Not living in caves
I'm just back from the rain sodden La Mon hotel in County Down where I was helping out on our live coverage of the DUP conference. I've been asked to contribute a "colour " piece to our main news website so you should hopefully be able to see my more extended thoughts here.
In brief, though, this was a well attended occasion in which the party staked its round for the next election. It has decided its best option is to forge ahead with its committment to power sharing mounting a more full blooded justification of the decisions taken by Ian Paisley back in 2007.
Peter Robinson still maintained a fair degree of ambiguity over the timing of the transfer of justice powers, but London and Dublin are likely to take heart from the tone of his speech, in which he tried to portray his critics (especially Jim Allister) as "unionist cave dwellers".
Although the DUP leader said Stormont's future couldn't be guaranteed, he added that his party wouldn't walk away.
I shall have an interview with Mr Robinson on Inside Politics on BBC Radio Ulster tomorrow after the one o'clock news.
I'm 
© 2012~RS~q~RS~~RS~z~RS~12~RS~)
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Mark,
From the word go it was clear today that the DUP are petrified of Jim Allister. In Peter's second paragraph he mentioned Jim. In total Peter said Jim's name 7 times and mentioned the TUV 3 times. Nigel Dodds said Jim's name 3 times. I note Peter has still not mentioned anything about cozying up to Marty by day and trying to smash him by night!!
Let us pick the bones out off Peter's speech -
Peter stated - "I make no apology for saying that I stand by this party’s conduct of the St Andrews negotiations." What conduct is this Peter? Is this where Ian Paisley had secret meetings with Tony Blair to which Peter is unhappy. Is this the same place Ian Paisley Jr was negiotation on behalf off his constituency not his party? Remember the shopping list. Just on an after thought. Was Seymour Sweeney present at the DUP conference today?????
With regards Policing and Justice I am now convinced it will not happen until at least after the next General election. Peter stated "I cannot guarantee the future of the Assembly but I can guarantee that it will not be the DUP that will walk away." Is Peter now accepting that he will not deliver within Sinn Feins time frame. Does Peter realise now that Sinn Fein may want early elections next year? On Thursday night on Hearts and Minds and today Peter will not say if he will serve as a deputy to McGuinness.
Did anyone else notice the position off the seating on the stage? The hardliners (Willie - my stomach is better now) McCrea, Iris Robinson, Gregory Campbell and David Simpson) were all within shot off the camera. It was strange to see Ian Paisley senior and junior and Edwin Poots out off the way. I wonder why!!
What was also interesting to note is that Ian McCrea was sitting on the front row. Do the DUP not want to be associated of the comments of Ian who said he opposed the pope comning to Ireland?
In other speeches Iris said that "There is excess fat in the (health) system". I think that this was more political spin than the truth.
David (grubber) Simpson said that the DUP are "helping small local businesses by cutting back red tape and reducing overheads." Maybe he shold show them how it is done by ending double jobbing and the farce on the hill.
At every conference someone always says that the party has a had a good conference. When was the last time any party had a bad one?
Stormontspy
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Mark
What a way to spend a Saturday !
The rugby has been great !!!
Will try to add to Stormontspy's post later.
You say you were asked to contribute "a colour" piece!
Which colours of the "rainbow on the hill",could you not use ???
Have seen no reports of Robinson, blaming a French footballer for his woes !!!
unless it was "JIM" Hendry,who handled the ball !!!
When is the "conference" being shown on Parley Chan ???
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mark
the "button" half worked!part of post got through!!!
Stormont control failing ???
Little people,grow up,put your hands in your pockets,realise
who you are,pretend who you think you are!!!
Not a BBC programme,NOW A DAVID MILIBAND dribble!
So bad,will any "moderator" stop this post?
BBC give me hope. I await !!!
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This was the sort of speech that David Trimble was making 8 or 9 years ago, I've been laughing at Peter bemoaning the "wilderness years" when Unionists were isolated and had no influence over direct rule minsters.
Errr Peter the reason why Unionism was in the wilderness was because of the rabble rousing tactics of the DUP in thwarting any attempt at agreement, (please refer to "Sunningdale" and "Ulster Workers Strike!"). Unionism would be in a much stronger position today if Paisley hadn't ellicted the support of loyalist paramilitaries to topple a democratically eleceted Executive that wouldn't have been as chaotic and dysfunctional as the current model! Also Unionism would only have had to deal with the SDLP and SF may never have been able to make the sort of gains it has over the last 15 years. It's incredible to think that Unionists once thought of Gerry Fitt and Austin Currie as the sort of bogeymen they now paint Gerry Adams and Martin McGuinness to be!
