Disappointment?
Here's the reaction from the heartland.
And this from the unconvinced.
I have to say, from my vantage point next to the DC delegation, my overall impression was that the audience in the hall were disappointed. The whisper uttered by a strong man can work in a big hall but he seemed rather engulfed and hemmed in. He was never in control.
The biggest cheers were for Sarah Palin, but what does this say about his dominance of his own ticket? She, after all, disagrees with him on one central platform item (man-made climate change) and one suspects on others as well.
That having been said, he has a certain grace, an inner strength that I suspect will have played well where serious people were watching carefully and wondering about leadership - particularly if their fears are about war and terrorism rather than the economy.
As I was leaving, the North Carolina placename fell (or was pushed over) and struck me a glancing blow before banging heavily on to the head of a woman standing next to it. Medics appeared and there was some concern, though she's OK I am glad to say. But a lucky escape for her - and for the convention...
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He's been upstaged, overshadowed, pit-bulled and lip-sticked by his running-mate. You have to feel a wee bit sorry for him.
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If you love your country the way McCain does, it was a great speech.
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I'm wondering if McCain isn't distinctly uncomfortable
in front of this convention crowd. It's hard for me
to tell from the TV what the chemistry was between
him and the delegates.
One can only hope that John will loosen up
in town hall meetings in front of Democrats
and Independents.
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McCain was awkward with the teleprompter but not with his thoughts. They were clear.
The crowd loved him. There were people in tears, especially vets.
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As an undecided voter, I have to say the speech was average. It was at it's worst when the protesters were shouted down by the "USA" chant, which gets old even for an American. The periodic interruptions that followed slowed up the speech and made it difficult to follow McCain, and his inability to read a teleprompter proved as annoying as ever. The best part of the speech was the rousing cry at the end when he started talking over the cheers, urging Americans to "fight with me," a first-class thirty seconds.
What strikes me going out of this convention is that John McCain failed to articulate, either through himself or through his surrogates, a cogent agenda. This creates a clear opening for the Democrats on economic issues. Absent another geopolitical crisis, this is a "bread-and-butter" election, something the Democrats should be comfortable with. Roll up your sleeves, guys (and gal) the real election starts here!
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I believe in America and the freedom that is synonymous (or at least used to be) with America, and therefore, I believe in John McCain.
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It's not just one issue.... Her positions on climate change (not real), creationism (teach it), abortion (not under any circumstances), taxes on oil company profits (she apparently increased them in Alaska), drilling in ANWR (she wants it), and quite likely immigration and waterboarding are way out of line with McCain's. This was all skillfully hidden though, and for that successful deception the GOP should be applauded. Bravo!
The way she overshadows McCain, flanks him on the right, hews to secrecy amid controversy, and hides from prying media questions reminds me of the Bush-Cheney relationship.
I'm still unclear on the McCain economic plan. That us what most people are truly worried about, and rationally so. Wars and even terrorism are distant things. The catastrophes that people think about every day (outsourcing my job, losing my home, being unable to retire or care for my parent or sick child) were not addressed. After the hype dies down I think that will take a couple of weeks to sink in.
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To call the Huffington Post "unconvinced" is highly misleading - you might as well call Richard Dawkins "unconvinced" about God.
And I don't think "man-made climate change" is a central platform element - "Climate change" is. Palin doesn't yet understand the science, but nor to 99% of people either. And anyway it's not as simple as "man-made" vs "non-man-made", climate change is clearly influenced both by human and non-human factors.
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AndreaInNY, I love my country the way Obama does -- by working for a brighter future, not living in the past. So for me, Obama's speech was really the great one.
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BTW I'm glad to hear that the lady struck by the North Carolina sign was OK. Even if they're aluminum or something, an impact to the head would still hurt.
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The whole thing certainly seemed kind of stuck in the 80s to me. The basic theme of the convention was the same as 2004, and I thought the oddness of that really stood out. McCain seemed uncomfortable. He is suddenly espousing change, now that the experience thing has been worn out, but the rhetoric was classic core republican...not change. The overly militaristic furor of the convention was a little scary, considering the vast majority of Americans are feed up with the whole war thing. It was more like a VFW convention.
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#4. AndreainNY: "There were people in tears, especially vets." But not the younger one holding a sign which TV cameras picked up briefly - he didn't appear to think much of Mr McCain.
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#6, Darth and others...
Yes, the speech was average and lacking in
specifics. So was Obama's acceptance speech.
There is something about the setting or the
politics of the situation which has prevented
either of these candidates to speak well at
their own conventions.
With McCain, it's because he can't say what
he thinks in front of his own party. I don't know
what Obama's excuse was.
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I really, really tried to watch his speech but that green background was awful. And the rest of the setting... Well, I kept thinking someone was about to tap him on the shoulder and ask him to move so they could bowl another frame!
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The BBC chose to have their reporter on the Today program this morning, located at the Convention, report on the Dick Cheney visit to Georgia.
BBC News are trying to link McCain to the Bush Administration.
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Betting odds are still about 60:40 in favor of Obama. The convention did not appear to improve McCain's chances.
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Maybe, like me, most people don't watch the convention.
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14, guns.
If Obama had not given his speech in dirge tempo it might have sounded better. I don't know if he eventually speeded up because I couldn't stand it anymore and turned off the television.
Abe Lincoln where are you?
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chill0 @16: McCain is a Republican, he's been endorsed by Bush/Cheney, and his running mate was suggested by the same people who ran the 2000 and 2004 campaigns (Karl Rove and friends).
They don't need BBC News to "link McCain to the Bush Administration", the link is there already and it's stronger than ever... which makes McCain's latest campaign message look fake. McCain's administration will be run by the same men who ran the Bush Administration, exactly like it's happening with his campaign.
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Why is it that the right to life people like Palin are also the gun nuts that like to kill as many animals as possible?
Also Allieway why is freedom synonymous with the US? Surely every other democratic nation is free. Try telling Australian's, Brits, Kiwis etc that the US has a mortgage on freedom.
Being a sassy hockey mum does not qualify you to be the most powerful person in the world. Both speeches were focused on scoring cheap points rather than soild political solutions, emphasising their weak policies (Obama was only slightly better).
This whole circus only serves for populist vote scoring and results in presidents such as Bush.
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Again, the Republican party fails to tell us what their agenda is. All what was basically heard from McCain tonight was:
1) I' am an American hero (highlight of his speech)
2) Same old 9/11 scare tactics.
3) Blatant lies about Obama raising taxes when Barack has repeatedly said he would cut taxes for 95% of Americans.
4) And that change is coming. (Really John? How are you going to do that? People want to know)
Basically the same GOP approach: "Don't vote for Obama because he's inexperienced, etc."
How about telling the American voters what you plan to do?
And to AndreaInNY who seems to be a propaganda spamer: I love my country and I felt underwhelmed by McCains speech who was actually upstaged by his VP.
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McCain managed to get through his tired well worn old stump speech with out falling of the stage or breaking the microphone. So in a sense I supposed he enjoyed some measure of success tonight. But quite frankly, he has been overshadowed by his running mate who has only been governor of Alaska slightly longer than John McCain has been campaigning for president. At this point it seems that McCain vs. Obama will be a gross mismatch, somewhat like lets say Bambi vs. Godzilla.
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The excitement for Palin was for her track record of reform and non-Socialist change. Oh, and for her gender, too. After the humiliation of Hillary at the hands of the Democrats, the Stereotyped Republicans had the last laugh in recognizing that women can lead, too.
McCain is an American Hero...not an American Idol. Obama has been annointed by the American press as The Chosen One. The American people will prove them wrong in November.
Perhaps Mr. Webb could use a primer on the history of American Political Conventions. He is making observations without understanding the nuances of the process.
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I am not sure the specifics of economic policy matter much from either candidate, beyond the broad direction in which they would like to go.
They are going to be blown around by economic gales from several directions. The USA has the highest deficit ever and in about a year it is likely to have major inflation following the major interest rate cuts over the last few months.
I think they both know of this economic turbulence but their responses are instructive.
Barack Obama is trapped in a political philosophy which involves government spending. I believe he is trying to follow the Third Way pioneered by Bill Clinton to make the economy grow and increase the tax take to pay for that spending. The problem is that much of the current economic cycle is outside of any government's control, so what can he do then ?
In the face of that, he still makes the promises. There does not seem to be a Plan B.
McCain is lucky, I suppose, that his agenda does not involve a lot of spending. To those who say that the Iraq War is a huge cost, I seriously doubt that John McCain or Barack Obama would do anything different from here on in. A withdrawal plan is being worked out with the Iraqi government, that is how it will play out.
Foreign policy may be a major differentiator in the coming Presidency. I believe that Barack Obama and John McCain would react quite differently to the various foreign policy problems that face the USA. What your opinion is of those differences will probably vary on a case by case basis.
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#20 supertoyg
Do you have any evidence for that ?
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I was quite mesmerized by the Republican convention, not because of their speakers, nor the way they manipulated the truth, but by the shocking realization that the Republican Party, it's members, and their inability to work within the current world setting, has become a slow moving, slowly dying dinosaur.
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I thought the speech was about as awful as I suspected it would be. It was not as disgusting as Giuliani's appalling speech or as hypocritical as Palin's idiotic blather, but it was definitely twice as boring.
The bottom line is that McCain's all-natual sleep aid speech will not win him any new supporters. The super rich, evangelicals, pro-lifers and military dinosaurs will all say it was amazing. These people are overexcited by crunchy peanut butter and would never vote for Obama anyway.
I can't wait to see the debates. My hope is that the stupid working class people in this country, who have no business voting for a Republican, will see just a bit of themselves in Obama and vote accordingly. The Republicans certainly don't care about them and I've never understood the allegiance.
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23, ljbella.
Which one is Bambi and which one is Godzilla?
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As a former military officer and conservative / Republican supporter for years, my views are absolutely reinforced after this speech and GOP events of the last couple of days.
Absolutely nothing personal against John McCain, but here in 2008 he is not the right man to lead the free world backed by a last minute VP appointee candidate - still as yet unknown.
The specification for this role includes massive domestic re-engineering to rectify wholesale Republican failings for the last x8 years, yes.
But most importantly, this new President has to be blessed with uniquely different qualities of statesmanship, leadership and charisma to deal effectively with markedly different evolving world challenges - both the here and nows and those lying over the brow of the hill.
There is an unbelievable global naivity that a World War can never manifest itself again. I beg to differ. Being currently based in the Caucasas region, I am astounded, by way of example, the way that Georgia has been allowed to propel itself into a potential conflict crucible of huge proportions. Propel itself and allowed, you ask?
Issues of deep seated ethnicity, religion and culture that have built up over generations here and elswhere, are not easily fixed by gung ho threats or poorly calculated and planned military interventions. Examples?
1. Ask ordinary Iraqi villagers, that I have seen astride the MSRs linking Baghdad to Kuwait. Many are still living in abject poverty without a proper roof over their heads after x5 years of instilling the panacea of democracy on their country. Ask them what democracy actually means and is doing for them? Properly and honestly channelled the effective delivery of those aid $billions from hard working Americans could have had far more effect on the population than reality indicates.
2. If Russia piled over and annexed some of Alaska the US would not be backwards in coming forwards to defend its national interests. So how did Russia feel being on the back end of a military intervention visiting actual harm on Russian nationals living in those areas on its back doorstep without warning?
The tough talking of DickCheney over the last x48 hours, the US proffers of $1 Bn in aid and commitment to standing beside its ally is one approach - but the wrong approach. What on earth stopped the US from being far more perceptive to the needs of both Georgia and Russia and i) reigning in President Saakashvili before he was allowed to trigger his ill-fated plan and ii) responsibly bringing together parties and working to diplomatically manage out these deep seated regional issues? (of which there are several others too).
My point is simply this. Diplomacy, Foreign Relations and Communications are the required tools of the trade for the future. Going back to basics and US isolationism and wielding big sticks to see off enemies is not the answer.
The US needs to convert enemies and perceived enemies into friends right now. The best person to do this has great intellect; develpment potential; carries no baggage; has demonstrated a marked affinity to gel with other key heads of states and has a profile not biased towards jingoism. I believe his approach and persona will curry deep respect and understanding from many nations and human beings worldwide looking earnestly for this lead.
This person is Senator Barack Obama.
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24, Kathy.
Being captured and tortured makes you a victim, not a hero. A hero is someone who goes into a burning building to save someone and hopefully gets out alive himself.
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For an interesting and, it seems to me, objective analysis of the basic differences between the Democrat and the Republican economic polices and philosophies, and the historical results that have emanated from these, I recommend: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/31/business/31view.html?em
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McCain is clearly outclassed by Obama in almost every area. If this was a tennis match, rather than a race for office, it would be straight sets ... 6/4 6/2 6/2 something like that.
Despite that, I think McCain is likely to win in November. Maybe even win easily. That's going to say something about "Middle America" that might be quite difficult to acknowledge.
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McCain did pretty well talking about his experience getting shot down. But he's had enough time to rehearse that one over the years. Now he just seems like a one-trick pony. I'm still waiting for McCain's economic plan.
And Dems don't even need to question his war record. Republicans did that already in 2000.
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Well McCain thats it......Obama the next President
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That's unfortunate that the Kansas City Star, "the reaction from the heartland", appears sold on McCain's less than stellar speech. I'm from Kansas City, and there is much more support for Obama in the city than McCain. I guess I shouldn't be surprised that the paper would suggest something different.
The best part about McCain's speech was the personal story about his experience as a POW, and it was truly moving. However, he failed to distance himself from the Republican party, and offered no real alternatives to the policy platform presented by the Democrats on issues like health care. Also, he was upstaged the entire convention by his choice for VP, and many I know are less than sold on Palin, including myself.
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What nobody seems to have noticed is that neither Obama nor McCain have mentioned any policy whatesoever. Frankly, I expect better reporting from the BBC.
They both deal out virtues to the faithful like candy and say they're patriotic (and most Americans think patriotism means agreeing with the government) but what are they going to actually do? Double funding for Medicaid? Rebuild New Orleans? Get the homeless off the streets? Tax the super-rich?
We know precisely nothing about their policies. If it's McCain, however, we know that for all the promise of change, if he gets elected he'll hand all the power right back to the oilmen
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Wow, that's a surprise.
Following a year long news black out on even mentioning his name.
The BBCs man was not impressed by McCains speech.
If you search your heart, do you think it is possible that you may be just a little biased about him?
(For the record - I'm neutral on this election: I don't think we should interfere in other peoples elections and I don't know enough about one of the candidates to have an opinion)
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FYI, Huffington Post isn't the "unconvinced". If Barak Obama himself said he was unfit and no one should vote for him, the HuffPost would still be cheerleading for him. I mean really, the National Enquirer too high-brow for you?
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It was a poor performance. I agree with the previous comment that the strongest part of the speech was the end.
We all know that the conventions are well timed and well staged. McCain's speech reminded me of a distance uncle at a wedding. Everyone respected what he had to say but, really there no conviction.
I have noticed the age of the GOP convention crowd. McCain will have to rely on people closer his own age to see him in the White House come Jan 09.
The TV head to head interviews between McCain + Obama will be fascinating. I really hope for McCain's sake he improves as I can see his approval dropping dramatically. Obama will take him to the cleaners.
The VP head to head will be great viewing. I feel there is something about Palin that will come to light in the next few weeks. She seems like she could get carried away and when the hard hitting questions are asked, it could be curtains for the Republicans.
As for McCain and his speech. 4/10.
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NimrodDave, the NYT? That's only slightly less worse than the HuffPost. Demcrats "better" at economics? Clinton - dot-com bubble and corporate fraud is his economic legacy, like Blair he managed to hand over this mess to someone else before it blew up. Carter? Worst recession since the Depression, allowed Pakistan to acquire nuclear weapons - though they wouldn't make a test until 90s - oh and actual record oil prices. Initiated the funding of mujahideen and chose the route of the ISI thereby ensuring the craziest of the nutters got the money. LBJ? Destroyed the dollar with inflationary spending oh and Vietnam, only war the US didn't win mainly by following Obama's methodology of giving up. Kennedy - again left the office before his policies could destroy the economy, leaving that to LBJ.
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So much for straight-talking, folksey, just-like-you John McCain's claim to being an ordinary fellow.
I guess this is the new preferred vehicle for "regular" folks.
"Dissapointed" doesn't begin to cover what I feel about John McCain and his speech.
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McCain seems like a good-enough guy, although I have grave doubts he'd make it to the end of his first term, let alone a second. So the choice of VP carries significantly more weight than Bush's choice of Quayle.
Palin is an irresponsible choice for VP. By selecting someone who is a fundamentalist, McCain has shown he can pander to the 'special interest' groups with the best of them. He lost his credibility as a maverick with this one.
Whatever experience Palin may have, she has shown herself to be a self-serving politician, filling up the pork-barrel when it suits her, then claiming she fought it when it suits her.
The person I feel the most sympathy for in this campaign is that poor 17-year old "couple". Thrust into the limelight, the boy facing a shotgun wedding and the prospect of living in a glass house for the coming years. I really wouldn't be surprised if we soon read of his suicide, but Palin seems hell-bent on keeping up the facade. A responsible parent wouldn't do this to her child.
And what of this, "no abortion under any circumstances" lie of hers? If that is really true, how on earth did she find out her baby had Down's Syndrome months before the birth? Clearly she had tests done, and was told, which means clearly there were circumstances under which she would have had an abortion. What a charade. The blatant hypocrisy and double-standards of fundamentalists is shocking.
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#30 BillTyrone
I agree with that.
I am not so sure about the rest of your analysis.
The Georgian crisis was widely reported here as having been caused entirely by Saakashvili. It is only if you look at the fine print that you see Putin in it. The South Ossetian militias - armed by the Russians with some pretty heavy weapons - attacked the Georgians over several days before the Georgians attacked them. Saakashvili said (I cannot tell if he meant it) that he wanted peace talks during that time. The Russians did not respond, to my knowledge or from anything I have read.
The Iraq War was prompted by Saddam Hussein having played the UNSC for many years. Again, as far as I can tell (and please correct me if you know better) there was no conspiracy outside of Iraq about WMD. All of the western intelligence agencies believed he had WMD, the only difference of opinion was about its scale and delivery options.
The Russians have a clear vested interest in Georgia. They want to prevent the oil and gas pipeline which bypasses Russian-controlled territory from being exploited by the West.
Saddam Hussein wanted to control Iraq's oil resources. They were not, however in his heartland - they were in Shi'a and Kurdish areas so he went to war on his own people. The insurgents effectively continued that war by constantly attacking attempts to rebuild Iraq's infrastructure. They wanted Iraqis in poverty so that they would hate the Americans. It worked.
How do you expect a President to respond to these things ? Are they none of your business ? That was what successive American administrations said to dictators all over the world, especially in South America. They would support any murderer who furthered American interests.
They were criticised for it at home by people like Jimmy Carter who had an 'ethical' foreign policy.
Joe Biden wanted to send troops to Darfur. Just recently, the Sudanese launched another campaign in North Darfur (under cover of the Olympics) to clear Block 12A, a potentially oil-rich area. This is so that they can suipply CNPC - the Chinese. Do you just ignore it ?
Do you take these issues to the UN as Barack Obama suggests ? The Russians and Chinese have vetoes. They have ruthlessly vetoed what is not in their interest in the past, as has the USA. That is a way of saying you will do nothing while looking good. Is it really good ?
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BillTyrone's comments were a breath of fresh air. Let's hope that lots of US voters are as rational come election day.
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Justin,
You should not be surprised that McCain's speech was woeful; he's a terrible public speaker, it beggars belief as to how he got the nod for the presidential candidacy in the first place. Are you only just now realising this? This man is even more phlegmatic than Gordon Brown and that's saying something.
The Republicans have the cheek to droan on about the fact that they don't know what Barack Obama's policies are, and thousands of them sit down in front of McCain whose policies are so sparse, they're almost non-existant. Surely America must now see that there is only one man that can be voted into the white house come November, and that man of course, is Barack Obama. His policies make more sense and have more in the way of cohesion and more importantly, they exist!
Hopefully, if pockets of white America can rid themselves of their innately racist views, they'll vote for the "right" candidate and Obama will be walking across the threshold to the white house come November.
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Justin,
The plain fact is that Mr McCain will be the next President of the USA and Obama will not.
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No.30 Bill, you give me hope.
Let's be honest, McCain is a woolly thinker as evidenced by the number of flip-flops he has performed recently. His support will come from those who would blindly vote for anyone who mentions America, God, the flag, the troops, patriotism, terrorism and fighting all in one sentence and those who have a neocon agenda as evidenced by his shadow Joe Lieberman.
By the way, did you know John McCain was a POW?
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The comment about McCain is always so negative. If Obama was as great as he's cracked up to be, shouldn't this election already be in the bag for him.
If there was an election in the UK tomorrow, Brown would be out, and Labour pretty much decimated.
America has the same issues, yet the Republicans are in with a fighting chance - surely that's because Obama just doesn't lift people the way the media says he does, and McCain is way more convincing than the media make him out to be.
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Here's why McCain couldn't connect with the crowd.
It's not his party anymore.
However, the point could be made that any
appointments to the Supreme Court require
the assent of the Senate, which would be
unlikely to agree with Palin.
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As an Englishman I find the whole tenure of the American system to elect a president very flawed. The so-called 'greatest Democracy' cannot even perfect its ludicrously inaccurate electronic voting system which produces serious errors at every Election. However, I would welcome an American's explanation of why so many people claim that because McCain was a Prisoner of War in Vietnam, it automatically makes him a good candidate. He was a bomber pilot who, on his own admission, was bombing areas of high population, i.e. a civilian target, was shot down and kept in prison for a few years. What choice did he have in this event. He couldn't stop himself being shot down, he couldn't avoid capture, and whilst in prison, he had no choice of what he could do, i.e. he was powerless the whole time. How does this make him a good choice for president?
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I didn't know McCain was a good friend of Georgian president Saakashvili. I'm now pretty scared that he will get involved in that mess. How many war fronts do we need?
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Is is sad that we all need to keep up with what is going on in the US election...Unfortunatelly we can not turn a blind eye an think is not our business... god help the world by removing the republicans from power in the US....if we want world peace, diplomacy, and world leadirship the last thing the world needs is a gun totting, religious fundamentalist in the white house, and lets be clear on this ... there are no maverycks in the republican party ... that would be contradiction !!!...they all belong to the same old boy network...
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I am very neutral in this overall election, in fact quite disappointed that the BBC is giving so much detail to it. So with that "context" here is my reaction - Justin, I do think that your reading of the speech and the reaction from the crowd is overly pessimistic.
It was clear that McCain's speech took so long because he got cheered for almost every sentence! We could hardly hear his finale! So how do you analyse that in anyway as being subdued or disappointment?!
Sure, may be the friends of the lobbyists and other Washington insiders were quiet because they now need to go and find new jobs! And dare i suggest Justin that you most probably are associated with that in-crowd, since that is how you will get most of your information.
So please stay focused and a bit more objective for those of us who do not have the "privilege" of being over in the US.
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A strange, superficial reaction from many on here. John McCain is not a great speechmaker. Period. Just as Barack Obama is a very skilled public speaker. It is therefore no great surprise that the speech was functional and at times dull rather than spectacular. Most American voters - at least those on whom this election depends - will be aware of this.
As a speech, Palin's was far more important. While McCain is well known, Palin is far more obscure and therefore needed to nail her one big chance to endear herself to the electorate. I would say she did pretty well. For McCain, the key last night was to persuade voters that he could unite the country, and persuade voters that he was not George W the second. For all his lack of stage presence, I feel he achieved both these aims last night.
Taken as a whole, the Republicans can be pleased with their convention - they did the right thing with regard to Gustav, they came across as a totally united party (far more so than the Democrats), and there were some excellent speeches. Palin's we've all heard about, but Mike Huckabee's was a particular gem. Romney was effective, while Rudy Giuliani went down very well, although personally I don't like his speaking style. McCain's speech was not as good as any of these, but nor was it expected to be.
With both Obama and Palin such new figures on the political stage, the studio debates will carry far more significance this time round. Obama has been exposed quite dreadfully before without an autocue; if he does not improve, then McCain can dominate here. Should Obama hold his own, he should win the presidency. Biden is regarded as an excellent debater, but Palin has a fearsome reputation too. The smart money is on Biden's experience to be too much for Palin, but should Palin come out on top, the Democrat campaign will suddenly look very lightweight indeed.
Speechmaking is overrated in modern politics, and deep down, I'm sure many of the commenters here, who are pointing to McCain's poor speechmaking as proof positive that Obama's the man, know this. I would guess that the vast majority of these will be talking up Gordon Brown - a terrible public speaker - back home in the UK, while sneering at David Cameron - a very accomplished public speaker - for being all style and no substance.
The Democrat convention saw very little "bounce" in the opinion polls, though the initial reaction to Sarah Palin saw a rise in Democrat figures. After Palin's successful debut, and a successful Republican Convention, we will probably see the figures return to the levels they were - a narrow Obama lead.
It's all to play for in the studio debates. Here, however, it is Obama who has the most to prove.
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Oh please. Justin Webb's comments on the running text commentary article shows he's fully in Obama's camp.
This headline is simply a cheap way for Justin Webb to pass his opinion for his favorite candidate as news.
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Now that CNN has done his life story and he has done his big speech, mentioning once again that he actually got caught and locked up in a morally wrong war (quite embarrassing actually, nothing to boast of), can someone give McCain a medal and ask him to kindly fade away? but no, he wants to, and may actually become, president in a world and century that he has not yet arrived in!
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The BBC showed one manual worker who announced that Obama took the oath of office on a Koran instead of a Bible.
