Returning to the fray from Europe
He shook hands with the policemen outside 10 Downing Street!
This is presidential? No way Ronald Reagan would have done it. Was it a nicely Democratic touch or a nervy moment for a man so exhausted that he would have shaken hands with anyone who presented him or herself?
Anyone except a foreign reporter, that is. Or to be more precise a reporter working for a foreign organisation. I see one British newspaper is cheekily suggesting that my friend Richard Wolffe is their man on the plane.
True Richard is British - from Birmingham and still capable of doing the accent (though unaccountably he chooses not to except on feast days) - but his day job is with Newsweek. This was, to the end, a US show.
It could be that Obama chose to shake hands with London bobbies because they were a landmark with which Americans could identify. Less so the Prime Minister Gordon Brown and not at all the leader of the opposition David Cameron whose photo op has been airbrushed out of most US coverage. In both cases the Obama camp knows full well it is bestowing favours, not receiving them.
Did he really cancel a trip to see injured soldiers because cameras were not allowed as alleged by McCain?
If he did, it was a mistake but not a disaster.
An honest assessment of the impact of the trip would have to be: too early to tell. Talk of poll bounces or the opposite is just 24-hour TV nonsense; voters will decide in November based on the totality of their experience of the candidates. The trip plays into that - it matters and overall it appears to have been a success but it will not be decisive.
Incidentally CNN described Gordon Brown as a "Head of State." This mistake - a common one - is part of the reason why Americans often think Brits are uncomfortably nasty to their prime ministers. To American eyes attacking them can sometimes seem unpatriotic - they do not realise that these figures represent a party not the state. Conversely we Brits forget sometimes that Obama and McCain are competing to become America's Queen. As it were...
Meanwhile I have kissed the tarmac at Baltimore Airport and returned to the fray. It is All About to Happen...
Hello, I'm 
© MMX~RS~q~RS~~RS~z~RS~26~RS~)
Comments
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The power of a US President to enact a program depends on the Congress and its leadership.
In Britain, the PM has more legislative power.
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The US President can also veto legislation which gives the position bargaining power in crafting laws. Often, the President's threat to veto will cause a bill to change it's form.
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At this stage in a campaign I am bored out of my skull. I don't care who says what. I don't care who is attacking whom. I don't care about the polls. I don't care what the world thinks.
What I do care about is shortening campaigns to two months and compulsory tarring and feathering of anyone who cheats.
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#3allmy...
I tend to agree.
It does seem as though the founding fathers created a system full of drama and longevity way before any long running Broadway play.
The only difference is the play is generally more watchable, since it is transient, unlike the presidential race!
Justin
I think you're right, it was more about aligning oneself with "symbolism" such as a London cabbie, rather than anything of substance....no change there then really!
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As to Obama shaking hands with a bobby, I have seen visiting dignitaries guilty of worse.
President Carter (who was so American he thought everyone else was) greeted the Empress Farah by kissing her on the cheek. This was a Moslem woman, the wife of the Shah! And on Iranian national television! Phew. That went over big. That was about as insulting as you could get. Not good PR.
Another memorable occasion was when the President of one of America's largest banks showed up dead drunk at a formal fete in his honor at the Central Bank of Iran. He stood at the podium so sloshed (in a Moslemy non-drinkiing country) he could barely stand. At one point he held himself up by wrapping his arm around my American partner, whom he thought was an old Persian friend. Not good PR.
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Like two great snipers, the protagonists are
each waiting for their opponent to slip up...
This is why shaking hands of Bobbies is less
dangerous than talking with BBC reporters.
#3, allmymarbles, if we followed your suggestion,
all of our politicians would look like "Big Bird."
Personally, I'm in favor of it, because it would
add color to our legislative assemblies, and,
being somewhat conservative as I am, I believe
that it would add a deterrent to the usual
political muggings that seem to be part of
our politics.
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It is easy to explain why he shook hands with a british police oficer - the british police are the most trustworthy and best in the world bar none.
In opinion polls police officers - despite being in a job involving conflict much of the time - constantly come out near the top - whilst journalists, MPs and estate agents rank bottom.
It threfore makes sense to shakes hands and be seen with someone trustworthy rather than shaking hands with the people from the gutter press.
The Moseley case shows how far the level has sunk in investigative reporting in the UK.
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"Obama and McCain are competing to become America's Queen. As it were..."
Hmmm. Judging by this story, McCain's already behaving like one. And it's not the first time in his career, is it?
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"CNN described Gordon Brown as a "Head of State." "
It's become a very careless hbit among journalists and people who speak English as a foreign language. It crops up a lot on the BBC News website ...
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The attitude to the President that you mention is one of the problems with the American system.
The American media is far too deferential to the occupant of the Whitehouse.
Presidents are politicians elected on a party ticket ,they have almost dictatorial powers under a system that is too heavily tipped against the Legislative arm of government.It is not healthy for democracy that once elected, they are treated like constitutional monarchs. Without the equivalent of Prime Ministers Question Time and with an overly respectful Media , they are able to avoid being properly scrutinised.
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The police and fire services are still highly respected in America following 9/11. Shaking hands with British bobbies, knowing those images will reach America says Obama is still in touch with the honest working man.
I have been watching Obama's tour and it is the faces of those people in the crowds, their huge smiles that reveal enormous expectations, that makes me think will he ever be able to live up to those expectations.
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
The whole media circus has been dumbed-down to appeal to americans and as such has little appeal to me. I think that the American political system is a dysfunctional joke and they should have an option to register a protest vote. Obama will not change anything, he is just as much in the pocket of the lobbies as McCain and Clinton. That country is run by corporations who create the illusion of a democracy. Then there's the fact that all the candidates are religious nuts and even boast about their lunacy as some kind of virtue.
As for the American fear of questioning their president, it's pathetic isn't it? It isn't so much that the president is head of state, it is mainly because they are so much more nationalist than us.
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I was dubious about Justin Webb's BBC appointment to Washington when announced.
I was completely wrong.
His sketches are just great.
Tight, penetrating, and often waspish to the point of near-bitchiness,,, and so often side-splittingly funny.
But most importantly, they're concise, incisive and accurate ~ always getting to the political pinch-points.
And so wonderfully "British" in tone.
Excellent, memorable and eminently quotable output.
Keep it up Justin.
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I've never really understood the need for a 'head of state', whether monarch or president. Surely we'd get along perfectly well without someone to magically embody our country like some kind of oversized voodoo doll.
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This comment has been referred to the moderators. Explain.
Approach a US police officer to shake his/her hand, and you stand a fair chance of being shot dead.
At least Obama knew the worst that would happen with a British bobbie was that the proffered hand be declined.
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So Obama was told by the Pentagon that he couldn't practice politics on a military base. McCain was told the same thing back in April, according to CNN, and there was no "seismic event."
http://edition.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/04/03/mccain.pentagon/index.html
If McCain is going to badmouth Obama, he can at least badmouth him about something he, himself hasn't done!
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There's no puzzle about Obama's shaking the policeman's hand. Americans, like the French, shake hands regularly with friends, strangers, and even policemen. The English don't shake hands very often and will look at an American who has offered to shake hands as if they are being offered a wet fish.
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So Obama was told by the Pentagon that he couldn't practice politics on a military base. McCain was told the same thing back in April, according to CNN, and there was no "seismic event."
http://edition.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/04/03/mccain.pentagon/index.html
If McCain is going to badmouth Obama, he can at least badmouth him about something he, himself hasn't done!
The current president, Mr. Bush, has taken too much power upon himself, and he is being brought to whatever senses he has by our Supreme Court, which has ruled against him many times over his treatment of Iraqis imprisoned - no, "detained" - at Guantanamo. The current president's approval rating in the US has just about reached the single digits.
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The power of the US President depends not only on Congress but the Supreme Court. Hopefully we will restore the balance of powers that the Constitution intended in the Fall.
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#21 - Candace9839
That would be the Supreme Court the president appoints would it? So much for the separation of powers then.
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#1 - Xie-Ming
The prime minister has no legislative powers. He does have extensive executive powers.
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#3 and #5 allmymarbles
Lovely stories. Thanks
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Shaking hands wuth two policemen may not have been very "presidential", but it is certainly very American! As opposed to Europe where class still dominates social relationships, we make no distinction between a policeman or a PM, actually, many of us would tend to hold a policeman in higher esteem than a politician!
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Justin, I thought the shaking of the policemen's hands was a really nice gesture.
Perhaps, it shows naievity but it also shows that he is a real person who can connect with real people. I know it's easy to be cynical all the time, but this guy really is a breath of fresh air.
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Justin:
You are very much mistaken that visiting the wounded troops is not a disaster.
German's don't vote in the U.S election.
Also you and CNN (I think you need to find a better U.S media source) have not mentioned one key point:
Obama said his position on the war would not change after he visited. And the fact that an airhead like Katie Couric can even fluster him shows that issue is not going away.
Obama trip overall good, but those 2 issues along with an obvious biased press will negate it.
You might alos point out that McCain decreased Obama's lead during the trip.
There is more than 1 canidate. how about doing the next five blogs about McCain?
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#17: If your comment was meant to take a swipe at the US for allowing gun ownership/allowing US police to carry guns, then say what you mean withou tarnishing the facts.
If your comment was meant as factual, it's ridiculous and also insulting to the men and women who wear the police uniform in the US, do an incredible job in the face of current crime levels, and who would shake your hand as well as talk with you if approached without any shots fired.
Don't like the gun policy in the US? Address that directly. But don't take swipes at men and women who put their lives on the line, are inadequately paid, and yet respond daily to public necessity.
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The condemnations of Obama's decision to cancel a visit to a military hospital in Germany reflect the desperation of the RNC, and their cynical attempts to undermine the popularity of one of the most charismatic, humble and intelligent presidential candidates we had in decades.
Let's face it, if Obama had visited the hospital he would have been accused of using wounded American soldiers as a "political football" to get votes.
What seems to be conveniently forgotten in all the discussions is an acknowledgement of the little enthusiasm and attention that McCain elicited during his visits to Colombia, Mexico and Canada since his nomination. In fact, judging by the limited attention he is getting at home, I question the accuracy of the polls that show him within striking distance of Obama. Is the media purposely trying to keep the race competitive?
Obama may not have all the right answers, and some of his proposals (expansion of the Faith Based Initiative, and increasing troop levels in Afghanistan) may be counterproductive, but overall his vision, proposals and the hope he inspires are a welcome development in American politics.
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For a man wanting to be president, which includes the duties of commander in chief, not visiting the injured troops is a heck of a lot more than just a speed bump-hiccup on the Obama Express Tour.
I'll be curious to see if the US media buries this story into irrelevance. I have a rather cynical feeling that this will be one of the only media outlets to report it (no, printing it on page 24 in section B of the NYTimes does not count).
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I wonder if Richard from the Telegraph will have a 'kipper tie'..?
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#18, Kaelinda wrote:
"If McCain is going to badmouth Obama, he can at least badmouth him about something he, himself hasn't done!"
The 'seismic event' to which McCain referred was "...If I had been told by the Pentagon that I couldn't visit those troops, and I was there and wanted to be there...".
In every case in the article you cite, McCain did make the visit to the troops but without politicking.
This is the kind of lie and invective that has characterised the Left at least since the Iraq War. The truth is, it appears, too inconvenient to be spoken.
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Gordon Brown - effectively powerless, more of an advisor and a figure head
President - has some power, more so depending on the politic climate in the US
Queen Elizabeth - ultimate power within the United Kingdom
When the US can learn about other cultures we will already have terraformed and colonised Mars
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@27 MagicKirin
We are not interested in McCain, we are seeing and experiencing the total mess his party is causing right now.
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As the leader of the dominant party in Parliament, the British PM exercises legislative power.
The US president must depend on the Congress and can have the opposition controlling the Congress.
The symbolic exaltation of the US president is a disconcerting thing and may fool the incumbent as well as most of the public.
[My take is that Obama is far less likely to be deluded by symbolics than is his opponent]
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Mighty Morfa Power Ranger wrote:
@27 MagicKirin
We are not interested in McCain, we are seeing and experiencing the total mess his party is causing right now.
Are you using the Royal We? It may have escaped your attention but there is a real possibility Obama will lose.
And the Democrats in congress have a lower apporval rating than Bush. Why? Because they have done almost nothing in 1.5 years except say no.
The Housing bill was the first real thing they have done except hold partsian hearings.
And some of us are sick of being lectured to a clueless individaul who has no qualifications to be President, other than he is older than 35.
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As to the length of a campaign, yes, it is painful to endure,
but, one gets a chance to see the contenders under stress
and, spin and counter-spin have more chance to work themselves out.
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Obama is a down-to-earth who shook the hands of fellow down-to-earth humans who happens to be policemen... so what's the big deal? Seems the British [class oriented society] expected Obama to shake the hands of elites and top politicians only. That's were Americans differ fundamentally from the British.
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i have not recently read in depth anything ,apart from the OBAMA visit .
i must say that i have thought that you have slightly turned native in how you see AMERICA ,it`s not anything i can point to but on reading your articles since you have taken up your posting.
it may be that the seductive way AMERICA treats us brits especially when they are the coresspondent (sorry don`t know full title)
from the BBC and they want to have BRITAIN on side to give them a slight hope to be seen less of a war mongering right wing bunch of critters than they are .
i`m not hopfull that you will agree but maybe on reflection and given time you may see my point .anyway best alex
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#18 kaelinda...
I am curious as to whether or not you actually read the article to which you provided the URL...
When I read it (in it's entirety), the only place Senator McCain didn't go was to a museum on a military base...
How idiotic would he look if he were to make a stink over not being allowed to visit a museum?
I do believe, however, that he would raise hell over not being allowed to visit wounded service members. Please remember that McCain was a POW in Hanoi for 5 years and to question his patriotism or his loyalty to the members in the US military is indicative of your level of ignorance on this particular matter.
