Nobel prize for dissident?
Is it possible that a skinny young man sitting in a Chinese jail will win the 2008 Nobel Peace Prize?
There's speculation that the Chinese activist Hu Jia - who's currently serving a three and a half year jail sentence - might be awarded this year's prize.
Hu Jia, who's 35, is already one of China's most prominent activist/dissidents. He's campaigned for the environment, for democracy, and for the rights of people with HIV and Aids. The Communist Party objected to his activism. In April this year, a Beijing court found him guilty of "inciting subversion of state power".
I met Hu Jia a couple of times before he was jailed. The first time was a year ago at the small Beijing apartment he shares with his wife, Zeng Jinyan, who's also an activist.
Hu Jia was a slight, shy figure. His wife - who speaks good English - was more talkative. Their apartment was cluttered with boxes, DVDs (including a few series of Friends) and baby stuff - Zeng Jinyan was seven months pregnant with their first child. At the time, Hu Jia was under house arrest - police officers even slept on the floor right outside the front door to make sure he didn't escape. He was only allowed out of the house to accompany his wife for doctors' visits (followed by the police, of course).
A couple of months later, the couple went to hospital for the birth of their daughter, called Qianci. My colleagues and I filmed them in hospital as they got ready to check out and go back home. Hu Jia spent most of his time filming his wife and daughter with his own hi-definition video camera. Plain clothes police officers stood in the hospital parking lot, keeping an eye on the couple and their baby. The officers managed to miss Hu Jia when he went from one part of the hospital to another - they ran after him in a slight panic when they realised he was out of their sight.
At the end of 2007, Hu Jia was formally detained. We tried to go and interview his wife at their apartment - but we were stopped by uniformed officers and taken to a nearby police post for our details to be taken down. Then, in April, Hu Jia was tried and sentenced.
We haven't been able to interview Zeng Jinyan since the day her husband was sentenced - the authorities still stop people from going to visit her. But she does keep up a blog in Chinese.
To the Communist Party, the couple are annoying opponents who deliberately break the law and try to embarrass the country. It's hard to tell what ordinary Chinese people make of Hu Jia and Zeng Jinyan because their activism is barely reported here.
This year's Nobel Peace Prize winner will be announced on Friday 10 October.
I’m 
~RS~q~RS~~RS~z~RS~26~RS~)
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Finally, you touched the bottom line of China, human rights and democracy ~
Right, this is the dark side of China and the horror of the party.
All Chinese shall keep fighting for freedom.
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He is brave and has done a great job although I disagree many of his views and demands
He could do a much better job if he did them in a more realistic and more constructive way. The solution to China's problems is not to kick out the communist party but to reform it.
He should also realise that he should be working together with people who love China and really want to help China rather than just drawing attentions from foreign journalists.
I think he will be released soon and fly to the US to continue his work.
A Nobel peace prize? You deserve to share one with him, James.
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who? someone who just talks about the same gutter everyone's in doesn't deserve a prize for anything.
People seem to think the government in China doesn't care, fact of the matter is:
- Chinese government knows China better than anyone
- Chinese government is trying to modernize China in the long run, whilst maintaining stability and growth
Already, the westernization has eroded Chinese culture and ethnic culture as well. Western governments wants to see a more liberal and democratic China, so it might prove more stable. Yet, China is being exactly what they want: stable. We are not invading anyone or being aggressive on the geo-political scene for a country of our size.
So, the question for the west is: what is your problem?
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The Chinese propaganda party will be meeting as we speak to try and sort this one out. They have no conceivable means of hiding it from the people so should be succeed I suspect they will release him from jail then celebrate him as a national hero who has campaigned for the protection of the environment and AIDS awareness with no mention of the other things he stands for. Can I have my job with the Chinese propaganda department now please?
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Nitroglycerine Peace Prize for Hu Jia? Of course he can have one! Even Dalai Lama has got one already!!! But giving the nature of the Prize and its political opportunist judges, I think giving that Dynamite Peace Prize to Mr Hu Jia is a serious insult to his noble personal character.
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I hope that Hu Jia will win the prize. It will help the human rights cause in China.
The Chinese government won the honour of hosting the Olympics and has failed to keep its promises on human rights . Now the international community should honour people like Hu Jia who has been fighting for human rights in China.
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I don't really know anything about Hu Jia, never heard of him when I was still in China, which is about 11 years ago. Lack of freedom is a major issue in China, I do hope the country will change for the better in the future. I mean I love this country, I was born there, I also understand the cultural differences and that it is a big country to manage, but I am still hoping that one day the government will suddenly realise that there is nothing wrong with people speak freely of their minds and criticism is a good thing in the development of the country!
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As far as I know, all this Hu Jia did were just publishing a few articles, writing a few books or perhaps leading a few protests. Nobody was hurt or had died from his actions.
I was talking to this Chinese friend about this guy, she heard nothing about this guy since for some reason this guy has attracted very little or virtually no media attention in China.
Although what constitutes to Hu's "inciting subversion of state power" is still unclear and was never made public, this friend of mine firmly believes that this guy 'is a bad guy' who must had done some really bad things. This is how some Chinese people trust their government. I bet many of our friends here have this strong belief as well.
