BBC Blog Network

User Profile

ScotInNotts

Listed below are comments made by ScotInNotts between Sunday, 4th October 2009 and Saturday, 28th November 2009.

«Newer
Older»

Climate change debate: 'calm, civilised, informative' 6:47pm on 28 Nov 2009 # 167 Susan-Croft

"I will tell you why, with the Calman report I think there is some dodgey dealings going on with Labour and the other Parties in Scotland. I have been reading all I can on this issue and have come to this conclusion. It was only the Unionst parties in Scotland at first that were in favour of the Calman report now suddenly the SNP are on board as well, when before they were set against it because they thought they would receive less money. The SNP in Scotland has never been more unpopular in fact I think the whole SNP movement is in trouble. Their education policies are falling apart and they are in disagreement with Councils over money and the largest teaching Union is up in arms. It is my belief reading what documents I can, that there is no intention of the Barnet formula being stopped when Calman is introduced that means Scotland will be able to tax raise and have other powers of borrowing, as well as keeping the tax money provided at the moment. Thus Scotland will be receiving more money than ever before. This may in turn give them the opportunity to cut tax and make Scotland more attractive than England for business."

The SNP were excluded from participation in Calman by the unionist parties, a dire commission set up by said parties to investigate the future of Scotland post devolution, but funnily enough didn't consider indpendence as an option, how strange. There still hasn't been any mention yet of the powers they wish to take back and make reserved again, watch as that goes down like a lead balloon when anounced.

Also, if you've read all you can then you'd know just how feeble the fiscal powers being offered are, far from being able to alter taxes to make business in Scotland look more attractive than England, which is what may be possible under full fiscal autonomy.

Borrwoing Powers (for large infrastructure projects like a new Forth crossing): Must be paid for by an increase in income taxes! If that had happened with the UK during the 'credit crunch' we'd all be paying 150% income tax now, sound reasonable? If it's such a good idea should we not apply it UK wide? No thought not, so no borrowing powers in effect.

As someone else has already pointed out: 'The current proposals will have half of basic income tax, a quarter of the higher rate and a fifth of next year's top rate going to Holyrood.

I don't understand the reasoning in 80% of a person's tax contributions going to reserved matters like defence when only 20% is going to devolved matters like health, education and transport.

We should be calculating what percentage of total expenditure is from reserved matters and paying a share back to the UK government for these services rendered.'

Barnett and Tax Raising Powers: 'Under the Calman plan, the Treasury would start by cutting the standard and upper rates of income tax in Scotland - and cutting the Scottish block grant accordingly.

MSPs would then decide. If they fix upon a 10p tax rate from Scotland, then the block grant would be restored in full.

A Hobson's choice if ever there was one.

In effect, this is a waste of money as no Scottish Government will cut their own budget.

So, administrative costs in calculating the grant cut back followed by administrative costs in restoring it - for no gain whatsoever.'

So according to Susan:
"This the Unionst parties, I believe, think will make the Scottish people turn away from Independence and be more satisfied staying in the Union. The SNP on the other hand are more satisfied because they will receive more powers for Scotland, which is what they wanted, plus the extra money. They know Independence will never happen at the moment. I believe England is being stitched up again."

The SNP want full fiscal autonomy, including control over natural resources and an end to the Barnett formula. I was encouraged to see consensus on the Question Time panel that Scotland should indeed have full fiscal autonomy, that is except from Lord Faulconer.

#175 Susan-Croft

"I forgot to say, the Labour Government is hoping to rush the Calman reforms through before they leave office. This would mean if Calman and the Barnet formular where in operation should the Conservatives come to Government, the Conservatives would have the job of upsetting the Scottish by cutting the budget if they wanted to be fair to the English or leaving it as it is and risk the English backlash.

A cunning plan by Labour."

Where on earth do you get your information Susan, nmore unfounded waffle. Nu-Lab have no intention of forcing Calman through before the GE, it's a big white elephant. The SNP has urged Labour to push through elements where all parties agree, for example control over air gun legislation, however Nu-Lab have made no moves whatsoever.