Please feel free to go back and review the link that you posted and post any corrections or retractions to your previous post.
I do believe that it was a mistake for Senator Obama not to have visited wounded service personell. Leave the campaign staff at the hotel, take your secret service agent and make a stop to visit your country's heroes.
As for shaking the hand of a bobbie, good for him. Obama has never been about putting himself above others (as far as I can tell) and shaking the hands of average working class Joes is what he does.
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Ref #36
And the Democrats in congress have a lower apporval rating than Bush. Why? Because they have done almost nothing in 1.5 years except say no.
Congressional partisanship is, indeed, disturbing and downright damaging to our country; but we would be well served to remember all the veto threats announced by the White House during the past 1.5 years every time the Democratic "majority" in Congress announced legislation that the Republican Administration objected to. Fortunately, the White House has recently showed more flexibility and concern for middle class America by agreeing to sign the Housing Bill and raising the minimum wage, which they threatened to veto 1.5 ago when the Democrats first proposed it.
Don't forget that the Senate consists of 49 Democrats, 49 Republicans, and two Independents with one of them (Lieberman) often voting to the right of many Republicans and VP Cheney acting as tie breaker. So much for a Democratic majority!
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Mighty Morfa Power Ranger wrote:
Queen Elizabeth - ultimate power within the United Kingdom
------------------------------------------------------------
Er.... the Queen, as a constitutional monarch, has no legislative, executive or judicial power whatsoever. Her role is almost entirely ceremonial.
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#33 Mighty Morfa Power Ranger...
"When the US can learn about other cultures we will already have terraformed and colonised Mars"
Hmmm... I'm guessing that it will be the US that's leading that particular mission...
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Why shouldn't Barack Obama shake hands with a London police officer? This comment by Justin seems more a reflection of his own attitude to police officers than anything else.
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NASA has worked closely with foreign space agencies (ESA, CNES, NASDA, CSA, RSA and others) throughout its history; but projects such as the Phoenix Lander and Pathfinder have been led, mostly, by NASA, JPL (CalTech), the University of Arizona, Cornell and other domestic institutions.
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I also saw how Obama was shaking the hands of the two Policemen standing in front of Downing Street there.
Great sign he has given to all the waiting people there ! Wish I would have been there too !
Barack Obama seems for me a man who has the right charisma and great understanding to lead America trying to make peace and freedom for our world how it should be !
To listen to his speech as he was in Berlin , GREAT indeed !
Wish Barck Obama would be the next Mr President of the Un ited States of America.
God bless him and all people in the world !
Syriane from Germany
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Look, Obama is going to be President, that is almost certain. Can't we move on.
If only all the hacks who feast on the election could be re assigned to Lagos or somewhere like that, then we wouldn't be subjected to these boring articles.
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Admiral1386
It's a good thing Obama doesn't look like a Brazilian electrician or he might have been mistaken by the London Police for an Arab terrorist and shot to death. Or he might have been taken into custody like Steve Lawrence and murdered by them. If they are as good as you say they are, Why did London hire former Mayor Guiliani of New York City as a consultant to help them reduce crime?
Comparing the President of the United States with a British Monarch shows a profound lack of understanding of the roles of different elected officials in the US government. Many others posting here show similar lack of knowledge. Mr. Webb, I suggest that you enroll in an evening high school civics class in Washington DC. You will learn far more about how American government works functionally than you apparently know or think you know. BTW, I think it's free. At least find out what text they use and read it. You will see that the US Constitution is the most exquisitely created instrument for balancing the power of government ever devised. By comparison, European Constitutions including the EU Constitution is ludicrously crude and clumsy.
Since Obama has no substance to give his candidacy credence, his image is all he will be able to offer the American voter. That image will be badly tarnished by his obvious faux pas not visiting the wounded soldiers in the hospital. His opponents would be fools not to take advantage of it. He proved Senator Clinton correct when she said he is not fit to be commander-in-chief of the US armed forces. It may seem a trivial point to Europeans but it will likely resonate with American voters.
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Dominick, I agree with you about the hospital visit. He would have been attacked either way - it's a non-story and it's unfortunate that even the liberal media are indulging the RNC with this blatant distortion.
I disagree however about the polls. I believe Obama's lead is even tighter than they suggest. Don't forget the Bradley effect. Some voters just can't bring themselves to vote for a black despite what they say to a pollster.
Nice article from Sarah Baxter in the Times today, but I'm not so optimistic. A lot of southern white Democrats are voting for McCain and I don't need to tell you why.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article4405766.ece
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The police hand-shake was a nice touch, to my eyes. Why should a an-important-person be too good to be respectful of police officers?
It goes to show that the 'elite' charge laid at him by Clinton was unfounded. Or so, perhaps, his campaign has calculated?
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ref #41
Dominick how about the house refusing to put issues to a vote? Several energy bills and the Columbia Free Trade agreement for example.
also how about the abuse of the confirmation process.
Advise and Consent, not block.
When Rep controlled congress, they allowed Ruth Ginsberg nomination through even though she was on the extreme end of the judiciary. Because they knew she was qualified legally.
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echohotel wrote:
Look, Obama is going to be President, that is almost certain. Can't we move on.
If only all the hacks who feast on the election could be re assigned to Lagos or somewhere like that, then we wouldn't be subjected to these boring articles.
That is what the Hillary supporters said two years ago.
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Webb,
For a supposed expert on American politics, you're really drinking the John McCain kool aid. I thought better of the BBC than this. Obama didn't visit the soldiers in Germany because the Department of Defense said that he could only visit with his Senate staff, not with campaign staff. Alas, they didn't tell him this until after he'd already left on the trip, bringing only campaign staff, leaving him little choice but to skip that part of the trip. In any case, the attacks being launched by McCain on Obama about not caring about the troops unless there are cameras around are pretty baseless, considering that just last week he visited Walter Reed Medical Center and left his entourage of reporters behind.
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echohotel, your European penchant for despotism is showing.
google "Dewey defeats Truman" and look at the famous image of President elect Truman holding up the November 3, 1948 Chicago Tribune newspaper on the day after election day announcing his defeat. A lot can happen in American politics between now and election day. The outcome is far from certain. It was Mark Twain who said "reports of my death are greatly exaggerated." I think you are afraid Obama will lose. I think your fears are well founded. How typical of Europeans to reject the wisdom of the American people to choose their leaders yet proclaim they like Americans but hate their government. Where else does government reflect the will of the people more closely than in America?
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USA politics
You know, when I visit people I care about in a hospital, I don't have any staff at all with me. Obama simply revealed his true feelings or should I say lack of them for our soldiers who risk their lives to protect our nation. He also showed he is not very clever. This reminds me of how he first refused to distance himself from Reverend Wright. Will he flip flop on this one too? If he can't avoid these simple blunders in a political campaign, what kind of mistakes would he make if he got into office. This proves his real lack of judgement. I think the kind of change Obama would bring is change for the worse.
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Well, there was nothing stopping Obama from going to see the troops on his own, was there? He could have left the paparazzi behind.
On the handshake - seems to be setting a good example to our own politicians. Let's see GB doing a bit more of that.
compare and contrast:
The POTUS and the Queen are heads of state in their respective countries, and their treatment by the media in their own countries is roughly comparable - seems fair so far.
The POTUS and the Prime Minister are the Chief Executives, and that's where the difference comes to the fore.
The point is that in parliament, we have Her Majesty's Government facing Her Majesty's Opposition. Both owe loyalty to the head of state, alongside the armed forces, the police and the judiciary, not to mention the rest of us. This is one reason why many of us - and I'm one - prefer to keep the constitutional monarchy rather than change to a presidential system. There are many problems with our system - not least the inequality issue related to inheriting status - but it does function to separate politics from some State issues.
Of course there are other options, and the upper House is well overdue for root and branch change, but I haven't yet seen any serious attempt which would keep the politicians from just putting in their pals. A senatorial system of some kind would be possible.
It's probable though, that any attempt by the Queen or her successors to exercise the theoretical power remaining in the monarchy would result in a rapid change in status. Law isn't law until she's signed it, but she really doesn't have any option once it's been approved by both houses of Parliament.
Choosing not to do so would mean a constitutional crisis.
I'd be interested to know how US posters assess how the parties in Congress and the Senate view loyalty - is it to the nation, the party, the POTUS, the American people or some kind of mixture? Does loyalty to your own state come higher than loyalty to the US or lower down the list?
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#47
echohotel is almost certain that Obama is going to be the president.
I'm not at all sure of it.
At least one of the last two presidential elections went to the candidate with the lesser popular vote. The electoral college, the courts, or even the congress may hold the trump cards in this election.
Is it time to consider a scenario where neither Obama nor McCain are elected President of the United States?
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#56, ArgyllJenny, if you ask your typical US
voter to rate his/her congressperson, they
would generally tend to be favorable, whereas
they would rate the Congress negatively.
As they say, "all politics is local."
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"Meanwhile I have kissed the tarmac at Baltimore Airport..."
An interesting choice of words. A metaphor I presume.
One of the advantages of jet travel compared to an ocean voyage or even a transatlantic trip on a prop plane is that you enter one world with the one you left behind still fresh in your memory only a few hours old. This allows you to make much clearer comparisons between them. And it also allows you to easily go back and forth again and again to make more comparisons or to make more detailed comparisons of those aspects of life you wish to compare. It will make for a more interesting book.
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People forget that the United States of America is a republic. The good ole USA, for all of our posturing, does not practice anything close to a pure form of democracy. I think we have to go back to Athens in Pericles' day to find any of that.
What this means is that a governing elite can and does overrule the voice of the people. That's America for you, and it's always been this way.
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"It could be that Obama chose to shake hands with London bobbies because they were a landmark with which Americans could identify."
Equally, he might just have been trying to be friendly. I don't think that political figures necessarily subject their every impulse to a vote-getting calculus before carrying them out. Is there any room left for warmth and decency? Just a thought.
And as for calling policemen landmarks...
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Ref #49
The feedback I have been getting from most of my neighbors, friends, and relatives is that they plan to vote for McCain because of an issue that has nothing to do with Obama's ideology, vision, or principles. It is a sad commentary on the values and maturity of our society but, like you, I also believe that the illusion of a fair and tolerant society is just a chimera at this point in our history. It really doesn't matter if McCain has to be wheeled in with an IV hanging from his arm to take the Oath of Office, he will be - more than likely - the next President of the USA. Let's hope he chooses a competent VP. Hopefully things will be different by the end of this century...
Ref #51
Opposition to offshore drilling was a bipartisan issue until McCain and Republican congressmen realized a few weeks ago that it was a convenient wedge issue that could be used effectively against the Democrats. The high price of gas has nothing to do with shortages or potential interruptions (ours come from Canada, Mexico, Nigeria and Venezuela). The reason involves irresponsible consumers intent on driving gas guzzlers regardless of the damage they cause to the US economy, oil companies and speculators more interested in profits than the well being of the consumer, and an auto-industry that is on the verge of bankruptcy because of their lack of long term planning. Oil is not a renewable resource, and consecutive administrations have done everything possible to preserve our resources so that our standard of living is not affected when shortages do occur.
On "free trade" agreements, the only thing I can say is that thus far they have favored our trading partners to the detriment of American workers. I support legislation that protects our people, not corporations or foreign interests. There is a difference between fair trade and "free" trade, particularly when the latter is anything but free.
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Chicoan;
America has a representative democracy, not a pure democracy. For a nation of three hundred million to have a pure democracy would be impossible. Besides, even if it were technically possible, it would not make sense. Most of us cannot become experts on the subtle but crucial aspects of all of the laws that our elected representatives with the help of their staffs and Congressional Committee meetings afford them. That is their full time job and unless you are willing to make it your own full time occupation, it is best left to those you trust most who can and do.
ArgyllJenny
The media do not treat the President of the United States in any way comparably to the Queen of England. The Queen is treated with great respect. She also rarely makes public appearances, I don't think ever a press conference, and never enters into the fray of public debate over government policy. She is purely a figurehead. An American President by contrast does all of the above and gets lambasted by the press perpetually, sometimes in the crudest of ways. Right now there is a ludicrous Committe meeting in the House discussing impeachment I think chaired by Representative John Conyers of Michigan. Any talk ever of impeaching the Queen?
It's a sad day when loyalty to one's own state and loyalty to the nation don't coincide. Elected Representatives and Senators take an oath to protect and defend the Constitution of the United States so that is their sworn allegience. To that end, they represent the interests of their own constituents. Their loyalty to the party comes last. It is not unusual at all for members of one party to vote with the majority of the opposite party, especially when there are quid pro quo deals which will give the constituents of one Congressman's state or district a concession in one bill in return for a comparable concession to others on another. This kind of wheeling and dealing if you want to be cynical about it greases the skids of American politics and make compromise possible. The Constitution sets up a system where lack of compromise can result in paralysis which is far preferable to the tyranny of a rubber stamp Parliament where the majority party always votes in lock step with the program of the Prime Minister. The legislative and executive branches of government have the power to say NO to each other without the government falling.
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If Barrack Obamma wants to be America's queesn, he had better start taking lessons from Ru Paul.
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MarcusAureliusII
agreed.
It's just that sometimes I wonder how representative the representatives are of their constituents.
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Check back 30 years ago ! If I remember correctly President Carter when he came out of 10 Downing Street and shook a constables hand to the delight of the British press.
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#63 Marcus
media attitudes
was going by what other bloggers have said (not just in this one) about unwarranted reverence for the President from the media.
Did I confuse the man with the office?
No, Her Maj doesn't give press conferences; it would be a gross (Shock! Horror!) occasion for the tabloids if she did as she is supposed to stay out of politics and never express an opinion about it in public, not even "seen it all before".
loyalties
Interesting - reading about a system can never give an outsider a real understanding of how it feels, rather than how it works.
