Talk about Newsnight

I hope his book does well and more people wake up and smell the real world.

Why spend time interviewing Dawkins?

It seemed so quaint discussing God.

Poor Paxman having to act the theist.

Richard Dawkins is one of those few voices that I am glad to hear in a world of ever increasing faith and delusion. He brings the light of reason to the table.

Currently listening to the Dawkins interview. My initial thoughts (and I need to look further into the book) are that it would help greatly if Newsnight were to have Professor Dawkins interviewed by someone from within the Christian church who understands what it means to have a living relationship with God. I really felt Jeremy Paxman was presenting God as some sort of warm comfortable feeling that people get when they stand up on a mountain and look at the landscape. Let's get real. God is real in so many ways - just start understanding what His Holy Spirit does every day in believers' lives. Then we can have a real discussion with Prof Dawkins.

Richard Hawkins is a God (amongst thinking men at least)

What a cold, Godless man, who never misses an opportunity to take a pop at believers. I think I'll write a book called 'The Dawkins Delusion'.

Dawkins last comment was "I don't believe we are put here to be comfortable".

If he does not believe in God, then who are we "put here" by?

Professor Dawkins speaks a lot of sense. We don't need the Judaio-Christian-Islamic god any more than we need a flying spaghetti monster, Thor or Zeus.

A voice of reason when religious beliefs are causing people to act and force their unwelcome views, opinions and laws on others.

Religion is the path to intolerance.

D

This common sense thinking is welcome and a long time overdue... about 2000 years overdue.

Hawkins is a legend. This should be required reading at school for all kids. It's time to open our minds and actually think about our place in the universe rather than simply deferring to a bunch of ludicrous and irrelevent fairy tales...

Professor Dawkins is right, but for obvious reasons doesn't go far enough. All organised religion should be outlawed. Not personal belief and faiths, take note. But organised religion is inherently evil. It has no place in a modern society. People of religious faith should ask one question and examine it carefully; If death was finally defeated by a techonological society, would they still believe in their God?
Think carefully.

Mr. Dawkins - the only deluded one, sadly, is you. Hopefully, the God you are unable to believe in will introduce himself to you before it's too late. Rgds. SH.

this poor stressed scientist need some peace and I am sure in a few years he will be writting his book about his own conversion to Christianity.
At the moment he seemes so confused and unrest . There is no way I will like to have his conviction if one ends up without peace. He should re-read CS Lewis and understand how he is being used... best of luck Mr Richard! Don't forget the teaching or our Lord, Love and forgiveness, he will always be ready to welcome you, try to search harder for the truth and you may end up like a new St Paul or a new CS Lewis himself!

Thank God! Someone who seeks truth over faith. We make our own purpose in life, and should live to our own values - not interpret others as our own.

Richard Dawkins' final comment to Jeremy Paxman was: "I don't believe we were put here to be comfortable." Who does he think put him here?

I was really saddened to hear the interview with Richard Dawkins. I am a Christian, and cannot see how people can look at the mountains, rivers and even at the human body and not see God at work in things so complex. I challange anyone to read the Bible and then deny God and his son Jesus.

Having just watched Richard Dawkins feeble attempt to disprove God, he was passionate enough to set himself up as the'font of all knowledge'. His opinions, and thats all they are, feed his own ego. He needs an encounter with Jesus to know about Truth and love. I encountered god over 30 years ago and it wasn't for comfort. To walk in the ways of Christ is very difficult in a world that prefers to hate rather than love.I cannot go with his comments on the New Testament especially since god healed me of epilepsy,angina, child abuse, gall bladder and also delivered me from smoking. I serve a mighty God who loves the whole world even Richard for all his foolishness. You don't need an Oxford degree to know that God does exist..just faith.

Thank goodness someone has written about all the things which worry me about religion.. Fundamentalists whereever they are are extremely worrying and yet most people don't seem to see past their concerns for muslim fundamentalists. Religion to me seems to be the root cause of most of the conflicts of the world and it would be pleasing if people woke up to the fact that they are fighting in the name of something which doesn't exist

At The end of the interview Prof. Dawkins said " I don't believe we were put here to be comfortable." put here by what? for some purpose or not for some other purpose? sounds very religious to me.

Thank Goodness (not God) that someone is speaking out on behalf of us millions of atheists - something you never hear from any public figures whatsoever.
Let's put this mediaeval phase behind us, shoulder our own responsibilities and work to create a modern world.

Finally, a man with the conviction of pursuing the truth and is not afraid to communicate his findings in an articulate / structured way this to the masses!!

I think this man will strike a cord in many reasonable human beings who let's face it, already have doubts in themselves that a higher being exists.

Professor you have my full support and suspect many others to come.

An Economist.

I agree with the title, although I would not criticise people that do believe in a god. I just wish people would keep their beliefs to themselves. It is fair enough to share good morales that may be enforced throughout a religion.

But it is not fair to force beliefs upon people. It is evil to use religion as an excuse for war. I think many people may conclude that many wars and years of fighting could have been avoided if there were no religions.

It seems to me that rather than pick up on the good points of a particular religion, some followers turn their attention to fighting with other religious groups because they feel they are right and the others are wrong.

Is there a God?

I don't know. I suppose that is where faith should come in.

It'd be trivial enough to say there's no God in the physical universe if so many people didn't actually believe it.

But exactly like these people, I think Professor Dawkins seems to have misread what all religion is really about... that God, if one exists, resides in the psychological universe... which is the one we're all ultimately left with.

a very interesting interview, but didn't Richard Dawkins rather undo all he has said and written about with his final comment of the evening. "I don't think we were put here for comfort" Who does he think put him here. If he is here for a purpose might there not be some higher being that 'put him here then'? No he didn't win me over at all. A great interview though. Thank you.

Mark Melluish

I've read several of Dawkin's books on Biology - "The Selfish Gene", "The Blind Watchmaker" etc. The man is a brilliant biologist. Unfortunately he has almost no real understanding of religious belief.

Tonight's interview with Paxman was interesting. Paxman is a skilled interviewer and asked insightful questions, but found my self thinking, wouldn't it have been good if Dawkins had debated with a proper theologian? Then I realised that I've never seen him do that except where he has control over the editing.

So by all means read the book. But when you have finished, could I recommend Alistair McGrath's "Dawkins' God", which is a well balanced commentary on Dawkins' views by a real theologian whose background is in biology - the sort of person who "baffles" Dawkins.

I'd pay good money to hear Dawkins speak on Biology. But when it comes to religion a taxi driver is as good

Thank God for Richard Dawkins.
I'm always shocked at intelligent people professing their belief in God.
If this book encourages more people to come out as atheists, rather than being wishy washy agnostics, the better.

In these mad times how refreshing to hear the Paxman interview with Richard Dawkins! Dawkins is so clear thinking. Compare him to that mad Islamist who was 'interviewed' on Breakfast this morning and the well spoken but equally misguided Rabbi.

Hehee - the God Delusion! What about the far more irrational "scientific" evolutionary delusion: that we are just the accidental side effect of a random explosion in nothingness, chance chemical soup & trillions of normally overwhelmingly destructive genetic mistakes!?
But of course Dawkins goes even further than that - & actually believes that life, morals & consciousness etc is just the result of random bio-electrical firings in our brains - itself the accidental side effect of our "Selfish Genes" mindless quest to duplicate themselves!
Comedian, heal thyself....
Philip Snow
"The Design & Origin of Birds" DayOne Books

Richard Dawkins was superb and very self-assured tonight. He answered questions straight from the hip of Jeremy Paxman, never faltered and was always on the ball. It was a brilliant performance. Bravo!

Any chance of posting the full book on the web?
£20 Is a bit steep for me.
After all, if Kahlil Gibran can do so, why can't you Richard?
I'm sure you can cover your living costs with your University salary.
Then more of us could get to read the book and get closer to the truth.
I await your response with anticipation.
Dermot Egan

We desperately need people such as Dawkins to counteract the fearsome power of religion. Anyone as intelligent as him who can expose the nonsense that passes for religion should be heeded. Tell me of a war that has not involved religion and I might believe that it has a value for the world.
The misery of this world should be sufficient to dispel any belief in a diety, let alone a benevolent one.

Professor Dawkins deserves a vote of thanks for his contribution to the debate on religion. When will humanity realise that it is time to move on; that we can only progress as a species by abandoning our last, and most trenchant, superstition?

Does anyone else out there quietly rage and fume about the utter waste of human resources in the futile pursuit of worthless and pointless religions?

My biggest angst is that I live in a time when the vast majority of the human race still believes in 2000 year old myths and superstitions written in a time of ignorance and stupidity.

Wake up people and realise that we only have one life and it should be lived in the pursuit of human kindness love and respect for other human beings and not an imaginary god and ever stranger hair splitting interpretations of ancient texts. These bizarre beliefs only lead to further reasons for segregation of people along religious lines rather than a coming together through shared human experiences

Thank Human kind for Richard Dawkins

Religion is by far the worst concept ever devised by man, having caused more bloodshed and misery than anything else by a vast margin and continues to do so.
Religious fervour is basically an ego trip, believers holding the opinion that they as an individual (and as a member of humanity) are so special and important that they must be destined for better things.
As far as I'm aware, life exists purely for the purpose of propagating more life but those gripped by an irrational belief in some all powerful deity give themselves a self serving device to give meaning to an otherwise pointless and meaningless existance.

Professor Dawkins seems to be stating no more than the obvious, though as ever he does so in a most engaging and lucid fashion. I would only complain about his need to introduce his opposition to the action in Iraq into the argument; he obviously feels very strongly about that, but he should realise that people like David Kelly didn't support the action because of any religious motivation, or because they were 'dragged' into it by Bush or Blair. However, I take one of his central points to be that belief in some supernatural afterlife allows people to behave in what would normally be seen as an 'evil' fashion, and that is certainly the case.

I’d just like to say, I’m in fully support of what this book is trying too and after watching the news night interview with the author I can say that I agreed with him completely.

I think it is about time atheists around the world started to make more of an effort like this to help try and inform the billions of severely unenlightened people in this world of the truth. It’s getting to the stage now where politics influenced by religion is becoming highly dangerous. You only have to look at bush and the Middle East fighting their holy wars now to get an idea of what to come if these world wide absurd delusions are allowed to carry on spreading through the minds of the gullible.

the last words of prof. dawkins in the interview were "... we weren't put here to be comfortable." So who put us here prof?

I have always admired and respected Richrd Dawkins for his sensible, logical and scientific stance against the complete and utter nonsense that is religion. I hope that this book continues this brave struggle.

I was so relieved to hear Richard Dawkins on Newsnight tonight. All my life I've thought religion just doesn't make sense, for all the reasons I heard from Richard. I've always been amazed that intelligent people all around me can believe what just isn't believable, and wondered if I was missing something, but didn't really think so. I'll buy and read his book, with great pleasur, and relief. Maybe there is hope for the world to be sensible, but I think it will take a long time

Coming from a christian upbringing, Richard Dawkins has removed my stigmatism of being an athiest.

I find all his publications to be a great insight into darwinism and how we continue to exist!

MANY THANKS RICHARD, I THINK THAT YOU SHOULD BE APPLAUDED MANY TIMES OVER.

It could have been a much longer interview.

Dawkins is right on all fronts of course. Why do we not hear more views like this more often...

A brave man indeed, but a man who speaks the truth. Dawkings has always voiced his beliefs, but unfortunatley he is seldom heard, lets hope this book is the first step into changing some peoples minds about the absurdity of religion and the troubles that comes with it, because without it we would have a whole lot less to fight about.

It's about time someone told these truths. Religion has deluded and traumatised the world for millennia. The need for religion is well past its sell-by date and belongs in the dustbin of history. Religion may provide a crutch for the weak-minded - but surely, if someone has a weakness, it is vastly better to cure them than merely provide them with a broken crutch!

When you think about it at length, except as an idea (albeit a very useful one), a kilogramme does not actually exist. If one published a book to that effect, would they make you a professor at Oxford?
I feel for Prof. Dawkins. The Lord loves an honest atheist, He is certainly not religious Himself, but in Prof Dawkins He has a problem. For should He decide to reward the good, truthful, tolerant to bigots, professor by allowing him into Heaven, Prof Dawkins would surely be very pissed-off to be somewhere he is sure does not exist.

To prove the existence of God is very easy.
Right now I'm sitting in my house - a building. I instinctively know there was a builder. I can't see him, smell him, touch him nor hear him but it stands to reason there was a builder. Similarly looking at a painting. I can't see the painter; I can't smell him, touch him etc. but I reason there was a painter. We can use the same reasoning for creation. Can't see him, smell him, touch him, hear him but from the beauty and order of creation there must be a creator. The Bible says a fool in his heart has said there is no God.

