Survival but at what price?
Survival. That was Gordon Brown's sole focus on the morning after the night before.
Hours after James Purnell's shock resignation from the cabinet and his call for his leader to stand down, the prime minister did persuade Labour's leading figures to back him rather than sack him.
He has though won it at quite a price. Alistair Darling stays as chancellor having made plain that he would rather resign than be moved as the prime minister had once planned. It was a sign not of Mr Darling's strength but Mr Brown's increasing weakness.
Peter Mandelson has a new title first secretary of state and a new role to match the reality that he is in effect Gordon Brown's deputy.
He is one of the growing number of unelected hand picked appointees that Mr Brown has come to rely on. It is hard to see how this lives up to Lord Mandelson's description that "we've seen the creation of a new government", it looks instead like the emergency filling of an unprecedented set of cabinet resignations.
Nevertheless Mr Brown has seen off the ministerial revolt and it is now up to backbench Labour MPs to decide whether they accept that verdict or conclude that their weakened leader should be finished off.
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These momentous happenings will see Brown gone. I am disappointed because his remaining would totally destroy The Socialist movement and Labour in The UK.
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If I understand the results of today then the man who is now Deputy (a post no longer held by a woman) is unelected by any voter, not having been elected to a constituency. On top of that he has previously twice left the Cabinet over allegations of malpractice.
Absolutely disgusting
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Brown is a dead man walking, Labour is the party of the living dead.
Bring on the General Election, after Sunday's drubbing.
Resign now.
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I don't think it's about what Labour want anymore, they are so unbelievably arrogant and self indulgent. If they are so sure of what they can achieve, why doesn't Brown do the only honorable thing thing left and call an election.
They are only elected officials and I think Brown has completely forgotten that fact. The man is a deluded megalomaniac!!
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Labour (144 council seats) has been beaten by "Other" (148 council seats).
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There's more courage in a Girl Guide troop than the Labour backbenches could muster. Brown has dug in. The Bunker has been reinforced and the country must now pay the price of the Labour Party's total lack of any moral fortitude. The only consolation will be that the Labour Party must now pay a much heavier price come the election next year.
Brown constantly insists on telling us what people want his government to do, and yet he refuses to actually ask the people what they want. Election day 2010 will be so sweet.
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Survival, is only an option to those whom know when to call it a Day.
In the Case of Brown it is ALL ABOUT refusing to be driven from Power, at ALL COST.
Therefore, if there is to be ANY REVIVAL in the fortunes of what is left of Labour when finally any Survival Plan is summoned to retrieve what is left of the Labour Party, then any turnaround in this Party's fortunes will not be seen in any of our life-times.
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Maybe the mass hysteria group will calm down. GB has dealt with foot and mouth, blue tongue, terrorist attacks and a world wide recession, in which he led Europe and America in the right stimulus directions and still the blood thirsty mob call for more.
The do nothing tory party offer zero in terms of policies, why would people vote for a nothing party?.
As for the those who have resigned, well! talk about spitting the dummy if you cant get what you want, unbelievable! Flint, the housing minister that once said " you must have a job to get a council house"
Paaaaa, carry on GB I salute your will to do what's right.
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It seems Brown won't be content until his cabinet, and our master, is full of unelected cronies. But what regard has he ever held for parliament and the electorate?
Desperate measures from an ever increasingly desperate man. Glynnis, I ask you? And a ne First Secretary of State with no MANDYate from the public.
I was going to make a joke about how there are probably no more Brazilians in the cabinet membership now, but I won't.....
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Dear Nick,
The slowest car crash in history just keeps on rolling and rolling and rolling. With new fluffy dice on the windscreen and the fresh smell of vanilla in the air, this car just doesn't know when to stop and give up! (Must be a volvo towing a caravan)
AJ says GB is far better than he at being PM, but if there was a vacancy, he never said never. If GB is better than AJ, will AJ be an improvement to us all??
Xxxx
ps,
Everyday GB is Pm, is another hundred votes lost for (Za)Nu(Improved)Labour. How many before it is all gone?
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Well we have seen how two faced some MP's are last night Caroline Flint was right behind Gordon Brown and by 16:30 she had resigned and slaged Gordon Brown off just because she did not get the job what she wanted in the reshuffle
I think Gordon Brown is better off without those ministers who want to just server for there own gain and not for the gain of the Country
I for one will be happy if Gordon Brown makes it law that all MP's have to have there claims audited by independent accountants and there accounts made public at least we then can see for ourselves rather than letting some other leader coming and saying that they are going to make the changes but then just put a gloss on it then give MP's and exception from having to show us anything regarding there claims and expenses
by Gordon Brown sorting it out we can get rid of the lot of them and know that the new lot have no were for them to hide any fiddles
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I would hardly call his performance as sealing his survival.
He was nervous, spoke very quickly, constantly denied facts which everyone knew to be true. He just about got through it - for the weekend at least.
The European Elections I fear will be an even greater disaster for Labour. The electorate has little time for the EU and they will use the opportunity as an even greater protest vote against Labour.
Having to make the shortfall in his cabinet up of unelected peers and recalling people like Peter Hain, shows his is really scrapping the bottom of the barrel. He truely is a man with no mates.
Having upset the women as well, I don`t think Gordon should be making any long term plans.
Once we get over this weekend and the Daily Telegraph gets back in to its stride anything can happen - and to this government it usually does.
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Speculation aside, just look at the numbers. (as of Fri 19:20)
Labour -228 seats clinging on to 146 and not a single council. Not one! Tory, LibDem, etc fortunes aside, Labour have been slaughtered. Calling these are not bad figures they are like calling WWII a bit of an argument.
They have been erased from local government. There are currently more seats going to independents than labour. Even Nick has to admit that is seismic.
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What the backbenchers should do is finish off Gordon and face the electorate in a general election.
What they will do is say nothing and take their next 12 months pay and expenses plus the golden parachute at the end of term.
All this presumes that UK Plc hasn't sunk without trace by then!
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The back benchers, tragically, don't have what Brian Moore would call the 'cajones' to go for it.
I weep for the state of this country, I really do. It is coming to a point that the people will need to protest - maybe a million in London would get the point across that we want this failing group of politicians out of our lives and a fresh mandate.
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What a farce. Don't worry we've now got Alan Sugar to give us an Amstrad Cabinet - it looks like a more expensive cabinet but theres much cheaper components making it up.
You have to feel sorry for Caroline Flint - last night she was backing Gordo on SkyNews 100%, today no promotion so stamps her feet and walks out. Kind of says it all really.
This is the government management team we're talking about and there are better run committees in working men's clubs round here
Still Glenis Kinnock got a peerage so some good news
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This almost beggars belief.....a completely lame-duck PM without a mandate, bereft of ideas, and despite his crazy "the people want me to get on with the job" rhetoric, completely obsessed with self-preservation AT ANY COST - and now more unelected flunkys in a sad attempt to string it out a little bit more!! Whatever happened to democracy - oh yes, it died in 1997. Brown's delusion is so far off the mark it's unreal. If he REALLY believes that the people want him, why doesn't he grow a pair and call a general election NOW. Of course he won't because he knows it's a pack of lies.
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So someone who was never elected to be Prime Minister appoints people that no one has elected into key roles. Good job we don't have more oil or we would be invaded by the US as an unstable dictatorship!
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I listened to the PM's news conference. He is akin to a rabbit in headlights, or maybe CJ. Can he actually answer a question? I recall the end of John Major from sleaze. This goes far deeper, he's not in control, he runs out the same old mantra in reply to any question and is making the whole economic situation worse by hanging on. Bringing in and then promoting Mandelson!!! Mrs Kinnock???? Were they voted for? Do the unelected and 'advisors' run this country. Indeed do they outnumber MP's that were elected to run this country? I can't believe I voted for this party.
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Still no mention of Flint quitting and calling Brown a useless woman-hater then Nick?
How many unelected ministers now? 3 as far as I can see (4 if you count brown as being the unelected PM)
How many cabinet resignations so far? 6, or 7? I've lost count.
And, with more than 200 council seats gained by the tories and more than 200 lost by labour, according to the BBC it's still not a good day for the tories.
Your "reporting" is a joke.
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I listened to Gordon Brown this afternoon. I think that he seriously misjudges the mood of the electorate which wants change as the local election results testify. I would have more respect for him if he put his trust in the people and held an election. His new look Cabinet looks like an old boy's club.
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What is motivating PM Gordon Brown to remain.
Is it his deep desire to create a prosperous and safe nation?
Is it to cement his place in history that he continues in desperation?
Does he still believe he acts in our Democracies name?
Is it his narcissism that prevents him hanging his head in shame?
Outside of Gordons fantasy world, his lackies know the score.
Gordon Brown the Prime Minister should be .. never more.
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I think we'll see what parliament et al have to say about the number of unelected officials we now have governing us.
This can't be allowed to stand. What's to stop this delusional megalomaniac instating all of the cabinet from unelected pals....
It says something when he can't find a whole cabinet from within the rank and file of Labour MPs....
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Should we not be concerned at the growing lack of representational democracy in Parliament.
Those MPs who have announced their intention of standing down at the next election are largely those who would lose their seats through voter anger at their expenses behaviour.
Their proper course is to resign their seats and fight a byelection. By choosing not to they are effectively denying proper representation to their constituents.
At the same time, we have Mandelson, effectively appointed Brown's deputy - in the Lords! Who the hell elected him? He is completely unaccountable! At least Sainsbury couldn't do too much harm as science minister - although his appointment was objectionable.
The expenses business has ignited a much wider anger at our hopelessly outdated political system. We have an unelected head of state, an unelected upper house and now an unelected deputy prime minister!
On top of that we have a rapidly expanding pool of disgraced MPs (100 plus) who have been forced to announce that they will not stand for re-election in the next Parliament - and who by their determination to hang on for their golden goodbyes are denying their constituents representation.
Pardon?
And this is the Parliament that took us to war to install democracy in Iraq? That is now proposing to reform itself?
This country isn't a democracy at all.
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He may have survived the council election results and a cabinet that reshuffled itself but it remains to be seen how the Euro results will affect Brown. I suspect that Labour will trail in fourth behind the LibDems, UKIP and the Tories (who'll be substantially in the lead). If it's a bad fourth place then the writing will be on the wall.
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GB's going to have a mega breakdown next week when his "inner circle" call in the men in white coats. He's unique, I've never seen such denial.
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he actually lied at the press conference when he was asked if it was his intention to move Alistair Darling...he said he never intended to change the chancellor...everyone in the room knew he was lying, but no journalist challenged him...
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Dictatorship!
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We no longer have a Prime Minister, just a stuttering, mumbling psychological curiosity. Get rid of him. Now.
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Come on Gordon, accept it, be a man, suck in that quivering lip and hear what you're being clearly told by the public as a whole.
Your leadership, your government and your party are no longer wanted, you have no authority, no mandate, no reason to continue, call a general election and 'do the right thing', because 'it is the right thing to do!'
You're seen as nothing more than a silly stubborn little man, procrastinating over a job you're patantly incapable of doing.
Go, go now!
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Can anyone enlighten me as to what the situation would be if Labour are completely wiped out in the EU election.
I ask because a straw poll amongst 35 people at lunchtime in my local working mens club did not produce one person who had voted Labour. Not a scientific way of doing things I know, but it did raise the question
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He wont go anywhere, as we have seen when he was chancellor. He is clinging on to that job he so desperately wanted. Its time for an election. This is just like 1997 with an old, tired and useless government. I lost my job 3 months ago, and no matter what, this government has done NOTHING for me. They bail out the corrupt banks, with billions of taxpayers money, but for training, and job security NOTHING. Its time to go now, the longer he waits, the worse it will be and Labour will be unelectable for years.
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And there we have it. Mandy has been granted the title of Lord Protector of England as the real King is considered a basket case.
Actually if I supported Labour, I would like to see Mandleson given a real go in the top job.
Is there any bar to a Member of the Lords being PM?
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There once was a dark lord named Mandy.
When using lies and deceit he was handy,
In the cabinet he lurked,
While smugly he smirked,
For his evil plans were working, just dandy.
Browns downfall was his ultimate goal,
Meticulously, Mandy perfected his role,
Going from Minister by Minister,
Mandys plot was efficient and sinister,
Forcing Brown to dig himself into a hole.
Mandy knew Brown wouldnt just resign,
So he keeps up the pressure just fine,
With more ministerial scandal,
Mandy, the political vandal,
To the scrap heap its Brown, hell consign.
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What is this country all about? A government that cannot hold onto a single council in the election yesterday led by someone, who is frankly no leader, yet he still will not face the truth.
This party has quite literally ruined this country and made us the laughing stock of the world and they still bimble along making a bigger mess by the day.
The last 12 years have been nothing but a farce, the health service is managed by bureaucratic nonesense, education is starved of resource, the roads are a total mess...
Why doesn't Gordon Brown do the decent thing, show his moral standing and do the best for the country a general election NOW!!!
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I am honestly ashamed to be British - how can Mandy be Deputy PM (in all but name)? Nobody but Gordon has voted for him and Mandy has twice been obliged to resign on the occasion in the past was he was elected as an MP. What sort of democracy is this?
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So many blogs today Nick, six so far, 3 have already gone into archive !
If there is ever a political youve been framed/all right on the night please let them play Caroline Flints two contributions of the last 24hrs.
Funny ? Hillarious ! BUT it shows all they care about really is climbing the greasy pole. GB forgot the hell hath no fury law.
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A wild day for Labour... and for me (an American living in Aberdeen), another reminder of the incredible ferocity of British politics, outdone only by the ferocity of the tabloid press, egging everyone on...
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The labour back benchers were emasculated by the leadership.
They need Balls out of the cabinet and on their benches.
With Balls they can then stand up erect and be counted.
Who better than a friend to kick Gordon where it hurts?
Back benchers call for Balls Out
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So Lord Mandelson is now "First Secretary of State". Why not just get it over and done with and call him the UK's unelected Deputy Prime Minister???? What a disgrace this whole mess has turned into.
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At the end of the day, the media will decide what happens next. Watch out for the 'Sun' newspaper, if they turn on the Labour Party then Gordon Brown is doomed. Don't forget what happened when they switched from supporting the Tories and gave New Labour their support back in the 90's.
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#13 (Unlucky for Some) Flint 1900
"Well we have seen how two faced some MP's are last night Caroline Flint was right behind Gordon Brown and by 16:30 she had resigned and slaged Gordon Brown off.... I think Gordon Brown is better off without those ministers........"
Be careful what you wish for, he might have a cabinet FULL of two faced MP's (let's ignore those we didn't get to vote for). AJ is in a very strong position now, Blair's babes are full of hormones and even Nick Robinson is running out of puff and promises!
The writing was on the wall with this government when they sent tanks into Heathrow. What price they'll be doing the same in Trafalgar Square anytime soon....
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Gordon Brown is showing remarkable courage in face of unprecedented difficulties. There will always be the nervous nellies and Corp. Joneses (Dad's Army) in any group and it is good that Brown has got rid of these. There is a global recession and the electrorate during any mid-term elections, will always take it out on the incumbent-no matter how good or bad they are. When it comes to the real election, people will make a sober assessment-during which Cameron's vacuous Tories(do nothing and no coherent policies) will be exposed for what they are-all style and little substance.
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This unelected bit should be looked at more closely. We are offered a choice of two main parties whose philosophies (such as they are) are much closer than they ever have been. We let one of them govern (sooner the devil you know) until the government runs out of steam and we vote in the the other party. The new government gets re-elected because the defeated party has self-imploded. We have no choice in the candidates put forward by either party, so if we want to vote for the least bad party we have to vote for their candidate even if their main qualification is 'loyal party worker'. The winners of Britain's Got Talent, Strictly Come dancing, The X Factor and Big Brother have received larger numbers of votes having beaten several others. Notwithstanding jibes at the voting systems in these programmes, there was more choice offered there than in electing any MP.
Elections should be not just about voting, but about making real choices. Our present system fails this test miserably. The proof of this is that in reality the public do not trust our present set of politicians or even the parties they they belong to.
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Zydeko@33
That's promising, but don't forget if any of them had voted Lab they may have been a little too embarrassed to say in public.
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"we've seen the creation of a new government"
By new I guess you mean undemocratic.
Gordon must surely go down as the most disgustingly self-absorbed and arrogant man to ever risen to power in the UK, and even that was underhand.
I guess for some people 'socialism by any means' is acceptable.
Why is it always the left who think their world view is more important than democracy itself?
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Labour are doing a better job of getting the Conservatives into power than the Tories themselves. There is absolutely no doubt that Labour will be utterly humilated at a general election under Gordon Brown. The public are sick of Labour but there is also no real appepite for the country to vote David Cameron into power either.
For the good of the Labour Party ,the spin doctors have to make it clear to all and sundry off-the-record - even now in the month of June - that Gordon Brown will be stepping down as leader of the Labour Party at the party conference in October in the best interests of the party.
The best (and only suitable) candidate to succeed Gordon Brown is Ed (not David) Miliband and by the time of his coronation around November he will have bought himself and the party 7 months to the next general election as Christmas, New Year etc comes and it would be reasonable to hold off until June. During this time it is conceivable that Ed could not only avoid a bruising defeat for the party, but he could actually win a fourth term for Labour under his strong, intelligent, thoughtful and personable leadership.
Any other course of action will be catastrophic for Labour - early election, Alan Johnson or the dreadful Harriet as the new leader, getting rid of Gordon Brown in June - and they will face not only years in the wilderness but also be defeated by a whopping majority. Getting rid of Gordon Brown just now would be a disaster only because of its timing. For the sake of the Labour Party they need to avoid the frenzy of the Tories and their cronies who smell the grandeur of power for the first time in 12 years.
The big question is do Labour shoot themselves in the foot or snatch victory from the jaws of defeat by manipulating a horrendous situation to emerge with a clunking great fist to knockout David Cameron in the 12th round. It is safe to assume that Tony Blair never imagined it would be in the shape of the modest but astute Ed Miliband.
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GREAT to see Flint revealing herself in her true colours. Hilarious to see her petulant "anti-women" rant dismissed by the HARPERSON. And then Brown replaces Flint with a woman. It gets better and better.
From self promotion to no promotion to self-inflicted demotion.
Out like Flint.
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10. At 7:11pm on 05 Jun 2009, derekbarker wrote:
Maybe the mass hysteria group will calm down. GB has dealt with foot and mouth, blue tongue, terrorist attacks and a world wide recession, in which he led Europe and America in the right stimulus directions and still the blood thirsty mob call for more.
The do nothing tory party offer zero in terms of policies, why would people vote for a nothing party?.
Paaaaa, carry on GB I salute your will to do what's right.
==============
Derek you really are a delusional soul.
Gordon is doing one of two things - either hanging on for his own ego, or he really believes that he has a mandate from the people to inflict his world view on us. Which do you think it is?
I notice that he mentioned today that we must go forward quicker. That really disgusted me. He wants to get his way before being ejected from office. If he could hand us over to europe tomorrow, knowing that he was going to be kicked out on monday I think he probably would.
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Brown tells Caroline Flint that he hopes she'll return to Government one day. Can't see it happening myself - she'll be far too old by the time Labour get another chance.
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Our "Dear Leader" postures and asserts his waning authority, surrounding himself with yesterday's men and women (Mandy, Glenys and Sralan - all now unelected, like him), clinging to those who are not yet quite ready to cut him adrift (Alan Johnson, Darling and David Milliband) while the rising stars of the Labour party (Purnell, Flint, Hutton), who see their future career beyond his tenure, race to disassociate themselves from his crumbling administration.
For ten years, as the Iron Chancellor, he smugly maintained to have an unprecedented measure of control and responsibility for the economic health and prospects not just of the UK domestic economy but for its position and influence on the world stage. With the possible exception of Greenspan, he was the one who claimed to have a steady hand on the tiller. If his influence was true then, surely is it not true now?
During this time the economy was mortgaged to the future expressly at his command at a rate that has never been seen before. Insurances against future uncertainty - notably our gold reserves - were discarded with astonishingly ill-timed incontinence. Byzantine levels of fiscal complexity were introduced - and pensions (deferred income) were seen as a ready source of further government funds. As the edifice began to crumble last year, yet more of our money was committed to shoring up his vanity to an eye-watering extent.
This mean-spirited, preening, joyless, ill-tempered, incompetent, narrow-minded, arrogant, spineless, un-elected, wheedling, cowardly, misanthropic, self-satisfied, demagogue more than any other person in office on the planet has his fingerprints all over the UK's and the world's present economic situation.
Why should he not now take the option of the glass of whisky and the revolver?
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More unelected ministers....
Brown holds the Parliamentary Labour Party in contempt.
I guess he's right to as if they had a collective backbone they'd get shot of this incompetent delusionist.
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10. At 7:11pm on 05 Jun 2009, derekbarker wrote:
Maybe the mass hysteria group will calm down. GB has dealt with foot and mouth, blue tongue, terrorist attacks and a world wide recession, in which he led Europe and America in the right stimulus directions and still the blood thirsty mob call for more.
The do nothing tory party offer zero in terms of policies, why would people vote for a nothing party?.
You just don't get it do you.
People have voted to tell Brown and his party they want no more of his failed policies.
He has led us to record taxes, record numbers on benefit, record national & personal debt, destroyed pensions, sold gold reserves at a fraction of it's value costing the taxpayer approx £3 billion.
signed us up to the Lisbon treaty after promising a referendum.
Promised an end to boom and bust.
Human rights protecting child molesters and killers, prisoners being released early, or being freed when they should not have done.
MOD projects costing billions of pounds with nothing to show for it.
An illegal war in Iraq.
No one wants anymore of this incompetance,
Derek, get it through your head that Nu Labour are finished, these MP's have destroyed the country & the Labour party as no other Labour MP's have managed to do in history.
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"At 7:47pm on 05 Jun 2009,jolo13 wrote: he actually lied at the press conference when he was asked if it was his intention to move Alistair Darling...he said he never intended to change the chancellor...everyone in the room knew he was lying"
That Brown lied was exactly my reaction. The reporter who asked was adamant that Brown's aides had been briefing that Darling was to be replaced (and no other reporter corrected him) and yet Brown denied it, twice.
Plus he also lied, to my understanding though please correct if I am wrong, when another reporter challenged him about cuts from 2011 onwards. Brown angrily stated that spending would continue to rise, denying that there would be cuts, and yet also not saying how the UK could possibly afford constantly increasing spending.
Would the journalists PLEASE nail him on these lies so he can be impeached (or the British equivalent).
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#10 derekbarker
Derek you really are into fantasies. Not long ago you were predicting a 5% lead by NuLabour over the Tories.
Time for a reality check Derek, the polls today were the real McCoy, not those predictions by the pollsters. I can wait for the result of the follow up on Sunday/Monday.
By the way your quote - The do nothing tory party offer zero in terms of policies, why would people vote for a nothing party?
Today people have been doing just that, voting for the Tories, indeed voting for anyone but NuLabour.
Even the County I live in, Lancashire, once Labours heartlands have said a big no to Duff Gordon.
Roll_On_2010 12 Months to go.
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Brown will survive this - the question is, will the rest of us? His press conference was a good example of the old politics - prepare the answers beforehand and stick to them regardless of the questions and, further, decide what the public want without having asked them. So we get a new raft of policies and priorities that he has decided we want. Just like he decided we need a foreign company to help us run the post office, (I'm all in favour of Europe but I think there are a few things we can do ourselves), that we wanted billions spent on identity cards, that we wanted to abolish student grants, that we wanted to invade Iraq and fight in Afghanistan... the list is endless. I wonder if Labour understand what democracy really means any more? (And it's not the unelected Alan Sugar helping to run the government.) Perhaps Gordon could set up a committee to look into it?
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Why no mention of the European election results? Not even a link to follow on BBC website. Have I missed something ? Are they not out until whole of Europe has voted or something ?
Did we go to all that effort yesterday for nothing ?
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Can't remember if it was on your side, though, somebody compared GB to the Terminator, before. I'd rather suggest a Palpatinian tendency. It might need a father & son double-team to take this one down. I wonder what's happened to old Obi-Wan?
You don't need to see his identification.
Move along. ;-)
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Why doesn't someone put some facts to Mr Brown or his cabinet ministers such as he took over as chancellor when Britain had a secure financial future and over 10 years he has been less than prudent in his management of our finances and brought us into the current recession. Yes there is a global recession but we should have been able to avoid the worst of it if he had been prudent.
In the two years since he has been Prime Minister he has made a complete and utter mess of everything has has been involved in. If he had been in business he would have been moved or dismissed for his dismal failures. Surely the evidence points to someone who is incapable of doing his job and should resign and allow someone else to clear up his mess.
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The spectacle of a Labour government ennobling people so Crash Gordon can put together a government just sums up the inadequacy of our electoral system and is simply a disgrace. Gordon can't even find enough elected MPs of adequate calibre to be ministers to run his government. The whole of politics is too concerned about only having people stand that will do the party's bidding, not that will be any good, and as a result there is not enough people who are up to the job. We must have open primaries, not just candidates who are the mates of party insiders.
The County Council and EU elections are a joke. 37% turnout is not an adequate mandate to Govern and spend all our money. Who are these people anyway when 2 out of 3 people can't be bothered to vote for them. There is too much Government meddling in our lives.
