when he was 41? The Australians ruthlessly and professionally rolled England simply by playing better cricket than England.
But what of the problems?
Preparation and tour matches: the cricket calendar is not what it used to be. Cricket is a fully professional sport and instead of the old summer and winter test series all nations are playing as many as 4-5 test series per year as well as all the one day series, 20-20 series and ICC series... There is simply no way of arriving in Australia months ahead of time and playing half a dozen tour matches to 'get prepared'. Our cricketers need to be fully prepared at all times and be versatile enough to perform in all conditions. The Australians have done this now for years and won series after series around the world. England have to get this level of professionalism and backbone as well.
Michael Vaughn MIA: What mystical power does Vaughn bring to England that his presence would have changed the result? Early on it felt like he was being used as a bogeyman early on to try and scare the Australians into thinking he might be back. He played 2 tour matches and made 0 and 9 before it was admitted he wouldn't play in the tests (though he looked 'sharp' making the 9 apparently...). I'm sure the Aussies would have welcomed a player with that sort of preparation and form into the England team! Or is it that the English players are a rudderless mob without Vaughn to inspire them? Is there not another player in the England team that can inspire the rest of the team? A sad situation if that's the case!
Flintoff as captain: yes, very probably the wrong choice as fast bowlers should simply have to concentrate on steaming in and getting teams out, but remember he was the one that wanted the captaincy and most people supported it enthusiastically... before this series anyway.
Declaring in Adelaide: ok, so the game was lost but not because of the declaration, it was because of the hopeless capitulation in the 2nd innings. If 550 was too early what should it have been? Bat on to 800 and kill the game off? Play for the draw? England were 1-0 down at the time and rightly wanted to win the test and go to Perth at 1-1, not ensure that they didn't lose. How many people thought the declaration was a bad thing with Australia 29/1 and looking a bit shaky at the close of play on day 2? The game was lost partly because England failed to bowl Australia out in the 1st innings for a low enough score but mainly because of the complete failure with the bat in the 2nd innings. Had they made as few as 200 the Australians would never have had a look in.
Not picking Panesar (particularly): he took 5 in the first innings in Perth and the immediate typical overreaction was to hail him immediately as a hero and virtually the saviour of English cricket. After that he only managed to get another 3 wickets and was battered about. He'll make quite a bowler one day but I don't think he can be considered the difference between the teams in the first two tests.
Well done Australia, its been a virtuoso performance and with any luck you will have shocked England into fundamental changes in structure and mindset so that 2009 is as good a series as 2005. Let's just stop looking for excuses!
Complain about this postThe Aussie team that has just completed the whitewash job has helped to highlight a major flaw in the English cricketing set-up. The State Matches last four days which is a much more useful grounding for future Test players whereas the county treasurers in England want more ground-filling events like the 50,40,20-over 'Mickey Mouse' matches. County Championship matches could, in their view, be consigned to the scrapheap. Also the Treasurers are very pleased to be able to recruit a 'big name', or on occassions two or three, to keep the turnstiles ticking over. England has to go back to good honest hard graft and must ignore the 'result in a day while you watch' attitude of a certain TV channel. While Michael Vaughan saw it useful 'to be around' I wish I knew.
Complain about this postLooking forward to the next BBC Sports Personalities of the Year Awards.
Team of the year
Englands Ashes Test Team!
What a difference a couple of years can make!
Complain about this post"A National Disgrace!"
Complain about this postIts a pity in a way the Ashes arent played every yr if not for the very lop-sided games us Aussies have to put up with but just to hear Aggers and our own Kerry O'keefe talk bout the match in progress .Fair dinkum you two would be worth the admission price just to go n sit listen to .. as of your team ..least said the better .
Complain about this postI watched David Graveny and a few has beens (Gough, Cork, Ali) at the HK cricket 6's in November 2006. They were disinterested. A year before I had shook Mr Graveny's hand and thanked him for winning the Ashes.
The people are not right anymore and with time and the right attitude things can be restored - Lord McLaurin made English cricket what it was in 2005 - it needs another leader and a bit of fear to bring the balance back again. Quality time and Comfort zones are for wimps.
Complain about this postThe way that we have lost all the test matches
Complain about this postis terrible, there appeared to be a lack of commitment on some players part.
The first mistake was making Flinty captain he went the same way as the "Great Both" you can't
burden match winning players with lots of extra pressure then expect them to bowl,bat and field
to a high standard.I believe that those sort of players need to be a free spirit, when they enjoy
themselves they benefit the team.
I also believe that we should have a manager
just like a football team who picks the side,picks the squad, and if the results don't happen get sacvked, that way we get rid of the enthusiastic
amatuers out of our national team affairs.
The truth is we could on for hours asking all sorts of questions but it all boils down to the fact
that (a) we weren't good enough and (b) weren't
professtional enough.
P.S. not looking forward to the summer.
It was obvious that Australia would win back the ashes after the euphoria in 2005. English cricket got carried away in 2005 and stopped thinking which leads to bad organization and preparation and inevitably lacked the desire to and the vision to win. And that is down to the man at the top. It is time to look for a new face as coach and a new direction.
Complain about this postAll credit to the Aussies they learnt from that defeat and had done their homework.
Mostly agree with you Aggers but really....was there any other result...on home soil?
On paper the Aussies are chock full of world greats....this is a young England team. Form going into the Ashes was fair at best for England, and unstoppable for Australia. As a Pom in Oz I've witnessed many, many whitewashes in the last 6 years I've been here. Aside from India a few years ago, this was one of the better tussles I've seen. England really had their moments. Every other team in the world would also have been whitewashed I believe.
Despite the ungracious claims of some Australians on this board, England fully deserved the '05 win (bad decisions for both sides), and if anything the the final scoreline flattered Australia (what would they have done without Warne?)...England tried to throw it away on several occasions.
Comments such as this being the worst ever English team are pathetic. They would have competetive with any other team but Australia....learn from it! Move on! Sacking Fletcher won't help one bit. Lauded in '05, the man doesn't become a bad coach overnight.
I don't remember seeing Oz play better as a team (backed up some of Ponting's comments). Simply brilliant. Well done!
Complain about this post'Freddie Five-O' (as a new nickname) - incentive enough to challenge for the 'five' to be the other way round in 2009! Australia gave away the 2005 Ashes as much as England won it. A lesson in itself, but a lesson learnt by Australia.
Complain about this postJonathan Agnew essentially highlights two issues to explain England's disastrous Ashes sojourn - lack of adequate preparedness and player discipline.
Both are very valid and aptly raised. But, in my view, there are two other key issues he hasn't touched upon - complacency following the 2005 Ashes win, and an obvious unwillingness to accept reality.
