The view from rural South Carolina
In preparation for President Obama's 100th day, I have spent some time today with South Carolina Governor Mark Sanford whose relatively lonely hold-out against the stimulus spending orgy has attracted some talk of future presidential bids if it all goes wrong for Mr Obama.
We left Mr Sanford on a tractor on a patch of land near Beaufort in the state's gorgeous lowland region - looking very at home on his own soil as it were.
Mr Obama tills no sod. He never has - not in Hawaii and not at Harvard and certainly not in Chicago.
I cannot think of another president who has not at least pretended to have a love of the great American outdoors. If Mr Obama goes down in one term it will be the revenge of the rural folks rather than a right/left thing.
At a gun shop, we heard lurid tales of ammunition-buying in the wake of the growth of the power of the federal government. Sounds daft? Maybe - and of course he lost South Carolina in the election anyway, so his relative unpopularity here is no great surprise - but South Carolina is only irrelevant if he manages to rescue the economy and then deal with the inflationary consequences of the rescue.
If it does not work, Mr Sanford is ready with the Big Chill that might be necessary.
Sell Palin (if you are still crazy enough to be holding this currency), keep Jindal, buy Sanford, at least as a hedge...
Comments
Sign in or register to comment.
Yes, there is a movement afoot in the Bible Belt fueled by evangelical ultra conservatives, abortion and gay rights opponents, and proponents of gun rights to make sure President Obama is not re-elected in 2012.
In my opinion, the GOP is making a strategic mistake in moving to the center. They are not going to persuade Democrats to vote for them and Independents are leaning Democratic. Their only chance remains with the traditional GOP base and the probability of an economic meltdown. It doesn't matter whether or not President Obama inherited the economic and fiscal mess we are in, if he can not fix it in four years he is out.
Complain about this comment
What? Hawaii dude...the greatest of the great outdoors without even trying.
Our rural brothers are not as stupid as y'all make them out to be - sure some are dumb as a box of rocks - but so are city folk (who also have more guns), and most anyone can tell you they wouldn't vote for someone whose dumb enough to choose to sit on a tractor in the hot SC sun all day if they didn't have to.
Complain about this comment
Cat,
- "...dumb enough to choose to sit on a tractor in the hot SC sun all day if they didn't have to."
How else to keep one's neck the proper shade of crimson?Complain about this comment
To#2 Frayedcat
Good points! And why should country folk be pitted against city folk? We do need each other. Someone has to grow those veggies and someone is needed to buy them.
To#3 Hesiodos
Sunscreen and a hat will cure that problem.
Complain about this comment
But it's his credentials!
Complain about this comment
To Justin Webb
I do appreciate the irony of you seeking out our current President's successor this soon. Early guidance in this matter can be so helpful, especially for those of us who live in rural areas.
Complain about this comment
"the revenge of the rural folks" - what a quaint fairy tale, perfectly suited for a correspndent eminently unwilling - and unsuited - to even begin discussing left/right "things" in any serious fashion...the same addled correspondent who not so long ago was dismissing the white working class as electorally irrelevant,,,any old wind that blows becomes the latest trend for a lazy brand of reporting that's permanently stuck on presidential personlities and crass electioneering, as if the other 300 millions daily efforts are all wrapped up in "irrelevant" power politics...Republicans & Democrats serve the same corporate masters so any overdue rebellion will favor nether...city "folks" aren't so easy to fool either
Complain about this comment
I wonder why someone who considers Justin Webb to be an "addled correspondent . . . permanently stuck on presidential personalities . . ." bothers to read this blog. Surely he must have better things to do than read blogs he hates just so he can make nasty remarks.
Complain about this comment
I think our Justin Webb enjoys irony and inciting interesting discussions.
Perhaps he was weary of the same arguments and wished to start new trends of thought and a sharing of ideas.
Complain about this comment
As Conservatives go, Sanford seems to be the real deal. Who knows? After Obama, a real conservative might just be an attractive alternative.
It's too soon to tell about the GOP contender. Whoever he is, he'll be in response to discontent with Obama.
I think the Republicans' laying low is a good strategy for now. Everyone needs to get to know Obama, the policy maker, not just Obama, the speech-maker.
Complain about this comment
#4. aquarizonagal: Someone has to grow those veggies and someone is needed to buy them."
Bear in mind that California is the primary producer of veggies for America - and you know how California votes!
Complain about this comment
To#11 Davidcunard
Excellent point!
Complain about this comment
To#10 Andreainny
The Republicans have been "laying low." Where?
Complain about this comment
So many things could happen in the next 4 years that would decide the
course of the election. Here's a partial list:
1. The Catholics could defect
2. We could get bogged down in Afghanistanhttp://www.politico.com/news/stories/0409/21724.html
3. Pakistan could fall
4. We could be attacked by terrorists again
5. The Democrats could go on an anti-terror witchhunt, and shoot themselves
by mistake because Pelosi was in the know, as explained here.
6. We could have stagflation or worse as a result of the stimulus package
7. The Obama administration could fail to turn around the economy, and
we could still get stagflation or worse.
8. The Russians could get aggressive
9. The Iranians could get the bomb
10. Iraq could come apart as we withdraw.
But, this is not a complete list. I encourage the reader to use his or her
imagination. And, of course, there are always unknowns waiting to erupt.
Complain about this comment
13, aqua -
I was wondering that myself. I guess they're hiding in plain sight.
Complain about this comment
I don't know how that link got posted twice, it obviously has to do with
point #5.
Complain about this comment
I did not not that it was a presidential requirement to be a farmer or an outdoorsman. I guess South Carolina has a lot to teach me.
Complain about this comment
I agree with you, however, that Palin is yesterday's news.
Complain about this comment
Maybe it's North v. South is the point ... again. Palin is like ...representative of the South of Alaska. North-South Korea, North-South Sudan. EastisEastWestisWest. Obama mentions the moral compass more than once. Cynics take the view that religious leaders use morality to control people. Then the whole moral power struggle can be tied to control of land and resources (back to the points of the compass) but the only measure of resources has become money. This upsets the compass - money doesn't have a geographic location anymore. The people are confused and so rebellious.
We should of never left the gold standard.
Complain about this comment
To#19 Frayedcat
A very interesting observation and worth some thought.
Complain about this comment
MAybe Maybe Maybe.
wow like having to guess the next election is not as irrelevant now as it was when after the last election(2 years ago, not presidential) the next day they asked about presidential bids.
At least he waited 100 days eh?
nnnnnnnnnnnnnmmmmmmmmmmghhgg uuuuu
Complain about this comment
18 marbles is that why she is refered to as Palinolitic
17 didn't you know you can't have a good leader unless they have slaves in their history.
Complain about this comment
19 frayed yes it is strange that gold has now risen to being more expensive than pot per ounce.
Complain about this comment
23, happy, I guess that means that now you can sell some gold and
buy something useful.
Complain about this comment
24 yea! now where did I put it?
Complain about this comment
There is no permanent majority in the US. What is happening in S. Carolina is as relevant as is happening in any place else - - if you are trying to peer through the fog of 1 2/3 years at the election of 2010, or 3 2/3 years at the next presidential election.
What Obama has done scares a lot of Americans today, maybe the majority of us. He has quickly spent trillions, all of it straight out of the national debt, in a time when we know we are hard up to pay our bills. Any sane person has to pause over that. And the people who really believe that the federal government should of right be in charge of everything including private corporate governance, are a distinct minority and always have been.
Right now we mostly like and admire him (but not all), and it is in our nature to give any new administration the benefit of a clean start. But a year and a half from now, enough water will have gone under the bridge to allow most of us to think again: that's as it should be.
South Carolina is still considered to be generally treasonous by the rest of the country, as it was in the 1830's when it led the first attempt by the South to succeed from the union, and was outwitted by the unionist President Jackson, himself a slave-holding Southerner. But its very steadfastness and obstinacy is also felt to be the guarantee of our ancient freedoms.
Three percent chose Obama, and turned the nation around. Elections are very hard to win, and harder still to control even one year out. No one knows what unlikely coalitions will be formed by the roiling and boiling under our surface. Don't discount places like S.C., nor people who don't look or talk like yourself.
KScurmudgeon
Complain about this comment
8. At 02:02am on 28 Apr 2009, bere54 wrote:
I wonder why someone who considers Justin Webb to be an "addled correspondent . . . permanently stuck on presidential personalities . . ." bothers to read this blog. Surely he must have better things to do than read blogs he hates just so he can make nasty remark.
-----------------------
Bere.. lol but I am with #7
I fit your description very well.
But I do like other people on the BBC 's blog. and I do live in the USA and have a british outlook.
so it makes some sense.
See I think the " Sounds daft? Maybe " is daft.. where's the maybe in it?
Complain about this comment
Justin Webb's conclusions seem to be as basic and primitive as Marcus Areola II's
Complain about this comment
I don't understand. The federal government offers a state (which apparently is not exactly thriving) money which is intended to benefit its citizens. The Governor refuses to take it, thereby depriving his electors, on purely ideological and partisan grounds.
This is a good, sensible, thing?
Governor Sanford, of course, is in a much more fortunate position than, I presume, many of his constituents. He has put a house he bought 12 years ago on the market for a frugal 3.5 million dollars. (Somewhat more than seven times the original price 12 years ago.) Now, suppose the position were reversed. . .would he be advocating government mortgage relief, I wonder?
Info from The Post and Courier
Complain about this comment
SaintDominick (Post 1) Where are the signs of the Republicans moving to the centre?! The current faces of the GOP appear to be Cheney, Limbaugh and Newt Gungrich - hardly a mad dash to the middle ground!
If they stay where they are now, they'll end up a rump southern and midwest party with about 30 Senators and 150 Congressmen.
Complain about this comment
17. At 03:58am on 28 Apr 2009, allmymarbles wrote:
"I did not not that it was a presidential requirement to be a farmer or an outdoorsman. I guess South Carolina has a lot to teach me."
I was wondering of course, if the Governor's 'attachment to the soil' is more an attachment to the soil profitable houses are built on?
Complain about this comment
Nearly 100 days! So long already. Who can a bored Justin suggest as pretender to the push for the throne in 2012?.
At first glance Governor Mark Sanford would appear to be an ideal choice to reinvigorate the credibility of the Republican party, and the important USA farming industry could be the catalyst required to introduce the winds of change that are bound to occur when BHO makes a small mistake over the rest of his presidency, though it will not just be the rural folk who want revenge...
aquarizonagal # 4 and David # 11 wrote about their veggies. But for the average American , his greens on his plate are usually ignored and it's all about the size of the portion of meat.
DouglasFeith # 7 "....any old wind that blows", has nosed out the problem,
The big question mark still appears to be about gas in all its forms, and how much America will accept change and move to a green healthier lifestyle [ and planet].
Gas and bile fill these pages.
Here is more- http://tinyurl.com/c87f89
Old news is not always good news.
Complain about this comment
British-ish is on the right track! I am a South Carolinian and am amazed that Justin didn't pick up on the history of Sanford. Sanford does not relate at all to rural America - he is part of the wealthy elite in S.C. The only reasons he refused that money is because he is an enemy of public education (which would greatly benefit from his acceptance of the last bit of stimulus money) and because he's a skinflint ('claims he is preparing for a rainy day). I believed his lies and actually voted for him in the first election, but then I saw his true colors come out. Sanford on a tractor is like dressing a pig up with lipstick. We should avoid putting such extremists like him or Palin in power.
Oh, yea - and quit complaining about Obama and let's hear your solution to the mess that the past several administrations have put us into. In all my years on this earth, I've never seen a president that tried to heal factions and work as hard on the issues as Obama. He is the only politician I feel positive about in my country right now.
Complain about this comment
33. At 11:00am on 28 Apr 2009, SC-Science-Teach:
Ta, I was hoping I was looking in the right direction. (Took me all of 10 minutes to get that far -- didn't think much of the Charleston City online rag at all; that's a shambolically confused 'article' for a start -- but to be honest I can't really be bothered about some flash-in-the pan politician who probably no-one in the Republican Party will be able to name in 2 years' time so I didn't look around any further.)
I shall wait to see what, if any, report emanates from Justin before passing final judgement, but let's say I wonder sometimes about the amount of research that's done in the BBC Washington office before a jolly jaunt to chat to a chappie on a tractor.
(Interesting report, sounding rather different, including views akin to yours, rather than the ones here that too often seem to influence our J, from Jamie Kuromasami -- never can remember how to spell his name, sorry -- on the World Service this morning, though.)
Complain about this comment
This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
Waterman,
- "At first glance Governor Mark Sanford would appear to be an ideal choice to reinvigorate the credibility of the Republican party, and the important USA farming industry..."
Ah, the key word! I remember when, as I was slowly becoming aware of politics in the late forties, the importance of the "farm vote". Now, just like the others, the farming "industry" is a powerful political entity. There is no longer a meaningful "farm vote":- "IN OCTOBER OF 1993, the New York Times announced that the United States Census Bureau would "no longer count the number of Americans who live on farms " In explaining the decision, the Times provided some figures as troubling as they were unsurprising. Between 1910 and 1920, we had 32 million farmers living on farms-about a third of our population. By 1950, this population had declined, but our farm population was still 23 million. By 199l, the number was only 4.6 million, less than 2 percent of the national population. That is, our farm population had declined by an average of almost half a million people a year for forty-one years. Also, by 199l, 32 percent of our farm managers and 86 percent of our farmworkers did not live on the land they farmed....."
I suspect Sanford's tractor has an airconditioned cab, so any neck colouration will be carefully contrived and applied from a PR jar.Welcome SC Scientist, we've got a Lady lurking nearby. I share your sentiments regarding the POTUS - the best and most refreshing thing in ages.
Give my regards to Robert E Lee IV, if you happen to know the lad. He'll be the same age as me and the Curmudgeon from Kansas...
Complain about this comment
Ref 30, Mark
"Where are the signs of the Republicans moving to the centre?"
The most obvious was the selection of a moderate African-American to lead the party. Statements by Republican strategists also suggest a move to the Center. Fortunately for Democrats, the base of the GOP remains as intransigent as ever and continues to be hung up on issues such as abortion, birth control, guns rights, and letting the "market forces" take care of our economic problems.
I believe Justin's observation refers simply to the fact that the opposition is alive and relatively well, but in my opinion without a realistic chance to win in 2012.
Complain about this comment
When the two main settlements of the Carolina Colony split the more affluent Charleston colonists were quite happy to separate from the the northern colonists. One popular joke in the play 1776 is the repeated refrain 'North Carolina defers to South Carolina'.
The last major news item before the recent wildfire, I remember hearing about SC was that fundamentalist christians were encouraging each other to move there to form a christian state and possibly succeed from the union.
Moving along a few hundred years the economic power and political importance certainly shifted north, North Carolina tipped towards the Democrats partly because many people have moved into the state and urban population has increased, high tech has taken over from rural industries. Why did you not visit Durham, North Carolina to see a majority black city at the heart of change. In the 60s a prosperous black 'wall street' was bulldozed to put through a freeway - many people think this was intentional, today the site of Research Triangle Park where high tech business has provided some of the diversity that is helping NC weather the economic downturn. And the downtown is making a great transformation, but the problems of urban America have not gone away yet. A tractor in a field in SC just does not seem like the pulse of the nation.
Complain about this comment
Oh brother, Mark Sanford's theories on economics are seriously flawed. He wants to cut spending during a RECESSION. That just will NOT work. The Last President who tried to this Was Herbert Hoover. Hoover was such an economic genius that he earned his degree in Civil Engineering.
Cutting spending during a recession has been proven not to work. We have to stimulate the economy. Then we can handle the budget deficiet, which made easier to deal with once people get employed.
Complain about this comment
I want to make ONE thing clear about the increase in gun sales. I understand many People in this country believe that it is their constitutional right to by guns.
However, that is based on a misreading of the 2nd Amendment of the United States Constitution. The Amendment actually says:"A well regulated militia being necessary for the security of a free state, the right to keep and bare arms shall not be infringed."
The key word in that phrase is Militia, aka the National Guard which in times of peace answer to the governor of whatever state they live in, Not the President. This amendment was never intended to gaurentee private gone ownership. Instead it recognized the rights of states to maintain their own militias, who were responsible for responding in an emergency. Granted many of these militiamen were farmers, who also used their guns for hunting. But no one is suggesting getting rid of hunting rifles. What we want to do is get rid of automatic weapons that are used by intercity gangs. WE are not threatening hunters.
Complain about this comment
@14 (guns): You are quite correct. There are far too many things on the horizon to be able to discern who will be where in 2012. Besides, the real action is not in the Presidency but in the Congress. If the Ds in Congress are high-handed, they'll eventually get what's coming to them.
@26 (KSC): You are also scintillating this morning. Your first and last lines in particular are worth remembering. For myself I'll modify that last one to say, "Learn all you can learn from those who don't look, or talk, or think like yourself".
Complain about this comment
The Republican, themselves, have been relatively quiet. The loudest voices are those accusing them of something. Obama has had the spotlight to himself, which, I would think, is exactly where they want it.
Complain about this comment
Sandford is a joke. Even state conservatives here are aghast at his refusal to take the stimulus money. His 'principled stance' has done nothing but cause every South Carolinian to shake his head in disbelief, how could we have elected such an idiot?
Yes the public debt needs to be dealt with, yes it's an issue that must be addressed but not in the middle of a recession! Not while SC has the highest unemployment rate in the nation! Sandford should've backpedaled while he had the chance, now he just looks like the idiot he is in front of the entire US and not just South Carolina
Complain about this comment
42. At 1:59pm on 28 Apr 2009, AndreainNY wrote:
The Republican, themselves, have been relatively quiet. The loudest voices are those accusing them of something. Obama has had the spotlight to himself, which, I would think, is exactly where they want it"
Which would make the republicans the first political movement in history that would prefer its opponents to be in the spotlight.
Better cure themselves of that hopeless naivity very quickly
Complain about this comment
This past month has been weird I mean really weird. First it was Republican Governors like Sanford, Jindal, Palin, and Reed all refusing to take the stimulus money, which would Actually Stimulate the exonomies. Then it was the republicans spreading fear over "guns" being taken away. Then It was the Tea Parties. All thesee events have no basis in rational thought what so ever. One of these governor, Mr. Reed of Texas said that if Texas wasn't satisfied with what wsa going on in Washington, the state would leave the Union. In other words he wants to suceed from the UNion. Forget the fact that we fought a war over this issue and Texas was on the LOSING SIDE in that war, he believes he can pull Texas out of the Union. Forget the fact that in TEXAS vs White, the Supreme Court said that States could NOT leave the Union. Reed apparently doesn't want help from Washington. That is until the Swine Flu Epidemic hit, and Now he is ASKING Washington for help.
Complain about this comment
28 just like the sea.
Lol
for a long time now I have seen MA TT in Justin and have pondered that maybe Justin uses these two alter egos to push his points.Unsuccessfully.
That they are one and the same.
I doubt it really but the kernel is there.
Complain about this comment
If south carolina's economic track record was any good then maybe Sanford could be taken seriously. I dont oppose to him not taking stimulus money, there are many reasons not to, but from his own explanation regarding 'philosophical' differences, thats a bunch of hot air and politcal grandstanding.
There are schools in south carolina that were passed by on the campaign trail which are desperately in need of funding, the conditions were atrocious, this state boasts one of the highest poverty rates in the nation and the highest high school drop out rate in the country.
Dillon SC is known as the state's corridor of shame, how can you be proud of this?
Sanford needs to be more concerned about this, before talking up his presidential credentials. But being a 'conservative' I suppose that is not his concern as its the people's problem not his own. Thats been the general attitude of the right. Short Sightedness at its best.
Lets not forget, a country that neglects education is going nowhere and will always be in debt to the rest of the world.
Sanford and his party needs to think outside of the box and show some real leadership to resolve serious problems facing states like south carolina, instead of playing it up for the camera and posing on tractors. Its this attitutude that lost the republicans the last election and they need to stop arguing amongst themselves and thinking in 2 - 4 year cycles and instead be a party of solutions.
Complain about this comment
I just looked Texas V. White up and discovered that the ruling said that in order for a State to leave the Union, they have to seek consent from the other STates in order to do so, which isn't very likely to be honest. Having said that, If the State of Massachuetes want to become part of Great Britian, I'd be more than happy to give to them.
Complain about this comment
water man interesting post ,
good to hear from you again.
looking at legislating cow farts is interesting.
World needs it.but as you ask can america handle it.
The obvious thing to do about the tax is to give a break to those that resell that methane.
But not too big a break because the feed lots (should be banned) would be able to handle the expense and drive little folk out of the equation.
Odd problem.
everything we do these days is basically mitigating the problems caused by global or huge companies.
Small local farmers should never have been able to afford to run a farm like a feed lot.
With that worst sign of america 100% grain fed. The package says, BIG RUBBISH.
but then the americans always like their food as tasteless as possible.
33. At 11:00am on 28 Apr 2009, SC-Science-Teach
Thanks. glad to know that SC is not as bad as Justin might have us believe.
remember this Justin likes republicans.
His version of rebelion is to say "republicans are cool"
like 13 year olds wearing their funny germanic(really hindu) symbols.
Not amusing but hopefully a phase.
It seems this phase has been going on for long enough.
Time for his wise old aunt to have a word.
Complain about this comment
40 american good guy.
On the Guns.
wow you are brave. I suspect a torrent of pro guns do not kill etc, . The inevitable discussion on constitutional law and the meaning of malitia.
Whatr I find amaziing is the maybe in Justin's sentance.
What part of crazies stocking up does he not get.
Yea sure some are just gun lovers.
etc.
but we have a country where people cannot afford homes. refused to pay for the taxes for health care, but will go blow$ 1500 n a gun and some ammo.
At two bucks a round for some of the expensive stuff you gotta wonder.
Is it time to tax Gun sellers and manufactures .
They charge taxes for tobacco, because it Can kill.
But back to the fools that wasted their last money on Guns and then the economy collapsed.
Now they need the guns;)
Complain about this comment
I think Gov. Sanford is prescient--he is defending SC from suffering the Federalization that Citi, BoA, GM, AIG, and so many other parts of our world are undergoing.
The Obama Grand Experiment will end in tears. It must, because it inherently cannot succeed. The Treasury's borrowing needs will be over 360 billion this quarter alone!. The announcement from Treasury is here: http://tinyurl.com/deqess
Mr. Sanford is attempting to keep the Federal government from dragging his state into the abyss.
Someone, somewhere, is finally standing up to Obama and saying 'No, thank you'.