That, of course, is false, but the man speaking was an American voter.
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You have to look at the audience McCain is going after.
He is not going to loud enthisiastic speech( like Obama or Palin) that is not who he is. And most Americans hate phonies.
He is trying to get the independents who want someone who goes beyond party and those notes struck
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# 54 ~
Even more so, what on earth is Dick Cheney doing wandering around the Caucasian states ?
I can understand that they wanted him to be about as far away from Minnesota as possible (and geographically he is) but Georgia and Azerbajan ? That's a tinderbox which the European leaders understand and have been handling with the most delicate of delicate kid gloves.
And now Cheney turns up.
Couldn't he have gone to New Orleans or even Florida to help with the floof relief - which is the sort of thing that Vice Presidents do ?
Seems pretty scary to me - and he's the one with the power for the next third of a year.
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Pleased stop wasting my money and your time and energy with precipitate, pointless reporting of this political bullshit. Must we really be subjected to trivial silliness and breathtaking dishonesty - "Change is coming!" from a 20-year Washington politician who voted to invade Iraq and proclaims himself a man of peace? It demeans the BBC to give front-page space to this farcical game show.
If you must report on the interminable narcissistic windbaggery, please allow yourselves a few minutes to digest and analyse the speeches, so that the BBC is not culpable in promoting blatant and easily refuted lies such as "[Obama] has authored two memoirs but not a single major law or reform" :
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/today/jimnaughtie/2008/09/a_roman_triumph.html
http://www.samefacts.com/archives/campaign_2008_/2008/09/palin_v_reality.php
For the record, Obama and the Democrats' campaign is hardly any better. Please, Aunty Beeb, take a moment, step back, deep breath : is all this really front-page news?
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As an English man looking in from the outside, judging matters on the current situation in the USA, the way the USA interacts with other countries, the challenges facing the world and what the candidates actually say - and discounting the biased and warped utterings of talk show hosts - surely there is only one choice the American people can make.
If they make that right choice I see some hope for the world as the USA is and will remain one of the most important driving forces in world affairs
Make the wrong choice - more confrontational foreign policy, ignoring Global Warming.....
I am involved in politics in the UK - my party is non-mainstream - and I am completely disillusioned by the two choices of government that will face me in due course
If one of those choices was Barack Obama, well that would be quite a different matter !!!
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Gosh, Justin, rather gallant of you to 'break the fall' of that placename.. - you don't think someone was trying to 'bump you off' the ticket, so to speak.. ?
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I too am an Englishman but unlike others, I don't find the US Presidential System flawed, I admire it.
Whatever the outcome, the US Electorate (or the proportion that bother to vote) have a say in the choice of their next Head of State.
In the UK we happen to be 'blessed' with whoever is fortunate enough to be the eldest child born into the House of Windsor (or whatever ruling Royal House)
The American system isn't perfect but it is far better than our system. Perhaps those Brits who sneer at the US should remember the old saying 'Those in glasshouses shouldn't throw stones...'
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It was watching the decline of a once military hero into a ghost of Petain or von Hindenburg. This is the deceptive betrayal of his and his ancestor's heritage.
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If Governor Palin is upstaging Senator John McCain, then we have a serious problem in our US politics. It means people are not reading with their brains; rather, those people are accepting unquestioned ideology. As for patriotism, why would a man who loves his country pick a successor who is right wing?
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For John McCain, the upside of picking Sarah Palin is that social conservatives will now support him but the downside will be a clear restrictions on what he can achieve in office - it is fair to say that if elected, the lipsticking wearing pit-bull will muzzle him!
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Having watched both speeches i have to say McCain was dissapointing, his lack of control over the crowd was indicative, to me at least, that he doesnt perhaps have the same weight with the delegates as Obama does, mccain did seem uneasy and seemed to talk with very little passion except fot certain parts.
I think now after the conventions and after appointing running mates Obama has a clear advantage, he used his speach to set out some clear ideas on what he wanted to achieve and some idea of how he was going to do it, he also used his speach to land some fairly tough, but id say well founded criticism on john maccain without disrespecting him, on his voting record for example.
As for vp canidates obama picked someone with experience and a solid record in teh foreign policy arena and also someone with more appeal to the demographics he has had reaching such as the blue collar workers and such, mccain has shot himself in the foot picking palin, she his headline grabbing being a woman an all, but she overshadowed him at the convention and has rather extreme views, he has also added servere inexperience to his ticket something which he was using to undermine obama, palin has very little experience of how politics in washington works, and tho that does mean shes not part of the system it also means she will take a long time to find her feet and perhaps build the connections that the otehr 3 have made in their time in wasington.
Lastly picking someone with an outstanding investigation into allegations of using her position to affect the lives of other state employees for her personal reasons is very definatley not a smart choice by mccain, if the invesitgation goes against palin all the wheels fall off the mccain wagon they really do
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68. At 10:53am on 05 Sep 2008, juliewriter wrote:
If Governor Palin is upstaging Senator John McCain, then we have a serious problem in our US politics. It means people are not reading with their brains; rather, those people are accepting unquestioned ideology. As for patriotism, why would a man who loves his country pick a successor who is right wing?
Why would anyone of sense and judgment pick a half educated individual as deputy who beleives the earth wwas created in seven days and that global warming is somehow "natural".
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I find it odd that so much of the text of the candidates (and bloggers) seems to concern the fight for freedom without bothering to define, even broadly, what you're on about. Anecdotally, one of my son's is in the US and finds a lot of petty hindrances to his daily life compared with life in Europe. Maybe finding a President that looks outwards for a change (that's a good word this year) instead of re-enforcing your own perceptions of the US would be a good thing. I wonder which candidate that will be. Any clues ?
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I find the comments on Justin Webb's supposed Obama 'bias' amusing. It seems to me that Justin tends to include links to more right leaning or critical commentaries. Of course he could be doing this as some kind of ploy - hoping we will see the craziness on the American right! I have found that Justin does tend to express some rather naive responses to critics of the US - is there a term Americanophile? But his interview of Carly Fiorinna was very strong. My guess is that the BBC's old argument could be cited here: that if they get complaints from both sides then they must have it about right.
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As a non American looking in I have to say that John McCain is not leadership material and his running mate is even less so. Her speech reminded me of a silly school girl reading out an essay in front of a class.
McCain's speech was probably even worse, he has the charisma and personality of a damp cloth and his calls for change strike me as a bit silly seen as he has voted 90% plus with Bush in the senate and is an old man with no new ideas.
The whole world is watching this election and I have to say that we are all hoping the American public do not let us down again by voting in the republicans.
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"57. At 09:38am on 05 Sep 2008, NiceLinesGiddo wrote:
A strange, superficial reaction from many on here. John McCain is not a great speechmaker. Period. Just as Barack Obama is a very skilled public speaker. It is therefore no great surprise that the speech was functional and at times dull rather than spectacular. Most American voters - at least those on whom this election depends - will be aware of this. "
But they won't necessarily like it. People in times of uncertainty tend to like being roused, n ot bored.
"As a speech, Palin's was far more important. While McCain is well known, Palin is far more obscure and therefore needed to nail her one big chance to endear herself to the electorate. I would say she did pretty well. For McCain, the key last night was to persuade voters that he could unite the country, and persuade voters that he was not George W the second. For all his lack of stage presence, I feel he achieved both these aims last night."
You feel being upstaged by his Vice Presidnetial candidate was what he wanted?
Hardly unless the man is a complete fool. McCain convinced voters that he was the tired old man the Democrats painted him as.
"Taken as a whole, the Republicans can be pleased with their convention - they did the right thing with regard to Gustav, they came across as a totally united party (far more so than the Democrats), and there were some excellent speeches. Palin's we've all heard about, but Mike Huckabee's was a particular gem. Romney was effective, while Rudy Giuliani went down very well, although personally I don't like his speaking style. McCain's speech was not as good as any of these, but nor was it expected to be."
Whihc shows expectations of McCain are fairly low. Being outshone by others is not good for a candidate in any election. particularly at an event they are supposed to dominate.
"With both Obama and Palin such new figures on the political stage, the studio debates will carry far more significance this time round. Obama has been exposed quite dreadfully before without an autocue; if he does not improve, then McCain can dominate here. Should Obama hold his own, he should win the presidency."
Obama has proven he is a natural speaker and effective debater, this is his type of forum. Whether anyone takes any notice of these debates is another matter.
" Biden is regarded as an excellent debater, but Palin has a fearsome reputation too. The smart money is on Biden's experience to be too much for Palin, but should Palin come out on top, the Democrat campaign will suddenly look very lightweight indeed."
Palin will have been so weakened by then she will be on the defensive. Already there is another attack on her past, most carefully timed and therefore effective.
"Speechmaking is overrated in modern politics, and deep down, I'm sure many of the commenters here, who are pointing to McCain's poor speechmaking as proof positive that Obama's the man, know this. I would guess that the vast majority of these will be talking up Gordon Brown - a terrible public speaker - back home in the UK, while sneering at David Cameron - a very accomplished public speaker - for being all style and no substance."
Depends on what is said.
"The Democrat convention saw very little "bounce" in the opinion polls, though the initial reaction to Sarah Palin saw a rise in Democrat figures. After Palin's successful debut, and a successful Republican Convention, we will probably see the figures return to the levels they were - a narrow Obama lead."
"It's all to play for in the studio debates. Here, however, it is Obama who has the most to prove."
No the work will be done before the debates. The republicans have an almost impossible task. They have to be against the incumbent, despite the fact he is inthe same party. They have to advocate the importance of experience, though at the same time promise radical change through the selction of a novice VP.
And they are up against a candidate who has already shown he can defeat the most experienced and seasoned of campaigners.
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Unlike any country in the world, foreign policy of the US is not a question of how the future president will react to world situations. There is no doubt that both candidates will be able to react properly to future crisis. But foreign policy for the US is a question of how the future President will want to see the world. On this basis McCain is better positioned. A younger person may be a genius but there is no good replacement for experience. That is what everybody looks for in hiring people so why not use the same argument for the highest job? A case in point is the 29 year old Defense Minister of Georgia (not to mention the young president) who can not compete with his counterpart over the Caucasus range. One day those young energetic intellectuals will also acquire experience in time, but time is what we have to wait for. McCain showed his experience in his speech.
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McCain in his acceptance speech praises his
own militray judgment by having advocated
a troop surge in Iraq. He then calls that a success. In reality the surge in Iraq was
the distraction the Taleeban needed to
rebuild their strength in Afghanistan. The overall military picture was ignored by McCain. Change for McCain means changing the spotlight. His choice for VP Ms Palin is a Creationist who bans library books. That was not put into the spotlight!
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What is terifying about all of it is that Palin is deemed electable because she has a family. The facts that, in her belief in creationism, she wishes to take us back to the middle ages, and that in other ways, her religious funadmentalism for example, she is resolutely unenlightened and, therefore, uncivilised, seem not to matter. They should.
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This is the man who was passed over by his party before; whose party judged George W. Bush to be better than him. Now that same party is offering him as their candidate for the Presidency. His party apparently sacrifices its own principles with such ease, just so they can grab the power.
And yes, #62, what IS Dick doing in Georgia and Azerbajan? He is doing his utmost to provoke yet another war to protect the oil interests of the US, and create a cushy income from Haliburton when he leaves office. He doesn't care if he starts WWIII in the process. He seems blind to history.
For those who believe he is defending democracy and freedom in Georgia: Tell that to Iran whose democratic government was replaced decades ago by a dictatorship when it threatened US oil interests. Tell that to the Saudis and Kuwaitis - especially their women - when the US supports the dictatorships there. Tell that to the Afghans whose freedoms were stripped away when the US supported the Taliban in the late 70s. The list goes on.
The fundamentalists in the US have hijacked the Republican party, and are intent on removing freedom from its citizens, and bringing about the Apocalypse any way they can.
If McCain is elected President, be afraid, be very afraid. He brings with him to power all the "good ol' boys" of the Republican party, and Palin will be their star.
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Justin,
I tune in to the BBC as often as I can to get up to the minute news and analysis. While I often get the former, the depth of the latter leaves a lot to be desired.
In essence, the Beeb seems to have the preconcieved notion that Democrats = good, Republicans = bad. From where I sit, it doesn't make a difference which party gets in, similar issues will arise and will need to be dealt with by McCain or Obama.
If you accept my criticism, can we please get back to analysing policies and the tracking of opinion polls. In that way, we might actually learn something of interest.
All the best
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"The excitement for Palin was for her track record of reform and non-Socialist change."
Wtf? Do you know what socialism is? Besides being un-American, of course.
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Justin, if you were superstitious, you might take that as a sign that the Republicans will lose North Carolina. It certainly reminds me of the omens that Sejanus tried to dismiss before his fall at the hands of Macro (for those not up with Roman history, Sejanus was the henchman of Tiberius who was torn to pieces by the Roman people).
And #49, some reasoned logic would help. It is likely that the number of people voting at this election will exceed the last time: a good guess might be that 120-130 million people will cast a vote. At the moment the straws in the wing suggest that Obama will win by about 4%. More importantly it is McCain who has to play defence. He has very few Dem states that he can turn, but he has at least a dozen states he has to defend. The odds are against him. Iowa is leaning Obama, as are Nevada and New Mexico: that alone would be enough to secure victory. More seriously McCain is having to fight to defend Virginia, Ohio, Indiana, North Carolina, Florida, Missouri, and Colorado. Obama won't get all of those, but one is all that is required. And remember that by early next week, Ike is due to make a direct hit on Miami. That may well have a very big impact on the result in Florida and elsewhere.
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#74
In my experience what Justin does is not so much express his own view than point to issues in a way that are likely to give rise to debate and comment. It is not about Republican or Democrat bias ... a couple of days ago he was accused of being a stooge of the GOP.
Now as for wacko sources of information ... anyone seen the National Enquirer today: it was rumoured they had the big scoop on Palin ;)
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#57 NiceLinesGuiddo
You say Mike Hukabee's speech was a "gem".
This bit wasn't very gem-like:
"Barack Obama's excellent adventure to Europe...(LAUGHTER)... took his campaign for change to hundreds of thousands of people who don't even vote or pay taxes here. But let me hasten to say that it's not what he took there that concerns me. It's what he brought back: European ideas that give the government the chance to grab even more of our liberty and destroy our hard-earned livelihood."
He's making a cheap shot: "Americans good, Europeans bad". Presumably that goes down well with Republican conference-goers. As a citizen of a country who stood and still stands "shoulder to shoulder" with the USA after 9/11 and is still losing soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan his comments are at best insensitive, at worst dishonourable.
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What struck me the most during Senator McCain's campaign speech was his discussion of the right of the American people to make their own choices. According to McCain, the government should be on the sidelines, not forcing a way of life upon them. This is the traditional Republican model. Nevertheless, both he and his running mate are pro-life (ie, anti-choice). Not to mention that Governor Palin is also against abortions in situations where a woman is raped or involved in incest. Furthermore, McCain is a staunch believer that marriage is a union between only man and woman, and he will work to see that this is put into law. As an undecided voter, this really makes me question whether or not he truly believes in the ability of the American people to make their own choices. If he is elected President this November, and if he enacts these policies, how can one say that his government would not be interfering in the lives of citizens? He implied in his speech that he was not running to further his individual beliefs. For these issues, however, his platform clearly demonstrates otherwise.
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In answer to #53's inquiry, from an American:
I have no defense for the current American system of electing our public representatives. It is what it is, and furious debate on the mechanics of the entire process have been going on for years. I expect that the debate will still be raging long after this current election cycle is over. The last eight years have certainly proven headache-inducing for all concerned--and the rest of the world, by association. (Example: the "Sorry Everybody" and "Apology Accepted" post-election-mortem websites that were briefly popular after the 2004 re-election of the current Bush administration.)
As for John McCain's POW experiences seemingly making him qualified to be president, it's not about his experiences per se. It's the marketing image. Because of the deplorable care of our own veterans of war, and especially after 9/11, it has become the "in" thing to overpraise our military. The overpraising is a hyper-awareness and a public attempt to redress legitimate wrongs that were committed to long-suffering soldiers and officers who came home from unpopular wars (Vietnam, specifically) to public vilification by war protesters and indifferent government treatment of the veterans. Especially now, if one does not IMMEDIATELY say to a current veteran "Thank you for defending my country" or something similar, it is seen as unpatriotic at best, high treason or the deepest disrespect at worst. (I could address crimes committed by a handful of veterans who take advantage of this current perception climate to weasel out of their own crimes/shortcomings, but that would be disingenuous.)
Currently, Republicans have latched onto the "patriot" meme for their party platform, as if Democrats aren't sufficiently patriotic or "proud of their country" to be considered American. Thus, John McCain's POW experience fits the Patriot meme perfectly. Here is a man who served his country during an unpopular war, without question or complaint; who suffered intense privations and life-altering injuries as a result of his wartime service; and who had endured his pain in the name of protecting the USA. If he's this much of an American as to sacrifice his health and body for his country in wartime, the assumption is that he would bring the same dedication and work ethic to the highest political position in the land.
Holding onto that meme, the Republicans are doing their level best to paint Barak Obama as insufficiently "American" or not patriotic enough to serve as President. By attempting to use the Patriot/ready-to-serve meme, they avoid the game-ending sticky-wicket of race as a disqualifier.
In other words, Republicans can't say "Don't elect Obama--he's Black" without slitting their own throats. They can safely say "Don't elect Obama--McCain's more patriotic and has already served his country" without much public backlash. However, they're doing their level best to use the Patriot meme and other red herrings (experience, legislation, "empty suit," etc.) to effectively say the same thing.
Hope this helps!
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I must say I think some of the views that Sarah Palin was presenting were extremely backwards and detrimental. For example, having a dig at Obame for not claiming 'victory' in Iraq was an atrocious comment! How can you ever declare victory when a) the aim was never to conquer in the first place b) thousands of innocent lives have been lost and c) the war should never have happened in the first place?!
McCain is not the youngest potential president and we have to face the fact that Sarah Palin could well be taking over as leader of the most powerful country in the world if God forbid his age becomes an issue for him.
I really hope that the American people can look past the 'fight-talk' and make an intelliegent decision by voting for Obama who is much more inspirational and forward-thinking. This has an impact not just on America but the entire world!
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7Harmony,
That's why it's so easy to get a new job at any age over fifty! ;-)Peace,
ed
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Mark,
The last time I saw Ike, I lived in Florida.;-)
ed
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#46 - Chill0
Where exactly have you been for the last 3 years?? You know everyone now agrees that there were no WMDs in Iraq? It was clearly a pretext for regime change and to deny that is to live in some kind of fantasy world...
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Doesn't anyone else find the placards and chanting of "Service" and "Country First" a little too much Joseph Goebbels like?
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I am an Englishman, born in Yorkshire but now also a US citizen (having lived here more than half my life), who can vote in November. I will vote for John McCain for his experience and his knowledge that you can't just say I want to change everything. The whole American political machine is too big to change instantly like Barack Obama wants to do. In my opinion Obama has lots of ideas and spin but no substance inside. If elected he will run into the problem of trying to get his changes through Congress and I think McCain has more chance of effecting change within the system.
I am also one of the registered democrats who will not vote for the party this election, but would have if they had Hillary Clinton as their candiate. The US Political system is very different to the UK, in that the President is a separate election, unlike the Prime Minister, who has to win his own seat, but also have his party win. The president can be in power but have an opposition government in both the Senate and House. With this situation, Washington experience means more than good ideas (or sometimes half baked ideas).
I do have to say though, that the BBC coverage in the USA has been Obama biased form the start - in the primaries their comentators were always up on Obama and down on Clinton. Now they are down on McCain. Perhaps it is wanting a candidate who is more their own age, but I remember the last elections, some people here voted for George Bush because they didn't like other contries telling them how they should vote (again the BBC was very anti-Bush), will those voters go for McCain because other countries are backing Obama?
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Q: WHATS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A HOCKEY MOM AND A PITBULL?
A: EVEN THE DOG DOESN'T BELIEVE IN CREATIONISM.
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The BBC doesn't seem to be posting my comments! The biased swines!
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#84 MarkfromOxford
I believe that as this campaign goes on there will be more and more sexual innuendo about Sarah Palin.
I have yet to see a woman rise in any walk of life without the accompaniment of such innuendo.
I believe the Enquirer also perpetuate a rumour Barack Obama is an Iranian agent.
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Considering the fact that the centerpiece of the Republican party is social and family values, and as incredible as it may seem - fiscal conservatism - it is not surprising that Gov. Palin upstaged her hapless mentor. The theme of the GOP convention, service and patriotism, was not a surprise considering the circumstances.
With the exception of a few references to President Bush, it was clear the GOP candidates are desperately trying to distance themselves from the record of the Bush Administration, and went to great lengths to reassure the public that their policies are different and that they do not plan to engage in the fiscal and economic excesses that contributed to the malaise we are currently in. Whether anyone buys this ruse remains to be seen.
The entire convention was devoid of coherency and depth when it comes to the issues that matter to most Americans; and I don't think ridiculing Obama for his community service record was such a great idea considering the inclination of so many Americans, including Cindy McCain, to do just that.
I admit, once again, that the GOP delegates do wear some real cute hats, but I think they would look better if there were a least a few suntans among them, the place looked so pale it was almost blinding.
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#16 "BBC News are trying to link McCain to the Bush Administration."
Perhaps that's because McCain voted with Bush 90% of the time.
How quickly he forgot how he was treated by Bush's people.
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57, 85:
It might be worth pointing out as well that there is a very large US population spread across Europe that will be eligible to vote. In a close run election those overseas votes might make all the difference. It will not have done Obama any harm amongst that group to have made the trip, quite the opposite.
At least Obama does not pretend that a refuelling stop in Ireland s visiting an overseas country ... as Palin did.
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On a parochial note - if any licence payers want to have a real go at the BBC, we should complain about dear old Jim Naughtie shipping himself off to Denver and Minnesota.
One morning this week we heard over the airwaves something like "Here I am, Jim Naughtie in Denver/Minnesota at the Democrat/Republican convention. And I'm going to hand you straight over to Justin Webb who will tell you all about it"
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The hecklers distracted him and he was flat as usual compared to Palin who got the loudest applause. As Obama pointed out, we all love our country, but it has been broken by his party over the last eight years for the majority of Americans and to imply that he is not a part of that does not hold water. Maverick seems to mean dressing up the same old rhetoric with a renewed commitment to the conservative right's ideals.
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Well said, Fluffybunny!
Dare I say "peace" in any non-English language?
Andrea, Tears of embarrassment, most likely.
Supertoyg & Chill0,As demonstrated here
Chill0, And I prefer the judgement of Obama to the detyeriorating mentality of McCain.
Bill Tyrone, Too right! Very well laid out!
Indeed, and in election year politics, we have to ask "cui bono?"
Paul Mc, You're too generous! I give it 2 out of a possible 8 (10 was never a possibility!)
Chill, Actually most believed he "wanted" WMD, and they were also very unsure of the strength of their "intelligence", but the caveats they inserted were ignored...
aka,I hear the McCain campaign has been hiring...
Nicelines, Don't you mean "dysfunctional"?
Deadlines are approaching for Voter Registration...make sure you are registered and pass this around to friends and family:
REGISTER TO VOTE: http://www.declareyourself.com/
IF YOU ARE LIVING ABROAD and need to register: https://www.overseasvotefoundation.org/overseas/home.htm
[other languages removed for Mods]/Peace
ed
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Ref 83
I live in Florida, and I would not count on this state being competitive. At the moment, it is leaning solidly for McCain, by double digits in some areas.
Obama has failed to address senior citizen concerns, and has not articulated policies of interest to that important segment of our population with the clarity and emphasis that he should have. As opposed to blue collar workers, who seldom vote, seniors do.
If there is one place where Obama should not waste his money that place is Miami - regardless of what Ike does to our state. GOP support among the Cuban-American community is so overwhelming and intense that it is risky to even mention you are a democrat when you visit that area.
Incidentally, those that talk about the "Latino" vote may want to consider the political fragmentation that exists among the members of that segment of our population before they make assumptions on their political inclinations.
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"If you love your country the way McCain does, it was a great speech."
Similarly, if the moon rises steadily, the badgers are ready to nest.
Nice to see McCains speech has been turned into a litmus test for love of country. It couldn't just possibly be that the two are not mutually dependent upon each other?
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#4 The crowd loved him. There were people in tears, especially vets.
The media were also apparently impressed that Sarah Palin gave her speech to a 'rapturous' audience.
Can I ask what on earth is so surprising about this? Palin and McCain are preaching to the converted for pity's sake! What did you expect the audience response to be? Throwing rotten fruit? The fact that an invited and vetted bunch of Republicans think these two are wonderful can hardly be shocking. Or impressive.
Personally, I think Palin's popularity will be short-lived. I can see her blowing up in McCain's face before too long. The more Republicans and the media build her up into a wondrous paragon, my response is to wonder if she's THAT terrific why isn't she the Presidential nominee? Far from affirming McCain's feminist credentials, it seems simply to say that for Republicans, women still rank firmly in second place. Which makes all those desperately feminist Republicans ladies who are proclaiming the glass ceiling smashed seem ever more bizarre.
And the sight of a young baby being used as a political prop just makes me wince with distaste.
Also - Obama is an elitist? Please! Look to the guy standing next to you, lady. At least Obama knows how many homes he has! Strange dart to throw when your boss has no clue - certainly MY definition of elitist!
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with regard to who is going to win the usa pesidential election i'm afraid i rather think it will be the team that has the best 'spinners'. forget which team can best convince the electorate that they have the best policies
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"I believe in John McCain"
So do I. I do not believe he is a Computer Generated Graphic.
