Peace in our time?

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• 1. At 6:10pm on 24 Nov 2009, ianapharri wrote:

  This ridiculous situation should never have occurred. Rhodri had no choice but to eat humble pie but why did he fall for Hain's trickery?
  
  Plaid were absolutely right in their response and at the end of the day, what choice did they have?
  
  Plaid have come out well from this, in sticking to principles and acting swiftly. Sadly, Rhodri has finished with a fuax pas but at least he saved the day which e deserves credit for.
  
  As for Peter Hain, how are Plaid or even Labour AMs supposed to trust him on the referendum now?
  
  Oh by the way Stoney, it's back on again! I thought that would wipe the smile off your face.

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• 2. At 6:13pm on 24 Nov 2009, John Tyler wrote:

  
  When Morgan and IWJ make a joint statement saying .....
  
  Both parties recognise the difficulties which would be created for a purposeful and united 'Yes' campaign, if that were attempted to be held during the run up to a General Election.
  
  ..... you know that Plaid have reverted to "lap dog at the bowl of power" accepting that there will be no referendum before the election, but IWJ is only one, I am waiting to hear the howls of protest from the plaid "Rank" and file.
  
  With PH on the doorstep in the morning I guess the howls of protest will revert to the whimpering pup ....

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• 3. At 6:18pm on 24 Nov 2009, jacothenorth wrote:

  This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.

• 4. At 6:40pm on 24 Nov 2009, Notonationalism wrote:

  What an unpleasant post, Jacothenorth. Perhaps you could explain what you mean.
  
  It's good to see Labour leaders finally recognising the unhappiness of many grassroots members at being signed up to campaign for a 'yes' vote.
  
  

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• 5. At 6:47pm on 24 Nov 2009, alfsplace1986 wrote:

  3
  jacothenorth
  
  How did that one get past the moderators, surely that borders on being illegal and homophobic

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• 6. At 6:49pm on 24 Nov 2009, ianapharri wrote:

  Stoney,
  IWJ stood his ground and Labour blinked first.
  
  Labour know it, the media know it and even you do. It just hurts to admit it, doesn't it?
  
  No...etc,
  It's not the members that are the problem, but the MPs. They don't want to lose their status, however beneficial it may be for Wales.

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• 7. At 6:53pm on 24 Nov 2009, John Tyler wrote:

  
  There never has been a smile from me when considering the putrid Plaid coalition, my guess would be the Conservatives will get around to a referendum by 2013, time enough to settle the country down [UK] and consider such things as educating the public as to how devolution works, maybe that should be 2015, and lets not forget a democracy needs the overwhelming support of the electorate, lets say ........
  
  There is of course Scottish Salmond the hapless nationalist who discovered today that the majority consider his intentions to be a no-no, much like in Wales, particularly following Adam Price with his visions from a twisted lacklustre history of dubious origins ......
  
  
  
  

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• 8. At 7:03pm on 24 Nov 2009, Lyn David Thomas wrote:

  Again what evidence is there that Labour party members oppose devolution or the coalition agreement. Certainly sections of the Labour party at all levels do, but no section voted against the coalition.

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• 9. At 7:34pm on 24 Nov 2009, ianapharri wrote:

  Stonemason,
  
  You crazy dreamer.

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• 10. At 8:23pm on 24 Nov 2009, thegnatswatter wrote:

  8. Plaid are just a convenience to Labour only someone as naive as you would believe that this was anything other. Labours biggest fear was a 'rainbow coalition' they knew that if they took Plaid as the junior partner they would be able to retain power and still control them while at the same time ruin any future rainbow alliance . Shrewd,cold politics and a master stroke which will leave Plaid isolated and friendless at the next election.

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• 11. At 8:25pm on 24 Nov 2009, John Tyler wrote:

  
  ..... ianapharry, you might just be right, .....
  
  ..... it is surprising how many of my dreams have come true during my life.
  
  Would you be surprised if it took 4 or 5 years for a referendum, think about it .....
  
  .. a change of government.
  .. dire economic challenges.
  .. the public need unbiased information to learn what devolution is about.
  .. parliamentary approval.
  .. the campaign.
  .. the vote.
  ..
  .. that adds up to something like 5 years.
  
  
  No big deal, democracy is much like a good wine, it shouldn't be rushed, you need time to stand and stare, chew the fat, you know, discuss the merits, everything that a Nationalist would cry about .........
  
  

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• 12. At 9:03pm on 24 Nov 2009, Jack_Wilkinson wrote:

  From Phil Williams, we know who wears the trousers in the Plaid/Llafur marriage made in Heaven? And it isn't Llafur.
  
  “Is it possible for a single-minded, uncompromising Plaid Cymru to create the conditions whereby other parties deliver self-government, albeit step-by-step and with some reluctance?”
  
  Re message 6
  Stoney,
  IWJ stood his ground and Labour blinked first.
  
  Phil, was right, a single minded, uncompromising Plaid Cymru, does seem to get the better of Rhodri's hapless Llafur.
  If you're happy to be a citizen of Britain, living equally with other folk of the delightful British Isles, is it safe to vote for Llafur?

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• 13. At 9:36pm on 24 Nov 2009, John Tyler wrote:

  
  Jack, could this be the start of a National "blink" convention, or contest, or a blinking eisteddfod.
  
  ..... the Nationalists are a tad ............ overwhelmed by events.
  
  

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