Berlusconi the fighter
When the Italian prime minister appeared before the cameras, after the court had lifted his immunity, he ended with the words "Long Live Italy! Long Live Berlusconi!" 
There is often a moment when a leader has been in power for a time when they begin to see the fortunes of their country and themselves as one and the same. It is usually a sign of weakness. With Berlusconi you can't be too sure.
He said he was "invigorated" at the prospect of the fight ahead. Indeed his public face was to relish the battle. He allows no reflection, no regret, no carefully-constructed argument. The trials against him are "false, laughable, absurd". He said he would defend himself in the courtroom and "make my accusers look ridiculous and show everyone what stuff they are made of and what stuff I am made of".
This is braggadocio. The very word seems to come with a swagger. I am not certain it is a real Italian word, but it means "empty boasting" or "arrogance".
Berlusconi is the master of braggadocio. The battle ahead is not about the constitution or the laws or corruption. In his mind it is about him and who he is. It is yet another test that will determine who is the man. And he will "front up" his enemies.
Italians know this Berlusconi well. The swagger, he guesses, plays well particularly with male Italians. He is not ashamed of his womanising. He likes beautiful women, he says. His defence against the accusation that he slept with a prostitute is that he has never paid for sex. And, in any event, half the fun of having a woman lies in the chase. So, after months of sex scandals that have enlivened the summer reading for thousands of Italians, his popularity remains fairly high. A significant number of Italians have a sneaking admiration for this man who created a media empire from nothing and ridicules his accusers.
This time, however, he is weakened. Two trials will be reopened against him. No one thinks that he will immediately be forced from office, but two dangers lie ahead for him. Firstly, will he retain the support of his coalition, particularly Gianfranco Fini, the speaker of the lower house? He came out and said the premier must "respect the constitutional court and the head of state". If he were to break with Berlusconi that might be the beginning of the end. Secondly, public opinion. Berlusconi sets great store by the fact that he remains popular. If the people deserted him that could push him towards the exit.
His defence will be that he is the victim of leftist newspapers and parts of the judiciary. There will be plenty of people who believe that. The curse of Italy is that politics has become so polarised. The benefit for Berlusconi is that he can dismiss all charges as political attacks by his enemies. He is also helped by the fact that the opposition is in disarray. Some even say that the courts are the real opposition.
So, for the moment, he is likely to survive. But a key stone in his defences has been removed. Some will worry that the continuing soap opera will distract from the tough economic decisions that need to be made.
I'm 
~RS~q~RS~~RS~z~RS~57~RS~)
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No mention of yesterday's European parliament debate about Italian press freedom?
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The man's tantrum is like that of a spoilt little 73 year old!
Stinky birds of a feather stick together ! The danger for his coalition partners will be how much of the growing Berlusconi stench could potentially cling to them ?
Right or left - Italy (and Europe) needs a credible leader other wise the Berlusconi stench will start sticking to every Italian citizen. If this happens then the big looser out of this could be the successful "Made in Italy" brand.
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Back in the early 50s we lived deep in rural Surrey and my Grandad had a wet-nosed, hairy, rugged mongrel with a roving eye called 'Thatch' that would disappear for hours at a time and occasionally for a day or 2.
He always returned looking even more dishevelled and grubby.
My Grandad always smiled, patted him and said, "Thatch, you're a dog, aint you boy, a real dog."
Back then I never understood the reference as it seemed so obvious, but, it has to be said, "Mr Berlusconi, you're a dog, aint you, a real dog."
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Great, another tourist writer. I'm afraid that understanding Italian politics takes a bit more than taking coffe in a Roman bar. The divisions in Italian life are violent and deeply rooted (Italians have been split in two ever since the middle ages, ad that hasn't changed a bit). Trying to explain it though a simplistic analysis of yesterdays news won't work; that is if you really want to understand what's happening. There are five fundeamental problems: 1) the North/South cultural, social, economic division; 2)The presence of 5 Mafia syndicates (all in the South, so this is linked to point one); 3)Extreme Left/Right polarization (this also involves the judiciary, and is linked to Berlusconi's ; 4) the political presence of the Vatican on National soil, with an ever present effect on cultural and political life of all Italians; and finally point 5) the Machiavellian approach to Italian politics, which not only are influenced by the previous 4 points, but can also look back to 2000yrs of Roman-centric career politicians that are dearly attached to their seats and will do anything to remain there.
Italians are not stupid, they are used to reading between the lines, and seeing through the facade; then of course you'll have 50% that will hate the enemy(not conceived as opposition), and will use all weapons available to eliminate him. This is particularly currently true with regards to the parliamentary left, which since WWII ended has regarded itself as the only legitimate political force; the others (Berlusconi in this case) is the enemy to eliminate (fascist is the word now, guelfi was the word in the XXII century.
Point is, as rotten as it may seem to a foreigner, the only reason you get attached so ferociously is if you do something that is bethering someone. The more you move the status quo, the more you will be attached. I submit to you that it's curious that Berlusconi i sbeing attched not on his poilitical agenda, but on his personal life. I don;t remember anyone asking Chirac for example about his excapades, the illegitimate child, the government money he spent for his personal wine collection, personal private flights, etc.)
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Gavins Hewitt may well do well to heed the words of the victorian adventurer Richard Francis Burton on the nature of the Italian character:
"This is part of the national character, which is never recognised by passing strangers. The Italian is a Janus, the model of a two-sided race. The face which first strikes you expresses the romantic and poetical, the gushing and the sentimental, almost the childish; behind it and far below it there is another countenance, whose characteristics are the baldest realism, the hardest matter of fact. The iron purpose which runs through Dante's "Comedy" -- why that absurdity the "Divine"? -- distinguishes it from the epic poems of the world. Compare it, for instance, with Paradise Lost."
Which explains that while the Italians are stylish and sentimental in living but care for one and one only thing when in competition…winning or better still survival at all costs. See The Italian football team as a example. Stylish Kit. Survival at all costs bordering on cynical tactics.
I think what gets lost is the fact that the braggodaccio is all facade. The British newspapers, including the BBC like to frame him as a buffoon who the the italian public have all allowed into power out of some sort of joke. What the many foreign observers fail to get is that this is a very dangerous and powerfull man who plays for the gallery but does cloak and dagger like no other man. Even his low key war with Rupert Murdoch which is turning nastier by the minute barely makes a headline here-where did you think the incentive for the news of the world phone tapping info 'actually' came from? Common knowledge in Italy, but hardly a peep here Britain. Compare with the fawning Blair or Cameron who bend over backwards for News Internationals malign Influence...
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Braggadocio? And where did you get that word from, I am Italian and I know a few dialects. Never heard! Does your superficial understanding of Italy end here Gavin?
And what about the impartiality of the BBC? Isn't your blog post biased?
I think that your attempt to comment on Italian internal affairs without having full and deep background knowledge is pure arrogance.
I recommend you stick to your internal British politcs and corruption. Leave Italy and Italians alone.