England were on a roll following their series victories against WI, NZ, SA and the Ashes win in 2005 was the icing on the cake. However, in the euphoria that followed (victory parades, champagne parties, MBEs) some stark realities were forgotten, or perhaps consciously ignored.
Firstly that all the series wins prior to the Ashes were against teams which, at that time, were in the bottom half of the ICC rankings.
Secondly, the Ashes itself was a pretty close thing, and two, if not three, matches could easily have gone the other way.
Thirdly, that in the following three series against PK, IN, and SL, England's true calibre was shown up, and injuries notwithstanding, the overall performances were uninspiring, to say the least.
All this, however, plus the pathetic showing in virtually every ODI tournament since 2005, was brushed aside using the argument that "the Ashes are the only important thing".
Sadly, to the unbiased cricket enthusiast, the writing was on the wall for some time now, and the whitewash comes as no surprise.
Complain about this post"Where should the English players drop off those MBE's?"
The MCG will be just fine.
Complain about this postThe general consesus seems to be that England played poorly. The truth is, England played as well as Australia let them. I think most of you should take your blinkers off and concede just what a great Australian team this is. 5-0 was terrific. I, like many others, weren't interested in watching a contest - we just wanted to watch the Aussies thrash the Poms. We did so, easily.
Complain about this postAgree with Aggers sentiment - it's a little embarassing that 2005 was met with such a celebration of what it's now clear was mediocrity. I was out in Melbourne when the "family section" of the tour was in full swing, and it seemed like the players were part of a busmans holiday. Given that the Australians man-for-man are a better set of players, with some of the best ever...realistically England were going to have to out-prepare and out-fight them to have a chance. Neither of which England either appreciated or followed through on. The Australians responded to the loss in 2005 like the best winners do - they observed the pain of defeat and vowed to never let that happen again. It will be interesting to see whether there is the stomach/ desire within the ECB and the players to not be contented losers when 2009 comes around. I doubt they will respond the way the Australians did in 2005...but i hope that they do.
Complain about this postNonetheless there are some good players around - many of whom were on this trip. Keen to see Ed Joyce get into the side as his mentality is akin to the best of the Australians - his talent is undoubtable, but his work ethic and desire is even more outstanding but sadly untested at the highest level. That ethic ironically is borne out of having to struggle harder and from less crafted beginnings than the rest of the England crew...try learning your cricket in Ireland - you make your own skill/ luck/ desire.
This was pitiful but predictable. My partner work me up this morning and said its cricket dave!! I said look we would not have lasted till lunch, oh dear how predictable or what!! This team has been undone by the psychology of Australia and their complete focus on winning, they took the loss as an national afront, they had to put it right and simply focused on that. We wrote biographies, partied, got pictures in Hello magazine and became celebs - what a total waste. Guys failures do not stay celebs, they become also rans. Do the decent thing hand back your MBEs, try and win them back in 2009. This was my lowest point in 35 years of watching cricket, I have never seen such an abject group of people.
Complain about this postMany of the comments here are absolutely correct.
The cricket team, especially Flintoff need to stop the talk and cease to continue say how they are going to bounce back (as they have done all tour) and actually just go out and do it.
Complain about this postEngland approached this tour with a supercillious attitude and took players along who were not fit physically and mentally and it has come back and bit them on the bum big style - GOOD.
One of the most important things when any team goes on tour is team spirit and the bonding of said team, this never happened with this team and as for the debacle on Christmas day where some players went and did their own thing with their families absolutely ludicrous.
England need to address the basics and the fans need to stop kidding themselves
Complain about this postAgree with all you say Jonathan.
1 - Its a job if everybody who got depressed at the thought of going to work quit and leave the whole world wouold be up the creek. So if you cant hack it stay at home in the first place.
2 - Stuff going to see Kylie and Elton John and co and do some more bloody practicing instead. Was Jones in the team so we could read what he had for his breakfast in the free paper? Pick players on form Read and Monty had to be in from the word go.
Finally Anderson just is not good enough at this level. Bowled like Dizzy did for Austrailia in the last tour. We would have been better served having someone like Dalrymple in hey he might not get a wicket but he is a better batsman than most of the team from what I saw.
However well done Austrailia when you lose you have to take it on the chin and England fans have plenty of experience at that in all the games we invented.
Complain about this postThe Ashes - England were beaten by a combination of experience, application and,more importantly, a bloody-minded determination and grit shown by the Aussie team. I dont think that there is a huge difference in the talent, but,significantly, the 'gutsy' English batsmen (Pieterson and Collingwood and Bell) top the English
averages.
Sure, the young team need a bit of time to develop, but the character of the individual is at least as important as the talent and experience.
Complain about this postWhy is it that everybody else can see where the problems have been on this tour except for those responsible for it?
Its all very well Duncan Fletcher saying that we will sit down and review the processes and look at where we went wrong but I can't see what good this is going to do. The people that are going to carry out this review are the same people that are responsible for the poor preparation, poor selection judgements and poor management of the tour as a whole.
Like JA says if this is going to be carried out it should be done in public so we everybody knows what has been asked and what the solutions are. Although i doubt very much that this will happen. We obviously didn't learn from last winters tours where we went into the Tests underprepared and with some players only half fit so why will it be any different this year?
Complain about this postIt's hard to see where Australia's supremacy ends and England's ineptitude begins.
I think it might be the way Australia always had a couple of players who would save them if they were in trouble. England always hoped a couple of players would get them out of the trouble they were already in.
Complain about this postWhat can one say? Offer Ricky Pontin tons of money and ask him to coach England for the next Ashes series.
Australia were never troubled, never frightened, and even when England placed a hugh score, the Aussies never look worried or concerned.
England lacked passion and presence. Australia attacked both in bat and field, and the days of yesteryear with England prancing around London are a far distant memory.
Duncan Fletcher and Freddie, what went wrong?
Complain about this postFuther to Jonathan's blog above, one thing we cannot loose focus of is that the England side is a relatively young side. The Warnes, McGraths & Langers of this world are all mid 30's and retiring at their peaks. We all know that there were a number of issues surrounding why we didnt perform from preparation through to squad selection. The Ashes have gone and that's that. We need to regroup, probably make some changes from the top down and focus on the future of English Cricket. If the Ashes tour was a school report it would have said 'easily distracted, must do better'
Complain about this postHaving listened to Fletcher and Flintoff I'm sure I watched a different series to them ! Thet say we were competetive and that this side can grow.We didn't have one player that would make the aussie side . The ECB need to get tough and get rid of the old boy network . Get some eager , hungry and angry men in this team .