Good stuff! Richard Dawkins FTW

Dawkins makes some salient points, but he also leaves himself open to counter-argument too easily. For example, he says "ONLY religious faith is a strong enough force to motivate such utter madness in otherwise sane and decent people." (My Emphasis) This just doesn't seem obviously true, political ideals (e.g. Fascism) have been strong enough to motivate utter madness in otherwise sane and decent people. So, it might be argued, are we then to bury politics along with religion - because of the well documented consequences? I think that the analogy may not stand up to scrutiny, but in making such strongly generalised assertions as I have quoted, Dawkins makes it too easy for his detractors to undermine what is an essentially well reasoned argument.

professor Dawkins is entierly right he has not gone far enough to be politicaly correct but where is the evidence of god in tsamis in war .the fact his alledged favourites are still very much dead. they have gone to a better place why do none of these people help us why take children who have no sin. i think the sin is ours in our belief that we have external powers to blame to not question. we should question everything it is the only way we have survived. god does nothing men do everything in his name...

Thank God for Richard Dawkins! Never have I heard such solid common sense, articulating so well all the thoughts I, and doubtless many others, have had for years.All power to his elbow, but I don't hold out much hope against the indoctrinated massed ranks of the forces of religious ignorance.

I've read the first chapter or so of the book and I've found it to be a refreshingly honest and frequently hilarious critique of religiosity and all of its vices.

I applaud Richard Dawkins.

Religious leaders are always given plenty of media time, and vast respect.

Many people in the UK DO NOT believe in religion and yet in the media we are given no voice.

When did Richard Dawkins become a
biblical scholar, he seems to be on
a mission to teach people what to believe. how the hell can he say that
God dosen't exist no one can say that
he's got a damn cheek just because
he's an Atheist he thinks everyone
else should be.

Little wonder that the BBC is constantly lambasted for it's bias against Christianity. On 'Newsnight', Jeremy only asked Professor Dawkins for his opinion on stories from the Old and New Testaments. Why did he not ask Dawkins about the sacred writings of other world religions and how they were delivered to the faithful? Why does the BBC defer more to other religions than it does Christianity?

Why do many people believe than being religious makes you happy? Accepting the view point that people aren't superior to any other species in this universe and that when you die you don't go to a different spiritual world doesn't make you unhappy. In fact, I think this view point makes a person really appreciate the beauty and complexity of this world. I am not religios at all but believe that everything is connected by energy and that when you die you really do die but every part of your body becomes part of something else. Why is that so scary to believe? Religious people seem to live in a lot of fear.

One thing that I find very difficult to understand is how people think that it is moral to follow a religion that is supposedly 'good' but has a entire history of killing thousands of people. Religion seems to be an excuse for everything, it is a source of power and a way of abusing people and having control over a society.

I think most people who are religious haven't really done any research into the religion that they follow. Being a 'good' and 'moral' doesn't have to be achieved by following a set of rules established many years ago. There are many non-religious people who are 'good' and 'moral'. The myth that being religious makes you a 'good' person needs to be dimissed. This myth runs strong in society. On the news if someone is a church-goer this is always mentioned as if to make the point that this person was a good person. Do they ever pop into the report that someone is an atheist when it has no relevance to the news report at all? I think not.

What a man of faith Richard Dawkins is! He has an unshakeable (and passionately evangelical) faith in the absolute power of human reason. (Or at least his own.) It's just a pity for him that the history of science is full of people who thought they had the last word on all sorts of things only for later generations of scientist to prove they were talking nonsense, or at best had only a quite limited understanding of that which they had been observing. Professor Dawkins claims to be interested in truth - well, perhaps the truth for Richard Dawkins might be twofold (1) there is a God and (2) you are not him.

Richard Dawkins
This guy is in danger of becoming god himself,he just talks so much sense.
If people really just took a moment to question their so called beliefs i think they would come to the same conclusion that there is no such thing as some guy watching everything and questioning your every move.That's not allah or god or yaweh that's New Labour

I absolutely agree with the author, unfortunately the relgious people are comfortable in their religion, they are gullible, but not, it seems, to the obvious, why does anyone need more than the universe.

I agree with Richard Dawkins that there are many dangerous beliefs (held by both religious and non-religious people). But his repeated claim that all religion is bad because some misuse it for their own ends is not well thought through. You could just as equally argue that all science is bad because some scientists use their knowledge for their own evil gains, or that all accountancy is to be shunned because some accountants use their skills to embezzle.

At last someone with some courage to tell it like it is.

Total respect for Professor Dawkins. I couldn't agree more with his statements.

Re Dawkins,
Given no God how do you keep people good? What is then the basic of our moral code?
I get the impression that most people no longer believe in god, but want some very good reason for sticking to their (Christian ) moral code. They need to be told "you are right to be good and respect Christian values because they are a good way to behave because......"
By saying there is no god you take away a crutch without putting anything for people to hang on to.
It is a serious problem. People did not make up god for no reason; they made him up to give strength to the moral code they invented and believed in.
So give us a lead, don’t just knock the simple man's answer if you cannot replace it with something as good.
WRT

Beauty & order??? Much of "creation" is ugly and chaotic.

Richard Dawkins said at the end of the interview that he "loves" his wife, family and science etc.

But if life is ulimately meaningless, that is, when you die, you cease to exist and thus it would be as if you had never existed (Been) in the first place. Then, what is "Love"?

I'd be interested to find out what he means by "Love"?

{What significance he attaches to it.}

How refreshing to hear the rational professor Dawkins on Newsnight.

Hopefully, everyone will buy his book and give it the time, thought & judgement it deserves.

Needs to be said. Keep alive and avoid a Fatwah and the thunderbolt.

Despite (or is it in spite of) my first name I am not of the faith, or any faith. What you say needs to be said, and said repeatedly. I've seen fervent religion up close (4 years in Saudi) and it is not pleasant, not pleasant at all. Your remarks re female punishment (they were still being stoned to death for adultery when I lived there) are all too correct. Can you speak more loudly? Can you promote your 'reason' more widely - please.
I really just have one question for you - how in the UK does state funding of religious schools (from Islam to CofE) make for a more civilised and tolerant society?
Dare I also say - we enjoyed the recent TV programmes too.
Many thanks, and please persevere.
Chris

In response to gareth morris.
a)you seem to misunderstand evolution.
b)taking a step back,you are making many logical flaws in your analogy. go here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Hume#The_design_argument

c)just because the bible says something doesnt make it true like any other book ever written. any response ive heard to that is equivalent to 'the bible is true because it says its true'

Richard Dawkins states that "The other is by example: God, or some other biblical character, might serve as ... a role model. ... if followed through ... encourage a system of morals which any civilized modern person... would find ... obnoxious."
In doing so he must infer that following the example of Jesus, living as he did, wold be obnoxious. I find this strange as I cannot think of a better example of a human being? I wish he would explain in what way Jesus' life was obnoxious.

Beauty & order??? Much of "creation" is ugly and chaotic and using the criteria that G Morris advocates for proof, anything can be shown to be true.

Given that the existence or non-existence of God is not objectively proveable, I see nothing wrong in belief or disbelief accoording to personal life experiences that lead a person to their stance. Science, though, would indicate that if there is a god then he/she is a rational being. What is completely irrational though, is to believe that an omnipotent god could not see his/her plan through to completion without the aid of George Bush, Tony Blair or Osama Bin Laden.

I would like to share a little story with Professor Dawkins whom like myself,desires the Truth. I invited an Independent Councillor Keith Watkin to a private viewing of my art exhibition. It was dedicated to the Oneness of God & the majesty of Mother Earth. When he arrived he stated that he didn't believe in God. I explained that i couldn't not believe in God as i had experienced just too many minor miraculous events. Of all the mant many events that i could have chosen to share with him i chose this... One evening i found myself having an out of body experience. I was outside the main Post Office and witnessing a robbery in action. I then followed the get away car to the place where the robbers abandoned it. On the news the next morning it reported the robbery and the location of the get away car. Poor Mr.Watkin looked shocked and then said that he was present at that robbery as he was standing on the corner.He eventually asked me never to contact him again as he didn't want to read in the news that i had been found dead in my hallway.!!

Dear Professor i was a total atheist like your self until i had what is commonly reffered to as 'A Near Death Experience.'As a child my father nicknamed me bloody fingers due to my constant probing into things. Belief is of no use to me. I have to experience things. There is a Light and when i was in it, the love that i felt was undescribable. I was then taken to a garden and sat at the foot of a tree. I was told to Give all my love to the tree & that the tree would give me everything that i needed. I belong to no religion and all religions as the tree taught me that we are in Truth all one. Thank you.

Professor Dawkins claims to be interested in truth. His statement that the New Testament is simply one of a number of similar mythical compositions is simply not true. Although there are a number of such collections, the differences between their teachings and claims and those of the New Testament are far greater than their similarities. The New Testament is absolutely unique. I challenge Dawkins to set side by side the teachings of Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism, the religions of Papua New Guinea, etc., and prove that they are all equally implausible.

Sorry Gareth, but that does not constitute a proof.

well being a scientist he must know that going by recent studies, the chances of the universe landing the way it is just now is trillions upon trillions upon trillions to one, scientists say there are two possibilities for this, multi parrallel dementional space or some sort of creator, i guess if the top physics men of today are including god or something like a god as one of two possibilities then i think this author is well off is his suggestion that god simply does not exist

Listening to Richard Dawkins I was amazed that he thought the easiest way for us to find Utopia was to sit around taking drugs. This is wishful thinking not the truth and he will not find that until he has feelings for his fellow man and stop his world being dominated by facts. I have never seen a formula for feelings, relationships, consideration or love. It has to be learnt and more people try the better this world will be. What ever your opinion may be, a damp good reference book to read is the Bible.

Inferring a designer from looking at an object such as a house is a different matter to inferring a designer by looking at the universe. One still has to explain the designer. How did that being come into existence?
Where is the proof?

It's easy to find evidence of builders, just go to your local DIY shop.
The complexity of everything in this world from flowers to people does not provide any evidence for the existence of a God.

many people believe in miracles walking on water and virgin births.
vast sums of money are generated by
many who propogate these myths.

Richard Dawkins increasingly puts me in mind of that Edward Woodward character in the 70's film classic The Whicker Man. Blundering around in a world he doesnt understand, making rash judgements based crudely on the 'crass' diet of 'fast religion', he knows prescious little about the pre-history of the human mind, of the human inter-reality which was and still can be spiritual, profoundly intuitive in the extreme and uncannily related to the life, the Earth and the Universe creating a charge of being so sadly missing from todays card board cut-out identities. The great holy men (and women) of the past - so few remain - were perhaps somewhat reflected of late in the great Sioux elder Fools Crow. Now, if Richard Dawkins could have met and seriously dismissed that man's world then I might listen to his arguments with greater curiosity. If he could have met the Cogi of Columbia pre-corruption and not been somewhat stunned by their slightly disturbing 'ability' and 'presence of mind', then his continued denial might place in question his own pre-conceived sanity. The crimes committed both by a politicised Christianity and a self-intoxicatedly athiest humanism are to destroy the very evidence that undermines the simplicity of the athiest position itself, as well as that of the more dogmatic religious orders.

I agree with Prof Dawkins' view that truth is objective, so I was surprised to hear him say in the interview such things as Christianity was invented by St Paul! No intelligent historian believes this as to do so would be to ignore the objective historical truth, backed by historical evidence, that Christianity is founded on the person and teachings of Jesus of Nazareth. It appears the Prof simply chooses to disregard objective truth that gets in the way of his personal beliefs, which is precisely what he dislikes about religious people!

I was mesmerized by the Dawkins interview on Newsnight. How clearly he explained the things that I have felt to be true since I cast off religion when I was a teenager, well over 40 years ago. I am afraid however that religion which set out to save mankind will in the end prove to be its undoing. Some religions have become finely tuned machines that brainwash each new generation at a very early age. So they cannot be easily ‘corrupted’ by the real world. Remember the Jesuit maxim used to be “give me a child until he is seven and he is mine for life”. The maxim holds true for all religions (given half a chance), even in the modern age. That is why it will prove to be necessary to strictly control and secularise all education in every school in every country on the planet. Since the opposition against such a move would be so enormous, I am afraid the world as we know it has no future. That’s a very sad thing. Not for me, but for our children’s children.

