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Park life

  • Jon Kelly
  • 24 Sep 08, 10:43 AM GMT

Fancy an easy dig at Americans? Then you'll probably want to use the words "trailer park" at some point. This one handy phrase conjures up every negative image of the US rural poor, whilst at the same lending you an air of aloof superiority.

All this made me want to go and actually see such a community for myself. I'd just crossed into Mississippi, the poorest state in the Union, and I hoped it would tell me something about low-income America beyond the archetypes.

The park I pulled up in, just outside Vicksburg, didn't look like some vision of feckless poverty to me. Most of the homes had recently been whitewashed and the gardens were neatly tended.

No-one chased me off their property with a shotgun. In fact, the people I met seemed genuinely pleased that someone had bothered to come and talk to them.

Jennifer also spoke to local children about politics and life on the park:

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I had expected the sort of caravans I always seem to get stuck behind on British roads, but Tina Abney, 41, put me right. She worked in the accounts department for a company that manufactured most of the prefabricated homes around me. Tina herself lived in one with her husband Dean, 42, and their two children.

Tina and Dean Abney"They're just like regular houses," she smiled. "They've got the same taps and sinks and floors. I like it here."

But, Tina said, the couple were currently living "from paycheck to paycheck". Her own working week had been cut from five days to four following a drop in orders. Dean was considering selling his new pickup truck because of the high price of gas.

"Times are tough right now," he chipped in. "I bet everyone on your journey has told you that." I nodded.

He hadn't decided how to vote yet. Neither candidate had convinced him yet that they understood his problems. "I'm leaving it until the last minute," he sighed. Tina would have backed Hillary Clinton had she been the Democratic candidate, but had been won over by Sarah Palin. "She'd be good for the country."

In a home around the corner, I picked up the same sense of resignation about the election that I had detected in Dean.

As an African-American, hospital technician Tim Washington, 42, appreciated the significance of Barack Obama's candidacy. But he wouldn't be voting in November, he said. Neither of the candidates had convinced him that they would make a difference to his life.

"In the past I used to keep up with politics," he explained. "I used to follow it. But I guess I just lost interest.

Trailer park in Vicksburg, Mississippi"I relate to Obama. But I don't really know what he's actually going to do."

If Tim was cynical about the way the country was going, he was positive about his community. Everyone on the trailer park got along well, he said - black, white, Hispanic, Asian. People looked after each other's kids, knew each other's names.

He was less enamoured than Tina with the houses, though.

"It's not like a real home. It'd blow down if a real wind came along," he said.

"But it's OK for me. If the people nextdoor move out, I want to buy their land and expand."

I was still very much in America, it appeared.

Comments

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  • 1. At 11:50am on 24 Sep 2008, Peter_Sym wrote:

    If these are meant to be the poorest of the poor in the US and the butt of every european jibe about rednecks then we have nothing to be smug about:

    They all work, different races get on together , they're proud of their homes and take care of them and the people decide who to vote for based on policy.

    Compare that to a British sink estate.....

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  • 2. At 12:00pm on 24 Sep 2008, diabulos wrote:

    It is clear from the text that he failed to go to a traler park, he went to a prefab home residential...be clear on how you present things, a trailer park is that, a place where people live in trailers, not prefab houses...you did not visit the poorest of them all, you know if you wanted you could have found the closest trailer park off a dirt road and see true utter poverty and mind-boggling levels of ignorance...but you chose not to...

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  • 3. At 12:05pm on 24 Sep 2008, JenetteFish wrote:

    While people living in trailer homes in Mississippi are certainly poor (or at least lower middle class), they are by no means the poorest in the country. To find them, you need to head to the sorts of communities that have been disenfranchised because of their background. Consider a trip to the borderlands, at the very south end of Texas, where you'll find large communities of Latinos, some migrants, some whose families have been in Texas since before it belonged to the U.S. You'll find people living without running water, without schools, and so on.