Complain about this postWhilst this a sad day for English Cricket, it should be reflected that we were beaten by a fully committed and professional Australian side, in comparison, some of our play was sloppy, at best. I hope that the England management do not rely on the retirement of Warne and McGrath, to assume that we will beat future Australian teams. On the positive side, we have a nucleous of young quality players, and it was pleasing to see Panesar prove he has the ability to be a match winner, on any continent. It was also good to have a top quality 'keeper, in Read, behind the stumps, despite his poor batting, which must give confidence to the bowlers.
Complain about this postok ok, a humiliating whitewash, and the knives are out. Dont lets forget that we were playing a good side, to say the least, with one of the best if not the best spinner of all time along with a pace man out of the top draw. Oh and there are a couple of batsmen in there as well.
Complain about this postAs long as those who need to learn from the experience it will never be a total disaster.
Chin up. Be prepared. Roll on 2009 and a truly competitive series.
OZ again in 2009!
Complain about this postI do agree with much of what you have written above but Troy Cooley wasn't poached by Australia. I understand from the media that England were not prepared to let him sign a two year contract and so he walked, thus demonstrating yet again the unbelievable shortsightedness of the ECB board. This brings me to another point; for England to recover the Ashes we not only have to adopt a similar apporach to the one taken by Australia at the end of 2005 but also look hard and long at the people organising English cricket.I am deeply alarmed at listening to some of the things being quoted from the likes of Dave Morgan and Tom Graveney, who both seem to be under the misguided opinion that we lost becaue we missed a couple of key players and had a young inexperienced team. I believe like you that we were totally unprepared, Harmison's bowling was a disgrace for most of the tour and Strauss was completely out of touch. The whole matter of families and girlfirends on tour, needs to be looked at seriously. Finally the selection and captaincy are obvious areas which need to be immediately addressed althoug I understand that Flintoff is flying home due to his ankle, which will save a lot of embarrassment all round.
Complain about this postOne has to sympathize with the likes of Plunkett who has not bowled a ball in anger for the whole Test series and is now probably expected to step into the One Day side.
We need radical change and not polite tinkering at the top to turn things around.Fletcher has done very well for the most part but I think he has finally run out of ideas and should be allowed to go with dignity due to his excellent record.
A disappointing series but still worth polling who people think was England's best player in the series.
Complain about this postMy vote goes to Ian Bell who at least managed four 50s and took some catches in the field. (didn't he also take the most catches in the triumphant 2005 series?) Had more of the top order been more consistent and posted similar scores more regularly it could have been different. Cheers Ian - a pity you couln't get that elusive ton.
True, all too true!
Complain about this postThis total complete humiliating thrashing is not only fully deserved but it could not have been any other way.
The Aussies lost in 2005 because they were caught asleep and England bowled really well. England deserved to win and a fight to the wire was no more than they deserved as far as the ease of victory.
Yet almost immediately they were talking of world domination. Then it was off to get their MBE's. This was infuriatingly inappropriate and sowed the seeds for their downfall. Fact is although they bowled well in 2005 they were lucky to win. Yet they acted as if they were a genuinely superior team to the Aussies.
I can already assure you that the 2009 attempt to regain the Ashes is already lost. I say this because even the magnitude of this defeat still has not shaken them out of their platitudinous slumber, and if a 5-0 thrashing coupled with the occasional record like 'the highest declared 1st innings score to lose a match in Test cricket. Ever.' did not wake them up then nothing will.
I present to you as a single humble microcosmic example, Anderson's comments about the Colly/Warne sledging...
"James Anderson yesterday described Collingwood as the best sledger in the team, but the key to the art is to pick the right target, usually a player lacking confidence." Yep that's Warnie alright, shy and fragile personality who has no belief in his own ability, easily crumbles under the slightest pressure.
What a fool. What a foolish comment. The right to safely sledge can only be earned with years of excellent cricket under intense pressure. Trying to sledge without having earned it only puts more pressure on oneself and is therefore not only futile but self destructive.
Complain about this postI love cricket but today I just feel an overwhelming sadness at the way we have capitulated in this series, albeit to a superior side.
Our bowlers seemed incapable of bowling the right length throughout the whole series and it reminded me so much of the past when cricketers such as Peter Martin were called in to toss another 4 ball at an Australian batsman. That combined with a muddled selection policy, batsman who can't concentrate and frankly, a captain out of his depth (and injusred to boot) has led this this humiliation.
Despite everyones feelings today, we MUST ensure that this series is looked upon not so much as a failure, but an enormous series of lessons learned. If we don't, we will sink back into cricket obscurity.
Complain about this postWhat depressed me is the way Englands batsman threw their wickets away time and time again with soft dismissals. Collingwood is not a top order batsman, yes he got a double century but he is not a world class number 4/5. The bowlers also looked incapable of putting 6 balls on the money and were lost for ideas - I am surprised they even had a plan of attack in their dressing room - it certainly went AWOL.
Complain about this postThe application was not there and Australia wanted it more - all credit to them against a very poor England side.
England are an absolute disgrace and don't bother coming back to England.
Complain about this postDear Johnathon,
Well, there we are then. A 5-0 drubbing by Australia to win this series of the Ashes.
I am disappointed to say the least but I take some cheer from having listened to the series in the car as I travel to work. The TMS commentary has kept me from going spare in the usual traffic on the M25.
Geoffrey has been his usual outspoken self and it has been nice to listen to some of the Australia commentators and their views.
It is quite an odd thing that as we listen you to all, you become alomst as freinds to us the listeners.
I have to say, well done on making your comments on Chris Read. The Jones / Read debate got quite vociferous and almost spiteful at times on the old TMS message board. I think you are right in that Read is no good enough to step up to Test level cricket. I did see him keep down at Canterbury in the Pakistan warm-up game against England A and he did score 150. His glove work was good and he is an agile keeper, but I think he is out of his depth as a batsman in the full test side.
I felt that in the absence of a skip then someone like Adams from Sussex could have been seconded not for his playing ability but because he knows the job of captaincy. And that is quite a tough statement to make being a Kent man myself.
On the batting line up. I have commented that a couple of experienced campaigners, Mark Butcher being one, could have been in the side. The balance between experience and youth was not right in the side.
Bowling. I am not sure where to start. We know our ranks are depleted but the quality of the reserves is not good enough to step in as replacements. I generalise here and don't think it is right to name names. I do think that the quality of coaching needs to improve and feel we can learn a lot from Glen McGrath and his metronomic style. Line and length as Geoffrey would say.
Coaching. Developing our coaches is paramount. The ECB must invest in coaches and facilities. Is there a chance that a coaches acadamy can be set up? Is the ECB that forward thinking? I am not sure.
Well, I have to sign off now - time for some work. Hope to see / listen to you again soon.
Yours sincerely,
Graeme Blundell.
Complain about this postRegarding a 5 game soccer series: it seems there are some with short memories here!
