Friday 20 November 2009
Across Cumbria emergency services are continuing evacuations where flood defences have been overwhelmed by record rainfall. Police searching for a colleague missing after a bridge collapsed amid the devastating floods have found the body of a man.
Just two days ago the Queen announced a Flood and Water Management Bill promising new legislation to protect communities from flooding and to improve the management of our water supplies. So how prepared are we and how well protected? Paraic O'Brien has been to the Met Office's Flood Forecasting Centre.
A husband who killed his wife was set free from court in Swansea today. Brian Thomas blamed a rare sleep disorder for his actions. He said he was having a dream about attacking an intruder when he strangled his wife. We'll look at how often this sort of defence is used and how a sleeping disorder might cause someone to carry out such a violent act.
The Oprah Winfrey Show is to end next year after more than two decades on air. Tonight we'll consider Oprah's influence and legacy - from culture, politics and race, to literature and entertainment. We'll be joined by Britain's very own Oprah, chat-show host Trisha Goddard, who styled herself in Winfrey's image.
For our Flemish viewers, if you'd like to see an interpretation of David Grossman's film about the Belgian Prime Minister Herman van Rompuy, who has been named President of the European Council, click here. We'd like to thank Vlaamse Radio- en Televisieomroep (Flemish Radio and Television Network) for their interest in our journalism.
Join Gavin for Newsnight at 10.30pm on BBC Two, and read on for news from Kirsty on what's coming up in tonight's Newsnight Review at 11pm.
I'll be joined by Tom Paulin, Rosie Boycott and Sarfraz Mansoor and we'll be roaming over making fiction out of history. Does dramatic licence reveal deeper truths, or is it wrong to play fast and loose with the facts?
We'll be discussing Women We Loved, the new season of drama on BBC Four which goes behind the public image of three 20th Century icons, Enid Blyton (Helena Bonham Carter), Margot Fonteyn (Anne Marie Duff), and Gracie Fields (Jane Horrocks).
And we'll be discussing Alan Bennett's new stage play, The Habit of Art, for which he teams up once again with director Nicholas Hytner. In the play he creates the imaginary reunion of two estranged friends, WH Auden (Richard Griffiths) and Benjamin Britten (Alex Jennings).
"There is no such thing as a single, correct version of history, and if dramatists are honestly trying to achieve a deeper poetic truth about their subject, that should be the guiding light".
Following his broadside against the BBC over what he believes are stifling constraints upon television drama, the writer and director Stephen Poliakoff tells us why he thinks dramatists should be allowed to take greater liberties with history.
We are also reviewing his first feature in almost twenty years, the historical thriller, Glorious 39, in which he visits the uncomfortable truths about the appeasers on the eve of WWII.
And at The National Gallery in London we'll walk through a recreation of history in the Hoerengraght, the final work of the pioneering American installation artist Ed Kienholz and his wife Nancy Reddin, which takes us into the red light district of Amsterdam in the 1980s.
This is going to be a very colourful and argumentative Newsnight Review.
I hope you will join us, Kirsty
© MMX~RS~q~RS~~RS~z~RS~44~RS~)
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Did someone forget to put a proper title on this when it was released?
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"Just two days ago the Queen announced a Flood and Water Management Bill promising new legislation to protect communities from flooding and to improve the management of our water supplies. So how prepared are we and how well protected?"
Well obviously not as well preapared as the NN blog was. Two days ahead of the event. How much warning do you want?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/newsnight/fromthewebteam/2009/11/thursday_17_november_2009.html#P88654672
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Your 30 minute serious news programme is covering 4 stories, one of which is decidedly ARTS based. We are not going to get much IN DEPTH on any of these are we. Hopefully Gavin and the production team will give the Lion's share to the issue of Floods. Otherwise, I predict a deluge of complaints!
And to Kirsty
PLEASE speak a little more slowly and clearly. In animated discussions, which you are promising tonight, much of what you say gets lost in gabbling, interruptions and speaking over each other.
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Production Team and the BBC
Because of the game I'm not going to watch Nm
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WHERE IS SCIENCE-SUSAN WHEN WE NEED HER?
It is self-evident that what we used to call a 'cloudburst' - a rare event, is now commonplace. OK - let's call current events 'climate change' - but what aspect of climate?
Do clouds now hold vastly more water than previously - if so why? It can't be higher water content of the atmosphere-in-general, due to temperature rise, that relationship is known, and 'global warming' is not enough to register.
I have more than a suspicion that it is THE ELECTRICAL STATE OF CLOUDS that is mediating the change of behaviour. The electrical link between Earth and cosmos is there, for those who wish to acknowledge it. the Sun is doing some odd stuff - WE are linked electro-magnetically to the Sun - and the solar system to the galaxy . . .
Watch that SPACE.
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This is relevant to the Cumbria story: " The flooding in Cumbria is part of a pattern of weather which shows that global warming is occurring faster than anyone expected."
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/earthcomment/geoffrey-lean/6617386/Cumbria-floods-theres-more-where-that-came-from.html
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climate change is just an extreme form of the heritage industry. people who want to preserve things. the heritage people want us to worship buildings and the climate changers want us to worship the present form of climate. both are ludicrous based as they are on false beliefs about the nature of reality. the false belief is that change is wrong.
actually for the climate changers the wiping out of mankind [except for themselves] would be their best fantasy. then they could sit and play with the squirrels.
at some point the sun is going to turn into a gas giant and consume the earth. when that happens does it matter if humans are still here or not? extinction on earth is the end game for humanity.
in terms of earth's history humans have only been around for a fraction of the time. the earth doesn't need humans to get along.
everytime there is a flood, drought, whatever we get the same hand wringing claptrap paraded out by those jacking up on their false beliefs.
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Did European leaders perhaps mix-up Baronne Ashton and Baron Ashdown? I think that must be what went wrong as Cathy Ashton is unknown in the UK
and has virtually no foreign policy experience to speak of. Unelected
politician, previously a member of an unelected chamber, nominated to
an unelected position by an unelected British Prime Minister? Typical.
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THE ANCIENT GREEKS KNEW! (#7)
They were shouting 'All is flux' even as the pre-historic flood hit them.
I am for drafting everyone into the Scouts and Guides. We should all be prepared - for whatever comes. Knowing how to keep warm and dry etc, might just be useful when the knife-edge infrastructure that we have stupidly set up, goes down. Snaring rabbits might just come back into vogue - and DIY tooth extraction.
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COMME SI COMME CA (#8)
Entirely possible! Or might it be the EU, a Superstate that takes Solomon's approach to headquarters' location, and has eternally un-signed-off accounts (has Gulliver called yet?) couldn't light a rigged stove in a Conclave. AND OUR POLITICIANS WANT TO BE PART OF THIS?!
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Have now spoken to Cumbria police. They are very busy. Have reported the incident as a terrorist civil contingency and obtained a log number. Will be contacted next week as they are all very busy, still evacuating people etc. The force is quite shock up about events and I have passed on my sympathies, thoughts etc.
#5 Rossby Waves?
http://www.answers.com/topic/rossby-wave
When I saw the cloud pattern satellite image. It was defining a Rossby Wave pattern. Large meanders in the jet stream. These move. Whether or not it was we wait to find out.
What seems to have happened over Cumbria was that the water containing clouds made a slow passage.Parked themselves. So continuous rain.
While I understand Southern England had a fairly dry summer, up here it has rained and rained. The jet stream not moving north as expected over summer.
Without any scientific resources here. We have high water carrying capacity, slow moving and orthographic (mountain induced) factors.
These may be some of the factors NN may cover.
This related to land use changes which were not compatible with being able to absorb such high levels of rainfall.
Why did it happened. Let me give you a few figures. Though much is made of climate change and it appears to have great influence and talk of £multi 100 billion consequences. The budget for the last set of UK climate models over 5 years was £25 million. Had the Government gone for the environmental management centre at the Dome or the police not shut down the project, the start up budget for the modelling, communication aspect would have been £800 million.
The whole world would have been different. Even if only to supply answers to Barrie. With that sort of budget nothing would have been missed out.
Celtic Lion
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Oh, what the heck. Have just been preparing this post, in repsonse to the usual dismissive missives but have been beaten to the salient pojtns.
Will post anyeway. You see, it wasn't raining when Noah built his Ark.
Weather/climate change/floods.
My (non scientific/unproven take in simple bullet points, having spent much of the summer/autumn in its midst, on some of what seems to be occurring.