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The problem with Italy is its judicial system. As Oscar Luigi Scalfari, the ninth President of the Republic once said in a Christmas speech on television, every person is innocent until proven guilty in the first, second or third instance (or degree, grado, in Italian). Which basically means until they have been tried three times and proven guilty the third time. If you then consider the numerous statutes of limitations, it is very easy for a person who can afford expensive lawyers to draw out the three trials until they escape punishment because of the statute of limitations. It is child’s play. Davis Mills has been found guilty and sentenced to prison, but in a system with three trials, firstly he is not in prison and secondly this will probably be overturned or reduced on the second trial and then increased or re-overturned on the third, if the statute of limitations doesn't save his bacon beforehand. It would make a lot more sense if the statute of limitations only ran until the beginning of the trial(s) and not during them.
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At first glance you could sympathise with the Italians, having an arrogant, narrow-minded, egotistical, intolerant, flawed Prime Minister. Then you could consider Gordon Brown and conclude that we have more than enough to worry about ourselves. Caledonian Comment
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Dear Gavin,
braggadocio is not present in the Italian vocabolary.Berlusconi is not a criminal, and actually the most of the italians are supporters. This because he gave evidence to be really close to the real italian problems with facts. See the Abruzzo emergency (new houses built in 110 days), the new High speed trains, the trash-emergency in Naples that has been solved in one week and many other actions..
Italian people see the facts. We do not care about the prime minister private life. He like women...me too! He has the power to arrange dinners and after-dinners with beautiful women? good for him!!!
Sorry for my english...
Marco from ROME.
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Ridoca, I totally agree with you.
I've been puzzled for years at the shallowness of the British media's analisys of italian politics. I often wondered whether they were plain lazy or they just didn't have it.
I think I've come up with the answer: they want their readers to have a clear-cut, simple caricatural drawing of what happens, so that they can follow it through and click back to check updates. It is not a serious analisys that makes your web clicks rise!
And by the way: mr. Hewitt, yes, there are people who believe that a good part of Berlusconi's judiciary troubles are politically motivated. I am one of them.
I am not a Berlusconi voter, neither am stupid. Berlusconi is probably guilty of most of the things he's accused of, but when you see things like
1) Summons to Court delivered to him during a G7 meeting (with the press given anonymous notice in advance) 2) The number of proceedings against him exceeds that of any other italian citizen, Mafia bosses included. And the law in Italy has a bad reputation for being slow and overloaded... well, his proceedings are fairly well oiled and fast 3) Some of the judges who "impartially" went against him in the past are now firmly established politicians within the ranks of the opposition.
You'd have to be really naif to believe that it's a "good vs. bad" thing. Or else you'd have to be your average BBC reader.
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To ridoca (4):
You ask what was the difference between Chirac and Berlusconi, I give you few ones.
1) Berlusconi, over 70, dates a girl that is less than 18. Berlusconi dates prostitutes and exchanges other favours with many other women. That is a huge difference, Berlusconi has stepped over boundaries that no person should exceed, especially if one is in a leading position of a nation.
2) Berlusconi uses his huge media empire to silence opposition and keep the nation ignorant. No word of his sex scandals were published in tv-stations and newspapers that he owned, in a matter of that they were used to hush down anything that had happened.
3) Berlusconi is an active idiot. His remarks about other countries, including Finland, and non co-operative approach to EU policies including the whole fiasco of setting up an European Food Safety Authority.
There is a lot of difference between Berlusconi and Chirac, the two should not be even talked in a same sentence, so drastic is the contrast between them. Anyway, what is totally unbelievable is that any European nation in this day and age allows politicians like Berlusconi to get in power and have such a drastic national politics. Haven't nobody in Italy heard on such thing as ration, rationality and modernism as they seem to missing from the country as whole.
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@4 you meant either (a) Francois Mitterand's or (b) Nicolas Sarkozy's illegitimate child, not Jacques Chirac ...
And both were known among the french press corps. That journalists agreed not to make it too much public until after (a) was dead and (b) acknowledged it, is a question you should ask them.
best regards,
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Jukka Rohila,
1) Do you want to make a list of politicians who consort with prostitutes? That'd be a long work, you know. There's a french one, for example, who's currently under criticism for consorting with minors (boys).
2) Media in the hands of berlusconi? Some. Not the 2 main newspapers for sure (Corriere, Repubblica) and not several TV shows (Annozero, Ballaro', Che tempo che fa, etc...) on the State TV and an entire State TV station (Raitre), firmly leftist and paid by the money of all taxpayers. If you wanna depict a new Mussolini, you've quite a long way to go.
3) Italians stupid? Yeah, you're right. Keep on believing it. And thanks for proving my points (see my post above).
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to Ford Mondeo (5); I could have never expressed myself in a better way, your observations are spot on.
Berlusconi is a buffoon, but a really dangerous one at that.
Like it or not (I sure don't) he is very influential also abroad.
To dismiss him simply as an idiot would be to underestimate him and sometimes I wonder if this is what he wants.
Some examples on how he could manipulate also on foreign affairs (on some issues he already moved, like lobbying for not having Germany get the permanent seat at the UN):
- Italy is the first commercial partner of Iran and the second (if not first) of Russia...put these two things together, add his personal relationship with Putin, and you get my point
- His relationship with Gheddafi (and with Lybia,of which, again, Italy is the first commercial partner)
- His alliance with an aggressive, xenophobic and completely anti-EU party
- Italy's military presence abroad (specially in Lebanon)
And I could continue for hours; Italy is still the 7th biggest economy in the World and, although it seems to count every day much less, it's infleunce is not to be discarded.
We need to see him go, the sooner the better, not just for the sake of Italy but for all the damage he could cause on an international level.
BTW Hewitt...I am afraid you have opened Pandora's Box. On other blogs, after similar comments, the Berlusconi's brigade have saturated them with thousands of comments..there seems to be a scheme there as well!
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Interestingly, braggadocio has been a word in English since the 16th century, made up by the poet Spenser who, having a bit of braggadocio thought an Italian style word would be fashionable. It has never been Italian
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To Jukka_Rohila (11),
1) Berlusconi has a huge media empire, TRUE
2) Berlusconi uses his huge media empire to silence opposition an keep the population ignorant: WRONG
I'm afraid this is wrong and extremely offensive. It's true that he will do anything in his power to shut the opposition up. But there is no such thing as media cesorship in italy (i'm italian, journalist, and worked in the UK for many years). Italy is not some western version of Iran or N Korea (no offenses there). What you might not know, is that italy is still full of politically backed newspapers, full of opinions and features. if you really think that B uses his huge media empire to distract itaians from real political life and keep them ignorant, then you should consider how many people in the UK read the Sun. what do you call that?? Ever realised that every time there are big international debates the Sun always has a new Posh and Beck story?
Italians are not stupid, not naive and, above all, not ignorant!
"Media" doesn't just mean TV. It means radio (indipendent ones too,which italy hundreds of), papers, periodicals and the WEB!