Once again with regards Scotland and the SNP you don't present particularly lucid arguements to support your case.

As far as the SNP supposedly in dire straits, if only it were true from your point of view Susan. I read the blog and your comments at the time of the Glasgow North East bye election but chose not to comment at that time.

It seemed you followed the press line that it was a crushing defeat for the SNP and had ramifications across all forthcoming elections, piffle.

A Labour held seat for 70 years with the lowest turnout for a Scottish election ever, and yet the SNP managed to increase their share of the vote.

The formerly honourable but now noble Baron Martin of Springburn's share of the vote between 1997 and 2005 were:

1997 71.4% as Labour SNP 16.50%
2001 66.6% as Speaker SNP 19.4%
2005 53.3% as Speaker SNP 17.7% Socialist Labour 14.2%

Bain's result was:

2009 59.4% as Labour SNP 20.0%

NB. Socialist Labour stood only in 2005. The boundaries of the seat have also changed a little over the years.

An unglencambly headline after the by-election would have been:
Labour hold Glasgow NE with lower vote share as SNP increase share

Hardly a detrimental or surprising result now was it Susan.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Labour and the Queen Speech, why was something as important as this with regards the Union not mentioned at all? It's never going to happen that's why, as Labour won't implement it before the GE and the Tories will naturally have their own take on things, even though they took part in this sham.

Watch as it's conveniently shelved after the GE, a waste of time and money in an attempt to distract from independence or FFA.

A parliament should be accountable for it's decisions and therefore should be in control over it's finances and resources, not some pocket money handout once we've handed over all our earnings but are kept in the dark exactly how much that is.

The question then becomes do we desire FFA as part of the union, or full independence.
Expenses and unemployment 1:38pm on 20 Oct 2009 #386 Susan-Croft

“The daft part about the whole thing is if I had stayed in Scotland I would have had a vote on Independence and ScottInNotts who is so passionate about Independence would not. It gives you some idea of how we are interwoven as a Nation. What do you think I would have voted? “

You’ve made this assertion before Susan, and I have had to correct you previously also. Whilst I may be working here at the moment I am still registered in my Scottish constituency and vote there, therefore you are quite incorrect.

With regards the rest of this post I note you go on to make the same points in numerous further posts on the blog thereafter, but I will confine my response to this particular post.

“Salmond is not ever going to be Prime Minister of the UK, he may well have ideas of grandeur but he is not a candidate never will be, never has been. He is in charge of a minority Government in a small Country of about 5 million. The 3 candidates for Prime Minister are Brown, Cameron and Clegg. This is why it is called the leaders debate for PM.”

It is not called the leaders debate for PM, it is the leader’s debate. Quite correct he is in charge of a minority government in Scotland, what does the size of the country have to do with anything? I simply cannot understand why you and others fail to see that by excluding Scotland’s largest political party from a debate to be broadcast in Scotland disenfranchises a significant part of the electorate. They would like to see each party debate their policies in order to make an informed vote.

I understand that this is of little interest to those outwith Scotland, but it essential in terms of electoral impartiality in Scotland, hence the Ofcom rules on PPB’s, into which category the leader debates fall.

“Sagamix 382

There is nothing to fear, Labour still is and always will be in my opinion a force in Scotland. At the moment we are all disillusioned with Labour, however I believe once they get back to their core values they will pick up again under a new leader.

Actually I am hearing from my friends in Scotland that whilst the people may vote SNP this time there is no appetite for Independence and they are getting sick of Salmond posturing and forcing issues that they do not care about. People in Scotland, as with everywhere else are worried about their jobs etc and feel not enough attention is being paid to these issues at the present moment. As I said there are still a lot of Unionists in Scotland.

My point was however that if Salmond keeps pushing the agenda and causing problems as he is, you may very well see England who are mighty fed up with this Scottish nuisance, kicking back. The English take a lot for a long time and then when they are aroused move very quickly.

You see from on here that the SNP people follow Salmond and believe they can bully Unionists and the English to think as they do. Its not going to happen.”

