Courageous stuff
I expect you are all huge fans of "Yes Minister". Do you recall the episode when Sir Humphrey characterises a ministerial decision as "courageous"?
Does that mean, asks the eager Hacker, that it is a good and wise decision? There follows a solemn shake of the mandarin head.
Iain Gray was in "courageous" mood at first minister's questions today.
Not only did he lead off on the chancellor's Budget but he sought to turn it into an attack on Alex Salmond.
You know, he didn't do at all badly, given the relative dearth of ammunition and the less than adulatory reception which has greeted the Westminster statement.
Mr Gray accused the FM of cutting services in sensitive areas, in advance of any plans produced by the chancellor.
Blame for these, he said, could not be laid at the door of the 2010-11 spending plans.
Real terms
An alert observer might suggest they were down rather to earlier restraint announced by the Treasury - but let us set that aside for now. On the day, it was a sterling effort.
Further, he said that the budget for Scotland had actually increased in cash terms - and, Labour argues, fractionally in real terms.
It was courageous stuff indeed. For two reasons.
Firstly, when Alex Salmond fought back with his customary vigour, he was citing not SNP figures - but statistics produced both by his own officials and by the Treasury.
Mr Salmond directed Iain Gray to Page 241 of the Treasury Red Book. When John Swinney gave the first reaction yesterday, he was bolstered by two senior officials from the Scottish Government.
Secondly, on the day in the chamber, Mr Salmond's analysis was explicitly backed by Annabel Goldie for the Tories.
She too talked of a "Labour squeeze" - before challenging Mr Salmond to say what he proposed to do now. Of which, of course, more later.
Plain and simple
How to explain the different interpretations. Firstly, Labour Ministers and Holyrood politicians tend to take the phrase "efficiency savings" at face value.
SNP ministers say that a reduction ordered by the Treasury - with the cash going back to the Treasury - is a cut, plain and simple.
Secondly, on the real terms point.
Labour says that the claim of a real terms reduction is based upon the fact that substantial capital expenditure has been brought forward from next year to this - giving the appearance that the 2010/11 budget features a reduction.
Scottish Government ministers say what counts is the available expenditure.
Money was brought forward under Treasury encouragement and fiat. It cannot be spent twice.
Consequently, there is a real terms cut. Hope that helps.
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I wonder if Jackie Bird will do her usual and find some way to attack the SNP over these Labour's cuts.
BBC Scotland - the last bastion of failed Unionism.
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Well, surely the point is that the money is given in the first place, so for there to be less, it is taken - a cut.
If we ran our own affairs, raised, managed and spent our own money...simple really, isn't it.
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So, Iain Gray denies that there are to be any cuts to block grant.
Is Gray aware that the cat is out of the bag on this one? - courageous is I suppose one way to describe Gray, there are probably other descriptions being used elsewhere though.
"You know, he didn't do at all badly" says Brian. Of course he won't do badly, the English press are currently donning the black cap for Brown and Darling. Their political obituaries wre being prepered as we speak.
In Scotland the media will merge with Labour in sychronised harmony and attack the SNP for daring to stand up for Scotland.
This is the 'Alice In Wonderland' of the Scottish political scene where an SNP government awards councils a better deal than they themselves received from Westminster and the same SNP are attacked for council cuts.
Now Westminster have announced further cuts in Scotland and guess who is attacked again - that's right, the SNP.
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Number 2:
Jackie Bird asked Brian Taylor last night if the SNP weren't just undulging in 'political posturing'?
This was AFTER the budget statement from Darling.
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Brian - I really don't understand why you are attempting to praise Gray for attacking the SNP.
The man doesn't have a leg to stand on. His proposition that the Scottish budget would increase by more than £2bn over the next couple of years is complete and utter nonsense because although Westmidden may well cough up a mediocre amount to help develop a couple of oil fields the tax revenue from them will go straight back to the Treasury.... As to green energy the biggest beneficiaries there will be the German, Danish and US wind turbine manufacturers!
Gray should be apologising for the mess his masters have made of the economy not defending them.
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Courageous - Mr Gray? To be honest he is doing his job courageously at least. Certainly a huge improvement on Wendy. However "In real terms". His performance is predictable "Attack the SNP" whatever the policy and whatever the problem. Labour do not have much ammunition left in their armoury.
The fact remains that Alex Salmond and his ministers speak Scotland up and Labour do exactly the opposite.
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Brian
"You know, he didn't do at all badly..."
The name's changed from Bendy Wendy to the Grey Man but the same tired (and now frankly tedious) tactic of trying to tell us what we can see isn't true with our own eyes just goes on forever.
I stopped reading at that point because I'm just not interested in reading another "North British Labour Party Daily Press Release".
I seriously doubt anyone else is, no matter what their politics.
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I wouldn't have believed it had I not heard it myself. Iain Gray, even after Brian Taylor had acknowledged his own gaffe, tried to use the divide by zero trick question in FMQ's.
In the thread covering that very subject I stated that misinformation such as this would be used by Unionist politicians in order to cast doubt on the First Ministers reputation and so it has.
Is there anyone now who doubts the need for the BBC to broadcast an apology now that this misinformation and false claim has been used in the parliement itself in order to discredit the First Minister?
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I said it the other day and I will now say it again.
If there are all these big 'efficiency savings' to be made, what were Labour doing whilst in Government.
Being inefficient obviously.
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Brian,
On second thoughts, thanks for not making your apology too public, but perhaps you should have tipped off Mr Gray that you had done so. It certainly make compelling viewing at FMQs, but perhaps a little too close to slapstick for my own liking.
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#9 greeenockboy
You've fot to be kidding! I can't seriously believe anyone could be stupid enough to do that!
If that is true we are now in a situation where someone who could not possibly be unaware of the true facts is deliberately misleading parliament.
The Scotsman repeating the BBC's "gaffes" is one thing.
But deliberately spreading smears against the First Minister of the Scottish government is utterly desperate.
If Taylor does not see to it that a full apology is broadcast he will be condoning a deliberate misleading of the Scottish parliament.
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However if the Tories get in at Westminister next year Ian Gray will find his job even more difficult. No longer will he have direct assess to the London government nor access to the London civil servants. His party will in effect become the true opposition and he will feel the isolation that it brings.
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Here is a direct quote from FMQ's uttered by Ian Gray.
"Presiding Officer, last week the First Minister was caught out with the old trick question, what do you get if you divide by zero - The correct answer is it's meaningless, and so is his budget arithmetic"
Salmond declared in response that the BBC had apologised. Now, i'm not sure what form this took but as the matter has been raised in the Parliament then it should be headlined in the Scottish press tomorrow.
Don't think so? Imagine the BBC apologising to Gordon Brown over a broadcast slur and David Cameron using the slur in a subsequent exchange in the commons.
Front page headlines? - You better believe it, it would also feature on the BBC's own news.
No, it doesn't matter the nature of the slur, what matters is that it has spread like a virus and has been used to attack the FM in parliament.
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courageous or plain daft ?it doesn't really matter.
full points go to Annabell Goldie. the only leader to spot the glaringly obvious ,well glaringly obvious to those of us not owning the red rose coloured glasses!
the SNP were correct an awful lot of people and organisations now agree with them , but , now is the time to tackle the problem head on.
we are where we are.
slagging off the labour party is becoming easier by the day
the hard part is dealing with what they have done to us in an effective and grown up manner. the time for name calling is over now is the time for action!!
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Gray is a buffoon. Just when do you think he will be allowed to become Chancellor, considering the current incumbent and previous joker?
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Pssssssst
Keep this under your hat, Reluctant Expat thinks A. Darling is a Jock.
Wansanshoo.
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#14 greenockboy
Thanks for the direct quote. I'm in the unfortunate position of not being able to see it for myself because the numpties that cover our parliament don't deign it important enough to provide clips to the Scottish public until several hours after the actual event.
It's interesting Salmond claims the BBC have apologised. Did he make it clear whether they had apologised to him? There was certainly no apology to Salmond on the BBC that I saw.
If Salmond means they apologised to him privately then why on earth have they not informed the Scottish public of that fact? What are we paying this compulsory tax for? To have them going around making "gaffes" and following them up with secret apologies? What is heaven's name is going on?!!
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It is all nice and fine reporting what the 'courageous' Iain Gray was saying but what is Iain Gray going to say about the mess his masters in London have presided over?
I knew this was going to happen, and so did you, Brian. Labour have got us into this mess, Labour is going to produce cuts for Scotland and Labour is attacking the SNP for the cuts that Labour have made. When are you going to jump ship Brian and start giving fair reporting to a Scottish government?
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Before Scotland joined the UK, they went Bankrupt. Had they not been in the UK now, they would have gone Bankrupt again. Ok, they would have done not too badly over the past 22 years, due to North Sea Oil, but what about the other 280 years?
Scots make up less than 8% of the UK, and yet, they took by far the lions share of the UK Bank bail out money, which we are ALL having to pay for.
Before you start ranting on about Northern Rock also being bailled out, 86% of UK Taxypayers are in England.
Stop whinging, we're all having to pay for your Banks mistakes, not just you. In fact Scotland is getting off pretty lightly, compared to the rest of us.
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15. sidthesceptic
Auntie Goldie was fandabiedosie today. What made it perfect (was I look up at my poster of Maggie) was at the end her being potrayed by the BBC (of all organisations) as some kind of statewoman with foresight.
Alex & Annabel do seem to work well together; it must be eincouraging thought for the SNP that next parliament they might be faced with an amiable Tory party at Holyrood (if 20 seats or more) that are able to help avoid the lib-lab 'vote down everything' mentality; best demonstrated by the budgetary fiasco.
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@ 6 wee-scamp
Aye it is diabolical that Gray includes the money going to enable further oil feilds to be explioted within this money coming to Scotland when we all know that the revenues will be going as usual directly to the Treasury.
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These are extraordinary times. The UK government has announced its biggest fiscal deficit ever, both in pounds and in percentage of GDP, and expects to rack up similar deficits for years ahead. This financial disaster, for that is what it is, will haunt us for generations. Gordon Brown bears more responsibility than any other politician still in office anywhere in the world for the regulatory disaster which allowed this to happen, and it seems extremely likely that he will be swept out of office next year as a result. (you knew those crazy house prices mase no sense, I knew they made no sense...what about the people who were supposed to be in charge?)
It is hard to see how unswerving loyalty to the soon-to-be-ex-prime minister is of benefit to Mr Gray or the Labour group in the Scottish parliament. But this is apparently their only policy. I think they need to find some other tunes to play, and soon.
There is a long and dreadful history of UK fiscal problems resulting in disproportionate damage to the Scottish economy. I imagine Ian Gray may even have campaigned against that once.....
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good to see you affirming your total support for your masters, Brian
"COURAGEOUS" are you having a laugh?
Gray was simply doing as he was told.
the big surprise was he managed to do it without making a mistake!
unlike Mr McNeil who had to be told how to ask a question
the worrying thing being these people want to govern our country!!!
Sid
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I'm sorry Brian you are convincing no one over Iain Gray's performance. It was dire.
I know the guid Unionist fowk at BBC Scotland detest Wee Eck, but to say that Iain Gray did well is utter fantasy.
BBC Scotland has a credibility problem over political issues. Labour party press-release journalism should have no place in a public service broadcasting.
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#20 Jim_Thompson
"Before Scotland joined the UK, they went Bankrupt."
True, but you conveniently forget to add the reason why Scotland went bankrupt.
The "whinging" these days is all being done by the English, as in today's Financial Times: "today the English have reason of their own for bitterness. Devolution is a gross injustice towards them ? they make up, after all, four-fifths of the British population. English vexation is stimulated further by the preponderance of Scots in the present government and has been given a final twist by a financial implosion that looks almost like a Caledonian conspiracy."
Nauseating, isn't it?
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Oh, and #20, you appear to be labouring under the false impression that RBS and HBOS were mainly owned by Scots or carried out the majority of their business in Scotland.
It probably would have been a whole lot better if they were (ie BofS hadn't been taken over by the Halifax, nor RBS taken over NatWest et al on the back of huge amounts of City money), but that is just speculation.
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#25 minuend
"BBC Scotland has a credibility problem over political issues."
This is now certainly true, if it wasn't before the BBC's humiliating "divide by zero" gaffe.
This is starting to have serious consequences for them now. They have managed to embarrass Iain Gray who's accused Salmond of making a mistake the BBC has already admitted Salmond didn't make.
Gray can't possibly be so badly briefed as not to have known that. I imagine he's locked in an office with his "researcher" at this very moment demanding to know why they've left him looking like such an idiot.
Gray now also owes Salmond a public apology.
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A lot of the stuff on these blogs is very petty.
After all frightful fiscal figures we had yesterday, we should be discussing questions like.
Should I sell the car and use the money to buy and fill the garage and the loft with survival rations before the Great Insolvency Crash and the Tories arrive.
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Perhaps Mr Gray was indeed being courageous in drawing any blame away from Duff Gordon and Capn. Darling for what happens at Scottish Labour's first test at the polling booth since the budget, in Inverness West. It will be a surprise indeed if they retain their 16% first preferences from 2007.
I was mildly surprised to find no reference to this contest on the BBC website, but in the process also discovered a useful website, votewise.co.uk, which provides a free platform for election candidates. Today's Inverness West and Aboyne by-elections are covered, but surprisingly not next week's Bannockburn one. Only the Tory candidate at Inverness West and the SNP and BNP ones at Aboyne have bothered to post anything.
Next week's Bannockburn contest looks much the most interesting, and in normal times Labour's 50.98% of first preferences last time would have made them near-unassailable, but I'll be surprised if it's not close next week.
Would anyone know why the votewise site doesn't have the Bannockburn info?
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26. Bighullabaloo: "The "whinging" these days is all being done by the English"
Ladies and gentlemen, nationalist delusion and denial at it's very finest!! LOL!!
Oh, this is going to haunt you for a while, Bigleapsintothebloo!
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#27 B of S were not taken over by Halifax, it was the other way around. RBS were also not taken over by Natwest. They, RBS, did their dirty deals all by themselves. And Sir Fred is reaping the benefits, while we all pay the price.
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20. Jim_Thompson
Jim, your not helping the unionist cause at all.
For example you highlight that Scotland was "bankrupt" upon entering the union. This may be true, but the context for that is missing in your statement; the Darian adventure, followed by the Alien Act which served to cripple any hope of recovery.
This is relevant considering you seem to be saying that because 300 years ago we were in a financially dire state of affairs this merited an automatic union with England, becuase it what; proves in your mind that we Scots can't run an economy?
Please, I may be a unionist, but I'm not having fatuitous misinformation being peddled as per your #20
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# 20 Jim_Thompson
The usual old guff from you then? No surprise. Unfortunately in 1707 the English seemed pretty desperate to get us into this Union and in 2008 they don't seem any less desperate to lock us into it. Ask yourself why. No answers on the back of fag packets please.
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#31 Reluctant-Expat
"Ladies and gentlemen, nationalist delusion and denial at it's very finest!! LOL!!"
It might haunt me if it wasn't for the fact I've supplied irrefutable proof of English whinging from today's Financial Times in that very same post!!
Oh, yes, the signs are definitely there. Whatever you are, your delusionist Unionist fantasy world is crumbling fast. You're now trying to attack people where the evidence for the statement they've just made is actually right there in their post!
Why would anyone who wasn't English feel the need to defend them against what I said in #26? Surely you're not English and trying to pretend your not? How pathetic is that?!!
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Hi Jim_Thomson,
Ref. your #20.
History is written by the victors, Jim. There is not enough information about the Darien Scheme in the public domain to be able to refute your statement but there are a couple of points in the that are worth considering.
1). Was the scheme aided or endangered by the English / UK Monarchy?
2). How large was the Scottish National debt at the time of the Union?
For point 1, the Monarch of the United Kingdom, through the English parliament, was persuaded to ignore the plight of the Scots, his subjects. The East India Company were not innocent bystanders here, they knew exactly what they were doing, ensuring the demise of a potential competitor.
As for point 2, Scotland being bankrupt, lots of people in Scotland lost their shirts in an already poor country, that is true but Scotland had no national debt.
In fact England was in deeper trouble than Scotland financially if the evidence is to be believed. After all, as a condition of signing up in 1707, Scotland was awarded a lump sum stated as being in leu of taking on a portion of England's national debt.
Best wishes.
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Out of interest, what are the links to watch FMQs? Apparently Holyrood.tv won't have it until much later today and some of us have lives so can't always watch it live.
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# 33 deanthetory
Most of us on this blog already knew this. It was entertaining, though, to watch Jim_Thompson making that mistake. I think allowances should be given to him for his ignorance of historical matters. If he has the time and the urge he may go and investigate that himself and if he is man enough he will come back with an apology. If not, well, at least he has learnt something.
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#33 deanthetory
I'll give you credit for at least having the courage to point out (as I did in #26) that Jim_Thompson's #20 is as woeful an example of selective distortion that has probably ever graced these boards.
Picking and choosing convenient facts from history whilst ignoring the inconvienent ones is all very well, but the rest of us prefer to live in the real world.
Calling it "fatuitous misinformation" is a very kind description of it. How often we see its like here, and how tedious it is.
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#37 corporationtax
"Out of interest, what are the links to watch FMQs?"
You don't seriously expect BBC Scotland to provide timely coverage of the Scottish parliament do you?!!
It's impossible to say when you'll see the clips. They're provided entirely at their whim.
They seem to believe what goes on in our parliament isn't nearly so important as the Punch and Judy farce in Westminster.
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The Institute For Public Policy Research.
The estimation of spending through the Barnett formula is calculated by removing the ‘social protection’ (benefits and pensions) and ‘agriculture’ (farm payments) categories from the Treasury’s figures for identifiable public expenditure by nation and region, as these are the two major categories of identifiable expenditure outside the Barnett formula. PESA data also allows us to compare public spending per head for each of the four nations of the UK with the nine regions of England. The Barnett formula does not govern the distribution of spending within England but including the English regions in the analysis provides a richer picture of how public spending is distributed across the UK.
Nation or Region £ per head % deviation from UK average
London 5,985 +28
Northern Ireland 5,684 +21
Scotland 5,676 +21
Wales 5,050 +8
North East 4,960 +6
North West 4,927 +5
UK 4,679 0
England 4,523 -3
Yorkshire and Humber 4,477 -4
West Midlands 4,430 -5
East Midlands 4,086 -13
South West 3,947 -16
South East 3,874 -17
East of England 3,820 -18
Wansanshoo.
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If only we were a sovereign state like Ireland - they haven't faced any cuts, have they?
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#37 corporationtax
"Out of interest, what are the links to watch FMQs?"
It's still not there yet, but it will eventually turn up here on holyrood.tv.
The BBC link varies, and this week's still doesn't seem to be up, but you can find it by entering FMQs in any BBC search box then selecting the News & Sport Clips on the right.
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#37 corporationtax
You can see it on BBC i player search holyrood live.
Its up there now.
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The English press at least believe it is
Alistair in Wonderland and Darling's great squeeze. No one is really fooled by the term "efficiency savings".
Andrew Neil with regard to the press says "One thing is clear to me: this Budget may or not mark the end of New Labour but it certainly marks the end of Murdoch newspapers dalliance with New Labour".
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42. AMoffat3
"If only we were a sovereign state like Ireland - they haven't faced any cuts, have they?"
I think that is sarcasm on your part? (if it isn't then woe, woe, woe!)
:)
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FM questions will be put on the BBC iplayer and it is usually up there early evening on the same day.
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#20 Jim_Thompson
I was going to take you task for your appalling lack of historical knowledge, but others have done it for me.
I would simply add that by the late 18th century Scotland was rapidly converting to an industrialised economy due to its natural resources - first reliable water supplies and ample wood from the Highlands, then coal, limestone and iron.
The economic transformation of Scotland in the 18th and 19th centuries would have happened whether the Union had occurred or not.
I'm happy to debate history with you, but before you do, I suggest you read a book or two.
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Can anyone link to a clip of today's FMQs? I can't wait to see this.
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Jim Thompson like many simply repeats the old saw of post 1707 history with regards to Scotland being bankrupt.
This is and was not true. In the decade leading up to 1707 Scotland's economy had been growing steadily at 2.5% - based on customs duties on imports and exports - and the Scottish and Burghs exchequers were in a pretty good state.
The investors in Darien were mainly the landed gentry who bought into the 18th century version of the dot com bubble and mortgaged their estates to the hilt whilst borrowing from the new Edinburgh Middle Class which actually had cash liquidity.
When Darien failed (because of Spanish and English intervention plus a couple of bucket loads of stupidity by the promoters) the Edinburgh Middle Class wanted their money back or a chunk of their Lordship's estates in lieu.
Down in Westminster they were bricking it that the Scottish Parliament would reject George as Anne's replacement and bring back the Stuarts. To this end, from 1700, Daniel Defoe had been paying off the Jacobite leaning Lords to keep them sweet.
Now all their George supporting loons were deep in the pooh over Darien, so they decided it was better to fund this group to pay back their mortgages, ensure George got his fat butt on the throne, the Union deal was done and the bankruptcy myth created.
At no point was Scotland 'bankrupt' nor was it likely to be. The Scottish economy only crashed and stagnated in the years after the Union and did not see any economic growth until the 1780's.
It is truer to say that the Union bankrupted Scotland than to say the Union saved Scotland from bankruptcy.
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Nice to get back to domestic Labour slapstick, after the "global" variety of the last few days.
I'd forgotten all about Gray!
I'd certainly agree with Brian's term - courageous, along a few other adjectives I could think of, for Gray's approach. Thinking "I'll attack Alex on the economy, budget, and cuts!". Genius!!
Could his questions have been posted to him by Westminster on Tuesday perhaps? Maybe back then, they were optimistic of a positive reception to their budget?
Optimism ( aka Fantasy) is a popular trait among Labour economists of late!
Having received his questions in the post - no way was the "courageous" Mr Gray going to divert from the party line.
"We'll have none of that "thinking on your feet here in Scottish Labour thank you very much!!"
The man is comedy gold!
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Just watched Iain Gray repeating Brian Taylor's "gaffe" of accusing Alex Salmond of not being able to answer the "divide by zero" question. It's at 3.40 of FMQs on the iPlayer.
Can someone please supply a credible explanation why Labour politicans so frequently pick up on comments made in Taylor's blog articles/interviews and turn them into attacks on the SNP?
It's not the first time they've done it. There are several similar examples from the days when Wendy Alexander was running the Labour circus.
Surely Labour politicians wouldn't be able to do that if Taylor's comments were truly impartial?
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I managed to eventually locate FMQ's on BBC iplayer. I was surprised that the link was not in it's usual place.
I'm also surprised that Brian didn't deem it necessary to mention Gray's use of the 'divide by zero' trick question.
