- 21 Aug 08, 01:35 PM
Beijing
Britain have won 39 medals at this Olympics - but have any of them been harder earned than David Davies' silver in the men's 10k open water race?
And is there a more deserving champion than the guy who beat him to gold?
Welshman Davies said he felt "violated" after his swim - he was kicked in the mouth, swum over, and had his goggles knocked off in the course of the one hour 51mins 51second race.
Wednesday's women's winner Russian Larisa Ilchenko said it had felt like "boxing not swimming".
And in today's race, pundit and former Olympic bronze medallist Steve Parry said it looked like Davies was having to practice the art of taekwondo at the same time as well as executing his strokes.
By the end of it he was tacking like Ben Ainslie as he flailed up the final 300m, his wayward line in part responsible for losing him his seven-metre lead to eventual winner Dutchman Maartin van der Weijden.
Davies admitted he was "delirious" by the end of his ordeal - and ended up in the back of an ambulance having collapsed as he left the water.
He looked unconscious momentarily (though he said afterwards he was just having a lie down and opened his eyes in surprise to find himself being bundled onto a stretcher!).
"The hardest race of my life," he said afterwards.
He said he'd only decided to go for the 10k at the start of the year "after lots of persuasive phone calls".
But said he was delighted with his Olympic "scoresheet" - one 1500m final in the Water Cube and one silver medal in Shunyi rowing lake.
(After all that, perhaps it was no wonder he lost his rag with an over-officious official at his post-race news conference and reportedly tipped water on her before calling a halt to proceedings.)
Actually it might have been worse for Davies in the medal stakes had Van der Weijden chosen to use some of the dirty tactics that are so apparent, and compelling, in this brilliant new event. (The world champion Vladimir Dyatchin was red-carded for too many fisticuffs).
Instead the Dutchman opted to sit patiently on Davies' heels despite the Welshman's wayward line - and then strike in the final 150m, straightening up to claim gold by 1.5 seconds.
He could have used up one of his spare yellow cards and given Davies a tug - which would certainly have cost the Welshman the silver as Thomas Lurz of Germany was only half a second behind.
But instead the 6ft 7ins Dutchman chose to win fair and square, and it was nice to see the pair embrace in exhaustion in the water afterwards.
It was a sensational finish - and a sensational story.
Van der Weijden was diagnosed with leukaemia seven years ago - but following a stem cell transplant came back stronger to compete at the 2003 open water world championships before he was crowned world champion over 25km in Seville earlier this year.
It was fitting that he took his place in history as the first gold medallist in the new event.
Cardiff-born Davies embraced Van der Weijden at the end of the race and said afterwards he was "a complete gentleman and a great ambassador for the sport".
"I said to him at the end that I was really proud of him. He's a really tough competitor, his story's amazing and one that can inspire people. What he has achieved is phenomenal."
Indeed van der Weijden regards himself as living proof that a cancer diagnosis does not have to be a death sentence.
"I am trying to spread the word about my story - you can do anything you want after surviving cancer. If you have cancer it is not the end, if you are lucky there is a whole world out there for you still."
"Before the Games I was fantasising about winning the gold medal, because you have to fantasise 100 times about something before you can win it, I was thinking I would be jumping up and down or screaming, but when it came to it , I just finished and felt amazed."
Like many people reading this I expect, I've seen at first-hand what cancer - and also the required treatments for it - can do to people dear to me. So I found his story very moving and uplifting.
"When you are in hospital and feeling so much pain and feeling so tired, you don't want to want to think about the next day or week - you just think about the next hour. It teaches you to be patient."
Next time I'm finding the going a bit tough, I'll be thinking of his words, and deeds.
Professor Ghulam Mufti, professor of haemato-oncology at Kings College London says Maartin is a "fantastic advert for transplants".
"This really does show how successful transplantation is in this day and age. It's really life-saving - it brings normality of life afterwards. Seven years on from being diagnosed and he is most likely cured."
On a final note, I hope the open water event is here to stay after a fantastic impression on its first outing. (But can we have some more cycling disciplines too?)
From a British perspective it delivered three rare swimming medals including the first in Beijing for a British man - and two great human interest stories in Van der Weijden and Natalie du Toit, the amputee swimmer who finished 11th on Wednesday.
