All part of the service
Final day of campaigning, final thoughts from the political leaders.
Given the polls, each of the parties spotlights the prospect of a hung parliament, either in anticipation or horror.
Here they are, listed for you in a handy paste-and-keep guide. All part of the service.
From Labour's Jim Murphy, a declaration that the choice confronting voters is "between a Labour Prime Minsiter or a Tory Prime Minister."
Mr Murphy argues that "voting for the Liberal Democrats, the SNP or staying at home would hand the keys to Number 10 over to David Cameron."
He advises potential voters: "If you don't stop David Cameron, no one will." Labour, he says, will prioritise the economy, jobs and families.
From Tavish Scott of the Liberal Democrats, disdain for what he calls "the old parties and the old system".
'Do a deal'
Only the Lib Dems, he argues, are offering to fix that system, rather than perpetuate it. In particular, he suggests that support for his party would entail "fairer taxes, green sustainable jobs and cleaned-up politics."
Mr Scott concludes that "real change is coming", advising voters: "Whether you voted Labour or SNP or Conservative last time, vote Liberal Democrat this time."
Alex Salmond of the SNP concludes that "Labour are finished while the Tories are arrogantly saying they can rule with no Scots MPs and the Lib Dems are ready to do a deal with David Cameron".
Restating his campaign theme, he says that "Scotland needs champions, now more than ever before." This, he argues, is particularly vital to protect public services.
Mr Salmond says that only voting SNP will "save Scotland from the worst impact of a Tory or Tory-led government."
From David Mundell of the Conservatives, a warning that "a hung parliament would put economic recovery at risk", threatening fewer jobs and higher mortages.
By contrast, Mr Mundell says that what is required is "a strong and decisive Conservative Government to sort out the mess left by thirteen years of Labour rule".
All night long
The Tories, he says, would help families, protect the most vulnerable, foster business and economic growth while securing Scotland's place in the United Kingdom.
PS: Herewith the plug. BBC Scotland telly coverage of the election - blending full reports and analysis of the UK and Scottish pictures - starts on BBC 1 at 9.55. We're going right through the night. I plan to blog.
BBC Radio Scotland coverage starts at 10pm, running right through to 0600 when it's Good Morning Scotland to 0845, then Call Kaye - and then continuous rolling coverage all day in a Newsdrive Special, pausing only for my Big Debate at 1215.
Watch. Listen. Surf. Enjoy.
I'm 
~RS~q~RS~~RS~z~RS~35~RS~)
Comments
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Brian,
"From Labour's Jim Murphy, a declaration that the choice confronting voters is "between a Labour Prime Minsiter or a Tory Prime Minister.""
For Scotland there is a choice to have a Scottish voice that is against the rule of Scotland from Westminster. That will be my choice. Anyone who believes in Scotland and is sick of the Westminster old school will vote for the SNP. The sooner the union is disbanded the better for Scotland. Independence.
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Given the polls, each of the parties spotlights the prospect of a hung parliament, either in anticipation or horror.
One party will be delighted with a hung parliament.
Newsnet Scotland
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As if we'll be watching it on the BBC, Brian! :) You can't disenfranchise us for three weeks then expect us to tune in like loyal sheep.
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PS: Herewith the plug. BBC Scotland telly coverage of the election
More like a threat the way the BBC in Scotland have behaved.
Newsnet Scotland will be open for instant comments should things be a bit slow here.
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Prediction Time
(as of yesterday) Electoral Calculus predicted 317 Tories, Lab 213, Libdems 88 Nats 11
I think Tories will get 309 seats and probably only win Jim Murphy's Renfrewshire seat in Scotland.
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One last thing:
Guess what little gem has turned up:
It's none other than our long lost friend 'Lost Medical Records'.
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Good news! Therefore it is unlikely that you will read about it in the various Daily Blahs.
What is most amazing is that over a third of Scots are stuck in New Labour's rut.
The poll, with a Scottish sample size of 1,141 over the last week, shows the SNP pulling away in clear second place in Scotland on 25 per cent - up seven points on the party's 2005 Westminster result and the SNP's highest YouGov rating since early March. Labour are on 37 per cent, the LibDems on 22 and the Tories 14.
If the findings were repeated at the polls it would make the SNP the only party to increase its support on the last election, putting the party on track for its largest share of the vote in a Westminster contest in 36 years.
Slainte Mhor
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If only I could place my X for none of the above! Just how many past / present & indeed future captains of industry really have to worry about the mortgage / endownments / pensions / heating / employment / savings / just living / holidays / and load of other materialistic products!
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And the SNP mob go into overdrive!
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BBC Scotland probably the worst public service broadcaster in the world.
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Happy voting, good people of Scotland!
If you want to discuss things through the night, quirkynats is open all hours.
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I wouldn't get to optimistic when you speak to most people they still seem to emit a baaa type sound!
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The Labour party has wrecked the economy, introduced so much security legislation they have fundamentally undermined democracy, legislation they have abused deliberatley to undermine democracy on occassions, actively use the media to subvert democratic discussion and mislead the public, they actively work against Scotland's interests for the benefit of London, they campaign by deliberately lying to people in the street about their policies and the policies of other parties to get elected at all costs. They have had the biggest number of members/councillors and MPs/MSP's being associated with corruption allegations/prosecutions (I could go on!).....
and still Scotland votes for them!
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7. Spagan: "The YouGov poll, with a Scottish sample size of 1,141 over the last week, shows the SNP pulling away in clear second place in Scotland on 25 per cent"
Are you sure?
I read these results:
May 5th: YouGov in the Scotsman this morning. Topline figures are CON 17%, LAB 37%, LDEM 22%, SNP 21%.
Are you now making up opinion polls??
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I suppose I really should have put a link in for my last post:
http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/blog/
Like I say, still showing the LDs in second and not "the SNP are in clear second place" as the nationalists would have us believe!
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9. Reluctant-Expat
To be ignored!
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Minuend wrote : "BBC Scotland probably the worst public service broadcaster in the world."
I assume the "probably" is in there because of their excellent service to the labour party. ;)
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well there we have it
after a month of campaigning what do we have ?
a straight fight between total fear or some HOPE!!
I know what I am voting for
please remember no matter what labour ,tory and their pals in the media would like you to think the only wasted vote ever is the one that is never cast!
Sid.
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Still nothing about who leaked the information about the paths at balmoral and thus endangered the Queen.Not a dicky bird from the BBC.
One can only guess what party this "leaker" came from. And remember Mr Murphy knew nothing.
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Why isnt more being said about the cases of election fraud being investigated? Or the fact that election monitors are going to be scruitinising the election results. This is an utter disgrace and makes a mockery of democracy, which we clearly do not have in the uk. C'mon Brian, this should be getting a mention.
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Reluctant-Expat seems to have gone into overdrive. Maybe she does understand irony after all (see #9).
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2. Online Ed
So will I!
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Reluctant-Expat wrote: "And the SNP mob go into overdrive!"
Do you actually have anything constructive to say regarding Politics? If indeed you don't, please refrain from posting at all.
Your pointless snipes are merely irritating, much like an itch under a stookie!
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"13. At 1:56pm on 05 May 2010, Vakov2000 wrote:
The Labour party has wrecked the economy, introduced so much security legislation they have fundamentally undermined democracy, legislation they have abused deliberatley to undermine democracy on occassions, actively use the media to subvert democratic discussion and mislead the public, they actively work against Scotland's interests for the benefit of London, they campaign by deliberately lying to people in the street about their policies and the policies of other parties to get elected at all costs. They have had the biggest number of members/councillors and MPs/MSP's being associated with corruption allegations/prosecutions (I could go on!).....
and still Scotland votes for them!"
Because of (1) fear of the unknown, (2) folk hatred of the Tories, (3) tradition, (4) believing the lies because it's easier to accept what people say than look at what they're really doing, (5) believing that, because Labour was once a socialist party, it still is one, (6) believing that, because Labour once promised to stand up for Scotland, it will do so now - even though it never has before.
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#9 R-E
the only thing in overdrive is the inane comment generator that is your keyboard.
Brian,
It is very telling that everyone is saying vote for me, except for Murphy who is saying don't vote for them.
I am in excited anticipation, as I cannot tell which way things are going. The SNP appear to be having a surge, though it is not clear whether this will be enough to gain substantial seats. The Lib dems are still on their Clegg high, though that is fading. Ironically this may hand several seats to Labour (eg Glasgow north, where I abide). Generally though the confusion about who is doing well, and who is the challanger may benefit labour most.
The feeling I get most in Scotland is "unseat labour" though it is not as strong as the feeling of getting rid of the conservatives that there was in '92 (remnants of which still remain). People just don't know where to turn.
The Lib dems have run a good campaign, but all that this has done is muddy the water, letting a lot of potential labour scalps escape. There is a core vote of conservatives (I recently discoverred I work beside one) that is remaining fairly constant, but there is no sign of this expanding to any great degree.
As for the labour vote. I honestly do not understand how anyone can vote for them. I can understand voting for old labour, the liberals or the tories. these are principled positions, but new labour is not a political philosophy, it is a private member's club devoted to self enrichment. It is the last chapter of animal farm where the farmyard animals look in on the pigs to see them enjoying their human lifestyles, except in our situation (thanks to the media), the blinds are drawn.
The SNP vote is growing slowly in the teeth of concerted campaign of misdirection from the media and the other parties. I can feel the vote growing, but am not sure how quickly due to the fact that there is no such thing as unbiased or reliable commentary any more (or it is as rare as hens' teeth). I am aware that this feeling of growth may just be my own wishful thinking, but I am also feeling it on the ground (which could also be wishful thinking I suppose). I guess I will know on the early hours of friday morning.
John
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5. "Electoral Calculus predicted 317 Tories, Lab 213, Libdems 88 Nats 11"
Clearly demonstrating the nationalists are dead right when they endlessly claim "the Union is dead!".
Wait, no that's not right...Both nationalist parties combined are only predicted to muster 11 out of a possible 99 seats.
You'd have to be seriously detached from reality to think that just 11 nationalist MPs out of a possible 99 demonstrates a dying Union. No?
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Brian
Will your blog on election night be a blether?
http://scottsrepublic.wordpress.com/
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14. At 2:08pm on 05 May 2010, Reluctant-Expat wrote:
7. Spagan: "The YouGov poll, with a Scottish sample size of 1,141 over the last week, shows the SNP pulling away in clear second place in Scotland on 25 per cent"
Then rambles on until:
"Are you now making up opinion polls??"
I read No 7. The word YouGov doesn't appear in it. You added it and gave it the appearance of a direct quote. How much else may we assume you make up?
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18. I'm going to vote for a party that accepts that spending has to be cut and that we can't continue on this 'tax!-spend!-borrow!-spend more!!' path.
We desperately need to get spending under control and borrowing down.
Yet, astonishingly, there are parties out there who are trying to tell us that we can maintain spending as it is and that we should also be borrowing more.
That is staying on the path that got us in this mess in the first place and is beyond insane.
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Roll up!
Roll up!
Get your Electoral Dysfunction remedies here!
A Hung Parliament ensures true satisfaction every time!
;-)
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R-E
I apologise for, and withdraw my response at 28.
There is a YouGov reference later in the text of 7.
The appearance of a pasted quote mislead me.
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23. Alba4ever, I could ask you much the same question. Are you going to say anything constructive regarding politics or are you just going to repeat the same old, tired SNP propaganda day in-day out, like you and the others on here always do?
Not that it matters.
Clearly, the combined 24/7/365 nationalist effort on multiple blogs has had very little effect. The SNP election campaign ("20 seats"?!) has emulated the independence campaign in being a humiliating nationalist failure.
Sadly for you, we Scots are not as blindly stupid and gullible as nationalism needs us to be.
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Well, well, well!
