Gaming battle: 3DS v iPad 2

I have no idea where this 'death of the console' comes from, i've played various games on smart phones, Facebook and the like and non of them can live up to even the most average of games on a console, even the best games such as Angry Birds, Plants vs. Zombies and Peggle are (to me at least) distractions to play on the bus or your lunch break, i don't play these games when im at home when i have the option to play on my X360.

I'm sure that Facebook and the iPad and the like will take a huge chunk out of the so-called 'casual market' as the games are cheap and easy to digest. But for people who take there gaming seriously, they can never compete.

While i would never suggest that consoles will never die as i am not a fortune teller, the idea that there demise is any time soon is a huge exageration.

3DS vs iPad2 yet this article tells us nothing more than they differ quite alot in price and throws in a few pieces of information anybody with even a passing knowledge of gaming will already know.

Neither of these devices will appeal to the core demographic of gamers who will either a) want better graphics than the 3DS can offer, b) who wont be able to afford an ipad2 or c) want dedicated online play which both will offer to some extent but not whats required by your hardcore gamers. These devices just cater for kids and people which a bit too much spare change rolling round there pockets.

Given the choice of an xbox/ps3 and a large tele to play it on or an ipad2 which would cost roughly the same i know what id choose every day of the week!

I don't necessarily agree with the reviewer's decision to outsource the review of the Nintendo 3DS to his son. Having 'poor eyesight' and a 'profound ignorance of gameplay' seems a pretty poor excuse. Smacks to me of "can't be bothered" to review the console.

Who is the target audience for this article? If it is 8-12 year olds, then 'Rufus' reviewing it may have been relevant. However, while I rarely visit this site, the target audience would appear to be much older, so I would have expected the reviewer to have put in the effort to play with the Nintendo 3DS himself.

In doing this, it would have given the audience, who may be equally 'ignorant to gaming', the opinion of a man who would not normally find himself playing with such a device. This viewpoint would have been particularly interesting when you consider that the Wii and the last Nintendo DS were the first consoles to introduce 'casual gaming' and attract audiences that were once considered impenetrable by console manufacturers.

Finally, 'the 3D can damage your eyes' statement seems to be verging on slander. I am aware that the 3D effect can give some people headaches after prolongued play, but perhaps it would be noteworthy to mention the 3D slider which can reduce the 3D effect (or even turn it off) or the fact that the battery only lasts 3 and a half hours, well under the time it takes those people that ARE affected by headaches to develop one.

I didn't want this comment to be so negative, I just thought that this article came across as rather a throwaway piece.

As a pure gaming device the 3DS will have the advantage, but only because it is focussed on gaming. The iPad, while still a very able gaming platform, is not a pure gaming device and so will suffer in direct comparisons. This article quotes the price of the iPad to be double that of the 3DS - this is true but when you consider the many more things that can be done on the iPad that the 3DS cannot then this comparison becomes meaningless.

Personally, for me, specific gaming devices like the 3DS and NGP (hopefully out at the end of they year - hopefully) will always beat the iPhone and the iPad. For one simply reason - the controls. For a lot of games I like to play, touch controls are just a pain in the backside and make the experience totally horrible.

Allot has been said about the death of dedicated gaming devices. Just look at the death of dedicated phones. To some extent you can see the reasons why people are now seeing the demise of a dedicated gaming device.

However this wont happen until you phones & tablets offer you more than just cheap throw away titles and give you a truly immersive game that you would find on a dedicated machine such as your 3DS or NGP. Certainly this generation you would think that gaming handhelds are safe but as mobiles and tablets get more powerful and capable you will see them offering the gaming experiences that "hardcore" gamers want. The first generation of this type of phone coming with the Android powered Playstation Phone.

RE the 3DS, i went to a Nintendo event and had a good couple of hrs with it and i can say that its an amazing little device. The games are great, the 3D photos were very good and the Augmented Reality (AR) cards were truly amazing. I think this little handheld will go places just like its predecessor.

@Javi You give me the Playstation Phone I give you the Nokia N-Gage. How did that work out?

Ill admit that I have some very good mobile games on my Samsung Galaxy S and both graphically and in gameplay terms its pretty amazing what can be done at the current time.