Obviously, rather than discussing whether it's fair to throw this guy to jail, many people here will try to guess why James is talking about this man and what his 'hidden agenda' is.
Hu Jia is perhaps a great man who cares a lot for his countrymen. But I'm sure there are many others out there doing the same. I hope he doesn't get Nobel Peace Prize just because he got banged up.
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chinese opposition will have a great opportunity in the next 12 months to rally public support as the chinese economy is hit by the global financial turmoil. it would be very useful to have an identifiable leader for that opposition that is recognised by the chinese public. so very propitious timing imo.
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Zeng Jinyan's blog is heart-wrenching!
I believe the heart of ordinary warm-hearted Chinese goes out to the couple.
Those who frenziedly defend Communist Party without focusing on the point need only sycophants around them.
Fortunately, they are by no means representative of the majortiy of our Chinese who know better of Chinese vitues e.g. criticism and self-criticism, compassionate, modest, friendly...
If you cannot exchange ideas in a respectful and constrcutive manner, PLEASE have the courtesy to conceal your Chinese identity so as to save some dignity for those Chinese who are down to earth and have a big heart that matches up to a big country.
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Please, please, please give him the Peace Nobel prize!
And also, start talking about the jailed lawyers who are only trying to protect people's right. I hear Chinese law is not all bad. So let's enforce it!
PS: I had not heard that Hu Jia broke the law, does he?
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Regardless of whether the prize goes to Hu Jia or someone else, it is wrong to lock up a person for something he/ she says.
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Will it make any difference? Dalai Lama, whose Tibet we claims part of our own, that makes him sort of "Chinese," is a Nobel laureate, look at how the nation, people, and CCP treat him.
Also check out the fate of another winner Aung San Suu Kyi of Burma, where we Chinese government the only supporter of that country's regime.
Hu will be a dead meat if he really win.
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James:
It would be a honour if he did win the Nobel Prize.
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I like people in China to say their piece freely and for them to stand up for their rights. But the Hu Jia deliberately break the laws of the land, and he does it to embarrass the Chinese govt and his country on the net for his western audiences. That I do not like.
Hu Jia is a hero to westerners, since not too many Chinese people know him in China as James reported.
It seems that Hu jia and his wife are getting almost all their backing from the west, didn't hear anything about them holding down any jobs.
Since they don't work, they must be in this to get not only attention but money from the west.
Well the Dalai Lama got the Nobel Peace Prize for his anti-China actions, so why not give Hu Jia a NPP too for his law breaking and criminal ways. Better a China man to get it and it goes to China, than it going to somewhere else.
Oh, Hu Jia should get an Academy Awards for good acting too. Make a good story for Law and Order.
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Hope he can get the prize.
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Nobel Peace Prize would only discredit itself by chosen Dala and any other anti China dissidents.
James, how could you still in China, not being deport back to UK? Seems to me Chinese authority is pretty open and generous to you and nasty "Free Western Madie" bias China authority in China.
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Even if the ordinary Chinese people had sympathy towards Hu, the Nobel Peace Price would totaly ruin it.
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Liu Jiancao, Foreign Ministry spokesman "the Mouth" commented:
Don't hurt our peoples' feelings again!
We have the tenderest feelings which would be hurt by any criticism.
We also have a PM whose best strategy when confronted with any challenge is crying!
Crying like a baby!
And shedding tears!! Crocodile type?
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The real embarrassment of the country is those people in power who try to keep the criticism down, and to deliberately ignore the law.
I hope the news of Hu being considered as a candidate can make more Chinese people start to think and to ask questions.
I hope Hu can win the prize. and the winning will win Hu a speedy regaining of freedom.
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There have been many winners of the nobel peace prize that have caused controversy
eg the dalai lama
there have been failures to award individuals with widely recognized contributions to peace eg mahatma gandhi, john paul II
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As I know,Hu's pointview about Tibet is unacceptable by most Chinese people(including me,of course),But no one should be sent into jail just because he or she said something.....
PS:Activist like Hu is unpopular in China,though I considerably agree their opinion in the aspect of Human rights and HIV aids,I dislike their behavior as it imposes a huge political investment.
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If he is awarded the nobel peace prize than it would have been politically motivated.
Issues of environment has nothing to do with peace. Issues of HIV and AIDS have nothing to do with peace. And certainly democracy has nothing to do with peace. Look at the US track record on that for proof.
Is his cause just, maybe, but I, you, don't know the full details of his situation, only what we hear in a biased western media. But does he deserve the Noble peace prize, definitely not!
The Nobel peace prize will be tainted from now on if it is award to him. It will become a symbol of western political propaganda. It should be given a new name of the "Nobel Democracy Freedom Activists Prize" and certainly not the "Nobel Peace Prize".
So nothing but western political propaganda meddling in the affairs of China again.
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I sincerely wish Hu-Jia could win prizes of any kind other than Nobel "peace", which became a joke ever since it was awarded to Dalai Lama, who has been anything but 'peace'.
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Nobel prize? What kind of prize is that? George Bush came close to it after his wars resulted in a million people dead, millions became refugees and millions disabled by their injuries. The prize has been used as a political carrot often given to the oppositions of targeted countries.
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I don't know what to say.In fact I know nothing about them, only wiki shows something.But is it true or just someone wants to use them to insult my country?Where can I get the truth?That's the problem.