"It has proved exceptionally popular," said Parry.
"The common perception beforehand was it had the potential to be pretty boring but it has actually delivered some of the most exciting racing in the Olympics."
BBC Sport The Olympic Broadcaster
React to comment, analysis and opinion from BBC Sport experts at Beijing's Olympics and Paralympics.
Interactive Beijing map
Meet Monkey
Latest Photos
Clicking on any of these photos will take you to an external site.
Recent Comments
- SimonTheKid on Taekwondo needs to move with the times
- MariaFalouri on The odd couple unveil new shoes
- Ranga2522 on Hunt is on for Paralympic talent
- The-Shed-Bar on London confidential
- fionnualadooley on Which sports would you add to the Games?
Topics
Podcast
Download or subscribe to this programme's podcast
Fun and Games
Olympic standard
Do you have what it takes to excel at Denise Lewis' heptathlon?
The BBC is not responsible for the content of external internet sites
CommentsSign in
You need to sign in to contribute to this page. If you're new to BBC Blogs, creating your membership is quick and easy.
This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
Ah, if only he had the hope that he could run with the welsh dragon alongside the union flag; who knows?
Complain about this comment
Congratulation for Mr Davis's silver medal, you have done well!
However, I am disapointed to see that he failed to show the sort of courtesy towards the Chinese official. It is rude to say "shut up" and threw the contents of water bottle at a female official, just imagine what you would think if this happens in the UK? David Davis is a good swimmer but he has a long way to go to join the gentleman's club.
Complain about this comment
Considering he genuinely seemed out of it for quite a while after the race, I'm not going to hold that against him.
More of a pity is that, while I can understand their passion, when he wants to watch back a race in which he won an Olympic silver he'll have to listen to the commentators yelling and berating him for messing up and blowing it. Can't really feel so good about that.
Complain about this comment
I got up especially early to watch the last half of the race and found it compelling. It really is a race for bravehearts as du Toit and van der Weijden showed.
David Davies could easily have won but didn't burst into tears and bemoan his fate. Instead he congratulated the winner and vowed to learn from the experience and improve. Yup, sometimes sport really does have lessons for us all.
Congratulations David, stick with it, and see you in Hyde Park in 2012!
Complain about this comment
What a shame! This 'gentleman' Davis threw a bottle of water to a weak lady volunteer, just to show his frustration after lost his gold at the final moment of the race.
Complain about this comment
A fantastic event!It fully justified the 3 hours sleep I`ve lived off today.As a spectacle,its mayhem and you just get caught up in it.Its aquatic mugging.Brilliant effort from Davies.As someone who trundles up and down the 50m pool in Sheffield next to the Northern elite squad every so often,drowning in their waves and looking like I`m swimming in wellies,it is mindboggling that he swam so fast for so long.Good luck in 2012!
Complain about this comment
The BBC says:
"As officials tried to steer him towards the podium, he took offence to the man-handling he was receiving.
After telling one overly aggressive official to "shut up", he eventually threw the contents of his water bottle at a female official before calling an end to his interview. "
Anyone who saw the video wouldn't say so.
David Davies is a thug. And it is a shame for BBC to speak for him.
Complain about this comment
you throw a water bottle to the lady who just want you to go get your medal?? it is your resposiblity to follow the medal ceremony instead of having an interview with the media at that time. you should apolagize!!
Complain about this comment
Fantastic viewing. It was exciting and frustrating, and I found myself waving my hand at the tele trying to push him on.
The medal was well deserved and the truth of the matter is that it should have been gold. His behaviour afterwards probably stems from his disappointment - disappointment which I thought was evident in the interview. That's not an excuse for the way that he acted, however. If a footballer had done the same thing then I doubt that anyone would be making excuses for them.
A note about the officials - I can't be the only person who has been a little shocked at the way that they've acted at times. I've seen them interrupt interviews and stand over the shoulder of the athlete as they've been talking. It's something that I haven't really noticed happening before.
Complain about this comment
Does anyone have a link to a video of the incident? As most coverage by the press in the words they use is extremely loaded to defend David.
Officials have a job to do too, there is the world's press there who all want an interview and only a limited amount of time, everything must run on time for the sake of the millions watching at home on TV. This is the whole reason why the swimming finals were held in the morning so that people in the US could watch them and it basically comes down to money, so of course sometimes they need to step in.