Complain about this comment
Lol
I wouldn't be opposed to taxing guns, I don't think that would be unconstitutional. Although I do think the National Riffle Association would oppose it, Although I do think it would make it easier to get drug dealers and gags off the streets, because they by and large don't pay taxes.
Complain about this comment
45 texas still has rights to secession that are not available to the rest of the USa.
seems to me less of our nuke arsenal should be allowed to be built or go near texas.but it is.
48 the state of MASS would be lucky then. they would immediately get 6 weeks more holiday than you and a health care system.
;) and not have to have abortion debates and debates on creates all the time.
Seems like a deal.
texas has an opt out by the way. Or so the texans believe. If so no stopping them and the oil terminals going.
Personally I say pull investment and companies out of texas and fill it with those republicans that are trying actively to collapse things ( Rush and Pat with their Pull out in june financial advice)
But take away their guns.
then let texas go and blockade them for the rest of time.allowing only people from the far side of the border across.
Complain about this comment
27, happylaze -
It has not been my impression that you are on this blog just to make nasty remarks, or that you hate the blog itself. I'm sorry, but if that is your intent, you are failing at being plain nasty.
Complain about this comment
Old south . If all the GOP did not pull their money out of the stock market when they saw Obama coming we would not ALL be in this situation.
Seriously.
Obama responded to that slump/crash. but it was created by rich people panicking at the thought of lefties in the house.
this country could be saved if they gave half of what they do not need to fix what they created or destroyed. for their business goals.
The Gop supporters plan of pushing the boat closer to the rim is ridiculous.
Just remember. Democrats have guns too.
Complain about this comment
54 well bere I try. I do feel that Justin is little more than MA or TT.
Complain about this comment
Hi Justin,
If you walk into any gun shop in the country you will hear lurid tales of ammo buying, but it has little to do with the growth of the Federal government. It started just before the election and so far as I can tell chatting to my fellow gun owners it seems to be caused by two things:
- Fear of a ban on certain types of ammunition, predominantly high velocity or amour piercing rounds (also known as 'cop killer rounds) has caused a run on it, all the crazies are buying like crazy (no pun intended. OK, it was intended). Same folks are buying semi-automatic weapons and high capacity magazines for the same reason
- Regular folks who have seen the price of shells going up and up as the price of lead has gone up and up. So when you see a deal you tend to buy 10 cases instead of one to save some money
This is likely to continue for the forseeable future. No judgement here, just observation.
#40
American,
Every time the rather poorly worded and punctuated 2nd amendment has been put to the test at the Supreme court your interpretation has been rejected. Assuming you are referring to the right to bear arms. Unless you are referring to the right to own the front paws of an ursine critter, which is acceptable when they are attached to the rest of him/her and the critter in question is stuffed.
The right to bare arms applies solely to Michelle.
Oh yeah. Now we're talking.
Sportsman Sam
Complain about this comment
AmericanSportFan (#40), your information on the second amendment is out of date. In a recent case, District of Columbia v. Heller, the Supreme Court affirmed the right of citizens to own operable firearms in their homes, even though not a part of an organized "militia." D. C. did, in fact, attempt to prohibit gun ownership generally.
Automatic weapons have been illegal for some time, by the way. It is semi-automatic "assault" rifles which are the problem usually addressed by gun control advocates.
Complain about this comment
If the nation is so worried about debt they should toughen up and do whats needed, demand less or pay more.
the economic crisis was not made in the last 100 days nor the last year. The reason why Obama's so called experiment is popular is because we have become accustomed to politicians who do nothing but protect their legacies.
Now everyone wants these politicians to do everything to maintain the way of life they are used to , but nobody wants to pay for it because nobody is used to paying.
The country has been running on a big platinum/diamond laced credit card for some time. At least 20 years.
That has been the preferred method because nobody wants to know what the currently low tax rates really can cover.
It certainly cannot cover 'universal' health care, 2 wars, public education , world peace and everything else people seem to demand.
Complain about this comment
57. At 3:58pm on 28 Apr 2009, SamTyler1969 wrote:
"Every time the rather poorly worded and punctuated 2nd amendment has been put to the test at the Supreme court your interpretation has been rejected. Assuming you are referring to the right to bear arms. Unless you are referring to the right to own the front paws of an ursine critter, which is acceptable when they are attached to the rest of him/her and the critter in question is stuffed."
Further evidence if evidence is needed, of the essential absurdity of the US constitution.
None of the main architects of the document, Jefferson, Madison etc would have considered for a moment allowing citizens, mad or sane, to arm themselves to the teeth with the latest weaponry
Complain about this comment
58 Automatic weapons are not illegal in Oregon with a licence.
Complain about this comment
#60
And I don't think Mohammed wanted people to go into a crowded place and blow themselves up along with whoever they can....
People like to interpret things in a way that suits them best....
Complain about this comment
Re 57
What you have to bare in mind is the fact that the majority of justices on the Supreme Court are Republican Appointees and Gun Control and Abortion have been made as litmus test. What the framers of the constitution originally intend was for the states to organize militias in times of crisis. They were not concerned with private gun ownership.
Complain about this comment
63 well said
it has seemed to me that the debate has not been held in the Subream court where the people were not mainly gun fans.
Complain about this comment
ASF (#63), I believe you are mistaken, but in any case you are in no position to say what the framers would have thought of the attempt by D. C. to prohibit the keeping of handguns in the home. Scalia is the justice most oriented toward "originalism," or consideration for the framers' intent, and he overturned the law.
I am a supporter of gun control myself, and I am mystified at the knee jerk reaction of many gun control advocates such as Senator Feinstein in criticizing the Supreme Court's decision in this case. The D. C. law which was overturned was a foolish and unnecessary intrusion on the right of the people to defend themselves in their homes. The Court protected this right, without overturning the right of the government to regulate firearms generally. Gun control advocates should have supported this decision, because those who opposed it give credence to the fear that they seek to disarm the populace.
Complain about this comment
If the original intention of the second ammanedment was to allow the citizens to band together against a governement that becomes tyranical then the concept has become out of date.
If the military does not support the tyrant then he could not enforce his will and would fall and if the military supports him then the militias would have to defeat the US army etal.
It would require the US military to be strong enough to defend the country against external threat yet weak enough not to be able to stand against the people of the US. A difficult,if not impossible, balancing act.
In any conflict between the pentagon and the people I'd be surprised if any citizens militia could find anything for sale in Walmart that would allow them to take down a steath bomber or cruise missle. But if such weaponry is widely available then Obama had better hope that the Iranians don't go shopping down the mall.
Is it possible that the idea of citizen militias was at least in part about being able to act quickly to put down any potential slave rebellions?
You're all doing very well !!
Complain about this comment
# 65
The problem is that the NRA wants no gun control whatsoever. They are not even infavor of assualt weapon bans. If they had their way, machine guns would be avialble over the counter. And that is dangerous.
Complain about this comment
66 YMG
good question at the end there.
like the analysis of the reason for this absurd law.
And the reason why it is bull.
You are still doing well.
Complain about this comment
happy (#61) is correct in noting that there are loopholes in the federal prohibition against machine guns (automatic rifles). Exceptions for licensing these weapons in particular cases are not the problem however. The biggest problem today is "assault weapons," which are semi-automatic rifles derived from fully automatic military rifles and easily converted to automatic operation. These are not sporting weapons. Despite the claims of the gun nuts, their pricipal use is to arm gangsters. The Mexican drug gangs which largely control the importation (and domestic production) of illegal drugs into the US are armed with firearms from the US, and the expiration of the federal assault weapon ban has made the distribution of these weapons for illegal purposes much easier.
Complain about this comment
Re 66
That could be part of hit, However, I think it is more based out of experience in the Revolution where the Colonists wanted to have citizens ready at a moments notice to repell any attack by the REdcoats.
Complain about this comment
Gary you doubt that the court is made up of people who use guns and have a vested interest .
Why?
Most americans believe in the right to carry guns.
Why not these judges?
it's Like trying to get a rastafarian conference to agree that pot should be illegal.
Ain't happening.
You will hear " I don't care what their law books say, it ain't wrong"
except one kills others and one only kills the user ( And medical FACT is not so certain about that bit either)
Complain about this comment
69 agreed that the laws(or lack of) have encouraged the spread of these weapons.
they are not sporting guns.
Unless one is a really BAD sport.
Complain about this comment
I suspect the enshrinement of the "right to bear arms" springs from the context of eighteenth century Europe, where the bearing of arms was restricted to certain classes, e.g. Gentry, Nobility, Soldiers, etc., although I may be mistaken. In such a context and the tone set in the Declaration of Independence (individual rights and freedoms), it would seem natural to enshrine the right of "self-defence". I'm sure the drafters would have been a wee bit alarmed to see their provisions used to justify assault weapons.
Personally, I regard guns as accessories to food-gathering. It would only be "sport" if the game were also armed. I suspect that in any confrontational situation any weapon I might be carrying would be as likely to end up hurting me as helping the situation.
Peace and non-violence
Complain about this comment
The main problem with the gun control issue in this country is polarization.
Gun control advocates are generally so ignorant about firearms that any
position that they take engenders distrust among the gun-owning community.
If pro gun control politicians actually knew what they were talking about,
then we could actually have an intelligent debate about the subject. Until
then, the Democrats are going to continue to alienate large portions of the
electorate on this issue, as they continue to on many others.
Complain about this comment
legal or not, there is no justification for anyone to own and use an assualt weapon such as an AK-47 in a civilised peaceful society. You cant hunt birds with them or deer, and it is a little over the top for protecting ones home from intruders (unless that intruder is the police or some other heavily armed force or group of people).Legal maneuvering has trumped good sense.
At the end of the day the NRA is protecting their own interest and that is to have their members sell as many weapons and be as prosperous as possible.It always comes down to money as is the case with every other issue, such as immigration.
Complain about this comment
Young-Mr-Grace (#66), I believe it was not the original intention of the second amendment to allow the people to defend themselves against their government, as you say, but to defend the country at large, and the people individually, against threats generally, foreign and domestic.
Thomas Jefferson was the principal author of the Bill of Rights. Here is a link to some of his statements on the subject:
http://hematite.com/dragon/jefferson2nd.html
Disclaimer: this link is provided for reference to these quotes only, and does not constitute an endorsement of any of the views of the persons who provided this web page.
It is clear that Jefferson assumed that the militia was the entire armed populace, and that while the state government would organize the militia for public purposes, the citizens had the right to defend themselves in their own homes. While the use of a militia to defend the country seems clearly obsolete, I think it very doubtful that Jefferson would conclude today that the need to defend one's home against criminals was also obsolete.
It's an academic argument, but the right to settle the argument belongs to the Supreme Court. I believe the Scalia opinion is well founded and that it achieves a good result, consistent with both the need for responsible gun control and the right of the people to defend themselves in their homes.
Complain about this comment
74, guns.
It is my understanding (and I admit to not following the debate closely) that those in favor of gun control want to outlaw the use of assault rifles and others arms of a military nature. I don't think they are anti-hunters, or anti self-protection. They also want all arms registered. Have I got this wrong?
Complain about this comment
51, OldSouth.
"The Obama Grand Experiment will end in tears. It must, because it inherently cannot succeed."
How do you suggest we solve the problem created by earlier administrations (Clinton and Bush II)? It is easy to say that what he is doing will not work (maybe nothing will), but what should be done instead? I have not come across an alternative that is viable.
Complain about this comment
Oh Justin, you provocateur, you!
Governor Sanford is ambitious, mendacious and embarrassing. Just that. SC-Science-Teach has it right. North Carolina defers to South Carolina on that ;-)
Just some observations regarding firearms in America and then I will let all of the rest of you argue over the Second Amendment until the cows come home, if you want to:
1. If we didn't have such lax policy on puchase and ownership of firearms, we wouldn't be worrying about the Drug Cartel Armageddon going on along our border with Mexico: drugs go north, guns go south. Stop the guns and you stop the drugs. Duh.
2. In 50+ years of living in such diverse and sometimes dangerous places as: New York, Chicago, Washington, DC, Salt Lake City (neither dangerous nor very diverse when I lived there, but...), Harrisburg, PA, Charlotte, NC, Minneapolis and Seattle, I have NEVER felt threatened enough to even consider owning a gun.
3. Members of my family are hunters and sportshooters, so I don't have an antipathy to firearms. I just don't happen to think you need an AK-47 with armor piercing ammo to bring home dinner.
Complain about this comment
Apparently you are allowed to hunt with a fully auto weapon in Oregon as long as you both have the license and a 5 round clip.
Complain about this comment
Jefferson on the Bill of Rights
On the right to bear arms
Jefferson on Everything
Complain about this comment
78 also marble I note the words
" because it inherently not succeed"
And wonder what that means.
why is it an impossibility?
or is this one of those veiled warnings of rightwing wrath about to be set loose on the world Again.
Thinking of veils wouldn't we all be better off with one during a pandemic?
Complain about this comment
Re 72
I have often believed that the Ammendment should have read the right to arm bears.
Complain about this comment
marbles, the issue the NRA and company has with gun registration, is that it is a swipe at the black market. Guns are bought legally then distributed and sold to the highest bidding criminals. In the western hemisphere outside of the north america these guns arm central and south american militias, and other criminal organisations in the region. haiti because of its lack of government is a huge transhipment point for weapons for example.
Shipments leaving US ports are hardly, if ever checked, so sending these weapons overseas is as easy as fed ex.
Many of these weapons , of course end up in criminal hands in the US also, gun registration would make it too easy for law enforcement to keep tabs on who is buying the most weapons and who is most likely selling them. Its also very expensive to keep track of. A registry would be a huge victory for law enforcement, but a huge blow to the black market in a time of recession. I dont expect a registry anytime soon.
Complain about this comment
Ms. Marbles, there is really a combination of issues.
The Democrats advocate a huge expansion of the role of government
in American life, and that causes concern to be raised among any
true conservative about how that power will be limited.
When the British marched on Concord they were not trying to seize hunting
rifles; they were attempting to seize military supplies. This is the
incident which the authors of the Bill of Rights had in mind when
they wrote the 2nd Ammendment. They wanted to limit the power of
the Federal government.
There is a wide variety of positions being adopted by advocates of
gun control. Almost all of these advocates are very liberal. Not many
conservatives trust the liberals on any issue related to limitation
of the power of the federal government.
That's really the core of the issue, not the specifics of which firearms
are prohibited or how they are regulated.
Complain about this comment
Well getting Back to the original post, Attempts by Republicans to block President Obama's Agenda just got hard now that Arlen Spector has deffected. This too me signals that the moderate wing of the Republican Party is dead. IF we assume that former Saturday Night Live writer Al Franken wins the Minesota a 60 vote super majority which will make it very hard for the REpublicans to block legislation.
Senator has a long and distinguish career in Public Servicce. He was a prosector in Philadelphia and served on The Warren Commission which investigated the assination of President Kennedy.
Complain about this comment
82, happy Jack.
"Thinking of veils wouldn't we all be better off with one during a pandemic?"
Funny. Funny. Actually I should think that the veils themselves would become contaminated, as would those face masks they are wearing in Mexico. You would have to change both pretty frequently.
Complain about this comment
84, moderate.
So what it comes down to is that the NRA represents gun makers who make their money on the illegal use of weapons. Why isn't that more publicized?
Complain about this comment
85, guns.
I should think the danger of the proliferation of military-type weapons far outweighs one's political orientation. We have heavily armed criminals. I don't think the second amendment intended this.
Complain about this comment
89, I agree with you Ms. Marbles on the issue that criminals should not have
guns, but the reason why we have so many criminals loose is that existing laws
are not enforced, and that includes existing gun laws.
Before passing new laws, we should enforce the ones that we have.
Complain about this comment
88. marbles it has been covered in the media a number of times. Ive seen something about it on dateline before, they more focused on how some weapons got into europe. This was at least 5 years ago. I find in the media there are some programs that cover some major issues that nobody cares to focus on. 60 minutes is one. They cover it then in about 5 years the rest of the mainstream media catches on. The subprime mortgage issue is one of those topics. I cant say I understand what drives the media to cover some things but investigative journalism doesnt seem to be very common these days.
Cnn , fox, msnbc for the most part have very short attention spans and operate more like tabloids. A story about paris hilton going to jail will be the top story and not what is going on in iraq.
On a different topic, I also find it a bit strange how the media in th height of the immigration crisis has never spent much time discussing how the mexican government treats illegal immigrants who try to sneak into their country from el salvador. It is brutal. Human rights violations is a nice way of putting it. Its criminal.
And all this while their president file complaints about the american approach.
I found this topic covered by a canadian news program just last year, how is this not mentioned in mainstream media throughout the US , is a mystery.
Complain about this comment
91, mo, nobody wants poor, destitute people. We should put a shroud over
the Statue of Liberty and disguise it so that looks like the Staypuft Marshmallow
Man.
Nonetheless, I believe that we should enforce our borders and end the practice
of allowing illegal immigration. We swear in 3,000 new American citizens every
day. That should be enough.
Complain about this comment
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/in_depth/8023460.stm
Well done arlen.
Complain about this comment
i agree that the immigration laws should be enforced as is, until it is changed. It is silly to have people running in and out of your country and not know who they are. That is a bigger national security threat than al quaida or anything in the middle east.
But thats the cowardice of politics at play.
Republicans talk tough on immigration but never see fit to enforce something like e-verify because their business lobby buddies will not have a cheap exploitable labor force that has no legal jurisdiction to demand fair treatment. The Democrats are pandering for votes and are the worst of the two. Expect nothing short of amnesty from them.
I must admit mass deportation is a lot more expensive than just giving them the legal right to stay. In fact it is impossible.
Either way if they intend to carry on wit amnesty, then they need to do a better job with the border or you will have a situation as there currently is with the finish line cubans who will do anything to get on american soil, risking their lives and that of their loved ones, because they know they will never be told to leave.
I expect both parties to screw the whole thing up, as is the case with DC nowadays.
What will happen is someone makes a sensible proposal to address the immigration issue, then after it goes through the debates of the 2 houses who will all be representing 'special' interests lobby groups you end up with a mockery of a bill with so many loopholes that it is worth less than used toilet paper. Then the issue will remain unresolved like it has been for 25 years. Typical DC gridlock.
Complain about this comment
90, guns.
"...but the reason why we have so many criminals loose is that existing laws are not enforced, and that includes existing gun laws. Before passing new laws, we should enforce the ones that we have."
It would be a lot easier to enforce laws if the appropriate ones were in place. Obviously with a ban on assault rifles we could monitor the gun manufacturers. That would be much more effective than catching those, one by one, who possessed illegal weapons.
Sorry, guns, on the gun question I have to disagree with you. This has nothing to do with my political leanings (I am an independent anyway) but with public safety. The gun thing is out of control.
Complain about this comment
Hesiodos # 36
Apologies for the delay- busy here.
Thought I read somewhere that the Obama family has taken to growing things in the White House gardens. Does that count him in as a minor crop-raiser on a par with the millions of french with a large garden who regard themselves as farmers.?
Maybe the true USA farming giants are declining, but when push comes to shove with the population as a whole, if their lettuce, beefsteak, pork chop and such become pricey items because of necessary "green" taxation, then the wind and manure backlash reaction could hit the fan. Sanford, a stalking horse behind the plough?
happylaze # 46, 49 etc
We fools never differ jack.Think your correct about Justin having a blogger alter ego- but MAII / TT he is not. Triple layer schitzophrenia with an "almost Doctor" Jeckyl, a master Hyde and the kernel/ nut in chief homomorphisming together? Have you been exceeding your quota of bongs today?
Hesiodos # 73
"It would only be "sport" if the game were also armed".
Managed to get a couple of hours of "sport" in a few days ago. Feeding the fish from the cliffs with fresh prawns as bait but little luck. Fortunately, my minnows do not have the strength to carry a harpoon gun or grapling hook to strike back with, because just dodging the lead weight when it comes flying back after snagging on a rock is excitement enough for me.
Complain about this comment
mo, this is why the Republicans lost the latino vote. What the politicians
in DC don't understand is that immigrants want their relatives to be let
in. They don't care about other people from their home country.
gridlock, agreed. It's too bad that our politicians (from either party)
can't seem to resolve any issue satisfactorily.
Complain about this comment
We have a variety of politicans and some are worse than others. South Carolina has the reputation for neglect in almost every area of services to citizens so not having stimulus money means that the citizens continue not to recieve services, status quo for South Carolina. Many a politican has tried to make a career on the backs of other people suffering. Maybe Mr. Webb should educate himself about the political history of South Carolina before he utters such nonsense.
Complain about this comment
98 but the nice man on the tractor seemed real friendly. he even shook Justins hand.
which is more than Obama did.;)
Complain about this comment
96 Lol waterman.
but yes.and no. No bongs yet.
Complain about this comment
anyway water you do know that MATT is one organism.
just think back.. when was it that MA suddenly lost his desire to thrash M.E. all the time?
just about the same time TT started pontificating.
Strange coincidence . or more fairy dust.
But lol I did say at every occasion that I was not convinced by my argument.Just hypothesising.
Complain about this comment
89. At 7:07pm on 28 Apr 2009, allmymarbles wrote:
I should think the danger of the proliferation of military-type weapons far outweighs one's political orientation. We have heavily armed criminals. I don't think the second amendment intended this."
Criminals are at least sane (generally). It is the bizzarre practice of letting lunatics buy as many weapons as they want that is really crazy.
Complain about this comment
36. At 12:07pm on 28 Apr 2009, Hesiodos wrote:
"Give my regards to Robert E Lee IV, if you happen to know the lad. He'll be the same age as me and the Curmudgeon from Kansas..."
Thank you for the compliment - I shall endeavor to live up to your kindness, having just had my heart replumbed last month. First time I have ever been mentioned in the same sentence with any R. E. Lee.
KScurmudgeon, humbled
Complain about this comment
102, Simon.
"I think it's a wise move, because it will win support from even more moderates in the general election, too."
I don't really understand what you are saying.
Complain about this comment
Here is an intelligent, energetic President trying to reshape America and take it to the heights again. In one hundred days he has achieved admirable success given the credit crunch and a myriad of problems resulting from the fiasco in Iraq and Afghanistan. Without trying to discredit the previous Administration, President Obama has deftly distanced himself from unsavoury practices(torture, water-boarding techniques) and is concentrating on taking America on a path of hope, multilateralism and transparency. One can feel optimism and pragmatism permeating America: a sense of real purpose despite hard financial times!