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Justin
You make a fascinating point about the deep seriousness of McCain being perhaps ignored by people who only see the more superficial.
If that is the case, it supports the view that as voters pick leaders, we get the leaders we deserve in a democracy. (You can find the argument on http://leaderswedeserve.wordpress.com/)
McCain will win if the Americans want a charismatic vice-president more than a charismatic black man. In either case, it will be a victory for image before substance.
That doesn't mean to say the choice will turn out to be a poor one. Only the choice will not be based as much on on the policies which the candidates advocate as on the images they project.
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Do they contain an ampersand (&)? If so, replace it with & (be sure to replace all of the wee beggers), and your post will go through.More hints here
Good luck
ed
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Bill Tyrone @ 30 - from an Englishman looking in, you have it absolutely right.
McCain spouting 'change' is laughable - same old ideas, same old actions. In this day and age that is very dangerous.
I beg the American people to see the wood for the trees - he may not be perfect, but Obama is the way forward...
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"• 28. At 07:44am on 05 Sep 2008, supesguy wrote:
...My hope is that the stupid working class people in this country, who have no business voting for a Republican, will see just a bit of themselves in Obama and vote accordingly..."
Hmm. I suspect that patronising attitudes like yours are exactly what sends them to vote republican. Why vote for a party that thinks you're stupid? Why vote for a party with self-righteous idiots as their natural constituency?
In my opinion both candidates are as bad as each other. America will get the president it deserves- a bad one.
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Good afternoon Ed ;) nice clip ...
#95, surely you meant 'What do call a senator with lipstick on his leg ... '. I'm sure you can provide any number of answers.
#97. I quite agree, except that Palin does seem to have pushed the envelope on more then one occasion; and while it must be treated as scuttlebut, if it proves true (as the Edwards rumour did) she will have to resign because of the values she has run on.
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# 93 ~ Tom
There were a lot of jokes going around yesterday from people who were saying (I think a propos of Guiliani's speech) that it read better in the original German.
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Someone's wish is granted:
Obama Camp Turns to Clinton to Counter Palin
A Girl-fight should be fun to watch.
;-)
ed
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Ref 84
"...anyone seen the National Enquirer today: it was rumoured they had the big scoop on Palin"
Mark, the last place I would look at for information are tabloids like the National Enquirer, they are still looking for aliens - the real kind - in the streets of NYC.
Sadly, sensationalism, gossip and innuendo go with the territory when people enter the political arena, regardless of party affiliation, although it is usually more pervasive when the candidate happens to be a woman.
Take this piece of unsolicited advice from an old man: skip the tabloids, take what you hear from the media with a grain of salt, and focus on the issues and the political platforms of each candidate before making a decision on who to vote for.
If you were just being sarcastic, I also enjoy looking at the pictures of aliens and monsters on the tabloids displayed on counters while I pay for my groceries.
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
ref #102
The hecklers actually made fools out of themselves. McCain used them as a prop effectivly.
He is more comfortable in a town hall format.
As far as the protesters they are from Code Pink, An Anti American intolerant bunch of female thugs allied with ANSWER and Acorn two other terrorists supporting groups
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Is America the home of democracy? I thought maybe that it was ancient Athens or Runnymede (Magna Carta) or the Paris Bastille or something.
Isn't the USA infamous for invading emerging democracies in central and South America and installing right-wing dictatorships, especially during the seventies? Not to mention genocide in Cambodia.
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
I watched the speeches on CNN in America, and noticed how many shots of women old and young there were. However when the camera pulled out, the audience did seem rather made up of more males than females. Just wondered if CNN was over-emphasising the female support for Palin and McCain.....?
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My take is that if the speech wasn't a disaster then it wasn't a disappointment. McCain has never been a great speechifier and never will be.
I voted for McCain in the 2000 primary. I think he is a good guy and, boy, would the world be a different place if he had been the Republican candidate in 2000.
But that was then, and this is now. I wouldn't vote for McCain now for a variety of reasons:
1) He is too old and the US is facing a lot of problems that will take a lot of Presidential energy to fix.
2) He was a major Republican figure for the last 8 years and, basically, did not nothing to oppose or mitigate the Bush/Cheney administration's bungling of just about everything.
3) He is not really in control of his own agenda... He has had to make too many compromises to get the support of the Republican right.
4) Sarah Palin is intelligent, young, and energetic but I will not vote for a ticket with a fundamentalist on it. Why? Because I believe that politicians should view themselves as subject to the will of the people and the law. Fundamentalist's reserve the right to overrule both because they "answer to a higher authority." The Founding Fathers were all Christians but they understood the dangers of fundamentalism which is why they created a secular government.
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Every time I think I am beginning to understand what is going on I find myself at a loss once more.
Perhaps living here in Spain I have a different take on things.
However here goes:
This was a party convention and therefore the core supporters were being adressed - the Media do not have any votes.
The sole role of the Vice Presidential Candidate is to help get the Condidate elected President in November. Therefore his or her view on spacific policy options or nor relivant.
Nobody every got elected for bring bad new which makes a bit difficult for either candidate. What makes it worse is that nobody knows what will break either within or outside the United States in the four or five moths from now untill a new POUSA gets into the Oval Office.
However campaigning on change is like camaigning on the sun will rise tomorrow, it is going to happen anyway.
Lets us all hope that Dick Chaney does not have another heart attack on the trip round Eastern Europe. That really would put the cat amongst the piggins.
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As a Brit with a passing interest, I would rather see Obama in power in the hope that he can diffuse the UK general public's perceived grotesqueness of American foreign policy in the Middle East. If you ask who the most dangerous man in the world is over here, the predominant answer is George Bush....the Republican. That's a dangerous position for John McCain and Sarah Palin to have to follow, given their respective stances on foreign policy.
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#92 GHBRich
What I said was
Now tell me, in face of that, what you think the President of the leading nation in the western world should do ? Hope that it turns out wrong ?
A similar problem is occurring with Iran. My opinion, for what it's worth, is that Iran does not have any present intention to pursue nuclear weapons. Can that be enough for the President of the USA ?
Suppose you are that President and you get intelligence from your most trusted people that a country hostile to yours (like Iran) actually has WMD. The first indication you may get that it is definitely true may be many thousands of your citizens' deaths.
What would you do ?
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Palin Also Supported The "Road To Nowhere" (And May Still)
Now it's a road up in the air? Jacob's Ladder, anyone?First it was a bridge to Nowhere, and now there's a road, but to a different Nowhere! How many Nowheres are there in Alaska?
;-)
ed
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#99 Irish_Mark
I don't know but how often do you think the average Republican senator voted with George Bush ?
How often do you think Barack Obama voted with the Democrats ?
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Re:#115. My money's on Clinton when the claws come out
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I would have been surprised if Justin Webb had made any comments favourable to John McCain. After all, he has already made a name for himself on both sides of the Atlantic with his constant hectoring of his left wing views. Like his friends Sarah Smith and Jon Snow on Channel 4, he no doubt relished the opportunity to have a go at anyone who does not share his strongly slanted left wing views.
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While I hesitate to engage in pure partisanship, the following seems a more apt question for potential Republican voters than for Democrats:
But perhaps the Republican party leadership don't even know their approach betrays the fact that they consider the electorate stupid?;-)
ed
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From one who believes it important to listen to, evaluate, and understand competing perspectives, both conventions failed. However, the Republican convention failed miserably. McCain had me in 2000. Unfortunately, his need to pull the vehemently conservative to his campaign has sold out his maverick and progressive policies and, maybe more importantly, his reputation.
It is galling to hear constant questioning of one's patriotism if one chooses to not wear American flag pins or rally around the "My country right or wrong." It is appalling, nay immoral, to watch the smear campaigns take on the patriotism factor. It smacks of fascist countries in the 30s and 40s or McCarthyism in the 50s. Senator McCain's horrible experience in the Hanoi Hilton aside, most Americans have not had to put themselves through such trying times. And, therefore, they should not be judged against that benchmark.
It is tiring to read the leftist bloggers who employ the same rumor-mill that the conservative bloggers used: think Swift Boat. It is equally tiring to hear the empty rhetoric in Minnesota. Governor Romney talked about the elite East coast liberals who've run things: let's see: Bush: Texax; Cheney: Wyoming; Clinton: Arkansas; Gore: Tennessee; Bush: Texas; Quayle: Indiana; Reagan: California.
McCain, Palin, Romney, Rove, Guiliani: Their speeches showed no leadership, no willingness to tackle serious problems, and no policy changes, nothing to show the country how to regain the idea of America that will help our economy, our energy crisis, our stretched military's superiority; our mural to many parts of the world.
Leadership is listening, evaluating, and deciding based on each situation's unique parameters. The Republicans have lost this independent.
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As a non-American looking into this election and politics in general in the country, I am frustrated that there seems to be no arena where politicians are regularly confronted, and made to answer tough questions about their policies and actions.
I think it would aid in the decision the American people have to make this election season, if they saw their candidates frequently put under fire in interview situations with competent journalists who strive to challenge them. The obvious British examples of this would be The Today Programme on BBC Radio 4 and NewsNight.
I realize there are upcoming debates between Obama and McCain, but considering the length of the campaign, this seems a small attempt to move away from the scripted politics we see most candidates issue.
As a result is seems to me that news programmes are left to discuss arbitrary character traits of the candidates, and descend into sports-like punditry about which section of the voters they happen to be appealing to at the moment. All of which leaves little for the general voter to go on.
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allmymarbles wrote:
24, Kathy.
Being captured and tortured makes you a victim, not a hero. A hero is someone who goes into a burning building to save someone and hopefully gets out alive himself.
By your own analogy, this is exactly what McCain did when he refused early release from that POW prison(burning building) and allowed other prisoners who had been there longer to go home first(self-less sacrifice).
By the way, McCain has never portrayed himself as a "victim" I don't know how anyone could suggest that with a clear and rational mind.
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I totally and respectfully disagree. The cameras were on the audience during the entire speech. The hall was thunderous with their applause, shouts, cheers, and total appreciation every single time he paused. Many times he could not go on because the cheering and applause where so deafening. We were at home cheering and at the same time comforted by this man with dignity, grace, honor and commitment FOR THE PEOPLE of the US. We are republicans, but very hesitant about him during the primary race. Now that we have heard him several times we are 100% behind the next president of the United States, Senator John McCain.
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The whole situation scares me.
McCain is old, Palin is popular. If the republicans win this time round there's a very big possibility Palin could become president.
Here's the problem, Palin is anti-abortion even in the case of rape/incest, she doesn't believe the world-wide scientific consensus on climate change, she believes that creationism should be taught in schools over evolution, she thinks guns are good, she's pro-oil drilling in enviromentally weak areas, she's pro-hunting even of endangered species (polar bears), she's anti-homosexuality, she's pro-death penalty, she's against sex education.
So here's the crux of it, America is disturbingly close to becoming exactly what they hate- a Christian equivalent of Iran or any other dangerously fundamentalist religious nation.
I truly hope America wakes up this time and does the right thing, it's worrying that Palin's views are popular enough for her to get this far.
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#122 SalemDesign:
"I believe that politicians should view themselves as subject to the will of the people and the law. Fundamentalist's reserve the right to overrule both because they "answer to a higher authority." The Founding Fathers were all Christians but they understood the dangers of fundamentalism which is why they created a secular government."
Agree 100%. The separation of church and State is one of the core principles of the Enlightenment. It's a separation that we must defend - by force if necessary.
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I think as a Brit living in the USA most of the people writing on here who are for Obama are British who DON'T live in the USA. The views are totally out of touch with working class midwest and Southern folks who have families, go to church on a sunday and understand that in order to lead the most powerful country in the world they need someone who has put their country before themselves. That is McCain! They guy has fought for the USA been tortured, been an elected official for many years and his wife can be compared to Princess Diana after the aid organisations she has worked for and they adopted a very ill little girl from Bangladesh. Is anyone on this blog actually for real to try to compare the Obamas to the McCains?
Obama has done nothing and has wrapped himself in change but is corrupt as he made his way through Chicago machine politics and a racist church to seek favor. He has never done anything to help his country.
I don't expect this comment to make it to the pages as the BBC IS in the tank for Obama it is obvious but it is not the BBC's fault on who writes on here and it shows that the UK (my home) is losing its traditional values. The voters in most of the USA want a president who is tested...can anyone say Obama is? He's not even in the same ball park as McCain.
I think that the BBC among other European outlets have failed to show an equal take on both campaigns. I spoke to my family and friends at home the other night and not one knew about who McCain was and of course they knew everything about Obama and how he is the new saviour of America. What nonsense.
Come live in REAL America. Asheville, NC; Knoxville, TN; Cincinatti OH; Lexington KY; Flagstaff AR; Fort Wayne IN; Kalamazoo MI and you'll see what the USA stands for and it isn't people who are bitter and cling to guns and religion.
It is hard working people who kids are fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan (Moral or not...they are) and they want a president that stands for them overseas, at home and will show them that they love their country.
There is nothing wrong with that.
I hate socialism and more government I have seen what the NHS and government has done to the UK and the creation of the EU stagnating growth. You want to talk about backwards its those problems at home and Obama wants it in the USA.
No thank you very much! As McCain says we want choice, the ability to choose ourselves not let the government do it for you and we want free markets. Obama with regulate the snot out of everything and then we'll see stagnation like the EU!!!
As for Healthcare, vote for Obama if you want low quality, low standards, doctors and nurses fleeing as they get paid nothing and go somewhere else. Masses of paperwork and beaurocracy to the hilt...not to mention masses of MRSA, dirty and falling down hospitals. Hmmm where have I seen that before. The UK maybe!!!
McCain is the only choice and his speech was great for a man that is substance and a patriot not a man full of empty promises and his only novelty is a decent speech
McCain/ Palin 08'!!!!
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Salem,
Actually, they were more Deists than Christians, but your point is well made, and it will be a glad day if ever the proper separation of government and Religion is re-established.Salaam, etc.
ed
P.S. It seems the Moderation Team don't want me to encourage Voter registration for all.
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#125 Chill0
I do not believe for one minute that you are that naive - the President's job is to assess the intelligence he is presented with and make decisions based upon it. It has become clear since that the intelligence was far from certain that WMD existed, but accepted there was a risk that it did.
Your take on foreign policy appears to be that if in doubt, invade. My own is that military action should be a last resort only countenanced if there is clearly a danger of imminent attack.
For the record, I actually perceive Iran to be a much greater threat than Iraq ever was. It is unfortunate that your pal, Bush, by invading Iraq unnecessarily under a pretext that nobody believed, has made it much more difficult politically for any action to be taken against Iran, now.
But then, he never was the brightest...
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116, DV.
It was written with a halfway grin ... As I'm in England, I haven't popped into an Albertson's recently, but I saw a refernce to what was coming on Wednesday. And, yes, I know about NE; but don't forget they did nail Edwards.
The interesting thing is that they have named the other party who, either way, might have something to say. I find it interesting that the McCain campaign were extremely quick to threaten legal action, presumably to keep the story out of the main stream media and more respectable blogs.
The problem with Palin is that everyday has produced a new story and there has been a lot that has proved 'awkward' shall we say.
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Think about a day when the most powerful individual in the world is trying to get her hair just right before meeting with leaders from Russia, China or any other Alpha types that come to power in our world.
The womens never had a passport!
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[QUOTE]: " ...As I was leaving, the North Carolina placename fell (or was pushed over) and struck me a glancing blow before banging heavily on to the head of a woman standing next to it....[END-QUOTE]
Talk about Karmic justice, Justin! So it will have to take a LITERAL "blow to the head" by an auspiciously "falling" Heartland ID, to clue you (..and the no-doubt otherwise brain-damaged female Republican Devotee...!) onto the FACT of America's essential - since MORAL, SOCIAL, POLITICAL and CULTURAL DECLINE?!?
All I can say is: Thank god for 'SIGNS!"
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Justin, you are so unkind to my poor little nation. Dear, dear, it is so distressing. But I have a thought, for you and for all of "intellectual" England: Fix Britain before you fix the USA. You have veered left in Britain and it doesn't seem to have helped at all, so pardon us if we veer right. Oh, and the sign fell on you because North Carolina can be a bit uncouth in the back country, and the signs there are very sensitive to guests who are snide, who are snarky, who are snotty, who sneer, who snort, who snicker, or who are sneaky or snaky in any way.
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To all who were offended by my comment about loving the US the way McCain does, I apologize. Obviously, one loves (or dislikes or even hates) one's country for personal reasons, and no one person's feelings are more or less valid than another's.
I was simply referring to McCain's particular affection for the US. He learned to love his country when separated from it, under terrible duress, when faced with the loss of his life, while fighting for it. He comes from a family that honors the US with military service. It's a unique relationship McCain has with America.
People who share this relationship with America, whether from having served or from being raised as patriots, will understand McCain's words.
Those veterans, despite the camara's catching one who wasn't crying, were very moved by McCain's words. Many of them probably feel the same way. I don't think many people can articulate their feelings the way McCain did.
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Sara has had a totally sheltered life and if something should happen to McCain at age
seventy-two she's the man. She's no Hillary, and this world needs more out of America then another tough guy stance on foriegn relations.
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Mike, old man,
McCain seems to feel that way. In a video (which I can't find) he said the VP had two duties, to stand by in case, and to open the Senate. S/he should also keep well away from the President (in case);-)
ed
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Josh Marshall over at Talking Points Memo has a lovely take on the visual background to the McCain speech.
People who know the building in the background say that it is NOT one of McCain's houses but the Walter Reed Middle School in North Hollywood, California.
And why :
Because McCain's team wanted a pic. of the Walter Reed Medical Centre but in grabbing the first one they found on the web listed under 'Walter Reed' they dragged this innocent school into the political debate.
Is this incompetency we can believe in ?
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130. At 1:31pm on 05 Sep 2008, Ed Iglehart wrote:
While I hesitate to engage in pure partisanship, the following seems a more apt question for potential Republican voters than for Democrats:
"Why vote for a party that thinks you're stupid? Why vote for a party with self-righteous idiots as their natural constituency? "
But perhaps the Republican party leadership don't even know their approach betrays the fact that they consider the electorate stupid?
*******************
Oh, so half the American population is stupid, and now the Republican party believes it's stupid, too.
They're all stupid, but you, of course, are not.
If only our politicians and citizens could see things the way you do, they might finally know something.
Glad we cleared that up. ;-)
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Being a former youth hockey coach in St. Paul, I see the difference between a hockey mom and pit bull being that the pit bull doesn't drink margaritas.
But seriously folks...
It 's been the history of the Republican party to elect a figurehead (Reagan, Bush Sr., Bush Jr.) and run the country behind the scenes.
It's been the history of the Democrat party to have the elected official actually run the country.
So it's more of the same from the RNC.
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#117 Ed Iglehart
Robin Cook, in his resignation speech, said
He appeared to believe what many analysts did, that Iraq had biological WMD. Only the delivery method was in question. Robin Cook had been Foreign Secretary, he would have had access to MI6's conclusions.
Iraq had missiles which the UN weapons inspectors identified as having too great a range, referred to in the CIA report (below).
A publicly released paper by the CIA issued October 2002, in its first lines, said:
The genesis of this CIA report was investigated by a senate committee after it was found that there were no WMD in Iraq.
Wikipedia on that committee’s report says:
I daresay the report itself is available in the senate archives.
The reason I said ‘all western intelligence agencies’ was that in reports at the time, this data was said to be shared with and sourced from the French, Germans, Israelis and others.
The point is, suppose that the American President (say, Barack Obama) receives intelligence that Iran actually has WMD, what would the American public expect him to do ?
I am not suggesting that I know the answer to that, just that it is no simple question any more than the Iraq War was as simple as hindsight appears to have made it
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AColby,
Don't let the phony accent fool ya! New England Establishment through and through...Salaam, y'all
ed
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Must say I thought he was a poor speaker, now it is evident. The question becomes, Is good delivery of a speech needed for the good of the people? I think not.
The points of both conventions seemed slimmed by the lack of specifics, but in fairness, they also delivered what was to be thier real reason. Introduction of the canidates, acceptance of position and really nothing else.
The debates are looking to be the stage for decision, for as to this point, both sides are good at derideing the other, but lacking in telling the finer points of how.
In my half century of political watching, the President is center stage, but oddly enough, when he is not, the world keeps moving on.
With all these 'Headline" shows of Presidential races, we are definitly losing sight of the most important races that are 'local' and servr alongside the President.
Congressional and Senate elections abound with nary a word from those who make up a second and third voice in our Government. I fear we're being sold a Mercedes without an engine. Literally a one horse show.
Our concern should even be stronger with the Congress as the approval rating is at an all time low. The facts are, we need a lot of new faces in there, all it will be Government as usual regardless of whom wins the top seat.
concerned citizen dane
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#137 Rednyella
It sounds like you are hideously right wing and out of touch with most Britons. Instead of accepting the majority view you packed your bags and went to live in the USA. Now you say you are in touch with most Americans - congratulations. Americans are not all right wing as you suggest - there's millions of Leftists and millions more of Liberals in the USA. You have a crazy view of the world. Please don't come back.
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Tiptoplisa,
Actually, I think the official orders given to servicemen in case of capture are to refuse any "early release". All he was doing was following orders.Noun, verb, POW
;-)
ed
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Rednyella,
Have you checked out the returns available on overseas investment funds?I reckon not.
xx
ed
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Disregarding the never ending media hype - (centred more on making stars out of glib news readers with seven-figure salaries) I have no doubt that the Republicans will win the day.
If you need to ask my reasons you have not lived and worked in grass-roots America!
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In the best traditions of Barry Goldwater and Ronald Reagan, John McCain addressed each of the issues and pointed out exactly why he should be the next President of the United States, and how Barrack Obama is absolutely wrong for America.
I don't know who Justin was listening to, but it sure wasn't John McCain, he hit that ball right out of the park; it was a very inspiring speech.
Cindy McCain's speech was kind of sappy though, I thought she was gonna cry.
I hardly saw any of McCain's campain during the Democratic National Convention last week, The Republicans let the Democrats have their fun at their big party.
But this week, half the time CNN was bringing in people from the Obama's campaign attempting to counter whatever was being said at the Republican National Convention.
The liberal media bias is so obvious the journalists might as well be wearing Obama buttons and urge the public to vote for their favorite.
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More information is coming out about Sarah Palin..and to me she looks like a bully...
but here is some information for you to decide
Documents detail Palin's political life
63 page pdf document about Palin by Democrats
Anne Kilkenny August 31, 2008
The easiest to read and most amusing is the link to Kilkenny who knows Sarah on a personal level..but these links will give you the criticisms that will be made of Palin. The Kilkenny letter is being circulated in e-mails.
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125.#92 GHBRich:
Suppose you are that President and you get intelligence from your most trusted people that a country hostile to yours (like Iran) actually has WMD. The first indication you may get that it is definitely true may be many thousands of your citizens' deaths.
What would you do ?"
You would give speeches about the dangers Saddam posed to the world, you would vote for war against him, then when it is discovered that he was bluffing, you'd try like the devil to rewrite the events leading up to that war.
You'd call it "Bush's War" to back yourself away from it as far as possible. You'd call it a "failure" to show you are on the right side of public opinion polls.
But then, at election time, you'd describe your love and appreciation to the troops and find ways to show you really cared about them all along.
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"I think as a Brit living in the USA most of the people writing on here who are for Obama are British who DON'T live in the USA. The views are totally out of touch with working class midwest and Southern folks who have families, go to church on a sunday and understand that in order to lead the most powerful country in the world they need someone who has put their country before themselves. That is McCain! They guy has fought for the USA been tortured, been an elected official for many years and his wife can be compared to Princess Diana after the aid organisations she has worked for and they adopted a very ill little girl from Bangladesh. Is anyone on this blog actually for real to try to compare the Obamas to the McCains?
Obama has done nothing and has wrapped himself in change but is corrupt as he made his way through Chicago machine politics and a racist church to seek favor. He has never done anything to help his country."
You think serving in the US Senate, means he has done nothing for his country. John McCain is a senator too, presumably he has done nothing since his military service either.
And without trying to upset you but the people so dear to your heart often don't vote, they can't be bothered.
Afer all if you "hate washington" why bother taking part in the process?
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McCain clarifies the role of the Vice President
;-)
ed
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Rednyella: you say "I think as a Brit living in the USA most of the people writing on here who are for Obama are British who DON'T live in the USA"
This is the BBC website: paid for the British public and aimed (mostly) at a British audience. Justin is reporting for us. If we choose to post comments supporting Obama (or McCain) then that's our choice.
As for the NHS dragging the country down: that would the same NHS that delivered my two children (despite complications), cured my mother's cancer, replaced my dad's knee joints and patched me up after various accidents.
All without sending me an invoice.
It's not perfect, but if you see it as a thorn in the country's side then you really are better off living abroad.
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#139 GHBRich
Not so, see my other post #150. They expressed as near certainty as intelligence ever can.
What is an 'imminent attack' in the context of WMD ?
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I think Justin’s statement: “He was never in control.” says it all – never in control in Vietnam, always searching for that elusive “control”.
“The biggest cheers were for Sarah Palin”. This appears to resemble McCain’s relationship with his mother, Roberta McCain's whose gaffes used to seem like "straight talk". (Sound Like Palin?) Now the GOP have forced their boy (McCain) to stick to the script, so are they are keeping his mother away from any mikes. Did you even know Johnny even had a living, breathing, and very talkative mother? I think the last comment she was allowed to make went something like this: “Holding their noses, they're going to have to make him the presidential nominee. I'm really popping off here, but he worked like a dog to get Bush reelected. He's backed Bush in everything except Rumsfeld. ... And I've never seen any public recognition for all he’s done for the Republican Party.”