The Scotsman is being accused of delibrately fudging YouGov polling figures to downplay support for the SNP.
It transpires the 21% figure quoted for the SNP in this morning's Scotsman is actually the combined % figure for SNP AND Plaid Cymru - the nationalist polling in both Scotland and Wales.
Once more in this election the Scottish media stands acused of misleading Scottish voters.
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I wonder when we'll see any of the three princes of darkness in Scotland again after tomorrow?
Will they arrive all smiles in a few months time to announce how big the expenditure cuts will be and how we should be thankful that it is them we voted into power to deliver them?
Or will they let the incumbent Holyrood Government do their dirty work for them and lay the blame at their feet just in time for the run up to the elections next year?
Are we the only country who is feart to let go? The vote tomorrow should be about who is really interestd in the land and people of Scotland. We already know who are not interested - BBC Scotland, the London based media and the three 'main' parties.
I'm no mad nationalist but I'd far rather have a mother who knows me well than a foster mother 400 miles away who only comes home for birthdays.
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14. Reluctant-Expat
I see comments over at Political Polling that the 21% figure is the SNP/PC figure combined and that the actual SNP figure is 25%. I can't find the YouGov table on their website. I don't trust The Scotsman as far as I can throw their whole building so that they have fiddled the figures to advantage another party is very possible.
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Brian,
Re your "I plan to blog", please remember to remind the blog's owner to open it for comments as the polls close so that we can discuss here, otherwise you may be a bit lonely. But thanks for this very broad thread to make comments on almost anything political "on topic" until the polls open.
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20. These "election monitors" are a merely group of young parliamentarians from several Commonwealth nations who are coming to observe the UK election at the invitation of the Royal Commonwealth Society!
As usual, you nationalists totally misunderstood.
PRESS RELEASE: The Royal Commonwealth Society and Commonwealth Parliamentary Association UK are delighted to announce the impending arrival of their Observation Team to the UK General Election. 11 Observers, all from Commonwealth countries, will arrive in the UK on Sunday 2nd May.
This is the first time that a Commonwealth team has observed elections in a developed country. The observers will be taking advantage of a recent change in UK law which will allow them into polling stations for the very first time.
The 11 Observers will include young Parliamentarians from 7 Commonwealth countries, plus 4 civil society democracy delegates. (See below for more details.) The Observation Team will:
- gain insight into the electoral processes of the UK - share lessons from their own countries - make recommendations for improvement
The participants will be in the UK from Sunday 2 May until Sunday 9 May. Their programme will include:
- briefings from key political organizations - several days shadowing prospective candidates in constituencies around England and Scotland - observing polling stations and the count - submitting a final report.
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Brian,
OTOH, why no thread on the FMQs just finished? I would grant that it was more like a series of PEBs than usual, but there were still individual performances on which to comment, with dour Iain Gray aiming for new lows, it seemed, both in his personal performance and his party's vote.
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Odd that YouGov have not yet put the details of their recent poll for the Hootsmon on their website. The numbers quoted in the David Maddox article looked less than wonderful for the SNP, so you would expect them to want it in the public domain PDQ. If it's not available tonight there must be some detail which the Hootsmon would rather we didn't get to know before the polls open.
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#8. At 1:26pm on 05 May 2010, redrobb wrote:"If only I could place my X for none of the above! Just how many past / present & indeed future captains of industry really have to worry about the mortgage / endownments / pensions / heating / employment / savings / just living / holidays / and load of other materialistic products!.
Not many I would think, except those who went bust. But look on the bright side. All those, (mainly Labour in Scotland), MPs who lose their seats will be very well off with their severance pay and Westminster pensions to add to all the expenses they already ripped off. They won't ever need to bother with their core voters ever again -as if they ever did.
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26. Reluctant-Expat
"You'd have to be seriously detached from reality to think that just 11 nationalist MPs out of a possible 99 "
represent anything except Tactical voting. *shrug*
But we do know you have problems with concepts like that so ... carry on with your blithering.
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#12. At 1:44pm on 05 May 2010, Vakov2000 wrote:"I wouldn't get to optimistic when you speak to most people they still seem to emit a baaa type sound!",.
Power to the sheeple!
Bah!
Err! I mean Baa!
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#7 spagan
"SNP's highest YouGov rating since early March"
Yes, saw that this morning and the best since YouGov changed their weightings, I think.
#14 Reluctant-Expat &
#15 Reluctant-Expat
A different YouGov poll with a different sample size to the one in the Hootsmon.
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14. Reluctant-Expat
Wilfully misquoting another contributor is both dishonest and despicable.
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28. WestCountryScot: "I read No 7. The word YouGov doesn't appear in it. You added it and gave it the appearance of a direct quote. How much else may we assume you make up?"
Look again...
"The poll, with a Scottish sample size of 1,141 over the last week, shows the SNP pulling away in clear second place in Scotland on 25 per cent - up seven points on the party's 2005 Westminster result and the SNP's highest YouGov rating since early March."
Now compare with the REAL polling figures on UKPollingReport:
"There is a final Scottish poll from YouGov in the Scotsman this morning. Topline figures are CON 17%, LAB 37%, LDEM 22%, SNP 21%."
Nationalists demonstrating an inability to comprehend clear English as well as being caught in the act fabricating polls. Oh dear!
Thank you for posting.
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29. Reluctant-Expat
"Yet, astonishingly, there are parties out there who are trying to tell us that we can maintain spending as it is and that we should also be borrowing more."
Identify the party and provide the appropriate citation.
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29. Reluctant-Expat
"Yet, astonishingly, there are parties out there who are trying to tell us that we can maintain spending as it is"
Then you will no doubt vote SNP since the IMF says that the three London parties are hiding their proposed cuts while the SNP has been very vocal about wanting to cut Trident, cut ID Cards, cut the House of Lords, cut the SoS for Scotland, and other wasteful programs.
Glad to know you've finally come to your sense.
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#14. At 2:08pm on 05 May 2010, Reluctant-Expat wrote:"7. Spagan: "Are you now making up opinion polls??".
Doesn't everyone?
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#14 oh!!! there is a surprise RE caught telling porkies, tut tut
RE caught manipulating others posts, who would have thunk it.
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31. WestCountryScot
"R-E
I apologise for, and withdraw my response at 28.
There is a YouGov reference later in the text of 7.
The appearance of a pasted quote mislead me."
The problem is that YouGov has not posted the table on this survey. There are accusations that The Scotsman combined the PC % with the SNP % in order to come to what would be to them a more desireable outcome. While it isn't something I would put past The Scotsman, I don't know.
This may or may not be true. Until YouGov posts the figures which they are very slow doing for some reason (not just this poll--they've been slow for the past week), we won't know.
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#29
"Yet, astonishingly, there are parties out there who are trying to tell us that we can maintain spending as it is."
As far as I'm aware the four main parties in Scotland are all accepting cuts in principle. The argument is over what gets cut, when, and how much. The SNP's position is that we should cut Trident and ID cards, amongst other things, rather than health and education.
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15. Reluctant-Expat
Weekly aggregate of YouGov polling here
http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2010/05/05/hows-your-region-changed-since-050505/
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Good of Brian to to give us a strict comparision between UK coverage and Scottish coverage from the BBC
"BBC Scotland telly coverage of the election - blending full reports and analysis of the UK
and
Scottish pictures"
I hope they are nice pictures.
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Well! It's like this - I cannot be bothered debating the merits of these opinionated Poll figures. To my mind the only poll that matters is the undemocratic, stacked and fixed one that starts tomorrow.
We cannot have a democratically elected government when we have three countries with different levels of devolved government and one, not devolved, that hold both the purse strings and the real power. A good stiff dose of another unionist government making cuts in Scotland should see something startling in the Scottish Elections exactly one year hence tomorrow.
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I have it on good authority that a certain large local authority is preventing it's employees from viewing Newsnet Scotland.
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33 & 35. Those 'comments accusing the Scotsman of fudging polls' were left by you nationalists! I have just seen them on UK Polling Report too!
LOL!
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33. minuend
"Well, well, well!
The Scotsman is being accused of delibrately fudging YouGov polling figures to downplay support for the SNP.
It transpires the 21% figure quoted for the SNP in this morning's Scotsman is actually the combined % figure for SNP AND Plaid Cymru - the nationalist polling in both Scotland and Wales.
Once more in this election the Scottish media stands acused of misleading Scottish voters.
"
So it would seem. Frankly, The Scotsman readership is so low it's doubtful they can do much harm anyway.
I won't absolutely accuse them of that until the YouGov publishes their figures and for some reason--no YouGov figures on the YouGov website for this poll.
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The outcome of this election is totally unpredictable, which is what makes it the most interesting and exciting election for decades.
There's only one prediction that can safely be made. However many percentage points the SNP vote increases by, or however many seats they win, Reluctant-Expat will be here to tell us it proves that Scots don't want independence.
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14 Relaxed Pattie
My post at 7 is absolutely accurate - not eh misleading propaganda version issued by the Sotsman this morning.
You didn't really expect the MSM to publish any good news stories that would illustrate the growing support for the SNP.
The last thing our wee country needs is another 5 years of Westminster focusing on what London needs.
Slainte Mhor
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"I'd far rather have a mother who knows me well than a foster mother 400 miles away who only comes home for birthdays."
I don't know of another country on the planet that continously votes for a neighbouring country to run all of it's affairs! Only in Scotland!
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37. Reluctant-Expat
Rather than misunderstanding, this is a responce to s desperate need:
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danielhannan/100037883/the-rules-on-postal-voting-must-be-changed/
We have degenerated to the point of being no better than a banana republic and are in desperate need of international survellence. For once, I do agree with you. This is not what is occurring but that is not something to be happy about.
This election is already a shambles.
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7. spagan
"The poll, with a Scottish sample size of 1,141 over the last week, shows the SNP pulling away in clear second place in Scotland on 25 per cent - up seven points on the party's 2005 Westminster result and the SNP's highest YouGov rating since early March."
Where is that published? YouGov is holding up on publishing their tables it would seem--at least on Scottish results. One wonders why. Amazing that Welsh and UK polls from the same period are up.
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43. Ah, didn't realise the Scotsman ordered two YouGov polls on the same day covering the same topics and questions.
That makes far more sense...
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45. Reluctant-Expat
"Nationalists demonstrating an inability to comprehend clear English as well as being caught in the act fabricating polls. Oh dear!"
A frequent problem with you BritNats. Perhaps a remedial course will help.
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Did anybody watch FMQs? Does anybody know what Gray was trying to do? Looked to me as if his bosses in London had ordered him to steer well clear of anything that might be an issue in the UK parliamentary election.
Like many people, I suspect, I have often puzzled over what qualities Gray possesses to qualify him for the position he holds, ie Pretendy Wee Leader of the Pretendy Scottish Labour Party. Today it dawned on me what essential characteristic fits Gray for this role.
Fawning obedience!
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<RICHPOST><a href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/briantaylor/2010/05/all_part_of_the_service.html#P95746378">52. BlooToon</a><BR />"<i>Weekly aggregate of YouGov polling here<BR /><BR />[Unsuitable/Broken URL removed by Moderator]<BR /><BR />Good figures for the SNP. Thanks for the link.<BR /><BR />Since I can't foresee a change before the voting tomorrow (in fact, of course they will contain a fair % of cast mail ballots) this gives a good idea what to expect!<BR /><BR />Not as good as I would have hoped but good nonetheless.<BR /> </RICHPOST>
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31. WestCountryScot
"I apologise for, and withdraw my response at 28."
Don't! [url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/profile.shtml?userid=7972880]Reluctant-Expat[/url] deliberately misquoted a genuine contributor. That is unaccepatable.
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A pipe dream?
I wonder.