Opinion polls would tend to suggest otherwise Susan, as you would know if you followed BT’s blog rather than hearing it from your pals, that Labour are hard pressed in their traditional strongholds. How long did it take the Tories to regain respectability after their crushing defeat? It could take Labour a long time to shake of Blair and co.s NuLab values and label.

It’s awfully nice of you to pre-empt the voters intentions and reasons in voting for the SNP, but that might be best left to the ballot box. I agree, there are still a significant proportion of people in favour of the union in Scotland, however as I have already mentioned the momentum would tend to suggest that the case for independence is gradually gaining ground, with those previously in favour of the union now drifiting to either full blown support for independence or to the undecided column. Clearly the arguement has not been won as yet (otherwise we'd have independence already), however the case 'for' is always growing stronger.

As an elected member of a political party Salmond would be remiss if he did not push his agenda. He has the advantage of not having to tow the Westminster party line, unlike his unionist party colleagues, and therefore is able to put Scotland’s interests at heart without having to ask permission form Westminster beforehand (e.g. Bendy Wendy and ‘bring it on’ Re the referendum). I also see you’re following the unionist party’s line with regards that we cannot talk about constitutional issues during the current economic situation, when that very matter goes to the very core of all those issues. The Gray man and Murphy would be proud.

I’m not surprised you would perceive Scotland as a nuisance, considering the media coverage of such issues (and your own persoanl circumstances). It’s much easier to buy into the sponging subsidy junkie story, ungrateful after ‘we’ bailed out ‘their’ banks (does that mean we get to keep all of the tax revenue during the good years retrospectively also? Just a thought.). Frankly it’s amazing you would want to keep us in a union if all of that was true. I guess we should go away quietly and be grateful? :)
Expenses and unemployment 1:02pm on 20 Oct 2009 #340 xTunbridge

“ScotInNotts
320,321,322

For someone so passionate about the place your handle suggests you do not live there ?

To berate those who find the Scottish position vis a vis English politics unacceptable whilst appearing to be a guest in England does rather take the biscuit Sir.“

As I have asked Susan, just what exactly does my current domicile have on the view I old or its political implications? I too find the Scottish position Vis a Vis English politics unacceptable, from the other side. However I do object to the rather more unfounded and at times unsavoury comments that some post here at times, and will always challenge those that do so.

I’d also like to point out that this ‘guest’ in England is contributing to the local economy, authority and services while I am here and will continue to do so until my departure.

I wonder what point you and Susan are trying to make using this tact, and whether you would still do so if I worked in another country for a time outwith Scotland?
Expenses and unemployment 12:53pm on 20 Oct 2009 #324 Susan-Croft

“ScotIn-Notts 320

I am not much bothered whether you are losing patience with me or not Scot. It is a free Country when I last looked and the SNP still are not going to tell me what I can say. They may do in Scotland.

Does it make it offensive just because I speak the truth about Salmond and the SNP. I think you need to wonder if you are being brain-washed, most of what I have said about Salmond he has said himself.

You do not live in Scotland do you?

The rest of your post is just the same denial of issues which are public knowledge. “

No-one is remotely attempting to control what you say or think Susan, however I for one will challenge your more questionable assertions rather than let them remain as ‘fact’ for all to peruse. Also, while you mat feel you speak the truth regarding Salmond and the SNP, it would do well to state that it is your opinion that you are expressing, not the ‘truth’ or fact as you put it.

I hardly think I’ve been brainwashed simply because I disagree with you or your more vociferous outpourings regarding Scotland, the SNP or in particular your personal favourite AS.

We’ve went through my personal circumstances before Susan on many occasions, what bearing does that have on the view I hold or the political implications?

The rest of my post refutes your repeated assertions on those issues, nothing new there. Same old tune, different day.

#325 Susan-Croft
“ScotsInNotts 319

Now that post really does take the biscuit, honestly Scot, I have seen the Scottish blog for goodness sake.”