LOCAL
• Jet stream not moving as far north as expected
• Warmer air collecting more of the moisture over the sea
• Weather systems (especially depressions) moving extremely slowly)
• Concreting over vast tracts of countryside – less run off.
GLOBAL
• Cutting down rainforests at a vast rate
• Population growth
• Burning of fossil fuels
Recently, my local town suffered flooding
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/8337149.stm
This was overnight on Sunday 1st November, and the week before it began to rain heavily and persistently at about 7:30 am on Wednesday. It stopped late Friday night only to commence again 24 hours later.
This past week we have also suffered long periods of persistent rain, with only occasional respite. High tides and high winds in the North Sea yesterday caused more damage.
THIS IS NOT NORMAL, even here in Scotland.
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dispatches [see c4 watch again]
while it was right to point out the cave in at the bbc with regards to bowen and the aid appeal it was curious despatches didn't mention the israeli internet warfare team who have openly said they target bbc online? nor did they mention the hasbara handbook that demonstrates as a means to silence people the method listed as number one is that of name calling [bearing false witness].
nor did they mention that brown blair and cameron are patrons of the jnf. an organisation whose polices would be illegal in the uk. something i have never yet seen challenged anywhere in the media.
what it showed is that uk politicians are more likely to speak for love of a foreign state's gold than love of the uk?
what is surprising given this is just a game of money that the arab interests have not just outbid the israeli lobby. 3 or 4 million a year is cheap to deliver another country's foreign policy? Uk politicians are indeed cut price ones who deliver uk foreign policy so cheaply? they'll probably do it for a duck island or packet of hobnobs?
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BEYOND GLOBAL (#12)
LOCAL
GLOBAL
COSMIC (from my post 5):
"I have more than a suspicion that it is THE ELECTRICAL STATE OF CLOUDS that is mediating the change of behaviour. The electrical link between Earth and cosmos is there, for those who wish to acknowledge it. the Sun is doing some odd stuff - WE are linked electro-magnetically to the Sun - and the solar system to the galaxy . . .
Watch that SPACE."
Orthodoxy has not yet caught up with 'THE ELECTRIC UNIVERSE' (google).
As above so below: cosmology is struggling to encompass a wide range of space-data BECAUSE ORTHODOXY ESCHEWS COSMIC ELECTRICITY. Our Solar System - this Earth - 'bathe' in the cosmos. Time to think electric, as the water comes under the door?
Of course, as with everything, there is a political angle. Once cosmic electricity is accepted, the destruction of Shuttle Columbia looks 'different' (view the video - read the 'explain-away') and the Health and Safety folk will be in hot water.
Interesting times.
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#12 byt
Of the bullet points you identify as causes of changes in weather patterns only the following are man-made and therefore within mankind's ability to control:-
• Concreting over vast tracts of countryside – less run off.
• Cutting down rainforests at a vast rate
• Population growth
• Burning of fossil fuels
And, of these Population Growth is the cause of the other three. Man has concreted over vast tracts of countryside, cut down rainforests and is burning fossil fuels at a greater rate than ever before BECAUSE of population growth, aided by increased capability (technology)and in the 'pursuit of happiness'(human rights constitutional or assumed).
Yet population growth is scarcely mentioned as a contributory factor, let alone seen as a subject for serious study
- except how to increase food production to support more humans.
This blinkered state is due, as usual, to an unwarranted and dangerous over-sensitivity to belief systems? Surely, in this country at least, we have a huge percentage of our population who now believe more in nature than in gods? We need the formation of a Humanist, or Naturalist political party to take an objective view of priorities and remedies.
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Well well, what do you know? News footage from a helicopter taken above Cockermouth show lots of nice new houses, built on a flood plain, being ......................... flooded.
Should planners go to the gallows for allowing this. It's happening all over. Criminal! Stupid! Shameful!
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The apparently irresistable rise of British Council's Emma Sky continues it seems according to a New York Times profile of the most influential British advisor on Iraq:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/21/world/middleeast/21emmasky.html
But since when has British Council - which is supposed to be a charity - been 'an arm of The Foreign Office'? This all seems very, very strange?!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Council
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MISSIONARIES - MEDICS - MAMMON (#15)
And I don't think anyone wants to address the unbalancing sequence of interventions (above).
Time for Pope, and Arch of Cant, to apologise to much of the world? What benefit a man if he gets God, medicine and food, only to end up with 'education X 3, and working for Mammon as he multiplies to foul his global doorstep?
This is the Age of Apology, after all.
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But did the host of gold daffodils survive the floods in Cockermouth?
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#15 Indignantindegene
I am on the same page. Perhaps I don't put it awfully well.
I see the lack of control of worldwide population, deemed necessary to support the growing global economy, and all that is required to support it (an ever increasing circle to my feeble intellect)as the KEY to many of the issues we face.
More people, more food required to feed them, more technology to produce that food, more transport to move the populace, more stuff to be consumed then discarded.
You point that out.
I am not convinced there is as much of problem about where they live as that they do live. Birth rates unchecked. Death rates dropping.
In the 'Good old days' A global war or plague would take care of the issue but those events are now being 'managed?
I am a solution based thinker but cannot see how or where one begins to exercise the necessary controls. Who would vote for a party anywhere in the world who tried to enforce the necessary measures. I wouldn't.
So, does democracy have to die for the world to live?
I await the name calling fest.
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To the Newsnight people
As you are going to talk about food and drink, may I let you know that I have just had some beef stroganoff but for drink had coffee rather than water. Later on I'm going to have some red wine mixed with passion fruit and pineapple juice.
So there you are, I'm now playing a part in your game, in some ways.
But if you knew how upsetting I find your game sometimes which even makes me cry not infrequently and if you had any sense or humanity left in you, you would stop it as from Monday.
I may add a few things in a few moments but as you're going on air now, here it is.
Madam Mim
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I've brought this up before but burning alleged low carbon fuels like gas emits a large amount of water vapour. As a rough guide in the late 1970s we were taught that burning 1 gallon of petrol emits 1 gallon of water, gas is worse still. Burning alleged " nasty coal " emits hardly any water vapour at all yet in some parts of the planet it would appear that excessive rainfall is the main current climate problem.
Perhaps its high time to stop appeasing the eco-fascists with wind farms and spend all the spare money on decent flood defences, sea walls etc. Of course the stock market parasites will prefer their pointless " King Canute " carbon trading scam and changing money on imported alleged green infrastructure. We can build flood defences without importing anything, get industry like JCB strong again, providing real jobs for real genuine " hard working " British people.
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#42
pol
What a brilliant answer to cookieducker!
Bravo!
mim
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Sir David King/.
Please re read this.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/newsnight/fromthewebteam/2009/11/wednesday_4_november_2009.html#P88053640
If Sir David had cited my work, then UK flooding would have been prevented.
Could Sir David 2 days before the floods occurred have put on a BBC flagship news programme what would happen?
No he didn't, no he couldn't yet the BBC still drag him out as the 'expert'. Why?
Celtic Lion
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#46
You get headaches, Streetphotobeing, and I get pain around my bowels after eating which is exactly what's happening now. That's also part of the game, i.e. punishment for being uncompromising which tonight partly means that I'm being punished for not watching NN in order to admire all their efforts of 'guiding me' to the programme. It nicely ties in with what pol was saying in his response to cookieducker at #42.
mim
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#15 II
'....dangerous over-sensitivity to belief systems'
I think it's even more simple than that.
Parents are unable/unwilling to say no to their children (and uphold it) or make choices.
Government is the same with its people. It is so afraid of a short lived tantrum (of course that amounts to votes and power) that it will not deliver and uphold the messages we OUGHT to be hearing.
Not sure which the chicken and which the egg but the omelette is pretty fowl!
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#13
Are you in control of all that money or are you waiting to get your hands on it when you've 'won your game'?
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To the Newsnight people again
Although I'm still in pain, I am going to have my favourite dessert which is the ice cream with bits in it that I described yesterday or the day before. Sooner or later, with the help of Zantac and Paracetamol the pain goes and the tense swelling of my belly and surroundings does go down.
That's one thing, another is that I'm not even going to bother to watch your tonight's programme on the Iplayer neither.
Madam Mim
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"Hoerengracht - as in Herengracht?" No Kirsty - the Herengracht is very posh! I think you mean the 'Nieuwe Herengracht?' Muddling the two is a bit like mixing up Old and New Labour!