Gordon and his failed government have to go. The electoral system has to be reformed before the next election with all candidates reselected from open primaries. We must have candidates from all walks of life and of genuine excellence, not the career politicians and lawyers foist on us at the moment who will simply be lobby fodder for the parties. There can be no credible Government with things as they are with the MPs that we get at the moment.
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Tonight, apart from Bristol, the electoral map is all blue........
Just imagine how devastating Labour's defeat would have been if the BBC actually tackled government ministers when they peddled obvious lies or spouted the usual misinformation!!!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/bsp/hi/elections/local_council/09/map/html/map.stm
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Nick
If one of those programmes were made about great British Prime Ministers Gordon Brown would be in the relegation zone. I also have to say that the press treatment of Brown this afternoon was so week it was an embarrassment. Lets hope the parliamentary correspondents dont have a football team since it would be incapable of scoring a goal. This scrutiny is vital since in this corrupted parliamentary system voters are effectively disempowered as we wait to see whether the Parliamentary Labour Party will ever get some backbone. As such well done Sherman, Flynn and Raynsford.
The arrogance of Brown knows no bounds. He informs us the electorate want him to stay in power to sort out an economy which his government has wrecked and reform a political system which new labour has dragged into the cesspit. This on the day when Labour scores its lowest vote since god knows when and will face another drubbing on Sunday. The people have spoken and yet he understands better than we know ourselves. His misogyny has been laid bare and that blazing hypocrite Harman still clings to the wreckage. Things are so desperate he has even brought a Kinnock back and placed her in the Lords which of course he promised to reform last week! It is patronising and breathtaking arrogance which led me after 40 years as a labour supporter to vote Green yesterday for the Euro elections. I will never vote labour as long as Brown is leader. A clear message has gone to all Labour MPs either get rid of Brown or face the ruination of the Labour Party
Where are the new listening politics that he spoke about last week and all the empty rhetoric about putting voters at the heart of the political system? The answer is 3 new talking shops - the National Democracy Council being the hollow joke of them all. We have in Labour a party that is little more than a self serving clique hanging on to power for grim death because they have nowhere else to go. They talk of saving the economy yet they are completely distracted and have in any case ruined the public finances for the next decade. They talk of saving the economy yet they are completely distracted and have in any case ruined the public finances for the next decade resulting in huge cuts to services and tax rises. Will someone please start a petition on Number 10's website for an immediate election we need to put an end to this debacle which brings shame upon our country and which demands a deep and lasting cleansing.
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So the PM tells us in his press conference what we the ordinary people are concerned about. I don't know how he knows what I think, I haven't had a Labour politician canvesss me for several General Elections. Stop telling me what I think, and let me tell you what I do think in General election.
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There seems to be some confusion about Lord Mandelson's title: "First Secretary of State".
Any cryptic crossword enthusiast will recognise that the answer is "S.O.S."
Hope that helps.
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well he's clinging on, isn't he? - guess that's what people in power tend to do - it's up to the PLP whether they bring him down or not, not so sure they will - the problem is this assumption that a new leader would HAVE to be followed immediately by a General Election (don't see why, myself, but that seems to be the view) because that essentially means that Brown out equals electoral thrashing within weeks - better, surely, to hang on in there and hope that time works its magic - if, in a year, the economy is picking up (a big if, I know, but it's possible) and the tories are still devoid of positive ideas, then you never know, hung parliament maybe - at the very least, the defeat may not be as bad as it would be right now - course, the risk is that things get even worse but that's a risk worth taking, I'd have thought
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Today's 'reshuffle' has dominated the news and overshadowed the Local Election results.
What can Brown have in mind for Monday to overshadow the Euro election results?
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Is there no one who can ask for him to be examined by a Psychiatrist? I fear he needs it
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Sir Alan Sugar (sorry Lord Sugar) speaking on TV tonight about one of his apprentices: "Trouble is he really really believes he is better than what he actually is. He has to go".
This phrase could so easily be applied to his big political hero. Priceless!!
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The man, who has decided all by himself to tackle constitutional reform, is now the very same man who has brought on board to his Cabinet, seven unelected Ministers.
Not one of these Ministers will be held to account in the House of Commons so how do the elected representatives of the people, our MPs go about their business as the legislature? They won't.
Brown who has constantly criticised Mugabe is beginning to look like his nemesis.
Zim-Invader? Perhaps you can provide some insider knowledge your end.
With so many Labour Ministers leaving the Cabinet today and the past week, they have a duty to themselves, their party and their country to mobilise the others who are disenchanted in thier ranks to rebel and force a GE.
I appreciate I should have listed their priorities in reverse order but I know how they all think and work.
Which is all the more ironic when one thinks that our despicable PM will attend the D-Day celebrations tomorrow and stand side by side with those who will remember their dead comrades who gave the ultimate sacrifice, who put their country above their party above themselves.
Gordon Brown and his cohorts are not fit to stand in their presence and should be ashamed as I shall be when I see the grinning fool pandering for a photo call with Obama which is the only reason he is going.
Nick, despite what you are reporting about the turnout in todays council elections, which by the way is something rather unique to the BBC compared to your rivals, the Labour Party has been crushed. If they achieve a loss of between 250 and 300 seats, it will count as a disaster or meltdown.
Coupled with Sundays results in Europe where Labour are expected to finish fourth, this too will be a double disaster.
Come Monday when GB will face the PLP in the H of C, I really cannot believe that Byers, Milner, Farelly, Gibson, Flint, Purnell, Blears et al will just sit there and accept that many of them have been replaced by unelected representatives.
Then come Wednesday and that tabled motion of no confidence in the government.
If Crash still does not take the hint, he will lead the Labour Party into history.
And finally, you could tell from the Press conference this afternoon that not one journalist, you included Nick (a good question by the way), was satisfied with one answer they received.
It was a poor performance by the PM, nothing out of the ordinary, but something the country has come to expect much to our shame.
Gordon is dead!
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I am both cynical and disappointed, bringing Mrs Kinnock and Hain back is only to shore up the Welsh vote. Brown has used his Scottish mafia to ensure popularity in Scotland and now Wales. He knows England is against him I wish he could do something for the English that would not make us feel marginalised
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#18
The Amstrad Cabinet. (Q? It's Alan the peer!)
Nearly as exquisite as Ms. Flint's slow-motion (or was that faster-than-light?) overnight undressing in the national window in the living room.
Hm. Mandy's not following orders, then...
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The result of the the votes from yesterday 4/06/2009 overwhelmingly indicate the nations choice. BUT it was the nation that voted labour into power through their lies over Europe and how we all have reaped their ill wind.
I am extremely concerned that this kamikaze makeshift labour government are going to make their mark in government before they leave or get kicked out by joining the euro or signing up to the Lisbon treaty. Now that Gordon Brown has the dark lord as Secretary of State as his 2nd in command, anything can happen and we don't have Gandalf Cameron with his magical staff at the ready to do justice.
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You ask at what price Gordon has survived Nick. Obviously not his sanity, so it must be another £100 billion or so in the run up to the GE....!
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52 zootmac.
You forgot to say who the Flint replacement is. Glennys Kinnock. Unelected yes, another one, but she dont suffer fools gladly and there is no doubt that SHE is female.
Does GB know what he is doing? Naw dont answer that.
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#1. oldrightie
These momentous happenings will see Brown gone. I am disappointed because his remaining would totally destroy The Socialist movement and Labour in The UK.
Oh please, my sides are splitting.
NuLabour are no more Socialist than the Tories, & if you think any differently you are in for a big shock.
Here are some examples to help.
1. Taxation. Labour continued to shift taxation onto indirect taxes to favour the wealthier & Brown removed the 10% Tax band put in place to help the less well off. Ozzy refuses to be drawn into the removal of the new 50% Tax band if the Tories get in power.
2. Education. Labour continues with the program of academies & opting out of local control. Cameron broadly supports this principle.
3. Privatisation. Labour plans to part privatise the Post Office, probably with a view to total privatisation if all goes well. Cameron supports this.
4. Transport. Policy remaines the same as before. No changes there.
5. The Tories started to deregulate the Banking systems & Labour continued to throw petrol on the fire. Both parties, until recently, supported less regulation.
6. Unions. Tony Blair did a very good job of shifting financial dependency from the Unions onto big business & thus diluting whatever powers the unions had. Many Tory donors jump sides. I wonder why?
7. PFI. A method of getting our grand children to pay for public building projects. Brought in by the Tories & continued in earnest by Labour.
8. Trident. Labour decides to go all nuclear on us & Cameron helps clinch the vote.
9. The Tories support the idea of a National Health Service & childrens schooling free at the point of delivery. Sorry, but these are socialist ideas. Failure to support these 2 things would result in as big a destruction of the Tories as we will give Brown next year.
We could split hairs all day long & the above list is not exhausted, but the basic principles of the last Tory government continue to this day & will continue under Cameron.
Heres hoping Cameron can cut some of the excess wastage, duff projects & non-jobs that Brown seems to have produced if he gets in power, but I wont be holding my breath.
Im afraid the days of flat caps, pits & pigeons for Labour have gone long ago dear fellow.
Now they have their ranks full of old school chums that use Westminster to fill their own pockets.
Now thats another similarity to add to the list.
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Twas on a bleak all hallows eve that the Gorbro left his lair.
With sulphurous breath, clacking jowls, lank and licey hair.
A sickening sob, a retched roar, ripped the solemn silence.
Confronted, Gorbro stood his ground as the Mandle wreaked his violence.
They locked their limbs and gnashed their teeth but neither gave up ground.
Finally the monstrous Mandle sobbed and cowered, a cringing hound.
Smirking and slavering, the Mandle knew the Gorbro would meet his end.
From the inky black moonless night, Mandles Ministers began to rend.
Tearing the Gorbro limb from limb Mandles ministers leaped and lurched.
When silence soothed the savage sight on Gorbros head the Mandle perched.
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"survival at what price" - you aren't kidding Nick; once the Tory's get in hopefully they'll sort your biased spin doctoring out.
ps... this is very funny: http://blogs.news.sky.com/editorsblog/Post:25817666-2eed-4343-a85d-082d0716fc71
Got your mark!
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The ( so far) survival of a PM and the steady erosion of democracy! Does anyone know when was the last time ( excluding the war) when there were so many non elected ministers of all ranks?
When we link the number of executive appointees to the number of quangoes with executive powers over our lives, which we also have no significant influence on appointing it appears Britain is edging ever closer to a typical banana republic dictatorship. I can't help thinking that Brown must have picked up quite a few useful tips on his African tour a few years ago.
I have thought for a long time that we have government versus the people rather than governance on behalf of the people but never thought to see government versus it's own rank and file MP's. It really gets more like Zimbabwe than we really want to admit. We've even had the police brutalising ( some might put it rather stronger given the death we are still waiting to have explained ) legitimate protest.
Its not made any better by having a leader of the opposition who clearly doesn't believe in fair and balanced representation of the will of the people in parliament. He obviously feels that what could to all intents and purposes become a one party state solution with no meaningful opposition is just what he needs.
I know people have their concerns about alternative voting systems but they haven't been a disaster in most of the world ( well certainly no worse than we have at the moment)and many have fared much better. Also don't assume that voting patterns or the political stance of parties will remain the same under a different voting system. The voting system creates our adversarial "tribal" approach whereas a coalition might well force openess and discussion. For example I wonder if Bliar could have taken us into Iraq if say four or five Lib Dems had been in his cabinet by right of electoral mandate? He couldn't have threatened them or silenced them if they had insisted on seeing the information Bliar clearly withheld from the vast majority of the cabinet let alone parliament and the people.
Some effective way of putting a brake on the almost despotic powers enjoyed by the PM ( of whatever party) and to make the executive truly open and accountable has to be found if we are to claim weare meaningfully a democracy.
For me the best outcome of the next election is a hung parliament to force the politicos out of their tribal bunkers and into a collaborative and consensual approach to governance.
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Informed sources claim Mugabe feels completely upstaged and is calling for UK to be thrown out of Commonwealth for being undemocratic.
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#47
"Gordon Brown is showing remarkable courage in face of unprecedented difficulties. There will always be the nervous nellies and Corp. Joneses (Dad's Army) in any group and it is good that Brown has got rid of these."
Funny you say that, I my self thought about the similarities between the current government and Dad's Army, couldn't help feeling that Gordon Brown is comparable to a certain bumbling Captain George Mainwaring - never quite grasps the plot, muddles through with the help of his under-studies but always claims the praise non the less, is always ready to blame those (especially those much younger than himself) who he should be leading and thus never takes the blame himself...
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#56 good post, but why waste good whisky?
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I am tired of being over-influenced by people with vested interests none of which seem to be focused on us ,the electorate, or the ecenomic challenges we all face.
So the BBC want drama and crisis, the corrupt MP's want the spotlight taken away so they can carry on "as normal", party politics with all it's hype and exaggeration carries on as boringly normal.
If you look carefully there seems to be some glimmers of economic hope, wouldn't it be nice if everyone could pull together to get us out of this mess, the best teams are the ones where people build on each others ideas, not when they destroy each other.
For a start lets weed out the corruption and downsize MP's to say 50% of current size based on people with proven "non-sleaze" credentials, from what has been published that would be easy to do, and do it now, not when the the MP's get to grab even more of our money by hanging on until the clamour reaches a crescendo.
It would also be good to have "dedicated" MP's I guess if they were all fulltime half of the current crew would deliver the same output. If I worked part-time I wouldn't get a fulltime salary !
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I'd be interested to see how long it's been since we had so many unelected members of a cabinet in government.
I wonder if it might even be "unconstitutional"?
It's at least arrogant, something our beloved leader isn't by his own admission.
At most it's dictatorial.
Quite scary.
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I can't see this being allowed by the mods, but the pic of (well, including) Nick on the sky news blog is priceless: http://blogs.news.sky.com/editorsblog/Post:25817666-2eed-4343-a85d-082d0716fc71
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Nick, I am wondering why you won't report the truth to the people who pay your wages.
Yesterday the Today programme asked you who was orchestrating the Labour rebellion and you answered "We do know, I am not entirely sure I am going to tell you on the Today programme"
What are you a reporter or a No 10 Apparatchik?
You represent everything that is wrong with the cosy Journo-Parliament relationship. You knew about Mps expenses before they were made public but stayed silent.
I ask again, who do you serve?
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I think this whole multi-layered fiasco will now inevitably get to a point where the monarch is compelled to intervene to represent the wishes of the People, which Labour have wilfully denied, and prepare the way for an immediate General Election.
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The more astute jounalists and political commentators who really are impartial understood today that the Tories did to Labour in the coundil elections what Labour did to the Tories prior to the 1997 GE.
They went after the opposition heartlands instead of staying in the shires and trying to increase the vote and turnout where thay would have won anyway.
Hence the lower turnout in council elections but at the same a crushing defeat for Labour.
Sadly these observations were either ignored or missed by those publicly employed servants who are the BBC.
Shame on you.
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What I have noticed these past few days and on this blog is that most traditional Labour Party supporters are more enraged about Brown than the Tories.
How come I can see it but he can't?
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What a shambles! We really are the worst governed people in the first world. What we need is a CONSTITUTION in which legislature is fully distinct from government. At present we have a single house controlled by a whipped party majority where corruption has to flourish because government controls the legislature. And that wholly undemocratic bit about the royal prerogative. Hopeless.
UK plc is losing a real 'stress test' just when cool and objective ie non-ideological leadership is needed.
I despair.
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Gordon is the 'I' of the storm.
Only when he is gone will calm be restored.
Which would be good for Labour and tricky for the Tories.
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I'm not a Labour supporter but I really do think that Gordon Brown ought to stay.
Firstly, there's no point having an election and new parliament until we know exactly which of our MPs have abused taxpayers' money. This needs to be done properly and not just by the Daily Telegraph. Otherwise we might get a situation whereby an MP is re-elected, only to be accused of wrongdoing by the star chamber after the election. This mustn't happen.
Secondly, we ought to usher through constitutional reform and a reformed expenses system during the PM's last year so that the new government can get on with governing after the election. In my opinion, it would be far better to use 2009 as a year of reform than to have the Tories elected now while all the systems and procedures of Westminster still stink. We want a fresh and squeaky-clean new parliament!
Finally, in Gordon Brown's defence, the economy really seems to be turning now and the first signs of recovery are evident. Perhaps in six month's time, when the electorate are a little less enraged, we will be able to assess fairly Gordon Brown's handling of this recession, which may have been better than a lot of people give him credit for.
I say all this without actually being a supporter of Labour.
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Ref #63
Gordon has started down the path to the dark side and forever will it dominate his destiny.
Never underestimate the power of the Farce.
More ministers turning away from him will bring balance to the Farce.
Remember the Farce is with you .... always.
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At what price - the promotion of 'spin' & the bringing in of more 'celebrity' to bolster votes - and all unelected too ...
Democracy - what democracy ... ?
We need 21st century leadership and management - and 21st democracy now ... !
Gordon Brown has shown 'what' he values, and the 'values' he upholds - and his remaining cabinet colleagues have too. Poweromics* is being desperately applied to stop the 'mutiny' by the 'officers', but they haven't asked the 'crew' what they think yet ... or anyone else !
We want 21st century democracy now - nothing else will do, as nothing else will work!
David Clift, a Future 500 Leader
* Poweromics = People using position and power for their own personal gain, based on poor moral values, self interest and greed. Take a look at http://poweromics.blogspot.com for more examples.
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Gordon: There are negotiations being made that are going to answer all of your questions and solve all of your problems. That's all I can tell you right now. Kinnock, you grew up in Nevada. When we make our move there you're going to be my right hand man. Harriet is no longer Consigliari. He's going to be our lawyer in Vegas. That's no reflection on Tom it's just the way I want it. Besides, if I ever need help who's a better Consigliari than my father. That's it.
[Everyone except Jacqui leaves]
Jaqui Smith: Gordon, why am I out?
Gordon: You're not a wartime Consigliari, jaqui. Things could get rough with the move we're making.
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@45 potter
i think you will find that people can think for themselves, and as the local election and highly probable the EU election have/will show, people overwhelmingly have opted for the conservatives, so i think you will find that the sun will follow public opinion rather than people following the sun.
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In the move to the middle ground Labour gave so much away that it became, (tellingly) labelled The New Labour project, an entity dedicated only to being re-elected---if core beliefs got in the way of this single directive they were ditched.
Then hollowed out as an idealogical vehicle it proceeded to extend the command-control-neutralise tactics to Parliament, basically rendered completely irrelevant, so that a war was started almost as an after dinner chat among mates on a sofa, without a minute or a proper record at all ---- now it reaches toward an ever more farcical and even pathetic demise with a 'Labour' Prime minister forced to create Lords and Ladies to fill the chairs on the photo-shoot.
In the rush to the middle ground it abandoned it's core voters and now the 'middle ground' has abandoned it, there is no real core left to fall back to.
It's a little bit like former Communist regime in Roumania---one minute it was there, implacable and unshakeable and within days the entire thing simply collapsed from within because no-one could summon any belief in it any more.
Not that there's real comfort for the Conservatives or even the Liberal Dems......
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@yazbod
Interesting to see how many of Gordon Brown's new 'cabinet' are non-elected.
I think it might be a good idea if the entire Cabinet was unelected. Obviously the idea would be need a lot of work, but I think many issues re Parliament could be resolved.
* Elected PM gets to appoint a Cabinet (with greater mandate)
* Parliament would be elected to scrutinise the Government and actually provide real accountability rather than being so 'whippable' and having so many Government Minister's "scrutinising" their own policy
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Good headline.
He's put everything in place to end the recession. It's not working yet so we all have to wait and wait and wait.
Twelve months later we will still wait. Too late he's off and the country's bust.
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Gordon is going to bring the house down. And labour with it. Hes wanted the hot seat for years and years bemoaning TB. Hope its hot enough for you now. The vast majority of the electorate dont want YOU Mr Brown, not even Labour wants you. You truly believe you can govern, show leadership and political expertise to get through the next year.this is called DELUSION by everyone watching you.
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Well, if all of Westminster and his dog has no vision for the future - here's mine.
(Well, for the future 72 hours anyway)
Saturday - day off. (Maybe get some quotes from Pickfords)
Sunday - The Duty Labour Minister will be wheeled out early to face a "savaging" from Andrew Marr and spout the Government mantra "right man for the job.......economic stability......the people want us to carry on...he won't walk away"
Monday - what comes first? Mr Broons last ditch effort of survival by introducing "sweeping changes to Parliamentary Procedure" or the Labour Backbenchers, (which now include 7, 8, 9 oh I've lost count) former Ministers of State, coming out en-mass with daggers drawn. My moneys on the daggers. He'll be gone before its time for tea on Monday.
And a final thought.....
If Mr Broon does resign, is he eligible to stand for the vacant Speakers position coming up in 2 weeks time? He could stand at the next election, UNOPPOSED and still cling on to some power! "Who will rid me of this terrible Minister?"
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In reply to comments made @ #90
[re journalists sources]
A successful investigative journalist is somewhat comparable to a successful police detective, you would not expect a police detective to divulge who his or her 'grasses' are, why do you expect journalists to?...
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The World economy is still trying to recover from its greatest peacetime disturbance in my lifetime.
I'm no fan of Our Premier, however, he was and is in charge of our Land whilst this is occurring.
Political rats are deserting the sinking ship or firing their torpedoes at it but the economic disturbance is not local to Little Britain, and, despite the whiffs of corruption emanating from the responsible representatives of our land, someone has to keep the helm through this storm.
The electorate has now 'spoken' and the result will be interesting but have no immediate effect.
The Ship cannot have an absence of helmsman during the Storm.
The immediate phrase has been uttered before: "Its the economy, Stupid".
N.
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I wonder if anyone in the No. 10 circle ever reads these comments. If they did, they might not be so arrogant as to insist over and over 'ad nauseum Harman' that they know what we think. The chaos of the infighting today, that painful-to-watch press conference, plus the arrogance of the man who insists he is not arrogant. Caroline Flint - what a volte face! Hell hath no fury like a woman with an ego that is so much bigger than her talent. All those unelected cabinet ministers, Lady Kinnock and the entire 6 billion pounds worth of university sector shoved quietly into Mandleson's 'business' portfolio... how did we come to this?
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Sunday's Euro results decide it. The Monday evening meeting, of the PLP, has the ability to finish GB off. GB will be making a completely open show of logical failure, if he doesn't respect their collective will. GB is then forced to deactivate by Tuesday morning. Else, to the doctor for another quiet chat - but not about Celtic!
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#91
"I think this whole multi-layered fiasco will now inevitably get to a point where the monarch is compelled to intervene to represent the wishes of the People, which Labour have wilfully denied, and prepare the way for an immediate General Election."
How ever bad it gets, short of riots and the army on the streets, I do hope not, if the Monarch ever did take such a step - something that has not happened since the 1600s. The effects on our democratic rights could be quite profound, be careful of what you wish for when rocking the boat, how ever bad it is in the boat it's always a lot worse out of it...
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The PMs News Conference today.
Nick, why did only one , unknown, reporter have the balls to start shouting at GB for lying.
What has happened to the Press Corps , or should it be Corpse ? Are you all so afraid of not being invited back? If so GB has the same hold over you as the spineless MPs who will not reject him.
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#93
"Labour Party supporters are more enraged about Brown than the Tories.
How come I can see it but he can't?"
For the same reason Hitler demanded that Germany fought on, even though Russian troops were in the eastern suburbs of Berlin, once you're in that political bunker (be that actual or metaphorically) it's very difficult to actually hear anything other than what you or your advisers think you want to hear...
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When will New Labour ministers stop saying that they know what the public want to hear (clean up Parliament, get through the recession etc) and listen to what the people are saying....
RESIGN AND GET OUT NOW
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I simply do not understand.
We have a Parliament filled with numerous MPs, from all parties, readily claiming as many expenses as they can, for which we pay for.
Yet people vote for the Cons.
If a general election happens soon it will be more of the same as before.
Are people bonkers?
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#103 balhamu
I wouldn't disagree with you that England would be better served by such a system. Of course, you guys have to give up your medieval idea of "Parliamentary Sovereignty" and actually become citizens who are responsible for your constitution!
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The BBC coverage of local results kept harping on about "share of the vote % ". Could anyone please bring to their attention that this country has a "first past the post" system - as long as a candidate has more votes than their opponent they are the WINNER.
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Now that I think of it, does the four year review of MPs' expenses include MR. Blair?
N.
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The only way PM Brown will go is if one of the senior cabinet resigns after the Euro election results, and publicly criticises GB.
If that doesn't happen, then we will all have to sit and wait to get our chance to vote at the next General Election.
Replacing GB isn't the problem. It's a new Government we want, but with new faces and MPs with moral backbone.
And it is up to us to vote for those MPs that we can place our trust in.
Sadly, us voters are often lied to, to get our vote. What we really need is a new form of Parliament, with far more accountability. An upper house whose members are appointed by an independent body with the simple rule - if you've served in the lower house you cannot serve in the upper. No party politics in the upper house, and all votes in both houses are votes of conscience - true representation.
Pigs might fly?
Only if we all continue to vote for the same old faces.