Rubber stamp - er, can't see you being troubled by the idea really, Marcus, but I think you might find G Brown has a somewhat different view. He was relying on the opposition for support on the vote on Lisbon. Fire the lot of 'em, IMHO.
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This is how I see Obama
He Can Talk the Talk
But Has Anyone Ever Seen Him Walk the Walk?
On throwing his hat into the ring Obama felt he must give voters a good reason
why they should think of him as the man for every season.
His Swahili name, he boasts, signifies one blessed by a God Almighty.
To make us love him can he be hinting it’s the one called Aphrodite?
To elderly Jewish ladies, when he wanted it’s origin to describe.
he said it was a Hebrew name, could it be from a Lost Tribe?
No need to explain the background of his second name Hussein,
which was very seldom heard as he embarked on his campaign.
He feels that, to be fair, he must give every ethnic group its place,
and he leaves no stone unturned as he covers every base.
So, as to reach out to those of every background he desperately seeks,
why have we not heard as yet any mention of the Greeks?
He says his U.S. family is connected to a Native American forebear
although exactly to which one he did not. I believe, declare.
To present himself as an African-American he has also managed to contrive.
but is one allowed to ask in which slave ship did his ancestors arrive?
One talent he does have and that no-one can refute
is his ability to talk the talk in a way that’s most astute.
His gift of the gab with which he would us all beguile
can only be inherited from the O’Bamas in what is called the Emerald Isle.
So there he stands before us, he who claims to be Everyman
as we wonder when we’ll hear he has relations in Japan.
Why is it that whenever on TV he stood up and spoke
all I could see on the screen were his mirrors and his smoke?
The captivated press guys punched their laptops and set their emails humming
as they wrote of Barack Obama as they would the Second Coming.
And they lauded him as a potential saviour of the nation
oblivious, it would seem, he was a Messiah of their very own creation.
With his smooth talk he mesmerized many a TV talking head
and few, if any, complained about the pap they were being fed.
As he claimed he’d ban donations from special interests and lobbyists as well,
on the cash they gave to his campaign the reporters did not dwell.
One thing he supports wholeheartedly, is what he calls free trade
yet he swears that, if elected, he will tear up every agreement ever made.
What he believes is trade that’s free, we should not be at all surprised
is flooding foreign markets with U.S. goods that are heavily subsidized.
He furiously rants against two-way trade with Mexico and Canada
and swears he will stop their exports if he becomes the Big Enchilada.
With a wink an aide told the Canadian Ambassador it was one of his boss’s jokes
meant to appease complaining Ohio workers whom Obama calls “the folks”.
If to look at his government’s trade figures he had only taken the trouble
he would see that since NAFTA U.S. exports to Mexico are double.
So if he is ever in a position to give the trade agreement opt out order
the loudest cheers will be heard from south of the U.S.-Mexico border.
His friendship with Tony Resko, charged with money laundering and extortion
has been, he claims, by critics blown out of all proportion.
On talk about his land deal with fraudster Nadhmi Auchi he hopes to put a brake
by saying buying his Chicago mansion from him was a “boneheaded mistake”.
How many more boneheaders may we expect will be revealed,
when diggers begin to search for any that so far may have been concealed?
If media talking heads and scribblers tried to analyze what Obama has to say
they would realize it has the same substance as a sad collapsed soufflé.
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ref #62
Dominick it seems your neighbors are on the opposite side of the same coin as mine.
They will be voting for Obama not because of his views, resume or even party. They have an intellectual disconect that is akin to a messiah complex with Obama.
You could point out an issue and they disregard or call you racist.
Regarding oil, you are right it is not an unlimited source but the democrats have been blocking srilling and nuclear and other alternatives
Cape Wind is the most notorious example of NIMBY by the Kennedys.
Regarding free trade and fair trade I don't think the Unions who are objecting to global workplace reality represet the interest of most people.
If we got rid of the Unions are economy would be so much better. Unions are outdated just like the horse and buggy
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Welcome back, Justin.
The Telegraph article was interesting if only for the quote from Obama:
"That is the tough thing about the war zone - that you can't talk to the local population because it is just too controlled," he said.
"That's an advantage that the press has. You can - particularly now that it is a little safer, there's a possibility to interact."
So tell me, Obama, how do you know that it's a little safer in either Afghanistan or Iraq?
It seems to me that both war zones are very dangerous places, especially for Western journalists, and that this must affect coverage (supply). That, coupled with the fact that few people are interested in what is really going on means that there is little or no market for anything that is produced (demand). The tendency must therefore be to trust what the military have to say.
Obama, why don't you set up an Internet forum for those in-country to let you know what is going on?
Oh, and while you're at it, take a look at "Instructions for American Servicemen in Iraq During World War II", published by the US War Department in 1943, and recently reprinted by the University of Chicago Press. If George had only had his own copyback in 2003, things might have been very different.
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MarcusAureliusII,
It's standard practice for elected reps to bring staff with them. Call it callous, but that's just the way it is. American politicians have handlers, who are always there. Do you think McCain rolls down to Walter Reed all on his lonesome? And I fail to see how his staff being there makes it a publicity stunt, as the McCain campaign claims.
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There is nothing exceptional with shaking hands with a policeman in the USA.
People who perform public service: police officers, firefighters, teachers and military personnel are highly regarded and shaking hands with any of these would not raise eyebrows.
Odds are he was just being friendly.
The fact that such a big deal was made about this says much more about the British press and mindset than it does about Barack Obama.
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#27 MagicKirin wrote "There is more than 1 canidate. how about doing the next five blogs about McCain?"
There's more than two candidates, but it seems Justin has no intention of giving a fair coverage to all.
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1. It was incredibly stupid for Obama's campaign to not make room for some foreign press on this trip -- I hope someone makes the candidate read your post so he can get an appreciation of just how dumb a move that was.
2. Non-US news outlets like BBC have every right to minimize their coverage of the trip, or even black it out completely. After all, they'd know best if their readers/listeners/viewers need or want to know about such things. After all, the major US networks do that all the time when reporting (or not reporting) on global happenings.
3. Both before and after 9/11 Americans have generally held rank-and-file law enforcement in high regard (particularly in comparison with heads of state). If that makes some people uncomfortable, they'll just have to live with it.
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Who knows better than Justin?
"I seem to smell the stench of appeasement in the air."
Margaret Thatcher, British Conservative politician, prime minister. Independent (London, October 31, 1990).
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DominickVila
I used to think about America exporting jobs the same way you do now. But there are some sobering realities to consider. If the many tens or hundreds of millions of jobs exported by America so far had remained in the US, they would either have gone unfilled and undone or we would have had to have grown our population to a far greater degree. These by and large are low paying semiskilled and unskilled jobs. To make them acceptable to OSHA and EPA, US industry would have had to invest probably about a trillion dollars or more and the workers would be paid $30 an hour here instead of $30 a month in China. While this adversely impacts GDP, it is a boon to GNP because much of the profit on the products of that labor goes to American corporations. And as consumers we benefit enormously with a vast array of low cost products.
The reason the American automobile manufacturers' cars are uncompetitive is that there is $3000 built into the price of every domestically made American car in a union run plant which goes to medical insurance for employees and retirees. That may soon change.
Fuel is expenisve because there is both a rapidly increasing demand from the developing world, especially India and China with no corresponding growth in supply and because there has been a lot of speculation on the oil futures markets. Some of that speculative bubble may burst soon but the demand will increase unless economic growth slows substantially. There is also a shortage of refinery capacity in the US. And there are many boutique blends of gasoline sold regionally and seasonally in the US. Gas in California is not the same blend as gas in New Jersey.
There will always be a large number of low paying unskilled and semiskilled jobs in the US. These will be for entry level workers like illegal migrants in the gray economy and youngsters getting their first jobs, often as summer hires or as high school drop outs. America's challenge is to create opportunities for all Americans to earn good livings by providing them with the education and incentives for highly skilled jobs leading to careers and in running their own businesses. It does a fine job of that for anyone who wants to take advantage of it. I don't think there is anywhere in the world where the opportunities in this regard are comparable.
Insofar as China is concerned, in 1973 when Nixon and Kissinger visited China, it was a nation of 1 billion people 90% of whom worked in agriculture yet they had perpetual periodic famines. Their government was as dangerously out of touch with the outside world as North Korea's is today. And they were building nuclear weapons. America relied on the power of a 5000 year old culture of making money, and trading over a 25 year imposed doctrine of communism to make a radical change in China. And it has worked. China today bears no resemblance to that of 1973. It has a direct stake in the future of a peaceful world. Much of this has come not at the expense of American workers but of European workers and corporations. European workers cannot compete with China's for these low wage manufacturing jobs any more than Americans can. Not only did American companies shift production from Europe to China but so did European companies. Margret Thatcher seems to have been the only European leader to have seen the inevitable end to the viability of the European welfare state and she acted to adapt Britain for that much to the anger of her nation. But it's the reason the UK is not in the same dire economic straits as the rest of Europe is now. How can Europe successfully deal with the increasing pressure to compete on an equal footing on the world market? I don't know.
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2 things about this upcoming election strike me:
1) Obama's message is simple: "America is the greatest nation in the world...now let's all work together on changing it"
2) I never (EVER!) thought I'd say it, but I miss Hillary Clinton...
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"Talk about the flag or drugs or crime (never about race or class or justice) and follow the yellow brick road to the wonderful land of consensus.
In place of honest argument among consenting adults the politicians substitute a lullaby for frightened children: the pretense that conflict doesn't really exist, that we have achieved the blessed state in which ... we no longer need politics."
Lewis H. Lapham, U.S. essayist, editor. "Democracy in America?" Harper's (New York, Nov. 1990).
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#48 and subsequent to #76
MA2 Much better! You've really toned down the extremism which made your persona unbelievable - though you need to make sure that your basic English Tory thoughts don't dominate too much.
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oldnat, in your vernacular...you're daft man! In mine...it's unpublishable here.
My views and positions haven't changed one jot (again your vernacular.) Maybe you are just beginning to get the gist of it.
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#79 - oldnat
Is there any other kind of Tory then?
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Barack Obama is on a presidential mission to take America to new heights. By pressing the flesh as Clinton relishes to do, Obama is showing his human touch. On that journey he will try to convince Americans and non-Americans alike that he has all the necessary charismatic, statesman-like leadership qualifications to bridge nations and people together.Shaking hands with British bobbies was bound to grab the head-lines. Showing a relaxed stance with facts at his finger-tips, Obama has captivated the European public. McCain will have a real mountain to climb to beat Obama.
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#81 threnedio
Apart from the original Tories in Ireland, and the losing side among our trans-atlantic colonists, there is the significant difference between English and Scottish Tories. Annabelle Goldie is rather popular in Scotland, and very clever in her parliamentary tactics. After independence, the Scottish Tories could do quite well. Their attitudes are different to English Tories - but that's for a different blog.
#80 MA2
Not a bad try, a more effective tactic would be to use a cricketing analogy - but get it wrong!
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#22 - the President may appoint, but the Congress must approve a nominee
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oldnat
From what I see of the Tories, I find them every bit as repugnant as Labour or the Lib Dems. In my country, if one party were to try to cede the nation's sovereignty to a supranational organization the way Labour seems ready to cede Britain's to the EU, there wouldn't be a call for a referendum, there would be an upheaval the likes of which hasn't been seen in these parts since the 1860s, there would be blood flowing in the streets. But the Tories have rolled over and played dead. Why? Probably because they agree with it. And the British press doesn't make much of the lack of a national debate either. Neither does the population at large utter a protest more than a mewling whimper. Any pretense of democracy under these circumstances can hardly be taken as any more than a sham.
I have also watched the way the Tories conduct themselves in Parliament including PMQT and I must say that they have no more respect for any elected officials or self respect than Labour or the Lib Dems. It's occurred to me that they may not even be sober. Their kind of routine behavior in the US Congress would get them thrown out of the chamber, by force if necessary.
I don't know anything about cricket. All I know that it's played with a flat bat. It is not like American baseball. Any game which breaks for tea time is a pantywaist game in my book. European sports don't cut it where I come from. Maybe this Beckham guy who moved to California to enjoy his millions in privacy and sunshine is popular among teenage girls and soccer moms here (I wouldn't know) but to most Americans, they wouldn't know him from a bag of sour apples. Even your sports have no appeal for me.
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#85 MA2
To those posters who claimed to enjoy MA2's wind-ups, and how people fall for them -
I draw your attention to the above.
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And what is wrong with Obama shaking hands with 10 Downing Street's bobby on duty. Nice people do nice things and it has nothing to do with who you are! Give the man a break he's doing a great job. People do worse things!
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Is it really of interest with whom a candidate shakes hands?
Or is it but an excuse for partisan squabbling?
The BBC has an a good interview with Obama's "Foreign Policy Affairs Advisor" today.
Does anyone have an opinion of the views expressed therein?
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I think it would have been far better for Obama to have shaken a few hands of the wounded soldiers in that hospital who risked their lives to protect America than some guy in a London Bobby uniform that looks like he came straight off a Basil Rathbone Nigel Bruce movie set. We'll see what American voters say when he gets back.
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I find it interesting that a video advertisment for John McCain accompanied this article about OBama criticizing his trip. Has the BBC sold out?
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Mr. Webb's generous willingness to overlook and downplay Obama's refusal to meet with wounded American soldiers reflects the limitations of any foreign correspondent: a suprising lack of awareness regarding Amercians - the very people he is supposed to be covering.
The mess surrounding that, inlcuding the argument with the Pentagon, has been a public relations disaster for Obama.
More homework is needed on Mr. Webb's part. He is so infatuated and obsessed with Obama that he is losing perspective.