Mr Dawkins is once again on his personal crusade against religion & God. I think if you are going to discuss a subject such as 'God' you should define what it is you are discussing. Ok, I haven't read the book, but it seems Dawkins is refering to a personal, man with a beard type god.He also ridicules the Bible. Ok fine. I and many believe there is an intelligence behind the universe, call it nature if you want, that permeates and runs through and is the source of all 'life'. Conciousness is the buiding block of the universe- not matter. Mr Dawkins would have you believe that somehow the mind is a product of the brain.
How this could be has not yet been shown by any scientist.
Mr Dawkins writes many books, but can you trust that what he says is not heavily coloured by his own set of predujices?
As for the 9/11 incident being the fault of religion- well that's patent nonsence. 9/11 was as a direct consequence of all the western perpetrated injustice in the world.
The USA's indiscriminate support for Israel and the staggering crimes perpetrated on the Palestinian people.

Professor Dawkins provides a convincing, well presented argument and it is refreshing to hear a discussion about religion that is calm and rational. In fact, it is refreshing to hear a discussion about the merits of religion on TV at all.

Post 9/11 the media has focussed on the war on terror(which we seem to be both paying for and victims of). It seems to me that it would be far more productive to declare a war on religion, albeit a non-violent one. You only have to pick up a paper to see that religion is the cause of hundreds of deaths every single day.

I don't think that we should tell people what they should believe but it is clear to me that the world would be a far better place without religion. Love your family and respect other people, regardless of their beliefs. You don't need to believe in god to do this and it has the benefits of religion without the mass murder and hatred.

If a religious person explains their belief to you just subsitute the word 'god' for any improbable thing ....aliens, fairies at the bottom of the garden etc. It is clear that if the person went around saying aliens built the world in 7 days they would soon be locked in a room with no sharp edges. If they believe god did it they become president of the united states.

I hope Prof Dawkins get his desired effect and at least gets people to think rationally about it. If they do, there can only be one conclusion and that will be better for us all.

Gareth Morris' proof of the existence of God (aka the argument from design) is no such thing, for the following, well known reasons:
1 - even if we accept the analogy, it implies more than one creator, if all the created things we humans make and use (buildings, paintings etc.) have a different creator, then analogously, so does the universe.
2 - A builder, a painter and so on, all have creators, i.e. parents. Therefore, if we accept the analogy, who is God's creator, and the creator of God's creator? If it is asserted that God is an un-caused cause, then what is to stop us saying the same thing about the universe itself, as Occam would have us do?
3 - A builder builds using materials. God is supposed to have created everything from nothing. So the analogy is clearly false on that front.
4 - finally, the whole analogy seems false because it assumes that if two things share one propery then they share all their properties. Like so:
A: A building is complex
B: A building has a builder
C: The universe is also complex
D: Therefore the universe has a 'builder'

But that is like arguing:
A Plants are living organisms
B Plants grow in the earth
C Human beings are also living organisms
D Therefore humans grow in earth

Which is clearly false. So, even if we accept the analogy, it runs into problems 1 and 2, but to accept it would be to accept an analogy which is fundamentally flawed.

The scrolls and writings upon which all religions seem to be based are undeniably physical objects. It therefore follows that they were created by a physical, actual, hand. The only assurance which we have that they are indeed the words of the various dieties which they claim to represent are the assurances of the long dead people who created them, presumably from the voices in their heads..and the thousands of intermediaries who have sought to interpret their "meaning" for us, most often very profitably for themselves, their Churches, and their various political masters. I ask you, do you really believe that people in "the olden days" were really so trustworthy?

i find it funny how people like to believe religion is a precursor for the evils of the world, considering two of the most evil men is history stalan and hitler were not religious, would humans not just find another excuses to commit murder and war against each other anyway, i think we would and i think youll find that the dark side of homo sapien behaviour is probably the main reason we are the number species on this planet instead of our extinct neanderthal cousins

Richard Dawkins, in his admirable attacks on superstitions of various kinds, forgets that religion has other aspects. It is possible to be, as I am, a materialist and an atheist, but one who sees God -- or gods -- as an illusion rather than a delusion, one generated by human beings' faith in each other. What is significant is that a true faith is one that is prepared to find that the 'truth' and 'sincerity' of one's beliefs, convictions, promises, vows, rules, values are open to deep subversion. Tragic differences with others may demand sacrifices beyond what was 'taken for' granted when promises were made. Nevertheless, the holding to an imaginary ideal KNOWN TO BE IMAGINARY is what we cannot escape when we enter into the 'rules' of language, the very thing that makes us human. This opens another route between Dawkins's 'truth' and the 'lies' of the superstitious: in his replies to Jeremy Paxman it is plain he has only seen these two opposing possibilities. See my book published six months before his -- 'Narrative, Perception, Language and Faith' (Palgrave Macmillan 2005).

At 11:22 PM on 22 Sep 2006, Gareth Morris wrote:

"To prove the existence of God is very easy.

"Right now I'm sitting in my house - a building. I instinctively know there was a builder. I can't see him, smell him, touch him nor hear him but it stands to reason there was a builder. Similarly looking at a painting. I can't see the painter; I can't smell him, touch him etc. but I reason there was a painter. We can use the same reasoning for creation. Can't see him, smell him, touch him, hear him but from the beauty and order of creation there must be a creator. The Bible says a fool in his heart has said there is no God."

Fine; you have "proved" the existence of God. Now it stands to reason that such a God must have had a creator. Now it stands to reason that that creator must itself have had a creator…

You can see that this argument gets you nowhere.

This is just the old "argument from design": it looks complicated, therefore it must have been designed. It's now nearly a century and a half since it was shown this line of thinking is faulty.

Just because creation seems to our eyes orderly, there must have been an intelligence behind it. In reality, the order is created from a few simple laws of nature.

I'm glad people with influence are not bowing to the religious zealots that are taking over the world. I for one don't feel guilty or wrong being an atheist. I am also proud that I don't band together with like-minded individuals to persecute non-believers or should that be believers.

I’m touched by the fine hearty omniscience of Richard Dawkins and his fellow atheists who have written in his support. Most especially by their frequent use of the word “truth” as if those who believe in God are uninterested in things like facts and evidence. It must be consoling to believe one can reach into other people’s souls to ascertain whether or not they are seekers after truth. I would wager serious money that few, if any of them, has spent so much as ten minutes careful, impartial examination of the rock-solid reasons why the world’s greatest thinkers have been theists.

It is easy to ridicule religion - or any other group of people - by recording their individual absurdities whilst studiously avoiding the equally or more extreme vagaries of others. Arbitrarily selecting facts in this manner serves only to provide ammunition for prejudice rather than present a balanced and objective verdict.

Yes, Dawkins did say 'only religion', when there are ideologies that inspire similar behaviour. Your correspondent cites Fascism and asks rhetorically if we should abandon politics. Not politics, no, but certainly some murderous ideologies, like Fascism, which are outlawed already in our current, essentially liberal humanist, ideology. But, basically Dawkins in on the right lines - you can't ignore the Enlightenment. He's also right in nailing the word that describes what irks about religious fundamentalists: righteousness. Bin Laden, Al Zawahiri, perhaps Pat Robertson too - always waving the index finger, chastizing me and my liberal ways. It does get tiresome.

'The fool hath said in his heart - no God.' Psalm 14 vs 1.

So Professor Dawkins is concerned for the Truth is he? Well so am I, which is why I'm a Christian and young earth creationist. In our post-postmodern age, truth is a slippery subject. A worldview can be defined as a fundamental commitment of the heart which can be expressed in a number of presuppositions. Only the Christian position is fully consistent with the reality of the world as we experience it. There is no other answer. It's as simple as that. Christianity is 'Total Truth'.
Despite what Dawkins might heretically claim, the cosmos was created by the Holy Triune God, in and through His only beloved Son, the Lord Jesus Christ. We can read the history of this event in Genesis chapter one, which is totally unique amongst ancient literature of the time. Dawkins is right that we are not here to feel comfortable. This world is broken and destroyed by human rebellion. As by one man sin entered the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned - so by one man, Jesus Christ, the gift of grace and eternal life is freely offered to those who repent and believe in His propitiatory death on the cross. Dawkins is in great need of salvation just as we all are as sinners. He needs to be shown the divine glory of Christ. Yet today he has only spoken so that the Scripture might be fulfilled: 'there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, and saying, where is the promise of his coming?' II Peter 3 vs 3. I would ask all viewers of Newsnight this one question: are you ready for the Day of the Lord's Vengeance? Dawkins clearly isn't.

I listened to professor with great interest tonight but surely there is some onus of proof on his part as well.If he thinks that the darwinian theory is correct he will have to give an explanation as to why humans have a conscience whereas animals do not. Also he uses one example where religion can be used for evil purposes, Bush invading Iraq. Why not mention someone like mother teresa of calcutta where acting on religious beliefs can actually do some good.

Yes, Richard Dawkins is at it again. Together with his covern of aggressive and belicose atheists at Oxford University, who believe science created the universe and life within it. He suggested that other scientists who believe there might be a supernatural explanation to the universe (or at least another explanation apart from random mutation of genetic material and natural selection) had compartmentalised minds, presumably one compartment devoted to scientific and natural explanation and the other steeped in fantasy. At least their minds have two compartments where Dawkins only has one. His mental compartment has a God too, science. Is it not possible that science will eventually lead to a supernatural explanation? Why doesn't the BBC throw Richard Dawkins amongst Scientists such as David Swift, William Dembski et al who will argue persuasively that Darwinists have no explanation whatsoever as to how biological macro-molecules arose 'naturally' and how it is mathematically impossible for DNA to arisen 'by accident'.

Sirs, I have listened to Professor Dawkins on tonight's Newsnight and also read the exracts from his book below and I am excited that this thought process is reaching the public arena. There are two points I would like to make:

Firstly I agree that in the beginning man created god and that for many years the majority were influenced by the minority who had the opportunity to fine tune a legacy of indoctrination to propagate control by fear of an etherial being mysterious enough to be sculptured /interpretted to suit the prevailing political, economic and social climates. The general populus is too intelligent now to allow this to happen.

Secondly: Whereas it may have been comforting to an eight year old in the 17th century to believe his mother had gone to heaven rather then died of the clap, we are not there now. The eight year old today would be equipt with the diagnosis that his mother should not have shared needles. My point being that current society does not turn to god in the same way as it did in the past, society turns to the courts, to benefits, to crime, to schools, to charity, to the welfare state all before turning to the church.

Thirdly: the knowledgable general populus are able to interpret the actions and opinions of religeous leaders and have the mindset and intelligence to question them. The antics of extreemist factions of certain religeons are eroding the etherial status of their gods and bringing religeon down to a human level at which point it loses the status of a religeon and is downgraded to that of a political party. I am thinking now of how close the pope's misguided spat is to the screams of "too litle to late" or "in real terms the seasonally adjusted figures were much more favourable with a previous administation"

In conclusion I would like to thank professor Dawkins. Rationalising and humanising religeon is a major step in diffusing the effect it has on society and the more society comes to accept that:
1. religeon is only a belief and
2. its ok for that [person to hold that belief
the better

For Dawkins to say that " much of the Bible is not systematically evil but just plain weird " just shows how ignorant he is when it comes to his understanding of Christian belief. He may be an effective scientific communicator but his understanding of the Christianity is full of polemical statements but no real substance. I don't know what Bible he is reading but the one that I read makes a lot of sense.
He is quite happy to quote the Old Testament as if that is the current thinking for Christians.
Christian thinking is based on the whole Bible, but in particular the New Testament . His attack of Christianity when he quotes the Old Testament is a bit like suggesting that scientists should ignore Einstein understanding of gravity and just stick to Newton's. No doubt that Newton's theory is applicable in most cases but scientists have move on to use Einstein theory ,in particular when it comes to the understanding of the universe. God gave the world a new revelation in His Son Jesus.
Dawkins idea world doesn't want us to be deluded with a theistic mindset but deluded with an atheistic mindset
We have got such great modern examples of atheists when one thinks of the "blood-spattered trail of atheism in the twentieth century. "
I am reminded of another comment that Alister McGrath said.

"Communism was a `tragedy of planetary dimensions' with a grand total of victims variously estimated by contributors to the volume at between 85 million and 100 million."

Do we want a world full of that sort of mindset ?

We need a lot more of this straight thinking.
More debate/discourse/learning about
Dawkins, Thos Paine, John Lennon("Imagine") et al.
I sometimes worry about becoming fanatic about being anti-fanatic.

Richard Dawkins is Professor of the Public Understanding of Science at the University of Oxford. Has anyone at 'Newsnight' noticed the significance of his title? He is NOT the Professor of the Public Understanding of Religion, however much he tries to redefine 'science' so as to make it include religion. Prof. Dawkins may be a brilliant scientist; he may not. He has at least studied and researched zoology and biology for a Master's degree and at doctoral level. But it is certain that he has had no training in theology or philosophy. When he discusses the existence of God, Prof. Dawkins is almost embarrassingly out of his field and out of his depth. Jeremy Paxman might as well interview me, since I have an MA and PhD in theology, about my understanding of genetics. This was a thinly disguised book-plug; a lame interview.