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How many of us would wish to stay in our job if we knew that the majority of our customers (electorate) and most of our senior work colleagues (cabinet) despised us and wanted us to go? I think most 'normal' people would fall on their sword, if only to sleep at night! It would appear GB isn't 'normal'! 'Nuff said?
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Mr Robinson - why do you insist on presenting your opinions as fact ?
You cannot possibly know whether Gordon Brown wanted to move Alastair Darling or whether he simply considered it. Your sources can only be hearsay .
Please remember your function is to report the news .
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Ref #74
Having retrieved the DNA samples from our last Brown Probing, it appears that the DNA results have been blocked by the official secrets act ... see #112.
Even those of Gordon's Teddy Twinkle have been held back for national security reasons.
The truth is out there...
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96. At 9:41pm on 05 Jun 2009, superchris_liverpool
I can not agree more with you
As my biggest fear is that we have an election or change of PM before the expenses and allowances are sorted the hole thing is just buried in a new Parliament
It was the TORIES that give us the present system in the 80's so MP's did not get as big pay raise this was so they could avoid income tax as expenses and allowances are tax free
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#103 Balhamu
"I think it might be a good idea if the entire Cabinet was unelected. Obviously the idea would be need a lot of work, but I think many issues re Parliament could be resolved".
==========
This is how it works in the States where there is a written constitution.
To introduce it here withour precedent for no other reason than self-preservation is an affront to us all, particularly as this same clown has appointed himself with a majority of one to alter the political system.
Long live Zimbabwe! Long live North Korea! Long live Britain!
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Well, it's hard to know where to begin, to deconstruct this farce. Is Gordon a misogynist, a bully, a phony or what? He grimaces like a chimp and talks _at_ us like a broken gramophone. Does this make him insane? He clearly isn't a democrat, since he promotes unelected flunkies in the most breath taking acts of patronage one could imagine. He clearly isn't a leader, since it's hard to think of anyone in (or now out of) the cabinet who respects him. I can't believe he can't see how humiliating this is for the country. Maybe we'll all wake up tomorrow to find it's all been a bad dream.
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Glad you are still at the helm Gordon,please can you keep the tories out right to the last moment,i have not forgotten what a rotten lot they are.Thankyou and Tony for the massive improvements in schools and hospitals and for recognising the talent of Lord Mandelson.I salute you.
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So we have an unelected Prime Minister with a deputy who is also unelected. And the deputy, when he was a mere MP and elected was not once, but twice put out of the government for malpractice...
So much for our 'democracy' we're more like a banana republic.
We need a general election NOW.
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I can't imagine it
We was wild in the hood we used to thug in the streets
I can't imagine my old cabinet crew without me
We used to run from the police hang with the OG's
You got caught and told people you didn't know me
You kept your silence and I love you for that
We started hustling (you gave me my first gun)
They said you went fishing I should have been with you
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"Peter Mandelson has a new title first secretary of state and a new role to match the reality that he is in effect Gordon Brown's deputy."
This means it is more likely more of Royal Maill will be sold off, and Tata will be given some UK taxpayer money.
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God the BBC disgust me. Still trying to peddle this as a good day for Labour?!!! Update the figures, you know, the ones that say Labour have only lost 250 seats when it's now over 350.
I know most of you lefty's aren't the full ticket, but that doesn't mean the rest of the coutry are too dim to see through your pathetic bias. Still, lol, think it will all change after the next GE, how long will all of the BBC Labour apologists like toenails last once Cameron is PM?!!!
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John Denham arguing that this was a bad night for the Tories on the ITV news - astonishing! Gordon Brown and his "complicated relationship with the truth" (Benedict Brogan) suggesting that he had never wanted to move Alistair Darling. Totally surreal.
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Pah !!!
Did anyone notice that Nick and yon sky news bloke were busy doing shorthand/notes rather than looking the PM in the eye ? (I'm sure their blackberry phones have a dictaphone nevermind all them cameras)
Why were you taking notes rather than looking Brown in the eye ?
Patronage ?
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Ahhh, what a shoer of diots we hve, im so cnfused by tdaias evnts im nt sure whooo is in the govermant and who isssnt. Did we vote fure thm?
ALL I KNW is tht things vcan onluy get better,
Kind rgrds
Gordon.
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Jeez! the masses gather, voting without knowledge of what their voting for? people talking without speaking?
Get a grip Great Britain, stop the mass hysteria and think before you vote a do nothing party like the tories.
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Well there it is Mr Robinson.
Gordo looks like he'll never ever go ... woh woh woh.
God help us all Mr Robinson
Gordo thinks the the voters are wanting him to stay .. hay hay hay.
Coo, coo, ca-choo, Mr Robinson
Jesus Knows why Gordo will not go (Wo, wo, wo)
God bless you please, Mr. Robinson
Heaven will make him go if the voters pray
(Hey, hey, hey...hey, hey, hey)
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Unless I'm mistaken, in the past, haven't we (UK) deployed armed forces in other countries to remove people from power who have defiantly ignored the wishes of their population and clung on to their postion until the bitter end in order to preserve their ego and lifestyle?
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How many of you have taken a look at what Early Day Motions the Conservatives have put forward in this Parliament.
if you have you will see that allot of them will hurt the working man or woman more than anyone else and most of there Early Day Motions will make it possible for the top 10% to walk away laughing all the way to the bank.
You only have to look Early Day Motions put forward by Conservatives to what there Government would do to us
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I am still waiting for the BBC to point out that the Tory vote was down 6% and was way below the Labour vote in 1996.
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Ref #133.
Being that close to Brown and Looking in the eye.
That has to be a very unpleasant experience.
Even for an Invader and a probe.
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derek barker @10
"GB has dealt with foot and mouth, blue tongue, terrorist attacks and a world wide recession, in which he led Europe and America in the right stimulus directions and still the blood thirsty mob call for more."
- sir, this is a wind up?
dealt with foot and mouth? which came from a government lab...
dealt with a worldwide recession? in the right stimulus directions?
explain please how exactly he can reduce the public borrowing deficit by more than £90 BILLION, yet not cut a single penny from any services (despite fiscal studies showing he will)?
sir, you seem to forget (conveniently?) that financial regulation was changed by one gordon brown in 1997, which took powers away from BofE who knew what they were doing, and gave it to a "new" third way FSA, who succeeded in doing precisely nothing!
"The do nothing tory party offer zero in terms of policies, why would people vote for a nothing party?"
- sir, does gordon brown need to wait for conservative policies to be released, before he invents his own version of them?
whatever happened to leadership? brown doesnt appear to have any
people voting for a nothing party? id suggest after todays election results, you are as misguided as your leader?
"As for the those who have resigned, well! talk about spitting the dummy if you cant get what you want, unbelievable"
- sir, its not just one or two ministers though, its 6 or 7 from a government made up of 22 ministers?
also it is not ministers in minor positions, it includes the communities secretary (the day before an election) the work and pensions minister, the home secretary, and the armed forces minister (when we are fighting in two countries!) - i seriously doubt your claims to be a case of spitting the dummy out for not getting what they want.
"Paaaaa, carry on GB I salute your will to do what's right"
- sir, each to their own i suppose, but do you really believe that brown's will is "to do whats right?"
i think his will is to cling to power as long as is possible!
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
1) Lot's of people on various TV channels have said that the problem with getting rid of Gordon Brown is just who from the Parliamentary Labour Party would:-
a) be perceived as capable of doing the job,
b) want to stand put his/herself up for the job and
c) want to take up the political 'poisoned chalice' that being a caretaker premier until the election would probably be and
d) run the risk of not succeeding in the attempt and going into political oblivion, or even worst being blamed for forcing a General Election.
2) I understand that the Prime Minister is usually an elected member of the House of Commons, but could technically be a member of the House of Lords.
3) What was that title that Mandy got? I wonder what the point of that 'promotion' was. Seemingly he's now, in effect, the Deputy Prime Minister.
Could that be the Labour 'inner circle' plan, then, if Gordon does get shafted by bankbenchers, Mandy takes over, one way or another? Now Mandy HAS got the experience and the political clout to do the job -unlike much of the competition.
So, could that have been the big "put up or shut up" used against potential Cabinet rebels? Is that why all these wonderfully 'loyal' cabinet members vowed allegiance to 'the best man for the job' in front of various TV cameras all day long? Perhaps there's no gain in anyone contesting the leadership, 'cos it's all sewn up anyhow, even before it happens!
If it happened that way, I wonder who Mandy would chose for Chancellor?
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It started with my intense hatred of Thatcher... and is ending with my intense hatred of Brown. The era of the neo-conservative (free-market anarchy combined with heavy-handed social authoritarianism) looks like it's coming to an end. Wish I could say it's been a fun ride, but it really, really hasn't - best years of my life gone (ages 5 to 35)! Even the look on Portillo's face wasn't worth the arrogant superiority of New Labour. New Labour and, thus, Thatcherism, is finally getting the kicking it deserves. Cameron will be a return to pre-Thatcher moderacy; not ideal, but a lot better than what we have now.
What's that strange feeling... is it... national pride? Welcome back Britain!
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#119 NixinKome
Did you not know Blair's expense records were shredded?
On a general note, if people think it will make any difference if the Cons got their way and we had a general election, they are deluded.
As for the media hype on Brown's demise, it simply detracts from the principal point; we have a dysfunctional Parliamentary system.
Voting for the Cons is a sick joke. Votes should not be casted for anyone until the whole Parliamentary system is reformed.
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#135 derekbarking
"Get a grip Great Britain, stop the mass hysteria and think before you vote a do nothing party like the tories".
==========
This argument is trite, puerile and tired.
If you were to be believed, GB would have gone to the polls yesterday.
The Tories are the Opposition; to do something would be undemocratic. To suggest to do something would mean Labour usurping their ideas and selling them as if they were their own as we have seen even during this economic crisis.
Your opinion of the public as being mass hysteria suggests a hint of arrogance or ignorance, possibly both, and puts you in the same shameful bunker as Herr Gordon during the last days before the fall.
I know your post is a wind up because it is symtomatic of a one-eyed die hard blinkered party apparatchik before the end comes.
But that day is getting closer.
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This is hilarious, people seeing good works from Gordon the incompentent. He has taken New Labour back towards the loony left of Arthur Scargill and other nation wreakers.
Broken our economy and still professing to spend our way out of trouble.
Made our hospitals less efficient than most of Europe with more processes and procedures and paperwork.
We have education standards that are laughed at by other European countries.
I delight in the pain these people are going to suffer for up to 12 months as we have had to put up with it for years as Labour tries to implement Orwell's 1984 because they know best. Yeah Right!
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@10,
god help us if you think he has done a good job; as someone who has direct experience of both FMD and BTV8, you are talking out of your proverbial. Brown and DEFRA are utterly clueless and if this incompetence is remotely representative, let the country move on. I also seem to remember that GB stole and lauded a number of toriy policies a couple of years ago, no wonder they keep their powder dry.
How can the UK public tolerate the possibility of unelected Mandy taking over in the event of GB falling. Unbelieveable.......
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103. At 9:56pm on 05 Jun 2009, balhamu wrote:
"I think it might be a good idea if the entire Cabinet was unelected. Obviously the idea would be need a lot of work, but I think many issues re Parliament could be resolved."
Aren't President Obama's 'cabinet' and advisors chosen and appointed by him, i.e. not elected by the people. But then the US President IS directly elected, unlike the UK Prime Minister.
So, if we get an elected Second Chamber and an elected Prime Minister, then surely the cabinet could be unelected. I think there are real questions as to the practice within the current processes of our Parliament. O.K. so no-one elected Alistair Darling as Chancellor, but at least some people voted him for him to be an MP.
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worldlian Re 116
I think the phrase "a Con trick" has a whole new meaning!
That is apart from our institutionally rigged electoral system
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Caroline Flints resignation Hahah!!!!!!!!!
I am not a Gordon Brown fan, but I could not belive the comments in CF's
letter of today,reference 'Female Window Dressing'. Hello!!! How she has the front to use this statement is beyond me, when a couple of weeks ago, she posed in a photo shoot in a national newspaper's colour
suppliment, and I do mean "posed" celebrity style.
I think this just proves what a "ME" person she really is.
No Party needs a person like this.!!!
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113. At 10:09pm on 05 Jun 2009, xTunbridge wrote:
"The PMs News Conference today....
...What has happened to the Press Corps , or should it be Corpse ? Are you all so afraid of not being invited back? If so GB has the same hold over you as the spineless MPs who will not reject him."
Nick, I was actually really surprised that not one journalist asked him if his proposed pre-recess parliamentary legislation changes would include having elected prime ministers, (or fixed-term parliaments, or an elected House of Lords/2nd Chamber).
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138. At 11:01pm on 05 Jun 2009, york1900 wrote
"How many of you have taken a look at what Early Day Motions the Conservatives have put forward in this Parliament. If you have you will see that allot of them will hurt the working....."
Allot? Well I hope that spelling is top of the agenda. If you have any evidence then please present it. There's nothing worse than spurious accusations.
And then look at the motions offered by our glorious leaders...
Yours and educarted,
Sumfing Wunderfall
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As an American, I can hardly tell Brits how to behave, especially politically, but it seems clear to me that it is past time for Mr. Brown to resign. Any clinging to power only demeans him personally, and Labor, and Britain, and the human race.
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You can't blame Gordon for trying to keep his j o b
- you would all do the same if it happened to you
(The cabinet reshuffle drama's are smokescreens
to hide the local and european election drama's)
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DEMO
C
R
A
C
Y
Welcome to 1984
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Of course GB has the moral high ground and external focus to carry Britain forward.
Young Cameron On Camera is just a novice act, over powered and silent on policies.
The tory do nothing party are trying to capture glory through the back door of the murky press.
There is simply no other politicians in Britain better equipped to deal with today's government than Gordon Brown.
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Oh, the arrogance of Brown: "I am the right man to lead the country" etc etc.
Do you know, those are the words of Robert Mugabe! How dare Brown think he can put his own aims and ambitions above those of the public?
How dare he! I am outraged, I really am.
What on earth is the man thinking of?
He can SEE plainly what the country wants and it will be hammered home by the results of the European elections on Sunday.
How can ANYBODY give him credibility now?
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How far is the media responsible for the hysteria that is surrounding Gordon Brown? I wonder if as individuals any feel they have massaged the truth for greatest effect?
Perhaps we could calm down for a few hours at least.
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
Almost the 6th of June D-Day remembrance tomorrow folks!
A time when people got behind their leader for the good of all Britain!
Just witness the voting of local councils? nothing short than mass hysteria.
What did they vote for? no-one seems to know exactly what the tories would do in office. The tories oppose the banking bail-outs? the tories oppose helping the car-manufacturers and job seekers? they oppose tax credit and want to help only the top 10% of earners and wealthy people in Britain?. The 6th of June indeed!
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I think it is unfortunate that people are putting all the blame on Brown, as if Labour Ministers and backbenchers have no share of the blame.
Brown is hanging on as he is a man with a mission. I have no doubt he sincerely believes in his cause and also believes that his policies can put things right.
Unfortunately, the Labour party doesn't understand they have run out of time. Their failed policies of 'Big Government', micro management, tax and waste have ended in tears as they always do under Labour.
Self-serving ministers who could have spoken out much earlier (eg on HIPs, ID cards, euro referendum, one-sided devolution etc) instead sat back and said nothing. Now, when the going gets tough, they creep out of the woodwork to condemn the leader as if they are without any blame themselves.
Forcing Gordon out of will make no difference now. As a party, Labour is condemned by its own track record.
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HoyHeHoHoy (Kate) Got it right.
No referendum on Europe, ID cards, hiding expenses, and please fill in the gaps of everything else that he promised.
Let's have Kate SHOUTING....
She's a Labour MP with guts.
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What we must NEVER now forget is that during the Downing Street afternoons News Briefing when Gordon Brown was reminded in a Question, that BEFORE it was announced that Alistair Daring was NOT being moved in the Re-shuffle so therefore would not be losing his Job, that also before Darlings position was reconfirmed BEFORE this News Briefing, ALL of Browns Aids were also BRIEFING ALL OF the Political News media in the common knowledge that Brown WAS going to move Darling and replace him with Ed Balls.
When challenged TWICE on this point Brown refused to except that any such statement was made by his Aids to the TV News media, ETC.
The point here is, if the Prime Minister can give a bare face LIE, TWICE knowing full well that he was lying Live On - Camera to the Nation and beyond, then how on Earth can anyone ever be expected to believe HIM
[ Brown ], when he saids anything in the future, and indeed further also how many lies has HE told us in the Past, for Labour will NEVER be able to clean up in everyday Politics when its Leader is telling LIES.
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#161 derekbarker
"D-Day ...for the good of all Britain!"
You have a weird view of history! D-Day was good for all Europe. The problem with the wartime system was the extent to which everything was centralised. You will know that Churchill wanted to force the transfer of women from Scotland and the North of England to staff the factories of the English Midlands. It was the influence and political power of the Socialist (not New Labour) SoS for Scotland, Tom Johnstone that prevented that.
You are no Socialist - not even old Labour - simply a lickspittle lackey of the Union.
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#165
Oldnat, can I remind the history teacher that Europe was under the rule of Hitler has his great Germanic march!.
Can I also remind the history teacher that his lack of dating leaves a gap in his history knowledge? Bannerman did send to the troops out to quell the workers and a certain young home secretary also ordered troops against the will of a work-force, however a believe that there is a time difference and a gap in your underestimated socialist understanding.
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What is it all coming to. The public is just becoming a consumer of junk reporting of politics. How easily we are influenced by gossip, rumour and a few politicans spitting the dummy.
If people want to leave the cabinent - good, I want a better calibre of politician who takes their responsibiity seriously.
I want political reporting to be about serious policy issues that deal with what matters in the real world.
Gordon Brown has made some mistakes but he is the best man for the job.
Let's get back to discuss politics based on values of right and wrong. The grass root labour party was built on looking after one and all irrespective of class, income or prospects. If you destroy the labour party the alternative government might not care about you or your kith and kin at all.
By the way please don't let rumour and gossip destoy the wonderful NHS, it is truely something to be proud of and continues to improve day by day. The credit crunch is going to be a difficult time and if we don't open our eyes, and see just how much good work is done by the NHS, the private sector will move in and start making a profit out of our hard earned money and poor health.
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This government simply has no credibility left.
To call today's activities a re-shuffle is stretching the term to its absolute limits - this really was the last scraping of very dregs of the the barrel.
The blame can't simply lie with the supreme leader - the simple fact is that this party has been tired of government for years. There are no new ideas and we are getting lumped with worse and worse quality individuals who should never have come any where near being in positions where they actually have responsibility for the proverbial booze up in a brewery, let alone our most essential needs and interests.
It shouldn't come as any surprise that these individuals yet again failed to find the courage to stand up to their leadership - they failed to do so over Iraq, they failed to so so when Blair went on too long and they have continued to fail to do so whilst Brown has proved to be the most inept Prime Minister in history. In fact they only time that they even looked like they might challenge their leadership was when Borwon - to his limited credit - actually suggested that their merciless abuse of the gravy train was somewhat unneccessary.
This is a governing party with neither ability, policy or morality. At least, for all their faults, the last tory government left us in some sense of order, a growing economy and a begrudging acknowledgement that John Major was an honest bloke.
Are we allowed to petition the Queen to use the royal prerogative? It can't be less democratic than what we have now...
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@ 96 superchris
"Finally, in Gordon Brown's defence, the economy really seems to be turning now and the first signs of recovery are evident. Perhaps in six month's time, when the electorate are a little less enraged, we will be able to assess fairly Gordon Brown's handling of this recession, which may have been better than a lot of people give him credit for.
I say all this without actually being a supporter of Labour"
it doesnt matter to my family and thousands of others, if the economy turns - its bound to turn positive, as it cannot fall much further - and suggesting we'll be able to "assess fairly gordon brown's handling of this recession" doesnt cut it, im assessing him now on what he has done for the past 12 years, and i dont like it one little bit!
i dont like schools closing because of lack of funding - i dont like the biggest budget deficit in my history and that of my parents which have robbed me of 3 years of my retirement and pension funds - i dont like a toothless FSA letting the financial system crash around us, brown brought it in back in 97 - i dont like all the extra taxes i have to pay every single day (even when i dont use anything or go out of the house everyday) - i despise his constant avoidance of members of the public and refusal to answer even a basic question, need i go on?
i loathe with a passion his ministers and himself, constantly spinning every event with fake figures, half of which, are events he brought on himself!
i say this with no malice intended and not as a supporter of the labour government, gordon brown is a complete carrot!
i dare say he is an amiable man who does not intentionally mess everything he touches up, but it cannot be disputed on any issue, that he hasnt the faintest idea what he is doing!
short of being dragged out of downing street by his ministers and beaten with a mouldy fish, in front of the news cameras, when will he take notice of the real world?
he doesnt take the slightest bit of notice of his own parliamentary party (how many more need to resign?), any forum, petition, public demonstration, pressure group, etc.
he just plods on making a complete hash of everything.
get him out now, get rid of his pathetic government, have an election and change things - it has to be better than another year of this freakshow!
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The PM lies on several occasions in a press conference and you say nothing in your report or in the BBC News. Why ever not?
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What a turn of heart for Caroline Flint!
Saying one day the PM is the right man to lead the country and the next whining that she is leaving since she is all but "window dressing".
Surely the cabinet does not need a person with so little integrity.
Fully agree with stephaniefc #167
The country needs its leaders to get back to work.
Enough of this nonsense about personal differences. Let the man do his job, this is not the right time to bicker, or call elections when there is so much to be fixed.
Any election now means Commons will virtually be in a standstill at this critical point in time.
And by the way, I am unhappy about Nick Robinson's reporting which seems to test the boundaries of BBC ethos of "not being biased"
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Alan Sugar!!!
Another meglomaniac in the cabinet!?
So what are the odds on Alan saying, "Gordon, you're fired!"?
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Seriously though...
Ol' GB thinks, "OK, economy tanking, need a businessman that everyone thinks is brilliant..."
Spin, or what?
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The defining moment for Gordon Brown was the failure not to chance the snap election when all the polls suggested he would win. The Labour government enters the same phase as John Major did in 97 the writing was on the wall but Major hung on...down to subjecting us to an excrutiatingly long election campaign. The refusal to offer (as promised) a vote on the Lisbon treaty wasn't too bright either.
As for the Conservatives well don't forget they were in exactly the same position in 1992 - 97 in power for so long treated the electorate as an inconvenience and thought they could do what they liked with impunity have they changed... well given that they were unceremoniously dumped out of office for sleaze in 97 they are mired in the expenses scandal as well and remember they supported the system as well and did nothing to try to change it, so has the leopard changed its spots...
On new Labour I had reservations in 97 when the BBC showed the Follet's attempting to open a bottle of champagne on their way to London for the election party, it seemed alien to me true I never expected a return to 79 but I never exppected what I got either. I left the Labour Party because of a number of issues What I perceived as the lies over surrounding Iraq (sorry Blair didn't mislead parliament did he?) then cash for questions cash for passports cash for peerages The Coronation of Gordon Brown and the inference of a back room deal with Blair over the handing on of the Prime Minister-ship
confirmed by the refusal to allow a vote on the Lisbon Treaty finally the expenses scandal which Brown seemed to handle ineptly.
I would be happy to see Gordon Brown go and the sooner the better and personally I hope it is the Euro results that finally nail him as the vote on the EU constitution a promise in the Manifesto was not honoured and showed me that there was a lack of bottle for making tough decisions and that is really where I started the post. In all the issues the government has been involved in from the phantom election to the issues of Iraq and the Lisbon treaty rather than being honest it seems to concoct some half brained story to get itself out of the mess the public can clearly see it is in.
Honesty is not simply a matter of not lying it is a matter of telling the truth and showing the whole picture as a half truth is a whole lie
If you don't believe me regarding the trait of dishonesty take a look at the interview today where the PM is confronted over the position of Alistair Darling. Blair told us we could trust him Brown told us we can trust him Cameron tells us we can trust him But Who can we trust!
I am Labour at heart but I am afraid the party will have to win that back and it won't happen under Gordon Brown
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#173
Beatsy! actually no, lord Digby Jones done the same type of job.
If Alan Sugar plays apart in Britain reducing it's employment numbers
will you still be so negative?.
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what has happened to democracy in this country - why aren't we on the streets now demanding to be heard, this is worse than Thatcher and I never thought I would ever think that!!!!
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"Peter Mandelson has a new title first secretary of state and a new role to match the reality that he is in effect Gordon Brown's deputy."
Are you sure it is that way round?
It seems that what authority Brown retains depends entirely on Mandelson's ability to hold together a core of Labour 'big beasts' during the last couple of days.
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Having read all the comments on here and the comments on HYS over the last few weeks I have come to the conclusion that the vast majority of people in the country are amazingly stupid and get the governments they deserve. Half the people making comments can't string a coherent sentence together and the vast majority can't spell. No wonder Top Hat Cameron is laughing up his frilly Old Eton shirt sleeve. As the Who sang "Don't get fooled again', but we the great uneducated British public do get fooled time and time again. We are fools, led by the noses by fools, always have been, always will be. Long live the Republic!!!
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#175
Sir Alan has *already* spent a productive lifetime reducing unemployment!