Complain about this postSadly, right to the end, England, and their acting captain, have been in denial that anything is wrong. Flintoff has talked much about the team showing character. However, talk is cheap. These are highly paid professionals who want to live the high life. Leave the family and significant others at home. Be professional - do not bring back an injured player back into the side because he is a mate - it gives the wrong message to the man 'in post' that they are only in the side as second best. It is time for Fletcher to go - he has done much for the side but new ideas are needed now. Flintoff should do the honourable thing and resign the acting captaincy. That is part of leadership - admitting when you have failed.
Complain about this postIf Andrew Flintoff really believes they tried their best, then we really are in deep trouble.
Complain about this postThis series was an embarrassment from ball one.
I was at the Gabba for the first ball of the series, and the crowd laughed at Harmison's pathetic delivery. I had looked forward to that moment for a long time, and I can tell you, it hurt.
I can't see one lesson that had been learned by any England player. Pietersen's final wicket was a carbon copy of his dismissal in the First Test... he played well all the previous afternoon, then gifted a catch in the first over of the next day. That's RUBBISH!
One word will sum up this England team - pathetic.
Can't wait for the Series DVD to be rushed out... what? No plans for one? There's a surprise.
Not one word of apology from the captain or the coach, or indeed any of the players, to the fans (especially those who spent considerable sums of money travelling to Australia). Not one "mea culpa". Pathetic.
Or is Freddy right, and everybody tried their utmost, 100% of the time, and were "just beaten by a better team"?
Complain about this postHarmison has proved a liability on tour. In an interview recently he said something like we would rather be at home than playing australia.
I want him out I dont want people like that representing my country, im sure he brings the rest of the squad down with his moaning.
I want strong characters with a real hunger, desire, drive and ambition in the team not weak minded wimps like HArmison.
Complain about this postWhan has England really dominated the Aussies. Probably 50 years back. So, don't dream of anything different for the next 50 years.
Complain about this postJonathan, I'm afraid nothing will change. A couple of home Test victories against lesser opposition will just paper over the cracks in the team. Too much bureaucracy in cricket and the talent in the country is thus being overlooked.
Complain about this postThis series simply underlined the fact that when the Aussies lose, it is usually a one off. I still believe England are a good test side and have the talent for the future. As usual, it is the media and the fans who expect the world out of them - they need to wise up to the fact that England are not world beaters, and be reasonable in their expectations.
Complain about this postIt's difficult to blame the players for our truly appalling defence of the Ashes because they have been playing under the most extreme pressure since Brisbane and were clearly grossly underprepared.
We regained the Ashes by dint of superhuman team effort and tremendous individual performances, even then it was a close run thing.
Why oh why did we go into the tour with several players who are only half fit physically and mentally.
Why oh why did we not have several proper competitive 4-day warm-up games to get our bowlers operating at t heir peak perfornance. By all accounts Harmison bowled really well in the second innings at Sydney!!! Didn't notice that the Aussie bowlers started the series at less than 100%.
The Aussies are a great side and I feel it is grossly insulting to them that we did not appear to take the Ashes seriously enough.
Sadly I feel the selectors let us down badly and should be replaced. The administrators should take a hard look at tour schedules to ensure that our touring sides get proper 1st class preparation next time round. Finally we must pick a fit squad...better to have inexperienced, highly motivated young players than half-fit old lags!!
Complain about this postHave managed to resist but must now have my say having heard Freddies post-match interview.
Apparently all this doom and gloom is a waste of time. England played well (presumably you don't count the number of times batsmen threw away wickets hooking, chasing wide balls - KP this morning was criminal - or getting run out not standing behind your crease, or getting stumped by going too far forward after Warner with one over of the day left, or getting caught in the deep with the side in trouble or not backing up properly to effect run outs, or not being able to consistantly bowl line and length). We showed lots of ability (!) and character (Second innings' in Adelaide, Sydney anyone?). And we have a good summer of test cricket to look forward to (in Freddies mind, the World cup is obviously not happening, or is at least not something to look forward to - OK maybe he has a point there).
Bottom line is that we have been hammered in 5/5 tests showing poor preparation and amateurish play. We have a good 1st XI, no strength in depth (Mahmood and Anderson look average and inconsistent, last summer Plunkett, Tremlett and Broad we also in squads - two of these need to stand up and make themselves un-droppable). We need a solid opening partnership - Cook has looked out of his depth opening this series and there has been no replacement available - this gives batsmen 3-5/6 a chance. We need players who are fit and have been playing - I'd take a slightly worse batsman or bowler with runs/overs under their belt than a guy who hasn't played for 12 months (Freddie, Giles). The 'keeper and the tail keep getting hammer for not scoring runs but failures by 1-6 have put the Aussies on the attack and those boys under too much pressure.
It's been a disaster from start to finish and Aggers is absolutely right - the planning of this tour needs to taken apart in all aspects, scheduling, selection, training/practice matches, to give the XI guys who go out into the middle the best chance of putting in a performance.
Complain about this postBonding ? have these players never met before, or played together previously? Are performance, endeavour, discipline dependent on bonding? I was under the impression that they are professional, dedicated cricketers, but it would appear that they need more than skill and application to succeed.
Under-prepared ? maybe - however I thought that cricket was a full-time job, and that they had played plenty of cricket (including together) not long before they arrived in Oz. I believe that they had played as much cricket as the Australian's in the lead-up. And how could "under-preparation" account for losing 5 tests?
Complain about this postAggers - spot on about pandering to the players. The problem with cricket and this sporting country in general is that there is no commitment to your country unless there is some reward involved. The Aussies don't want MBE's or open bus tours they just dream of wearing that baggy green cap. This tour was encapsulated for me with the missed run out of Warne by mahmood - he had just given up. Let's forget this sorry tour and SERIOUSLY shake up English cricket from the top down.
Complain about this postIt's quite plain and simple to me. When big business buys 'the rights' to televise national sporting events such as this, it deprives the majority of people access to it. How can younger generations get enthused and then involved in major sports such as cricket and rugby if they have to pay to watch thier national teams play in international events - many families simply cannot afford to do so. The so-called 'right' to watch a national sporting event should lie firmly in the hands of the British people and it should be free - what the devil do we pay a TV license for - to watch the Weakest bloody Link everday?! It saddens me and many others that we have sold a major element of our culture so that the priviledged few can watch it. This is simply not acceptable and until we give back to the Bristish people what is rightly theirs, then poor sporting performances like the ashes cricket and rubgy fiascos will perpetuate in the future.
Complain about this post"England win something, then a short while later capitulate spectacularly."
Please apply this to everything since the late 1800's, especially sport.