I looked forward to the interview of Professor Dawkins on Newsnight tonight in order to see what all the fuss was about.

I was staggered to hear so many misconceptions attributed to religion being put up to then be demolished. Surely any book worth looking at in this way by Newsnight would be written by someone who knew his subject? But Dawkins appears to know practically nothing. What was the point of having him on?

In his interview Professor Dawkins conceded that there are Christians who are also good scientist but that he (Dawkins) didn’t understand this.

Confirmation perhaps that he doesn’t understand the subject of religion (I’m assuming that he understands science).

If you want to know about science ask a scientist. If you are curious about faith ask someone who has one. If you want to know how the two live together ask someone who understands both.

I'm gratified that 90 per cent of the respondents here support Dawkins's stance and admire his articulacy, advocacy and guts. It's interesting that the small number of anti-Dawkins, pro-God comments look decidedly washed-out, having to resort to empty exhortations about 'love' and 'belief'. How dare they say that I, as an atheist, cannot have satisfactory explanations about love. This book should be on the National Curriculum, alongside Bertrand Russell's 'Why I am not a Christian' The scandal is not that this book should get publicity, as some will imply, but rather that our public broadcasting organisation gives daily propaganda to religion in, for example, 'Thought for the Day'.

Listening to Prof.Dawkind, I find myself in agreement of 90% of what he says (I haven't had time to read the extracts from the book yet).
However, I have one very serious criticizm of his whole approach.
He - quite rightly in my opinion - dismisses the version of "God" as portrayed in the Great Religions, and of those religions as being mainly concerned with dispensing "comfort" rather than truth. I entirely agree with this, and have written on the subject myself. But then he assunes that,
because that version of "God" is ridiculous, there cannot be ANY "God" at all !! A total non sequiter !
Does he really think that the Universe, like Topsy, "just growed" ? When, for the "Big Bang" theory to be correct, the Laws of Physics - Gravity, Thermodynamics etc. - must have been in existance BEFORE that event. The evidence for an "External Intelligence" is quite overwhelming, and, far from being "supernatural" such an Intelligence is entirely natural !
But with none of the Man-emulating characteristics of the Judeo/Christian/Islamic "God"
It amazes me how effective the "brainwashing" of the Great Religions has been in convincing believers and unbelievers alike that there is only ONE version of "God" - theirs !!

Richard Dawkins spoke of many things that he "loved". Paxman failed to ask him what love is? The Bible says that God is love and that those who worship God must worship him in spirit and in truth. Jesus said, "I am the way the truth and the life." Dawkins will never have any inkling of what "truth" is if he fails to understand the simple truth that "truth" is much more than cold scientific fact.Why is Dawkins so driven and so obsessed by his anti-God crusade I wonder? I would have thought that someone with his Knowledge of the wonders of creation would recognise the hand of a creator. "Those who have eyes to see, let them see."

Wonderful interview with Paxman - Lets hope this book sells in vast quantities - the timing is perfect -Halleluja , Halleluja !!

I am delighted someone has the guts to challenge these passively held ideas.It's as if we are afraid to actually look at reality.This argument and discussions surrounding it are needed now more than ever!!!!

how refreshing to hear some sane comment on religion in this day and age. Think of a world with no religion, no-one would have any reason to hate each other. There would be no reason to think whether my god is better than your god, no fatwas, zealots, 911's, 7/7's, inquisitions.

As to the bloke on radio 4 this morning? No thanks, i have no interest in your religion, i don't believe you're right. And if you think i'll give up my democratic rights for your religion, then you have another think coming. I don't believe christianity is right either. How many people have suffered and died at the hands of christians? Even modern ones.

The arrogance of human kind is to think that the beauty of nature couldn't have happened without some kind of human based god.

Without humans you have no gods. Are we really saying a god created all of nature then after trillions of years toyed with the idea of creating us? Then put us on a small ball of rock in the middle of nowhere? Then just left us to get on with it? Did he get bored of the whole dinasaur thing? Has it all gone wrong? Or is it all going to plan? In this day and age, is it working out for him? I wonder?

We knock the shiite out of each other and in the process destroy this beautiful planet, our only home. If everyone got on with the business of living instead of harping on about what happens when we die perhaps we'd all get on a hell of a lot better.

Mr Dawkings yet again makes much sense. Sadly, too few people as yet see this as evinced by the comments of several religeous types already. Open your minds people. And to answer a question put here several times already, he was put here by his parents! Duh!

A bloke walks out of the desert and says "God spoke to me" and millions of weak-minded, gullible people, afraid of death, believe him. Go figure. You can't make this stuff up. Or perhaps you can ...

A wonderful disquisition by Professor Dawkins. Insightful as always. I'm a Muslim turned atheist- and was quite a devout and religious one too. I come from a very religious family and was indoctrinated in the Islamic faith from the moment I could walk. When I attained puberty I adopted the Salafi sect of the Sunni branch of Islam (the preponderant sect in Saudi Arabia) and began taking my inherited faith seriously and became more observant than any other of my family members (which in my junior days I held to be immensely religious).

That was all before I was introduced to the great thinker and philosopher Bertrand Russell. My conversion to atheism and free thought came a few months back at college when whilst scanning the Philosophy department of my college library, I happened on an excellent and thought provoking book- not by Russell- but by Peter Vardy entitled The Puzzle Of God. That somewhat shook the pillars of my faith, in that it challenged my absolutist frame of mind and paved the way for Bertrand Russell to demolish my superstitious religious beliefs.

Many thanks to Professor Dawkins. Religious persons (even an extreme Salafi like I once was) can be changed. One doesn't read Bertrand Russell's Why I Am A Rationalist and decide instantly to drop their long held beliefs then and there, it's a process, but as happened with me, it is possible to sow the seeds of doubt with compelling argument and sound rationale, thereby altering, or at the very least challenging the irrational notions people have been brought up to believe.

I shall order my copy of The Delusion Of God right away. Kudos to Dawkins!

From a Salafi Muslim turned free thinker.

Why is it that Richard Dawkins is never challenged by intellectual equals with different points of view. He earns fortunes on the lecture circuit where he pontificates to his adoring fans and he always appears with a TV presenter who cannot counter his arguments in a scientific way. His only opponents seem to be those who offer emotional and subjective counter arguments.

I believe in God, the Father Almighty, Creator of heaven and earth, and in Jesus Christ, His only Son, our Lord:

Who was conceived of the Holy Spirit,
born of the Virgin Mary, suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, died, and was buried. He descended into hell.

On the third day He arose again from the dead. He ascended into heaven
and is seated at the right hand of God the Father Almighty, Thence He shall come to judge the living and the dead.

I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy Catholic Church, the communion of saints, the forgiveness of sins,
the resurrection of the body, and life everlasting.

Amen.

I believe this with my whole being!
Glory be to God!

I hope that Richard is converted by the grace of God before it's too late. Otherwise he's going to get a serious shock when he dies! His pride is his downfall...

For those theists confused by Dawkins' last comment, "I don't believe we are put here to be comfortable", the question is not 'Who put us here?' but rather, 'What put us here?'. The evolutionary process put us here. Now - that wasn't so difficult was it?

Well done prof!

to all those that asked this question:

"the last words of prof. dawkins in the interview were "... we weren't put here to be comfortable." So who put us here prof?"

-it was the Flying Spaghetti Monster of course - very arrogant of you Christians to suggest that the alternative to Atheism is Christianity.

- incidentally your Christian God didn't intend for us to be comfortable, otherwise he wouldn't have invented evil and created parasites that devour childrens' eyeballs.

Thank you Prof Dawkins standing up to the mumbo-jumbo crowd.

Finally someone have the courage to admit what we all knew but afraid to tell , we've been submitted for centurys by a catholic society , which in the name of god , massacred and terrorized all the native americans and slayed all the black africans. If God really existed , he would'not be anything similar to what we expected

Watched interview with professor Dawkins on newsnight tonight. He repeatedly put himself forward as a source of truth? The question that comes to mind is whose truth? Professor Dawkins I suggest, at best it may only be described as his version of it.
It seemed to me he had no convincing response to the question put to him by Jeremy Paxman on, 'how do you get through the night?' Love of music, love of art, love of science, etc,was his response,some of the greatest despots of human history could have said the same.
He apparently lives in denial of the possibility of anyone having a religious experience and imagines that those who have had such experiences are self deluded. He conceded that one might have a spiritual experience, of the Einsteinian kind although how one separates the spiritual from the religious is not clear.
God does not exist for Professor Dawkins therefore God does not exist? What stupendous arrogance! What a leap of faith that is? He denies the divinity of Jesus Christ who said 'I am the Way the TRUTH and the life' and who said of those who would believe in Him, 'You shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free.'
It is patently obvious that Professor Dawkins advocates not the TRUTH but his own version of it. I seriously doubt however if it will ever trully set men and women free.
Finally I don't think I would want to live in the world that he advocates, a world destitute of the Spirit of Gods grace and love without divine constraint upon the baser instincts of human kind. A world where men and women are driven by their own wharped sense of what is good or right. I believe the Bible has another name to describe such a place, its called Hell.
The bbc has presented the professor with an opportunity to advertise his book but I doubt whether it will have anything like the impact or appeal of Christs sermon on the mount or Pauls majestic teaching on love or Johns account of creation.
Just a thought.

Richard Dawkins spoke of many things that he "loved". Paxman failed to ask him what love is? The Bible says that God is love and that those who worship God must worship him in spirit and in truth. Jesus said, "I am the way the truth and the life." Dawkins will never have any inkling of what "truth" is if he fails to understand the simple truth that "truth" is much more than cold scientific fact.Why is Dawkins so driven and so obsessed by his anti-God crusade I wonder? I would have thought that someone with his Knowledge of the wonders of creation would recognise the hand of a creator. "Those who have eyes to see, let them see."

It is't just religious believers who are deluded, we all are, every human being on the planet unless you clinically depressed. Many Psychological studies have shown this and explains why something like religion has been practically universal throughout history and around the world.

oh dear. prof d's upset some people with an invisible friend. years ago my two year old daughter had one called 'deedow'. he was run over and never thought of again. p'raps good advice for all those of you with god on your side/in your heads. take the advice of a two year old.

I enjoyed the conversation between Paxman & Dawkins immensely.

Dawkins' theses regarding God & Religion remind me of a quote by Yann Martel in his Booker Prize winning book, 'Life of Pi':

"We all walk as far as the legs of our reason carry us and then we leap."

It seems that Dawkins' legs can carry him a lot further than most !

Napolean once said that you can get anyone to believe anything so long as it's not from the Bible! What about evolution? It is still a theory, yet to be proved. The fossil evidence is extremely unconvincing. If it were convincing we could call evolution a fact and not a theory. Like the sun exists - a fact. Shouldn't science be a study of what we can observe and identify. Monkeys have similar features to humans so that is enough to say as a fact that we evolve from them? What about comparing a small cessna plane to a 747. They have similar features. Did the cessna physically evolve into a jumbo? Of course it didn't. It had a common designer who used a similar blueprint.
Let's assume that you have an incredible 1% of all the knowledge that exists in the universe. Is it possible, that in the knowledge you haven't yet come across, there is ample evidence to prove that God does indeed exist? Or have you an ulterior motive not to believe? Could it be that the "atheist" can't find God, for the same reason a thief can't find a policeman?

Mr Norman Littler writes "It is easy to ridicule Religion" That, Mr Littler is because it is by definition ridiculous.

It is high time the UK officially became a secular state, as France and Turkey, for example, did many years ago. We could also do with more balance in religious discussion programmes etc. to give the atheist view more prominence. The pope's recent comment to the effect that religion is rational, and does not support violence, is the opposite to what we see in reality.

Arrogance is his downfall. He denies his creator. "Religion" has caused much conflict in this world but there is a big difference between man-made "religion" and God-made Religion! Think RCC...

For those of us who have faith in God, it's not just a matter of blind faith but instead it is the movement of God's grace in one's soul that give a sure knowledge of His existence. Faith is a gift which is given to those who are humble before their God.

I do not feel that religion in itself is wrong although I do beleive it is an 'untruth' and have felt that way for as long as I have been capable of independant reasoning.

If people gain comfort from believing in an afterlife, and that ultimately is the root cause of all religion, in that it is about coming to terms with death and the unknown, it is about rationalising the inevitable and forces we cannot control. Then who am
I to challenge that belief. unlike many fundamentalists I believe in peoples right to self determination.