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#53 - you said it. Obama woud have been criticised whatever he did - we all know that, despite the foot-stamping and tantrums of the McCain Gang.
Let's face it, they have precious little meat and no scandal where Obama is concerned - even McCain is having to admit that a sixteen month time line for withdrawal is actually a good idea, depending on the conditions on the ground, which is exactly what Obama has been saying for over a year. You only have to check the 'Issues' on his official website to understand this. Day after day we see hashed up versions of what the right wing press think Obama is all about, which just shows how little they value good research and truth-telling - anything, however far-fetched, for a good story and a snipe at the candidate, eh?
As for shaking the hands of bobbies - Justin you're being a bad boy. There are enough people being worked into a lather about Obama without you adding to it ;-)
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My fellow-Brummie Richard Wolffe comes as close to anyone in the media to describing Obama's recent trip as a carefully orchestrated photo-op with the slavishly obedient cooperation of his media fellow-travellers. I thought the man from "Baremingum" hit the nail on the head when he described Obama's rise to prominence as being akin to a county councillor running for Prime Minister after four years in office. Indeed, where did this guy come from? Now all of a sudden he is acting like a Commander-in-Chief lunching with his troops. What kind of an insane scenario is that?
Obama supporters need to come down to earth and see their man for what he really is - a publicity man's dream and little else!
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I still don't understand what is so radical about
Obama shaking hands with a policeman.
Would some Brit please explain to us why this
is significant?
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gunsandreligion:
It's not possible for anyone to know all of the traditions and customs of another nation. I don't think even the most anglophile American would know that it was definitely a profound insult to shake the hand of a bobby.
But this will allow Obama to apologize profusely for the entire American population, once again. He is good at that - and that is the key to his popularity in Europe. Trendy left-wing anti-Americanism is the key to popularity in Europe.
Will he apologize for his failure to meet with hospitalized American troops in Germany? I doubt it. He is far too narcissistic.
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I'm a Scot, so I have no idea.
Rather liked it myself. Much better than Bush knocking down a Scots policeman at the G8!
Maybe there is some strange protocol that the English/British have about not engaging with the servants - they can be strange people at times.
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If you can for a moment move beyond your ingrained British arrogance you may be able to entertain the possibility that Barack Obama shook hands with the bobbies for no other reason than that he's a friendly American who does not share the Englishman's sense of class and snobbery.
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Since no one , including Webb, has been willing or able to look at issues, I shall say good-bye.
[It does illustrate how low and desperate the American right is].
--. ---.---.---.
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Why wasn't there a BBC interview with Barrack Obama while he was in London? An interview with Jeremy Paxman or Matt Frei would be a very informative and exciting interview to watch. You would think when Obama is in your own backyard one would seize the oportunity!
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From a British point of view, Obama didn't understand he is Upstairs and that the Bobbies are Downstairs. Upstairs and Downstairs don't fraternize. The hired help is to be tolerated but disdained. Britain is not a nation whose government is of the people, by the people, and for the people. It's about Eton, Oxford, Cambridge etc. It just isn't done.
Time for tea. Watercress sandwiches anyone? Perhaps a small glass of sherry to calm the nerves. All this business with the foreigners shaking hands with the rabble is enough to make anyone upset. The next thing you know, the bloody riff raff will want a written bill of rights just like the Americans. Nothing but trouble I say, we never should have let them off on their own in the 18th century. They've brought nothing to the world but hell in a handbasket ever since.
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hipsternewsjunkie, I believe that Justin has
been telling us that the Obama campaign will
not grant interviews with their people.
I suggest to Justin that he dress up like a
bobby, and extend his hand when Obama
passes by.
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#94 - gunsandreligion
I can find no reference to it at all in the UK broadsheets today. I think this has grabbed Justin's attention for some reason but nobody else as far as I can see has found anything odd about it.
#97 - Fieldmarshalleccles
- is very uncharitable. I think the friendly gesture explanation is the consensus and I don't think anybody has been class conscious or snobbish or arrogant. Personally, I thought it was charming and natural.
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#100 MA2
Substitute "England" for "Britain" and your post makes the same point as my #96.
Shame on you for agreeing with a European!
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Ref #69
I agree with your opinion of unions. They served a purpose up to about four or five decades ago, but with all the labor protections laws that are in place and the demands of competition they are, indeed, outdated and totally unnecessary.
Having said that, in my modest opinion the main reason for the decline of our industrial and technological might is not caused by unions but by shortsighted managers and corporate greed. Unions did not force Ford, GM and Chrysler to continue making huge vehicles; fuel prices have been rising steadily for a couple of years, why didn't management change strategy, and why did the Japanese foresee this crisis and focused on energy efficient cars, including hybrids? How come Brazil, developing coiuntry, can transition to ethanol for 40% of their fuel needs, and we can't even find a pump or vehicle that operates on ethanol? Obviously, a country that can put a man on the moon and land robots on remote planets can build an energy efficient engine and a network to support alternative fuels, the answer is collusion by corporate and government officials who still see an opportunity to squeeze a few more dollars out of their captive audience.
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On the one hand, it is nice that Senator Obama shook hands with the constables. It is true, someone like Reagan would not have done that.
On the other hand, I am being skeptical and think all he did was something mentioned in any of the Dale Carnegie books about "winning friends and influencing people."
You kissed the tarmac upon landing at BWI (Baltimore Washington Airport)? I cannot resist being cheeky Python style. How did it taste?
All kidding aside, Justin, thank you. It is obvious you love us. I enjoy this blog. All who hate Americans as a whole, I only have one thing to say. (I've said this to others). If you know me and hate me, OK. If you do not take the time to get to know me and say you hate me that is hardly fair, but also not my problem.
Thank you again Justin for having this blog.
I will make sure I have this as a trackback on my blog http://tucsonmike.wordpress.com
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You know better than that oldnat. The watercress sandwich and sherry stereotype might wash with the more bigoted element but it sure as hell cuts no ice over here.
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hipsternewsjunkie wrote:
Why wasn't there a BBC interview with Barrack Obama while he was in London? An interview with Jeremy Paxman or Matt Frei would be a very informative and exciting interview to watch. You would think when Obama is in your own backyard one would seize the oportunity!
Obama is a carefully scripted canidate. when a light weight like Katie Couric can fluster him; he is not going to take a chance with the BBC.
Why do you think he avoids the leading cable news outlet and goes on a network with 1/20 of it's audience MSNBC
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Only in painfully class-conscious Britain would the media , in the form of Mr.Justin Webb, latch on to the sight of an American politician shaking hands with a London policeman and question motive. Shame. By the way, I am an incurable anglophile.
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#106 threnodio
In Hungary? I agree. When I was in Budapest a few weeks ago, I couldn't find a watercress sandwich anywhere!
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Class-conscious? Britain? Which century are you people living in?
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#108 Gatorhank
Please desist from including the Scots in your description of "class-conscious Britain". Our class structure is pretty much the same as I see in the USA - essentially meritocratic.
The UK is by no means mono-cultural although the caricatures on TV may lead you to believe that.
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Justin:
Barrack, shook the hand of the police officer outside 10 Downing Street, because it was a proper thing to do...
I think it was very presidential, although, he [The election has not happend, and not i am endorsing anyone]....I will have my say, as an American citizen in November in the election booth....
Richard Wolffe, The journalist from Birmingham, although working for NEWSWEEK and MSNBC--Could have more of his british charm...
About the cancelling the trip to Germany, to visit the troops--is due to schedulling and protocol...And i agreed with the Pentagon, regarding there reasons about it was not a good idea! Since it would have been condone as a campaign stop.
Shame on John McCain, for doing that to Barrack Obama...I would have thought from an former military service officer, that he knew that it was in bad form...
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CNN: Got it wrong when they said the Gordon Brown, was head of the State...It is the Queen of England [and when it is time: King of England]....
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"He shook hands with the policemen outside 10 Downing Street!
This is presidential?"
No its not, and that is precisely the image that he was trying to portray!! You've been following the coverage of his trip abroad just as much as, in fact probably more than any other journalist!! I'm sure you know that the McCain campaign and others have been accusing him of being too presumptive, of acting as though he has already won the white house-with his huge security detail, big speech, and press comfrance right along side president Sarkozy (who was effectively singing Obama's praises, and who in a not so valed way endorsed him for president!!) Obama had been fighting these accusations all throughout his trip! So you honestily think that in those circumstances he would do anything that would further entrench the impression that he thinks he has already won the white house? I think not! If anything, he'll act in a way which will show the world that there's no way a "president" would act, and therefore deny through action rather than words, the accusation that he does think he's the president!! Actions speek louder than words, do they not? And that is what the hand shakeing of the policemen was all about!! I personally think that even if Obama wasn't running for president, that it would still just be a nice thing to do to shake a policeman's hand! I don't get what the big deal is! You believe in being nice to one another, don't you Justin?
"No way Ronald Reagan would have done it."
You're probably right, but then again, he was probably accused back in the day of being eletist, out of touch with the common man, rude and selfish!! Damned if you do and damned if you don't!
"Anyone except a foreign reporter, that is. Or to be more precise a reporter working for a foreign organisation. . This was, to the end, a US show."
Gosh! Who's overreacting now? I don't understand, Justin! I thought we had discussed this. I thought you had forgiven him/his campaign. I thought that while you disagreed with his decision, you realised that this trip certainly wasn't the end all and be all of foreign press interviews with him!! But it seems that I was very, very wrong indeed!! Again, I don't like the fact that he didn't let foreign journalists interview him at all on this trip either!! But its over now! We move on! Obviously he thought it was too much a risk for the American audience back home! It certainly wouldn't have been for me, but there are many different people of whom he must woo in order to be elected president, and perhaps that is why he made that decision!! I honestly think one or two interviews would only surve to enhance his cradencials, but we all don't agree on everything do we? I do hope that you get over this, and make up for lost time by trying to get as many interviews with him as you can in the comeing months!
"It could be that Obama chose to shake hands with London bobbies because they were a landmark with which Americans could identify. Less so the Prime Minister
Gordon Brown and not at all the leader of the opposition David Cameron whose photo op has been airbrushed out of most US coverage."
My God! How stupid do you think we are!!? Yeah you're right, Justin!! I bet you couldn't find one American who knows who these people are!! Are you crazy? I, for one, know who they both are!! And I think many others do as well!! Please don't jump to conclusions!! What's this business about "identifying" with a foreign leader? Please explain? And by the way, I think it was encredibly disrespectful and rude of our news broadcasters to "airbrush" out the coverage of Cameron!! What gives them the right to judge who is important and who is not!!? Would the BBC or any other British broadcaster "airbrush" out coverage of Brown meeting with Nancy Pilocy or Hary Reed? No I don't think so!!
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Oldnat - happy to debate the so-called English class system and explain why I am in central Europe whenever but it's hardly relevant here.
I am trying to figure out what someone who admits to stooping Pope like to pay homage to the Baltimore tarmac finds odd about shaking a copper's hand.
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#113 dennisjunior1
When correcting others, you may as well get it right.
Elizabeth is currently Queen in the United Kingdom, of which Brown is the current Prime Minister. She is Queen Elizabeth II of England and their conquered territories in Wales and Ireland.
In Scotland, she is Queen of Scots. The different nomenclature is important. The Scottish Constitution (long ignored by the Westminster Parliament) does not recognise the Divine right of Queens/Kings. In the Declaration of Arbroath in 1320 (which influenced the US Declaration of Independence, and to which the ex-minister of my parish was a signatory) the Scottish realm asserted their right to replace any monarch who did not act in the interests of Scotland (I paraphrase).
When Scotland becomes independent again (rather soon, I think), she will continue to be Queen of England, with some Englishman/woman as her Prime Minister and Queen of Scots with Alex Salmond as her First Minister). Unless, of course, we decide to become a republic. After that she would have to be revert to her namesake's title (except for Elizabeth of England still claiming to be Queen of France!)
If I were you, I'd stay clear of the abstruse constitutional complexities of the monarchy that you guys correctly threw off.
If your response was "who cares?" I'd be inclined to agree
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I'm not surprised most Americans find the English rude when talking about their Prime Minister. Most Canadians find the English rude at all times. We wouldn't talk about a serial baby rapist in the way you sneeringly, acidly, sarcastically whine and moan about anyone and everyone, from the local bobby to the Queen! It's as if you're all competing in a "Worthless Jerk of the Millennium" tournament and are all desperate to win.
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#113 dennisjunior1
I may have been wrong in assuming you were an American (from whom the remark would have been understandable). If, on the other hand you are English ...............
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bagpipes, kilts, haggis, OMG that explains a lot about poor oldnat. BTW oldnat, how far can you toss a caber? And I understand that people in Scotland actually FRY Mars bars????? I know, don't knock it till you've tried it. No thanks....well maybe the fried Mars bars but that's as far as I go.
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Ref #76
I agree in principle with everything you said, but I still think that the main reason for the problems affecting our automotive industry are not caused by high wages and prices, our vehicles are competitive. In my opinion, the blame rests mostly on the failure of management to recognize the need to switch from large vehicles to energy efficient vehicles. Unfortunately, even if we decide to manufacture some of the small cars that American companies are making overseas at home, it will take 3 to 5 years to re-tool. In the interim, the market belongs to Asian auto manufacturers.
I agree with your observation about the reduction in our pool of unskilled workers. One of the consequences of our success in providing our children with a college education or trade is that the availability of unskilled workers has declined dramatically in recent decades. Part time workers and teenagers fill some of the vacuum, but are not enough to satisfy demand. That is the main reason for the government's inaction in addressing the illegal immigration issue. Whether we like it or not, without the illegal workforce our agriculture industry would collapse and other industries, such as meat packing, would be severely affected; and even construction and hospitality would suffer greatly. The truth is that even if we tripled the meager salaries earned by illegal workers and added a benefit package, we would still have problems finding enough people to work in the fields. I don't mind admitting that neither my children nor my grandchildren would even remotely consider doing that kind of work.
