The AM Glass Box.
Welcome to the AM Glass Box - your chance to help shape tonight's PM.
You may have read your morning paper and listened to the radio, and have some ideas you want to hear on PM tonight.
Perhaps a question about something in the news you would like answered - or better still, direct experience of something topical. Or maybe there's an aspect to a big story you haven't heard explored that you would like to hear.
Just as the PM Glass Box emulates the meeting we have AFTER the show, the AM Glass Box will be like the real meeting we have every day at 11.00, in that all ideas are welcome.
Just like the real meeting, most ideas that are suggested will not make it on air. But we would like to try this to see how it works. It's best that you make your suggestion before 10am.
Listen to PM
© MMIX~RS~q~RS~~RS~z~RS~08~RS~)
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
Registration of authors et al required to allow them to talk to school children? The government has definitely lost the plot!
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A little thing that you could do in the 5:53 slot this week would be what date did man land on the moon? A lot of people say the 20th, but depending on where you were in the world at the time, it could also be the 21st (in fact for over half the globe, it was already the 21st of July, 1969 when Armstrong and Aldrin landed. Given that there's an international agreement to use UCT (Coordinated Universal Time) when it comes to space matters, are people going to be celebrating a day early?
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Eddie and Team
American Express axes pension contributions.
Another company in a long list reneging on employment contracts. Job cuts, pay cuts, pension cuts: these measures should be taken as a last resort AFTER they renege on all director/employee contracts, such as:
Maximum remuneration 200k pa.
Pensions re-structured to pay out 50k pa max.
Luxury cars removed from company car policy.
Have they?
And do Amex intend to make good the pension cuts when good times return?
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FF (3)
They brought back a bunch of rocks apparently...that they turned into a none stick frying pan...Only cost 2 billion in 69...must have been a good frying pan.
Seriously though,Although I was still a teenager, I remember the issues over justifying spending so much on the moon when we had half the world starving (remember Biafra). And of course the cost of lives in the Vietnam war and there we were sending people to another world as it was described to ruin that one when we couldn't sort out our own. or so those against at the time espoused...Some things never change eh....
Nevertheless, the wonderment and challenge to the technology at the time was very attractive. There was a genuine sense of going into the hitherto unknown, and no one really knew how it would all perform. There had been earlier set backs and tragedies in the space program...nothing was cut and dried. We were still using what my mum referred to as 'elements' in radio-grams and the like. These elements reminded me of light bulbs and took time to 'warm up' when you switched them on. Often when they cut out for no reason my mum would say, "its got too hot" give it five minutes. Invariably, she was right. In fact any biggish electrical equipment that went wrong in our house was reffered to as needing a new 'element'. colour tele had only just about reached us but, it would be a few more years before we had one. In fact they cost about 260-80 squid back then. over thirty years later you could still buy one for the same price. You, had to ring the operator and book some international phone calls and I got half a crown pocket money. And when the gas or electric man came to empty the metre, Mum got a rebate and thats the times us kids got to go to the pictures...but try telling the kids today...
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Eddie and Team,
I heard David Blunkett on Today prog this morning. Paraphrased, as it was on car radio: need to restore public confidence in Police. We need to restore their legitimacy.
Blunkett was the one who created these problems. Humphreys/Stourton didn't even mention it: Criminal Justice Act 2003; US-UK Extradition Treaty 2003
If Blunkett is coming on your programme tonight, perhaps you'd like to remind him, and ask him for a view on Gary McKinnon case.
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Instead of trying to 'fix' the current banks that are entrenched in their ways, new banks should be started with ethical principles and all profits being returned to customer-investors. I'm sure ordinary customers would flock to move their business.
Voting with one's feet is always the most effective way of showing one's displeasure; the only issue being at the moment in the UK there is a lack of real choice. The current banks have got it all sewn up. Time to let them wither.
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3. Fearless Fred
Celebrating? I'm still not 100% convinced they landed anywhere but a film lot, at the time the US was panicked by the USSR being so far in advance re space, and that was part of the cold war arms race. So the impetus to 'land' on the moon was overwhelming.