Roberta lamented to some radio host who approached her Tuesday in St. Paul. "They won't let me talk anymore." I wonder if Johnny (as his mother calls him) laments similarly about Palin. She won’t let me talk anymore!
As for the woman who pushed Justin Webb…hmmm…Was she, I mean did she appear over 90, like 96.?
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It was not convincing atall! He explained his policies like a dicatated notes for him. Atleast he should have been more specific on Energy,employment,Economy More than Security.
Palin also did the same way ,Rather telling people what she will do she just went on attack on Obama.More over whats wrong in talking to enemies " We are all citizens of this world and as a responsible citizen you should try to talk first and use all diplomatic ways to tackle the situation than slapping the other person".
If in a family someone does wrong we will not slap in first instances atleast we will give room to negotiate and put a dialogue to change that person.
Thanks
Responisble Human
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commentbrbrco,
It ain't England's business to 'fix' Britain.Complain about this comment
143. At 1:46pm on 05 Sep 2008, commentbrbrco wrote:
Justin, you are so unkind to my poor little nation. Dear, dear, it is so distressing. But I have a thought, for you and for all of "intellectual" England: Fix Britain before you fix the USA. You have veered left in Britain and it doesn't seem to have helped at all, so pardon us if we veer right. Oh, and the sign fell on you because North Carolina can be a bit uncouth in the back country, and the signs there are very sensitive to guests who are snide, who are snarky, who are snotty, who sneer, who snort, who snicker, or who are sneaky or snaky in any way."
Hey don't thank us, we are a generous people, we gave you your language, religion, and most of your law.
Yes I believe people in NC (particularly whites) are very sensitive. Back country people used to be very, very, very sensitive to black people too didn't they.
They actually made postcards to demonstrate their "sensitivity" to the wider world.
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If instead of McCain the nominee would have been someone else who is not hailed the hero status for choosing to sit in a prison camp, the crowd inside, just like the crowd outside would have BOOed and rioted.
It seemed to me like McCain too stands against the choices of his party over the past 8 years, but he forgets one thing, 90% of the time that was his choice. So McCain says he is ready to change America, I ask, How are you going to change America when the only direction you know is the extreme of what Bush has followed?
The choices is clear, and it would be political suicide if America does not choose Barack Obama as president and Joe Biden as Vice President.
Americans (and I don't mean the CEO's of HP or EBAY or clowns like Giuliani and some others) but real citizens of this country who make it possible for these people to make a fortune out of our misfortunes will like Obama, Europe and the world will like Obama, and history will like Obama.
Senator McCain talk about service to this country, that he is not afraid of anything, but I say he should be very afraid of loosing America, because once it is lost, there will be no revival. He offered no solutions to the crisis other than more wars, more bloodshed, and more empty promises of change, without a plan on how to bring the change. Furthermore, with a vice president who is nothing more but an insult to women in America and the world, who uses sarcasm and bad humor to entertain the loyal clowns at the expense of a suffering nation, whose citizens can't even buy decent food due to roaring prices, can't even go to the doctor because they can't pay their bills, can't afford a day off work to care for their sick parents or children, the only direction America can take is downhill.
The only service I see John McCain to do to his country is to move aside. It's time for the new cavalry to lead the charge and bring the change.
A wise man once said, we need to be the change we want to bring,
McCain and Palin are perfect examples of the zero change in America, barack Obama has change written all over him.
And to answer Mrs. Palin critic on Obama, which I found insulting to all those who volunteer to make this country better. Mrs Palin, there is more responsibility to being a community leader than to be a city mayor, and that is a moral responsibility and not a legal responsibility. It is a responsibility that runs deep in the veins of people who care not only for their families but for their neighbors too, a responsibility that is not rewarded by a big government paycheck that you receive at the end of the month, but by the silence gratitude of those who need help but are too proud to ask for it, because they are the sort of American heroes we see everyday, and not John McCain or your world champion husband.
ANd next time pick another animal to compare yourself too, Pitbulls in england are considered baby killers. Consider that. I know you love hunting, but not cool.
America, if we want change it is time for us to change, and it starts by electing Barack Obama as president and leave the old war days behind but move into an era of peace and friendship.
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# 137 - Rednyella
Good Grief !
Yesterday we had Palin as the new Margaret Thatcher. Today we have Cindy McCain as the new Princess Diana.
What next - Laura Bush as The Queen Dench and Bristol Palin as Amy Winehouse ?
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What is interesting about this election is how America chooses to address it's lack of moral leadership in the world and also it's declining influence.
The term a bridge too far comes to mind.
Much like two world wars and the economic realisation that ensued, put paid to the British empire and British global influence, correctly or incorrectly it is possible to draw parrallels with the two ongoing wars and America's debt to China. Although in this age one can argue that America is not at an end. However under this Republican regime, China has been afforded the opportunity to develop and grow to world dominance, likewise Russia is experiencing a re-emergence.
Whoever takes office will have work on their hands to rebuild the American nation, within and without.
The Iraq situation and the snubbing of the UN, now means that rightly or wrongly America has gone from being viewed as the good guys by some governments to being viewed as a global problem. So much so that a vast majority of Governments do not trust America. If we can agree that Europe and North America do not make up the whole world.
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AndreainNY
John McCain did not fight to defend this country. He fought for the interests of this country. Those are very different reasons to fight.
And I really don't understand why people value these war heroes so much, but they don't value their own fathers who work long hrs in factories to put food on the table, mothers who singlehandedly raise kids while the work full time jobs and go to school. Those are real heroes, but these world is so full of hypocrites and people always look at violence and those connected with it first.
Such a shame. America is still swimming in violent waters and doesn't see the light of peace at the end of the tunnel. it's a mentality Obama must change, of people who think like you. People who love the country for selfish reasons and personal benefits...No wonder America has become the most despised nation all over, because of selfish people who think their love for the country is greater than everybody else's love for that country or other country.
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Ed #138, Great efort to get the overseas voter registared, I always thought it was still done through snail mail.
GHBRich #139 Agreement on the points of C'n'C and the intelligence given. Iraq, though possibly the victim of poor intelligence, might have been more a larger concern other than WMD. (or played a larger part)
I wonder if the larger, long term plans didn't see the need for bases (mutiple) and a winnable war resulting in a Democracy in the Middle East,... within striking distance of Iran?
My nominal sudies of WWII years ago showed the war to be more of a Chess Game then I would of ever thought from lessons in HS history. This war, Vietnam, Korea and the Cold War were all moves on the Chess board called Earth.
Winning isn't always a defined land mass change with the United States, it is the erosion of dictatorships and confining, oppressive governments. With a free Iraq, we place the spirit of democracy where it never has been (ages at least).
When a twenty-first century Democracy is instilled next to a nineth century society, the change and knowlege crosses borders. Offering a people something they know nothing about, or can't see next door, would cause a very strong militarially Iran to be the true quagmire. With the people wanting change in Iran, it will be easier bring it to them.
Look for instance at the changes in China, simply by the close relationships with democracys, how long will they be communist in a capitolist world. The erosion has already started and the Olympics may have exposed more of its people to the realities and possibilities available in the democratic world. (Without firing a shot)
We still do not have a Historical occurance of one democracy waring with another, and until that happens and I pray it doesn't, our hope for world peace, lies in Democracy for All,... ie: freedom.
Namaste ()
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and one more thing...
patriotism is a virtue of the vicious...Oscar Wilde....
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#143 - commentbrbrco
Oh dear - exactly the kind of xenophobic rant that explains why the US is currently the most hated country in the world, even amongst it staunchest allies.
For your information, Britain has certainly not 'veered to the left' as your ignorant ravings suggest. If only that were true. In fact, the Labour party, which was once the party of the left, has shifted into the centre ground. Believe me, a true Labour PM would never have stood by that sorry excuse for a man people like you elected to ruin the planet.
I hope McCain wins - you deserve him.
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I thought quality in British politics ran very thin but what has happened to America?
Having elected - almost twice - a character with no character and less intellect, the latest Republican offering is a wobbly old duffer and a glorified secretary with bizarre views.
How can that pair hope to deal with Putin the Poisoner and his ilk?
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Has anyone else heard that Palin criticized the Obama ticket for slating her family and bringing it into the spotlight? I saw it on yahoo news, so hopefully its not true. If she did say that its outrageous considering how polite and supportive Obama has been of her during the whole charade.
#51 Comparing Obama's lead in the polls over McCain with the likely situation in the next UK election is ridiculous. The Conservatives and Labour are so similar in their policies that it doesn't really matter who you vote for. Both are right of centre, and thus interchangable if one becomes disillusioned with the party in power. In America the Democrats are so far left of the Republicans that just because right wingers hate George Bush, does not mean they will be able to bring themselves to vote Democrat.
Also, if a large proportion of the electorate thought David Cameron was a muslim im sure the polls would look rather different!
#135 I concur!! A highly religious US government is probably the last thing the world needs right now. Especially if said Government is so war mongering with regard to muslim countries. It will only add fuel to the fire of the war on terror by polorizing the US and muslim fundamentalists. This may be a bit of a doomsday predicition....I've evidently read to much into Huntington's Clash of Civilizations...
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#148
Pretty much.
Sam
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No, Andrea, at least one major political party seems to think at least half the American population is stupid. I'm optimistic that they will be proved wrong.
;-)
ed
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#2
I love my country unconditionally. I don't think that's the way most Republicans do, they seems to pick bits to love and bits to hate.
It was an awful speech. Wobbling on about Pearl Harbour and all that. He didn't say anything about what he would do as President other than 'I'm not Bush and I'm not Obama'.
Couple that with the mainstream press fact checking Sarah Palins speech and finding most of the key points were, let's just say, inaccurate and this convention was a charlie foxtrot.
Was that a muppet out there? Will the real John McCain please stand up? Can the real John McCain stand up?
Sad Sam
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No.137 Rednyella
Give us your grid reference coordinates, states side, please. There are topside of 3000 US families who what to chat to you about the war in Iraq and GWB and Donald Rumsfeldt *standing firm* with them.
Maybe you can offer to put up the 200,000 US homeless vets reported at your place for Bed and Breakfast?
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#139 GHBRich
You are mistaken, I am not personally friendly with George W Bush.
The result of the Iraq War could have been that no other nation in the region would dare develop WMD. That may well have happened in Iran.
An alternative is that they are emboldened. That has hardly occurred as a result of American government actions which were highly dissuasive. Rather, it is as a result of the reaction in the media and by anti-Iraq-War groups.
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46. chill0
"The Iraq War was prompted by Saddam Hussein having played the UNSC for many years. Again, as far as I can tell (and please correct me if you know better) there was no conspiracy outside of Iraq about WMD. All of the western intelligence agencies believed he had WMD, the only difference of opinion was about its scale and delivery options."
chill0 quote
That is not true and shows how effective the campaign to hide the dissent to the war has been.
[Unsuitable/Broken URL removed by Moderator]
This is a partial list of people who opposed the war
"On July 28, 2002, eight months before the invasion of Iraq, the Washington Post reported that “many senior U.S. military officers” including members of the Joint Chiefs of Staff opposed an invasion on the grounds that the policy of containment was working."
........................
Gen. Joseph P. Hoar (Ret
Morton Halperin, a foreign policy expert with the Council on Foreign Relations and Center for American Progress.
Scott Ritter ("Some opponents of the war also believed that there would be no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, and thus there was little reason for an invasion. Prominent among these was Scott Ritter, a former U.S. military intelligence officer and then a United Nations weapons inspector in Iraq")
Brent Scowcroft,..
Gen. Hugh Shelton, former Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
Anthony Zinni, former head of Central Command for U.S. forces in the Middle East and State Department's envoy to the Palestinian-Israeli conflict,
"By January 19, 2003, TIME Magazine reported that “as many as 1 in 3 senior officers questions the wisdom of a preemptive war with Iraq."
Ambassador Joseph Wilson, former charge d'affaires in Baghdad, resigned from the Foreign Service and publicly questioned the need for another war in Iraq
John Brady Kiesling, another career diplomat
John H. Brown, a career diplomat with 22 years of service,
Mary Ann Wright, a diplomat with 15 years of service in the State Department following a military career of 29 years
and outside of the US these two weapons inspectors were known to oppose the war...
" ElBaradei had disputed the US rationale for the 2003 invasion of Iraq from the time of the 2002 Iraq disarmament crisis, when he, along with Hans Blix, led a team of UN weapons inspectors in Iraq. ElBaradei told the UN Security Council in March 2003 that documents purporting to show that Iraq had tried to acquire uranium from Niger were not authentic. "
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohamed_ElBaradei
IF THE US GOVERNMENT WERE FUNCTIONING PROPERLY THERE WOULD BE AN IMPEACHMENT
because there are serious questions about how the Iraq War was sold to the American people.
It is known that there were retired military officers who were paid to go on cable tv to give support to the war.
And I know that voices that opposed the war were not shown on tv...
just as now the people who want impeachment can not get air time on tv.
( some "free" press) but something is seriously wrong in America...
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What struck me from what i've seen (just the last bit of McC's speech) was that his audience didn't seem to be particularly interested in what he had to say. They were cheering so loudly they couldn't possibly have heard his words.
I am also afraid that the US electorate will still vote for McCain come November. I don't think the US in its present state will ever be ready for a black president. It would take a social and economic upheaval of immense proportions to achieve that.
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After reading so many hundreds of comments on this blog during the last few weeks, I am wondering if there is a place here on the BBC site for Americans to give our opinions when there are elections in Britain?
We will have the chance to do what the Brits do here: tell the people of Britain how to vote, what to think, how to respond, how to behave - and otherwise lecture them.
The arrogance and condescension towards Americans here has to be seen to be believed, and even then it is hard to grasp.
It is certainly time for us to have a place where we can tell you how to live.
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Irish Mark:
Why would someone stop in Ireland to re-fuel if they aren't traveling over seas?
Governor Sarah Palin went to Kuwait to visit the troops, not to go backpacking through Europe or get wasted in Jamaica or Amsterdam.
I don't know how well off Palin's folks are but I don't think she come from the liberal elite that own yaghts and can travel to any counrty they want, any time if they want.
The average American just doesn't have the time off from work to go to other countries. The air-fare and hotels would bankrupt them. It's even harder when you have family who depend on you.
Most of the people I know back home have never left the country, and probably never will. I wouldn't have been able to travel around the world if I had not joined the Navy.
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I can't help but wonder if the intent of McCain's speech was to energize the base of the Republican party, or if it was just a swan song from a man that has betrayed his principles in exchange for a few votes.
The courageous positions he has taken throughout his political career when he opposed tax breaks at a time of war, his positions on immigration, campaign finance, off-shore drilling, the environment, and the pervasive influence of religion in American politics that earned him the epithets of maverick, or RINO dependent on what side of the aisle you sat in, is now a distant memory. Today we are seeing a man that looks visibly uncomfortable every time he delivers a speech advocating everything he has fought against throughout his adult life, his POW stint notwithstanding.
What would be interesting to see is what his policies will actually be if he is elected. Considering the fact that he has already said he doesn't plan to run for re-election in 2012, would we see the old McCain bucking heads with his own party, or the born again politician we have seen the past 12 months? Barring a premature one-way trip to the big house in the sky, I would not count on too many Clarence Thomases in the Supreme Court.
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Chill,
You persistently ignore and fail to include the word "probably", and then go on to use this [my emphasis]I hope Barack will have better intelligence than the last lot, and will also be less trigger-happy. After all, Israel has WMD, so what possible moral argument says Iran shouldn't? I know, the anti-proliferation treaty, which can be discarded or simply disregarded (as by the USA) at will.Personally, I would love to hear of any example of Iran invading or attacking any country in the last century or so. Perhaps you can point me in the right direction on this.
Salaam, etc.
ed
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TO Rednyella
wow...i think you are very far away from the truth.
And those christians you talk about...who are they?
The McCain christians who abandon their paralyzed wives because they couldn't stand them and married someone else before getting a divorce...O i am sorry, war heroes can do that...they are allowed anything for sitting in a prison cell for years....
What do you know about his time in Vietnam? Noone knows what Mccain did, and his pals of course would only praise him. There are very few honest people in america who would put truth before anything else, even their families. McCain is hardly an example.
Or are you talking about the christians who pray on sunday, and come monday go back to drugs, firing people, judging people, abusing people? There are plenty of those I can show you.
Or are you talking about christians who have governmental healthcare like Palin, yet do not want anyone else to have it. those who have millions at the expense of child labor in poor countries like the ceo's who spoke at the republic convention yet the compare themselves to the general american mom who work 14 hrs a day to feed their children and can't take a day off work to tend their parents and sick children.
Looks to me, like your teeth have caught some fat, and you are precisely the sort of selfish inhumane person the republicans would love to have on board.
If christianity is what these people and what perhaps you think it is, than christianity is a hoax.
But time will tell and God will decide who are christians and who used christianity to rule and subdue others. it's the oldest trick in the bible. It might help if you stop going to your brainwashing churches who pray for safety of your soldiers but not others, who pray the economy changes at the expense of children in panama, nicaragua, vietnam, india, china, and others. It might be better if you actually get to know God yourself. you might see the real light too. Than talk about christianity.
These people would crucify christ everyday of the week, and twice on a weekend, for their personal interests.
Comparing McCains wife to Diana is an insult! I get it you are ashamed to being british, and i am not british, but that is very low and I am very much offended by it. It really tells how intelligent you are. The republican party does have a ceiling for intelligence and you seem to be just under it. Perfect for them.
FOr the sake of america I hope McCain does not win.
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I totally agree with John McCain that "change is coming" and that change is Barack Obama !
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All this business about Replican women transferring into famous Brits (Palin/Margaret Thatcher, Cindy/Diana) leads to something that has been worrying me.
With his prediliction for pea-green backgrounds, McCain is showing something of a Kermit-the-frog complex. Is this what guided him to his VP pick ? When they're out on the campaign trail, are we going to be seized by an impatient would-be VP yelling "Where's the FRAAAWWWG" ?
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The man of grit (McCain) well on the way to become the 'man of destiny'(egotic, but not egoistic like the Corsican who became Emperor):
I used to associate 'true American grit' as portrayed by John Wayne in films as the stuff of myths. But when I hear repeated and public (tear jerkng) authentications of McCain's experiences, I am at a loss to understand why he had to struggle so hard to be the acknowledged leader of one of the
greatest democracies of the world. It is better late than never.
McCain's detractors at first railed against his choice of Palin as his running mate. However, after she proved her mettle by doing one better than perhaps the best of Democratic Party speakers, the critics were
dumbfounded.
Then they turned their attention to the acceptance speech of Presidential Nominee
McCain and it was found to draw more applauses than even the brilliant speech of Palin. So, they are now trying to compare and contrast the two speeches. Are they are trying the cheap tactic of driving a wedge? I think people are wise to it, and will embrace the program outlined by future
President McCain as the way to move forward.
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I think as American's we're forgetting the real issues in our Country. Our image overseas has fallen into shadows, we create more hatred for our Country with every passing policy and ridiculous news show that covers it, we have lost control of our government (but we claim to be patriots because we fly a flag outside our door). We are in serious trouble folks. John McCain is such a "maverick" that he voted party lines 90% of the time. Obama is no different, but he doesn't paint himself up to be something he isn't. Obama was not my first choice, I've always been an Edwards supporter. He got it right, we have a class struggle in this country, and John McCain simply allows for the struggle to get harder for the middle and lower classes than the upper class. He said that people who have over $5,000,000 are wealthy...what does that say about his ideas on the Economy. If you don't see a problem than you will do nothing to correct it. At least Obama and Biden acknowledge that something needs to be done, and Obama inspires people, not sure why, Bobby Kennedy was a real inspiration because he talked the talk and walked the walk.
One last rant, McCain has enlisted the help of Karl Rove to run his campaign...have we so soon forgotten who Karl Rove's previous employer was? None other than the man himself, Georgie. Come on America, work with me here, I know we can pull ourselves through this one. We can weave through the lies and deception. It is truly up to us. Let us practice the ideals we force others to live by and lead by example not force. Let's have more than 65% of our eligible population vote. Let's for once actually take responsibility for our actions and our problems and proactively change them. It doesn't matter who wins the presidency if we don't wake up and take our Country back.
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Reuben34g
I am not going to argue with you because there is no point, but don't blame the media. When you have no subtance to hold on too, you always attack others. We know that. but just like the republicans you too seem to think the world is stupid and is waiting for people like you to enlighten us...
get out and make some friends, you'll find out people know as much if not more than you do.
The media is doing what is supposed to do...finding the truth...finding holes, and there are some giant holes on McCain and Plain. You are just angry that you can't go after the Democrats on anything expect color and ... oo that's it.
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157. At 2:17pm on 05 Sep 2008, Reuben34g wrote:
But this week, half the time CNN was bringing in people from the Obama's campaign attempting to counter whatever was being said at the Republican National Convention.
The liberal media bias is so obvious the journalists might as well be wearing Obama buttons and urge the public to vote for their favorite."
Hardly compares to the illiberal media's attempts to mock Obama's very name, accuse him of making terrorist salutes, abuse his wife and make remarks concerning his possible assassination.
If you going to dish it out be prepared to take it in return.
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All my Marbles (are you out there?) Dorood,
You may be interested in listening to the PM programme for yesterday and Hugh Sykes' report from Iran (about 25 minutes in)
Here's a link
And a link to some pictures
I'd be pleased to learn any opinions you may have in response.
Salaam, etc.
ed
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Webb is a true biased reporter. Mccain gave a Mccain speech and put out a direction for this country to the people.Webb has no clue but to continually support the Obama ticket that has nothing to say. Media is to report the news not try to make news or take sides.
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# 30. BillTyrone wrote:
"Diplomacy, Foreign Relations and Communications are the required tools of the trade for the future."
"The US needs to convert enemies and perceived enemies into friends"
Yes and when we use our troops it should be after all other avenues are used and after open and active debate.
The troops protect us with their lives..We should protect them with our votes.
It is the responsibility of every American to become as knowledgeable as possible about the issues facing America.
To not know or to not vote is abnegating a responsibility as an American.
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#157
Whine, waaaah, whine. Honestly, all you hear from the right wing these days is the media are biased. And a bunch of other stuff they made up to represent what they wish the country was, rather than what it is.
I watched both conventions on a variety of channels, both had party hacks and others criticising the other side. MSNBC was a bit left and Fox was, well, Fox. Other than that it seemed pretty even handed, especially CNN. The only issue is far less time has been given to fact checking that should be. If it were then the whiners would be whining the house down about left wing bias because in their minds it is bias if you point out someone was economical with the truth, in the way that the fact checkers say Palin was.
And another thing. I am sick of the Republican party being the party of fat bald middle aged white Christian males who love their guns. I am a fat bald middle aged white Christian male who loves his guns and I have been progressively turned off by the Republicans over the last 8 years.
While I am going to remain solidly independant I do think we should have an action group called 'Bald Ugly Fat White Gun Totin' Bible bashin' guys for Obama.
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Reuben34g #157
Well said, I watched the Public Access programme as every time I went to CNN, I got Super Delegates from the DNC reporting. On NBC and CBS it wasn't much different, but ABC at least had both sides disscussing the convention,.. stayed with the PBS because it started two hours earlier than any other.
Obama-Biden O8 should have been on every reproters lapel for full disclosure,.. oh, am I saying that the republicans are stupid and didn't see that on thier own,.. no. I'm saying DemoKoolAids are, cause the smart ones see it and are complaining as well.
McCain-Palin 08-12 :)
and beyond
Palin-Jindal 16-20
now that's scary if your a democrat, cause who ya got?
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If eight years not being President can age McCain as much as this shows, how much time IN office d'yall reckon he'll manage?
;-)
ed
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By Hilary Rosen
CNN Contributor
Editor's note: CNN contributor Hilary Rosen is the political director and Washington editor at large of HuffingtonPost.com, which describes itself as an Internet newspaper and focuses on politics from a liberal point of view. A longtime Democratic adviser, Rosen is a former CEO of the Recording Industry Association of America and supported Hillary Clinton's presidential campaign.
Hilary Rosen says she empathizes with Sarah Palin's personal choices but opposes her political views.
(CNN) -- Warning! This pundit isn't feeling the same way as many of my colleagues about Sarah Palin. She is being attacked for her lack of experience for the job and for whether she should be putting her family first instead of her career.
This just isn't that unusual in my book. And the more it goes on, the more uncomfortable I feel with that message.
Let's reflect. In her acceptance speech, we saw a woman who was compelling, charming and aggressively partisan. She succeeded in demonstrating that she is a regular mom who came to government to make a difference.
And she had that crowd in the convention hall eating out of her hands. Celebrity? It will be hard for the Republicans to attack Sen. Barack Obama for his celebrity now that they have one of their own.
A superstar of the radical right was made Wednesday night. And she may also have made some headway with those who buy her folksiness without knowing the extreme nature of her actual policy views. Read the transcript of Palin's speech
So where does this leave us as Democrats in making the case against Sarah Palin and her running mate for president? What is the choice now for the American people? There is a really strong case to be made against the McCain/Palin ticket and Democrats need to make it the right way, right away.
I am a woman who someone took a chance on several years ago when they gave me a job that had only previously been done by old white guys. Experience? How do you get any if no one takes a chance on you? And the decision to take a chance can be instinctive, as John McCain said.
And what about the argument that she is a negligent mother who will be distracted from her important role? I am a mother who constantly feels the pressure from others about whether I am fit to be a parent, whether I put my kids first often enough and whether my children get enough of my attention. Who has the right to judge my family?
My grandmother always said, "You can't tell time on someone else's clock." Judgments about people's personal lives are better left unsaid and unrealized.