My "negativity" was directed at GB riding his coattails in order to be more "appealling" to a (certain) large segment of the electorate (IMO).
Sorry to offend.
(But I still ain't Sir Alan's number one fan...)
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...and anyway.
Lord Digby would have said "I'm sorry to have to inform you that your period of employment expires in this fiscal remuneration period".
Hah!
;-)
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Gordon Brown,
Lets not forget you are the architect of our countrys current situation, sure there is a world recession, but Britain or whats left of it, is somewhat deeper in it than others. Encouraging excessive lending on over inflated valuations - a house of cards sure to fall in the slightest breeze.
One could look to reserves but against the advice of your advisors (what point in having them) you sold 400 tons of gold at a rock bottom price years ago. What a fool, this cost the taxpayer two billion pounds
I keep asking myself, why? but by your own admission 'Im not good at maths' hardly a suitable requirement for the position of chancellor you held.
I could go on, but Im fed up with the rhetoric, the headline grabbing & the 300 million pound schemes that bring no real change, the apalling waste. All I can say is hold on as long as you can, because youre doing the Conservatives a big favour. But when change comes its going to take many, many years to clean up your mess.
I just hope yours is the last labour government we ever have to suffer.
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Why are the British public so stupid?
The conservatives have been far worse when it comes to the most recent expenses scandal, yet the few people within the Labour party who have been guilty have now all quit and everyone thinks it is because they are so principled.
We deserve everything we get. The tories will get in at the next election and no doubt continue getting there moats cleaned at the tax payers expense. Then they will rescind the 50% tax bracket so that we all pay more out of our wages in every month.
They cannot even promise to cut taxes now since a huge part of our tax burden goes on the colossal debt that the greedy city boys have racked up by gambling on useless US subprime mortgages.
Incidentally the whole subprime crisis cam about because if a US citizen finds themselves in a negative equity trap they can just hand back they keys and not owe a cent. We would have to hand back the keys and still owe the remainder so be declared bankrupt anyway.
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156
What the Barclay brothers(proprietors of the telegraph) should realise is that "Tommorow never Dies" is a work of fiction not an instructional video.
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No2 RogerACA
Have you noticed that the majority of parliamentarians are un-elected? It is reported that members of the House of Lords can claim up to £350.00 per day, not for doing anything, just for turning up. Do you think it is time for the Second House to be abolished? In view of the fact that there are still approximately one hundred members who qualify for membership due to accident of birth,and worse still nearly thirty Bishops, is the current time not a great opportunity to introduce a degree of real democratic renewal by removing all unelected, unaccountable, unrepresentative characters from playing any part in the governence of the UK.
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No20 & No128
My pal thinks that those who believe that in the UK we elect Prime Ministers are political lunatics.Do you agree?
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Why is the fact that Gordon Brown has no elected mandate as Prime Minister being brought into question?
That has never been the case in the entire history of British Democracy. Or perhaps a directly elected head of the executive would be preferable, where he can gradually accumulate more and more power until he betrays the country and has to resign in disgrace? Whatever its current problems, the modern British political system has never allowed the scandalous behaviour that caused Richard Nixon to scar American politics for a generation.
It makes little difference if members of the cabinet are unelected. Any decisions they make on new policies will ultimately have to be voted on in the House of Commons anyway. Cabinet members who have been elected as MP's do not have a mandate for their ministerial position either, to ask for one would break up the cohesive unit that the cabinet forms for most of its existence and effectively end its current influence on the Prime Minister.
Who in a sane state of mind would blame Gordon Brown for wanting to remain in power, the power he has been so obsessed with since his political career began? He had to watch from the sidelines as his arch-rival in the Labour Party led the country for ten largely successful years. It is for the Labour Party and its MP's to decide when his time has expired, taking into account public opinion.
Gordon Brown has no real options to salvage his reputation and legacy, the best outcome he can hope for from this Spring Revolt would be a stay of execution. He has no meaningful future in politics.
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Am I correct in thinking that Gordy, at the start of his Premiership (Ha!), started to ring random telephone numbers of UK Citizens to "see how they were and is there anything I can do for you?"
Anyone had a phone call lately?
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The abiding memory of the press conference for me will be the "I'm not arrogant" mantra repeated over and over by Golem Brown. A mantra followed by...
...but I'm the only person in the whole world who recognised the global nature of the economic crisis.
...but Barack Obama came all the way to London to learn from me how to deal with the economic crisis.
Yes, no arrogance there, I suppose, but an awful lof of delusion from our mumbling, stumbling, bumbling premier.
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As a foriegner living in this country since 2002, I think that Gorden Brown is better than Tony Blair and certainly less cunning than David Cameron.
Unfortunatly, the so called democracy in this country does not necessarily shared the views of common people. As an example, everyone in the community I live in decided not to vote in this election. Being North of England they still remember how the Thatcher and Conservative Party put them down. Yes, down and killed their livelihoods.
The problem is that the people who vote are influenced by media (including BBC) in a way that the media wants them to live their lives. That is really sad. People in the UK do not have their own lives or independant critical thinking, other than following media ...
The solution for headache is not to change the pillows, but to be responsible. What I see is that people are not ready to change their habits, practices and values. What they think is that having David Cameron will solve their problems. That is not... He is the male version of Thatcher, who will take your jobs, health care and educatoin. He will take many more... Can't trust him.
This is sad that the British people don't see the value of the excisting PM, who is not good at PR, but doing a good job.
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Well,what goes around comes around!Remember Neil Kinnock- that fiesty pre election quasi presidential speech in Sheffield - full of confidence, based on public support et al! Then,alas,a Major landslide defeat.Ousted from power from British politics... but soon jumps onto the Euro political gravy train, not long after, followed by his wife. It was not long before questions were asked about their collective expenses - in Euros of course!So it now seems as if an exponent of financial scams in Brussels is being parachuted in to support an ailing prime minister whose gravy browning has run thin.The last thing a Scotch on the rock needs at the moment is support from a suspect leak (leek)!!!
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The one thing that this whole rolling trainwreck has taught me is this: every single one of these foul parasites - Labour, Tory and Liberal all - are only in politics for what they can get for themselves. Not a one of them would be able to spell integrity without a focus group telling them whether doing so would be good for their self image and personal advancement.
I'm glad I voted BNP. At least with the British Nazi Party, the pretence is only token, like in professional "wrestling". They know what they're about, and so do we. Honestly, I'd rather have the Nazis in charge for a while rather than this herd of squealing squabbling pigs whose only concern is keeping their snout in the taxpayer funded trough.
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Posts 189 and 191 are a depressing reminder that there are still some who just really don't get it. This constant harking back to the Thatcher years are the reason we were landed with the deplorable Brown in the first place. Thank God these kinds of views are restricted to a small minority. Even those on his own side are beginning to come to terms with his unsuitability for the job he has coveted for so long. He can manage neither people or the country with any great success. As for registering a protest vote for the BNP words fail me.
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even Brown's own biographer announced on television yesterday that our unelected PM is a Stalinist and a Trotskyist ! Lord (as he likes to be called) Mandelson is unelected , Glenys Kinnock is unelected (soon to become a Baroness !) Lord Sugar is unelelected and is a sexist and a fascist..Brown will have the distinction of being the most hated PM this country has ever had. He has destroyed the economy and almost destroyed our political sytem, by surrounding himself with crooks and spinners. At least we only have one more year at the most.. (or will he alter the voting system to stay in power for ever like Mugabe)? God help us.
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Q: What's the difference between Gordon Brown and a Limpet
A: The Limpet's not really committed to staying where it is!
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Over the last 12 years Gordon Brown has been spending on public services on a high interest credit card. Buy now, pay later. And boy, are we paying for it. The problem is that the PFI contracts the government entered into and encouraged others to do so, are usually for 25 years plus. Meaning that as long as the contractor performs, he gets paid. There is no way of reducing the services required of the contract, regardless of the state of the economy. This is why public finances are in such a state. Especially in hard times like now - the contractor is going to work its damn hardest to make sure he performs and gets paid more, whereas it is in the interests of the public finances that his services are reduced. The Tories will be stuck with these contracts, so extreme savings will need to be found elsewhere
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Hardly anyone has noticed, but there were two announcements in Gordon Brown's press conference which set the stage for a transformation of British politics - if the government can seize the initiative quickly enough. They have about two days:
http://www.knowingandmaking.com/2009/06/two-hidden-stories-which-could.html
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we need some proper gander
labour are a feel-good party
remember those radical free
60's, 70's & 80's rock concerts
ban the thatcher, ban apartheid
free mandela, stop the nukes
peace and love and not war
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I am very dissapointed not to see Simon Cowell appointed to a senior political post and leavng Piers and Amanda out of government is a serious ommision. Stravros Flatley and son would have made good overseas development ministers and of course Susan Boyle for Arts.
Glenyis Kinnock wife of an unelectable labour party leader to the Lords , what post is she going to be given I wonder?
So what is now laughingly called a Government is not much more than a bunch of unelected GB cronies,people who have had to leave government a number of times for inappropriate activities, people who do not have the integrity to say what everyone else can see. "GB you are a disaster" as they would rather cling on to some power while it is available to them. Plus of course a raft of MPs with dodgy expenses claims that "were within the rules"
The honest, upright Labour MPs with integrity must be in despair.
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I often wonder about the intelligence quotient of parliamentarians and their media commentators. What is Brown likely to do? He has made it perfectly plain that he is not going to quit for over six months so what has recently changed?
The expenses row covers the whole spectrum of Westminster and no doubt many in public service outside Westminster too, just as our City black suits couldn't be trusted either. So Fiddler's "Middle Class Syndrome" is responsible for bringing the UK to its knees via an acute viral infection once known as greed. Its main symptom manifests as the repeated use of the words "All within the rules" no doubt borrowed from some kind of secret ceremony performed to prove "loyalty".
So Brown sticks "within the rules" and carries on until May 2010 now bereft of some of the lousiest ministerial material seen in Westminster for a long time. He casts an eye over the occupants of the benches opposite and sees no reason to believe UK plc would be in better hands there. He looks to the Liberals where another bunch of upstarts and one good man do not a government make.
The disease is a political one, fostered by a media who do not know how to be incisive any more. Fickleness has invaded our Parliament since the Great Opportunist, one B Liar, concocted "sleight of hand before your very eyes" and you are all still mesmerised by his memory. You recall that good doctor lying under a tree somewhere in the great English countryside and realise that that day you all lost your integrity to a couple of playground bullies and their game of "who can tell the biggest porky and get away with it".
Carry on missing the point if you want - talk to the hand.
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So, what is the point of having MPs then? Hundreds of Labour back benchers and,according to Brown, no potential ministerial talent, hence the need to bring in Kinnock, Sugar, and Mandelson, the Lord Protector
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There was one moment that summed up Gordon during his press conference.
When asked 'was there, at any time during the last days, a point when you even remotely considered that resigning would be the best move?'
To which he answered flatly 'No'
And then with timing that any comedian would give his right arm for, added: 'But I am not arrogant!'
From my perspective that summed Gordo up right there and then. The sheer arrogance of the comment and then the straight denial of what just occurred.
The country went to poll and said 'we don't want labour'. In Gordon speak that means 'they want me to stay and do something else'.
This isn't a democracy it is a farce.
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The worst PM since Chamberlin at least he recognised that his time was up and stood aside.
He will lead the Labour party into a generation of political wilderness at a time when our politics is need of radical reform. Please Labour MPs follow Purnell and ditch this disaster
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Finally the end of Brown is in sight, as chancellor he rode on the back of a housing bubble taking from the productive and indulging the unproductive, as with all socialists the money eventually runs out. Is Cameron bold enough to make the tough decisions to fix the country?
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+--------+
|warning |
|stress & |
| anxiety |
| will kill |
| u dead |
+--------+
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#201
...and those who went to the polls didn't exactly show any incisive alternative to what we have now. Judging by the apathy demonstrated by the great British electorate they have really had enough of this rubbish masquerading as democracy....
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The man is now an embarrassing international public joke. That press conference yesterday made me cringe. It seems that Gordon Brown's new vision for the United Kingdom involves forming 3 more committees. It's pitiable to watch.
The saddest thing of all is watching the spineless, supine insects around him - his so-called cabinet colleagues - wheel behind the most appalling, incompetent, illegitimate, bullying politician ever to have forced his way into high office.
So, now it all rests on the parliamentary labour party minions: that money-grubbing lot who have also let the Executive get away with blue murder for a decade. Let's see if they have the guts to act. On past performance, I'm not holding my breath.
In which case, what on earth are we the people supposed to do in the face of what is becoming, to all intents and purposes, an unlected dictatorship? This is madness. I never, ever thought I would see UK politics reduced to such a shambolic mess. Gordon Brown will never live this down in the annals of British political history. It's ironic that a man who so craved power, and who was so singularly unsuitable to hold it, will eventually depart in ignominy ... however long he clings to office.
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I think the real root of the problem lies in the fact that Gordon Brown really doesn't have any kind of inkling how many people including those he would consider to be his allies actively dislike him as a person. He's made many enemies along the way and despite his protestations is in fact extremely arrogant. One commsntator during this crisis I thought put it very well. He said "It just needs a good close friend of Gordon's to tell him that the game is up and there's no turning back". The die has been cast and there is now no way that he can regain respectability or likeabilty regardless of the hoped for economic upturn which appears to be his last straw of hope. You can only have to watch the Big brother crowd in London to see how much arrogant people are detested in this country. Add to that the fact that he lies blatantly (his denial of the plan to remove Alistair Darling is a case in point) and you have a poisonous cocktail of a person who the majority of people are beginning to treat with disdain. He thinks and claims it's all down to expenses or The Recession an argument propagated by his remaining loyal sycophants. It isn't. He was unpopular long before either of thee two issues reared their ugly heads. I would love to be a fly on the wall of Number 10 so that I could exactly what is going on behind the scenes of this enfolding drama.
In many ways he reminds of an ex female boss who had a close inner circle of friends who she treated with respect and who supported her to the max while the rest of her work force were treated with barely concealed contempt.
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208:
I apologise for the spelling errors in this piece. Only just emerged from my pit!
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this country is in one hell of a mess politically . in my thirty years of voting i have seen the quality of politicians diminish alarmingly. the vast majority now have no idea or the understanding of work or business life and if the system limps along as it is then the future is frightenining. my own political veiws range from extreme right wing on some issues to extreme left wing on others so i have no allegance to one party. we i believe must have some sought of PR introduced to ensure real democracy and please lets have politicians who are sincere and do not see it as a career.
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Mr Brown, you have now plumbed the depths, dredging up fifth-rate unelected has-beens, showbiz mavericks, yet another disgraced ex-Minister, and unknown nonentities. This is not reinvigorating government, it is a desperate recycling of old, worn out unfit-for-purpose rubbish.
These desperate and pathetic attempts to cling onto power are doing untold damage to our country. Under your stewardship, our MPs have dragged our politics into the gutter, held the electorate in contempt and made us the laughing-stock of the world, and your government's inability to put things right is yet another symptom of the desperately low calibre and self-interests of our politicians.
Just because YOU want to hang onto power, Mr Brown, doesn't mean that you're "the right man for the job" but such arrogance and delusion is typical of the age that puts affected style over substance and, with You Tube appearances and the latest phone calls to Morgan and Cowell, you're certainly a man of your age.
Although it's really all over and you're condemned to go down as the worst Prime Minister in generations, you could earn a small footnote of praise if you woke up now and did the decent thing. Resign, call a general election and give us a chance to sweep this whole stinking mess into oblivion.
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the tories can't get in on negative sympathies for labour
surely they've got to have some sort of constructive plan
that's like your woman leaving you for someone greasier
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First Secretary of State is an alternative title to Deputy Prime Minister.
I wonder how the rest of the Cabinet feel when they realise that they have been displaced in the pecking order.
"Harry Harperson" must be spitting feathers. Will she resign next?
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It's good to see a lion dealing with a pack of jackals. The pack should learn a little respect. Lord Mandelson's interview with you, Robinson, was a prime example. Lord Mandelson please, Robinson.
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Well done Nick, all about Gordon, little about the stark enduring and deafening message from the electorate..
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#211:
No man or woman for that matter could be greasier than the person you refer to. The opposition policies will be presented as soon as they are made fully aware of the exact nature of the economic situation and need to produce a detailed manifesto for a General Election. Granted they will have to move fast if The Election is brought forward but noone in their right mind will elect them on a vague promise of change.
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EXCLUSIVE
Gordon Brown will resign next week and go straight into the Big House.
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I'm sure there must be some clever businesswomen who could have made more efficient Economic tsars than the sycophantic Sir Alan soon to be Lord Sugar. The fact that they may not be TV celebrities may have ruled them out I suppose. I'm waiting for Piers Morgan or Frank Skinner to be drafted in to coach the P.M. in charisma skills and audience engagement.
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For all the screams of "blue murder" you closet Tories just don't get it do you? Brown operated as Chancellor to allow you to bring this country to its knees as you drove the stock markets to make money from companies who were fiddling to get you to do just that. Greed begets greed, so while you were busy fingering through your property profiles the rest of the world was being driven to its knees. Now you join them (but only because it isn't quite so lucrative for you all now).
Well welcome to the gutter and may it rain on you big time. Brown and Blair connived a huge slice of the Tory vote through visions of a promised land that tired old Major and co. couldn't possibly have seen or even imagined. Fickle voters out for a party that disowned its own and fostered the rest. Fickle people living a life of O'Reilly and not once demonstrating compassion for those who struggled on debt just to survive.
Debt through necessity is one thing. Debt through greed quite another. Brown wasn't responsible for your greed but boy did he take you for a ride on it? And now the horses are out of control you'd like to ditch the driver... is that it?
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Had a read of 30 or so coments above about this continuing debacle. Not happy are we? I've never seen quite such a shambles from government. We still respect Major as an honest man, acknowledge Thatcher's place in history, and realise Blair could lead and do 'the job' of PM. Brown? Trying to step back from most of the grubby stuff of leading and get Mandy to do all that while he steers his chancellor and poses for the pretty pics.
Days I think left, only days.
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#218:
The stoking of a credit bubble built on excessive borrowing and government debt is but a small part of Gordon Brown's legacy thus far. Sadly it looks as if he will hang on for another 12 months so there is plenty of scope for him to run the country into the ground even further. He has made errors of judgement in all kinds of areas too many to mention here but well documented. He accuses the opposition of planning to make public service cuts but refuses to acknowledge that with a burdening debt he would eventually have to do the same if he retained power and was forced to begin to balance the books.
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This man has waited patiently in the wings for a long time to get to where he firmly believes he should be. He also believes he is the only one who can steer the country out of this mess.
Brown is not going to give up without fighting to the last.
Is he delusional? Maybe. Perhaps all strong leaders are.
For all his faults you have to admire this man for sticking to his guns.
What you have to criticise is a system which allows the failed but all powerful labour party being allowed to continue in power when it is patently clear the voting public do not want them to be there.
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Well done Nick, all about Gordon, little about the stark enduring and deafening message from the electorate.. So, the will of the electorate can be ignored with focus on a Survival strategy? The BBC will be announcing the European results while Sir Alan Sugar's Apprentice final is on next.. Shame on the lot of you.
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219 baseball
"We still respect Major as an honest man"
Not sure Norma would quite take that view"
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#135 derekbarker
Hi derek, decided to stick your head above the parapet again, I see!
We are still waiting for the 5% poll lead that you told us Labour was going to have in February.
According to the local council elections, they are 5% BEHIND the LibDems and 15% BEHIND the Conservatives.
Any comment?
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"178. At 01:27am on 06 Jun 2009, neebols456 wrote:
Having read all the comments on here and the comments on HYS over the last few weeks I have come to the conclusion that the vast majority of people in the country are amazingly stupid and get the governments they deserve. Half the people making comments can't string a coherent sentence together and the vast majority can't spell."
Just because we can't spell (im severely dyslexic but have two degrees) dosn't mean that we dont have valid views.
Also some posts are either rushed as done on the train etc or clouded by the high level of anger a topic invokes.
Im fuming with this goverment, all Brown ever does these days is reacts to bad news!
As for his statement about Hazels advoidance of CG tax on the sale of her second home was despicable, it was HIM who, in the late 90's, changed the inland revs rules concerning CG Tax and MP's second home adding the clause that ment that the Inland Rev would allow MPs to claim that their declaired second home for expenses was their main home for CG tax.
We have averaged more than one new law for each and every working day that this goverment has been in power.
I run a small business, as of today, different goverment departments owe my business over a third of a million, over half that is more than 120days overdue. This debt accounts for 90% of my all overdue invoices. For two invoices im considering calling in the bailiffs, as i think walking into the treasury handing over a court order for no payment would make a good press picture! Yet Brown tells the House and press conferences that all goverment departments are paying in under 30days.
Having lived off saving all year and not taken any salary im having to lay off 3 staff members on Monday, if the goverment departments paid up I would be hiring!
Like every weekend my Saturday morning is spent checking up and reading new goverment red tape, this morning is new health and safty regulations and yet another rule change for working with children, which will rewquire all my staff to read, answer a quiz sheet and sign that they understand, I wouldnt mind BUJT we dont actually work with children just service equipment on council sites and they insist we are certified and conform with evry minor change in the law.
As a business I applied to the recently anounced apprenticeship scheme to see if I could get funding for two school leavers but was told their was no cash available only advice, some of which would be charged for. Then last week it was revealed that over 90% of all the new apprenticeships within goverment were infact rebranded job titles or existing trainees. I know of two Kent goverment bodies that have closed down ALL their apprenticeships putting over 20 people back on the dole.
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He spoke at the Press conference like Mugabe! I will continue whether you want me or not. It is what I want, not you, that matter!
The bare-faced bloody cheek of the man!
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The future of government spending and debt will becme ever clearer in the next few years when PFI repayments start to kick in. PFI has always been off the books so we do not know the amount of loans taken out, who loaned the money or even the terms of the deal.
So even if government spending is maintained at current levels, the actual amount of money to pay for services will shrink as the remainder pays off the instalment of PFI. The BMA highlighted a figure of GBP 50 billion of PFI loans taken out to build new hospitals worth GBP 10 billion. The pricing of that deal definetly favours the lender, and not the borrower!
This I believe is why the commitment to a new Trident, ID cards and other sundry IT systems have to be shelved.
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It is time for Brown to relise that he never was and never will be a good leader. If he had been elected leader on the death of John Smith in all likelihood Major would have won again. That is why Mandelson moved to ensure that Blair was elcted leader.
If Brown had stuck to doing what he knew best, crunching numbers, who knows what his legacy might have been. As it is, he will be remembered as a self-dillusioned broken man clinging to the last vestiges of power with the british people despising and pitying him at the same time.
What a legacy to leave to your children!!
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Socialism doesn't work. Full stop. All it does is encourage abuse by an entitlement generation that procreates only to get a bigger house from the Government.
As for Gordon Brown, I never voted for him as Prime Minister, did you? He, unfortunately, will hang on until the bitter end, driving our beloved country into the abyss. When the next election does finally arrive it will be an ABBA election - Anybody But Brown Again!
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Brown gets his saviours in through the House of Lords.
Mandelson is Deputy Prime Minister cannot answer questions in the commons was NOT elected. Glynnis Kinnock the ageing wife of the unpopular Labour candidate for Prime Minister, Neil Kinnock, is sidled into the Lords at the enth hour yesterday to save Brown's face when Caroline Flint confronted him and walked out.
Brown - Unelected
Mandelson - Unelected
Kinnock - Unelected
How arrogant, pushy and in THEIR interests, not OURS!
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Great to see Derek Barker back again. He always adds some spice to the rantings on this site and always makes me laugh.
Personally I see these "no policy" Tories comments quite funny. The Tories have finally learnt the lesson from 97. Do not make any solid policy announcements, make high level bland but media friendly soundbites and concentrate on sniping at the governement. Add that to an electorate that is fed up with those in power and bingo you get great election results. Its not rocket science. The only thing you need to do is question just why it took them so long to work it out.
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I haven't read all the comments so maybe someone else has made this point but I don't think you have, Nick: the simple reason why Brown has received the backing of Mandelson, Miliband, Johnson, Darling et al (ie they haven't resigned!) is that they now, at long last, have real power round the cabinet table. Brown can't sack them. They can actually now do their jobs without Brown interfering. He's a lame duck - and that's a good thing. Cabinet government by intelligent people at long last. And Mandelson as lst Sec of State & Lord President of the Council is closer to being PM than he could ever have thought possible! They'll keep Brown there as long as possible for this reason. No election before next year - put money on it!
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WOW one MP, Ian Gibson, deserves the title "Right Honourable".
He is the only MP who has foregone his goldan good bye and actullay stood down as an MP forcing a by-election.
Yes he played the expenses system but when caught and barred from standing as a party MP at the next general election, he did the honourable thing (against the parties advice) and stood down.
Well Done Ian! I wish more of the expense system playing MPs would follow your honourable example, instead of paying back peanuts knowing that they will receive a shedload when they leave at the general election.
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175. At 01:16am on 06 Jun 2009, derekbarker wrote:
#173
Beatsy! actually no, lord Digby Jones done the same type of job.
If Alan Sugar plays apart in Britain reducing it's employment numbers
will you still be so negative?.
