Me and my shadow
Annable Goldie, leader of the Scottish Tories, has reportedly been invited by David Cameron to attend shadow Cabinet meetings in London once a month.
Why? An attempt, perhaps, to build links between Holyrood and Westminster, to bring Edinburgh and London closer together in the run-up to the General Election. Her title? Shadow First Minister.
Here's a sign, say Scottish commentators, that Mr Cameron does want to make devolution work effectively.
So what of Nick Bourne? Has the same invitation come his way?
Mr Bourne has been to Shadow Cabinet meetings several times in the past I'm told and will continue to attend "as and when".
By the way a thought: is it better to be Shadow First Minister or real life Leader of the Opposition?
I'm Betsan Powys, BBC Wales' political editor. I'll be blogging the inside track on 
© MMIX~RS~q~RS~~RS~z~RS~07~RS~)
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Betsan...
i think that there are trying to get annable to be (first minister)......
~Dennis Junior~
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Why? Because, the party in London (and the leadership) wants to be able to have a good round of people in the ready for elections....
Her title? Shadow First Minister....That is what, My predictions also go with!!!
~Dennis Junior~
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One thing is for sure, Goldie isn't going to be First Minister, ever.
The Tories have always had more respect for Scotland. They know what damage the Scots can inflict on UK politics. They also know that the Scots are on the brink of taking the plunge, and the election of a Tory UK government might well push them over.
One asks the question: Why are the unionist parties so keen on retaining the Union? This applies particularly to the Tories. Without Scotland and Wales, they would have an easy ride in English politics, as they are the natural party of government in England. Labour has traditionally relied on Scottish and Welsh support for a Westminster majority. Add to that the financial cost of the Union (the Barnett formula) one thinks why do the Tories bother to fight to keep the UK together.
The truth is, that without Scotland and Wales, England would lose much of its standing on the world stage. It would be further eclipsed by France, Germany, Italy, and even Spain, within the EU. It could also lose its seat on the Security Council. So its not largesse on their part to give us 'handouts', its self interest. Mind you, we would have done much better without their so-called handouts. What self-respecting people want to be accused of living off their neighbours?
The 'Campaign for an English Parliament' wants the same 'privileges' for England which Scotland gets, ie, their own legislative parliament. If there are votes in it, why don't the Tories adopt that as a policy? One of the problems that many English people have is that they fail to look at the Union from the viewpoint of the minorities. They generally think its a good thing, and that they're being generous to their less well-off and smaller neighbours, but they like being the dominant force in politics. After all, Scotland and Wales together can only muster under 100 MPs, out of 646. That means in effect that England already has a parliament of its own, and has had one for centuries. Yet they complain.
Its a bit like Israel and the Palestinians. Israel has stolen their land, oppressed them for 60 years, and complains when a few primitive rockets get thrown at them. They can't understand why the Palestinians detest their country.
The Tory party has always treated Wales with a measure of contempt. Tangible contempt. We had a string of English Secretaries under Thatcher and Major. Wyn Roberts wasn't good enough, even though he was loyal to the party. But then, he was Welsh through and through, and Welsh-speaking, well educated and articulate in both languages. But they preferred Redwood, who wasn't much good at anything, except alienating people.
Cheryl Gillian is the latest incarnation in that line. Her appointment spells out what things will be like here in Wales under a Cameron administration. He has nothing at all in common with Wales, knows nothing about our country, and is not interested in it. He lives on a different planet. (It doesn't mean that he isn't a likeable chappie). If he gets into power, it will be despite Wales, not because of it. If things are bad now, they will be worse, much worse.
"...is it better to be Shadow First Minister or real life Leader of the Opposition?"
That reminds me of a joke...
First prize in a raffle = 1 week in Swansea
Second prize = 2 weeks in Swansea
The First Minister has less power than the Secretary of State had before devolution. The Secretary had the same powers, and sat in the Cabinet. He didn't have such democratic credentials. Being FM isn't much, DFM is a cr*p job, and shadow anything in Wales is completely illusory, as the word implies. As for Nick Bourne (whom I quite like actually) in the Cabinet.. you must be joking.
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Wales means a trip to Barry for Cameron every once in a while. Oh and Alex Salmond visited Cardiff, so Cameron might have looked into that. Otherwise he can ignore us, especially when we beat the english in cardiff! Whatever Bourne is, like all Welsh politicians, with a few exceptions like Peter Hain, they are all irrelevant and won't bother Cameron.
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Just realised. The only reason Cameron wants her is to gather tips for beating Labour from someone who is familiar with Salmond.
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brynt41, your #3
"So its not largesse on their part to give us 'handouts', its self interest. etc ....."
No handout, no largesse, not self-interest, just the UK family, living side by side, good times and bad .....