Please let's not use clichè!
Modernism? yes, i have heard of it. It's a well known cultural movement of the 20th century. MODERNITY, on the other hand, is not at all missing from italy. The Country still has a decent train system which charges you per Km,is well networked and doesn't tell you to "please remember to take all you belongings with you before leaving the train" at every single stop. Free higher education system, good free medical care (believe it or not, doctors still do home-visits), no alcohol dependency issues and healthy eating culture, well established tourism and export industry ... oh well, forgot to mention that Italian "old fashioned" banking industry didn't wreck the country to bits! Why are we not ruled by huge corporations? who knows!
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Braggadocio, not in the Italian dictionary? Of course it isn’t and Gavin Hewett quite rightly doubts that it is really an Italian word, which only demonstrates his good knowledge of Italian. A pity that some of the Italian speakers here have not demonstrated an equally good knowledge of English, since the word braggadocio is an English word invented and coined by the English. I quote the Shorter Oxford English dictionary: "an empty idle boaster". The word probably originated from Braggadocchio a character in Edmund Spencer's epic poem the Faerie Queen first published in 1590 (to cite Wiki “from the English brag and the Italian occhio a comic knight with no sense of honour. He steals Guyon's horse. He is not evil, just a dishonourable braggart).
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#4 ridoca, #10 anonimolombardo
Unfortunately it is not only the British press that displays a shallow ignorance regarding Berlusconi and Italian matters. It exists here in Ireland, France, Belgium, Spain, the US... pretty much everywhere I have checked. But even in Italy it exists, as the media campaign against the media tycoon has shown, attempting to show Silvio as corrupt and immoral.
As ridoca points out, Italians are not stupid, and because of their enlightenment, despite what the world media says, as well as the communist Italian media and Italian judicial system, they alone, can see how great Silvio is. It is just unfortunate that everyone, whether right or left, who can't see his greatness is wrong, or in the words of Berlusconi 'comunisti'
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@13 That's precisely the problem with Berlusconi : in other developped country, the press is more or less free to choose, whether or not to divulge such details to the public.
However, in Italy, only press, radios and TV stations not under the direct influence of the Berlusconi familia, can decide to speak freely ... and, even then, they have to cope with threats of legal cases and advertising boycotts from them, large enough to stiffle free speech by forcing them into bankruptcy.
Not even mentionning, that they are in a minority position when it comes to reaching audiences ...
In short, for all practical purposes, Berlusconi is a politician who has a HUGE conflict of interest with its industrial empire, and undermines Italian democracy (whatever its other flaws).
Best regards,
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You have got some good posts here, but as Italians we should not explain ourselves. In your blog you have given a significant example of your shallow judgment at the foundation of an all British arrogance.
Look inside yourselves, your serial killers, your antisocial behaviour, your millions of single mothers, your dirty hospitals where people die of MRSA, your poor educational system, your pseudo-democracy with unelected peerages for sale, your mafia like political system where parties are allowed to obtain private funding and in return make laws for their "clients", your hathred for Europe, and lets have some fun as well: your stupid cars with the steering wheel in the wrong side!
Let us see that you talk and debate about your internal problems, that you are capable of acknowledging them. Then you will be entitled to talk about us.
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#16 fmatera
As an Italian journalist I'm surprised that you appear not to realise the difference in press freedom that exists in Italy and the rest of europe. Italy and Turkey share the honour of being the only western European nations to be regarded as having 'partly free' press. Whether this is down to Berlusconi's invlovement, wither actively or simply as owner, in the world of media can be argued, as is often done in the EU parliament.
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Ford Mondeo: bravo, you hit the nail on the head. Behind the buffoonish veneer hides a very shrewd and ruthless person.
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@16 fmatera
Too True... I am no fan of berlusconi and I think the main problem isnt so much his media clout which nearly italians can see right through, but the problem which is more endemic in Italy is the lack of deterent against private conflicts of interest that can allow such nefarious individuals to sit in in the first chamber.This will Continue even when il cavaliere decides to quit politics. More stringent anti trust laws are desperatlt needed. In Britain there is fretting about the professionalisation of politics and distance from the public sphere, while in Italy the politicians have TOO many vested interests behind them emanating from society... not all for the good of the nation state as a whole.
" if you really think that B uses his huge media empire to distract itaians from real political life and keep them ignorant, then you should consider how many people in the UK read the Sun. what do you call that?? Ever realised that every time there are big international debates the Sun always has a new Posh and Beck story?"
Glad you noticed that as well. While Italy's media power problems are out in the air, Britains are often sinsterly underplayed. How Rupert Murdoch's attack dogs are able to run what is foreign influenced press, pay next to near no taxes and actively print outright falsehoods without barely a whimper from a emasculated press complaints commission is beyond me...
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I think Gavin is well within his remit to comment on 'internal Italian' issues/politics. He is the europe editor. And I don't think he needs a PhD on the Renaissance, or to have lived in Italy 20 years, to comment on the lifting of Berlusconi's immunity. Perhaps when the espresso wears off cooler heads will prevail.
It's clear that Italian politics is complicated. To those on the outside it looks like a farcical circus.
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It has been plain to see what a buffoon Berlusconi is for a long time now. Any country silly enough to have a leader whose priorities are 1)his media empire 2)chasing 17-year-old girls 3)the rest, deserves the sad position they find themselves in. No man should be above the law.
In Case You Missed It - Berlusconi
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n. 18, Danremont:
You see, I happen to live in Ireland. I know well your newspapers are CTRL+C and CTRL+V -ed from the british ones. You rarely find anything original, sport tabloids included ("better because we're irish?" Oh, c'mon)
To stick to Britain, the last time I read the Daily Telegraph, Celia Walden let herself go on a purely racist rant about italian men (all of them), their obsession with sex and the annoying way they speak. Did you mean THIS kind of journalism, Danremont?
As for Spain's newspapers, well, that's become personal vs. berlusconi, El Pais most of all. You know, they happen to have a very leftist government.
America's medias are pro or against him, depending whether you follow CNN, CBS, ABC or FOX.
Given the fact that you already labelled me as a Berlusconist, I read it through the lines, let me stress once again my point: you have the choice to choose between two positions; one sees half of italian voters as being stupid altogether (around 25 million of them, 5 times the population of your country). The other position would point towards other reasons for their vote: ideology (a completely unknown thing in Ireland, where Fianna Fail and Fine Gael have more or less the same policies), refusal of a certain leftist and statalist conception of politics, lack of alternative: this last one seems to be rather incisive.
There you go, here's the embryo of a more complicate explanation. Can you cope?
At any rate, I did not vote for him but I hate ignorant comments.
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Gavin, this is a painfully serious subject and you should have looked much harder and closer before you wrote your column. Why did you introduce 'braggadocio'? You must have a dictionary!
Italy is a real country, not something that exists only in films and literature.