So why, is everyone suprised and getting so upset about it? It happens decade in, decade out. Whats more, we all knew it was going to happen, and the same will happen after the rubgy world cup.
All of you posting comments about feeling short changed and disgusted about this latest miserable performance please remember it is the English way and to have followed up one excellent sporting performance with another would have meant breaking a tradition that is centuries old.
Complain about this postI found the interview with Steve Harmison on Sky TV the other evening most bizarre. Her neither seems to have an appetite for playing cricket yet alone touring and playing for his country. AIf Mr Harmison, wishes to stay in the North East and be with his family, then he should apply for another job and let someone who values the chance of playing for their country do so. I agree with Jonathan Agnew, that there needs to be a move out of the comfort zone for a bunch of highly paid non performers, who would in the real world of work, would now be looking for other jobs having been dismissed for poor performance and failing to care!!
Complain about this postGreat entry Jonathan, preparation is often the key to any competition. Australia were the better side throughout. We should take lessons from our opponents in how they prepared and what they did in over coming their problems. Like you I fear for our the up and coming one day series and the World Cup.
Complain about this postI wonder if John Buchanan has made every Aussie player watch the Trafalagar square parade night after night.
Complain about this postI wonder if John Buchanan has made every Aussie player watch the Trafalagar square parade night after night.
Complain about this postIt is over-simplistic to say that Australia "had the better players". In the individual performances (highest innings, best bowling performance, wk dismissals) England players took the honours. What England lacked was team ability in depth. Australian players showed on several occasions that throwing your wicket away and poor shot selection are not subject to an English monopoly; this, in spite of the decidedly "curate's egg" consistency of the English bowlers. However, even though the Australians found themselves in a dire predicament from time to time, they could draw on reserves to rally and compensate for earlier failures. From the English point of view we lacked good, aggressive captaincy - setting defensive fields the moment an Australian "slogger" comes to the crease and hits out is a totally wrong strategy. We were also let down by a lack of preparation as well as an attempt to create silk purses out of sows'ears. I am sure that the English management recognised that an established wk-batsman like Adam Gilchrist is a huge strength in the Australian side. They understandably craved a similar advantage, but then made the wrong choices, mainly due to the unavailability of resources.
I hope that England takes a good hard look at itself and the state of the game in our country and draws thje required conclusions.
Complain about this postJA is spot on in his remarks. As I wrote yesterday - in inevitable anticipation of the predictable result - will lessons be identified and learnt? I have little optimism.
Knowing tha the Aussies would be ruthlessly determined to win back the Ashes why did we not prepare equally professionlly and focused? The arrangements made to meet this need beggar belief. We got what we deserved.
If the players are not going to be 100% focused and committed on the task -as JA wrote(finally) - do not tour. They are being pathetic to say theay cannot tour without them (they do not join servicemen on operations - and the Ashes series should be treated as like) Accompanying families girlfriends? Join after the series is won (or lost!).
And who is going to accept responsibility? Flintoff - probably not - he did his best but clearly showed that he should not be captain. For starters FLETCHER AND GRAVENEY shobe sacked.
Finally as a sign of team contrition return all those MBEs
Complain about this postCouldnt agree with your more Aggers.
What struck me most about the last 6 weeks compared to 2005 was the lack of sustained intensity in the England team.
I was living in Perth during the 2005 series, and my Aussie mates were impressed/shocked how the English bounced back from lords to really harry them out of that series.
The England management and team were complacent going into the series and didnt respect the situation they were going into down under.
The ICC tournament in India was an excuse. If they wanted these Ashes enough, they should have pulled the test players from the ODI team and spent the 3 weeks preparing down under.
Complain about this postI bet Geoffrey's mother would have fared better in Australia than any of our players did! Possibly a double century and figures of 20-0.
Complain about this postI agree with Agger's comments about WAGs and commitment on tour, but the main reason we lost this series so badly was the batting. To win the series was always going to be a struggle with so many key players from 2005 either not there or not match fit. But to collapse so regularly had to be the result of great bowling by Australia (it wasn't that good) or poor batting by England. In 2005 only Vaughan and Trescothick had the temperament and technique to make big hundreds regularly. It didn't really matter whether they did or not, the important thing is that there was someone there who knew how. The only current England batters with the ability to grind out long innings are Bell and Cook, and they need lots more practice. Strauss is hopelessly unable to graft and should be dropped. But, given the current England setup, he won't be.
Complain about this posti call on english supporters to refuse to come to australia in 2010, if the format for the tour is not changed..........we demand 1 month to acclimitise and minimum three 4 day first class games to warm up........unless england give themselves the best chance after this debacle, what is the fan to conclude?
Complain about this postLets see how many books the English team publish after this debacle. Too many living on past glories. The heroes of 2005 will now be remembered for taking an embarassing mauling.
Complain about this postI read one headline this morning with Flintoff stating that he was 'optimistic for 2009'. Pray, where does this new found optimism derive from after such total humiliation? I hope that all who read your 'Wake-Up Call' comments appreciate that your observations and those of many others are generated by genuine English patriotism. There must be immediate changes(hopefully resignations) within the management of English cricket, Fletcher and Graveney now, with the captaincy situation to be reviewed at the earliest opportunity. I firmly believe that until this happens the physcological damage caused during this tour debacle cannot begin to heal.
Complain about this postThis is a very well written comment, I agree totaly with it. We have to look forward and not dwell on this thrashing by the Aussies. Maybe bring in new players so there is competiton for spaces in the England side. Teach some mental toughness that England seem to lack, but I am sure there are other players out there that could to the job.
Maybe somebody like Botham or Alan Lamb to become the new coach these ex players know only one way and thats winning not losing.
We can prepare just like the Aussies did when they lost to us, start now and get the ashes Back.
Complain about this postI was a quarter of a way through my half pint at the sports bar in Haymarket and it was all over and had to go home. Oh dear.
If Robert Key had been playing we would have won 5-0
Complain about this postI am in Sydney and went to the previous match in Melnbourne too. The body language of the players particularly Pietersen and Harmison showed it all.
All our players are singularly good enough but we cannot compete with the Australian win ethic.
Not one single player can come away from this Ashes series saying they have done well.
As a footnote Rudi Kuertzen did more to bring forward the inevitable TV umpire in just one game at the MCG. His decisions were woeful.
Complain about this postChastening is a kind word to use - humiliating might be a better fit. It all started by inadequate thought prior to squad selection. Don't take match unfit players anywhere. Flintoff himself is hardly fit; they make him Captain (untried). Graveny should resign. Next use Strauss and Vaughan, if he is fit. Find a Troy Cooley replacement who can succeed. Bring some discipline back into the dressing room - give each player a card which says if you give your wicket away - no match fee.
Complain about this postBuild a proper competive selection and playing system that never allows humiliation again.