I wouldn't use fatigue as an excuse either, if he has enough energy to talk to the media then he has enough energy to be polite.
Complain about this comment
Well, he is rude.
I do not care if he is tired or not. When you participate in this level of competition, you are expected to come on top of the intensity.
BTW, the official wants him to go because everyone else is waiting for the medal ceremony. He is no more special than the others.
If he can not deal with that, maybe he should stay at home and hug his teddy bear.
Complain about this comment
On Aug 21, 2008, on one of the largest Chinese internet portal, popyard.org, Mr. Davies is the No 1 news, I suppose for not his athletic achievement.
Complain about this comment
He not only lost the gold for a game, but also proved his failure as being a civilized person in front of the world.
IOC should do something. Otherwise, next time who still wants to serve the Olympics for being treated by this like of person anymore?
Complain about this comment
The things he did to the official justified that he don't even deserve the right to join the olympic game! He broke the spirit of Olympic game!
I doubt that what s kind of education he has got in the previous, I think they should ban him and cancel his result!
That's his fate he didnt get the gold as his rudeness!
He s such a shame! As he s stand for UK to join Olympic!
Complain about this comment
probably not the best reaction but having watched the games quite intensly i agree with other comments that the stewards are very heavy handed and abrupt. watching the womens marathon when the us women dropped out early with a foot injury, she explained to an official and the girl waved her on and pushed her off!! then the hustling of competitors when they do a lap at the stadium or stop for the press is absurd, if you've just won a medal you want to tell the world ie an interview, as for the comment that a footballer would be dealt with for an action like that, i dare say if Mr becks or the like, turned up for an interview no official would dare set hands on him let alone move him on!!
Complain about this comment
Aww... Such a gentleman isn't he. Show the world what Olympic spirit is really like ! He has no respect towards the other athletes who were waiting for him at the podium to receive the medal, or the medal itself.
The Chinese officals were too soft on him, they deserve an apology from this guy.
In my opinion, he doesn't even deserve the medal.
Well done national hero!! For throwing water at an innocent female volunteer worker, shame on you !!!
Complain about this comment
Olympic spirit.... come on... every one deserves to be treated fairly... such behavior could not be tolerated... I guess... this proves that he doesn't deserve to be a winner...
Those officials are just doing their jobs... they need to stick to the time. Otherwise, everything will be late...
I think he needs to enroll in anger management. =)
Complain about this comment
shame on what you did to a lady in beijing.
Complain about this comment
He may have worked very hard, but, he is rude and inconsiderate, just like some British tourists in other countries. I do not respect him. Also, I think he is a racist.
Complain about this comment
I am sick of these British morons who think that the law does not apply to them, and that they have the right to behave however they like when visiting another country.
Their economy is shinking, house price is falling, comodity price is rising, more young people enjoy stabbing each other, more girls start having sex before age of 12, they are fat and loving binge drinking, and even the state govenment ain't able to keep confidential documents safe ...
Where do they get this arrogance from ?
They'll be the No.1 losers of the 21st century!
Complain about this comment
Shame on him! Flipping hooligan!
I feel sorry for that woman who was desprite to have him on the podium, as you know, David's medal could've been canncelled if he failed to attend the medal ceremony on time.
I'm also disgusted to see his rude behaviour being encouraged and prasied as 'role model' by the BBC.
Complain about this comment
the Walsh man might be feeling embarrassed after he recovered from a short pass-out, and tried hard to look calm and enjoyed so much to talk to BBC and left the other winners (include the Gold medal winner) and the whole world is waiting for him because all the events are sold to worldwide broadcasters with same fixed the schedules.
His pass-out had already delayed the process and he insist to talk to BBC with his life story...
the female official must under pressure to call him to avoid any further delay...
what he did then is just like a thug!
he tared Team GB
Complain about this comment
WHATEVER the lady did, I mean WHATEVER she did, she didn't deserve having water poured over her.
END OF
Complain about this comment
A typical, typical British thug. Perhaps it was fortunate he did not give her a British stabbing. Shame on all the UK media not only overlooked his crime, but to justify his behaviour. He should be arrested, trailed and jailed for assault. This should teach British thugs(especially the football ones) how to behaviour in other countries.