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The conclusion from it all , on my part, is that since you've made me into a martyr, I might as well be an honourable and noble one.
Madam Mim
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NAME CALLING BRIGHTYANGTHING (#20)
"I am a solution based thinker but cannot see how or where one begins to exercise the necessary controls. Who would vote for a party anywhere in the world who tried to enforce the necessary measures. I wouldn't."
Hi BYT! Perhaps you heard the discussion of 'philosophy in schools' earlier this week? I too am a 'solution-based thinker' and try very hard to offer a solution before attacking those who live within the current lie.
I am of the opinion that, were we (able) to raise a 'critical mass' of the planetary population (starting with UK, right after we get our independence back) to their highest possible level of competence, through intake of philosophy and psychology (wisdom) much of the negative behaviour that currently characterises 'the good life' would simply wither for lack of fertile soil.
I do not see school as the means of presentation - rather television. I have laid it out elsewhere, but like the feed-in grid and the 'abstention box' on a voting slip, and a lot of other obvious 'goods', the Westminster Mind senses danger . . .
This is 'bottom-up' defined. No 'controls' or 'measures' are needed. Just a program-maker who can see a revolutionary good thing, when it's offered. I put a whole team together (Including a canny ex-'Ardent' bloke and a leading cartoonist - no fantasy bullshot there) and an easy-to-understand ethos. Zilch. This is Britain.
I am convinced that, as more individuals grow competence, the better they are at spotting charlatans and the less they wish to be charlatans themselves. QED
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I have been reading the documents that were leaked from the University of East Anglia today and show how scientists have been fiddling the figures on global warming. Yet still we get these government "experts" appearing on Newsnight blaming the floods on global warming and saying how they can fix flooding etc if we give them yet more money. All the while one assumes those same experts are saying it is perfectly OK to carry on building massive projects like the Thames Gateway on the flood plane (someone is).
If the leaked documents are to be believed (they have been confirmed as genuine apparently) it looks like a massive scam has been uncovered. Some are calling it the biggest scientific fraud in history.
The Telegraph is carrying the story:
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpole/100017393/climategate-the-final-nail-in-the-coffin-of-anthropogenic-global-warming/
Read the dodgy emails here:
http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andrewbolt/index.php/heraldsun/comments/hadley_hacked/
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Celtic Lion - vindicated again .... every time it rains!
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#20 BYT Development or planetary evolution must be decoupled from economic growth. Economic growth cannot predict planetary ecological 'backlash' it contributes to it.
#15 Indy2: Humanist, or Naturalist political party to take an objective view of priorities and remedies.
Why include the word political? Barrie says spoil party games. The best way is to set up an alternative system outside all political games?
Everything is within our control. No other set up in the world knew what was going to happen in Cumbria.
Wappaho: You did want to know how time relocation worked. You were told what NN would report 2 days before the event happened. It is not a trick, Darren Brown could not do that. Do you now understand why 'future generations' was changed to NOW?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/newsnight/fromthewebteam/2009/11/thursday_17_november_2009.html#P88657883
For anyone else just Google:
Celtic Lion SD
Wappaho did 2 days ago. The future was already written.
Celtic Lion
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You don't have a Newsnight Review comments board, so I'll stick this here. I just wanted to say well done yet again to Rosie Boycott for revealing the plot of a film none of the viewers of NR have yet had the chance to see.
And for adding the name of the actor, too, just to make sure none of us can go into the cinema with any uncertainty in our minds. Isn't she thoughtful?
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33 Neil
Thanks.
[Unsuitable/Broken URL removed by Moderator]
Scottish band.
Celtic Lion.
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Away to watch the second half of 'Frost/Nixon' having pressed the pause button for 'Newsnight' ..... what's this about 'did that phone call take place though?' .... how dare you reveal the plot before I've watched the rest of the film! Mind you: it is excellent so far ... though watching the original interviews (also out on DVD) was equally rivetting and I was thrilled recently to find a copy of the biography of one of my all
time heroes (Watergate Special Counsel Archibald Cox) recently in The
States .... opening it up and finding his signature and dedication on
the first page was a real thrill:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archibald_Cox
[Unsuitable/Broken URL removed by Moderator]
(Newsnight's Charles Wheeler on 'free spirit' Archibald Cox)
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#36
So why (Google):
Why does it always rain on me?
a reason for moderation?
Celtic Lion
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The broken link in my post #37 was to Charles Wheeler .... 'Newsnight
Gold' on Watergate and so much else ... different league from Frostie
and indeed from Oprah - though he would have thought both significant?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/newsnight/7487753.stm
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#15
Brightyangthing
I've just reread your post.
Brilliant!
mim
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#32 Simon 987
Para 4
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/newsnight/fromthewebteam/2009/10/thursday_29_october_2009.html#P87803104
Make any sense?
Celtic Lion
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31 Barrie
it gets my vote.
27 min
didn't understand a word of what you wrote. but then i rarely do. x
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
#45 continuation
it's not meant for you, anyway
nor for cookieducker
nor for mk2newfazer or whatever the name is
nor for jj
nor for brossen 99
nor for any of your cronies
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From the Independent his morning, pretty close to #11
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/rain-clouds-usually-leave-as-quickly-as-they-arrive-but-not-this-time-1824929.html
#12 BYT + #14 Barrie
That looks like an equation. But an incomplete one. The equation needs a common denominator. It is the common denominator which links all things together, bit like the Force in Star Wars?
Simon 987
See the Hadley Centre thing is in most of the papers.
Celtic Lion
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46 ...nor for any of your cronies..
?
are you trying to bear false witness?
what would motivate you to do that?
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THERE IS A CANOPY OUTSIDE THE HADLEY CENTRE (#47)
But for how long? It has an 'aerofoil' look about it. . .
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Cambridgebeatnik
I have now downloaded Gil Scott-Heron 'Spirits' & 'I'm New Here' and am now listening to him. Love it. Love the lyrics, his voice, the music, his sensibility.
Thank you so much, he's a real discovery for me!
Lucky you for having seen him sing live.
Would you let me know when he's next in the UK so I can see him live too?
mim
I wasn't convinced, however, about some of the other people you mentioned or perhaps I found the wrong people(?). I'm talking about those with one way or another having something to do with Jewishness.
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#32 simon a new best seller advertised on the link you supplied:
" 'AIR CON' demonstrates, with hundreds of scientific references, that global warming” was not, is not, and will not be a global crisis. The new religion is merely an excuse for world government. World government will not, repeat not, be democratic government. The “global warming” debate is not really a debate about climatology - it is a debate about freedom… I commend this timely book, which makes the scientific arguments comprehensible to the layman. Those who read it will help to forestall the new Fascists and so to keep us free.” – Lord Christopher Monckton, Viscount of Brenchley, former adviser to Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher.
Sounds like a good read to balance 'An Inconvenient Truth'
However, human population growth is a destructive force in nature, whether or not there is a direct link to climate change. The problem remains how to get this subject under analysis and discussion.
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#51 Indy2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMe5dOgbu40
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national gallery
the amsterdam display looked like a big practical joke. someone thought here is the national gallery lets see if we can pull their leg about what art is?
after watching enid i could never recommend her books.
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.
Roger Waters of Pink Floyd once sang " if you should go skating on the thin ice of modern life...". a few see the the thin ice and are aware of its dangers, whilst most don't.
Watching the masses being hoodwinked into believing an "inconvenient truth".. the global warming therory nonsense is a sad spectacle to behold and i admit to raging against these kinds of untruths on a regular basis, I recently entertained a room full of students and tried to explain - in between jokes and monos - that Al Gorleone's Inconvenient truth is actually just a convenient lie. All I got was blank stares. How dare i challenge their new religion. I got a one word heckle from a young fella - directly below me - who stood up and pointed at me and shouted "heretic!". Wow! I've never had that one before. This kid is clearly stupid enough to believe anything he's told but smart enough to know the definition of 'heritic'. The sad bit was the room was with him.
Whilst thinking of a comeback, and within the blink of an eye, I thought how today we have more information at our finger tips than ever before; the ability to gather data is so much easier now but the kids of today - and many of mature yrs as well - don't even bother to question what they have been told; they've got no desire, no compulsion to make any kind of inquiry what so ever; they buy the party line and go with it. Our masters it would appear still have the upper hand at playing with the peoples minds.