I have no doubt that both will sell lorry loads and as things develop im sure they'll include surround sound and all kind of things but at the end of the day you still cant beat gathering round large tele/monitor and gaining that true immersion in a game. In the meantime the 3DS and NGP will remain in the back seat of the car where little Rufus will pass his time on the drive to school.

@2 4StarMatt raises an interesting point with "Neither of these devices will appeal to the core demographic of gamers".

We have to reconsider who these people are. There will always be the hardcore COD, Fifa and Teken type gamers. But increasingly now there is greater revenue and gaming time coming from social gamers.
These people are no longer those who pop on for a quick game of Angry Birds. They play Farmville or Mafia Wars for 3 hours a day and spend another 2 hours on the Wii fit. These people generally wouldn't have touched a computer game 3 years ago. Now they are downloading content and buying credits.

And this is the money Nintendo, Sony and MS are chasing too.


As for the old this is a Blog debate / Rory doesn't know how to review gadgets - I commend those people to stick to The Gadget Show and another of their challenges...

I think its about time we had a dedicated gaming blog on the BBC. And not like that incredibaly amateurish 'Rampage' one on the 1extra site...when your video game 'experts' can't even get the name of a Call Of Duty game right you know your dealing with novices...

Comparing the 3DS and the iPad is like comparing shirts and trousers. They're not the same thing, the only vague similarity is that they both play games.
If that was the aim of the article - where the future of gaming lies, then that should have been far more clear, not a comparison between two new gadgets.

It frustrates me so much that Nintendo is branded as a kids, or casual gamer company. Rory says it above, and when I tell people that I'm a 20 year old that plays Pokemon, the looks I get can range from surprise to disgust, yet people don't realise just how in depth the games that Nintendo create are, how much better FPS are (First Person Shooters) on the Wii because of the motion controls, and don't even get me started on the "graphics over gameplay" debate.

"Now Apple is hoping that the new version, with its gyroscope to make action games that bit more engrossing, will make further inroads into the market. I had a quick demo of one first person shooter game, and was impressed by the way the landscape moved around me."

Rory here neglects to mention that the 3DS also has a gyroscope for exactly the same purpose, the DS series (started over 5 years ago) has always incorporated a touchscreen, and as for the landscape moving around him, well that's called gaming, and the fact that he tested the iPad and not the 3DS just suggests to me, as it seems to have done to many other of the people who commented, that this review was destined to be biassed from the start.

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

Personally I really do not see the point in reviewing 2 completely different platforms like this together. You may as well compare a PC and an Xbox, after all a PC can play games! Yet this would not happen. They are two vastly different platforms that should stay that way.

3DS vs iPad 2? Each device is completely different and designed for different uses. Mainly that the 3DS is a handheld gaming console and the iPad 2 is a tablet PC (Just with a dumbed down OS so it will never be as effective as a laptop/desktop).

@8 MyVoiceYrHead What do you define a 'social gamer' as? Because ive played/play Call of Duty, Fifa etc and one of the main reasons that i play these games for is to chat and socialise with my friends who i either know from everyday live of have made whilst playing games online. At the moment none of the handheld consoles/phones/ipads really cater for this.

I think your possibly referring to what i would describe as a 'casual gamer' perhaps? Those that an enjoy a party game on the Wii when they have friends over or as you say use Wii fit or there equivalents on the PS3 and Xbox.

In recent years ive had/or played on pretty much everything out there and can only speak from experience but most people i know who brought Wii's during the first few years they were have since traded/sold them or there just gathering dust on the TV stand similar to the DS and PSP on my shelves. Its very hard for these gadgets to stand the test of time when the novelty value wears off.

It would be easy to say the industry is driven by money which to an extent it is but id imagine games developers would also tell you that they desire to make the best game possible using the best equipment/hardware possible and as good as portable devices are they still cant compete yet with consoles or PC's.

Purpose of this article seems to be to cram the 3DS and the iPad2 into one piece, under the connection of sharing a launch date.

Like a few comments above, I would find calling this article "informed" a stretch, even before the 3DS review (with added Apple, got to include Apple somehow!).