Oh how they must rue the day when they toppled Sunningdale! The ultimate pyrrhic victory!!
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It was a really weird speech, on the one hand it was extremely hard line, attacking republicans and focused on bolstering the union, focused entirely on the unionist community. You can understand that, it's Unionists who vote DUP, but it is rather discouraging to moderates like myself. On the other hand there were moderate parts of the speech, including an absolutely extraordinary bit in which he claimed that the SDLP had been right about civil rights (the same civil rights so vehemently opposed by Ian Paisley). He appeared to be suffering from political Schizophrenic.
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Yes the opening part was as far as I can recall the moderate bit. And you are right YellowSmurf, it reminded me of Tony Blair going to Europe and Gordon Brown recently too in the European Parliament, talking things up beautifully about Europe, but the narrative never ever met the reality, which Labour as a party had done nothing on in terms of building up consensus in Britain to be more supportive of EU ideals.
Robinson said look back at the old assembly wasn't it a failure and this new assembly is working, why would you want direct rule? But the truth is that while there were confrontations and arguments and failouts it was a breaking in period, this assembly has been consistently bad tempered and in stasis.
This time it is only the taut party grips of SF who manage to hush up its massive political failure in education and the DUP's grip in hushing up of executive walk-outs and non-agreement of agendas etc. All quiet on both fronts then you would think? But people can see past this as just very strong party management of putting gloss on failures. As to let go of this grip would mean everything would fall in on itself.
"The DUP kept faith with its principles" - yeah right - well until First Minister power-sharing became an option. So why did the DUP take up its ministerial seats and govern with Sinn Fein IRA (sic)? I wonder if big Ian was written down why he did what he did? Don't get me wrong, he was right to accept reality and moderate a little, but ehm, after all those years, it's just a little bit out of kilter with, if not diametrically oppposed to, that old DUP principle.
Can't wait for Paisley's memoirs, the years 2006-2007 in particular.
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Mark,
On Saturday Peter said -
"We held our ground when others bowed the knee; resisted the blandishments of false friends and held firm to our principles and beliefs."
Peter must have a short memory. At a DUP annual dinner in 2004 the leader at the time Ian Paisley said -
"Men and women of North Antrim, the political home of Ian Paisley, you know that I am not in the business of sellouts and surrenders.
When I first received your trust 34 years ago to be the voice of this great constituency you gave me the charge to defend the Union, protect Ulster, speak out for our people and lead us all to better days. I have put my hand to that task and you put your faith in me many years ago.
There will be no sell out or surrender as far as the Democratic Unionist Party is concerned. May I not fail this Province that I love!"
As Democratic Centrism wrote "Can't wait for Paisley's memoirs, the years 2006-2007 in particular" I whole heartily agree.
Stormontspy
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Sorry, I should have said Schizophrenia not Schizophrenic; I accidentally deleted the last letter while sorting something out with my keyboard and then completed the word without reading the sentence. I shall proof read in future.
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I think stormont spy you are beig a little harsh.
The DUP did not sell out.
The UUP said not guns on the table, under the table or outside the door....the promptly started negoitiations wihtout keeping that promise. They then said No guns no govt....then weeks after koined sinn fein for the first at three attempts of making the GFA work.
Clearly they changed posiitons form their manifestos.
The DUP kept theirs!
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for the sake of clarity perhaps you would point out which of the DUPs 7 principles from the 2003 assembly manifesto has been broken in securing this cuurent deal?
Perhaps you could look in the european election manifesto of 2004 and point out to me where the DUP sold out on their promise to the electorate....based on the 'devolution now' document of the same year, it sets out in further detail the DUP strategy for bring devolved institutions back to northern ireland.
You will note that Jim Allister signed off both manifestos as a DUP party officer and indeed won that eurpoean election on the same basis. It wasn't the DUP that changed....it was Jim.
"A mandatory coalition to include Sinn Fein
is only possible when they are demonstrably
committed to exclusively peaceful and
democratic means."