Your subject demands a serious and authoritative report by the BBC. Politics in the rest of Europe is important to the UK, the BBC has the duty to look closely at all our EU fellows. As several comments have suggested, forget the lurid aspects of the sex scandals. Investigate the relevant accusations:
Is SB's media control excessive for a Premier and who gives the false picture: the media under his control or the rest?
What was his part in P2 and is it relevant?
Has he paid bribes?
Where has he obtained financial support and do his companies launder money?
Does he have connections with organised crime?
Does he abuse his power?
Is he a genius, who is solving Italy's problems, or something darker?
Spend six months on the questions, get a cross-section of views, most of all find the truth, then write a column or make a Panorama programme.
It's important for Italy to have some honest and independent answers. It's also important for the rest of the EU (that includes the UK) as we progress to greater integration.
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Danremont,
you are right and I don't deny it. In fact, I am perfectly aware of B's involmentent (and guilt, I daresay) in Italy's partial freedom of information. My point is: if you're in italy and you seek alternative opinions, there are lots of places you can look. What people outside of Italy don't understand, is that our culture, starting with the school system, teaches us how to "read between the lines" (here i quote Ridoca).
Italians are not stupid. They are perfectly aware of what goes on around them. Politic talks happen in school, at home, in the bar, in recreational societies. I can't remember the last time heard a political conversation in a British Pub. It is in our nature to mistrust our institutions and our political parties. Believe me, you'll struggle to find a disappointed italian if you look! The same couldn't be said about the British "blind trust" and "positive attitude" towards the Country's ruling class. I believe, and these aren't my words, that the economic crisis was partly the media's doing. Exageration, sexed-up headlines, abuse! It's not lack of freedom, quite the opposite. Doesn't it lead to similar effects? "ignorance" (to use Jukka_Rohila) and detachment from reality.
jimdavisit,
how good's your Italian then? Do you really expect everyone outside of the UK to have studied ancient English? Shall we try some Dante then?
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#20 - dudelange
I can understand your irritation at some of the simplistic comment about Italy but really do not thing that massive generalisations involving popular misconceptions about Britain serve your cause. If anything, your prejudice simply reinforces the very stereotype you are attempting to gainsay.
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Jukka_Rohilla and #11.
Doing it again, aren't you!?
It's all black and white to you: E.g. "... anybody in Italy heard of ... rationality and modernism they seem to be missing from the country as a whole.."
Matti Vanhanen: Now there's a name to consider - - you know the one - - Prime Minister of Finland; any chance of a bit of rationality with his liaisons, election money, furniture costs!?
Not a bad chap, but lillywhite? I think not.
Vanhanen is not the only Finn: Berlusconi is not the only Italian. Chirac is not the only Frenchman. Brown is not the only Scot/Briton.
In fact none of them are female so could be described as failing utterly to represent 50% of anything!
Now their individual 'interest' in the oppoosite sex may be said to emulate an awful lot of the male species - - in which case the various highs and lows of each one's character is par for the course given Human Nature.
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Ridoca and #4.
Excellent summary of the Italian scene: Must get frustrating to know other Europeans concentrate so much on the rather petty foibles of an elderly Italian.
Of course Berlusconi's 'aggressive, aggrandizing business interests' are a wholly different matter: In that sense he is no joke at all.
That said, anyone who thinks the EU Commission, and National Political Leadership in France, Britain, Finland etc. are not tied into 'Business interests' with every Policy they propose is clearly not living in the 21st Century.
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I think most of the ire directed on this blog is directed towards the general attitude of British media rather than Gavin's ability to comment on the news as he sees it. Like Mark Mardell like before him, as Europe editor he has a full right to report the situation as he sees fit.
Its just that the report seems…disappointing. It follows what seems a distinctive inability of British Media to comprehend, even wish to try to Italian politics. A pity because the Italian machinations in political life actually make better reading than the insipid tales from Westminster. In Italy politics is happily discussed over lunch by young and old hence the lack of voter apathy that bedevils Britain. Some negative comments have gone overboard though, seeing the simplification of Italian political life as a slight against Italy itself- the attacks on British societal problems I think are a poor comparison.
I think maybe the gripe is that as a BBC Europe Editor, Gavin should better placed to see beyond the tabloid caricatures for the nonsense that it is, and give a more reasoned in depth analysis, such as what is it in Italian society and constitution that allows men like Berlusconi to maintain his powerbase in politics. That and that maybe we hold the BBC to greater standards than other media outlets.
Mark Mardell himself indulged a bit of this himself though on some of the previous euroblogs, prompting some comments that he didn't take some of the European stories seriously enough, going on to make light hearted joke asides about some of the peculiarities of continental politics. To many continental readers of the euroblog this sometimes was interpreted as stereotypical British condescending superiority which is then reflected in the media. As a man with both British and Italian (and European) identities I see where the cultural misinterpretation problem may often arise. What is often seen as gentle 'ribbing' sometimes comes across to other continentals as patronising superiority, which is a shame because I’m pretty sure that that not at all how this article intended to come across.
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#26 anonimolombardo
Attacking Irish and British newspapers does not prove anything. I do not appreciate being called ignorant and neither do I appreciate you putting words in my mouth, ie labelling you a 'Berlusconist', whatever that is. I am talking about freedom of press, not quality. Here is a link to the site that ranks press freedom:
[Unsuitable/Broken URL removed by Moderator]
If my comment seems abrasive to you, I apologise, I was simply trying to show the polarising nature of Italian politics. If I disagree with Berlusconi I get branded a communist by the right, if I agree, I'm suddenly a fascist in the eyes of the left (thinking especially of di Pietro here).
Of course Italians aren't stupid, but I think they get blinded by the extremes that come with such polarised politics and it becomes a competition of me against you, who is right and who is wrong. The question of how Italy should move forward seems to take a back seat to the question of us v them. Centrist politicians get massacred for not having an ideology. Credit to Berlusconi, he does unite the 'right', but does this drive a deeper wedge into Italian society?
I thought Veltroni (may I assume you voted for him?) may have been on the right track in trying to promote more co-operation over the divide. Is his future in politics dark now, or could he re surface at some later stage?
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Gavin,
despite what has been said, i quite enjoyed reading your article. To tell you the truth, the the person i'm mostly intrigued by it actually Fini.
Initially, i was very worried about the merge of AN with Berlusconi's party. After all, everybody knows that , whether you support left, right or centre, the guy has his head straight and talks sense. I thought that being "ruled" by Berlusconi, he would be weakened. What i realise now, is the that Gianfranco's cunning plan is finally taking shape. By merging with FI, Fini managed to shake-off the heavy weight of the "fascism" stigmata associated with his former party.
If he plays his part skillfully (and he will), he will soon be able to break Berlusconi's power from within. I personally think the guy's a great statitian and a great politician. Never made a wrong move!
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The profound and insightful nature of the BBC's running commentary about Berlusconi makes me wonder how good the quality actually is in their reports about any other country. Perhaps we should check the BBC's charter and check if the "inform and educate" of old has been reinterpreted into "engage in storytelling for the masses"?