Complain about this comment
This Article was disappointing as it came across as very tongue-in-cheek: Not at the usual considered standard!
Why all the mention of possible contenders 4 years hence?
As for President Obama: The man has been better in Office than I originally feared; his lack of experience of every aspect of Government and Political machinery still does worry me a great deal. Nevertheless, he has kept to a few of his on-the-stump policy commitments and at least has had the foresight to try to rebuild American open-minded-bridges with supposed allies and foes that poor old Dubya just never seemed to have the grace or inclination to do.
The Article is at least accurate like every analysis of the first 100 days... all to play for and much to come as PM Macmillan's cautionary words reflected, "..events dear boy, events.." they are what affect a Leadership of any nation!
Complain about this comment
Do you remember those days of slavery?
http://www.in.com/videos/watchvideo-simple-simon-revolution-fighters-1844575.html
Complain about this comment
46. At 2:55pm on 28 Apr 2009, happylaze wrote:
for a long time now I have seen MA TT in Justin and have pondered that maybe Justin uses these two alter egos to push his points.Unsuccessfully.
+
using the same instinct / logic maybe
happylaze is Barrack Obama in disguise
and allmymarbles is Hilary Clinton??!!
Complain about this comment
@94 (moderate): It's actually dirtier than you portray.
Consider this: Senator D sees Congressman R in the local watering hole. Congressman R is kinda discouraged-looking.
"What's up, R?"
"It's that immigration thing again."
"What about it?"
"Well, D, the border is out of control, and my constituents are screaming about it again."
"R, I've been around here a while, and you shouldn't get so wound up over constituents screaming. They do that all the time. It makes them feel like they are contributing to the process. Little do they know that their Congressman becomes tone-deaf within a few years, and knows how to say all the right things so they forget. They also forget far too easily. Thank God for beer and TV sets."
"D, I know all that, but even after all that the border's wide open and I just don't see any way to fix it. It's going to cost billions to deport folks, and that's impossible. It's going to cost billions to check for legal residency, and the ACLU will scream themselves hoarse over that. But we can't just turn our heads because if we do, then we run real risks with security, and if there's another 9/11, then I guess it's also possible that the screaming might turn into something more serious...like electoral challenges."
"R, this is the reason you are still a Congressman, and I'm a Senator. You just don't know how to look at these things correctly.
"What do you mean, D? Didn't I sum the issues up correctly?"
"Look here, R. Many of the financial backers of your party want cheap labor. Now don't deny it, and don't get excited or offended. Many of my party's financial backers have a cockameemie vision of some "world society" where we'll all hold hands and sing together, and national borders don't matter, and all will be peaceful. It's obvious they haven't read any real history, probably just the pap they were served in school, because if they had really read history they'd understand that humans just don't work that way over the span of time, and never have, and aren't going to. The point I'm focusing on here, though, is that both of our sets of financial backers really want open borders, even though the American public doesn't. How do we resolve that and stay in office?"
"It's easy, really. You are forgetting that even if we pass a law, it still takes a Congressional act to appropriate money to actually see the law enforced, and those appropriations usually only last one year. The American public doesn't understand this, and doesn't take time to figure it out...they'd rather watch TV and drink beer. So what do we do? We announce a new plan to resolve the border issues, and put it in a bill and pass it, and the backers behind your party and mine will scream theatrically on cue for a while and then finally decree that 'while it's not the bill we like, it's probably the best we'll get', or some such nonsense, and the American people will think the problem is solved. They'll go back to sleep, and afterwards the messy appropriations process will ensure that over the next few years after the bill is passed the actual financial commitment we make to enforce border controls will gradually shrink, as other things get the attention of the American people, and they scream about THEM. Result: We pass a bill and look good today, and win re-election based on that; our backers get what they think they want; and the American people wake up 15 or 20 years from now and realize that the borders still aren't being managed, but they can't figure out who to blame. So they scream at Congress a bit, and then go back to their beer and TV sets."
"D, that's the most cynical piece of mouthing off I have ever heard from you. You know what, though? You're right. It will probably work just that way."
"R, you still don't get it. Not only will it work that way, it ALREADY works that way, and has for far too many years, and on far too many things. So long as our waking hours are spent figuring out how to get the next campaign contribution, and what piece of America's future we have to sell to get it, it won't work any other way, really."
"D, do you think Americans will ever figure this out?"
"R, they have been suspending disbelief on our shenanigans with the budget since before you or I either one were born. What do you think?"
"Forget I asked. Join me for a drink."
"Don't mind if I do."
Complain about this comment
DO WE REALLY WANT A PRESIDENT FROM MY HOME STATE?
I live in South Carolina. Our Governor, Mark Sanford, a Republican, refusaes to allow us to receive Pres. Obama's Stimulus Money. Statistically, we have the least educated people in America- DUE TO LITTLE OR NO MONEY FOR SCHOOLS AND TEACHERS. We have the poorest people in America DUE TO OUTSOURCING AND MARK SANDFORD, WHOSE PEOPLE STOLE OVER 50 MILLION USD (38,485,250 euro) FROM THE SOCIAL SERVICES AND OTHER AGENCIES THAT HELPED THE POOR IN OUR STATE.
Our state has lost nearly all of our economic and agricultural businesses. Why? because of our Governors. We keep electing Repubicans Governors who do nothing but IGNORE US.
MOST OF OUR YOUNG PEOPLE ARE FACING JAIL SENTENCES IF THEY DO NOT RELOCATE, DUE TO POVERTY AND UNEMPLOYMENT IN OUR STATE.
The Governor before him, cut off money to the handicapped and his state treasurer (exchequer) was arrested for Pushing Drugs LIKE Cocaine.
DO WE REALLY WANT A PRESIDENT FROM THIS STATE?
Complain about this comment
This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
It's good to see all the South Carolinians here. I do think that, given the coverage, Sanford is positioning himself for a run on the WH in 2012.
My thoughts? Sanford does have principles, and he makes no bones about them, which is good. (I happen to disagree with some of them...) He has the honesty that Palin lacks. I'd disagree with the earlier poster about Sanford being tied to various scandals in SC. He had nothing to do with the (ex-)State Treasurer using Cocaine, the (ex-)Agriculture Secretary concealing cockfighting, and the Lieutenant Governor's speeding and other misdeeds. (However, he's done nothing to stop the Adjutant General's illegally endorsing political candidates and getting campaign contributions from NG officers in exchange for promotion, and he's done nothing to dismiss the Attorney General for his involvement in the closing of numerous polling places in the 2000 SC Republican Presidential Primary.)
Many Republicans will love his take on reducing spending. However, it's likely that most of the rest of Americans won't. (And, if people see the schools in the "Corridor of Shame", they would dislike him even more.) One thing that surprised me, though, and which will no doubt turn off many Republicans is that Sanford opposed the Iraq War...
Finally, while Sanford may appear to be rural in the press events and interviews, most of the rural areas of SC have high unemployment.
Fellow South Carolinians, should we help inform Justin and the rest about various other things going on here in sC?
Complain about this comment
maybe Justin should leave the governors mansion and venture into South Carolina a bit more to get a better understanding of South Carolina's plight and the nations declining infrastructure and social services , like education. Then maybe he will get some perspective as to how bad a stimulus package is needed in South Carolina.
Maybe he may also see how political posturing like that of Mr. Stanford, and DC gridlock has led a great nation to a now precarious breaking point.
I would like Justin to go talk to a principal at school's in the non upper class regions of South Carolina, take a walk in the corridor of shame, if you are not too afraid to do so, take a look at JV Martin Junior High School, then tell us if there is any school in the UK like this.
Give us a real coverage of how the politics is affecting the daily lives of everyone, not from the perspective of the man in the office but from the perspective of the person who's survival depends on his decisions. That would be ground breaking.
Complain about this comment
113 MO well said.
I second that call. Justin get out of the Ivory tower into the real america.
the america that has no health care.
doesn't have a great employer like the BBC.
But then how fun would that be eh?
Work for a living.
Go speak to more people that "have a shower AFTER work". as someone put it recently.
Just like the sea
Do you remember
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTiRt1YYWXM&feature=related
Complain about this comment
Re: 114 happylaze
Jah No Dead
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4Vv0Y8K2KY
and they tried to fool the black population
by telling them that Jah Jah dead
Complain about this comment
Aah. Yes. This will do fine. Must be Charleston. I can see the harbor out the ariel windows. Smells like Brunswick stew has been bubbling on the stove for a couple hours. O-o-o, yeah. The okra has thickened it just right.
Y'all make yourselves comfortable. I'll help the kitchen band set up while y'all have some stew. There's some Carolina rice steaming in the other pot. Johnny cake's in the oven.
Complain about this comment
detroit - I just told everyone we would be eating el fresco! But that will have to be for lunch tomorrow as I must abed.
A demain.
Complain about this comment
The bands here.
Many Changing Woman, I've found an ocean and a beach for y'all to stroll. Go ahead. Take your shoes off. Get dem dogs patterin' in the surf.
Complain about this comment
timewaitsfornoman
Jus' fine. There's a deck off the kitchen y'all can sit and enjoy the stew and the view. Even walk down them thar steps to the dock and dangle yer legs over the side and eat some pone. Plen'y of good eats and good times a-waiting y'all. Jus' make yo'selves comfy.
Complain about this comment
Go' mornin', y'all.
For y'all that like ta hear da pipes in da mornin', I found this hera bonnie lad ta be play a dawnin' tune.
Bere. I know itsa kinna dark. The laddie's wearin' a kilt fer ya.
Donna worry, Timewaitsfornoman. He's a-standin'; not a-sittin':-)
Complain about this comment
Nothin' could be finer than to be in Carolina
In the moooooornin'!
Loved the Otis!
;-)
Complain about this comment
FROM WAY UP HERE
It's just a little ball of rock and sea and sand,
No bigger than my hand.
From way up here the earth looks very small,
They shouldn't fight at all
down there upon that little sphere.
Their time is short, a life is just a day,
You think they'd find a way.
You think they'd get along
and fill their sunlit days with song.
From way up here the earth is very small,
It's just a little ball, so small, so beautiful and dear.
Their time is short, a life is just a day,
Must be a better way
To use the time that runs among the distant suns.
From way up here the earth is very small,
It's just a little ball, so small, so beautiful and dear.
Words by Malvina Reynolds Music by Pete Seeger
© 1962 (renewed) by Abigail Music Co. All rights reserved."
;-)
Complain about this comment
Just a ball
;-)
Complain about this comment
117 Timewaits.
I'm thinkin its "al fresco", as opposed to "el fresco", but that can be left to the experts.
Good on you on the history thing. Students always do better when their own interest is awakened, and it draws them onward.
Publius, Aqua, et al - remember the Hockey Rant the other night? Have you seen the news today?
Complain about this comment
Good morning.
Publius, bag pipes this early aren't quite the thing for me but I appreciate the kilt. So glad it's sunny and warm here in the kitchen because it's cold and rainy in Vermont. After this rain and a bit of sun everything will be gloriously green, and it's about time!
From way up here I can see South Carolina!
Now I must slog through the rain to the diner for breakfast.
Complain about this comment
124 Interested - al fresco - Oh thanks! I know but it was late and I was in a rush to be post 500! Perhaps el fresco is Spanish!
I love history, but have not donated the time to it as you have. I really should brush up. I enjoy reading historical novels and learning tidbits of information. I guess that's me - a tidbit of information person! I send them to you for details. At least I have the overview!
Complain about this comment
Ref 124 InterestedForeigner
What do you think? The Hamilton Highlanders? Hamilton Havoc?
It would be good to have the 'Great One' back in Canada.
The Canooks were rather chippy last night against Chicago. They were skating like a team that wants Stanley. I'm rooting for them to beat the Black Hawks.
Another battle going on with the Ducks. Detroit will be fired up for losing that goal in the 3rd.
Complain about this comment
interested forner
Education
I was told at school;) means "drawing the light out from within."
Now drawing is an old word I am sure so could have many meanings.
but the drawing out of metal seems to be the same sort of drawing.
just cause that side of history and the origins of word amuse me.
As someone into history perhaps you could help.
How was it that a white guy from the British isles turns up in the north west. looks down into a river and sees so many of one type of animal.
SO MANY. they are almost trash to the locals.
and yet when he points these out or asks for the name of these animals the name ends up being a perfect description of the animal.
IN ENGLISH?
for the funsters, what is that animal.
for the serious. how the hell does a name of an animal from the otherside of the world end up being a great description in English.
and nice beach.. so good to get out for a picnic.
Complain about this comment
115 our Unnamed one.
How did your name get the change.
Great Song GREAT Movie.
ALL must see "Rockers"
not the bobsliegh team or anything.
"ROCKERS"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G45UCqx9b_E
THIS IS A TAKE OVER.
Complain about this comment
Heloise - Have you seen the new blog feature? I forgot to close "a bold move" and a comment popped-up saying the "<a" did not match the "<b." Now if you could effect a change in more important world matters in a similar manner. Make a mess of things (unintentionally of course) causing the gods to intervene to prevent it from happening again. Think of the good you could do in this world! Intentionally!
Complain about this comment
this thread
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxHLyptrA1s&feature=related
this dread.
Complain about this comment
Ref 125 bere54
I'll admit the piper should have been off in the distance playing softly through the mists to pipe in the day. That's what I had been looking to find. Had to settle for the light of false dawn framed by palm trees.
Complain about this comment
"The UK has been able to ban people who promote hatred, terrorist violence or serious criminal activity since 2005, but the list was only made public for the first time this week."
British-ish did you see the article on Michele savage trying to sue the gov in the UK because he is labelled a hate promoter.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8035114.stm
and yet?
Complain about this comment
Ed, great photos of your 'hood. What are the yellow flowers I see in bloom? What species is that old pine? And the oaks?"
Probably the yellow flowers are Gorse (Ulex, "Whin"), a feature of April/May 'round here. The pine is probably Corsican pine (Pinus nigra var maritima), The oaks are mostly Quercus (robur and petraea) and intermediates. In this "time of tenthousand greens", every tree in the valley announces its identity through flower and/or leaf timing and appearance. The hawthorns are among the first in leaf but among the later to flower. There is an old saying, "Ne'er cast a clout, till May is out!", and I await this year's show. When they emerge, it's surprising just how widespread the thorn tree is, and that's without the hedges, which don't flower due to being close clipped (flower and fruit are on last year's growth).
;-)
Complain about this comment
Here's a tune from Judge dread that will get past he mods
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oB1Jc73mLHY&feature=related
Complain about this comment
happy - I'll give it a go and if I'm totally wrong, well I tried! I'm guessing salmon. Although I have no confirmation it is a native word, it is their colour. How it happened I have not a clue. Someone/thing moves in mysterious ways. Of course if the colour is named after the fish it blows a hole in my theory! Unless the natives used the same name on the Atlantic coast, the white man learnt the word there, named the colour, then went to the West coast. What do you think?
Complain about this comment
Long tea break, mods. Hope the scones are fresh and tasty!
Complain about this comment
Good Morning!
Really enjoyed all the lovely music except the bagpipes which I tend to associate with funerals. (Sorry, Shaman) Is Pete Seeger not truly amazing! I hope I am still as vital when I reach my ninth decade. He has done a lot of songs written by Malvina Reynolds. I always liked her "Mrs Clara Sullivan's Letter." among others.
Happy Coyote
It is too early for you to 'riddle me a riddle' but I did enjoy the reggae. I had to also listen to "Life Is Down In Denver," as well.
As for education: Someone once told me that "Learning is reminding us of what we already know." Sort of a Zen kind of comment to begin the day.
Timely One
I do not wish to be the word police but el fresco could be translated as an insolent person or being 'fresh.' Thus al fresco for the outdoors. Sometimes Spanish can be just as confusing as English!
Complain about this comment
happy - Hijacked, good song I was not familiar with it. On the Cuba theme. Where I may go anytime I like.
My sister met some Americans in the International area of the Havana airport (it was a stopover for them - flight from Montreal) and she suggested they buy cigars. He asked why? "Because you're in Cuba." He had no idea (if you can imagine!) where the plane had landed and almost "hit the ground." In a panic asked what she was doing there. "I'm on vacation."
It's very slow going today - gives me time to catch up on some work.
Complain about this comment
128 Happy
To draw - like drawing water, or like a bellows so the coals in the forge can glow white.
Perhaps it isn't an animal, but rather a fish? Chum?
Complain about this comment
It must be tea break or a lot of action on the other threads. I shall go take a peek. I have had my tea so I think I can face it now.
Complain about this comment
127 Publius.
Gives a whole new meaning to "Roll up the RIM to win", doesn't it?
As for a name, well three thoughts come to mind:
First, perhaps something traditional, like "Hamilton Tiger Cats". Even "Hamilton Tigers" would be ok. Of course, that would also require the purchase of a CFL team (more likely the assumption of debt of the franchise, and lifetime free season's tickets for Angelo Mosca, but that's another story). I suspect that both the City of Hamilton and the Ti-cats would be overjoyed to share the name. The City has already offered Copps Coliseum.
Second, given the origins of the sponsor, perhaps the "Waterloo Computer Scientists", which could then be "Computer Geeks" or "the Nerds", for short.
or, better still, third, perhaps the "Black Bears", and, inevitably, their cheerleaders, the "Black Berries".
Complain about this comment
133, happy -
Thanks for that link on Savage and the list. I didn't know about that, and I know very little about Savage except that he's a lunatic.
Complain about this comment
136 well done.
Chinook.
sounds like chinhook which is a great description of a chinook.
I think the first guy got there and said "what's that"
the local said what. so he pointed and being a Brit said"THAT WITH TH HOOKED CHIN" shouting as the universal form of communication.
the local looks at him and puzzled goes"Chin Hook?"
and so the satisfied tourist was happy to have learned something new and told all.
Complain about this comment
135 happy - Well that's an "up and "happy" tune! Thanks. I do wish you would stop posting songs that remind me of Jamaica Mon as I would love to return....soon, but I have a summer home to support! Rail-less, as you know! My only hope at the moment is that my sons' business will continue to grow and they will be able to take me! Not! that that was ever my plan but, things change! And they do so love their mother. Whether enough to foot the bill to Jamaica - yet to be seen! Have you been?
Complain about this comment
139 lol Time.
I am waiting until cell phones can be loaded with ones own ring tone.
and "Hijacked" would be mine. but I would turn it off in airports;)
the perfect tune to say " sorry this conversation has been hijacked by technology"
----------------------------
Now all go easy on them mods. they HAVE to read MATT letters.
at least we can scroll on by.
After that I think a break outside the building with some happy favourite is probably needed;)
Complain about this comment
138 aqua - Quite alright. I was just trying to cover up my mistake! When I think I was concerned about the spelling of, fresco not, al. But I have a perfectly good excuse. Two in fact. 1) I was tired 2) rushing to make 500. I know all of you will overlook my error!
Quebec has "language police." Government employees from the Office de la langue francais, whose job it is to ferret out illegally placed English words. This is true! Bizarre when one considers the taxes of English speakers also go to fund this agency. See Interested for details.
Complain about this comment
timewaits, thanks for the trip to Cuba.
Does anybody know if there has ever been a court case to decide if it is constitutional for the government to ban citizens from traveling to Cuba, or anywhere they want? Has there been any other time when American citizens have been barred by law from going to another country? I don't understand how this has been allowed to stand all these years.
Complain about this comment
133. At 4:45pm on 06 May 2009, happylaze wrote:
British-ish did you see the article on Michele savage trying to sue the gov in the UK because he is labelled a hate promoter.
Haven't just seen it, I've had the misfortune to hear him. (R5 in the early hours -- 'the same 'Britain/England is finished' stuff we are all familiar with around here, World Service today -- intro: "some listeners may find this offensive", you can say that again -- ranting about Muslims and the Koran, in which he proved entirely in Marcus-fashion what a good idea it was to ban him. Not that I approve of the Act that allows it.
Said he had 'seven lawyers working on it. He wouldn't need one to tell him that under UK law, there's damn all he can do about it. Suppose he'll turn up nonetheless with a vast number of cameras behind him one day all the same. just for the publicity. I doubt if anybody in Britain had heard of him, much less cared about him, until yesterday.
Complain about this comment
146, happy - "Now all go easy on them mods. they HAVE to read MATT letters. at least we can scroll on by."
You know, I never thought of that! How perfectly dreadful for them. Poor mods.
Complain about this comment
I don't know how to post links, but there's a cute little video on Youtube showing a mother duck leading her babies around the White House grounds. Nobody shot them and they weren't arrested as terrorists.
Complain about this comment
143 bere I just posted it to show there are different standards in the UK to the US. Lack of freedom of speech, baloney.
It would seem to me that certain posters have behaved in a way that might be illegal under the rules that came into effect in 2005. and yet the BBC has not seen fit to make sure they are not giving voice to people that would not be allowed into the UK if their hate was broadcast.
but here in blogger world it is as if they believe just we few read these posts.
Offensive can be struck. continual promoting of hate and the encouragement of nuking whole countries is not worthy of the electrons used to transmit .
Time
No I have never been to Jamaica but I did live in Tulse hill for a while.(same road that innocent Brazilian who was shot was from).
For me the rest of music is.....um.
the 80's and 90's were full of rubbish while the mainstream media marginalised reggae(still does) in part because they like to have a puff, some of them.
We get endless rock stations. on our local NPR station they have endless "jazz" and blues. but No reggae shows.
Used to but it got world musiced instead of removing yet another jazz show.
Reggae is seen as all sounding the same.(like metal doesn't . Or rock. to those that are not into it)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4e7kUgSQ00&feature=related
I had to laugh when My mum started to listen to my music and realise it was deeply spiritual. she had hope.
;)
Complain about this comment
Britishish
I neglected to thank you for posting that song link on the 'nuclear' thread which was totally wasted on a certain person. Thank You!
I have read about this 'savage person' who wants to sue the British for not letting him visit the country. I have never listened to him and I do not wish to do so. I have read a few things that he has said which is enough for me. His comments about immigrants made me ill.
I have read quite a bit of debate regarding just how far these kinds of hate mongers should be tolerated. One person made the point that it is better to have them in the open spouting off where we can watch them, than to have them hiding away allowing their poisons to fester into violence. I am not sure about this but will say I try to avoid those that pain me too much.
I was much more militant when younger but I do not have the energy or health for it anymore. Perhaps it is cowardly but I have retired from the fray. I prefer peace to constant discord.
Complain about this comment
ah british ish he was the guy you mentioned before in the thread.?
Boy that Tosh is good though.
