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Betsan Powys | 06:00 UK time, Saturday, 22 September 2007

Labour pamphlet: Plaid's role in the Assembly government 'has not at all dented their separatist aspirations'.

Plaid press release: 'Plaid's new role in the One Wales Government will certainly not dent its aspiration to secure full national status in the European Union ...'

Plaid call: 'on Rhodri Morgan and his Assembly cabinet to distance themselves from regressive voices within its own ranks in Wales'.

Who, along with Peter Hain, has put his name to Labour' s pamphlet?

Rhodri Morgan.

Comments   Post your comment

  • 1.
  • At 10:58 AM on 22 Sep 2007,
  • Richard Harris wrote:

I (unfortunately) remember Hain's earlier pamphlet, "The A-Z of Nationalism", produced for the 1999 Assembly election ~ so BAD that the Labour Party themselves virtually disowned it.

Rhetorical question ~ Is there anything more gut-turning than Peter Hain - "Agent Orange" - yapping canine faithful as his (new) master's voice? His current piece on conference democracy for the Guardian's comment site would do "credit" to Joe Stalin.

I had maybe thought rather better of Rhodri Morgan given their previous, less than happy, "relationship".

NEEDS DRIVE?

  • 2.
  • At 11:15 AM on 22 Sep 2007,
  • John R. Walker wrote:

Labour are dead right that Plaid - a.k.a. the WNP - are still hell-bent on breaking up the UK.

Straight from the horse's mouth, in a surprisingly otherwise unreported interview with the Parliamentary Monitor, we have Dafydd El proclaiming that the EU is already more important than Westminster... No surprises there then!

"But really, it is not about the United Kingdom anymore; it is about Europe. We must start developing stronger relationships with other legislative regions within Europe.

"For the next few years, we will want to concentrate in Wales on gaining greater powers and Plaid and the SNP will want their respective referendums to come at the same time."

It's here:
http://www.epolitix.com/EN/News/200709/c434b256-7eeb-4511-8a20-e6b1e394d495.htm

Not sure why the usual collection of pro-devolution political hacks in Cardiff Bay didn't report this but maybe the truth wouldn't go down too well with the proles?

  • 3.
  • At 11:00 AM on 23 Sep 2007,
  • Ian Titherington wrote:

Well yes, we do actually have a political ideology and are not ashamed of it.

It is also interesting to note that that Tory MPs in Wales are now also creating clear blue water between themselves and their Assembly colleagues-mirroring the behaviour of Labour.

In terms of our long term vision of a Wales governing itself, why does it have to be seen in terms of a negative? The UK has only been around since 1921 and all we are doing is campaigning for a political democracy that we believe will best serve all the people of Wales.

  • 4.
  • At 03:43 PM on 23 Sep 2007,
  • John Evans wrote:

Of course Plaid want full the brake up of the UK, thats what Plaid are all about. Hain and the other unionists must have a very low IQ, or perhaps they think the people of Wales have an even lower IQ.

In due time the EU will become more important than Westminster, maybe or maybe not that time has actually come.

As Plaid have often said we want to get out of Westminster not the EU.

Hain and his lot have had their day, even if they dont fully know yet

  • 5.
  • At 05:54 PM on 23 Sep 2007,
  • Arfon Jones wrote:

This was reported on the BBC website - publication of Peter Hain's pamphlet. I don't think anyone in Plaid Cymru are trying to hide the fact that our ambition is similar to Scotland in that we will be recognised as a nation within Europe. Rest assured Mr Walker that the UK is and will continue to break up...and the sooner the better, and there is nothing that the imperialist fascist right can do about it.

  • 6.
  • At 08:21 PM on 23 Sep 2007,
  • david rodway wrote:

Wow, Mr Walker has the scoop of the century: Plaid want independence within Europe. Move aside Paxman, Robinson, Powys et al! The party that has always wanted a self-governing Wales and greater powers for the Assembly secretly wants... er... wait for it... a self-governing Wales and greater powers for the Assembly!
As for us 'proles', is Mr Walker suggesting that we Welsh are too stupid to realise what we're voting for, or that we don't know what Plaid stand for? Agree or disagree with them, their stance is clear.

The real question is this: WHERE DO LABOUR STAND? With Rhodri and Carwyn Jones wanting more devolution within a federal UK, or with Don Touhig et al wanting, well, anything that keeps their jobs and keeps power in London?

The new Hain/Morgan pamphlet is an attempt to divert attention from THE single major rift within an otherwise slick NuLab machine.

  • 7.
  • At 10:09 PM on 23 Sep 2007,
  • david rodway wrote:

Wow, Mr Walker has the scoop of the century: Plaid want independence within Europe. Move aside Paxman, Robinson, Powys et al! The party that has always stated that it wanted a self-governing Wales and greater powers for the Assembly secretly wants... er... wait for it... a self-governing Wales and greater powers for the Assembly!
As for us 'proles', is Mr Walker suggesting that we Welsh are too stupid to realise what we're voting for, or that we don't know what Plaid stand for? Agree or disagree with them, their stance is clear.

The real question is this: WHERE DO LABOUR STAND? With Rhodri and Carwyn Jones wanting more devolution within a federal UK, or with Don Touhig et al wanting, well, anything that keeps their jobs and keeps power in London?

The new Hain/Morgan pamphlet is an attempt to divert attention from THE single major rift within an otherwise slick NuLab machine.

  • 8.
  • At 09:25 AM on 24 Sep 2007,
  • Richard Harris wrote:

"the usual collection of pro devolution hacks...etc"

John W.? ...Why only last week The HAIN ONE was talking about "devolution" being "the settled will of the Welsh people", to be further advanced through Labour's thoughtful constitutional procedure aka "The Maze" aka "Keep the Touhigs On Side"...

The MIGHTY Gordon demanded yet another grovelling U Turn from you??? Yet more Loyalty tests???

Hard to keep up with TRUE WELSH LABOUR!!!

  • 9.
  • At 12:37 PM on 25 Sep 2007,
  • Vale Boy wrote:

I thought John R Walker's comments were interesting, if a little naive in some places. Dafydd El's remarks in his interview last week were quite dramatic, and I thought echoed the main thrust of Plaid's current political argument- that further devolution (and, subsequently, independence) is 'inevitable', and were similar to other recent arguments laid down by other senior Plaid politicians- that if you are a unionist you are somehow 'backward-looking' and that 'British' is now a dirty word in Welsh politics.

I'm surprised it didn't get much more coverage in the Welsh media as they usually love this sort of stuff, but it could be quite indicative of the flavour Welsh politics that is to come with the new 'One Wales' coalition- interesting times lie ahead!


It is quite clear that New Labour and true Labour is Blue Labour, however much it is disguised. Tony Blair and Godon Brown took over the central ground and made it their own. The likes of Michael Foot would be shocked to see what Labour has become. The people of Wales have no connection with London Labour and the clear red water is the only way in which Labour can re-establish that connection.
Otherwise I believe that Labour has lost Wales and the people will look elsewhere for progressive policies focusing on people rather than politics. We know which party espouses these ideals.

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