The article is introduced by a very limited observational outlook on gaming. Painting the PC as having already killed consoles as if Grand Fantasia matches the sales of Call of Duty, and as if Valve (the guys behind Steam) hadn't been marketing their platform in recent conferences as "saving PC gaming".

It also overstates the current position of smartphones - and, yes, the clearly-beloved iPad - in gaming today. Mr. Cellan-Jones might be interested to know that Plants v[s] Zombies originated (and, I understand, sold more) on the PC and has also featured on the Xbox 360 (and I think PlayStation 3?) with features other incarnations lack, such as network play.

On next weeks show, Rory compares a television to a printer....

Seriously, when did you up with the idea for this?

I'd also love to know where/when "we keep hearing about the death of the console". Consoles probably wont be around for ever but to think that the iPad spells the death of the console is just ludicrous! There is of course a market for casual gaming but the depth and complexity of modern console/pc gaming is so far ahead of phone/tablet games that it's like comparing a pen to a PC.

There are a lot of people out there that are quite serious gamers, and although you wouldn't know it because of all the media hype surrounding them, many many gamers don't just slog it out on COD night after night. Up coming this year are two enourmous titles (amognst others) - Deus Ex 3 and Skyrim, which will likely sell millions of copies. The likes of which games the iPad will not be able to compete with for probably at least 20 years. Just because people like Rory are ignorant of the games industry does not mean in any way that gamers are all migrating to Angry Birds!

As for what I've seen of the 3DS so far, I'd say its an underpowered and overpriced gimmicky console. Not really any different from the regular DSi. The whole 'internally 3D' business seems no deeper than a child's hologram. If price was any contention, which mercifully for the 3DS, it isnt, then I'd choose an iPad any day.

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

These two systems are in no way aiming to catch the same demographic, nor are they anywhere close in comparisson so i'm not entirely sure why this blogger insists on making it seem as though there is a battle beginning. Not sensationalism at all eh..

How lazy can an article be? Any reader with a passing interest already knows more about these machines than the piece gives away. Also, handing over the reigns to a child and then publishing their unqualified medical opinion (how do you know this to be a fact?) is impaired judgement at best.
What I'd like most is to see the author walk into Apple HQ and describe their product as a games console, then see where they insert it.
An opinion piece with little point really. Poor.

@17, Takeel

While Nintendo are understandably marketing the 3D aspect of the console you are right that it is merely a gimmick, the real beauty of this machine is the spot pass, street pass and the augmented reality features which i suggest you research in :)

Though i can't help but dispute your comment on it being under powered...since when has power equaled great games?

@MyVoiceinYrHead - "But increasingly now there is greater revenue and gaming time coming from social gamers.

These people are no longer those who pop on for a quick game of Angry Birds. They play Farmville or Mafia Wars for 3 hours a day and spend another 2 hours on the Wii fit."

Firstly I assume you mean casual gamer as social gamers is not a recognised term. And as such, a casual gamer is someone who plays a game casually. I have friends who will play SingStar or Rock Band when they come round, have a go on FIFA and Mario Kart, but don't play games at home. This is a casual gamer.

Some who plays Mafia Wars is not a casual gamer, they are bordering towards being a hardcore gamer. It matters not what type of game you play as to whether you are a casual gamer or a hardcore gamer, more about how much you do it.

Rufus should have also reviewed the iPad 2 as a games platform!

It'd be interesting to see whether he prefers it to the 3DS.

I've just returned from a shopping trip at the Trafford Centre and observed lines of people queuing for the Ipad 2 outside the Apple Store, which goes on sale at 5pm. How sad I thought, for two reasons. Firstly, I would never buy any Apple product, whats the point when in less than a year from now Apple will only release yet another version, total rip off.

And secondly, why queue, just come back next week, surely you can last the weekend without having Ipad 2 withdrawal symptons. The world, well the west, has gone techno mad.

@stevio

Like you, I struggle to understand the queueing mentality. But it isn't recent, and it isn't related only to technology. Over many years, people have been willing to queue for highly anticipated films, books, exhibitions, concerts, sporting events etc.