So why then do I think that Sarah Palin would be a terrible vice president? Because I also think that John McCain would be a terrible president.
I don't care about how Sarah Palin or John McCain take care of their families. I care about how their policy choices affect my family and millions of other Americans.
McCain and Palin get their health insurance paid for by the government (hers in Alaska and his in Washington). Yet they oppose giving the nearly 46 million uninsured Americans the same access to affordable health care.
John McCain's kids don't have to worry about paying for college. Yet he has opposed every single education support program to help others.
McCain and Palin say they will stand up to oil companies. Yet the only energy policy they support gives millions of dollars in tax breaks to oil companies to do more drilling and he has opposed every piece of federal legislation to explore alternative fuel sources.
McCain and Palin say they will revamp how Washington does business. Yet his campaign is filled with lobbyists and she has cooperated with Sen. Ted Stevens in funneling federal money for useless projects in Alaska for years. And McCain and Palin have no solutions for Americans worrying about their jobs in a fragile economy. iReport.com: Is Palin the right choice for you?
McCain and Palin want us to leave their families alone. Yet they want to make rules for our families by eliminating our right to make our own choices over abortion, eliminate our access to family planning education or domestic partner benefits, and our freedom from discrimination.
They want to control what our kids learn in school about sex and about science. In short, through the policies they promote and the judges they support, they want the government to have more control over our private lives than at any time in history.
McCain and Palin now say their campaign is about change, too. Yet the only real change they have proposed is a change from a suit to a skirt in the vice president's office and one man fighting a misplaced war for another in the Oval Office.
That seems to me to be the right reason to oppose them in November. It's not the process or the people, it's what they represent. This unconventional choice of a vice presidential nominee by John McCain won't result in a win in November, because McCain and Palin are the wrong choice for the country.
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People who are republicans will see only the positives. People who are democrats will see only the negatives.
By the time we are old enough to vote our prejudices are hardwired into our brains, we have very little control over this.
Which is what makes the whole 12 month spectacle such a waste of time.. after 12 months and billions of dollars we'll be in the exact same situation we were before... with a couple of neutral voters in a few states deciding the whole thing.
PS/ how can anyone "love a country"?? Its a bizarre notion thats dreamt up and drilled into people for no good reason.
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And then there's this one: I'll be too old in 2008
What has changed?
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I was just wondering if any other women out there think its flattering to refer to themselves as pitbulls as Sarah Palin did?
As a young woman myself, I cant help but think that viciousness and aggressiveness, are not generally traits I look for in a Political candidate.....
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I haven't watched any of the speeches. My feeling is that whatever they say in an "important" speech like that is so filtered by their handlers that it bears little resemblance to what a candidate actually thinks - if they can even remember what they actually thought about an issue. I think those speeches are designed to say what the speech writers feel most people want them to say.
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Seems sometimes the comments here are spiralling out of control. I will admit to being a Brit in GB but I have family who live in Canada and USA. I have enjoyed reading many of the comments from both sides of the argument but it was #137 that really disturbed me. I'm not totally sure all your argument stands up. The Conservatives (i.e to the right and not socialist) privatised many services (i.e opened up to free markets). Blair/Brown continued this into the NHS so if things are rubbish it's because of openning up too much to free markets. I don't think anybody would say the EU or UK has it right but I think there is a perception that the Republicans for at least the last 4 years haven't been so good for the US especially overseas. As US news does appear a lot over here we do get some picture (I do wonder how often UK news appears in the US, last time I was in the US I don't remember that much). I think you are a bit harsh to compare Obama and McCain in personal accomplishments directly as McCain is 72 and therefore has had more time to pile them up. Also #137 McCain/Palin combine banning the choice of abortion with no choice against the teaching of Creationism (if that is what she really does believe). Such strong religious undertones within a party/government makes dialogue with shall we say non-believer states a bit harder. Anyway, rambled on enough. If I was there I would probably vote for an independent. Real change then :)
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I realise this probably isn't particularly helpful, but as soon as I heard Sarah Palin speaking the other day, I immediately thought of all the moms on South Park. Her intonation and pitch is almost identical.
Now, to have Trey Parker and Matt Stone writing her speeches - is that too much to ask for...?
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#159 AndreainNY
not quite sure what your point is here, and whether it is in fact directed at me or, rather, whether you had misunderstood the thread to that point...
In any case, I am not sure what you are getting at - Obama opposed the war from the start, did he not?
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American governance is dominated by corporate power, which this election will not change.
The U.S. Congress, corrupted by corporate money, can not undertake principled public service, such as using its constitutional powers to restrain imperial presidents, which this election will not change.
Our nation’s resources are being squandered and priceless opportunities lost on a global, corporate controlled American Empire, which this election will not change.
While it is unlikely Obama or McCain or their running mates will be as dreadful as Bush/Cheney, the American Empire will continue to spiral downward, with the fallout from eight years of reckless mismanagement preoccupying the new president, which this election will not change.
For all the vacuous drama generated by corporate media and candidates’ promises of "change", this election will decide the fate of personal ambitions and little else, because real change will come, likely unforeseen and unwelcome, as sure as the end of a rolling drum, which this election will not change.
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bethpa #158
Thanks for the links, though they seemed to me as expected, opinionated just like myself. That letter from her aquaintance though, her opinion is weighted by proximity and Sarah may be more mainstream (picked,trained,placed, just like Nobama, in my humble opinion:) then meets the eye.
Ed, you and you tube!! Do you have a cadre feeding you these links?
The polls haven't arrived to date this yet, but I'd say the bounce is nominal just as OB key-no-bees was.
Whats up Moderator man, lunch break or are the wires buzzing??
people, just people
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More on super-Trooper:
Aides to Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin improperly obtained her former brother-in-law's state police personnel files and cited information from those records to raise complaints about the officer, the head of Alaska's state police union said Thursday.
Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin has put an aide on leave during a probe into the firing of the public safety commissioner.
"It's apparent to us that the governor or someone on her staff had direct access to his personnel file, as well as his workers' comp file, and those are protected," said John Cyr, executive director of the Alaska Public Safety Employees Association.
I wonder what the deleted box in her Yahoo account looks like?
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I do love all the criticisms of the "liberal" media as if a conservative media or socialist media would be any better. What's better is the lumping of socialism and liberalism together yet they are quite different. If conservatism is right wing then it must be lumped with other "right wing" political philosophies that I won't mention as it might be deemed to offensive. And socialism has it's own extreme end.
What I want to know is who is standing as independents in the presidential race? And for those who criticise the apparent bias of the bbc over here towards Obama, we have satirical programs which laugh at his manner of presentation as much as laughing at McCain.
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Beth,
Thanks for your research, especially Kilkenny. Maybe Hillary and she should get together?
I sense a catfight coming!
Great spectator sport...
xx
ed
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# 158
Gratitude to Bethpa for drawing our attention to the Anne Kilkenny document.
Here are just SOME of the observations in that document :
~ She fought ideas that weren't generated by her own staff.
~ (after describing some of her staff selection methods she created) Staff loyal to the point of abusing their power to further her agenda
~ Fear of retribution has kept all of these people from saying anything publicly.
This is serious stuff. All the more so because it brings to mind a supremely powerful Vice Presidency that has utterly and completely altered the perception of American throughout the world. A Vice Presidency that has taken American from being seen as hero of democracy to torturing bully.
It is now up to the American press to investigate the Kilkenny observations - and if they care about their country and what can happen - and has happened - to it if they fall asleep on the watch, they had better do their job well.
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#88, Bunny
I need to, with all due respect, disagree with you. Republicans have always branded patriotism, this is not a new phenonemon.
Being a POW attests to convictions and McCain's story is one of tremendous character. At the end of the day, the American people will be voting on who they trust for the job and a big part of this is character.
All of his opponents and critics are quite welcome to attack his policies and his ideological beliefs, but when we attack a veteran, let alone a prisoner of war who underwent the depths of hell for his country, then I think we have lost our humanity. He is a hero. But, I believe that all men and women who wear a uniform are heros. I could never imagine putting myself in harm's way every day as they do ...
Also, re: the debates. The problem that Obama is going to have is that he will be limited in time for his answers. McCain gives short answers. It will be interesting to watch.
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99. Irish_Mark wrote:
#16 "BBC News are trying to link McCain to the Bush Administration."
Perhaps that's because McCain voted with Bush 90% of the time.
How quickly he forgot how he was treated by Bush's people.
****************
A few points.
First, Factcheck.org reports that Obama voted with Bush 40% of the time.
It also reports that Obama voted with his party 97% of the time. Surely, you're not suggesting this election should be a referendum on Pelosi?
It's too bad Obama's not running against Bush. Therein lies Obama's greatest chance to win.
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#163 Chill0
I really am amazed you can continue to run this argument 3 years after it was utterly discredited. The intelligence was not 'expressed with as much certainty as intelligence ever did', it was lukewarm but spun by politicians for their own ends.
An imminent attack means exactly that. Not some tin pot dictator with a can of germs half way around the world from you! Are you honestly saying with a straight face that George Bush genuinely believed that Saddam Hussein had the power and technology to launch an attack on the USA?? He could barely control the Kurds for crying out loud!!
I think you need to start doing some thinking for yourself, my friend.
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Corrupt Republican lobbyist Mr. Abramoff is off to jail for 4 years, in part, due to John McCain.
I guess he walks his talk.
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"Yes I believe people in NC (particularly whites) are very sensitive. Back country people used to be very, very, very sensitive to black people too didn't they.
They actually made postcards to demonstrate their "sensitivity" to the wider world."
Simon: How many hours do you spend here mocking and ridiculing Americans? Have you been to North Carolina?
What conceivable reason could you possibly have to spend time on a web site insulting the people of another nation?
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I've always found it most useful to just read the printouts of political speeches; it allows me to understand what the speaker (or speechwriter) set out to say before the hoopla and lighting got in the way.
American, Brit, or anyone in the world - no country can even attempt isolationalism anymore on a realistic basis. Both America's President and the UK's PM have to represent their country to the rest of the world. But right now, the focus in America is on internal issues, because the internal feel of America is not, at the moment, a good one. It's also heavily influenced by the media, which is why I turn to places like the BBC to give me a more realistic sense of current events. I have no idea whether it works.
Americans don't need to come together for "love of America." We need to come together with common sense and mindfulness of ourselves, our fellow countrymen, and every creature with whom we share the world. I spent a semester abroad in London, and one of my first memories there was of picking up the newspaper and seeing that there had been a rape. One rape, on the other side of town. People talked about it for weeks. I felt I was with sound, sensible individuals, even if they did use an unnecessary "u" in "color."
In America, I feel often that I am apathetic, and so are the rest of my fellow citizens. Otherwise, why would we allow fear to influence us so much? We live on a soil that's barely been touched by violence from anyone but our own people for the last 200 years. Comparatively speaking, we're only slightly less isolated than Canada. Or Switzerland. Or Antarctica. And even they have a cohesive health care system.
Whomever you vote for, please make sure you're choosing someone who will represent America well, and who will be able to motivate its citizens toward reclaiming the values that made us prosperous to begin with.
My greatest fear is that George W. Bush will somehow declare a state of martial law, or say that he just "gets another term," and that things will never get better. Let's just make things better. After all, the government of the American people is supposed to BE the American People.
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AndreainNY
Can you believe this one time poster on any BBC blog is calling you a "Spammer"
DaveInTexas #22
I'm still saying we must be aware of these fools, cause they ain't foolin' anyone.
Alot must be happening as the mods are behind, here anyway, over an hour and a half. Can tell huh, rereading those I skipped over.
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154. Ed Iglehart:
Actually, I think the official orders given to servicemen in case of capture are to refuse any "early release". All he was doing was following orders.
*******************
I suppose you could also say that withstanding years of beatings because he refused to cooperate was just "following orders".
If only Obama were as good at following orders as McCain, we could all rest easily.
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DougTexan
Interesting points, and quite possibly represents the thinking behind some of the more intelligent neo-cons in the White House.
Would you agree, however, that far from introducing a beacon of democracy in the region (a noble goal in itself), the Iraq war has in fact achieved the opposite: it has made Iran and its neighbours more fundamentalist and more hateful of the USA?
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172. At 2:42pm on 05 Sep 2008, DougTexan wrote:
Ed #138, Great efort to get the overseas voter registared, I always thought it was still done through snail mail.
We still do not have a Historical occurance of one democracy waring with another, and until that happens and I pray it doesn't, our hope for world peace, lies in Democracy for All,... ie: freedom."
This is not actuially true, though it is often trotted out. Apart from the US civil war in which both sides were, by the standards of the time, democractic.
Spain in 1898 was a nascent democracy when war broke out with the US.
there is also WWI where Germany, though not a full democracy like France nonetheless was a democracy and that did not stop 10 million deaths.
What this phrase often means is the form of government we call full democracy has not had many wars. Largely that is only true because states like these were, until recently relatively rare.
But it is a very dangerous mistake to assume that war cannot be a very popular activity (at first at least) and that "democracies" have not initiated conflicts aimed at self glorification.
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"Reaction from the heartland" is nothing more than one journalist's off-the-cuff remarks on the speech, followed by those of a few bloggers.
Wait a minute! That's what this is!
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"The choices is clear, and it would be political suicide if America does not choose Barack Obama as president and Joe Biden as Vice President."
It may be clear to goleooo #168, but it sure isn't to the contender and his party.
I myself see the direct opposite, not political suicide, but the death of the America that leads the world in inovation, improvosation and implimentation.
Though the Nobama presidency would be a short four years, his choice will keep the democrats from office for another long twelve years.
Remember, the US government is parted into three pieces, and they (dems) currently hold two, and are failing misserably in both. With a McCain presidency, his leadership with them would help them more than Obama, who wouldn't balance, but fall into the same we had as when the Republicans had the whole pie.
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Is Rednyella smoking some hippy tobacco? I presume she or he hates hippies, so what gives?
"No thank you very much! As McCain says we want choice, the ability to choose ourselves not let the government do it for you and we want free markets. Obama with regulate the snot out of everything and then we'll see stagnation like the EU!!!"
So, Americans want free, unregulated markets. How about the market for mortgages? I think that is certainly something that needs more regulation, not less.
Some of the lending that happened in the US, that has led to the present global financial crisis, verged on criminal.
One example I know of off-hand is that of people who got houses through the housing charity Habitat for Humanity. It is not uncommon in some states for these home-owners, after physically building their homes with their neighbours and volunteers, and with the help of no-interest mortgages, to be duped into re-mortgaging. The terms start off favourable and end up usurious. The result is repossession. People with little education and poor literacy are tricked out of their possessions. It is not clear to me that free markets can help them.
This is just one example of the subprime madness that swept America and is now screwing up the world's financial system. And you want more of this?
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Change and reform from the party that brought us eight years of W?
They can attempt to talk the talk but its the same old neo- cons in lipstick .
I dont believe it and dont buy into it in the least .
Anyway you slice it ,the republicans are the same old warmed over tripe being served one more time to the Ameircan public
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Doug,
Hitler was elected.Complain about this comment
No 46. Comments acknowledged. I'll leave it for others to decide on whether Georgia's action was a unilateral required strategy to muster US support or not. The punitive Russian counter-punch was not, in my opinion, about seizing / denying the Baku-Ceyhan pipeline. But, if Moscow had wanted it? The real tragedy here is the loss of life and displaced refugees.
On top of demographics, energy and deep rooted cultural and religious issues, also note where the 2014 Winter Olympics event is to be staged and the regional implications.
Typing this listening to commentary from spokespeople in Tehran and Moscow after this finale speech. Moderates in Iran view Sen Obama as offering *light at the end of the tunnel* in respect of their hope and scope for positive future relations. President Dimitry Medvevev apparently views Sen Obama as a man from a younger, fresh, political generation with whom he / Russia can best do business.
Your last para is a good one to comment on re: the UN. The UN is and remains a critical global institution. But the trick is what happens on a personal level between world leaders behind the scenes. This is where the business can be and should be done effectively. Get these relationships right and this would mitigate the ganging up; dogma and vetoing failures that have so prevalent this decade?
A personal opinion. America and the West needs a completely fresh focus and SURGE in developing and fostering better relations with the Moscows, Pekings, Tehrans and other developing nations of this world. Just like the USA, these countries have aspirations, rights and acute responsibilities for providing for and managing, the best interests of their own people.
Examples of key battlegrounds are climate change; diminishing resources; rank global corruption; human trafficking, slavery, abuse and abject poverty which, in 2008, is incredulous, but reality (including the reported 200,000 homeless veterans in the USA).
Funnily enough, here in 2008, I sense that the antithesis of the traditional profile expected by many Americans as President is the one best placed to deliver. I stick with my belief that Sen Barack Obama has the qualities required i.e. pragmatism, flexibility, understanding, cultural sensitivity and the wherewithal to build much needed bridges and trust with his opposite numbers.
Highly contentious, but maybe a good starting point would be to take a real step out of the box and look to actually engage Al Qaeda / Taleban in some sort of dialogue akin to those with the IRA. This issue is not going to disappear magically in a puff of smoke. When was the last time since 1988 / 1994? Fortuna Virtutis Comes.
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"As a Brit with a passing interest, I would rather see Obama in power in the hope that he can diffuse the UK general public's perceived grotesqueness of American foreign policy in the Middle East. If you ask who the most dangerous man in the world is over here, the predominant answer is George Bush....the Republican. That's a dangerous position for John McCain and Sarah Palin to have to follow, given their respective stances on foreign policy."
This is not just a UK perception, this is a world perception. The world believes George Bush and associates made this world a most dangerous place to live with their foreign policy.
Unfortunately, the world is waiting for someone, anyone who can change that and make the USA great again instead of the most hated country on earth.
McCain is same old, same old. His policy is no different then Bush and that, my friends, is really scary.
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McCain does have grace. He is, after all, "an officer and a gentleman." But Republicans today don't necessarily want grace, they want pit bulls (even those with lipstick!). When McCain went for a strong finish at the end, he struck me as old and tired, when a presidential candidate should be vigorous. Sad, really.
The "disappointment" arises out of the conflicts within the party. The right wing wants to control the party and its nominee, but they haven't succeeded this year. They demanded and got Palin, but they want it all.
The Democrats, on the other hand, have a similar problem. For a long time they have been beholden to their left wing, which sometimes leaves them looking a little foolish and vulnerable to attack. This should be a walkover for the Democrats, but it isn't because of the unoccupied middle.
The number of independent voters has increased in recent years. Will we someday reach a time when there is enough room in the middle for a new centrist party to succeed? It sounds unlikely to most Americans, who think that the dominance of our politics by two parties is a "system." But then, the Communist Party of the Soviet Union lost control. Anything is possible.
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They say that America and Britian have a special relationship but the more I read about this election the more I think that the only thing we have in common is the same language.
Sarah Palin as I understand it is a creationist who believes that the world was formed 6,000 years ago. This belief flys in the face of all scientific evidence, facts and theory available to us. It seems to me that if someone can seriously believe this in denial of all know and accepted studies on the subject purely on the basis that this does not support her religious views then she does not have a proper grip on the realities of life.
One might say, what does that have to do with anyone other than the American public?Well the fact of the matter is that whoever wins the race to the White House probably has more longterm affect upon us than who is in power in Downing Street. Epsecially when one considers the similarity of the parties nowdays in the UK.
Sarah Palin is also pro-life and anti abortion in all circumstances but seems to think that all animals are fair game. I would love to hear her views on homosexuality and race. It struck me that someone like this could only come to prominence in the US as fundamental religious beliefs and politics would never settle easy with the electorate in this country. In addition, it scares me a lot to think that, with John McCain being potentially the oldest President of all time, it is not inconceivable that this woman could end up as the most powerful person in the world. I am then comforted by the thought that the most advanced country in the world with an intelligent and for the most part well educated electorate would never allow this situation to occur. Depression soon sets in when I remember that I thought the same thing twice before but we still had 8 years of GW Bush.
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#181 Chill0
You didn't understand the point I was making.
Politically, following the ill-fated invasion of Iraq, it will be incredibly difficult for any US government to carry out an invasion of Iran, however justified that invasion might be. The US would get no support, probably not even from the UK, and large sections of the US would not support it having seen what actually happened in Iraq.
Had Bush been a little more circumspect in relation to Iraq (which, as you failure to repsond to my point regarding launching an attack on the US proves, was wholly unnecessary), the US might be able to garner some support for taking on Iran, which poses a much greater threat.
Yours is a classic example of Bush (i.e. primary school) understanding of foreign policy, as is demonstated by your inability to understand why the 'highly dissuasive' policies have utterly failed to dissuade anyone. You need to convince people that your (our) way of life should be adopted, not provide them with more and more reasons to think the exact opposite.
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ref #176
Palin has not blamed Obama, she has rightly blamed the biased left wing press and the hate sights like the Daily Kos.
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From a Canadian point of view, I believe, McCain, Obama and Hillary are all very sincere about their agendas and love their country. I just do not trust Palin. She is a threat, to the international image of the US, and to the freedom of common people. She is narrow minded, full of hatred, and attacks without reasoning. In many ways she is not in line with McCain. My of my American friends here are worried that if she is in power, not only the war with Iraq won't be over, but there will be more wars with N Korea, Iran and any country that is not to the taste of the US government.
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#135, iwinter:
"McCain is old, Palin is popular. If the republicans win this time round there's a very big possibility Palin could become president."
We are all a plane crash, a car accident, a heart attack, a stroke, and a freak accident away from death. So, yes, Palin could become President.
"Here's the problem, Palin is anti-abortion even in the case of rape/incest, "
But, I don't think she is in a position to dictate her views on anyone. If she happens to end up as President, and an opportunity arises to pick a judge, and that judge passes the approval of Congress, then she would have a voice. A legislator would have a far bigger impact, such as...
Let's review the counter case... Barrack Obama is one of the most pro-abortion person in Washington. In Chicago, in many late term abortions the baby was born alive, and the doctors would let it die. In response, in 2002, legislation was crafted called "Induced Infant Liability Act" which was killed in committee by Barrak Obama.
NARAL Pro-Choice America released a statement that said,
The same type of legislation, Born Alive Infant Protection Act, went before the Federal Congress with only 15 nay votes in the House, and unanimously passed the Senate. Barrack Obama would have late term babies born alive die.
"she doesn't believe the world-wide scientific consensus on climate change, "
She may need to be brought up to speed on some facts. This is one. Her position as governor though is similar to mine. I oppose so called "green" actions that will make things worse, like corn based ethanol.
"she believes that creationism should be taught in schools over evolution, "
No, she has said she thinks it would be alright if both were taught. I disagree with her on this. I think theology belongs in the philosophy class.
"she thinks guns are good, "
Guns are good... for killing things. If you are defending your property, nothing beats a gun.
"she's pro-oil drilling in enviromentally weak areas,"
You mean like ANWAR? Saving 2000 acres out of millions is fanatical environmentalism. America bought Alaska for its natural resources, and now you would like it to be one huge National Park?
"she's pro-hunting even of endangered species (polar bears)"
That is misleading. Here is what she said in the New York Times.
"she's anti-homosexuality,"
Again, that is misleading. She has been in defense of marriage as between a man and a woman, and has been against same sex partners receiving state benefits as if they were married. Many Americans believe the same, (2008 CBS polls had 58% opposed, and 36% in favor).
"she's pro-death penalty, "
When an adult kills a child.
"she's against sex education."
She is not. She has been against explicit sex education for children in schools, which included handing out contraceptives in schools. She is even pro-contraception. Her stand is that sex education is a parental prerogative. My view is that it should be taught, but not before age 15. There are some places that are teaching 10 years olds.
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"181. At 2:52pm on 05 Sep 2008, chill0 wrote:
#139 GHBRich
An alternative is that they are emboldened. That has hardly occurred as a result of American government actions which were highly dissuasive. Rather, it is as a result of the reaction in the media and by anti-Iraq-War groups."
You reckon. You do not think helping the Iranians by removing a threat to their western border (aside from boosting the price of their oil) has not perhaps emboldened them?
And you don't think the failure of the US army in Iraq to secure the country other than by financing and handing out weapons to tribal gangs, as was done in Afghanistan to disastorous effect, has not shown up the country's military as incompetent?
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#184 - TimothyR444
This blog is a place for people who visit the site to exchange views on what is happening around the world. You should be flattered that so many people so far away are sufficiently interested in your country to contribute. there is no need to get upset because some do not agree with your personal views.
You ask whether a site exists for Americans to do the same come British election time. I fear there might not be. Why? Because, from what I can, most Americans are not particularly interested in what goes on outside of their shores. How many can name the current Conservative leader?
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Are we rational beings, true and true? It is clear we love and hate politicians the way we love and hate our women/men.
If we love Obama, then we love him, no matter he does (love is blind).
If we hate MCcain, then we just hate him, no matter what he does (Hate is blind!).
Why don't we all just shut up. Or do we hope to persuade voters? Long shot. they are also lovers and haters like us.
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Troubling for me is that so little seems to be made of those whom she has upset in the republican party.
Not just the lowly unknowns, but the senior (R) Senator from Alaska
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185
The point was that when asked what overseas countries Palin had visited, she said: Iarq, Kuwait, Germany, Ireland, and Canada.
It turned out that the first four were all on the 2007 trip but that the stopover in Ireland was solely to refurl the plane at the airport. Now, I don't know about you, but I've passed through plenty of airports but that doesn't mean that I have visited that city or country: it's a rather desperate attempt to puff out a very slim CV.
And before she became Governor of Alaska, as far as I am aware, she had spent time in Alaska, Idaho, and Hawaii. She then went to Dallas and DC. I'd be fascinated to know whether prior to her visit to Arizona just over a week ago what other states she had visited.