Listening just now the BBC Radio Scotland and the sudden re-emergence of the Carbon Capture to the political and environmental landscape.
Interestingly, the fact that Labour effectively pulled the plug on the Peterhead Carbon Capture plant seems to have been forgotten.
On Cuts, Glasgow Labour council are currently voting for the closure of several popuar schools in Glasgow.
The SNP will be to blame of course, just as they apparently are when councils refuse to employ new teachers, despite getting the funds to do so.
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# 48 old nat
I guess I need to read more books other than those by Nigel Tranter too :-)
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#54 rickyross3359
I have those as well. Certainly more of an entertaining read than much of my library!
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52. bighullabaloo
Love the Labour circus comment, its brilliantly illustrative, and descriptive.
:)
But Tavish and Salmond were rejecting each others stats. They were so different it makes me wonder ho will be proven right in the coming days. Was it 1.1% decrease (Tavish) or 5.?% (Salmond) ?
Could this be another apology heading Big Alex's direction?
But, he never actually answered auntie Annabels point about what he plans to do now has he?
And given that he knew the labour cuts on Scotland were coming he must have a plan, why didnt he outline some of it as requested by auntie gold?
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Haven't seen FMQs yet, but did Iain Gray rip up Labour's last manifesto? After all they did promise no rises in income tax and no privatisation of the Royal Mail amongst many other lies...
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Right on cue:
BBC Radio Scotland are reporting that medical records have been stolen from a laptop in (I believe) Aberdeen.
I almost laughed out loud when I heard this, it is one of those 'stories' that regularly emerge when things are bad for Labour.
Council stories are another favourite as are people complaining they have been lying on trolley's.
Watch for the usual plethora of such stories in the next few days.
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I further note Salmond actually states during FMQs: "Actually, the BBC made one of their few apologies to me, as far as the maths question was concerned." (FMQs, 4.57).
Let me repeat: "apologies to ME".
Salmond is making it crystal clear apologies were made TO HIM.
Since no public apology was made to Salmond on the BBC website, that statement lends strong support to the suggestion that the BBC made an apology privately to Salmond.
If that is so, isn't it totally pathetic they couldn't summon up the courage to apologise publicly as we all know they should have?!!
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I hear Jim Murphy's going to (courageously) turn up at the Scottish Cabinet meeting wearing a T-shirt reading,
The answer's Zero.
they obviously know that like their choice of Prime Minister Brown, they're on a winner with this one.....
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I don't think the people of Glasgow will be blaming the SNP over the closure of these schools by the crowd out in force in George Square today it is definately Purcell's blood they are after!
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#53 greenockboy
If I was into party politics, I'd no doubt be lambasting Glasgow for closing schools.
Actually, I'm rather in favour. We have far too much of the education budget being spent on buildings rather than on children learning.
The argument is different in rural areas,where distances between schools can be significant, but there is little justification for over-provision of school buildings in urban areas.
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Hi dean,
Ref. your question why Salmond didn't respond to Ms. Goldies request for information.
If you were Mr. Salmond, would you give your opponents something to help them evade the matter in hand?
Best wishes.
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Nat usual suspects, put away your stings. Mr T when he says "courageous" and "not at all badly" is practicing the fine art of damning with faint praise (Sir Humphrey was a master at this) not rewriting Labour press releases. Also, Yes Minister is still comedy gold after all these years.
Anyone who actually wants to watch live FMQs must be quite mad. In a previous life I was forced to experience FMQs on a regular basis (no, I'm not Jack McConnell) and I recommend the Official Report to anyone who actually wants to find out what goes on there. Nice cup of tea, wee bevvy, settle down to read at your leisure AND you get to skip the boring bits.
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#60 GrassyKnollington
However, such a T-shirt would then allow Murphy to claim he had a more accurate prediction of UK economic growth in 2011 than Darling.
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#56 deanthetory
"Could this be another apology heading Big Alex's direction?"
Another apology to "Big Alex"? Maybe you can supply a quote for when the first apology was made to "Big Alex?"
If you mean that apology for an apology that Brian Taylor made to some of his blog contributors the other day then it's a case of "Shurely shum mishtake?"
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Jim Murphy should certainly be looking for a new job, Eastwood is a least one seat the Tories look to be taking. I believe that Annabel Goldie is being urged to stand for the westmidden seat?
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#59 bighullabaloo,
Mr T probably bumped into FM in the winding corridors of parly and said "Sorry pal." I don't see he needed to tell us about it.
You know anyway a lie (or gaffe) is halfway around the world before the truth has got its boots on. Even if they forced him to jog about Embra with a sandwich board on saying "I'm No' Guid At Maths, Sorry Alex" or perform a public act of Maoist self criticism live on BBC Scotland while dressed in a dunce cap people would forget that bit and remember "that time Salmond got his maths wrong."
We're probably doing our bit to keep it alive by talking about it here anyway.
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66. bighullabaloo
The first apology was the one he referenced at FMQs today.
(lol, Shurely shum mishtake?)
But as for her being told to stand for Renfreshire East westminter that would be good but its Richard Cook again (sigh).
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Jim_Thompson:
#20.
"Before Scotland joined the UK, they went Bankrupt."
The other posters have corrected your... lack of understanding about Scottish history.
"Had they not been in the UK now, they would have gone Bankrupt again."
Is this an actual home truth?
Is there evidence to suggest Scotland would have followed in the foot steps of the London Government?
It appears you have no evidence to support your claim here.
Let's discard this nonesense.
"Ok, they would have done not too badly over the past 22 years, due to North Sea Oil, but what about the other 280 years?"
Oldnat has stated some information for you here, but I have to ask, why do you see the United Kingdom as Scotlands sole reason as survival?
For all the historic success of the United Kingdom which you may seem exists, this has been wiped out. There is no success in this current moment of time, would it be logical to remain inside a battered country or look for something different?
You assumed that Scotland was saved by the Acts of Union, but should we start assuming that there is no purpose to the Union and we could be damaging ourselves, and for what?
"Scots make up less than 8% of the UK, and yet, they took by far the lions share of the UK Bank bail out money, which we are ALL having to pay for."
For someone who comes from Northern Ireland, I find your arguements ridiculous. Northern Ireland relies on quite alot of Government support, and when the banks were in profit during the good times, and paid billions into the Treasury for Labour to dish out to EVERYONE in the country, who do you believe benefited most?
"Before you start ranting on about Northern Rock also being bailled out, 86% of UK Taxypayers are in England."
Yes, who's mentioning Northern Rock?
"Stop whinging, we're all having to pay for your Banks mistakes, not just you. In fact Scotland is getting off pretty lightly, compared to the rest of us."
Like I said your arguements are ridiculous.
Scotland has nothing to do with the financial services, Yes even those with "Scottish" in there name.
They were open to the current climate due to Gordon Brown's, Yes BRITAIN'S regulations... one of the main reasons we are ALL suffering now.
I suggest you stop your ridulous claims of the United Kingdom saving Scotland, there baseless.
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I'm "confused.com", but then aren't we all ?
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#58 greenockboy
At this rate we'll be getting: "A laptop containing personal health records has been stolen from a man who at the time had been left lying on a hospital trolley in a ward by MRSA.
"When interviewed by a local BBC TV reporter the man - who is definitely not and has never been a Labour supporter - inexplicably challenged Alex Salmond to divide 24 by zero.
"When asked what thats had to do with the theft of a laptop, the man replied: 'Nothing, but it's a good way to prove the SNP are useless at running the country.'
A spokesman for the hospital - who is definitely not and has never been a Labour supporter - late told the press: 'We categorically deny we are in any way to blame for lax security. It's all Nicola Sturgeon's fault.'"
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Perhaps should bring up the maths problem and say sorry live on Scotland today in 35 minutes?
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#69 deanthetory
It would seem to be a waste for any talented Scottish politician to head south nowadays.
With the exception of the non-job of SoS for Scotland, one can see no possibility of either Labour or Tory giving any MP from a Scottish constituency a Cabinet post for many years to come.
Ambitious politicians are now much more likely to see their future lying at Holyrood, I would have thought.
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#68 fourstrikes
"Even if they forced him to jog about Embra with a sandwich board on saying "I'm No' Guid At Maths, Sorry Alex".
Well, for starters, maybe.
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#68 #75
Brian?
Jog????
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"Ambitious politicians are now much more likely to see their future lying at Holyrood, I would have thought."
A double entendre so delicious I could eat it oldnat.
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#75 bighullabaloo, LOL!
It's always good to see someone with the same leaning towards revenge fantasies that I have.
But I think this scenario could be improved by adding a. a ninja, b. a pirate, c. a paddling pool filled with jelly and d. a sack of cats. Not necessarily in that order, and I'll leave it up to you what gets done with them.
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74. oldnat
"Ambitious politicians are now much more likely to see their future lying at Holyrood, I would have thought."
Your right (at least as far as Scottish Tory Party goes, thats where my Knowledge derives mostly).
Annable Goldie might stand in the Eastwood Holyrood seat, given how close we came last election (depsite the squeeze on our vote in the mamoth SNP-Labour clash of the titans election). Its highly winnable and our leader ought to represent a FPTP seat, even if its merely a matter of honour.
Its like the recapture of Ayr in 2000, it was important to my lot, as before 1997 I think I'm right in saying it had been Tory represented for about 100 years at westminster?
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#77 GrassyKnollington
I'm too honest to say it was deliberate. However, now that you point it out, I'm quite proud of it - even if it was unintended!
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#76 oldnat, this is part of the punishment.
I can attest that he can be a nifty mover on occasion though, having once encountered him bolting out of parly as though the hounds of hell were after him. (I was visiting a friend nearby.)
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Bighullabalo.
http://www.ippr.org.uk/publicationsandreports/publication.asp?id=607
If you download the PDF file at the bottom of the page, it wil give you an insight of how the IPPR view the relationship between Government and the BBC.
Wansanshoo.
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#80 oldnat
It also makes dean's response to you more amusing.
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#81 fourstrikes
"I can attest that he can be a nifty mover on occasion though, having once encountered him bolting out of parly as though the hounds of hell were after him"
Was he yelling: "I didnae mean to make it look as if you're a numptie, Alex, honest!!!" at the time?
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#82 Wansanshoo
I can't be bothered to fill in all the personal details they're asking for before you're able to download the pdf.
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So who has got the maths right in the building trade employment numbers?
Is Scotland's building trade "jobs lost" numbers over 4% while England's are a mere 1% of " jobs lost" in their building trade?.
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#78 fourstrikes
I agree with all except I'd change the sack of cats to a sack of ferrets.
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#81 fourstrikes
There's a lot of latent energy in gallusses. I think without them, Brian looses his powers....
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#84 bighullabaloo,
I suspect he was trying to nab a taxi, but I like your scenario better.
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#89 fourstrikes
You don't expect us to believe he beat McLetchie to the taxi rank?
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#87 bighullabaloo
I'll happily accept that recommendation. Cats are rather nice and ferrets are not. Also, they smell worse and you can fit more of them in a sack.
Mr T, we're joking, honest. I like this blog and would have told you so if you had not been practicing for the gold in Taxi Hailing and Legging It Across The Road From Parly at the time.
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#81 AW
You may well have a point there. Sort of a Samson/hair thing. Or Popeye/spinach.
Unless you were suggesting I was witnessing a catapult effect? :)
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#90 bighullabaloo
Well, there was only one taxi left....
(there's usually two)
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#85 Bighullabalo
Im laughing my a$$ off here, you dont have to fill in anything, but dont worry.
Wansanshoo.
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#92 fourstrikes
If it's the catapult required then I know just the ticket.
I suggest Warwolf. The same one Edward the 1st used at Stirling.
You can look it up on Wiki.
Feel free to use your imagination as much as you like. ;-)
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#92 fourstrikes
I'm in hysterics!
It's got to be catapult effect ;-)
Do you think the Beeb could include a BT cartoon/running story board - or as you scroll through the posts, cartoon BT "runs" in the corner of your screen......!
;-D
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I have to say Brian that your views of Gray spearheading a Labour attack sounds as though you found his pathetic observations as bombastic and exciting.
It was laughable the way the Labour leader paused to think about his answer to dividing by zero. The questions and the attitude taken by Labour in Scotland is laughable. I am embarrassed to listen to Gray for his own sake. It is clear he has been told what to say. Talk about this and talk it up, not down. I admit the wee Darling has given an impressive looking budget considering the mess his master created by opening the rules and regulations Brown was supposed to have setup.
I must say Brian that you should be a little more objective within your blogs as you all too often come across as being too pro Labour. I understand that personal feelings cannot always be put aside or put asunder but one cannot find any dissernable evidence of understanding in Grays tact. Labour do not convey any conviction or competence.
Sorry if I have insulted anyone but I really cannot justify agreeing with anything Gray has said. He also sounds too thoguhtful, as though he doubts the very words he has written to say. There is no conviction in his weak arguments at all.
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#96 AW
I would pay good money to see that. Or I would if I had any money.
It would enliven the board no end. Though I think bighullabaloo would have to have him pursued by ninjas/pirates/ferrets/cats/the FM and cabinet/the massed ranks of the SNP/all of the above. ;)
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The Idea of Brian joggin about Edinburgh with a sandwich board conjours up picture of Rab C Nesbit string vest and headband joggin in one episode after he had saw a pink elephant.
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#95 bighullabaloo, how excellent! Does he get to land in the jelly at the end?
I found this on Wiki:
"Even before construction could be completed, the sight of the giant engine so intimidated the Scots that they tried to surrender."
And further comment is superfluous.
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Excuse me but didnt Wee Eck tell us that the Recession wouldnt affect Scotland didnt he promise us that????...
He said We in Scotland would not suffer and that the sun will always shine on us cause we are " Special" ?????
are you telling me Wee Eck was wrong ???? We have hardly seen or heard anything from Wee Eck and his bunch ..not a dicky bird about his what his former workmates have done to the RBS and to think the Numpty wanted RBS to run Scotlands economy ...he still doesnt have a plan to sort it ..does he ...Nahhhhhhhhh.....But as usual Wee Eck goes into his usual stance like the Tories he flaps his gums ...but have no solutions to offer ..so instead of everyone pulling together at this time and working together ..nahhhh ..Its lets keep stirring ...that is the only Policy that the SNP havent dropped and it is the last thing the people want ...because that isnt the way we do it ...we all muck in and help... we should be putting our differences aside and sort this out.....
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#97 Scara
To take a step back from enjoyable land and a step forward into political land, I think Mr T was laughing behind his hand at Iain Gray.
As are we all, for different reasons.
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# 86 losses in English in building trade only at 1% well the London Olympics buildings project is well on track and is likely to shield "English figure".
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#98 fourstrikes
I see a computer game... ;-)
Oh, it's a political blog - vote SNP!
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You've all just reminded me of something.
What a image it was to witness too. You remind me of Tory conference in Ayr when Brian was half naked and getting felt up by Mundell (it was blindfold guess the celeb). You've just reminded me of a really awful memory!
Blue lagoon I think the after conference party was called...
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Details of the funding arrangement can be found in HM Treasury's Statement of Funding Policy[2].
However, the continuing distribution of a per-capita amount to each devolved areas higher than that allocated to England still continues to attract calls for the formula to be re-negotiated. Using figures for the financial year 2006/2007[3], if a UK-wide per-capita average was a notional 100% then identifiable per-capita expenditure on services in England would be 97% and the Scottish amount 117%. Wales would be 111% and Northern Ireland 127%. This comprises all expenditure that can be identified as being to the benefit of a particular country. It does not, however, take account of 'non-identifiable expenditure', such as defence and debt interest, which are deemed to be for the benefit of the entire UK, regardless as to where the monies are actually spent.
In actual monetary figures, this will work out as (per person):[4]
England £7,121
Scotland £8,623
Wales £8,139
Northern Ireland £9,385
As these variations were not ever a consciously decided policy of the Treasury or Parliament this has been cited as a reason for reform. However, as noted earlier these differences are eroded by time, and at current rates of growth in public expenditure they should disappear in thirty years.
The population of England is 80% of the population of the UK. Instant abolition of the Barnett Formula, based on the above figures would result on an average UK expenditure of approximately £7362. This would be a large decrease for each person in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland, but an increase of less than 4% per person for England.
Although not subject to Barnett, there are significant variations in identifiable spending between the regions of England: [5]
North East £8,177 - 111% of UK average identifiable expenditure
North West £7,798 - 106%
Yorkshire and Humberside £7,188 - 98%
East Midlands £6,491 - 88%
West Midlands £7,065 - 96%
Eastern £6,144 - 83%
London £8,404 - 114%
South East £6,304 - 86%
South West £6,677 - 91%
Wansanshoo
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I have been skimming the posts and saw the Scottish Bankrupt part. I have my own theories and reason as to which king among many who playfully helped the destruction of Scottish politics but since the vast majority of Scotland march to his tune, I had best keep schtum ...
Anyway, I was giving a wee lesson one time on bonfire night and was asked by an invigilator why Guido Fawkes wanted to blow up The Houses Of Parliament. Well to kill King James of Scotland. But, I continued, just imagine if they had succeded. Just imagine how Scottish Politics would have gone. The very act of union would have resulted in a parliament in Edinburgh, due to the absence of an English one, possibly, and with the adventage of having no crown, well only for a short time. I think it is amazing how one little whisper can rule or rue the fate of many. And may I just remind the many Scotsmen who will clammer to damn my convictions against marching to a particular tune, the Glorious Revolution is marked as in English history as being the Glorious Revolution of 1688, not 1690 and I go to no church and hold no hate for anyones religious convictions ... damn, I am flapping my gums again. I once saw a "Scottish" band march, by the way, I heard tehm two and a half miles away through the Loon Valley. I was excited but found it funny that the Scottish bands were either Canadian or American, with a German Scottish band too (work that one out!) and my American girlfriend was moaning about the heat and that the fish supper was too greesy and the Irn Bru was too sweet. I know, I said, but it's good. I once had a Scottish girl friend who bawled at me for not liking her taste in wine or that I would not walk from one corner. I pointed out that the Orange Sash signifies Holland.
Jeez, I can blether ... Scottish History is fascinating.
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#99 rickyross
LOL, I remember that! Maybe that's the mental image I had ;)
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#100 fourstrikes
"And further comment is superfluous."
Except perhaps to point out why it says "tried". Edward refused the surrender and set up a nearby viewing platform for his Queen to make absolutely sure she had a really good view of all the "fun".
Re: "the jelly"
Unlike, Edward the 1st, bighullabaloo the 1st would magnanimously allow landing in a pool of jelly.
There is no truth in the rumour that I'd also slip the Warwolf operator a fiver to make sure he missed it.
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Boudica53:
#101.
"Excuse me but didnt Wee Eck tell us that the Recession wouldnt affect Scotland didnt he promise us that????..."
No, Gordon Brown said, "No more boom and bust!"
" ...he still doesnt have a plan to sort it ..does he"
First Minister Salmond has no plan to sort out what? The Royal Bank of Scotland that was nationalised already?
Is First Minister Salmond in a position to do much when it comes to banks which collapse?
Numpty, no, Salmond's not in a position to do anything because the Scottish Parliament has no responsibilities in this area.
" ...Nahhhhhhhhh.....But as usual Wee Eck goes into his usual stance like the Tories he flaps his gums ...but have no solutions to offer"
Hey, you know what, First Minister Salmond has shared his opinions. However each time the London Government do not seem interested, like usual, on talking or cooperating with the Scottish National Party.
It was First Minister Salmond who suggested we buy the entire bank, rather then the bad departments (HBOS).
"..so instead of everyone pulling together at this time and working together ..nahhhh ..Its lets keep stirring ...that is the only Policy that the SNP havent dropped and it is the last thing the people want ...because that isnt the way we do it ...we all muck in and help... we should be putting our differences aside and sort this out....."
It's too late for that. You have shown your dislike for Scotlands First Minister, do you believe you have now gained the support of the supporters ofr Salmond or the Scottish National Party?
Plus the Alex Salmond had invited Gordon Brown to a Scots Cabinet meeting, along with their Brown's Cabinet to discuss the economy which was declined, but now we have Jim Murphy meeting the Scots Cabinet instead.
Is this the type of cooperation you wish to see?
The Scottish Government were elected to defend the peoples interests... in Scotland! Do you expect the Scottish Government to carry out the demands from the London Government? If Scotland were getting a raw deal, what do you expect the Scottish Government to say, sit and allow it to happen, and when the people become upset, accept their wishes when it comes to elections?
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#104 AW
And what an amazing game that would be. :)
Er yes, politics....as I always say, for independence and a Scottish Soviet!
#109 bighullabaloo, LOL again! But given the current credit crunch you may have to double that ;) Or triple, for landing in a particular place.
They were evil bar stewards back in the day, no?
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And who said that Scottish politics wasn't fun? (Probably BT after this!)
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#105 dean, my (mental) eyes!!!!
I'm hoping against hope this never really happened. When it comes to Tories I'm usually for the "up against the wall, use a machine gun" approach. It's unnerving that I should feel sorry for you ;)
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I note that boudica53 has been returned to her safe "locked ward:".
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#112 oldnat, I'm sure he knows we love him really. Um. In a manly/womanly and non romantic fashion.
;)
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#101
Was it not Alex Salmond and Tommy Sheridan among others who were warning of the dangers of taking on too much risky debt? Correct me if wrong but I am sure it was Tommy Sheridan who spoke of nationalising the banks in the first place.
You cannot seriously protect Labour on this front. Brown has even spoken about the legislation he put in place to protect the savings of British people, the very legislation he slackened off to allow greed and the wealthy to flurish. The reason the two Scottish banks were hit hard was because they had the financial clout to carry London and hand out cash like there was no tomorrow. Never once did the FSA say STOP! They only told HBOS, your business plan is wrong or asked RBS, why did you pay that much for a failing bank? Even when RBS were buying up every American bank, sorry I mean US of A bank, that they could, no-one stopped them to verify what exactly RBS were doing with savers money. I am sure that it was, you know I have completely forgotten the mans name now that I want it ... the last conservative leader who tried to ensure that business could not reep from sowing bad crop. It was indeed Brown who rescinded his own authority into the hands of his deep and personal friends. After all, it is laughable how Brown was friends and confided in the very people we all now blame for this fiasco. The truth is that if someone had cared to acknowledge the levels of debt and risk and try to put a stop to it, then Britain would not be in such a mess, instead, the FSA did nothing and Brown contrived to tell us everything was OK and rosy in his world. How bright the sun shines from that great big crack in the back end of Westminsters Abbey! The fact remains fact, Brown, just like James, wants to rule Scotland from London with the storke of a pen and rule the fate of England too. I would get much enjoyment if his Fife constituency did not vote him back but I know that won't happen!