Its trite (in some quarters) but I reminded the audience of the Nazi propagandist and the often quoted line that if you tell a lie, regardless of how big or ridiculous the lie is, if you repeat it often enough, you'll get the masses to believe in it. The Nazi scholar Go1 no doubt will come on in and give it an airing verbatim and link Griffin and the BNP to it, he may be a one trick pony but he comes in handy sometimes, he's got all the books and audio tapes...he's a font....of infomation.
Its no fun preaching to the converted, I'm on auto pilot most of the time but its very weird when your audience is totally against you on any given subject that challenges a common orthodoxy. I changed subjects quickly as the kid in front was still still stood up, eyes bloodshot, bottle in hand, dribbiling at the mouth. I moved onto a joke about when my father was once waiting for me in the tool shed...pedophilia and incest is apparently a less taboo subject.
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Poliakoff 'partly' blames the anti-BBC agenda press for putting pressure on producers re BBC Drama due to the tree press need to sell.
Now put that with - 'blurring fact and fiction'
Cricky someone drill a 'get real' hole into his head and ask him why on earth are we paying 3 BILLION a year to the BBC when we cant defend our homes from flooding or our very existence from bankers and corrupt politicians who have been allowed to infest and thrive on this island. Get real, party time for the upper class arty oxbridge brigade who want expensive drama paid for by force is coming to an end matie. The press must continue to bombard the BBC and remove or seriously reduce the licence fee.
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before the global warming crew jump on me can I say that I don't remember all this volume of floodwater before the private utilities took over. Older workers in the industry say that there was more attention to detail when it was in the public arena. Manpower levels have been drastically reduced and flood plains are being built on in pursuit of 'profit'It would be interesting to hear what the residents of Workington and Cocklemouth think of the privatised utilities performance when compared to what was the norm for sixty years...maybe a Newsnight reporter up there might shake a few...Jeremy, over to you.....
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The interview with Gil Scott-Heron the other day was really rather sad - clearly ill and probably drugged up. If I were there and filmed that I would think carefully about putting it on air. Just feel we should show the best of such talent. I guess part of an explanation can be found here in the later years heading:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gil_Scott-Heron
Bit of a shock to see him now and the memory in my minds eye from the 1970's when at school.
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ENDOW THE YOUNG WITH WISDOM AND (ONLY) THE WISE WITH SUFFRAGE. (#54)
I was on my feet, cheering, Cookie. Can we still legally (EU) march?
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#55 & 57
Streetphotobeing
Have you ever been for the licence fee?
If so, why have you changed your mind?
Personally, I don't see a problem with abolishing it, especially because public trust has been and continues to be abused with what you call a high drama which I would expand into high.reality titilation drama. I never thought of it however as particularly aimed at the higher echelons but perhaps you're right and it is to do mainly with the Oxford brigade.
I agree with you that more effort should have been made in presenting Gil Scott Heron who obviously is outstandingly brilliant.
mim
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Streetphotobeing
it is now time for focus time
On what is vital, on what is fine
I have been rehearsiing the precious lines
Waiting for proimising and treasured times
When the performance matches the dream
Hoping one day we share the ice cream
mim
L
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Mim
'Have you ever been for the licence fee?'
Not really and its become very much less so. There was a case for it years ago but not now. The internet means that costs can be radically reduced. Its out of hand and delusional - we are a small nation and the BBC should concentrate on news and debate with the weather thrown in. Really Paxman and the others getting a fortune has got to stop. Its been an excuse to employ the oxbridge brigade at forced expense added with 'crikey we have all this money how can we spend it?' and nothing to stop the flow. Mim Ive known a number of people who work at the Beeb over the years who were more damning than me.
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Nos 55 to mim
I should have said :
'Get real, party time for the upper class arty oxbridge brigade who want TO MAKE expensive drama paid for by force is coming to an end matie.'
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51. At 11:58am on 21 Nov 2009, indignantindegene wrote:
global warming” was not, is not, and will not be a global crisis.
If you pop over to Richard Black's blog (about the only place certain 'issues' have or could have registered on the BBC), it certainly seems to have become a matter of some local concern of late.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/richardblack/2009/11/copenhagen_countdown_17_days.html
As always, if you think I've missed something important in this weekly round-up, please post a comment.
Update 2309: Because comments were posted quoting excerpts apparently from the hacked Climate Research Unit e-mails, and because there are potential legal issues connected with publishing this material, we have temporarily removed all comments until we can ensure that watertight oversight is in place.
There is a certain irony in that penultimate para, all things considered.
One can only wonder if we are in for a whole new era of unique 'watertight oversight' when it comes to certain news media publishing things that seem to be across the whole MSM and blogosphere as far as I can surfmise. Best not to quote/link to the Times, Telegraph, Guardian, Mail, etc, because, well, you know.
There's a load of bunk out there, but when it matters, as much as I can I like to know. And make my own mind up.
Interesting precedent being set.
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#62
Streetphotobeing
I prefer not to comment on individual contracts although I'm sure Jeremy would survive nicely on smaller pay. And anyway, he seems to have so much going for him that a cut in what the BBC are paying him currently shouldn't be too much of a problem for him.
Otherwise, Streetphotobeing, that's exactly how I sse things myself. They keep wasting so much on their own delusions from public purse for nothing.
mim
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The kind of coverage that can only ensure 'watertight oversight*' surely?:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1229695/BBC-dispatches-35-staff-climate-talks--creating-carbon-African-village-does-year.html
*That's not reporting, at all, until you are absolutely sure, right? I just stress this in case such a laudable practice slips in future, perhaps when the narrative is more 'suitable'.
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The fact vs fiction debate was fascinating, I'll be watching Glorious 39 full of this glorious debate - but why do panelists shout over each other!? Its Arts!
Plus, Sarfraz Mansoor - is he the ONLY Asian commentator the production team can find?Come on production team! Find some different voices!? PLEASE???
AND! he's looks scruffy - especially this week, he looked liked he'd rolled out of bed! Yellow card to Sarfraz for being on too much and being scruffy!
CUE: NEW VOICES!! PLEASE!***
***and that doesnt mean Yasmin Alibhai Brown, Zia Sardar, Tariq Ali zzzzzz
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"DO WHAT THOU WILT" SHALL BE THE WHOLE OF THE LAW.
Westminster - BBC - print media - banks - advertisers - corporations - military - lawyers - brewers - even schools, and a range of other amoral/immoral operators, ALL stitch up the unempowered - us.
We have a culture of 'might is right'; small wonder so many have caught 'Affluenza' (Oliver James). Small wonder kids want a fast track to stuff, fame, wealth and image, bypassing maturity and wisdom - the antidote.
We all belong to the 'Hellfire Club' now.
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#64 Mim
'.... I'm sure Jeremy would survive nicely on smaller pay.'
Ah, but no none of it is that simple in my understanding
First and foremost because taking away from ANY individual that which they have become accustomed to is going to be resisted not necessarily because it is NEEDED, but simply because they HAVE become accustomed.
Though frankly I would rather a substantial sum were paid to someone who indicated a modicum of effort, education, skill in their position (so your example of JP would probably comply in the greater scheme of things in my book Mim, rather than some vacuous stick thin juvenile female 'presenter' or , Mmmmmmm J Ross esq for example
But those judgments are always going to be subjective. Who do we mandate to make that judgement call? And what would we pay them?
All of us, if pushed, are likely try and protect our own interests. This is why few of us are willing to give up our cars, our holidays, our social lives or whatever, in return for the greater good.
Every question begats another bigger and more complex question.
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http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=92061
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#68 Brightyangthing
Umm?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLrrBs8JBQo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XM_Hlx_yZRE
Celtic Lion
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#68 & #62
Brightyangthing
It’s another of those issues where when I look at both yours and that of Streetphotobeing’s points of view I can see validity in each. And I’m trying to see things from Jeremy’s perspective but obviously only as an exercise in practical dialectics.
On one hand if Jeremy’s decided that a pay cut would help bring about a necessary and vital change in the BBC in the sense that BBC would finally decide to rid of unwarranted forces, be they from representatives of the Trotskytes or those of the extreme right, that have been so damaging to the BBC, then he might prefer a cut but be left in peace to do the job that he’s employed to do rather than being forced to ‘obey’ orders from creeps and charlatans. And as I mention to Streetphotobeing, Jeremy does seem to have the ability and possibility of earning very good money elsewhere although I’m not sure whether there are restrictions imposed in this respect by his BBC contract.