    Similarly, painting a picture of poor people who can all work and who live together in racial harmony is not always the case. I spent a week in Appalachia (West Virginia, specifically) and left thinking to myself, "These people live in America? In the 21st century?") It was eye-opening.

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  • 4. At 12:05pm on 24 Sep 2008, lordSUPERFRED wrote:

    Really in tersting , I have visited Vicksberg on holiday a few years ago on a travail down Hway 61 visiting civil war sites and have fond memories of the pople and area .
    I t is the same here in the uk , people are disintersted with politicians and although this is perhaps the most crucial world period since WW2 I am not suprised that the people interviewed feel powerless to affect a change by voting for either candidate .
    I dont know what to put it down to but I would not suggst apathy , more like resignation of the ordinary folks being shafted by rich co-operations and politicians having no real felling for them or the mess the average person finds himself in

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  • 5. At 12:09pm on 24 Sep 2008, distantrambler wrote:

    I totally agree with Peter_Sym. They go to work they do not live on the state and they do not look for free council homes and then trash them.

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  • 6. At 12:10pm on 24 Sep 2008, Middle-Engerland wrote:

    I couldn't help but think that the author was himself having 'an easy dig at Americans' himself, judging by the tone of this article. But as Peter_Sym said above, most of them take care of their homes as best they can and get along together, whereas many of our council estates are places where no-one gives a damn and which often look like war-torn Beirut.
    And yes, what exactly *does* Obama stand for? Not unlike our own Gordon Brown, who makes up policy on the hoof, viz. the 10p tax climbdown, and the raft of recent 'initiatives' from them, such as 'help' for the housing market and with fuel bills.

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  • 7. At 12:28pm on 24 Sep 2008, RJTysoe wrote:

    "If these are meant to be the poorest of the poor in the US and the butt of every european jibe about rednecks then we have nothing to be smug about"

    They're not, and nowhere in the article does it say they are, so further discussion is pretty pointless.

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  • 8. At 12:38pm on 24 Sep 2008, freemembername wrote:

    Why would these people not feel disenfranchised?

    Long before their UK cousins American politicians knew that there is no chance of being elected by the crucial middle-ground swingvoters by doing something as laudable as caring about the things that matter to the poorer members of the electorate

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  • 9. At 1:14pm on 24 Sep 2008, iwinter wrote:

    Peter_Sym, your suggestion that they vote based on policy made me chuckle somewhat.

    The lady called Tina in the article said she'd have voted Clinton but has been won over by Palin. Their policies are rather opposite, it's pretty obvious she isn't choosing a candidate based on policy but in fact based on sex which is typical of what I can only call the "Hillary Problem".

    Obama needed Hillary to win over the women who put their feminist agenda over and above common sense voting and yet he also shouldn't have chosen Hillary because she just didn't have that great policies.

    McCain realised he could win over those women with a woman VP of his own, no matter how opposed to his own policies she is and no matter how atrociously bad she is as a politican, he's won over the rednecks and the women voters who can't see past some inferiority complex over their sex.

    If only these people were the sort to select a candidate based on policy- if that were true we certainly would never have had the tragedy that is Bush and we also wouldn't see McCain so close to succeeding in attaining the presidency.

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  • 10. At 1:21pm on 24 Sep 2008, 1randomman wrote:

    As an American who lives in a Trailer I would like to tell you of an experience I had last year. An engineer from london came to my company to do some work for a week here in New Mexico. I brought him home one day. He really enjoyed shooting all of my guns, riding my dirt bike and off road go cart like a true mad max, wearing my cowboy hat, messing around in the barn, etc. NONE of those things were in any way available to him at home in England. At the end of the day, he made a lot more money than me, but he was the one who was jealous..... In short, dont think that we poor Americans have it all that bad.

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  • 11. At 1:46pm on 24 Sep 2008, ArthurofKansas wrote:

    I known many people who live in “trailer parks” and the one Mr Kelly visited is quite typical. The rural working poor may be one paycheck away from complete poverty but they hold traditional rural values, like personal responsibility and patriotism. If you want to see truly degrading poverty, you must go to the cities.