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No, Andrea, at least one major political party seems to think at least half the American population is stupid. I'm optimistic that they will be proved wrong.
No, Ed, you think half the American population is stupid. Come on, just admit it.
It must be nice feeling smarter than millions of Americans. I'm in awe of you.
;-)
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Commentbrbrco,
UK Politics have swung to the Left have they?
Clearly you know absoloutly NOTHING about British Politics. This is fair enough, its probably not really of any consequence to you, but please refrain from commenting on it! At least until someones explained the concept of New Labour to you as a bare minimum....
#66 This has been discussed on a previous thread but the Queen is in no way comparable to the President. Arguments for keeping her tend to rely on the fact that she has no real power. They'd soon oust her sharpish if she ever put her foot down!!
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re:182
its frustrating to have made a list of the people ..generals, diplomats etc who opposed the Iraq war..because many of them did not believe there were wmd that could endanger the US only to see it moderated
anyway this is what Obama said before the war from:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opposition_to_the_Iraq_War
"But I also know that Saddam poses no imminent and direct threat to the United States, or to his neighbors, that the Iraqi economy is in shambles, that the Iraqi military a fraction of its former strength, and that in concert with the international community he can be contained until, in the way of all petty dictators, he falls away into the dustbin of history. I know that even a successful war against Iraq will require a US occupation of undetermined length, at undetermined cost, with undetermined consequences. I know that an invasion of Iraq without a clear rationale and without strong international support will only fan the flames of the Middle East, and encourage the worst, rather than best, impulses of the Arab world, and strengthen the recruitment arm of Al Qaeda. I am not opposed to all wars. I'm opposed to dumb wars."– Then-Illinois State Sen. Barack Obama, October 2, 2002
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TimothyR444, I don't know if you have ever been to one of the Have Your Say message boards but plenty of Americans leave messages there. I think many over here and in Europe are just scared by another term of a Republican administration having seen what has happened globally in the last two terms. But as you will appreciate in a free world everybody has a right to an opinion. So who would you want in power over here? The whole build up to the US elections started even before the primaries here so you can start advising us over here. I would be intrigued.
I just thought McCain looked uncomfortable and actually quite shifty. What was with his winking and secret smile? Palin just seems a bit scary.
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From your local supermarket checkout....Publish and be darned? It takes testicular fortitude, and will doubtless enrich quite a few lawyers...
;-)
ed
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ref #188
You might take a lesson from Obama, family is off limites.
Cindy McCain had done tremendous charity work.
Why do people have rose colored glasses with Diana? She cheated on her husband and she actibly went after being the Princess of Wales.
She was closer to Heather Mills than Mother Theresa
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Justin,
and everyone else, have you seen the atrocious comments posted by us Brits on the BBC 'Have your Say' blog? It's incredible. V sad.
This forum seems so much more disciplined in comparison, even if there are strong comments to each other. Well done people on here!
I thought the speech was not terribly poor, only nothing very special. More to rouse the troops, as it were...
Very intriguing contest it will be, but for me, Obama's assurance and 'presidential' qualities shine brighter and clearer.
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"John McCain is such a "maverick" that he voted party lines 90% of the time."
It is an unfair characterization because it counts things like, "National Buckwheat Day". McCain is a maverick because he crosses the aisle so much so that it ticks off Republicans. Like on Immigration reform, McCain Feingold, etc. Bush and the neocons don't like McCain.
"One last rant, McCain has enlisted the help of Karl Rove to run his campaign...have we so soon forgotten who Karl Rove's previous employer was?"
No, he works for Fox News, he is an informal adviser to the McCain campaign.
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"199. At 3:15pm on 05 Sep 2008, DougTexan wrote:
Reuben34g #157
Palin-Jindal 16-20
now that's scary if your a democrat, cause who ya got?"
Dunno, but it sounds like an obscure martial art.
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#184
Hey Tim, Im sure if you go on to the CNN website you could find something that your looking for.
If reading English comments on an American election bothers you, maybe you should get off the English website? Or you could use this space to appreciate the views of all others, rather than wasting valuable blog space moaning about it.
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doug texan,
you seem to be precisely a redneck, with the intellect of a coffee cup, just about the sort of person that has darkened the image of americans everywhere in the world to the point that when my friends come and visit, they were CANADIAN PINS and FLAGS on their backpacks so that they are not targeted, robbed, humiliated, and left alone.
but hey come on, your' a texan. your idea of fun is sitting people on electric chairs and pulling the switch.
You seem to be a very special person, and it would be my honour to introduce you to the governor of Alaska, because she is an advocate for all special people like you. the two of you can go fishing together, or better off, put on your pitbull masks and hide in corners to scare sidewalkers and their kids.
Just an idea..
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184. At 2:55pm on 05 Sep 2008, TimothyR444 wrote:
Well go to an american site then or stop complaining you pathetic over patriotic twit.
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#187 Ed Iglehart
I did include the word 'probably' in the Robin Cook quote which is the only place it is used. The CIA report contains no such word. You have ignored the whole quote from the CIA document which is as definite as language allows.
The reason I used the quote from Robin Cook's resignation speech is that he opposed the Iraq War and resigned because of it. His assessment is therefore illuminating about the state of mind of opponents of the war at that time.
The other British document is the Joint Intelligence Committee report which contains the reference to chemical or biological weapons available for launch within 45 minutes. That also could not be more definite.
You are preaching to the converted. I do not believe Iran has any major hostile intent nor that it is developing nuclear weapons.
I do believe that Iran is financing groups which are part of the problem in the Middle East but only in the same sense that, say, Israeli settlers are also part of the problem.
I used Iran as the example because they are currently an issue. I therefore ask the same question as before - if you were President of the USA and you were told by your intelligence agencies - backed up by others internationally - that a regime inimical to the interests of the USA has WMD, what would you do ?
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Sam,
Can't you get a better acronym than BUFWGTBBGFO?
;-)
ed
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Sam
#157
"And another thing. I am sick of the Republican party being the party of fat bald middle aged white Christian males who love their guns. I am a fat bald middle aged white Christian male who loves his guns and I have been progressively turned off by the Republicans over the last 8 years.
While I am going to remain solidly independant I do think we should have an action group called 'Bald Ugly Fat White Gun Totin' Bible bashin' guys for Obama."
Never thought I'd see such honesty, very well said, and very refreshing to hear, even if 'gun-toting, bible bashin' might not be my thing!
Good on you Sam!
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There are many people posting here who say or imply that Sarah Palin should not be allowed to be Vice President because of her religious beliefs.
Would you allow a moslem to be Vice President then ?
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the last 8 years have been a liberal conspiracy.
liberal liberal. did you see the liberalforgot my economic plan liberals , liberals,i'm a real american liberals, liberals not pow's liberals.
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I think that McCain's performance was adequate. He's not a gifted orator like Barrak. The speech was well written, and it touched on the things it needed to for the audience.
I feel the convention was a 45 degree turn for the Republicans. They were heading for a dead end in November, but the "Country First" message and the folksy populism of Sarah Palin will resonate with Americans who are worried about domestic issues. McCain doesn't need to convince anyone he can handle the Commander in Chief job, but he does need to let people know he supports peace, and domestic prosperity.
Many people who post here think she is akin to trailer trash, and then again, so too was Bill Clinton. Backwoods Alaska, and backwoods Arkansas are not much different except the weather. Elitism and pomposity will kill the Obama campaign. The people in America are tired with the inaction of the blowhard elite in Washington. All the issues that are hot buttons for Americans, were hot button issues 4 years ago, 8 years ago, 12 years ago, and 16 years ago. Climate change and the advent of global peak oil has escalated the energy and environment issues.
The Bush's are done, they had their time and nothing got done. The Clinton's are done, they had their time and nothing got done.
Like I said earlier. If McCain can distance himself from the shabby coat tails of GWB, it will be a whole new race.
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I think it is very unfair that the BBC have left a single moderator to clear the blog while the rest have gone off to the pub ;) Hence, I'm going to do lookwise: it's Friday 5pm and the uncleared list should be sorted out by the time I am back :)
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#46 chillo: "The Iraq War was prompted by Saddam Hussein" - prompted perhaps, but not started by. There is a great difference.
#66. BSlight: "In the UK we happen to be 'blessed' with whoever is fortunate enough to be the eldest child born into the House of Windsor." There's a vast difference between an apolitical head-of-state and the American Presidency; The Queen has absolutely nothing to do with policy. Parliament is supreme, not the Monarch.
#137. Rednyella "I spoke to my family and friends at home . . . and not one knew about who McCain was." Perhaps that's because they only read the tabloids? The Times, Telegraph, Independent and yes, even The Guardian, have reported on Mr McCain in depth.
"As for Healthcare, vote for Obama if you want low quality, low standards, doctors and nurses fleeing as they get paid nothing and go somewhere else." Like the NHS, some healthcare provision is better than NO healthcare provision. I'll bet you were born in an NHS hospital and you and your parents have used NHS facilities. In addition to the NHS, health insurance is available in the UK. At least British residents don't become bankrupt over treatment as can be the case in the USA. Go back to the UK (your home) and change the system if you don't like it. Whingeing about it from thousands of miles away won't help anyone.
Jon McCain - and Cindy - ask that we trust him; his first wife couldn't. That says volumes about his character.
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re #137
You talk about socialism and big government as been the same thing. But big government is overwhelmingly American. The US is so regulated at city, county, state and federal it absolutely spins your head. If you have to deal with these organisations everyday you may realize just how cumbersome the US government is.
I have a client-a Vietnam vet, just like McCain. You try get this guy treatment and social security like he deserves. I see a 70 year old man, suffering from his war injuries, desperately seeking help from Veteran Affairs, Social Security and been given the run around from government at all levels. I see a man with thousands in unpaid medical bills that is losing his home. I see a man that was contemplating killing himself because there was no-one willing to help-even his church! If this is a example of how great the US government and society is then something is clearly wrong.
McCain just is not getting it. Yes he has suffered! But he has also lived a very privilaged upbringing. He has seven homes, a multi-millionairess wife, an elite health care plan etc. You need to wake up! 6% of the population is out of work. 6% of the population is getting their homes repossessed.
What McCain/Palin are offering is more of the same. No healthcare plans, no economic plans. All I heard was some conservative christian rhetoric. The speech appealed to the that group in the Republican party but not the disaffected democrats or the independents.
And no, I am not a democrat. I am a economic conservative and libertarian. Someone who represents people against this monolithic government.
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#203, Ed Iglehart:
Isn't the White House an old soldiers home?
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melissambuckwheat #192
"John McCain is such a "maverick" that he voted party lines 90% of the time. Obama is no different, but he doesn't paint himself up to be something he isn't."
Missy, (N)Obama sure does paint himself as what he isn't. Nonpartisin.
JM at least voted against his own 10% of the time and co-authored a few bill with Democrats.
I'd like someone to give me three definite Obama only or lead things he has done while in office,... just three.
so gone
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The GOP made the argument that only they can fix the mess they have made of this country ove the last eight years. They want low taxes with a half trillion dollar deficit and ten trillion dollar debt. They want only private health insurance when 50 million people in the US don't have any health insurance. They confuse nationalistic militarism with patriotism, and they appeal to the least educated and cultured people in this country. We can do better than that. We don't all live in trailer parks, carry guns, thump our Bibles, listen to country music, and want unplanned kids with disabilities. Most of us live in cities, want tougher gun laws, sporadically go to church, listen to hip hop or rock, and want our children and theirs to be planned. This is not the 1950s. Being American isn't what is used to be.
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SamTyler1969 FOX? Where on FOX did you find the Convention, either of them? FOX nightly news here was broadcasting ABC.
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miketheagle (#53), you misunderstand one important aspect of our electoral process. As we are a federal system, many things are the responsibilities of the individual states. All of the machinery of elections is controlled by the states, except for the certifying and counting of electoral votes by the Congress. Within a state, the responsibility is further delegated to the counties. Counties within one state may have different means of ballotting, subject to meeting state standards. When snafus occur, they are usually limited to a county. On the whole, the system is quick and reliable. It sometimes appears not to be, because of the confusion in Florida in 2000. Had the election not been close, or had the system in Florida been better, there would have been no difficulty.
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so the hard details of the mc cain plan are now evident to all
his economic policy is there,
his grasp of diplomacy is there.
no sorry that's a lie , but there were some liberals.
and all of 35 african americans. wow.
diversity in action, must have taken a lot of people from various countries to feed and hostel all them big fat american geriatrics.
Did anyone notice that the hall was full of OLD people.
OLDIES oldies oldies a sea of oldies.
not liberals
most so senile they think voting GOP is patriotic.
Did no one tell them that their party is a party of old has-beens trying to cling to what viagra pills they have left.
I'm a liberal
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#198, Sam
CNN and BBC America were the only outlets that I watched. CNN had a proportionate number of republicans and democrats through both conventions and tried to come off as unbiased (and to a very large extent they were successful.) BBC America delved into the minutia and posed difficult questions (or at least tried to) to current and former leaders and, for the most part, reported rather than commented. Fox, well, as you said, is Fox and haven't watched them in years. And, MSNBC, particularly Olberman, has become the liberal equivalent of Fox, therefore a complete waste of time to watch.
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BillTyrone Post # 30.
I read your post looking, but finding absolutely nothing conservative or Republican in it. I therefore must also doubt the veracity of your claim of identity as a former military officer. I do believe that you have served in Iraq in some capacity. Perhaps you are one of the many civilian contractors who are making astronomical sums of money over there, capitalizing on the country's recovery from war... nothing personal... someone has to do it.
Regarding your comments:
1. As someone who has driven and walked along the MSR's of Iraq, I have seen many ordinary Iraqis you speak of, who are living in abject poverty. True, they are no better off than they were 5 years ago financially. (It's certain that Saddam was not sharing the country's oil wealth with the majority of the Iraqi population either.) What they do have now that Saddam is gone is opportunity. Unfortunately, the Iraqi population has only known a tyrant's rule for over a quarter of a century. They don't share well with each other... culturally they have learned to exist by climbing on top of each other. It takes intellect and education to be able to take advantage of opportunity and hope.
It is the next generation of Iraqis who will grow up in an environment of freedom and who will benefit the most from this war. That's exactly what the terrorists are most afraid of. But I digress...
2. What's your point? You say your point is:
"Diplomacy, Foreign Relations and Communications are the required tools of the trade for the future." If you truly had been a military officer you would understand my point: That effective influence in foreign relations require the applicable use of Diplomacy, Communications, Economic leverage, and (hopefully as a last resort) Military force.
Your closing argument shows a lack of comprehension:
"The US needs to convert enemies and perceived enemies into friends right now. The best person to do this has great intellect; develpment potential; carries no baggage; has demonstrated a marked affinity to gel with other key heads of states and has a profile not biased towards jingoism. I believe his approach and persona will curry deep respect and understanding from many nations and human beings worldwide looking earnestly for this lead."
Enemies of the US will not be converted by a good Obama speech. Most of our enemies don't speak English.
While I agree that Obama has great intellect and DEVELOPMENT POTENTIAL... the US Presidency is NOT a place to develop!
I do not want a pretty-boy-rock-star learning the ropes as the head of state for the most powerful nation in the free world! You are right saying that he has no baggage... good or bad... he is an empty candidate. With his short career being devoid of any foreign experience, has he ever even met a key head of state?
I believe that with his approach and persona Obama will curry an attitude that the US is weak. He cannot make a decision. This will endanger the lives of US citizens around the world as terrorists, and rogue nations are emboldened to try and exploit us.
My point is this: I am convinced the entire world would be a much safer place if President McCain was in charge.
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bethpa I have said to friends that If the Mc criminal wants my vote he better promise to put GW and dick on trial.Twist, impeachment I want them to face the death penalty(of course I do not wish the state to be so stupidly murderous as to carry it out)
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To Ed Iglehart
It has just occurred to me that about WMD in Iraq we are at cross purposes.
You are thinking of WMD only as nuclear weapons. It is called WMD because it includes chemical and biological weapons.
The CIA report uses 'probably' for nuclear weapons because it is talking about the future. It is definited about chemical and biological weapons in the present, as is the UK JIC report.
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Just FYI and possibly why mods are slow:
204 through 270, all awaiting to be posted ritght now, five have never posted on any BBC blog, four only once.
Thats how long I've been just looking.
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shewantstobeinformed (#121), if the percentage of women delegates at the Republican National Convention seems low, it may be merely because the Democratic Party has rules which require equal representation. I don't think the Republicans have this rule.
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
#202, soul
Um, nope. Don't agree with you. Not this time, as Obama says.
In this election there will be myriad voters not towing the line and voting for the other party.
For the first time in decades, there are voters re-registering on the other side. This has already been evidenced.
In one way, we should thank Pres. Bush for having caused so much discord in this country that it's people have become activated.
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#209
And, when is the world ending?
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Two comments:
1. I live in St. Paul and close enough to watch everyone come and go. The last time I saw such a police state was in Peru in 1990 under marshal law because of the Sendero. This is what we have to look forward to if the Republicans win.
2. The republicans are the biggest liars on the planet, topping even Putin and the President of Iran. They can't tell the truth because they know they will get soundly beaten if they tell the truth. McCain is no maverick, he cow-towed to the far right and is pandering to women. Demeaning, not exciting.
Example of the lying: Democrats won't give you balanced budget. The last republican with a balanced budget was Herbert Hoover (late 1920s for you Brits). Since then both Lyndon Johnson and Bill Clinton had balanced budgets. So which party can't deliver on a balanced budget?
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"Since 2003, executives and employees of Exelon, which is based in Illinois, have contributed at least $227,000 to Mr. Obama’s campaigns for the United States Senate and for president. Two top Exelon officials, Frank M. Clark, executive vice president, and John W. Rogers Jr., a director, are among his largest fund-raisers.
Another Obama donor, John W. Rowe, chairman of Exelon, is also chairman of the Nuclear Energy Institute, the nuclear power industry’s lobbying group, based in Washington. Exelon’s support for Mr. Obama far exceeds its support for any other presidential candidate.
In addition, Mr. Obama’s chief political strategist, David Axelrod, has worked as a consultant to Exelon. A spokeswoman for Exelon said Mr. Axelrod’s company had helped an Exelon subsidiary, Commonwealth Edison, with communications strategy periodically since 2002, but had no involvement in the leak controversy or other nuclear issues."
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Invisible,
NO! It attests to getting caught. Nothing more.Complain about this comment
Ed (#154), you are correct. There were about 600 US aviators captured and held by North Vietnam, and all were subject to the same rules and largely the same treatment. McCain, as the son of an Admiral, may have been treated somewhat differently, but they were all basically in the same boat.
I am struck by how little mention McCain made of the sacrifice endured by all prosoners of war. It seems to me that he wants to be seen as exceptional within that group.
I don't say that he wasn't courageous. All of these aviators put themselves in harm's way, and more than 600 paid a heavy price for it. And others were killed, of course. He was one who survived, and I don't doubt that it improved his character as he described.
Not a reason to elect him president, for me.
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Cool One,
And one or more of his acolytes walked their walk right onto McCain's campaign staff.Complain about this comment
Community Organisation
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McCain and Abramoff
;-)
ed
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I just wanted to say, that if any Europeans, or
Brits who consider themselves to be Europeans,
are reading this blog, then they must consider
some Americans to be incredibly isolated from
viewing our campaign.
But then, this is more or less a common
stereotype of Europeans for Americans.
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
TO DougTexan:
Good sir, i can challenge you on political debates every day of the year and twice on holidays.
Yes the democrats are in control currently, but america is sufferering from the republican control of the previous 6 years, because every bill or reform needs a few years to produce results. Georgie did not veto a single bill during the previous 6 years that everything was bloody republican and this is what it produced. An America that is despised in the world, an America whose citizens suffer at home and abroad, an America that sends its sons and daughers to trade their blood for Cheney's oil and whose parents are proud of it sadly, an America that does not care about Global warming, an America whose citizens cannot afford to buy healthy food for their families, an America whose poverty rate and unemployment is increasing continuously, an America whose citizens are afraid to go to the Doctor not because of the desease but because of the bills they have to pay, an America that cares about the select few who make millions at the expense of child labour in poor countries yet it ignores the hard working middle class families and their needs, an America that makes Heroes of anyone and continuously wants to promote war and hatred towards nonchristians, an America that choses force before diplomacy, an America whose education system has failed, where kids learn how to lie, cheat, plagiarise and not value science and common sense but are brainwashed by a unintellectual propaganda of religious politicians whose only purpose is to stay in power and rule over the masses.
So if you want to debate me you better come to me with more than NOBAMA or black Obama slogans good sir! America has serious problems but people like you that the farthest place you go is your local neighborhood pub have no idea what those problems are. You are proud of military people who create wars for their purposes and the lobbyst that put them in power, and you laugh at the deaths of private world citizens who don't share your christian so you claim values.
So next time you write me come to me with substance not with empty slogans like McCain and Palin do. Else may i suggest you invest in personal education of the world. you will find out that the world is not about America, but America about the world, that americans at the moment are all alone, and alone nations die.
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Palin's intro song flagged by Heart
Don't mess with the Wilson sisters
(corrected link)
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And, for those posters who have lamented that
so few minorities were present on the RNC convention
floor, I would recommend this short clip of Joe Biden and Barack Obama
sneaking into the convention.
Bet that Justin didn't even notice!
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Dems are scared to death of Sarah. She talks to the people in their own language. Not down to them from Hollywood.
McCain the most qualified man to run for President in my lifetime.
Obama the least qualified man to run for President in my lifetime.
The choice is clear.
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TO. tigermilkboy
I am glad someone else sees the truth as it is and does not sugarcoat it. Well said mate!
That's America!
The Obama people were wrong in saying that McCain and Palin will be 4 more years of Bush. McCain and Palin will be worse than Bush.
People don't like Obama because he is not from an elite class, like McCain. Because he is one of the people, who would fight for the people, and not for rednecks and ceo's.
McCain has no idea what it is like to put your kids to bed at night with an empty stomach, or to worry how you are going to send your kids to school, or if you will still have a job tomorrow when you wake up. The man never had to sweat in his life, and now is using his "heroics of sitting in a prison cell' in a shameful war that almost everyone opposed as a ticked to the presidency. Have Americans forgotten what the Vietnam war was, a fiasko. Have Americans forgotten? That's what Iraq is now, the new vietnam.
Him being a hero means nothing to this election. He is a thing of the past, and republicans for ages want to take this country back to a glorious past that never was and accuse Democrats of wanting to take this country to a future that cannot be real in their eyes.
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Well I can comment, I am a British citizen still, married to an American and live in America. Frankly until you live here in the states and get to understand the politics properly and not view from afar, the same can be said in reverse, then certain peoples words and comments seem crass and frankly embarrassing to read.
I am not affiliated to either party just for the record. I appreciate intelligence and people who actually lay out their policies and what they can and will do in office for the people and why.
I used to say to my husband when I was in the UK that the news was portrayed in a totally different way back home and we heard things not reported here...and he would say the same.
After reading this blog and having watched the both speeches and conventions, I can safely say, Justin, go find yourself a new niche as this most certainly is not yours.
Just as I ask people in the US not to assume to know how the UK process works at home and why we think and have the process we do in UK politics..right or wrong..the same applies for the US politics when I speak with friends etc back home commenting without actual experience of it.
Two very different and admirable men are up for President. Last night a man spoke who happens to be more comfortable in a town hall setting. He is not neocon but a moderate and anyone who listened heard him probably piss off party members when he vowed to have his cabinet consist of a mixture of each party because he wanted the RIGHT people doing the job for their qualifications not their party affiliation.
Perception as I have learned over the last few years, can be very misleading when it comes to US politics. Media control and biased influence over such important decision making times in all countries now, seems to have become something immeasurable and deplorable..and unfortunately unavoidable.
Venomous comments on blogs now rising equally as part of that great media circle.
Well hey one day the bloggers will get paid for it, till then we can add to their building resume'.
North Carolina is rather lovely by the way, I live there. You scuffed my sign! Where should I file a request for a replacement?
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I can't get the links to work smartly so can I just say, for some Friday night laughs, check out The Daily Show website and check out their "takes" on the convention: "Sarah Palin Vet This" should make you hoot, and despite the seemingly prurient title "Bristol Palin's Choice" puts some pro-lifers on the spot. You'll squirm...
I was reading somewhere that John Stewart is becoming a main source of news for some youngsters... well, if it keeps us all interested...!
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I am an independent and skeptical about all politicians. As a group, it appears they will say anything to get elected.
I had difficulty staying awake during McCain's speech last night but I wanted to see how many changes of position he would have and how many outrageous claims. For example:
Renewable energy seems to now be a plank of his platform - though he voted against funding it (or was absent) for 7? votes in the senate.
Many of our problems are the result of the current administration - yet he voted with it more than 90% of the time, plans more tax cuts for the rich, and his running mate seems to share many of Bush's convictions-though she's probably only window dressing for the election and won't be part of the inner circle on policies..
He doesn't want to increase taxes on big oil. At the same time he lauds his running mate for reducing taxes in Alaska - achieved as a direct result of getting more money from the oil companies.
He trumpets that Obama has no executive experience. McCain is 72 years old. I'm not aware of any executive experience he has. I'm almost as old and was a corporate executive for 40 years. I'm also much fitter than McCain - but I'm well aware that my energy, memory, patience and consequently my decision making are not what they were when I was 50.
I won't be voting for McCain.
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TO R-snail
I read your comments and well here is my reply to what you say.
I am not a military person but a civilian and so is the majority of the world something for you to consider, that perhaps a soldiers viewpoint is limited.