On the other hand, as you say, to be suddenly forced to accept a cut while one is used to a certain lifestyle, as well as having all kinds of commitments already in place, does seem very unfair. Especially as what people like Jonathan Ross or Grahm Norton get seems hugely disproportionate to people like Jeremy get. It seems that going into a BBC studio, poking fun at others, getting a few hysterical laughs from an audience is much more appreciated financially than what people like Jeremy do trying to balance opposing, not infrequently bitter, arguments and contr-arguments into some kind of cohesive, if partial solution, for the sake of the nation. The politicians or whoever else who get interviewed by Newsnight for example don’t seem to be there only to show their faces and spurt out rigid dogma but, I’m pretty sure, frequently value having a chance to have their own opinions challenged and modified, or whatever one could call it.
A few years before I left St George’s all the secretaries in the Neurosciences and Thoracic Departments were lied to about the reason for a sudden cut that they were supposed to endure. It made us all very angry indeed and quite a few of us considered leaving. Luckily the whole lie was uncovered and although not officially admitted to by the new powers in the Trust, we were allowed to keep the pay we had been used to and consequently get a slight increase as per new NHS pay scale recommendations.
I hope my musings on the matter make some sense to both you and Streetphotobeing
mim
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Brightyangthing & Streetphotobeing
Whatever the outcome of the big change that is now on the cards, I'm sure Jeremy has the staying power and endurance to cope with it all with possibly his own contribution to the change itself. He is well known for having spoken about the issue for some time now.
I'm going to watch Gil Scott-Heron on the utube tomorrow at some stage but just wanted to say for now that the hope is that he'll manage to pull his socks up once again and give us the benefit of new thoughts, musings, his suble sense of humour and music.
Good night
mim
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Nos 68, 72
I don't much care how much people in the 'entertainment' business are paid so long as I'm/we are not forced to pay for them. When it comes to health care its hitting a different moral scale with different moral issues that are even more important about how we care for people.
Being use to a particular life style against what has happened and will happen re the bankers and non regulation isn't a real argument on such a devastating background. When mother nature comes knocking with major force no amount of delusional debate will justify stupidity, selfishness and outright greed. It just gets washed away in a damning reality.
The reality now is that the internet will blow and wash away the dead tree press and later on TV . If there are no 'get real' contingency plans in place expect to be flooded and washed away.
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#74
Very well put, Streetphotobeing
Having, for some reason, been aware of the fragility of life and human emotions, that's how I've lived since childhood, I think, though I cannot put a date to it. There were times when this realisation seemed to have a bit of a detrimental influence on me but I seem to be guided by what I once called a bizarre force guiding me through the worst and the best, I suppose. The changing times used to come about in quite dramatic situations or superimposed circumstances and that's probably why I feel now virtually unshakeable in my faith in the future while always remembering the fragility of life in general and of humans in particular. And that's why, I think, I do not like to insist on anything too much, not to rely on others too much and definitely not to force anybody to act my way.
As we have been speaking about Jeremy Paxman quite a bit in the last 24 hours, on waking up the following ditty has come to life:
With today being Sunday
While tomorrow being Monday
I am thinking of that Wednesday
With Jeremy face to face.
He spoke to me from the stage
All in light with face to face
And then later at his pace
Signing books at Britain’s Tate.
First while sitting and then standing
Looking straight into my eyes
I was happy with him talking
Not through telly but straight live.
With today being Sunday
While tomorrow being Monday
I am thinking of that one day
With again us face to face.
Have a good Sunday
mim
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Streetphotobeing
Having said what I've just posted, everything really good or special coming my way I treat as a wonderful bonus rather than an award although some of it may well be well deserved.
mim
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Streetphotobeing
After fumbling in the dark earlier this morning I broke my red wine and passion fruit and pineapple filled glass. To follow on from my previous post about fragility of things, here's what I've come up with as a comment on the event:
On the fragility of objects
My long glass served as a mirror
But I broke it this morning, oh dear!
But it was only an object
So there's no need to despair.
Little things like this one are so easy to fix and so easy to repair
I shall buy yet another
After streets of London on my bike I first cover!
mim
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Zionists stop medical talk after campaign
Miri Weingarten from PHR-I was due to give a lecture, entitled The Right to Health in a Conflict Zone, to three hospitals in Manchester, Liverpool and Bury last week.
But just hours before the lecture, the Manchester Royal Infirmary and Alder Hey Hospital in Liverpool cancelled the event.
Ms Solomon said that the original plan was to send members to the meeting to dispute some of the topics.
She said: “We felt the talk was political and hospitals should not be seen to be political or hold political events...
http://www.thejc.com/news/uk-news/21462/zionists-stop-medical-talk-after-campaign
this is how it happens. given the context that israel has said it it going to target human rights groups we get a talk about 'The Right to Health in a Conflict Zone' is classed as 'political'. Is basic human rights 'political'?
the pro israel right wingers see human rights as anti israel and see anyone speaking up for human rights for all as anti semitic and anti israel even if they are jewish. Pro human rights jews were physically attacked by anti human rights israeli right wingers during the gaza demonstrations.
the right wing narrative does not speak for all jews nor for the only model of israel. Is the uk going to be bullied by foreign states where any talk on human rights is called 'political'? The answer seems yes. Which makes the uk a breeding ground for right wing anti human rights groups. Is that the vision of britain the state wants?
the battle of israels soul between those who want an israel based on human rights for all and those who don't is being played out on uk soil with the effect that the UK State allows human rights groups to be silenced by right wing anti human rights groups. Why does the uk State and uk political class let this happen? Has it anything to do with the Dispatches report? Have the british political class sold the nations right to talk about human rights for all regardless of race, creed or religion?
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THE ULTIMATE ATTACHMENT (#77)
I wonder if Buddha were scheduled to give a talk on 'attachment', in Jerusalem, it would be cancelled?
I listened to the Radio 4 church service while 'rising' (no pun - oh what the hell) this morning. You can understand why Dawkins gets so upset. But our wishy-washy worship is nothing to the burden the Jews carry.
Weep for wisdom absent.
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ha. not a weeping type barry :)
clearly there is a failure of leadership in the british political class who for love of foreign money is happy to see the norms of the israel [and chinese] anti human rights model be slowly adopted and defacto normalised in the uk.
foreign states wish to suppress human rights for all in the uk. this can only happen if foreign agents are allowed to perpetuate the darkness through bogus narratives and the if british political class keep taking their blood money?
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I am hearing a lot this morning about bridges being checked in Cumbria.
Appreciating the logistical problem a national effort would necessitate, I do hope this might not suggest a post horse-bolting postcode lottery, as I do suspect that floods of biblical proportions are poor respecters of council boundaries.
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As it is a Sunday morning if you want something to pass 5 minutes. Google:
celtic lion fmd
You will get a background on a Foot and Mouth model from 2001. I think you may find it interesting.
If you click the top link in the text, this will take you to the model. Land Use Scenarios introduces preliminary flood prevention strategy for Cumbria.
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81. At 10:17am on 22 Nov 2009, Roger Thomas
Tx. Tried. Sadly my googling is not as good as it might be and there was nothing obvious to the link you suggest.
But as it seems we may be facing unprecedented future rainfalls, attributed by many to (A)GW, I remain interested in other possibly equally negative, complementary factors that can lead to flooding and how these may be addressed.
As money is tight, it may be better to understand what can be done, now, to help prevent such tragedies on a local scale, possibly through better land management. And also, if sadly necessary, defensive measures.
With such as boiler scrappage currently ignored in favour of handing more work to a BMW assemblyperson, I am struggling to maintain faith in the politico-media establishment prioritising high enviROI efforts over superficial voter-winners or ratings winners and finding convenient ways at pointing anywhere but at them..
We've had our second 'head for the hills' from the EA system in so many weeks, only to see the footy pitch by the river get waterlogged and no more. Sadly we no longer pay it heed. A metaphor there, to other, bigger pictures?
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#82 JunkkMale
http://celticlion.wordpress.com/2008/01/15/background-foot-and-mouth-assessment/
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With all this nonsense about Dr Belle De Jour and a plastic whore show in an 'important' art establishment.
Take a look at a website by a women called Shelley Lubben - former US pornography performer turned religious saviour of the fallen women. I don't like the religious stuff but its nearer a general truth than a Dr Whore word spin for a minted bint to be.
http://www.thepinkcross.org/
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#82 JunkkMale
http://celticlion.wordpress.com/2008/01/15/foot-and-mouth-assessment/
section 3 Land Use Scenarios is an example of multiple goal analysis applied to the Lake District during the 2001 FMD outbreak. It is also a brief introduction to flood prevention strategy.