Slainte
Cash
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45. Reluctant-Expat
"28. WestCountryScot: "I read No 7. The word YouGov doesn't appear in it. You added it and gave it the appearance of a direct quote. How much else may we assume you make up?"
Look again...
"The poll, with a Scottish sample size of 1,141 over the last week, shows the SNP pulling away in clear second place in Scotland on 25 per cent - up seven points on the party's 2005 Westminster result and the SNP's highest YouGov rating since early March."
Now compare with the REAL polling figures on UKPollingReport:
"There is a final Scottish poll from YouGov in the Scotsman this morning. Topline figures are CON 17%, LAB 37%, LDEM 22%, SNP 21%."
Nationalists demonstrating an inability to comprehend clear English as well as being caught in the act fabricating polls. Oh dear!
Thank you for posting."
Apology awaited, R-E.
http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2010/05/05/hows-your-region-changed-since-050505/
Scotland
Tory 14 (-2)
Labour 37 (-2)
LibDem22 (-1)
SNP 25 (+7)
Change shown from 2005. Funny thing, which one--and only one--shows an increase from 2005?
[Unsuitable/Broken URL removed by Moderator]
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#45 your're oh so quick to condemn the SNP and those who vote for the SNP expat.........since it is quite obvious you won't be voting SNP tomorrow are YOU man enough to tell us who your allegiences will lay with tomorrow or are you a CHICKEN.....cluck cluck.
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52. BlooToon
"Weekly aggregate of YouGov polling here
http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2010/05/05/hows-your-region-changed-since-050505/"
That looks a bit more realistic. As you know, I usually refrain from discussing polls as I lack the required anorak. But something just didn't seem right about the YouGov figures being trumpeted by The Scotsman. I fully expect the SNP to suffer from the massive media campaign mounted against them. But I also expected this to be countered to a considerable extent by the party's record in office at Holyrood.
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http://www.politicshome.com/uk/article/8763/the_view_from_the_regions_4_may_2010.html
A link to the Politics Home site with the original of that aggregate poll.
Take a look at Scotland and you will find something that the table of it at Political Betting did not show (because it wasn't showing the weekly figure).
There was a 4% surge in SNP support in the last week!
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20. At 2:27pm on 05 May 2010, Megz wrote:
"Why isnt more being said about the cases of election fraud being investigated? Or the fact that election monitors are going to be scruitinising the election results. This is an utter disgrace and makes a mockery of democracy, which we clearly do not have in the uk. C'mon Brian, this should be getting a mention."
Channel 4 Dispatches programme covered the visit of the inspectors to investigate the election and Channel 4 news last night ran a longish story about the postal voting scams. They even sent one of their reporters round the doors in a London constituency to investigate the numbers registered as staying there. One flat had 11 peopleregistered to vote at that address another had eleven.
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69. GrannieAnne
For some reason the moderators consider Politics Home to be an inappropriate site.
Now I wonder why. A simple search will turn them up or you can take my word for it. Anyway, the SNP had a 4% surge in support in the last week according to the YouGov aggragate.
http://www.politicshome.com/uk/article/8763/the_view_from_the_regions_4_may_2010.html
I'll try again with the link because there is nothing inappropriate about it.
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70. InMyKip
"#45 your're oh so quick to condemn the SNP and those who vote for the SNP expat.........since it is quite obvious you won't be voting SNP tomorrow are YOU man enough to tell us who your allegiences will lay with tomorrow or are you a CHICKEN.....cluck cluck."
Nah. I'm betting he doesn't have the bottle to nail his colours to the pole.
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67. Electric Hermit: "Don't! Reluctant-Expat deliberately misquoted a genuine contributor. That is unaccepatable!! Banana!!"
I did?
Where?
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Today's Daily Telegraph front page story about the Tories maybe going into coalition with the DUP (likely 9 MPs)if they need more MPs to put them over the top. Likely price tag for DUP support: 200 million pounds which the Tories will not cut from the NI budget as part of their overall cuts. Also suggests some DUP MPs might be given ministerial posts.
Now who said small parties were irrelevant in Parliament?
Should Scotland not have champions like the DUP to protect them from cuts by supporting the party in power on an issue by issue case?
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#63 Reluctant-Expat
"43. Ah, didn't realise the Scotsman ordered two YouGov polls on the same day covering the same topics and questions."
They didn't and my #43 made no suggestion that they did.
"That makes far more sense..."
Whilst you make less and less. If you were more up-front about your grief that the Blue Tweedles look unlikely to have things all their own way, your rantings would be better understood - perhaps even forgiven on occasion.
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69. Ah, the 'aggregate' poll finally surfaces!
As pointed out elsewhere, when the SNP have been consistently polling 19-23%, how come this 'aggregate' poll now has them on 25%?
The polls:
YG consolidated poll for week ending 18 Apr:
C17, L39, LD20, SNP20, Oth5
YG consolidated poll for week ending 25 Apr:
C14, L36, LD25, SNP21, Oth4
YG in Scotland on 2 May gave:
C17, L37,LD22, SNP20, Oth4
Populus on 1 May:
C16, L37, LD24, SNP 19, Oth4
TNS BMRB in the Scottish Mail on 2May gave:
C13, Lab44, LD16, SNP23. Oth4
YG in Scotland on 5 May (above) gives:
C17, L37, LD22, SNP21, Oth3
YG consolidated poll for week ending 2 May:
C14, L37, LD22, SNP25, Oth2
Since when has an average been higher than all it's components?
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74. GrannieAnne
"I'll try again with the link because there is nothing inappropriate about it."
I've put the figures up here. Although there's no way of knowing if that link will be acceptable or not.
I'm not into dissecting polls. But this aggregate one seems more valid than most.
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Ah, a social life beckons.
Well, many thanks for playing, everyone, and I shall see you on the other side!
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
There's little left to say about the State of the Union or Scotland's place within it because it's quite clear, to me, that we have no place. In the eyes of a corrupt British Establishment, powered by graft and greed, we are worthless and irrelevant - untermenschen!
It's often said that the UK shows its contempt for us by treating Scotland as a region rather than a nation. Scotland should be so lucky! We would, I think, be better described as the inhabitants of a reservation.
Now, having already perverted our democracy, New Labour urges docile injuns to debase themselves by carrying Labour's dishonesty and dishonour to the ballot box. Don't vote for Custer, vote for the mule that will carry his corpse to glory! Labour is renowned for its cynical abuse of public trust but it still comes as a bit of a shock when its announced with such fanfare!
Who issued this clarion-call to prolong the rancid rule of a wholly discredited and utterly shameless political party? Ed Balls! Mr Balls assures us that only New Labour can guarantee a 'Future Fair for All'.
We must tighten our belts, put our shoulders to the wheel and dig for Britain! Unfortunately, there will never be enough notches on our belts, the wheels have fallen off the Westminster wagon and the hole that they dug for us breeched the sewer that had, until recently, kept the foul evidence of their corruption from the public gaze. Ask any of the Westminster millionaires why we should pay for their incompetence, greed and criminality and they'll tell you that we're all in this together. Isn't it amazing, how easily the responsibility slides from the shoulders of the guilty onto the backs of the innocent? We've fallen on hard times and all must share the pain, they say. Does that sound fair? Let's take a look at the New Labour notion of fairness as applied in the case of Ed 'Golden' Balls!
In 2007/08 Ed Balls and his wife Yvette Cooper enjoyed joint salaries of almost £300,000. They topped that pittance up with another £300,000, give or take a few quid, in expenses. They managed that by successfully claiming that their London residence was their second home. They lived in London, worked in London and sent their children to school in London. She was at the Treasury and he was the Minister responsible for the well-being of children.
While they were enjoying a joint income of almost £600,000, courtesy of the great unwashed, four million children were living in poverty and going hungry. The Golden Balls children were quite rich and were never likely to suffer hardship but that didn't stop their parents from claiming £600 a month for food, just in case!
It's the New Labour Way!
I'm deeply dismayed by the suggestion that any of us should mimic their dishonesty and disrespect for the democratic process by giving our votes to anyone other than the candidate whose case we support. I live in a constituency where the SNP is unlikely to win but I won't be giving my vote to anyone other than the person who best represents my interests. I'd have to be mad to favour any of the Unionist parties who seek to silence and disenfranchise me. I've pledged my support to the SNP and, if the fates allow, I'd like to breathe the free air of an independent Scotland before I shuffle off. Until one or other of these events comes to pass, my vote is a non-negotiable bond.
To my mind, tactical voting is dishonest and cowardly. It confirms our subordination to Westminster's liars, thieves and fraudsters. How could anyone surrender something so precious? No Tory, Labour or LibDem MP, regardless of origin, will ever serve Scotland's interests. We've watched them squirm, wriggle, stutter, stammer and choke to summon up spit for the weasel words that justify the abandonment of any sense of duty or moral responsibility to the people who elect them! Voting for them may confirm their view that you're irrelevant but, in my view, it's much worse than that. When you lend support to the quilty, you become their willing accomplices!
What the Westminster parties have done is often described as a betrayal but they haven't betrayed Scotland. They're contempt for us has been consistent throughout. Our English neighbours are mere novitiates in the school of political hard knocks. I'll let them decide whether or not they've been betrayed by the politicians that they elect to govern all of us. I don't, however, expect them to dwell long upon how their votes affect anyone but themselves. The Scots, Welsh and Irish tribes should, we're told, count themselves lucky to have what the English electorate has been taught to believe that they give us!
To my mind, there can be no reconciliation with the despicable individuals and agencies who took part in the criminal conspiracy. Anyone who would consider voting to re-elect those who have participated in, overseen or simply acquiesced to the dishonest, disloyal and criminal conduct of those who cling to the tit of the lang syne barren 'Mother of Parliaments' is, quite simply, mentally and morally deficient!
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78. Brownedov
"If you were more up-front about your grief that the Blue Tweedles look unlikely to have things all their own way..."
The YouGov Regional Aggregates don't look at all cheering for the Blue Tweedles. Seems Clegg may have been the fly in the ointment.
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All Part Of The Service.
Two wishes and one observation:
1. Ochil and South Perthshire to the S.N.P. as it's my home turf.
2. A balanced parliament.
3. Reluctant Ex Pat is an anagram of Expel Tartan Cut
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#70,#81 as I thought expat you are CHICKEN
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International Observers. There are two teams of observers and if my memory of the programme is correct one is from the Commonwealth because they interviewed one of the organisers. In the Dispatches programme one of the Observers interviewed had been involved in monitoring elections in Iraq and Haiti. The Channel 4 programme, unfortunately, is not yet available on 4oD.
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What was actually written -
7. spagan
"The poll, with a Scottish sample size of 1,141 over the last week, shows the SNP pulling away in clear second place in Scotland on 25 per cent"
Your deliberate misquote -
14. Reluctant-Expat
"7. Spagan: "The YouGov poll, with a Scottish sample size of 1,141 over the last week, shows the SNP pulling away in clear second place in Scotland on 25 per cent""
Emphasis added as an aid to the hard of thinking.
When you identify a source and put quotes on the text then you had better make sure you have copied that text verbatim. To deliberately alter text while presenting it as a quotation is dishonest and despicable. There are no trivial instances of such dishonesty.
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#76 Reluctant-Expat
""Don't! Reluctant-Expat deliberately misquoted a genuine contributor. That is unaccepatable!! Banana!!"
I did? Where?"
Yes. In #14, viz:
#7 spagan
"The poll, with a Scottish sample size of 1,141 over the last week, shows the SNP ..."
vs
#14 Reluctant-Expat
"7. Spagan: "The YouGov poll, with a Scottish sample size of 1,141 over the last week, shows the SNP ...""
Not exactly Goebbellian lies but quite enough to show that neither you nor your "quotes" can be trusted.