===
Derek, just trying to be helpful here, I think you mean reducing UNemployment figures.
Or are you in favour of more people losing their jobs?
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183. At 02:24am on 06 Jun 2009, dhwilkinson
What Gordon Brown should have realised is that "1984" and "Animal Farm" were works of fiction, not instruction manuals.
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I agree with many comments below that Brown is now fatally wounded in the eyes of the public yet he could continue to hold office until next year if the backbenchers are too lame to do anything! I think the situation would be markedly different if the Conservatives would get their act together! I mean come on was that really the best Cameron could do at Prime Minster's Question Time?? It was an open goal and yet he still completely missed! So yes Labour are a pathetic dieing bunch but the Cosnervatives seem no better.
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175. At 01:16am on 06 Jun 2009, derekbarker wrote:
"If Alan Sugar plays apart in Britain reducing it's employment numbers
will you still be so negative?.
I would certainly hope so!
Lesson #1 of successful partisan politico blogging, don't blog when tired, lesson #2, always double check your messages actual meaning. :-)
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208. At 07:47am on 06 Jun 2009, sicilian29 wrote:
208:
I apologise for the spelling errors in this piece. Only just emerged from my pit!
===
sicilian, neebols456 would take away your right to vote for not being able to spell properly!
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So the police say that because the fees office knew some of the payments were dodgy but agreed to them there are no grounds of prosecution.
I must remember that when I do my next expense claim....
When I hand it to my office manager, as long as I tell her that its dodgy but pay it anyway I can put thru anything! Knowing that like MP's will I avoid Tax and prosecution!
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What a joke is Ms. Flint, she became the darling of the media yesterday with her intemperate impression of a woman scourned claiming Gordon used her only as window dressing. Lo and behold today I see she has allowed the press to use her as not only window dressing but as a pin up. If they were trying to make a point I think she has lost out. This little hissy fit she has had confirms that Gordon was right not to have upgraded her position in government. Shame that so many so called Labour rebels have such delusions of adequacy perhaps they should cross the house and join the party that has the patent on that role?
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What I've been watching on GB, is a witchhunt that started immediately he got into office - not helped by the BBC, a major PUBLIC organisation, constantly speculating. They've been a better opposition than the official one, pointing and exaggerating every deficiency in the public media daily on radio and television.
As the expenses and the latest set of resignations have demonstrated is a bunch of self-motivated/centred people who have done little for the grassroots of the party.
The party structure is the problem for our democracy. Most people put forward are not elected by the "people" but just a bunch in local parties.
PS Don't think the tories are any better, just better polished.
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Brown lied on national tv yesterday. Every body saw it. Twice he had the opportuntity to admit that he and his advisors had been briefing all political journalists that Darling was for the chop. This includes briefing Nick Robinson to that effect. Tom Bradby of ITN asked him twice to be honest and admit it,as Gordon said his style was to be honest because that is what his father was. Twice Gordon said that they did not brief about darlin going.
Brown is a liar on live national television, unless the journalists want now to say that Brown and his advisors never briefed them about Darling going.
Brown is a liar on national live televisison.
But I don't hold out much hope of you letting this one through.
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Gordon Brown still doesn't "get it". He talks about reform of public services as his priority, but can't really have any effect on those of his own constituents in Scotland, only the English who didn't elect him to parliament, and can't therefore vote him out again. He talks about a Constitutional Reform Bill, but you can bet that it won't include a solution to this glaring devolution anomaly. The growing, (and in my Scottish view justified) anger and resentment in England at this unacceptable state of affairs, that his governmet created, is one of the factors no doubt behind the drubbing that he received in the English elections. He won't do anything about it because that would leave him in the absurd position of being a prime minister unable to vote on domestic issues anywhere in the kingdom. Still, it is a mess he helped to create, and he must now pay the price.
He talks about renewing faith in democracy, but doesn't mean any such thing, or he wouldn't use the undemocratic device of parachuting unworthy people into the House of Lords to bolster his lack of elected talent. That is clearly undemocratic as well.
He talks about honesty, but is unrepentant about his refusal to honour a clear manifesto promise to hold a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty.
He talks about remaining in office to do "his job", but if he does, after the clearly expressed will of the English electorate at the polls, and if as expected the same from the rest of the UK in the Euro elections, then he will have destroyed the Labour party for a generation, if not all time. Some moral compass he has; he is just trying to salvage his won career, but that is now beyond saving. Labour backbenchers must either wake up to this fact and oust him, or kiss their own politcal careers goodbye as well.
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#184
"Do you think it is time for the Second House to be abolished?"
No, that is not to say that it should not be (greatly) reformed, nor do I think it's wise to have a wholly elected second chamber - why - because the second chamber is a checks and balancing system on government policy, these checks and balances can only occur if those overseeing the review of policies do not have to panda to the popular vote It's a sorry thing to say but the majority of voters are actually incredibly stupid and/or self-centred in their political outlook - the "I'm alright Jack" attitude.
A populist government and second chamber returned on the back of some political, social, union or constitutional scandal stating that politics etc. has got to clean it's act up, with a government majority in both chambers it could lead to anything from the banning of political parties, a 'sting-'em-up' for having the wrong look on their face or simply being in the wrong place at the wrong time judicial system, outright banning (or forced closed shops) of the unions, to the deceleration of a Republic etc.
Be careful of what you wish for...
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he knows he is unpopular and unliked but politics is not a popularity contest so in hindsight he has done the right thing.
may be he is right looking at those in the house with him none are capable of governing this country.
so better the devil you know yadda yadda.
has his reshuffle finally killed off the blairite element and settled his government?, will he have time to sort things out?
who knows.
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Today on the anniversity of the D day landings, we have a situation that in a small way reflects the situation then. A dictatorial maniac hiding in a bunker pretending he's winning and proclaiming he has a " cunning " plan he got from Baldrick to see off the enemy and save the fifth socialist republic. Like his heroes of the Russian revolution, his dream is dead, and his brand of Socialism for about the fifth time since the war has been proven to be useless as a basis for government of a free nation. Labour has outlived it's insane philosophy of envious equality for all,and left us with a state supported underclass of non working non achieving Labour voters who strip the workers of resources and services.
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#220
The problem is that the difference between Brown and Cameron is wafer thin and is not disguised by the latter's "we'll have to wait and see" on the budget questions. With three million plus unemployed by the autumn and who knows how many more to come the public debt will increase out of necessity unless we are going to make strident and vicious cuts in education, health, the armed forces, and law and order.
We have no manufacturing base; our service industries are under threat from cheaper resources abroad; we are fighting two pointless wars; the steel industry is about to take a massive belly blow in Teesside; and Cameron has no idea what government is.
This is no longer a party political issue or even a personality issue. This is time for British people - the ordinary working force that has been ignored for three decades - to take back what is theirs and damn those who have brought us to our knees (Thatcher in particular). We also need a media that at least attempts to reflect the truth about Britain today instead of the hype ridden drivel that pours out of its scornful and mealy mouth.
The ghetto crisis in the States is worse now than it was when Obama was elected to power - that is what Britain has to look forward to unless someone does something very, very radical NOW. "Cameron, put your arm down lad."
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230. At 09:13am on 06 Jun 2009, flamepatricia
I think this is a full list of the unelected members of HM Government, literally "lording" it over us. Others please feel free to add to it.
Lord Mandelson
Lord Sugar
Lady Kinnock
Lord Myners
Baroness Vadera
Lord Davies
Lord Carter
Lord Adonis
Baroness Andrews
Lord Bach
Lord Darzi
Lord Davidson
Lord Hunt
Lord McKenzie
Lord Malloch-Brown
Baroness Morgan
Baroness Royall
Baroness Scotland
Baroness Taylor
Lord West
Lord Young
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240. At 09:38am on 06 Jun 2009, notfooledsteve
Here's how seriously Caroline Flint objects to being "female window dressing"!
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1182928/So-DO-Minister-Sexy-Skirts---You-tell-Caroline-Flint.html
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Once again Brown's 'acolytes' emerge from Number 10's bunker and start briefing against ..... this time Alistair Darling. But the 'Great Leader' 'knows nothing'. What a surprise! Perhaps we should be thankful for 'small mercies' with Purnell's timely intervention?
Just think we could have had Mr Balls 'running' the economy. Wasn't it he with Brown that effectively found a way to ruin final salary pension schemes for the masses? (Still Ms Cooper at Work and Pensions can find a more ingenious way of 'inserting the nail'.)
Surely it will be this, and the millstone of extra taxes for decades to come, rather than the 'chicken feed' (sorry pig slurry) of MPs expenses that will be Brown's legacy.
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#191. At 04:12am on 06 Jun 2009, Rogerborg wrote:
"I'd rather have the Nazis in charge for a while"
You really think that once in charge you would get the option of kicking them, out again - you poor delusional person, have you never bothered to read the political history of Germany 1900-1945?...
On this date, of all dates, we have ignorant 'Little Englanders' spouting the utter clap-trap you have, you should be thankful that the BBC blogs are fully moderated or you might just read what people really think about people like you - and your "easy-options, find the scapegoats" political 'solutions'...
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Here's what Number 10 decides Labour MPs should think, as they clearly cannot manage it by themselves:
"
ELECTION BRIEFING: FRIDAY MORNING
Tough times for Labour but not the breakthrough the Tories wanted either. We need to work hard together to come through this recession, listen to the voters, and earn back peoples trust after the expenses scandal. But if we do that then we can be confident that in a head-to-head with the Tories where the choice is between a Labour party led by Gordon Brown and determined to stand by people, or a Tory party led by David Cameron that would walk on by when people need help most then we can go forward from today and win.
I think the whole cabinet have found James Purnells resignation surprising and disappointing. Labour Party supporters were out campaigning hard yesterday and this is the last thing they would have wanted to see. James is still in the early stages of his career and Im sure hell be back. His decision is the wrong one, as cabinet colleagues have said.
I think James has drawn the wrong conclusion for two reasons. First, the public wants to send us a message that after a month of hearing about moats and mortgages and duck houses that they are angry about expenses and want them sorted out fast. Second, they are worried about their jobs and want us to return our focus to accelerating economic recovery. Now those are the plans that Gordon Brown is working on and over the coming week he will make sure that he has a first class team full square behind him.
We now need to listen to voters anger over expenses and to act. The last thing the country needs right now is for the party to turn inward. Faith in politics has been badly shaken and needs to be restored. Families are worried about their homes and jobs and are trusting us to stand by them and bring them through the downturn.
It is already clear that these are going to be a tough set of elections at a tough time for the Labour Party were in the middle of a recession, turnout is significantly down, people are clearly angry about expenses and as the party of government with the most MPs, it looks like were feeling the brunt of that anger.
There are some interesting results. Weve won seats from the SNP in Scotland and held seats in places like Hastings where the Tories might have been expected to advance meanwhile the Tories came seventh in the Hartlepool mayoral election.
Tough times for Labour but not great for Cameron either. Voters who are angry about MPs flipping homes or cleaning their moats on expenses are staying at home or voting for minor parties but they are not switching in great numbers to the Tories. The Tories got 44% last year, when the local votes are projected into a nationwide vote. This time theyre predominantly in their heartlands but they dont appear to be lifting off from that result. That tells us that Labour need to respond to peoples concerns but in a head-to-head, we can still win the fight with the Tories.
Its hard to translate European and local election results into consequences for a General Election. In 1989, when we were in opposition, Labour won the European elections but lost the 1992 General Election. In 2004, Labour were down to 22% but we beat the Conservatives in the elections the following year.
Sundays national results will tell us a bit more. Anything less than 36% for the Tories means that David Cameron is falling short of where William Hague was in 1999. They had 27 MEPs last time it will be interesting to see if they get many, many more.
Going forward: in the coming weeks we will set out widescale plans for cleaning up politics and accelerating our recovery and reforming public services.
Q&A
James Purnells Resignation?
I am obviously disappointed about Jamess resignation. The Prime Minister and the rest of the Cabinet are absolutely focussed on the big challenges of cleaning up our politics and getting Britain back to work quicker:
how we guide the economy through the downturn and strengthen it for the future
how we push ahead with reform of and investment in our public services
how we renew trust in our democracy and Parliament.
It is sad that James has gone but we get on with the job of helping people through this downturn fairly. The PM will continue to give his undivided attention to addressing these great challenges facing our country and putting the interests of the British people first and foremost.
John Hutton resignation?
John is going to step down as an MP at the next election for personal reasons. Really sad to see him go hes done a fantastic job. Whole party will thank him for his contribution over the years at Dept for Health and at BERR, and particularly for his recent leadership at the Ministry of Defence, where, in the most challenging times, he has overseen the end of combat operations in Iraq and supported our troops in bringing security and stability to Afghanistan.
Time to change leader?
Right now we face the two great challenges of this era an economic crisis that has engulfed the world and caused global recession; and a political crisis that has engulfed Westminster. In Gordon Brown we have someone not only with the economic leadership and experience to tackle the global recession and to steer us through the downturn but with the integrity and determination to sort out the challenge of MPs expenses.
Has Labour been worst hit by expenses row?
The vast majority of MPs work terrifically hard for their constituents and have been appalled by some of the wilder stories about moats or swimming pools. All agree that we need to take action now to restore faith in Parliament. Its important to remember that the expenses crisis is not just confined to government but to all parties and even David Cameron has had to answer questions about his two mortgages.
What about resignations from Jacqui Smith and Hazel Blears?
Sad to see them leave both have an excellent record. As Home Secretary, Jacqui has cut crime; introduced the tough Australian points based immigration system; and rolled out neighbourhood policing across the country. And as Communities Secretary, Hazel has led reforms in local government and ensured that weve had better local services as well as the lowest average council tax increase in 15 years.
What are you doing on expenses?
The vast majority of our MPs have worked terrifically hard and are doing an excellent job. They didnt come into politics to get rich but to help people and all of them are determined to restore faith in Parliament. The old system is dead. An independent-led body will now check the claims of every MP over the past 4 years. We have agreed that in future MPs should no longer set their own pay, allowances or standards of conduct and that these should be handed over to independent regulation. MPs allowances are being stripped right back:
- no more claims on moats or swimming pools no claims on furniture, household goods, gardening, cleaning, or stamp duty;
- no more flipping or avoiding Capital Gains Tax;
- mortgage claims only on interest and capped at a maximum of £1,250 a month;
- no more London MPs claiming second homes;
- no more second home allowances for those in grace-and-favour homes;
- and no more secret second jobs.
Dont we need a General Election?
Neither of the two great challenges we face the economic challenge and the political challenge would be solved by an election. And the last thing the country needs is for Labour to be talking to itself. That is why the Prime Minister and the Cabinet are focussed on the big challenges that matter to the British people: cleaning up our politics and getting Britain back to work quicker.
Why are the BNP winning in places?
BNP success down to three things: first, gut reaction of voters wanting to punish main parties; second, very low turnout; and third, their deliberate strategy of attempting to gloss over their racist nature. That means all main parties, not just Labour, need to listen and respond to voters anger over expenses; encourage people to get out and vote which they will do in greater numbers at an election; and all of us need to uncover the true face of the BNP who are led by a man with convictions for inciting racial hatred. Many of the people whove voted for BNP are not racist and I think many of them would be appalled by the nature of that organisation as it begins to show its true face.
Do you accept part responsibility for rise in BNP?
The BNP are a fascist Party our parents and grandparents fought a World War to defeat what the BNP stands for. There is a duty on all parties to fight the values of the BNP. Weve campaigned hard and the PM was out on Monday directly addressing the threat of the BNP quite unusually for a sitting PM.
The Tories are saying that Labour is to blame for the rise in the BNP are they right?
No. We would much rather be fighting the Tories in white working class areas but in many of the places targeted by the BNP there has been no sign of the Tories since Margaret Thatcher in the mid-80s. We know that it tends to be unemployed men who are most likely to vote for the BNP thats why it is so important that we reach out to that group for example, we are giving a guarantee of a job or training place to every young person out of work for more than a year. Instead of trying to get some kind of party political advantage out of this, the Tories should be setting out what they would do to help the unemployed in white working class areas, instead of ignoring them.
Background facts
Most of the seats are in county council Tory heartlands and the last time we fought them was on General Election days when turnout was much higher so our expectation is low
The councils up for election are predominantly County Councils in two tier areas (27). The three Labour-controlled councils majority (Derbyshire, Nottinghamshire, Staffordshire) are all vulnerable.
There are also Mayorals although we only hold one out of the four up for election and that in an area the Tories have traditionally held
Highlights so far:
Labour gain from SNP in Glasgow (Anniesland / Drumchapel Ward). Anne McTaggart wins 2689 1698 on second stage of transfers
Labour gain from SNP in North Lanarkshire (Coatbridge North and Drumboig Ward). Peter Sullivan wins on several stages of transfers after leading SNP by 37% 30% of first prefs
Hartlepool mayoral results:
first preferences only. Tories beaten into 7th place behind UKIP and the BNP. Lib Dems losing deposit.
Results for Hastings:
Braybrooke and Castle Labour hold with 47% of the vote
Central St Leonards and Gensing Labour hold with 40% of the vote
Hollington and Wishing Tree labour hold with 43% of the vote
http://www.labour.org.uk Sent by email from the Labour Party, promoted by Ray Collins on behalf of The Labour Party, both at 39 Victoria Street, London SW1H 0HA. Website: labour.org.uk ; to join or renew call 08705 900 200.
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#194. At 05:20am on 06 Jun 2009, gruad999 wrote:
"Q: What's the difference between Gordon Brown and a Limpet
A: The Limpet's not really committed to staying where it is!"
Q: What's the difference between Gordon Brown and a Limpet-mine
A: The Limpet-mine can be defused.
Boom-boom!
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#242
It is the height of naivety to trust what journalists say and print.
Many a journalist under pressure has caved. I do not trust politicians but I do not trust journalists either. People trade in "coded messages", "body language", "sinister appearances" etc, you know the stuff of Stephen King, but they still walk straight into the traps that life sets for them don't they? They wouldn't know code, body language or sinister appearance if it screamed at them at the top of its very loud voice.
Like the pantomime sketch says "he's behind you". Oh no he isn't - he is you walking straight into the trap....
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Seeing as we literally pay the piper, can we call the tune? The tune being a General Election?
"A detailed analysis of Mr Brown's expense claims also reveals that the Prime Minister claimed £30 on his office expenses for the cost of hiring a bagpiper to play at a ceremony for veterans.
George Wallace, who played at a "veterans' badge presentation" at a church in Kirkcaldy, told The Daily Telegraph: "I took a few hours off work but I said I wasn't worried about getting paid. I was quite surprised when the cheque came from Gordon Brown."
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/mps-expenses/5456789/mps-expenses-Gordon-Brown-billed-taxpayer-for-two-second-homes.html
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Where is the balance the BBC once stood for? The government has certainly made a rod for its own back, but please tell me what the alternative is because I dont see any. Brown bashing is in and Nick is in there with his steel toecaps.
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# 242 corruptfred
You cite an example of Brown lying on national TV; I agree with your observation ... and we know, anyway, that Brown is just that: a brazen liar. Here's another example: http://tinyurl.com/r6rohn
The Labour Party entered office on the basis of one almighty deception; now we're about to pay for it.
It beggars belief that we, the citizens, are treated with such utter contempt by our political elite (ha!). The situation bears all the hallmarks of the appalling arrangements that existed in the old USSR (and probably still exists in Russia) and characterise life in China today. Why on earth are we tolerating this in a democracy? Assuming we still live in a democracy. Do we still live in a democracy?
Yes, on balance, I think we do, but nobody's had the courage to tell this to Gordon Brown yet.
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This is a media-led propaganda campaign trotting out the same old arguments and missing the essential issue. There is a comment above about the Sun turning against the PM. Wake up! It has already. it's been backing Cameron for months.
We have to ask ourselves do we want our opinions dictated to by the media? Just reflect a little. By attacking the PM, the media deflects the attention from all those MPs who might otherwise be in the spotlight for their expense abuses. Well paid media people have nothing to lose by it and everything to gain by increased circulation.
The pathetic voter turn out in the recent county council elections point to voter apathy and voter anger. The apparent decline in voter power and therefore democracy is down to the voters themselves.
We need a media which gives us facts and doesn't constantly try to form our opinions.
We've just had county council elections which have put the Conservatives in overall control of almost all the authorities which were up for election. The facts are that the party had 38% of votes of less that 50% of the total electorate. They dominate those county councils now and will dictate policies.
The fact is that, because of low turn out, the party which now dominates English county councils actually polled 19% of all potential votes. The other parties, Independent, Labour and Lib Dem together polled 31% of the votes. (5.5% 11.5% and 14%). The figures speak for themselves. This is the issue we should be concerned about. I notice a lot of questions above about whether central government is democratic. Unless all voters use their privilege to vote and government is truly representative, the mandate of any government, on any level can be called into question.
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think there's a typo in para 3. Didn't you mean to say: 'a new role to match the reality that Gordon Brown is in effect his deputy.'?
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Get behind the PM. Stop the self interest and backstabbing. Those that have jumped ship-good riddance. The electorate will not forget nor forgive. Especially the appalling tantrums of Flint- happy enough to remain "window dressing" whilst the chance of promotion was in the offing. Spiteful, dishonest and deceitful. Also, having had dealings with Flint (as an ex-constituent) as an MP pretty ineffectual as well. No loss to government.
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# 257 moraymint
By the way ... when you watch the video clip on my previous link, look at Brown's face when he realises that the guy from whom he's just invited a question is The Spectator's Fraser Nelson ... Brown looks like he wants to leg it out of the room. Didn't stop him from proceeding to lie like a cheap Chinese watch at that point ... again.
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With the unelected taking such senior roles the democratic nature of government is in even more trouble than usual. To be in Browns government is an exercise in group delusion. The PM is loathed by a sizeable proportion of the people and the statements from ministers show that this is a very partisan approach to try and save a few Labour MPs from peoples soverign right to vote
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The complacency and stubborn qarrogance of Labour apologists on BBC and Sky News again this morning was astounding. Bradshaw and Kinnock dismissed the rebels and resignees as nonentities and refused to acknowledge that the people had given their damning verdict in yesterday's Council Elections. For goodness sake we are now 12 years into this Labour Administration and they are still talking about reconnecting with the people. They made great play of the fact that the Labour vote only went down 1% and reiterated the tired response that Gordon Brown was by 'miles' the best man for the job in the country let alone The Labour Party. It really is time we got this shambolic lot out!
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yellow belly @ 249
yes yes, I know all that ... she seems to want it both ways (sorry!) is the point you're making, I suppose ... but yet nobody looks at James Purnell's ridiculous, vanity driven, seventies throwback sideburns (plus oh so tight suits) and uses that as a reason not to take him seriously as a politician ... do they? ... double standards, see
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Its democracy stupid.
The unelected wielding power over the disenfranchised.
Another Kinnock telling us what to do, what to think - disgusting.
Good job Nu Labour never got round to abolishing the Lords - where would our leaders come from?
Another year of this early season pantomime.
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242 corruptfred - hear hear, it was squirm-worthy viewing; is there some law that stops journalists outright accusing GB of lying, if they have their notes from No10 briefings and there were a few of them surely there is no slander? Are thy afraid they lose their annointed status?
225 icewombat - in a similar situation but happily my outstanding debt from HMG is only 1/10th yours, if you are having to make 3 redundant i would make as much noise locally as you possibly can, invite the papers, local radio/tv - they would love it. As one of many suppliers of services to HMG I can only se this situation worsening
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If there is one measure of the weakness of Brown it is the promotion of Andy Burnham. Rmember that this is the man who libelled Shami Chakrabati and David Davis and then tried to bluster about it. Either (1) he had evidence for his comments and was too much of a coward to use it directly or (2) he was too stupid to realise how his comments would be taken or (3) he knew but did not care in which case he is morally unfit. Whichever it is he is unfit to be an MP never mind a minister - and that is ignoring his expenses misbehaviour. Brown is truly finished if he is forced to appoint this person.
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The good thing about derekbarker is that, although he is in a minority he is not alone and they will no doubt give GB the confidence to hang on until next summer, which will result in the total demise of the Labour party as an electable Government and ensure that for the next 30 years our two party system will become Tory and Liberal.
Unless, of course when the Liberals form the Government which follows the next Tory Government they introduce PR.
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Survival but at what price?
that's a deep perceptive inciteful question mr robinson
=> I want a refund NOW!
cowboys, cheats + crooks
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Do those who claim that The Opposition in Government would be no better than Labour really expect the rest of us to endure another 4 years + of negative stagnation and rising debt under Gordon Brown? Where is your evidence that they will be no better? They haven't been in office for 12 years.
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If this 'independent revolution' is happening in the arts and education, why can't it happen in politics?! Get Sugar to fire them all and hold a reality tv contest to see who's the next PM...and call it "your country needs you: for real this time".
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Talk about Orwellian double speak!
Brown is:
"...getting on with the job" that demonstrably the vast majority of the electorate do not want him in.
"Cleaning up politics" by
1) promoting to effective deputy leader a man who has twice been forced from high office on corruption allegations, and whose own personal relationship with Brown is innuendo rife.
2) Brought back to office Peter Hain who was forced out last year on corruption allegations and uses the fees office to pay his 80 year old mother.