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Whilst waiting for the next NN topics I'll comment on this morning's Andrew Marr Show with a weekend grumble(hope that doesn't offend the thread-bearers).
The good news was the introduction of some new BBC docu-dramas, including at least one featuring HM The Queen (or rather one of 5 actresses that play her).
The irritating thing to me was that the BBC captions under both females interviewed stated 'ACTOR', which unless they are men in drag should have read 'ACTRESS'. Is there some stigma in being a female that justifies the incorrect use gender? My dictionary states quite clearly that an actor is a man who acts, and actress is a woman actor. Where is the Equality in this type of PC?
I also hate the stupid use of 'the chair' when addressing a chairman or chairwoman. I'm always reminded of the line from a Neil Diamond hit 'I am, I cried, but nobody heard, not even the chair!'
The brief episode shown, featured the Queen, presumably in discussion with her PM, stating that she "could not remain on the fence for much longer". Let's hope this is an example where real life immitates art.
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SCREWED THREAD-BEARERS ALL (#86)
Classic IDG2! I'm afraid my brain curdles when such drama is trailed.
I noticed that was a young version of the monarch, not wanting to fence-sit. I bet they won't portray the CURRENT queen as pondering the 'ultimate sacrifice' on behalf of her subjects. But, as I have said before: should she do so, that might just 'save' her!
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'Governments have already shot their fiscal bolts'
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/6599281/Societe-Generale-tells-clients-how-to-prepare-for-global-collapse.html
If this happens and gold is use to back the $ well, few will be able to afford gold jewelley - price will rocket.
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CNBC Interview with Meredith Whitney :
http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232/?video=1332936523&play=1
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85. At 11:38am on 22 Nov 2009, Roger Thomas
section 3 Land Use Scenarios is an example of multiple goal analysis applied to the Lake District during the 2001 FMD outbreak. It is also a brief introduction to flood prevention strategy.
Thank you. Interesting. And possibly yet another I might add to a growing list of examples of rather unfortunate consequences arising from the Law of Unintended Consequences, especially as regards animal husbandry. Last was a real head shaker regarding a ban on traditional pig feeding in light of some health scares, but which has turned them from a pretty effective carbon sink to a rather massive contributor.
No doubting it is all highly complex and difficult to balance, but as we seem to 'enjoy' Governments of all the knee jerks, I am not encouraged. On the news just now I have heard that maybe checks will be made in Brecon following another possible incident there. Stable doors do spring to mind.
Off now to try, again, to persuade Welsh Water that while it is possible that what we have put down the sink is causing blockages, it is rather odd that when there is flooding from the nearby Wye, that seems to coincide with the neighbourhood's sewage bubbling up out of the manhole in our driveway.
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A DOSSIER ON DODGY PRIME MINISTERS
Blair will, of course, escape the Iraq 'noose', if only because he was a BRITISH PM, and we don't have the balls to admit the following truth: Even without 'doing God', he WAS the nutter he feared being labelled as - a devious one at that. But then, look at Thatcher - devious nutter. Brown - devious nutter.
The fact is that Britain, ROUTINELY, elevates devious nutters to leadership (and buttonhood). And there is a goodly supply of devious nutters lined up for the next succession. Until some SUPER-CHILCOT looks into the 'why' of this inevitability, we shall just stumble on into the embrace of whatever mega-plot is waiting to engulf us.
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#90 JunkkMale
Thankyou for taking the time to read it. The date of that coincided with the competition to run the Dome. So all the knowledge of UK flooding was presented to the Government in 2001. Had the Government gone for the environmental management centre instead of the venue/casino. None of the flooding since December 2006 would have occurred or if it could not have been prevented at least mitigated.
All the knowledge of flooding and prevention was here. There is no denying they didn't have it.
http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/ecodome/
Unfortunately very little of what is being told to the public in the media is true.
As regards unintended consequences Brossen 99 told me a story about budget for climate change in his area has gone into cleaning out all the grids etc.
Think about this at it's simplest. If there is a foot of rain and the grids are blocked you get a foot of water standing. If there are 10 places with blocked grids that is 10 places with a foot of water. say the height of a kerb and up the step.
Unblock all the grids so it all surges in one go and the place 400 yds away and very slightly lower gets the full 10ft. The first is a minor inconvenience the second a disaster.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ydo2Mwnwpac&feature=player_embedded#
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Watts up with that :
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2009/11/21/cru-emails-search-engine-now-online/
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@ #64 Mimpromptu - Jeremy is worth every penny of the licence fee payers money! I still haven't seen a journalist or a programme in the same league as Newsnight yet on any channel - be it Sky News/Al-Jazeera/France 24/CNN etc. The PM STILL refuses to be interviewed by Jeremy, yet has appeared before other BBC journalists - because he knows he will mess it up......
If the BBC licence fee was abolished, would we ever be able to have documentaries by Sir David Attenborough (the National Geographic Channel uses the BBC's documentaries)? We also have lots of tv and radio channels plus unrestricted internet access (including BBCi Player) on the BBC too. The BBC has discovered so much new talent in the UK - from Ricky Gervais to Matthew Corden and retained old favourites such as the BBC Proms (would we really have that broadcast on a commercial station?)
@ #88 StreetPhotoBeing - Gold prices are at record levels at present(US$1150.00/oz) and there is also a shortage in world markets at the moment (it may even surge to US$2500.00 per oz in the next year or so). People tend to buy gold in times of economic crisis as hedge funds etc have ripped a lot of people off.
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Mistres76uk
Am well aware of the gold price and why it goes up and down, thanks.
Tell you what we all watch Sir David Attenborough while our homes get flooded out and are forced into unemployment, banks rip us off mercilessly, cowboy supermarkets endlessly repeat 'do you want any cash back' (debt brainwashing for morons) at the tills. Cold callers endlessly hit on us. Folks (usually older) who dont wish to pay via direct debt or via internet have to pay a lot more than they should. Cowboy repair men hit on the old and are targeted by muggers. The police don't want to know so we set up private PAY security situations. The vulnerable disabled who cant read a gas or electric bill get ripped off by cowboy utility companies they then go on meters and are paying even more - and it goes on and on and on and on.
So were safe in the knowledge that we are being forced to watch Sir David Attenborough - a comforting thought.
Paxman is worth about 150k and he could get it on a commercial channel. Its not really important, the internet effect is.
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#96
Streetphotobeing
Is that all you think Paxo is worth? Let's not exaggerate.
And is that all that you can say about David Attenborough? Transmitting him on the BBC doesn't mean we have to watch him or does it?
As much as the internet does seem to play an enormous, if not vital, role in spreading Madam Mim's word, the telly could also play a bigger role if it was not so shamelessly shallowed down by pretentious, 'fun loving' gits. I won't mention the names as even repeating them makes me sick.
mim
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Oh, just remembered, Streetphotobeing
I didn't buy a new long glass as I ran out of time but shall get one tomorrow.
With regard to ice skating, I felt quite good on ice today and glided and twirled to all kinds of tunes but the most significant thing is that it was absolutely brilliant to glide and twirl to Gil Scott-Heron with listening to his lyrics being an additional inspiration.
I'll watch the interview again in a few moments, as well as see him on the u-tube, and may get back to you again later with some further thoughts.
mim
P.S.
I think his newest track 'Where did the night go?' is very moving.
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#98 update
Streetphotobeing
I have just watched the interview with Gil again but this time it seemed absolutely fine. He doesn't seem bothered to be filmed the way he is at present and seems to be speaking his mind as he thinks and as he feels.
Very promising comments also from the guys who interviewed him in jail and who seem to be helping him rebuild his career. I just hope he resists any vulture trying to sponge off his talents with him although proud and with preserved self-faith and integrity, still possibly remaining somewhat vulnerable due to his current circumstances. It was very good also to hear him speak about some of the people who ended up on the bottle side of life because of this or that.
I like Gil Scott-Heron's wit and sense of humour.
mim
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Streetphotobeing
Do you think that Jeremy Paxman, like Gil Scott-Heron, has runners runnning behind him like headless chicken feeding on the the shreds of corn he's leaving on his trail?
mim
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Streetphotobeing
I like your take on Dr Belle du Jour, very good.