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Hu Jia is a person that can rock the CCP and who CCP is afraid of. I will be in three heavens if he is award the Noble Peace Prize.
Games are over and it is time that CCP show great move forward in Human Rights.
He represents the voice of Chinese people and working endlessly for the people of China.
It is time that Chinese posters here learn something from him rather than mocking around here
It is time to remind CCP that repression and censorship in China are no longer acceptable.
WE LOVE YOU HU JIA.
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Zhang Dan Hong, a Chinese woman who work as an editor for DW-Radio is now sacked. She made comments such as "the communist party of hina has more than any political force in the world inplemented Article 3 of the Declarartion of Human Rights." She was suspended and now finally sacked. Hu Jia will get Nobel peace prize? Of course. Any one who speak ill of Chinese government /ccp will be given a bonus and anyone who dare to praise the Chinese government or the party will be punished. Freedom of speech is dead. We are the lucky few who can deliever our censored speech at BBC. We are anonymous, right?
The Chinese government is not managing the internet well. They should learn from BBC. They should sensor unwanted speech and delete it like BBC does. Then there would not be a Hu Jia at all and they can boast freedom of speech. Given the fact that China has 0.2 billion netzens, there would be thousands and thousands moderator jobs created. The Chinese government should collect a special tax to fund the jobs. The Chinese must be happy to pay the tax to get the freedom of speech.
Thank you BBC.
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People's Republic of China!
Can man be silenced?
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To *5 zickyyy:
Quote:
'He (Hu Jia) could do a much better job if he did them in a more realistic and more constructive way.'
I wonder how realistic and constructive your stance is:
1. A simplistic view of foreign esp. western countries--assuming all foreigners are malicious even though China as a country is so powerful now that it virtually fears nothing, let alone some different opinions!
2. An equally 'frog-in-the-swell' view of China itself--Chinese history is full of examples of how people suffered from a government who couldn't take criticism!
You have exposed not only yourself but also those Chinese who genuinely care about our country to embarassment!
Nobel Prize for the courage of Hu Jia and his wife!
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voodohaze #28
So how do you feel about this guy being locked up ? That he deserves it ?
Why is there little/no coverage of this man in Chinese media? What do you think? What makes you think the coverage on this man in Western media is biased ? Where did you get your unbiased information about this man from?
I am sure many in China think this man is evil, not that they know what he did, just for the fact that some in the West love him.
By talking about your favourite George W. Bush and his policies all the time are you sure you're not 'meddling' US' internal affairs?
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wonderfulchinese #30
I want to know how you actually feel about this man being locked up. Do you think he deserves it ?
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To *30. wonderfulchinese
Your posts (as well as your blogname) is a CARICATURE of our Chinese people!
1. Always resorting to the overused tactic: 'Don't criticise our country and politicans because yours are not good either'--even though this is a space for meaningful debate where we share various thoughts about China.
2. Always use good things about China so as to deflect attention from or even legitimate implicitly bad things taking place in China.
If you are a strong, confident and dignified Chinese who truly love our country, please have a good sense of self-criticism (Zi Wo Pi Ping)--which is, by the way, one of the laudable communist traditions!
As Zeng Jinyan rightly points out in her blog: too many Chinese, wittingly or unwittingly, are complicit in the cover-up of the wrong, by refuse admitting to glaring mistakes!
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there's a few guys here in the west that I know that are so very much anti-China, they say and write things that even Hu Jia never has gone into.
so if the Nobel WMD RIP Prize needs tobe giving away for putting China down, give it here to these guys. Some are maybe posting here too.
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For foreign media to get involve with Chinese so-called 'dissidents' by interviewing, supporting by any means (including awarding any prizes) is, to me, a brutal interference of Chinese internal affairs. I just feel insulted by that. If the government is so bad, the people will rise up to take care of it. I am saying this only because I am a Chinese. I am not a PRC citizen, much less having anything to do with CCP.
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I don't think it will make to much of a difference whether they give him the Nobel Prize or not, it had already become a political tool in many Chinese people's minds that has nothing to do with promoting world peace but to criticize the Chinese government.
In the Chinese people's hearts, the real heroes and heroines who actually do deserve a Nobel Prize are those people in China and overseas who rushed to help the victims of the Sichuan earthquake. Those individuals are content to live their everyday lives in peace with others, never causing problems for anyone. But when a time comes that others need help, they would do everything in their power to help, whether its donating their hard-earned money or going to the disaster area to provide medical/humantarian aid. These are the kind of people China really needs and who are really able to promote world peace.
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Nobel peace prize has became a big fat joke to the world since it awarded the prize to Dalai, the so-called spiritual leader.
This time, after the successful Olympics, all those anti-China or China-bashing specialists do need an icon for their future work. And the Nobel prize committee would never let us down as it has proved us that the peace prize committee has nothing to do with humanity or peace but politics and ideology.
PS: it is really amazing that the best way to get those sorts of prizes/awards for a Chinese citizen is to become an anti-government activist. If you were really lucky to get yourself in jail by any means, you would even get the chance to be awarded the Nobel Prize.
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I like this kind of posts written by James. He only lists those facts and leave audience to think and discuss.