The increased demand for fuel from China and, to a lesser extent, India is indeed a factor in the high oil prices we are seeing today. Even though those countries import their oil from different sources than we do, in a global economy what affects them affects us as well.
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#115 threnodio
I had assumed that Justin's "kissing the tarmac" remark was simply a figure of speech indicating that he was glad to be back in the USA - meant nothing.
I had also assumed that his incredulity about Obama shaking the policemen's hands stemmed from his (presumably English) upbringing.
Could be wrong, but I am as as mystified as my US co-posters by the remark. If it doesn't come from the English class system, where on earth, did Justin get that peculiar remark from?
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To all of you who think this, please get over this idea that the UK is obsessed by the class system. Maybe 50 years ago but not now. Sure a lot of our politicians went to certain public schools, but given time I think even that will change (this may be more symptomatic of a general lack of interest in being a politician). Let's hope they don't become as controlled by big corporations as their US counterparts seem to be.
Obama shook hands with the bobby, which is unusual for any visiting politician, and yes we Brits are on the whole are more restrained than our US and Euro cousins. I think the question Justin was trying to raise (in the absence of being able to interview the guy) is whether we thought this was a cheesy attempt at publicism or a genuine, sign of the man's friendly, down-to-earth nature. Would Gordon Brown shake the hands of one Bush's agents, probably not but I can imagine Blair doing something showy like that.
Thanks to Old Nat for her comments re: MA, which successfully provoked him!
Just a thought on his views of the UK and our response to the EU. I think the main reason you're confused by the response of the opposition and the public at large is that at a fundamental level a majority are probably in favour of the EU in some form. Sure a LOT disagree with the level of integration etc, but if the Conservatives really felt that pulling out was what the majority wanted, do you think they wouldn't be campaigning on it (this is how democracy 'works')? This might be hard for you to understand given the differences between our countries but don't assign it to any idea that British people are any more likely to have their will disregarded than the US.
Finally, isn't the problem with the US car companies that their US products are inferior to Japanese/EU designed rivals? Historically in terms of reliability, but more recently in terms of design.
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"CNN described Gordon Brown as a "Head of State." This mistake - a common one - is part of the reason why Americans often think Brits are uncomfortably
nasty to their prime ministers. To American eyes attacking them can sometimes seem unpatriotic - they do not realise that these figures represent a party not the state. Conversely we Brits forget sometimes that Obama and McCain are competing to become America's Queen. As it were..."
Yes you're right, Justin!! In fact, will you please define for me the word "criticism"? I keep hearing it (only in the foreign press of course!), but somehow I can't understand its meaning!
Are you insane?! My God! You do realise that Bush has the lowest aproveal rateing of any president in US history since poleing began, right? I can't/won't speek for other Americans, but this American certainly doesn't think that the Brits are (mostely) "nasty" to their prime ministers!!! Everyone in every democratic society criticises their leaders!!! That's inharent with getting the job!! And if I did think that some Brits were a bit harsh in criticising their prime minister, believe me, it wouldn't be because some CNN news anker described him/her as a "head of state!!" It would be based upon the context of a situation, and whether I felt that they were justifyed in how angry they were at a particular policy!! For example, When the BBC asked not so long ago what people would feel about a Cameron-headed government in the UK, the most recommended comments were something along the lines of '"Well it can't be any worse than it is now under Brown!" Or '"It would be the exact same, because both parties are full of selfish, self surving greedy politicions who don't care about what the people want! Its a choice of the lesser of two evils!" That, I feel, was a bit harsh. There was no '"I'm hopeful for this change of government to come soon, or I think it would be considerably better because of such and such policies of which Labour doesn't support!" I honestly don't understand why calling the prime minister a "head of state" is so wrong anyway!! Who introduces bills before the houses of parliment? Who signs treaties with other governments, travels to meet with other "heads of state", or world leaders if you wish, who nigociates the stream lining of the EU etc? I know the queen is oficially the "head of state", but she has no real power anymore, right? Isn't it true that she isn't even allowed to express publicly her views on politics? And in refference to representing the "state" as aposed to a "party", the prime minister speeks as if they do represent the "British people" just as much as the queen does in my observations!! Perhaps more! Just as Sarkozy represents the French people to the rest of the world, Bush represents the American people, etc. "Head of state" is just a synanym for "world leader" that's all!! I don't think CNN ment any harm by it!!
And "unpatriotic?" O, please!!! Only right-wing Americans, I would venture, think that "atacking" one's leader is "unpatriotic!!" We atack our president all the time even though he is the "head of state!!", as it were. What Americans have you been speeking to!!??
And I've asked you this at least twice on previous entries. Please tell me, what do you dislike so much about CNN? You mention it vagely, but never any specifics.
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#135 threnedio
Lighten up! I don't care where you are, but (though I didn't think I'd need to explain it to you) my light-hearted comments related solely to your use of the word "here" in your #106.
#119 MA2
OK. I've tried to help you, but you're back into your English reality again, instead of the American persona that you're trying to create.
Many Americans will have been to a Highland Games and seen caber tossing. They know that it is nothing to do with distance. On the other hand some of you sad English people , sitting in your bedsits, have far less cultural knowledge than Americans who have frequent cultural festivals to celebrate their diverse roots. That's why Americans are normally generous, open-minded people (even if ill-served by their media).
If you are going to pretend to be an American, then you need to include the inclusive, non-racist, attitudes, that America embodies, in your posts.
I think you are making the mistake of modelling yourself on some of the more extreme US evangelists that you see on your satellite TV channels. Most Americans aren't like that.
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
#122, paulcrossley, you've touched on a point
close to my heart. We have some of the best
engineers in the world, and the worst corporate
bosses. That explains why our cars are so poor,
our auto businesses are failing, and why the
"super-rich" are so rich in America.
I believe that in most countries, when a stork
is sent from heaven to deposit a child in a
chimney, that the stork either deposits the
children with the brightest fates in the finest
chimneys, or at least makes an attempt at
a random distribution.
But, in America, storks ensure that the children
who are to be born with silver spoons in their
mouths are the ones which are the least
intellectually gifted. This may be divine intervention
as a way of balancing scales so that social
mobility is enhanced.
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paulcrossley #122
"we Brits are on the whole more restrained than our US or Euro cousins."
Like when the drunken British soccer hooligans go on a rampage on the continent or make the Spanish wish again their Armada had defeated the British in 1588 just to keep them out today?
Obama shook the bobby's hand because he didn't understand Europe and its customs. He didn't know that he'd be crossing a line that is taboo in British culture, a line that doesn't exist in American culture. I wonder how many other people in other countries he will inadvertently offend.
Let me clear up a myth about American cars. It is true that until two or three decades ago when Japanese imports began to make a big impact on the US market (Japanese learned quality control from an American) the big three US car manufacturers deliberately built cars to last no more than about 60,000 miles. Having the market to themselves, they were guaranteed huge profits. That changed when they woke up to the fact that the Japanese were eating their lunch. But perceptions die hard in America and once Americans were convinced that Japanese cars were automatically better, many shunned buying American. And it took awhile for American cars to catch up. About fiften or tweny years ago, I heard one GM exec complain that the market would pay $1800 more for a Toyota Corolla than a GM Metro even though they were the identical cars built in the same plant in Freemont California. Savvy American buyers even know how to read the VIN and other code numbers on a vehicle to know what plant a car was built in and what day of the week it was made. There's the old theory about Monday and Friday cars that may have had some truth to it.
Today there are many fine American cars on the road that perform well and last a long time. A few years ago I unforgivably passed up a fantastic deal on a brand new loaded Mercury Grand Marquis for about $17,000. It had zero miles on it but was the previous year's model when there was a glut of inventory. For those of you who don't know it's a large luxury car similar to a Lincoln Town Car. What could you get from Japan at that price, a Nissan Altima? I don't think even that. And not all Japanese cars are reliable. There have been some stinkers like Subaru, some Mitsubishis, and others. Not all of them are Toyotas or Hondas.
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Well, actually, many Hondas and Toyotas are
made here. So, they really are "American"
cars.
Now, we can deport our incompetent corporate
managers to Vanuatu.
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To those asking what was so weird about Obama shaking the policeman's hand - it was weird, as some American writers have already noted, because here in England we are crippled by our archaic class-bound society, in which the powerful despise the lowly.
Furthermore, the members of the ruling class are invariably periwig-wearing dandies, often to be seen mincing down Carnaby Street hand-in-hand with Austin Powers, while dodging the snarling redcoats who roam all the over place. Unless it's Thursday, of course, when the beefeaters take over. All while drinking tea and hating the Irish.
Anyone want to add any further mindless stereotypes? Might as well while we're here, in the faraway Disneyland that is America's view of the rest of the world (including, bizzarely, the country they have the most in common with - Canada doesn't count).
Justin brought attention to it because it doesn't normally happen - and presumably wondered if it was contrived. I've not seen Bush chinwagging with his secret service agents - is that because he's the brat son of a rich oilman who went to Yale on a legacy, pulled strings to dodge serving his country while the poor died in their pointless thousands, and finally inherited the presidency?
Not really, it's probably because policemen and the like are usually left to get on with their jobs, and photo ops are a rarity.
The classless society of America is a joke made in poor taste.
The stereotypes fly both ways across the Atlantic, and let's keep them coming before we get all soppy with one another - but the ones used by the founding fathers are well out of date by now.
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#127 MA2
Better. Many Americans confuse Britain and England, so it's believable that an American could talk about the non-existent "British" in 1588, or that there have ever been "British" football fans. You also remembered to use "soccer" rather than "football".
What was really good was that you managed to talk obsessively about cars (though calling them automobiles would have been more in character).
In a year or two, at the current rate of progress, your persona might be really believable!
Keep it up!
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oldnat #121, 124
I just assumed what Justin Webb really meant by kissing the tarmac was that his plane's wheels touched down on the runway. Funny how jargon gets invented. Flight time is now "wheels up to wheels down."
Actually I'd never heard of caber tossing until I saw it on TV on Samantha Brown's visit to Scotland. It looked to me like a telephone pole. She could be visiting the black hole of Calcutta and get excited over being a tourist in someplace new. She'd make a speech about the grandeur of a room at Motel 6.
If you really think I'm British, your moniker should be changed to oldnut.
gunsandreligion
has it ever occurred to you that the best and brightest in America have ambitions to achieve far greater things than go into politics or go to bean counter school to get an MBA so they can become execs? While that's where the money is, it is a very boring life compared to working on the really intellectually challenging problems of advancing technology. The best minds I think go into science and engineering. Even so, American businesses by and large do fairly well much of the time. It takes all of Europe and and almost twice as many people to equal America's GDP. Even that doesn't tell the full story.
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MAII, just think how well we would do with
competent people at the top of our corporations.
Fortunately, foreigners are free to come here
and set up shop - virtually the only country
in the world where that can be done with
no restrictions on ownership, with the exception
of a very few industries.
It's no accident that Mr. Honda was inducted
into the Automotive Hall of Fame in Detroit.
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#131 MA2
Now that's good. You've removed so many of the negatives, and stressed some of the positives about the USA, that even I could believe in you.
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Old nat - 'After independence, the Scottish Tories could do quite well'. A hopeful presupposition, no? 25% in favour at the moment?
Come on, really, who would you rather be - Alex Salmond or Gordon Brown? Better yet, here's a question for all the non-Brits: which politician made the greater impression on you, Jack McConnell or Tony Blair?
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Byrn-UK
Canada doesn't count? No wonder people like MyBlurgle are so anti-British. This enmity is something I never suspected, just like until a couple of years ago, I didn't realize how much enmity there was in China for the Japanese. Why doesn't Canada count? There are over 30 million people living there. Not as many as the UK but more than half. They have vast resources, many great cities, and on the whole I think far fewer problems and are happier than the UK. Of course they are always aware of the monster to the south but it really doesn't present any threat to them. It certainly doesn't want to swallow them up the way the EU wants to swallow up Britain. And by and large all kidding aside, we actually get along quite well. Amazing how many Canadians have relatives in the US, even second homes in places like Florida. Is the UK jealous of Canada's relationship to the US? That thought should be very amusing to Canadians.
Funny how oldnat tried to tell us that the Declaration of Independence traced its history back to Scotland. And the Russians invented jazz. Everyone hates America but wants credit for having had a part in inventing it. Hey folks, it invented itself with no help from the outside. That doesn't mean it didn't learn from other peoples' past.
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"....fantastic deal on a brand new loaded Mercury Grand Marquis for about $17,000......What could you get from Japan at that price, a Nissan Altima? ..."
Here in Japan, you can buy a lexus for that money.
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gunsandreligion;
Yeah, just think of how well American corporatoins would do if they only had some competent people running them. Think of what Microsoft could have become if it had a Bill Gates at the helm. Might have changed the world. If only Intel had an Andy Grove. If only Apple had a Steve Jobs who could not only have brought computers out of data centers and put them on desks and laps but come back if it got in trouble after he'd left and created ipods. Coulda, woulda, shoulda.
Bryn-UK
Is Scotland really going to give up all that money England sends north so it won't be alone? Doesn't sound Scotch to me.
Once I saw a carpet installed in an office with a color called "banker's gray." I was reminded of it when I saw Gordon Brown on TV for the first time. He was the same color. I thought for a moment there was something wrong with my TV set. So I looked up the word gray in the dictionary and what do you think I found? A photo of Gordon Brown. It doesn't get any grayer than him.