I am thoroughly humiliated to have such despicable imbecile to represent my country.
Complain about this comment
Oh honestly. He poured/sprayed/flicked water over her, "thug" is a tad over dramatic.
Had he punched her in the face, yes, "thug" would have been appropriate. But assuming she was wet because of the rain anyway...
Anyhow, the Team GB doctor has come out saying he wouldn't have been acting rationally due to the fact that he had just pushed his body to the absolute limit, and his brain was starved of oxygen.
"I am thoroughly humiliated to have such despicable imbecile to represent my country."
Really? Do it yourself then.
Complain about this comment
he should come out and say something like he was not in a stable situation and say sorry to what he had done and send some flowers to the lady, everyone watched the race would give him a lot of credit because he gave 110% for the game and an apology only make him a better person!
to cover up and saying him being man-handled is ill-minded!
go to Getty image web site and search David Davies and see what he was like and how Chinese stretcher workers had "man-handled" David! they might have rushed to put him onto the stretcher and carry him away to get proper medical treatments, he should be thankful for that not complain!
Complain about this comment
To team GB fan
What, you are allow to throw water at somebody intentionally if she is wet? Try to do it to a police and see whether you will get locked up in jail. Really internet are full of idiots these days.
Acting irrationally because he was depleted? Well others managed to find their way to the podium, so rationally speaking, why was he different. Typical of a rude bigot who thinks he was above everyone.
I rather not to represent my country to throw content of bottle to volunteer merely carrying out her duty. I shall leave that to imbeciles such as you and Davies.
Complain about this comment
Yeah, obviously because ONE exhausted swimmer over-reacted and threw water over someone, that obviously means the entire population of his country should be judged on it, right? Obviously we must be all violent, arrogant bastards who are still devastated from the loss of our empire over a century ago, not to mention the kind of people who, come London 2012, will obviously be demonstrating similar behaviour to visiting athletes. Yes, clearly, the one thing must automatically lead to the other! Get a grip! Don't you think you might be over-reacting just a teensy little bit?
The rampant nationalism (from ALL countries) on these Olympics boards is frankly frightening. No wonder there are still so many wars going on in the world when people are so quick to judge others, and express such utter venom and hatred towards the citizens of an entire country based on something one person does. I don't hate all the citizens of China over the Tibet issue, or all the citizens of the US based on what George Bush does. Neither do I hate all citizens of my own country based on the actions of Tony Blair when he was in power. This was ONE person.
No, he shouldn't have done it, and yes, if he hasn't already (and maybe he has, I don't know, and nor do you!) he should apologise, but considering that not long before he'd been lying on the stretcher in the back of an ambulance, completely physically exhausted, I can understand that he might have had more of a short fuse than usual.
Question: has anyone actually SEEN this video of Davies throwing water over the official? Because I've been searching for several days and I can't find it anywhere on the web. Don't judge on something you didn't see and therefore know nothing about. And before you throw metaphorical bottles of water at me, I didn't see it either, so I make no judgement. You might want to try it sometime.
Complain about this comment
Is he the only exhausted swimmer there? Is the gold-medalist not exhausted? Why did he has the right to keep other ppl wait? Who does he think he is?
Throw water to a woman?
Shame on him, better no to come back, ppl will welcome him with lots of water!!!
Complain about this comment
Shame on him!!!
He will be remembered in Olympic history for behaving like an animal, better give his medal away.
Complain about this comment
calmdownpeople:
I think BBC has the answer to your Question of whether David Davies splashed a bottle water (he had opened and drunk) in the face of a female volunteer worker!
you want people to calm down?
then ask the offender - Mr David Davies to come out and apologise to the victim!
that is the only right way of doing it, not try to say it didn't happen because you could not find a video clip on the Internet...in your logic, the human history didn't exist before a camera was invented !
I doubt your generosity here of trying to calm down people
Complain about this comment
His behaviour amounts to assault and should be dealt with under the law. The splashing of water over another was uncivilized and unruly, more so was the lack of apology. Pretty surprised that so many people have defended him and put the blame on the victim. This country has no future if the government, the media and the fellow countrymen continue to act arrogantly and bash other peoples at their own will, by force, in words and in personal behaviour.