I'm still listening to the "dog that piss on the wall of babylon"
JAH RAAASTAFARI
Complain about this comment
150 they have also had to read my rants to them in complaint ... ;(
Complain about this comment
149, british -
I've been looking at Savage stuff on Youtube, and I can see why he's been banned. Too bad he can't be banned from here. I'm wondering why you don't approve of the Act. It doesn't seem to be a matter of banning any sort of speech but of saying: "You are a despicable person and we don't have to let you come here and be despicable." Since I really dislike being around despicable people I have no problem with banning them.
I'm all for diversity but I don't think that counts. Wouldn't it be a much nicer world if all the really nasty people were gone?
Complain about this comment
bere54 (#148) "Does anybody know if there has ever been a court case to decide if it is constitutional for the government to ban citizens from traveling to Cuba, ... "
court case - travel to Cuba
It's not difficult to find this stuff.
Complain about this comment
Happy
I am really enjoying your music links!
Complain about this comment
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzSzhHmhiOY&feature=related
Well it is not this here in Eugene.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIqLsGT2wbQ&feature=related
here's an all time classic.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ORJBFI_OLdU
Complain about this comment
bere54 (#156) "Wouldn't it be a much nicer world if all the really nasty people were gone?"
It would, but your advocacy for government having the power to decide who is "despicable" and censor their speech proposes a radical intrusion on First Amendment freedoms in the US. We have a very long history of tolerating despicable speech (as opposed to action), and I wouldn't want to change it. If goverment can silence anyone, they can silence you.
Complain about this comment
157, Gary
Well, I guess I must be stupid because I couldn't find anything on the link you posted, nor could I find a way to search on it. Some of us are quite new to the internet but I don't think that's a reason for others to be snotty.
Complain about this comment
#148 Bere
I do not know if the law has been challenged but I do know that people go to Cuba. They merely go from here to Mexico City, Canada or somewhere like that and then go to Cuba. People have gotten into trouble for that if caught on their return here. I could be wrong because I got this information third hand from someone who knows someone....
Complain about this comment
lol aqua . I too wonder about it but after a year of threads being destroyed why bother.
Personally I would rather the hate filled just stayed in their caves and grunted.
Enough crazies make it to the thread to make all the same points but without the constant lies and red herrings .
Complain about this comment
Interested Foreigner,
Dear sir, I know I am off topic & only if you are willing.
I have read many of your posts & noted the depth of your ansewrs.
I hawe just finished reading the crucible of war by Fred Anderson for the second time.It delt with many questions & posed others.King G,3,understandably felt the American folk were his people & was not going to let them be highjacked,so fought for them.
Q1,Was Brittian right to feel aggrieved after fighting a world war against the French empire,only to be kicked out by the people who benefited from that victory ?.
Q2,No txation with out repro,was the rallying cry from rent a mob.How hollow that mantra after the war ,Shays rebelion ect.Who was useing & Behind the rebels / patriots,who stood most to gain, who orgistrated & manovered this split,were they the same guys?.
Just in case any minuite men come for this red coat.I LOVE the USA& its folk they helped buy my freedom with thier blood I just want to under stand more.
Oh yes Marcus before you start,Bugger Off
Complain about this comment
bere54 (#161), are you saying that you can't follow the link I provided? I just tried it, and it works for me.
Complain about this comment
happy - I have so many stories from that country. Their way of operating, often most unusual, so similar to the UK or Canada (Commonwealth-ish) but with a Jamaican twist. The smell of grass 7:30 in the morning on their way to work! As you can imagine not much gets done. (bere alert! read at your own risk) Jerk chicken (watch out for the hot sauce!) from the Jerk Centre in MoBay with live chickens running around! Oh dear!
If ever you go, this is the best advice I can give you: Tell them you have been there numerous times (just not that area to explain your ignorance), love the country, etc. They will treat you with Respect Mon. Otherwise, look out you are a mark.
I have mentioned this before Montreal has everything! In true Jamaican fashion most of the site is under construction! You have a place to stay as long as you bring your anvil and leg vices!! (Hope this gets through, I am not trying to sell anything!)
Complain about this comment
before I head off to the shop
some hammering tunes
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0cTEMaWaKK0&feature=related
this one has a power hammer(listen carefully 2:19 into it.
lol)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FJ3yxMWnsE
See you later folks . hope you enjoyed the music.
If not scroll past it;)
Complain about this comment
lol uk wales
Complain about this comment
160, Gary -
Oh, please. This is the kitchen. I'm not here to be condescended to (my take, perhaps wrong). Can you lighten up just a little?
Complain about this comment
166, timewaits
My son spent a week in Jamaica a few years ago. He was visiting with a Jamaican friend so stayed in a non-tourist area and said he was immersed in Jamaicanism the entire time. Apparently he wore very little clothing and did nothing the entire week and had a great time. I was of course hoping he would marry the friend (a beautiful young woman) and I had visions of romping on warm beaches with my little brown or tan grandchildren tumbling in the sand but this did not happen and they have gone their separate ways. Sigh.
Complain about this comment
Time and Bere
Lol I never went to JA because it seemed to me I might not leave.
Might , may be the wrong word there.
Complain about this comment
To Garyahill
Be kind, please.
I totally agree with you about rights to free speech. We also have free ears and eyes and are not required to listen or read what offends us.
Complain about this comment
172, aqua -
Yes.
And we also have the right to wish that we didn't have to be exposed to despicable people. Which was my lighthearted (attempted anyway) point.
Complain about this comment
ukwales
Where have you been? I remember a long time ago guessing so will try again, "To London to visit the Queen?"
Complain about this comment
Well, I am off to farm-sit for the night, for a mellow old yellow lab, a hyperactive young black lab, a whole mess of chickens and their newborn chicks, and a bunch of sheep and adolescent lambs. The dogs will get a treat because I let them share the bed with me, as their owners do not (I'm allowed to do this), and I will get very little sleep. And Evil D is going to be very annoyed because he's on his own for the night, with dry food for breakfast. Hope he'll forgive me.
Hope everyone has a nice evening in the cozy kitchen. Where I go there is only dial-up internet that can't be used with my laptop and doesn't work very well anyway.
Complain about this comment
156. At 7:50pm on 06 May 2009, bere54 wrote:
149, british -
I've been looking at Savage stuff on Youtube, and I can see why he's been banned. Too bad he can't be banned from here. I'm wondering why you don't approve of the Act. It doesn't seem to be a matter of banning any sort of speech but of saying: "You are a despicable person and we don't have to let you come here and be despicable."
It's more than that in a way, because various forms of incitement are against the law here, so it's really saying "you have made statements/acted in a way that would contravene our laws and traditions of behaviour if you were to do that here, so stay away."
The trouble is that it is always open to another minister to ban someone for more narrowly political reasons: I doubt somehow that Jacqui Smith (a politician I thoroughly despise, btw) would welcome Mr K Marx or Mr F Engels if they were around.
My god, I can hear another on the BBC WS joining in now: why the hell do they shout?
Gary: he can rant and rave as long as it isn't in person in the UK, thanks. From what I've heard, some of what he says would here be at the very least so offensive about some religious groups it would amount to a "breach of the peace" at the very least, so it saves the bother of arresting him.
And btw, I don't remember the 7th Amendment being invoked a few years ago over Yusuf Islam. ( Cat Stevens !!!!!!) A very gentle, kind, charitable and highly respected man. Lives not far from me.
(There was a story circulating here that came from what we often call "usually reliable sources" but was always unattributable, that the NSA/Homeland Security/FBI whatever had been given a name Yusef Islam by some questionable sources and simply didn't know "Yusuf Islam" was Cat Stevens, and then punted all sorts of rubbish into the US press to smear him and distract from their stupidity.)
Complain about this comment
lol on the free speech.
I could come up with hundereds of Bill Hicks links. Most of which I agree with. MAny on topic. but because he says a word with F in it it will not make it here.
nor on USA TV. Freedom of speach is great. but when televised or broadcast it changes.
that is the law here in the USA.
there was a song called "can't say crap on the radio"
they were right back then.
America has always had censorship. for media.
Advertisers drove it.
MTV is not allowed to show all them drug promoting songs.
the radio will not play drug songs.
Kaya one of Sir Robert Nasta Marley's best songs was left off the "songs of freedom "compilation because it is about pot.
Censorship and lack of free choice are known to me and all pot heads.I've had numerous post removed because they include an "incitement to commit a crime"
but racially offensive people that hate all and promote it are OK.
So no one tell me about the free speech here in the states.
When will there be a free debate on allowing us to smoke?
The BBC had a discussion on that. Guess what. the censored all the pot talk till all there was were a few dweebs saying. you're all junkies.
Complain about this comment
173 yes that seems right.
Complain about this comment
britishish well said
bere have fun.
Complain about this comment
happy - What does it matter if you do not leave? Especially if you are "happy" there. Unless you are afraid of becoming an illegal immigrant! A lot of violence there now, unfortunately. Long story - will try to be brief, as brief as my Newfie blood will allow me - already too long!! Brought some small plastic water pistols for the kids to play with in the pool, had our bags checked going into the country! (never before), guns were confiscated!! In the process discovered one of the bags was not ours. Red caps/porters running all over the airport looking, found the man who had mistaken our bag for his about to get on a tourist bus. Exchanged bags. We would not have seen that bag again without the customs check as we would have no idea where he was staying or he us. Everybody happy!
Complain about this comment
169. At 8:36pm on 06 May 2009, bere54:
Well, unless I'm reading it totally wrong, it says the US government (or more precisely, the legislature) can tell any citizen they cannot visit a particular country if it's a matter of 'foreign policy concerns" regardless of any constitutional amendment. It's the 2004 'Trading with the Enemy Act' that applies to Cuba.
Here we can only be 'advised'.
But we will not be told, of course, if we are on the US "no-fly" list.
Complain about this comment
british-ish (#176), the US has also declared certain aliens "undesirable" from time to time, including Charlie Chaplin, who was a citizen of the UK.
Michael Savage is making a fuss about this, but I'm sure he's secretly enjoying the notoriety. I expect he's making good use of the incident on his radio program.
Complain about this comment
LOL british ish good example with the Cat.
another one denied a visa to perform in the USA were the "new model army"
"No artistic merit"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqOWBLugj9E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkTFo-AZysQ&feature=related
now it may not be ones cup o joe but . it seems to me there was some censorship going on.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nj-YNDUVzqw&feature=related
Complain about this comment
Hello Timewaits.
No, not to London but Moldova. Its between Romaina & Ukrain.Suporting a feeding center for kids who Moms & dads cant cope any more.Its church led but only qualifing attribute needed ,your a child & your hungary.Its like going back in time,no running water "well or caught rain water.What the folk grow in summer they eat in winter,no grow no eat.Its ok if man & wife make a go of it,many men go west or east to gain a wage & try to get away from that grinding poverty.Then for what ever reason the money stops,I have seen real fear in the eyes of young mothers with young kids who cant spend the time growing food & looking after the children.My friends & I help but its never enough,I always feel very low after these trips how mutch reality can one take,thank you so mutch for asking where Ive been.
Complain about this comment
Thanks for th trip to Cuba, Noman. Jackson sounding a wee bit like Randy Newman...Love all the Happy reggae!
Bere, the link has one of those sneaky <br /> thingies hidden in it. Works fine when that's taken out.
My passport in the sixties said "Not valid for travel to North Vietnam, North Korea or Cuba" If I was on the Supreme Court, I would vote such restriction as unconstitutional, but I'm not. I'm with Gary on freedom of speech, despicable or not. Paxman had it about right tonight: "Are we all that stupid so the government has to protect us in case we believe whatever some idiot says?" (paraphrase)
G'night all
;-)
Complain about this comment
182. At 10:07pm on 06 May 2009, Gary_A_Hill wrote:
"I expect he's making good use of the incident on his radio program."
From what I hear on the Be0eb, he is, he is. Called on all his listeners not to visit "England" (sorry, all you Scots, Irish, Welsh, Canadians) and boycott everything 'British'. (If MA takes him up on that one we've got a result.
Yes, I'd forgotten about Chaplin.
Complain about this comment
157 Gary, 161 Bere 165 Gary.
Dear Gary: I also have trouble opening the links you post - not only yours, though. I think it has something to do with the age & software of the computer.
Complain about this comment
ukwales - It must be very difficult for you to make the re-adjustment when you return home and turn on your tap. I do not understand why there is so much inequality in this world. Why must those people suffer? Canada is a huge country with so few people. We were discussing tonight how the Province of Nova Scotia is a beautiful piece of geography with a population of under 1M. Halifax the largest city has less than 400k. We have plenty of room and we need more people. It does not make sense to me that we have so much while others suffer. I know how fortunate I am to be born Canadian.
Hard as it must be, it must also be very rewarding. Another jewel in your crown.
Complain about this comment
183. At 10:28pm on 06 May 2009, happylaze wrote:
another one denied a visa to perform in the USA were the "new model army"
"No artistic merit"
They really gave that as a reason? And they let Posh in? You
mean you have to prove you can draw now when you apply for a visa? "Sorry, Mr Buonarotti, we don't think much of your angels at all. Too masculine looking. You can't come."
(As so often, whenever I think I'm joking, someone's got there before me. I found this, from 'The Christian Science Foundation':
"The same goes for wings. Without evidence from his cadavers, he dispenses with them, painting angels as fit as young quarrymen and pasta-loving cherubs to whom aerodynamic principles will never apply." Except they're not joking . . . )
Complain about this comment
186 british - You probably don't want his listeners visiting anyway. Perhaps he is doing you a favour! What is your take on George Galloway being banned from Canada? I do not know if this is our right leaning Conservative government in action or whether it is warranted as I do not know enough about Galloway. This government of ours has been doing and saying things that have the rest of the world, as well as Canadians, thinking, "Whaaat?" They really must go! Interested, chrono and I are working on it.
187 Interested - Did you see the video from the convention I posted earlier in the former kitchen? If not I will look for it. My niece is in it. Very active in the Liberal Party.
What do you think of the Galloway ban?
Complain about this comment
All:
From The Notorious MA on another of the Beeb blogs (he's taken agin our new Poet Laureate on top of everything else) today:
"Be aware that my postings on retroactively moderated BBC blog sites are being moderated pre-actively on all of them"
A result, I think. Bout time, too.
Complain about this comment
190. timewaitsfornoman:
Didn't know about it. He ran rings round some US Senate committee a couple of years ago, who had alleged he was in the pay of Saddam*. (He did visit and crawled all over him rather loathsomely -- likes to choose an underdog, just to be outrageous.) That's probably why. Aberrations like that apart, otherwise, he's an old-fashioned Socialist. Oh, that might have something to do with it.
*Supposedly, a Torygraph journalist had found a dossier offering him x numbers of barrels of oil for being nice about Saddam. Just happened to be on the floor in the burnt and looted secret service's building in Baghdad. Just happened to be entirely written in English. I ask you. imagine MI6's Ziggurat on the Thames being bombed open, a journo walks in and the first thing he steps on is a document labelled 'Top Secret' saying the Queen is bribing Ahmendinajad with a couple of black horses. Written in Persian . . .
Complain about this comment
George Galloway is a Truthspeaker - one of the best! A true burr under the saddle of fools.
Complain about this comment
The View from Rural South Scotland:
The Time of Ten Thousand Greens
;-)
Complain about this comment
164. ukwales
Dear Wales:
I don't know.
Q1 was Britain right to feel aggrieved.
Yes, I think so. But that doesn't necessarily mean that the government followed wise policy.
I raised those points on the previous thread because I felt that another poster's commentary lacked balance. Countries do not generally go to war over triffles, the "War of Jenkin's Ear" notwithstanding. For Britain to have engaged in a huge and vastly expensive war on the North American continent there had to have been substantial cause - on both sides.
While we are used to seeing things from our own viewpoint, "No taxation without representation" being a good example, often times if you examine the other fellow's viewpoint you can see that it isn't entirely without merit. And when you can do that, it opens the way toward mutual understanding, and the ability to make the kinds of accommodations and negotiated settlements that yield a lasting and stable peace. Some of us believe that the "reasonable man" can usually find a way to get along.
Of course, some people look at that as weakness, and will be unreasonable, no matter what you do or say. This can be observed easily enough on this blog. Occasionally people of that mentality, or having those personality traits find themselves in positions of power, and then its just trouble.
In those situations you have three choices, in decreasing order of desirability. First, you simply make your deal with someone else. Second, you do without, and wait for the passage of time to solve the problem. This can be relatrively cheery (as in Spain waiting for Franco to die; now waiting for Fidel Castro to die), cool to the point of indifference (as in Egypt's cool relationship with Israel) or downright bitter (as in waiting for China finally to lose patience with a quasi-dynastic clique in North Korea. Why does the Royal Ottawa suddenly come to mind?). Third, you mobilize (as with Hitler).
Britain had more than half a point. Keep in mind, too, that the North American colonies weren't the only ones to benefit from the war.
Q2. Who fomented the revolution?
There was a relatively broad base of anger in the various colonies that grew over time. I don't doubt that it was genuine, or lacking in legtiimate grounds. And over time it became clear that the British government did not really have sufficient resources or a sufficiently high level of popular support to enforce its will, and had squandered chances to take a moderate line.
What people often do not realize is that if 10 % of the people decide to make a concerted effort not to obey the law, the state will have a very hard time imposing its will by force. Even 5 %. Think how long ETA has been able to keep going, and its hard core support base among the population probably doesn't amount to 100 people. But there are many more who will quietly turn a blind eye. Usually, though not always, the small minority who are ready to risk their lives have a grievance that has some fair basis, sufficient to obtain at least tacit, if not active, support amongst a far larger proportion of the population. This allows them to find sanctuary, to find recruits, and to find or extort financing.
Military suppression usually increases the sources of grievance, and therefore the number of recruits, and the people willing to hide them. Authoritarian governments have trouble dealing with this kind of opposition, unless they are willing to massacre their own people indiscriminately. Only governments that find a way to tackle the underlying grievances are likely to succeed in overcoming this kind of rebellion. That is one reason why revolutionaries assassinate moderate members of their own community - to prevent reconciliation and to heighten polarization. These are not nice people.
Consider, for example, the Sinhalese governement of Sri Lanka. They have fought a very long, very bloody civil war against a ruthless enemy. They see victory within their grasp. They have suffered a very great deal to get to this point, and they are not in a mood to compromise. In the circumstances, it is hard to blame them. Perhaps they will find victory satisfying. Perhaps it may be many years before there is another uprising.
But if the grievances of the minority are not addressed in an open and forthright manner, it is doubtful that we will have heard the last of that dispute. Irish home rule was a thorny topic, a constant running sore on the body politic for well over an hundred years. Problems like that do not tend to go away until an effort is made to solve the problem by addressing underlying grievances, rather than trying to suppress by physical force those expressing the grievances.
And it is unfair to ask the military to try to solve by force of arms, alone, (or possibly at all) problems that are, at root, political. There are limits to military solutions, and recognizing that some problems cannot be solved by military means (some not at all, some only in part) is an important milestone on the road to wisdom.
Getting back to America -
There was also a failure on the part of the British government to realize that it was unrealistic to think that they could rule half a continent, an ocean away, directly from Westminster. There were enough people with a genuine grievance to sustain a rebellion, even though there were others, on both sides of the ocean, who were ready to work to heal wounds. The rebellion came close to flickering out on a number of occasions, and the British were at times remarkable inept.
Complain about this comment
british - I almost had to take notes and draw a chart to figure that sentence out! And why are we being told this? So you and I will go to his defence citing the First Amendment?!! Do you have any bristle/bristol(?) board and a felt marker? Where should we gather? Well, I'm very amused by my wit.
Is no subject above/beyond criticism? What has the poor woman done or not done? Perhaps I do not want to know.
Heloise - I thought you had gone to bed. Well if he is a burr, we do have a fool (unfortunately a rather intelligent one) as a PM.
Complain about this comment
193. At 02:34am on 07 May 2009, Hesiodos wrote:
George Galloway is a Truthspeaker - one of the best! A true burr under the saddle of fools.
I wasbeing a bit unfair. He was a leader against the sanctions on Iraq (particularly those that so disastrously affected ordinary people and children) and I know very well from Iraqi friends that the very least you had to offer Saddam if you got anywhere near him was fulsome flattery. (And that didn't always save you from Uday.)
(I was actually at university with the guy who became Saddam's English translator. We knew he was reporting to the Embassy every week, and British Iraqis there, and anyone who had any connection at all with the Middle East, were extremely wary of him. We never knew whether he was a volunteer or under some form of duress. I happened to see him on telly after the invasion being interviewed by Dan Rather. He'd aged a good twenty years and his hair had gone completely white. I was not surprised.)
Complain about this comment
InterestedForeigner (#187), I'm sorry you have a problem with the links. I have tested the one above in post #157 on my NT4 PC system (old), and on my Mac with OS/X and FireFox (relatively new), and both work. The case is:
Emergency Coalition to Defend Educational Travel v. U.S. Dept. of Treasury, 545 F.3d 4 (C.A.D.C., Nov. 4, 2008)
The opinion cites a Supreme Court precedent, but I don't have the citation, because the document to which I linked is merely an article about the case. It contains a link to the opinion, but it's on a subscription site.
Complain about this comment
195. At 02:40am on 07 May 2009, Interestedforeigner:
Poor old George gets a bit too much of the blame I think. It was Lord North. Not one of our greatest successes as Prime Minister. Just because the previous lot had won the Seven Years' War and he'd kept the Spanish out of the Falklands, he thought Britain was bound to win.
(There's something slightly disturbing about that last sentence; can't quite put my finger on it . . .)
Complain about this comment
Ref 195 InterestedForeigner
I will add that it was not so much about taxes as it was about representation. As you pointed out, Britain tried to administer a large, diverse landholding from a considerable distance. This in a time when communcation by sailing ships took months adding further complications.
The British North American Colonies where created for commerce. We can give a slight nod, and a wink to the Pilgrims and their religious ambitions. Even their Plymouth Colony was foremost a commercial venture. Virginia was purely a commercial enterprise. The Crown administered land grants, but allowed the commercial enterprises in London to govern their own colonies; most often this was done poorly.
As the colonies grew, the need for local governance became a necessity. In 1619 the Colony of Virginia created the House of Burgesses to provide governance and became the Commonwealth of Virginia. Other colonies created their own local, governmental units.
It was not so much an issue of taxes. The colonies had been paying taxes and tariffs all along. It was a matter of how the taxes were generated and collected. After the Queen Anne's War in 1712 (French and Indian War), the Crown, and Parliment, needed increased revenues to pay for the war. The British government began issuing a series of tax policies that were sometimes very impractical for the economies of the colonies. The Stamp Act is a good example of an impractical tax levy.