But, considering the vast developments in other spheres - personal computers for instance which now have hugely more capacity than NASA had in the sixties - isn't it surprising that it's still at the stage of waiting a month to launch the shuttle because of the weather, and still nothing more than some satellites and a half built 'space station'? Many in the sixties thought that by now we'd be into interstellar travel, but it all seems to have stalled. Perhaps the realisation dawned that the distances were just too vast for our short lifespans. But considering tha vast sums of money poured into 'space exploration', some would find it hard to admit it hasn't achieved much more than a nonstick frypan.
Would Flash Gordon have settled for a month's delay before launch?
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FF 3, As it was an American who did it, you would use the American date.
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5. funnyJoedunn
'...but try telling the kids today...'
I know! Don't know they're born, LOL
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2. bigbiscotti-one
It goes with parents not being allowed to video school sports day.
They're all jobsworths.
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6: 'If Blunkett is coming on your programme tonight, perhaps you'd like to remind him, and ask him for a view on Gary McKinnon case.'
Why? Are you suggesting that there is something wrong with extraditing someone who has admitted to committing a criminal offence in another country?
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David (9) it has always puzzled me why a nation that was so quick to shrug off British rule is so attached to Imperial measures.
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Invisible (8)
Yeah, expectations were really raised as to how far we'd be going...living on moon base before hoping on to Mars, etc.
I know there are those who believe it was all a hoax. And of course there is that well known film about a spoof mars landing too.
However, I think for me the one that might be believable is the espousal that we just haven't got the technology anymore to land on the moon again. We might have lost the old technology that enabled us in the first place to do it. Just like all the manual technologies of the Victorians or ancient civilisations, we are no longer capable of replicating what seemed for them, a matter of course. Some believe this is why we haven't been back there since the early seventies...just before we were hit by the computer electronic age. I don't know...?
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David (9)
Quite right, well said.
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bb-o (2) and ia (11) I agree. For all the furore whipped up by certain parts of the red-top press, it is generally not the stranger that needs to be checked, but those in persistent contact from within the family and friends that are most often to blame when crimes against children occur
TFR (12) Ah, but where was the offence committed. I believe there is precedence in this case where other hackers from the UK who hacked US systems were tried and convicted here in the UK, not in the US.
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12. TheFirstRalph
The 'offence' being showing the US military that they had no security? If he'd been an Islamist terrorist rather than an Asbergers' sufferer ...
And yes, there is something wrong with the UK bending over backwards to do anything the US demands, while the US refuses to extradite people the UK wants to put on trial. But then the 'special relationship' always was one-sided, US 'aid' to Britain during WW2 left us with a massive debt that was only finally paid off in 2006.
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16. Fearless Fred
And I see they want authors to pay £64 to be vetted!
Philip Pullman
Michael Morpurgo
Quentin Blake
Anne Fine
Anthony Horowitz
all saying no, so children will lose out by not having them visit and talk to them.
We so need a good clear out of these politicians.
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Ref 12. TheFirstRalph
"Why? Are you suggesting that there is something wrong with extraditing someone who has admitted to committing a criminal offence in another country?
He was in this country.
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Sorry to add a little levity to this, but all the talk of the moonlandings is reminding me of Jacques Tati and 'Trafic'. I hoped I might find a clip on YouTube, but you can see it on this site
http://www.orbit.zkm.de/?q=node/378
Does anyone else remember this? And I wonder how many Hulot fans there are out there .... I love his stuff.
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Re; #8 invisibleatheist
Not 100% sure. Well they did get there, do you think for one moment that the Soviet Union, Jodrell Bank and tracking stations in Australia couldn't tell signals from the moon when even in the primative 60's astronomers could pin point radio signals from deep space ie the crab nebula.
what makes us human is the constant search for knowledge.
I say thank you America for the huge effort that you made to advance our knowledge. Also the space programme was a small percentage of the US defense budget.
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DMNC
When you go to the pub what do you say when ordering a round of drinks?
"Barman, I'll have 16 fl oz of bitter 2 cups of larger 1/2 quart of shandy and a pint of quest ale?...there all the same measurement!
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Ref 3. Fearless Fred,
Bottom of the class for you. The anniversary is relative to where you are in the world.
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20. Big Sister
Oh me too! Thanks for the link,
I'd been thinking of looking for DVDs of hs work. You've wetted my appetite now.