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  • 12. At 1:49pm on 24 Sep 2008, idontlikeguns wrote:

    I feel this article has totally missed the point. What may embarrass a significant percentage of white America is the existence of so-called "poor white trash", a highly derogatory term for low income white people with seemingly little education and culture. The existence of the term itself is a poor reflection on those who use it and the trailer park the author visits is a long way from the trailer parks that these people have in mind. You just have to get off the beaten track.

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  • 13. At 2:25pm on 24 Sep 2008, EnglishHooiser wrote:

    I was born and spent a lot of my childhood in Britain, but i've lived in Indiana for the last 14 years; I can tell you that there are trailer parks like the one Jon Kelly has visited, and then there are the stereotypical redneck trailer parks with broken down cars on concrete blocks in the front yard.

    As with any other type of neighborhood, there are good examples and bad examples. What Jon Kelly went to was the former, a well-maintained park embodying multiculturalism and private land ownership, located just outside of a city of 27,000 people. I recommend this reporter go to a rural, West Texas trailer park to truly appreciate the poverty and ignorance trailer parks sometimes represent.

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  • 14. At 2:27pm on 24 Sep 2008, dracodarling wrote:

    As an American that happens to reside in a manufacture home park, I am partially relieved by this article. People in America have an assumption that citizens that do live in a "trailer" park are poor, white, dirty and ignorant. I have had people that judge a person prior to never actually entering into a place or taking the opportunity to get to know the people who live here. Our neighborhood is cleaner and more aesthetically pleasing than most of the home developments adjacent to the inner city. We have beautiful gardens, no junk , non-rusting swingsets, and a tranquil atmosphere which is why my husband and I have remained here for years. We own our home, able to save money, and continue to live diligently. We both have university degrees and always vote based on policy. I thank the author for this article to reveal a somewhat more positive image of people who do live in these type of neighborhoods.

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  • 15. At 2:41pm on 24 Sep 2008, OldSouth wrote:

    Good article...so many in the South like these folks. Working hard, raising children, hoping for a better life in a 'stick-built' or brick house. Many scrape up money to buy land, install the pre-fab house on it, then scrape up the means to build their own permanent dwelling. They barter their skills as mechanics with others who know how to install plumbing, for instance.

    I know these folks, live amongst them. They are highly imperfect souls, just like all of us, but to the elites, either at the country club or in academia, these people are invisible.

    Who speaks for them and to them?

    As you ride on the bus, I suggest listening to Alan Jackson albums. He seems to tell their stories these days.

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  • 16. At 3:32pm on 24 Sep 2008, theoldgoat wrote:

    Tina would have backed Hillary Clinton had she been the Democratic candidate, but had been won over by Sarah Palin. "She'd be good for the country."

    That's a really scary thought, that you could place the gender of a candidate above the policies.
    Frankly the US deserves the president it elects. I just don't think the rest of the world does though.

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  • 17. At 4:11pm on 24 Sep 2008, Peter_Sym wrote:

    "That's a really scary thought, that you could place the gender of a candidate above the policies."

    Is it? How many people voted Kerry last simply because he wasn't Bush. Is that any better for the US (and the rest of the world) than voting for someone based on their sex, their skin colour or their age?

    In any case most voters in the US will vote the same party they always vote for. The actual outcome of the election will be decided by a very few swing voters.

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  • 18. At 5:53pm on 24 Sep 2008, briahugh wrote:

    It should also be remembered that the electoral college system in the US means that candidates can and do completely ignore non-battleground states such as Mississippi during elections. Mississippi is solid Republican (60% last 2 elections) and will remain so which results in neither candidate spending time or money finding out what the voters there think or want - there's nothing in it for either candidate to bother making promises. Unfortunate if your one of the 40% who didn't vote Republican as it means you have essentially no voice at all in the election (same thing but reversed if you're a Republican in California or Massachusetts) but it's the way it is.