The problem as I see it is one of human nature, opportunists using religion to their own ends to push their own agendas to gain and hold onto influence and power over peoples.

In my experience it is the gulable, insecure and indocternated often from birth/socialy who allow themselves to live under a defacto theocracy.

The only reason Europe is largly secular is because Europe historically and like no other region on Earth has suffered at the hands of religious zealots and despots who have used religion as an excuse for their actions. We are secular because most people have learnt from the mistakes of our collective past.

I look forward to reading the book.

P.S It amuses me to see postings by christians who are dismayed etc. They appear to have completely overlooked the entire rasion d'etre for this debate, that of rationality.

Professor Dawkins is one of the few leading public intellectuals who recognises the inherent uselessness of attempting to seperate religion from its excesses. Instead of simply condemning violence springing from religion, he recognises that the mindset at the heart of faith - namely, the fervent belief in something for which there is greater evidence against - is what is at heart responsible for all of the other problems we associate with religion. Even when someone is liberal and peaceful in their religious beliefs, it is still important to be said that it is nonetheless nonsensical and irrational. While the fundamentalists and their appeasers would be happy to cast Professor Dawkins as equally dogmatic as themselves, they do so only because what he has to say is unanswerable.

i am a great beliver in evolution and this is how i see it

15 billion years ago the universe came into existance through the big bang...there are a few unprovable theories like "m" theory but no-one really knows how this happened yet the author is sure it was not god

around 4 billion years ago the earth formed and over millions of years life started on this planet... there are a few theories but again no-one actually knows how this happened but yet the author is sure it was not god

the thing that i can't understand is that the author seems very sure about about the non existance of god when the the 2 fundemental questions of existace have yet to be fully answered ....to me it is he who is practicing bad science

Hooray for Dawkins!!!!

Religion was undoubtedly invented by mankind to keep the masses in order.

Today church attendances in the UK are falling. Is this because life is far more hectic or could it be that people are not so afraid to stay away.

Hopefully more people will start to question their beliefs, I feel the majority who say that they believe in god actually travel through life without really questioning what they believe in. It's just what was drilled into them when they were young.

Advertising works like this. First you scare the hell out of them, then you sell them the product. Get the idea?

I've only read the extracts here (not the entire book), but it seems to be of the typical "Cor blimey gov, I aint never seen no God, so how stupid can you be believing there might be one" school of atheistic apologetics, which has characterized Dawkin's later books. These extracts read like the bar-room rant of an after-hours pub-philosopher. Perhaps Paxman interviewed him on BBC2 because people in his Local won't listen anymore. Dawkins typically rejects the possibility that one can be a committed and critical Christian, who doesn't necessarily have to accept the literalness and inerrancy of the entire Bible to believe that it contains matters of immense and universal God-given value (however that material was sourced).
As a lapsed 'Dialetical Materialist' (a.k.a. an atheistic Marxist in recovery!), I know that it is possible to share Dawkins resentment against the arrogance and naivity of fundamentalist Evangelicals (not just in the USA) and still have a firm belief in the existence AND providential interaction of God in the world. In the Paxman interview on Newsnight (21.09.06), Dawkins seemed bemused that some people can have an authentic Christian faith, and still have a commitment to the integrity of scientific method (ie. they are succesful practising scientists).
He arrogantly dismisses them as suffering 'compartmentalized thinking', or that they really only hold to some nebulous 'Einsteinian' pantheism. Has Dawkins ever sat down, in a spirit of genuine open-minded intellectual curiosity, and had an honest conversation with any of his colleagues in science, many of whom have a far from nebulous Christian faith in Jesus? There are no shortage of them, and I'm sure he knows who they are. I'm not equipped to judge the experience of people of other faiths, but some Christians believe they do have an empirical basis for their faith; from their own diverse life experiences. It seems Dawkins hasn't (yet) had such experiences. To dismiss other people as simply delusional or suffering a self-deception is to trivialise the prolonged rational engagement many people have with these experiences and with their faith. Dawkins would probably dismiss them all as being the victims of a religion 'meme'. That is just sticking a label on something he doesn't understand, nor, it seems, tried to understand. At its best, 'atheism' is a rational and honest response to an individual's own experience and understanding of the world. Dawkins position is unscientific. He seems to have resorted to highly emotional ridicule to dismiss data (other people's lived experience) which he obviously doesn't have available to verify (or falsify). 'Atheism' deserves a better champion than this.

in response to ronald rainer.

You argument is totally ridiculous.

You say 'The Bible says that God is love and that those who worship God must worship him in spirit and in truth. Jesus said, "I am the way the truth and the life." Dawkins will never have any inkling of what "truth" is if he fails to understand the simple truth that "truth" is much more than cold scientific fact.'

You simply have no reason to think that other than the fact the bible claims it to be so.

Whats this 'truth is more than scientific fact..' Its just incoherant rubbish. It doesnt even mean anything.

Ill say it once, clearly. You cannot use the bible to prove 'truths' about god and infer his existance. The bible assumes that god exists as it is a book primarily about him in the same way that the star wars script assumes darth vader exists, because it is about him. Any proof from that (even though it rambles incoherantly 'i am the way the truth and the light' - absolutely meaningless, just sounds nice)assumes the answer of 'god exists' as thats what the bible is about to prove that he does. You assume the answer to prove the answer. Its like error 1 from basic logic 101. People keep doing it over and over again though.. Stop quoting the bible to try and influence us! You have to use self withstanding logic and evidence!

All things bright and beautiful,

All creatures great and small.

Evolved from self-replicating entities,

the lord god (extinct) made none of them at all.

I was fortunate enough to here professor Dawkins on Newsnight this evening at first hand and very credible views he put forward.

Unfortunately I won't have the pleasure of listening to it in 2ooo years as I am sure it would be a most fantastic and incredible story by then.

Have religeous people ever played chinese whispers.

Let us imagine for a moment ourselves as God the Creator. We make a World and populate it with a vast array of Flora and Fauna. We then decide that it would be nice to have some recognition for all our hard work and so we create a sentient being..Mankind. We then decided to give this particular creation "free will" presumably to observe the choices which it independently made. It, decided to do things which we then decided for reasons which are unclear were "sinful" and so to teach it a lesson we decided to create another human being which we decided to call our son and named it "Jesus". This one we had publicly tortured to death in order to cleanse our other little creatures of the sins which we had invented in the first place. Does this not seem a little sadistic? Do we really want such a God as this? If this is an expression of Love then His movements are no more mysterious than those of Pol Pot.

Dawkins is typical of this age in that he believes his intellect can circumscribe the world and everything in it.
The intellect itself tells us there is much more to this world than can be comprehended or understood by the human mind alone.

A little humility wouldn't go amiss.

PS He's in for a big surprise.

The people here (see comments 8, 18, 22, and 33) who have a problem with Dawkins’ last comment in the interview (“I don’t believe we’re put here to be comfortable”) seem to be forgetting that we were all put here by our parents, regardless of whether or not we believe in a deity. Many people choose to bring children into the world in order for them to do something meaningful and/or significant with their lives, and i assume that Dawkins' own parents were two of these people.

Also, would David (comment 56) care to elaborate on his musings on love? When we die, the world is not left unaffected by our life by any means. We all have some sort of impact on the course of history, and loving one's family, for example, and treating them with care and respect will likely be remembered and carried on into future generations, therefore being very important for the development of humankind (in my opinion). I believe it is probably true that when we die we do cease to exist in any conscious or spiritual state, but why would this lessen the meaning of the love we might have felt for others during our life? I think that the familial love that Dawkins was speaking of is completely different from the spiritual love that David feels for God (assuming he is a religious man).

It sounds like Mr. Dawkins book about delusion is more of a critique in mans religious failure. We could hypothesise that religion (mans attempt) and God are two separate things all together. Mans failure doesn't necessarily mean that God doesn't exist, surely? Homo sapiens have serious limitations physically, mentally and we don’t know what truly exists out there in the infinite universe. It’s a very mysterious place and we are very limited in what we truly know because we're primarily stuck here on planet earth. I would like to ask Mr. Dawkins what does he make of people who have seen ghosts? I'm 99% certain I've seen one and it was quite an unusual experience. Nobody has to believe me but I honestly saw one. How do we explain that? Am I mad, am I a liar, was it delusion?... Who's to say God isn't speaking through Mr. Dawkin in a very uncanny way? Let's not kill the messenger just yet he maybe onto something... (lol)

in response to gareth morris.
i dont know if i can cope with this...

'Napolean once said that you can get anyone to believe anything so long as it's not from the Bible! What about evolution? It is still a theory, yet to be proved. The fossil evidence is extremely unconvincing. If it were convincing we could call evolution a fact and not a theory. Like the sun exists - a fact. Shouldn't science be a study of what we can observe and identify. Monkeys have similar features to humans so that is enough to say as a fact that we evolve from them? What about comparing a small cessna plane to a 747. They have similar features. Did the cessna physically evolve into a jumbo? Of course it didn't. It had a common designer who used a similar blueprint.
Let's assume that you have an incredible 1% of all the knowledge that exists in the universe. Is it possible, that in the knowledge you haven't yet come across, there is ample evidence to prove that God does indeed exist? Or have you an ulterior motive not to believe? Could it be that the "atheist" can't find God, for the same reason a thief can't find a policeman?'

You evidently have no knowledge of the scientific method whatsoever and i mean that literally. Technically, everything in science is 'just a theory' as we cannot know 100% as we are not responsible for the rules that govern it, unlike for example, mathematics. See hume's fork. Scientific laws are only called such as they have a mathematical element ie a formula which are usually derived in a way that makes it a certainty (provided all our knowledge about the system is correct-back to humes fork). If evolution was mathematical it would be a law. A mathematical relationship that absolutly governed the way evolution worked would be a law. Both however, would be equally correct.

With regards to the fossil record... are you joking? To pick just one example, and lets be topical. The 3.3 million year old 3 year old found in africa which posessed both human and ape like qualities. Its been in the news lots. How can you explain that..? and 'the devil put it there to trick us' will not suffice.

Your design argument is very very weak. Also have you noticed how a 747 is actually quite alot better at flying than a bird? And that cameras we have designed are better than our eyes? (spectral range, even resolution, lack of common myopia, lack of blind spot etc.) It seems we are better at designing stuff than god is... strange that.

And your last comment about 1% of the information. You could believe absolutely anything that way. I could say that the remaining 99% showed that there are winged mystical creatures everywhere except where im looking and that all the toys in the world come to life when im not looking. Listen to yourself, you are saying, 'i believe in god because of what i DONT know.' what a joke!

Professor Dawkins' remarks on Newsnight showed once again - indeed he admitted - that he doesn't understand the many who are able to reconcile Christianity and science. That is partly because he does not understand Christianity and partly because he does not understand how people (including scientists) can think differently. He judges them by his own standards, which involve a sense-based, rule-following, "truth as pattern-matching" methodology to the exclusion of an intuitive, error-eliminating, relevance-seeking methodology delivering truth (whatever the subject) as reliability in use, i.e. probable freedom from significant and irredeemable side-effects if wrong.

On the science side the professor should try taking his cue from Bacon and Shannon rather than Hume. On the religious side, he needs to understand that word 'religion' etymologically means "retying", as implied in the doctrine that we have been freed by Christ, and that it is right and fitting to commit ourselves to the one who freed us.

If the majority of Christians, like Professor Dawkins seems to, passionately want to believe what they have been told is right, intuitives - just as they would studying science - more often try to make sense of what primary sources actually say. St Paul says, "If Christ be not risen from the dead then our faith is in vain", and the accompanying testimony to his having so risen is subject to the interpretive criteria of historical rather than sensory evidence.

Our decision whether or not to accept that evidence (or otherwise believe) may be partly prudential: if there is a God and I deny it then I miss the point of life, whereas if I assume there is and there isn't, the Christian excuse for celebrating life is as good as any. But that suggests second and third reasons for being prepared to believe: temperamentally, and having looked at both, we would rather listen to Christ's advice than trust in politicians, while the few scientists who bother to study methodology are well aware that science just as much as religion is interpretive and comparative: we move forward by having faith in the best available hypothesis.