..... but we have the dour separatists amongst us, glass always half empty, as empty as their vision of a promised land, we still welcome them to share a meal even though they deny being hungry, and with Barnett their starvation is relegated to bad dreams.
There is one bad dream the unionists cannot rid themselves of, the nightmare on "Plaid Cymru Street", not just yet .....
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#6 TheStonemason wrote:
"No handout, no largesse, not self-interest, just the UK family, living side by side, good times and bad ....."
Trouble is, in this UK family 'home' someone perpetually lives in the attic and the basement, where the central heating isn't installed, and there is no insulation. There live the poor relations who always feel the cold and the damp first.
But they do occasionally get the crumbs from the table, but are contantly reminded of how lucky they are to live under such a roof, with such generous people. Btw, the main householders are always getting into expensive and unnecessary fights, often across the other side of town, and they expect their poor relations from the attic and basement to help them out, whilst they stand well behind.
They have recently decided (how very kind of them) that the inhabitants of said basement can decide for themselves how to share out the crumbs, but aren't allowed to make any other important decisions. All that happens upstairs, and can't be questioned. The occupants must know their place and doff their caps to their betters in this 'family' home
One hope that you had a nice weekend, perhaps got 'stoned'?
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brynt41, your #7
Why insult a person with unfounded and obnoxious accusations?
To drive attention into the valley's of despair so loved by the separatists, opponents of the Union have nothing concrete to bring to the party, whereas the majority will share with each other, including the opposition, the good times with the bad, always making sure "crumbs" and "caps" are kept firmly in antiquity.
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I hope the Conservatives win the next UK General Election. I really do, because with a Conservative government Welsh independence moves closer to reality.
I welcome a Conservative Victory in England!
Tan yn Llyn 1936
The Conservative UK government of Stanley Baldwin refused to consider a petitition by half a million Welsh protestors who objected to a bombing school in the Llyn Peninsula.
The result: The events of Tan yn Llyn galvanized the Welsh community and recast Plaid Cymru from mostly a Welsh language education and pressure group to more of a political party, one which adopted Welsh independence as part of its goals.
In a modern sense, the events of Tan yn Llyn demonstrated that the UK government would dismiss the will of the Welsh people who objected.
The flooding of Capel Celyn 1956
The Conservative Parliament of the 1950s pass the bill which resulted in the flooding of Capel Celyn, a community of historic significance, dispite universal and vocal objections by all politicans in Wales, with 35 out of the 36 Welsh UK MPs, across all political parties, voting down the bill (one Welsh MP obstained).
The result: According to Professor John Davies"The building of the reservoir was instrumental in an increase in support for Plaid Cymru during the late 1950s. Almost unanimous Welsh political opposition had failed to stop approval of the scheme, a fact that seemed to underline Plaid Cymru's argument that the Welsh national community was powerless", and "of perhaps greater significance, however, was the impetus the episode gave to Welsh devolution. The Council of Wales recommended the creation of a Welsh Office (Swyddfa Gymreig) and Secretary of State for Wales early in 1957, a time when the governance of Wales on a national level was so demonstrably lacking in many people's eyes" (Butt-Phillip, A, The Welsh Question, (1975)
Hunger Strike for S4C 1981
Following the Yes Campaign's defeat in 1979, and believing Welsh nationalism was "in a paralysis of helplessness," the UK Conservative government Home Secretary announced in September 1979 that the government would not honour its pledge in the previous May's election campaign to establish a Welsh language television channel, much to widespread anger and resentment in Wales, wrote Dr Davies.
In early 1980 over two thousand members of Plaid Cymru pledged to go to prison rather than pay the television licence fees, and by that spring Evans announced his intention to fast to death if a Welsh language channel were not established. In early September 1980, Evans addressed thousands at a gathering in which "passions ran high," according to Dr Davies. The government yielded by 17 September, and the Welsh Fourth Channel (S4C) was launched on 2 November 1982.
With these fine examples, I welcome Her Majesty to appoint the next Conservative Government in London.
With the current meddeling with the UK parliament in granting LCO's and with th expected meddeling by a Conservative appointed Welsh Secretary, one can expect greater sympathy in Wales for greater parliamentry authority.
Bring it on! lol.
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Re: 3. brynt41
I generally agree with your observations Brynt41, but with one exception. I do not believe that England's world profile will be really that diminished.
I think a "United Kingdom of England and Cornwall" (if Cornwall ever achieved Self Government status as many would like) would still retain a strong international presence within the world.
As far as the UK losing its seat on the UN Security Council... there are currently calls for it to lose the seat now. And France, too, for that matter.
There are calls from many to have France and the UK to be replaced by a European Union representative, and to add either India or Brazil as a permanent Security Council member.