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  • 19. At 6:42pm on 24 Sep 2008, nodano wrote:

    To all those people who are disappointed that Jon didn't go to a "stereotypical" trailer park, all I have to say is the real world has both the good and the bad. From the tone of the article, Jon didn't have any agenda when he set out - he didn't go looking for the "best" trailer park. The fact that he found one which bucks the stereotype just means the stereotype isn't always true.

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  • 20. At 10:07pm on 24 Sep 2008, acmesilver wrote:

    As diabulos pointed out in comment #2, Jon has yet to visit a trailer park, yet he seems to think his comments are to be taken in that context.

    Think again Jon, and do a bit more searching. Get out of that bus, into a small car, and travel the miles and miles of dirt roads that criss-cross many states, especially in the deep south.

    You will find a very different America than the one along the highways. It is an America many Americans don't even know exists..and it votes.

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  • 21. At 03:54am on 25 Sep 2008, nmresident wrote:

    I have been following the trip since Jon began. What I find interesting in the reader comments, both American and foreign, is the consistent view that Jon is not talking to the "typical" or "stereotypical" American.

    I have lived in 8 states and traveled to all but one. I can say that there are cross-sections of people, certainly, but as Jon is finding out--there is no one American. There are rich and poor, kind and selfish, educated and ignorant, and every stripe in between. It seems to me the same is true of the countries I've visited. And, I'm not certain anyone else doing such a journey in a country other than their own would know to find such diverse communities and individuals.

    Given that he has visited a native tribe, people in a trailer park, folks in cities, in rural towns, etc., I'd say he's going to more places than do most reporters. Keep it up, Jon--you are meeting America. So many tourists seeing America see just the tourist spots--Orlando, New York, Vegas. There's so much more.

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  • 22. At 08:44am on 25 Sep 2008, SydneySD-6 wrote:

    I liked the article for what it was meant to convey but I was totally put off by Tina's comment on who she would have voted for and who won her over. Since Palin and Hillary have absolutely nothing in common in regards to policy, Palin won her over because she is simply female. That is really sad. May be just as sad as what McCain tried to pull yesterday when he suspended his campaign and suggested to postpone the Friday debate to deal with the financial crisis. Does he have the country at heart when proposing this? I am not buying. I personally think it is a political move to sway some voters his way. Just like the Palin pick as his running mate.

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  • 23. At 10:02am on 25 Sep 2008, Peter_Sym wrote:

    #22. Are you criticising a politican for making political decisions? You might as well criticise a cloud for raining.

    McCains decision to suspend campaiging until the bail out is sorted is no more or less a political move than Obamas decision to keep campaiging. Both have done what they think will best serve them at the polls. I am amused that you think picking Palin was a political move, but imply that Obama picking Biden somehow wasn't!

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  • 24. At 3:47pm on 25 Sep 2008, bobbyford wrote:

    This is all a great idea, just a shame about the itinerary for the bus....

    Has no one told the BBC that the US elections are decided state by state? Nearly all of the states the BBC has placed on this trip are not even remotely in play this year, so the voters there will make about as much difference to the outcome as I do here in Manchester.

    Into this category fall California, Illinois, and New York for the Democrats, and Texas, Mississippi, Arkansas, Tennessee, Kentucky, and Arizona for the Republicans. Neither of the campaigns are spending any time in, or money on, these states. They are in the bank. The only battleground states on the whole trip are New Mexico, Nevada and Ohio.

    As I assume all the BBC's political reporters are on this bus, they are spending the majority of their time covering this election in places where the outcome is already 99% certain, and ignoring completely states like Colorado, Virginia, North Carolina, New Hampshire, and Pennsylvania (to name but a few) where the election will be won or lost.