I think Hu Jia maybe a man with a good heart for China...but not in a very efficient way. He seems to have that kind of Chinese heroism image, somehow.
Many Nobel laureates won our respects like Mother Teresa who really delivered the message of LOVE and PEACE. However, people like Dalai Lama show us his PASSION and ...(definitely not peace).
I hope Hu Jia will be released and given the right position to serve the country he loves but I don't think giving him a Nobel prize is any good for Chinese...
I wouldn't take Nobel Peace prize serious any more if only Chinese opposing CCP can win it.
There are plenty of QUIET Chinese people serving and suffering with love for the peace of the country....They should win the prize.
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To midnightjunkie.
How did I insult Nobel peace price? Which part of my post is not true? Which word is not true? Simple facts. NPP insulted its self by allowing political figures who have nothing to do with peace become nominees. If you think NPP is a holy thing that can not be criticised it is your view, not mine.
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To onjournalism.
I accept your critism to change my blog name. I picked up this blog name from BBC's suggested blognames when my original "chinese" username was rejected by BBC. It looks like this blog name bother some people here. It is only a blogname right? Why would people take it so seriously?
I did not choose this blog to do my self critism. It attracted my attention during the torch relay because of its unfairness. I stick to it to talk back.
You could be a perfect Chinese from whom other Chinese should learn from. However I am in no mood to learn that at the moment. Please do not try to regulate others. (Only CCP tries to do that, right?)We are who we are.
RE HuJia. Did you see his letter to German Chancellor Merkel? In which he seems represented "hundreds of millions Chinese Buddhists wish Dalai Lama back to China".
Sorry I do not agree with him and I do not think he can represent "hundreds of millions of Chinese Buddhists". I do not think he has achieved anything related to peace.
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To midnightjunkie.
By the way, my government(Australian government) told me that Hujia is a peace maker. I have not heard of the name "HuJia" from Chinese government. I found things about the person on the internet. You are pretty good at misunderstanding my post. When did I say that he deserve to be jailed? Can you find out for me?
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from what I have read of some of Hu Jia's postings, I wonder if Jia's posts would've passed the BBC's pre-moderation stage?
if Hu Jia was not talking about the CCP in China, but he was talking about how the west don't care about HIV in Africa or if he was talking about how minorities suffer racism in the UK and in the EU, would the west still love him?
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To *53 wonderfulchinese
I certainly don't have the power nor do I wish to regulate others--I apologise if I make you think that way.
Again, this is a debate space for 'sharing' different thoughts about China. I don't really mind whatever YOU say, please just don't assume, implicitly or explicitly, YOUR own views are representative of our 1.3 billion Chinese people, whether you are in the mood or not!
That is a matter of respect and fairness in debate, especially considering the majority of ordinary Chinese people who are neither able nor willing to voice their views here....
No offence, you need to brush up on your Chinese history to understand the Chinese essence of 'self-criticism'--no doubt you already have enough skills to criticise others/other countries.
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It’s amusing to hear Nobel Peace Prize from Westerners again.
People still vividly remember that Dalai Lama got one such prize decades after he had instigated a violent riots, sponsored by CIA, and caused thousands to perish in 1959.
It couldn’t insult Mr. Nobel anymore by awarding those thugs with the prize.
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To wonderfulChiense.
Correct.
If Hu Jia were posting on BBC blog in his critical ways on western issues, he would be blocked by the moderator for breaking the House Rules.
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A question for all: why criminals in China are frequently heroes in West?
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Hint for my above questions: most of these criminals receiving money from West.
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Why Hu Jia? I don't think he has done much for peace of the world, or peace of China. If the candicate is chosen for promotion of democracy and human rights, then I hope the Nobel Peace Prize is given to Mr. President, George W. Bush, cause he successfully lead US allies to Iraqi wars, under the name of promoting democracy and human rights. hehe...
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The prize is becoming a joke. Anyone that gain publicity for opposing China get a prize. What about those that oppose the war that cause the death of 600000 in iraq.
Dalai is a person that say one thing and do quite another. He get a prize too.
What a joke.
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Receiving money from another country for being anti own country is a crime in any country. Even US.
So tell me does this answer, why he is jailed.
Remember some scientist being trial and later found to be innocent just because of his skin color and having friends that is chinese. Then to cover up and another small thing like not proper procedure was used to sack him.
Think that scientist did less harm to own country than this guy.
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It is annoying that he's in jail. Doesn't deserve to be, as he has good intentions. However I do see why many people find him a nuisance.
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Who said that Chinese haven't stood up?
After decades of hard work, the great party excels at producing Nobel Prize winners on the world stage, Nobel Peace Prize exclusively. Equipped with industrial melamine, an army of gold medal hopefuls will blow the 2nd. tier Prize competitors into oblivion at any given time. Nobel competition? What competition?
With world-class tutors of the great party available, led by visiting prof. dear grandpa Wen who specialises in the state-of-art Instant Emotion Control, which by the way, is far more subtle than Hockey Mom's dumb take on Bush Doctrine, CCP should really set up a PhD class on that.
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I'm a little confused why my comment (#42) broke house rules. I hope the moderators can take another look at it. Maybe there was a mistake?