Thing is Jonathon, you use all this hard talk in your reports but I can guarentee the instant you see anyone from the ECB or PCA you're back to shining their shoes so as not to fall out with anyone.
Us normal england fans are in no position to talk to these people and castigate them, they're not interested, but someone like you can make a difference on our behalf and actually tell them how stupid they are to their face and what you and countless other ex-pros think needs to be done, the question is whether you will forgo the free lunches and other perks you no doubt get for the good of the england team and do all you can to get things changed.
Will YOU (and others like Gatting and Hussain) rise to this occasion, or will you give up as meekly as the current team?
Complain about this postYou all seem to forget that the West Indies also won 5-0 on English soil.
Complain about this postaggers i just wont to say how much i enjoy the abc comentary and i think you would be one of the most unbiased commentator i have ever listen to and i think what andy and the boys did for langer was very special i am a trucker driver in brisbane and i listen to most of the comentary job well done to all the team bill
Complain about this postI feel really sorry for the England supporters who have paid a lot of money to go and see a pile of crap, oh sorry,sometimes the games finished early and they saw nothing at all, at least there's the weather . The England set up and players need to learn now that this is a well paid JOB, so leave the family etc behind until the JOB is done, as a paying cricket supporter,this tour is an insult to my money.
Complain about this postWe MUST build a team that wants to and will win matches and tours both home and away, who are fit and ready to play, players who WANT to be there,if they can't hack that, then go and enjoy safe mediocrity, not the cauldron of WANTING to play and beat allcomers as part of a team,Look at how Australia prepared as a team, worked as a team, they wanted to WIN as a team.
Further to Fred (130) - didn't Pieterson try to call Symonds a prefessional fielder before he went on to score 150+ when the game was in the balance? Sledging can always turn around and bite you on the bum.
Complain about this postAs always Jonathan you are on the money, the Authorities are more interested in meaningless One Day Triangular Series after the tests than proper preparation matches before them.
Also keep the families away, this is not a holiday for gods sake, it is a job of work! Its no different than the WAGS and the footballers, and look how bad they are!
Complain about this postJonathon,
Complain about this postIt has been a pleasure hearing your commentary over here this summer. I wish I could say it has been a pleasure to listen and watch the performance of the England team, but sadly for those of us wishing for a close and entertaining series, it has not. Glen McGrath predicted a 5-0 whitewash well before the start of the series and it did not come across as arrogance this time, but it struck me then that the aussies were really "up for it" and were desperate to regain the ashes they had lost the previous winter. There was so much grit and determination, that England had to be a much better side than what many of us suspected. The series was heavily hyped, due to the previous result as finally it was possible, the aussies would be tested after series upon series of one sided competition with the Poms.
Sometimes I wonder whether it is simply due to lack of national pride in England, that causes sporting failure at the highest level. Perhaps times have changed, but as a kid growing up in the UK, we never sang the national anthem, never saluted the flag and were never drilled to be proud of our country and want to represent it.
Bringing my own children up here is a very different story. Most persons are proud to be aussies (I am proud to have had "the operation") and we love singing Advance Australia Fair, flying the Southern Cross and everyone wants the national sides to do well (and everyone hates losing so much that they do something about it on the occasions when it happens. We love our heroes and forgive and sometimes forget their off field antics. Politicians openly support the national teams.....vast sums of money is invested in developing sport and not just paying prima-donas, huge salaries for little in return. The number of volunteers in sport here is phenomenal. In the district where I currently reside, our local association has over 3000 registered coaches, managers and other support persons at a local, grass roots level, and they are provided training and attend coaching courses and the like.
English sport could learn a lot from observing just a fraction of what goes on here. The socceroos have finally cracked the big time after years of being given a raw deal by Fifa and they seized their opportunity at the last world cup and gave a great fighting display.......way superior to the woeful displays from the glamour of the English team.
I love living here, it is my place of choice. I still love the history of the UK, all the old buildings and stories from a colourful past.........but does the whole country have to be history?
I have never been so ashamed to sit and watch us capitulate so easily in every test.
Even the fantastic "Barmy Army" have turned into the "Tartan Army" ie: knowing they are supporting losers but enjoying themselves anyway.
English cricket is at an all time low, and this only 18 months after arguably the best ever ashes win. My concern though, is that I don't believe the players and coaching staff believe this. All I've heard throughout this disastrous tour is how the team have picked positves out of a defeat, only to follow it with another humiliating defeat.
The present England set-up is simply not acceptable, we need a strong coach & captain who will not bow down to making these tours into a family & friends holiday outing, they need reminding that they represent their country......and that's a serious business.
Complain about this postAs an Anglo Australian I can see why the English fail so much, In Australia it is the ambition of every cricketer to play for their Country, they are dedicated and unlike the English they put the game first and hate loosing. in short England treat the game as a way to an extended Holiday.In Australia a test team place is contested for at every state match by every player, In a country populated at over three times the size of Australia the UK should be disgusted at this latest showing. I know I am.
Complain about this postLet the people of England learn not to get carried away like we did in 2005 and say this could be the best test side in years to come.
Please keep things in perspective. Please Please Please don't rush to give honours. There is no value at all now.
The signs were very clear even before the ashes started but we were just kidding our selves and saying we will regain. Any sensible person could see that England were going to get slaughtered.
God Luck. Shut the mouths and let the cricket do the talking. We should not belong to the NATO.(No action talk only)
Bye
Complain about this postReka
I'm afraid the the England team have been wonderful examples of the national attitude to all sport; its the taking part that counts not the winning. As long as we maintain that attitude then all our sports teams will suffer continued disasters.
Complain about this postIts all about winning, if you're not winning then you are losers. We must develop a national mind set that we play to win, at all times, no matter what the cost. Schools teach that competion is a bad thing as some of them lose and feel very upset. Good, thats what its all about for goodness sake! Find some guts and some sense of pride and go out there to win and murder the opposition, it might just avoid another whitewash.
So waking up this morning English Cricket and more generally English Sport finds itself in a familiar position; having being totally thrashed, humiliated call it what you want and all the usual excuses are all ready flying around.
Blame the management.
Blame the English cricket structure and system.
Blame the preparation.
even Blame the bunch of 11 "Celebrities" on the field wearing the 3 lions symbolising the good old British values of passion, pride and empty trophy cabinets.
So what have these values produced in the last 100 years of the major team sports:
1. 1 World cup football
2. 1 World cup rugby
Can any passionate English fan of whatever team sport they support say this record is nothing short of disgraceful if you take into consideration that England has a larger player pool and much more developed infrastructure than most of its rivals in these sports.
Wouydn't it be obvious to say that there seems to be a common problem across all these sports ?