No doubt you’ve seen BT’s blog through your own filtered view point. Since the opinions expressed therein disagree with your particular take on issues doesn’t automatically mean that they are all ‘zealots’, a phrase your very keen on using in order to try and portray something sinister.

Perhaps you could participate and challenge those views, or is it easier to preach to the choir here where you generally remain unchallenged?
Expenses and unemployment 05:06am on 17 Oct 2009 #244 GomerPyle
The SNP’s stance is independence in Europe.

“I doubt that Scotland would gain independence without including the English in the vote, and that fact renders all threats and tantrums rather pointless”
Sheer ignorance. Recently polls have consistently shown support for independence at 40%, those against at 40%, and undecided voters at 20%. There has been a reduction in those definitely against independence, with many more registering that they are undecided i.e. they’re at least thinking about it. The idea that we could possibly leave the union and become independent is not as abhorrent to those as it once was.
#257 GomerPyle
“Do I recall that Europe was going to take control of the oil reserves ? I doubt that Scotland will get any subsidies at all as Europe's largest oil producer, unless they give something up first.”
Do you, perhaps you could enlighten me by providing a link to this proposal. Also, where did you become privy to the EU’s plan to distribute subsidies to Scotland should she become independent?

It may be difficult for you to come to terms with Scots wishing to determine their own affairs; however that is the political reality.

“Has Alex Salmond woken up to the fact that without a Labour government in power the SNP become an irrelevance, and the fact is, that people with only one card to play, never play it”
What a curious statement. Either you fundamentally misunderstand the present Scottish political dynamic or you sincerely believe that the SNP has grown in popularity solely due to the demise of the Labour party. Whatever the basis for your assertion, unfortunately for you the SNP will not disappear and become an irrelevance.
#275 GomerPyle
“If England doesn't subsidise Scotland, then Alex Salmond and the SNP have been a bit of a waste of space.”
As I have asked other I will ask you, please show me the stats that detail how Scotland is subsidised.
The fact is there are no exact figures for the tax revenue raised and spent in Scotland; the best estimates are the GERS accounts. It should also be noted that this does not include any monies accrued from oil revenues as these are assigned directly to the Treasury. There is no credence to the statement that Scotland is subsidised.
Instead of handing over all our revenues accrued from all sources to the treasury and getting a proportion back, many Scots now wish full fiscal autonomy, even those that wish to remain part of the union. Think any Westminster government will ever voluntarily allow this situation to occur? The Scots will have to democratically make their voice heard on the matter, as many are fed up with the subsidy myth, again including those that support remaining in the union.
As far as having more say in the EU, Scotland currently has 6 MEP’s, which is equivalent to Luxembourg, whereas a country of comparable size such as Denmark has 13. It would appear we could only increase our influence in the EU from our present position.
#291 GomerPyle
“It's quite possible that Alex Salmond has more support for an independent Scotland in England than in his own patch.”
Once again, sheer nonsense. Even if that were true, one would be based on positive attributes, the other based purely on grievance, and can you guess which?

You choose to continually portray the case for Scottish independence as one solely consisting of grievances. This is simply not the case, no matter how you wish to portray the issue; there are many positive aspects to becoming independent.