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To follow up on my comments on post 10,
I do admire the UK military, and all three nations of Scotland, England, and Wales have strong military traditions independent of each other, traditions that will not be lost with independence of Scotland and Wales.
For Wales, one could imagine that on independence, Wales would retain the Royal Welsh, and all other military assets within Wales, under the titular command of a Welsh Prince of Wales as Head of State. The Royal Welsh could continue its international presence, but through the United Nations, as a peace keeping force simular to the French Foreign Legion. Domestically, the Welsh Guard would serve for local defense.
England, Scotland, and Wales would bring their military expierences and expertise to greater use through the United Nations, and through NATO.
I do not believe for one moment that an independent England would be in any way inferrior to the French.
Foreign policy between the three countries would not be so divergant as to believe that they would
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
My #12 was removed because of a pdf link.
#10-#11 Drachenfyre
I'm afraid we have to disagree on Wales' military traditions.
True, Welshmen have been used as mercenaries for a long time by the English... Crecy (1346) being a prime example.
Large numbers from Wales fought in the world wars, but most were conscripted. Many died or were maimed. The Great War was fought to maintain Britain's trade and empire, from which Wales gained precious little. The Welsh were foot soldiers, led by English public school-educated donkeys on the general staff. The Second War resulted from the mistakes of Versailles. There wouldn't have been a Hitler otherwise.
Much as I disagree with the principle of the end justifying the means, Lewis, Valentine and Williams took a principled stand against militarism, as you point out above. There was strong support in Wales for that principle, if not for their direct action. A Welsh jury refused to convict them, despite their admission. Pacifism (of which btw I'm not really a supporter) has strong roots in Wales, particularly in Welsh Nonconformity, as exemplified by Henry Richard MP ('The Apostle of Peace') and others.
A sovereign Welsh state would indeed need defence forces, on land, sea and air, but they would be miniscule in comparison with those of the UK. The budget would be tiny. Wales wouldn't need a nuclear deterrent - Trident - or two gigantic aircraft carriers, for example. It wouldn't need an armaments industry.
The UK has sold weapons and is selling them to some very questionable regimes, directly, as in the case of Israel, or indirectly. It also produces electronic components for advanced weaponry, some exported to the USA and used in the F16 aircraft which devastated Gaza killing and maiming hundreds of children. The engines in some of the pilotless drones which bombed Gaza were made by an English firm in Lichfield. This is a trade in which Wales need not participate or benefit from. It is dirty money. The British government doesn't like to publicise its involvement in the trade for that very reason.
http://www.amnesty.org/en/library/asset/MDE15/012/2009/en/5be86fc2-994e-4eeb-a6e8-3ddf68c28b31/mde150122009en.html
Welsh defence forces could be involved in peacekeeping duties, similar to those of the RoI, thus being a constructive force in the world, instead of the opposite.
My vision is for a peace-loving Wales, having good relations with fellow members of the world community. I remember from my schooldays the tradition of the 'Message of Peace and Goodwill', broadcast in 1925 for the first time by the Urdd and the League of Nations. Ifan ab Owen Edwards, the Urdd's founder, decided that bridges should be built between different cultures and nations, after he experienced the destruction and suffering of the Great War. He believed that the Urdd should join the campaign for peace to rid the world's nations of ignorance and prejudice.
Edwards' vision has been shattered by the likes of Blair and Brown, who associated themselves with Bush's militarism and the desire to extend US hegemony in the Middle East. Britain's standing in the world community has plummeted in the last decade.
Wales' foreign policy would be very different. It would be a Wales of which we could be proud, instead of ashamed.
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Brynt41, I love your last sentence!
Scotland ,when she becomes independent , will follow that path too!
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re 13 Brynt
*Nods*
I respect your comments very much. And indeed, Welsh pacificism has deep roots in Wales. In large part as anti-UK sentiment.
Plaid Cymru was officially neutral during the Second World War, but the party did leave it to individual members to decide their involvement in the War. However, the party did object to the wholesale conscription of Welshmen to fight in another country's war, and felt that the Welsh should chose to volunteer. A nuanced position on the whole.
The vast majority of Plaid members did fight in the Second World War against Faciest Germany, and viewed the War as a Just War, even if they personally objected to the UK army.
Having said that, true contentious objectors were dismissed from service, such as Gwynfor Evans.
However, Saunders Lewis was not a pacifist himself by any stretch. His actions demonstrated his convictions. He objected to the bombing school in Llyn because of the cultural traditions there and that the bombing school threatened the peaceful culture there. The bombing school would have a negitive impact on the local population.
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When I wrote of Welsh martial traditions, I was meaning in the sense that the Welsh have very capable service men and women fighting today. Most of the service men in the past hundred years and more have been conscripted, weather or not they were English or Welsh or Irish. Had Wales always been an independent nation, she would have built on the traditions of Prince Llywelyn the Great and other military leaders, sustaining a suitable armed forces necessary for its own defense. Prehaps the military would be simular to that of Denmark or Norway. Or, indeed, Ireland.