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"According to Nobel's will, the Peace Prize should be awarded "to the person who shall have done the most or the best work for fraternity between nations, for the abolition or reduction of standing armies and for the holding and promotion of peace congresses" (Nobel Foundation)
Can what he has done make him qualified?
Mr. Nobel would never be in peace under the ground if Jia gets the prize. It's sad to see this prize has become like a sort of gift.
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To Xlbfan
Quote:
"Regardless of whether the prize goes to Hu Jia or someone else, it is wrong to lock up a person for something he/ she says."
Speaking in general terms(totally spare Jia's case), this is indeed true, in a mature society formed with civilised people. However, the situation in China is far more complicated than the people in most developed countries could ever imagine. I hate to admit this, but some of my fellow citizens don't deserve freedom of speech at this moment. They have no idea about the responsibility that comes with the freedom. They may deliberately spread out rumours or instigate riots, all for their own interest/benefit, what makes it worse is that they can easily find their allies.
Imagine some one in this country repeatedly promoting terrorism in public, would he get taken away by the police? Remember, denying holocaust is still against the law in Austria.
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Why did Hu Jia write to a foreign leader about Dalai Lama representing millions of buddhists in China ? China politics is for Chinese only and must not allow any foreign party to get involved. No body represents your country's interest better than yourself.
I urge all the young Chinese both in China and outside China to learn more about the world's various political systems, their functions and benefits that bring to the people. Modify and adapt the appropriate system to China's actual environment with the goal of improving its political, economic and social conditions that will ultimately bring a better life to the millions of Chinese who are still struggling. Your system need not necessary be called "democracy" or "communism" or whatever in that strict defination. As long as the system brings about better life for the Chinese people, just go for it.
Chinese politics is for Chinese only.
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Hi Nicky9L,
You make a fair point, although I stand firmly by my statement that it's wrong to lock up anyone for something they say.
My response to your comment that many have no idea about the responsibility that comes with freedom of speech is that this is something that needs to be taught in school. The aim of the party is to teach obedience instead of the ability to have dialogue and debate (I have seen this). From the very top of government, the way of doing things for a long time has been backbiting. More moral leadership is required to deal with the real problem that you present. That is also a confucian virtue I believe.
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I must say that Mr. Hu Jia is so brave, not because he faces CCP the great party, the biggest organization in the Universe who likes wasting nature resource and energy at the expense of deterioration of environment and don't care of people's health even babys' lives or future of the country, or what the party dearly called flowers in the garden, only to make GDP a heard bigger figure printed on a piece of paper, but because he does the simple right thing which he thinks to save the country .
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I never met Hu Jia but I believe he love his country and his people very much like his ordinary countrymen. If this Nobel Prize has a hidden agenda from West to insult Chinese, I believe he will be the first one to step-up to defend his country and throw away his prize right under the nose of Nobel Commitee.
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Nobel peace prize has been used as a tool by west to humiliate China and other developing countries with different systems. People still respect to the other non-politicalized Noble Prices such as Bio, Phys, Chem or Econ but half of world populations think that heavily poticalized Peace price is a jok. If slave master like dalai lama can have one, why this opportunist Chinese dissdent should not get one? The Noble Peace price has dead. Nobody treats it serious anymore. Give to Hu, who care?
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Giving Nobel Prize to third-world countries' dissidents is a norm rather than exception.
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why?have you being to china?do you kown what the people need most?stable and better life!when the chinese have just got a better and stable life why so many oppositions want steal all these from the poor chinese?
chinese have live through so many years' hardships.when the aggressors from western countries spoilt the land,has anybody thinked about the human rights in china?
please please!chinese need a peaceful life!
the party's government has many problems,they need to change!but chinese people will never allow foreign force to spoil the land again!!never!
chinese will get the democratic rights by themselves after they get a stable and happy life.whoever wants to destroy their happy life will be regarded as enemy
P.S:i'm not chinese but i have lived in china for many years
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James:
Thank you for posting this news here. I hope Hu Jia will be the winner finally. He's so deserved the honor. Anyone blaming him, please, go searching what he has done at least. What a extraordinary chinese he is. Being a chinese, i am proud of having a compatriate like him.
James, keep going this direction. Have you heard of another very famous dissident writer named Liu Xiaobo?
Regards
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Will that really make any difference?
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Chinese bloggers see Nobel Peace Prize as a conspiracy of the West to humuliate China. It is interesting that Chinese are holding so close and dear of their victimhold. Could it be because they have no other indentity than being victims of the West, fabricated or imagined. It is much easier to blame outsiders than to look within onself for reasons of failures in the midst of the latest national scandals.
Hu Jia in his human rights advocacy is but one single individual trying to push the tide back, and consequently has paid a price for it. What is sadder still is that so many Chinese bloggers blame Hu for his demise. This is so reminescent of decades of Mao murderous rule with no Chinese daring to challenge him. Everyone fell in line supporting the Chairman chanting "Long Live Chairman Mao". Chinese cannot see a rainbow, but just the storm. In this case Hu Jia is the rainbow and the government is the storm, corrupt and secretive, harsh and destructive to the human soul.
Hu Jia would make an excellent choice as the receipient of Nobel Peace Prize. Chinese ought to be proud that there is one citizen who dares to speak the truth. As long as there is just one voice of truth, there will be less tyranny in the world.