One more thing, have a thought for the gentleman who blew the whistle at HBOS on the level of risk and was sacked, paid to keep quiet and his sackers elevated to personal confidents of Brown et al.
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113. fourstrikes
It was a good night that one. And yeh, the relief was we were all very drunk (excuses excuses, but I'll say no more, thats for Brian to explain)
:)
Thomas_Porter you make a damn good point when you say "Plus the Alex Salmond had invited Gordon Brown to a Scots Cabinet meeting, along with their Brown's Cabinet to discuss the economy which was declined, but now we have Jim Murphy meeting the Scots Cabinet instead."
But do you remember the delicious early one liner - "he never phones, he never writes". More accurate about how Labour have treated devolution rather than a comment on the SNP, but New Labour spivs on the blogs will never stop spinning will they?
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#111 fourstrikes
"They were evil bar stewards back in the day, no?"
Don't be fooled by the veneer of apparent modern-day "civilisation".
If today's bar stewards thought they could get away with putting council tax non-payers in stocks and sticking their heads down the barrel of a cannon, they'd do it, and not even give it a second thought.
The way things have been going in Gordon's glorious socialist republic recently it might not be too far off.
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105. deanthetory, you lot sound like you know how to run a conference!
Can this be true? A half naked Brian being felt by a blindfolded Mundell?
How did I miss that?
Brian running full tilt out of Holyrood is looking more sinister by the minute!
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#112 oldnat
As a pokemon, Blogtwurp, who uses (in an enthusiastic seven year old's voice) "gallus-attack"!.....
I have four sons ;-)
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Can we quit with the "half naked Brian" talk, please?
I'm trying to eat my tea.
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121. I actually inhaled mine when I read about it!
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#121 bighullabaloo
Look, if he's running out of parly half naked, thay puts an entirely different slant on it. I'll have to up the certification for my computer game...
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This is a Courageous blog ;-)
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Brian, you've become the story instead of the host twice in a week. You're turning into Angus Deayton !
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#123 aye_write
Up it to what? "Unfit for human consumption?"
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This blog like so much of the BBC in Scotland is becoming a joke, praising Ian Grey, I listened to him and he was pathetic, torn apart by Salmond and Goldie. Only the Labour party and BBC Scotland think it was a good budget. Today the BBC were trumpeting the coal fueled power stations and carbon capture, a proposal put forward ages ago for Peterhead but rejected by Westminster.
Like many others I have complained to the BBC and once spoke to I think the producer of Good Morning Scotland who informed me it was the role of the BBC to hold the SNP government to task, so there you go, not to report the news but to hold the government to task.
I would dearly love not to purchase a television licence as i do not wish to support an organisation whose political views I do not share but unfortunately that is not an option. I can choose which newspaper i buy or indeed whether or not to subscribe to Sky television but have no choice but to fund the BBC, especially in Scotland to attack the democratically elected government of Scotland.
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Mods are moving swiftly, cheers guys/gals! Thanks for your help :) I know you have a multitude of boards to oversee and think you're doing a very good job here.
#116 Scara
It's an old Militant demand that we nationalise the top 200 companies. Mr Sheridan is part of that milieu and gets it from there. The Militant are the CWI (Committee for a Workers' International) nowadays and show themselves as part of Solidarity in Scotland and the Socialist Party in England and Wales (lovely acronym.)
#117 dean
A lot of revelations on this thread. It does sound lulzy but then you're a Young Conservative, no?
#118 bighullabaloo
I agree with you totally on the evilness, but not on the socialism. GB's about as close to socialism nowadays as snakes are close to mongooses.
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I was planning to watch Jon Stewart this evening, but this thread is turning out to be far funnier!
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#120 AW
Don't do that to me when I am drinking. I can't afford to keep replacing keyboards ;)
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To all...I affirm Mr Taylor was fully clothed. I, er, definitely would have noticed. And the taxi driver would have locked his doors and sped away ;)
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#126 bighullabaloo
Am I getting this right, do you....not like Brian, bighulla??
Would it please you if I rated it "zero"?
;-)
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Did Brian really run half naked oot of the parly in pursuit of a blindfolded McCletchie trying to find a taxi with Mundell in it?
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#115 fourstrikes
"I'm sure he knows we love him really. Um. In a manly/womanly and non romantic fashion."
Are you suggesting Brian, or us, are....celebate trannies? This computer game is needing a lot of revising....
;-)
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128. fourstrikes
Just thought I should confess that I had to look up 'urban dictionary' to know what lulzy means.
To all:
I've been reading on a couple of blogs around the blogosphere that the SSP are currently on target to recover a Holyrood presence next Holyrood G.E. Is there any truth in this (based on reliable polls?)
Since speaking of Sheridan, who rates his chances in the coming Euro elections? (standing on a better off out plank; I say plank as he's steadily been walking one the last three years!)
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#128 fourstrikes
"I agree with you totally on the evilness, but not on the socialism. "
Don't tell me you don't believe that "Alastair's my Darling" isn't really "hammering the rich?" The BBC is telling us he's hitting all those who earn more than £150,000 a year right where it hurts!
All four of them.
It's been interesting to see the BBC have actually interviewed all four of them on this website today. See "Big Ears", er, sorry "Big Earners".
Apparently three out of four of them are going to join the "reluctant expat" club and spend their days getting slightly tipsy on Chablis and sniping bitterly on BT's blog from a safe distance (i.e. a broken down Brittany farmhouse).
Whilst we're on my #118 I don't believe this is a republic either. It's a plutocracy. Those who say it's a monarchy well, I don't like to disillusion them, poor dears.
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#133 rickyross3359
"Did Brian really run half naked oot of the parly in pursuit of a blindfolded McCletchie trying to find a taxi with Mundell in it?"
Yes, I read it in the Scotsman.
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133. rickyross3359
I think you've got a bit mixed up in all of the various different threads flying about tonight (and some are rather amusing)
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#130, 131
LOL!!!
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(oops!)
#130, 131 fourstrikes
LOL!!!
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133. Aye. It's true.
Apparently someone read it in The Scotsman.
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1. Salmonds answer to the divide by zero question was wrong also. As Iain Gray pointed out the answer is that you can't divide by zero, not infinity as Alex Salmond said.
2. Clearly the economy is going to have to face cuts, we're in an economic crisis. Obviously Brown and Darling haven't helped with things, but what exactly is salmond expecting? During such times cuts, or efficiency savings, or whatever need to be made. The amount of money being spent needs to be reduced because there's less of it.
Therefore following his idea seems to be saying that the taxpayers in England, Wales and Northern Ireland should be subsiding us from suffering the consequences of this recession.
This seems a little contradictory to me, as frankly getting his way would be evidence of a Union dividend. But frankly I see no reason why others should suffer to prop us up.
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This is desperate stuff Brian. I can't believe the words courageous and Ian Gray are being used in the same sentence.
To me courage is Salmond and all the many SNP supporters young and old from who have fought for decades against the disgraceful slurs and lies pitted against them and their noble vision of a free Scotland. And who now on the precipice of this country finally and rightly becoming independent will have to try and salvage this country from the terrible damage inflicted upon it by Westminster.
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Can someone tell me if Brians opposite number at STV Bernard Ponsonby is the permanent presenter of Politics Now and what happened to Michael Crow? Did he decide it was no longer possible to be biased and be a journalist and leave?
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#141 GrassyKnollington
Does your report that someone read it in the Scotsman and believed it (Iain Gray?), mean that
(Iain Gray?) has to apologise to Brian?
you have to apologise to Brian?
rickyross has to apologise to Brian?
the Scotsman has to apologise to Brian?
Brian has to apologise to Brian?
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Having come in from work after staying late (I don't get overtime :( ) I sit down to bacon and eggs (it's Thursday, I'm allowed my artery panic attack) and read the blog.
Only to be confronted with the vision of a half-naked Brian running after a taxi with a pokemon chasing him with David McLetchie in hot pursuit, reading the Scotsman, with Big Eck booting IG up the backside while Auntie Annebel scolds them both.
And then it gets worse by the vision of a perma-tan Buckie drinking Glaswegian socialist in the EU parliament!
Time for some biscuits I think.......
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#142 NCA999
Congratlations.
You have finally understood the independence argument.
"But frankly I see no reason why others should suffer to prop us up."
That is the essence of the Unionist argument - that we need others to "prop us up".
If that is actually the case, then we should be ashamed of ourselves.
A country like Scotland with its resources performing so badly that we need propped up? - Obviously we need to dismiss all the politicians that got us into this position. They were all at Westminster.
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#142 NCA999
"Salmonds answer to the divide by zero question was wrong also. As Iain Gray pointed out the answer is that you can't divide by zero, not infinity as Alex Salmond said."
So, when Salmond uttered the exact words: "you can't divide by zero" at 19.55 into the interview" you missed it because you flipped out for a second into your alternative reality? Is that it?
You people really do talk the most ridiculous twaddle! It's as if you think we're either blind or stupid and can't see what is actually said in an interview.
Go and check the interview for yourself then come back here like an adult and apologise, if you've got the guts!
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Salmond: As long as we must rely on decisions being taken for us by Westminster, the Scottish economy is being pushed towards recession and redundancy.
Gray: When will the FM grow up and start getting on with the job of running the country?
(both paraphrased)
Now, how can the FM "grow up" when it is the Unionist parties that won't allow him to.
Embarrassingly, we have to receive our money from Westminster, not be "grown up" like other countries who collect and spend their own.
Iain Gray doesn't even realise he is ridiculous.
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145.
Oldnat freakily, it's even more complicated than that. Helen Liddle has to apologise to Brian as she had bet Mundell 50 quid that he wouldn't guess it was him because of the stockings.
Myself I'd be getting the solicitors in......
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#145 oldnat
"Brian has to apologise to Brian?"
Lol! No problem, he could apologise in his blog.
;-)
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#142 NCA999 (addendum)
Also clearly you don't understand the terms of the debate. If you argue in terms of "what's best for the UK" then you are arguing for "what's best for the majority of the UK". You will find that majority concentrated in the South East and Midlands of England. The reality is that the other economic regions of the UK suffer by those policies. Not just Scotland, but Wales and Northern Ireland and the peripheral English regions.
Salmond and Swinney articulate this on behalf of Scotland - that's there job. Wales, NI and certain parts of England also need a separate strategy.
The North of England has little choice - it is part of England, and needs to reconstruct the English demos to gain fair treatment. The other nations in the UK have an alternative.
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#134 AW, LOL!
This game is sounding better by the minute! I nominate you as Chief Programmer.
When you animate me, can I please have a block colour dress? I'm not into florals ;)
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#151 aye_write
"Brian has to apologise to Brian?"
I acn assure you that one day Brian will have to apologise to Brian and it will be a very sad day for him, believe you me.
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NCA999:
#149.
"Therefore following his idea seems to be saying that the taxpayers in England, Wales and Northern Ireland should be subsiding us from suffering the consequences of this recession."
You appear to be reading, only what you wish was there.
Alex Salmond has never said that England, Wales and Northern Ireland should subsidise Scotland during the recession.
However Alex Salmond does represent Scotland, and has no authority or reason to represent Wales, Northern Ireland or England which is why they fight our corner, and keep out of issues that concern the other parts of Britain.
Then again Wales and Northern Ireland have spoken out against the cuts, why have you choosen to pick out Alex Salmond in this matter?
Is it out of person hatred for the man? or out of hatred for the policies in which their party represents? or perhaps you attempted to join the party and the SNP said no?
;-)
Then of course. Alex Salmond has so far never said that they (Scotland) would also be able to avoid paying back the debt that we would take out against the cuts.
Alex Salmond is proposing we begin repaying our debts once out of recession.
It's politics really. Alex Salmond and the Scottish National Party feel Labour have borrowed for the wrong reasons, borrowed and as consequence we will witness either cuts in all services in Scotland or see some services disappear altogether.
It's a difference of opinion. There's nothing different about the matter simply because a group of pro-independence campaigners are saying it, the Conservatives and the Liberal Democrats occasionally back away from what Labour propose and other alternatives.
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"Well 24/0 would be infinity because you can't divide by zero."
#148 I just went back and watched it and those were his exact words. This is not a mathematically correct statement and so no I will not apologise.
#147 No I have not "finally understood the argument". It's a baseless statement to arbitraily claim that Scotland, unlike many of the "small countries" that Salmond wanted us to be like would not in any way be suffering as a result of this economic crisis if we were out of the UK.
Given that our two biggest banks collapsed, something unrelated to what country they were based in and entirely related to their performance on the international market (ergo would have happened in either scenario), I hardly think that we would be in a good situation right now. We'd either be like Iceland, screwed because our banks were bankrupt, or bankrupt ourselves having had to bail them out.
Either way we would currently be making cuts, probably greater than at the moment, possibly less, but the idea that we would be financially well off right now is ludicrous.
Therefore claims that cuts are being "foisted" upon us are equally daft.
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Please do not even mention the Garden party at Helen Liddells house in Kilmacolm. I think there were a few that got off lightly on that ocassion.
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Michael Crow of STV fame left to become a media advisor to the Tory party. Quelle surprise eh?
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#153 fourstrikes
A red dress? Can you wear that with your...hair?
;-)
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#153 fourstrikes
Stupid me, you'd have a wig...
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#92 et seq
Children, Children! Really! How did you think Dundee became the games centre of Scotland?
But to return to "Courage, mes enfants!" how should we cut our cloth to suit our new slim line purse?
Raise the entitlement age for State pensions to 70?
Pay a fiver to see our GP?
Make Civil service (+ MPs') pensions subject to the same rules as the PPF?
Scrap the fifth fourth crossing and extend the M90 to Kincardine?
Impose VAT on newspapers, childrens clothes and food?
Over to you.
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#135 dean, you sadden me. I'm at least ten years older than you and I know what lulzy means.
RE the respective chances of Sheridan and the SSP, Party discipline prevents me commenting. All I'm saying is that I hope to see socialist victories in the near future ;)
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#156 NCA999
You wrote in your #142 that Gray pointed out the answer is: "you can't divide by zero".
You've now admitted that Salmond uttered those exact words "you can't divide by zero" but you're still refusing to admit he got the right answer like a petulent five year old.
As I said, you haven't got the guts to apologise, even after making a complete fool of yourself in front of everyone reading this.
Do all unionists have as much integrity as you? i.e. "Zero"?!!
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#154 bighullabaloo
"I acn assure you that one day Brian will have to apologise to Brian and it will be a very sad day for him, believe you me."
Brian: The day has come Brian.
Brian: What day, Brian?
Brian: The day when I have to apologise to you, Brian.
Brian: I'm sorry?
Brian: No, I have to say that.
Brian: Sorry.
Brian: No, I'm sorry.
Brian: You're sorry...
Brian: This is a very sad day.
Is that what you had in mind??
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#157 rickyross3359
Level 2......
;-)
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#159 AW
A wig, natch! And chicken fillets for the, um, lady obvious parts.
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#161 handclapping
Have a raffle.
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Actually the Garden Party in Kilmacolm was really a barbeque but because of the "class" of people present and the location it became "Garden party".
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#156 NCA999
If Salmond got the answer wrong, what on earth was Brian Taylor doing yesterday apologising to his blog contributors for accusing Salmond of getting the answer wrong? Are you going to deny that happened as well? Go ahead, let's hear you make an even bigger fool of yourself.
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# 158 Bluelaw
Thanks for that Good for Michael Crow then, could not similar positions be found in other parties for Gordon Brewer and Glenn Campbell?
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#156 NCA999
You really shouldn't adopt the weak argumentative strategy of attributing to your opponents, things they haven't said.
It makes you, and your arguments look even weaker than they are (quite an achievement when you see what your arguments actually are).
You obviously don't understand the time dimension.
If we had become independent in the 19th century there would have been a strong economy based on indigenous resources.
If we had become independent in 1929, we would have had to deal with the transition during a severe global crisis as the UK had to do.
If we had become independent in 1969, we would have been in Norway's situation.
If we had become independent in 2008, we would have inherited the worst of the banking disaster that NuLab's weak regulation produced.
If we become independent in the future then our economic position will be determined by our resources and economic strategy.
Can you explain to us poor weak minded fools how Brown's "post neo-classical endogenous growth theory" (ie let the financial market do as it likes) has actually benefited the UK or Scotland?
Please quote sources to support your thesis - Unionist assumptions are so tiresome.
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NCA999: 142
"Clearly the economy is going to have to face cuts, we're in an economic crisis. Obviously Brown and Darling haven't helped with things, but what exactly is salmond expecting?"
Hopefully Salmond was expecting that Labour (of all parties) wouldn't resort to crude 'top skimming' reductions in public expenditure; as this will adversly affect the quality and in some cases probably even the existance of front line public services.
Salmond I am sure wants (present tense intentionally) to see real public service efficiency savings; which involves reducing overall expenditure at UK level spending- but not be merely cutting the budgets (slash and burn) But actually save money through efficiencies, greater productivity, or greater discipline of wages for a given number of years etc. But not crude 'top skimming' then attempting to play the Labour squeeze on Scotland as 'efficiency savings'; its a cut- not efficiency anything.
I'm sure that was what Salmond was expecting (after all, isn't it reasonable to have expected the party that made such an issue of the exact same fiscal strategy in the 1992-1997 wouldnt resort to what they condemned before being elected?)
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166 fourstrikes
fourstrikes: "I'm a lay-dee."
;-)
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#156 NCA999
On the contrary the statement is mathematically correct; please remember that mathematics is a very broad discipline which encompases deliberately modelling the unimaginable to see what outcomes may be produced.
In what way were RBoS and HBoS "our" banks? What has the failure of economic regulation, being a matter reserved under the Scotland Act, have to do with a) the First Minister, b) the Scottish Government or c) the SNP.
There is an argument that the banking "failures" were caused by the banks being too large for their currencies, would they have happened in the same way if Scotland had been part of Europe and adopted the euro? Has the fate of Fortis any relevance to your argument?
What are your preferred cuts?
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Any idea who said these words?
"Members of the Scottish Parliament were labelled numpties. The Scottish Labour Party was notable for obligingly selecting candidates that fitted that stereotype, while blocking more independent minds from entering Parliament under its party flag."
Not here.Tory plan to deal with Alex Salmond - the enemy of my enemy is my friend
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#164 aye_write
No, what I had in mind requires an understanding of the price people pay for suppressiing their consciences to the detriment of thousands of decent hard-working people - just to make sure they're own nest is well feathered. Don't worry about it, very few people seem capable of understanding the concept of personal morality these days, never mind living it.
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#163 No, that was part of the answer he gave, not the answer he gave, there is a difference.
An example you may understand. If I wrote in a history exam, Germany declared war on Poland I would be correct. If I however wrote Italy attacked Germany because they declared war on Poland I would be incorrect. Just because part of the answer would be correct if you deleted the other part, doesn't make an incorrect answer suddenly correct.
#169 Because Brian Taylor also got the answer wrong, and Salmond was much closer to the correct answer.
Apologies will be accepted on a postcard now :)
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#167 aye_write
We've got one but it's all being spent on the London Olympigs!
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NCA999:
Your whole comment in #156 is based on your assumptions of what would happen to an independent Scotland.
This is not debating, or giving a reasonable arguement against independence.
If I were to create my own assumptions that Scotland became another Norway, a country which has avoided much of the credit crunch, and has giant cash reserves then I would no doubt be told I need a reality check.
The same goes for you. It's pointless to create assumptions on the situation for what could have happened to an independent Scotland.
Nobody can tell, so let's stick to our current situation as apart of the United Kingdom.
Insane debt, and personal debt and thousands unemployed.
That's the reality of the situation.
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What kind of "party" had you in mind?
And what kind of positions??
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#176 bighullabaloo
Brian is immoral and a hypocrite in order to line his own pockets?
But maybe with his fancy poetry he is like Nostradamus and predicting the future in such a way as we won't understand for three hundred years.....(how silly will you feel then?)
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#177 NCA999
You do need to learn some history!
I'd have failed you on both statements. Germany didn't declare war on Poland. It invaded Poland with no declaration.
If you can't even get documented facts from the 1930s right, there's not much chance of your being right on anything else.
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#178 handclapping
I nominate Gordon Brown for the high jump - the rest can play ping pong (and tiddley widdley winkies ;-)
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#177 NCA999
You're claiming that when Gray utters the words "you can't divide by zero" he's correct but when Salmond utters the words "you can't divide by zero" he's wrong.
There is no difference at all.
It just shows how totally absurd your "argument" is. I can't even bring myself to call it an actual argument.
It's totally and utterly ridiculous.
As people here are pointing out, Salmond's answer of "infinity" is not an "incorrect part of his answer".
It's every bit correct as the other part of his answer "you can't divide by zero".
You're trying to tell us "Salmond was much closer to the correct answer" but either he was right or he wasn't. You can't be a "little bit pregnant."
You don't seem to realise all you're doing is exposing your irrational hatred of Salmond.
It's truly pathetic.
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#181 aye_write
I should imagine that in 300 years I won't be feeling very much at all but thanks for the vote of confidence!
The answer to your initial question is a resounding: "Absolutely!"It is precisely the reason why I post here at all.
Generations of Scots are being denied a better future because of these people. If you can't see it then that's just too bad.
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#184 bighullabaloo
But bighulla,
When it's part of a unionist's argument, it's right. When it's not, it's not right. It's a perk of being a unionist, that you are always right ;-)
(Sometimes you don't even need to explain it, just say "I sincerely believe" and it's right! Great, eh? ;-)
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#173 AW
LOL! But it's not fair, what have I told you about not making me laugh while I'm drinking?
Emily/Fourstrikes ;)
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#175 cynical
Douglas Fraser. I claim my e-fiver.
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#177 NCA999
"If I wrote in a history exam, Germany declared war on Poland I would be correct."
No, you wouldn't be correct.
You'd be making just as much a fool of yourself as you are by claiming that when Salmond uttered the words "you can't divide by zero" he was wrong.
Your problem seems to be that you think just because you utter something it must be correct.
The reality is that you need to go and check your facts before opening your mouth and letting your belly rumble, because you're making yourself look like a total fool.
Maybe that's an example you'll understand? Although I seriously doubt it.
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re 178
Oops, that was meant to be Olympics.
But given the way it's troughing money from the rest of the UK, London Olympigs might be a suitable description.
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#186 aye_write
"(Sometimes you don't even need to explain it, just say "I sincerely believe" and it's right! Great, eh? ;-)"
Yes, it's great, until whatever you're on that made you think that way wears off again!
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#185 bighullabaloo
bighulla,
aye_write sees it, saw it a long time ago....