On the question of the existence of God, Professor Dawkins had not even understood the Christian hypothesis when he argued you cannot find him in the universe. We Christians believe God is both outside and inside the universe: much as a mother is outside and ultimately separate from her child, and yet shares the genes within her child. Seeing genes one would never guess their influence, but intuition can find no fault in recognising some likenesses between mothers and their children, and now we believe the sense-making and fruitful hypothesis that many of these likenesses are generated by shared genetic programming. Again, Professor Dawkins never mentioned the evidence for a Big Bang before which there are are problems with the logically necessary scientific axiom of the conservation of energy. Of the rival hypotheses consistent with that, there can be no evidence from the energy flows in the present Universe pointing to its continually expanding and contracting, and Fred Hoyle's assumption that it does apparently didn't work out theoretically. There is no way either than we could see a pre-existing God, but in this case an alternative exists, that a God without our limitations could communicate with us. But that is exactly what Christianity claims happened, and the point of the Resurrection is that it is evidence making plausible the reality claimed. Of course, if Professor Dawkins refuses to believe the evidence, he will have no grounds for believing the claim, whether or not it is "true" in his sense.

Dawkins may well have grounds for (unkindly) slighting naive creationists and arguments from "design", but here the best available hypothesis has moved on. Unless for the fun of it, an intelligent God would not bother to design all the details of the universe, he would program it to "design" and construct itself, much as the evolutionary hypothesis suggests and informed Christians accept it does. What he might well have found necessary (as humans do with systems they build) was to tweak or assist it a little at crucial moments, thus giving some substance to the Creation story. Darwin rightly claimed only the origin of species, not the generation of genuses, which would have taken him beyond the evidence.

I thought it was good that atheists got a bit of airtime as their views and consideration to them is often lost as it always seems to be religious fundamentalists who make the most noise. One thing I would pull him up about from the interview though is the glib use of soundbites, e.g. "Christianity was a creation of St. Paul", well even a quick visit to Wikipedia would tell him that the origins of it are not as simple as that and that there is considerable debate and research. If I'd gone on TV and said something as equally glib about his work I'm sure he'd be up in arms about my lack of insight.

If only, if only, Dawkins book - the clean, simple, humble logic of it - could ever begin to affect those who choose to believe in the historic rubbish of organised religion. Unfortunately, fairies and elves and gods are still required to decorate the ignorance of the masses. Bless.

To Gareth,Jim(77) and I'm sure many others who believe it is all too beautiful/complex not to have an 'Intelligent Design': Read "The Blind Watchmaker".
Sitting in your house, looking at your paintings, you know they cannot happen by accident. Something/one with a (grand) design must have made it. So, who made him? and him and him. Eventually, you have to start from nothing, perhaps a big bang to get things going, but perhaps not. If it requires trillions of universes starting with a big bang to eventually lead to us, why not? I find it easy to believe that if there is one universe, why not trillions - either by accident or from some intelligent designer. After all, at one time it was thought that there was only one sun and as our ability to detect these things improved we have discovered there are trillions of trillions of suns - maybe with people going 'round many of them. I think my point is if you don't know what to believe then a god is probably the easy way out.

Another good read is Sam Harris' "The End of Faith: Religion, Terror, and the Future of Reason". Note that both Sam H & Richard D are equally zealous about their own beliefs in non-belief.

2,000 years ago religion had a purpose. It explained the inexplicable: droughts, floods, earthquakes, tsunamis, volcanic eruptions, solar eclipses and the most intriguing question of all - how did we get here? Over the past 200 years or so, all those questions have been answered by science. There are still plenty of things we don’t know, but one thing we should surely have learned by now is that the answer does NOT lie in religion.

Bravo Richard Dawkins.

And by the way, those who equate Professor Dawkins’ allegiance to science with their own allegiance to religion are missing an important point. Dawkins believes in what can be proven, while they believe what someone has written in a book.

To Gareth Morris:

"Monkeys have similar features to humans so that is enough to say as a fact that we evolve from them?"

That's why they say, little knowledge is a very dangerous thing. Only the lack of understanding of the Darwinian theory of evolution can lead one to think that humans 'evolve from' monkeys. Hit the books !

The concept of a single true god that directly challenge another individuals true belief does nothing for peace and the future of humankind.
The earliest single-god belief system that I know about is the Egyptian Sun-God Aten and this appears to be the origin of many of the myths and legends within most of the modern monotheistic religions.
When cultures met before the one single truth, gods were simply incorporated into the varied pantheons. The Romans came to Britain and Pagan deities were accepted as just Roman and Pagan gods by another name, but since that time religious tolerance has taken several steps backwards.
Fundamentalist of any faith are created by this one ultimate truth and this by its very nature creates intolerance.
Humankind struggles against racism, sexism and fascism etc… all of which were once considered truths, isn’t time humankind grew past these divisive truths and sort to further our own development by asking questions rather than learning the answers from whichever book we are indoctrinated into. Cult or Religion, one ultimate truth is flawed and one man’s cult, appears to be another man’s religion.
Unfortunately, until all of us decide to question these religious beliefs, whether fundamental or liberal whenever we encounter them, we will always be faced with an intolerant world. His book however good, is not the one truth either and will not change the world for us!
And what I interpreted Dawkins to mean by “…we weren’t put here to be comfortable.” was that humankind evolves through adversity to further our understanding of ourselves and the universe around us. The ‘put’ was a reference to the original spark of life, and I’m guessing a scientific explanation, not a creation theory with a bloke with a beard. I’ve also stopped worshipping the Sun-God, but I'm not planning on worshipping Dawkins either, I'll question him as well!

149 comments and still not one rational defence of the existance of God. It seems from their comments that those who believe in God are not terribly bright, or at least seriously lacking in critical thinking skills.
Consciousness of are own mortality is a profound and deeply terrifying conundrum. One that each of us must come to terms with on our own terms. It would be nice if more of us could do this without involving the supernatural.

I respect Richard Dawkins' power of reason and his willingness to stand up and say what he believes. However...

Richard Dawkins' biology rests primarily on the presumption that it's "all in the genes". This is the heart and soul of "genetic determinism". But this sweeping presumption has not been adequately accounted for.

I have three crucial questions:
1) How much "information" (data) does it take to put together a genetic "blueprint" to account for a developed, healthy human body, with all its hairs, veins, nooks and cranies, eyes, teeth, secretions, etc?
2) Is it conceivable that this enormous amount of "information", or data, can be encoded into a spherical volume (the nucleus of a human egg) that is a mere 0.02 of a mm in diameter? Hold up your hand, and see if you can estimate that diameter between your thumb and forefinger, holding them steady as you do so. I am open to being persuaded by a compelling argument;
3) Where is the computer that processes this information? Does it lie within the nucleus that must already contain the enormous amount of data required for the human genetic blueprint? Or, embedded within the genetic code itself, does it "bootstrap" itself into existence from the genetic code?

Without a satisfactory account for this "information" problem, the basis of Mr Dawkins' reasoning is without foundation and the entire edifice comes crashing down.

Can someone, somewhere, please provide an estimate as to how much "data" is required for the human genetic blueprint, so that I can make my own estimates as to the validity or otherwise of the genetic determinism that Mr Dawkins thesis depends on so completely? THEN we might be better placed to discuss the merits or otherwise of different religions.

I respect Richard Dawkins' power of reason and his willingness to stand up and say what he believes. However...

Richard Dawkins' biology rests primarily on the presumption that it's "all in the genes". This is the heart and soul of "genetic determinism". But this sweeping presumption has not been adequately accounted for.

I have three crucial questions:
1) How much "information" (data) does it take to put together a genetic "blueprint" to account for a developed, healthy human body, with all its hairs, veins, nooks and cranies, eyes, teeth, secretions, etc?
2) Is it conceivable that this enormous amount of "information", or data, can be encoded into a spherical volume (the nucleus of a human egg) that is a mere 0.02 of a mm in diameter? Hold up your hand, and see if you can estimate that diameter between your thumb and forefinger, holding them steady as you do so. I am open to being persuaded by a compelling argument;
3) Where is the computer that processes this information? Does it lie within the nucleus that must already contain the enormous amount of data required for the human genetic blueprint? Or, embedded within the genetic code itself, does it "bootstrap" itself into existence from the genetic code?

Without a satisfactory account for this "information" problem, the basis of Mr Dawkins' reasoning is without foundation and the entire edifice comes crashing down.

Can someone, somewhere, please provide an estimate as to how much "data" is required for the human genetic blueprint, so that I can make my own estimates as to the validity or otherwise of the genetic determinism that Mr Dawkins thesis depends on so completely? THEN we might be better placed to discuss the merits or otherwise of different religions.

I have to say I found Richard’s view of the world a little confusing and linear in perception. His final comment to Jeremy, when he said: "I don't believe we were put here to be comfortable" does, as some have already pointed out, show a flaw in his ideology. Who did put us here? And who are we in relation to who put us here? I’m not religious in the orthodox sense by any means. I don’t go to church and don’t plan on reading the bible at bedtime any time soon. But I do consider myself a person who acknowledges a higher being “who put me here”. I may not understand it, but to deny its existence would mean denying my very purpose on this planet. I would suggest looking at the things I do the way I do as being “spiritual” and being spiritual does not mean I am religious in any way.

The dictionary defines “spiritual” as “of or pertaining to the spirit or soul, as distinguished from the physical nature: a spiritual approach to life.”

Spirituality is a sense of knowing, a sense of awareness of a higher self. When we develop this sense, our urge is naturally to grow. I’m not talking about growing in feet and inches, I’m talking about a growth in consciousness.

Sadly, I’m afraid that if I were to ask Richard about concepts such as ‘spirituality’ and ‘consciousness’ I think he would have very little to contribute. He seems too wrapped up with evangelical Christians and their deluded beliefs, and his answer is to write God off altogether as in his mind its misguided belief of God that’s causing all the trouble.

But in order to write off God, one first has to have a deep understanding of what “God” is. And I’m not sure that Richard has either the spiritual dimension – or conscious awareness – to contribute here either.

Thank God for Richard Dawkins? Well I accept Richard’s presence on this planet, with his views, has some purpose. :-)

Thank goodness for Dawkins.

Life on our planet Earth hangs by a thread. It could end at any time due to volcanic activity, runaway climate change or collision with a meteorite.

Long before the Sun runs out of fuel, the Earth will start to die.

Instead of wasting vast amounts of resources on religion, we should apply those resources to look beyond our planet and solar system, and seek new worlds to secure our future in.

Religion could end up costing humankind and all the other species on Earth their very existence.

What a waste that would be!!

Dawkins'body language and style are those of a self-sure religious man who like old prophet fights false ideas of God. How do his selfish genes get to that? Seeking truth? Why? And why spread it? He argues that only rational thought about the empirical data is admissible. Yet, he accepts that the brains do many strange things. Serenpendicity is one of them. Like art, most science is born from connections the brains make unconscienciously, often during our sleep. Religion is about keeping the brains well-focused even in that inconscious action.

In response to Richard (146):

Everything in science may start out as a theory and you need enough of the observable stuff to turn it into a law, gravity for instance. What I'm saying is that I'm not convinced with the evidence presented for evolution. The fossil record is extremely weak. If there was a mass of evidence then logic says it would be worth taking seriously, but that is simply not the case. Why would I automatically accept the speculation of a scientist on the news or what they taught me in school as being concrete and complete? People make mistakes; the guy who invented the pencil knew what he was doing when he put an eraser on the top! It is illogical and narrow-minded to accept something speculative as truth when there are other possibilites to consider.

Sir Fred Hoyle calculated the likelihood of the formation of life from inanimate matter as one out of ten to the power 40000. What caused the big bang? When the first fish walked out of the sea how did it breathe? Had it evolved lungs already? If so, why did it feel the need to evolve lungs in the sea? How did it procreate? It takes faith to believe in evolution.

You misunderstand me about your other point. I'm not asking you to believe in God because of what you don't know. Only to consider the possibility of God existing with the knowledge you don't have. Again,it makes good science.

Belief in the theory of evolution of course does have one appealing aspect. It takes God out of the equation and gives us a clear conscience to do the things that God would rather we didn't do!

You've already taken a leap of faith to believe in the theory of evolution. What's stopping you from doing the same thing with God? You can know God, not by blind faith or by other people's say so - but through your own desire to seek Him and find Him.

God reveals Himself to us both objectively, through the Bible, and subjectively, through His Spirit. An intellectual understanding of the Bible is important but not enough. God's Word appears puzzling and sterile without His Spirit. Knowing about God is not knowing God Himself. If you treat anyone as only an object, you will never come to really know that person. You merely know how they look or act. Subjectively, we must come to God, knowing Him and being known.

God bless.

In response to Richard (146):

Everything in science may start out as a theory and you need enough of the observable stuff to turn it into a law, gravity for instance. What I'm saying is that I'm not convinced with the evidence presented for evolution. The fossil record is extremely weak. If there was a mass of evidence then logic says it would be worth taking seriously, but that is simply not the case. Why would I automatically accept the speculation of a scientist on the news or what they taught me in school as being concrete and complete? People make mistakes; the guy who invented the pencil knew what he was doing when he put an eraser on the top! It is illogical and narrow-minded to accept something speculative as truth when there are other possibilites to consider.