And 3) brings into cabinet Rosie Winterton, one of Prescott's alleged former mistresses.
The man's either utterly delusional or plain mad, in any event dangerous and if Labour parliamentarians have any respect for the country they, as only they can, must get rid of him.
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Did Gordon Brown lie when he was at the Press Conference about Alistair Darling?
Well he might have, but then again, who actually said that Darling was going to move?
The Press.
Now none of these experts are going to say that their sources were wrong or that they allowed themselves to be politically 'wrong-footed', or that they gave too much credence to things they were being told by people who didn't actually know ... but they might have been.
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Can anybody else see a connection here?
Tue, May 5th, 2009
Viglen, the UK PC maker, has won a Office of Government Commerce contract worth up to £30m to supply public sector organisations with 70,000 PCs. Its chairman, Sir Alan Sugar, is very pleased indeed.
11:04pm UK, Friday June 05, 2009
Businessman Sir Alan Sugar is to receive a peerage and take up a role in the embattled Government.
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Good Morning Nick,
may I suggest that you may actually have broken the moderators rules with your comments on the Today programme this morning. It really is not good enough to hide behind the fact that this was made on a saturday morning. I think that if anybody can replay your inetrview then you more or less made the point that many of us have in that Brown could be becoming paranoid.
I thought it very interesting the programme from Bayeaux Cathedral where Brown was next to Prince Charles. All the time the cameras were focused on the PM, until that is when it came to the singing of the National Anthem, you know where we say 'God save our gracious Queen', I would have so loved to see the lips of the PM move to sing thoise words. I really can't wait for the next meeting between the Queen and her PM, and how he can in any way criticise the House of Lords when we have an unelected Lord who is the new Deputy PM, and an unelected Lord who will be in charge of enterprise. Oh and another one who is now in charge of Tarnsport.
This is absolutely shocking and unlike Ben Bradshaw I cannot see any justification for the way in which we are losing our representative democracy, it really is time for an election, but the House of Lords must be abolished, to be replaced by a fully elected second chamber. There must also be an English parliament, none of this Regional stuff.
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There was a great leader called Brown
In truth he's a bit of a clown
The fella called Mandy
Is a bit of a dandy
And will end taking him down
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Calm down! Calm down! right you've had your cuckoo moment at the polls
time to get serious about the move to recovery and "YES" there is only one credible choice, Gordon Brown of course, so it's a clear onwards and forwards for the labour movement.
Step aside young novice (Cameron) politics is about to get real.
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I hate Nick Robinson. When / if if!! the Tories regain Government I'm sure they'll show their appreciation to you Nick.
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Moderation or censorship - la la la!
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barking @ 277:
What's it like up there in cloud cuckoo land?
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skip and flip and
move your body
wicked and wild
and so versatile
if you never know
you've got to
get on the go
blow man blow
and no need
to be ashamed
stick on the wall
like a walrus
you've just got
to pay and will
never get away
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The true colours of the BBC are now becoming so obvious it's painful. Time and time again yesterday they were desperately grasping for any angle that could make the results somehow look bad for the Tories. It was like interviewing a football manager thus: "So, you won the game 7-0 but you missed a couple of chances. You must be desperately disappointed that you didn't win 9-0 and surely this means the team is in terminal decline and won't win any more matches". It really was that stupid. These projections based on shares of the vote are totally spurious because they make the assumption that people always vote on party lines alone - i.e. they pay no attention to candidates, local issues, the authority they are electing, the perceived performance of the party currently running that authority, or tactical voting. This is both absurd and insulting to the electorate. Reading yellowbelly1959's posting of the number 10 briefing, Labour are making the same mistake though for more obvious reasons than the BBC who should be informing not spinning. On Sunday night Labour will try to peddle the idea that because the Tories will get less than a 36% share in the Euro elections that means they are behind where William Hague was in 1999 - cheerfully ignoring all that has happened in the last 10 years and the political context at the time.
There are so many variables in voter motivation that yesterday's local and Euro elections have only passing relevance to what might happen in a General Election. Predicting numbers of seats in a future House of Commons on that basis is complete nonsense. The only thing we can say for certain about yesterday's local results was that the Tories won hands down - both in the north against Labour and in the south west against the Lib Dems. The results are a disaster for Labour and worrying for the Lib Dems. In the General Election the issues will be different. If you ask Labour activists what they are hearing on the doorstep they will tell you that Brown is their main problem. His pathetic performance yesterday will only reinforce that. When Paul Waugh told him that Caroline Flint had resigned he seemed to crumple. He then told us that he'd replaced her with the wife of a former Labour leader who quit 17 years ago. If you made this stuff up you nobody would believe you!
In a recent poll all but 26% of people believe that Brown is out of touch with ordinary people. The other 74% are correct. That is why he hears "people want me to get on with the job" when what most ordinary people are actually saying is "we want you to get out of the job." The Tories know that they haven't won the General Election yet - not a single vote has been cast. But they have a lot more cause for optimism than the other two main parties. Not that you'd think that from the BBC coverage yesterday.
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277 derekbarker
"politics is about to get real."
I loved this comment ! Bearing in mind the government has totally lost touch with any semblence reality, the electorate or anyone or anything else outside the Number 10 Bunker, and the breathtaking state of denial now gripping the government - the irony of your comment was superb! Though I suspect it was lost on you.....
Here we are in the middle of a real crisis of confidence in the political system, where the electorate really don't feel represented by the politicians any more. Politicians nedd to reconnect. So what does Gordon Brown do ? He appoints more unelected people into government by making them Lords ! Glenys Kinnock ???!?!? I realise that the 1990s is every popular retro-wise but this is really the best your lot can come up with as a way forward ?
As for politics getting real, it's all about survival for Gordon Brown now, and he doesn't give a stuff about you, me, the electorate, the people, the Labour Party, the government, the country or anything else. Its all about his personal survival for him.....nothing else matters.......And we will all be the losers in the meantime.
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Ladies and Gentleman of our once Great Country.
I present to you Mr Gordon Brown, the unelected Prime Minister who is deluded enough to actually think he knows how to get us out of the mess he himself has created.
It's time he went, it's time labour went
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#273
"Well he might have, but then again, who actually said that Darling was going to move?
The Press."
Err, no, not quite, if the PM had no intention to move Darling why did he duck (twice) that oh so simple yes/no question asked of him during Wednesdays PMQs, sorry but it was very clear that - prior to Purnell resigning - Darling was on his way out of Government never mind the cabinet (in that respect I suspect that Darling owes Purnell big time!).
The press were just reporting what they were being told behind the scenes and what was happing in front of the cameras.
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264 sagamix
Do you know how Peter Mandelson's new job affects the position of your beloved Harriet Harman as Gordon Brown's "deputy" ?
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Are "voices" telling our Great Leader that "the country expects him to get on with the job"? - The country -including a number of his loyal colleagues- is praying that he will call an election and end this farce!
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I am amazed that 3 non-elected members of parliament, without constituencies, now represent the government with responsible portfolios - Mandelson, West and now Kinnock. How can this be acceptable?
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Nick
In discussing the appointment of Baron Mandelson of Hartlepool and Foy as de facto deputy PM, you forgot to mention the calculated snub to Harperson this entailed.
And how about a post on the MPs Brown decided not to promote, choosing instead the unelected Glenys Kinnock as Europe Minister - Ivan Lewis, John Healey and others?
#248 yellowbelly1959 gave us a list of the political peers in ministerial posts. We should also note that the Kinnocks' daughter works for Gordon Brown in the Political Office...
7 cabinet members and attenders among over 20 political appointments as peers in Ministerial posts, it's beyond a joke...
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#277. At 11:13am on 06 Jun 2009, derekbarker wrote:
"Step aside young novice (Cameron) politics is about to get real."
Brown was a novice once...and some might think he still is, he certainly hasn't yet grasped what it means to be and the duties of the PM...
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153. At 11:30pm on 05 Jun 2009, SomethingWonderful wrote:
You aske for This inormation just follow the web address and look at what the MP said
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200809/cmhansrd/cm090210/debtext/90210-0004.htm#09021037000001
Mr. Christopher Chope (Christchurch) (Con): I beg to move,
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Hang on a minute - first it was the speaker's fault - so he's been binned. Now it's Brown's fault so he'll be binned. What about the MPs themselves - it's actually their fault. They should all resign and let us have our say about them individually. Carrot top Blears blames Brown for her career curtailment - excuse me wasn't it her own fault?
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Nick, You sat next to Tom Bradbury at Browns press conference yesterday. Tom asked Brown if he had intended to sack Darling. Brown clearly lied in front of you all. What does this say of the man, and the cabinet that support him. More specifically what does it say about the integrity of Darling.
Brown also stated that it was "his mission" to stay on. What kind of deluded statement was that.
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No230 Flamepatricia,
In order to help me understand the nature of British Government, could you let me know when was the last time a government was formed without members of the House of Lords? I look forward to hearing from you.
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In today's Guardian:
Polly Toynbee: By failing to stop the crisis this cabinet has proved itself unfit for leadership
At least she's seeing some sense now. Dizzy Draper above should be ashamed of himself / herself!
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We saw that during the week that Gormless Gordon has had his old Pal John Reid around for a stiff drink or two, where they talked about Football, and the other thing that they both have in common, being: that their BOTH boring talkers when in conversation.
Now, could it be that JR who is on the Board of Glasgow Celtic Football Club is lining-up "Sure Shot" IN THE FOOT Gordon to be Celtics next Manager, for afterall Gordon will need something to do once his life-less M.P.s' have got up enought Courage to sack their Manager currently labouring at Number 10.
You heard it First here, so get the Car started.
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brown's going nowhere and that's the sad thing.
he's a broken man leading a broken party into the teath of a gale of public resentment, infighting and disaster.
A suporter of Brown in my work said 'this is what he's waited for his whole life' [ie. the leadership] but that's not a reason to stay on not when the country and the party's on it's knees.
Brown is a dead weight that both the Labour Party and the country is carrying and he should do the honorable thing but then he has a problem with honer does he not? Thatcher resigned when she realised her cabinat no longer backed her, Major went to the country, Brown has ruled like a Medievil Pope and will continue to do so now he's destroyed his only real sucesser.
Resugn and let the party rebuild. Resign and let the country breath.
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Brown is a bastard isn't he?
He refuses to acknowledge Caroline Flint and rarely invited her to discussions which involved Europe but has made Glenys Kinnock a peer in the Lords.
All to save face. Brown's face.
I guess Kinnock would have lost her seat as a Labour MEP tomorrow.
Brown really is a bastard isn't he?
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Not only the MPs still dont get it, well excepting the Flints who travelled a Damascus road overnight, but the loyal party workers dont either.
It was sad listening to salt of the earth Party activists bemoaning the way the cabinet resignations were hurting the Party.
Surely its time these honest folk, whose efforts have been abused by the shower they helped to Westminster, started to ask ; what can the Party do for me?
They have done everything for their Party and had it flung back in their faces by the freeloading, property portfolio building wretches they helped.
Come on chaps , see the light, back to Damascus again eh?
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Dont finish him off, he must understand this by himself, if not then finish him off.
So, finish him off.
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Hi Nick
What I find most unsatisfactory is the difference between what Gordon Brown says and what he does. For example he claims one of his roles going forward is to clean up politics. But he does the following.
Brings Mandelson back into government. Is there a UK politician with a worse reputation on honesty/malpractice?
Brings back Peter Hain who resigned not long ago on electoral expenses.
Brings the unelected Glenys Kinnock back into power. Her family have been massive burdens on the public purse and actually took part in the sacking of the woman who wanted to clean up the EU.
The deeds do not fit the words.....
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Brown must go, and we must get our referendum, and get our country back from the even more corrupt EU of the elites.
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Derek, from your posts I can only conclude that you are trolling. Only a fool would think Brown has any chance of even remaining in power, let alone somehow cleaning up the financial disaster he presided over.
General election now.
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The coverage of the resignations in this morning's press is hilarious. All of the "big-shot" resignations are virtually overlooked as the Flint takes over, all glammed-up from an "Observer" photoshoot, with pouting, curvacious snaps accompanying the "female window-dressing" rant.
Even the Torygraph has given maximun front-page coverage to this nonsense. Message understood, guys.
Neal and Christine Hamilton: look out! This woman is heading for a desert island near YOU.
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Alan Sugars first Day on the Job.
Brown: "Well old Sugar tell me the truth: What will be your first Act in MY re-shuffled Cabinet?"
Sugar: "My First - Act is to tell you: YOUR FIRED GORDON" and " ALWAYS CALL ME SIR when you address me"
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220 sicilian
#He has made errors of judgement in all kinds of areas too many to mention here but well documented.
Since you seem reluctant to mention them perhaps I could help you out.
Recruiting over twenty thousand more nurses and thousands more doctors and building many new hospitals and equipping them with the most up to date equipment, plus updating the older hospitals and treating them to the same upgrades. now we all have to admit that was a grave error of judgment don't we.
Employing about twenty thousand more policemen and thousands of community police and bringing all their equipment up to date.Another total waste of money, wasn't it.
Employing thousands more teachers and teaching assistants, and building many schools and renovating the ones that were falling down,of courese that was your profession wasn't it, so you know that was another grave error. Don't you think?.
Minimum wage, another grave error, we should never have given people in low class jobs a half decent wage should we?,then of course the pensioners four hundred pounds for over eighties and two hundredand fifty pounds for over sixty fives then on top of that he gave the over seventies free TV licences, then this year becase we had a cold spell he gave pensioners another sixty pounds, what a waste of tax payers money,what a bounder.
Of course there are too many errors to name them all but here's a few,
extended maternity leave for mothers and fathers. massively inreased family allowance, family credit, sure start, well I could go on but lets face it every thing he did was an error, and to be fair to the Tories they opposed every one of they above.
They had a much better ideas than that,lets give half the cost of a private operation to all those that could afford the other half, then all those surgeons that were operating on the ones that couldn't afford that luvury would have to wait longer for their operations, but thats fair isn't sicilian? if you have the money then you should expect to be treated better don't you think?. Then of course the Tories had another brain wave lets cut the inheritance tax on two million pound homes, and I guess there must be thousands of them, you can tell that by this election even the working class now know what a wonderful idea that is.
Then to come up to date Gordon Brown had the audacity to have his and his wifes flat kept clean for six thousand pounds,that was terrible.
Dear old Dave only had six hundred pounds for cleaning the wysteria from his home, no comparison is it, of course lets keep the eighty thousand in low key we don't want any questions about that do we?.
And so to the economy to get us out of this recession he's put the country in massive debt and our children and grandchidren will have to replace that cash. it would have been much better to have carried out the Tory policy of doing nothing and allowing the country to free fall into a third world state.Now wouldn't it?.
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@ derekbarker
oh dear oh dear, you keep banging on about how the tories are a "do nothing" party and that Gordon Brown is the only real choice, it seems you've completely missed the entire point. You seem to be the ONLY person on this entire blog thread (and thats out of a lot of people) that seems to still support the "PM" (sic). All this whilst spouting about the stupid masses rolling over to hysteria. You sound precisely like the arrogant, stubborn politician you are trying to defend.
You also say politics is about to get "real"..... well here is some real facts for you:
1. Nobody in the UK's democracy voted for Grodon Brown.
2. Nobody in the UK's democracy voted for his cabinet.
3. Democracy is about voting.
4. We the people shouldn't have to put up with an impotent PM beacuse of an ignorant internet armchair pundit (you).
5. GORDON BROWN WILL RETIRE ON A PRIME MINISTERIAL PENSION (a lot of money)
To be honest, I'm kind of coming to the opinion that's actually you there Gordon, desperately using technology to make your point (youtube style). Democracy is dead, long live democracy.
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This is all about Brown and his toadies`s politicial careers and nothing to do with governing the country.
He does not want the igmany of having to resign - losing at an election seems to be the only way he is going out of No10.
Consequently we will have 12 months of a government in total limbo - unable to put forward anything even slightly contentious before parliament.
Part privatisation of the Post Office is a prime example. There are so many Labour MPs opposed to it, Brown would not even dare putting that to the vote.
He is now so damaged. His MPs no longer fear him. He can no longer influence any of their careers so everytime he tries something they don`t like they will just stick two fingers up at him.
Let`s just hope the EU Election are so appalling for Labour that he may be forced out next week - otherwise I am afraid nothing will get done to sort this country out until the GE next year.
Brown`s standing with people like Obama and the other leaders within the EU must be non existent. Why would any of them wanted to be seen with Brown, let alone doing any business with him.
He is totally finished as a politician - everyone in the UK can see that, except him. He still doesn`t get it.
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Brown must go, but we must get on top someone who can do the job and put all these rats jumping and staying in the ship to where they belong.. they have no right to retain their salaries, allowances, and houses, retirement etc etc.. all they achieved by fraud.. and lets not forget the EU, that is staying quite, because their scam is even bigger.
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Fear tends to concentrate the mind and many MP's must now making the calculations as to their future.
I suspect that for many MP's, the main focus will be on ensuring that they obtain around £100,000 or so in 'earnings' for the coming year.
After which (a General Election), many of them will be contemplating a new career.
So, in all likelyhood, the Prime Minister will probably not face a significant challenge from within and therefore will continue until the last possible moment because there is always the faint possibility that 'something will turn up', maybe even the economy, which would save some (Labour) skins for the next Parliament.
Brown just needs to hold his nerve right now in the face of the baying media, the 'jackals', as described by one Arthur Scargill, which is not an entirely inappropriate description.
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Brown by not calling an early election is protecting the MPs, so that the MPs can support him now.
this is it.. they are all togeter in this mess and they dont want outsiders to discover the scam.. since it may be bigger than we are told.
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Brave Souter. Its all about Brown saving his own face. He is not interested in the people of this country, just in the bigger POWER picture worldwide.
Nobody would have wanted Mandelson now would they? And I see Glenys Kinnock had stood down from the MEP elections. Both of these people have been drafted in to help a desperate man.
Brown is not interested in the public and they have shown they are not interested, nor do they want, HIM. What part of that don't you or he understand?
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Cling-on Gordon should be taken to join Susan Boyle in The Priory.
His selection of Unelected Lord Peter Mandleson and Unelected Sir Alan Sugar to positions of high power, should make us all question his sanity.
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291. At 11:49am on 06 Jun 2009, york1900 wrote
Before any of you say it Yes I am a saddoe who spends time trawling trough EDM's to find out what the MP's are trying to stick on us through the back door
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What is wrong with the British people??? Why is everyone blaming the Labour Government for our economic woes, our curent problems have been created by greedy bankers (does anyone know a Labour banker?). I remember what life was like under a Tory Government .....15% interest rates ,,they abolished the Married couples allowance,,abolished Mortgage tax relief,,Privatised the railways,,Privatised Electricity/Gas/Water,, destroyed our manufacturing base,,Decimated our coal industry and to cap it all put out to tender all services provided by our local councils not to mention creating social housing shortages by enacting "Right to buy" for council tenants and not building more homes. The Conservatives have already mentioned that they will be cutting frontline services and be looking to make major savings across the whole spectrum of Government services..........Most of us will be affected by these plans ...the poor will get poorer and the rich will get richer and all the fat cats of the privatised industries created by the Conservatives will get fatter, so those of you out there who cannot remember what life was like under the Tories then read their past history,maybe then you will have second thoughts on who to vote for at the next general Election...don't say I didn't warn you...........By the way I am not a traditional Labour person nor am I associated to ANY political party, I just want what is good for me and my family................
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Where's the Queen when you need her? She could dissolve parliament now, not for her own sake but for that of the people.
If she did that I think the monarchy would find a new found respect. Nobody wants to overstep their bounds, but it is clear what the majority of the country want
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282 ZaragOn
"The Tories know that they haven't won the General Election yet.... But they have a lot more cause for optimism than the other two main parties. Not that you'd think that from the BBC coverage yesterday."
I couldn't agree more with the final comment you made. The BBC reporting of yesterdays events on here - and on some aspects of the news - was presented in a very strange way, even minsiters resigning be interpreted as some sort of positive, and the clear pounding of New Labour in the local elections being hinted at as some sort of Tory failure. The other TV channel news programmes, and indeed the BBCs Newsnight later on took an altogether more realistic line. Everyone knows that, if you really want to know what's happening in politics then you need to look much further than the BBCs version of events.
I have to say though, Kirsty Wark on Newsnight gave Peter Hain such a hammering that he genuinely looked lost for words and shocked at times. He was trying to defend the goings on in the Labour Party, and he clearly had no idea how badly this denial type politics is playing with the public at the moment. Must have wished he'd stayed out of the way !
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I agree that Brown is the man to lead Labour into the next election. I just wish he'd do it now rather than hanging on and making things worse for a few more months.
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#294
Of course in the past there had to be at least two Lords in the Cabinet: the Leader of the governing party in the upper house and the Lord Chancellor.
The point is now that Brown (and Blair before him, with Adonis) is deliberately choosing unelected "cronies" for key, Departmental, posts which have always been held by MPs who are accountable to and have to report to the House of Commons.
THIS is the fundamentally undemocratic issue. Why could someone from the ranks of Labour MPs not be promoted - after all they have a big group of people with ministerial experience after 12 years in office. And some of the Ministers of State are actually quite good.
Instead Brown has chosen unelected people who have alliegiance only to him and no mandate from anyone...
And losing so many Cabinet ministers to resignations is partly his fault anyway. If he had treated them better...
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An impotent and incompetent Prime Minister who is not even English? Cabinet reshuffle? Unelected Kinnock, Sugar and Mandleson in the cabinet? Who the hell is mismanaging the country?
Do I detect a similarity with Hitler's last hours? G.B. is now hunkered down in the Downing Street bunker surrounded by unelected sycophants and totally blind to any form of reality, The Tories are crossing the Rhine (sorry, Thames) - when on earth is he going to do the decent thing and shoot himself?
This is no more than a case of the partially sighted leading the blind!
G.B. always was a disgrace to the country - he has now turned the office of Prime Minister into a ludicrous farce - and the UK is currently the laughing stock of the world.
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Labour MP Tony Wright says, "People are saying to us 'stop the infighting, stop the caballing, stop the organising against the leadership'." Shows how selective one's hearing can be. What people are really saying is 'For God's sake, GO!!!!!'.
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315. At 12:48pm on 06 Jun 2009, Disgrunt123 wrote:
I can not agree more with you
If the we get Tory Government we will be back to working a 100 hours a week just to pay the bills
I have been there my self do not want to go back to having to do that
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315. At 12:48pm on 06 Jun 2009, Disgrunt123 wrote:
291. At 11:49am on 06 Jun 2009, york1900 wrote: See 291
In 1996 I had to work a 100 hours a week to pay bill as soon as the minimum wage came in I only had to work 40 hours a week to pay bills and any extra hours I worked I could put towards Holidays
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Re:316.
WHERE IS THE QUEEN WHEN YOU NEED HER?
It is in my understanding that The Queen DOE'S HAVE Personal Prerogatives Powers open to her too ask the Prime Minister to dissolve Parliament at any time AGAINST the Prime Ministers wishes should the needs arise.
But there is a matter of what is known as a Constitutional Convention that ALLOWS any sitting Prime Minister ALONE to decide the timing of any General Election.
This constitutional Convention however IS NOT Set in Law, therefore the Qustion that needs to be asked: Is doe's NOW the Queens calling for an immediate dissolvement of Parliament merit this intervention?
My Answer, would be: YES, but then some may beg to differ.
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I think Gordon Brown should stay on a long as possible.
The UK is f#*~!d anyway so another year of Gordon won't matter because it can't get any worse.
Another year of Gordon will ensure The Labour Party is destroyed forever and is never given a third opportunity to bankrupt Great Britain. It messed it up in the 70's and now it's happened again - how many times does this need to happen for us all to realise?
Left wing politics always trips itself up because it's never based on common sense and is usually based on it either being trendy to vote Labour or tribal 'I've always voted Labour so I always will' mentality.
No country will ever reach it's full potential unless people vote based on merit rather than what they've always done.
Tony Blair was admittedly a bit false, but Gordon Brown got in the way of delivering all Blair's best policies out of spite, stupidly thinking he could then be seen to deliver them himself when Tony Blair was hounded from office by ungrateful idiots. So Brown isn't to blame for just a year of damage, he has been directly responsible for damaging Britain ever since Labour came to power. He's never given a s#@t about this country, only himself.
He has also ensured that nobody in England will ever accept a Scottish politician again.
We gave Labour a second chance, including me, and they blew it. But let them destroy themselves completely before we wave the final, and very enjoyable goodbye...
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NOW WE ARE INSULTED BY HAVING THE YOU'RE FIRED MERCHANT IN THE GOVERNMENT
IT'S A BIT LIKE TAKING FAGAN IN AS AN ADVISOR NEEDLESS TO SAY TO TEACH A
FEW MORE DIRTY TRICKS. . .
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THE MIDDLE CLASSES ARE CLOSE TO RIOTING....A FEW MORE WEEKS OF GORDY
COULD WELL IGNITE THE SITUATION....
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306. grandantidote
Hello old sparring partner.