Once independent, the Welsh armed forces, however modest, will have skilled men and women who will be able to get the job done.
I agree and share with you these sentiments:
"A sovereign Welsh state would indeed need defense forces, on land, sea and air, but they would be minuscule in comparison with those of the UK. The budget would be tiny. Wales wouldn't need a nuclear deterrent - Trident - or two gigantic aircraft carriers, for example. It wouldn't need an armaments industry.
Welsh defense forces could be involved in peacekeeping duties, similar to those of the RoI, thus being a constructive force in the world, instead of the opposite.
My vision is for a peace-loving Wales, having good relations with fellow members of the world community. I remember from my schooldays the tradition of the 'Message of Peace and Goodwill', broadcast in 1925 for the first time by the Urdd and the League of Nations. Ifan ab Owen Edwards, the Urdd's founder, decided that bridges should be built between different cultures and nations, after he experienced the destruction and suffering of the Great War. He believed that the Urdd should join the campaign for peace to rid the world's nations of ignorance and prejudice. "
*By the by, The UK does not have two "gigantic" aircraft carriers, hehe. Compared to US aircraft carriers, they are merely amphibious support vessels! Even the new Queen Elizabeth II class aircraft carriers are rather modest to a conventional French aircraft carrier.
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#15 Drachenfyre
"The UK does not have two "gigantic" aircraft carriers..."
I wasn't referring to the existing vessels but to the two ships the Labour government are in process of commissioning (although as the link below shows, are going to be delayed for economic reasons).
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7776695.stm
Your own government is probably the most militaristic in the universe, hehe. If you read my link to Amnesty in #13 you'll see the extent to which the US supplies Israel with its military hardware. I am not an admirer of the US Government, but have several good friends over there.
To link back to this blog topic, the Tories are generally the more military and defence-minded of the two parties, although New Labour have perhaps overtaken them in that respect. I don't believe that the Tories and their right wing policies resonate well in the Welsh psyche. I consider them in essence to be an English party. Wales will suffer at their hands.
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test
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(Post 17 was a test, I was having issues copy/pasting my comment. It wasnt taking for some reason! lol)
re: 16 Brynt
Yes, the US does supply and sell weapons to allies and western leaning regimes we think we can work with. Granted, in the long term this policy as bit us in the arse! lol. But this is similar to the UK policy as well.
I do not see any conflict in selling arms so long as it is to allies, or peaceful western leaning liberal democracies, or freedom fighters fighting against tyrannical governments.
I personally have an issue with selling it to absolute dictatorships or entities that act as third parties for them.
Yes, some initally western leaning governments which at one time professed towards a liberal democracy have shown themselves to be in fact petty dictators themselves. It can be hard to forcast into the future for generations when it comes to this.
In terms of selling arms to Isreal, I do agree that we should halt the sell of weapons to Isreal if Isreal continues its occupation of the West Bank and Gaza, and continues to allow settlers in those regions.
However, Isreal does have a right to defend itself against terrorist actions. The governments of the West Bank and Gaza (such as it is) needs to realize this and not allow terrorists to use their country as a spring board to terrorize Isreal.
In terms of the US being "the most militaristic in the universe", I defer you to the regimes of the People's Republic of China, the Russian Federation, the Islamic Republic of Iran, the Democratic People's Republic of Korea, amongst others.
Tust me, give them an inch and they will take a country or two. They have no respect for human rights, and I am sorry but repression and political abuse is not a valid cultural tradition.
They are enemies of the Liberal Democracies of the world, and will use any means at their disposal to undermine the values you and I hold dear.
The US invasion of Afganistan was a Just War, as the Taliban party there suported Al Qaeda. The US had the United Nations approval to invade, and Nato was called in to adhear to its charter to defend a member nation.
I agree we did not have a "Just War" to invade Iraq, and I disagreed with that particular war and occupation.
I repsect that you may not agree with US foreign policy (I do nto always either), but better the devil you know, then the dictatorship you dont. Can you imagine Russian or Chinese warships patrolling the cost of Wales or Western Europe to be sure that their oil contracted suppliers got to China unmolested?
It scares me.
Its great you have friends in the US, and you have another here too, lol
I did know of the two pending Queen Elizabeth class aircraft carriers. But they only hold 50 aircraft each and have limited capabilities.
US carriers hold 90 fixed wing aircraft. The UK carriers are for the US simply support vessels, with half the combat capability of a US carrier.
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Here are wiki links to the two styles of carriers
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_George_Bush
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_Elizabeth_class_aircraft_carrier
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