So why did Jim stand for election on this basis if he didnt agree with it?
Why aren't the BBC asking him is this not a bause of democracy to say one thing to get elected and do another afterward...
Jim attacked the UUP record on that issue then did it himself!
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Madge,
Back on the 8th May 2001 there was a motion in the Assembly titled - No Confidence in Minister of Education (Martin McGuinness)
Here is the bits that the DUP need to come clean on as they have done a massive U-Turn -
Mr P Robinson:
I beg to move - That this Assembly has no confidence in the Minister of Education, Mr Martin McGuinness MP.
I move the motion in the name of the Member for North Belfast, Nigel Dodds, and myself.
He was an officer in the IRA in Londonderry when hundreds of killings were ordered, and it was only the vigilance of the security forces, the ineptness of his own terrorist gunmen and bombers and the hand of God that reduced the tally.
He did not remain in this local command for long. He catapulted himself up the organisation structure, and eventually he became the terror group's chief of staff. He held that position from 1978 until 1982. During that period alone, the IRA, under his command, murdered 327 people, and he remains one of the seven members of the IRA's Army Council.
According to that document, Mr McGuinness is a member of the Army Council of the IRA, which has sanctioned the murder of thousands of men, women and children in and outside Northern Ireland. Now, while still a member of the IRA's Army Council, Mr McGuinness is the Minister of Education with the responsibility for moulding the minds of thousands of young people.
That is in spite of evidence from people such as Rose Hegarty, the mother of Frank Hegarty. Mr McGuinness lured her son back from England, gave her repeated assurances of her son's safety and informed her that while her son would have to attend a meeting across the border, "nothing would happen to Frank". Mr McGuinness even told her that he would bring him home himself. Frank Hegarty never returned home alive. He was shot and his body dumped by the roadside. The families of all those who are the victims of the IRA, under the leadership that Mr McGuinness now admits, should now take action against him in the courts.
The truth is that it was not a confession, it was a boast. He wears his IRA leadership as a badge of honour. He gloats over his association with that terrorist organisation. He has not come clean. He is only providing a snippet to suit his propaganda purposes and aid the IRA's attempt at revisionism.
With that knowledge, I opposed, at the time of the referendum and ever since, any role for Mr McGuinness or his unrepentant associates in the Government of Northern Ireland. No one by their vote would put in to Government someone in whom they had no confidence. No one would set up a Government in which it was an obligation to provide places for people they considered completely unfit to hold office.
Are we going to continue with this unseemly and immoral sham? This House can decide whether it has confidence in Mr McGuinness - I do not.
Rev Dr Ian Paisley:
People in this country are asking what has happened to democracy. On a programme this morning, a lady said that there are terrible arguments over the man who committed the Great Train Robbery. That lady asked what had happened in Northern Ireland. It has been suggested that Ronnie Biggs should serve the rest of his sentence, but in Northern Ireland those guilty of terrorist acts are in the Government of the country. What has happened to democracy?
A convicted terrorist and a self-confessed commander of the most bloodthirsty and murderous gang of the IRA, the Londonderry brigade, sits as the Minister of Education in this House.
Today, the blood of innocents stains him. He has destroyed families by his direction of the Londonderry brigade of the IRA on its wicked, murderous ploys. He has destroyed families. He has destroyed the peace of men and women, boys and girls, fathers and mothers and sisters and brothers. That brigade butchered their loved ones in a most atrocious and bloody way.
Mr Weir:
I have no confidence in the Education Minister.
There should be no need for a vote of no confidence in Martin McGuinness, because he and his Colleagues should not be in Government in the first place.
No democratic system in the world would tolerate having people whose organisation has committed murder after murder involved in its Government.
Rev Dr William McCrea:
The Bible says that
"A double minded man is unstable in all his ways."
Mr Campbell:
The issue is not whether Martin McGuinness is a suitable person to be Education Minister in as much as how he conducts himself in the office of Minister of Education between 9.00 am and 5.00 pm. The issue is whether Martin McGuinness is a suitable person to be Minister of Education because of his background, his activities, and his adherence to the philosophy of violence and murder. That is the issue.
Mr Dodds:
Listening to Mr Adams speak about moving forward and forgiveness, one would not think that members of the IRA have been the butchers of innocent people in Northern Ireland for 30 years.