    This is a terrible waste of a great opportunity. It would be like American reporters coming over here in 2005 and spending their whole time camped out in Newcastle, Glasgow and the Home Counties. Hardly an approach likely to help the folks back home understand how the result is bieng fought.

    Sorry John, I know this is not your fault, but you might want to tell your higher ups to read a few basic American politics text books before planning their next road trip at the tax payer's expense.

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  • 25. At 3:50pm on 25 Sep 2008, grim-reality wrote:

    I am from Northern Canada and grew up in a Trailer Park, not that much unlike what was in the video. And yes diabulos they are trailers not pre-fabs houses.

    But I am currently living in the UK just west of London. I have a son and want to move back to Canada as I can give him things there like an outdoor life.

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  • 26. At 3:58pm on 25 Sep 2008, lynnetteinmn wrote:

    Whether McCain's decision to postpone the debate was based on what it would do for him in the polls or not, being in Washington at this time is where he should be. In his position as Republican nominee he has enormous influence there and should be an active member of the bi-partisan decision making process.

    And, frankly, I would prefer to hear that some sort of action has been decided upon rather than listen to a presidential debate. There is still plenty of time for a debate, whereas this economic problem is an urgent matter that needs tending to.

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  • 27. At 3:59pm on 25 Sep 2008, tuairimiocht wrote:

    "If these are meant to be the poorest of the poor in the US and the butt of every european jibe about rednecks then we have nothing to be smug about.

    Compare that to a British sink estate..... "

    I suggest comparing like with like. For example,

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cabrini-Green

    Is the BBC bus going there?

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  • 28. At 4:07pm on 25 Sep 2008, sblake7 wrote:

    Why is it the so called dum-redneck not only reads more than the urban dweller but their predisposition to guns, hunting, farming and the frontier, position these people far better strategicaly, during any serious downturn going forward.

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  • 29. At 4:09pm on 25 Sep 2008, sblake7 wrote:

    an average redneck has a far better life balance than even your average lower to middle middle class brit

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  • 30. At 4:13pm on 25 Sep 2008, tuairimiocht wrote:

    The lucky English man:

    "He really enjoyed shooting all of my guns, riding my dirt bike and off road go cart like a true mad max, wearing my cowboy hat, messing around in the barn, etc. NONE of those things were in any way available to him at home in England."

    No, these things are not available to that many people in London, or probably New York either (really, how many barns are there in London, Manchester, or Birmingham?). Their presence or absence is no reflection on a country's merit. In fact, they are absolutely irrelevant to this article.

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  • 31. At 4:19pm on 25 Sep 2008, peej2k6 wrote:

    The poorest of the poor who complain about the hard times they are going through, yet decide to continue to vote for the same party, with the same neo-con right view points?

    No wonder southern trailer park living folk are considered stupid.

    "Some folk'll never eat a skunk, but then again some folk'll, like Cletus the slack jawed yokel!"

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  • 32. At 4:40pm on 25 Sep 2008, tomireland wrote:

    Why isn't the fact that both parties are controlled by the same interests being reported?
    It doesn't matter which one they vote for, both parties are the same.
    Why aren't people like Chuck Baldwin being mentioned as well? He is a presidential candidate.
    I find the way the BBC report to be very one sided, you ought to be reporting on the whole presidential elections and not just these two individuals Obama and McCain.
    There is a constitutional party that has had support from 'both' of the 'main parties' [sic] but people wouldn't know it if they only looked at this website, i find that a bad state of affairs to be honest, i pay my fee every year as well.

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  • 33. At 4:47pm on 25 Sep 2008, JohnJoshua wrote:

    #2 Diabulos - In response, i grew up in a "trailer park" and the neighborhood mentioned in the blog IS a trailer park. We just insist on calling them pre-fab homes because it sounds nicer, but there is no difference. The homes in the article have wheels on them, believe me. I was poor growing up. My parents bought our "pre-fab" home for about $10 thousand....and this was in the 80's. Yet, we took care of our home too and so did most of our neighbors.