As far as I was aware the SNP were intending to adopt the Euro, what point were you trying to make? The rest of the post descends into fantasy land and presents a clearer view on what you base your opinions regarding Scottish politics and independence.
#315 GomerPyle
Another obsessed with Alex Salmond. If you had done your research you’d know that the unionist parties at Holyrood are the ones blocking the referendum at the moment, so stop trying to invent some sort of English-Scottish grievance, it’s both offensive and inaccurate.
You would also seem to misunderstand independence, the very definition of taking responsibility. For someone that professes to care less on the issue you’ve expressed a number of opinions suggesting that the opposite is true.
Expenses and unemployment 04:23am on 17 Oct 2009 #238 Reaper_of_Souls
It’s a matter for the Scottish people to decide if they wish to remain as part of the union or become independent, I’m afraid no-one else’s view comes into it.
Scotland does and could have so much more than ‘just and oil industry’ as part of its economy. Any remaining oil could aid in the transition and establishment of new industries. Let’s face it, the London centric policies of the past haven’t helped Scotland (or other parts of the UK I’ll grant you). Of course we would take our share of the national debt, which would only be right.
#242 Reaper_of_Souls wrote:
You ask about responsibility to national interest. I think you may be confusing matters in that for the SNP the national interest is Scotland, not the UK.
As regards undue Scottish influence in Westminster, how many Scottish MP’s are there compared to those from the rest of the UK? That the West Lothian Question exists due to an unbalanced devolution settlement is unfortunate; however watch this issue disappear if/when the Tories get in at the next GE with only one or two MP’s.
#249 Reaper_of_Souls
“Which could of course lead to England still subsidising Scotland, but via the EU.”
Another that subscribes to the commonly held myth. Please show me the stats that detail how Scotland is subsidised.
The fact is there are no exact figures for the tax revenue raised and spent in Scotland; the best estimates are the GERS accounts. It should also be noted that this does not include any monies accrued from oil revenues as these are assigned directly to the Treasury. There is no credence to the statement that Scotland is subsidised.
#251 Reaper_of_Souls

“Surely that is denying others the right of self determination.
If others want to be in a union without Scotland why shouldn't they have the right to that choice?”
It is the right of Scots to determine whether to be independent or not. In your system you could have Scots wishing to be independent and the rest of the UK wishing to remain part of the union, then what? Also, I’m curious to know why the rest of the UK would remain in the union if they expressed the same view as you did that Scotland is subsidised?
#272 Reaper_of_Souls
“The Barnett Formula?

And how much of Scotland's economy is public sector based or servicing the public sector”
Ah, the union dividend, where we can send all our resources to Westminster and get pocket money back. We can also hold no control over the mechanisms to alter said demographic of our economy. You’re making the case for independence rather well :)
Expenses and unemployment 04:01am on 17 Oct 2009 #209 Susan-Croft
It’s not all about you Susan. The SNP (not Alex Salmond’s personal policy) have governed Scotland as they saw fit in the best interests of the Scottish people. That they choose to invest money in ways differing from Westminster in areas such as health has those interests at heart as the motive for their choices. To suggest they do so to create a divide is either profoundly cynical or a expressing a personal grievance.
#210 Susan-Croft wrote:
The SNP (again, not Alex Salmond) has categorically stated that they will hold a referendum, and if a majority vote for independence then they will negotiate with Westminster for this. No other route to independence has been endorsed or discussed, either through Westminster directly, as you insinuate, or through a UDI should the SNP obtain a majority of the Scottish electorates vote in any election.
#220 Susan-Croft wrote:

“There are still people in Scotland who believe in the Union and at the present time have no voice.”
If you hadn’t noticed the SNP is a minority government in power at Holyrood. That would suggest that the majority had voted for one of the three union parties, sounds like they have plenty of voice and representation.
Contrast and compare that with Scotland’s voice at Westminster.
“I believe as long as the other parties agree in Scotland a referendum can be held. It should be as soon as possible, however I doubt Salmond in this economic climate can win one and he knows this, thus this is why his intention is to undermine the Parliament we have to force Independence”
Closed ears and eyes again. The unionist parties have been the ones stalling on giving the people their say, perhaps you should tell them it should be asap. Also the referendum has always been timetabled to be held in 2010. Please, tell me another story Susan.
#231 Susan-Croft
While it may be true that not everyone that voted for the SNP wishes independence it is disingenuous to portray this as a protest vote against or because of the demise of the Labour party. The SNP has attracted support for many positive reasons, as people realise they are better placed to have control over their own affairs, and as the SNP administration continues to perform well for the people of Scotland.
Again, stop dispensing sinister conspiracy theories, no-ones forcing independence on Scotland, it will be decided through the democratic process, as it always was and will be in the future.
#240 Susan-Croft

“The oil is out of the picture because under the Lisbon Treaty they can take the oil under EU management. Norway is the only Country which can retain theirs because they did not integrate into the EU as the rest of us did.”
That’s a new one Susan, funny you’ve never mentioned it before.
#259 Susan-Croft