You say Iraq is no better off than they were, yet you say now they have opportunity...Opportunity to do what exactly? We give them opportunity to dream and hope for a day that most of them will never see. That's the opportunity you are talking about? Can you please define freedom for me from your point of view, because to be honest with you I have lived in a few countries and they are freer than America is.
You say enemies will not be converted by an Obama speech and you are right. I most definitely agree with you. But enemies will be converted by the attitudes of the American people towards their culture, their way of life, their religion, instead of us forcing our way of life into theirs. I can name a lot of people who tried to do that over 3 thousand years and you wont' like most of those names I am sure so I won't go there. Those people only made enemies, and so are we.
Most of our enemies don't speak english you say, but I am sure we can find a few who can translate Obama's message in our midst. We are an immigrant's country after all, a new world as it was once called, but I understand your military point, and i know that for military to keep itself ready and active it needs a job, and its job is wars.
Obama met the German couselor among others...just for your information. But I would rather have OBAMA than Palin as head of state. So wot's your point?
And if need be, if this country needs my help i will be ready even though i might not have the boot camps trainings you have. Switzerland seem to be an awesome example that people don't need to have boot camps to defend but than again why should they, they are liked by everyone and everyone protects them because they don' t judge or force anyone to changing their way of things by force.
And for your information the US is weak. China is ahead, Russia will soon be ahead, and Europe will stop supporting America's wars for oil and enrichment of certain big figures in American politics. You have the luxury of simplifying things my friend, that is the luxury of a soldier, but the world is not good and evil, it is not black and white, and it certainly does not revolve around America as it does for you soldiers.
You value words like honor, love, courage, and I honor you for that, but politicians use those words to lie, to manipulate the uneducated and most of the soldiers fall in those ranks sadly, to create chaos and fear.
I see in Obama a peace president, that will not send you to trade your blood for oil. I see in Obama a president that will start rebuilding old friendships and making new friendships starting, that's the best way of defense, looking out of the common good of everyone, instead of us challenging all nations and invading when we please and scream at the top of our lungs when another country does what we do best.
And to tell you the truth, American lives abroad are at danger even in places you think are safe. I have seen my friends when they visit me in Europe put Canadian flags on their packs or jackets so that they won't be targeted, ridiculed, robbed, or beaten up for being American. That's the legacy our violent policies of controlling the world through our military ignoring the saying of other countries have left to us.
No one trusts us anymore, because we have proven time and again over the past 8 yrs we are not trustworthy. When we won friends to fight terror, instead of making use of them, we ignored their efforts to join our war, and opted to let Bin Laden and his people go, and instead moved to invade Iraq for oil and money. And don't tell me they had nuclear weapons.
but as i said, seeing the world from the eys of a person who has fixed ideals is easy, and i understand the way you look at things and respectfully i cannot agree with you
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#281, Ed
I would disagree with you. If he didn't hold strong convictions, he would not be in the position to be caught.
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#271R-Snail: "the US Presidency is NOT a place to develop!" Then how can you possibly approve of Mrs Palin who may have to step in at a moment's notice? A disaster waiting to happen.
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#266
"They confuse nationalistic militarism with patriotism, and they appeal to the least educated and cultured people in this country"
Hmmm. So, I, who hold a PhD, travel round and round the world for both business and personal purposes, have lived in Eastern and Western cultures and accepted both, and put my hand over heart when hearing the Star Spangled Banner (not for militaristic purposes but for love of country) am confused, uneducated and uncultured? Wow - you have very high standards for democrats, don't you?
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RE: Comments about full democratic countries invading each other
The democratic USA has invaded or terrorised many other full democratic states. They just rarely get reported. Countries like Guatamala, Nicaragua, and Chile. Moreover, the USA, during the fifties, sixties, and seventies ensured that many new democratic countries in the Americas were smashed and turned into right wing dictatorships. The USA State does not like democracy - abroad or at home. The American ruling power elite do not want a State that is representative of the American people. If democracy could change anything they'd abolish it.
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Just keep wrapping yourself in the American Flag McCain. Don't forget to mention P.O.W., 9/11 and the Iraq surge at least every other sentence and don't forget "change" and "maverick". Last time i checked a Maverick doesn't vote party lines 90% of the time. Party policies that have destroyed the US economy and standing in the world. As an independent have examined both sides and i think you have to be missing a few brain cells to think that the US is headed in the right direction.
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invisibleserendipity
Good sir, and you having a PhD support the republican agenda of having no agenda to solve america's problems?
Or are you one more of those American's who hide behind their PhDs and use it to quiet everyone else whose parents didn't have the money to invest in them, or who couldn't because they had to work for their sick children and parents?
I know some of these sort of PhD people that's why I am asking, and without a PhD i am more of man than all of them put together will ever be. So a man of your intelligent I would be dissappointed if you waved that PhD comment to raise your status on this forum.
I don't have a PhD, I was born in a foreign nation, i have lived in several foreign nations, and being American was a choice I made not something I was born into, and I too put my hand over heart but not for the Star Spangled Banner, but for what it used to represent and for what it must represent.
So what is your point, exactly, other than you comming across as a PhD republican?
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Most interesting discussions here on Justin's blogs I must say.
After following the presidential race for a few weeks, what troubles me most is the attention given to the two individuals running for office , and their chosen sidekicks.
It is my understanding that, even in the US, it's the gouvernment running the country, not a single person - isn't that correct ?
Hence, the capabilty of putting together a well functioning governing body, and intimate knowledge of today's global needs might be quite important in a candidate .
Now Mr. McCain here, he might be an honorable man, or so he says, but one can't dismiss the simple biological fact that at 72 he is facing senility.
Then he went and let this Palin person be chosen as his VP candidate.
Barrack got a lot of heat for picking Biden; it almost seems that the bizarre Palin nomination has left everyone speechless.
How else can the restraint of the oh-so-pro-Obama press be explained , how comes this abstruse choice is even be discussed in a civilized fashion ?
It really is turning into a freak show.
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ref #289
Palin's nickname on the basketball was the Barcuda. if the Wilson sisters have a problem with it, they are being very petty.
Of course Nancy has very few brain cells left.
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#302
Seem to have touched a nerve? My point was that to call all Republicans uneducated illustrates complete ignorance.
Me? I am using my Republican PhD to vote for Obama. I am not sure what the others of my ilk are doing ...
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#302
Oh, and, by the way, I am a 38 year old woman.
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invisibleserendipity
I also read one of your earlier comments, and well I don't know how to put it but it seems to me you lack a bit of reality sense.
According to you military people are heroes eh...hmmm Hitler was a military person too...so was Milosevic, Napoleon, Stalin, Kings in Europe throughout the ages, Roman Emperors some madder than others...I would hardly call these people heroes, and I am sure every person in their right frame of mind would not follow your definition of hero.
You want to know what a hero is:
Mother Teresa and all those like her who give their life to change lives of those that life has chosen victims. The real heroes are people who don't expect a big paycheck at the end of the month, don't own 7 houses, and lecture people on family values when they abandon their spouses, but people who are content and at peace knowing that what they receive is a silent gratitude of proud people to ask for help. Sounds like something Obama knows more about than you sir or the Republicans...
You travel the world you say, but I have a feeling you travel on yachts, and make a big fuss at the airport not wanting to wait in lines because you have a gold card. I know...perks of having a PhD, but that doesn't make you better than me who at the moment is working towards is PhD, or towards those who will never make that choice or sacrifice to get one for reasons we all know.
But I see why you write the way you do, and I must say I am dissappointed that even educated people in America have a dark heart and soul. Knowledge was supposed to be a source of power to be used for good, instead is used for selfish reasons and 21st century barbarisms that you can call love for country, nationalism, patriotism or whatever you wish.
But I would value more a father who works 2 jobs to feed his family, who has no health insurance, and who works paycheck to paycheck and yet has a smile is his face because the only thing that makes his life worth is the idea that he is working for his family, than someone with PhD or war medals around his neck who knows nothing about real struggles that people face today.
If you really value knowledge may I suggest you leave the books behind, and actually get to know people instead of dead writers and numbers on paper.
I am sorry i don't mean to offen you, but I made me very uncomfortable that someone like you who claims to be educated and probably twice my age, has such low views towards humanity and stands against equality and common sense.
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Disappointed?
B-b-but he was a P.O.W.! Haven't you heard?
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#256
Ed,
It fits on a 12 gauge. What more could you want.
Sam
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#300, dceilar, please don't be so overwrought.
I suggest, for your edification, this brief encounter.
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invisibleserendipity
Well I am sorry for assuming you are a man. and no you didn't touch a nerve, and I guess i owe you another apology for perhaps assuming you were supportive of the republican's agenda and what they stand for. I take back some of the things I wrote than that might offend your intellect
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#303, Fritz_Kraut, you've got it - a freak show!
The whole thing makes me want to haul out and
watch an old DVD of Liza Minnelli in "Cabaret."
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#307
There is a big difference between a troop out in the field that has been sent by his government for service and Hitler, Stalin, et. al. Yes, those troops are my heroes. I did not say the government that put them there was.
It may surprise you to find out that I do not travel on gold cards and have lived in rough spots without hot water, etc.
Before you judge others and bandy about accusations, you should research your argument and make sure that it is accurate. Read a book - is that not what you advised me to do?
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#309, Sam, do you think that you could let in a few
Fashionably Thin Hair Club For Men Gun-Toting Idiots
into your party faction?
We could do something useful, such as making
sure that the signs don't fall on people, etc.
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TimothyR444 wrote:
After reading so many hundreds of comments on this blog during the last few weeks, I am wondering if there is a place here on the BBC site for Americans to give our opinions when there are elections in Britain?
Timothy... it's a British website. As I said in an early post, Justin reports on what's happening in the States from a British perspective, for a British audience. That's possibly why some people take offence at what he says.
I used to enjoy "Letter from London" on cbsnews.com. It's disappeared now, but it was a take on things in the UK by their reporter in London. I didn't always agree with what he said and sometimes just couldn't recognise the country he was describing. But I took it for what it was: a view of my own country by someone who clearly has a fondness for the place but still finds some things a bit odd. I think that's what Justin does, very well.
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192. melissambuckwheat:
"I think as American's we're forgetting the real issues in our Country. "
Wrong. You have mistakenly assumed that what you believe are the "real issues" are as important to everyone else. Your view of what's important, while perhaps shared by many Americans, is not necessarily representative of all America.
There are many Americans with diametrically opposed viewpoints. And they vote, too.
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Blogger # 30 has nailed the real problems. He obviously has first-hand experience that supercedes the emotional garbage that has dominated this campaign. World War III would be a tragedy that would dwarf the "economy", the "terrorist attacks", the "feminism/sexism", that seem to dominate the concerns of Americans. History lesson: Both World Wars started in small countries. Vietnam was a war that had nothing to do with the safety or freedom of the U.S. So was Korea (if anyone really remembers that one). Our dependence on foreign oil (read: people who hate us) is a legitimate issue and one that has a lot to do with the terrorist attacks. Our military presence in Islamic countries (read: similar to Roman Empire) triggers that hate. And did I hear the words "undivided Jerusalem" uttered at the Republican convention?
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#311
Thank you. We are cool.
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Its always good to be able to say I told you so.
I have written on these pages that the GOP would not allow the press much access to Gov. Palin once their convention was over, and it appears that she is now off back to Alaska with no appearances scheduled in her diary - until the debate with Biden I suppose.
So they've nearly a month for her crash course in how to be a Vice President.
Truth becomes ever stranger than fiction.
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invisibleserendipit
I get your point yes. And just for information with the exception of Hitler everyone else at some point was in the field, but let's no go there. Not my favorite topic to talk about military and politics.
Your traveling habbits do not surprise me either, I am glad to hear you don't travel on gold cards, and not having hot water is hardly a rough place...try no water at all. There is a large part of the world who lacks even drinking water let alone hot water.
For the rest I believe I apologized above. and personally I like to learn by experience instead of from someone's fantasies or theories written in a book, at least for the things that really matter in life. Books will never teach me how to live my life but experience you can be sure will. And in the words of C.S. Lewis, experience is a brutal teacher, but by God you learn.
But I am glad I was wrong on my "accusation" i lined you up with the republican agenda, when you very much stand against it.
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AndreainNY,
can you please tell me what is important to you?
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#279, magnbay :
Minneapolis and St. Paul are socialist liberal governments run by something left of Democrat.
Mayor of St. Paul is Chris Coleman, DFL party.
The council has twelve DFL members and one from the Green Party. R. T. Rybak also of the DFL is the current mayor of Minneapolis.
Your police state is DFL run.
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and on more thing Andrea...please don't be Sarcastic on your response... I got enough of it from Palin to last me in my next life too. just be honest( republicans can do that no?)
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I noticed quite a large gap between Obama and McCain's acceptance speeches. As a public speaker, my opinion is that McCain's speech was simply dreadful. It was not thematically coherent and he did not indicate what plans he has for addressing America's problems.
Obama, however, had a well-constructed speech which included not only his plans for fixing problems but he outlined how he intends to fund them without incurring the monsterous debt wracked up by the fiscal irresponsibility of the Republicans.
Considering McCain has fully backed the obviously failed policies of the Bush administration and indicated his intention to continue them, I cannot fathom how anyone would consider voting for the GOP this year. I am flabbergasted he can use the words "bring change" when he's been part of the system for so long.
A McCain presidency would be disasterous for not just the United States but for the entire world. The last thing we need is more warmongering, the stop-gap measure of more drilling that ultimately perpetuates the problem of climate change and an economic policy that has never worked and in fact drives our country deeper in debt. Have Republicans even looked at the figures lately? Their policies and spending habits are putting our great-great-great grandchildren into crushing debt.
I wonder if the legality of first-term abortion will seem nearly as important when the anti-choice voters cannot find employment, the bank takes the house, the public assistance programs that would help them get back on their feet are gutted and their kids are deployed to another war zone.
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#214, wanderingangus:
It's very standard to clear your administration of people who will undermine you. Think about TravelGate...
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#291. At 6:42pm on 05 Sep 2008, nnjital "McCain the most qualified man to run for President in my lifetime" You must be very young!
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Fritz_Kraut (#303), it's not as simple as "the government running the country." In the US, we have divided government. The President is the head of the Executive Branch of government, is Head of State, and is Commander-in-Chief of the armed forces. In those roles, he has a great deal of individual power. However, he has no direct control over the Legislative Branch (Congress) of government, which is a separate and co-equal branch of government. Congress itself is divided into two independent houses. The President and the majority in one or both houses of Congress may be from different political parties, which is often the case. The effective power of the president depends on the relationships between the leaders of the Congress and the president, and whether they are of the same party.
The president has a lot of power even when both houses of Congress are controlled by another party. Thus, even though Congress is now controlled by the Democrats, they cannot easily bring the Iraq war to an end.
The whole thing is a very complicated subject.
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75. At 11:16am on 05 Sep 2008, srmgin wrote:
How much snake oil will you be buying then
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McCain has just proved Obama right by agreeing that America needs A CHANGE WE CAN BELIEVE.McCain is surely not that change.It`s too late for him to change or make that change.Palin is just his desperate pun aimed at the ignorant or naive women.America should move on !
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#253, goleooo :
That was over the line, don't you think? If you disagree with someone, stick the the area of disagreement rather than attack all Texans with a bigoted caricature.
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goleooo,
Hitler was "in the field" (i am assuming you mean in the military sense). In fact he was blinded in a mustard gas attack by the British in WWI. In fact he was decorated 4 times.
He was considered a bit of a weirdo even before he decided that killing 10+ million people would be a good idea. It really is a mad world.
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Re:#304 It's copyright infringement, actually
Artists cry foul
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Some time back on # 184, the lovely TimothyR444 asked if there was a blog where Americans could comment on the British politics.
There is indeed. Right now. He needs to go to Nick Robinson's newslog (listed on the r/h side of the main page here).
He would probably find quite a few friends amongst Nick's bloggers
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#263, tigermilkboy
"What McCain/Palin are offering is more of the same. No healthcare plans, no economic plans."
Here you go. His plans for health care are pretty good actually, from a libertarian point of view. If you like socialism, then Barrack has the better plan.
My wife has been recovering from a severe car accident for the past 8 years, and needs weekly physical therapy. Insurance stopped paying for it after 6 months. That is the type of crap we need to root out. So I pay for her care out of pocket, and my insurance company steps aside. They just want my money, not my problems. I would love to change my insurance to a HSA, and then have affordable catastrophic care with a high deductible. If everyday health care prices were market driven they would be affordable and not dictated by government programs or HMO's. BTW, I have UHC, and it is horrible.
John McCain's Healthcare plan.
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To goleooo
My dear friend, you seem to be an intelligent, yet very angry young man.
For my part, I did not say whether or not I was military. BillTyrone made the comment that he was a former military officer. I said nothing of myself, other than I have been to Iraq.
In answer to a few of your points... The Iraqis now have the opportunity to hope, and to disagree without fear of imprisonment and torture. I have also seen a couple of Saddam's "interrogation cells" that civilized people like you and I call "torture chambers". Not waterboarding chambers where people are made to think they are drowning, but the places where body parts are cut off and incredible pain and mutilation is inflicted before death is no doubt welcomed. My friend if there is one thing I wish I could convey to you in no uncertain terms, it is that there is Good and there is Evil in this world...
When Britain declared war on Nazi Germany on 3 September 1939, WWII began... did the English people know of the Soviet / German treaty to divide Poland at that time? It could have been labelled a wrongful war, but after liberating the concentration camps at Belsen and Auschwitz, the people of the world knew that the horrible war that claimed millions of lives around the globe had had a noble purpose.
Nobody likes war, least of all the military man who's life is in the balance. Nevertheless, there are things worth the sacrifice.
I will not debate you as to whether the Iraq war was started by bad intelligence or by greedy politicians, but I will debate you if you wish, that the Iraqi children I saw begging in the streets today will have a better chance at a happy, fulfilled life because of the sacrifices of the thousands of American and British and Aussie, and Italian, and Pakistani, and Ugandan, and Canadian servicemembers, along with the folks from all of the other coalition countries I've neglected. Maybe we do have a few friends after all...
I think you mean the German Chancellor... Obama was, I think, a Community Counsellor... and I think I might agree with you that I'd rather have Obama as head of state over Palin... but you are comparing apples and oranges. Palin is running for Vice President... she's an understudy... Obama is running for the Top Dog position, and he's still a unweaned puppy. That's my point.
(I hope you meant to spell what's "wot's" or I'll have to take back my 1st sentence).
You say you admire the Swiss. So do I. However, Switzerland's history of caving into Nazi demands during WWII underlines one of the problems with pacifism. Neutrality requires two sides. Do some research and get back to me...
Hey, who said "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."?
If you think the US is weak, you are confused. Our greatest national problem with foreign policy is that while we decline any imperialism, the free world expects us to be their policeman. The US is cried for to send military help to Bosnia, Somalia, Liberia, Chad, Rwanda, East Timor, and a host of other places that to be absolutely honest we have no compelling need to lend assistance. There is no US interest in those places, no US citizens at risk, yet the free world looks to the US to do what is right, and help those less fortunate. How did we get so fortunate? Off of the hard work and sweat and tears of those immigrants you mentioned in your 4th paragraph. Now, are we becoming weakER...? Yes we are, because our forefathers worked very hard to make our lives a little easier, and so each generation is a little softer, and now we have a growing population that wants handouts for nothing...
Do our politicians lie and manipulate the people? Yes, they do it in every country on the planet. So how do you overcome the lies and manipulation... by EDUCATION! But our country is failing at education. Did you know that? Our students have lower scores, but they feel better about themselves, because the schools have become psychocological training centers where we teach tolerance instead of science. (Have you ever noticed how intolerant the folks who preach tolerance are?) The LA county school district, 2nd largest in the US, employs more administrators than it does teachers.
Do you know who is principally responsible for a child's education? The parent! But Obama and the NEA are dead set against school vouchers where parents can choose their own children's school. You see the Democratic Party would have you give all your money in taxes and then they'll give you back health care, and schools and food stamps... just give them all your money and they'll tell you what's best for you. We need Moms and Dads to make those decisions intsead of watching the telly.
The Welfare State in Britain practically bankrupted the government before Maggie Thatcher saved the UK. Now the US socialists want free healthcare...?
Get a job and get your own healthcare!
Take some individual responsibility for yourself man! Grow up.
I visit Europe often. I love it's rich history and the food's pretty good too. History is in the past...
Our political problem in the US is caused by our rigid reliance on a two party system, where voters are forced to choose between the lesser of two weevils (pun) rather than the best person fro the job. My personal pick for President... Colin Powell but he'll not subject his family to the efforts to seek office. It's not worth it.
I ask you this final question: If you were to line up 100 citizens from every country in the world, and ask each one where they would prefer to live... money is no object... where will the majority elect to go? I pontificate that 99 Swedes would stay put... So many Brits are retiring to Spain, they can even play football there now... but my friend, I would argue that there would be several thousand immigrants once again lining up to head to the US of A. We have quite a problem with those Chinese that you admire trying to enter our country illegally. I for one say let them all come in just like in the days of old... they're willing to work, and they work hard.
The US is not a perfect nation. We bicker too much. But no matter who's in office, we're the best thing going... at the moment.
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#281, Ed Iglehart :
Did he mean convicted by the North Vietnamese? He was a war criminal, to them.
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298 David_Cunard
David my friend...
I do NOT approve of Mrs. Palin as VP. However, when faced with a choice of the lesser of 2 evils, I choose the McCain / Palin disaster-waiting-to-happen over Obama / Biden disaster-sure-to-happen.
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#337
Snail,
Very long winded, very boring, very wrong.
Marcus, is that you?
Regards,
Sam
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303, Fritz_Kraut :
"Now Mr. McCain here, he might be an honorable man, or so he says, but one can't dismiss the simple biological fact that at 72 he is facing senility."
His 98 year old mum was at the RNC dancing to "Barracuda". :)
He might make it 4 years. He seems to have good genes.
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#302, goleooo :
What am I? Are you done eating sole yet?
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#338 SamTyler1969
Sam,
How very short, and very uninsightful, and very empty. Is that you?
Regards,
Snail
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#337, not so wrong from my viewpoint. Not perfect, but nothing is.
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No 271 R-snail. Pointers in answer to your queries.
1. Confirmation. Yes, 12 years service as an Army officer at the height of the Cold War, both pre and during the Reagan / Thatcher era.
2. The Military and Politics. I note how you pigeon hole military personnel as being of a Republican / Conservative bent? The key tenet used to be and still is, that the military serve their political masters with equal loyalty and commitment, regardless of party colours. Counter to Sen McCains view over his sole suitability etc, the US military forces will faithfully serve the next President - period.
3. Iraq. i) I'll never forget the look of glee in the eyes of two little girls who approached us on the edge of MSR (Main Suppy Route) Tampa during a halt when I gave them a tube of candy each. It made their day and more (and mine). They ran off to their habitation - x2 walls of piled up earth with palm fronds strung precariously overhead to shade the sun. These people needed help and looked on with hope when the military occupation was triggered. Even a set of pots and pans and raw basics would have made a huge difference. ii) I experienced the machinations of the Iraqi Ministry of Interior. iii) I saw the $multi-million US AID ID IQ contracts re-construction programme and KBR influence in action.
4. Diplomacy etc. We agree the fundamentals and my point remains clear. The absolute need for the next president to apply these diligently and effectively in re-building existing relationships and to forge new durable ones.
5. The enemy? Sorry, you are markedly OTT here - I am sure many nations are very much smarter than you give them credit for.
6. Obama Development Potential. Absolutely YES. A key quality and requirement in any senior political role of this nature. A personal commitment to the continuance of learning, ability to listen, guage advice, absorb new facts and intelligence in a constantly changing world is not derived from any manual, day 1. All leaders must approach such a role with flexible thinking and not pre-conceived *I know*, *I will* intransigence. Hurricanes Katrina and Gustav have surely providing a clear domestic case history example of such development?
7. Obama - Heads of State Meetings? Check your research. The marked warmth and enthusiasm of a number of leaders and top aides to Barack Obama in Asia, the Middle East and Europe has spoken volumes to many people. No, picking up a following of over 200,000 people in Berlin was no mirage and conveyed a clear message.
8. Obama Weakness? Quite the opposite. I am certain that many US doubters and right wing hawks will be blown away and left sidelined by the progress that Barack Obama will make on the international relations front as President. Dictats, threats and jingoism do not signal strength. Yes, he will have the big stick in waiting, but success and results are best measured by political initiatives, gains and deterrence - not wanton, open ended, and costly, military campaigns a la Iraq.
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#324, BrevardMinister :
"Considering McCain has fully backed the obviously failed policies of the Bush administration and indicated his intention to continue them, I cannot fathom how anyone would consider voting for the GOP this year."
Would you be more specific?
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#153 dceilar
Yes I am right wing, I am an evangelical actually and believe that I am not crazy I just believe strongly in individual responsibilty and the right to life.
I moved to the USA to study and it worked out that I now work and am married to an Ameican. After 22yrs growing up and being educated in the UK and I am a very proud British citizen but find SOME comments from UK citizens hard to take when they don't live here. Do you understand the makeup of Appalachia, or the agricultural midwest or even the deep south? Probably not. The US does have many liberals but mainly in NYC, LA and larger cities. The majority of the working class live in secondary and tertiary states and cities and are Christian people unlike the UK which is becoming mainly secular. 75% of Americans are practicing Christians compared to only about 15% in the UK.
So when McCain and Palin talk the way they do it means they are connecting to those who live in West VA, Pennsyl, Ohio, Kentucky, Iowa etc...who believe in the above. So am I really out of touch!?