I think there is and it is caused by 2 major reasons:
1. The first one is you and myself the British sporting public celebrating sporting mediocrity and being statisfied with one off acheivements.
Wayne Rooney is not a football great. He has talent yes but has he won anything yet no. Stop believing or even reading the headlines (which should stop them being printed.) Ignore Mr Rooney and Coleen. Let him realise he is still only a kid and needs to prove himself over a ten year period (including winning international trophies)before anything near the word great can be associated with his name. Not to do so is to insult the true greats ;the 1966 side who did actually achieve some that can be called world class.
The same goes for Mr Flintoff. He is another with talent but has not achieved anything near the true great all rounders. Even at the present time Shaun Pollock and Jacque Kallis records make his pale into insignificance.
So we must stop lavishing these so called icons and start expecting from them. The more they achieve the more we must expect and if they do evolve into true legends they will deliver like Shane Warne and Glen Mcgrath consistently do.
I think this change in sporting culture will assist with the second factor:
2. The English sporting mentality. I can tell you from being of Antipodean origin that deep down all cricket and rugby lovers from that part of the world know the biggest weapon we have against English teams is being able to consistently win the mental battle against them. Generally although there have been exceptions (Martin Johnson for one) the word winning has become this over complicated. elaborate almost scientific theory that can only be be solved by having a ward full of coaching staff. Just by listening to regular rugby pundits Dewi Morris and Stuart Barnes dissect a rugby game I feel like going back to tertiary education to feel a more adequate rugby supporter.
Do you think the 2003 World Cup success was founded on this? Was it not more to do with the almost fortunate timing of having a bunch of players on the field who knew how to do the basics correctly, believed in themselves and team mates and had a leader who understood all of this. Just to prove this point look at what all of Coach Woodwards wonderful ground breaking scientific coaching methods did for the 2005 Lions team and Southampton FC.
The Ashes was not lost because of the management team, English cricket structure and system, preparation or even players.
It was lost by following the English sporting tradition and mentality of loosing.
Winning matches is achieved by applying simple sporting basics in a more successful and consistent manner than the opposition. To do this the players must have belief, mentality and skills superior to the opposition and realise sporting greatness is only achieved by applying these qualities day in and day out.
If these qualities are developed from a young age starting now here in England and with the natural advantages of large player pools and better infrastrusture the next 100 years should read a lot differently.
Complain about this postI must disagree concerning the players' families
It will not be possible to persuade players to tour regularly if they are away from their families. The only way is to allow families to visit.
Families are usually blamed when tours are lost. However, I do not think they were to blame for the lack of team spirit or discipline evident in this team.
In my view, the lack of team spirit was because some players felt partly excluded by manager and captain. Secondly, Flintoff was not the man for the captaincy. I suspect that, unlike Vaughan he shares Fletcher's faults of inflexibility, dogmatic approach and lack of imagination
The poor results themselves come about because of a variety of factors. Australia had by far the better side, and the lack of preparation was hardly conclusive.
Looking forward, I believe we will need to jetison from the side Jones, Read and Giles. Mahmood and Anderson must be sent back to the A side until they can bowl line and length and, in Mahmood's case, until his attitude improves.
Complain about this postAs a an interested 'sideliner' - I love cricket and am only interested in seeing class players - I have to say this England team was a joke.
I think the whole sledging thing is an even bigger joke. Who in the England team could even consider themselves to have the "right to safely sledge" ....."earned with years of excellent cricket"
What a load of rubbish. There should be no 'right' to sledge...and certainly not for any England player. Individual sledging is the fallback of weak individuals, Warne only uses it as part of his superiority, players with real class don't bother, their skill is sufficient.
As to MBEs - another joke, they should have the courage to hand them back. It also shows where the connections in Lords lie - part of the establishment - what sort of a society is England?
If they weren't contractually commited to the ODIs they should slink off.
Complain about this postThe England cricket team is simply a joke, and were lucky to win the last Ashes series in 2005 thanks to poor weather conditions.
How these players were awarded MBE's and voted Team of the Year for BBC Sports Personality of the Year in 2005 is beyond me.
Those awards should have been given to Liverpool Football Club for their Uefa Champions League success in capturing their fifth European Cup. They did far more to deserve these accolades than the England cricket team. Defeating the likes of Juventus, Chelsea, and then AC Milan (coming back to win from 3-0 down at half time, in the final, as everyone knows) on their way to winning the competition.
It pains me to say that I see troubled times ahead for the team. I don't see England winning a single game in the upcoming ODI series, and I forsee a terrible World Cup ahead.
I think it's time changes are made immediately, from top (David Graveney and other selectors) to bottom (players such as Steve Harmison, whom is useless) to ensure a bright future for English cricket.
-Ian Smith, London (Arsenal supporter)
Complain about this postHit the nail on the head- Australia prepared for these ashes in they same manner in which we prepared in 2005. We have a good young side and we were thrashed by a well prepared angry Australian squad.
Complain about this postAggers,
No good can come out of this whitewash. Only lesson to learn is to not have open bus parardes, give out gongs and every player and coach writing a book about their famous Ashes victory. This was like raising a red flag at a bull to us Aussies.
England will not come back from this embarrassment for another decade.
Complain about this postNo excuses, in every department we were completely outplayed. There was absolutely no competition in the series and this 'marquee series' collapsed into an utter shambles for English cricket. Get Flintoff back to being an allrounder and find a captain for captaincy. Congratulations to the Aussies, the fight was over after round one.
Complain about this postCompetition - an old fashioned concept. The way things are with the current England team makes it almost impossible to bring in new talent and assess alternative selections. In other words the 1 XI are not under pressure from those on the fringes. This is not satisfactory. In the 5-0 debacle whilst the top six England batters did get, generally, reasonable starts, that fact remains that only two players had an average above 40. Australia by contrast had 8 with an average above 40. What was need was more matches against State sides with genuine competition for places. As it was Joyce, for example, had no real opportunity and yet both Marsh and Warne rate him highly. In short make the players fight for their places.
Complain about this postyes - what a great point England lost because their wives and children were with them and not because Australia were a much better team - and we had 4 number 11s and a number 9 in our bottom 5. Do you seriously believe that had they been unaccompanied by their wives they would have miraculously become good at batting (or bowling for that matter)?
Yes we were initially unprepared but were we undercooked in the 3rd 4th and 5th tests? - no.
For those that didn't start watching cricket until mid way through the summer of 2005 please do not post "why does Flintoff bat at 6" - as has been demonstrated in this series Flintoff cannot be relied upon to be one of 4 bowlers - hence we need 5. What we need are bowlers that can do the basics of line and length - look at what Stuart Clark has achieved - and bat a bit. We have the makings of a top six in our batting line up.