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A lexus is a toyota with a fancy price tag and some frills. And there are Lexuses and Lexuses. What model, a pricey version of a Toyota Corolla? Most foreign car manufacturers have cheap junky models they don't export to the US. Mercedes made a 140 D used as a taxicab in Europe that was much like those old Checker Marathons. Citroen made the deuxcheveaux for Europe that resembled an overinflated baloon of a volkswagon Beetle that bounced up and down the road on bedsprings and had to be cranked wtih a handle coming out of the front bumper to start. Its stickshift looked like a crowbar coming out of the dashboard. Even domestic versions of cars exported to the US are often inferior to the export version, often having dozens or hundreds of critical differences. Even the glass used in the windows is different.
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#134 Bryn-UK
Wrong blog for most of your questions. Post again on Brian Taylor's or Nick Robinson's blogs and I'll reply.
As to your last question - let me answer it with another -
For the non-Americans, which politician killed more people, Schwarzenegger (off screen) or Bush?
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The Canadians don't count because they're exactly the bloody same except they whinge more (no mean feat). That and they've got some Frenchmen living there. And also, therefore, a modicum of culture.
Anyway you're only sucking up to the Canadians because you're afraid of them, after the whipping they gave you in War of 1812...
Your posing as an American is indeed going well - Old Nat told you that the Declaration of Independence can be traced back to Scotland, and you pretended you didn't know full well that the Scots always claim to have invented everything, and that such claims must sometimes be taken with a pinch of salt. I'd say about as much as Old Nat puts on her porridge.
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Is there something inherently wrong with shaking hands with a policeman? Even a US Senator is just a man or woman, even though most of them think they are Gods. What is wrong with being kind to someone?
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#135 etc MA2
Sorry, I'm going to have to give up on you. Spoof characters need to do a lot of research to get things right, and I'm afraid you are like a number of the lazier students I taught.
Didn't do their research thoroughly
Relied on stereotypes rather than reality
Far too susceptible to being wound up
Lacks a sense of humour
I had hopes for you at some points, but you remain an unreconstructed poseur.
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#142
many gave up long ago....and came to the same conclusions :)
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oldnat #142
I lack a sense of humor? Does't the fact that I'm actually talking to you prove I have one?
What exactly is it that you taught? Humor me.
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#127.
It is true that Detroit finally caught on that it had to improve their cars after the influx of Japanese imports were stealing their market. But the American automotive industry should have caught on in the fifties, before the Japanese ever appeared on the scene.
Pleaple from the east coast started visiting Europe not long after the war ended. After all, it was no further away than California. It was on these trips that they found out how crummy American cars were. Suddenly there were Volkswagon Bugs, Saabs, and Volvos on the the American roads. Big spenders bought Jaguars (a "cold" car, wonderful-looking but problematic) and Mercedes. My brother had one of those little two-seater MG's which were lots of fun. Even the BMW Isetta found buyers for city driving.
Detroit knew what was happening, but stuck to their guns, making big, flashy overpriced tincans. It was not until they had already lost a big chunk of their market that they decided to retool their brains. They finally understood that people wanted value for their money.
I still don't trust American cars and this is probably an out-dated prejudice. We have a Subaru which handles easily, runs like a dream and never gives any trouble. I don't feel like gambling on the home-grown. Detroit had its chance and blew it.
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Justin --
This does not need to be posted, just a thought from a reader.
I wish you were a little less ADHD in your blog. It seems as if you need to superficially touch on 5 topics per post, when you'd really do best writing about 2 at most. The impression ends up being that the most surface, briefly considered and irrelevant topics (e.g., the significance of Obama shaking the hands of policemen outside of Downing Street) are what hold your attention. Obviously you are not a superficial person. But, either you are severely underestimating the intelligence of your readers, or you are underestimating their ability to see through notes dashed off with seemingly zero thought. There also seems to be an unintended implication, embedded under the surface of your writing, that your biases are very strong, and you (falsely) believe that if you make everything sound like a tossed-off thought, you won't be discovered.
Just something to think about.
Ulysses_9
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good point, well made Bryn-UK #129, lets dispell the idea that we're all shocked that some politician shook the hand of the bobby outside No 10. I note no one has responded to your highlighting of the US class system and the role it plays in politics there.
MA - #127, I said "On the whole", believe me, that's one problem the UK needs to sort out. Surprised you heard about it all the way over there in the USA, maybe old nat's right on that one. If only our badly behaved holiday makers had the sense to stay on home turf as no doubt yours do.
On the subject of cars, it sounds like gunsandcars and allmymarbles have the right idea. It's not that the US can't construct good cars competatively - just like in the UK you're making, Honda's, Nissans and Toyotas which sell pretty well. It's just that designs of the homegrown companies nearly always seem to be unimaginative, or copies that appear on the market too late and they're saddled with the reputation of unreliability. There's some great exceptions, but not consistently. I personally can't stand Toyotas (bland) or VWs (expensive and no where near as reliable as you're told) but I can easily see why GM and Ford seem to be struggling right now.
Obviously not the right forum for discussing Scottish independence, but if they want it, good luck to them. Could proove expensive (for them) but at least it should stop the problem of their MPs voting on legislation that does not affect their constituents. Also, I am aware that the Scottish do seem to claim to have invented everything. Since coming to Australia though, I've noticed they also do this.
Finally, lets not blame Canada for everything, those Cnaadians are generally so nice.
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Welcome back, Mr. Webb.
The weird season is about to get underway in earnest.
Keep up your good work--you know better than to surrender your reason at the door when writing about any politician, anywhere.
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Thank you, Justin, for another perceptive and enjoyable post. I agree with several other posters that Obama shaking hands with the Bobbies will be viewed Stateside as a simple human gesture. Obama connecting with the common man as it were. Cynics will question his motivations, but otherwise, I doubt anyone would find it odd that a presidential candidate would shake hands with a police officer. I may be naïve, but I thought it was a nice gesture on his part.
“27. MagicKirin wrote: Justin: You are very much mistaken that visiting the wounded troops is not a disaster.”
Actually, I think Justin is spot on. My brother, a West Point grad, has until recently (he was finally discharged) served as an officer in the Air Cavalry over in Iraq. He joined during the Clinton years and was stop-lossed by Bush. He served multiple tours in both Afghanistan and Iraq. My brother and his friends (with one lone exception) aren’t upset that Obama didn’t visit the troops at the hospital. They understand why he didn’t. USAPolitic's posts sum up Obama's dilemma quite well. Had he visited them Obama would simply have been criticized for using the troops as a campaign prop. Most of the military personal I know are far more concerned about veterans benefits and ending the war than they are about empty political gestures. On the other hand, they aren’t at all happy that McCain voted against the new GI Bill. Now that was a disastrous choice, because it, unlike a missed hospital visit, directly affects their lives. I have no doubt that McCain's failure to vote for Webb’s bill will be remembered by many servicemen and women on Election Day. My brother and his comrades were absolutely livid.
“#25. DominickVila wrote: Shaking hands with two policemen may not have been very "presidential", but it is certainly very American! As opposed to Europe where class still dominates social relationships, we make no distinction between a policeman or a PM”
“38. joechike wrote: Seems the British [class oriented society] expected Obama to shake the hands of elites and top politicians only. That's were Americans differ fundamentally from the British.”
Surely you jest. I’m sorry, but I don’t recognize the nation you’ve described at all as the one I’ve inhabited my entire life. Take a good look around you, gentlemen. Sadly, quite a few Americans (particularly the right-wing ones) make a definite distinction between high-ranking powerful individuals like a president or PM and a poorly paid cop.
It may be true that once upon a time we were much less divided in this way than European society, but that time has passed, and at present we are extremely divided. The only real difference today is that “class,” and I use that term very loosely, and social status in our country are predicated more on wealth than birth, i.e., unlike Britain, we have no genuine blood aristocracy. I love our country, and we aren’t as wretched or ignorant as certain individuals believe, but we are in terrible shape right now. Our economy is failing, our educational system has become a joke, we’re operating a concentration camp in Cuba, we’re waging an illegal war, and our President can’t even formulate a clear and concise sentence in his own language. We aren’t really in a position to throw stones.
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“#3 Allmymarbles: What I do care about is shortening campaigns to two months and compulsory tarring and feathering of anyone who cheats….”
This I agree with wholeheartedly. I actually enjoyed Obama’s tour. If for no other reason than that I enjoyed seeing American flags being flown rather than burned in the streets abroad. That said I don’t see why we have to have year long campaigns. They’ve become a three ring circus. I’m not that old, I’m only twenty-five, but I don’t remember it being this bad even just sixteen years ago during Bill Clinton’s first presidential campaign. I come from a very politically active family and despite how young I was I have vivid memories of that campaign. It didn’t seem to last this long. We need to set a definite time limit for campaigns. I’ll be generous and give them four months instead of two. Then, as you suggest, we must force the candidates to abide by the time limit. No sneaky attempts to get around the rules and campaign early should be tolerated. Sadly, I doubt we’d actually be allowed to tar and feather the offenders, though. ;-)
“#13. At 10:15am on 27 Jul 2008, popefridge wrote: The American fear of questioning their president, it's pathetic isn't it? It isn't so much that the president is head of state, it is mainly because they are so much more nationalist than us.”
“39coolpolitealex wrote: it may be that the seductive way AMERICA treats us brits especially when they are the coresspondent (sorry don`t know full title)
from the BBC and they want to have BRITAIN on side to give them a slight hope to be seen less of a war mongering right wing bunch of critters than they are “
My, what sweeping generalizations! So you believe that all 303+ million Americans are pathetic, nationalistic, war-mongering right-wing “critters.” Thank you so much for your snide and condescending assessment. Obviously, Americans have no monopoly on either ignorance or arrogance. Not all of us are (or ever have been) afraid to question authority, the President included. Nor are all 303+ million of us nationalistic right-wing war-mongers. That’s as simplistic as my suggesting that all 60+ million people in the UK are football hooligans. As you yourself point out our system is now almost entirely corporate controlled. So has it never occurred to you that perhaps, just perhaps, opposition does exist and simply isn’t publicized by the corporate shills? It may also have occurred to you that not all 303 million of us voted for Bush and that quite a few of us, myself included, didn’t - and still don’t - support his war. How is that certain Brits will hypocritically insist that they are not responsible in ANY way for the choice made by their PM to join Bush in an illegal war – despite the fact that you then returned the Labour Party to power – and yet conversely many of you seem to hold each and every single American, even those of us who voted against the cretin and protested his war, personally responsible for Bush and Iraq? It’s an interesting double standard. Oh, and Popefridge, as for our being a sham democracy, we aren’t democracy, we are officially a republic.
“36. At 1:21pm on 27 Jul 2008, MagicKirin wrote: And the Democrats in congress have a lower apporval rating than Bush. Why? Because they have done almost nothing in 1.5 years except say no.”
The Democrats' extremely slim majority and the record number of filibusters (sixty-two in all during the last year-and-a-half) carried out by the Republicans might have a little something to do with the Dems inactivity. Rather ironic that the Republicans who seemed to consider filibusters criminal or satanic just a few years ago are now utilizing them. I can't wait for the wide stance brigade and their toe-tappers to be ushered out of office.
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He was just being nice; get over it
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I don't find it improper in any way that Obama shook hands with a bobby. In Scandinavia it would be a good way to start when meeting someone for the first time. If someone doesn't vote for him just because he shook hands with some people or changed this schedule, I don't think he or she really thought about at all.
Why is it that some individuals continuously choose to view Europe as a collection of separate states instead of a collection of countries with mostly entirely different cultures?
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#137, MAII, you've wandered into my patch
of the world. Not that I run it, but I know how
it runs.
The computer industry is an exception because
some of these companies are still run by founders,
but that will change. Wall Street will get a hold
of them, and that will be the end of a good thing.
Fortunately for us small-time folks, the
Wall Street crowd can't grasp the smallest
technical argument, and put people like
Carly in charge of things. No wonder they
make craters out of good companies.
I say, let's enjoy it while it lasts.
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Whether or not a candidate shakes a policeman's hand should not even qualify as news. Perhaps, as some have opined, this campaign has been going on way too long. It has. The political process in the US is so broken one wonders if it can ever be repaired. But, the news reporting process is equally damaged as exemplified by nonsense coverage like this. News reporting is so silly I've stopped imbibing and now my sole source of news in the US is the BBC and that may not last much longer given this sort of nonsense. CNN, as you quote, is little better than a news source for people who are not too bright provided by people who are even less intelligent. It makes one want to never leave the bed in the morning.
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If he doesn't visit the troops he's being unpatriotic.
If he does visit the troops he's using America's wounded heroes for electoral advantage.
What kind of masochist runs for president?
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paulcrossley
British automotive engineering had the reputation of being the worst in the world....before the west discovered the likes of the Tribant and Yugo. The carburator of an MG was generously described as a controlled drip while before Ford took over Jaguar, the car had to be retuned every time it went around the block. American manufacturers deliberately built cars up to the 1980s that would have a short lifespan. It was called euphamistically "planned obsolescence." The first Japanese cars imported into he US were not very reliable either. Our 1972 Toyota Corona had every single mojor component fail at one time or another. But they learned. That's when the US had to start catching up. Also, most were originally bare bones econocars, not what lots of Americans wanted. Right now all car manufacturers including Toyota are suffering with large inventories of SUVs and producton lines geared to make them. They were also caught off guard by the sudden jump in fuel prices. Some Toyotas like the Tundra do not have a good reputation or record for reliability per Consumer's Union Reports. Toyota occasionally builds clunkers too.
Much of what I said is starting to come true. In WWIV it's been a busy last few days for the enemy. Multiple bomb blasts in two areas of India, Turkey, Baghdad, a victory of sorts for them in the Southern Phillipines and more rocket test firings in Iran. If this keeps up, the reports of new attacks and threats of note worldwide on our "civilized world" will be heard every day. China is becoming alarmed at the prospect of disruption of the Olympic games by Islamic separatists. BBC Business reports a looming economic crisis in Europe more severe than in the US. Mismanagement of monetary policy by the EU central bank keeping interest rates high is the blame cited but I think the root cause is more complex than that.