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#28 fmatera
You make a good point. I go to Italy quite often, 2-3 times a year at least, and one of the first things I noticed is the amount of political conversation that takes place there, among people of all ages and from all backgrounds. I agree that, especially in Britain, the press does have an excessive influence over people.
However, whether your culture and education system gives you the ability to 'read between the lines' to a greater extent than any other nation is arguable. This seemingly immeasurable attribute is surely necessary for any political system to work.
Being able to 'read between the lines' is great, but 61 governments since 1945 is not so great.
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I would like to state that I am ITALIAN, very proud of my heritage, my culture and also the chaotic like state of affairs that come with the politics in my country. On the other hand, I would like to say to my fellow british opinionist, that a Buffoon is someone that performs in Art and not in Politics, but maybe this is something that they do not teach in the british schools. I also understand that to some of you, it was better when we had government that were too accondiscending to the Anglo-Saxons nations, rather than guide the way as sometime Mr Berlusconi's government is doing. Maybe you preferred Italy to be the country of Pizza & Pasta only, not a country that has formidable allies outside the EU or the North Atlantic pact, that can seat at the decision tables of the major industrialised nations and count, not to be a push over as it was in years gone by. Maybe your ignorance of Italian Politics is so great that the only thing you can do is rubbish us all so that you can feel better about your endemic failures in foreign and domestic politics. Mr Andreotti (a former Italian Prime Minister) once was asked by an opposition journalist why the political climate in Italy was always so heated, the reply was simple: Power deprives, who does not have it! or Il Potere Logora chi non c'e' l'ha!!!
To some of you a reading of some of the classics, would open your eyes and make you understand what you cannot even see, but to do that, first you need to learn to read and accept the fact that Soverignity is not limited to the British Isles but to every nations in the world, and that what people choose in their own country should be respected by the others and not made a joke of, not unless you think you have God's Will on your side and impose others your ways. But in case you did not know it, that is referred as Colonialism,to put it politely,and you should know all, about that, shouldn't you???? Be respectful of others country and of their institutions.
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Unfortunately, Berlusconi is most likely to go on "forever". I cannot see him losing an election, his lawyers will keep him out of jail. Its only dementia that is likely eventually to stop him. Unless he "dies on the job"
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There's more than one tourist, Ridoca! Forget what you've read in the history books (obviously written by English speakers, in your case). There is nothing about Berlusconi's "political agenda" that is anything other than protecting his economic and personal empire. Do yourself a favour and Google Berlusconi, Falcone, Mangano, Dell'Utri (all together) and if you can cope with the Italian language, open your eyes to what really is behind Mr B. The fact that he has also been caught with his knickers down is simply a sordid extra - but it is not the real reason why he should go.
Macchiavelli was an amateur in comparison.
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fmatera
the usual Italian "supponenza". Try a bit harder with your reasoning powers. As for Dante - any time ( quando vuoi) - but remember, the real problem is that Italy is not being guided by Virgil, but by Berlusconi - fat chance then that the country will ever "...riveder le stelle" while he is still out of prison!
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Berlusconi the fighter, (viva Italia viva berlusconi) Was it a provocation or does it mean without Berlusconi they will be no Italy.
The prime minister was (incassato nero) when he walk pass journalist after the verdict.
So now I ask myself is this the beginning of the fall of the PM or we're going to see a come back?
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N. 33 danremont:
If by "attacking" british and irish newpapers you mean defending myself against Celia walden's grossly racist insults, or commenting with frustration on the Irish Times' BBC-styled editorials, then my friend, you have a peculiar conception of "attacking". Or maybe you're just too touchy.
You did not label me a Berlusconist, I quite clearly wrote "I read it between the lines". I think you had that suspicion.
But now I see you think I was a Veltronian (another Star Trek population)... well, wrong again. It doesn't really matter who I voted for, does it?
Sorry your URL couldn't be published. But I guarantee in Italy you'd find much more freedom of expression than you think, given the fact that Berlusconi's sex life went LIVE in pictures and published trascripts of recordings (For God's sake, if that's not freedom of expression...)
Last but not least, a funny anecdote: I recently posted a comment on the Times' website, joking about the fact that people were complaining about Berlusconi's control of the press - on a newspaper, the Times, owned by Rupert Murdoch, the owner of half of the world's media (certainly more than Berlusconi's), who has been at loggerheads with our PM for a few years. Something to meditate about...
Well, my comment was not published one, two, three times in a row. I stopped trying and just laughed.
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Mr. Berlusconi is a criminal, his original relationship with the socialists and Craxi (the soicalist leader) were criminal enterprises. Craxi died in exile to avoid prosecution.
Here in central Italy we have never voted for Berlusconi or for the parties in his coalition. By central Italy I mean my region Tuscany, Emilia Romagna, Umbria and Marche. Only the greedy and racist shop keepers in the north and the paid for voters in the south, vote for the disgusting coalition of fascists, racists and ignorants.
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#42 anonimolombardo
Not sure why the lin I posted regarding freedom of press isn't up, it's on freedomhouse.org website. It's about freedom of press, not freedom of expression, which is more difficult to assess.
Only reason I thought you voted for Veltroni was because you said you didn't vote for Berlusconi, and I was interested because I thought Veltroni was interesting candidate. I'm not trying to catch you out or get you to state your allegiances, just looking to discuss. But since you insist on 'defending Italy' instead of 'discussing Italy' and trying to find some innuendo in what I write then I don't see any point in continuing our line of discussion.
#34 fmatera
Have to agree with you about Fini. I find him impressive, he's clear and doesn't play to the audience like so many others (both in and outside of Italy). Although his past may make him ideologically divisive, much more so than Berlusconi, the fact that he 'has his head straight and talks sense' as you put it so well, should hopefully appeal to those willing to rise above the right/left divide and want an effective politician. Interesting times ahead...
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Gavin, after all these posts if I were you I would resign. You make the BBC news appear like a shallow tabloid.
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dudelange - can I suggest you have a look at the excellent "Betsan's Blog" on the BBC..
It has just the sort of obsession with English deficiencies in Government, discussion of Italian style 'tangentopoli' on a much more amateur scale in the halls of Cardiff Bay, a really nasty fight between the Welsh 'North' and anglicised 'South' and some quite vindictive prose between people on the right and left of the political spectrum.
You see, the British really are able to see the 'beam in their own eye' as well as being able to see the 'mote' in other people's eyes.
If you wonder why spend so much time discussing Berlusconi, the simple fact is that he is good 'box office'. Just as the fantastic film "Il Divo" by Paulo Sorrentino [please forgive me if I've spelt his name incorrectly] marries amazing cinematography with an operatic plot and lust for blood. Just Amazing !!