@Stevio

Totally with you...i love getting games on release but do i ever queau at midnight? Do i heck...i order them online...get them through the post or maybe even the day before if you know the right retailer ;)

To be fair, I'd have thought staring at an iPad for long enough would also strain your eyes. Of course anyone who does this should put the damned thing down for a while, go outside and enjoy the sunshine.

(p.s. Queueing outside electrical stores does not count.)

@djhsecondnature - "Firstly I assume you mean casual gamer as social gamers is not a recognised term. And as such, a casual gamer is someone who plays a game casually ... This is a casual gamer. Some who plays Mafia Wars is not a casual gamer, they are bordering towards being a hardcore gamer."

Trying to keep to such a rigid and inflexible set of two definitions doesn't really do modern gaming itself much justice.

You yourself go on to state that it "matters not what type of game you play" immediately after calling Mafia Wars players hardcore gamers which if nothing else exemplifies how such efforts at one-or-the-other categorisation don't really work anymore.

Is someone who religiously plays Angry Birds on their Galaxy S (note to blog: This is a smartphone not made by Apple) for 20 hours a week while commuting but wouldn't think of playing games "hardcore"? Is a working parent who devotes all of their maybe 5 hours of free time each weekend to Call of Duty and Crysis "casual"?

In this age of social gaming and gaming on the move, those labels just don't mean much anymore. And the latter is clearly on the rise - coincidentally, the 3DS and iPad2 both sport that portability appeal, which is something the article above hasn't really touched on.

Not being a fan of pigeon holeling people into categories I accept the unofficial terms described on Wikipedia. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gamer).

My comment was more aimed towards the increased revenue stream that both the 3DS and iPad are marketing towards.

If you spend £40 on Fifa etc you can play online free (PS3) for years. If you play Farmville you can buy credits everyday, even if you only play for an hour per day and spend £££ over the same time period.

This is the growth market (http://www.insidesocialgames.com/) following the Korean model where virtual goods etc are worth a fortune. This is why Apple etc are so keen to enable in-app purchases, subscriptions & payments. The easier is to spend money in these environments the quicker they make money.

About 15 years ago the games market moved from profiting on Consoles to profiting on software. Soon we could get both these free and only pay for downloadable content.

We've seen this with the Smurf Game. Parents give their kids an iPhone with a connected credit card account and the Kids spend a fortune on fees ($59 for a Wheelbarrow!!).

as good as portable devices are they still cant compete yet with consoles or PC's

That's not true in any meaningful sense; as far as technical specs go nothing can compete with a PC, even the 360 and PS3 are feebly limited in comparison, but handheld consoles can certainly compete in terms of the quality of the experience. There are games that suit handhelds that wouldn't benefit from a move to a full size console just as much as there are console games that couldn't and shouldn't be shoehorned into a portable.

One of the great strengths of the DS, and now the 3DS, is that they encourage developers to think differently about games rather than just scale down existing ideas. There are some absolute gems in the DS library that just wouldn't have happened on a different sort of system.

And for the record I agree with previous commenters - both Rory and Rufus should test both devices. Though preferably not just with Nintendogs.

I am hopeful that the BBC's new outsourcing policy for technology news will improve the quality of the content.

Hmmm, iPad vs 3DS......

Next up, cars vs boats and ice-cream vs cheese.

Trying to keep to such a rigid and inflexible set of two definitions doesn't really do modern gaming itself much justice.

You yourself go on to state that it "matters not what type of game you play" immediately after calling Mafia Wars players hardcore gamers which if nothing else exemplifies how such efforts at one-or-the-other categorisation don't really work anymore.

Is someone who religiously plays Angry Birds on their Galaxy S (note to blog: This is a smartphone not made by Apple) for 20 hours a week while commuting but wouldn't think of playing games "hardcore"? Is a working parent who devotes all of their maybe 5 hours of free time each weekend to Call of Duty and Crysis "casual"?

In this age of social gaming and gaming on the move, those labels just don't mean much anymore. And the latter is clearly on the rise - coincidentally, the 3DS and iPad2 both sport that portability appeal, which is something the article above hasn't really touched on.