“Puts a bit of a new slant on Salmonds arc of properity or despair which ever you choose to believe”
I thought I’d showed you the latest IMF predictions for Ireland, Iceland, Norway and the UK, or are you ignoring those too?
#282 Susan-Croft
Susan, what is your fascination and obsession with all things to do with Alex Salmond. Please stop the scaremongering and conspiracy theories, your beginning to come across as rather unsavoury at times.
For the last time, independence will only be determined by a referendum on the question put to the Scottish electorate. Guerrilla wars and reaching into England indeed! Why stop there when world domination waits :)

PPB’s such as the televised leaders debates are governed by Ofcom rules, we’ve been over this. To exclude Scotland’s largest political party from any electoral debate is wrong and disenfranchises the electorate in general. How else can they make an informed choice?
The rest of your post degenerates into an offensive diatribe with no basis but your own personal view and vitriol.

“Salmond has been lucky because had Scotland been Independent at the time of the banking collaspe the two main banks which have cost the British tax payer so much, were Scottish. The bail out would have had to come from Scotland as the parent company is there. How on earth do they think they could have afforded that. I also note that the main job losses within these banks and with Lloyds are in England because a deal was done not to take Scottish jobs.”
More conspiracy theories and what if scenarios. Everything would have turned out the same had Scotland been independent had it? Can I borrow that crystal ball you’ve got? Also, the UK borrowed the money required for the bail out.

“What of those who still want to remain in the Union in Scotland, they have no say anymore they are being ignored by this tide of SNP propaganda”
They can vote for another party Susan.
#290 Susan-Croft
You can disagree with the SNP’s spending policies, however as I have already stated, the Scottish electorate will decide whether this has been to their benefit or not.
The only way to satisfy you Susan and silence those like you that peddle the subsidy myth, short of independence, is to give full fiscal autonomy, including all natural resources. Think that Westminster will go for that? No, didn’t think so, wonder why?

Quite right that in minority administration concessions had to be made to get the budget through, in that way many views are expressed and a larger part of the electorate is represented. I’d say that was getting the job done.

“Salmond makes unreasonable demands and in most instances receives them, for now.”
What would that be your referring to?
#310 Susan-Croft
True, many still adhere to the union; however the momentum is at present steadily moving in favour of independence. The SNP as the party advocating independence are the majority political party. If you spent anytime on BT’s thread you’d see that it is not the haunt of “extreme SNP voters”, whatever they are.
“Salmond is very unsure of his ability to deliver Independence especially in the current economic climate thus his decided assault on the UK Parliament if it is hung. He would like to gain Independence by the backdoor in a hung Parliament rather than let it go to a referendum.”
Waffle. Why do you insist on making this stuff up?

“What needs to happen is for Scotlands strangle hold on the UK Parliament to end or England to have its own parliament.”
Let the English electorate lobby for their own legislature, which is their right. How many Scottish MP’s are at Westminster? Strangle hold indeed! Watch as the West Lothian Question disappears if the Tories get in. In having only one or two MP’s there simply won’t be an issue in the government voting through legislation affecting England only at Westminster in this case, unless of course the opposition manage to prevent it (normally highly unlikely).

“The SNP would do well to get themselves a better leader, because to be frank if Salmond keeps playing his games it could well be English that demand Independence from Scotland before it happens the other way”
I thought that is what you wanted, although it doesn’t sound like you mean for an amicable separation.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I really am losing patience with you Susan as your posts are becoming more detached and offensive with each one you post. Your grievances with the SNP and in particular your visceral personal dislike of Alex Salmond clouds any sensible point you could or try to make. You continually portray anything to do with independence, the SNP or Alex Salmond (your personal favourite) as something sinister. This in turn appears to give you license to denigrate whatever part of Scotland you wish to suit your own particular point at the time, yet you simultaneously profess to care about the plight of the Scots out of sheer benevolence. Finally, please do some research into Scottish political issues instead of inventing spurious scenarios to suit your own personal views, it does the debate no good whatsoever and correcting the blatant untruths is becoming ridiculous.