The colonies had by now, well established local governing bodies with about 80 years experience in successful, local governing. The individual colonies would have 'paid the bill' if Britain would have simply sent them a 'bill for services rendered' and allowed the local governing bodies the authority to create and collect the taxes to pay the 'bill'. The colonists well understood their obligations. Basically, the taxes imposed from afar created economic difficulties in the various colonies and upset local and inter-colonial commerce, in particular. Many attempts were made to get the Crown and Parliment to recognize the problem. There were a number of very reasonable solutions also presented. The Crown showed some signs that it was willing to compromise. (King George was having health problems at this time) Parliment stood fast, not wanting to lose power to a bunch of colonial merchants.
From the onset, colonial people did not want to seperate from Britian. On the contrary; the colonial people wanted to be recognized as full British citizens, not just some colonial rabble off in some foresaken wilderness.
Failure to reach accord most always leads to more stern actions on the part of both parties. The problems went unresolved and grew.
Complain about this comment
Ref 199 British-ish
I agree. Poor old King George got the bum rap for the Revolutionary War.
There was a power struggle between his Ministers and Parliment, that left him too often on the sidelines without reliable information. I often wonder what would have been the outcome if the King's health was not weakening him.
Complain about this comment
Thanks to IF for the excellent wee essay! Thanks to Publius for commentary!
May I recommend (again) an hour spent (re)reading Common Sense, simply the most entertaining and effective political pamphlet ever written.
May I also recommend Gorgeous George
Salaam/Shalom/Shanthi/Peace
Complain about this comment
186, british -
I wouldn't worry too much about the boycott. Twice in the last ten years right-wing radio and TV nuts ordered their audiences not to visit Vermont and it didn't harm us in the least. We'd rather not have them wandering loose in our friendly state.
Complain about this comment
Gary: re: links - thanks.
190. timewaitsfornoman wrote: "187 Interested - Did you see the video from the convention I posted earlier in the former kitchen? If not I will look for it. My niece is in it. Very active in the Liberal Party.
What do you think of the Galloway ban?"
On the Liberal convention, no. I used to watch the playoffs a lot more intensely, and used to be much more of a political junkie (could name the MP for every riding from memory, and tell you by roughly how many votes they had won, how long they had held the seat, that kind of stuff - sort of the way some kids know baseball or hockey stats). The older I get, the less interesting it seems. Not that the prospect of bringing Stanley home or of getting rid of the present federal government wouldn't change things.
As for Galloway, I am a firm believer in Freedom of Speech. I don't have much use for Galloway or his ilk, but if he wants to stand up and make a fool of himself, and if others want to ignore the wise old saying "never argue with a drunkard or a fool", well, so be it.
There are limits on Freedom of Speech - the classic example is of someone why yells "Fire" in a crowded theatre as a practical joke. But the more practical limits are on those who espouse hatred or who directly or indirectly promote violence. In all cases, it is the negative externality issue: You can not use Freedom of Speech as an excuse either recklessly or deliberately to cause injury to others.
And one final qualification: religions are not entitled to a free pass on Freedom of Speech. Provided that one does not advocate hatred or violence, it is perfectly legitimate to criticize religious belief in the same manner and to the same extent as one might criticize political beliefs. If it were not so, then we would regard the Reformation as having been illegitimate and Martin Luther as a criminal. That cannot be a tenable proposition.
The government has just given this fellow the kind of publicity that you couldn't buy at any price. Stupid? Yes. And yet so characteristic of the troglodytes of the present minority government.
Oh, I forgot for a moment. According to the present government there never were troglodytes: The world was created 7000 years ago, and the fossil record is an elaborate practical joke.
Complain about this comment
194, Ed -
Lovely! Looks exactly like Rural Northern Vermont. Could have been taken right where I was dog-sitting last night. Very noisy in the countryside last night - peepers out in full force. I sat on the porch for a long time enjoying their singing.
Complain about this comment
Heloise - You might be interested in this interview from, I guess, the last time Galloway was in Canada. (Far less shouting! none in fact.) I agree with what he says. Presume our PM did not like what he heard, therefore the current ban. Don't know how many times I have to say that man (PM) must go; to salvage our reputation. The Hour is an excellent show.
Complain about this comment
206, timewaits -
Well, I've fallen in love again -- with George Galloway! Seriously, though, thank you for posting that interview. Galloway seems like a very sane well-spoken person whose ideas are radical only if you are someone like George Bush. What a respectful conversation that was. I was impressed with the interviewer, who seemed very well-informed, especially for his age (he looks very young to me). Perhaps Galloway is not usually so well-behaved (this was my first exposure to him) but I don't understand why he would be banned from anywhere. Not counting the Bush White House.
Complain about this comment
Interested - The MP from every riding!! OMG, your brain must be a marvellous thing! Naming all the kings and queens of GB is one thing, at least they often go in some sort of order. Ever thought about running yourself? Think of the pension! If interested the link is in the Strategy thread #339.
Complain about this comment
Regarding trolls (I don't want to post this on the other threads because I am a coward and loath to bring wrath upon myself):
For one thing, being new to blogs I am surprised to find that there are so many of these that a new definition of an old word has been coined for them (per Via-Media on the Pakistan thread). I had thought they were being called trolls by the old definition (ugly things lurking under bridges and eating goats), just because it's a good word to describe something you don't like.
Secondly, I wonder what would happen if every thread were to be abandoned by non-trolls as soon as a troll shows up. Would the trolls give up and go away if there were no more postings each time they posted? Or would they (he, mostly) figure out what was going on and then deliberately and gleefully end every discussion? Some people don't seem to be able to just ignore the trolls.
Complain about this comment
bere - The Hour with George Stroumboulopoulos is well worth watching. He is a very good interviewer, well liked and known in Canada. And, a huge Habs fan! Maybe your new computer can handle watching it online. It is not in the clip but as an intro a world-wind tour of the interviewee's life is given.
Complain about this comment
Darling Noman,
Thanks very much for that interview link. George at his best.
Respect!
ed
Complain about this comment
Ref 190 timewaitsfornoman
Have meant to comment earlier on seeing your neice in the video. I know you are proud of her, as well you should be.
I think the Liberal Party would gain some very good milage to use your neice as a young spokesperson in more videos. She has that wholesome, 'nice-girl-next-door' look about her and comes across as confident and sincere in this brief glimpse of her. An attractive young person who can motivate the youth vote. The Obama campaign used the internet as a vehicle to successfully reach youthful voters through bright, positive young people, like your neice, communicating a message.
Even us elder voters watching young people delivering messages with such poise and decorum react positively when we see and hear the youth taking up the reins of citizenship. It shows a forward-looking party and inspires confidence in the future of a nation.
Beside all that; she's just so darn cute:-D
Complain about this comment
Heloise - Forgot to mention, very beautiful pictures. You are ahead of us by a few weeks but we are quickly catching up! bere will agree, we have had a very early spring.
209 bere - I agree, it is a quandary. I suppose these blogs could be defined as democratic and you and I are in the minority. Although, without reading the original post, I have learned some things through the responses.
Complain about this comment
timewaits, I understand that Galloway was refused entry to Canada because of his support for an organisation that the canadian government, amongst many others, consider a terrorist organisation. In the 1990s he appeared to support a ruthless dictator, since deposed. Details have been spared to avoid direct reference to a region I would prefer not to introduce to the kitchen.
I am sorry to report that my reign as king of the pasty makers was short lived. Apparently my veggie version lacked protein. Given that my wife does not like tofu, any suggestions for alternatives?
Complain about this comment
#188,
Thanks timewaits,The only crowns I am in line for are one for poor spelling.The other is the one my wife says I will get if I dont stop bloging & do the work I said I would do !!.
Bye...
Complain about this comment
203 LoL bere.
that sort of ban would encourage sane people to visit knowing the riff raff were not going to disturb them.
Good plan. can we get savage to tell people to not go to Oregon.?
Complain about this comment
Ref 210 timewaitsfornoman
The first time I watched George Stroumboulopoulos I thought he was a light-weight interviewer. Sometime later, he was to be interviewing someone whose views interested me, so I tuned in to watch. It was then that I caught on to his interviewing style. He asks a question, then listens intently as he allows generous response time to the person he is interviewing.
My first impression of him just being a slick little toady has changed to admiration.
Complain about this comment
Interested foreigner,British,Publiusdetriot & Hesiodos.
Thanks, I love history,input from different view points & lands allways paints a fuller picture.Thanks for taking the time..
Complain about this comment
lol freed of of speech is great.
but so were tim of Ohios posts.
;(
Bere the country side can be naturally noisy.;)
UK wales . good on ya man.
I was wondering if you were heading to Romania.
I remembered you did work there.
I can still remember living there as a kid when the dictator was in power.(from the comfy position of being a dip brat there rather than a local.)
Old fashioned but beautiful .
Like I said though I was a kid and easily impressed by being able to visit Dracula's Castle.
Complain about this comment
Bere Time . there will still be trolls.
they don't just disappear.
last time this happened (it has before) a new appendage grew.
Complain about this comment
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7l5XjLJIoDM&feature=related
opps I forgot the link.
Complain about this comment
214 Quorn?
or beans.
Bere I tried the stop and watch but it goes on and on.
Complain about this comment
214, seanspa -
Lots and lots of cheese. Five cheese pasty perhaps?
Complain about this comment
211 Heloise -You are welcome. Keep your eye on The Hour, George S. gives a good interview. Our present government (therefore Canada) has also been criticized by Al Gore for our current stance on the Environment (ergo the appointment of a bombastic shouting environment minsiter - our PM's idea of solving a problem!). Your CD
212 detroit - Thanks, she is a very bright and ambitious girl. Looks more like her father but with her mother's hair colouring (my sister). She is also 6'3"! She would be extremely pleased to hear your suggestion. I have two other nieces and one looks so much like me, except for her fabulous chestnut hair, we are often confused as mother and daughter.
Complain about this comment
Ref 219 happylaze
What's a "dip brat"?
Complain about this comment
Why do the men on this blog all know how to cook? I'm told husband M makes a fabulous Martini, but since I don't drink not much use to me! Both my sons are making progress though. One son lives alone so has no choice and the other likes his food spicy so takes over that part of the cooking. Fine with me.
Complain about this comment
"He asks a question, then listens intently as he allows generous response time to the person he is interviewing. "
ah the dig your own hole and put your own foot in it method.
Speaking of which
Mrs Merton REAMS Bernard Manning.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O0ESNN03YwE
Let's him tie his own knot and kick his own chair.
PS there is more and it got real ugly.
Bernard was disgraced on national TV.
Long Live Mrs Merton.
Complain about this comment
pub, you may be about to see happy and diplomat in the same sentence!
Complain about this comment
#219,Happylaze,
Still old fashion & beautiful,the place & people.It was moldova this time.
Last time in Romania I also saw Draculars castle.It had a home spun fast food place near the out side castle wall & we all stopped for a bite!!!.
Complain about this comment
228 lol Seanspa.
yes . strange as it seems;)
(anyway I CAN be diplomatic;)
Complain about this comment
229 I remember asking my mum if he was in the coffins.(they were really chests")
the tiled roofs .
and the hills around tim e shara(phonetic I was 6 when we left)
Complain about this comment
happy good link to a thoroughly obnoxious piece of work. I managed to get half way through part 2 before I'd had enough. Richard Wilson did pretty well showing him up for what he was.
I never understood why Victor Meldrew was labelled grumpy. I thought his complaints were all valid!
Complain about this comment
Ref 226 timewaitsfornoman
Cooking is a very rewarding experience. Skillfully combining ingredients to come up with something delicious is the reward, particularly when there is someone sharing the reward.
On another note:
A scientific poll was recently conducted of all the 21 year-old, male voters in this household (SonnyA and two friends who stopped by). The results clearly indicated that your neice generated interest in young voter support for the Liberal Party of Canada:-D
Complain about this comment
208 Timewaits.
Can't open the link on this machine.
You only get the pension after 6 (?) years. That may not seem like much, but it means you have to win at least twice. That isn't as easy as it looks.
And if you run for Office, win, sit as a back-bench MP (particularly an opposition back-bench MP) and then lose, you are almost unemployable afterward. Pierre Trudeau said MPs were nobodys once they were 50 yards from Parliament Hill. There's a lot of truth in that.
Huey Long famously said he never wanted to be caught in bed with a dead woman or a live man. Nowadays, if you want to run for office, you had better not be an atheist, a philanderer, a smoker, a carnivore, or (gasp) even worse ...
a frequent poster to blogs.
Automatic disqualification, right there.
Then there is the small issue of picking a party: no party that represents my views right now, which is a bit of a problem. But I live in hope that the voters may go some distance to putting that right at the next opportunity.
Next, obtaining a nomination in a competitive riding is a committment of a very substantial amount of your time and money. You give up any hope you might ever have had that you, your spouse, or your children may ever enjoy any privacy.
And you have to raise money from others. Who will expect that money to buy things later.
You have to avoid losing your temper, or making sarcastic remarks to or about well-funded, high pressure single issue interest groups. You must not allow the delightful image of them all being fed to the lions in the Roman Forum ever to escape your lips.
You must eat a lot of unhealthy food, and put up with people who bore you to tears.
And you must do it all without becoming smug or insincere, and without falling prey to so many pitfalls and temptations, otherwise you begin to lose your own soul.
It is hard work. It can often involve unpleasant, bare-knuckled behaviour, stacked meetings, deceit, and so on. I have seen this first-hand.
Third, you have to be able to bear the unwavering knee-jerk partisanship. I can't do it anymore. You can never say aloud that you think that sometimes Socialists have good ideas. Or that sometimes even Separatists have good ideas. Or that sometimes Liberals can be careful with money (Bless you, and keep you, Paul Martin). Or that sometimes Socialists can be careful with money, too: The CCF was jam-packed with Baptists, Congregationalists and Methodists raised in the Depression - so tight they made Presbyterians look like free spenders. And sometimes the Conservative Party is taken over by the Reform Party, and no matter how many times they change the name its still the same old croc, run by and for people who stand for things that make you nauseous. A coat of paint won't change that.
My experience in business has taught me to steer clear of people who are doctrinaire. They are just way too partisan, way too strident. They are more interested in proving, however obnoxiously, that they are right right right and you (and the rest of the world) are wrong wrong wrong, than actually achieving anything that would be of benefit to anybody. They're talkers, not doers. We've seen postings by people like that on this blog.
Fourth, there is often so much personal ambition, and so much sleaziness in it, too. When I was much, much younger I remember being offered a rather well paid job (for someone of my then age, non-existent qualifications, and utter lack of experience) by a government entity. I hadn't applied for the job. The minister was a friend of a defeated candidate for whom I had worked. I decided I would never work for them ever again, and I haven't.
The thing is, in that time I also met some very, very fine people who really did, and do, believe in public service. There are Conservatives, Liberals, and NDPers who I know who are dedicated to public service, and who are selfless. They are open minded and positive. They are ready to listen to the other guy's view. If I campaign for someone, it is because of the quality of their character and personal conviction.
For myself, though, right now I'd just rather work with people to solve problems, without regard to whether they are Liberals, Conservatives or what not. I still believe that thoughtful, reasonable people can find common ground, and can make a difference for the better in our society.
Complain about this comment
Ref 228 seanspa
Wonders never do cease!LOL! I can see it now:
"Mr. President, I would like to introduce you to the Ambassador of Oregon, Happy Jack. He would like to present you with this toke[n] of appreciation from the Great State of Euphoria."
Complain about this comment
Ref 230 happylaze
We know you can be diplomatic. You have demonstrated that quality at times. It's just that you're much more fun as Trickster Coyote. OOWOOOooo!
Complain about this comment
Ref 226 (again) timewaitsfornoman
Further reflections on why men like to cook:
1) You get to splash around and play in the water.
2) There is an endless supply of knives to play with.
3) There are tons of really cool kitchen gadgets.
4) Making and kneading dough is akin to playing in the mud.
5) Constant tasting and nibbling is required.
6) Fire is involved.
7) Banging and clanging of pots and pans is musical.
8) Fire is involved.
9) Appliances have lots of buttons, dials, and speed ranges.
...and in the case of my Joe Six-pack, Four-alarm Chili; every time the chili gets a beer, so does the chef;-) (Three for the chili; three for the chef)
Complain about this comment
Woe is me. Just had to take the Evil D to the vet for an unrelated-to-weight problem but they always weigh him anyway and it seems he has gained almost a pound on his diet. He is now 20.2 lbs. I was sure he was losing weight. We are going to try a new diet.
235, publius - That was very, very funny! It cheered me up a bit after the distressing vet visit.
Complain about this comment
Interested - You are so literal!! I keep forgetting that. Is it your Scottish blood? I believe I have mentioned this before, my father-in-law was born in Scotland, so I choose my words very carefully when around him. As for working with people to solve problems, can they not fix your computer? I'm guessing you're not in computer science! (That's a joke.)
I know someone who ran for the Liberals in the last election. Not in my riding but I supported him in any way I could. Up against a very strong opponent. Would love to tell you who, but then others might work backwards to me!! He did not win but did well considering, so I know some of what you speak. The pension would be nice though!
Complain about this comment
detroit - "Cooking is a very rewarding experience" Maybe for some, even occasionally for me. But I would just as soon have someone else do it. Really enjoy eating at the homes of friends who know how to cook.
She's too old for them! Conversely, they're too young for her. I don't know your son or his friends, but believe me they'd be out of their depth! She is the granddaughter of a very strong woman - my mother!
Complain about this comment
Ref 234 InterestedForeigner
I know what you mean. I worked in partisan, local politics for years until I tired of the game. Went on to work for single-issue ballot proposals (Return-able beverage container bill, legislative reform bills, etc).
Was once woed (in my mid-twenties) to run for State Representative. I was not interested, recruitment pressure continued until I pointed out some things that would likely sour the voters in the very conservative district (Best friend was a closet gay, avid seperatist of church and state with no religious affiliation, had inhaled, noted anti-war activist, etc).
Complain about this comment
bere - My wheaten terrier weighed only 28lbs!! The vet was always complimenting me on her weight, although it had more to do with her digestive system (poor - therefore no scraps), than me. That is one big cat! Have you tried jogging? Or just forgetting about the whole thing and letting him be.
One of my sister's cats is huge (came into her life like that) and is always on a diet. Don't know if he has lost a pound (doesn't look like it), but he is not very happy. Strange, like you my sister is not a big eater but has a fat cat.
Complain about this comment
I'm heading out for English tea with a half-English couple. I wonder if they'll have pasties. Can pasties be for tea? Whatever they serve, at least it's food I didn't have to prepare. That's my favorite food - anything made by someone else.
Complain about this comment
I was first inspired to cook by Keith Floyd. The joy of cooking with alcohol.
Timewaits, don't you find it funny that you are complaining about being taken seriously? As for anyone tracing you, yo must know that publius knows exactly who you are!
Complain about this comment
Ref 238 bere54
I stand neutral on the issue of cats. Neither like them, nor dislike them. But every now and again a meet a cat worth knowing, and Evil D is becoming one of them. He knows what you're up to with this diet stuff and is determined to win. He predicted this trip to the vet and retained water; just for giggles.
It always amazes a friend of mine when I come to visit. The cat that makes it a point to ignore everybody with a display of such airs of superiority, always comes to greet me. The other cat who must be the center of all attention no matter how often rebuffed, will come for her ear-scratch and accompanied praises to her beauty, then go off and amuse herself while we visit.
Complain about this comment
240. Time.
I must have misunderstood. Can't see facial expression on the internet. Machine isn't broken - just old. No, I am not a computer scientist.
I'm guessing that if your friend came close last time, he might be in with a chance next time.
241. Publius.
Exactly. You get tired of it.
You never get tired of helping people, though, or of doing positive things for the benefit of others. That always remains worthwhile.
I left you a pun yesterday about the Hamilton Black Bears hockey team.
Complain about this comment
Ref 240 timewaitsfornoman
LOL. The guys recognized she was older than them, though they found her attractive. As for depth; my son commented when I asked them if they would be interested in having a political discussion with your neice, "I can tell she'd eat me alive in a political debate."
If it were not for the age difference, I have the impression she would fit in well with my son and his group of friends. They are all bright, attractive, active, informed, ambitious young people. I love having them around me. They enjoy that there are no taboo subjects in my house. Everything is open for discussion and debate. There is no sexism, nor racism amoung them. They treat each other as peers.
I keep thinking, what a dynamic business we would build if I could hire all of them and unleash their ambition, talents, and enthusiasm; giving the business world a kick in the pants.
Complain about this comment
seanspa - It is my sterling wit you are suppose to be appreciating! I have no trouble being taken seriously. Except maybe by a garage mechanic (then I don't blame him!). I rarely use it, but one look from me and people know, I'm serious! As I have said many times, I do not mind that you and others know who I am, but I almost feel like if I invite you over for a beer (as I have) then I have to invite all the others!! No thanks! But that's just me.
detroit would not be very good at his former job if he had not done so. I have supplied enough information for me to find myself!
Complain about this comment
Ref 246 InterestedForeigner
Yes. I did enjoy your pun. I've been having fun thinking up binary code cheerleading outfits for them to wear. 100100100 comes to mind:-)
Complain about this comment
timewaits, your wit is much appreciated, if a little subtle for some. But that's something to be proud of.
Complain about this comment
Interested - No not at all. I enjoy reading your posts. With your knowledge and wisdom I thought it would be great to have you help run this place! I was not expecting you to give me your reasons why not, but enjoyed reading them. As for his winning next time, don't know about that, some voters will have to "smarten up" first. He ran against a party leader!! Not from Quebec. I'll leave you to figure out who.
I caught your pun - the Black berries?
Complain about this comment
247 detroit - But are they over 6'3"? She can eat anyone alive and has no trouble doing so. I just smile and agree with her! As I look up, not way up, but up. I'm used to it as the three men in my life are all 6'3" a common height in my family (if not taller).
Complain about this comment
Ref 248 timewaitsfornoman
When we get to Quebec all I need is to have Bere on the look-out for a certain lily pond while I drive the scooter so we don't end up in a wreck. The Google satelite photo gets too pixilated to find that specific feature with any certainty.
I still only know you as Timewaitsfornoman. Your cryptic clue still has me stumped. Besides; Timewaitsfornoman has a nice rhythm and meaning to it. Sounds like a name your neighbors across the river would happily bestow upon you. Like, Many Changing Woman is only right for our dear one in Arizona.