I've also liked watching just now an American movie about a man and a woman, with him a journalist and her a silly dumb girl who thanks to him discovers how smart she realy is and thus turning into an idepedently thinking lady. I don't know whether you've watched the movie but it ends up with the man and the woman marrying, etc, leaving the nasty fat bloke, who thought he possessed the woman, sitting on his bottom with a lesson from the woman about possible ways of coping with the rest of his life.
The film was full of with and most enjoyable to watch. It was a much interesting way of spending this evening rather than browsing through the internet.
mim
mim
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Streetphotobeing
Was it you who's invited the press to do some investigation into the scam re: a plastic doll? Was it re: a plastic doll or was it about something else? I don't seem to be able to find this particular post.
mim
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Streetphotobeing
As there has been talk about whoring, including that of Dr Whore, I would like to present Madam Mim's overall philanthropist philosophy and her views on her own attitude to whoring:
Madam Mim likes sharing her thoughts
Madam Mim likes sharing her heart
She's prepared to do all that for nothing.
But Madam Mim does not like sharing her bed
Madam Mim for that likes only one man.
One and only one man, that is final
And that's for Madam Mim’s vital.
Madam Mim for nothing has advised this world's Presidents and Premiers
Not expecting a penny for that
But Madam Mim would not share with them her bed.
Have a good day, Streetphotobeing
mim
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Streetphotobeing
I'm getting fed up with browsing through all the manipulated items on the internet and am planning to cut this activity right down. I've been on it so much largely because of my need to communicate with a /one/ man.
mim
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93. At 3:01pm on 22 Nov 2009, brossen99 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ydo2Mwnwpac&feature=player_embedded#
I have been staying abreast of this as it has 'unfurled', if in a somewhat odd manner. That the BBC's environmental reporting system seems to have gone into lock down for now is an interesting precedent. The theory seem to be they are working to a new era of 'watertight oversight' that on the face of it is welcome... if consistently applied across the board. Not so great if the BBC only gets rigourous when things are not quite going they way of the required narrative or how events have been decided to be interpreted. I do recall instances when they have not been so reticent in commentating on speculative or areas or indeed matters of legal complexity.
Having listened to the interview this is of course just one 'side', when I see much of the problem in sensible discourse being that the majority of the 'heat' on (A)GWarming seems to be generated by two sets of extremes with rather 'all or nothing' dogmatic views canceling out any illumination. Actually, compared to a lot from the 'sceptical side' this one was pretty measured and lacking in tribal triumphalism.
More than I can say for others. Still bearing the scars off trying to point out on such as James Delingpole's Telegraph blogs that one swallow does not summer make, and projecting potentially corrupted work at one place to disproving any man-made involvement in climate change is about as sensible as Al Gore cherry picking everything supportive as gospel to push his views.
And it is true the views so far from supportive media do seem to have been 'dismissive' or 'defensive' at best. Just got these in my in-box:
http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2009/11/the-cru-hack-context/
http://climatedenial.org/2009/11/22/swiftboating-the-climate-scientists/
I have tended to be wary of anything that still thinks 'deniers' to be a suitable basis to kick off upon, especially as this seems to include any asking questions, which ironically puts one in mind of Dubya's 'if you are not with us, you're 'agin us' piece of dubious diplomatic engagement.
Something has happened, and blaming every one else, and trying to focus on the 'crime' of the hack seems a tad desperate. Look at MP's expenses. Not sure if the stand off role of such as the Guardian or BBC is helping allay the sense that they are being very cautious with 'news' here because it doesn't suit this time. Hardly helpful to reputations for objectivity in the future in this area... or others.
One key thing in the piece you feature is the speaker referring to a rather cosy circle of 'peer review'. This has been used as a substantive pillar in defence of any science, and I have been in the past persuaded that this is a powerful validation. Now another question has arisen in my mind to taint this oft trotted out standard... especially when from the same lips as politicians who say 'the science is settled', and the PR passed on without much more than a 'wot I fink' by an often less than challenging media.
One which, along with the pols, seems to find an ongoing lack of enthusiasm from the public to engage as being the 'fault' of the public, rather than any worthy feedback on the content of the message, the quality of its sharing, and hence the competence of the message creators and/or bearers. But there are glimmers.
http://worldhaveyoursay.wordpress.com/2009/11/20/are-you-selfish-or-are-we-bad-journalists/
I made this comment over the weekend:
‘Are you selfish – or are we bad journalists ?’
There’s a sense of ‘them & us’ that may go some way to informing the second half of the question. If folk are not buying into a message (and it is not like it isn’t being shared… a lot) that usually tends to suggest there is a problem with its content… or the way it is being shared. QED.
There is so much swirling around that it is unsurprising folk are still confused, even when many in high office do state, and are supported by many in the media, that ‘the science is settled’. Then along comes something that might suggest it is not as settled as claimed before, often with deadlines that seem to pass with depressing frequency, only to be updated as things… ‘evolve’. Hence an understandable default to waiting and seeing seems hardly selfish, but possibly prescient.
And there is the focus of what does get shared. Too often it is absolutist terms that merge negative climate change with the various potential causes… and it is hard to get past the boogey man generic ‘it’, to get a handle on what the actual proposed ’solutions’ are, mean, what they will cost, achieve and how well all this has been structured to ensure the enviROI is positive. With contingencies. ‘Green’ is a broad church, and not everything that is demanded in its name need be ‘good’. One needs to prioritise, and honestly.
I recently had opportunities, via Newsnight and the Guardian, to pose questions to the respective climate and energy pols from the two major parties. Sadly, not much detail was forthcoming on many key issues.
Here are some areas of concern I posed, to find out what was, in the minds of these expert pols and their media supporters, those of priority:
Deforestation Shipping Population Autos (electric) Autos (hydrogen) Autos (LPG) Autos (oil dependent) Air travel Plastic bags Bottled water Immigration Renewables (tidal vs. wind vs. solar) Coal power Nuclear power Ethical Fashion Eating Pets Smart Grids Local micro-generation Boiler (and other efficiency-related job and green improving) scrappage TV size and power restriction bans Recycling for targets or box-ticks over viable recyclates Flooding defences Drain clearing Affordable housing Packaging Daylight saving
There are plenty more. Some critical. Some irrelevant. Honestly, which have had a lot of heat around them that didn’t deserve it, and how many need much more illumination than they have had so far?
Hence, maybe the questions for some media may better be: Is the critical issue still to:
a) Prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that negative climate change is totally at the door of man, and crush all not sharing this belief before tackling anything else. Or, now…
b) Accept that man may be more than an insignificant fly spoiling what is shaping up as a dubious ointment, and come up with pragmatic, coherent, across-the-board, non-hypocritical policies of engagement that are conveyed (with pros and cons, sensible times rather than daft deadlines and £ numbers where possible) via honest, best-we-can-guess, still informative, non-dogmatic comms efforts that do not pander to extreme dogma and depend pretty much solely on fright, guilt, nanny, pedestal, finger wag and/or fine?
Especially from those who seem to think they are too busy, smart or important for what they say others need to do as such needing to apply to their own actions?
I’d vote the latter.
And once I start to trust in the non-hypocritical objectivity of the messengers more, I might again be more moved to engage with the messages they seem still baffled are not being received as broadcast (especially when, too often, it is in ‘only’ mode. Back to the answer to the second half of the question).
Current developments, especially in the face of the latest CRU revelations, seems to suggest the rather over-confident ’science is settled’ justifications for pushing through any old thing in the name of ‘climate’ can be on rather shaky foundations, upon which are often also perched even shakier journalistic conceits.
It still awaits moderation (I don't think they work during this period)
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92. At 2:40pm on 22 Nov 2009, Roger Thomas wrote:
Unfortunately very little of what is being told to the public in the media is true.
I'll try and be more forgiving and suggest that 'true' be amended to 'accurate' (some revelations self-evidently excepted), as I am sure most are sincere, from pols to media folk, but have got so caught up in the spinning game they have forgotten how to take deep breaths, sit back, ponder a while, and sift facts from the cacophony of 'noise' that comes their way, and resist peer pressure attempts to sway matters in ways that coincide with personal, and often personal political beliefs.
Hence the floods in Cumbria are no more necessarily 'proof' of (A)GW than fly in the air. Yet every report and talking head from gov, quango or expert activist group seems to be trying to allude it is down to 'climate change'. Projecting that on taxing flights whilst extending car scrappage, or ignoring shipping industry pollution as it doesn't suit... does not compute.