;-)
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175. cynicalHighlander
"So Miss Goldie, doing her bit for the overall UK Tory strategy, concentrates her fire on Labour. So much so that it looks as it did yesterday like she is aiding and abetting the SNP."-Telegraph
Thanks for bringing this to my eyes cynical. This is pathetic nonsense of the worst kind from the telegraph: indeed the use of 'aiding and abetting' you'd think we Scottish Tories are guilty of defending some sick axe murderer get out of a prison sentence!
All Ms. Goldie did was accept facts as they are (rather than attempt to Gray-spin them); and sensibly ask "so what are you going to cut" given the Labour squeeze on Scotland is now well and trully upon us.
Indeed the article looses all credibility in my eyes when you read the suggestion at the end:
"but is there no mileage in painting Alex Salmond and the SNP as politicians who will invent any number and use any scare story to further their cause and excuse their incompetence?"
That is below modern Conservative standards; indeed the Telegraph may have been able to expect it in the early 1990's but not anymore. Its time for my parties 'supporters' to grow up rather quickly and accept that the greatest enemy to our people [Scots] is not the SNP (who at least act out of desire to always help the people) its New Labour- the sick love-child that was neglected by my party over 18 years. The extremeified new-blue ultra-tory New Labour party. Spin, Campbell and disbanding the Scottish regiments!!!!!
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#191 bighullabaloo
bighulla, you're funny.
Can I clarify (just in case):
I SUPPORT SCOTTISH INDEPENDENCE
Always have.
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#185 bighullabaloo
I'm going to get all serious for a moment and stand on your side. Partly, like. ;)
I don't think that Mr T of this blog is hypocritical or in the service of New Labour. I'd be surprised if he held a Party card. He's a mildly cynical journo and a good one at that.
I do agree that Scotland should be independent and the longer we aren't, the greater the danger is. It's worrying enough being ruled by New Labour. Imagine Scotland when the Tories get into power. And they will.
We won't agree about how an independent Scotland should look...as a revolutionary socialist, my vision differs radically from yours. But we're going in the same direction.
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re 190
Should we cut all funds to the London Olympics?
We'd probably save as much as scrapping ID cards. Hmmm, at least with ID cards we'd get 42 days and only 21 for the Olympigs. So ID cards are better value (REnomics).
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#187 fourstrikes
Terribly sorry, if I've made you spill some alcohol....that's a crime ;-)
I haven't had anything to drink tonight!
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196 handclapping
We could raffle the olympics?
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#156 NCA999
Finally bothered to read your post - didn't think it would be that interesting. It wasn't.
All that stuff's hot air. Do you feel better now?
N - not
C - concerned with
A - accuracy
?
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#192 aye_write
Yes, I expect you do.
It's great having a laugh and joke about it all but, ultimately, this is how evil actually works in this world - invisibly - under the radar. I'm sure you've heard the phrase: "All that's required for evil to succeed is for an honest man to do nothing".
I am merely pointing that out in a very direct way. In what some might regard as a too brutally honest way. But I'm really just telling it like it is.
You see people experiencing this sort of realisation every day. It's such a subtle thing that it's drowned out by the clutter and clatter of everyday living. But Alice Mahon, formerly of the Labour Party, woke up one day and realised that, in all good conscience, she simply could not live anotehr day supporting the immoral and corrupt Labour Party.
All I am saying is it comes to them all. Some sooner, some later. All those still supporting that sort of evil - whether politicians or journalists - are not getting a free lunch on this. They will pay a price for sacrificing their morals to make sure they've got their nice house and a BMW.
It's a bad trade. When the day arrives you would gladly give the house and the BMW, and even your own life to get back what you so callously and casually gave away - your own moral integrity. It turns out that is the only thing of true value that you own - or will ever own.
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188. handclapping
Will buttons do as we are in a depression.
193. deanthetory
I did leave a comment might put his blood pressure up if he reads anything other than his own writings.
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199. aye_write
You missed: 99.9% of the time
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In response to Brownedov in post 30
'Would anyone know why the votewise site doesn't have the Bannockburn info?'
We rely on an army of volunteers to notify us of elections. If we don't have it listed it's because nobody told us about it.
We need at least two weeks notice to list an election as we post an invite to every nominated candidate. Alas it is now too late for us to feature Bannockburn.
If you would like to list an election please volunteer to help here
http://votewise.co.uk/?more=volunteer
Your help in keeping this excellent free service going is both needed and greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Tony Parsons
Votewise Director
PS. More posts like this are also helpful in spreading the word.
http://votewise.co.uk/index.php?more=diary
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If anyone is interested it was the invention of the blast furnace by William Neilson of Ayr, latterly of Queens Hill and Barcaple in Kikrcudbrightshire, that really got the industrial revolution going as his invention created a cheap source of iron on which all the rest was dependent....
The problem with the Unionist argument defending itself since 1707 on economic grounds is it is based on a plethora of lies and part truths.
There is no economic evidence, given the natural resources in Scotland, that Scotland would not have been a major player in the industrial revolution. This is especially true given its large pre 1707 trade in coal with the Low Countries and the Hanseatic League which died on the day the Union was signed.
The ship building industry would still have happened because site and availability of a skilled work force. Most of the early Japanese Navy came of the stocks at Robbs in Aberdeen thanks to the acumen of the Scottish Samurai, Thomas Glover.
The Scottish enlightenment was not a 'flash in the pan' it was courtesy of free education for all initiated by the Scottish Parliament in the late 16th century which in turn lead to the demand for places at Scottish Universities from folk from all back grounds.
The problem with the Unionist argument for me is they are like kids looking the wrong way through binoculars.
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201. cynicalHighlander
You left a comment and Cochrane deleted it? LOL- that man gets more ridiculous daily.
Ha, that really is the icing on the rather irksome article.
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#198 aye_write
Worthy of the RE_master himself! Or a cut price offer back to Paris?
re 161
The trouble is all the really big money wasters are reserved; pensions, defence, benefits, Olympics. Our NHS and education are rather about keeping the pressure on for more productive use of the resources put in. The only things we can "cut" are capital expenditures. I don't know that the Borders railway is exactly the best use of limited funds. I would have thought electrification of the Waverley-Queen Street line produced a greater benefit in the short term and uses some of our renewable wind-power too.
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Someone referred my #146 to the moderators.
Erm, why?
I made some humerous comment based on what I was reading in the posts. Didn't give some nasty unionist or nationalist argument.
Just had a bit of fun for once.
Someone here needs a humour transplant.
Come on, own up please. If the moderators do decide it "breaks house rules" then I will be writing to the BBC Board of Governors for a full explanation.
It seems now that any comments referred are not reposted, since the moderators are scared of any follow up.
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#202 cynicalHighlander
"99.9% of the time"
Very good! I'd thought of putting "999 - is that to report crimes against decent debate" but I got all complicated ;-)
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#207 Neil_Small147
Neil, was it humour that was equally fair or scathing to each side?
;-)
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#201 cynical
Wowee! Chocolate buttons?
Did you read Gillian Tett in the FT on how Cadbury's chocolate coins are a better bet than UK gilts? Lordy, lordy, how de times dey are a changing!
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#197 AW
I have toasted you tonight, so you may drink vicariously (sp) :)
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#211 fourstrikes
"you may drink"
That has been known.
Cheers! We don't want Brian's to be the boring blog ;-)
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#211, 212
It's always the case, you go down the pub wanting a serious discussion and there are a couple of mad persons more than half fou and there's no sense to be had at all.
But talking into my lonely glass, who paid for Murphy's trip to China? Not that I want to stir up Anglophone or even broadcast it on NR blog but it could be a nice factoid for future use.
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Darling's missed the biggest Scottish efficiency saving - do away with all the Scottish MPs at Westminster. Scottish MPs must have the biggest claims for travel expenses, second home allowances, just think how much better off England would be without having to fork out for all of them - especially Superbroons salary. We'll happily deal with our own Scottish economy without having to listen to the crap spouted by the Grey Man and his BBC cronies. Brian what do you think the future holds for you when the inevitable independance comes - do you think you'll be remembered by the Scottish people as a journalist who was fair and honest or a Labour Party puppet and mouthpiece. I'll not be putting any money on the first option anyway. Why don't BBC Scotland journalists see that the writing is on the wall and start talking up Scotland and report honestly that the SNP are the only party who have Scotlands interests at heart.
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210. handclapping
No but dark chocolate is good for heart disease but not the wallet thats for moths.
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#213 handclapping
Oh, no!
Cursed, handclapping...
That's rich coming from you (see end of Anger management and others!), and I'm sober!
No ill intent.
Is it a joke?
"Who paid for Murphy's trip to China?"
"I don't know, who did pay for Murphy's trip to China?".......
;-)
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#216
Any more of that and I'll put the "Yes" spell on you so every time you ask "Does my bum look big in this?" the answer will be.
Was the China trip UK expenditure or Scottish expenditure?
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214. fifebirder wrote
"and report honestly that the SNP are the only party who have Scotlands interests at heart."
Not so much honesty as partisanship you seek eh?
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#217 handclapping
That's alright, it does!
Interesting question....
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#217 handclapping
Who pays Murphy's wages....
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#20
The sort of ignorant statement made by this gentleman demeans this whole blog.
He is obviously completely unaware of the huge and varied Scottish economy ranging from very successful hi tech industries, electronics and a vast high quality food economy in agriculture,livestock and marine harvesting through forestry to the whisky industry which is and had been worth more than the British car industry for as long as anyone can remember. There is also a huge expansion in the green energy industry taking off in Scotland and this is rapidly becoming a major employer. I would say that the scottish economy is in much better shape than the UK economy which was heavily reliant on buying money and selling debt and recording debt as an asset. In fact the scottish economy is very much like the economy of any other small, developed nation and better than most of them.
Scottish Oil, by the way, dates from the mid 1960s asnd was ther collateral used the last time a bankrupt UK went to the IMF for a hand-out.
He appears to be unaware of the fact that central Scotland was "the cradle of the industrial revolution" and for several periods from the mid nineteenth century up to the Second World War this area was the richest area on the face of the earth.
There appears to be some confusion in his mind. Does he imagine that the UK is not bankrupt at the moment? It most certainly is and it remains to be seen whether the UK will be able to service the huge debt it is now in.
The continued description of RBS as a "Scottish" bank is a political ploy. It is a large UK bank and 90% of its business is outside of Scotland. It is Nat West and Ulster Bank to mention but two of its divisions.
I am not alone in believing that we should have done what US did and allowed bust banks to go bust. The borrowed money thrown into UK's busted banks is lost forever. Far better for the money to have been invested in infrastructure, housing and other enterprises which would have got the economy going again.
There is of course no direct connection between commercial banks and the state so banks going bust does not mean the state is bankrupt. The Union of the Parliaments was agreed by a tiny section of Scottish society who had lost much of their money in the Darien Scheme. Tough.
The vast majority of the Scottish population were not affected by this and opposed the union furiously.
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No just a bit less of the blatant Unionist lies the the Labour party (and your lot) would have the BBC try to fool the Scottish people with.
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221. sneckedagain
"I am not alone in believing that we should have done what US did and allowed bust banks to go bust."
Normally I would readily agree with the sentiment proscribed. However I have reservations about letting the likes of the RBS go bust.
The unemployment that it would create; and the damage that it would inflict upon Edinburgh would have been very serious.
We Scots do rely substantially upon the "invisible economy" (service, and financial sectors) more than perhaps we ought to (but thats a seperate debate). The harm that it would enflict upon Scotland; if we let Edinburgh as a financial centre be hit for six wouldn't serve our interests in minimising the hardship to ordinary people.
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I'm still trying to understand the Budget. Taxing the "super rich" won't do much. In fact, it may cause more damage. I have never liked the socialist idea of taxing anyone who earns a good salary to death. These are the people - mostly - who create new jobs.
The Chancellor could have started by imposing a pay cap on MPs (if possible).
As to Trident, while I still believe there is a valid argument for a nuclear deterrent, this can easily be achieved using submarine launched cruise missiles, easily carried and are carried by attack submarines. So a reasonable saving there.
As to Scotland, I agree that there has been a cut in funding. But I'm tempted to side with Annebel Goldie here when she ticked of Alex for shouting about it and doing (apparently) little else. But I'm sure he will cope.
More schools being shut in Glasgow - is that for genuine reasons or just to scupper the SNPs plan for smaller class sizes. I get more cynical by the day.
#214 firebirder
The Scottish MPs may have large allowances, but I would argue that they are justified. I don't see many of them using a house five miles away as a constituency office and claiming for it. Nor do I see them staying at a sibling's house and claiming enough to buy two houses in Scotland.
And if you are a true nationalist, please learn to spell I-N-D-E-P-E-N-D-E-N-C-E otherwise oldnat will be giving you detention.
Back onto the Budget. Am I the only one who is thinking that is deliberately having major cuts in 2 years time, since Labour now expect to lose the election, and are hoping that the incumbent Tory Government may not survive after one term?
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My last comment was in reply to #218 deanthetory
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222. fifebirder
What lies; pray tell; would 'my lot' want the BBC to 'fool' the Scottish people with?
I believe it is true that 'my lot' are equally mistreated and misrepresented by the BBC, which is hardly impartial.
I agree with your general point, that the BBC ought to be impartial (as thats is the point of the organisation).
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224. Neil_Small147
"Back onto the Budget. Am I the only one who is thinking that is deliberately having major cuts in 2 years time, since Labour now expect to lose the election, and are hoping that the incumbent Tory Government may not survive after one term?"
I think that is a valid assumption- part of Browns scorched earth policy; currently underway in the depths of the New Labour bunker.
However the British people have more sense than to fall for such an obvious trick.
(I know most here do, like yourself)
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http://www.snp.org/node/15197
OK so an SNP commissioned poll, but Holyrood voting intent polls are thin on the ground at the moment,
1020 adults, April 21-22 - incidentally, seems strange to question before the budget too, if you were seeking to get "most positive" results. Perhaps you really can't buy serious pollsters?
Constituency,
SNP 37% [+6%]
Labour 30% [-2%]
Tory 15% [-2%]
LibDem 13% [-3%]
Other 5% [+3%]
Regional,
SNP 37% [+6%]
Labour 28% [-1%]
Tory 15% [+1%]
LibDem 13% [+2%]
Other 7% [-8%]
If you care to plug those figures into Scotland Votes calculation, you get variations around,
SNP 53 seats [+6]
Labour 40 [-6]
Tory 17 [no change]
LibDem 16 [no change]
Green 2 [no change]
Independent 1 [presumably Margo if still healthy and willing enough].
Encouragingly it also shows the SNP within striking distance of Labour at Westminster (in terms of share of the vote at least, generations of Labour gerrymandering is not overturned so quickly),
SNP 30% [+12%]
Labour 32% [-8%]
Tory 21% [+5%]
LD 13% [-9%]
Other 5%
In fairness YouGov is always thought to overestimate Tory and underestimate Lib Dem support - so things may not be quote as bad for Tavish and CleggOver as this suggests.
Worth mentioning again this was (overwhelmingly) before budget disaster which sent shocks through the markets, and got me wondering as to whether it would be best to transfer all cash to the US while the pound is still worth something.
Ultimately we'll see, but there are some interesting numbers in there.
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We are broke, bankrupt, out of money. The UK Govt wants to load us all with 22000 worth of debt each. That's 110,000 for aye_write and her family. It's 22000 for Brian Souter and its 22000 for the next 16 year old with a drug problem and no qualifications who signs on.
What are we going to do without to pay it back or are we going to leave it to our kids along with our copy of Abba's Greatest Hits and a hope they'll look after Tiddles.
You'd might expect that out of the 40 that have posted here and the hundreds that have read it, someone would come up with something better than scrap the Borders railway and electrify Edinburgh-Glasgow instead. If we are expecting AS and Holyrood to do this for us then we'd better shut up about their salaries and expenses.
How about the NHS is only free till you retire?
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#226, Dean - "your lot" did say you would cut their (beeb's) funding officially and very publicly. Just saying.
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20. At 4:08pm on 23 Apr 2009, Jim_Thompson
Can you please get your facts correct. The banks were not entirely Scottish - a major part was English. Check the map and find out where Halifax is for starters.
I have to agree with most of sneckedagain's comments at #221. I don't normally agree with many of his comments, but I cannot stand ignorant uneducated xenophobic comments. Scotland is not the highest receiver of subsidies in the UK. I agree that things should be reviewed, but London would not survive on its own. Not exactly many farms in the City is there?
The oil is the one thing that is helping the UK stay afloat. Now I'm not saying that Scotland would not have suffered if independent - no one can state that for certain, but the oil would have helped support, even if the prices are bouncing up and down.
As to Labour being in power - it was ENGLISH voters who ensured that Labour gained and retained power. Scotland does not have enough Westminister constituencies for any party to gain a majority.
I'm not yet convinced by independence for Scotland at this moment, as I feel our parliament - regardless of political leanings - is still immature. But divisions raised by people like yourself will only push the independence argument forward.
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#224 Neil_Small147
"otherwise oldnat will be giving you detention."
Oh that I could!
But who would take on detention duty for such a large number of people?
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#224 Neil_Small147
Scottish MPs large allowances may be justified but are a waste of money when we could govern ourselves without sending anyone to Westminster. Thanks for the spelling lesson but ye jist burnt yirself by misspelling my name - Fife not Fire.
#222 deanthetory
We got the same manipulation of the truth and blatant lies from the BBC when the Tory's were pulling their strings especially in the Thatcher years. At least Bella has got some sense of realism and fairness about her - she realises that independence (alright Neil) isnae far away and she's going to have to live with it. God I must be going soft, praising a Tory.
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233. fifebirder
If your still in a charitable mood Fifebird, the Thatcher years were 17 years ago, and alot has changed since 1997. Especially in regards to my lots attitudes to the BBC.
We simply don't like its politicisation of news under the banner of impartiality anymore than any other non-new labour party does.
But auntie annabel is probably one of our best Scottish Tories to appear (leading us up here) for many, many many years.
And she has won a major concession for Scottish Toryism- the right to sit in every cabinet meeting of the UK Cons (in or out of gov.) That alone shall help avoid returning to an apologists' role which we were resigned to increasingly under those 18 years.
But as an afterthought, which actual examples are there of 'my lot' manipulating BBC reporting during the 18 years (Just so I can go and have a gander over it all, it never hurts to know all details- especially if your like me and born at the tail end of the 80's- too young to know through experience).
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Our poor politicians. Real questions to be asked, proper preferences to be deided and the people who elected them to represent them just stand about shuffling there feet,heads hung and saying it wusne me.
People, it's coming, not to a nation near you, not to a capital near you or a town or the next street but to your house. It's like you are on 23000 and it drops to 21850 overnight, the price of food and petrol are going up and you've got the mortgage to pay. What are you going to cut?
Alright the quad bike can go, (that's Westminsters bit) but there's still the what can we do without in the housekeeping (and that is Holyroods problem).
Give the MSPs a break; start the ball rolling on ideas that will make a difference.
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We just wish the Scots would summon up the courage to vote for independence, but of course that has never been the real aim of the nationalists.
The Scottish collective national persona is crofter Macakeneatit. They want their own cake while eating the English cake.
The SNP is a joke. When it looked like it might achieve any kind of power it changed its manifesto from an immediate independence referendum to one in 2010. The excuse was "to give the SNP a chance to show the Scottish people it could govern". The real aim was to get as much English taxes shovelled into Scotland before any referendum. We in England doubt the referendum will happen and if it does it will be watered down with questions about confederalism.
What a sham.
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The SNP should change its name to 'Subsidies Now Please' although it wouldn't have the manners to say please.
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#236, 237
No wonder when elected by the English, Tony Blair cried "Education, Education, Education.".
Another Nu-Labour promise broken then.
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#236, 237
He could have cried "Manners, Manners, Manners." with the same result.
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#214 fifebirder
I suspect you may not be 100 percent serious, but that's never a handicap in my book ;)
The idea that cutting Scottish MPs' allowance would save any money that would translate into a noticeable benefit for anyone is a laughable one. I've been reading the Have Your Say comments on the Budget and they are on a similar (mad) level. If you abolished all the Scottish MP posts tomorrow, the English taxpayer would notice nowt as the sums involved are so tiny. This is not a good argument for independence.
#234 dean
I'd probably start with the "oxygen of publicity" thing for bias, one of the daftest decisions of the Thatcher years in re Beeb. Having said that I remember the moaning at the time about how lefty the BBC was - I've got a pal who works for the BBC and he points out that it doesn't exist to make the gov't of the day happy, whether that gov't is SNP, Con or NuLab. It's not North Korean state TV. There are always complaints, and would be no matter what party was in power.
News is political. There's no way around that. When the Beeb tries to remain impartial by using "dissident factions" "insurgents" "militants" and the like, the right complains that it hasn't used "evil terrorists" thus proving the BBC's pro terrorist bias. Whenever a member of Scotland's governing party's held to account, the commenters here complain of the BBC's pro Labour bias. How healthy would the Beeb be if it reflected the politics in your head? It's not a state broadcaster in that sense.
I say this as a Trot who reckons that the organs of the State are all biased. I'm just saying that a lot of commentators here aren't arguing for a lack of bias, they're arguing for an overt bias in favour of the party they like.
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#236 StephenGash
All this talk of cake is making me hungry :)
I have no reason to doubt the SNP goal was exactly what they said it was. Make the people like the party, then go for the independence vote. It's classic pol tactics. English taxes are good conspiracy theory, but not realpolitik.
#224 Neil
While I'm experiencing this bout of insomnia (I hope no poor mod has to check these at this time in the morning) the "creating more jobs" thing for most over £150,000 is a myth, really. Loads of those guys are the equivalent of middle management in places where cash is thrown about willy nilly (um banks). They're not the bold John Galt types people believe them to be. Even if that were a good thing, these are not the Atlases you're looking for.
I've seen the argument very often (and recently on the HYS boards) that civil servants on £150,000 or above are responsible for various evils. Maybe so, but in Scotland they're a very rare breed. We're not exactly overburdened with SG officials earning £150k plus....there are a handful, but earnings in the civil service aren't what people think they are.
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#200 bighullabaloo
I have great respect for Alice Mahon and reading your posts I'm getting a lot of respect for you too. We will not agree but you are a person who stands up for his/her beliefs.
How are you defining evil, though? I'm intrigued for a number of reasons.
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
After watching FMQs I would have to agree with Brian's comment that Iain Gray was being 'courageous' (within the context of 'Yes, Minister'). Did I detect Brian laughing when he mentioned this to the person he was interviewing after FMQs? (I forget that person's name.) I suspect that Brian was being just a wee bit ironic. This maybe why his back was turned to us during the interview.
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More On The Barnett Formula.