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Big sis (20)
I for one have never seen this before. It looks really amusing, my type of humour. Is it from that era or filmed later? Pity nothing on youtube. Liked the bit where one of them was simulating moon walking. This is exactly what we all did for the few weeks after the event as kids. I remember my brother wrapping me in tin foil...my space suit.
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Richard (23) I did not say when I considered it the anniversary, so why the aggressive tone? All I did was suggest that this could be a nice little topic for Eddie to use in the 5:53pm slot when the LW signal goes to the Shipping Forecast that is generally used for a light item.
Just don't get me started on celebrating the Millennium!
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21. Looternite
Did all those you mention track it? I can't get out of my head the flapping flag on a windless moon, and the shot of the 'first man' descending the ladder totake the 'one small step', shot from several metres away... who put that camera there?
The 'huge effort' wasn't to advance knowledge it was to score over the USSR. I'd love to know what knowledge was gained, other than how to fire big rockets, which they are still doing, despite concerns now about pollution of the atmosphere which hadn't surfaced in the 'primitive' sixties.
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Can we have something on the scaled down proposal for eco towns
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8152985.stm
and why it is better for the planet/ environment/ climate change to create a new housing estate on a green field site rather than to work at getting us all to improve the environmental performance of our existing houses and work places.
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Joe/InvisibleAtheist: I'll post another clip on The Beach (don't want to be accused of being off topic). :O)
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20
Preferences, preferences, preferences
Hulot and Laurel and Prescott in a railway carriage, both remembered with horror from my days in College (the fIlm Studies buff had a thing about both)
So claustrophobic!
But Chaplin being taken for a chicken in a little hut in the middle of a frozen nowhere by a big very hungry man and Buster Keaton on a girder, that's something else.
Harold Lloyd, no.
Keystone cops, no.
But Laurel and Prescott in almost anything else and Felix the Cat always.
PS I like a Gershwin toon
How about you?
(Ans. from DMcN's sister especially welcome)
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Big Sis,(20)
Actually I think I might have seen a couple of films with him in. If I remember right, he might have had something to do in a public toilet in one of them with madam pee pee in attendance. It might have been a money making plot/scam by pee pee fleecing the customers somehow with the saucer used for the coins...He might have been trying to rob the bank next door through access via the toilet wall...I don't know?? Whatever, it was funny.
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Digital TV seems contradictory. We are told it's progress, that it's superior to analog, that it's the future. Yet my set top box find 79 channels, all but five of which are either never broadcasting or chopped up into bits, or selling jewellery. Depending on the weather, even channels like BBC News and BBC1 are unobtainable, and the only channel which is always perfect is BBC Parliament, the one I least want to watch. Yet our other set, plain old analog, gets a good picture which never breaks up no matter what the weather.
DAB radio seems not to suffer from these environmental problems, but digital TV is useless. Or is it just set top boxes that have this problem? [many people will rely on them when analog is switched off if they can't afford to buy a new digital set].
The digital industry claims TV reception will improve hugely once analog is switched off, but will it?
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Since the moon orbits the earth, surely the most logical answer to "What time did they land on the moon?" is whatever the time was on the section of Earth directly below it...
Meanwhile, talking of Americans, the US Defense Department has ruled that their troops should continue to be allowed to smoke in war zones, as they're already stressed enough without the added stress of taking away their right to smoke...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/8153094.stm
And talking of killing, 136 fewer people were killed in the UK in 2008/2009 than the previous year...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8153392.stm
...However, don't get too complacent, as there were more attempted murders with knives, more rapes, and (perhaps unsurprisingly as we're in a credit crunch) more domestic burglaries and shoplifting.
But returning to the foggy issue of smoking, just be grateful your packet doesn't cost you £14 quadrillion...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/8152278.stm
I wonder if he used a Visa Buxx card? A US student was rather surprised when a visit to a restaurant also entailed him going overdrawn to the tune of Â14 quadrillion...
