EU wary of extra cash injection
2015: If the European Union gets its way the London G20 summit will concentrate on new rules and regulations, not discussing how to further stimulate the world economy.
The EU, I hear some of you say, doesn't have a seat on at the G20. In fact it has two: for the presidency (the Czech prime minister) and the president of the European Commission. That's in addition to the permanent members of the G7 - UK, France, Germany and Italy. Spain and the Netherlands are being asked along. Poland is very unhappy that it isn't represented.
Of course, whatever the summit agrees today there is nothing to stop individual nations arguing their individual case when it comes to 2 April in London. But there seems to be little objection to French and German insistence that this summit should deliver the message that existing plans must be given time to work and that new rules are the "top priority".
Gordon Brown wants to leave the way open for the world summit to talk about new stimulus packages, but a Downing Street spokesman conceded fiscal policy is not an issue at this Brussels summit. So they are down to talking about how the EU spends its 5bn-euro (£4.7bn) stimulus. And it's not proving easy.
I’m Mark Mardell, the BBC's North America editor. These are my reflections on American politics, some thoughts on being a Brit living in the USA, and who knows what else? My 
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For the United Kingdom, it would appear from all the data availble, that the Recession will be long, deep and very depressing if not a full-blown Depression.
For the rest of Europe, the recession may not be as prolonged or in need of further stimulation than has been undertaken by the various EU governments.
The problem for Gordon Brown is that he is keen to maintain that the UK's fiscal deficit is the solution to what is a global problem, whereas, in fact, the problem is truly an Anglo-Saxon laissez faire attitude to the Banks and the Bankers malpractices and it is the Anglo-Saxon nations (which seem to prosper in sunny times due to inflation driving up value of commodities, services and private wealth) who will suffer the worse for this Hyper-Debt driven recession.
The Americans can create National Debt of humungous scale because they know that the Chinese and their private savings are so heavily invested in America that the Chinese cannot see the USA becoming bankrupt. On the other hand, no one cares a fig for the British (whoever they are these days!) and certainly not a jot for Grodon Brown who is trying to emulate the Americans by creating a National Debt that wiil inevitably bankrupt the United Kingdom.
In reality, I think Gordon Brown knows that he will lose the next General Election within the UK and all of his claims to Fiscal Prudence are now a sham as he is more than happy to leave the corpse of the UK governance to the Conservative Party who will inherit a National Debt worse than that following the Second World War and a need for austerity in the private and public sector economy that will cause the Conservatives to either become a one-Parliament party or create such public revolution as the UK governance will be overthrown.
Quite rightly, the rest of the European Nations will have nothing more to do with Gordon Browns "Let's spend our way out of Recession" theories as it is precisely this bogus spending-based-upon-debt that got us all into this pickle in the first place. More-of-the-Same Gordon ("Not -so-Prudent") Brown's policies are creating a catastrophe waiting to happen and he will be the Captain that goes down with the Labour Party Ship - thank goodness!
Sadly, for the next UK Government it is a poison chalice to take up the reins of governance. Probably something the other EU nations political parties are desperate to avoid for themselves.
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Mark:
I am on the side of the EU wary about the extra cash injections into the economy...Since, in the long-term it will be cost prohibitive....
~Dennis Junior~
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If I may be forgiven for saying so, given that the UK taxpayer's to the debts of HBOS and RBS is something in the order of £600bn, why on earth are they arguing about 4.7 billion. In the great scheme of things, it is loose change. The Fed has pumped something like $1.75 trillion back into the system in the last few days. The BOE's QE measures will add up to something like £75bn in the next few months. If the is the best the cream of European politicians can offer is a row about pocket money, they would be better off going home and contemplating life after politics.
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So new rules are the top priority. OK.
WHAT NEW RULES?????
Sorry for shouting, but this is starting to freak me out a bit. How is it that every politician in Europe can agree that we need "new rules", but none of them can articulate what these rules will be?
How do they know if we need new rules if they don't know what the new rules will be?
How do they know the new rules wont create more problems than the old rules?
Why is there zero discussion about what the new rules will be in the press? Are we too stupid to understand? Is it that nobody in government is allowed to discuss these top secret issues?
I have a sneaking suspicion that the only thing these politicians can agree upon is the need to create more government paid jobs for party members. They all want to expand the size of government by creating new departments, because by creating new government departments they can expand the number of jobs they can offer to university graduates who spend most of their time campaigning for votes. That is before they leave uni, and after, when they are supposed to be working in their government department.
But I stand willing to be corrected. Presumably all the people who work in the FSA, and its continental equivalents, are going to be sacked because they did not achieve their stated aims of protecting investors from risk.