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He is a hero as far as locked up, would be a traitor to receive the notorious prize.
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The effect of bestowing the Nobel Peace Prize to this activist Hu Jia goes beyond shedding light on the human rights and societal issues in China.
If we look back at past Nobel Peace Prize laureates, it is evident that not only does this recognition help cast some much needed light on the issues the laureates fight for, it exerts unequivocal pressure on the authorities to act on those issues and raises discussions and attention about both the laureate and the issues they campaign for. Even if such exchanges of thoughts are done under the radar.
Consider Nobel Peace Prize laureates Nelson Mandela and Aung San Suu Kyi. The ripples their recognition sparked were unparalleled. It is almost impossible for governments to keep their people in the dark and not realize that the activists have been awarded the Nobel Peace Prize.
Perhaps the most important aspect this recognition yields is the psychological support it gives to both the laureate and all those who share the same ideal. The knowledge that their work is being appreciated and their plight being noticed is often what keeps these activists moving despite the severe opposition. This should, however, not be interpreted as a devoid of altruism. This is where one draws out mental strength in dire situations, besides the fervent belief in the causes one fights for.
Responding to those who believe this is all about China-bashing and an erosion of the so-called "western" ideology. I have no doubt that you desire a better China. And I respect that patriotism and belief. But to put things in perspective, consider this question, what makes a better China? In fact, how do we gauge a nation's well-being? The people.
A nation is merely a collective entity of its people. The well-being of all the people who live in China is the well-being of China as a nation. Bear in mind that it is not a scant fraction of the population that counts. The causes that Hu Jia is fighting for can be collectively categorized as human rights: the inalienable rights that comes with everyone of us for being a human.
So quite frankly, it is ill founded to say one is suffering for the peace or well-being of their country. Any country is just a reflection it's people in whatever aspect. China is only as good as all its people are. And how good its people are can be determined by whether their human rights are respected.
At any rate, this is not a criticism of communism. As far as I am concerned, activists do not loathe the Communist Party, they are merely concerned that there are people whose fundamental rights are not respected and upheld. i.e. their well-being are undermined. These people are devoid of what allows them to purse a life with the dignity and rights every human being should have.
I can only lament the fact that some of the very people who Hu Jia fight for scoff at his efforts.
China has a fascinating culture and an intriguing history. I know that because I have seen it for myself. I want to its people enjoy talking and writing freely without facing persecution.
At the risk of losing my composure, see for yourselves - he is being imprisoned for advocating for your well-being!
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What that guy posted up there is honest-to-goodness truth. I myself harbor no ill feelings toward the Chinese citizens here.
I... let's face it, I won't be able to write anything that will not be misunderstood as China-bashing, just read what ErnestU said above, I believe he said everything that needs to be said on this issue.
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ErnestU's posting brought tears to my eyes. I am lost for words because of his beautifully written article deserving of being published in an Editorial.
The Nobel Peace Prize is awarded to people who have done extraordinary deeds, in recognition of their extraordinary humanity. I hope Hu Jia will be the first from China.
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Just to add to what I said earlier.
Human rights organizations do not promote nor disparage any political system. They are interested in the well-being of individuals, no matter the political system or its wealth.
If one looks at reports by human rights groups, it is only obvious that countries with other political systems (e.g. parliamentary democracies, republics) are criticized as well for not safeguarding human rights.
Online sources include:
United Nations - Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights
Amnesty International
Human Rights Watch
I think it is only noteworthy to mention that there are people who are employed by the Communist Party to refute anything "sensitive" to their ears while there are those who are ordinary Chinese citizens.
I suppose it is hard to discern comments made by the latter from those by the former. Even then, with censorship and systemic propaganda, one could hardly tell what ordinary Chinese citizens think. Naturally, they would not risk speaking up for fear of retribution.
So engaging in constructive discussions with posters is futile if they are instructed to shower down "undesirable" arguments and mislead ordinary Chinese citizens.
If only the spirit seen 19 years ago would manifest itself again.
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I hope he wins, and I really hope the chinese people will get to hear about this.
To sinodeplant, His Holiness the Dalai Lama has never been anti china. What has he ever said to make you say this?
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Thanks for your kind words, democracy101.
Yours are as insightful if not better.
Not to mention the many typos and oversights I made.
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I dont agree with all his demands, but the key point is that he should have the right to say it. Unfortunately anything deemed "unacceptable" by the government in China will be shut off and this will have to change.
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!As far as I am concerned, activists do not loathe the Communist Party, they are merely concerned that there are people whose fundamental rights are not respected and upheld. i.e. their well-being are undermined."
Erm... yes most do loathe and hate the CPC. That's just blatantly incorrect.
Hitler was nominated in 1939. Now I'm not putting either of these in the same light but Hu Jia winning the prize will only - yes unfortunately - put him in the same light as the Dalai Lama to many Chinese people. Non-pragmatic.
Why you guys don't think that the Chinese don't speak out about these issues is beyond me. They just don't go blaring out to the rest of the world about it. Even Sarkosy deserves this prize more than anyway in recent times.
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Hitler was nominated for the Nobel prize in 1939, however, it is because of his actions and ideas for promoting change in the then stagnant german politics. No one would know that in a few year's time he would turn out to be a genocidal tyrant.