Maybe I am crazy but having lived in Europe and now in the USA for the last 4 years I think that those who go to Disneyworld on their summer holidays or NYC Christmas shopping and think they know America are slightly ignorant.
#155
Yeah international funds are doing well due to the wonders of free trade of which I support strongly but if you look at one important point...The EU GDP growth (economic growth) historically is no where close to the US or what is going to happen in Asia. 3% growth annually is a recession in the USA. OH! yeah that is whats happening right now. BUT all that regulation and big government (beaurocracy) has nothing to do with it does it!
#162
I am a UK citizen who likes to keep up with thoughts from home and news that the BBC reports. I still pay NI and hope to come home one day if my career allows me. Yes I am conservative in my thinking but didn't Churchill say that with more experience and age you become more conservative as I understand how the world works. And it isn't through the government running US...they should serve us...we should be running them!!! Less government and more individual responsisblity would cure us.
OH and on the "NO invoice from the NHS"....yeah you do get an invoice in your income taxes!!! That's why you pay a lot higher taxes than the Yanks, not to mention your petrol and duty on booze and cigs!!! In the USA the people get to choose their Healthcare plan and who their surgeon will be...you enjoy your run down hospital and foreign doctors and the MRSA running rampant in the dirty wards!
I like paying low taxes and being able to save more for my kids college, my retirement and the chance to come home and get a bottle of IRN BRU and afish supper once a year.
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299, Invisible.
I have no quarrel with your opinions, however I do have a problem with your validating them by virtue your education.
I see in a later coment that you are a 38-year-old woman. Well, I am a 78-year-old woman and throughout my professional life I have worked with people with multiple PhD.'s, with people with little education, and even with illiterates. I have never noticed a difference in intelligence. Of course, there is a difference in knowledge, but that is something else altogether, and has nothing to do with the ability to reason.
I find your attitude offensive. Dare I say elitist?
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
#267
Hi Doug
Fox News. In NY.
Sad Sam
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#314
Guns,
I believe so. We of the BUFWGTBBGFO have a broad tent, Although we do see ourselves in the long term as a viable party in our own right. We are begining to develop our manifesto now. When we come to power we will enact the following manifesto:
- Bible bashing is allowed, indeed encouraged so long as you bash your own and don't disturb anyone else. Especially in the quiet car on Amtrak
- You can own any make of gun that you like. However it should be noted that the clean lines and aescetic look of a Baretta only looks good when held by a woman
- Wigs are unacceptable in any context except for cancer patients
- Hair dye for men will be outlawed. Same for teeth whitening
- Banjo playing will be considered one of the arts, alongside opera and classical music
- Drinking at lunch times will be returned to acceptance in corporate America. It will be mandatory on Fridays
- Pick up trucks with gun racks will be subsidized
- Top Gear will be carried on all major networks
- All aspiring presidential candidates must be interviewed by Jeremy Paxman. VP candidates twice
And we will balance the budget.
Comrade Sam
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RealFrigid
I am sorry it offended you, I sincerely apologize to you but my debate at the time was not with you. Can you move past that? I am sure not all Texans are the same.
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ref #319
Palin was in Wisconsin today.
there is a report that Oprah has refused to interview Palin.
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Hi Justin, enjoyed your report on BBC world.
I couldn't help noticing you used a phrase about McCain raising the party in his own image, which seems identical to one in your cited article from the Huffinton post.
Is this journalism you xerox?
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R-Snail
"I visit Europe often. I love it's rich history and the food's pretty good too. History is in the past... "
So history is in the past then. About the only thing I agree with you. Brevity please.
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#338, Sam, gotta be... there cannot exist
2 like that.
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# 327
"Fritz_Kraut (#303), it's not as simple as "the government running the country."
Gary, I agree, pardon my simplifying the matter.
To clarify, even with the great power the US president has, isn't he depending on his advisors and other government members not only for day-to-day decissions, but for crisis management as well ?
It's a huge , complex country , with indispensable global connections and interests , how can one single man possibly handle all that by himself - or even a fraction of it ?
It might still be a naive argument, yet personally I rather look at the sort of team a candidate might put together than scrutinize every last detail of his life or any of his recent and past actions.
Being German and all ( having spent the better part of the past 7 years in the US), I've favoured Barrack ever since he left Clinton behind; Clinton runs circles around both candidates when it comes to experience re. the pres. office, in my humble opinion.
Not that I like her that much, but I'm quite sure she would have made the most 'professional' president.
As things are now, Barrack might have talked about 'change' a bit too much, but with the US still being a major global player at this moment in history, this country electing president a fairly young, utterly bright black-ish man might prove to be just the kind of change the US need to still be a successful player in the future, both at home and global.
Not that there is a difference these days....
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allmymarbles
regarding your post 346, I couldn't agree more.
A better education does not necessarily mean a more intelligent person. While many intelligent people seek higher education, an impressive educational resume really doesn't tell one anything about a person's actual intelligence.
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#346
Again, my comment was mis-read.
The assertion made in the post I was responding to, was that every republican is uneducated, uncultured and basically ignorant. My point, by writing all that I wrote, was that I am a republican who is not only educated (whatever those diplomas may or may not mean) but have also been around the block a few times and it was actually the poster who was displaying ignorance by writing something so vitriolic.
It was not meant to be elitist. I am not. It was meant to say think before you speak if you do not know who you are speaking to.
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After returning from a long absence, I am surprised to find that this blog seems to have become dominated by many who seem to be little more than shills for one or the other of the US political parties.
In my view, post # 209 by BillOfCapeCod reflects the actual reality quite well. Neither parties' actions have been consistent with the principles which reflect the promise of freedom and government of, for, and by the people. Both have been and continue to be corrupt and are unlikely to change under the current system.
On the Rep side, McCain has been involved in scandals of his own (e.g., Keating, other lobbyists), and has consistently supported programs of both Reps and Dems which enrich their well-heeled friends at the expense of the nation as a whole and has also consistently voted to curtail freedoms (e.g., Patriot Act, etc.). To believe that he represents change is pathetic. Palin, while a fresh face, is a sop to the fundamentalists; although, to be fair, she is on record as stating that she has no right to impose her moral views on the people, and that it is up to them to vote on those issues. Attacks of her inexperience are absurd; she, at least, has attained her positions via her own efforts, at various levels of government, each time by securing the approval of her constituents of her performance at the previous level. One could say the same about Obama, although his rise has certainly been helped by the corrupt Chicago political machine. (Clinton, against whom she is contrasted, has reached her current position (and became a perceived-by-some to be a possible candidate for President) solely by riding the coat-tails of her husband (I'd be interested to hear a credible counter-argument to that))
On the Dem side, Obama (when he votes at all) has also supported the entrenched interests, voted to curtail freedoms, and has de facto supported US militarism by voting for the military appropriations in every instance. To claim that he opposes the war while consistently voting for it is absurd; a truly principled individual would be willing to take the political hits associated with refusal to fund illegal actions. He has quickly learned the lessons of earmarking and pork to the benefit of entities for which his wife works and/or directs. Biden, throughout his career, also has consistently supported programs that benefit entrenched interests and has been filmed as stating "I am a Zionist" (so much for expecting the US to contribute to a fair Israel/Palestinian resolution during an Obama/Biden administration).
Both parties (and candidates) are inextricably linked with AIPAC and similar organizations and will continue with further "regime change" and/or other military actions to support Israeli interests (think Iran) and both completely misrepresent the actual events in the Caucasus in order to demonize (and antagonize) the Russians.
The current economic situation is the result of actions taken by BOTH parties over many years. The Reps have enriched their favorite constituents over the past 8 years at the expense of the nation as a whole; the Dems did the same for their favorite constituents when they were in power. Under neither party will the national interest be the prime determinant. Obama-as-national-savior is just the flip side of creationist fundamentalist beliefs.
The US (and everyone else) is going to be buffeted by the currents resulting from peak oil, climate change (and contrary to assertions by the uninformed, the actual degree of its being anthropogenic has not been established by anyone), development of the rest of the world, emerging nationalism, overpopulation, etc. for quite some time. Neither party (or their candidates) seem to have any credible solutions or ameliorations in mind (there may be no acceptable solutions possible, only mitigations).
The sooner the US rejects the major political parties and players thereof and searches for candidates/parties who are intelligent, capable, and willing to level with the people, the sooner things will improve. Until then, the Rep/Dem, McCain/Obama, and other contrived dichotomies are nothing more than a sadistic joke of which we and the rest of the world are the victims. "More Bread and Circuses" continues to be the mantra of the American political system.
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What I find offensive is if as a conservative you are incorrectly labeled, you are aparently not allowed to challenge this falsehood as you might appear offensive and elitist. As a liberal, you delight and receive admiring posts when you announce how many degrees you have.
Amazingly, allmymarbles is proving that MA2's description of her is correct. Who'd have thought he would get anything right!
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To #158 and #197Bethpa
Keep sending those links. I got them from my brother this morning. Killkenny shows Palin's ruthless ambition. Perhaps Palin is a redneck version of Hillary? As for voting: OH YES! and maybe twice on Sunday if that is permitted!
To#174Ghbrich
Please do not wish McCain on all of us! Not all of us deserve what his tenure would give us.
To#192Melissambuckwheat
Right On! I am with you!
To# 198Samtyler1969
Great! I will form "The Short, Very Wrinkled, Gun Toting, Old White Woman Group for Obama" to complement yours. (I had to leave out the bible part because it bothers me) I will add that I am small town and very rural.
To#202Shewants to be informed
I would be VERY insulted if someone called me a pit bull. I consider them nasty dogs who have savaged and killed both children and adults, especially where I live. Some owners have allowed them free range which is despicable. They were bred only for fighting.
To#220Audradio
I, also, prefer to read the speeches' as well as' listen to them. English is not my first language and at my age hearing is starting to go. I would recommend that everyone obtain written copies of all the speeches, read them without the 'hype' and then make some real judgments.
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#349, Sam, I thought you were losing it, but your manfesto is the best I've seen in a long time. Can you add something about having proper beer available? - how I miss english real ale!
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To#351Magickirin
Oprah? Really?
My understanding is that Palin's contact with the press will be very carefully controlled, at least until the debates. Do you really believe that the mean, sexist, horrible, leftist press will be allowed anywhere near this woman. Maybe they can dress Karl Rove in a dress, put some lipstick on him and send him out in her place!
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I did not watch the McCain speech and it is because I love America. I could write well in advance more than half of the things he was going to say.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOBWZ7Jocc8
ABC report on "Troopergate".
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ref #329
That is definite ageism.
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#360
Arizona,
While we are foind of Bashing, it is optional.
Our alliance is strong, and it is growing!
#361
Sean,
Our policy on beer is being developed. It is a major concern to us and as such deserves a full sub committee review. However, we are sure of two things:
- Beer and guns should not be mixed. Nor should beer and Bible Bashing. In fact Beer will be given it's own special time of the week between 5pm on Friday and 11am on a Saturday. This Time will be dedicated to the appreciation of beer and recovery from the appreciation of beer. 5pm on Friday will henceforth be known as 'Beer O'Clock'
- If the Belgians buy Anheuser Busch they will be forced to make Bud taste like beer.
As my old friend Alan B'stard would say:
'Sensible policies for a happy America'
Prepare for government!
Candidate Sam
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To R-snail,
Dear friend,
Well imight have misread your blog than, i apologize, was in a bit of a hurry.
I have been around for a while myself, and i have seen wars in the balkans from close range come to that. So i am no stranger to the horrible images of the war, nor afraid of them so I don't find them very shocking. But I have also witnessed the profiteering that comes as a result of it, even in the balkans, where it was our soldiers and commanders running the drug trafficing and the prostitution rings, while here in the states they had mothers and sisters of their own, it was ok to sell romanian or serbian girls for money or rape abandoned teenagers who had noone in the world. But CNN does not talk about these things of course because we are so pure, there is no evil in our purposes or our soldiers who most of them can't even read at a 6th graders level, and follow commands like a blind horse.
And I don't agree with you that there is Good and Bad. There is this ugly thing also called Indifference. And most of Americans I have a feeling are very indefferent to what happens in the world or in America for that matter unless it puts at risk their private interests and bank accounts. THis is something I have observed and you can try to prove me wrong on that. But I didn't see american interested in the war on terror, a war that europe has been fighting for centuries until the Trade Center attack. But let's not go there. Too many skeletons in that closet that history will bring to light.
The good people in the world are few sadly, the bad are more, but the worst are the indifferents. those are the ones I fear, the ones who put personal interests above the common good of society and there are way too many of those in this country who fool the common people into wars and give moral lecture when they themselves have ZERO. (i am a young man, and it will be a cold day in hell, before I listen to McCain or Palin to lecture me on morals or family values, and you probably know them better than i do, so I won't say why)
Now you say i am comparing apples with oranges eh...Yes I am, because Palin is a possible president, and i only hear 3 minutes of her speech and could not stand the woman for she was insulting, sarcastic, and as she said a pitbull, not the sort of person i consider to be wiser or better than me or my own mother. Speaking of which my mother who speaks broken english couldn't stand her just by the mimics of her face and her body posture speaking for the sort of person she really is.
I wonder when is the last time you did something good for someone who is too proud to ask for help without wanting any sort of money for it but a simple thank you? Sarah Palin that you seem to support seems to have a problem with that. ... That's comment of hers on a major having more responsibility than a community organizer is enough for all decent citizens of this nation not to vote for McCain. I respected the man until he brought her on board, now i have no respect for him being him a hero or no hero, he is a thing for the past, a past that needs to stay in the past. Think about that, and if it has been a while, give a try, and see what a great feeling it is, and how wrong and insulting your VP possible president is, than let's see if you are still Pro McCain and anti Obama. Bill Clinton was a puppy too wasn't he, yet it was during his time that I got to know and love America, and it was during his time that Americans were loved in the world and trusted, I was one of those who did love and trust them, and I, I choose to come to this country, and i was not born or brainwashed to pledge to ideals of a revolutions that has ended 300 yrs ago.
The free world doesn't even want US right now. The US is seen as a menace to international affairs, as a greedy country driven by love for money and oil. So let's not talk about that.
Education let's no go there, i agree with you, but that's the price of generational ignorance. people in america don't value common sense anywhere, from a mcdonald to the president, there are procedures, and if it is written that you should jump off a bridge people will do it. I agree with you on the school thing, and I am living it everyday, seeing one of my parents with more years of experience in teaching than any american would ever dear to, struggling to find a job, because some college graduate with no clue how to teach or what to teach, got a degree from an american university by cheating and plagiarising. I got my degree here too, and it is the worst mistake i have made, for schools here are nothing but a name in the wind. the brain comes from elsewhere, Europe, India, China, Africa. American kids like only drugs, alcohol, and easy classes like sociology or whatever and than they have a degree to become presidents...sorry...Palin has a journalism degree..But who is failing this country? Let me tell you, from my viewpoint that NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND stuff is idiotic.
If parents choose their kids schools than you would have separatism again. The rich would choose good schools, and those who cannot afford well according to you what shall they do? Live in ignorance and accept their luck eh...I am not saying that Obama will fix the country...OH NO...it will takes generations to fix this country...but at least the man is willing to initiate change and change they rusty mentality of the american people that is self destroying them.
There was once an empire called rome that vanished in thin air, because its leaders and its people thought too highly of themselves and did not evolve but decided to live in the past remembering the good old days...America is walking that same path...and McCain a war president, and Palin the most insulting woman I have ever heard for 3 minutes, would only speed that process to hell.
And if you create the job sir, I am sure americans will take it. I will make sure they take. So it is easy for you to say perhaps "GET A JOB and BUY YOUR OWN HEALTHCARE"...
You say history is in the past, and you are voting for a guy whose campaign is all about his past history...let's no by hypocrites here...make up your mind
if i am to line up citizens...NORWAY, Sweden, Danmark, Switzerland, Canada, Spain, Germany. and those migrants that you talk about like my family think of america as a land of opportunity until the get here to find more oppression and lies for people who are far less intelligent and hard working than they are, but are well connected and second or third generations here...I am not stupid sir, so if you want to debate we can debate, but I will prove you wrong in almost about everything.
in italy they tell this story about migrants who want to come in America " a young man thought of america as being the place of dreams, of golden dreams, where roads are paved with gold, but when i got there, not only were not the roads paved in gold, but there were no roads at all, and all of them were waiting for me to pave them." that's Bush's america...and that will be McCains america. We would rather sit and watch baseball and get money from China than work for ourselves, than you complain about God knows what.
While you are proud we are the best thing going at the moment, I am not. Because I want to be proud we stay the best thing for more than just the moment.
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I know that I am out of step: I felt a sense of shame at seeing Sara Palin's unmarried pregnant teenage daughter standing on state as a model for America's Second Family.
But I guess Mary Cheney set the standard for Presidential Family Values and a pregnant unmarried teen is no big deal. She also had a baby out of wedlock.
But to parade this adolecent and her "baby daddy" before the public, when teenage pregnancy is one of the leading causes of poverty in the US is almost criminal in its intent.
The so-called family values of the political connected is just as bad as the common folk who tell their daughters the consequence of not abstaining. My generation feared pregnancy and "the clap." This present generation is fearless because now its behavior is backed by the Seal of the United States.
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R-Snail Post # 271, it's you, not Bill Tyrone Post # 30 who shows a lack of comprehension.
You doubt Bill's claim of identity a a Military Officer because there is nothing conservative or republican in his writing? Are you implying ALL Military officers are either conservative or republican? You really don't know of any democrats or liberals who have been Military officers? It's your bona fides which are in doubt Mr.Snail, not Bills.
Referring to Obama you ask, "has he ever met a head of state." Yes, he has, more importantly, he has actually lived abroad in Asia and Africa. He has a far better understanding of their cultures than almost any other politician. Contrast his diversity with that of Palin who just recently visited abroad for the first time.
I note you believe the next generation of Iraqis will benefit fom the war. My concern is at home, will Americans benefit from this war, and how? Was the cost of the war worth it? More than 4,000 dead. 30,000 injured - thousands of American children living without parents, husbands without wives and wives without husbands. Thousands of American families devasted by loss and injury. Hundreds of Billions of Dollars of borrowed money spent on this war, was it really worth it?
We attacked Iraq, as you imply because Saddam was a tyrant and not treating his citizens right. Would the rest of the world have been right if they had attacked us when we had slavery because our system did not treat all our citizens fairly?
You go on to assert that Obama would project America as being weak. Has the foreign policy of President Bush who weilded a stick resulted in any gains for America? If so, what?
You may have visited Iraq. I come from that part of the world and I believe democracy is not coming to Iraq for at least 50 years. Sadly, Islam is not yet compatible with democracy. The war has turned one of the most liberal Islamic countries into one of the most conservative. The Iraq war has emboldened Iran and we have been unable to marshall all our resources to tackle the real problem on the Afghanistan Pakistan border.
Speed up, Mr.Snail!!!!
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Sam, it was all going so well until the 5pm thing. It's nearly an hour away, I could drive for 30 mins east to Montana and Mountain time to speed things up. Alternatively, as they say around here, it's after 5 somewhere. Cheers!
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229 Ed Iglehart
Hitler was Elected, but than took over into a dictatorship. You know better, and that remark is sad.
As to the Civil war being fought as two Democracys, yes,... but is was a civil war within one democracy,... Jeez
Any one for the three pieces of legislation (N)BhO did? As the author.
I noticed that on wikipedia the "community organiser" page has been updated five hundred time so that history is fundimentallly re-written. No prior dates exist, (they keep up to five hundred pages for historical research).
Mentioning Hitler and re-writing history, community organising for race, creed and placement, pre school children through revolution,... and ya'll ask for it.
McCain*Palin
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I'm an American, and I thoroughly enjoyed BOTH conventions. They are extravaganzas, spectacles, and lots of FUN!!! A presidential nominee convention is not the platform for presenting policy and agenda but rather-
1. It is a celebration of the victory of the party's candidate and 2. It is a rally with the main purpose being the unification of the party.
The nitty-gritty stuff starts AFTER the conventions are over.
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Talk to them.Salaam, etc.
ed
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#345 Rednyella From the dates you provide you appear to be all of 26 - hardly a lifetime of knowledge of the world, let alone America.
"I still pay NI and hope to come home one day if my career allows me." If you become an American citizen you won't be eligible for NHS treatment at no cost, meanwhile, as an American resident (not UK) you are not eligible now. National Insurance contributions do not pay for the NHS - general taxation does. I hope you can afford the cost of health care in the US - millions cannot, which is why the Democrats will ensure that they can.
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The Democrats seem more for change than the Republican's, in fact it's inherent in the philosophy of the Republican's that change means less government interference, which translates to no change for the masses, but individual change for the individual who can manage and control their personal freedoms of which there are relatively few with this capability.
The problem the Democrats has is at some point when you get the poor, unemployed, disadvantaged, oppressed, young, disenfranchised middle-class on their feet they will be wanting more of their personal freedoms to determine their own destiny and not necessarily want the destiny that the Democratic government will define.
So both parties has to recognize that both their political philosophies need each other to thrive, that is, the more personal freedom minded people there are the more in aligned with the Republicans they are. The less government community initiatives the less able the community can manage and control their personal freedoms because they will be economically disadvantaged.
The trick is to get the balance right. Yes, that means at some point you will have to both raise and reduce taxes. Yes, that means government will have to both control and give freedoms to people depending on the circumstances. Yes it means both going to war and declaring peace.
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Fritz_Kraut (#355), your first point is "spot on," as the Brits (or is it merely English) say. The fallacy in emphasizing the experience of various kinds that the candidates have is that none has any experience at all at being president or vice president. Whoever the president is, he will have many advisors at his side, some of whom have participated in previous administrations. The National Security Council is the key group of advisors in crisis situations, but there are many others, and of course senior members of Congress, the Chiefs of staff of the armed services, and so on. What the president needs is not experience in all aspects of his responsibility as Chief of the Executive Branch, but good judgment in selecting the people around him and in evaluating their advice.
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Chill,
And they were wrong in both cases. Deeper examination revealed many caveats, including "single source" warnings. America was never threatened, but, at a stretch, Israel might have been, but is well able to retaliate.Salaam, etc.
ed
As I said before, I would talk, and if action eventually proved necessary, I would move mountains to get the UN on board...(and I would listen to my Weapons inspectors if they wanted more time)
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Justin, we both know this. Sarah Palin is on the ticket to spice the McCain candidacy up. He is NOT the greatest public speaker.
If McCain loses, his campaign already had problems. If he wins, there may be a boost from Gov. Palin there.
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Do we (USA) want a chicken hawk or a peacemaker?
Unfortunately nearly all the people I know of that want McCain for President do not really know the impact of their choice. They think he is more experienced, therefore he should be a better leader. Their focus is on stability, internationally and domestic.
I met a Psychologist Doctor a few weeks ago and asked him if a person was tortured for 5 years and a broken man, what longterm psychological harm can one expect from such conditions? He had no idea I was speaking about McCain until later. He responded, "I did not think of that."
The point I am making that people want to feel good and overlook want is really happening. Most voters really do not get it.
If one is more experienced, it does not really matter what experience it is or what is the underlining factor for that particular leader. They can have failures all their life, and have experience.
The most important candidate for our time is who is the better leader, not who is more experienced. We do not need a hot head on the thermonuclear button. America wake up and get educated. We are too much accepting of the sound bite and 30 second commercial drivel.
McCain = War
Obama = Peace
God help us all.
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#335
Snail,
1. 'My friend' is a patronizing and annoying address. Bloggers are not your friends
2. Britain and France declared war on germany because their national interests were threatened. Period. Did they know the Nazis were nasty to Jews? Yes. Did Britain know the Argentines were throwing people out of helicopters before the Falklands war? Yes. Irrelevant
3. The jury is out on whether Iraqi kids will be better off than pre war. Right now they are still at risk of losing their lives and therefore worse off, as you said, than before. To argue they will be better off in future as justification for an unjust war is ridiculous
4. Edmund Burke. His position would be the US should be in Rwanda, Uganda and so on. Arguing against yourself by trying to look smart
5. Education is awful in the US largely because it is underfunded and the burden of the 'No child' legislation diverts that money to administrators. Another Bush legacy. Increased funding is needed. Vouchers are not the answer. Introducing a free market in demerit goods results in higher prices and lower service, this has been shown in everything from Military services to healthcare
6. healthcare. See 5. Britain spends half the US GDP on healthcare and gets better per capita services. US healthcare paid for by employers is a hidden tax on business and should be scrapped to help our companies compete
7. The welfare state did not bankrupt the UK. The biggest issue facing Maggie was Keynesian economic policy and Union restrictions in the labor market. The introduction of monetarismsaved the UK economy. Somethingthat would be useful here right now
8. You have to look at both candidates on the ticket this year because McCain is unlikely to live through the presidency, statistically. At least he is unlikely to be fit for 4 years. That said, a vote for the ticket is a vote to put Palin in charge
9. Our political problem is people being allowd to get away with lying. That may be changing
10. Taxation. A big lie always brought up by Republicans when all else fails. No where has Obama said he will raise taxes on anyone but the top 5%. republicans always raise indirect taxes and charges which hit everyone the same por the poor hardest. Immoral
11. A silly example of where would people like to live. Most at home. A better question is 'which country do you most fear' or 'who is the most dangerous world leader today'. Both are hypothetical and therefore nonsense
And next time, try to make a single point. Jeez this is tedious to respond to.
Net net, McCain / Palin. A broken old man who jokes about bombing and an unknown zealot. Or Obama / Biden. A promising Senator with good judgement and a good team with an old foreign policy war horse?
Obama Biden is a safer bet in a bad world.
Serious Sam
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ref #373
And then knowing you Ed you would let them keep them.
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