BTW, I seriously doubt if London will be a hospitable host in 2012!
Complain about this comment
I just simply wonder where he is now? He has a blog here on BBC and he has been so talkative. But all of a sudden he just disappears from all the criticism.
Real shame on him.
Complain about this comment
Chelxea - try actually reading my post before responding to it next time.
1) I DID say he should apologise, if he hadn't already. How did you miss that bit?
2) Clearly, I wasn't saying that just because the video clip couldn't be found, it meant that the incident hadn't happened. That would be ridiculous. What I am saying, which seems perfectly reasonable, is that nobody who hasn't seen that clip can judge either way.
singingdancingcat -
I do not think that exhaustion is an excuse for his behaviour, what I was doing was setting out both sides of the argument:
1) His behaviour was wrong,
2) he should apologise,
3) obviously there was a reason for his actions, and exhaustion has to be taken into consideration. The other similarly exhausted athletes may or may not have over-reacted if someone had been pestering them, we cannot know.
Of course, if you want to ignore the fact that 2 out of my 3 points agree with you, then, my friend, you will never be happy with anything in this world.
I ask again: BBC, please post this video on the Olympics site, so that all these ignorant people (and I include myself among them because I haven't had the luxury of seeing said video either), can make an INFORMED judgement, not one based on hundred year old prejudice and sweeping statements about 60 million people based on the actions of one.
I thought the Olympics were about celebrating sporting achievement of all nations, but these boards have disabused me of that naive notion. Apparently they are about bashing other countries and rampant nationalism. Sport itself seems to have become secondary.
I shall not be visiting these boards again.
Complain about this comment
Self-righteousness is often the first response to criticism and I see 'calmdownpeople' is trying hard to big the issue.
what we demand here is an apology, it solves everything, "exhausted athletes may have over-reacted if someone had been pestering them" but he did to a woman who just tried hard to get him onto the podium for a long delayed medal ceremony that is to be broadcasted worldwide according to schedule!
BBC's view was clear that David Davies splashed a bottle of water into the face of a female.
and that is simply not a part of what the Olympics were about... celebrating sporting achievement of all nations by splashing water to a female's face and called that splashing of Champagne?
shame on the Welsh man!
Complain about this comment
I just don't like him after his interview.
Imagine what he said during the interview. He said he wanted a cameo part in Gavin and Stacey? What an attention seeker?
If the interview were to be more decent, maybe like praising other athletes, I would probably favour him a little more.
What made him keep everyone else wait was his ambition in the showbiz. How very sweet, indeed.
I can not be more sarcastic.
Complain about this comment
I'm from China the country where the Olimpic's playing in. I'm just an primary English leaner,however I'm not good at speaking it.I'm here just want to show my opinion for the pity stuff. In China here,we always has a good impression of people from England which is royalty and gentalman. But it once changed for me for the hole thing which Davies did.But now my anger disappeared,because I see so many people still hold the right standard of morals and thanks a lot for the backups.
Wishes you good luck at 2012.
Complain about this comment
You should say sorry,MR DAVID DAVIES!!!
Complain about this comment
Shame on DAVID DAVIES!!!
Shame on GB!
Complain about this comment
He absolutely is a dog biting human being!!!
Complain about this comment
the thug stil not apologized? shame on him!
Complain about this comment
To start with - I'm Caucasian British. Davies shouldn't have snapped at the Chinese official, and he shouldn't have thrown water at her. Of course he should apologise for that.
But on the other hand, he's no "dog biting human being" (chemhehe #42), "thug" (dragon-89 #43) or Gary Glitter (grant20126, #39 on Steve Parry's blog about the women's race 20/Aug/08). Did he hurt the woman, did he injure anything except her pride? No - because he is not a thug.
I must admit, some of the reaction on the blogs has been so extreme, I can only conclude that some of these people must be working for enemies of China. They are trying to shame China by making it appear that for instance ordinary Chinese actually think that persistent paedophilia is like throwing water over someone. I can't believe real Chinese people think such a thing, these views are so extreme that they must be intended to make China look bad.