Sir Fred Hoyle calculated the likelihood of the formation of life from inanimate matter as one out of ten to the power 40000. What caused the big bang? When the first fish walked out of the sea how did it breathe? Had it evolved lungs already? If so, why did it feel the need to evolve lungs in the sea? How did it procreate? It takes faith to believe in evolution.

You misunderstand me about your other point. I'm not asking you to believe in God because of what you don't know. Only to consider the possibility of God existing with the knowledge you don't have. Again,it makes good science.

Belief in the theory of evolution of course does have one appealing aspect. It takes God out of the equation and gives us a clear conscience to do the things that God would rather we didn't do!

You've already taken a leap of faith to believe in the theory of evolution. What's stopping you from doing the same thing with God? You can know God, not by blind faith or by other people's say so - but through your own desire to seek Him and find Him.

God reveals Himself to us both objectively, through the Bible, and subjectively, through His Spirit. An intellectual understanding of the Bible is important but not enough. God's Word appears puzzling and sterile without His Spirit. Knowing about God is not knowing God Himself. If you treat anyone as only an object, you will never come to really know that person. You merely know how they look or act. Subjectively, we must come to God, knowing Him and being known.

God bless.

Could we have some books with the conviction of "The God Delusion" that can be read to and read by children please? Like many parents I find myself fighting a rearguard action against religious indoctrination in our schools, which appear to have a dispropotionate ratio of religious head teachers.

It is embarrassing listening to a scientist quoting from the Bible in his book, expounding on the story of Noah and Lot's wife, giving it the very literalist interpretation that is so beloved of fundamentalists, as though his scientific training qualified him to 'understand' everything. His ignorance of spiritual matters is quite astounding, and yet he has no shame in pronouncing literalism as though he 'knew' what these stories really meant. And this is what passes for modern wisdom.

I used to be proud of our news programmes. As a result I am disappointed that they seem scared of reflecting what must surely be a widespread opinion: that some religions seem exempt from critisism and that religious protestors are often over-reacting. How sad it is that some members of certain religions can not handle ridicule! I am convinced that religion causes more problems that it solves. I hardly know anyone who is religious, yet it often features in politics.

Religion a source of evil in the world? So is sex. Let's stop doing that as humans, and pfff, problem of evil solved - in one generation!

The allegory of Lot's wife, as not understood by Dawkins yet quoted by him. The Doctrine of Sodom (self-love) perceives the approach of something divine, and wishes to show how everything, including the divine, can be known in a self-love manner. In that attempt, their ability to see it is, of course, too blinkered, and incapable of seeing it. As a result, the divine protects itself and leaves only the literal view to sight, and of course, this is all that Dawkins can see. And yet this blinkered approach to reality is extolled as a virtue, and paraded as truth. The kind of understanding presented by Dawkins is of that perverted type, assuming for itself a total inclusivity when it is actually quite primitive. Nothing personal about Dawkins, but it is amazing that we have these kinds of ideas thrust upon us in the name of science which is very worrying if this represents the modern wisdom. It is a kind of reconstruction of Sodom in the allegorical sense.

I was disappointed to hear that the spaghetti monster is not real but delighted to see my old pal Dicky in a suit rather than jeans that are too small for him - do love him though

The proposition that there is no God relies, entirely, on the counter proposition that there is a God. QED the bet that there is as as good as the bet there isn't. The main religions agree that the human mind is simply not equipped to comprehend the nature of God which is constantly being reinterpreted (read Karen Armstrong's History of God). Professor Dawkins is trying to climb Mount Impossible...again.

Professor Dawkins like the rest of us has every right to express his views but like us all they are clouded by the limit of his vision. Let me explain. I am totally Deaf, it would therefore be unacceptable and inappropriate for me to write a book or to propose an argument regarding a musical composition or the improbability of bird of identification by their sounds. I know of a man who is totally blind who would not presume to render an article describing the non existence of pattern and colour in nature – for example, or to deny that green leaves of summer change to the glorious reds and golds of autumn. Ridiculous!
Unfortunately Professor Dawkins is a blind guide, unable to see or hear the things of God he seeks to take others down the sorry road of ignorance. I wonder why he tries so hard to convince others? Perhaps he is afraid that he is wrong and needs to have the reassurance of other ‘believers’ around him.
As John wrote early in the first Century “That which was from the first, which has come to our ears, and which we have seen with our eyes, looking on it and touching it with our hands, about the Word of life. ……….We give you word of all we have seen and everything which has come to our ears,”

Thank God for Dawkins! I have read a number of his books and through his engaging writng style, backed up by scientific discovery, he has provided me with answers to many issues that used to trouble me.

Without satisfactory explanation of how complex designs come into existence and why, it is easy to fall back on religious "faith" as the cop-out solution and rely on the answers provided in religious doctrine, all written many years ago when the scientific evidence we have today was not available.

We are all free to choose what we want to believe in, and why - at least we should be; but of course indoctrination of children can have a life-lasting effect that, by its very nature, removes that liberty.

For me, the explanations and writings of Dawkins provide a far more satisfactory answer to the big issues of existence, evolution and civilisation that any scripture or religious doctrine does.

If that makes me an atheist, then I am content with that. Far more content that calling myself a non-practising Christian, simply because that's how I was brought up and then not really bothering to resolve all the religious paradoxes that fill the headlines of media every day.

To change a religiuos label requires one to select an alternative. Most of us spent our youger years at school, where we inherited, or were "given", a religion. After leaving school you either continue to actively practice your chosen religion or just let it slide because you find that your religion, or religion in general, raises problems for which you have no satifactory answers.

In the case of the former, religious activists are, on the whole, unlikely to change their beliefs as continued worship and practice simply reinforces their beliefs. However, in the case of the latter, the common practice is probably to simply do nothing about it - we are not short of things to do instead of worship on our days off! Unless we are confronted by an alternative, that can be understood, the easy thing to do is just carry on with your life, not bothering to resolve the unanswered questions. You may call yourself a non-practicing Christian, Catholic, Muslim or whatever, or you may just debunk it all and not care, because you do not know any other alternative.

In his books, Dawkins does now provide an understandable alternative; one that is supported by today's scientific and archaelogical evidence.

Dawkins accuses other scientists with 'religious'leanings to have compartmentalised thinking. That's rich!
'Scientists' have, like most other folks, predujices and blind spots. All scientists work in 'compartments'. This means that research is often time wasted or futile when facts and findings from other disciplines and researchers are not realised or taken into account.
Most 'scientists' and researchers are still living in a 'Newtonian type paradigm' universe.There is a 'new'(its not really new atall) and soon to be more widely accepted paradigm, that of the primacy of conciousness.
Although Dawkins is really talking utter nonsence he does, sadly, represent a very large proportion of current thought in todays deperately 'lost' and rudderless society.

He's right isn't he...

Hello
More of such programes please let people hear against a belief of god there are lots of programmes about and for religion, I believe there are more Atheists in this world than we think. Bring on other peoples truth.
Wonderfull 10mins,with no hate or trying to belittle others, did not want to conker the world with imaginary friends.

While Dawkins makes some valid points about the nature of religious belief and the immoralities religious communities, his comments fail to make any effect on the existence of God. Many thinkers have put forward theories for rejection of God's existence. Sigmund Freud put forward religious belief as a psychological neurosis, Emile Durkheim as a necessary element of society and Karl Marx as a way of controlling the masses. These arguments all come from materialist influences as does Dakins view. However all such arguements fail as they commit what is known as a genetic fallacy, in that even if the points they make about religious belief are true they make on existential points. It is possible to concieve of a God existing independent of all religious belief. More importantly independent of the scientific realm of space and time. Prof Dakwins can show the world as much evidence of the immoralities and delusion of religious belief as he wants, however he will never make any effect on God's existence. I suggest that he sticks to science, rather than breaching off into realms of philosophical reasoning and Theological knowledge in which his field caries no weight.

Human beings thrive on loving kindness that brings healings, miracles and peace. I didn't see this originating anywhere except from the heart of God.

One day, many centuries from now, in a peaceful world free of hatred, bigotry and oppression, a future archaeologist will uncover a dusty old book which pointed the way to this paradise on earth. But this book will not be the Bible, not the Koran, not any work of false prophesy ascribed to a supernatural power. It will be a book by Richard Dawkins.

It was such a relief to hear Proffesor Dawkins.As a child I loved and feared God.I prayed & talked to him and thanked him for my life.In my thirties I began to question religion but was to busy to think about it & ceased going to church.Gradually I have now developed my own sense of beliefs which in my seventies I cling on to but until now have been reluctant to talk about. GOD IS LOVE,not a far off being in the universe.In a close family,of which I am part,there is an abundance of love.As we get older we feel it more deeply i.e we become closer to "God or Love?" When we are young we are too busy to think about it until something happens to make us question what life is all about.Even in a close family love can be stretched, but then life is not always easy or as Proffessor Dawkins said "We were not put on this earth to be comfortable" I also believe we have our parents genes and consequently they live through us.My mother still seems as near to me as when she was alive .Although I hope and believe I can live through my children I know this supposition has a flaw as not every one has children,but surely those who create love have a better chance to have a peaceful afterlife.That, of course, is not as easy as it sounds,although it is more logical to me than the religion in I was brought up to believe.

The UK isn't really religious in the way the US is. And every nation seems to have it's own take on religion. This matter of mass irrational belief may be responsible for a coming dark age of unimaginable horror & extent. But it may also be a insoluble conundrum that even the most enbrightened cannot overcome even as a collective. Say you got the fire of superstition under control in one region for a decade...wouldn't it flare up again elsewhere? our biology means charismatic madmen are inevitable....surely this is the greatest lesson of history Dawkins?

I've got a lot of time for Richard Dawkins and have often considered joining the British Humanist Association, though I can't help but think it's another little "tag" to identify someone by in the same way as "Christian" or "Moslem".

However, regarding Dawkins comments on the "strangeness", "weirdness" and "pick & choose" mentality of the Bible and it's interpretations, I've posted the article below to a few of my more evangelical Christian friends over the last few years.

The only response has been the "Well, your not meant to take that literally" which begs the question, "Which parts do you take literally?"

Anyway...the free thinkers amongst you enjoy, and the rest of you feel free to shift uncomfortably in you seats...

---------------------------

"Dr. Laura Schlessinger is a US radio personality who dispenses advice to people who call in to her radio show. She has said that homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22, and cannot be condoned under any circumstances. The following is an open letter to Dr. Laura penned by a US resident, which was posted on the Internet. It's funny, as well as informative.

“Dear Dr. Laura,

Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can.

When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate.

I do need some help from you, however, regarding some of the other specific laws
and how to follow them.

1. When I burn a bull on the alter as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord - Lev. 1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They claim that the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as is sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

3. I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness - Lev. 15:19-24. The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.

4. Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

5. I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?

6. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination - Lev. 11:10-it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this?

7. Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?

8. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?

9. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

10. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them (Lev. 24:10-16). Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws (Lev. 20:14)?

I know that you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident that you can help. Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.

Your devoted disciple and adoring fan...”"

I see the so called “enlightened and tolerant” do not practice what they preach. They in fact are not interested in honest and open minded discussion. Instead spread fear and intolerance of others beliefs! Is it not tolerance that we allow others to think and believe as they grow in the knowledge of the truth? Apparently, the millions of people of faith (Christian or otherwise) around the world are ignorant, brainwashed or suffer from a Jedi mind trick. If Mr. Dawkins and apparently his readers, are so afraid of these millions of faithful soul's worldview and how that worldview will effect humankind. Then, why not be part of the solution instead of part of the problem.
Engage, in an honest and open-minded dialogue with those of faith in their community. They are not hard to find, they are located nearby in local houses of worship. Invite the local pastor or church leader to a cup of tea. Be open to listening and understanding. You won’t find some mindless, uneducated, brainwashed fool. Instead what you will find is a caring, educated, thoughtful person who would love to discuss your world view and theirs. They are not afraid what they know is Truth will be compromised. Are you?

Could I ask Richard to please write the same about the millions of non-religious murderers, abusers of children, thiefs etc that are in our prisons of the secular west. Is this the secular moral? Yes, religion kills thousands as can be heard on the news, but what about the 2nd world war when Hitler on the basis of the survival of the fittest race philosophy sought to rule the world. Richard please write a book attacking the other side in your very imaginative writing. It could be a great money earner as well.