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79. Reluctant-Expat
Where is your source stating that the polls you refer to are the ones which were used for the aggregate?
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79. Reluctant-Expat
Alas your understanding of polling is as limited as your understanding of Government finance.
You used to post tables from A-Level textbooks to support your arguments on deficit, and you didn't even understand those.
Now to point in you the right direction, look at the words "aggregate" and "components", then strip out from your list those polls which aren't components.
Once you've done that, then look at the Politics Home description why they use aggregated data, and then strip out the remaining post in your list which isn't a component either.
Once you have learned to stop comparing apples and pears (or more appropriately for a Tory, bananas), I might transfer you from Foundation to General.
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#79 Reluctant-Expat
"Since when has an average been higher than all it's components?"
It isn't. It may be the YouGov daily polling for the Sun reweighted to YouGov's revised Scottish weightings, but whatever it is it will be only data collected by YouGov and not other pollsters.
If you cannot comprehend that you are even less statistically savvy than the rest of us thought.
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72. GrannieAnne
Let me remind R-E (and any lurkers) that Politics Home has no connection to and no support of the SNP. This aggregate poll simply reflects what YouGov has reported.
I happen to have the personal opinion that there is higher SNP support and lower Labour support than this poll indicates, but that may be wishful thinking on my part. We'll see. We will see very soon. And then on to Holyrood and the election that really matters to Scotland!
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BNP leaflet to black Christian voters branded 'obscene'
Neo-Nazis compiling lists of people defined by race and/or religion. Anybody else not entirely relaxed about this?
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77. cwh
"Today's Daily Telegraph front page story about the Tories maybe going into coalition with the DUP (likely 9 MPs)if they need more MPs to put them over the top. Likely price tag for DUP support: 200 million pounds which the Tories will not cut from the NI budget as part of their overall cuts. Also suggests some DUP MPs might be given ministerial posts.
Now who said small parties were irrelevant in Parliament?
Should Scotland not have champions like the DUP to protect them from cuts by supporting the party in power on an issue by issue case? "
We had better because you can bet neither the Tories nor the DUP will support Scotland's interests. And the Feeble Fifty showed LONG AGO how much we can expect from Labour in this situation.
How can we now expect Labour to protect us against Cameron? We can't!
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Ok Ok could any of you unionists out their please explain to me why the Act of Union should be continued. All I hear from you is
1.Scotland does well out of the union! In what way?
2.We are to small to matter! Why does size matter?
3.We are stronger together! Please demonstrate why!
4.It would cost us more to be independent. Is that such a big deal?
While considering your answer please mull over the following.
On a recent overnight drive to the south coast of England I made a quick calculation based on the numbers of road planers, workmen, trucks 360 diggers, men asphalt and lighting I saw busily working away over the length of the road, between Manchester and Birmingham. From what I observed, more money is being spent on road reconstruction/repairs on the M6 IN ONE NIGHT than is spent on SCOTLAND'S roads in a whole year!
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83. albamac
I agree with your take on tactical voting, each must vote for who they think will represent their views in Parliament in the best way.
However this is not an easy decision in this election. I can not remember an election campaign where so little respect for the voters has been shown.
Each of the three main political parties has continually lied to us re the scale of cuts that await us.
The SNP are in denial that cuts are required at all. All together there has been no meaningful debate on the key issue. None at all.
So for many the choice will simply be not to vote at all. Amongst all the predictions the only one I feel can be made with any certainty is that the turn out will be down again.
None of them have learnt the lesson of the expenses fiasco. They are all carrying on like it never happened and the electorate are just plain stupid.
Not exactly likely to lead to a renewal of democracy.
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94. Electric Hermit
I don't like it, but I must admit someone might trawl the registry and pick out my name as Scottish and target me for something. Of course, they might or might not be right in other cases. I'm not sure how wise it is to make assumptions because someone's name looks 'African'. Can you then assume they are in fact African or in fact Christian as this leaflet apparently does?
I think that the BNP has the right to put its message out there and I don't see any accusation that they had access to anything except names.
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May I suggest you should all log into Kaye on Radio Scotland and listen to what Gray had to say and what staunch Labour supporters had to say to him,the best one being that if a dog ran across the the road and caused an accident he would blame the SNP for it,splutter well,well not a very happy man was our Gray.
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97. northhighlander
"The SNP are in denial that cuts are required at all."
Why say something that is so blatantly untrue? The SNP has consistently said that cuts are required and was criticised today in the FMQ by the LibDem of all people(!) who are calling for unspecified cuts themselves.
You may not agree with the SNP cuts, but they are CERTAINLY calling for cuts. Which is it you oppose? Getting rid of the HoL? Getting rid of the Scottish raj? Getting rid of Trident? Getting rid of the ID card scheme?
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97. northhighlander wrote
"The SNP are in denial that cuts are required at all." That certainly scans well as a unionist soundbite or your personal opinion but it's not actually true now is it?
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97. northhighlander
"The SNP are in denial that cuts are required at all."
I guess it's true. If you repeat a lie often enough then you're sure to find somebody daft enough to believe it. Here in the real world, the SNP has been the only party to acknowledge the true extent of the coming cuts. While the recent Institute of Fiscal Studies report revealed that the Tweedles were concealing up 87% of their proposed cuts.
One of the reasons there has been such a desperate effort by the establishment parties to keep Alex Salmond et al off media stage is that they were iterating a message that resonates with every sane person in the UK, never mind Scotland. They ask whether it can be justified that hundreds of millions of pounds be squandered on WMD and other useless "prestige" projects while cutting services that vulnerable people rely on.
None of the Tweedles have an answer to this question. In fact, they do not even acknowledge that anyone has a right to ask it.
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Gordon Brown to put in a late night appearance at a 'mass rally' for the party faithful in Summerhill, Dumfries at 10 pm.
This is obviously not a sign of desperation as the Labour vote collapses. Rumours of frighteningly low postal returns are no confirmation of signs of a surge from soft Labour votes to the SNP in an attempt to keep out the Tories. Reports of the Labour party in Dumfries being 'deeply offended' by comments made by me are as yet unsubstantiated. For those interested I have a most splendid photograph of the typical Dumfries Labour voter at the above titled cheesy blog.
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I would suggest thst YouGov, having produced by "weighting" polls designed to suggest SNP support collapsing, are now covering their back because there is no real evidence that there is a collapse of any real significance of SNP support.
I expect SNP to poll in the high twenties.
If however YouGov are still using the weighting which provided a false dip in SNP support I wouldn't be surprised if SNP and Labour are very close in votes cast across the country on Thursday
If Labour however polls 37%, as YouGov would have us believe they are likely to do, I will knit a meringue.
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
#97
Since the start of this campaign the SNP have repeatedly said there are huge cuts coming which the UK parties are denying so obviously you haven't been paying attention
In fact Alex Salmond made that very point very forcefully and to considerable applause on QT.
What the SNP is saying is that an SNP bloc will vote for protection for Scotland from disproportionate cuts which would be Westminster's first impulse. Tax the colonies and favour the mother country.
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As I don't wish to fall foul of the moderator that would be the blog titled 'universality of cheese'. Lovely photograph. I'll be making them available as souvenir T-Shirt's for those nostalgic for a trip down Labour madness, in a few years time...
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103. universality of cheese
"Reports of the Labour party in Dumfries being 'deeply offended' by comments made by me are as yet unsubstantiated."
Dear UoC, your very existence offends them. So does mine, for that matter. The more offended the better!
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I've been trying to persuade one of my sons to move back to Scotland from the USA where he's been working in a high tech industry for five years.
So I really need to understand why Scotland would vote Labour and so reward Brown for his astonishing mismanagement of the economy so that I can reassure him that Scotland has grown up and is on its way to an economic and industrial revival.
Can anyone help?
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Did Iain Gray really call respndents to the National Conversation as
"Braveheart bedroom bloggers".
It's amazing, but I don't think they realise just why their support is disappearing year after year.
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108. At 7:26pm on 05 May 2010, GrannieAnne wrote:
Grannie Annie, I'm astounded at their attack today. You would think that with a few hours to go before polling they might have better things to do than attack me...Truly the writing is on the wall.
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Jon Snow and Alex Salmond and the old questions – and insults...
"The First Minister is amused but patient, as always, and gives the same consistent answers he has given throughout the campaign...."
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97. northhighlander
Not surprising that that is your conclusion. This has been a media election, with the agenda set by the TV networks, not the parties - and certainly not the electorate!
The Scottish Government accelerated the publication of the Goudie Report that Scotland could face a loss of up to £35 billion based on a likely cut at UK level of £370bn in public spending over the next 15 years.
As Salmond noted “This is like an iceberg, and we are debating only the small portion above the surface. When I have tried to raise these figures, the other parties have been in denial.”
What people need to consider are the priorities of the various parties, and the SNP position is quite clear that the UK should stop prioritising spending on things we don't need - like Trident - and prioritise spending on the services that people need.
The SNP slogan was "More Nats : Less Cuts" - not no cuts.
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111. universality of cheese
"Grannie Annie, I'm astounded at their attack today. You would think that with a few hours to go before polling they might have better things to do than attack me...Truly the writing is on the wall."
You'd think that Iain Gray would have had something better to blether on about today in the FMQ than "Bravehead bedroom bloggers". Dearie me, what DID we do to deserve such a parcel of gits in our poor suffering nation?
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I tend to lurk rather than post on this blog and I've observed a steady decline in the Unionist debate to a level that one can only now describe as desperate. Why? Do you believe you have lost the arguement?
The cybernats have been tenacious, logical, truthful and unerringly positive.
The unionists have lost the arguement on here and helped make up the minds on lurkers to vote positively for parties that put Scotland first.
The one poster who has done more damage to the unionist cause than any other has to have been 'Reluctant Expat'.
If RE doesn't like it here then could I suggest that he/she/they[check the IP address!] anagramatically support the Private Finance Initiative looking to restore an old Roman road - the P.F.I Foss. I suggest they take that long road to nowhere and give us all some peace.
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109. Wee-Scamp
"So I really need to understand why Scotland would vote Labour... "
If you find an answer to that question then I know a great many people would be grateful for the insight. Not least myself. It certainly isn't a rational choice based on the evidence of recent decades. The comfort of the familiar? Fear of change? Simple habit?
I could understand it better if there was not a viable alternative. But we have in the SNP a party that retains and develops all the principles and aspirations that once drew people to the Labour movement. Indeed, in many ways, the SNP is what the British Labour Party might have become but for the disastrously destructive intervention of Blair's NuLabour project. To see a progressive, left-of-centre, social democratic party shunned by a large part of its natural constituency is perplexing and disappointing in equal measure.
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110. Online Ed
"Did Iain Gray really call respndents to the National Conversation as
"Braveheart bedroom bloggers"."
He did. And he actually seemed quite proud of it. Must be one of his own lines rather than the script his boss, Murphy, feeds to him. Even the dire, "More Nats, Less Cuts" looks good next to Gray's sad efforts. At least it doesn't seek to denigrate and vilify the very people whose votes are being sought.
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Something worth reading if you have or you haven't made up your mind whom to vote for:
I kick men's asses, and I vote
'...And that's why I oppose all calls for tactical voting. Where possible, it's best to vote for what you believe in, otherwise you perpetuate the 'two-horse race' with a pair of nags you didn't really like, the same Hobson's Choice that exasperated you when you looked at the last results. There might be hundreds, perhaps even thousands of people who believe as you do, but vote for something else simply on the strength of a bar chart. Not this time. If you believe in a party, in a policy, or if you simply believe that out of the choice you have, one party's views are closest to your own, then vote for it. With the outcome as uncertain as it is, and a worldwide climate as grim as it is, we need a clear bedrock of principle on which to build a programme. That doesn't mean that we need a clear majority. It does mean that we need candidates whose presence is derived from concrete policies rather than the performance of their party in 2005. We need belief, not barcharts....'