In recent years, the application of the Barnett Formula appears to be partial with some funding subject to 'formula bypass' and with Scotland not always treated in a fair and reasonable manner. An example is the allocation of development and regeneration expenditure tied to the London Olympics and expenditure on prisons in England, from which Scotland did not receive appropriate consequential funding.
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Wansanshoo.
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I've just quickly scanned the postings and I would appreciate some of whatever you lot have been taking. I was totally lost on some of the postings. I might have to re-read them to try and get a handle on this joke.
I see that Jim_Thomson hasn't come back with an apology. I hope that Bighullabaloo has added him to his ever growing list. ;)
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Watched Brewer interview Swinney on Newsnight last night and thought Brewer's manner was one of disdain from the off.
Brewer seemed to be genuinely upset, even angry, at the stance taken by the SNP who are complaining about the cuts imposed by Westminster.
Brewer's line seemed to be that there are cuts being itroduced to all areas of the UK and that the Treasury were hardly likely to change their minds for Scotland.
If we extend Brewers logic then there is now no point in complaining about things over which you have no control, opposition parties and camoaign groups should just shut up. I don't recall Brewer taking the same tone with Labour Westminster MP's who continually criticise Scottish Government policies.
Again I have to say that Brewer appeared to let his own emotions get into the way of the interview as he tutted humphed and could be heard making all sorts of disrespectfull and dismissive noises when swinney was speaking.
Now, contrast his demeanour with Swinney to that of Alf Young, the former top Labour party researcher who now writes business articles for The Herald. No haruanging of Alf over Alistair Darling's widely derided growth predictions of 2010/2011.
Instead we had Alf desperately trying to lend credibility to the figures, with Brewer giggling like a demented and excited schoolboy. "I love your optimism" a chuckling Brewer said to Alf at the end of the interview.
To me this looked like the behaviour of people who know the games up for Labour, in Brewers case his anger at the SNP was reminiscent of Glen Campbell at his worst.
My opinion is that we are witnessing the realisation from some in the media that Labour are dead. Their manner towards the SNP is one of bitterness and annoyance because they know the SNP are the only beneficiaries in Scotland.
It's dawning on them that they are powerless to prevent change, so their mask is slowly slipping.
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The Highland Council will be counting votes from the Inverness West by-election from 10:00 BST and expect to announce the result at lunch time.
#228 pattymkirkwood
Thanks for the info on the new YouGov poll, Patty. YouGov aren't showing the full details yet, but the Herald have a better than usual report on it with their Pressure piles on Labour as the SNP power ahead in the polls.
One can but agree with their: "This is a poll that is far more Glasgow East than Glenrothes, the best for the SNP since the autumn and a shift of seismic proportions within one month."
Had it mentioned the Glenrothes register problems, it would have been pretty fair comment.
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#236
Put your bigotry to one side for a minute and actually look at the evidence. It's Unionists who spread misinformation regarding the viability (or otherwise) of an independent Scotland. It's Westminster MPs who come north of the border and tell Scots that they're too poor, too wee and too stupid to run their own country (Vince Cable being the latest example at the recent LibDum conference).
The nationalists have an uphill struggle to try and get the positive arguments out there. With a hostile media (including the 'impartial' beeb), mostly controlled from London, I might add, who really is delaying independence. Media controlled from London, MPs from London spreading disinformation, Unionists controlled from London telling Scots independence isn't viable - isn't your problem actually London? Wouldn't have anything to do with London being the highest subsidised part of the UK, now, would it?
As usual, your bile is aimed at the wrong target. But then, you're such a bigot, you just can't recognise that.
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#247
I don't know, greenockboy. Gordon Brewer is no Glen Campbell, a man who just can't hide his hatred for all things nationalist and who wears his Unionist credentials on his sleave for all to see.
Brewer has always struck me as quite impartial and, last night, Swinney didn't make a good showing for himself, despite Brewer giving him several chances to make a coherent argument. When asked was Scotland (as a department of government spending) being hit harder or more unfairly than other government 'departments', Swinney could have gave the argument that our very own BT gave above. Instead he rambled on about cuts during a recession are bad, the IMF disagrees with the Chancellor's predictions, all pertinent but less than headline grabbing assertions that in no way showed Scotland will be hit harder other parts of the UK.
It is Swinney's main failing - a very intelligent (can capable) man who tends to fall apart in front of camera.
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The Herald's politics section is definitely rather better reading than usual today. Ian Bell's Word to the wise for Iain Gray: when in a hole, stop digging is a particularly good account of yesterday's FMQs, and wittily put.
More curmudgeonly is their editorial, SNP surges ahead, but even that admits that the results "do suggest that the SNP honeymoon is not running out of steam". They also take a neat swipe at Mr Gray with: "Effective opposition parties are led by figures with good approval ratings."
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Yougov Poll results:
Holyrood Constituency Vote
Party - Poll [2007]
SNP - 37% [+4%]
Labour - 30% [-2%]
Tory - 15% [-2%]
LibDem - 13% [-3%]
Other - 5% [3%]
Holyrood Regional Vote
Party - Poll (Change from last poll) - [Change from 2007 election]
SNP - 37% [+6%]
Labour - 28% [-1%]
Tory - 15% 1%]
LibDem - 13% [2%]
Other - 7% [-8%]
Which ONE, if any, of the following Scottish Political leaders do you think would make the best First Minister?
Alex Salmond - 36%
Annabelle Goldie - 10%
Iain Gray - 7%
Tavish Scott - 4%
Patrick Harvie - 1%
* Thinking about the performance of the UK Labour Government and the Scottish SNP Government over the past year which do you think cares MOST about the needs and interests of you and your family?
Scottish Government - 44%
UK Government - 22%
Neither - 26%
Dont know - 7%
If this Iain Gray and the Scottish Labour doing well at Holyrood as Brian Taylor has been telling us for months, then God help them.
BBC Scotland are backing a loser on this one.
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Its Interesting to watch Ian gray and Alex salmond sparring with the budget. It is however futile when cosidering its a Westminster matter.
What is important is the new yougov poll showing the SNP have gained a lot of support from the Scottish public. If this new poll is to be believed then Ian Gray has succeeded in stabilising Labours political descent.
The problem lies within Labour as a whole, Ian Gray is a better opposition party leader than Wendy ever was however he cannot be seen to be doing too much without the full backing of the Labour party UK. This is the dilema affecting Ian Gray.
For the most part ordinary working folks in Scotland are focused on whats important to their everyday lives, local services like education, healthcare, housing, and policing. All of which is handled within Holyrood and many Scottish MPs in westminster really fear that they are becoming more and more an irrelevance to the everyday aspirations of the scottish people. We rarely see Scottish Mps on tv anymore, but We do see the scottish MEPs quite regularly.
Ian Gray is being hampered by the Labour MPs who are afraid of obscurity and therefore wont let him perform as he would like. This in the end will lead to dissallusion between the public and Labour. Leaving only the SNP to fill the gap.
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'Barnett Formula Bypass'
The Olympic Stadium will also be the location for a new secondary school along with a national skills academy for the sport and leisure industry and a centre for the English Institute of Sport.
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The 2012 Olympics are paid for by all UK taxpayers and is not subjected to the Barnett Formula rules. Labour claim it is a UK event, on that basis is the 'English Institute of Sport' a UK institute under a different name?
Labour (short) Change Is What We Do !
Wansanshoo.
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Comment 250:
I agree with your view of Brewer, by far the best on the BBC. However, such was his manner with Swinney that I felt he let his emotions get in the way.
My view was that Swinney is merely ensuring that the elecorate know these cuts are from Westminster. Whether we are suffering more or less than others is (for me) a sideshow.
As I have said, Brewers line seemed to be that the Treasury won't listen to you so why don't you just be quiet. He displayed a contemptious attitude that was out of proportion.
Indeed the line I expected the interview to take was the ridiculous one put forward by Iain Gray and I'm sure that Swinney expected Brewer to take this quite normal route. It would have given Swinney an opportunity to attack the Scottish Labour line.
The line taken by Brewer was strange to say the least. Swinney could only repeat that Scotland was facing 500 million pounds of cuts - this he did and Brewer offered no argument against it.
The interview with Alf Young that then followed was as fawning as they come. This was an opportunity to give Young the opportunity to lambast Darlings predictions for growth, if he didn't (and it was no surprise that he didn't) then hold Young in the same contempt as Swinney was held in.
However Brewer simply engaged with Young as you would a close companion. He chuckled and joked throughout the interview and failed to challenge Young once.
We were left with the business editor of a Scottish quality newspaper having to endorse fantasy predictions because to do otherwise would have meant criticising UK Labour.
Brewer's nervous laughter suggested that he didn't believe a word of what Alf Young was saying, and that he knew he should be challenging him.
If you watch the interview you will see a clearly embarrassed Alf Young almost squirm as he is saying it.
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The Herald are saying:
"Alex Salmond, the SNP leader, has opened up a 19-point lead on Iain Gray"
In fact the lead is an even more impressive 29%.
The Herald are also now back to calling a two year term a 'Honeymoon'.
It is possible that the SNP are actually doing a decent job and people are beginning to notice. This of course doesn't quite fit with the Scottish media's 'narrative'.
Remember that one? - 'narrative', brian Taylor stated a wee while ago that the SNP needed to change it's 'narrative'. I think that the media in Scotland need to have a look at their own 'narrative'.
'Honeymoon', 'courageous', 'efficiency savings', 'PFI' ..... only joking, that last one has been dropped from the lexicon of the Scottish journalist.
Seriously, can anyone shed any light on the PFI figures and when they are expected to be placed onto the public accounts?
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It was certainly interesting stuff watching the BBC early evening news yesterday.
Sally Magnusson is normally wheeled in when a big SNP slagging match is ordered.
However, maybe it's a sign of change, or maybe they didn't want egg no their faces, but there was absolutely no mention of the Scottish Government, although there was a total news blackout on the budget and it's potential consequencies for Scotland.
The BBC are maybe realising that their future no longer rests with London Labour, and that a new beginning is near.
Maybe they BBC Scotland will realise that the Scottish Government is working for Scotlands best interests, rather than just working to keep Westminster happy.
After all, I can't imagine Westminster going out of its way to change something just to keep Scotland happy.
Also, let's remind ourselves about the removal of the lower rate tax band, which raided the lower paids income, and continues to do so, long before any increase in the top tax rate, which the wealthy will simpy find ways to avoid.
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or maybe the BBC just didn't have anything good to report about Labour yesterday, after the mess they've got the UKs nations into.
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For us expats, aunty has now got her post-Easter act together and yesterday's FMQs can now be viewed in the inline player on this website's Budget fallout dominates FMQs, also now linked to from the main Scotland politics page.
Holyrood.tv have also emerged from their slumbers and the session can be downloaded in WMV format here.
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#242 fourstrikes
I've said all I want to on this topic but since you've asked me a specific question: "how are you defining evil?" I am happy to answer you.
First of all - and this is important - I do not define evil as what anyone else tells me it is - no matter which political, religious or moral persuasion they may be. Sadly I've found such definitions usually to be tainted with self-interest, even though they may not know it.
You, therefore, should apply the same skepticism to my definition and the fact that you should is itself the clue to where the true definition can be found. Whether you like it or (and lot's of people apparently don't) you have to decide for yourself what evil is on a case by case basis.
There is no ready-made, off-the-shelf morality that wasn't crafted from the mind of man, and therefore there is no morality that doesn't have the hallmark of ego-bound, human selfishness.
Is this a "cop-out" suggesting everyone can decide right and wrong for themselves, thus absolving then from responsibility to care for their fellow man? No, because that too has the hallmark of ego-bound selfishness attached.
True morality can only be found by releasing yourself from ego-bound selfishness, which means putting yourself at the service of your fellow-man. Thus, pious claims by politicians that they are honoured to "serve the people" can be seen as the hollow sham they really are.
So, how does one know that what one is doing (or not doing) "evil"? By listening to your own soul.
Unfortuantely, those who cannot listen will not hear. They put their hands over their ears and shut their eyes. But still they can't drown out the whispers. Eventually the whispers grow louder and more persistant until a moment arrives when they are impossible to ignore.
For Alice Mahon that moment arrived when her daughter-in-law Rachel asked her: "How could they do that to people like David Cameron and his wife Samantha when they had recently lost their son Ivan? What kind of people think it would be a good idea to smear them?"
When Alice put that question to her true self, the answer came back: "evil people". And that was enough for her to stop doing nothing, and to take action. Regardless of what we think of her, do you think Alice feels better or worse for taking that action? I think she feels better. A lot better. And that is the confirmation that she is doing "good" rather than "evil". Good for herself. Good for other people.
Explaining by an example such as this is the best I can do in answering your question, because every example provides its own definition. But the one constant is that people always get such inner confirmation, and it is their choice whether to listen to it or ignore it. My suggestion is you do listen, because there is a high price to pay for ignoring it, even if that price is impossible to see at the time.
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Hypothetical question, should Scotland gain independence what would become of the Biased broadcasting Corporationand the journalists /experts involved?
Answers to exclude any mention of lamposts and piano wire please!(Though I do like the idea of a rat infested ship off the Somalian coast!)
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#240
Aye it was tongue in cheek but the savings were more on efficiency rather than monetary and as the English are always commenting on Scotttish whingeing we could do them a favour by governing ourselves.
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#261 Diabloandco
"Hypothetical question, should Scotland gain independence what would become of the Biased broadcasting Corporationand the journalists /experts involved?"
Hypothetical answer: you'd see the biggest tune-changing exercise you'd witnessed in your own lifetime, with certain media people uttering words you'd never have believed could come out of their mouth. When this happens - and it will - remember we should have compassion for the weak, for they know not what they did.
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Enjoyed this blog , some very funny comments :)
I think its clear to those of an independent mind
that the SNP are doing what is good for Scotland as best as it can with the kitty it has.
Labour are sounding like the spoiled kid who had his bag of sweeties taken from them, and doesnt want anyone else to have fun
More apparent is that some are playing at Politics and some are playing at what is best for the country
And whilst Im agreeable to the SNP its also good to have an opposition to keep them on their toes.
Id rather see and see it as a benefit to Scotland to have people rather than parties to represent us, Parties in this day and age are meaningless.
I look at the person rather than the politician and cant see any bad reasons why there shoudlnt be an independent Scotland, we could always run the North of England too and Leave London to be a country in its own right, much like the Vatican :) (ok that was just my own daydream )
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#261 Diabloandco
"(Though I do like the idea of a rat infested ship off the Somalian coast!)"
Ah, you're bringing back memories of my misspent youth when my expat parents were based in Holland. Good description of Radios Caroline and Veronica although they were off a different coast. Radios Sally and Kirsty, perhaps, off the Forth and Clyde, with NuLab's Radio Wendy operating from a canoe in Loch Lomond?
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Having exposed myself bravely to the wailing and gnashing of teeth that has been going on continuously in the NR blog since the recent historic recession budget, I have just emerged into the light of day to be confronted with the latest YouGov Scottish opinion poll, which, as you will be well aware, shows a substantial increase in SNP voting intentions and a substantial decrease in Labour voting intentions, which confirms an impression which I gained during my brief sojourn in the frenzied atmosphere of the English blogosphere.
For your diversion I have sliced that impression up into a concise five-part analysis, which, when I stand back and gaze upon it to see if it will pass muster, seems to me now to be little more than a simple statement of the glaringly obvious, although it will not be obvious to the southern inhabitants of the "Etat bananier", of course, as the francophone media have been enjoying themselves referring to dear old Blighty since the latest truly appalling public-finance revelations from the Chancer of the Chequer Board:
(1) when extremely deep UK government spending cuts come, the value of the public services that the UK state will be able to provide will diminish drastically so far as the Scottish electorate is concerned, with the result that the value of the anglo-union in the eyes of that electorate will also diminish drastically;
(2) the incoming Tory UK government will be urged by its core support to take the view that devolved government has become unaffordable, with the result that the UK government will not be trusted by the Scottish electorate to leave devolution in place irrespective of assurances to the contrary, which may be forthcoming now but not necessarily after the next UK general election;
(3) the incoming Tory UK government will try to restore the public finances by relying on rapid exploitation of oil resources in the claimed Scottish sector of the Western Approaches, producing an uncanny sense of deja vu for those of us who were around in the 1970s and reducing the dimensions of Scotland even further on the BBC's weather map, if that is even possible;
(4) the Scottish Government, with public support, will claim tax-raising powers over these resources, as well as the North Sea ones, producing an England-Scotland conflict which could result in the disintegration of the UK within a decade as Irish troubles are re-ignited partly in consequence of certain emerging problems associated with UK government anti-recession measures, including, not least, the recent unilateral delineation of UK sub-sea territorial rights in the Western Approaches, which has also mortally offended Iceland and set events in train of which we shall no doubt be hearing much in due course;
(5) as in the 1970s, oil reserves will be central to the course of constitutional progress. Unlike the 1970s, Scotland, with its own government devoted to achieving independence, will take England completely by surprise, as the latest opinion-poll findings, of which England is, of course, entirely unaware and in which it could not be less interested, seem to confirm.
As one of the more respectable contributors to the NR blog observed not very long ago, "Really, the English are generally so ignorant about Scotland and the many native Scots' current political apirations. One day the English will wake up and find that you've simply gone!" (JohnConstable, March 23rd)
Incidentally, as another contributor to the NR blog stated to me the other day after I had commiserated with a Moray-based former servant of the Crown who had confessed to having become ashamed of being British, one is to be ashamed of being Scottish, as England's current troubles are all the fault of the Scots, he exclaimed, predictably. To which I reply, of course, unhesitatingly: Vive l'Ecosse! Vive l'Ecosse libre!
This chap also indicated that I am to be ashamed of being French for some reason. What an utterly preposterous suggestion. They are clearly very upset in there. Anyway, I bear no grudges. Vive la Republique, . . . the banana republic of England, that is!
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#255
Whilst Brewer has never shown Paxman like disinterest for the proceedings on newsnight, not many would accuse Brewer of letting his emotions get in the way, regardless of who he is interviewing.
You might think of it as a sideshow but, realistically, if all government departments are facing spending cuts, it's difficult to argue that Scotland should be immune from these cuts. However, if Scotland is facing BIGGER cuts, and many believe that through Barnett we are, that's a completely different story and it's this avenue any argument could take.
I don't think it was contemptious, I think he was merely saying "what's your argument, well that's not an argument". And, based on Swinney's response ("it's no right"), he had a point.
Well Brewer can hardly be expected to only ask the questions that Swinney had prepared for (we want impartiality, not simpering toadying ala Gordon Brown and Andrew Marr. This actually illustrates a point that our Neil is always banging on about, the SNP needs to get slicker at these types of interviews. NuLab politicians at Westminster (we'll omit the Holyrood variety) are a dab hand at turning any question into the one they actually want to answer.
I think this was more to do with time constraints than anything else (the Swinney interview probably did run on longer than expected) and, at the end of the day, let's be honest, they weren't exactly saying that the budget was good news.
You're usually quite spot on when it comes to identifying bias in the media, greenockboy, but I think you've called this one wrong. You suggested I watch the interviews again to see Alf Young squirm. May I make a similar suggestion to yourself, to see just how many chances Brewer gives Swinney to make a coherent argument against these cuts. Other than, "it's no right", Swinney fails on each occasion. Unfortunately, that argument won't fly and Brewer let Swinney know that.
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I get the distinct feeling the realignment has already begun. The tone of the Scotsman has certainly changed since the Westminster cabinet came up on their grand tour; whether this is down to the recent change of editor, a genuine disenchantment with Labour, or even a simple calculation that the Party is no longer to be feared is as yet an open question.
As to the characterisation of the attack by Mr Gray on Wee Eck as being courageous; I fear that those who think Brian was betraying Labour sympathies really need to get out more. It certainly was courageous, just as the Charge of the Light Brigade was courageous but stupid. Did Mr Gray brace his shoulders and mutter here goes the last of the Brudenells before striding into the chamber?
And raising the infamous maths question again well that was courageous too but even more stupid; as even I can figure out the correct answer without needing to take my boots off its pretty obvious that far from succeeding in embarrassing our Alex, its the courageous Mr Gray who is making a fool of himself by referring to it.
No wonder Labour fortunes and credibility are plummeting
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Oh come of it Brian even this entry to your blog is so biased it makes me embarresed for you.
I have just finished reading Nelson Mandela`s book a long walk to freedom ,in his book he talks about the role the media played in discrediting him and the ANC,he says that he would read newspapers from different regions of South Africa not just for the news as untruthfull as it was but to learn what type of people read these newspapers and how best to counter the lies put out by these biased media outlets.
So just like the lies put out by the British Government through the media from the days of the the Indian Raj, the Boars,The Russians,The American Revolution ,etc etc today we have the fifth estate in Scotland which includes the BBC which are sitting with there heads in the sand while a Scot Gordon Brown does his best to strip his own country men and women of any aspiration and desire of a better life for themselves and there country.We have had over 300 years of the Union with England and its time is now up,whether it has been a Conservative or Labour Government at Westminster they have both taken the UK and Scotland to the point of being bust. Wasted our natural resources our young mens lifes ,Brian yourself and the BBC in Scotland are allowing us to be treated as fools by Westminster get out of the BBC village and see what damage Gordon Brown and his Scottish Labour collegues are doing to Scotland,and tell it as it is .
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Just a common link!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eyLrsu9YWo4
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252. minuend
Those poll findings aren't good reading for the so-called Scottish Labour resurgence (laughable I know).
What did surprise me is the first ministers question- could someone point out any other polls where Gray has sliped as First Minister preference behind annabel Goldie.
That did surprise me a bit. Especially how such support (if thats the right word) hasn't translated into physical support for the party.
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Comment 267:
Thanks for your response, thought provoking, you make some good points.
Perhaps your take on this particular interview is more accurate than mine was.
I still think though that he (Brewer) could have challenged Alf Young. Todays GDP figures further undermine Darlings predicitons.
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As pointed out by BT on an earlier thread, if the money is retained by the Scottish Government (or a Whitehall department), it is an efficiency saving simply because that money can then be redirected to another area. The money is not lost, it is simply put to another use. However, if the money is retained by the Treasury, it is a cut because it cannot be put to another use by the Scottish Government. Simply really and I'd bet New Labour (not dead, only resting, apparently) would be screaming blue murder if the Tories were doing this.
Also, are Andy Kerr and Iain Gray the only two people on these islands who think that the Scottish budget has been increased?
Additinally, I see the Treasury forecasts are falling apart, even before the proverbial ink dries: "The British economy shrank at the fastest rate in 30 years in the first three months of this year, raising fresh doubts over Alistair Darling's budget forecasts just 48 hours after they were announced.