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/07/15/quadrillion_dollar_visa_overcharge/
A quick Google reveals the source of the error. Apparently converting the amount of the charge in dollars ($23,148,855,308,184,500.00) to hexadecimal reveals 20 20 20 20 20 20 12 50. Conveniently the hexadecimal value of an ASCII Space (hitting the space bar) is 20, so those are just 6 leading spaces before the decimal value. Unfortunately Visa's software misinterpreted them as part of the number...
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/07/15/quadrillion_dollar_visa_overcharge/
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ia (27) The camera for the first step shot was on an extendable arm on the outside of the capsule. As for the flapping flag, just because there is no air doesn't mean a flag won't flap. Unless the flag is stretched in a frame on all four sides, any force acting on a single layer flexible surface will be enough to cause a ripple to propagate through the surface. But, because there is no air on the moon, the ripple/wave will have only the limited gravitational force to slow and nullify it (no wind resistance) so the flag probably would wave due to the forces imparted onto it as whichever of the two astronauts it was planted it into the surface of the moon.
give what you suggest in your second paragraph, I'd suggest that the USSR would very quickly have published any evidence they had that the landings didn't take place. After all, they were in the race to get there. They wouldn't have simply folded if they had any reason to suspect there was a cover-up.
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Did they land on a bit visible from earth?
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mac (35), AFAIK they landed on the "light side", which is the bit facing earth. However, you would have needed a pretty darn powerful telescope to spot them...and as the moon and earth are always moving relative to each other, you would have needed more computer power than was readily available to shift the position of the telescope by minute amounts each second to keep the astronauts in the field of view.
I assume they left their buggy behind as well as their footprints, so if there was a moon landing mission in future (perhaps by a remote controlled rover - Spirit and Opportunity are still roaming around Mars, several years after they were predicted to die), there's a chance the Apollo 11 landing area could be revisited.
And with technology having advanced significantly from those days, the rovers could even post updates to the internet (albeit indirectly - you'd still need a satellite dish and computer at the earth end to receive the updates, verify their integrity and post them).
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Invisible;
My set top (actually its not on the top of the set. Its underneath and behind the tele)box with the digital TV in the bedroom will not produce a picture on some channels if the main set in the living room is on. Apparently if another tele using the same aerial pinches too much signal, the other one won't get a picture. This happens with BBC 1 and 2 the most on my TV. However, I can still buy jewlery and flashing lights false teeth on other channels and cops chasing the same vehicle for the millionth time.
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33. At 11:24am on 16 Jul 2009, mittfh wrote:
'... the US Defense Department has ruled that their troops should continue to be allowed to smoke in war zones, as they're already stressed enough without the added stress of taking away their right to smoke...'
But what are they smoking?
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IA: Are implying that they may be smoking herbal cigarettes? ;o)
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(Sorry - I meant are YOU etc.)
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Were they in sunshine when they landed?
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@38 - hopefully only tobacco (although I've heard there's a plentiful supply of opiates in the vicinity...), and hopefully they won't smoke or discard used butts anywhere near any HE (unless they fancy being nominated for the "prestigious honour" of a Darwin Award...)
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mittfh: You may hope, but I doubt it very much from what I've heard. Allegedly.
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28. Anne P
Precisely. It's the same as paying taxpayers money for substituting perfectly good cars capable of running for many thousands more miles for new ones with a huge carbon cost from the manufacturing process. It only helps those who could afford a new car already.
Just don't expect joined up thinking.
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39. Big Sister
Well Afghanistan is renowned for its herb.
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re: 27. invisibleatheist
"Did all those you mention track it?"
Yes they did. It may have escaped your notice but the Earth rotates and when the moon came over the horizon they picked up the signals. The Soviets would have been delighted to have blown the story if they had any evidence surely.
"I can't get out of my head the flapping flag on a windless moon"
When the men planted the flag it moves of course it does, there is a mans hand on the flag pole. The flag also moves when the men blast off. The clue here is "Blast Off" the exhaust also blows up some dust. Thats what happens close to a rocket when taking off.
"the shot of the 'first man' descending the ladder totake the 'one small step', shot from several metres away... who put that camera there"
The camera was added to the lander module when it was constructed. It was not metres away but had a wide angle lens that makes men look smaller than they really are. Also the pictures are crappy because of the constaints placed on weight etc. You will of course notice that the pictures were much better when the camera used wasn't the fixed external camera but the hand held after the second man stepped out.