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  • 34. At 4:54pm on 25 Sep 2008, 1randomman wrote:

    #30, the lucky Englishman. These comments are absolutely relevant to this article in that they address the quality of life issue that is inferred from the topic of a "trailer park" in the first place. As an american who is facing a "downturn", I was simply pointing out that a bad year in the US is still better in many ways than a good year in the UK. New york would still be better in my opinion, than london. I really enjoyed your cropping of my statement by the way. Here is the rest of it that made the relevance clear.

    "At the end of the day, he made a lot more money than me, but he was the one who was jealous..... In short, dont think that we poor Americans have it all that bad. "

    All this from an irrelevant, ignorant, gun toting, uneducated, Christian, conservative, Redneck with no college degree! Have a nice day!

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  • 35. At 5:01pm on 25 Sep 2008, aviewerbham wrote:

    I must be on the few Brits who has lived in a trailer park - I stayed with an American friend in a trailer park in Santa Barbara. It wasn't as grand as the one you visited - there were no double-wides, and the trailers were old fifties designed.

    Nonetheless, I loved it there - the trailers were cramped but no worse than modern, expensive "luxury" flats like the one I live in back home.

    I was also surrounded by beautiful scenery and palm trees which you don't see much back home either!

    The people who lived there were certainly not well off, but they were all friendly and tolerant of me. Most of the residents were Hispanic and spoke Spanish so we didn't talk much, but they kept themselves to themselves and smiled at me as I went past.

    The trailers were old and kind of battered but I loved the original fifties tiles in the bathrooms and the big old stoves in the kitchen area. I would have happily lived in one, and people took a pride in them and kept them clean and the area litter-free.

    There was no trouble and I felt much safer there than most council estates or even city centres in Britain.

    The people knew people looked down on them as "trailer trash" but I was proud to know them. Americans and Europeans alike can sneer all they want - I know they were good people.

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  • 36. At 5:17pm on 25 Sep 2008, tuairimiocht wrote:

    1randomman, the comments you made are relevant to the article, only if you regard wearing a cowboy hat, shooting off a few rounds of a gun, and messing around in a barn as a good indicator of quality of life. I would suggest looking at things like growth of real incomes, Gini coefficients, child mortality, access to healthcare, literacy rates, life expectancy, and so on.

    As for your assertion that a bad year in the US is still better in many ways than a good year in the UK, that is a rather dubious statement.

    Don't get me wrong, living in a trailer or a one of the homes that the reporter describes, and enjoying beautiful scenery and fresh air every day sounds pretty nice (a lot better than London, or New York).

    However, idyllic scenery or not, I do not think I could live in the US during the downturn that you anticipate. With 50% of the country's mortgages owned or guaranteed by the government, and the other 50% going the same way pretty soon, it is a little too socialist for my taste.

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  • 37. At 5:23pm on 25 Sep 2008, Sceptic_Kev wrote:

    I lived in South Carolina for a year and a half and it was an eye opener to the 'real' USA not the USA in the movies.
    The thing that shocked me the most was on a recent article about the election, South Carolina has a black majority, and yet I worked in an office without a single black face.
    Worse still a black South African friend of mine complained that he was being discriminated against by the Americans! And yet was not discriminated against by white South Africans and could quite easily socialise with white South Africans in our group.

    You think the USA has no race problems - think again, it may not make headlines but its there.

    One more thing, if you think the UK and France have inconsolable differences, these are nothing to the differences between neighbouring states in the US.

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  • 38. At 5:44pm on 25 Sep 2008, 1randomman wrote:

    Oh, and thats the best part.... I dont have a mortgage.... Wont be needing one iether. You see, some of us were a bit smarter than the average bear, saw all of this coming, and prepared for it.
    "Things like growth of real incomes, Gini coefficients, child mortality, access to healthcare, literacy rates, life expectancy," etc, are simply ways to attempt to limit risk in life and build security for the masses who are not able or willing to do so for themselves. (IE socialism). The only way to build security is to be responsible for ones self. In any case I would be more worried about your government flirting with sharia law than mine helping its citizens out of a jam. How are you going to prevent that from being applied to You in ten years when you STILL cant own a gun to defend yourself with? The guns and cowboy hats have a purpose, and contribute to the American quality of life tremendously. That they are fun too is a side benefit...