You can get some objective idea of how significant this incident actually was by looking at the coverage in countries other than Britain and China. To be honest, I can hardly find any from reputable sources, in the West or Asia. Certainly you'd expect the Aussies to be quick to find fault with the British - but they didn't think it even worth commenting on. On the other hand there's been lots of comment in other countries about the Spanish basketball teams' "slit-eye" photo, and the Swedish wrestler who threw away his medal in the heat of the moment. They really did show disrespect, even if the Spanish didn't realise what offence they were calling, and Abrahamian was another spur-of-the-minute flash of anger. But compare the international reaction to the three events, that should tell you which are important.
The Davies incident was just one of those things that happens between an exhausted athlete and an official with a boss on her back, from different cultures and with no language in common. It's regrettable, but unfortunately these things happen from time to time, both were embarassed but it was nothing more serious. For instance, it wouldn't have happened if Davies spoke Mandarin, or if the organisers had sent someone who spoke English - and that alone tells you that this wasn't the result of malice on Davies part. People should just accept that and move on.
I can assure any Chinese here that any Briton I know would have apologised over such an incident, small though it was. And Davies seems like a good guy, so I'm sure he has apologised in private. Just because we haven't heard about it doesn't mean no apology has been made. Britain has nothing to lose by making such an apology in public - and as these blogs show has quite a bit to gain - whereas China, perhaps, just wants to sweep the whole affair under the carpet for whatever reason, as evidenced by the lack of coverage in their media of the original event.
Picking up on some of the other comments - Davies obviously did not have as good endurance as the winner, otherwise he would have won! By that logic the unfortunate Xin Tong would have been fresh as a daisy. More seriously, it is much more efficient to swim in the wake of someone else, Davies was in clear water for over 9000m, and was clearly in a bad way by the end, the medics were obviously worried about him.
adamhomgaard - he was full of praise for the other athletes, just see the quotes in this blog about how he said van der Weijden was "a complete gentleman and a great ambassador for the sport....I was really proud of him....What he has achieved is phenomenal". How much more do you want?
As for the Gavin and Stacey thing, that's not about wanting a wider showbiz career, it's just about his otherwise ordinary hometown, which is now famous for two things, that show and David Davies. He just thought it would be fun to briefly combine the two. And personally, if that's all the "fame" he wants after winning medals at two Olympics and swimming 80km every week - good luck to him.
Complain about this comment
I would leave it there, but our Chinese correspondents seem so reluctant to see Davies' point of view that a bit more explanation is in order, unfortunately this will end up being a bit pompous but that's only to match some of the previous responses. If you want other people to understand and respect your culture, first you must make an effort to understand and respect theirs.
First, our Chinese friends may not understand how important personal space is to Westerners. There's been lots of academic research on this kind of thing - see some of the references in http://www.renmenbi.com/personal-space for examples. Just being touched by strangers in an uncrowded area is pretty unusual, although Londoners are more used to that than people from the country. Being grabbed by the arm by a stranger just doesn't happen, unless perhaps you're a criminal being arrested or something. You must understand what a hostile act that would be perceived as.
Now, I wasn't there, so I don't know exactly what happened - was anyone on this blog actually there? And I've not seen any TV footage, so all I can rely on is accounts from people who _were_ there, such as this one from Nick Harris in the Independent :
"an official - a Chinese woman for whom the adjective ?overzealous? might have been invented - barked repeatedly in his ear in Chinese and tried to manhandle him away.
?Will you shut up, please?? he asked her at first. More hassling followed. More barking. Then a tug on Davies' arm. ?Will you take your hands off me, please?? asked Davies.
The official wanted him to head to the nearby podium but the medal ceremony was still 10 minutes away and Davies talked on. He was grabbed again. ?Touch me one more time,? the mild-mannered Davies warned. And then the official touched him one more time, barking louder.
Davies had a plastic bottle of Evian in his hand. He turned. A moment later his bottle was less full. It was raining hard, but not all the water on the official's head was rain. No complaints were made."
So even if he hadn't just come from 2 hours of "boxing not swimming", the woman would have made Davies uncomfortable just talking in his ear. By grabbing one of the arms that was aching from 2 hours of swimming, she was being very hostile by Western standards, Davies would have felt like he was being treated like a criminal just at the moment he thought he was a hero. It's no wonder he reacted to so much provocation. In fact, eatdrinking and Kathleen - while Davies couldn't be arrested for assault, there have been several cases in British courts of assault charges being brought for grabbing people in the way the woman did. And yet we are told all visitors to the Games were guests of Beijing, which means that surely Olympians are honoured guests and medal-winning Olympians particularly honoured guests of the city? The fact that she was "just following orders" is no excuse - and in any case we are led to believe that the medal ceremony was still 10 minutes away, there was hardly a rush.