At least the politicians of Cardiff Bay haven't started bumping off their enemies, but give it time...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/betsanpowys/
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I think Berlusconi is the most talented politician in Europe. Only Berlusconi could survive such scathing media attacks about his personal life and legal battles. I respect Berlusconi because he started with nothing and turned into one of the richest and most powerful men in Italy and Europe. In addition, I respect Berlusconi because he is worth billions of dollars and instead of vacationing and traveling he works non-stop for Italy and the Italian people. We must not forget that Berlusconi picked up the garbage in Naples, reacted wonderfully to the earthquake in Aquila and most importantly has brought some form of stability to Italian government. It is important to remember that no human being is perfect; we should respect his private life and remember that you are innocent until proven guilty. As far as the opposition go they have no ideas on how to make Italy better they only complain about Berlusconi. Until the Italian left turns into a respectful and serious opposition Berlusconi will continue to win elections because he the only person who can do the job.
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Berlusconi's great! In an age of soundbited scripted shallow politicians with a permanent eye to the opinion polls and trying to be all things to all people and not offend anyone, it is such a relief to see a successful politician who speaks from the heart with genuine emotion, unscripted and who is himself rather than who his handlers want him to be. Politics in the West would be far healthier with more politicians like him, not less. And Italy is extremely lucky to have its most successful businessman, a doer, a self-made man as its Prime minister rather than someone who has never done a productive day's work in his life and never run anything like almost all other countries.
The viciousness of the attacks on him is the usual Leftist nonsense when a politician of the right dares to step beyond the limits the Left insists politics takes place in - their stage of course. He is of the right and successful so any tactics are valid to bring him down. The usual hypocritical nonsense to be ignored. Forza Italia and Forza Berlusconi
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6. dudelange
"Braggadocio"
Isn't it a word from Spenser's Faerie Queen? A 16th century English neologism.
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I hardly ever read or heard anything positive about Berlusconi either on the Italian or the international press. I wonder where all the control for media that they accuse him to excercise is. Indeed we know who his declared supporters are, and we have the freedom to choose to listen to them or not. Despite that everyone can see a predominant campaign against him, with even a self declared neutral news agency like the BBC takes the liberty to mock him.
We Italian are a free people, and unlike British we have an excellent broad education, which is after all at the foundation of our freedom. The British culture is quite different, more based on the Machiavellian model recommending to keep people ignorant and happy so that "the Prince" can have more leverage in maintaining control.
British academic education is very specialized; touching in depth only a few areas it makes the average citizen more dependent on the information is fed by third parties. Not that this model is wrong, because people are happier and eventually more productive. In Britain, unlike Italy, people hardly ever talk about politics, in fact they wouldn't know what to talk about! The only recurring opinion is "we do not trust politicians!".
We Italians we do have a choice to make our own mind up.
British should observe more respect for the choices we as Italians make about our country, if they want to be respected by us.
Berlusconi is an Italian matter. We Italians can criticize Berlusconi because if and when we do it, we know what we talk about.
You Brits? No you can't!
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Alot of people do like an unrepentent person, remember Clinton? The more he apologized the more people disliked him.
Reagan's rule was "never explain, never apologize." But, sometimes (in Bush's case) one would like to see some indication of self-insight. Maybe that is a conservative dictum--never explain....
But, I dislike it because it is arrogant and makes the politican unaccountable for their actions and stirs up sympathies from far right (fascist) sympathizers.
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@anonimolombardo: I totally agree with you.
Italians are not stupid. If they had alternatives, they'd vote B. out.
@dudelange: come on! I too dont like to be criticised by the Brits, but they have point here. Served on a silver tray.
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berlusconi reminds me of boris johnson. he is certainly no idiot, but he likes to play the buffoon. if it works for his domestic audience, why should he care what the rest of the world thinks? on the other hand, i can't imagine boris johnson bribing a judge (unless maybe it was to get him off throwing a brick through someone's window or stealing a policeman's helmet or something..)
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I’ve taken the trouble to talk with as many Italians as I could about this topic in particular, Berlusconi in general and subjects raised by the contributors. I’ll mention a few points they raise. I’ve tried to keep the comments ‘acceptable’, but cannot guarantee total accuracy.
Many who support SB think he’s a great leader, much abused and the defender against the arch enemy communism. Even amongst these, many believe him to be a criminal, but accept it, because ‘all politicians are criminals even you British MPs.’ To be sure, it seems ‘taking maximum advantage of the system’ is widespread in Italian politics and goes much deeper than in the UK. In Italy, it is acceptable to be a member of a city council, the national and European parliaments and never be turn up for any.
Certainly, there’s a wide acceptance that an elected leader should be able to do anything he likes, a dictatorship of the majority. That would put him above the law, which may well be the ambition of politicians worldwide, but sounds strange to British ears. The same goes for making laws by decree without extensive discussion in open parliament and parliamentary committee. These ideas may not be Anglo-Saxon, but we have to accept them. Only a minority of Italians question his position as ‘padrone’ of the country.
People, who don’t support him, point to his media control and influence. Government control of the public TV is stronger than in the UK. The one significant ‘independent’ channel is presently negotiating a takeover by an associate of the Premier. There are no Jeremy Paxmans in Italy; they are not allowed. Few politicians answer questions. The ‘leftist’ programmes try to achieve some balance, while the ‘right’ amount to part political broadcasts. Why not watch Italian TV for yourself, it’s free on the Hotbird satellite? If you don’t understand Italian, you’ll better see the body language of the politicians.
It seems Italians find the Sun and the Sunday Sport rather strange; that sort of material appears in weekly magazines in Italy. However, they claim a Berlusconi family newspaper, ‘Il Giornale’, is as accurate in its description of politics as the Sunday Sport is on the location of London buses. Il Giornale appears free in many bars in Italy. It ran a piece listing the failings of the British and the superiority of Italy and Italians. Comment on foreign countries is not out of the question and not always accurate. Are ‘The Wall Street Journal’ and ‘The Economist’ communist, English newspapers?
All tell me there’s nothing anti-British, it’s just rivalry between Berlusconi and Murdoch. Indeed, before this exploded Thatcherite Britain was held as a model by the right.
No one commented on education without my prompting. Those familiar with the England said that twenty years ago the Italian state school education was wider and much harder than the English, even too arduous. However, right and left agree that it’s gone downhill badly. The present economic constraints are pushing it further down together with the Universities. One Italian said the only decent texts on their twentieth century history are foreign, usually English.
My conclusion is that Italy is a very different country from the UK: a world where David Cameron is on the left and a typical labour voter supports the far right. It seems fair to say that Berlusconi should not be allowed to be PM of anywhere. However, good or bad, Berlusconi is not the source of the problem. The real sources are the failures of state organisations, from the Post Office to the Police, City Hall to the tax office, to perform their functions properly over the last half century. Where the state fails, the state opens the door to anarchy and organised crime. When things don’t work, people have to change their values and accept what otherwise would be unacceptable. I suggest that British people and British politicians pay attention to these points, especially in the current crisis, and not fall into the same problems.