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101. GrassyKnollington et al
I genuinely have been very turned off by the whole election debate. I did watch the tv debates. Alec Salmond argued on that night for a growth strategy as opposed to cuts. The few cuts he offered were Trident and ID cards, which I think all sensible people agree are not required, but equally all sensible people agree that the scale of savings over the next three years are a drop in the ocean of what's required. The trident figure is something like 8 billion over the next 3 years. A contribution but a very small one. Where are the real cuts going to come?
So no he is no more honest than the rest. His point seemed clearly to be that better to grow the economy than cut services. He really was in denial that Scotland needed to shoulder any part of the future cuts.
So at least be honest. He was playing politics as much as the other jokers. He was no different. The electorate are getting more and more turned off by this rubbish. I want to see a little honesty and when I decide tomorrow, I will decide on the basis of who I feel has told the least amount of lies. Might as well draw lots.
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113. oldnat
"This has been a media election, with the agenda set by the TV networks, not the parties..."
Not quite with you on that. The agenda was initially set by the London-based, establishment parties. The rigged TV "debates" were intended to serve that agenda by excluding and marginalising all alternative parties. It was the Tory/BLP managers who laid down the rules. What they failed to realise was the power that they were placing in the hands of the media.
Needless to say, having been given the ball, the media are now making the play. And it is going to be very difficult to win back that ball. The establishment parties will not want to do these TV debates again now that they realise they cannot wholly control them. But the media will hound them with accusations of cowardice and refusal to face the electorate.
That genie ain't going back in the bottle without a fight.
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113. oldnat
He has also argued that growth is a realistic option to cuts. Surely even you can see that this position and the way he represented it was less than honest?
The SNP have played the media in the same way as the rest. Shown the same contempt for the electorate.
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119 North Highlander.
''Alec Salmond argued on that night for a growth strategy as opposed to cuts.''
Simply not true, the same accusation was put today at FMQs by Tavish Scott,it may be of some interest to you to visit Democracy Live and view the detailed response put by Salmond.
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121. northhighlander
"He has also argued that growth is a realistic option to cuts."
No, what he has said is that cuts should not applied in such a way that they would prevent growth. We should cut things that "do not matter" and a list is given of those "things that do not matter" and that should be cut.
That is quite a different thing than saying there should be no cuts which you are saying is his proposal.
So if you oppose the SNP cuts, make an argument for continuing the blatantly undemocratic, useless and wasteful House of Lords.
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#115. At 8:18pm on 05 May 2010, gunnergoz wrote:" I suggest they take that long road to nowhere and give us all some peace."
Right on the button. Nothing has been debateable due to the constant name calling, sheer lies and deliberate disruption by the Unionists. It is a strange effect to observe the religious like, "I believe", type blind faith that no power on Earth seems able to change.
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119. northhighlander
"The few cuts he offered were Trident and ID cards, which I think all sensible people agree are not required"
So we can exclude Labour and Tory leaders from "all sensible people". Both continue to urge more expenditure on Trident. Presumably, you don't want to vote for parties whose leaders are, on your own definition, not "sensible".
That leaves you with a choice between the LDs and the SNP.
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119. northhighlander
"He really was in denial that Scotland needed to shoulder any part of the future cuts."
This seems to be an article of faith with you. Faith - belief which is only reinforced by contrary evidence - is notoriously impervious to reason.
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120. Electric Hermit
"The rigged TV "debates" were intended to serve that agenda by excluding and marginalising all alternative parties. It was the Tory/BLP managers who laid down the rules. What they failed to realise was the power that they were placing in the hands of the media."
I don't disagree with you on that. I'm sure that you noted out of all the questions that politicians could have been asked, all three of the networks chose questions on immigration. Now, I'm aware that this is an important issue for people in certain areas of England, but for all three broadcasters to ask questions on it, gave it an importance that it simply lacks.
In so doing they went for an issue that will reduce social cohesion in England, and emphasise some mythical racist basis for Englishness/Britishness. Give the media power like the Lab/Con/LD alliance have done and England (for this was an English election) will become a much more unpleasant place.
They are our nearest neighbours and friends. This matters.
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#121 "The SNP have played the media in the same way as the rest. Shown the same contempt for the electorate."
Nonsense!
The Media have played you, and you now know it.
There is only one Scottish party, the rest are Aliens to this country, and will extract what they can from us for their country. Your support for them is much the same as the typical turkey voting for christmas.
Stop the denial and wake up, we are being robbed.
You are standing idly by and letting it happen.
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125. oldnat
I am not going to vote for either Labour or Tory. I am looking at the alternatives.
Perhaps the lesson of the last 25 years is that a balanced parliament is a better way to go. In reality of course my vote will make little difference under first past the post, I live in a safe LD seat anyway. However it is important to vote, always even if the choice is crap.
Certainly won't Vote for Salmond ever. Absolutely detest the man and what he stands for.
So maybe it is time for an LD vote. However I don't really like Clegg or Cable. Or maybe a protest Vote for the Greens or an Independent?
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121. northhighlander
"He has also argued that growth is a realistic option to cuts."
This is the shallow view that the establishment parties try to promulgate. But it simply isn't a straight choice between spending or cuts. Government spending will continue. It is a case of prioritising that spending so as to encourage growth while making cuts where they will do least harm. The SNP has made an honest effort to set out this case. Nobody is able to give precise figures for this and that. But the SNP has been honest about the scale of the problem and, more importantly, has spelt out the principles which would guide efforts to work towards a sustainable recovery.
None of the establishment parties have gone so far. They have been too busy pretending that their cuts would be less painful or more "progressive" than the other Tweedles'. None of them are talking about constructive, forward-looking measures in the months and years beyond the election.
While the Tweedle threesome have their eye only on the prize for themselves, the SNP has its eye on the possibilities for the future.
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122. Wansanshoo
"Simply not true, the same accusation was put today at FMQs by Tavish Scott,it may be of some interest to you to visit Democracy Live and view the detailed response put by Salmond."
I should go listen to that part again. Oddly enough, the second his Tavishness starts droning on, my eyes go blank and I hear nothing but a humming sound. It always takes a while for the condition to clear itself.
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#119. At 8:33pm on 05 May 2010, northhighlander wrote:
"I genuinely have been very turned off by the whole election debate. I did watch the tv debates. Alec Salmond argued on that night for a growth strategy as opposed to cuts. The few cuts he offered were Trident and ID cards".
Why! Oh! Why! Must you be so dishoinest? For example, just who do you think you fool? On Trident it was not just the scrapage of Trident but the non-buying of, "Son of Trident". The ID caed scrapage is also a year after year saving. Scraping the SoS, also a year on year saving AND HE SAID THESE WERE ONLY EXAMPLES. To be burtally frank - A Scotland with full autonomy, her oil, gas, power, Crown Estate and the tax. including VAT, Hydrocarbons, Alcohol duty, tobaco duty, Land fill, aggragates levy, that UK wide companies pay now through London head offices and, of course the billions from Crown Estates revenues and royalties. Then Scotland would have no financial problems. Not only that but the pride of being able to hold their heads high knowing WE ARE NOT BEING SUBSIDISED BY LONDON would be worth every penny if there was a shortfall. But there would not be.
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129. northhighlander
"Certainly won't Vote for Salmond ever. Absolutely detest the man and what he stands for. "
Then why waste everybody's time pretending that you are seeking to make a rational choice?
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129. northhighlander
"Certainly won't Vote for Salmond ever. Absolutely detest the man and what he stands for.
So maybe it is time for an LD vote. However I don't really like Clegg or Cable. Or maybe a protest Vote for the Greens or an Independent? "
I don't believe in protest votes any more than tactical votes. Vote for which ever one is closest to your own beliefs.
I believe in a strong, self-supporting and independent Scotland (the principles you so despise but that is your right). I will vote for that even though it is a large swing for them to win in my constituency, but I will not vote for any party that does not put Scotland first.
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Re SNP cuts.
One that AS stated a few times recently, and particularly in the last Scottish Leader (+ 3 others) debate was the Scottish Office (or Scotland Office as it is now that it a full time job again).
Personally I thought that it would be a good idea keeping this. Only, the emphasis would be just slightly different.
I think that this job should be done by a member of the Scottish Parliament, rather than the other one.
If they were a member of the Scottish one, with a place on the Westminster cabinet (part time probably - for only items that affect Scotland to give advice or to argue for direction) I feel that they would talk more for our country, rather than following London PM stance. They may not be from the ruling UK party, but their direction would generally be in the correct direction for Scotland, which is kind of what the job description implies. Even if both pariaments had the same party in charge they would still be going in the direction chosen by the population of Scotland.
I obviously have no idea how to persuade DC to turn in this direction once elected to PM but maybe one of the 'vote negotiations' that only the Nationalists of planet earth seem to be keen on admitting to being interested in might turn something up. I think that this would strengthen the Scottish Parliament position. Getting rid at present I think means losing a connection that we could use more efficiently.
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133. Electric Hermit
Just being honest. I am not alone either. I make no secret of opposing nationalism as do the majority of Scots.
As for Alec, just don't like the man, don't like his style at all. Again, in a growing segment of the electorate.
But my decision not to vote SNP is based on the policy. Simple. Same as reason for not voting Labour or Tory.
So think will vote independent. Better than not voting.
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130. Electric Hermit
"Certainly won't Vote for Salmond ever. Absolutely detest the man and what he stands for.
So maybe it is time for an LD vote. However I don't really like Clegg or Cable. Or maybe a protest Vote for the Greens or an Independent? "
The Green's are your only choice if you are going to vote at all as Independence isn't your cup of tea!
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#129 Northerhighlender
"However it is important to vote, always even if the choice is crap."
LoL; another turkey :)
I have some good haggis stuffing for you, it's left legs are longer than it's right :)
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#129. At 9:00pm on 05 May 2010, northhighlander wrote:
"Certainly won't Vote for Salmond ever. Absolutely detest the man and what he stands for".
Oh! Aye! So Just what DO you think he stands for?
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132. Auld Bob
Yawn Yawn
More of the thieving English rhetoric. How original! Must go and find something useful to do
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It's clockwise :)
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129. northhighlander
"Certainly won't Vote for Salmond ever. Absolutely detest the man and what he stands for.
So maybe it is time for an LD vote. However I don't really like Clegg or Cable. Or maybe a protest Vote for the Greens or an Independent? "
Ah! At last you've stopped pretending that you are on the fence over Scotland's constitutional situation. I suspect that you are a little less knowledgeable about politics than you might pretend.
The first time you could "not vote for Salmond" would be in Gordon in 2011. Are you planning a flit? But since you "detest what he stands for" - which is eventual Scottish Independence, greater autonomy for Scotland in the short to medium term, and standing up for Scotland's interests at all times, it really doesn't matter what you thingk of one particular individual does it?
Didn't you know that you don't have a Green candidate in Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross? Wouldn't do you much good anyway. The policy of the Scottish Green Party is Scottish Independence.
You do have an Independent standing. Do you have any idea what his policies are?
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#129 northhighlander
"So maybe it is time for an LD vote. However I don't really like Clegg or Cable. Or maybe a protest Vote for the Greens or an Independent?"
Have you moved? Last time we were discussing locations, I thought you were mentioned that you're near Wick. If you're still there, you have exactly 5 choices of where to put your X for the next hon. member for Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross: Gordon Campbell (Ind), Alastair Graham (Con), John Mackay (Lab), John Thurso (L-D) or Jean Urquhart (SNP)
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#136. northhighlander wrote:
"So think will vote independent. Better than not voting."
Just a guess but from the 'highlander' part of the name and the 'Lib Dem' sitting candidate I assume you are roughly in the same area as me - the greater highland capital area.