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  • 39. At 5:45pm on 25 Sep 2008, tuairimiocht wrote:

    "Why is it the so called dum-redneck not only reads more than the urban dweller but their predisposition to guns, hunting, farming and the frontier, position these people far better strategicaly, during any serious downturn going forward."

    Yes, this frontier spirit, combined with the wholesale effective nationalization of America's housing-stock. Oh, and let's not forget, the sponsorship of Manchester United. Enjoy.

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  • 40. At 5:52pm on 25 Sep 2008, 1randomman wrote:

    Go arsenal!

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  • 41. At 5:53pm on 25 Sep 2008, tuairimiocht wrote:

    "Things like growth of real incomes, Gini coefficients, child mortality, access to healthcare, literacy rates, life expectancy," etc, are simply ways to attempt to limit risk in life and build security for the masses who are not able or willing to do so for themselves. (IE socialism).

    Let me get this straight. Being able to read, avoiding mothers and children dying, and living a long life are socialism. Right. And nationalizing 50% (so far) of the US housing stock isn't. Also, see above.

    Anyway, well done for not having a mortgage. Shrewed move.

    As for Sharia law, well, it already arrived in the UK, and the US, over 1000 years ago; see

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/7631388.stm

    And with a Muslim population of 4% in the UK, I can't see it going much further.

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  • 42. At 6:02pm on 25 Sep 2008, 1randomman wrote:

    Funny, considering that the first 5 books of the bible and koran are identical. as for thier influence in your future, go ask the french.

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  • 43. At 6:32pm on 25 Sep 2008, tuairimiocht wrote:

    1randomman, I need to get home to my American wife. Just to clarify your last post:

    "In any case I would be more worried about your government flirting with sharia law than mine helping its citizens out of a jam. How are you going to prevent that from being applied to You in ten years when you STILL cant own a gun to defend yourself with?"

    So, if in ten years' time, religious minorities in the UK are given the right to settle a small number of civil matters according to traditional customs, by prior consent and without coercion, I should get myself a gun and keep a lookout for Muslim hordes?

    That is, of course, assuming I am in the UK in ten years' time (I am not British). If the wave of socialism and economic protectionism ends in the US, you might find me there. Otherwise I'll be in Canada.

    Anyway, enjoy your American scenery. I myself am rather jealous (London is drab). From one socialist hellhole to another, goodnight, over and out.

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  • 44. At 8:01pm on 25 Sep 2008, 1randomman wrote:

    Not at all, it is (sadly) too late for the average brit to defend himself from the government, because it would require all of them to have guns. This is something they are not going to get. The key is outnumbering the government in power and people. Any government that is not respectfully fearful of it's own populace is soon to be out of control. As to the vocal minority, see above post. I have to head out to work here in a bit myself and so will let this issue rest as well, and say thanks for the debate! (ps, the current bailout has a 2 year time limit on it) so you can come buy a trailer of your own in 2011! See ya soon!

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  • 45. At 8:07pm on 25 Sep 2008, tucsonmike wrote:

    Well Jon, you didn't meet the poorest of the poor, you did get to meet Americans who are having a tough time.

    You also saw we are of all races and creeds in this mess.

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  • 46. At 8:43pm on 25 Sep 2008, miketyler wrote:

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.

  • 47. At 9:26pm on 25 Sep 2008, PhiladelphiaMom wrote:

    You know, Trailer Homes have wheels and hooks, but I’ve never seen Trailer Home on the road unless it was empty. And most Trailer Parks I’ve seen (a dozen or more) look like the one you’ve described...