Hu Jia winning the Nobel prize might put him in the same light as the Dalai Lama, but they have markedly divergent goals. The Dalai Lama was fighting for Tibetan independence, Hu Jia was campaigning for better rights for the Chinese. The only reason that they are even connected to each other is that both are marked as criminals(?) by the the Chinese gov't.
Some Chinese might believe that Hu Jia deserves the prize anyway, but I don't think that most of them will be able to post on this blog. Pity.
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Responding to endyjai's:
- "Erm... yes most do loathe and hate the CPC. That's just blatantly incorrect." -
I'm afraid what you said was wrong. And there was no reason for labelling what I said as 'just blatantly incorrect'. Perhaps you could enlighten me with some justification?
Quoting what I said "...activists do not loathe the Communist Party, they are merely concerned that there are people whose fundamental rights are not respected and upheld. i.e. their well-being are undermined."
What I meant was that human rights groups do not mind communism. As long as individual's human rights are being upheld, any type of political system will do. The fact is that they do not align themselves with any one political party or government, i.e. they are non-governmental organizations (NGOs). This is what makes them independent.
Rather than concerning themselves with political ideologies as you seem to so fervently believe, human rights groups focus on individuals' human rights. This has been pointed out in my second last post (#86)
So, it is not the Communist Party per se that concerns human rights groups, or rather the global community, but the practices which gravely violate human rights. Are you sure your human rights are being respected?
The bottom line is that they do not bear any grudges against the Communist Party. To quote Amnesty International, "we campaign so that every person may enjoy all of the human rights enshrined in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights...(aim at)...preventing and ending grave abuses of these rights, demanding that all governments and other powerful entities respect the rule of law"
Presuming you are not so familiar with human rights bodies, you might like to cast an eye at those bodies' websites which I had included in the post you responded to.
Reading the latter part of your post, I don't quite see the relevance of Adolf Hitler and Sarkozy.
- "...yes unfortunately - put him in the same light as the Dalai Lama to many Chinese people. Non-pragmatic." -
I seriously doubt that ordinary Chinese citizens would get an untainted picture of Hu Jia, if at all.
- "They just don't go blaring out to the rest of the world about it. " -
Would you mind elaborating on this?
Democracy101, these are just my opinions, article is one too heavy a description. ; )
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You both can keep praising each other's good writing, great insights .......... whatever. But ...
People, who have different view from yours, "are employed by the Communist Party" ? ..... This will never "bring tears to my eyes." This brought me laughter, instead.... Very entertaining, indeed.
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The Dalai Lama does not want independance.
The Dalai Lama does not want independance.
The Dalai Lama does not want independance.
The Dalai Lama does not want independance.
The Dalai Lama does not want independance.
...
He has been saying this for so long now, I wish some of you would finally realise this.
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Judge a person by what he does, not what he says.
The Dalai Lama wants to rule one-third of China's territory.
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#94.
It's not what Dalai Lama says that matters but what he does!
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#92
"...they are non-governmental organizations (NGOs). This is what makes them independent."
Any organisation, NGOs included, is run by people and people have opinions, sometimes very biased opinions. Just because NGOs are not directly linked to a government doesn't necessarily make it objective.
It's very easy to assume all dissidents are right in pursuing their cause against the mighty Chinese government, especially in the eyes of those still stuck in the cold war mentality. It's even fashionable to jump onto the Human Rights wagon. But what a government has to do is the best for the nation as a whole.
Give me one example of a country as poor as China 50 years ago that have managed to develop a western style democracy whilst reduced poverty from 85% of population to 16% in the last 25 years without the legacy or help of other countries. I can give you a dozen countries that didn’t, including Zimbabwe, India & Pakistan.
In my opinion, on balance Chinese government has done a good job for the Chinese people and that’s why it has the world’s highest approval rate at 86% in BBC NewsNight’s recent survey. If they hadn’t, Chinese people would have revolted. CCP took power from Kuomintang through revolution; both the party & Chinese people know what would happen when a government does not serve its people.
In my view, what matters to the vast majority of Tibetans inside China is quite different to what matters to the Tibetans in exile and what matters to the vast majority of Chinese is quite different to what matters to many dissidents. I would urge my western friends to find out what really matters to the majority of the people they wanted to help so they do not try to pressurise Chinese government to put its efforts into areas that concerning my western friends INSTEAD OF the Chinese people. Sometimes one simply couldn’t achieve everything, not at the same time anyway.
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This year's Nobel Prize was won by Finland's ex-president.
I hope the attention Hu Jia has received from the high-profile award could get him out of prison and reunite with his wife and child.
What he advocates is for the good of ordinary Chinese. To incarcerate him for 3.5 years only smacks of authoritarian oppression.
I don't think China has to change because other powerful countries say so. However, it does need to open up for its own people, providing more scope for different opinions being enunciated, discussed and negotiated.
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#93, tclim38,
Why are you putting words in our mouths?
What you said earlier: "People, who have different view from yours, 'are employed by the Communist Party' " ? is a manipulation of what ErnestU really said:
"I think it is only noteworthy to mention that there are people who are employed by the Communist Party to refute anything "sensitive" to their ears while there are those who are ordinary Chinese citizens."