I see a few posters for the 'Joy of Talk' party who are fighting against Danny Alexander. That might be an option and let them keep their deposit. Maybe worth a thought.
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136. northhighlander
"As for Alec, just don't like the man..."
Based on such depth of knowledge that you don't even know the man's name.
You cannot be taken seriously.
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#140. At 9:17pm on 05 May 2010, northhighlander wrote:
"More of the thieving English rhetoric. How original! Must go and find something useful to do".
You do that, "northhighlander". Because it is quite obvious you have not a shred of evidence, or the ability, to prove my points wrong. Not to mention your stupid attempt at terminalogical inexcatitude. England has no treasuary and no laid down expenditure figures. The Treasury is that of the UK and I have never claimed England robs Scotland - they just benefit from the robbery.
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hope the results are as exciting tomorrow as tonights footie. 6-5 to hibs and motherwell have just missed a penalty.
I would take a score of 6 to labour and 5 to the lib dems tomorrow if the rest went snp and none to the tories
Shame 3 of the other games tonight are 0-0
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Those that for whatever reasons are opposed to Scottish independence must then be prepared to offload responsibility for the running of Scotland's economy to the City of London.
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#147
ooops spoke too soon - 6 all.
OK I could still go with that tomorrow
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137. cynicalHighlander
Don't know what happened there!
129. northhighlander
"Certainly won't Vote for Salmond ever. Absolutely detest the man and what he stands for.
So maybe it is time for an LD vote. However I don't really like Clegg or Cable. Or maybe a protest Vote for the Greens or an Independent? "
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147. highlandarab
Unusually, the Kilmarnock v Falkirk game on Saturday will be interesting.
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If at first....
129. northhighlander
"Certainly won't Vote for Salmond ever. Absolutely detest the man and what he stands for.
So maybe it is time for an LD vote. However I don't really like Clegg or Cable. Or maybe a protest Vote for the Greens or an Independent?"
The Green's are your only choice if you are going to vote at all as Independence isn't your cup of tea!
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North Highlander.
"Certainly won't Vote for Salmond ever. Absolutely detest the man and what he stands for.
''So maybe it is time for an LD vote. However I don't really like Clegg or Cable. Or maybe a protest Vote for the Greens or an Independent? "
Suggetion: Dont vote, watch it on the box with a fish supper, or chicken, perhaps single black pudding or a pie & chips if your the indecisive type.
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151. At 9:41pm on 05 May 2010, oldnat wrote:
Unusually, the Kilmarnock v Falkirk game on Saturday will be interesting.
Aye! I have a feeling I saw you touting for Killie a few blogs ago (but maybe I am thinking of someone else - I huvnae checked).
Last year Falkirk were in exactly the same position and had to come up to Caley on last day and win - so they have got previous for this. Last year I think Caley were 3 ahead. Could be an interesting day.
If its any help I have it as a 1-1 draw for Saturday on my work predictor - shame I'm bottom of that league though.
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The Scottish Greens want Scotland to be Independent :)
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#147. At 9:33pm on 05 May 2010, highlandarab wrote:
Nah! Motherwell 6 vs Hibs 6. Good value for money: Jutkiewicz scored on 90minutes.
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154. highlandarab
I'm an Aberdeen supporter (for my sins!) Kilmarnock is my nearest club, but my son would disown me if I backed them. He's an Ayr Utd supporter (for his sins!)
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So does Tommy Sheridan and Margo MacDonald, I think :)
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So in my veiw all of those would be good votes. I have SNP here so I will be voting for them. I will do what I can to further the cause :)
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Have you noticed that I've shown several instances of how the London Treasury take credit for revenue earned in/by Scotland and the Unionists keep saying I'm wrong, or just sneering. Can anyone remember any of them proving either my claims or figures wrong? They do, though, still attempt to push the England subsidises Scotland myth.
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#157
Ooops sorry
You are really in bother tonight then, with Killie beating the Dandies and your son no speaking to you.
Eeek!
I had better shut up and get back to my homework.
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So here we are. Polling day tomorrow. I just wanted to say a couple of things.
Firstly, to remind all nationalists, friends of Scotland and those with the best interests of Scotland at heart - tomorrow starts nothing and ends nothing.
The campaign for an independent Scotland started before any of us were born. I hope to see it succeed in my lifetime but I'm not so arrogant as to assume that it will. What tomorrow will be - is another step along the road.
And it will be a forward step. I believe that, absolutely. We will hold our electoral ground and we will make gains, maybe not as many as we would like, but we will make progress. And in 2011, we will make further, and more significant progress. And onwards, and so forth.
Which brings me to my second point - a moment, please, for the activists. All of you, all of them.
I've come quite late to political activism - and I'm still not anything like active enough. I have thirty years catching up to do, on some of my fellow Branch and Party members.
Thirty years - walking the streets, chapping at doors, handing out leaflets. For the party that 'would never win a Westminster Seat', that 'would never be the party of government in Scotland'.
And yet, here we are. Thanks to the voters, thanks to the candidates but, most of all, thanks to the activists - usually unsung, unrewarded and unknown men and women - the 'political anoraks.'
Further ahead in the polls today, it seems - further forward than we've ever been before. Odds against us, as always. We're 'irrelevant', we don't matter, we'll never win.
Except we have done before and we will again tomorrow. We'll win more seats - maybe not many, maybe only a couple, but more not less. And we'll keep going - election by election, seat by seat, vote by vote, we'll keep moving forward.
Because of you, because of the candidates but, mostly, because of the activists.
This is what, I think, parties like Labour have forgotten. They're machines - the point and purpose of which has become nothing more than the need to keep the machine running.
The SNP is still a peoples' party, a grassroots party. It belongs to its members and, mostly, to its activists. I believe that Labour will find out tomorrow that, in some constituencies, they've been outworked, out-walked, out-canvassed. And they'll sit around and blame each other and wonder why.
Polling day belongs to the voters, elections belong to the candidates but the votes belong to the activists - they're the ones that go out and earn them.
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145. Electric Hermit
""As for Alec, just don't like the man..."
Based on such depth of knowledge that you don't even know the man's name.
You cannot be taken seriously.
"
For some reason he thinks it is terribly insulting and will convince the large percentage of us who think AS is doing a good job that we should turn on him. Instead it just makes our Highland friend look a bit dim. There are many things one might call AS (I'm fond of Maximum Eck myself--I fear he could stand to go on a diet) but Alec is just eye-rolling.
Nor does that particular Highlander apparently notice that there are many people who vote for the SNP who do not support independence.
Sensible people in their way even if I don't agree.
They are aware that the SNP has neither the intent nor the power to force independence. It is their intent to bring about a REFERENDUM and campaign for independence. Those who oppose it will vote 'No' but in the meantime the SNP supports sound policies that protect and promote Scotland.
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129. northhighlander
"Certainly won't Vote for Salmond ever. Absolutely detest the man and what he stands for. "
Are you saying you are Alex Salmond's constituency? Otherwise what does your personal like or dislike for him matter?
I assure you that as much as I LOATHE Gordon Brown (and it would be impossible for me to put into civil discourse how much I loathe him) I would still vote Labour if I believed in anything they stood for OR thought they would defend Scotland. I don't. I vote for the party I do believe in.
Voting for or against a party leader is -- peculiar unless you CAN actually vote in their constituency.
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160. Auld Bob
"Have you noticed that I've shown several instances of how the London Treasury take credit for revenue earned in/by Scotland and the Unionists keep saying I'm wrong, or just sneering. Can anyone remember any of them proving either my claims or figures wrong? They do, though, still attempt to push the England subsidises Scotland myth. "
Indeed. You, sir, are right on all counts.
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For what it's worth - my list of ten seats to keep an eye on tomorrow night -
1. Dundee East – how solid a foundation the SNP here will give a good indication as to how likely (or not) they are to go on and make gains.
2. Dundee West – SNP will need to win this, if they're going to make progress.
3. Edinburgh South – Significant Tory/Lib Dem 2 way. Will be a good test of the extent of ‘Cleggmania’ in Scotland
4. Falkirk – Local issues may or may not be a factor here – SNP candidate endorsed by Dennis Canavan
5. Glasgow East – Interesting Glasgow constituency. SNP by-election win in 2008, by 365 votes, but which load of negative publicity will have the most impact – SNP over GARL and various anti-Glasgow allegations, or Labour’s political nightmare over Stephen Purcell and the GCC?
6. Ayrshire North & Arran - with the Tory candidate deselected - which way will their votes go?
7. Livingstone – Something of a weather vane in terms of voters and MP’s expenses – Jim Devine’s former seat.
8. Ochil & South Perthshire – SNP’s top target. Failure to win here will mean a difficult night for the SNP
9. Renfrewshire East – A big windmill for the Tories to tilt at. Will Jim Murphy's last speech as SoS be to concede victory to Richard Cook and the Tories?
10. Stirling – A good yardstick for the Tories’ overall performance. If David Cameron is going to win a working majority overall then he’ll probably need to win this seat back, lost in 1997 to the incumbent, Ann McGuire
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The moderation has vastly improved. Long may it continue. The moderation today has been exemplary. I sincerely hope it stays this good. It really does make all the difference to the debates.
I suspect that Brian may have a hand in this, as I believe he is nothing if not fair.
I wonder if there have been some "internal politics" taking place in Pacific Quay. The ups and downs on the blog, the terrible moderation all gave a perception of censorship and political bias. It seems for the moment to have improved. It would seem that someone has spoken up for fairness and freedom of speech. If indeed that was Brian Taylor then I would send him my respect. It would be an act of integrity that would rank with Malcolm Chisolm.
When it comes to voting dilemmas:
Vote LibDems - get Westminster
Vote Labour - get Westminster
Vote Tory - get Westminster
Vote SNP - get Scotland
Hmm..let me just think about that..
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116. Electric Hermit
"I could understand it better if there was not a viable alternative. But we have in the SNP a party that retains and develops all the principles and aspirations that once drew people to the Labour movement. Indeed, in many ways, the SNP is what the British Labour Party might have become but for the disastrously destructive intervention of Blair's NuLabour project. To see a progressive, left-of-centre, social democratic party shunned by a large part of its natural constituency is perplexing and disappointing in equal measure."
Nice one E-H!
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Here is a thought. When Scotland needed the vital Tay, Forth, Skye and Erskine bridges the Scots were charged tolls in order to get and maintain them. In Wales there are two main toll bridges and some minor toll bridges the Cleddau bridge, Severn bridges, Pont Briwet, Penmaenpool Bridge, and the Barmouth Bridge, (only used by trains, cycles and pedestrians). There are also several English Regions with toll Bridges. How come there are never tolls on London's many bridges?
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
160. Auld Bob
"Can anyone remember any of them proving either my claims or figures wrong?"
That would be rather difficult!
All they do is to repeat the Brit Nat myth - they don't even produce the Brit Nat figures any more. The last one to to even try that was RE some time back - and I took great fun in demonstrating that he hadn't a clue.
GERS still isn't accurate as we know - with the shoddy nature of UK statistics, that's not surprising. However, already it demonstrates that, at least, Scotland has been no worse than the UK as a whole (which is an apt description!).
GERS does, however, have the data to disprove their propaganda, which they either post out of ill-will, or because they haven't bothered to check their facts.
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London Newsnight have kindly put up the 3rd new Sir Humphrey analysis early at: Sir Humphrey responds to the Labour manifesto with links to the first two for those that missed them.
This means that if, as I suspect, it's broadcast after the 23:00 BST Newsnicht switchover, you have no excuse for missing it.
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#162 Bandages. Great post.
Just listened to Kaye and Gray. What was striking was the despair of the Labour callers. It has taken them a very long time but they are now asking themselves 'why am I voting Labour?'. The answer is they don't know. That is why you never get any Labour unionists on here. They remember why they used to vote Labour but those reasons no longer hold up. Many nationalists have been down the same path, many of them on this blog.