    Trailer Parks are great places for do-it-yourselfer independent types and good hard workin’ folk like mechanics, waitresses, and the occasional Elvis impersonator (seriously). Occasionally you’ll have a 'bad neighborhood' with some drug problems, but you have THAT problem in all places, from 'burbs' to 'hoods'.

    -- If you want migrant white folk, go to an RV park. Some retirees sell the house, buy an RV and spend the rest of their lives reading library books at warm state parks… until their investment tanks…

    -- If you want folk likely to shoot you for walkin' in their turf, visit 'gang territory'.

    But even then, it’s not nearly as dangerous as some parts of Mexico right now. In fact, you might be hard pressed to find the Mafia (It), the Jets (Irish) or the Sharks (Hisp). Our crime just isn’t as organized as it used to be, back in the day…

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  • 48. At 9:54pm on 25 Sep 2008, PhiladelphiaMom wrote:

    Wow... a few folks seem to assume that all Urban Americans are uneducated.

    That seems rather silly, given that most cities are home to quite a few colleges, universities and prep schools... where do you think the teachers and admins live?

    Heck, I'm just a lowly accountant, and I have more bookcases in my "Urban Apartment" than clothes closets. After all:

    "A room without books is like a body without a soul."
    -- Cicero


    Not to carry the tangent further, BUT the problem of education in our cities is that PUBLIC EDUCATION is failing.
    -- Here in Philly, there are almost as many private schools as public schools. So if you want your kids to get good content, you have to pay for it...

    This is why I live in a crappy apartment and drive a crappy car... because I'm paying 6,700/yr for my son's Middle School. (And THAT was the best school at the cheapest price I could find!)

    Fortunately, Charter Schools and the like are increasing each year, so the situation is improving.

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  • 49. At 10:00pm on 25 Sep 2008, PhiladelphiaMom wrote:

    dood... 1 random Theologically-Clueless man:

    The 1st 5 Old Testament books, called the Torah in Jewish traditions, is NOT identical to the Koran. The Koran is a retelling of the Torah, verbally dictated by the Prophet M (circa 600 CE) and transcribed by his followers after his death.

    It is very similar, but the laws are rather different and some of the characters are rather different.

    So... your close, but No Cigar for You.

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  • 50. At 04:28am on 28 Sep 2008, Caligirlnow wrote:

    Just like anywhere else - the American trailerpark experience varies. My parents lived in one for the first few years of my life - My Father was a construction worker who was also attending school at night after earning the money for tuition serving in the navy(He speaks two foreign languages fluently, has lived abroad and has his Bachelors and two advanced degrees) The easiest and cheapest way to travel around from college to college with a family of four was to have the trailer.

    Everyone was very nice in most of the parks we wound up staying in. The whole family has done well for itself - all went through the public school system in various parts of New York state, followed by the excellent New York State University system (SUNY). Almost all are liberal democrats.

    I used to get upset when someone would drop the term "trailer trash" when talking about ignorant types in front of me - because they never thought it would apply to me. Now I let them know that I am the result of trailerpark life.

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  • 51. At 01:15am on 30 Sep 2008, foxtrottango1 wrote:

    Refer to: #34. Irandomman


    Funny, it is said that only in the USA can an individual become filthy rich, get several college degrees and still be the irrelevant, ignorant, gun toting, uneducated, bible thumping flag waving "Christian", conservative hood-wearing in the night redneck, and you laddie boy fit the bill on all counts. Obviously, you are still ignorant and arrogant and hasn't learn anything from life around you. The problem is, there are shortages in the USA with people like you.

    The fact is, you chaps will never match the sophistication, the well mannered educated, well educated Brit.

    All this from someone who has been living next to your sorry kind for a lifetime. As for living in a mobile home, I park it with the hitch facing to the highway just in case I come across sorry individuals like you and if I don't like the neighborhood, I move to someplace where people, regardless of their income, can get along.

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