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IA: So I've herb. :o)
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42. mittfh
Poppies aren't the only fruit.
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IA: No, and we mustn't forget the weeds ...
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46. Looternite
Thanks, you've cleared up some lingering doubts... I'm really not a conspiracy theorist, in fact I spend time rubishing them usually.
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AP 13, Do you want them to choose a date decided by the Jewish calendar?
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AP 13, PS Amercans measure with cups when cooking.
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AP 13, PPS And the American pint has 16 ounces, not 20, making the gallon smaller.
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mac (41) - they landed on the light side of the moon. Use your brain (it's quite mathematical, so I'm sure it can handle elementary physics). Of course they landed in sunlight.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_11
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ia 18, Has JK Rowling said anything about it yet?
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fJD 22, When we go to the pub, we order and pay for our own drinks. We don't believe in buying rounds. (Gotta stop or 'you know who' will complain that I am snding too many posts in a row.)
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Re: #50. invisibleatheist
Phew for a moment you had me going I thought you was a Landing Denyer (is that spelt correctly, took your advice and looked it up but the dictionary could not help maybe its a bit old).
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Eddie - I hope you'll be able to do a report on the Open at Turnberry? It's the 138th you know. Ca' canny Eddie.
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Is the 'light side' the bit we see or is it the bit that happens to be in sunlight at the time?
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Re: # 55. David_McNickle
Surely J.K. Rowling is a woman therefore not a suspect peado.
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17: The offence was hacking, illegal both here and in the US, and his motivation and capacity are matters for the US court.
We don't extradite if someone will face the death penalty, so are hardly blameless.
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Invisible et al (moon landing)
So how come we didn't get to see any of the clangers then!? Nor even hear a whistle!?
I remember the day they landed. It was a beautiful warm summers day with a full red sunset over Britain. I think England may have been playing some Cricket at the time, can't really remember? After the live landing, me, my dad and brothers went to the pub. Everyone was buzzing on how precise the technological achievement. We thought this was the start. Warp speed this time next year.
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I haven't heard the one about how, since they can put a man on the moon why can't they put them all there (?) for ages or how Pink Floyd are the greatest band ever.
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Afternoon everyone.
I am becoming increasingly annoyed at Credit Card companies, especially after one wrote to me recently advising that should I wish to continue to use my card, my interest rate would rise to 33% (which I thought was some sort of joke), but if I guaranteed not to use it again, my interest rate would stay "at the current level". This prompted me to check the aforementioned "current level" and I was disgusted to find that this rate was almost 22% - how do they justify this when the Bank of England rate is just 0.5% ? I would strongly urge all listeners to check their c/c statements, as I am pretty sure that we are all being fleeced !
Best wishes,
Roy
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Two more lunar Wikipedia articles - hopefully these, together with the Apollo 11 article I linked to earlier, should clear up confusion over where they landed, whether they landed in sunlight, and the correct terminology for the lunar hemispheres:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moon
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Near_side_of_the_Moon
And I suppose you'll want to investigate these as well:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_Moon_Landing_hoax_conspiracy_theories
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When they landed we were still on DC so I hadn't been part of the Dansette revolution becuase they were strictly AC.
And our phone was for my dad's job, so even to phone TIM we had to go through the Council operator and at weekends and after hours we had to push button A in a Scott box.
The radio NEVER worked and the TV had it that there were snow storms everywhere.
The beds were banana shaped, the sheets tore if you turned over too quickly, the carpets were rags and my foreman at the factory used to say he'd seen the cat hitch hiking with a board saying ANYWHERE.
We were so PLEASED all that effort had been put into going to the moon.
It turned us all from fellow travellers to paid up Tories.
We did have a set of cast iron frying pans, which I still use, non-stick of course because of seasoning and good for anything from omlettes to searing stakes.
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I cribbed this bit from Wikipedia:
Dark side of the Moon may refer to:
* Far side of the Moon, the lunar hemisphere that is permanently turned away from the Earth
The rest of this disambiguation (a word they found carved on the lunar beacon in 2001) is about films and stuff
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Whilst the guys were plodding around the moon, I was an embryo about 0.2 inches long.