I can only hope others have a more balanced and informed view than yourself otherwise future relations could prove unnecessarily difficult between our two nations.
Expenses and unemployment 02:59am on 17 Oct 2009 I have not looked on in this blog for a number of days, however I am more than a little irked by the comments that I have read regarding so many issues relating to Scottish politics (on a thread relating to MP's expenses?!).

Either through a lack of understanding (or deliberate miscontruance) of those issues; personal grievance or dislike (or for some other unsavoury reason) of Scots MP's at Westminster, the SNP or Alex Salmond the level of debate has descended into an uncomfortable and frankly distasteful tone.

Those that contribute to this blog in such a manner know who they are, and I would kindly appreciate that in future any debate on such issues can be conducted in a more civil manner without descending to the lowest common denominator, resorting to well peddled myths, or simply inventing some themselves.
Seven months for The Sun to boost Cameron 8:59pm on 05 Oct 2009 #612 Susan-Croft

Hi Susan,

I'm sorry I don't have time to reply to your post properly, so I will make just a few brief points.

1. Yes we are in disagreement about the state of the Scottish oil industry.

2. We have thought long and hard about the financial repurcussions of independence, it's actually one of the major reasons for wanting it! The public sector issues will be resolved once we have control of our own revenue system.

3. The bank collapse was as a result of a number of factors as you know. Had Scotland been independent (a 'whatif' scenario again, pointless) the businesses would have been trading in Edinburgh, not just cosmetically registered there, and would have been regulated by us. Who knows what would have been. Also, if you care to look back, check up on the SNP's propoed plan for the banks at the time, it sure wasn't what happened.

4. We don't elect PM's, we elect local MP's from political parties. That being the case the SNP has the largest share of the vote in Scotland, to not include them would be closing your eyes to the political reality there. The Tories are a minor party in Scotland, perhaps DC shouldn't be there in debates broadcast to Scotland following some peoples logic. As I said there are Ofcom rules regarding PPB's, so this is all academic.

I'm sorry if you find all of this boring or uninteresting, however that is the political reality as it stands, you cannot avoid debating the constitutional situation as it has ramifications in all areas. There is a difference, as you already pointed out, so why try and pretend that 'one sixe fits all on issues such as this. I know you dislike AS, and this would seem to colour your thinking on issues. You've not mentioned Clegg's efo, really think he has a shot do you? :)

Finally, could you please stop portraying the desire for independence as grievance based, try reading BT's threads sometimes or other literature on the matter. There will always be zealots on all sides, however I had always considered myself a pragmatist. The SNP desire indpendence, and while I do not agree with all that they have done, they are the only party that has this goal in mind and so I will support them for the time being.

What you say about Scots and there knowledge of history is also not true, nor the attitude of the genreal population. I have many English friends and colleagues, however I have also met many small minded people that have taken issue with my nationality during my time here and also by similar types when abroad, I have even been assaulted because of it. I choose to think of these people as a minority and not the majority opinion. That you met small minded people during your time in Scotland is unfortunate, however I do take issue that "we're all like that", because we simply are not.

I hope your basing your newfound drive for English indpendence on a positive basis rather than grievances.
Trusting the trust 11:52pm on 04 Oct 2009 #663 deanthetory

659. At 11:24pm on 04 Oct 2009, Roll_On_2010 wrote:

"Annabel Goldie unveils plans for fast-track courts and business start-up fund.

Miss Goldie will use her conference speech to argue that a vote for the SNP or Liberal Democrats in next year’s general election will only help Gordon Brown cling to power."

She is correct.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Nonesense Dean, you know very well that a vote for the SNP weakens NuLab's power base in Scotland. Hardly helping to keep Brown in charge is it?

Tell, me, whats the party spin line to make that one stick?

«Newer
Older»

^ Back to top

BBC MMVI

The BBC is not responsible for the content of external internet sites

BBC.co.uk

BBC Blog Network

Find and talk to the BBC's bloggers.

User Profile

ScotInNotts