Complain about this comment
All morning I have been being entertained watching a storm on radar and METAR coming in from the west. Went out and mowed my lawn and completed the task just before the rain started here. Took SonnyA out to lunch and came back to play on this thread while it was raining, and expected the rain to continue for the rest of the afternoon.
The front hit the cold waters of the Great Lakes and broke up; almost completely disappearing off the radar except for a couple pockets. This took me by surprise. The sun is out and warm. I'll have to go back outside and play.
I love this retirement gig!
Complain about this comment
253 detroit - There are a couple of ponds, boy would you two be surprised if you turned up at the wrong one! She's timewaits?? I'll check google earth to see if you are wasting your time. I find it hard to believe my clue still has you stumped. I say no more!
250 seanspa - Thank you. Perhaps they should come with Wit Alerts! I am often extremely amused by my own posts, as I am yours. You are not getting the full picture though as my stories generally come with actions/demonstrations.
Complain about this comment
Ref 252 timewaitsfornoman
SonnyA is the same height as me, 6'2". Friend S is 6'4", and Friend C is the short one of the Three Musketeers at 5'11". They are all quite handsome. I have fun watching the number of waitresses and young women patrons flirting with them when I take them out to diner. Of course, I benefit from this by getting superior service. (College students always appreciate a free meal)
My mother has a sister who is 6'6", and another who is 4'3". Mother is 5'9". All us nephews (12 kids in her family, so there are a lot of us) strutted around feeling like giants when we surpassed Aunt R well before we were teenagers. She was a good sport about it.
Complain about this comment
251. Time: Either that or "the Pearls"
Complain about this comment
publius, I bet you're right! Evil D was retaining water so that doesn't count as real weight! And I might have had my thumb on the scale. So maybe he's not fat after all. His new diet involves just canned food with no cereal filler, no more dry food, and he loves the new food so maybe he'll be happier. Apparently it's the cereal filler that makes them fat.
Tea was real scones with Devonshire cream and the most magnificent home-made strawberry jam I've ever tasted and cucumber sandwiches and little chocolate pastry things. I'm feeling pleasantly stuffed.
I realized a kitchen or so ago that I had inadvertently given you enough information to easily figure out what town I live in. Not Peacham! So you shouldn't have any problem finding it when you come to pick me for the ride to the Quebec lily pond to meet Timewaits' niece.
Complain about this comment
Howdy all!
Ed, way up there, re: trees.
As you probably remember, we have mostly Eastern White Pine (pinus strobus) and Red Pine (pinus resinosa) here. The pines formed the bulk of the lumber industry, so not much old growth left (the older regrown trees are now quite spectacular, however). The really old stuff that's left is mostly up in the Temagami region.
Our cottage in Western Quebec is favoured with a good grove of Burr Oaks, including 5 real giants. The field across from our place (that once was the farm) has 5 or 6 big spreading Burr Oaks who are quite spectacular. A few big American Elms (rare now 'cuz of Dutch elm disease) are also found there.
Warning! These images may be disturbing to those still recovering from winter! I'll get some springy images this weekend.
Seanspa, re: meatless pasty filling. Red lentils and bulghur, properly seasoned, might do. Or (yuck!) "soy protein meal" (the sort of stuff that is in those lovely "tofu weenies").
But really, meat's the thing.
Cheers,
Pinko
Complain about this comment
256, publius -
That's so true about better service when one is with good-looking young men. It happens when I am out with my son. There used to be a place here where the food was great and the service okay but there was one waitress who acted like a zombie - never a smile, mechanical service. Then I went there with my son and oh brother did she turn on the charm! Son told me, very immodestly, that this happens to him all the time! But he's only 6'1" - on the short side for men in our family. And the women in my family are tall too - all except me, but I am not short! It's just that everyone else is taller than I.
Complain about this comment
detroit - I didn't picture you as tall, not short, just not tall. happy has mentioned his height, leading me to believe he is tall, as is Ed. I picture Interested as tall (is that correct IF?) bere we know is not tall and seanspa I think of as (well I don't like to use the word) average height. I'm 5'7"
How to use the word "tall" numerous times in a single paragraph - just keep repeating it.
Complain about this comment
Oh chrono, I also think of you as tall. I'll find out when we meet in Lachute - hope you got my change of location post! We might as well meet in front of the Parliament Buildings than have me go to Chelsea!
Complain about this comment
hey Pub. you forgot to mention that fire is involved.
Complain about this comment
Ah, so this is where all the rational folk are hiding. I'm feeling like the trolls are winning on all the other threads.
Anyway
124. At 1:32pm on 06 May 2009, Interestedforeigner wrote:
"I'm thinkin its "al fresco", as opposed to "el fresco"."
Indeed it is "al fresco" .... but in the interest of trivia you should all know that Italians never eat al fresco .... unless they have been very naughty. "Al fresco" is Italian slang for "in jail" (like "in the cooler").
This is a classic "false friend" word, where the original meaning has changed with time or distance .... like peperoni, which in Italy is a bell pepper, not a type of salami, or latte, which is just milk.
Anyway, enough food trivia. I've been cold in England for a week now, but will be back in Rome in 5 days, and I'm looking forward to eating "fuori" (outside), as they say.
Complain about this comment
232 seanspa. right on. victor was just pointing out how stupid people can be.
As for bernard the big one he reminded me of some.so I thought I'd share that. I remember when it happened, we were all cheering Mrs merton on.;) ;) ;) ;)
Talk of leading the cow to slaughter.
241 there's that freedom issue being tested;)
lol on the looking guys.
I can't find me so good luck if that ever comes up.
but time I'll have a hard time finding you to set up the forge this summer.
(how come you're at the summer house already?
Bere. the filler is the same for humans.
that air they pump into icecream was the best example of calories from no where;)
Complain about this comment
261, timewaits -
There is absolutely nothing wrong with being average height! Nothing! It is not a pejorative. I am 5'4 1/2" and if I stretch my neck I can almost get another half inch. So I just say I'm 5'5" which is an inch above average height for an American woman and there's nothing wrong with that! Being loomed over by extra-tall people does not make one short. As I keep telling my disrespectful children as they loom over me. My daughter is 5'9" and she just finds that so amusing. We are not amused.
My husband was 6'2" and my brother is 6"4" and once I was walking down the street between them and felt like a bug. But that does not make me short!
And I am not at all sensitive about this!
Complain about this comment
hey stu finally. did you get lost?
I'm out before I waste "ink" over there.
I'm on the hit list now.
Still yes the trolls can have it.
Advocating genocide and such is such a good use of BBC resources.
Time on height.
I'm just under 6' 3 but I must be taller. The number of people I have met that swear they are 6'3 and I'm looking at their fore head is amazing.
I think maybe my specs must make them foreshortened or something.or else they are vertically ambitious.
Complain about this comment
chrono - We lost our 4 elm trees to Dutch Elm last year. In the spring one looked a little sad and by August they were all dead. It happened that fast. Had them cut down and then debarked them to kill those rather unpleasant looking larvae to help stop the spread to other trees. I'm not particularly squeamish but I'm getting the chills just thinking about them! The larvae, not the trees! Really yucky!
detroit - Checked google earth and windows live local but the pond is not visible.
Complain about this comment
I just advocated genocide on the east coast on the other thread . I wonder if the Mods will find that genocide acceptable?
I went a little further than that admittedly, but nothing that has not become expected here on the BBC.
Tonight it's hitting time
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vL9V19As2Ro
later folks.
Would you believe this is Duran Duran.;( lol
Complain about this comment
This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
Did somebody mention fire? Or pitch pine?
;-(
Complain about this comment
I used to be six foot five.
Complain about this comment
Full Moon tonight folks. Ish-ish, and Stu, if you're in London, better be "wary".
Yours,
Pinko
Complain about this comment
Now bere - I went out of my way to say and I quote, "bere we know is not tall." You see I put your name and the word tall in the same sentence. I was talking to seanspa who could be 6'5" for all I know so did not want to offend him (as men in particular have a thing about height - ok, I'm stereotyping, but 100% of the ones I know). And happy just confirmed it.
happy - You are probably using UK feet and inches. You must have see the ads on US TV where the women claim they are a size 2. I don't know if we even have a size 2 in Canada! Unless in the children's department.
I am at home now but will be officially moving in a couple of weeks. Right now we are back and forth. I'll let you know.
Complain about this comment
Thank you for contributing to a BBC Blog. Unfortunately we've had to remove your content below
This decision has been made because it contains material on which the copyright appears to be owned by someone else. ...
...[someone dead for almost 100 years, whose complete works are openly published on the website of the Sierra Club, which he founded and of which he served as President until his death!]...
...
Regards,
The BBC Blog Team"
Pinko,
An oaken friend (petraea), and Another, and yet another, and an elm, sadly now dead, and one of my favourite "smoker's rests".
When my neighbour goes away for a few days or a week or so, he often asks me to "look" his livestock, an onerous task which requires me to ride his "quad bike" all around some of the ugliest hills imaginable.
Many of the old-growth red pines from North America now hold up the slates on Scottish roofs and American pitch pine panels many churches and serves as hard-wearing floors.
John Muir spent much of his youth clearing bur oaks from his father's farmland in Wisconsin
To this charming hut, in the sunny woods, overlooking a flowery glacier meadow and a lake rimmed with white water-lilies, we were hauled by an ox-team across trackless carex swamps and low rolling hills sparely dotted with round-headed oaks. Just as we arrived at the shanty, before we had time to look at it or the scenery about it, David and I jumped down in a hurry off the load of household goods, for we had discovered a blue jay's nest, and in a minute or so we were up the tree beside it, feasting our eyes on the beautiful green eggs and beautiful birds,--our first memorable discovery. The handsome birds had not seen Scotch boys before and made a desperate screaming as if we were robbers like themselves, though we left the eggs untouched, feeling that we were already beginning to get rich, and wondering how many more nests we should find in the grand sunny woods. Then we ran along the brow of the hill that the shanty stood on, and down to the meadow, searching the trees an!
d grass tufts and bushes, and soon discovered a bluebird's and a woodpecker's nest, and began an acquaintance with the frogs and snakes and turtles in the creeks and springs....
By this time I had learned to run the breaking plough. Most of these ploughs were very large, turning furrows from eighteen inches to two feet wide, and were drawn by four or five yoke of oxen. They were used only for the first ploughing, in breaking up the wild sod woven into a tough mass, chiefly by the cordlike roots of perennial grasses, reinforced by the tap-roots of oak and hickory bushes, called "grubs," some of which were more than a century old and four or five inches in diameter. In the hardest ploughing on the most difficult ground, the grubs were said to be as thick as the hair on a dog's back. If in good trim, the plough cut through and turned over these grubs as if the century-old wood were soft like the flesh of carrots and turnips; but if not in good trim the grubs promptly tossed the plough out of the ground...."
Complain about this comment
Hes you can cry over a fire though.
;(
check the future of smithing out
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLwaPP9cxT4&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLwaPP9cxT4&feature=related
this stuff is safe but no substitute.;)
Complain about this comment
nice beech there Hes. bet it keeps some of the rain off for that smoke.
lol 272 i used to be 4 ft 2.
Complain about this comment
Timewaits,
re: verticality -- 'Round about 6'2".
But I ain't shy. Here's the whole famn dambily.
Yours,
Pinko
Complain about this comment
274, timewaits -
Okay. I like having my name and the word "tall" in the same sentence. I can do selective quoting like they do in the newspapers: bere is . . . tall. I read somewhere that they do that with movie reviews. "This is far from the best movie" becomes "this is . . . the best movie."
You know they've changed all the sizes here in women's clothing, don't you? I can't figure out what size I wear now. I decided to try on some Carhartt jeans for women and the smallest size they had was a 6 and it was way too big. Even when I was in high school and weighed 99 lbs I didn't wear a size 4. I suppose a lot of women are fooled by this and buy more clothes because they're thrilled to discover they can fit into a smaller size. It's very peculiar. I guess it's all part of the new trend of downsizing.
Complain about this comment
happy - Read your post on the other thread and ummmm.... I live 6 hours from NYC, bere about 4, so we would appreciate it if you would pick a different site. I'm finding SKV (is it?) interesting. You?
Heloise - "I used to be six foot five."!! No comment! But amusing. OK, I'll comment; stopped measuring did you, the day you found you were 6' 4 1/2"?
Complain about this comment
No. I started shrinking...
Complain about this comment
Actually, sort of 'settling', I guess, 'cause I've got broader...
Complain about this comment
Ed,
Yikes! That was one helluva fire. Did you re-build?
Yours,
Pinko
Complain about this comment
Not yet - still considering design - probably cruck-frame. It's a bit more of a "blank slate" than before...
;-)
Complain about this comment
RomeStu #264) " ... like peperoni, which in Italy is a bell pepper ... "
I thought that was peperoncini. What's the difference? I suppose ..cini is a small one.
Complain about this comment
280, timewaits -
I'm about 6 hours from NYC so you must be more like 8 hours away but that's still too close. And my son lives there! No nuking there, please.
Complain about this comment
Ref 278 chonophobe
Thanks for the pictures. Now we know why you're Pinko:-)
Liked the over-head shot of the boat, and the one of the scooter. You're bride is talented with the charcoal. Her self-portrait shows determination. I know too well the struggle. Hope I am not being forward to ask you to give the "Survivor" a hug for me. Determination is still in her eyes.
Complain about this comment
Ref 281 hesiodos
Gravity always wins.
Complain about this comment
chrono - thanks for the pics (which I will have a better look at tomorrow when my screen stops being green!) and werewolves. Googled Warren Zevon to read that he died at age 56. Maybe I knew but had forgotten. I find that happens a lot these days. Husband M and I joke that between us we are still able to complete a sentence!!
Complain about this comment
bere - Obviously you're not driving with M!! And of course now have to include time at the border, but I don't think that's going to hold up the fall-out! I'm pretty sure the last time we drove it took under 7 but could easily be mistaken.
detroit - Is the game over? Did they win? I've been thinking, since we're in Carolina we could take in a game. I'll be rooting for the Hurricanes. You may only join me if you promise not to support Boston (lovely city that it is, but we're taking hockey)!
Complain about this comment
Ed,
"Blank slate" indeed! How are the walls holding up (literally)?
Have you come across this on your internet rambles? I spent a long while reading it this evening, and thought you might be interested, as it concerns your friend Hesiod.
Publius,
Hugs warmly received. She is a tough lass, and has come through with spirit intact.
And re: the pink thing -- I'm a proud librul commie pinko too!
Yours,
Pinko
Complain about this comment
273. At 02:24am on 08 May 2009, chronophobe wrote:
Full Moon tonight folks. Ish-ish, and Stu, if you're in London, better be "wary".
Yours,
Pinko
Oh. So that's what Marcus looks like? I'll get the garlic out of the fridge, then. Right away.
(Damn. It was supposed to go into the Bolognese on Saturday.)
Complain about this comment
Ref 290 timewaitsfornoman
Wings and Ducks into OT 1-1 could be heading into double OT.
Complain about this comment
Timewaitsfornoman
Oops! It's tied in the first period. I was misreading an on-line scoreboard. Just found the game on radio. There is not a television station in Detroit, nor on my cable selections carrying the Wings playoffs. Detroit just scored 2-1 and we are at the end of the 1st.
Had been watching the Canooks on HNIC. The Canooks fell apart in the end of the 3rd, 2-1.
Complain about this comment
277. At 02:40am on 08 May 2009, happylaze wrote:
lol 272 i used to be 4 ft 2.
I can beat that. I'm pretty sure I was 18 inches once.
Complain about this comment
Ish-ish,
Not surprisingly, perhaps, Warren does a live version as "Werewolves of Jersey."
Oh yeah, that's the guy!
Yours,
Pinko
Complain about this comment
And it's a silver bullet you'll be needin'. The Bolognese is good to go.
'Night all.
Complain about this comment
detroit - I really must go to bed, but... you don't have a station that carries the Wings - in the playoffs?!! I had no idea it was that bad! Nor did I realize they were playing out west tonight, which I presume they are. There would be rioting - literally - in the streets here if the fans were denied the game.
Complain about this comment
Ref 298 timewaitsfornoman
I think it's a conspiracy to get us to go to the 'sports bars' to watch on the two premium cable stations.
Oh well. It's like being a kid again. Listening to the game on the radio. Only received HNIC on the television back then. The Detroit station that carried the Wings didn't reach that far into the country.
Complain about this comment
297. At 04:44am on 08 May 2009, chronophobe wrote:
And it's a silver bullet you'll be needin'.
Can't. London. No gun. The Bolgnese's had it.
Complain about this comment
Since the morning piper didn't go over well, how about this mellow flute?
Complain about this comment
Pinko, Thanks for the link.
- "The creative accomplishment of Hesiod is difficult to overstate. For the first time in Greek thought we have a writer setting out to give a dynamic account of the entire order of being, accomplished largely in the Theogony and supplemented with the Works and Days, which takes up the origins of man and his orientation to or rebellion against the justice of Zeus in life in a cosmos which is straining against its compact self-containment. This straining is evident in the revolutionary nature of the Theogony with its coming into being of Chaos, Gaia and Eros and its development in three generations of divinities in which the injustice of the reigns of Uranus and Cronos are replaced by the dike of Zeus, the supreme god. It also appears in the Works and Days in the myth of the five ages of man with its pessimistic pattern of degeneration caused by the rejection of the divine dike by mortals, causing a crisis of consciousness in which the poet, filled with the pneuma of the Muses, speaks prophetically to the princes and the people of the need to return to the measure of god."
"For the first time in Greek thought we have a writer..." He was an oral poet! Such is the presumed primacy of the written word, "holy writ", an invention of accountants which brought us the plague of lawyers!Here's a taste of Hesiod's opinion of the Iron Age - pretty prophetic, eh?
Grrrr! ;-)
Complain about this comment
285.Gary_A_Hill wrote:
"RomeStu #264) " ... like peperoni, which in Italy is a bell pepper ... "
I thought that was peperoncini. What's the difference? I suppose ..cini is a small one."
Peperoncini (correct - little pepper) refers to the chili pepper, ground up to put on pasta or pizza, or infused in oil.
Peperoni - bell peppers, red, green, yellow or orange
Buon appetito to all in the kitchen
Complain about this comment
301, pub -
Much better, lovely in fact. Could listen to that any time of day. Thanks.
Complain about this comment
295. At 04:31am on 08 May 2009, british-ish wrote:
277. At 02:40am on 08 May 2009, happylaze wrote:
lol 272 i used to be 4 ft 2.
I can beat that. I'm pretty sure I was 18 inches once.
isn't that TOO big?
Complain about this comment
one for the kitchen
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGq5JlJXgCc&feature=related
sorry to all those on the east coast.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=662LnzTMy7A
(i'm going to try and post this song on the war thread.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_H7TEG4uu0&feature=related
seems appropriate)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AasyyVQoIgo&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfXLWCQlqX4&feature=related
Grrrr! ;-)
GRRggrRRrr ;-()
Complain about this comment
305 happy - "isn't that TOO big?" I think so, where's the Guinness Book of World Records? Is there a category for that?
Hope there is a new thread soon, not that I comment on them but... I haven't a clue as to a Supreme Court Judge other than someone Liberal...please! Nor do I know where the Nukes are hidden in Pakistan.
Complain about this comment
here's a prayer for the sun.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98hGHjPNo9k&NR=1
Complain about this comment
306 happy - "sorry"??! Well that's ok then as long as you're sorry. I don't know Augustus Pablo. Good song, I can see/hear the appeal if I think back to my melded with the couch days!
Did you see my link to the Montreal International Reggae Festival? End of June. You could volunteer or rent a Kiosk. They have a list of artists but I am woefully ignorant! Google it.
Complain about this comment
307 If it were the High court I 'd have a nomination.
Time for me to figure out some money issues. so lol and later
Complain about this comment
ref 307 timewaitsfornoman
That group of posters working themselves into a lather about nuclear weapons in Pakistan need to stop blabbering about it and go look for them. Personally:-) It's like the 1960's all over again. Create paranoid fears to forget about more pressing, domestic problems.
Complain about this comment
Ref 304 bere54
Glad you liked the music this morning.
Ran into something last night about Vermont I had never heard before while listening to the Wing's game on radio in the wee hours of the morning and searching for a product called, Bag Balm. Something we once used on the farm with dairy cows that works great on healing dry, human skin. Turns out, the balm is made in Vermont. But, that's not the topic.
I read that it was made in the Northeast Kingdom region of Vermont. I never heard of this "Kingdom". Are you Vermonters secretly running some kind monarchy back in the mountains? Maybe, some kind of maple sugar cult? :-)
Complain about this comment
Senator Bernie Sanders is on VPR right now doing a call-in program about health care, torture, investigations and prosecutions, etc. It's too bad so many people (including his fellow Senators) dismiss him as a lefter-than-left crank because he really makes a lot sense, particularly on the health care issue. Because his is terribly idealistic few will take him seriously.
Oooh, a Canadian just called in to say how good his health care is and that the Canadian system is nothing to be afraid of.
Complain about this comment
312, pub -
Yes, Bag Balm is made ten miles down the road. Big green can hanging on the side of the building. Bag Balm is a popular souvenir item here ($4 for a teeny tiny can, about one inch square).
And yes, we are the Northeast Kingdom and I am the monarch! Very well-kept secret!
Actually, the name was coined in a novel years ago by (I think) Howard Frank Mosher that took place in a fictional "Kingdom County." The tourist agency picked up on it when they were thinking up cute names for different parts of the state. The Kingdom comprises the the three northeast counties. We identify ourselves as being from "the Kingdom."
Complain about this comment
Ref 314 bere54
QueenBee! I like that! Her Royal Majesty of the Northeastern Kingdom of Sugar Trees.
Does Her Majesty have a crown and all the trappings of office? :-)
Can we become your Royal subjects and get passports?
Complain about this comment
315 pub -
No crown or trappings. I prefer to keep a low profile; it's the Vermont way. In fact my profile is so low no one but me knows I am the Queen Bee! For a small fee I will whip you up a passport, if I could only figure out how to work that program on my computer. Really, it would be more of a certificate of honorary citizenship, good in any diner in the state - allowing you counter privileges.
Complain about this comment
311. publiusdetroit wrote:
It's like the 1960's all over again. Create paranoid fears to forget about more pressing, domestic problems.
I see shares in the yellow ribbon industry are at an all-time low.
Complain about this comment
Sugar cult?