The reality is, as Mr Peter Robinson said, that we know of Martin McGuinness's role in the leadership of the IRA. That is why we opposed the setting up of an Executive with IRA/Sinn Féin in it. That is why we put down an exclusion motion to put Sinn Féin/IRA out of the Government of Northern Ireland. This is not a last- minute motion that was put down because of an election. This is something that is ongoing, because our role in the Assembly is to harry Sinn Féin and expose its members for what they are.
Would it be acceptable in any European democracy, or anywhere else, for someone who has confessed to being the adjutant of a terrorist organisation to remain in office? He has never indicated when he left the IRA, if ever. There is a list of crimes ascribed to that organisation which were carried out when he was in a leading position. Did he think that that would not be challenged and that it would not raise serious concerns that would lead people to demand that he should be voted out of the Government of Northern Ireland? I
People see the IRA being compensated. They see terrorists coming out of jail. They see terrorists in Government, and they see nothing in return. Now is the time for action.
--
Well Madge what changed the DUP's mind?
Stormontspy
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Stormont spy....are you having a laugh?
Read the DUP manifestos since then. This current deal is not the ideal situation but the DUP said in Jim allisters manifesto and in the assembly of 2003 that they would recognise sinn feins mandate when they committed to peaceful democratic means.
That quote was in my original post. It was put to the people in several elections. the startegy was clearly laid out. In 2001 Sinn fein did not accept the police, courts or british rule of law. They do now. its all in the manifestos 2003, 2004 and 2007. read them yourself.
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Madge,
Maybe you would like to explain -
08/05/2001 Mr P Robinson - "According to that document, Mr McGuinness is a member of the Army Council of the IRA, which has sanctioned the murder of thousands of men, women and children in and outside Northern Ireland. Now, while still a member of the IRA's Army Council, Mr McGuinness is the Minister of Education with the responsibility for moulding the minds of thousands of young people."
The DUP have now secured Martin McGuinness as the Deputy First Minister. Just to be clear his history has not changed. Once people join paramilitary groups they never leave them. Martin McGuinness is still sitting in the IRA Army Council. Not only is he double jobbing this just shows he is triple jobbing.
Let's go back to the 8th May 2001 and Peter Robinson - "I opposed, at the time of the referendum and ever since, any role for Mr McGuinness or his unrepentant associates in the Government of Northern Ireland."
Was this the aim off the DUP in 2003??
On the same day Rev Dr Ian Paisley: "In Northern Ireland those guilty of terrorist acts are in the Government of the country. What has happened to democracy? A convicted terrorist and a self-confessed commander of the most bloodthirsty and murderous gang of the IRA, the Londonderry brigade, sits as the Minister of Education in this House" (now Deputy First Minister and after next MLA election will be First Minister).
On the same day Peter (give me a job) Weir - "No democratic system in the world would tolerate having people whose organisation has committed murder after murder involved in its Government."
I wonder does he stand by that. What has changed significantly to let that happen? People's past history doesn't disappear.
The classic quote which I hope Willie - my stomach's better now - McCrea can explain - "A double minded man is unstable in all his ways."
Is the DUP and in particular Ian Paisley unstable? 40 years of saying no is now a yes.
Stormontspy
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Stormontspy
Politics involve moving things on and changing things. You must agree Sinn Fein has changed over the years. When Sinn Fein changed then Unionisim has 2 choices.
1 Run away and hide in the caves and let others fight your case ie Direct Rule
or
2 Stand up and confront them the way the DUP have been doing ie Irish Language Act,Maze Shrine
Even the cave men have changed there was a day when they would not even sit in a studio with sinn fein now they can talk with sinn fein openly on the media.
They (Jim Allister)also say in one breath unrepentant terrorists are not fit for government and in the next they say if sinn fein stand for election and get enough votes and form a coalition then they can be in government.