I also liked how Kaye and the Labour callers continually had to tell Gray to stop blaming the Tories and the SNP.
Freedom
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BBC 10 o'clock news doing a great job of boosting English resentment against the other nations.
It might push them towards English Independence, but it would be unfortunate if that happened on the basis of false information and the politics of grievance.
It's always difficult to see how those with the enormous power can manage to portray themselves as victims.
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#162
Well said.
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Should anyone doubt that Labour have given up hope, this week's Scotsman Politics Podcast is worth listening to. Genuine angst over "why should anyone vote Labour". Probably tear-terking for old Labour supporters like derek/kered but risible to anyone else.
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174. oldnat
"It might push them towards English Independence, but it would be unfortunate if that happened on the basis of false information and the politics of grievance.
It's always difficult to see how those with the enormous power can manage to portray themselves as victims."
What I don't understand is how they don't see that they themselves are tearing apart the Union that they (supposedly) support. While it would be better if the Union dissolved because of the truth, the hatred they are engendering toward the other nations WILL eventually tear it apart.
What are they thinking? The evident stupidity baffles me.
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My comment at 170 was found to break the rules, i asked why oldnat supported Aberdeen and urged people to vote with a hope that otheres would vote for the party I also support. If this breaks the rules BBC then can you please refund my licence fee becuase i always thought we lived in a land of free speech.
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I've just been watching BBC NEWS24 and they have just done a piece abour Devolution from the English publics viewpoint. What they believe is very interesting. The general belief goes along the lines of - why should they, (Welsh & Scots), get free prescriptions and we don't? Why should they get free home care and we don't? If they get it so should we? We're all British, we should all get it if they get it? They should not get to vote in our parliament?
Methinks, if they go for English devolution, they are in for a B-I-G surprise. Not least that Westminster is NOT the English Parliament. There can be only two things that can happen. 1 - They get an English Parliament and a block grant and have to fiddle the block grant formula to be kept in the manner to which they have become accustomed. That means Independence for Scotland and Wales for not even the sheeple would stand for that. 2 - They get an English Parliament but attempt to retain the treasury and continue to finance England as the UK and ... ... ... Independence. Win-win for Scotland & Wales.
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143. Brownedov
"#129 northhighlander
"So maybe it is time for an LD vote. However I don't really like Clegg or Cable. Or maybe a protest Vote for the Greens or an Independent?"
Have you moved? Last time we were discussing locations, I thought you were mentioned that you're near Wick. If you're still there, you have exactly 5 choices of where to put your X for the next hon. member for Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross:"
Those rigged TV "debates" have had a decided effect on the more susceptible intellects.
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anyone catch that piece of reporting in the 10 o'clock EBC news from Nodnol - about the english being angry at scots and welsh voting in the UK parliament,on Engerlish issues - probably labour mps. and they are jealous of our independent policies re health and education....
Can we give them a referendum if they want to keep us in the Union?? Independence by the back door!
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Have to agree with oldnat:
"BBC 10 o'clock news doing a great job of boosting English resentment against the other nations."
Indeed. The timing and depth of that piece I found to be very strange. The last story on the BBC News... on the eve of an election...
In some respects I hope it pointed out a few home truths to our friends down south, that the current electoral settlement is badly badly screwed up.
But the timing ? Hmmmmmmm...........
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176. Brownedov
"Should anyone doubt that Labour have given up hope, this week's Scotsman Politics Podcast is worth listening to. Genuine angst over "why should anyone vote Labour". Probably tear-terking for old Labour supporters like derek/kered but risible to anyone else."
The part I noticed was the whinging over devolution. It didn't occur to her (apparently) that when we are independent, devolution will disappear as well. Oops! I have a feeling that wasn't what the poor wee thing had in mind.
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162. Bandages_For_Konjic
And you've earned a vote of thanks from the rest of us. Even though I don't like Parties.
Slainte
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It is all said and done now; it is up to the voters from now on. I don't have to say which party I hope will progress in Scotland; I think you already know. Let's hope that it is done in a fair and democratic way and that there are no suspicious postal votes.
Being a democrat I say 'good luck' to ALL the parties and hope that the next UK government will do its best, not only for Scotland, but for the rest of the UK.
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#176
Evening BrowneDog you old howler!
Well, I've just looked out the old biscuit tin! low and behold, I found a couple of thrupences, a halfpenny and a sixpence. I'm loaded with memorabilia......boy do I get a kick out of you! good luck.
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178. peteraberdeenshire
"i asked why oldnat supported Aberdeen"
I was brought up near Ellon, and Harry Yorston and Paddy Buckley were my heroes!
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#166 Bandages. Ayrshire North & Arran is an interesting one. That could go SNP and people will remark 'nobody predicted that'. However, Kenneth Gibson's wife is standing. The Gibsons are like the SAS of the SNP. They really do know how to campaign. Witness Kenneth Gibson and Cunningham North.
Freedom
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I just saw Jim Murphy dancing with an OAP and kidding on he could sing :(
I wonder what he had to say after that?
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Actually he was kidding on he could dance too.
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For those who haven't been here before during an election -
"The BBC's election rules state that, from 0600 tomorrow, all discussion of the parties and their campaigns must stop until the polls close. On the blogs and messageboards this means we'll be asking people to stop leaving comments of a political nature during that period. Some forums and threads will be closed."
My guess is that BwB will be one of those closed - until 10pm.
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Much like he kids on to be a high ranking official!
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The highest ranking in Scotland X
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
LoL can you guess what I said next :0:0:0
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185. gedguy2
"Being a democrat I say 'good luck' to ALL the parties"
As a democrat I totally disagree with you!
"Luck" shouldn't come into it. It should be the outcome of the popular vote of the people of Scotland (what happens elsewhere is not my concern) in a fair election.
However, the election has not been fair, so if luck is involved in anyway then I hope that it benefits those parties in Scotland not involved in the faux presidential debates.
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Ranker is not a bad word :) I means to hold rank :)
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187. Oldnat, Auld Bob and any other experienced poster.
I wonder if any of you have managed to post a comment in the ‘Daily Record‘, Magnus Gardham’s forum. I have tried but on each occaison an error message comes up, “Text entered was wrong. Try again.” even if I know that the characters were correct.
It was another extremely damaging rant against the SNP, headlined, ‘Dirty tricks in Rutherglen‘
I was surprised that the usual that the normal headline in the Scottish press ‘SNP Accused…….’ wasn’t used but he still writes some very suspect articles and it look likes doesn’t allow criticism.
Has Magnus Gardham ever, ever accused Labour of dirty tricks in Glasgow?
Couldn’t he as a fair minded reporter, search for dirty tricks no matter where and no matter who by.
From this side of the World I really am amazed at the bias of the UK media and their the Pravda journalism.
KiwiMike
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" THE SNP are waging a desperate dirty tricks campaign against Labour's election candidate in Rutherglen and Hamilton West, Tom Greatrex."
‘Daily Record‘'s , Magnus Gardham’
http://blogs.dailyrecord.co.uk/magnusgardham/magnus_gardham/
Yet no 'Dirty Tricks'in Glasgow about an other 'Scottish' Party?
Mike
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142. oldnat
There is a lot of posters on here that think they know more than they do, yourself included. Politics is all about opinions and changing them.
I did for a fair while give serious consideration to the arguments for independence after realising how poor Labour were at delivering. However they just don't add up, the situation with Salmond is simple since becoming first minister he has done well... nothing. But he is big on bluster, just eh same as Brown or Dave really. A politician of the same vein.
As to the Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross list you are right we have no green candidate standing. The independent is a local eccentric whose policies are really irrelevant. He will attract the "none of the above" vote.
Which will probably have one more. Also EH's claim re the SNP is just arrogant and back to the last by election again "how can people be so stupid" argument.
It shows how poor the argument for independence really is when in the middle of the most unpopular labour government ever the SNP are campaigning on a strategy that doesn't hardly mention independence.
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"The BBC's election rules state that, from 0600 tomorrow, all discussion of the parties and their campaigns must stop until the polls close. On the blogs and messageboards this means we'll be asking people to stop leaving comments of a political nature during that period. Some forums and threads will be closed."
Oh, well, if people aren't allowed to leave comments of a political nature, RE will be on all day, since she doesn't bother with politics... :)
Onward - and Holyrood 2011.
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#196 oldnat
Dontcha just luv it! when Oldnat contradicts his favoured STV system.
" Luck" shouldn't come into it. It should be the outcome of the popular vote"
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Vote for what you believe in and nothing else.
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Exclusive photos of Brown's last ever engagement whilst pretending to be PM at the cheesy blog.
http://tinyurl.com/cheesyblog [Unsuitable/Broken URL removed by Moderator]
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‘Devolution literacy’ and the 2010 manifestoes
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199. Mike
"Labour's election candidate in Rutherglen and Hamilton West, Tom Greatrex"
I don't bother with the Record. However, they are quite right on this occasion. The SNP are using dirty tricks by telling the truth. Unfortunately truth is a commodity long abandoned by New Labour - which is but a parasitical organism that has replaced its host. There have been some really bad sci-fi films based on that premise!
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200. northhighlander
"As to the Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross list you are right we have no green candidate standing. The independent is a local eccentric whose policies are really irrelevant. He will attract the "none of the above" vote. "
So why this?
129. northhighlander
"So maybe it is time for an LD vote. However I don't really like Clegg or Cable. Or maybe a protest Vote for the Greens or an Independent? "
If you have no Green canditate, LD's suit you depending on which way the wind blows!
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200. northhighlander
"Politics is all about opinions and changing them."
You don't get to have an opinion about a man's name. And if you don't even know the name of Scotland's First Minister then there seems little reason to consider you the informed commentator you feign to be.
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200. northhighlander
"It shows how poor the argument for independence really is when in the middle of the most unpopular labour government ever the SNP are campaigning on a strategy that doesn't hardly mention independence."
What is the nature of your problem that you need to be constantly reminded of the Scottish National Party's main objective? I doubt if anyone else is so vague on such a crucial aspect of Scotland's politics.
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200. northhighlander
"It shows how poor the argument for independence really is when in the middle of the most unpopular labour government ever the SNP are campaigning on a strategy that doesn't hardly mention independence. "
This is not a campaign for independence. It is a campaign for the Westminster parliament. How hard is that to understand?
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200. northhighlander
"There is a lot of posters on here that think they know more than they do, yourself included."
There are indeed. However, I'm always prepared to be challenged on my knowledge and arguments. When you have posted your assertions, I've normally treated you with respect, and researched my responses (hence my reference to your local Independent, who has stood in multiple elections).
You fell in my regard, however, when you posted that you detested a party leader and all that he stood for.
I respect people who come up with positive arguments for their stance - even if I disagree with them. in all my time on this blog, I have never seen a Unionist come up with a positive argument for the status quo - other than the status quo should not be disturbed.
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202. kered
"Dontcha just luv it!" when derek displays his total ignorance of voting systems?
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dialogue
Function: noun
a conversation between two or more persons; also : a similar exchange between a person and something else (as a computer)
Looks like #83 was an example of the latter. Thanks, PC!
I might, also, have thanked northhighlander for the solitary response but, in truth, he wasn't responding to what I'd written, at all. In effect, my post was irrelevant but that may have been my fault since I've been word-weary for some time!
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According to Europe1, a descendant of William IV is about to take up residence in 10 Downing Street as prime minister of England, albeit with the assent of a grandson of a Russian aristocrat whose party may be about to come third in the Blighty general stitch-up despite coming first in the popular vote. The ways of the Smother of Parliaments and its electoral system are indeed intriguing. Would that they were recognizably democratic too. Anyway, good luck to the Celtic Alliance and confusion to their foes, confusion being a commodity which is unlikely to be in short supply.