That was almost as pompous as I thought it might be :-(, personally I think this is all getting a bit ridiculous but if people want to throw the "thug" Davies in jail for assault, then they must first ask why the Chinese representative assaulted Davies in a worse fashion, and why BOCOG have not apologised for treating one of their most honoured guests like a criminal. Answer those questions, and you may find why BOCOG kept quiet about this incident, and why any apology from Davies has been kept quiet.
I'll say again though - as a Briton what he did was obviously wrong, and he should apologise, although it doesn't have to be made public.
Complain about this comment
Dear Stop_it_Aggers
What you said all made sense until you cited Independent. Dear me, 'barked repeatedly in his ear', is it the way how the British presses report?
Honestly, what offended the Chinese the most was not Mr. Davies. It was indeed how the British presses put it.
Apologise in private? I highly doubt it. One of my friends tried to make enquiry to Team GB. She even got a phone call to threaten her that they would take legal action against her. My friend, the girl just made a phone call. Legal action? Crazy.
Complain about this comment
The Chinese were more offended by the way the press covered it than the action itself? That's not the impression we're getting here. But like I say, I was not present at the incident, so I'm forced to rely on second-hand coverage. And I did go looking for coverage in other countries, but none of them seemed to think the incident worth noting, if you can point me to some alternative (reputable) sources, please tell me. I would gladly quote eg the Xinhua account alongside a British source, but I couldn't find one. So I was left with the British papers. They certainly have their moments of juvenility, but the Independent is normally pretty grown up, so if it sounded like "barking" to their correspondent, it probably sounded like "barking" to Davies.
Again, I think this is partly just a cultural issue - spoken Chinese has a lot of triggers that sound "aggressive" to Western ears. It is generally spoken very quickly and has lots of "hard" sounds. Which is a particular problem in English as for historical reasons English has two versions of many words, a "polite" version derived from French (which tends to have softer sounds and longer words) and a more earthy word derived from German, which tends to be shorter and harsher. To take a stupid example, compare "Please retrieve my bovine lactation" with "Go milk my cow!". For that reason, you can tell a lot about someone's intention from the rhythm of their English. Unfortunately spoken Chinese has a lot of the audible triggers associated with "aggression" in English, so even "friendly" Chinese sounds like "barking" to British ears. No doubt to Chinese people, native English sounds quite "slow" and "wordy".
I'm no expert on Oriental languages, but that's my impression of Chinese, anyway. So again, it's one of those misunderstandings that arises when different cultures meet, rather than anything more fundamental like anti-Chinese bias. No matter how polite the woman was being in Chinese, it probably sounded quite aggressive to Davies and other Westerners present. Again, it wouldn't have been a problem if Davies spoke Chinese or if BOCOG had sent an English-speaking volunteer.
U3805756 - why do you "highly doubt" that there's been an apology? As I say, from a British cultural perspective, it would be extraordinary if there _hadn't_ been an apology. Given that we know that the Chinese authorities seem to be trying to hush up the original incident, they would be even keener to hush up the aftermath. I think you should expend your energies trying to find out what BOCOG is prepared to say about the affair.
As for your friend's phone call - this threat of legal action sounds bizarre. It's hard to think what sort of legal action they would have meant. All I can think of is that they've had a lot of calls from Chinese nationals making threats against Davies (we've seen a few on this site) or there's some kind of agreement with BOCOG not to say anything in public. Obviously neither of us can know exactly what was said, but all I can think of is that somehow what she said was interpreted in the light of one of those scenarios. But it would be interesting to know what the response was when you phoned BOCOG to find out if they had received an apology from Davies....
Complain about this comment
I'm not condoning what Davis is reported to have done, but allow me to highlight a few points to his critics...
1) I doubt that many of the people commenting on Davis' behavior have ever swum long distances in open water, if they had they would realize that on exiting the water you don't have a full understanding of what's going on as due to the sudden drop in blood pressure (which can lead to confusion, erratic behavior and collapse).