Can someone post TUV policy on
1 Sinn fein in government.
2 Talking to unrepentant terrorists on the media
3 Direct Rule
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Stormontspy
To follow on my last post I have just read Jim Allisters latest post on his web site (Allister answers back in Lurgan)
Jim says Peter Robinson did not attack sinn fein, if Jim takes a little more time and reads other speeches made at the DUP conference he will soon see sinn fein attacked. He goes on to say it is wicked and both morally and politically wrong to put at the top and the heart of government in Northern Ireland, further on in the speech Jim says yes they (sinn fein) are elected, but as anywhere else in the world any minority party should only have access to government ( I cant believe what he said they SHOULD only have access to government) if they can persuade other parties to form a coalition with them. So in one breath its wicked to have sinn fein in government and in the next Jim says if they are elected and can form a coalition then they should have access to government. You can read it all on TUV website Allister answers back in Lurgan. I wonder will this post on the web site be removed or changed it wouldnt be the first.
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The above post should read. It is wicked and both morally and politically wrong to put at the top and heart of government in Northern Ireland those who through the worst excesses of wickedness bombed and butchered the innocent of this Province, further on in the speech....
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LisburnDUP,
Let me try and address those issues one by one!!
Yes politics has changed over the years. The DUP and Sinn Fein have both moved on a great deal. Remember the days when the DUP marched with the UVF and the UDA, it organised a series of strikes in conjunction with Loyalist paramilitaries, it helped establish Ulster Resistance and it helped in the procurement of weapons by Loyalists. Also Willie - my stomach is better now - McCrea officiated at the funeral of a UVF man who was killed blowing up the Miami show band.
You say - "Even the cave men have changed there was a day when they would not even sit in a studio with Sinn Fein now they can talk with Sinn Fein openly on the media." So did Sinn Fein. Even after the DUP went into Government with Sinn Fein some members off the DUP still didn't sit beside Sinn Fein in TV studios.
With regards to TUV policy you would need to ask Jim Allister that as after all it is his party.
You claim "Jim says Peter Robinson did not attack Sinn Fein, if Jim takes a little more time and reads other speeches made at the DUP conference he will soon see Sinn Fein attacked." Why not try reading this again and again if necessary to understand it. Jim Allister is right that Peter Robinson does not attack Sinn Fein. Peter's only attack was on his only political enemy - TUV. Yes you are right, every other speaker attacked Jim Allister. Remember during the European Election Diane Dodds was threatening to "Smash Sinn Fein". Did she? While she was trying what did her husband do?
Lisburn DUPm tell me this. In 2004 Ian Paisley made a call for the IRA to "wear sackcloth and ashes". Have they?
In 2006 at a Labour Party Conference Breakfast Event in Manchester Ian Paisley said "No other part of this United Kingdom would permit, within the ranks of its administration, those committed to terrorism or criminality." Has Sinn Fein had it's history wiped?
Stormontspy
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Stormontspy
You say you are going to address the issues one by one, so lets see what you have to say
1 You agree that sinn fein and the dup have moved on a great deal, you then go on a rant about dup history. The other points you ignore are what do unionists do to confront the change in sinn fein.
Can I ask 1.If you think its good that Parties have moved?
2.Which option should unionists chose Direct Rule or a Local Assembley ?
2 I said that the TUV (cave) men had changed to make the point that people can change, you reply to this point with comments that dont make sense.
3 TUV policy - I asked for anyone to post the policy. I must say that your postings would lead me to think you would have great sympathy with TUV I could be wrong. Im finding more and more that TUV voters are against the DUP and want the assembley down as you do, but ask what should be in its place and there is never a clear answer. So I ask you what do we have in place when the assembley is gone?
4 Fighting Elections - The DUP and TUV will be electoral opponents so I can fully understand political debate between the two ( I believe it would be better if there was more unity between unionist parties)I dont think the DUP would talk about the TUV as the enemy its always Opponents, and I dont know why you are bringing up the European Election, remember Diane Dodds took the seat from the sitting MEP something that had not happened in Ulster for I dont know how long I cannot remember it ever happening.
5 You then start to quote from the past. I would think we could name and quote most if not all politicians in Ulster and prove they have moved. So quoting a handfull of politicians to try to make a point is not a great idea because I could name and quote and that proves nothing.
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Lisburn DUP
While I am preparing a response to the above tell me this. Are the DUP happy sitting in Government with a member of the IRA Army Council?
Stormontspy
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Im not a spokesman for the DUP im not even a member, but I dont think the DUP would say they are happy sitting in government with any member of sinn fein. It would be a great wee country if there was no sinn fein no sdlp no one else here but right wing unionists and we all thought the same as you, but thats not the way it is.We need to face the real world
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Lisburn DUP,
Let me be clear. I am not a member or supporter of any political party. I am glad that the trouble in Northern Ireland is over. I am also glad that the arguments in Stormont are settled with words and plans not bombs and bullets.