"Official figures released this morning showed gross domestic product (GDP) fell by 1.9% between January and March. This is the sharpest three-month decline since the third quarter of 1979, the year when Margaret Thatcher came to power.
"The fall was far worse than the 1.5% decline forecast by City economists. It contradicts the chancellor's claim on Wednesday that the economy shrank "by a similar amount" to the fourth quarter, when it contracted by 1.6%.
"ING economist James Knightley said: "Today's GDP report again highlights how optimistic Darling was in his budget assumptions and that the risk to the fiscal deficit remains heavily to the upside."
"The downturn is forcing the chancellor to borrow £175bn this year.
"The data from the Office for National Statistics (ONS) revealed that output in the first quarter was 4.1% less than a year ago, the worst annual decline since the end of 1980."
And as for growth of 3.5% in 2010-11, if only, if only. I wonder what colour the sky is in Darlingworld.
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Stop Press: Highland Council have just announced the Inverness West By-election Result, with the winner being the LibDem. The turnout was 38.35% but no other details yet.
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Am I still the only one really confused over the truth in all of the political spin and counter spin?
Where are the 9000 jobs under threat? Are we really facing a cut or not? Are the SNP government saying Scotland shouldn't have a share of the cuts? Or is AS arguning that savings in public spending are not required? Or not just now? Or only in England? Or is he arguing we are shouldering an unfair portion?
All seems like school boys needing to stop and listen. It almst makes you wonder if they ever listen to themselves, or are their heads so far up their own backsides they don't realise how stupid they both look? One thing they never listen to the public who really want to see politicians trying to make some sense of the mess and working together to find a way forward.
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Latest Telegraph Scottish Poll!
Labour failing!
Here are the figures (see the analysis- good - on UK polling report)
Scottish Parliament constituency voting intention:
CON 15%(+1), LAB 30%(-4), LDEM 13%(+1), SNP 37%(+2)
Scottish Parliament regional voting intention:
CON 15%(nc), LAB 28%(-4), LDEM 13%(+2), SNP 37%(+7)
Westminster voting intention: CON 21%(+1), LAB 32%(-5), LDEM 13%(+2), SNP 30%(+3)
"In every case we have Labour dropping, with the SNP the largest beneficiary, albeit the other parties also gain. Asked who would make the best First Minister Alec Salmond is dominant, picked by 36%. He is followed, perhaps surprisingly given the Conservatives comparatively poor position in Scotland, by Annabelle Goldie on 10%"
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Just watched FMQ and was treated to Labour doing their usual , the Tories speaking some sense and McTavish, well, being there.
Most interesting are the shots of Labour MSP's behind Gray when he is droning on:
Kerr - budget, what budget
Curran - I need to get out of here, the Westminster trough is calling,
McNeil - bang the table, look alive...well hardly and as he spoke, the poor voters of Renfrew and Inverclyde must have been aghast at the man who represents them can hardly formulate a sentence..
I hope the newest polls are true and this flotsam disappears into the whirpool of oblivion.
This country is i think ready for independence and then ALL parties can get on with the business of what's best for Scotland.
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#275 northhighlander
"It almost makes you wonder if they ever listen to themselves"
The problem is a lot of them never listen to themselves, as I pointed out to fourstrike in my # 260.
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deanthetory
"Here are the figures (see the analysis- good - on UK polling report)
Scottish Parliament constituency voting intention:
CON 15%(+1), LAB 30%(-4), LDEM 13%(+1), SNP 37%(+2)
Scottish Parliament regional voting intention:
CON 15%(nc), LAB 28%(-4), LDEM 13%(+2), SNP 37%(+7)
Westminster voting intention: CON 21%(+1), LAB 32%(-5), LDEM 13%(+2), SNP 30%(+3)"
I think the most interesting thing about this poll is that is was conducted on Tuesday and Wednesday of this week.
This was just enough time for the Chancellor, the Prime Minister and the rest of Labour to put their spin on what the budget meant.
However, it was conducted before the media and other parties had a chance to pull the budget apart and identify what the real consequences of Labour's decade in power has really brought about.
Roll on the next poll.
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Argyll and Bute
Con:29.22
Labour:14.65
LibDem:25.05
SNP: 29.22
This will be one to watch apparently- it could come down to less than 100 to win it!
(This is all rather exciting, even Darlyings 'safeseat' in Edin. is predicted to only have a 1-2% majority based on these new figures, and East Renfrew is 1% majority for SoS Murphy)
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More bad news for Labour on the way over expenses.
http://www.theherald.co.uk/politics/news/display.var.2503941.0.Backbenchers
_grow_restless_over_Browns_plans
_to_reform_expenses.php
I was particularly struck by the following part of the report,
MPs have already seen drafts of the intended publication and the Labour whips office has reportedly warned the Prime Minister that when some MPs' expenses claims are laid bare, resignations and by-elections will be inevitable.
How many more Marshalls are there out there?
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Re 276
Dean
Annabel is only popular because she uses every chance to distance herself from DC and those around him. Because she knows that the likes of Osbourne represents the totally unelectable face of the tories for Scottish Voters.
So come a Westimister campaign and Osbourne and co get more of a profile I would reckon tory support would be more likely to go down.
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The 2012 Olympic Barnett Formula Bypass.
Why should the UK pay for London 2012 ?
There will be many benefits left locally to the main site, which covers parts of Newham, Tower Hamlets, Waltham Forest and Hackney.
A new 500 acre park (bigger than Hyde Park) will be available for the public. This will be the biggest new park in Europe for over 100 years.
New transport, including the new service from Stratford International to France. This will take you to Kings Cross in less than 10 minutes, and also directly to France.
Therell also be lots of new carriages for the DLR and Jubilee Line, the new East London metro service will be open, and the Silverlink line gets major improvements, not to mention a number of new bus services and lanes.
Around 9,000 new homes will be left from the Olympic Village or built afterwards, and up to 50% of these will be affordable, with many being fully accessible for people with disabilities.
However, the Games must also provide a social legacy too. It needs to give people from east London and Essex more jobs, improved skills and qualifications - while helping people to become more active with increased access to sports and healthy activities.
Labour, regenerating London at the expense of all the other regions with the UK.
Wansanshoo.
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#275 northhighlander
"You cannot cut your way out of a recession"
Alistair Darling, Budget Speech, 22nd April 2009.
So it is clear, from Labour's position, you don't make cuts during a recession.
The next question is:
Are these cuts, or are they efficiancy savings?
And efficiency saving is where you already have your budget in place and, afterwards, through identifying more efficient mechanisms of delivery, you manage to make savings. The savings can then be used to provide more of the same or to do other things. The level of svaings is unknown beforehand, so targets are used to aim for, but services are not threatened if the savings cannot be found.
A cut is where the budget is reduced before it is identified if and how that savings can be found. The savings must be found even if more efficient mechanisms can be found or not. Targets are not used, as the budgets are already lowered to the set level. If more efficient means cannot be found the certain parts of the delivery must be cut.
The Chancellor did not identify how these savings could be made and made it clear that there will be no more funds if efficiency savings could not be found.
These measures are cuts.
The only question that remains is whether the country will have found a way out of recession by the time that these cuts are in place.
On the basis that Alistair Darling thinks we will have recovered by next year then he may be correct.
Unfortunately, he seems to be the only one who thinks that this is possible, never mind likely.
If everyone else is correct, and that we are still in recession next year, then at that time, the Chancellor will have to go back on one of two things.
He will either need to change his view that you cannot cut yourself out of a recession, or he will have to cancel these cuts.
Then, again, by this time next year we will be in the middle of an election campaign.
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#284 talorthane
Scintillatingly clear logical argument and precise rational thought like that has no place whatsoever on a blog like this!
Apart from anything else you'll make them feel that their "selective distortion" and "categorical claims without proof" tactics are are so pitfully inadequte that you'll demoralise them altogether.
Although there are signs that is happening already anyway.
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Sorry for being such a rapscallion earlier :)
Considering Mr Murphy's view that the Scottish Government should behave like a Scottish family and tighten it's belts etc, I feel that it should be said that;
No sane sensible Scottish family could substantiate giving all of their salary to their neighbour only to beg for the scraps from their table for sustenance!!!
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Must admit, I had to laugh at First Ministers questions when Tavish Scott finished his argument with Salmond on the rate of first quarter decline in the construction industry south of the border (ie. 1% as opposed the more likely figure of 5%).
Salmond explained to him how to work the figure out and he was caught on camera mulling over how he got the answer wrong with a confused school boy look... Priceless!!!
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284. talorthane
These measures are cuts, and Salmond got it dead right when he pointed out the differerence between efficiency savings and real terms cuts (top skimming).
It is rich indeed that New Labour (dead following the income tax rise) is accusing the Cons for wanting to sort out the budget. What shocks me is the level of debt, most of it shall be structural- and optimistic forcasts are predicting paying the structural debt by 2017. This is the price of Labour in government.
The Scottish People have learnt this and want to see more SNP & Scottish Tories; less New Labour failure.
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An interesting sign of changing media attitudes is today's big piece in the Scotsman about how Kofi Annan was heavily leant on not to mention Alex Salmond by name in his Kirkcaldy speech.
Once upon a time not so long ago all we would have had was a big splash about Mr Brown the world statesman introducing the head of the UN. Instead GB got a brief mention halfway through the gagging story and even that was really only a feed to Mr Annan's complaint about how GB and his faithful sidekick seemed to be able to conjure up billions to bail out banks while bairns are starving in Africa
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As leader of the Scottish Labour party, Iain Gray must be one of the best politicians in Scotland.
I find this worrying.
When I see him on tv he appears to be uneducated, even thick.
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Re 284/288
Okay, we agree that the money is being removed before we get it. However are you both arguing that efficiencies of this order cannot be made?
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#290 bernera
How thick does someone need to be to accuse an opponent of making a mistake that a third party has already publicy admitted they didn't make? To save you the bother of working it out, the answer is: "as thick as a plank".
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#274 Brownedov
The Inverness West details are here.
The winner it seems represented the "Liberal Democrat Focus Team" whatever that is!
He got 1,503 (59.6%) votes, so no redistribution to analyse.
The others were
SNP– 556
Labour – 210
Scottish Christian – 115
Conservative – 111
Solidarity – 27
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Talking of "courageous stuff" I see the BBCs favourite historian Prof David Starkey has been sharing his academic wisdom on Question Time.
When asked if St. George's day should be made a public holiday he replied
'If we decide to go down this route of an English national day it will mean we have become a feeble little country, just like the Scots and the Welsh and the Irish.'
He went on: 'We do not make a great fact about Shakespeare, like the Scots do about that deeply boring, provincial poet Burns and we do not have national music like the awful bagpipe."
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PS to my #30 re Inverness West
Full results now available here
The full first preference percentages vs 2007 were (Total 2,522):
Well done the LibDem but the near halving of NuLab's vote is probably more interesting.
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#291 northhighlander
"Okay, we agree that the money is being removed before we get it. However are you both arguing that efficiencies of this order cannot be made?"
I agree that it is possible that efficiency savings could possibly be made.
However, the way to achieve this is to set targets for makings these savings before the budgets are cut.
Then the Treasury has work with the Scottish Government, and any other department, to establish which efficiency savings are sustainable in the longer term without having an impact on service delivery in general.
The budget should only be altered after this process to ensure that cuts in delivery are not necessary.
It is also possible that cuts need to be made. But if that is another matter, and if that is so then the debate can only begin when the Treasury admits that it needs to make cuts.
Then the debate can assess what are the possible areas for cuts at a UK wide level, looking at all options, whether reserved or devolved.
It is about choices.
The debate about ID cards or Trident, has to now include what services will be cut if these schemes are progressed.
And if we don't want these cuts to occur then the choice is to abandon these schemes.
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Re 288
What also amazes me along with the scale and size of the debt is the way in which Cameron and Salmond both have positioned themselves as absolutely blameless in the whole sorry espisode.
Seems so easy to forget of all MP's and MSP's none were predicting this or campaigning for tighter regulation of banks. Labour are in power but it is the job of the opposition to question and probe government. So it is clear that Brown and Darling have failed on an epic scale, but so have all other politicians.
None have had the intelligence to come fully to terms with this situation and develop the politics that are required to move on.
For example after the budget what did we hear from Osbourne and Cameron? A rubbish of labours policy and budget. Okay not difficult to do. But where is the meaningful, thought out alternative? Where is the leader in waiting with the fresh ideas? All through this crisis Cameron has offered little if any original thought.
In Scotland, surely this crisis should have been used by the SNP to develop arguments that show that this gives a great opportunity for Scotland to go alone. What could we do better to get out of the recession on our own? Where is Salmonds alternative proposal for how Scotland should get out of the recession independently? No new ideas, more rehashing of the same old rhetoric.
Salmond appears to want to wait until Cameron wins in Westminster and Labour are in opposition. Then when the inevitable spending cuts come the Scots will turn on mass to the SNP. It probably will work, but surely we can and must do better?
Labour have made a complete mess of things, but we need new original thinking, it appears none is likely to appear on the Horizon.
It seems to me that no-one has developed the post recession ideas on how we need to develop our public services on the back of smaller government spending. Some original thinking in this area is desperately required.
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#200 bighullabaloo
Yes, I know "what goes around...".
You can say what you like - as can I.
If it's persuading voters, the question I suppose is, would you be persuaded by your own tactics?
What is your "game"?
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#293 oldnat
Thanks re Inverness West - I had a feeling I might be duplicating your post. No news yet from Aberdeenshire Council re Aboyne, Upper Deeside and Donside.
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northighlander poses some questions:
Where are the 9000 jobs under threat?
Scotland, however the specific areas are not known
Are we really facing a cut or not?
I'm surprised that you need to ask; Yes, we are facing a cut.
Are the SNP government saying Scotland shouldn't have a share of the cuts?
Good question. The SNP are saying that the timing is bad. You do not cut when the economy recovery is in it's infancy.
Or is AS arguing that savings in public spending are not required?
No, Salmond has already introduced efficiency savings, however the money saved is ploughed back into public services.
Do not forget that an independent Scotland could have raised extra revenue against it's oil reserves. We would have been in a better position than most to weather this storm.
Or not just now? Or only in England? Or is he arguing we are shouldering an unfair portion?
See previous answers, however do not forget that ultimately Salmond and all independence supporters wish to move to a position where Scotland and England will spend their respective resources how they see fit.
One thing they never listen to the public who really want to see politicians trying to make some sense of the mess and working together to find a way forward.
Alex Salmond offered to sit with Brown's cabinet in order to sidcuss Scotland's problems.
The Forth Bridge funding proposal put forward by the SNP was a very sensible and forward thinking idea that was twisted and contorted by both Labour and the Scottish media SFT has been slow to get going, there will be projects announced this year, however it is now the only way forward as far as funding capital projects are concerned, yet both Labour and the Scottish media continue to attack it.
Throw in nuclear plants, ID cards, Trident, and you can see what party are defiantly holding out against public opinion. Oh, a referendum is also another idea supported by the scottish public that Unionist parties continue to ignore.
As an aside:
This afternoon's Lesley Riddoch show contained a kind of question time format. Five minutes before the end of the show someone asks "Has the bank crisis made independence less likely?" The misinformation and downright lies that three Unionists uttered in response went basically unchallenged.
What were the arguments?
We are part of a bigger system (??)
Small countries cannot cope
Iceland and Ireland given as examples
Only countries with large banks can raise capital. (??)
Lesley Riddoch did mention Norway to Andy Kerr, who responded that things weren't good there either. Riddoch failed to point out the state of the UK when compared to the small independent country that is comparable to Scotland.
Finally:
Margaret Curran looks to be electioneering already. Curran is doing the rounds with a suggestion that children be allowed access to the Commonwealth games for free.
Listen carefully and you'll hear the Labour candidate for the next election's Glasgow East seat neatly slip in the name of the constituency when being interviewed on her proposal.
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#292. bighullabaloo
"How thick does someone need to be to accuse an opponent of making a mistake that a third party has already publicy admitted they didn't make? To save you the bother of working it out, the answer is: "as thick as a plank"."
Either thick or completely deceiptful.
His attempt to use this story to undermine the First Minister was probably decided as soon as the interview was aired, and before the apology was made.
However, as a former Maths teacher he can no credibly have believed that the First Minister's answer to that question was anything other than comprehensively correct.
For him to then proceed with this attack only highlights how desperate his position is where he has to adopt knowingly misleading claims within the chamber.
Gray should be brought to task on this behaviour.
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#297 Northhighlander
"In Scotland, surely this crisis should have been used by the SNP to develop arguments that show that this gives a great opportunity for Scotland to go alone. What could we do better to get out of the recession on our own? Where is Salmonds alternative proposal for how Scotland should get out of the recession independently? No new ideas, more rehashing of the same old rhetoric."
I think you have overlooked the fact that Salmond, Swinney and the SNP have been developing these arguments.
Salmond criticised the Government at the time of the bank crisis for the one-measure-at-a-time-in-the-hope-that-this-one-might-work approach. He stated clearly, right at the start of the problem that the UK Government should be hitting the problem with everything they had immediately to protect confidence in the market. But they didn't and things got worse.
Salmond and Swinney have also been making it clear that Scotland is doing all it can with the powers it has, but that is not enough. It needs more powers to be able to tailor Scotland's response to Scotland's needs. Now the Calman Commission is recommending the devoltion of borrowing powers and possibly other financial levers.
The argument is clear, if Scotland is not to continue trailing in the wake of whatever problems beset the UK, it needs it own powers for its own distinct problems.
The acquisition and deployment of these new powers will show how Scotland can go it alone. But that is the very reason why Labour do not want any new powers to transfer to Holyrood.
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#297 northhighlander
"no-one has developed the post recession ideas on how we need to develop our public services on the back of smaller government spending."
I quite agree.
This is not just a problem for Scotland or the UK, but throughout the western world.
Some of the ideas are already clear for Scotland.
We don't need (or want) a "great power" military. It now makes even more sense to have a European Defence Force with the economies of scale, into which an SDF could fit in times of emergency.
While there is an obvious need for protecting against terrorism and other such activities, intelligence resources need to targeted at protecting, not controlling, the people - so no need for Labour's "Big Brother" approach of ID cards. In fact if we joined the Schengen area, we would have full access to the European database that tracks dodgy characters, which we don't have access to at the moment.
In a small country, we don't need 8 police forces, 32 LAs, etc etc. This needs a complete rethink to drive down costs while focussing on service delivery. Indeed the whole of the public sector needs to be refocussed on service delivery, not spending the budget - and its very difficult to change mindsets!
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Re 302
Well if we haven't hit the problem with everything we have got I don't see much else we can do, we are effectively skint.
Sorry I have missed the raft of new ideas on how Scotland would recover from the recession better as an independent country from Alec.
I genuinely would be interested to see some original thinking.
You contain no actual actions or policy that I can see n your post. New powers are only any good if you habve the ideas from which to put them to best effect. I would like to see these ideas ASAP.
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The Scotsman also seem to be interested in council by-elections, and are using four English ones to try to stay on-message in their Labour experiences gains and losses in first post-Budget by-elections. This is despite a LibDem swing of +32.7% from NuLab in Totteridge.
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Re 303
I agree that this type of issues that need to be developed and debated.
If the SNP stood on a policy of Independence with a rehash of Local government policing etc that you mention, to make these services genuinely accountable and local, with economies of scale realised in "back office" activity then I think I would not be opposed to the idea of Independence.
However the reality is far from this. No party ha even started this process. In Scotland this should have been on the SNP radar anyway. In practice they have centralised power even more than Labour.
However if the mindset of government is wrong to start with the public will never change their opinion. Public opinion is cahned easier when lead, from someone with new ideas to solve old problems. We seem to lack the leadership and the ideas.
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#298 aye_write
Sorry, I can't make logical sense out of your response. What "game" are you talking about?
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#294 GrassyKnollington
I agree with Starkey. It's time Scotland "un-enfeebled" itself by getting rid of the Unionist shackles that have enfeebled it.
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Still nothing I can find from Aberdeenshire Council, but the PA are reporting a LibDem win in their Lib Dems celebrate by-election wins which indicates the counting went through a number of stages.
Looks like we're going "new look" soon, but the new thread gives me a 404 error. Has anyone reached it yet?
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#306
What nonsense.
How exactly has the SNP "centralised power even more than Labour"?
Please give some example of this.
Presumably you haven't noticed that the SNP Government has ended ring fencing of council funds allowing them complete freedom to spent their funds as they see fit.
Or missed the fact that the body promoting Sport in Scotland has been split up and given HQs in a variety of locations across the country.
And so on
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#286 rog_rocks
"No sane sensible Scottish family could substantiate giving all of their salary to their neighbour only to beg for the scraps from their table for sustenance!!!"
WELL SAID!
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#304 northhighlander
"Sorry I have missed the raft of new ideas on how Scotland would recover from the recession better as an independent country from Alec."
northhighlander,
It's not about some wonder of a magic wand, you know.
It's removing tha barriers to normal operation - that's what we are talking about.
:-)
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#306 northhighlander
I like that idea northhighlander.
You may see it yet? ;-)
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#309 Brownedov
"Looks like we're going "new look" soon, but the new thread gives me a 404 error. Has anyone reached it yet?"
It's not working for me either but someone got through because it already has one post recorded. Strange, eh?
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#307 bighullabaloo
You don't post on here to persuade others of the vitrues of independence?
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Re 300
I am bemused by some aspects of your answer.
The 9000 jobs that are under threat are "across Scotland but specific areas are not known" So one might reasonably ask how the figure of 9000 has been arrived at?
So you appear to argue that we borrow more money against future oil production? Is this really a good idea? Surely borrowing against money not earned is what got us into this mess you appear to say more please?
Surely if we learn anything from this it is that we need better and more efficient public services. Not more expensive services.
Re the bridge. it seems accepted that the bridge should not be paid for out of taxation and not from a toll. I agree with this to an extent, but there is an opportunity cost here, in that what are the other schemes not funded to pay for the bridge and what is the cost in economic development terms for the communities affected?
In particular i am thinking of the A82, A9, A96 all key routes in rural Scotland that are now "aspirations" because of the new bridge.
So although you all bang on about innovative fundiong suggestions from the SNP i have yet to see anything that really works out a strategy that tries to deal with all of Scotlands transport issues, not just one.
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#315 aye_write
No I don't. Is it compulsory?
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Re 312
I don't expect a magic wand. What I do expect though is at least some idea of how we would use any new powers. No use knocking down a barrier if you don't have a clue what to do next.
Some vision, some clear thinking on what we could do. All of this is lacking, seriously lacking just now.
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#309. Brownedov
Maybe the emboldenone got through.
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Gordon Brown’s budget is a dishonest piece of pre-election politicking sums up the man's integrity.