Parents married June 7th 1969
I popped out March 10th 1970 (a day late)
So count myself as part of the generation which was born after man walked upon the moon. Which I think is quote cool. From an anthropological milestone POV.
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@JRWoodman (7) - I think you're right. We need an alternative to the existing banks.
What about the Grameen Bank - as started in Bangladesh by Nobel prizewinner Muhammad Yunus? There seems to be an ethical model there that is already well-established. http://www.grameen-info.org/
Is there a banking model - islamic finance, perhaps - which works well, but doesn't depend on continuous economic growth to survive, as is the case with the money-as-debt model that we seem to be exclusively burdened with right now?
Were the mutual building societies - now mostly turned into shareholder-owned regular banks - really the answer all along? Many people at the time of those sell-offs predicted dire things in the future. Is now their time to say 'I told you so!'?
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Looter 60, And Anne Fine?
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David (70) do you mean do I agree that Americans do use such measures? of course I do. However, without wishing to start in international incident, (and even having been brought up to do calculations in rods, poles and perches, gills and fluid ounces, pounds, shillings, pence and farthings) I still think that we need to use international systems of measure internationally. There was a famously failed space endeavour not so long ago where one team was using SI units and the others imperial!
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On the news the warmongers continued to argue amongst themselves over helicopters in Afghanistan. They've got advanced weapons systems, guided missiles, well-trained and equipped troops, satellite command-and-control systems, supersonic jet fighters, armoured vehicles and much, much more. Far more than anything the Afghan tribesmen have. Its pathetic: an attempt to divert their frustrations onto someone else. They can't accept the uncomfortable truth. They've failed to achieve their own objectives. Why can't they just admit it, instead of this diversionary debate over helicopters?
Perhaps they ought to be questioning all the money they've invested in officer training at West Point Academy and Sandhurst. After seven long years, the best officers these establishments can produce seem no match for the Taliban.
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Ref 36. mittfh
"they landed on the "light side", which is the bit facing earth."
Not so. There is no "light side." The surface exposed to the sun changes as the moon rotates/orbits. "The bit facing earth" can be light or dark.
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60. Looternite
Actually no. A woman was convicted only recently for child sexual abuse.
Not sure how it could be accomplished during a talk about books by an author in the school hall though.
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57. Looternite
I have a problem with that too, as with global warming denyers, looks like something to do with stockings, but deniers looks even more so, and I go back to denyers, but it still looks wrong. Guess it's just one of those awkward words that need shooting.
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I'm dying to read Eddie's post about William Shatner. The test card is, though, quite amusing.
One or two things need tweaking on this new-style blog, it would appear. An alternative would be to reintroduce the old one. Shall we have a vote on it?
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76
No. On the old blog we'd have Shatner AND A Very Short Life, both, in the SHowcase Three.
Be very grateful.
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A slack news day and everyone to the right of George Galloway listening to the nationalism feste on Radio 5 Live Extra (or watching it), so could PM slip in how many dead there are THIS year in Helmand.
Local people, whether fighting the Nato invaders or just hoping they'll go but dying like real heroes.
What does Nato think is the status of people captured by their forces?
Are we at war?
Can you ask Miliband before he disappears for the summer?
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AP 71, I used pounds, shillings, and pence (still have some) my first year in England, 1970. I had no trouble switching to the noo money in 1971. I learned to use metres and centimetres here doing archaeological site drawings. Much easier that feet and inches.
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AP 71, I'm also in favor of switching to the Euro, which we used in France recently.
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I know the only time we'll see the French is at the head of the victory parade (see Paris 1945) but if they're too scared to fight surely the least our NATO so-called allies could do is let us have some vehicles, helicopters and crews
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By what we hear from Lord Myners ( is he the bloke who passed Fred Goodwin's daylight-robbery pension ?) it seems our politicians are still in thrall to the City slickers and the cosy club goes on as if nothing had happened.
If the Government doesn't wake up and do something positive like raking back some of the bankers bonuses in the form of a windfall tax.
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82: It's the same man (though I don't think he 'passed' Fred Goodwin's windfall - he was just informed of it).
I agree that there's a lot of clubbishiness in the City and that this needs to be broken down.
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