Well, I guess we can sit back and watch these party vultures squabble over the 5 billion of taxpayers money that is about to be divided up by the special people in brussels. I am so glad they are doing this for my benefit. Goodness knows, if they had not taken money from me in tax to pay to help me, I guess I would just have to keep on wandering around in the dark like a fool.
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The title to this thread is misleading. Clearly no politicians are wary of the cash injection. What they are wary of is not getting a slice of the pie. They are crowding around our taxes like wolves around a lame deer.
This whole "crisis" is such a farce of simulated concern. The rich have no more money, and so they are concerned. So they tell the government to give them some more, and this concerns the government. So they were concerned, because the voters might object. But that danger has passed, so now the concern is how to get hold of "stimulus" spending.
Oh well, at least we are not being sent into wars so that banking and politics can dance their merry dance. I mean, not big ones.
I am actually starting to like the idea of a great depression. If I were offered the chance to go hungry just as long as the politicians shut up for a few years and the bankers went broke, I think I'd take it. Might be cold and hard to sleep, but at least I wouldn't be driven crazy by the news.
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On another website I read "55 per cent of us want out, according to the BBC".
It is actually more complicated than that. Nevertheless this is an interesting result based on a poll which was carried out or published on Wednesday. I cannot find see it being mentioned on the Europe page on this site. I find that strange.
Any comments?
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/daniel_hannan/blog/2009/03/19/would_britain_vote_to_leave_the_eu?from_comment=true&message=WW91ciBjb21tZW50IGhhcyBub3cgYmVlbiBtYWRlIHB1YmxpYyE=
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4. At 10:59pm on 19 Mar 2009, democracythreat
It seems there's a lot our politicians (and the media) like to keep hidden. Like where the 'old rules' originated.
IT'S A BIG SECRET
NOBODY CAN TELL
Perhaps because -
"After entry there would be a major responsibility on HMG and on all political parties not to exacerbate public concern by attributing unpopular measures or unfavourable economic developments to the remote and unmanageable workings of the Community"
FCO 30/1048 1971
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My understanding is that the US want European countries (whether EU or not) to increase their support packages.
Europe is not the USA; and the economic policies pursued from the start in Europe have been different from those enacted in the US. Most countries appear to have given support to the supply side; though the UK chose to push the consumption side (and G Brown is said to be economically literate). Most European countries (so far as have read) have further cash ready, if needed - but think it better to wait for their earlier measures to show effect first. They now want to focus on measures to regulate financial markets, to prevent a repetition of the current crisis.
If G Brown is proposing more "support measures" now, he's clearly out of touch with Europe (reality?), and besotted with Obama.
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I notice that european industrial output is down. Now this is described as a consequence of a fall in demand due to the "crisis", but I am given to wonder if the real reason the world is suffering a crisis of demand is because we have endured a prolonged period of peace, and perhaps everyone has a full inventory of "stuff".
I mean, if everyone has enough "stuff", surely demand must drop, and the potential for economic growth must erode?
It is time to quote the great capitalist philosopher, Zorg:
"Life, which you so nobly serve, comes from destruction, disorder, and chaos. Take this empty glass. Here it is, peaceful, serene and boring. But if it is destroyed… Look at all these little things [robot cleaners]. So busy now. Notice how each one is useful. What a lovely ballet ensues, so full of form and colour. Now think about all those people that created them. Technicians, engineers, hundreds of people who’ll be able to feed their children tonight, so those children can grow up big and strong and have little teeny weeny children of their own, and so on and so forth. Thus adding to the great chain of life."
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When a Downing Street spokesman says that no fiscal policy is to be discussed in Brussels, and when there are hopes that the existing plans must be given time to work, there is no room for “top priority” discussions. Unless, the G20 summit is aimed at the solemn inauguration of the next “large international coalition” which is believed to lecture us on how difficult is the market situation and on how different are our approaches to solve the problem… Thanks…
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To my previous post: it should read: "...to be discussed in London.."
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#4. Over here they have pretty good ideas what those new rules could be like. One would be to only allow bonus payments for longer periods than one year (4 to 5) so that nobody who doesn’t help to create long term success of a company and instead lets it bleed out for the short term benefit won’t be rewarded by a stupid bonus system. Well that is one that’s still on my mind there were some others, but when I read them I didn’t think I would have to teach them to others ;-)
Since London and Washington will block those new rules anyway as now “everything runs fine” again I doubt that it matters even. Just make another couple of trillion dollars if it crashes again. So far European countries spent a lot of money on those packages already and they must have some time to show that they are (or are not) working before making new ones.
Plus: Most of the sources for this crisis lay within the US (e.g. laisez-faire capitalism, fiscal policy of the FED, previous US government), so I don’t mind that they have to pay far more for cleaning this mess up.
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