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#317 bighullabaloo
Nope ;-)
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#318.northhighlander
"No use knocking down a barrier if you don't have a clue what to do next."
Its called getting to where we want to go "FREEDOM"
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Re 310
The much voiced end of ring fencing is not really true. Again it is rhetoric that is not matched in practice.
The concordat has provided council with more money that the SNP government has then proceeded to spend for hte coucils on schemes like free school meals. Only the funding didn't quite match the cost.
But the gap was to come form Efficiency savings. ( Apparently when decreed from Holyrood they are different than those decreed from westminster)
Also councils freedom to set local priorities by increaasing local taxation was stopped.
The now dead LIT was going to be set in Edinburgh for all of Scotland.
All of these things are centralising actions. By the way shifting a few bods from Edinburgh to Glasgow is not decentralisation.
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Re 322
Freedom always comes at a cost. I think I would like to know what that cost is or is likely to be first.
Blind Faith is a very dangerous thing
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Comment 316:
I'm not surprised you are bemused.
You appear not to accept that 9000 jobs are at risk, that's your prerogative.
On the oil and bridge funding, I didn't advocate borrowing, I said that independence would offer the choice of borrowing or not. And no, this isn't the same as borrowing against 'fantasy revenue' not yet earned. The oil resources are hard collateral, they already exist and are in great demand.
Similar with the bridge, the SNP put forward a proposal, whether you endorse it or not isnt the point. The point is that at the moment we cannot implement ANY proposals, we do not have the power.
Independence will allow the suggesitons I mention or indeed any others that you might even come up with.
The UK is bankrupt, Darling's forecasts being further undermined by todays GDP figures. Whatever lies ahead with independence will not be worse than what lies ahead within the Union.
So although you all bang on about innovative fundiong suggestions from the SNP i have yet to see anything that really works
Bang on? You were the person who asked the questions for goodness sake. Are we now to be criticised for answering them?
You argue that no suggestions have been put forward, then when they are you complain that you don't like them and that nationalists are 'always banging on' about them.
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I see that northhighlander is now posting assertions on virtually anything at all.
It will prove impossible to correct many of the 'errors' of his posts as he deliberately meanders from one topic to another.
For those of you who are willing to enter his wonderfully crafted but vacuous 'nebula of misinformation' I say good luck. Beware though, as you try to dismantle one 'factoid' another two will take it's place.
Let me know when he actually advocates anything, either a political party or indeed offers a defence of the crumbling union.
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#325 greenockboy
"You argue that no suggestions have been put forward, then when they are you complain that you don't like them and that nationalists are 'always banging on' about them."
What this highlights is the tell-tale hallmark of the abusive personality.
It's called "double bind". Basically, it's a case of: "If you do X I'll hit you with this big stick. If you don't do X I'll hit you with this big stick."
I imagine everyone has encountered this bullying tactic at some time or other. No surprise that it should rear its ugly head here.
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#
"Blind Faith is a very dangerous thing"
You might have apathy, if every explorer followed your fear they would of never set foot outside their own enclosure.
My faith insn't blind its built on practical common sense coupled with a perceived knowledge of what we are capable of without the constraints put in place by Westminster.
Murdo Fraser calls for portrait of the Queen in Scottish Parliament
Not for me.
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#309 Brownedov, #314 bigH:
The new look blog does seem to be coming soon. Previous posts are available href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/briantaylor/2009/04/">here, although trying to view the comments takes you back to the old style page and the enigmatic "Off the record" post still has a broken link.
Now that the dust has settled a bit on the budget and opinions are crystallising, just a reminder that you can all cast your vote on Darling's efforts over at Brigadoon. Hurry though, polls close in around 6 hours!
In passing: northhighlander, cheer up! I can't shake the image of Rev IM Jolly whenever I read your posts ;o)
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Well, whatever Brian's new blog is, it certainly seems to have the right title!
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Re Greenockboy
So the 900 jobs at risk as stated by AS are really just a made up number for political reasons?
Also note i didn't use the word fantasy.
You answer nothing. more empty rhetoric.
Re the bridge funding the point I make and you try to ignore by rubbisihng my point is that there is no fresh thinking delivered, just more empty rhetoric.
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#323
I'm sorry but ring-fencing has been abolished and money for school meals was part of a package of extra money the councils voted for by signing the concordat.
Well at least we got the concession from you that the councils got extra money despite the difficult economic situation.
We now have Labour complaining that ring-fencing has been abolished and you saying it has not. So, who we believe?
Actually I don't believe any of you sallies have anthing to do with whether we should be independent or not so I'm not going to respond
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I see Peter Cairns has made an estimate from the YouGov poll that such voting would result in SNP 52 (+5), Lab 40 (-6), Tory 17 (0), LibDem;16 (0), green 2 (0), Ind 2 (+1) at Holyrood.
In such a scenario, I wouldn't want the SNP to form a coalition, but on an issue to issue basis, to get a measure through, they would need only the support of the Tories or Lib-Dems.
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#271, Dean thats not so unusual if you go back a couple years. bella has been more popular than her party before. I for one think she is a very good politician if slightly bloody-minded, many people looking on and thinking she is doing a good job could never bring themselves to vote Tory again (thanks to Thatcher's vandalism), ever.
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north
Blind faith is what you have been following if you have voted for Unionist parties. In fact it would seem you have your eyes open and still can't see!
Unionists never have an answer for anything so they throw questions at the SNP and it's supporters. I'll take an independent Scotland with all the pros and cons whatever they they may be. Why not ask questions about the subsidy London receives or what benefits we are receiving from the Olympics? We wanted to bring forward the construction of a new Forth Bridge which would cost a fraction of what the games are costing. This would create jobs and help the economy. See the difference?
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Blind faith:
belief without true understanding, perception, or discrimination
Thanks, northhighlander. Nice to know that's what you think.
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335. And around we go with this discredited nonsense again. Keep your hands in the car at all times, folks!
(Just because you ignore/reject answers does not mean none have been given.)
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Reluctant Expat,
Just for asking, what would you choose if you could only pick one, Scottish or British?
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Brian
Courageous Iain with 7% of the Scottish public behind him, he needs all the help he can get. Now, Alex, he's courageous as he has to put up with smears, negative media, spying(loosely), all Unionists. What a fine job he's doing don't you think Brian? Who would you rather stood up for Scotland Alex or Iain?
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303 oldnat: "In fact if we joined the Schengen area, we would have full access to the European database that tracks dodgy characters, which we don't have access to at the moment."
Yes we do, it's run by a dedicated unit within SOCA through which every UK law enforcement agency has full access.
Hasn't the SNP sorted out it's capital financing yet? There are countless schemes, many now urgent, that have been delayed by two years so far. And there's no end in sight.
We often hear how the SNP is supposedly building so many prisons, hospitals, schools, roads etc. but ALL those schemes were started by the last lot pre-2007.
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#324 Northhighlander
"Freedom always comes at a cost."
That cost is responsibility, which is actually a good thing.
"I think I would like to know what that cost is or is likely to be first."
If you're talking about financial cost, it is a red herring of a question.
What will be the cost of continuing with the current constitutional set-up?
The answer is, as shown by recent circumstances, that we don't know because we can't predict the future. What we would do, as a part of the UK, is to adapt to circumstances. And place that responsibility on those who we elect to find the solutions.
In the case of an independent Scotland the answer is the same, we adapt to our circumstances, like every other country on the planet.
Even Iceland, where recovery is well underway.
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Expat
The facts are a bankrupt Union which has squandered Scotland's wealth. I choose a different path I choose independence. It's called democracy but the Westminster Govts. call it anything but, as they can do as they will with a third of the vote due to fptp. Do you think Scotland would disappear if it became independent? We would get on with things no matter the outcome of the economics. You can guarantee if we couldn't pay our way it would be headline news for weeks. Anyway do you pay taxes in the UK?
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340 Expat
Maybe on hold due to the budget cuts! Ask the councils?
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@ bighullabaloo
I can't find the number as this blog has gone weird (Mr T, please put it back it was nice before!) but your post about evil was interesting. I've actually got a lot of time for Ms Mahon and suspect she was hearing the whispers for a long while. For someone like her it's a terrible thing to break from a party, so while she'll be feeling better in the long term she's probably feeling a bit rubbish right now.
Some people don't really survive party breaks in the same form. Whittaker Chambers is an example of this. What he was after was not what he was before. Intriguingly he describes a similar "evil people" moment. I'm not sure how to c&p or if I'm allowed so please google his name and "Letter to my Children". Chambers as I'm sure you know was a Communist of the Stalinoid variety dramatically turned ex. He puts it as "one night, he heard screams." Of course the screams were going on all the time and he could hear them all the time, but there's hearing and there's HEARING.
Stalinism isn't a bundle of laughs (I am pissed off having had a run in with a tankie today, but now I'm drifting wildly off topic). I don't agree with Chambers on much but I did find the parallel intriguing.
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why shouldnt there be cuts to scotlands budget? the multi billion pound bail out of the banks inc 2 scottish banks. in fact given that they were more than anyone else, its surprising that we are not having an even bigger cut. that would seem fait to me.
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# 328 cynicalHighlander
Being a republican at heart I still have no problem of hanging a picture of the Queen in our parliment. After all she is the head of our state so the inscription below should read: 'Elizabeth the first, Queen of Scots'. I hope that will satisfy Murdo Fraser.
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#343 (possibly) AW
You didn't ask me, I know. But the answer's "None of the above." ;)
I wonder where Mr T's missing comment has gone? With an intriguing title like that he may be about to fess up to all sorts of stuff, possibly talking about his experiences with dean's Tory young team and their pokemon ;)Or maybe it's a post about the newspaper industry, which is more likely.
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Igreco9
The banks didn't need to be bailed. Politics i'm afraid! Why should we be cut we send about 80-100bil to the UK treasury.
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
#345 lgreco9
Your post might have had some relevance if a Scottish Exchequer had received the tax revenues from these banks while they were profitable. In fact all those revenues went to Westminster. Are you suggesting that funding for Halifax Regional Municipality should be cut disproportionately as well?
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#347 fourstrikes
I suspect that "new thread" may simply have been a test for conversion to the new style.
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I see my comment about Brian's picture has been referred to the mods. It is because I quoted something that has already been posted on a previous blog and passed the mods. I wish they would make up their minds or does it solely depend which mod is reading at that particular time?
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Christ, you couldn't make this stuff up. The nats and the tories want to form some kind of Independent national party and adopt David Starky as their leader, even fourstrikes seems convinced by the right wing nutters.
A distant echo indeed!
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Numpty Murphy on radio with Brian on budget.
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#353 derekbarker
"you couldn't make this stuff up"
But you just did, derek! OK sensible people wouldn't make such stuff up.
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#344 fourstrikes
Re my #260: Alice would be a queer fish indeed if she didn't feel regret at having invested so many years of her life in a political party only to discover that they are corrupt.
To be clear about what I mean by "feeling good" it is this:
Alice can now look her daughter-in-law Rachel in the eye and feel good about HERSELF. More importantly, she can look in the mirror and do the same thing. That's my definition of "feeling good".
I see plenty around me who either don't know what feeling good is or don't care. They're too busy grabbing whatever they can, as quickly as they can, no matter who they trample over to get it. I used to wonder how these people could look themselves in the eye until I realised the obvious answer: they've disabled their own consciences.
In my view, this is like sacrificing what makes you human.
A tiger kills a deer but doesn't feel guilty about it. We wouldn't expect it to.
People who choose to disable their own consciences turn themselves into "animals" and there is no excuse for it, since they always have the free will to choose otherwise.
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#353 derek
Don't worry. There's no way on earth I'd join the Nats or the Tories or any mythical combination of the two, and I suspect they wouldn't want me. ;)
Are you still in the Labour Party, btw? I've probably asked you this and forgotten the answer.
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#351
I do not like the new style, and shall mope for a bit.
Anyhow what happened to the grand old IT tradition of calling test threads things like "testy testo"? :)
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Will a Million Voters Tell Gordon to Go? don't all rush as once we would hate the site to crash.
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Pauline Mclean has a BBC blog article today called "Off the record" so it appears the blog article of the same name here is just a test post for a switchover to this big print format.
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#355 Oldnat
And so says captain sensible!sounds as-though your trapped in a gold fish bowl with Bighulla,Oldnat.
What wisdom does separation bring thee! thy solemn one?
Alright fourstrikes, still a proud socialist.
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#340 Reluctant-Expat
"Yes we do, it's run by a dedicated unit within SOCA through which every UK law enforcement agency has full access."
Yet another half-truth to score a point, R-E. The UK does indeed have some access to the Schengen Information System but not "full access". What we do not have access to is the key Article 96 data, which covers "persons, not nationals of a Member State, for whom an alert has been issued for the purposes of refusing entry into the Schengen territory". We do have info on those for whom official warrants are out, but it's the not-quite warrantable lot who are hardest to track and on whom the UK gets to share no information.
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Brian,
Just listened to the 6.10 programme on Radio Scotland.
Two comments:
One, just what has happened to the Dundee Arabs that you should be so otherwise pre-occupied when you were supposed to be hosting this programme??
What an utter shambles it was!!
Two, I have previously labelled a certain politician as 'the weesleekitmurphybeastie'. Based on this programme, I need to revise that assessment.
What a total slimeball!!
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I had a look at the two YouGov polls published today, and compared them with the 2005 General Election (change from 2005 in brackets).
U Kingdom - Con 45% (+13), Lab 27% (-8), Lib Dem 18% (-4), Other 10% (+2)
_Scotland - Con 21% (+5), Lab 32% (-7), Lib Dem 13% (-10), SNP 30% (+12), Other 4% (-1)
Interesting that, while other parties show differences between the political systems, Labour shows a consistent loss under both.
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Aberdeenshire Council have finally put the STV calculations on-line, so we can examine what happened to next preferences as the count progressed. The LibDem did much better from SNP and Forbes (the more popular Ind) than did the Tory. The following is a CSV of the percentages at each stage.
Count 1, Count 2, Count 3, Count 4, Count 5, Party
26.66%, 26.82%, 27.00%, 32.56%, 45.74%, LibDem
31.47%, 31.58%, 31.71%, 34.24%, 42.87%, Con
23.16%, 23.25%, 23.53%, 27.68%, n/a, Ind (Forbes)
16.97%, 17.08%, 17.51%, n/a, n/a, SNP
1.21%, 1.21%, n/a, n/a, n/a, BNP
0.52%, n/a, n/a, n/a, n/a, Ind (Hutchison)
n/a, 0.06%, 0.25%, 5.52%, 11.39%, Non transferable
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#364
Well! Well! there does indeed seem to be a pattern link between the nats and the cons, many say it all begain way back in the seventies! you now! that old wild north blistering tartan tory trail.
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derekbarker re 353
But you just did make this stuff up. No one has ever said that, "The nats and the tories want to form some kind of Independent national party and adopt David Starky as their leader"
Will you now be replying to yourself that it is terrible that the Scottish Nationalists (thats their correct title you and Cochrane can keep calling them that if it helps your agenda) and the tories are forming an alliance.
Re what would reluctant want, as he is from Northern Ireland it is the union first last and always, the future is orange.
Remember Shrek, posted by Northern Irelands own AM2 on the Hootsmon web site.
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#365 Brownedov
I think that's the first by election I've seen where the candidate with most first preference votes, eventually lost!
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#367 dubbieside,
Ah, so we can expect some sort of diluted fiscal control for the drop of Independence as Alex Salmond gets his lordship, dontcha! just see the scene.
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derekbarker
That is the poorest response I have ever seen.
Where is your reply to "The nats and the tories want to form some kind of Independent national party and adopt David Starky as their leader"
Or are you just going to keep making this stuff up and hope you will find some other people who will take what you write as correct, who like you will not bother with things like facts.
Your Labour party is dead in the water, but keep trying, you may just get something near the truth that you can cling on to. How about, "no more boom and bust" to be going on with.
P.S. This comment "Ah, so we can expect some sort of diluted fiscal control for the drop of Independence as Alex Salmond gets his lordship, dontcha! just see the scene" makes even less sense, if that is possible.
P.P.S. Alex Salmond probably does not have one million pounds to buy a "Lordship" whatever that is. Can you confirm one million is still the going rate for Labour to sell peerages?
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#368 oldnat
"I think that's the first by election I've seen where the candidate with most first preference votes, eventually lost!"
I can't recall having noticed an earlier Scottish one, but I challenge anyone to demonstrate why it would have been "fairer" to have given the seat to a candidate with 31.47% of the valid votes. It should be used to demonstrate to people how their vote really does count under STV. It should also be a salutory lesson to the Forbes voters who comprised more than half of the 11.39% thrown away that if they dislike the LibDem more than they dislike the Tory it's their own silly fault she was elected.
PS. Famous last words, but I've withdrawn my mantra temporarily as the modding has been fast for the last day or so.
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#370 dubbieside.
Alex Salmond talks about the loss of Scottish jobs, yet, AS still hold's two jobs, MSP and an MP. Does he talk the talk but fails to walk the walk?.
Lord Salmond of double standards!SOP/sop? Ho Hum.
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Looks like Mr Gray will have to queue outside Duff Gordon's study behind Capn. Darling for six of the best, since both have got it wrong about cuts.
The Supreme Leader is quoted on this website's Brown pledge on public investment as having told the Welsh Labour conference in Swansea that: "You don't cut public investment at a time like this. You support families and businesses through a downturn."
Pity he didn't say that before the hapless pair got their sums wrong.
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#366 Nats and tories together? Really? Come on Derek you're Barking up the wrong tree there, your conviction about Labour seems to be slipping with a quip like that, are you beginning to see the reality of Gordon Brown's visions and our nightmares. Isn't it Gordon Brown who much admires Margaret Thatcher, a 'conviction politician' much like himself. I'd agree they should be convicted especially Brown, criminally negligent while in control of a country would do for a start. Well done Labour you took the country 1 step forward and 10 steps back.
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derekbarker
Still no answers I see derek. You are getting more desperate by the minute.
How many jobs does Lord Foulks sake have? How many jobs did Donald Dewar have? Not an issue then, or did I miss you raising Donalds two jobs in the letters page of the Herald? Nothing like Labour for double standards Derek.
Keep trying you may just post something sensible, but I am not holding out too much hope.
How much are Labour charging for a peerage now Derek? do not be shy I am sure you can tell us.
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derekdarker
Here is a link to a petition looking for one million signatures for Brown to resign.
http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/please-go/#detail
I am sure you would like to add your name to the list.
P.S. Will it stop at one million?
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#374 InMyKip
I'm afraid that derek is just following the McBride political strategy.
Start any baseless story on the internet, and hope that it makes people think there's something in it.
A little pathetic I think.
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#374 Inmykip
Conviction politician, in terms as, convinced by their beliefs, YES!
Where as AS made a comparable between the economics of his party (SNP) and the tory party.
Sharpen up nats........
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#375 dubbieside
Are you by any chance conferring with Captain sensible, Oldnat, tut, tut kid, break out and have a go yourself and stop all this happy talking nonsense.
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#377
Oldnat on the raw nerve?
Vote SNP and get the tories, just like 1979 allover again.
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derek,
If you're not going to say anything sensible, could you then say something humourous, like Labour have every chance of winning at Westminster...
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#378 Well yes Derek I take your point Gordon is convinced by his beliefs, as was Adolf Hitler and emmm Josef Stalin......dangerous people conviction politicians me thinks.......it's a pity no one else is convinced about Brown's beliefs....visions......delusions.....except it seems your goodself Derek......maybe you're also being slightly delusional about the worthiness of Labour to be in government.
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#381
Mss Aye of a thousands sleepless nights (sensible enough?)
#382 Inmykip, was it sensible for Mr Swinney to impose a 2% efficiency programme on all 32 local authorities last year, will he now! remove that obstacle,giving the fact he now supports the need to support the public sector?.
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383 derekbarker
Mss Aye
Nearly, Mss Aye A...
;-)
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#383 Nice body swerve Derek, but let's get back to Gordon Brown's mishandling of the UK economy, how many years will it take to pay back all the money Brown has borrowed, don't bother telling me the answer, tell my daughter (she's only 8) tell her why she's going to be paying for Brown's gross stupidity when she's old enough to pay taxes. Good old Gordon, an economic arse-onist. The sooner Labour are out before they do even more economic damage the better.
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#378 derek
It's grand to have you back. More tea? More tea Mrs T.? I've got you two together as you are both conviction politicians, don't believe in Scots and are economically illiterate. Well, actually it's because I want you to sponsor RE for the Ig-Nobel prize in Economics.
You're doing fine, son; remember it's only 25 minutes to go till you get your medication and then it'll all be allright again. I like you 'cos, like me, you don't let facts get in your way when telling a good story.
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derekbarker
I thought this would not be possible considering the competition on this blog, but you must be the most senseless poster here.
"Are you by any chance conferring with Captain sensible, Oldnat, tut, tut kid, break out and have a go yourself and stop all this happy talking nonsense" Just what does this mean Derek? You are talking nonsense, no change there then.
I also like the "kid" bit, you are not reluctant are you? he posts like that when he has nothing sensible to post. He called me son, much to my grandchildrens amusement.
Are reluctant, Derek and AM2 the same person???
Come on Derek, you can do it, how much does Labour charge for a peerage these days???
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Derek Barker,
The fact that the SNP, and Tories ar both showing polling increases indicates no such 'axis' between the two. It has to be the rediculous posting of the decade.
As for vote Nat get Tory; there is so much that is wrong with that that I'm simply not going to read an further postings by you until you grow up a little bit- honestly vote Nat (centre-left!) get Tory (centre-right). That makes sense I suppose if your a New Labour apologist.
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#385 Inmykip
It's a global crisis, however Blair has many question to answer? you cant have a first class economic enviroment without the need of fair taxation and of course, those how can pay more must always pay more, Blair changed that and I hope the new 50% bracket is a step back to the labour party of old. It's a nightmare situation but hey! if we dont try and meet it head on with stimulus, what is the alternative, think hard if you reply, what exactly would the do nothing plan mean to everyone in Scotland.
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#387 dubbieside, ask Alex the price of a lordship?
#388 Dean the broken bishop! thanks, how's Stirling these days?.
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#388 dean
Our Derek, the resident joke on this blog like Oor Wul and the Broons in the Post, refers to the end of Big Jim Callaghan (the one who decided that the Scots really didn't need their oil, his need was much greater), who asked the Nats for help to avoid a vote of No Confidence and didn't get it, so Mrs T got in instead. No blame on Labour for their disastrous economics then or now.
Derek, How are you going to blame the First Minister for 15 years of Call Me Dave?