I'm in.
All Hail the mighty QueenBee.
Complain about this comment
Need to chill out after the other thread?play these in order.
sit relax BREATH deeply;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyCX6mhwBTA&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQiru402Bps&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbWmMo606qo&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kv9NKRWxzOY&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6iB7__lbJ2Y&feature=related
By the end you should be fairly relaxed.
Now here's Tammy winette as you have never seen her before
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RPjggN-KByI&feature=related
Complain about this comment
here's something completely different
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwpZi2KkuwM&feature=related
from the same girl
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSKhGZklg-Q&feature=related
Bere I'd make you a crown but I don't thing my lead foil would look good on you.
Complain about this comment
319, happylaze -
I dunno. There's only so long I can sit and watch farm animals sit. I couldn't tell - were those sheep or cows?
As for Tammy Wynette, she was wearing my crown!
Complain about this comment
happy -
I'm sure I would look good in lead foil, even if it didn't look good on me. I want a crown! (Stamps foot, low-profilely.)
Complain about this comment
lol bere yea chill out was designed to bring people off E really.
calm em down. good for bed time in the city.;)
that group were a hoot they wrote a song to prove a point about getting to number 1 and then did putting Tammy WYNETTE to the top of the British charts.
I'm not sure if Dolly managed that one.
Thinking of dolly s . they were ships.
opps Yess MMAm
Complain about this comment
Happy Jack,
Thanks for the tunes.
A righteous groove here for ya.
I'm no reggae aficionado, but I know what I like. A great tune, and this band is sooo tight ... almost jazzy.
Yours,
Pinko
Complain about this comment
321. At 9:52pm on 08 May 2009, bere54 :
What happened to your son (the new thread) happened to a friend of mine in Massachusetts after he went out for a walk in the early hours of the morning.
(Only time I've ever been questioned by a cop that way was about 4am leaning alone on the parapet of Westminster Bridge looking along the Thames. More of a conversation really. It was a while before I realised he was worried I might be thinking of suicide, not Wordsworth . . .Once I'd cleared that up, we chatted about poetry.)
Complain about this comment
happy is pleased with the new thread - right up his alley. I wonder if anyone other than the choir will be listening?
Complain about this comment
326. At 02:27am on 09 May 2009, timewaitsfornoman wrote:
happy is pleased with the new thread - right up his alley. I wonder if anyone other than the choir will be listening?
Won't be long before the 'My country-always right' gets going. In fact, Bere has already been effectively accused of being non-American and her son of being a hash smoking flasher, probably Dutch . . .
I've been enjoying Happy . . . .
Complain about this comment
Happy
Please be respectful of Dolly.
I think she is a very nice lady. I enjoy her music and I love the song she wrote for the movie "Transamerica." It is well worth a listen regardless of one's beliefs. The movie, I think, is also worth watching in order to have more understanding of those who choose a different way of being in this world.
Complain about this comment
Ed,
The oral nature of the Hesiod's poetry is an interesting dilemma. It's like trying to figure out what a Charlie Parker tune sounded like if all you have is a written score. It's always going to be a guessing game, and because the living tune changes for each performance, never complete. But people of talent, who can themselves extemporise on the basic patterns, will come up with some pretty good interpretations. Every translation, every interpretation, philosophic or artistic, has to be viewed as a performance.
As to the iron age, I guess I'd just say that prophesy is the business of warning people that their civilisation is coming off the rails (Isaiah comes immediately to mind). Prophets always seem to be right, at least eventually. Heed them not at your peril.
I found another little essay written by Moorton, the author of the Hesiod piece above. He is presenting here the thinking of William Galston. Galston's schtick is an attempt to reconcile rights based liberal individualism and a more communitarian subordination of the individual to a notion of what is right.
That essay can be found here.
As a liberal concerned with the limitations, and indeed the excesses, of modern liberal individualism, I find this kind of thinking fascinating. His conclusion is that, "As we people of the West engage the world in a great conversation about the nature of democracy and humanity itself, we should remember that to affirm democracy as the best form of government need not imply that nothing better lies beyond it."
My money is on the the rastafari!
Yours,
Pinko
Complain about this comment
british - I am far from an expert but would be surprised to learn Canadians can be arrested / taken in for questioning without some charge or reason given. I consider Canada to be very open and liberal. Our current government is a bit scary, they of the Galloway ban. We were criticized recently by Al Gore! How low can we go?
Complain about this comment
To#325 Britishish
You have been most fortunate.
We were doing aid work and were 'arrested' once by 'police' with machine guns. They took all of the food and medical supplies and most of our clothing but they did not kill us. We considered that to be a very good day.
Complain about this comment
Pinko, Thanks for the link. I'll look at the essay later, but now must sleep....
Thinking of Bird, I leave you with this:
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Complain about this comment
331. At 03:01am on 09 May 2009, aquarizonagal wrote:
To#325 Britishish
You have been most fortunate.
I wouldn't argue with that. Though, alas, I have known people who did not survive.
Complain about this comment
329. chronophobe:
I had to track way back for Ed's link, and now I'm worried. I'm pretty sure I sat on a gravestone when I was twelve.
Complain about this comment
british -
I am so upset about that person's response to my post on the new thread that my hands are shaking. I replied to him and tried not to be too nasty. I think maybe I'd better stay away from that thread now; it is too upsetting. Perhaps if he ever gets a call from a child arrested for no reason on the other side of the country and spends frantic hours trying to figure out what to do, he'll have some empathy.
All day they told my son he would have to post bail and it was a Sunday and the bail people in California wouldn't accept my credit card without a fax of the card and we don't have fax places here open on Sundays. It was only when a friend in San Francisco and her husband and daughter used their ATM cards up to the limit for cash and were heading north to rescue him and I called the jail to tell them that, that they suddenly released him without bail. One cop told me they were going to make him post bail because he kept asking questions!
So it makes me very angry when someone has the gall to tell me this doesn't happen in this country.
Complain about this comment
327 british - I agree. Won't be long. bere is defending herself with determination. While in the US recently amassing mounds of one dollar bills, I broke my silence and commented to a clerk that perhaps dollar coins might be a good idea. I was immediately told they have (I believe) 14 one dollar coins. Oh! None in circulation, of course which was my point. But I was quickly put in my place. Silly me, I thought the guy would agree! But no.
331 aqua - That was a very good day! You are here to tell the tale.
Complain about this comment
Sorry Britishish
I did not mean to be cranky but having had dealings with various forms of 'police' in several places (not the UK) I will choose the police in the US because they usually do not rob or shoot you.
Complain about this comment
Bere
I am so sorry. Please do not let those posters upset you.
Complain about this comment
335 bere - You defended yourself and your son admirably. I do not know why people write such nonsense. Also made it sound as if the US is the only country in the world where people are allowed to speak out against their leaders. Self righteous. I've been in plenty of demonstrations and have yet to see the inside of a jail. Our police force appears to be there more for crowd control than enforcement.
Complain about this comment
Britishish
Sorry, so have we also. Let us remember our fallen comrades together.
Complain about this comment
335.
I've referred him. I warned him long ago my patience with these vicious little tricks of his was at an end.
Complain about this comment
341, british -
Oh no, did the troll say something too? I don't read his posts, but I see it's gone. It was #41 that upset me, McJakome, but if the troll said something nasty too I'm glad you referred him so I won't be tempted by masochism to read it. Or are they one and the same?
Complain about this comment
341.
S'pose that's another thread down the drain, though. Even earlier than usual.
Complain about this comment
342.bere54:
Oh, dear. He's upset :-)
Complain about this comment
british-
Thank you so much for your #66 on the other thread! So they are the same person? (I use the word "person" loosely.)
Complain about this comment
bere & british - And we were so enjoying happy's posts. Surprised he was able to drag himself away. Perhaps when he returns will be able to wrestle back control.
Complain about this comment
342. At 04:05am on 09 May 2009, bere54 wrote:
341, british -
Or are they one and the same?
Think he's one of the other trolls, only 1 post, can't tell which yet.
Complain about this comment
To#343 Britishish
Good for you!
Should we let them do this? I am going back. Probably stupid of me but this could be a very good debate. I will try.
Complain about this comment
Hi bere,
I don't think they are the same person. McJ just seems naive. Until they turn their power upon you, or one you love, the Forces of Order look benign and protective, "They only use their power for a reason."
And then one day, it'll happen. You get involved with an officer of the law who takes a dislike to you, for whatever reason. Not quite as compliant as he or she expects, you ask too many questions, have the wrong skin colour, the wrong hair, the wrong nose ... you never know what might set them off.
And I have great respect for cops. It's a tough job they do, and most do it well. But if they are incompetent, corrupt, or even have a bad day, people can die.
Yours,
Pinko
Complain about this comment
Ed,
Seems I posted a bum link to the essay. Try, try again.
Complain about this comment
I have been doing what I can on the new thread but I am growing very weary.
So far, I think that the worst has been stopped. Sorry, Bere that you got slammed. Do not let them see you bleed. Some are like sharks and would eat their own young.
Peace, my children
Complain about this comment
351. At 06:42am on 09 May 2009, aquarizonagal wrote:
I have been doing what I can on the new thread but I am growing very weary. So far, I think that the worst has been stopped.
Me too. Had one of my sleepless nights. Hope you're right.
Complain about this comment
Ref 350 chronophobe
Good essay, Pinko. I will have to read it again tomorrow. There were some points worth deeper consideration; but it's late, I think someone left the grape juice out too long in the heat at the art opening I was attending, and it turned. Had to sample it a few times to be certain.
Yes, sir. It definately turned.
Complain about this comment
Dear Kitchen Kohort:
I wonder if we're being spied on? It's just dawned we did Savage here, briefly, didn't we?
Complain about this comment
Ish,Surely you mean "spied upon"?
;-)
Complain about this comment
354, british -
Was it here in the kitchen? I had a vague idea he had come up earlier but couldn't remember which thread.
If we are being spied upon (okay, Ed?), perhaps some more of our brilliant chit-chat will turn up as blog subject matter.
Complain about this comment
For Bere54 & timewaits,
What is this life if full of care,
If we have no time to stand & stare.
No time stand beneath the boughs,
and stare as long as sheep and cows.
No time to see when woods we pass,
where squirrels hide their nuts in grass?.
No time to see in broad daylight,
streams full of stars,like skies at night.
No time to turn at beautys glance,
and watch her feet, how they dance.
No time to wait till her mouth can
enrich that smile, her eyes began.
A poor life this if full of care,
we have no time to stand & stare.
No sniggering at the sentimental Welsh guy.
Well OK, but not too mutch...
Complain about this comment
Sorry,
The poem was by,
William Henry Davies...
Complain about this comment
No time stand beneath the boughs,
and stare as long as sheep and cows.
No time to see when woods we pass,
where squirrels hide their nuts in grass?.
......
Complain about this comment
357, ukwales -
I would never snigger. The other evening I stood and stared at a bunch of sheep. And they stared back at me. We even conversed a little. It was all very peaceful.
Complain about this comment
timewaits (and anybody else who's interested) -
I have a friend whose daughter teaches French at a small private school in southern Vermont and her class had been scheduled to take a trip to somewhere in Quebec this month. Some parents expressed concern about their kids going "over the border" to a place where there apparently have been some cases of swine flu. The trip has been cancelled.
My friend was telling me this over coffee this morning and when she said "a trip over the border" I was confused and thought she meant Mexico, since that seems to be the area of concern, then was flabbergasted when it turned out the parents were worried about going over the Canadian border!
(This school is near the border with New York, where I think there have been more flu cases than in Quebec.)
Complain about this comment
Ref 361 bere54
Let's see. In a country with a population of over 33 million there were 242 confirmed cases and 1 death reported as of 26 Apr.
The children should be allowed, even encouraged to spend as much quality time as possible with intelligent, thoughtful, rational people so they can be free of the woefull, inane fears and baseless prejudice of their parents.
Complain about this comment
Ref 362
HRH Bee
Sorry. I'm just not hitting on all cylinders today. The country to which I refer in #362 with a population of over 33 million is Canada.
With only 3 weeks left together, SonnyA and I have been talking until the birds begin to chirp in the false dawn for the past few nights after he returns home from being with his friends as much as possible.
Complain about this comment
362, pub -
I agree. Unfortunately, if the teachers absconded with the kids against the parents' wishes, they'd probably all be charged with kidnapping. The point of the trip was to speak French with intelligent, thoughtful, rational people but instead they're taking a shorter trip to someplace in Vermont (where the people will quite possibly be intelligent, etc., but won't speak French). I bet the kids are really disappointed. It's really a shame.
Complain about this comment
Bere
My understanding is that the New York cases were school children who had been visiting Mexico. The Canadian case or cases were also people who had recently visited Mexico.
This whole Swine Flu thing has been a tempest in a tea pot as far as I am concerned. While I do believe that one must pay some attention to these things, becoming paralyzed by fear is something else.
Why has our society become so fear driven? It seems to have gotten even worse than the cold war years when some idiots were building bomb shelters in case of nuclear attack. My personal opinion then was that I would stand and meet whatever came.
Fear, fear, fear! Life is a terminal condition that ends in death. Accept that and one can be free to live with joy in the living of each day.
I have said before that "fear is a mind killer and a little death." For myself, I choose life! NO FEAR!
Complain about this comment
To#360 Bere
I prefer goats for conversation, much more intelligent and they do not always agree with you, although my Nubians were very sweet natured and peaceful most of the time.
Complain about this comment
359. Hesiodos:"where squirrels hide . . ."
Dear All:
The squirrels have had a somewhat cryptic message from the Gnome From Gnome Party: "You may have noticed that a certain reptilian has been reduced to posting to itself. The discreet use of that blue line (with detailed, succinct, reasoning as back-up in the text box on the last page) appears, at last, to work. 'The price of freedom from trolls is eternal vigilance'."
Complain about this comment
Burgers all round!
;-)
Complain about this comment
363, pub -
I knew you were referring to Canada. I am glad to see you have recognized my exalted position.
365, aqua -
My friend and I were discussing that very thing this morning, and we came to the conclusion that people love to be frightened when it's group fear. It gives them a sense of belonging, something to pull together for. They seem to revel in group panic. It's kind of weird to stand outside this mass hysteria, looking in. Remember all those people rushing off in excitement to buy duct tape and plastic to protect themselves from anthrax or whatever it was? Oooh, they were all part of the "war" effort.
Very much like the sheep I was staring at the other night. One got a little spooked and took off and they all rushed madly after it, bleating at the top of their lungs, without any idea of what they were running from.
Complain about this comment
Ref 364 bere54
Too late! The first case of swine flu in Vermont has been confirmed!!!
Beware!! World wide statisics reveal that this virus spreads at the speed of a two-toed sloth with hang nails. Protect yourselves!!
Joe Six-pack Surgical Masks Sales and Service
Complain about this comment
368, Ed -
That was very funny, but sadly I hear that now there is great controversy because Obama put Dijon mustard on his burger. I never use any other kind of mustard and did not realize it was controversial. Must I now put aside my love and use that nasty bright yellow stuff? I would hate to be un-American.
Complain about this comment
Ref 365 aquarizonagal
"Why has our society become so fear driven?"
I attribute one of the causes to 24 hour news broadcasts and wall-to-wall news coverage of shocking events.
Sometimes my mother will hear a report of a murder in Los Angeles and call me to see if I'm all right; because I live in Detroit where murders don't happen every day, although people still have the preception that we are the murder capitol of the world.
Complain about this comment
370 pub -
Oh no, oh no! Where can I run? Where can I hide? I must be safe at any cost!
Well, not at the cost of wearing one of those ugly face masks. Joe Six-pack won't get my business.
I'd heard there was a case in our tiny state (where we all breathe the same air), but there does not seem to be a run on face masks at the hardware store.
Complain about this comment
Pinko,
I've now had a chance to read the Moorton piece, and I found it very thought-provoking.
I had trouble with your link, so I provide a tinyurl version if anyone else was unable to read it.
Does "The Right" Matter More Than "The Good?"
Discuss.
;-)
Complain about this comment
Ref 371 bere54
Queen Bee of the Northeastern Kingdom can have any kind of mustard HRH prefers. I would think it would be maple mustard.
Isn't it great to be a monarch?
Complain about this comment
372, pub -
Guilty. I called my daughter this morning to make sure she wasn't on one of the trolleys that crashed in Boston last night. And of course I called my son a while back to make sure he hadn't been under the crane that fell in New York. (It did turn out that a few days before it fell, Son had been in the bar that was crushed. Yikes.) I listen to the radio too much. But my kids humor me about this. Sometimes they call me first: "Mom, it wasn't me who got murdered in Roxbury last night."
I almost panicked over a friend's son who was at Virginia Tech when the massacre occurred there, but fortunately my daughter had his email address and got in touch with him almost immediately. He was safe, locked down in a building next door, but able to email and phone everyone who was concerned about him. Twenty-four hour communications capability to the rescue!
Complain about this comment
To#374 Singer
Thank you for that link. I read the essay and it gave me much to ponder. While I am a firm defender of the individual, I also believe that we are part of an inter-connected web of existence, that includes each and everyone of us, the natural world and the world of spirit.
Complain about this comment
374, Ed -
Agree, thought-provoking. Read it last night when I was sleepy and just re-read it, but still not sure I understand it all. Both liberalism and communitarianism offer ideals but also extremes and reaching a middle ground ought to be attainable. Is there a name for the middle ground?
I tend to be very much a non-group person, except concerning things that only work in groups (universal health care, e.g.). Something that has taken hold in this country of late (and I know this is trivial but still it exemplifies much for me)that is almost the epitome of communitarianism is the Community Reads crap where the mayor or some other official picks a book and the entire city is supposed to read it. Monster book groups. There are some things that by their very nature are solitary activities and reading is one of those. But now here in the U.S. it's a group activity. Is this creeping communitarianism and a good thing? I just find it creepy.
Complain about this comment
371. bere54:
Dijon. French mustard. Is that what it's about? Don't tell me there are mustard patriots now. Really keen to do him down, aren't they?
(I prefer English, especially on ham or sausages; brings tears to your eyes. None of this wimpish foreign muck. Is there Iranian mustard?)
Complain about this comment
Singer
I will add that I believe in Ubuntu, the African concept that whatever hurts you, hurts me, hurts everyone and hurts the world in which we live.
The Navajo have a concept of "walking in beauty" or alignment with self, others and the natural world. I also espouse this belief. Am I thus a 'tribalist?'
Do the needs of the many always weigh more than the needs of the one? Or do sometimes the needs of the one require the support of many?
Complain about this comment
To Britisish
I agree!
If mustard does not clear the sinus cavities it has no place in my house or on my food!
And yes they are "really keen to do him down." If they cannot wow the public with their brilliance, most commentators are content to baffle the public with cow manure. (I wanted to use another word but I do try to be a 'lady' and did not wish to be censored at this time.)
Complain about this comment
Bere
I do not think that "communitarianism" means just blindly doing whatever everyone else does or what ever is 'popular' at the time. I think it is a matter of mindfulness to our connections with our world both material as well as spiritual.
We, none of us exist in a vacuum. All of our actions and I believe even our thoughts are like pebbles tossed in a pond. The ripples move out and touch the ripples of others. But these are just my ideas on this subject. I am not particularly learned.
However, I will also add this: Is it really such a bad thing if statewide reading projects actually get people to 'read?' You do not have to actively participate, just be a cheering squad and perhaps suggest to people other books you found rewarding.
Reading IS an intensely personal pleasure but many may not know this in a world dominated by tech.
Complain about this comment
381. At 8:20pm on 09 May 2009, aquarizonagal:
Some people will try anything to show Obama can't cut the mustard. . .
(Yes. Well. Must go; got a meeting with the squirrels about the anti-troll Gnome alliance.)
Complain about this comment
382, aqua -
I agree with your idea of communitarianism at its best; I did not mean to imply that it meant mindless herd behavior. But I am wary, because people seem to be more willing to misbehave in groups than individually. Mob rule, that sort of thing.
What disturbs me about the town-, city- or state-wide reading programs is that there seem to be so many people who would never think of reading a book unless everyone else is doing it. And then of course when one is eagerly addressed by a stranger about the book of the moment and one confesses to not being a participant, there is that look of disapproval to contend with. What are you, some kind of weirdo misfit? I just smile and say I have my own reading list. Never mind, I'm quibbling over nothing.
383, british -
Now the truth comes out. You get all your brilliant one-liners from the squirrels. Have you their permission to use them in this forum without accreditation?
Complain about this comment
Ref 347 Hesiodos
In the old ways of the natives, communitarianism did not take way from individualism. People were proud of their distinct identity, as noted in the wide variety of 'fashion' and the distinct body paintings. One would not find two people clad, nor painted the same. An individual's spirit was sacred and guarded. The name I was given in my vision quest is known only to me and Manitou, who gave me my name. This way, no one can steal my sacred identity from me.
Individual skills were constantly honed not only for the pleasure and pride of the individual, but also for what well-honed skills would do for the mutual benefit of the tribe.
Complain about this comment
To#385
Most eloquently and beautifully stated. 'Wisdom of your people,' this is why I call you 'Shaman.'
Complain about this comment
We seem to have pretty much a consensus on the wee essay. All is one, and each is its own part of all....
When we try to pick out anything by itself, we find it hitched to everything else in the Universe.
-- John Muir
I come more and more to look on each creature as living at the center - one of the infinite number of centers - of an arrangement of processes that reaches through the universe.
-- Wendell Berry
I also deeply agree with the Shaman that communitarianism and individuality are not (necessarily) antagonistic nor mutually exclusive:
;-)
Complain about this comment
This is perhaps a non sequitur, and of course extremely simplistic, but I have noticed that there seem to be two types of people in this world: Those who smile and say "thank you" when a stranger holds open a door for them, and those who stride through without acknowledging that a stranger is holding the door for them.
I am convinced that all of you in the kitchen fall into the former category.
Complain about this comment
Singer
That last paragraph does say it all. To ever imply that there is "nothing better" out there is to stop dreaming, imagining and creating.
Complain about this comment
Oh my goodness!
Our Shaman just showed his warrior side on the other thread. I do not know if that will send the 'MII' person skittering away to lick his wounds for a while but it may make some others think about engaging in more polite discussion.
Bere
I am always so happy when someone holds a door for me. I also hold doors for others, men, women and children. It just seems like such a basic courtesy. Most people, in my experience, are most gracious but perhaps this is where I live.
Complain about this comment
Ref 390 aquarizonagal
My coup stick called me to add fresh notches.