Well I didn't want to rub it in, since I'm sure you are putting a brave face on it as you lick your wounds. I am delighted that Brown received a hammering, I'd be a hypocrite to state otherwise, but I am also happy that Cameron hasn't by any means got it in the bag yet. It is disgusting the weak way he tried to defend Ashcroft, and cannot hand on heart declare his backer keeps his fortune in the UK and pays full taxes. Brown, is even more disgusting, he pretends to be a socialist and sells peerages, the latest to Sugar. How Brown loves wannabes, witness his sympathy for the late Jade Goody, and now his countrywoman Susan Boyle.
I am just going to respond to one statistic in your letter of defence on Nu Socialist spending. Police. The French parents of the poor students who were murdered here are suing the judiciary. The Chief Probation Officer of London resigned, but Jack Straw, the Minister of Justice has glue on his pants and hangs on. If ever there was an "His Master's Voice" chzracter it is this talentless, craven person. All the money poured into policing is money thrown down the drain. Probation staff have said on TV how much of it goes on bureacrosy - surprise - and wasted on Community Support Police. These cheap rate workers have neither the skills, training or power of real police staff and are mainly politically correct appointments. As are the magistrates and judges, who consider prison bed targets and allow maniacs and criminals out too early, or even receive "supervision in the community". More money is thrown away in Education and Health. Yet more half-baked NVQ at the most qualified, care assistants, teaching assistants, nursing assistants, etc. Chemists acting as GPs, checking for STDs and other conditions, the list could go on for ever. I said I would concentrate on just one subject, Policing, so I will leave these other ministries for another time. I just dread the time we will have Vocational crash courses for surgery and dentistry, but no doubt that is also in the pipeline. Despite all this angst - have a good day, and remember no politicians are worth spoiling a weekend!
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welcome back to the reality derekbarker:
labour are finished under brown - a man who has lost all authority and has no ideas for the future.
the remains of brown's cabinet are a wretched collection of serial failures and unelected toadies - not one of them is fit to run the country.
in his disgraceful press conference yesterday afternoon he waffled on about expenses reform - yet is powerless to remove the expenses cheats from his own cabinet.
still, your deluded ramblings are a moment of light relief for the rest of us until we can finish labour off at the general election in 12 months time.
now derek - lets hear about where labours 5% poll lead? were you talking about a 5% poll lead over the lib dems or the tories?
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
Brown could learn a thing or two from Susan Boyle.
She got the publicity without courting it and it frightened her.
He courts the publicity and frightens us.
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I see Glenys Kinnock was berated for her appalling service as an MEP and stood down. Now Brown has made her a Lady in the House of Lords in charge of Europe. You couldn't make it up could you?
Read this:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/8049764.stm
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Isn't it ironic that in Africa - Niger, Togo, Guinea-Bissau for example, the British Govt supports efforts to prevent countries from manipulating their constitutions so their leaders can cling to power. These countries are places where the "leader" appoints "cronies" to firm his position - in opposition to democratic principles that they say they abide by.
Notice the similarities?
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314. At 12:42pm on 06 Jun 2009, york1900 wrote:
291. At 11:49am on 06 Jun 2009, york1900 wrote
Before any of you say it Yes I am a saddoe who spends time trawling trough EDM's to find out what the MP's are trying to stick on us through the back door
===
More power to your elbow for doing so, even if I disagree with a lot of what you say.
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320 ceylonJOHN
SO WELL PUT:WHAT'S A BULLET BETWEEN FRIENDS;GORDY MANDY TONY JACK ALLY
ETC ETC. . .
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Looks like the turkeys delayed Christmas.
Not a single councilor are they not ashamed? Obviously Gordon Brown doesn't think anything is wrong and how on Earth are they going to fix this in time for the election, this guys a ruler not a leader, I don't want him lecturing me on democracy, I wasn't given the opportunity to vote for his party as leader... he was forced upon us.
The reshuffle is pathetic with more unelected people.... getting folks from the Job Center would have been far better.
It was McBride and now its Sugar spot the difference are they both not bully's or does this indicate Peter Mandelson hasn't the 'foggiest'?
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@328.
'As are the magistrates and judges, who consider prison bed targets and allow maniacs and criminals out too early'
But heaven forbid you can not pay your council tax and a cell soon turns up, quicker than you can say 'Jack Straw's a useless g#t'
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320. Ceylonjohn
It's a sorry state of affairs, and I agree with you about the similarity of the bunker situation. Alas, the evil Hitler at least had his Eva, this miserable GB has even been deserted by Jack-Boot Jaqui.
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331. flamepatricia
Good day Patricia,
That comment was pure Oscar Wilde in its biting wit. I'm sure the other one that was 'moderated' was equally good.
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The only sad thing about all this is that when Labour eventually lose power next year, we'll have 4 years of terrible Conservative rule to look forward to.
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
315. At 12:48pm on 06 Jun 2009, Disgrunt123 wrote:
What is wrong with the British people??? Why is everyone blaming the Labour Government for our economic woes, our curent problems have been created by greedy bankers (does anyone know a Labour banker?).
===
*Lord Myners, Sir Fred Goodwin, Baron Davies....How many would you like?
===
I remember what life was like under a Tory Government .....15% interest rates ,,they abolished the Married couples allowance,,abolished Mortgage tax relief,
===
*MIRAS was completely abolished in April 2000 by then Chancellor of the Exchequer (now Prime Minister) Gordon Brown who argued it had become a Middle Class perk.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortgage_Interest_Relief_At_Source
===
But are you old enough to remember the last time that the UK had to be bailed out by the IMF, or when inflation hit 26%?
By the way I am not a traditional Labour person nor am I associated to ANY political party, I just want what is good for you and your family................
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#191 BNP
In terms of twisting the general public's arms behind their backs, & beating everyone to a pulp, they're even closer to the hardline than Gord or Maggie!
Besides, with that political position, how could a person possibly vote for a party, whose chairman, when put together, has the first two letters of each his first & last names read as THAT!? Talk about preaching purity!
I mean, it's just not RIGHT!
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WHY IS BROWN IN NORMANDY HE DOES NOT REPRESENT THE PEOPLE.
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Ceylonjohn,
I hate to have to tell you this, but there is no such place as Ceylon, it does not exist, John
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The lumbering, festering hulk that once was the good ship New Labour, is languishing anchored just off of the shoreline, unable to dock. There is no wind in its shredded sails, its moral compass is broken. Its once devastating firepower lies rusty and forlorn, having run out of ammunition long ago.
It is quarantined, its crew afflicted with a malaise that has seen it's captain ravaged by fever and indecision. With a madness worthy of Bligh himself, Captain Brown refuses to unlash himself from the wheel until the rotten, cankered hull is driven firmly onto the rocks. Officers have thrown themselves overboard to swim away to serve another captain, or sink without trace, rather than serve another minute under Captain Brown.
In a bid to rid themselves of this eyesore and put the wretched crew out of their misery, the citizens of the mainland volleyed a broadside at the hulk this week, delivering mortal blows to the rotten timberwork and forcing more crew to jump ship. The ship took on a perilous list, but Captain Brown in reply reshuffled his crew to counterbalance the effects, unfathomably promoting some of the scurviest seadogs to the Captain's table.
This Sunday provides another broadside from landward as the townsfolk attempt to land a mortal blow. Hopeful that if the ship can't be sunk immediately a mutiny will be affected and the new Captain will usher in more decent, honourable actions.
Even now, there are rumours that a crewmember, possibly the Captain himself, has lit a fuse in the magazine to blow the once proud ship New Labour to smithereens.
It can't come a moment too soon.
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315. At 12:48pm on 06 Jun 2009, Disgrunt123 wrote:
... The Conservatives have already mentioned that they will be cutting frontline services and be looking to make major savings across the whole spectrum of Government services..........Most of us will be affected by these plans
===
This may be news to you but Labour are also CUTTING public spending by GBP20 BILLION a year, it's just that they lie to you about it. Even yesterday Gordon Brown lied about the spending cuts hidden away in the Budget.
http://www.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/3674858/facing-browns-spending-deceptions.thtml
http://www.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/3560461/significant-cuts-are-hidden-away-in-the-budget.thtml
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I love reading the ti-raid of comments to remove Brown...it reminds me of how the supports of the football team I support react when the team does not win everything....all want him out and a new manager asap...(and John Reid is not the answer either...they say!?)...its depressing... who would want the job in charge...even if you have given your whole working life to public service (unlike some of the ones currently posturing for some limelight)...right now Brown could walk away and be courted by the best financial institutions in the world for silly money...he is probably the most employable PM in recent times due to his ability...ok he is not loved..that was always his problem...."no media likability"....Blair had that is spade loads (O how I wish John Smith had lived on)...but behind it all he spent most of the time keeping everyone happy...Cameron will be the same...If Brown had the Obahma media factor I believe he would have been the best PM this country has seen in a long time...unfortunately we are a country of 'Britain got talent!?' PM pickers.
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
So there are now seven unelected Cabinet Ministers: Mandelson, Adonis, Malloch-Brown, Drayson, Scotland, Royall, Kinnock.
This is not democracy.
Revolution NOW!
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As one of the political commentators said yesterday the choice facing The Labour Party is a stark one, endure a slow painful death with Gordon Brown at the helm or a quick execution at an early General Election with someone like Alan Johnson in charge. The consensus of opinion seems to be that they will go with the former but you never know.
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The elevation of the unelected Mandelson to a virtual Deputy position is appalling. On top of that we have Glenys Kinnock and Alan Sugar. The Cabinet is fast becoming an unelected quango that makes a mockery of democracy. We can only hope that the Labour MPs, on their return, will rally to James Purnell's call for Brown to step down.
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#348 wrote:
'right now Brown could walk away and be courted by the best financial institutions in the world for silly money...he is probably the most employable PM in recent times due to his ability'.
I'm sorry I must have missed something in all of this. What ability? The man has helped to run the country into the ground!
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nick brown has not survived , he just has no honour, he is delusional as is the BBC it appears, and his party is full of corrupt self serving miscreants with no cajones, but we the people know and we will not let him carry on, if vote of no confidence next week fails, we will take to the streets.
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delpius @346:
Nice maritime analogy!
A simpler one but equally apt might involve rats fleeing a sinking ship.
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Good afternoon, Phoenix.
I can't remember what the moderated one was but once they email me on I will see what it was they found so "offensive".
Couldn't be more offensive than Brown thinking he knows better than we do what is best for us.
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we will tear him down utter utter embarrassment
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Re, 333.
What really must be ironic is that in the U.K. Today WE,THE PEOPLE do NOT have ANY Legislation Setting Out a British Written Constitution FOR OURSELVES, while and at the very same time our Government continues to tell the Rest of the World the errors of its ways, forever forsaking its own People ie, YOU AND ME with the same respect.
Britain doe's have the Oldest and most outdated Democracy in the Western World, with a Museum piece of a building for an outdated Parliament full of self selving M.P.s'.
Are we behind the Times, for in the U.K. we have NEVER been WITH the Times.
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why has my comment @357been moderated, brown absolutely humiliated and embarrassed our great nation with his speech, his slip of the tongue moment according to the BBC, renaming Omaha Beach Obama Beach is unforgivable, and surely as a British subject i should be entitled to say so on a public funded comment board.
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#348
It is good to have one voice of sensibility amongst all those scapegoating Brown for the sins of the world. And your football analogy is apposite.
Brown arrives as a Labour Chancellor in 1997 amid cries of we need deregulation, growth, and support for entrepreneurs. So what does Brown do? He gives them what they want and off they go to make money by any means except hard work. They fill London and the South East to the brim, pushing up house prices so high that even a box room located twenty miles from central London will set you back £125k. The property boom breeds new "business supremos" getting rich on rentals and working all of one day a week.
We have the stocks and shares brigade, and the gamblers paradise whose enlargement was narrowly averted by a Presbyterian with the courage to say No (and who be that?). We ship jobs abroad, mechanise anything and everything that can be mechanised and send those made jobless off to serve in KFC, McD or a pizza shooter. Our tradesmen are elbowed out of the way by black economy infiltrators from the EU as companies cook the books through sub-sub-sub contracts, and our construction industry falls apart. The dole queues get larger and the voices get louder about the work shy.
And then suddenly the bubble bursts and these arrogant people find themselves joining the dole queues and asking the questions about how their mortgages are going to be paid for them. "Never been out of work before in my life" is the cry. The tears get bigger as they face the reality of pittance benefit and shabbier training or reskilling opportunities. And all because for eleven years they haven't been paying attention.
"It isn't my fault, its that nasty Mr Brown. He is such an unpleasant man. No charisma. Clever mind but no personality."
What none of you seem to get is that had the Tories continued in power from 1997 to now the same damned things would have happened simply because the capitalist world was kidding itself and cheating anyone it could get to listen. It isn't socialism that has brought us to our knees it is greed. It isn't Brown you should be angry with it is your damned selfish and greedy selves. Thatcher staunched the idea of a greater "we" and introduced a whole bunch of people for whom the only word in the English language that mattered was "me".
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The Ruler
Wrong Boyo start all over again
Some day you are going to fall
Why do you lie steal cheat and deceit
and try to trample people under your feet
you better stop it is the wrong 'em boyo
so you start again all over again
play it philistines play it philistines
and we will have a right 'em boyo
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
It was interesting to hear Alan Sugar's own explanation on his appointment. In summary he said he didn't any point in having an election until we had and knew we had a honest and decent bunch of politicians to vote for. (Clean Up). Secondly, he wants to 'help' Whitehall officials to get to grips with business and innovation. (Do a decent job ...or...). I agree with both.
By honest and decent, I would also include the the business of excluding the evidently self-serving.
The people of this nation deserve better...and it will take more then a 'snap' election to set the scene. Get on with it Gordon- and then go when the country tells you....or your wife!
Jtrevm.
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@derekbarker, you must be blind, live in another country, or both.
All the parties are morally bankrupt, they are all in the pockets of the corporations, people don't seem to realize this.
Lawful rebellion, [google it] could be an excellent option for all people that care about this country and it's people.
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Labour simply has no history of deposing its leaders. Brown is safe. Johnson wont take the job and the PLP wont have David Milliband.
The media frenzy will subside and doing the right thing will resonate with voters in due time. Cameron and the media are desperate to topple Brown at which time Labour would have to call a GE and be annihilated. This will not happen. The economy will turn in the next 12 months and Brown has the opportunity to clean up Parliament as well. Changing the voting system wouldn't go amiss either.
Monday night's PLP meeting is the last chance to finish Gordon. IT WILL NOT HAPPEN.
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161. At 11:50pm on 05 Jun 2009, derekbarker wrote:
Almost the 6th of June D-Day remembrance tomorrow folks!
A time when people got behind their leader for the good of all Britain!
Just witness the voting of local councils? nothing short than mass hysteria.
-----------------------------------------------------------
That's exactly what Mugabe would say.
"I am the best man to lead the country"
"Now is the time to pull behind your leader"
"Anybody who criticises me doesn't have the best interests of the country at heart"
It's only a small step from that nonsense to imprisoning dissentor's for "Treason" and banning all demonstrations.... oh they did that already.
Yes, I think Gordon's "Going Postal", Barricades on Downing Street "Come and get me copper!" is the cry.
All silliness aside, if rank and file labourites think everything is rosy they are bonkers. Do they not see that for the first time ever they run ZERO councils. All thanks to Crash and his policies.
Actually he can stay come to think of it.......Meltdown is assured.
You'll never take me alive!!!!!!!aaaaaargh.
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#182 Ash
"Why are the British public so stupid?"
==========
Speak for yourself, Ash.
AD in the last Budget has already confirmed that NI contributions will increase; if you regard tax as paying more money from earnings, this is a tax.
The Budget forecasts show 'in writing' albeit in small print that public sector cuts will have to be made if Labour are still in power. Fraser Nelson asked the PM twice yesterday to confirm that these cuts would not be made; twice he confirmed this to be true which will now compromises GB's Presbyterian conscience. In effcet he lied twice and on the record.
The Tories call them tax cuts; New Labour as you would expect calls the same thing waste management.
The public really will be proved to be stupid if they think that taxes will not go up and that there will be no cuts in the public sector.
If you are spending more than you earn, no matter how much the economy improves, you have to cut back regardless of which party you support.
Also if you have borrowed the largest amount of money in history, at some stage it will have to be paid back.
If Crash had firstly not created fantasy money from a credit bubble, and secondly had kept back some of the surplus when the fantasy money rolled in, we would not be in such a bad mess as we are.
GB and Bush led the way on sub-prime and could have held it back but either did not understand the situation or turned a blind eye to benefit from the credit boom.
A recession was always coming and it happened to coincide with the banking crisis caused by the credit bubble.
I would have an ounce of sympathy for GB if only he would admit his involvement in creating the credit bubble but since he either can't admit this or doesn't see he is at fault, I have absolutely no faith in him to put the situation right.
The current recession started around June 2007 so whether it is Brown, Cameron, Clegg, me, you or anyone on this blog, if you wait long enough, normal market forces will see a recovery; politicians can make a difference but with or without them the economy will recover.
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What I find amazing and pathetic is the way some political observers and commentators latch on to non factually proven statements, twist them around to their own political motivations and then completely and utterly choose to ignore the real truth to suit their own ends to completely confuse and deceive the general public.........Long live Labour........
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@361 and 348
what's that then, the Obama Beach effect, also i think you will find it was the changes and the decision's of this labour government over the last 12 years, that caused many of our problems, mass immigration, intolerance, increased terror threats, diluted education, and yes the economy, there may have been a 'global credit crunch' but 12 years of brown ensured the British suffered.
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It seems that those backbenchers still considering whether to depose Brown are thinking more about themselves than what is good for the country. There was a time when changing direction would have helped, but they all stayed quiet to avoid damaging their promotional prospects. But it's much too late now.
Where were these brave 'rebels' when Brown decided to break Labour's manifesto promise of a referendum on the EU constitutional Treaty?
Where were these rebels when Brown pushed through plans for ID cards? Where were they when Labour introduced powers to let local councils snoop on individuals and intercept emails?
Where were they when Labour triggered the beginning of the break up of the United Kingdom by granting one-sided devolution for Scotland but not England?
The fact that Caroline Flint 'supported' the Prime Minister while hoping for a promotion, but condemns him when she doesn't get it only highlights the fact that these Labour MPs are entirely self-serving.
To hear unelected Mandelson telling us Labour will bring in constitutional change sets alarm bells ringing. Even if Labour hangs on to the bitter end, they have no mandate to change the constitution. If changes are to be considered, they should be put to the people in a manifesto - not rushed through by a doomed an unpopular government in its dying days.
We badly need a change and the sooner the better. But if Labour MPs think foisting another unelected Prime Minister on us will suffice, they are deluding themselves. If they had any real courage, they would be telling Brown to call a general election.
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#360
"humiliated and embarrassed"
You are obviously very easy to humiliate and/or embarrassed, even the Queen has similar slips of the tongue, but never mind you have put your opinion on record - and on that subject, in my experience it's often not what you say that gets moderated but how you say it.
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Mandelson is a total farce and has achieved nothing when he was in EU, so they had to move him to another position, and keeps changeing positions so no one notice that he is doing nothing, but milking the system.. since he is a friend of Brown and in the elite circle.. they have all their friends up there in the jobs.. so no one will dare to tell anything about the other.. they have all a finger in the scam.. so they cannot put themselves in prison..
does anyone knows that for getting a public job, first it should be published in public for everyone to apply, but they already have the candidate, and guess what.. this is the system we live in.
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I think the most distressing and damning central feature of this is not that Gordon says he's capable of sorting out the mess, it's that the mess happened on his watch.
In any other occupation, that would be a disciplinary offence...
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Re. 361.
Yes,I agree with your opinion for in my mind New Labour was and ALWAYS has been a near Conservative Party in as much that it had to appease those of the City Classes to come onboard by ditching traditional Old Labour values and ideas as far as possible while trying to maintain a vision within the Labour movement that by being a more Centre Party everything will work out fine for the Blue Collar Working Classes.
This worked quite well until the EEC was opened up allowing an even Poorer Class of Worker into the U.K. who set about undercutting Wages and Investments using what before Pre 1987 has only been tactics seen in the form of Scab Labour during the Miners Strike during the pervious Thatcher Years, which we will undoubtingly will return to under any future Conservative Government, if only for any Employers to further maxinmise THEIR wealth prospect for the few, by the hard Labour of the many.
So in any events for the future either under New Labour, or the Conservatives you will still have the ME, ME'S around in full swing, investing in themselves and working one hour a Day, then down to the Golf Course for a 7 hour lunch break.
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353 sicilian
#I'm sorry I must have missed something in all of this.
You often do old chap thats your problem.
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In a world of semantics and second guessing, it occurs to me that, no matter how much I find the presumption, arrogance and delusion behind the phrase sickening, instead of 'the people want me/us to get on with the job' it might be a tad more encouraging if the person using it tried (and believed) 'the public would like me/us to start* doing a GOOD job'.
Otherwise, they may well be being totally honest (for a change), but on past evidence, not exactly encouraging.
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Post #361
I actually don't think that Brown is entirely responsible for creating the financial crisis by himself. I think that we would have had big problems whichever leader/party we had in power. However, I do BLAME Brown 100% for our country being very poorly placed to weather this crisis than most other western European countries.
I also don't think that even bigger borrowing by the treasury for bigger public spending is the correct strategy to get us out of this hole. Brown is on the wrong course - he has been spending public money like there is no tomorrow and when he is faced with the current financial crisis he thinks the solution will be provided by even bigger spending.
As for the comment in Post #361:
"Brown arrives as a Labour Chancellor in 1997 amid cries of we need deregulation, growth, and support for entrepreneurs. So what does Brown do? He gives them what they want and off they go to make money by any means except hard work."
Well doesn't this statement alone contradict the general thrust of Post #361's point that Brown is not responsible in any way? It seems to me that we had TEN years of Brown crowing about how great the economy had become under his watch. Now things have gone pear-shaped it's someone else's fault according to him and his dwindling supporters, Was Brown telling porkies then or is he being untruthful now? You can't have it both ways #361! It's also time to stop blaming previous goverments when you've been in power or been Chancellor for the last 12+ years.
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Ah, Forensix, youre a funny man, you cheered me up no end...
"a Presbyterian with the courage to say No" hahahahahaha, brilliant!!!
"We ship jobs abroad, mechanise anything and everything that can be mechanised and send those made jobless off to serve in KFC, McD or a pizza shooter. Our tradesmen are elbowed out of the way by black economy infiltrators from the EU as companies cook the books through sub-sub-sub contracts, and our construction industry falls apart. The dole queues get larger and the voices get louder about the work shy."
And just who's watch do you think all this happened on? Just who'se over complicated tax regime was in place? Just who'se social engineering by signing up to the EU's charter resisted by the last tory lot was in place to allow every man and his dog in, undercutting any local workers? Just who'se benefit dependant, button-pushing culture do you think allowed all this to grow?
Who could have done something about the construction industry building up huge landbanks while building slowly to artificially keep house prices high? Who could have done something about the planning processes, tax breaks for using brown field land, who could have done something about all this?
Who though, didnt give a stuff so long as he was stuffing new Labour's pockets full of tax revenue? Who didnt give a stuff so long as he got to be top dog?
Who is currently wrapped around the partys neck like a wingless albatross dragging them into oblivion?
You cant blame that on the tories. All stuff that happened on NL's watch, they had time and chance to sort it out and didnt.
The only thing that Presbyterina has got the courage to say no to is an election where he knows he will get his butt kicked all the way back to Kircaldy and oblivion. The only thing he gives a stuff about is saving his own bacon. I mean for gods sake, Alan Sugar?? Glenys Kinnock?? What in the name of hells teeth is going on in there?
To the Labour apologists: You might think theres an upturn coming, but you wait until the public truly grasps the scale of the bill you have left their kids and grandkids to buy your way out of a self inflicted meltdown. You wait til inflation boomerangs upwards next year, taking interest rates skywards with it.
You cant keep on putting off Christmas for ever you know. Its going to come, not soon enough but it will come. And when it does, your goose will be right royally cooked for another generation.
Enjoy lying to the public and deluding yourselves while you can guys.
The clock is ticking.
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I have found an extremely interesting Report on the UK MEPs performance in the European Parliament commissioned by the Tax Payers Association. It has reviewed the performance of each MEP and ranked them on the basis of their performance.
Top performer was J. Allister (Ulster) with 6 CONS, 1 UKIP, 1 LibDem and 1 Green in the top ten. The bottom 10 is revealing; 1 Con, 1 LibDem, 1 Independent and 7 (yes seven) LAB. Glynis Kinnock (now Lady Kinnock, Minister for Europe - Yes indeed) being very near the bottom.
The Labour Party claims to be representing our interests in Europe but this performance of the Labour representatives give the lie direct to that claim.
The debate on the Gravy Train where Reforms proposed the replacement of blank cheques for MEP travel with payment for receipts, an audit of MEP second pensions, reform of the sanctions system for fraudsters, and an end to the Strasbourg commute was OPPOSED by Kinnock (a surprise ??? I think not)
A Motion of Censure against Barroso ( the leader of the Commission whose accounts WERE NOT AUDITED) was OPPOSED by Kinnock
Citizens For Europe Programme: provides for large amounts of money to go towards pro-EU cheerleaders ....... This waste of money was supported by Kinnock.