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#389 yes Derek I realise it's a global crisis after all Global Gordon has told us all often enough. But remind me Derek, wasn't Gordon the Iron Chancellor during Tony's premier ship?? Wasn't it Gordon's safe pair of hands on the economic tiller?? So even though Gordon is one of the people responsible for this mess we should trust him to get us out of it?? Gordon the economic arse-onist is now Gordon the economic fireman (albeit a chocolate one)....let's praise Gordon....he's saved us from the frying pan.......
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#391
handclapping, your up late tonight, jeez! a rewarding endeavour from the sugar daddy no doubt.
Are you red-necking on the oil plan again kid! how much for a barrel nowadays then?.
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derek
Do you know your enemy, d'you know your enemy,
You gotta know your enemy, we're here...
Do you know your enemy, d'you know your enemy,
Silence is the enemy, we're here, ooh,oh-o-oh...
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390.derekbarker
The broken Bishop? Ha, thats a joke thats just ran over my head I'm afraid!
But yes, Stirling has been good recently; especially that given the latest figures the evil McGuire (who closed down all of our post offices, being the good little junior minister she was) will probably could loose her seat.
And you all know how important (for me at least) Stirling seat is (the best desciption was by someone- 'sacred lodestone'; very good).
Making my final push in the Bannockburn by-election on Sat. As per always I shall update all following the event.
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/8016440.stm
Imagine the BBC inviting on known Islamophobes to speak, as the reporter says Starkey had form ... why the hell was he invited then?!
What is it with this English chippyness and need to constantly malign all their neighbors (Scots, Irish, Welsh and French)?
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#393 derek
You want rewarded? I'll speak to the nurse. He can probably give you a double dose and you'll be able to sleep through the night.
WTI is USD51.55 and the Dollar 1.47 which troubles me not a bit as I made GBP6000+ today alone. Think what Scotland could have done with their oil.
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#396 pattymkirkwood
Well look at him!
;-)
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#395
Dean,
With all the cunning power of your Passchendaele spirit,I wish you guid luk and a fon slip up at Bannockburn.
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#396 pmk
You're a historian, oldnat's one too, so are Starkey and Global Broon. Should we ban the teaching of history in an independent Scotland's schools?
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#396 Starkey is after all entitled to his opinion, but that is all it is his opinion, and the rant he had says more about the type of person he is than it says about us, our country and our poets. Starkey's thinking I suspect is weighed down by the number of chips he has on his shoulder.
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#396 pattymkirkwood
What you didn't see, however, was Brian Donohe - you know the "clever" MP for Irvine etc on BBC Scotland calling him "Starsky"!
Kept having this vision of him dropping off a wall and sliding across the hood of his car.
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#394
SLF for you Mss Aye...........
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6lR-j9kye0&feature=related
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#396 pattymkirkwood
He only had a dose of the Brits....! ;-)
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Sounds like someones on the tripe and potted head diet here just like Brown's favorite food is cabbage no doubt boiled to death.
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#401 aye_write
Starkey's thinking has all be pre-done by Paxo. It's like musical boxes; the ballerina on the top is different, but the tune's always the same.
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derekbarker
#387 dubbieside, ask Alex the price of a lordship?
More rubbish Derek!!! How would Alex know that? "Lordships" do you mean honors? They are under the remit of Westminster, or did you forget that too?
Hard question coming up derek, how many honors have Labour sold to the highest bidder since 1997? What price were they sold at? What is the going rate for them now that we are in Browns recession? Answers in the usual brown envelope.
P.S. Are you, reluctant and AM2 the same person? Do you all agree with one another, or do you argue among/with yourselves/yourself?
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#405 cynical
A cabbage called "Sweetheart"; like a pale blue Tory called "New Labour".
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#406 handclapping
What a repellent image you conjure up! :-)
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derekbarker
Just when we think even you cannot get dafter "Passchendaele spirit" you really are losing it.
Now you have me sticking up for a tory.
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Government gives £1m to anti-extremist think-tank Quilliam Foundation
SNP urged to drop 'sectarian and divisive' Muslim candidate
Suspicion!
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#403 derekbarker
I like them! Thanks. But I prefer Safe as Houses...(just not in the Labour recession! ;-)
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dubbieside
I think you might need a cup of tea or something stronger given such a mighty and indeed sysmic event!
ALL:
As for Starkey, he is entitled to his views, but I won't pretend I asnt positively intemperate when he said wht he said (in reference to Scotland, Wales, Ireland). But he should just say it if he feels that way, better knowing what he thinks than have him pretend to be something else, and subsequently fake respectibility.
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#408 handclapping
Labour: Now it's kind of blue
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Hmm, is someone working up a big appetite, boiled beef and carrots or is it just the work house nature of some zealot nat.
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#413 deanthetory
People like Starkey (who glories in the appellation of "rudest man in Britain") are to be more pitied than anything else.
These outbursts (all carefully planned) are designed simply to focus attention on him. I've known a number of unpleasant pupils like that in my time. It's actually just the behaviour of an unhappy little boy, in guise of a man.
Consequently, he's not a very good historian either.
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Brian,
I'm afraid Ian G was utter rubbish. Just watching it now.
G doesn't have any real clue about maths, does he.
Talk about courage, the Gurkha fiasco, even bigger than SLEAZEGATE, is discrimination and racism in its worst possible form.
These brave soldiers are employed by Britain, laying down their lives for Britain, and so should be getting paid the same salary and pensions as all other British soldiers.
If somebody comes to this country to work, no company would dare pay that person based on where they are from, their nationality, or the colour of their skin. This is exactly what is happening with GURKHAGATE.
Get a grip Westminster!!!!
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#415 no Derek sadly you are wrong again, boiled beef and carrots would be the stew Gordon Brown has dropped us in to.
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#413 deanthetory
better knowing what he thinks than have him pretend to be something else, and subsequently fake respectibility.
Quite agree dean, better he should attain honest non-respectibility ;-)
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#406
Was the Ballerina one Mike Russell....ouch! 1million reason...SOP!!!!
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#420 derek
Another "courageous" post by derek, RE and AM2. Why not carry on with your game of cards in the boiler-room of John Smith House and leave us to cut our own pork steaks from the swine you are fattening for June.
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#420 derek
Sorry, senior moment; just realised SOP stands for Save Our Pork. Take back the last sentence. Not the done thing. Didn't know they were relatives. Carry on with the game, old boy. RE has got the ace if it's any help.
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#421 handclapping
I like that! ok, it's a bit woody allen but hey! it was good, your begining to sound a bit like Zee from the ant colony. YoowZa! so where is the utopia in nat land then handclapping?.
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#422 handclapping
SOP...It's a type of forfar-loon thing, working on it although.
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derekbarker,
Have you no self respect man? Get a grip.
Best wishes.
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derek, forgot your post number...too right. I'm proud to be a socialist too :)Also, the thought of Mr Russell in ballerina garb is disturbing, but then let's face it, this thread is chock full of disturbing imagery.
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#425 bobbishop
Good evening Gandi, whats Mahat-ter with you then?
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#426 fourstrikes
Well something had to be done once BT's image disappeared under the new format! (Sorry BT)
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#394 AW
I'm going to date myself here. because your post reminded me of Rage Against the Machine lyrics.
"What, the land of the free? Whoever told you that is your enemy!"
They had some classics...and were perhaps the only band to fit the word "bourgeoisie" comfortably into a track. ;)
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#426
Yes! sort of constricts any free speech, you know' he's not one of us attack syndrome.
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I like derek, he doesn't think in straight lines but that's cool as it makes life more interesting :)
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fourstrikes is right as per 426, I've never seen so much debachery scandalously unvailed in one blog!
Oldnat, you are right to say that Starkey's grasp of history does want revisiting. Did anyone ever see his interview show from a while back?
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I do believe I've just been curved (no straight lines)
could it be the smoke and mirror imagery.
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#431 Och is that no nice, Derek's got a wee pal and he's a socialist tae.
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#429 fourstrikes
Yes, and your Rage Against the Machine lyrics reminded me of REM lyrics! My post was more of a Green Day ;-)
(It's not a political reference ;-)
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#380 - "Vote SNP and get the tories, just like 1979 allover again."
Or, alternatively Derek Barking, vote NuLab and get the tories, just like 1997 all over again.
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#436 Vote Nu Labour and get Gordon Brown......now that is disturbing
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Who is this Starkey, and what has he got to do with anything?
Anyway, how are you dear subjects of Her Gracious Majesty coping with the news that the UK is confidently expected to be the first state in Europe to go under in the present historic cataclysm, which will doubtless be known to respected historians as the final chapter in the decline and fall of what remains of England's global empire of blessed memory? When a "great country" finally collapses in disarray, it is a sad spectacle, or not, depending on your point of view.
This latest bombshell will come as quite a blow to anglo-unionists, one supposes, on the day when they had the news broken to them that the UK economy contracted by no less than 1.9 per cent in the first quarter of this year, which is a rate of contraction which, if maintained throughout the year, would, alas, give the UK an even more catastrophic economic decline for 2009 than the International Monetary Fund has been predicting for dear old Blighty. Mind you, the contraction of 4.1 per cent that it is forecasting for you for the year still puts you in a very deep hole compared to other economies, the IMF prediction for the global economy being a contraction of only 1.3 per cent for this period, making the Labour UK government's claim that Blighty is better placed in the recession than other economies look rather feeble, frankly . . . unless, of course, HMG was thinking of Zimbabwe or something of that nature.
One trusts that anglo-unionists will not prove to be too feeble to swallow some of that infamous Britannic pride and that they will manage to face up to the lamentable fact that the Chancer of the Chequer Board really has told you that Blighty's current deficit is a record 175 billion pounds sterling - whatever that may be worth this evening, depending, one supposes, in part on how many pound notes Her Majesty's empty Treasury has been printing today - and that the prospect of UK Gross National Debt reaching, according to the latest most optimistic predictions, no less than 79 per cent of Gross Domestic Product in 2014 has not caused them to lose their jolly sense of humour.
As you may or may not be aware, the director of the European Investment Bank, Philippe Maystadt, declared on French radio the other evening that he expected that the UK will be forced to apply to the IMF in the hope of saving itself from utter disaster. As you may remember, a certain "great country" had to hold out the begging bowl to the IMF in 1976 in order to save its currency, which has lost a quarter of its value over the past year, one is given to understand, and still has nothing much to stop it falling further. The Labour Party was in office in 1976 too, of course. Was brave Caledonia also blamed for that embarrassment? Or has blaming and defaming it only become fashionable since it got its parliament back? But I am digressing.
It is being said on the European mainland, rather ominously, that, if poor old Blighty is in danger of going under, there is nothing much that the IMF can do to save it on this occasion, as, despite the additional billions that were accorded to it at the reviled Caledonian PM's G20 summit in London in April, it does not have the means to rescue such a "great country", its resources stretching really only so far as to stave off disaster for little feeble ones or developing countries such as used to belong to England's global empire. Some of the 'anciens riches' are, in the regrettable economic circumstances now prevailing, simply ineluctably going to become the 'nouveaux pauvres', or so it would appear.
Fortunately for the "feeble little country" to the north of England, on the other hand, it has existing North Sea oil wealth and fresh abundance of oil resources to look forward to in the Hatton-Rockall Basin in the Atlantic, together with a potentially huge renewable-energy industry, inter alia, if it determines that its essential national interests require it to go independent, which looks increasingly likely - does it not? - in view of the continuing rise in popularity of the Scottish National Party, as revealed by the very latest Scottish opinion polls.
In such an eventuality England, which, as it is being expressed, sold its soul to the financial-services industry in the Anglo-American cowboy-capitalism era, will be faced with the somewhat uncomfortable fact that it has allowed its industrial base to be eroded. Apart from a few remnants of its aeronautical industry - and one hears, alas, that even the UK's participation in the Eurofighter project is having to be reviewed - there is very little left of primary and secondary industry on the English side of the Channel. In exposing the UK cruelly to the worst of the recession, chronic mismanagement of its economy, of which the subject peoples have evidently just about had enough, appears to be bringing down the curtain on the UK as presently constituted, with even Plaid Cymru returning to the theme of independence for feeble little Wales.
Understandably, this is upsetting for anglo-unionists, but blaming one component of the British Union for this and subjecting it to gratuitous vilification will only make matters worse, one imagines. It is an inescapable fact that those who live beyond their means are eventually brought down to earth. Since the beginning of the current year even UK personal debt has been about 170 per cent of GDP compared with an average of 100 per cent of GDP in the eurozone. Subjects of Her Gracious Majesty are ungraciously addicted to living beyond their feeble means, frankly, both as a "great country" and as individuals.
Time to pay . . . on a truly historic scale, as any decent historian will tell you.
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I never saw Brewer interview Murphy. He did his usual bust-up thing on Swinney. I thought Gary Robertson was appalling when interviewing Swinney. Much less agitated when interviewing Darling.
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#402 oldnat and aye_write #398 & 404,
I wont offer an honest opinion of Brian Donohoe, as there seems to be a new moderating procedure and it would be a shame to run foul of it so early.
On a rather different note, thought this Downing Street petition might be of interest to some
Gordo must go,
http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/please-go/#detail
Must be important, Guido is leading with it! As we all know now the blogosphere’s news is effectively the beeb’s but around a week earlier … and more accurate … and less slanted etc …
;-)
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Less of the "anglo-unionists" frankly_francophone. I'm a proud Scottish Unionist! Characature the whole of unionism based upon what a silly little man like Starkey or Murphy or Brown says is not only doing an injustice to wider unionism but is highly telling upon yourself. Do you hold your views so meakly that you must characture the views of people like myself?
I feel that you are more than capable of out debating me; so why demean my political values; and falsely paint me as effectively someone opposed to Scottish culture/values pride?
Less of the sweeping generalisations such as 'anglo-unionists'- I am a Scottish Unionist, and that is a valid position to hold in a fair and free society. (Notice how I don't feel any cumpulsion to misrepresent nationalists as some kind of anti-english political force? Its because that would be unfairly misrepresenting their [your?] sense of civic-nationalism).
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Just a thought- given the recent headline socttish voting intention; SNP 30%, Lab 32%, could we be seeing the SNP begin to replace labour as the dominant left wing party of scottish politics?
I meantion it because many comentators say that in England the libDems are poised to replace labour as the electable centre-left voting option for those of such mind.
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#441, Dean - how about dropping this "separatist" pretence in response then? We all know unionism represents the most total form of separation from the outside world that Scotland has ever been subject to.
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Blog is now pretty much unreadable.
No point in posting anymore - good luck everyone !!
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443. pattymkirkwood
You will find I never said 'seperatism' once in my response to frankly_francophone.
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#441 deanthetory
Hello, Dean.
Terms we use and what we mean by them . . . this could be a very long post, but I'll keep it short.
I use the term "anglo-unionism" to refer to support for direct union with England, which I oppose, as distinct from euro-unionism, which I support. As the term 'unionist' applies as much to euro-unionists as to supporters of direct union with England, I do not use it, for the sake of clarity, which I also support.
I trust that this clarification will mollify you somewhat even though I am intent upon continuing to plough my furrow so far as this matter is concerned. If you are content to describe a euro-unionist such as myself as a nationalist, which is a term with which I personally do not identify for a host of reasons, I suppose I can be content to describe anglo-unionists as anglo-unionists.
As for holding views "meakly", you can shoot me tonight if it will make Scotland an independent member of the European Union.
Good night.
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#446
Frankly Mr Carphone, that's quite alot of words just to tell us your a
" euro unionist"
Now I'm off to dream about Pocahontas and me.
Guid nicht.
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#445, true - but you have employed it rather liberally before.
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http://www.theherald.co.uk/politics/news/display.var.2504225.0.Salmonds_financial_competence_at_heart_of_poll_boost.php
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Dear God!
I see the infection is back in the shape of Mr Barker.
Where have you been? Hospital? On holiday? Prison? Or on the Labourlist website getting caught out spreading lies and innuendo?
I am sick of the Nat Knockers in whichever shape they appear, from BBC Scotland, to Mr and Mrs Cochrane to Derek Draper et al.
Surely the media is not so stupid that it cannot see the self destruct button? Particularly the dead tree bunch?!
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The details of both YouGov's UK and Scottish polls from this week are both now available from their Political Archives. I had hoped that there might be regional information for the Scottish poll, but sadly that is not the case, so there is no useful extra detail there.
Comparison of the two polls, for which the fieldwork was only one day apart, does at least show how little reliability we should place on the tiny Scottish sample sizes of the UK-wide polls.
With unweighted samples of 1,020 and 193 respectively, for Westmidden voting intention the polls show:
Party, Scotland, UK (Scottish sample)
Lab, 32%, 41%
SNP, 30%, 18%
Con, 21%, 27%
LD, 13%, 14%
My own suspicion is that weightings based on 2005 patterns are simply no longer valid.
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#447 derekbarker
Well, Derek, it was either that or my standard treatise on denotation and connotation.
The number of words used matters less than choosing the right ones and getting them in more or less the right order. Try it some time.
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Not much new political news in the Thunderer today, but an excellent new selection of cartoons, where Peter Brookes's Nature Notes: "A Morbid Anatomy of Gnu Labour" tells it all about Capn. Darling.
Their leading article, Dishonesty and the Budget drums the point home fairly well.
Post or reactive moderation for all except CBeebies, please!
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More nuspeak from Duff Gordon in the Indy's Unrepentant Brown defends Budget as a 'plan for recovery', which informs us that he told the "Labour Welsh conference" that: "If you don't invest in the future, you don't have a future."
That of course must be set in the context that the GnuLab/PC Welsh government are just as concerned about the cuts as are the Scottish Government.
Post or reactive moderation for all except CBeebies, please!
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"You know, he didn't do at all badly" - In fact he did so well he is now rated below Annie in the latest poll.
You can fool some of the people all of the time, you can fool all of the people some of the time, but now I just think your fooling yourself.
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The schizophrenia of the Guardianistas continues with support for the GnuLab budget mixed with a touching concern for liberty and democracy. I rather suspect that the continued interest in the latter, as expressed by today's new Postal vote allegations: Labour candidate contest in Erith and Thamesmead, with more evidence given will ultimately be the cause of Duff Gordon's downfall more than the mismanagement and other sleaze.
If a courageous Scottish journalist were prepared to investigate the Glenrothes register scandal properly, the end of GnuLab might truly be in sight.
Post or reactive moderation for all except CBeebies, please!
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greenockboy re your 444
Do not give up on us. This is the reason that Dalek/RE/AM2 pollutes blogs to try and stifle debate. We can all get on our soap box from time to time, and sometimes it can get a bit much, but we need your impute.
Deanthetory re your 413
I had to go and lie down in a darkened room. However after throwing a few darts at my dart board I am feeling better. Normal service will resume.
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I know my posts are often sprinkled with honest typos...... but is there any way a spell checker can be accommodated for this blog? It grates terribly whn some perfectly valid point is blown out the water by some horrendous mis spelling.
Deanthetory hits on a subtle shift in the political landscape. The latest opinion polls show the LibDems creeping up on Labour in England. If they pass them it will mean the end of Labour as a potential governing party in UK. Mrs Thatcher's most significant effect in British politics (apart from voodoo economics which saw her destroy rather than fix the UK's industrial base and replace it with the trading in money and debt which has have brought us to our present sorry pass)was to lay out the ground for NuLabour. NuLabour in turn destroyed real Labour and there is now no ideological base to sustain a fightback for Labour when they get knocked out at the GE. We will have Tory government (by default) for the next couple of decades facing opposition from the aimless remanants of Labour and a LibDem presence of about the same weight without any real defined rationale.
In Scotland I feel the SNP is already replacing Labour and Tory Government may create the circumstance for this to become complete. The house of cards is close to coming down.
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Interesting that at the time of writing, the "top" story on this website's main Politics page is Hague attacks Brown on EU treaty, where the official unionists bang on about a Lisbon Treaty referendum. Quite right too, I believe, and would vote "yes" given the chance, but how different from the unionists at Holyrood regarding giving "the people" their say over Scotland's governance.
To save costs, the two referenda should be combined, with the Lisbon votes being counted "regionally" so that those "home" nations who wish to sign up to Lisbon could do so, while eurosceptic England goes its own way and leaves the EU. Polling on the same day in 2010 shortly after the Tory victory at Westmidden, perhaps?
Would the courageous unionists at Holyrood go along with that, Brian?
Post or reactive moderation for all except CBeebies, please!
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#458 sneckedagain
Excellent post, and I don't disagree with a word of it.
The English bit of me does hope that you're wrong about the LibDems, though, and that they remember their home ruling, Liberal roots to offer real opposition to the "official" unionists in time to prevent Westmidden carrying on unreformed as the UK of "England & Northern Ireland" while Scotland and Wales go their own ways. I do recognise that that's inherently a problem for the English, though.
Post or reactive moderation for all except CBeebies, please!
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#417 HughEdinburgh: Excellent post. The treatment of the Gurkhas is quite simply racist. What happened to "a man's a man for a' that"? Not if you come from Nepal it seems. Try listening to Radio 4's Any Questions (repeated this afternoon I think). Some NuLab clone was on the panel trying to defend this disgrace. The obfuscation and exaggeration he employed was nauseating. Even after smeargate they can't change. The good news is that everyone can see through it - when Dimbleby asked the audience what they thought all but two of them agreed the Gurkhas should be treated the same as other Commonwealth soldiers. The NuLab minion promised that the government would listen (and ignore he didn't have to add). Yet another nail in NuLab's coffin.
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Brian
Politics has come to a pretty pass whenone is reduced to comment on the comedy courage of the leading opposition politician. Still it's on message in that it concentrates on him rather than Westminster's joke SoS.
So, now the media are starting to wonder what the world will be like without the NuLabour incubus, to what can we look forward? A set of European elections where only the party faithful will vote true and the rest will protest in the way that best suits them making the results incomprehensible. The expenses scandal in June and a steady stream of revelations through the holiday season with MPs resigning and standing down for the next GE. A Sterling crisis in September when all the Gnomes of Zurich decide, after hearing reports of the scandals in their media, that the UK is not a good bet to repay their loans. An application to the IMF in October turned down as they do not have enough money to deal with the UK's problems. A Vote of No Confidence and a December GE?
Dear me in all this turmoil when is an activist like Dean going to get any time to get his studies done?
I would have commented on the plight of this scenario for peoples jobs and homes, but, as well as depressing you, it would have depressed me futher so I haven't.
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#456 Brownedov: that sort of skulduggery is a plausible explanation for the explosion of postal votes in Glenrothes. Interesting that Georgia Gould assured the Guardian she knew nothing about her supporters turning up on Labour supporters' doorsteps with pre-filled postal vote forms. Indeed, I'm 100% certain that there will be no letter, note or email that would indicate that she knew anything about it. Weren't me guv, I was in all night..."</