Complain about this comment
365 372 aqua, bere, publius ...
Fear is a big tool for controlling the people. Allow the mob to focus on a significant, yet unlikely event, and then create a fear through sensory overload (24 hour news etc).
I'm not tinfoil hat enough to think this was a govt policy. I believe the media created the situation with news overload, and it is now exploited by governments to keep people focused on what they want, and to distract the people from what else is going on.
More worrying, if people are afraid then they will sacrifice their freedoms in the name of security.
As Aqua said in 365 "I have said before that "fear is a mind killer and a little death." For myself, I choose life! NO FEAR!"
Complain about this comment
So what was in that post at #193 that publius was responding to? Not that it really matters as it probably was the same as the rest of the troll's. But now I'm curious.
Complain about this comment
ukwales - Thank you, that could be a description of me. I spend a lot of time stopping to smell the roses (even when I'm should be "getting a move on")! I have often been told, "you are always smiling." And my response, "What is the alternative?"
My crown is not as heavy as I think yours is, but I do like to think I have a few jewels in it.
A bit of a joke - hardly in keeping with your poem - but... I couldn't resist!
Complain about this comment
RomeStu - that was a clever suggestion on the other thread and an excellent first choice. Simon should be able to skirmish for a good hour or two or three! Gives the rest of you time to nap.
Complain about this comment
Good people
We have done our very best but the 'MII' person is now onto something about Gaza. (two posts worth) I am finished there.
Timely One, I do need a nap or rather totally decadent entertainment with my dear one.
Peace my children and enjoy your evening!
Complain about this comment
bere - I am of two minds regarding the school trip. The WHO is warning of the similarities between this and the Spanish Flu. I have no idea how bad this pandemic (as they now call it) will get, but do not know if it is worth the risk should a student return home with it. It appears to spread so easily and the students would be spending a lot of time in close quarters. On the other hand the risk does seem small and it is a shame they are being denied the trip.
I am not surprised it is in Quebec as so many vacation in Mexico. More surprising is how long it took to appear. We now have 16 cases. I am not concerned but if I hear of someone I know getting it, that will quickly change.
I just learned a Montreal school has cancelled a trip to NYC even though they thought "the risk was remote."
Complain about this comment
timewaits -
I suppose schools have to err on the side of safety. I have to say that my friend's daughter was relieved as well as disappointed because she and her husband were going as chaperons and would have been taking their 3-month-old baby along. Best to keep the baby at home.
And now on a completely different subject, I heard a funny quote today (and I'm probably the last one to hear it so forgive me if it's old). About all the bad investments and ponzi schemes coming to light, Warren Buffet said: "Until the tide goes out you don't know who's been swimming naked." This is supposedly the silver lining of the economic collapse.
Complain about this comment
Ref 398 bere54
They were being allowed by the school to take their 3 month old baby with them while chaperoning school children?
I would think the school would be concerned that the couple would be distracted with the care of a very young infant and not giving their full attention to caring for their student charges.
I also have some questions about their parenting skills. Why would parent want to subject their infant to long exposure to a group of students (schools are hot beds for all kinds of virus infections) on a bus to and from the activity. It would not be something I would do.
Complain about this comment
I'm away for the next three weeks; somewhere there's no internet access. Probably won't be back, I'm weary of trolls, and I shall be otherwise very busy the next three months. It's been fun. Bye.
Complain about this comment
400 british-ish .... come back and see us in the autumn. Your insights are always interesting. Just check in to ensure the Dark Side doesn't win.
Have a good summer.
PubliusDetroit
Good show on the freedom thread. You have managed to engage Marcus and hold him to a rational discussion without insults and gratuitous stereotyping. You are a bold psychologist trying to draw his opinions from him in a rational form.
I may not agree with much that he writes, but you have halped him show that he can discourse reasonably.
Which ironically simply proves in our microcosm what many of us have been saying on many threads about real-world situations ..... if you talk and negotiate with those you disagree with, then you start to get somewhere. Will Marcus realise this, and apply it to other situations around the world? Time will tell.
(or did you just keep him talking til dawn and now he's turned to stone?)
Complain about this comment
british - Have a fabulous trip. I've enjoyed your posts tremendously.
timewaits.
Complain about this comment
Ref 401 RomeStu
This is not the first time Marcus and I have conversed in this manner. I find him to be an interesting fellow when we do converse without becoming petty and rude to one another. We may not agree with each other, but, I at least enjoyed our round of postings. When one reads through our series of posts, you will find that we even found accord.
It is not just whether Marcus will see that rational conversation is informative and enjoyable. I should hope that many other's see what Marcus and I had accomplished last night. I am guilty of being petty and rude just as well as others. It was either British-ish, or InterestedForeigner that made me see the error of my ways some time ago. I am getting better with my behavior. It would make this forum a much better place if we all can learn something from the respect Marcus and I developed over our series of posts.
It supports my position on responsible free speech quite well.
Keep in mind that it takes time and care to heal wounds.
Complain about this comment
399, publius -
It is a small private school and things are more relaxed. The father would have been an unofficial chaperon since he doesn't work for that school and he would have been in charge of the baby, mostly. I wouldn't have wanted my babies around a bunch of schoolchildren but it seems most babies go into day care at a very early age these days (since maternity leave is usually 3 months) so they're going to be exposed to all sorts of things anyway.
I will miss british and his sharp wit and the squirrels.
Complain about this comment
publius -
Vermont seems to be more child- and family-friendly than any place I've lived (and I've lived in quite a few places). On days where the schools are closed for a day or for short periods such as Winter or Spring Break, you will find children in shops and offices because people just take their kids to work with them. No rushing around madly trying to find daycare for a snow day (except for jobs where it would be dangerous to have kids there). I've even seen an infant in my dentist's office when the mother's babysitter didn't show up for some reason (the mother was a dental hygienist). At one time or another I've seen shop owners' and employees' children in just about every place I patronize here, so a baby on a school field trip doesn't seem all that strange.
And there are dogs and cats everywhere. There is a dog in the shoe store, dogs in both the outdoor gear stores, a dog in one knitting shop and a cat in the other. And the seamstress often brings her pug to her shop. Oh and there's a dog in the frame shop too. One of the children's librarians brought her cat to work with her until he died of old age. I've wondered about shoppers and patrons with allergies but this seems never to have been an issue, except that the shoe store owner got a labradoodle to hopefully avoid any allergy problems with her customers.
Complain about this comment
bere54 (#371) "Must I now put aside my love and use that nasty bright yellow stuff? I would hate to be un-American."
The mustard seed used to make Dijon-style mustard comes from North America, even when the finished product is produced in France. I wouldn't worry about it.
Complain about this comment
Happy Mother's Day to bere, aquarizonagal, and timewaitsfornoman
Complain about this comment
publius -
Thank you!
Complain about this comment
detroit - Thank you. I had a good day. Son No. 1 came to dinner, so it was the four of us. It often is, but tonight we had a nicer table cloth and better wine! Plus cake!
Happy Mother's Day aqua and bere.
Complain about this comment
To#407 Shaman
Thank you so much!
I have had the most lovely day. I have been pampered and indulged and gifted in a most extraordinary way by my dear family. They have arranged for us to go back to Africa as total tourists to visit as long as we like! We can see old friends, extended family-in-law and make new connections.
"I bless the rains down in Africa. Now we have the time to do the things we never had to do." (Toto and others)
If I seem delirious, I am! It is winter there and the rainy season is over for most places. Gaborone, here we come and on to...
Totally too excited!
Complain about this comment
aqua - That is truly lovely news! How exciting for you. I look forward to hearing your plans. How long do you anticipate is, "as long as we like?" Will admit my ignorance and googled Gaborone.
It does not surprise me that you have such a loving and generous family.
Complain about this comment
410, aqua -
That is wonderful news. How soon do you go? All I know of Gaborone is from Alexander McCall Smith's Ladies Detective Agency books. He depicts Botswana as a delightful place full of warm and friendly people. Is it really like that?
You have every right to be delirious. What a magnificent surprise! I hope you will be able to send an occasional travelogue to the kitchen.
Complain about this comment
To Aqua - A small Mother's Day gift for you.
With love, timewaits
Complain about this comment
bere - a gift for you!
Love, timewaits
Complain about this comment
timewaits -
A wonderful gift! Oh those eyes!
Thank you.
And good night.
Complain about this comment
Another soft and gentle morning awakens.
Peace with with thee.
Complain about this comment
pub -
Lovely music to greet this soft and gentle morning. Sparkling day here, greenery all around, a bit chilly but it's finally Spring!
Complain about this comment
Hey chrono GREAT tune . You may not be an aficionado but you picked true greats there.
328 No probs Aqua, And no dis to Dolly.
Just saying as the only country western singer known to the people of the UK (in part because the brits like Bristols and she had em.).
No one there (certainly none of the rave going hedonists of the 90's) would have known who the heck tammy wynette is.
But they got her to number 1.
Amazing.
truly not the easiest thing to do.
PS if anyone watches the KLF bit on what they are NOT about . it is the music video with all the lights etc.
They are true artists. Not just tish artists.
back to true artists
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cklsv0AK6w8
One for our northern friends.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1QnVBjwLQ0&feature=related
Complain about this comment
Nice sunny day here, as well. Cool, but sunny. I'll have to get out and get some work done in the yard. The lawn is growing like crazy.
Complain about this comment
happy - good comment on the other thread. Also the one by Interested. Incarceration rates staggering. How can that explained? (Not by you and me!) A country of criminals? Canadians too weak-kneed to break the law?
bere - Lovely day here also, bright and sunny but cold - sweater weather. Cake for breakfast!
Complain about this comment
Beautiful Flute and spectacular pictures!
My dears, reality struck this day when we realized just how much time we will spend flying on this trip! The children pooled all their frequent flyer miles for 'business class' so that should be a help. Plus the flights will be broken up so we can rest a few days in between. We are excited at the destination but a bit nervous about the how we get there.
However, this is probably our last opportunity for a trip like this and we will prevail!
To answer a few questions: Botswana is the most stable country in Africa, economically and politically. Although, they have also suffered from the recession. AIDS is probably the single biggest problem there, as it is in all of Africa, but the government has programs for treatment and prevention.
We will stay with some relatives of my grandson-in-law and he has arranged for a cousin to be our driver and escort for the entire trip. We have friends and family in South Africa so also plan to re-visit there as well. There are some other places we would like to go that may not be safe so we will have to find out about that later.
We leave in June and will probably be gone a month but the return flight date is open. Our dear family has made arrangements for all to be cared for in our absence so we do not have to worry about anything except flying!
Complain about this comment
This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
timewaits -
Cake for breakfast? Ooooh, I am so jealous! May have to go to the diner and have pie for lunch (my favorite lunch).
Still quite chilly. Lunaticwoman on second floor opened landing window, sends chill draft up through gaps in my door. It's due to lunaticwoman that I am so friendly with the chief of police, as I mentioned on the other thread. She calls the police over things like my closing the landing window, the police come, tell her she's crazy, tell me she's crazy, warn me to keep my door locked. Sheesh.
Complain about this comment
421, aqua -
Would it be too much to ask for you to stuff me into one of your suitcases? I'll pay the overweight baggage fee!
Complain about this comment
bere - Re # 424 What are you talking about? You can't even get a bottle of lotion to NC!! If I used lol, at this point I would say lol!!
Complain about this comment
Bere
I understand that airlines have gotten really awful about over-weight baggage so you would have to leave your Evil Donald at home.
Complain about this comment
I have read some very thoughtful comments on the 'freedom' thread, along with the usual. I was tempted to comment about Noam Chomsky but decided that I am enjoying this day too much to explain why I despise the man personally, even though I agree with some of what he says.
Complain about this comment
timewaits, I hope you are not implying that I am more of a danger to air travel than a bottle of lotion is! I feel so safe knowing that only passengers with cracked, dry hands are permitted on airplanes. [This is a joke, so please don't anyone come on here and lecture me as to what can be hidden in a bottle of lotion.]
But aqua has a good point, though I'm sure she is not implying that my big-boned cat is fat, only that he happens to weigh a lot. He would require a suitcase to himself.
And aqua, on another day when you feel like it, I hope you will explain why you despise Chomsky. I know little about him, good or bad, except that some people revere him and others revile him.
Complain about this comment
BTW if you think you guys are making progress with MATT. lol
Discuss it once it has happened. because it has before.
Complain about this comment
ber54 (#428) " ... some people revere him and others revile him."
There's a lot of room between "revere" and "revile," of course. At least he hasn't made himself an object of ridicule by becoming a perennial candidate for president, as has Nader.
Computer scientists respect Chomsky for his contributions to formal linguistics.
Complain about this comment
Ref 428 bere54
If you pack Evil D in a suitcase to smuggle on board the plane, airport security might mistake him for a cat bomb.
Airport Guard 1: "Well lookee here at the size of this hare cat, Thelma Lou! That ain't nomal!
Airport Guard 2: "Yer right, Bobby Lou. Sumpin' ain't right with that thar cat. Sumpbodies been stuffin' that cat full of sumpin'. Better call fer the bomb-sniffin' dawgs. Might be full o' bomb stuff.
Complain about this comment
Well, it seems Justin Webb will be leaving this blog. I for one am disappointed. I wonder if it has anything to do with his son's health and his perhaps wanting to be back where there is national health care. Will this mean we can no longer gather in the kitchen?
Complain about this comment
431, publius -
Evil D can wrap any dog around his paw. No problem passing the dog sniff test. Cat bomb! I won't tell him you said so, it might hurt his feelings. He can't read yet, fortunately.
Complain about this comment
bere - Justin has been offered a job, "you don't turn it down." He has said often enough how much he enjoys living in the States so presume it is quite the job. Wonder what happy knows about his replacement, Mark Mardell. We'll soon find out.
Complain about this comment
What is a "presenter" anyway? I thought it was just the person who reads the news. Is there more involved than that? I would think being a roving-around correspondent would be more interesting. This must have been in the works for a while. I wonder why he didn't say anything about it on this blog.
Complain about this comment
A presenter is a host. I remember something was said awhile ago about Justin returning to the UK, but I thought it was for a different job so perhaps this one just came up. Do not know. I guess he will soon, as his replacement has mentioned it on his blog!
Complain about this comment
Well, I feel a little sad. It seems everyone's leaving the party. And I think people are dropping away from the other threads due to that troll who seems to have taken over. It reminds me of those icky slugs that leave a trail of nasty slime. He takes what could be an interesting discussion and pours crap all over it. I wish people wouldn't lead him on.
Good night, to whomever might still be up.
Complain about this comment
Mark Mardell's current blog is quite interesting. I think he's a little left of centre, so most of you guys will love him :) but he does make some interesting posts. Look out for more than a couple of mischievous paragraphs. I think that the threads should be more on topic because of this.
Complain about this comment
437
I wish people wouldn't say ' I think he is cute" lol all agreed the thread unraveler has been at work , but ignore it and don't respond . or get the offence moderated and look what happens. a few minutes of relative sanity to convince us we were harsh and back at it.
and the other parts of amorphous footwiper do the same.
but they are not connected?
lol
so hard
Still Mark mardel . what ever. the Ed isn't why I'm here.
He seems OK.
here's a song for the morning.Especially for AQUA
[Unsuitable/Broken URL removed by Moderator]
Complain about this comment
#421 Aquerizonagal.
Wow,do have a brillint trip,enjoy every second.Business class is the way to fly,Lucky you..
Bon voyage....
Complain about this comment
bere - I think posters come and go, some disappearing for a period of time only to reappear. happy/jack perseveres ... And good for him.
I don't know what unsuitable song he posted for the morning!
Complain about this comment
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TuSkyOpjoVk&feature=related
It seems the original post had a link to a commercial site.
on those that go and come back.. they do but some never leave.
they just change names
Complain about this comment
442, happy
That was lovely but I think it would have been even better if I'd had a little something to smoke first.
Complain about this comment
happy - "they just change names" Present company excluded! Do you think anyone is listening to you? (I ask seriously.) I hear you and agree, but do others? Also, what can they do about it? To hear most speak it is fixed in stone and "the right and proper thing to do." Whatever it is.
Texas executed a Canadian, without informing the Canadian government he was in custody - on Human Rights Day!! I called the American Embassy in protest but husband M told me I was wasting my time, as I'm not American they could not care less what my opinion is! Note the Governor!
Complain about this comment
443 lol bere. it helps. or at least the memories of sitting on a hill , over looking a valley full of what were referred to as cheesy quavers (ravers). the sun just poking over the fills and the trance taking over from the Garage.
Aside. "Trainspotting" in the UK was term used to refer tot those guys (and gals) that collected techno music in a manner that was reminiscent of those old guys by the train lines collecting numbers.
They get togeather comparing their latest vinyl score.
" I got a de jax white label. Wicked killer mate"" Did you get the special release version of it. AW man it's bloody marvelous, shame you missed that one"
Aqua . when you go have a great time.
If you see Neil say hi from the son of a diplomat blacksmith.
He will not know who you are talking about but we lived somewhere in the world at a dip post.
http://www.syntacticweb.co.uk/nta/
Complain about this comment
444 did you change names?
anyway never know who listens right.
Complain about this comment
444 time the guy executed was killed by bush.
the forgetting to mention something to his consul should be enough to try all those involved in the processing of him. But most important GW bush and Gonzalez who was GW legal advisor.
They both as Gov and Gov hang man were meant to read the case before killing the guy.
something as with reports on WMD GW has shown no ability to do.
Much like the amorphous foot wiper, which if you want to push off from is best derided in ways that do actually offend it. tell it the truth. but don't discuss what it wants.
Complain about this comment
An old cooking lesson. It's a bit long, fuzzy, and blighted by some fat bloke.
Complain about this comment
446 happy - No. Also, Right. It would be nice to hear some acknowledgement or positive feed-back, but you are right. I'm listening but what I'm hearing is not encouraging.
A prosecution paid for by the family! Who ever heard of such a thing? Other than Texans. Revenge not justice.
Foot wiper - try using "sweetheart" that seems to work!
Complain about this comment
time.. (#444), you give the impression that the person in question was held incommunicado until the execution. While it seems that the case was unknown to the Canadian government for some time, it came to light several years before the execution, so there was some time for intervention by Canadians in the appeal process.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/372247.stm
One aspect of US criminal law that is unclear to many foreigners is that most criminal cases are state matters. Under our federal system, the US government does not have jurisdiction generally, but only when there is a federal question involved.
Complain about this comment
seanspa - Harry is a bit of a character! Is he like that all the time? And bonnie! And you and Sean. Thanks. I will have to watch the rest later but from what I saw there wasn't much in that pot! Maybe I should fast forward to the finished product!.... Was the making of the cheese sauce shown? I already know how to boil pasta!
Complain about this comment
lol time I did use it sweetheart"last night lol that is great we can all get passed by using the codeword;)But I have taken to few answers to that same person. I don't really care what hat he wears he still has the same face.
I see that DC is thinking something like I do about him. and a few others.
I made my views on what to do many times. petty but effective. and not as petty as the posts.
"complain"
No comment .
As for texas Justice. yes
I have long derided it and GW as the hangman executioner and state they are.
I have never been there and will not unless detained.
And I challange them lovely folk when i meet them.
see if they are all "well some godda die" first though.
One of my good friends here is from that state.
(Ps they still make anvils there and I did get one. There is a part of the anvil called the horn.
In the UK t is the pointed bit and it is horizontal.
this one sticks up a few degrees
it is refered to in the trade as "having an erect horn" there is no other term;)
Always trying to reinvent the wheel there in Texas.
I had to grind the state name off the side(also stupi they put raised letters where a decent smith hits occasionally (far face) and it would marr the work. But then they just wanted something Big . Being taxas and all.
Complain about this comment
timewaits, harry doesn't always try to sound like david attenborough, but he does talk a lot, and still sounds very english. If you know how to boil pasta then you may not learn much from his video. There was no cheese sauce. Speaking of which, it's one of the things I hate doing, it just takes so long to thicken.
I should also point out that the fat bloke isn't quite so fat any more.
Complain about this comment
LOL Seanspa.Ah a face to the man.
Sean seemed to be putting up with little bro. Good kid.
Harry could be the next BBC america host.
Gary there you go defending the system.
the first day he should have been informed of his right to speak to the consulate.
His Defence attorney should have informed them straight away.(but then this is texas the state that does not provide legal help for appeals. Fund it yourself or DIE.
Your into law go volunteer time to help the poor probono defence lawyers that ceaselessly work in Texas trying to give people the legal rights they are entitled to.
A fair trial.
Once the state disregards international conventions the feds have ALL the authority to make the situation legal.
They are preventing a crime. International law was broken.
That sick guy running the place at the time couldn't read all that from the AG that proved he knew nothing about law.
Alberto Gonzales.
Anyone would think we moved to Iran.
Complain about this comment
450 Gary - Are you suggesting it would have made a difference if I had called Governor Bush? If Canada had been informed he would have had better representation at trial. The point of my phone call was to say, If Texas feels he is a threat, return him to Canada.
None of that takes away from the fact he was executed on International Human Rights Day nor that it was a Private Prosecution.
Complain about this comment
Hey sean good to hear you've been working out.
" I just realised with all my digs at justin you might think I was being rude about Harry being the next "next BBC america host"
I wasn't.
How long has he been in the US .?
his accent is still nice;)
Complain about this comment
Hey sean good to hear you've been working out.
" I just realised with all my digs at justin you might think I was being rude about Harry being the next "next BBC america host"
I wasn't.
How long has he been in the US .?
his accent is still nice;)
455Time NICE great link.. Scary place. NO WAY AM I GOING TO TEXAS.
Complain about this comment
444, timewaits -
From your link:
"Governor Bush is often spoken of as a possible presidential candidate. We are concerned that he would exhibit the same lack of concern for international treaties and agreements should he ever become President."
Oh man, was that prescient or what?
Complain about this comment
time (#455) "Are you suggesting it would have made a difference if I had called Governor Bush?"
I didn't suggest that, and it wouldn't have made a difference, but the governor is nevertheless the proper person to receive petitions for clemency (preferably in writing).
My only (implied) suggestion was that it is helpful to provide some details in the form of a link so that someone who might be interested in the case would know to what you were referring.
Complain about this comment
seanspa - Don't be so hard on yourself. You look "healthy" to me and taller and, as I found out recently, younger! You can cook (with or without cheese sauce) and know how to install doors! So there you go!
Harry Palmer the next BBC America Host! I like it! (Just read happy's #456 and for one mad moment thought he was apologizing to Justin!!