Rules changed to block filibuster 31 January 2008
Opponents of the Lisbon Treaty used the procedural rules to slightly delay the passage of the EPs ratification of the Lisbon Treaty, as a one-off protest at the way in which No votes in
referenda were being suppressed.
In reaction, the pro-integration lobby decided on a shameful ad hoc change of the rules to suppress this legal opposition. A vote against the motion, to retain the existing rules rather than change them ad hoc to stifle dissent. Again Kinnock voted for the motion
And so it goes on. Looking after the interests of the UK public which was massively against Lisbon and other issues was clearly not supported by Kinnock.
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#376:
grandy old fellow I think you'll find you're backing the wrong horse! Yet another personal comment doesn't really befit a gentleman!
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#366:
Not one political commentator shares your daft optimism. Gordon Brown is toast. Take it from me!
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#376:
Incidentally the problem you speak of is shared by millions of others so there may be an epidemic. I know you think highly of your hero Brown but there are not many who share your view as the election results on Thursday indicated.
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Re. 373.
Public positions for work places or appointments are normally advertised internally before they go out to Job Centres, whereby once they are past onto Job Centres these Vacancies have already been filled internally, and the Jobless spend all their time filling out worthless CVs, and going around trying to find a Job that has ALREADY been filled and taken.
This is nearly always the outcome of any Case in practise.
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The real danger to the Labour Party in future elections is their core voter turnout. On Thursday some voted for them or other parties, but a significant number did not. At a time and even before the expenses revelations there is a fundamental disengagement between the populace and politicians.
Labour basically won 3 GEs on the trot thanks to high turnouts. Voter apathy is a dangerous malady, in that not voting once easily becomes twice and then a third time. The second thing that will make it harder to get the core vote back, is that the workers in the field are usually led by local councillors who organise the party volunteers. the councillors have been whittled back in successive local elections.
At a national level the party is organised reasonably well, but the disparity between local and national has never been greater. Even if the government turned things round which is debateable, at election time the local constituencies may not be able to galvanize the voters to care again. True the expenses issue hits all the parties, but Brown by saying only he can fix things is putting himself in a very tight corner. He will not get away with saying that Cameron and Clegg did not cooperate with his plan, because labour voters will simply not vote. So now he has to deliver.
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328 Poenixarisonq
Good afternoon old chap,
Nah! I'm not licking any wounds, I don't exp[ect to be around long enough for any of this to effect me to much, I just feel sorry for all the fools that voted conservative yesterday if they haven't learnt their lessons from the past it looks like their going to learn it in the future, God bless em. I have no quarrel with bringing in Sugar or Kinnoch infact as far as I am concerned they could bring in Quasimodo as long as it was for the good of the country, of course it would offend the sensitivities of many on here that seem to want to judge a man by his appearance than his ability.
I can't agree with you regarding hospitals both my wife and I have spent time in hospitals, that is prior 1997 and up to recently, the change has been incredible, almost like stepping into a time machine, hospitals now are so well equipped and nurses doctors and indeed all the staff are so much more obliging, as my wife said about a recent stay in hospital, its almost like being in a hotel, even a choice of three different menu's for every meal with coffee or tea breaks in between, a damn sight better that pre 1997 I can assure you,
As for the appalling attack on the two french lads, I know we always want to lay the blame on someone,I'm not quite sure why Jack Straw should get the blame, that doesn't make sense to me, I am afraid that the blame lies with the two creatures that did this to them, and in the one case the disgusting family that dragged him up, in which case you could say that the Tories were to blame because he was raised on their watch, but no they were not to blame no more than Jack Straw, the mistakes were made much lower down the scale than that,no my friend the people to blame are the maniacs that did this, and I hpe they never get out and are never allowed to mix with other prisoners.
I have nothing but praise for the police in my area and also the community police, they appear to do a stirling job.
338
#this miserable GB has even been deserted by Jack-Boot Jaqui.
your slipping old chap, never mind jackboot jackie, why did he let the delectable Ms Flint out of the bunker.
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189. At 03:48am on 06 Jun 2009, hyperNali wrote:
Well said....for once a balanced view... and one many people share. Its a british thing to knock people down who do not have X factor. Brown does the business...and he is straight. The labour government has run its time but Cameron and co will have the country all over the place for the next 4 years.
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Poor old Mr Brown stands indicted by Middle England on the charge of single-handedly causing the economic crisis that is afflicting Blighty, for the severity of which he must bear, admittedly, some responsibility, although one does not notice him doing so. Poor old Mr Brown is also blamed by Middle England for the political crisis resulting from the decadence and corruption of the UK parliament. And yet he soldiers on, promising to finish the job to which he has set his hand with Churchillian resolution despite the fact that all that he touches is turning to dust.
Soon Middle England will elect a Tory UK government in the vain hope that the Cameronians will be able to sort out the mess, finance the mind-boggling deficits, re-industrialize de-industrialized Blighty, take action against rampant unemployment, which is making your broken society even more nauseatingly distasteful to contemplate than it already was, ban Scots from UK public office and restore the fortunes of the City while recovering from the acute embarrassment of being beaten by the Dutch at cricket. Beaten by the Dutch at cricket! You are in a bad way.
The best of British luck, old boys.
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383 sicilian
#but there are not many who share your view as the election results on Thursday indicated.
Assuming that there were a hundred people voting and the winner got 55 of the votes the loser still had 45 of the votes, rather destroys your argument doesn't it?.
381
grandy old fellow I think you'll find you're backing the wrong horse! Yet another personal comment doesn't really befit a gentleman!
Who said I was a gentleman!
I'm just here to have fun, if that winds you up, thats a bonus.
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While I agree that Gordon Brown and Labour have run their course, and have destroyed the country, brought politics into disrepute and made us a laughing stock the world over, would the Tories be any better, I find them equally as unlikeable as I do Brown , Balls, Mandy and co, and The Lib-Dems are just too wishy washy. It's no wonder voter turnout is so low, when there is no viable alternative on the slip, maybe 'non of the above' would send the right message
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Come on chaps! Unless there are a load of wind up merchants out there doing it for some kind of strange amusement, can we stop the my gang is better than your gang threads please?
None of them are any bloody good but there is no point in wasting energy trying to topple those that aint in power is there?
Showing how a bad govt can be forced out just might make any replacement think a bit. Yes its a big MIGHT.
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The appointment of S'ralan and Glenys Kinnock to the government shows a bizarre disregard verging on contempt for Labour backbenchers, parliament and the British people.
1. Backbenchers are effectively being told "none of you are good enough for government" - hardly likely to engender party loyalty;
2. More ministers are being appointed who will not have to face the scrutiny of the commons and therefore can only be questioned by select committee rather than the full house; and
3. As 1 above, the British people are being told that the calibre of the average Labour backbencher is not up to much - not a great message to send in the run-up to a general election.
As to the appointments, Lord S'ralan may be another attempt at popularism, but like YouTube will turn round to bite him. I expect every investigative journalist from right and left alike will be looking at his employment practices particularly in the early days, for evidence of anti-unionism or anything that looks vaguely like a sweatshop operation.
As to Glenys, with a likely high vote for UKIP in the Euro-election, and an arrogant refusal to let the people have their say on Lisbon, appointing someone who has gone native in Brussels, looks like an act of staggering stupidity.
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@ 361
What none of you seem to get is that had the Clowns continued in power from 1997 to now the same damned things would have happened
that's a very fair assumption (it's almost certainly true) but it's irrelevant - doesn't matter - what matters is what's going to happen from now on - the choice for the future is what counts - do we want a government who will balance the imperative to make some cuts and reduce the debt, with the need to support the economy and protect the most vulnerable? - or would we rather have one who will make bigger cuts to pay down the debt a bit quicker, and (if they have anything to spare) will tend to prioritise tax cuts? ... gee, that was a less than exciting experience, typing that ... bored myself silly ... hardly keep my eyes open now
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
My fear is that through all this present Governmental strife and all those so called Brains of Britain who are our leaders and who are meant to keep us on their straight and narrow path of enrichment and success. How did we get lost! We have no strong stalwart leader, his followers are selfish, withering, weak, sunken, and corrupted through the temptations of power and gold. So then who is going to lead us? We may as well use postmen, shipbuilders, barstaff, union men, teachers WAIT A MINUTE ! They are the present Government....we are DOOMED
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#389:
Fair enough. If you're just having fun I undertake never again to respond to any of your posts. I can see from your comments relating to Gordon Brown that you're not really being serious. ttfn.
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Nick, on the offchance you read these comments, may I make a suggestion.
I am sure all you reporters want to be the one who delivers the coup de grace at GBs press conferences. He cleverly stops you by limiting you to one question.
He lies in reply and you have no comeback. Respect for the poor chap who tried. So, stating the bleeding obvious really, you get together and work out a question strategy. So when you get a lie in response to your question the next one chosen to address the exalted one, hammers the point home again. And again and again if necessary.
Share the glory chaps, its the only way you might get the truth.
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386. grandantidote wrote:
328 Poenixarisonq
Good afternoon old chap,
Nah! I'm not licking any wounds, I don't exp[ect to be around long enough for any of this to effect me to much,
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Dont be daft! Only the good die young, so you and I should still be rattling the keyboards, or whatever takes their place, for years to come.
Minister Jack Straw is the Justice Minister and as chief of the judiciary, the buck stops with him. Of course those evil maniacs did the killing, but who let them out and why? Same situation that caused the death of poor Baby P. Complacent, arrogant officials and untrained, poorly paid field staff. Judges and magistrates who award lenient sentences because its politically deemed. Well that's what I think, you believe otherwise. I wish we lived in your area. The hospitals here are not very clean. Its very hard to get an appointment with one's regular doctor, and for the elderly, medical care is really negligent and uncaring. The food is so bad that patients rely on their families bringing it in. For those unlucky enough to be without family or friends, they can slowly starve to death. Even if they wanted to eat, there is no staff to sit beside them and spoonfeed them if they are too weak to eat alone. The best thing is to live well, and try and keep out of the hands of the doctors and hospitals.
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As soon as Labour MPs realise that they don't have anyone in the cabinet who is willing to take on the 'unkillable' Peter Mandelson, who is Prime Minister in all but name, and even if they did no one could overcome his 'good cop / bad cop' ability to be as nice with patronage and nasty with dirty tricks, they will soon realise that Gordon Brown is the only show in town, and that they had better get on the only train. Otherwise they will be left out in the cold wilderness, alone and defenceless.
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I HAVE CAREFULLY REWORDED MY COMMENT WHICH HAS TWICE GIVEN OFFENCE: SORRY, BUT I REALLY DON'T KNOW WHAT I SAID WRONG.
360. At 3:12pm on 06 Jun 2009, tisfedup wrote:
why has my comment @357been moderated, brown absolutely humiliated and embarrassed our great nation with his speech, his slip of the tongue moment according to the BBC, renaming Omaha Beach Obama Beach is unforgivable, and surely as a British subject i should be entitled to say so on a public funded comment board.
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Same as my comment #349 which was removed. I didn't embarrass anybody as much as GB has done. Can you imagine Michelle chuckling with her husband tonight, and also Charles and Camilla? No disrespect for the veterans, the only disrespect shown to them is that after fighting for freedom and democracy, they have to see an unelected Prime Minister who doesn't even know the name of a famous beach. Pathetic!
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#393 Saga
I seriously doubt there will be an option to reduce tax when the Tories come to power [taken as read now] because of the state of public finances - nor do I believe there will be wholesale cuts in services because the public would not tolerate it.
I would guess the Holy Grail of public sector pensions will be a prime target as the present two tier system of public vs private pensions is untenable.
This week many more organisations have closed their final pension schemes because they are simply unaffordable.
I don't know the exact figure but somewhere between 40-50% of our Council Tax services the local government pensions and when some of the people paying this unfair tax are living off meagre pensions themselves it hardly seems fair.
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I saw the entire press conference. It was astonishing! A nervous breakdown before our eyes, he gave us denial, delusion and dishonesty. He said the reshuffle had been "conducted in a calm and ordered manner"!!! This at the exact same time Caroline Flint was resigning!!! Please upload a video of the entire thing to your web site so the whole of Britain can be in no doubt of the man's state of mind.
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This is all very interesting and even funny BUT...can anyone give me one just one credible name that could take over from Brown?
Please don't show your self by saying Cameron because thats not even funny.
He maybe the best of a bad bunch but Brown is by far the best man for the job in hand.
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396 sicilian
#Fair enough. If you're just having fun I undertake never again to respond to any of your posts. I can see from your comments relating to Gordon Brown that you're not really being serious. ttfn.
Oh! come on Dutch you've promised me that before but you never keep your promise, you can't resist having a go at me no more than I can resist having a go at you, don't be so pompous.
I thought that you were on here to have fun, judging by your posts it seemed to me you were having a whale of a time, never thought for one moment you were serious.
TTFN old Tommy Handly stuff, well Mine back to you would be "Can I do you now sir " did I see a little smile, now come on tell the truth!.
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unionjock @404 asks:
" ...can anyone give me one just one credible name that could take over from Brown?"
Answer: a pig's head on a stick, for starters. (And in any election, it would win more votes than Brown).
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401 phoenixarisonq
Oh! come on phoenix have you never made a mistake, just remember whether you like him or not the man at this moment in time is under a massive mental strain, don't play party politics with every single thing he does,"Did you notice he straightened his tie three times" give the man a break old chap.
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#379
Glad I cheered you up or at least raised a laugh.
I am not a supporter of NL or an apologist for them, nor am I a supporter of Brown. What I am is a pragmatist who happens to note that on "NL's Watch" (as you must have it) there was enormous accumulation of corporate wealth in the US, in Europe, in China, in Russia and in the Middle East. In the case of the US, the UK and most of Europe this accumulation was false book wealth hedged against a massive debt that was started by Thatcher with her Council House car-boot sale. There was no real growth at all just the fictitious profiling of it. All this was done under the gaze of incredibly able (so they claimed) economists only a few of whom actually realised what was going on. They were quickly passed off as idiots.
Exaggerating assets is nothing new in commerce but the levels attained even as early as three years into NL's regime (i.e. from actions taken prior to 1997) and reported by some wiser economists. Prior to Enron's collapse in 2001 some academics claimed that the "paper accounts" could not be truthful but they were dismissed. Much of this was predicted in the mid-nineties when suspect deals had been noted in the USA. In 2000 there were even reports of "sub-prime dangers" with property prices showing strangely erratic patterns.
New Labour's mistake (Brown was as guilty as Blair) was to accept the Tory spending plans for the first two years of their government instead of building social and affordable housing for the many who were already struggling to afford mortgages in some parts of the UK. If house construction had been driven properly then many companies who were using similar processes as Enron would not have got away with such high asset reports. Instead Blair was already committed to health, education and law and order, expenditure which generates much less in return than property building.
New Labour's mistake highlights Blair's duplicity. He wanted kudos but he didn't want to risk upsetting his cronies in the property field (i.e. banks and corporate business generally). The Tories would have done the same (indeed New Labour were following their plans and took Tory ground from under their feet). Couple that with the lack of attention paid to Europe because the Tory Opposition were in disarray and couldn't make up their minds who they were and you get the picture that Blair was an opportunist not a career politician. He didn't care unlike Brown who did care - that was the fundamental flaw in Brown's make up in a party that was a sham. Brown got carried away by success at the upper echelons of society where New Labour reeled the billionaires into the UK- new tax haven of Europe (read the Tax Payers Alliance evidence to the Commons Select Committee). Brown equated jobs with success so the creation of a million or so poorly paid openings was as good as it could get. The Tories would have played it no differently - indeed the whole of the western world was at it.
Blame Brown for being in the wrong place at the wrong time by all means but do not blame him for giving the many greedy people in the UK exactly what they demanded just as the "conservative" US did. My position is that the whole of our democracy stinks - blue, red and yellow - and that we are now servants of Europe a situation that would not have happened if our Parliament had been sorted out after Callaghan's defeat by Thatcher in 1989. But she had other fish to fry.
Disposing of Brown will not solve anything and neither will Cameron ride in to rescue us. He'll just make it worse. Sort our democracy out and we may have a chance.
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And now Mandy has been caught with his trousers down sending an e mail to Derek Draper to the effect that Gordon Brown could never win a General Election because he ws more interested in headline grabbing gimmicks than promoting real policies. You couldn't script this!
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65. At 8:39pm on 05 Jun 2009, dicko1966 wrote:
The County Council and EU elections are a joke. 37% turnout is not an adequate mandate to Govern and spend all our money. Who are these people anyway when 2 out of 3 people can't be bothered to vote for them. There is too much Government meddling in our lives.
Gordon and his failed government have to go. The electoral system has to be reformed before the next election with all candidates reselected from open primaries. We must have candidates from all walks of life and of genuine excellence, not the career politicians and lawyers foist on us at the moment who will simply be lobby fodder for the parties. There can be no credible Government with things as they are with the MPs that we get at the moment.
On the first point, is it the people who are elected who are the joke or the people who don't bother voting and spend their time making idiotic statements on the internet?
On your second point, how do you see "open primaries" canging things? There is a problem with our system at the moment, and that is that too manny people stay away. If you believe something needs to be changed, why don't you get involved. Whichever party you like the look of, just get involved. Stand as a candidate yourself, as an independant if you want, but just spouting off on here won't help. You are just expecting someone else to do something else.
The three major parties are struggling in most areas because too many people just let others do it, which leaves them to complain about what they do.
Surely, the first change that needs to be done is introduce compulsory voting. How far could we take that? What if we had a fine for those that did not vote? How much should it be? If it's too small, it would only punish the poor, if it's too high, it would be unafordable to the poor so what would you do next?
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he looked a bit tired didn't he
So what has he had to promise?
It appears to also have played its part this weekend with the "Obama Beach" faux pas in front of all those leaders and our proud servicemen
Let him retire to the back benches and catch up on his rest.
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Gordon Brown wants a new constitution. He wants the electorate to have more of a say in how Government is run. He wants more power for the people and more engagement in politics. I'm sorry but I think that Mr Brown is heading in the wrong direction. I think the electorate wants LESS power, LESS of a say in how politics is run.
Isn't that why we vote for a representative in the first place? Someone of good standing, to represent my opinions, and needs. LESS Quangos, LESS Government intervention.
But Labour could actually win the next election if they actually connected with the electorate.
It going to take a huge swing for the Conservatives [sorry, let me break into my conversation and ask why was the Conservative positioned in the recent election a 'Conservatives' alphabetically coming fourth, yet the Labour Party was listed as 'The Labour Party' - the T coming first on the database and so ending up near the bottom - next time Gordon - cast yourself as LABOUR PARTY - you will look much higher on the ballot - paper] to win - and the big block is Gordon Brown's inability to connect to the Country. The Labour Party could come close in the next election if they connect with the people.
Read here of how
http://my.telegraph.co.uk/stepdowngordonbrown/blog/2009/06/06/labour_to_win_the_election
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It was a just another bad day in the Orifice,
a very very stiff brandy should do the trick
maybe we should free the weed for income
and mellow out their worries and problems
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#412
The will to vote is driven by the belief that things will change if you do vote. Given the microscopic differences between the three main parties there isn't a choice that will make things change and that is the problem.
Compulsory voting would only work if there was a box on the ballot paper marked NONE OF THE ABOVE. Given the current apathy NOTA will win everything by a landslide....
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For the information of those on here who take pleasure in criticising Gordon Brown's speech at the D-Day Remembrance, you obviously are not aware that Camilla, Duchess of Cornwall was not present. HM the Queen, who was allegedly snubbed by the French was, as we already know, also absent. The reason for these omissions was placed firmly at the feet of Gordon Brown. However, as Her Majesty was at Epsom Racecourse to watch the Derby this afternoon where, I believe, she had a horse running, one really needs to question the royal family's priorities. The arrangements for the D-Day celebrations were known in plenty of time for the Queen and Prince Phillip to attend had they wanted to. It seems probable that Her Majesty had this prior engagement and that's why she was 'happy' with the arrangements that had been made by the French. I don't know why Camilla didn't attend, perhaps she was having her hair done. However, Gordon and Sarah Brown did attend, and I for one am glad they did.
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407. At 7:02pm on 06 Jun 2009, grandantidote wrote:
401 phoenixarisonq
Oh! come on phoenix have you never made a mistake, just remember whether you like him or not the man at this moment in time is under a massive mental strain, don't play party politics with every single thing he does,"Did you notice he straightened his tie three times" give the man a break old chap.
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Good job I saw your posting as I am off to watch TV tonight. For once there are some brilliant programmes on BBC 2, not cooking, sewing, make-up, dieting, gardening, home improvements or how to stop drinking, eating, breathing etc.! First, I have made and continue to make many mistakes. That is why I have never been put forward as prime minister or even an MP. Secondly, in the harsh real world of commerce we pay for our mistakes. Massive mental strain? "If it's too hot in the kitchen, get out." Not my words, but the response of most employers. Actually, I agree that he is suffering from massive mental strain, his judgement has become even more erratic than usual. With Lord Mandy breathing down his neck (as he himself once haunted Blair), a horrible tragedy, worse than Macbeth, is taking place before the eyes of the world. Caroline Flint has abandoned ship, and he is now left with a handfull of weaklings, under the control of Lord M and now Lord Sugar. The kindest thing he could do for himself, his party, and most importantly the country, is to call an immediate election. Well, I am off to listen to another "Waste Land" latter tonight, and before that, if I a, luck "Dad's Army". Good night to you and all bloggers everywhere.
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#393
sagamix is bored with himself - please stop boring us as well
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AS GORDY LIKES THE X FACTOR/BRITAIN'S GOT TALENT ETHOS SO MUCH, HOW LONG
BEFORE ANT&DEC THE TWIN HEADS GET A LIFE PEERAGE SO THEY CAN BE SPECIAL
ADVISORS. .
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They booed him! Those veterans had more courage than anyone else!
The Queen should have been there to take the salute for it will be the last salute for many of those present.
Someone has suggested that the Child Catcher is now in position to act as interim PM should GB be ousted /have a nervous breakdown.
Tony Blair waiting in the wings to be President of Europe , Child Catcher in the UK - UK dead duck!
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WE CERTAINLY HAVE A CABINET OF ALL THE TALENTS! FAGAN'S TALENTS!!
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boilerplate what the, i have respect for my country, and want my country to be represented by someone worthy of that position not a bumbling in-articulate fool, that is so up Obama's .... that a freudian slip on the world stage, i felt embarrassed for our veterans, they didn't want him there, in fact he was booed by them, you and your like can defend this person as much as you like, it just shows what low level expectation you require, no wonder iour country is going down the pan.
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415 valdan70
"Her Majesty was at Epsom Racecourse to watch the Derby this afternoon where, I believe, she had a horse running, one really needs to question the royal family's priorities. The arrangements for the D-Day celebrations were known in plenty of time for the Queen and Prince Phillip to attend had they wanted to. It seems probable that Her Majesty had this prior engagement and that's why she was 'happy' with the arrangements that had been made by the French. I don't know why Camilla didn't attend, perhaps she was having her hair done. However, Gordon and Sarah Brown did attend, and I for one am glad they did."
A most remarkable assessment of the sitaution, almost New Labour-like in it's lack of factual basis in reality and distortion of the facts. The Queen was not invited. End of story. Your comment about the royal families priorities is utterly offensive and contemptible beyond words.
As for Gordon Brown, a few months ago the MOD said that there were no plans at all for the D-Day servcies. Gordon Brown only cleared his diary to attend once he heard that his new best friend Barak Obama was attending. His very presence in these circumstances is insulting and offensive in my view.
Gordon Brown only represents himself these days, and he certainly isn't representing me.
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Diablo
THE UK IS A DEAD DUCK:A POTATO REPUBLIC WITHOUT POTATO.
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What a farce.
An unelected Prime Minister presiding over a cabinet increasingly comprised of unelected Lordships.
How can we call this shambles a democracy?
Labour supporters - if you love your country and care about your party, get rid of this man (although I fear it's too late on both counts).
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As a Tory Party Grandee let me tell you about our greatest secret weapon.
Sir Gordiano VII de Bruno. He is the son of a long line of English Lords including the first Gordiano who fought in the battle of Bannockburn (1314) and who was responsible for beheading more Scottish Chieftains than anyone in the battle.
And so we recruited his great great great great great Grandson to be our weapon against the anti-christ Toby Blair.
We trained him carefully coming up with the idea of putting the bricks in the plastic bag you took to the house party making sure he would be identified as your typical leftie.
And now he commands all he sees. Poly Toynbee and the BBC beware: he is handing the election to the Tories on a plate and with that comes cuts in the Licence fee and revenue from advertising non Jobs.
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I have yet to see the Obama gaff, too much Rugby on the TV today. I am looking forward to seeing it later.
I agree with other bloggers that this must be a Freudian slip. Mr Brown could not give a monkeys about the D-day celebrations. All he was concerned about was that photo opp with the US president in the vague hope that that some of the stardust may rub off on him. No wonder he did not want her majesty there to share in the glory.
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#409 No, this is all part of Mandy's plot to take over. Play loyalty card by backing Gordy. Choreograph the resignations. Suffer "embarassment" - but do so sticking a very pointy dagger in. Organise a few more resignations on Monday night after election results. Say Gordy has lost the party and thats it ... Mandy has to take over!
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