What I believe ErnestU meant is that there are people employed by the Communist Party masquerading as ordinary Chinese citizens in this blog, overreacting vehemently to any comment that even mildly criticizes the Chinese gov't.
You on the other hand, in trying to use our own words against us, have come up with a twisted version of what we really mean to say.
Now, to quote you directly:
"You both can keep praising each other's good writing, great insights .......... whatever. But ...
People, who have different view from yours, "are employed by the Communist Party" ? ..... This will never "bring tears to my eyes." This brought me laughter, instead.... Very entertaining, indeed."
>Really condescending manner in which you posted your comment, although I have yet to see anything substantial to back any arguments you may have, or do you have anything to begin with?
>Now if you're goal is to provoke us, goad us into anger, or to simply post smug/snide comments, just feel free to do so, it's an open forum anyway.
>One advice though, try quote anyone directly unless you know what he is really trying to say, ok? You'll just create misunderstandings if you do that.
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#94 TrickyQuinsRl,
I do apologize for mistaking His Holiness the Dalai Lama's goals, although my only point is that his and Hu Jia's goals are very different, and it is incorrect to compare these two people.
In any case, even if the Dalai Lama is not fighting for tibetan independence, It still does not affect what I said earlier.
Also, Finnish ex-president Martti Ahtisaari has already won the Nobel Peace Prize for 2008, hahaha.
Well, that's that then.
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
Defend Freedom Everywhere! I would say deep inside Mr. Jai there is a little American rebel waiting to get out. If you had a Constitutional Right to keep and Bear Arms I am sure the "Party" would be over!
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He has my vote. Every government after a time become corrupt, .. if they didn't start out that way. If you don't believe me then your undoubtly a very luck person. See you don't find out until a crime befalls you and try and make those in your own country see it. They just can't see it and they won't see it. They will even attack you because they don't want it to happen and for some reason they blame you because you might awake them from their dream.
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I dislike the idea of activism and absolutely disagree with the praise and heroism heaped on it. Activism is what people do when they're not intelligent enough to do something useful about the situation they're blabbering on about, like try to improve the situation in a realistic and sustainable way. Activism is full of smug and self-righteous finger-pointing. Even if I did agree with this guy's ideas, he's expressing them in a totally obtuse and inappropriate way.
Dramatic change in China would be appalling for the majority of the population, which is why change is taking place, but slowly and sustainably. We don't need anyone to tell us there are things wrong with our country - we know there are things which are wrong, and until they are improved at a sensible pace, we have to work with what we have, which includes following the rules.
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if he break the law, then go to jail.
Come on , China is changing, the party is changing, by many ordinary Chinese, and yes there are still problems need to be resolved. because we say you can not finish dinner by one bite.
I won't worship a prisoner, when he now lost the ability to help the people they need.
the party's general direction is right, to very present moment, the members of the party many of them ordinary Chinese people are not corrupted and protecting Ordinary Chinese people's interest in every aspects. I perfer to rely on them, rather then BBC or other foreign media jounrlists, whom I honest to say biased.
Hu jia, he may right (20% of chance), but I am sorry in a wrong way!!
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Nice to see that Hu Jia is serving his time in jail, which he deserves.
Winning the Noble peace prize? Just a joke to the world.
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Why does he deserve jail?
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To #105 Lee Roy Sanders, Jr.
Why the American Mummia NEVER receives a Nobel Price?
I thought EU is all for Freedom?!?!???!!!
Oh, I see after reading your post: you just can’t see it and you won’t see it. You will even attack others because you don’t want it to happen and for some reason you blame others, because you might see the cage on your European mind.
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To onjournalism #98,
How do you know China does not provide different opinion and discussion? Do you speak any Chinese? Have you been to, for example, ChinaDaily discussion board?
I hope Europeans like yourself could learn some Chinese; and be educated about the real FACTS which iare thousands miles away from what you are told.
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#56 OnJournalism,
Since you repeatedly accused China of historically suppress dissents, I would ask two items:
1. Give us a list of the incidences.
2. Tell us if the Christian West does not behave the same way.
To disagree, I give you this example,
One Tang Emperor suddenly believed in Buddha. The most famous poet Han Yu wrote him an open letter ridiculing his behavior. If this happened in England, he would have been accused of witch-craft and burnt alive by the Pope.
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Quote OnJournalims “the majority Chinese people are neither able nor willing to voice their views here….”
To OnJournalism, I would say the Chinese posts here thoroughly reflect the Chinese majority views. Your imagination is wrong. The majority of Chinese people, if they can speak English, will be angered by BBC. You probably have no clue due to your obvious inability in Chinese language.
BTW, the majority Westerners are neither able nor willing to read any Chinese websites. Do you realize it?
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To #83,
It does not matter how you see your behaviors. It does matter how the Chinese see the West.
Your behavior is interpreted as a challenge to China. If the Christians hate atheism, they should have little difficulty in understanding the Chinese majority views.
People who want to mess up China; people who take money from Westerners; are SIMPLY hated by the Chinese majority.
Chinese people’s lives are vastly improved. You don’t speak a word in Chinese, you have no clue.
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Stupid essay: What the west had done so far only serves to tarnish the brand name of Nobel. What I have seen on BBC is systematic suppression of freedom of speech. Anyway, what can you expect from a for-profit media?
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