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Dudelange
what a load of tripe you talk. Italian education? I have taught in the Orientale in Napoli - and there, as everywhere else, if the baron (the examining professor) doesn't like you, hasn't been paid or otherwise treated to "favours" of all kinds - you don't pass. If Italy's education were so good, people from across the world would attend your universities - but in fact the only foreigners are those from 3rd world countries, because, generally, it is cheap and University entrance is not subject to tests or minimum grades (virtually no "numero chiuso"). And the average time for a University student to graduatein Italy is about 8 years (nearly everyone is "fuori corso").
If Brits don't talk politics as much as in Italy (although what proof of that there is, God only knows) then it's probably because they've got more of a life - and less of a choking feudal system, as that which is so rooted in the Italian culture. Get out while you can - and stay out as long as Mr B is in power!
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Signore Dudelange - writing at #6 and in three other posts above - the vast majority of Britons would love to leave Italy and the Italians alone, to manage your own affairs in your own unique way.
Unfortunately, we in the UK are part of the "European Project" along with Italy. The antics of other European national leaders such as the clown Berlusconi only goes to emphasise the massive rift between the British and Italian cultures, and confirms why the UK and Italy should maintain an active trading relationship and nothing more.
Now where's my bottle of Naturasun ?
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N. 44 Danremont:
I like the way you now pose as a quiet person who just wants to find an answer, and try to make me look like the touchy italian who snapped for no reason and tries to find innuendos.
Well, here's your innuendo, taken from your post n. 18:
"As ridoca points out, Italians are not stupid, and because of their enlightenment, despite what the world media says, as well as the communist Italian media and Italian judicial system, they alone, can see how great Silvio is."
I don't think that ironizing on the stupidity of italians who voted from Berlusconi could be depicted as "discussing Italy".
Anyway, you're right on one thing: let's give it a cut. I got dragged into this, but I am really not interested in involving foreigners into discussions about my country. We've enough problems ourselves.
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Mr Hewitt, Braggadocio is surely not Italian. It must be a hangover from your Washington DC days.
Just because the Sopranos use this word, it doesn't make it Italian.
Nor will your understanding of Italian mafia, or politics for that matter, be improved by watching US-made mob movies or tv series.
If one thinks they understand Roman politics, then he surely has been very badly briefed.
More to the point, Gianfranco Fini was just a neofascist before his alliance with Berlusconi. And when Berlusconi will be gone Fini will be just a postfascist. He knows this very well, and he owns everything to his master. He might pull a tirade every now and then to "prove" his independence, but no one really buys it.
Same for Umberto Bossi and his Lega Nord. Both fascists and leghists are bound to support Berlusconi because he's the warrant of their piece of Italian cake.
This explains also why Berlusconi will hardly ever be scathed by all this judicial endeavour. With his media empire he controls the Italian public opinion and he can destroy anyone political who tries to stand against him. The judicial process will be Insabbiato. This is a real Italian word, it means "stuck in the sand".
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I am a British ex-pat living in Italy for 10 years now. While it is certainly true that many Brits don't really understand Italian Politics, I don't think this is true of Gavin Hewitt.
The Italian commentators responding in this blog fail to point out the one significant difference between Italy and the other major European democracies, and one reason why the Political situation in Italy is so bad.
It is simply that the Italian Government controls the State broadcaster, RAI. Governments of all persuasions have the right to (and do) make Poilitical appointments to the the boards of directors. The Government controls what journalists say. The State broadcaster is in practice a Political service rather than a public service. In fact the three main channels, RAI 1,2 and3, are each affiliated to one of the Political right, centre or left. Italian Politicians, who must be the most self-serving, least civic minded individuals in any Parliament in Europe, see no reason and have no personal motivation to separate public service broadcasting from Government. This system of control is right out of the "Mussolini Elementary Guide to Fascism".
When this system changes to something resembling the system in other major democracies, then other changes will undoubtedly if slowly follow. As someone pointed out on BBC World today, if Italy were applying to join the EEC today it's application would be refused simply because Italy doesn't comply with the EEC criteria for a democracy.
Many Italians, in so far as they are informed, do tend to be in denial about the state of their Country. It's not unusual to see fingers and criticisms pointed in other directions, as if that somehow mitigates or negates the rotten state of the State. I feel very sorry for Italians in general for having to tolerate such a shambolic and dangerous situation. But I am tempted to ask who made this situation possible? Is it that, in spite of the desperation of many Italians to oppose and change their rotten lot, Italy's Government(s) and the utterly rotten Political system is merely a reflection of Italian society as a whole?
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54. At 09:56am on 10 Oct 2009, WolfiePeters,
That was pretty much spot on, although perhaps a bit simplified (the constraints of time and space no doubt). Corruption though is THE big deal in Italy and the one thing that Italians will not deal with. The answer as to why is obvious. Taxes are so high (owing to people not paying their taxes!), and the cost of living high relative to income, that almost everyone is complicit in some way or another in some tax dodge or other - even if it's paying the dentist in cash for a discount. This has led to very large numbers of people, particularly professional people like dentists, making it a matter of practice.
For example, you pay your dentist in cash for a 10% discount. But the price includes IVA (VAT). So the dentist pockets the cash, including the IVA element, minus the 10% discount - which is actually embezzlement of the State's money, never mind the amount not declared for personal taxes. This kind of practice seems to be so wide spread. And there is no difference between this behaviour and what the Government gets up to.
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Gavin - nice one ! I've learnt a lot about Italian politics. Thank you. Can you write a commentary on President Sarkozy next ... ?
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To LaCerniaGigante and PVandCK @ 58 to 60
I think you’ve covered perfectly a number of points that I left out.
Berlusconi's allies cannot stab him in the back, because without him they lose their position and power. The opposition are restrained, because the endemic corruption extends well into their benches; the sheep stealers go down with the cattle rustlers. It’s in the interest of all to portray Di Pietro as a lunatic.
How far does corruption go? According to a newspaper article a few years ago, a very large proportion of lawyers and doctors declared to the tax authorities similar incomes to Fiat workers. The doctors and lawyers can run Mercedes; the Fiat workers struggle.
I’d like to ask what happens next. As LaCerniaGigante says, it’s very unlikely that any legal process against Berlusconi will progress to a conclusion. He looked shocked in the pictures. He might feel seriously affronted; for someone with enormous self-belief (or arrogance), not used to such setbacks, that can be a heavy psychological blow. On the other hand, if he can keep his support (and there’s no sign that he cannot), it may be an opportunity to erode the power of the judges and the head of state. After all, he has always stated a preference for a French style presidency....
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Very lucid and correct analysis of the Italian "anomaly", as I call it. As an Italian (from Rome), I am just glad I speak several languages so I can read foreign newspapers, magazines and websites (and of course watch foreign tv...). There is no other way I can get unbiased, undistorted information on matters concerning my own country. How sad is that? What have we come to? I am just glad foreign media are not leaving us -the sane half of the country- alone in this struggle.
Our prime minister owns half of the televisions in the country and indirectly controls the other half through government (Italian state tv is practically government-run in Italy...). He also owns a variety of newspapers, magazines and one of the major publishing companies in the country, not to mention a bank, a football club and the like. This cannot be tolerated in a western democracy. You either get on with your business or get rid of it and get involved in politics. That is all. This alone should have been a good enough reason NOT to give Mr.B any support.