But, equally, to claim there need be no concern on highest rainfall rates in recorded history is equally facile. What happens when that water hits the ground being another story. One it will be interesting to see how it gets played out.
It is to be hoped that we may yet get to an era of political and media professional honesty, hopefully complemented by competence.
Who knows, once that happens the public may start trusting again and work with genuine efforts that truly are 'for the best'.
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Streetphotobeing
As it's raining and I don't feel like getting wet and thus delaying venturing out, I've had a few rhymed thoughts on Dr Whore which I'd like to share with you:
Dr Whore is not getting the message
Dr Whore is too full of himself
Dr Whore who's turned out to be garbage
A pitiful creep seeking great wealth.
mim
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And one more, Streetphotobeing, about the male whore
Dr Whore thinks he's got it sussed out
Having bribed so many a man
Having bribed so many a woman
But for me a pitiful conman
Who will get neither the wealth nor the flesh.
He seems he's got himself into a mesh
Being unravelled as I write and as I speak
Once again, he is a pitiful mad creep.
No forgiveness is coming from here
Whatever the reasons that seem to appear
To come from when a boy he used to once be.
Once again, he is a monstrous, mad creep.
As for his colleagues, the number one and then three,
Their 'dreams' will also hang on a tree
For all to see and for all to spat at
Whether wearing some jeans or wearing a hat.
mim
P.S. I know that Dr Whore likes to be talked about but I'm not dittying about him to boost his ego but rather to add more salt to the wound, as well as trying to make sure that he and his colleagues are dealt with in the near future. Something tells me that it is not impossible.
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To Whoever
Having said that I'm now concerned about another homeless person, a young man of around 20 who like Tim, whose funeral is on Wednesday this week at 2 o'clock at the Putney Vale Crematorium, Roehampton, seems to have developed an infection after sleeping rough one night. I know that the Police know where he can be found and I was wondering whether somebody could make sure he doesn't finish like Tim.
He's been in touch with the Homeless Unit at the Wandsworth Council who are prepared to help him but there is a delay with him getting a copy of his birth certificate. I have a feeling that number 3 thinks that somehow the young man is some sort of his equivalent. It was no 2 with Tim, of that I am certain.
mim
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And on a more general note, apparently the people who sell the Big Issue do not have the right to a free prescription. That's what I've been told anyway. Apparently they can get free medications in Walking in Clinics so maybe I'm worrying unduly. However, some of the people who sell The Big Issue that I have met seem to be caught up in a vicious circle not always able to earn enough money to sleep with a roof over their heads and not enough to be able to pull themselves out of that vicious circle. So I was wondering whether the owner of the Big Issue shouldn't help them more on that score.
Another thing that's worrying me is that I suspect, although it is only a suspicion, that these vulnerable people may be used by some kind of nasty spongers stealing money from them.
Madam Mim
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DOES SLOW FOOD MEAN EATING AN ELEPHANT, BURGER BY BURGER?
#105/106 JunkkMale
Much food for thought there. Well constructed. Great links. Ingesting and digesting slowly.
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TOP HATS AND TROUSERS
Just took in Andrew Marr - Start The Week.
Some scholar was calling for recognition that we CAN all get on. He pointed to the Crusaders mingling happily with the Muslims. What - like the British Army and Navy used to 'mingle' during that WWII, when they were supposed to be on the same side? Perhaps it was the knights (not the squaddies) who wrote the diaries?
The trouble with intellectuals is they never realise that they are somewhat farther from 'the animal' than oikdom. They are nerds - so carried away with intellectual exchange in lofty chapeaux - they forget the majority live in their trousers.
Unfortunately, with politicians it is the Third Way. They use intellect for deceit, and trousers as an expression of the power they crave - the worst of all worlds.
Celtic wants 'truth' - Junkk wants 'accuracy' - I'll take 'reality'. Whatever. Oikdom will just take another drink - and anything that can't run away. Armageddon anyone?
Definitions: NERD - unable to comprehend the world view of the Oik.
OIK - unable to comprehend the world view of the nerd.
POLITICIAN - (unsuitable definition removed).
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Anybody read this 106. At 6:40pm on 22 Nov 2009, Khaled wrote: from Thursdays posts...
I like things straight from the horses mouth.
105 Good post JunkkMale, still ingesting it!
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http://www.thegwpf.org/
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#112
Mr Singleton
You're just another trouser wearing 'animal' who thinks that he's got it all working out, aren't you?
Reality, both natural and human, 'my dear', is a multifarious manifestation of all kinds of make-ups, so to speak, interlinking with the constantly changing phenomenon of universal flux. Shame only that some make-ups do not have the real insight into the flux, etc. Some posters have tried to engage in real exchanges with you but you seem as inflexible as Dr Whore Know it All.
Madam Mim
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#111
As for myself, Brightyangthing, I'm having a rare steak for dinner tonight with that delicious ice cream to follow.
mim
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Just heard an appropriately titled song on the radio (R2).
"Do you want the truth, or something beautiful?"
Answers on a postcard please, to................????
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#113
Lucky you, Ecolizzy, to get it straight from the horse's mouth, unless I'm misinterpreting /?/
mim
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TO MISINTERPRET IT IS FIRST NECESSARY TO ADDRESS INTERPRETATION (#115)
You are in no danger Mim.
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HIDING TO NOTHING
Science is often a hiding place for the socially incompetent - the 'absent minded professor' being the extreme embodiment. Thus a scientist can be 'poor in spirit' yet loom large in his chosen discipline. Such people do not accept the nakedness of the Emperor easily, when challenged - the more so when formed into a group consensus - worse if it is the politically expedient consensus. The most immediate horror, is the 'expert' who damns an innocent to years in jail with his certainty.
Once again the problem is lack of maturity and wisdom - individually and collectively. The cloud of stupidity that now envelopes this planet, is far more threatening than any 'greenhouse gas'.
Has anyone posted this NIPCC link? http://www.nipccreport.org/
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"FLY SPOILING DUBIOUS OINTMENT" (#105)
There's no answer to that! Keep 'em coming Junkk. (:o)
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#119
Ah, but Barrie, it's not me I'm worrying about, it's the homeless I come across, it's human beings like the politicians and journalists who were murdered in the Philippines early this morning and thousands and thousands more having been killed off or mutilated in the name of the 'game'.
Great fun, isn't it, Mr Singleton?
Sure, I do not like the torture but what others and their families have to go through because of some mad creeps having fun is not only unforgivable and methinks punishable and I'm just wondering why it's been taking so long to do something about it.
Madam Mim
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105. At 07:52am on 23 Nov 2009,
Just back from a day 'off', but still dodging floods.
Remember I mentioned this?:
http://worldhaveyoursay.wordpress.com/2009/11/20/are-you-selfish-or-are-we-bad-journalists/
Well in my browser it seems to have migrated. Or... something... (not my fault, as I am sure Barry's blogdog would not have allowed me to post a broken link, surely?)
Error 404 - Not Found
Oh no! You're looking for something which just isn't here! Fear not however, errors are to be expected [oh, the... further... irony]
And the lengthy, barely digestible (sorry, but ta to those nice enough to reply for persevering) comment I tried to make over the weekend seems not to have made the 'cut' in it's new, slightly different incarnation either:
http://worldhaveyoursay.wordpress.com/2009/11/23/are-you-selfish-or-are-we-bad-journalists/
Which has now been joined by this fine, well-balanced fellow:
http://worldhaveyoursay.wordpress.com/2009/11/23/on-air-are-climate-chnage-deniers-the-greatest-threat-to-our-planet/
Nowt like setting out your stall up front and personal, very personal, starting in the headline.
Just what might a 'climate change denier' actually be? The term makes zero sense. Who denies the climate changes? It just seems to be a pet term for some to try to lob about to pigeon hole those who have a few questions on the 'solely man made orthodoxy' currently under some scrutiny, which I rather thought a national broadcaster committed to 'watertight oversight' might feel is rather pejorative to use in balanced, objective reporting and moderated debate.
So we seem to be still in a state of flux*. And, not just climatically but also its reporting (or not), especially in some places which frankly should know better... well and truly better... that's heading well and truly to being more than a little *ed up in its handling of this.
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#123 JunkkMale
Got the error 404 not found, myself so just clicked on the links at the side.
Will read them again. They just seem a bit wordish and I am not quite sure what they are trying to say. But as JJ would say some of us are not blessed with verbal skills.
Celtic Lion
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