In my opinion the whole arrangements at Stormont are a farce. If we were to have a proper Government then there would be a Government and an opposition. Here we have a circus. We should either transform our Executive or go back to direct rule. The country is broke and here we have the dummies on the hill bleeding dry even further. To suggest that a pay rise is the way forward is criminal. I know people who work twice as long as the average MLA and get 3 times less. Politicians like every other member of society needs to justify their wage. I see the PSNI are now getting every officer to justify their job. I think that practise should be introduced in Stormont for both the MLA's and support staff.
What amazes me is how the whole change of the DUP was brought about in the last 3 years. From 40 years of saying no now Ian Paisley said yes. Why?
Stormontspy
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Stormontspy
You might want to consider supporting the DUP as you will find your views and those of the DUP similar, on the type of government the DUP want voluntary coalition government with an opposition but whos against it ?
The DUP also want the number of MLA,s reduced to 72 I think it is, that would save alot of money.
The dummies as you call them on the hill are not bleeding the country as much as the dummies in the scotish, welsh, and even the republics government.
While I support the need for MLAs and MPs to only have one job when that happens that is going to cost the country alot more money.
I do smile when I hear people from other parties crying about the DUP MP,s and MLA,s double jobbing, is that not a very poor reflection on themselves when the voters say the one DUP person can do 2 jobs better than they can do 1.
You ask at the end why Paisley changed. I cant answer in detail that question but I think you might answer it yourself in your opening words of your last post,you said "im glad that the trouble in Northern Ireland is over" for that to happen everyone had to change. Paisley and the DUP made it clear what sinn fein had to do before there could be any progress. People agreed and people disagree with what was done and I have no problem with that but standing pointing the finger at all the current problems and offering no better solution is of no use to anyone.
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Lisburn DUP,
I would never join any political party. The general public view political parties as money grabber and job dodgers.
The DUP has said that it wants the number of MLA's and departments reduced but have done nothing but have a pointless debate on it. Actions not words are needed. I believe we could survive with 54 MLA's. Just for the record I live in Northern Ireland so that is my only concern.
The fact that all MP's are MLA's, show the lack off depth in the DUP ranks. As David McNarry said "the X Factor nine are the best of his bad bunch".
Paisley had the chance to end all trouble years ago and choose not to. All Paisley's beliefs have gone up in smoke. Paisley opposes gambling yet Ian Paisley Jr lobbied for lottery funding for Seymour Sweeney and the Causeway project.
Stormontspy
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
Stormontspy
Your last post starts with political parties being Job dodgers and then you complain about them having 2 Jobs, that does not make sense.
The argument that the DUP have no depth is just crazy, You just have to look at the candidates that UCUNF are putting forward. Im waiting to see who Jim Allister will risk letting lose as a candidate. You may not like the DUP team but when you consider Peter Robinson, Nigel Dodds, Jeffrey Donaldson, Gregory Campbell, Sammy Wilson, Nelson McCausland, Arlene Foster, to name but a few you cant say theres no depth. Lottery Funding - What you are saying is any one or any organisation who asks for funding from the Lottery has to support gambling. If you apply to Europe for funding does that mean you support being in Europe thats just stupid logic.
So its all Paisleys fault all the trouble for years, he should have ended it all years ago I think thats a bit simplistic.
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Lisburn DUP,
Your brain washed to sy the least. People can have as many jobs as they want but whether they do it efficiently or not is a more serious matter.
As for lottery funding you have to look at the bigger picture. Would you accept a loan from Martin McGuinness bearing in mind what happened with the Northern Bank.
As for all the DUP candidates. They all share the same qualities - bitter and under achievers.
Stormontspy
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Stormontspy
I think when we reach taking loans from Martin McGuinness, its probably a fairly good sign that this disscusion has been exhausted.
We will let the people decide in the incoming year who is delivering efficently in their Jobs and me thinks the "bitter under achievers" might do ok, but we will see.
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LisburnDUP,
Tell me this -
1. How many seats do you think TUV will take from the DUP at Westminster?
2. How many seats do you think TUV will take from the DUP at Stormont?
Stormontspy
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The TUV will take no seats in the Westminster election. as for Stormont I would be in a much better position after the westminister election to predict the number of seats the TUV would take.