@Miraglyth I was using Mafia Wars as an example as that was the example that was provided prior to my comment. I did not call 'Mafia Wars players' hardcore gamers, just those that would play it for several hours a day. This is the case if you replace Mafia Wars with any game, be it Call of Duty, Wii Sports or Uncharted.

In order to play 20 hours of Angry Birds in a week you would assume that there would be some hour+ session in there rather than just the one 'pick-up-and-play' game at the bus stop. This would easier make this person a gamer. As is the working parent who dedicates a five hour session to gaming. If that five hours was spread out across 10 sessions across a week then they would be 'casual' yes, but there is nothing 'casual' about a five hour gaming session. It would be the same in any other medium.

And again, social gaming is not new nor are we in an age of it. Social gaming is the playing of games in a social context, with real people in the same location. Rock Band, SingStar, Buzz are all social games. If anything we are leaving that era as the decline of such games are well documented.

While we're doing these sort of comparisons, what about Rory trying out Crysis 2 (or FPS of his choice) on a decent spec PC and an Ipad2? We could see how these different "gaming" platforms handle a title- perhaps comparing the Ipad's intense graphical experience to, I don't know, maybe a PC with a geforce570 and I7 in it? That's similar to the 3ds/ Ipad comparison.

Interesting to note that Rory despite being "someone (with) both poor eyesight and a profound ignorance of game play" managed to test an FPS on the Ipad, but couldn't stretch to trying the 3DS. It's rather telling...

@32

I pick cars and cheese

Nice to be modded by the Beeb again. Sometimes the truth hurts.
Anyway, poor comparison choice, uneven review, perhaps someone with a knowledge of games should have been asked to write a blog article?

I hope that the BBC's new policy of outsourcing technology news will result in some decent coverage for a change....

It's just ridiculous to claim these two products are competitors.

Please let's have a dedicated and informed games blog in the future.

Do please lighten up folks! Give Rory a break! The coincidence of two launches on the same day provided a good opportunity to take a look at the superficial similarities between the two devices. They can both be used for hand-held gaming, so how do they compare? I think Rory pointed out the differences quite well. This was never meant to be an in-depth review of either device, nor a comparison of two devices in direct competition with each other. It's a bit like comparing a point-and-shoot camera with the camera on a mobile phone. There are plenty of specialist sites and blogs for those who need rigorous and in-depth reviews.

4starmatt suggests the 3DS "will not appear to the core demographic of gamers", but Nintendo's audience IS a big part of the core demographic. And to say that core gamers will want better graphics is a somewhat shallow approach to choosing games; Nintendo have long been going in a very different direction from Sony and Microsoft, such that they are decreasingly becoming competitors. Sony and Microsoft are locked in a battle of graphics and hardware, while Nintendo has long been about games with charm and playability, using their locker of franchises that people have come to love over years. I used to be the former; these days, give me the latter any day. As such, I relish the arrival of the 3DS. At the end of the day it's about games, not who has the best graphics processor.

ah yes, the death of the console at the hands of casual gaming and smartphones. just like how consoles caused the death of pc gaming. remember that? no me either.

stevio wrote:

"Firstly, I would never buy any Apple product, whats the point when in less than a year from now Apple will only release yet another version, total rip off."

Who is forcing you to buy "another version" every year?

Yearly updates are normal for most electronic products with most manufacturers.

While I appreciate the scope of the article (comparing two gadgets that can both play games) I wish there had been some mention of the new technology in both machines:
The improved processor and double camera in the iPad 2 and the 3D Video camera/ spot pass/ Alternate Reality Simulator in the 3DS. These are the two things I am really interested in.

I'm not a gamer (the last game I played was Tomb Raider, and then I grew up), but the games for the iPad and iPhone are really just minor diversions for tea breaks and bus journeys. No serious competition there. The future for the iPad, and other tablets, is business apps. When they take off, tablets will come into their own, and will probably overtake laptop sales.

Since when was the iPad a gaming device? Being able to play Angry Birds doesn't make it a gaming device.

You can't bring yourself to write anything without mentioning the iPad, can you? Why does everything have to supposedly be in competition with the iPad even when it's clearly not?