As such, the media bows to the will of the prime minister, reporting what and how he wants it reported, twisting stories to suit his administration’s interests, or giving little or no air time to stories he does not want the Italian public to hear. All the while he is trying to undermine the last independent media outlets by either sueing them if they run a story he disagrees with, or trying to undermine them any way he can to get them to conform or shut down. You need not look further than the recent scandals to see all of these processes in play.
After all we have learnt about him through the years I thought he would step out or be voted out. I was wrong, and I am seriously worried now.
In conclusion, as an Italian I just feel very very sorry we had to come to this...we now are the laughing stock of Europe, we have to deal with it whether we like it or not, instead of taking it out on foreign media for reporting things as they really are.
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Gavin Hewitt:
Yes, Berlusconi is a fighter because of all of his life
experiences and his achievements; And, also, his failures and his gaffes...
~Dennis Junior~
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Libertas_Mentis in his post misrepresents his opinion as facts as follows:
"[...] Our prime minister owns half of the televisions in the country and indirectly
controls the other half through government (Italian state tv is practically
government-run in Italy...). [...]"
FALSE: his companies own 3 television channels, what the poster fails to clarify is that Italy has 9 national television channels and hundreds of local channels, hence he does not own "half". In addition state television is controlled by a parliamentary commission, not the Prime Minister.
FACTS: of the 3 RAI channels RAI 1 and RAI 2 are controlled by government backed commissioners, RAI 3 is left to the opposition backed commissioners. RAI 1 and 2 try to be as neutral as possible, however sometimes are accused to be supporting the government. RAI news have strict rules that allocate exactly the same amount of speech time to every party's representative. If one is interviewed, everyone else must be given the chance to replicate in the exact same time and it can get quite tedious with tens of them. Not even the BBC does that because when the Gordon Brown is interviewed they call the major opposition to reply, maybe the LibDem, but hardly ever the small parties.
"[...] As such, the media bows to the will of the prime minister, reporting what and how he wants it reported, twisting stories to suit his administration’s interests, or giving little or no air time to stories he does not want the Italian public to hear [...]".
FALSE: only one of the three channels owned by Berlusconi's Mediaset, openly supports him: Rete 4 (Mediaset), everybody knows because support is not subtle and everyone has a choice to follow or not to follow.
FACTS: State television, controlled by parliament in general is neutral as is Canale 5 (Mediaset). Italia 1 the third TV channel owned by Mediaset in general does not have political programs or even news. RAI 3, one of the three state controlled TV channels is controlled by the opposition parties and weekly hosts talk show with political content with clear opposition to the prime minister and his government and often campaigning against Berlusconi and his alleged media control.
FACTS: Il Giornale is the only newspaper owned by Berlusconi's media company. All
the other Italian newspapers, some neutral and most controlled by the opposition and
the left parties (Corriere della Sera and La Repubblica in particular are papers
self declaring themselves as neutral) campaign regularly against Berlusconi.
Those who do not support Berlusconi may allege that the media I described above as neutral is biased, but the same would classify RAI 3, La Repubblica, Il Corriere della Sera, Sky News as neutral ...
I wonder with all the alleged media control Berlusconi has, why there is such a negative media campaign against him, especially in Italy, a campaign eventually echoed by international press and media.
Oh! Wait a minute, let's have a look: La Repubblica is backed by De Benedetti, who once owned bankrupt Olivetti that the Italian state has backed with million of Euros to avert disaster. Rupert Murdock and De Benedetti are allied and together control a significant slice of Italian TVs and Newspapers. De Benedetti still wants to milk the Italian taxpayer, but with Berlusconi there, he is not gonna be able to do it anymore. Murdock wants to control the lucrative media business in Italy as well as he did in the UK, but again with Berlusconi there ...
Beyond gaffess and "conflict of interest" there are big names' financial interests at stake here.
Honestly I prefer Berlusconi to Murdock, at least he is genuine and Italian and "a Milanese".
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Dudelange (65) gives some hard, quantitative facts in defence of Italy’s first minister. They are not judgemental or qualitative and are offered by an apparent supporter. He states that the Berlusconi companies own three TV channels and one newspaper.
If this really is the case for the defence, is any more discussion required?
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Right well by the looks of things these blog posts have just started to turn into a massive slagging match. As a keen observer of how the media represents itself I find it amusing how some people react to this blog. A blog is an opinion. Everyone is entitled to there opinions. I've went through some of the people who have left numerous comments on this blog and actually found one calling for the writer of this blog to resign as he has made the BBC seem like a tabloid.
The same person warned this journalist to do his background research on Italy, and then went on to pretty much describe Britain as a country full of disease, serial killers and political corruption.
What I find amusing here I that whilst he criticised this journalist for not doing his research. This person obviously read a few News reports about Britain and has made a massive leap and came out with all these assumptions. I think the person I am talking about here is called dude lange.
Also another problem with these comments is the constant criticism for the journalist using a word that sounds Italian and he did admit he doubted it was Italian. He only used the word to describe B. What's the problem? If you are going to leave a comment about this blog criticising somebody's work at least make sure you understand it first.
P.s anyway the biggest problem with politicsin general is some sections of the media. Politics is put under scutiny overthings that don't matter in the long run, and politicans have to constantly explain themselves instead of doing work. Now I do believe in a certain amount of transparency but I don't care if a politicans pays for sex, cheats on his wife, or throws crazy parties. That is there private life.
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Dudelange, here is some food for thought..
1. You seem to forget that indirect control can be as powerful as direct control. While Berlusconi only owns three stations and one newspaper directly, his position as prime minister and other factors allow him to influence the media to an extent reminiscent of the less democratic regimes in the world. This includes exerting political influence over the state TV stations (which The Economist magazine cites as being more tied to the government than many other state-run TV channels in Western Europe and thus a cause for concern) and the poor underfunded local channels.
2. Indeed, throughout most of Europe the very fact that a PRIME MINISTER owns any section of the media would be considered thoroughly UNdemocratic, dangerous and is in most cases completely illegal.
3. If press freedom is not threatened under Berluconi’s rule – Why are Reporters about boarders so worried about Italian press freedom? (Our rank is dropping and we are getting close to Bulgaria in terms of press freedom) Why was Italy recently downgraded to a "partly-free" country by media watchdog Freedom House? (Placing us alongside Mongolia, Turkey and Indonesia) Why was there a large rally in Rome for press freedom recently? And, more importantly, why has press freedom – and indeed now judicial freedom – in Italy all of a sudden become such a cause for concern for foreign press? (All “communists” or “leftists” according to Berlusconi).
Now- who here would like to claim this is really a worldwide conspiracy against “the most persecuted man in history”?
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Please could I ask that an erudite reporter such as yourself refrain from using the awful term 'if you like'. Your report today was littered with this phrase which implies lack of a basic vocabulary.
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