I heard two interviews with Obama yesterday, one on C-Span and another with ABC News. If Europeans and the American left listened to what he has to say, there's be little for them to cheer about. Yes he said he wants to pull American troops out of Iraq in 16 months but will have to modify that if things turn bad there. It's to pressure the Iraqi government AND to redeploy many of them to Afghanistan where he intends to intensify the war. He has indicated that he might attack Pakistan. He holds out little hope for the Palestinians. His rhetoric is as much in lock step with Israel's security needs as the number one priority as Bush's or anyone elses in America or Israel. He's taken nothing including military action against Iran off the table and that's to protect American security interests as well. He is determined Iran will not get nuclear weapons and says their nuclear resources have been dispersed. This could mean the entire country would have to be destroyed at once if it comes to a military attack as a last resort. It was pretty dumb for a Palestinian to attack Israelis with an earth mover at the very time he was there within about a mile of where he was. He also pretty much told Europe that they'd better start pulling their own weight in the war on terror. I think the left has somehow deluded itself about a lot of things about him. They seem to hear what they want to hear, not what he is actually saying.
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You're right of course, British cars did get pretty bad at one time (1970s), I don't recall ever claiming otherwise (is that the sounds of goalposts moving?). While we're on the subject then, you seem to be implying it's better to purposely build crap cars (US) than to do so through poor management, a striking workforce and inept government intervention (UK).
To continue, Jaguar improved their reliability long before Ford got involved. Yes. some Jap designed cars are rubbish too (is the Tundra one of those dull SUVs? I'd add the Corolla, just because it causes narcolepsy in those who have to see it). I read today that Honda is able to relatively easy to switch over to economical smaller car production and that VW has abandoned plans to build a pickup. Looks like it's going to be GM and Ford that suffer the most then. Shame for Ford becasue some of their world cars are pretty good efforts - less so for GM (Astra and Corsa excepted).
Perhaps Citroen will introduce the 2CV, actually a very good car that fulfilled it's brief perfectly - what many Europeans needed at the time when gas guzzling barges were all the rage stateside. Might itsell well in NYC now?
Sorry to labour a point, if you like I can suddenly switch tack - maybe start talking about a none existent WWIV?
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He isn't yet the President.
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#124 - oldnat
Sorry oldnat, had to catch some sleep - it's traditional in Hungary. I don't need to lighten up because I am already so light I am floating. I don't think I have poseted anything here recently without planting my tongue firmly in my cheek.
'Here' (at 106) is Europe, out of regard to MA2's affection for the place.
To be serious for a moment, there does appear to be a lot of outdated thinking going on on that side of the pond about the English class system. People in England are considered for the most part - you will find bigots everywhere - equal regardless of religion, race, sex, sexual orientation and disability. This I welcome. They are also nowadays considered equal regardless of what we used to call breeding - good manners, a command of the language, education and cultural awareness. This I am far more ambivalent about. Ignorance, after all, is bliss - crass ignorance is unforgivable.
There are, my American firends, only three classes in England - the poor, the well off and the super rich. Money is everything. It buys power, influence and tickets to the Royal enclosure at Ascot. The one thing it does not buy, however, is respect - which brings me back to the handshake.
Police officers do a difficult and demanding job and, for the most part, derserve respect. In offering his hand to a copper, Obama recognised that and made a friendly and entirely appropriate gesture. As far as I know, nobody was remotely shocked or offended and I have absolutely no idea why Justin has a bee in his bonnet about it.
And no - oldnat, I didn't seriously believe Justin kissed to tarmac but I would love to know how, at 124, you knew what you thought I was going to say at 135. You can tell me over water cress sandwiches and fried Mars bars one day.
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It was pretty dumb for a Palestinian to attack Israelis with an earth mover at the very time he was there within about a mile of where he was.
Slightly dumber for the Israelis to promptly announce more illegal settlements as soon as he left. Not that any but the most pro-Israeli fanatics beleives much of what Olmert says anymore.
Apparently that does include Condi, who becomes more ridiculous by the week. Her departure will remove one of the great diversions of American politics. Colin Powell, of course, remains the master buffoon as S of State (literally not knowing what country he was supposed to be in), but both Maddy Albright and Condi run him a close second.
Perhaps John McCain could investigate if Mr Pee Wee Herman would like the job?
"He also pretty much told Europe that they'd better start pulling their own weight in the war on terror. I think the left has somehow deluded itself about a lot of things about him. They seem to hear what they want to hear, not what he is actually saying."
Hmm not exactly what he said is it? And as for the "war on Terror" a term which we may take as read that the next president will drop like a white hot penny, the US needs to do a lot more. Stopping people collecting for Irish terror groups and an apology to the victims of the IRA would be a start.
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just over three months to an election that might have global impact not seen since WWII
thinking back to what Hillary Clinton, and the public, endured---including speculation on the size of her bum
are we in for more of the same---will there be ANY serious or even minimally professional discussions on this election?
who cares if Obama shook hands with a police officer?
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Simon (and any others actually interested),
It may be worth five minutes time to read obama's interview with the editor of the Jerusalem Post:
I found it worth the five minutes.
Salaam/Shalom/Shanthi/Dorood/Peace
ed
As for Anus Mundi,
The eye sees only what the
mind is prepared to comprehend. -Robertson Davies, Novelist and playwright
(1913-1995)
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Being American, I often have trouble recognision irony. Is this ironic? Or simply daft?
McCain Accuses Obama Of Playing Politics On Iraq
;-)
ed
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Ed,
Great link, when I read his flowing comments and obvious intelligence, I wonder why he hasn't done anything more inspiring as a Senator.
With me, I worry, he is to 'Johnny come lately' with all the right words, charm and style. His history in the senate isn't long, but shows a very partisan one sided vote.
In four years more, I may vote for him, change takes time, and he has changed all his friends (associates and business), pastor (religious view?) and family(his comments in his books and in interviews) in a matter less then one year.
Born in NYC, raised in Pennsylvania, you were known by the company you kept. In my adult life, same. But now, simply because the media says, that is not true.
Personnally, I was a homophob and racist at nineteen and didn't even know it. Over the course of 35 years I'm totally different, but I can look back at my experiences, friends, family and children and map the change.
You see, with Barach Obama, all his change 'seems' to have come with his bid for the white house. The, "in the public eye" changes have occurred in the media, and on the surface, not in the soul of the man.
After the elections over, Reverend Wright will still be the Rev. that baptised his children, his style of belief will still be the same, his associates and friends are still the same. It is superficial at best and phoney at least, to say he is not known by whom he associates with is to not know the man.
Again I must say his Intelligence and Charm may win the election, but in my case, I wouldn't know who I'd be voting for if I were to vote for him.
simple mind, simple thought
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In study, evidence of liberal-bias bias
Meanwhile, in other news:U. S. NEWS
McCain to tour Iraq-Pakistan border area
Bush: “Wall Street Got Drunk”
Then threw up all over everything.
Quagmire Relocation Effort Underway
Consensus developing to shift U.S. troops from unwelcome interference in endless ethnic conflict in Iraq to futile meddling in hopeless tribal wars in Afghanistan.
Salaam, etc.
ed
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Isn't Senator Obama's refusal to visit the wounded American soldiers in Germany a sign of diffidence vis a vis things military? If
so, it is one more reason why Senator McCain will make a much better Commander-in-Chief of U.S Armed Forces than Senator
Obama and hence President of the United States.
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Scribesolomon,
Que? Diffidence?
Smile
ed
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I don't see the problem with Obama shaking hands with a policeman.
In fact, I don't see anything about it anywhere, apart from this blog. (I've had a brief look over "Obama in London" articles on the BBC and Times Online websites, but couldn't find any mention of it).
If it was seen as "taboo" (or even just an embarassing faux pas), I'm sure it would be getting far more coverage.
As for whether it would be seen as "presidential" or not - when Tony Blair went on walkabouts shakign hands with everyone he met, he was accused of being too presidential.
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Isn't Senator Obama's refusal to visit the wounded American soldiers in Germany a sign of diffidence vis a vis things military? If
so, it is one more reason why Senator McCain will make a much better Commander-in-Chief of U.S Armed Forces than Senator
Obama and hence President of the United States.
Being an effective comander in chief of anything means more than carrying out empty gestures. Who can forget GWB's wearing a bomber jacket to pretend he knew something about the military or his serving of plastic turkeys at a military base in Iraq.
A good CinC will not use his army to boost his political position by getting it involved in supposed "easy wars" etc.
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The Surge I Working
Yeah! Right!
;-(
ed
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For the record,it mattered not that he bypassed those wounded men and women. His patriotism and caring are not even part or parcel of concern. Hey, he 'IS' an American patriot, HE truely cares by his actions when he visits the soldiers in Washington when no one is looking. I defend his Intelligence and intentions, but I disagree with his politics.
It is of concern to me his 'one world view' is just like Bush. It concerns me that his socialist views are going hurt the economy quickly and going to 'cost lower and middle wage working citizens' the most. Taking more from the richest and corporations only mean they will pass the expense to us.
President Carter entered office with similar situation and similar views, the result was a strong recession and an extreme increase in taxes and cosumer costs.
In the interview with the Israeli press, you cannot disscount his intelligence, I agree with his positions and applaud his answers, but I question the depth of that belief. His lack of action in the senate of Illinois and the Senate of this country, his partisn voting record and his unwillingness to 'cross the isle' to compromise.
McCain is similar in views, both are patriots, but McCain has worked hand in hand with Democrats, compromised with both parties, and through his 'actions', I feel he is a better choice now for C in C, though Obama in four years may have a history we can all embrace.
namaste, peace, etc.
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Oh ed, sad link on the surge, can't really blame the surge, blame the terrorist idiots.
yeah right!!
pray for them
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so what if he shook the hand of a policeman. you british are too obsessed with titles and class :)
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Doug,
Might not most economic recessions have something to do with being preceded by injudicious use of debt and concomitant related spending sprees? They certainly don't just appear out of nowhere.The seeds of considerable economic disruption have been building for quite some time, and it would be facile indeed to blame Obama when the excrement hits the fan. He should be judged after we see how well he is able to deal with what he 'inherits'. I, for one, cannot imagine how any sensible person would seek the position.
May the Gods help us all, and that includes today's crop of 370,000 new mouths needing feeding. (only 219,000 net population increase, after we've buried 151,000 who died since yesterday)
Salaam, etc.
ed
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he didnt visit the wounded troops in germany? this may be bad but this is just a gesture, but actions speak louder than words.
McCain opposed the GI bill, while obama supported it. McCain said it was too much of an expense to the government (he was a benificiary of the GI bill). Obama said its a worthy sacrifice to take care of war veterans. but McCain is playing the patriot, im a better american and care more about the troops card?
Time and time again flag pin wearing politicians cut back on support for war veterans leaving many of them without adequate support after doing their duty. sometimes even inadequate compensation for their injuries.
These are the same politicians who testifies their love and appreciations for the 'great men and women who sacrificed for this great nation' while in public, but behind clothes doors kick veterans in the behind! cutting them loose.
troops and veterans and their relatives, shouldnt care bout gestures, they are meaningless when coming from a man who expects them to make sacrifices for the country but not willing to give them anything in return but kind words and a speech and visit on memorial day.
put your money where your mouth is , flag pin wearing politicians. how u take care of veterans is a reflection on the nation. they shouldnt hav to be marching on washington for benefits.
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Justin,
Maybe I am missing something, but why is it wrong to shake hands with policemen? In the United States we are really proud and supportive of our police, and Obama shaking hands with an officer would be seen as a good thing. Something must be lost in translation across the Atlantic.
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Several times over the course of this "discussion" comments have been made about british and english society, which are extremely offensive and reflect quite badly upon the authors. "Class" in present day Britain is not relevant to what one does with one's life, however, the wealth of one's parents (commonly mistaken for , but not actually, the way of determining class) may gain access to an easier life, as it does anywhere in the non-communist world.
Perhaps the furore over a foreign politician shaking hands with a policeman is simply that it was the symbolic setting for the prime minister to greet official representatives, which the senator for Illinois did not classify as, so the only picture the photographers got was of him being quite polite to another person, which on a slow news day was blown out of proportion.
It's only a thought.
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I can't wait!
;-)
ed
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Regarding the handshake, I noticed it, and thought it was "cool". I've also noted, as have several other posters, that there was no "furore" in the UK media - in fact no mention whatsoever!
Here, in one of the "polite"-est of cultures, why should a simple friendly gesture seem out-of-place? I admit, one doesn't see it every day, but WHY NOT?
Salaam, etc.
ed
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Ed
"The seeds of considerable economic disruption have been building for quite some time"
I could not agree more. I am not blaming McCain nor BHO for the economy that they will inherit.
My point is that BHOs policies will diametricly increase the damage. Not to say that McCain will weather the storm much better. My opinion is just that, but I personnally think, from history lived through, is that the more a government interfers, taxing and new spending, the worse it gets.
Currently we are barely stable though losing money value daily. (Thanks to Bush policies past, and Congresses largess currently) Yes the dollar keeps re adjusting with world currencies, showing up and down purchasing power against other currency, but that is a poor measuring tool, because all currencies are also adjusting and suffering from our and thier monetary inflation. (a hidden tax)
Items don't "cost more", the money is worth 'less', here and abroad.
As always the election boils down to one quote, from where I don't know:
"It's the economy"
namaste, peace
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For my definition of "class" in England, I refer you to the author 'Dick Francis'.