@ no.30

:::::::That's not true in any meaningful sense; as far as technical specs go nothing can compete with a PC, even the 360 and PS3 are feebly limited in comparison, but handheld consoles can certainly compete in terms of the quality of the experience. ::::::

in the politest possible way i disagree. it comes down to what you play video games for.

i play for immersion\captivating storyline....yes i know there could be some brilliant ones on the DS but really I need HUUUGE speakers and a monitor blasting out sound and light to get really sucked in.

handhelds just cant do that for me.

"39. At 17:42pm on 25th Mar 2011, camyeoerfraefrance wrote:

Do please lighten up folks! Give Rory a break! The coincidence of two launches on the same day provided a good opportunity to take a look at the superficial similarities between the two devices. They can both be used for hand-held gaming, so how do they compare? I think Rory pointed out the differences quite well. This was never meant to be an in-depth review of either device, nor a comparison of two devices in direct competition with each other. It's a bit like comparing a point-and-shoot camera with the camera on a mobile phone. There are plenty of specialist sites and blogs for those who need rigorous and in-depth reviews.
"

-------------

And in the meantime we get the lazy hacks of the BBC pretending they know something about what they are writing a blog about. All Rory seems to know is how to prod at a touch screen tablet device.

I have to agree with everyone here who has said that the iPad2 and the 3DS should not be mentioned in comparison with each other.

For a start the iPad2, as others have said, is over priced and isn't a dedicated games machine.

Secondly the 3DS (or anything Nintendo has done for the last decade or so) is squarely aimed at the family market or younger kids, i.e. casual gamers. The iPad on the other hand is aimed at your "I've got plenty of cash and I want to look flash" lot.

Thirdly the death of consoles won't happen whilst developers like EA and Activision continue to see they can rake in the profits from those born every minute that buy their products, yeah the CoD and MoH fanboys I'm looking at you...

Now if Rory was to have reviewed both devices the blog might hold a bit more credibility, but then we all know Rory can only do Apple.

I agree with Mav (Comment 9) in that it is about time the BBC had a dedicated section for video games like the Guardian website has. Hopefully if these comments are read by BBC staff then this suggestion will be noted.

As for the topic of the blog itself, I will be buying neither device myself. I was seriously considering purchasing an iPad/iPad 2 a few weeks ago, but it is simply too expensive for what it is in my opinion. There are far too many compromises. For instance, no citations in iworks, web browsing is noticeably slower (over wi-fi) when compared to my macbook. I can see the appeal though and newspapers in particular look impressive on the iPad. I might get one in a few years when the technology has evolved and the price has dropped, but it is just too much money at the moment. One also has to wonder why so many people selling them on auction sites give the reason for sale as 'lack of use'.

As for the 3DS, it will no doubt be successful, but it isn't for me. The upcoming Sony NGP looks a lot more exciting in my opinion, providing the retail price is reasonable for what is being offered.

Its completely irrelevant comparing these two devices as they wont be directly competing with eachother in the same market place. I dont see the point of this piece. Particualrly as Mr Cellan-Jones could not even bring himself to properly review the 3DS.

'Death of the console'.....thats news to me and the gaming industry as a whole. Sure, there is a lot more platforms out there but these devices, in terms of gaming, are for quick 5 min hits here and there eg. Angry Birds.

The hardcore gamer still demands a deeper and more challeging experience, to be immersed in the plot or gameplay. This cannot be done except through the consoles or pc.

I believe the main change to gaming will be the rise of digital downloads as a medium for software, but the console will remain a mainstay of this industry. Its the biggest branch of the entertainment industry because of massive game franchises, COD for example. It certainly not because of the gaming experiences to be found in the vast quantities of shovelware on devices like the ipad.

They are both fantastic pieces of technology but are really not comparable with eachother in their market placement.

Andrew i think you should quit as a 'technology' writer while the going is good. How can you compare the two? Portable game console and a tablet? They are very different and attract different audiences. It is not uncommon to find a 3DS or even PSPS owner also owning a tablet or even a smartphone. This was a poor article from you

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

Not sure both were to be compared, but a chance to look at the types and aims of the products.

For sure both show us how technology has advanced and where we are heading.....think both products are great for the market.