Whoever ends up occupying Number 10 will need good luck too, of course, the markets expecting, as they do, action to be taken soon to reduce Blighty public debt, which was 44 per cent of GDP in 2007 but will be a staggering 88 per cent of GDP in 2011 thanks to the financial short-termism and the 'privatization of profit but socialization of loss' approach that Mr Brown is so proud of but which the general population may come to view somewhat differently when deep public-spending reductions begin to cut a swathe through the economy.
No wonder the governor of the Bank of Blighty was reported recently to have prophesied that whoever is in government after the election can expect to be out of power for a generation after the following one. If he thinks the hole that Blighty is in is as deep as that, it probably is, I venture to suggest. The constitutional status quo is hardly likely to commend itself to those in Scotland who will be suffering grievously under a government in England while their less powerful government at home opposes it at every turn, forcing a concession here and there, if that turns out to be possible.
After Brown the deluge.
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162. Bandages_For_Konjic
"Polling day belongs to the voters, elections belong to the candidates but the votes belong to the activists - they're the ones that go out and earn them."
I hope that was a just a poorly expressed thought! Nobody 'owns' my vote!
Isn't that the special province of the Labour Party?
Police investigate electoral fraud claims after journalist is beaten up
'Independent' reporter Jerome Taylor relives his bloody experience on the trail of voting fraud in east London
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I see that the USA has redefined WMD. WMD now includes petrol and propane. Iraq certainly had that. Actually so have I.
Yet the USA allows private citizens to own machine guns, rocket launchers, tanks!
Do I detect just a tiny little hint of hypocrisy (not to mention stupidity)?
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They'll probably close the blog soon so I wanted to wish everyone good luck (even if Oldnat doesn't approve of luck). Things ahead will be rough but we will come out with Scotland stronger and better--and independent. I am sure of it.
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# 196 oldnat
You are, of course, entitled to your opinion, as I am to mine. I agree with you that the whole election process has been blatantly skewed away from a fair say for all the parties in Scotland, meaning the SNP, but who ever claimed that politics was fair? It isn't; it's a dirty business not only in Scotland but the world over.
When I say: "'good luck' to ALL the parties" I, of course, meant this towards the voters as, to vote for whomever they want, is their democratic right. At the end of the day, which ever party wins I will accept the will of the people. That, as far as I am concerned, is what democracy is all about.
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Before this blog is closed for comments, I just want to remind everyone that every vote counts and every vote will make a difference. So encourage everyone you meet to make the effort, and prove to each and every candidate that apathy won't win the day yet again and the electorate can no longer be taken for granted.
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Well is the blog closed?
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BBC news "Polling stations open across England".If there was ever doubt about the BBC as a "British" broadcaster this shows where their heart lies.It is a UK election and I'm sure polling stations are open across the UK.This is a link to the site but it may be removed http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/8661824.stm
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#229 ... It's on the ENGLISH bit of the site. Get that huge Nationalist chip off your shoulder!
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When I voted this morning, I noticed that the voting slips were not stamped with the perforated punch that is normally used. I asked the returner about this, and they said that they have been told not to do this this time. Is this the same everywhere? I have to ask why they are reducing security measures. Maybe I am just paranoid now.
I also noticed that there were two colours of voting slips - white and pink. As I was only given a white one, I have no idea what the pink one is for - any ideas? are there some local elections as well?
John
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233. john
Didn't notice the perforation (or lack of), but I was only given a white slip. I also read the list about 6 times - just to be sure (paranoid or what!). Don't want any spoiled papers now!!
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Oh well, I half expected the moderators to censor my post.
Just go to Newsnet Scotland.
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233. john
Just found this on http://www.justice.gov.uk/guidance/docs/general-election-2010-factual-brief.pdf
"If someone attends a polling station and finds that a vote has already been cast in their name, the system of “tendered votes” operates. The elector is invited to vote on a different coloured ballot paper (usually a pink one)." [Unsuitable/Broken URL removed by Moderator]
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Here's why you should vote:
"Scots in poor areas are more than 30 times more likely to be killed in an assault than those in affluent parts of the country.
The research shows a widening gap in society, and Scotland compared badly with similar European countries.
The paper, published in the Journal of Epidemiology and Community Healthdescribes "extreme" inequality among death rates and a rise in fatal knife attacks.
A woman in the most deprived area is 35 times more likely to die in an assault than one in the most affluent area with men 31.9 times likely to die - a rate similar to deaths from stroke."
Now ask yourself, whuich party or parties are most responsible, and which party has the best plan to change Scottish society. And vote accordingly.
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#230 But nothing on the Scottish site about stations opening and this was highlighted on the Google news page.
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Guido reports that a plane with UKIP's Nigel Farage has crashed injuring both him and the pilot - don't know how badly...
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Well it seems like my inocuous comment at 6.45am this morning has met with the ire of the mods. I will try again in chucks!
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Good morning all. It's 6.45am and drizzling here in South Wales. I'm off now to take the dog for a walk and cast my vote against.....
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.....but also had the largest expenses replayment order in Wales.
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I suspect that, despite the Polls suggesting a balanced parliament....
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40 - Auld Bob
Personally nothing short of custodial sentences! For them all inclusive trews, kilts or skirts ! and any others that follow, and certainly not allowed to pass go, EVER!
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...an overall majority. The upside might be that it will herald the beginning of the end in Scotland for....
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229 & 238. Are you being serious, nationalist??
Have you noticed this headline from 5.59am?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/election_2010/scotland/8663161.stm
There you go, feel better now?
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....the red-rosette-on-a-monkey syndrome.
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Now what, in my sliced up re-post, would cause the original post to break the rules, I wonder?
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On voting.
It is interesting that places where there is corrupt government are poorer and have a unenviable list of unfavourable statistics attached, such as to do with crime, health and employment.
It is interesting that this has no link to size of area. For example, Kazakhstan has some shocking life expectancy figures, my mother reports because of the high level of alcoholism. His students are quite amazed that my father, at 62, is still alive and so old. The obstructive red tape there still is a throw back to the Soviet days, although things have changed. But for a country, as it is, the size of Europe, this isn't reflected in a standard of living that is as good as that of the whole of Europe combined.
Japan is far richer in that respect. Yet in comparison it is tiny. The USA is huge, yet is has some shocking poverty, much of it hidden unreported. Glasgow is Scotland's biggest city but it has some shameful levels of poverty. The link is where you find poverty you find corrupt government. There are many large countries that are still very poor. And many successful and prosperous small ones. Size is not the factor here. It is good government.
So beware Westminster and another majority government. No accountability will not, and has not, lead to good decisions in government. Here we are (following the corruption of the banking system), facing times that will be hard and a debt that's worse than Greece's. We need good decisions, by righteous MPs, motivated by what's best for the people. SNP politicians have shown they can deliver that. Can we trust any of the other parties to look out for Scotland? And even if their Scottish constituency MPs want to, given that the majority of their party doesn't have that as its priority, how can they?
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251. Anglophone
The Eurozone doesn't look exactly enamored with propping up heavily indebted countries with runaway public spending at the moment.
Nope, you couldn't count on the Eurozone to have offered to bail the UK out.
Scotland though has all the assets the UK needs to appear 'debt-worthy'.
Scotland isn't heavily indebted in that we aren't even allowed to borrow. No, we must beg. Like a council department, we have to harry to ensure we get the same budget next time. We know how encouraging of responsibility and efficency that is. But the SNP have made efficiency savings, and would gladly take that responsibilty.
Because we are not a department somewhere that has just got to manage. A country, as we know, should be adjusting the levers of its economy, in these times especially, but at all times, to ensure growth. We don't have any to pull. Scotland is reduced to pressing the big red button that puts money out, until the vending machine goes out of order. Until fiscal autonomy, what is our other alternative at the moment?
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224. gedguy2
"At the end of the day, which ever party wins I will accept the will of the people."
Indeed. Farage hasn't had much luck though!!!!
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Eye Write (No: 257) - you forgot to mention the cover ups of the death of Dr Kelly, the 7th July 2005 "attack" on London and currently the Chilcot Enquiry - which is yet another "white wash" - and the real reason why we are currently fighting in Afghanistan and the illegal war in Iraq. I am sure there are several Government personnel and others who require to be investigated and brought to book.
I am convinced that the current problems with the banks were engineered by the banks as was the problems with the Greek Economy in an attempt to destabilise the Euro and keep the US Dollar as the World's Reserve Currency and so keep teh US economy afloat - sadly thjat will not happen as their GDP/US National Debt index has now exceeded 90% and the US economy is now in terminal decline (currently the GDP/US National Debt percentage is 90.208%). Total debt in the US is currently in excess of 300% of GDP - basically the US is BANKRUPT!!!! Every man, woman and child in the US owes over US$ 116,820 just ot cover the total debts of the US!!!!!!!!!!
The Federal Reserve Bank (A PRIVATELY OWNED BANK) acknowledged that THEY had caused the Great Depression of the 1930s which directly lead to World War 2 - who gained from that - THE BANKS OF COURSE, as they have done in every war since the 18th Century.
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On voting, part 2.
Is a vote for a party you fear won't win the seat a waste?
No, absolutely not. Once nationalists weren't expected to win any seats. Yet, in a few short years, here they are in government. With every vote, and each increase in votes, seats were won, as people saw there was support, and lent there's.
In a way those pre-seat winning votes mattered just as much, if not more, as those cast when the seats were won. As without them, the candidates would never have got into the position of being seen as able to win these seats. As they demonstrated support. And this information is broadcast after each election. It all adds up. It is demonstrating support for your party that gets it in power.
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255. To repeatedly accuse Labour voters with "the red-rosetted monkey" line is highly hypocritical when you nationalists will unconditionally back anything and everything said by someone with a yellow rosette.
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262. eye_write
On voting, part 2. continued
Therefore in my view it is always the right thing to do to vote for the candidate that you think is right, regardless of position 'in the running'.
I concede that does give voters in England some problems!
(Really, I think my neighbours have been treated shoddily and let down big time by the contempt and lack of Westminster democracy. I do think its a travesty. I don't think folk should be treated like they have been.)
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#253 Reluctant-Expat
"Are you being serious, nationalist??
Have you noticed this headline from 5.59am?"
You're sailing perilously close to the wind re the special Polling Day house rules, R-E, when you're a nationalist yourself like 99.9% of the posters on this blog. As one of the very few who isn't - I'm a localist - I'll forgive you.
The timestamp on the page you link to is indeed 05:59 GMT = 06:59 BST but that is no indication that it was actually published or linked to at that time.
More relevant is that not one of the four national versions of the use the word "nation" while only the English version uses the word "national", and then use it quite wrongly in relation to a kingdom-wide statistic. See:
● Voters going to polls in election
"Voters across the country..."
● Polling stations open across England
"Polling stations around the country opened..."
● Voting starting across Wales
"Voting has started across Wales..."
● Voters head for polling stations
"In Northern Ireland, a total of 18 seats at Westminster..."
Only the Scottish version avoids mentioning the nation it applies to until near the end of the second para.
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WOW, They are being picky - No mention of party allowed, no mention of candidates allowed, no mention of constituencies allowing, no mention of expenses allowed, no mention of nagging one's kids to vote allowed!
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#262
Absolutely. Tactical voting is a self-fulfilling prophecy. By voting tactically, people are failing to stand up and be counted (literally) for what they believe in, and thereby failing to encourage others to do the same. Remember that only slightly more than 21% of the electorate voted Labour last time round, but they got a *majority* government - partly because of those who didn't bother to vote or who wasted votes by trying to be tactical. Just vote what you believe, even if you don't think they'll win the seat this time: you'll help them get closer.
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