2) Davis was bound to be suffering from greater fatigue from the eventual winner and those behind him as he had lead for the greater part of the race. Swimming on his heels would have required up to 30% less energy than it would have taken to have swam in front.
3) If the time schedule was so tight, why have the medal ceremony so soon after the race, at least allow the athletes the chance to conduct interviews etc. before whisking them off to the podium.
To brand Davis' a thug or an embarrassment is wholly unfair. Put yourself in his shoes and imagine how you would have felt to not only have just missed out on an Olympic Gold but to then be hurriedly ushered away from an experience that you have earned.
Perhaps an apology would clear the air? I do know that Davis should be congratulated on an epic effort and we should be proud of his achievement, after all, it's not like he kicked an official in the face, is it??
Complain about this comment
Dear offshoreswimmer
Since when 'barking' has been used to describe a lady's talk in English, especially by a pretty 'grown up' press?
to answer your 1), 2), 3) and after 3)
1), 2) Since when the likes of 'sudden drop in blood pressure' and 'greater fatigue' give you the right to say 'shut up' to a lady and throw water on her face? After all Mr Davis was able to talk on the BBC in lenght, but he couldn't stand a few words from a lady?
3) The schedule had already been running late because of Mr Davis's initial passing-out rather than being scheduled too tight. All the other medallists and officials were actually waiting for Mr Davis. That's why the female Chinese officer asked Mr Davis to come quickly. He would be stripped off the medal if he missed the ceremony.
Afer 3), so you think kicking a lady's face is bad whilst throwing water on a lady's face is somehow ok, right?
Finally, about the phone call my friend got was from a guy in Team GB, and his name was David Richards. He told my friend that my friend was lucky that he had not been sued. All my friend did was phoning British Swimming Association and suggesting Mr Davis should apologise. So that's why I doubt a private apology had been made.
Let me finish this. Right is right, wrong is wrong. Mr Davis won a medal for Team GB, which was great. But his behavior and the British reports were highly inappropriate.
Complain about this comment
Dear U3805756,
as I said, I'm not condoning what Davis did/didn't do, I am merely trying to lay out some reasons as to why he may have acted as he did.
Your right to say that right is right etc. and I couldn't agree more that a volunteer in any sport doesn't deserve to be treated with disrespect (though thankfully it seems that in swimming we have a long way to go until we reach the standards of football, but don't get me started on that).
In response to your comments about the schedule, I would like to aid that, given the nature of this event, don't you think that perhaps a longer period in between the finish and the ceremony may have been a better idea?
I do think that whilst what Davis is reported to have done isn't the kind of behavior I would like to see from any sportsman, I must admit that some of the comments on this blog have been perhaps a tad over-zealous.
Whilst Davis should apologize to the individual concerned, I think perhaps the British should focus more on his achievements at the games, it seems that the press and public are too keen (in some instances) to focus on the negative. Think about how much coverage Paula Radcliffe received after the marathon in comparison with Mara Yamauchi.
Complain about this comment
dear offshoreswimmer
thanks for your reply. like i said before, most of your comments made sense. and nice to see people can actually talk sense here. let's move on to cheer those remarkable individuals competing in the Paralympics.
Complain about this comment
U3805756 - I've already addressed in #47, the points you raise in #49, I think we are just getting into a circular argument here.
However, one thing has just struck me - there are several meanings to the verb "barked", but it's so obvious to a native English speaker which meaning was intended that the alternative sense wouldn't even cross one's mind. Yes, the word can mean the sound a dog makes. But the second meaning, as per the Shorter OED, is "to speak angrily or aggressively" - typically it would refer to the way an officer would say orders to his soldiers, or a guard to his prisoner.
Unfortunately I see that my Pocket OED doesn't explain this distinction very well, unlike its big brother - perhaps this confusion is widespread? So this simple misunderstanding of language might explain why our Chinese friends are taking offence when no comparison with a dog was intended at all - as you can see, it's taken me two weeks to even think of this explanation.
So I'll say it again - there was no intention to compare the volunteer to a dog, her words were being compared to the way an army officer gives orders.
Complain about this comment
View these comments in RSS