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LisburnDUP,
I would not be too sure. Do you think the Ulster Unionists will take seats off the DUP or do you just think that the DUP will return to Westminster with 9 MPs??
Stormontspy
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What we can all be sure about is, The Ulster Unionists wont win any seats they dont exist in the westminster election, the Ulster Unionists are not standing in any constituency. Im waiting with interest to see how the selected canditates will react when they are told that they are not allowed to stand for the election. I understand David and Reg have to have a wee chat about selection. Reg will then have to deliver what he,s told, lol that will be fun for Reg.
I think the DUP could return with 9 MPS or even 10 or 11. How could that happen you might ask well if they retain all their existing seats and Lady Silvia stands as an independent in North Down against the UCUNF then DUP could slip in and if the UCUNF agreed to run an agreed candidate in South Belfast and Fermanagh then the DUP could have 11 seats and UCUNF 1.
Alot depends on how many seats TUV fight and how many votes they take, there could be some close seats Upper Bann, South Antrim, North Antrim, if the Tuv take enough votes then a UCUNF candidate could get in I dont think it will happen but it could .
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LisburnDUP,
I accept that Ulster Unionists are now called Ulster Conservatives but I do feel that they will at least win a seat somewhere. The fact that Jim Nicholson won a seat against all odds in June says they have a fighting chance. Maybe their candidates are not up to much but anyone in North Down would hardly look to Peter - can I have a job - Weir.
In 2004 the DUP under your hero Jim Allister had 175,761 votes. The Ulster Unionists under Jim Nicholson had 91,164.
In 2009 the DUP had 88,346 and the UUP had 82,893. Jim Allister had 66,197. It is quite clear that the DUP lost half their votes.
You say that the DUP are going to maintain if not increase their number of MP's. Where did you get that from? A Christmas cracker!!!
Stormontspy
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Can I just say, a majority government will never again return to N.Ireland, or atleast not until Ireland is put back the way it was. Unionism caused our current problems by not playing democracy, they can never again be trusted with sole power or sole control over N.Ireland. It's power sharing between Green and Orange or power sharing between Dublin and London. Unionism is stuck between a rock and a hard place and has moved into self destruct mode. It's great to watch.
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Ref post 32: a chinese fortune cookie; not very reliable; beware.
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Stormontspy
You asked a question in post 30 to which I replyed and i explained my answer. You say its a christmas cracker.
Now lets look at your logic. You say in post 32 the UCUNF will win at least 1 seat, and you seem to think the DUP are going to lose seats, which means they will lose them to TUV. I really dont know who the TUV (Jim Allsiter) could put forward as candidates. Jim will take a massive risk if he lets any other members of the TUV go on radio or TV, has any one heard another member of the TUV speak on the media (I have heard 1 other Keith Harbinson and he was on Nolan Apologising to Sinn Fein because the TUV offended them. Jim was on this morning trying to sort another mess out.)The TUV is made up of anyone who hates the DUP thats all you have to do to be a member. Jim Allister is smart enough (sometimes) to make it look otherwise but there is not another member of that party who could debate on the media, they are not even fit to post on their own web site. There are a large number of posts that are removed and replaced because they dont make sense or contain spelling mistakes, Jim will have his hands full keeping his clowns in line around the westminster election. So I dont think any of them will win seats. I have given you my views on the election now lets here yours.
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Lisburn DUP,
I think at the general election the UCUNF will take a couple of seats. Sinn Fein will grow their number of seats while the SDLP will go bust. The DUP will still have MP's but as for the numbers I am unsure. I think the big problem for the DUP is that if they lose voters to the TUV then another party will swop in and beat the 2.
Stormontspy
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Does anyone think that a vote of no confidence in our current minister for education would be a good idea? My personal opinion is that her handling of her post has been woeful at best, and when the current 11+ (sorry for any political incorrectness, but I’m not really that worried) fiasco is observed it appears to me that she is incapable of the task appointed to her.
At least we can say one good thing about her time in office; she has united schools from all backgrounds and dominations in their support of academic selection.
As I hope everyone is aware by this post I am suggesting this on a basis of her performance from 9am-5pm, not on her general political views or party affiliation
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