'Ya gotta love a good horse story in Texas'
Thus I have high regard for my unknown friends and family over the 'pond'.
all ways
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"W" or "w"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cyDvUwRalXY
it aught to be
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Doug,
Again, we agree to a considerable extent, but I'd add that a good deal of the present credit problems originate in injudicious de-regulation, much of it led by Phil Gramm and his Missus. I'm not at all sure that tax cuts for the rich were that good an idea, either.It's worth noting that Obama has some pretty heavy hitters in his economic team, including Paul Volcker, who I've always respected and today comes news of a couple of "Republican" alumnae joining up, while McCain seems to have some rather dubious characters whispering in his ears, in addition to the Gramms
I know which horse I'd be betting on. Meanwhile, I comment my favourite columnist, one Adam Abelson, or his deputy,
Randy Forsyth. Typically one with a Jewish name, the other a Scottish one ;-)
Salaam/Slainte
ed
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Here's the bbc take on the deficit that either canidate will inherit.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7529372.stm
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Yes, both your articles were upbeat and right on point. Typical for WSJ writers and reporters, appreciated and read all the more.
I don't know if McCain has replaced Gramm or not, but Carly Fiorina is a respectable leutenant.
McCains web site has this as one part of his plan on the economy. One problem he may have is the dems will not work with him, even to the detriment of the country, sad.
http://www.johnmccain.com/Issues/JobsforAmerica/reform.htm
Lets reopen pandora's box, all thats left in it is "hope"
namaste, vaya con dios, peace
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A Million Bucks! Where we might find the money to pay for what we need?
Salaam/Shalom/Shanthi/Dorood/Peace
ed
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Doug, Namaste.
And then, there's Gerry parsky, credited with some rather unfortunate developments and with a surprisingly mixed presence in search engines for such an influential advisor....
I'm afraid I trust Obama's friends rather more than McCain's...
Shanthi
ed
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Doug 184
While you are at it you might like to look at this gem, also from the BBC Business news today:
Credit crunch still worsening
Qoting from the section - Fannie Mae rescue
The IMF is particularly worried about the crisis that has engulfed the US government sponsored mortgage lenders Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, which fund half of all US mortgages
Skipping 2 paras:
The former US Treasury Secretary Larry Summers argues that ultimatelythe only solution is for the US government, bankrupting the shareholders but generating more cash to desperse to people facing foreclosure.
Now comes the first real gem:
However, that solution would triple the US national debt from $ 3 trillion to $ 9 trillion, something financial markets might not find easy to swallow.
And who in the whole wide world could let alone be willin to buy 6,000,000,000,000 dolars of US gevernment debt?- just asking.
Now the second:
China is also the largest single holder of bonds issues by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, ...
Has anyone got round to asking the Chinese what they think of the idea? My guess is not much, not much at all.
I may be wrong, I sure hope I am but it looks increasing close to the risk the the US banking system could collapse.
What do you think?
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Is poor judgment hereditary?
A little background on the Keating Five, which has had remarkably little coverage considering one of those reprimanded for "poor judgement" is running for POTUS....'nuff said?
;-)
ed
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Opening Pandora's box?
Simply brilliant!
Shanthi
ed
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Welcome home Justin. Good to have you back.
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No way Ronald Reagan would have done it.
Reagan shook hands and mingled with everyone before being elected President. After the inauguration he had to follow the protocol expected of a President, very much the same way your PMs do. In contrast to those born rich, both Reagan and Obama had very humble beginnings, which is one of the reasons why so many people find them so appealing.
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Hi, ed!
Webster's Ninth New Collegiate dictionary,
a 'souvenir' of my sojourn in the U.S, defines
'diffidence' as: "a quality or state of being
diffident" and 'diffident' is defined as "hesitant in acting (or speakng) through lack of confidence". An interrogative cannot be interpreted as a premise; neither can a parenthesis.
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Old-man-mike,
exactly, China doesn't want our debt of 9 to the fifth power, (? 9 trillion)
Heck, the chi-coms are suffering with the olympics and cost of lost production just to reduce pollution.
Ed,
The keating five, good site for info, I like it cause it shows McCain in a good light, though that is just from my interpertation. :)
gotta beware
peace in numbers
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WebPendragon #10: "Presidents are politicians elected on a party ticket ,they have almost dictatorial powers under a system that is too heavily tipped against the Legislative arm of government.It is not healthy for democracy that once elected, they are treated like constitutional monarchs. Without the equivalent of Prime Ministers Question Time and with an overly respectful Media , they are able to avoid being properly scrutinised."
Actually the system, in the way it is supposed to work,has three branches of government; the executive, legislative, and judicial. You may think that the president has powers too heavily tipped against the legislativebranch because the constitution, in a time of war, gives more power to the president; power which Bush has exploited for all it is worth!! Couple that with a Republican controlled congress for 6 years (meaning the president would have little, if any difficulty getting legislation passed), and you have a recipe for a government seemingly one step away from dictatorship! Now I’m not suggesting that there weren’t Republicans who aposed Bush in any way!! I’m just merely saying that there wasn’t enough serious opposition to seriously impact the legislation that the president was trying to pass. But generally, when it is working as it should, Republicans and Democrats must compromise when ever a piece of legislation is put before the congress in order to pass it, and if the president vetos it, it can be overridden with a two thirds majority in both houses. This is perhaps why congress has such a low aprovial rating; because since the Democrats took over, they have been in the majority by one or two people, and so in order to override a veto, they must get Republican help-of which has been sparce. I disagree with you on our media not properly scrutinising the president-just because they may not be as stern as the British media can be, doesn’t mean they’re pushovers!!
cousteau669#17: "Approach a US police officer to shake his/her hand, and you stand a fair chance of being shot dead."
What police officers, prey tell, have you tried to shake their hands and they’ve threatened to shoot you?
Threnodio #22: "That would be the Supreme Court the president appoints would it? So much for the separation of powers then."
O my! Do I detect a hint of sarcasm? I’m not used to this from you-you’re usually so respectful and kind! Yes the president appoints supreme court judges, but they must be confirmed by congress, and the president only gets to appoint one if a judge either resigns or dies-which doesn’t happen often!! In my opinion unfortionately in Bush’s case, he got to appoint and confirm, two extremeright-wing judges because one-Sandra Day Oconer-resigned, and another of who’s name escapes me at the moment, died. This, I feel it should be pointed out, is an extreme rarity for one president!! If anything, a president gets to appoint one judge to the court during their time in office.
Mighty Morfa Power Ranger #33: "When the US can learn about other cultures we will already have terraformed and colonised Mars"
And which US citizens do you mean specifically? Because some are already very well world culturally educated!!
ArgyllJenny #56 "The POTUS and the Queen are heads of state in their respective countries, and their treatment by the media in their own countries is roughly comparable."
Well I’m sorry I disagree with that. The president may be "head of state", but they certainly get scrutinized, judged, questioned, and praised, based upon their domestic and foreign actions. When foreigners say the media holds too much reverence for the president, they-I’m hopeing-mean for the office, and not for whomever occupies that office! The president, if you wish, is sort of like the prime minister and the queen in one. And to anser your question, congressmen are supposed to be loyal to the American people, but for some it may be difficult because of some bribes from lobbiests!
Chicoan #60: "People forget that the United States of America is a republic. The good ole USA, for all of our posturing, does not practice anything close to a pure form
of democracy. I think we have to go back to Athens in Pericles' day to find any of that.
What this means is that a governing elite can and does overrule the voice of the people. That's America for you, and it's always been this way."
Yes, but don’t we elect that "governing elite?" So I guess its our fault that our system sucks so bad. Isn’t it?
Paulcrossley #122: "don't assign it to any idea that British people are
any more likely to have their will disregarded than the US."
O trust me, I'm not! In fact I fear the opposite!
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Doug,
I have to admit I hadn't read it right through until your commrnent, but, to me, it makes him look either naive or as thick as two planks. I leave out any inference of hypocrisy, in case that might offend the moderation system...
Salaam, etc.
ed
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ref #165
Excuse me if I don't accept an academic study as fact. Considering the climate in the U.S where Ward Churchill can keep a job and the Duke 88 can't torment innocent Lacrosse players with no punishment.
I trust the study as much as Media Matters the George Soros funded group.
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If someone has already mentioned them, apologies but here are a couple of other "politicians abroad" faux pas:
George Bush, Sr. throwing up on the prime minister of Japan
Gerald Ford showing up for a meeting with the Emperor of Japan wearing morning clothes that must have been borrowed and were about two sizes too small. He looked as though he was auditioning for the Beverly Hill Billies.
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#195
NoRashDecisions writes:
Yes, but don?t we elect that "governing elite?" So I guess its our fault that our system sucks so bad. Isn?t it?
You've hit the nail on the head, my friend. It is our fault and no one else's. I have no idea why we keep electing Kennedy's, Bushes, and in my neck of the woods, Browns to decades of public service.
If you have any insights I'd love to hear them.
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"...Brits forget sometimes that Obama and McCain are competing to become America's Queen."
Queen?..or even King would be a demotion.
The correct title sir, is: President of the United States, Commander-in-Chief of the U.S. Military.
Constitutionally, Americans in uniform or otherwise serving their country are the only people the president actually controls. The power is so supreme sir, that the president can send US forces into war without anyone's approval. Can your lovely Queen do that?
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No 200, sir; please note part of the titles of
Her Britannic Majesty Elizabeth the Second, by the Grace of God, of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and of Her other Realms and Territories Queen, Head of the Commonwealth, Defender of the Faith, Commander-in-chief Australian Defence Force, Canadian Forces, New Zealand Defence Force, British Armed Forces and supreme governor, Church of England.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_titles_and_honours_of_Queen_Elizabeth_II
I make that commander in chief of four independent countries forces, Head of state of 16 independent countries, and holder of divine approval.
The Queen has as more power than the president to send troops into war as legally she owns the army. Just as in America, if a decision went against the public opinion, then the ramifications would probably end up with removal/replacement of not only the whole government, but also the head of state, be it Monarch, President or Politburo.
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THE POWERS OF THE BRITISH MONARCH
For the record, all British military personnel, police officers, members of the intelligence services, judges, senior civil servants and members of either House of Parliament are obliged to swear a lifetime personal Oath of Loyalty to "Queen Elizabeth II, Her heirs and successors according to law".
There is no Oath of Loyalty to the Government, to the country, to the Constitution (there isn't one), nor to the flag (that has no legal basis either). The Oath is only to the Monarch. The military, police and intelligence services must also swear to unquestioningly obey any and all orders given to them by Queen's officers of superior rank. Atheists are permitted to affirm. Those who decline to swear or affirm (Quakers, Republicans etc.) are excluded from all participation in public life or in these professions. Elected Republican MPs are not allowed to take their seats in Parliament.
When Hitler abolished the German Oath of Loyalty to the Constitution and replaced it with a lifetime personal Oath of Loyalty to himself, the world rightly condemned this as the start of total dictatorship.
Queen Elizabeth is exempt from all laws to which she chooses to be exempt, only pays those taxes she chooses to pay and has absolute control over absolutely everything that has not specifically been claimed for itself by Parliament.
Queen Elizabeth is Queen of 16 countries, in 15 of which (only Canada has succeeded in trimming her powers) this situation obtains. The chain of command which originates with her Royal Prerogative is used in many covert and shady commercial, mercenary and political enterprises to carry out the confidential activities of a State within 15 States.
It is utterly untrue that the British Monarch has no power and it is utterly untrue that those powers are not secretly exercised, sometimes with her knowledge and sometimes without, but certainly without the knowledge of some or, indeed, often of all of her governments.
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Whats the beef with shaking a policemans hand? It seemed a humble, polite and friendly thing to do. There is nothing wrong in an important visitor to these shores acknowledging the professional work done by police in Britain, even if it is for political imagery point scoring. Get back to the issues, this is mindless fluff.
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"No way would Ronald Reagan do that?"
Hey Justin, I think Rony would have not only done that, but givin' the guy a manly pat on the back!"
"Thank you for protecting my life while i'm here!"
Reagan was old enough to remember cops on foot, something we don't have anymore. Something about "getting bribed"! Never stopped Chicago, or my hometown of Aurora, IL. from getting on the "take"! And they REFUSE to get out their squad car, with two cops with guns!
I think this is over blown, despite the fact that I'm for McCain.
I fear here there will be olot of votes FOR Obama, out of PC Fear that if you DON"T vote for him, you're a racists!
SAD, isn't it!
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I, personally, do not have any problem with any (PC here, fill in you're own blanks) as long as he, or she , or it or what, leads us into prosperity and friendship with our forieghn (spelling) neighbors.
I want what, and who, I think is best for us, not Germany, not Britian, not Isreal, nor anyone else, for that matter. I won't go into who now. My opinion, althought mostly set, does change a bit!
It's going to get ugly. It already is.
I do stand by my thought that, here in the US, that we are so hard pressed to please Europe, and the world, that there is a white percentege that will vote for Obama so as NOT to be considered racist. That in itself is racists. Sad. Very sad.
But Obama is going to get elected, i think. And mostly based on fear (and yes, HOPE! do not forget many still are on that kick) of people getting labeled, in their own minds (our elections our private) of NOT voting for the Obama is being racist. and there is nothing either candidate can do to eleviate this, despite the fact that neither are running ANY kind of racist campaign!
Sad, really sad!
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this is the last chance in my mind for the AMERICAN people to do themselves and the rest of the world .
If they do not elect OBAMA then they will have set back the world for a long time in trying to get rid of their blunders in their blind support of ISRAEL,in it lies all their troubles and if they can't see it by now after their bloody monstrous attempt at forcing their values down the throats of a people that were"in fact slowly changing "but have now pushed that potential change into the dustbin of history .
FOR GOD KNOW'S HOW LONG "
The people of the MIDDLE EAST deserve to be free of the interference from AMERICA ;their defence of ISRAEL is criminal and they should be charged allongside ISRAEL in their crimes against the defenceless people that have had AMERICAN bombs dropped on them ,what on earth has the women and children done to deserve to be treated as animals locked up in the cage that is PALESTINE.
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