Finally just a word about attitude - people see winning teams running around clapping and showing great team spirit and they believe that that is why they are winning (this applies in many sports) - it's like saying that you have to have blond hair to be clever based on knowing a clever person that has blond hair. We simply weren't good enough - let's just face it.
Otherwise great article.
Complain about this postI despair at the level of comments being made. I would guess that those over reacting now did the same back in 2005 when we deservedly beat probably the best team that has ever existed.
Complain about this postFreddie Flintoff, Duncan Fletcher, Kevin Peterson, Andrew Staruss, Paul Collingwood, Steve Harminson, Michael Vaughan, Tony Blair, Margaret Thatcher, Winston Churchill, Mick Jagger, Tim Rice, Jeffrey Archer, Lord Nelson your boys took one hell of a beating!!
Complain about this postI was a quarter of a way through my half pint at the sports bar in Haymarket and it was all over and had to go home. Oh dear.
If Robert Key had been playing we would have won 5-0
Complain about this postThis is typical of English sports writers once England have lost. Mega-critical.
As an Aussie I love beating England, but it is not all doom and gloom for England. They were without 2 top batsmen (including their captain) and Simon Jones who tortured Australia's lefthanders in 2005. What if Australia had lost Hayden, Ponting and McGrath. In 2005 it was Australia who made bad selection decisions (Katich over Hussey) and has out of form bowlers (Gillespie and Kasperwicz), this time England had some out of form players and bad selections early on.
How will Australia go in 2009 without Hayden, Langer, McGrath, Warne, Martyn and Gilchrist.
Complain about this postMy advice is don't have inquiries, meetings and media witchhunts. Focus on 2 years preparation of your still young team for 2009
In Aggers and Boycotts post match analysis this morning, Boycott said that ex-England players like himself, Gooch, Gower and Botham have not been sought out for advice at any level not have been asked to help. Whilst this is deplorable, it is not surprising for there will be no public accountability by those administering the game for the 5-nil shambles, no published enquiry findings and the 'money men' will have still made a small fortune, and the team will still have those ghastly gongs.
Complain about this postFinally, any chance of Warney being invited to be the next coach? About as much as a snowball has of surviving hell!
Aggers,
I am sooo pleased that my mrspao said "no you are not paying to watch the cricket"!
This tour has been an embarrassment and I really hope that the selectors,coaches and the players learn from their mistakes after the complacency that seems to have set in since 2005.
What has happened to that competative edge that we had?
Do our players want the Ashes back enough to care?
I hope that everyone involved can at least be honest and shoulder their fair share of responsibilty and work towards the future. Its just a shame that there is a one day series and World Cup to get in the way of that process.
In the meantime thanks for your and your colleagues stirling work over the last few weeks it has been much appreciated.
Paul
Complain about this postDon't agree with Aggers view that they tried their best on each and every day...they looked a beaten team very early on in the series, and in the last test, most didn't show any passion or fight which was most notable by the dreadful shot selection which several batsman got out to.
Complain about this postQuite agree about returning the MBE's, should be done as a matter of honour afer they disgraced themselves.
England lost because of a bunch of over-rated players. They will lose again as people continue to over-rate the players.
Look at the batting averages of the English players in comparsion to the Australian players? They make dreadful reading.
Strauss was clearly off form though was harshly called out many a time. Cook had only 1 hundred, no fifties, he failed to often, as an opener what confidence did he give to the team.
Bell too failed too often as 3rd batsman, perhaps some glove training and number 6 beckon.
Some of the bowlers should never wear the England shirt again. They are too expensive and ineffective particularly Anderson and Mahmood.
Pansear is over-rated, while he holds promise, he is still very expensive, I lost count of all the times he was bashed at will around the park as Australia increased the run rate. Harmison is still good but just needs a rocket up his backside, how lazy can an international bowler be!
Only Petierson, Flintoff, Collingwood and Hoggard (as an average grunt) can take anything out of the tour and in that order.
The rest are Mollycoddled Bums of the Empire (MBEs)
Complain about this postThe simple truth was, that a squad of no hope bowlers were selected for this tour.
Complain about this postWe will go into the one dayers and the World Cup without a coherant strategy and will suffer the consequences.
Its time for Fletcher to go now !!
Perhaps after this dreadful performance, and remembering how all the counties basked in the reflective glory of 2005 one can only hope that they (the counties) will really try to develop the ENGLISH game. Why, oh why are there so many non-England qualified players on county staffs who are there for the money - not to develop and improve the English game. Do any of the southern hemisphere test palying countries "enjoy" such an influx of England palyers to there top level domestic cricket? For every non-England qualified player in the UK playing there is one England qualified player who is not - and what's more he is not getting the experience or development. Always it is such short-termism. I dread to think what will happen in the one-day series, let alone the World Cup. God helps us - I think He's the only hope!
Complain about this postNo backbone, no fight, no spirit...
But what else should we expect when our children have non-competitive Sports Days in school ?
We have a whole generation being brought up on lack of discipline, lack of respect, 'I want and I get attitude without hardwork', lack of drive and desire to succeed etc etc.
Time for the silent majority to get this Country back on track !!! Sport is just the visible problem !
England Football Team - over paid and don't deliver time and time again. How can someone be paid to play for their Country ???
Complain about this postEngland Rugby - shambles
England Cricket - embarrassing
It's been a fairly disastrous tour all round, one of the main reasons being that the selectors go for out of form 'names' rather ther than those players who are in form but not so well known. It's the same as the Beckham scenario in football.
We didn't learn from 2005 when we squeaked through 2-1. We didn't prepare enough and we got battered.
The place in the team has to be earned and then maintained. No-one, not even the captain, should expect to get through on their position. If they're not up to the job then they should be dropped.
Complain about this postJonathan, you are absolutely right. I only hope that you are listened too.
The irony is Shane Warne picked the best side for England before the First Test (Read and Panessar) but by the time they got a game the result was never in doubt.
The problem is the England team has been too much of a closed shop. Replacing Read with Jones, bringing back Giles. There is nothing wrong with either Jones or Giles, both fine men, but what a kick in the teeth it was for both Read and Monty. You've worked hard, but we'll take over now. This is de-motivating.
There needs to be more professionalism in the England side. This isn't a holiday, and if they don't like that then (as you say) they should go, and make room for someone who wants the job.
The result, 5-0, is flattering to Australia. If England had got their teeth into Australia and won the second test or even drawn it then it would have been a different matter. As it is thanks lads, the Aussies will be gloating about this for years to come.
This heavyweight contest became one-sided due to one of the competitors not taking it seriously, being complacent, over-weight, and short of practice. For all the snide comments made about the Australian team's age they certainly weren't complacent. Well done Australia