Well, here we go again. Richard Dawkins publishes a book believing that over 2 billion of the present global population are all deluded. Well, would he die for his scientific belief; would his scientific convictions all him to give up his life? Has he tried to create anything out of nothing? Has he created anything in the laboratory? I expect not. But still the sun rises each day; trees grow, human beings and animals are created daily, food is grown for life. But did a single human being create any of this? No. It all happens without a single human being being able to create a simple blood cell or one leaf rom a tree. How amazing that Dawkins forgets that bees and insects and nature flourishes without human intervention. It all just happens. But if this were so, it would be like affirming that the present-day city of New York with its skyscrapers, just happened to be there one day, without the aid or direction of architects, construction workers, planners or materials.
Richard Dawkins thesis is flawed from the start. His views are hollow, lack substance or reason. The only rational explanation for this planet and for the whole universe is a superior being,who has a plan, has created it all and destined those who believe this, to one day share the ultimate eternal reward. Dawkins' heresy is that he does not see that billions ARE believers, not because of religion, but in spite of that, and because it is within the hearts of all - if you care to take the time and see.The arrogance of his thesis is that he believes he is right and that billions of 'the believers' are wring. I stand with the majority as any good democracy would do.

Anthony (Griffith)
London

It never ceases to amuse me that religious believers accuse Dawkins of arrogance and pride because of the conviction he displays in his atheism.

It is precisely those characteristics which support all believers in their own conviction that there is a god.

The stench of hypocrisy hangs heavy...

Prof. Dawkins has been a hero since I found him in the early-eighties. He just keeps getting better and better.
We need more devout atheists to proudly stand up and proclaim not only the intellectual but, most urgently, the moral need for a rational foundation to our beliefs.

For the first time in years I felt that I was not alone in my conviction that humanity needs to rid itself of the God delusion.Richard Dawkins gave me hope that people may eventually come to realise the truth - we as humans and we alone are responsible for how we live our lives and how we treat our fellow human beings. Bravo Richard Dawkins!

Thank Evolution for Professor Dawkins the Patron saint of Common Sense

The problem with Dawkins' thesis is that if a scientist can never be sure then a scientist has to be agnostic. So in the interests of truth lets use the terms correctly. Atheists are deluded.
Only faith brings certainty, so it would appear that Dawkins' is a man of faith.

By the way I have a PhD in zoology and I am a Christian

Great, back to square one again. To me reading the various comments here are like watching a new episode of planet of the apes. The monkey people (Darwin supporters) trying to take over earth. People, the concept of a few monkey offshoots to your forefather concept are pretty "monkish". Intelligent design still makes more sense. It is a long pass to call the evolution a science yet, as it does not conclude on the evolutionary theory.

I think Professor Richard Dawkins, is banging his head against a brick wall. He'll never shake the faith of those religious people, They quote the scriptures and seem to be utterly convinced, its fascinating to see the total blinkerdness of these folk brainwashed by superstitious nonesence
much of it perhaps dreamt up by some poor old monk sitting in a cell hundreds of years ago trying to make sence of his world around him. It is refreshing to read and hear his thoughts and using logic to make sence of all the evidence staring at us from the ground and rocks.

Hi Dawkins, When did you get so old man? I guess God's got it in for you - how else could you get so wrinkly so quick?

It is unbelievable how a man with great intelligence (some how suggested by the "professor" title) can be so foolish! But then, the Bible says this - "For the wisdom of this world is foolishness in God's sight"

If the bible wasnt true how could over 1000 prophesies be fulfilled in the New testament?? Wake up

I feel sorry for Dawkins. Eternity is a long time.

Evolution, intelligent design, God, all are perhaps interchangable metaphors for our quest to gain some understanding of a mystery that is beyond the limitations imposed by our five senses.

The world needs more people like Richard Dawkins. Every "faith school" in the country should be made to have a copy of his book in their library. The regligious fanatics are all for showing "both sides" of the "evolution debate" with the totally unscientific concept of inteligent design. How about seeing both sides of the religion debate. I imagine they wouldn't be too keen on that.

For someone who keeps saying that he believes in truth, Dawkins certainly is economical with it, to the point of misrepresenting Einstein's view on God. Einstein did, in fact, say that God exists and died believing in Him.

I think that Dawkin's fierce attack on faith is to convince himself that God does not exist as he said many times that he cannot prove that He doesn't exist.

If he doesn't want to accept the account of the Gospels regarding Christ, he can easily find that there are other reports of His life and ressurection from eminent scholars of the time which were not His followers. He is like a man clatching at straws in his attempt to misrepresent all the historical evidence of Christ's miracles. Roman and Greek scholars wrote about what they have seen and now Dawkins wants us to believe him, 2000 years after the event, and not the eyewitnesses. Is this what he regards as dealing with truth?

A person cannot see what they don't want to see. Dawkins has shut himself in his own delusion that he is unable to grasp what so many other eminent scientists have - namely the existance of God. Why are they all wrong and he is the only "logical" one, the only one who sees the "truth"? I think this should tell us a lot about his mental state.

He once said that without God we can live life as we please. This is his subconsciece reason for his attack on God. He wants to live life without the confinds of his own conscience.

Leading scientists have written and talked about God but Dawkins never deals with those issues but simply puts his own views forward. Is this scientific? He admitted to Jeremy about his own intellectual shortcomings by saying that he cannot understand how scientists have a belief in God. Indeed! Finally the real truth from him. He does not have the capacity to understand so he attacks blindly.

If science only deals with truth, why do so many scientist argue and disagree about "scientific facts"?

God only appears to those who are open to Him and stays away from those who do not want Him. This is respecting free will.

I watched Paxman interviewing Dawkins last evening.I tend to agree with Dawkins.
I may have picked this up wrongly but I felt that Dawkins stated that humans,as a species, have no purpose.
It is possible that the question about why the universe exists will never be answered (maybe there is no answer) but I remember reading a quote (sound bite?) from an American scientist,George Wald,who said that he believed that humans,as a species, were the attempt,or more likely one attempt,of the universe to understand itself.
Thinking about the universe,and I am not a scientist,is mind blowing and it is only living,conscious, intelligent creatures who have the ability to answer major questions.
That seems an important purpose to me.

alot of things confuse me about the scientific community, they say god does not exist yet they cannot explain how the universe came into existance, they say that the absence of god proves he does exist yet in the quantum world they create theories around what they cannot see or measure on a regular basis i.e dark matter and dark energy, they say evolution proves the non existance of god yet evolution gave us this inherent need to believe in something greater than ourselves, they say that we are the sum of our biology yet no one yet can fully explain consciousness, scientists like to say "because it can't be explained does not mean it is god" but i believe until the major questions are solved then i feel nothing should be dismissed out of hand including god, either in the biblical sense or as i believe the great scientist in the sky

In reply to comment 181. At 10:53 AM on 23 Sep 2006, by MH.

Sad! sad! sad!

And to others who have only just found their saviour in Dawkins.

Where have you been hiding all your life?

There is only one truth whether you can see it or not. Look around you the evidence is real and tangible.

Since reading several of the above comments I must confess my viewpoint has not changed at all. I agree completely with Professor Richard Dawkins. Where is the evidence, let alone proof, to back up the existence of God? I have heard many Christians use the excuse that God only helps those who are open to him and stays away from those who don't to respect free will. Yet this free will gift is not all it's cracked up to be. Free will does not explain why suffering is permitted following a natural disaster. Free will did not help the Jews in Auschwitz - exerting all of their free will would not have made any difference to their fate. If God did create the universe then he is responsible for all the suffering that has taken place. I would prefer a God to show himself and help those suffering or in need rather than discriminate. This does not sound like a benevolent God to me, nor does one that lets a child die of poverty every 3 seconds in Africa. The recent violence in Iraq is based on religion. I just don't see why God, if he does exist, he doesn't just show himself to clear up the debate once and for all. As someone said earlier, if we were immortal, would we still believe in God? Several religious people have confessed to me that they believe in God because of fear of death. Finally, I don't understand all this fuss over Dawkins' finals comment "I don't believe we are put here to be comfortable". I assumed he was simply saying there was no reason for us being here, whether it's comfort or not. We should just try and help each other get along as best we can. The atheists I know love life because they don't see it as some sort of transitory period to a better place.

I am much struck by the high quality of many of the contributions to this debate, in marked contrast to those posted in some previous debates. Valid points have been made on both sides, generating more light than heat.
I think that most current major organized religions suffer because they have ejected the female principle from divinity: a Goddess might be Good for You.

Is it available in Arabic? If not, why?

Sorry, folks - I take back what I said in 201 about previous debates being of poor quality - I didn't realize this was the book debate section.
As an illustration of what I meant - go to the section commenting on the whole programme and read the ranting.

For those that keep saying there are extra-biblical accounts of Jesus I would like to point out that none of them are contemporary. Pliny talks about it, almost 100 years after the event. But even he states that he has no idea what a Christian is, but only learns it from a Christian he interrogates. Justice Tiberius wrote a history of Galilee in the first 30 years of the Christian era. He did not mention anything to do with Christianity at all. Not once! When you consider that the Romans wrote about their own slaves, you find it totally absurd that the Justice Tiberius wrote a history of the area that Jesus was living in, at the time Jesus was alive, never mentioned Him once. Then when you consider that Jesus is the "Son of God" it becomes even more strange. Why does the most "important" event in human history have such a sloppy historical record for it? We are talking about a devine being afterall...

This voice of sanity is sheer delight.But if over 50% of the population of a country as well educated as the USA believe in creationism what hope is there for change? The brainwashing has gone on for centuries.

There were not many mentions of Allah were there?
From Paxman's thoughtful examinations you'd have thought Dawkins was only denying the existence of a Christian God?
Why was that do you think - fear of a belief they themselves do not believe in?

Richard, you are a bright shining light in the darkness. A beacon of common sense in a vast ocean of stupidity.

For the lucky ones of us who weren't brain washed by religion at an early age, it's plain to see the delusion that so many suffer. But I think it's just too late for them. They have closed their ears and are happy with what they "know" to be true.

We should be concentrating on future generations. Getting legislation through to ban faith schools. And concentrate on teaching a moral code of conduct to children, free of religion.

Altruism is possible without recourse to god.

In response to Anthony (Griffith) who wrote:

"Well, here we go again. Richard Dawkins publishes a book believing that over 2 billion of the present global population are all deluded...

...The arrogance of his thesis is that he believes he is right and that billions of 'the believers' are wring. I stand with the majority as any good democracy would do."

Surely in a world populated by over 6 billion people, the 2 billion 'believers' represent a minority? (6-2=4) And being a good democrat you should thus be an athiest? An excellent way to choose your faith by the way, just follow the masses. I think that's what's got us into this mess in the first place.

I think the earlier comment "thank God for Richard Dawkins" perfectly sums up the comical nature of this debate. This is no longer worth discussing, the scientists (or at least the educated) won a long time ago.

Having said that, what harm do Buddhism, Sikhism or Hinduism cause anyone? Although I generally agree with Dawkins, I wouldn't dream of imposing atheism upon these people who probably enjoy life whilst the Muslims and Christians kill each other.

Although historically religion has a lot of blood on its hands, with regard to our current problems I think the buck stops with irresponsible governments who insist on playing with fire.

Dawkins' arguments, however, certainly remain valid and should be given more widespread discussion, not only be intellectuals but even by kids in school, rather than just forcing them to swallow the traditional doctrines - a practice which probably contributes greatly to their continued acceptance. The great story above from the muslim-turned-athiest is a good example of what could happen a lot more if people were encouraged to think for themselves.

The world would become unrecognisable if kids were exposed to Dawkins as a counter-balance on the curriculum.

To Gareth (161) who said:
"Sir Fred Hoyle calculated the likelihood of the formation of life from inanimate matter as one out of ten to the power 40000."

This pointless calculation was shot down in flames during the "Intelligent design" debate. Take a pack of playing cards and 52 people. Shuffle the deck and give each person a card. The chances of each person getting the card they got is less than one in ten to the power 68. Virtually impossible isn't it? And yet it happened.

We need more of this. If it wasn't so ironic, I'd say that Richard Dawkins is a prophet in his own land. Well done that man for speaking the truth. Only one thing ...In the blurb it talks about Europe becoming secularised - this isn't the case in the UK where New Labour seems to be fixated with faith-based social policy - it will all end in tears.

well done Prof Dawkins.
Having faith is one thing.But imposing your faith on others through an unproven scriptures,Holy texts is another thing.

Without question Professor Richard Dawkins is an intelligent man, unfortunately in this instance, he forgot to follow the basic fundamental laws of scientific research; for example he only had one model of experimentation. The inability to compare in any scientific investigation invalidates the findings of that research.
What Professor Dawkins presents to us is his own personal opinion and it contains no scientific validity.
In this instance the ‘Dawkins belief,’ becomes just another belief, another idea prompted by another man. Now his own belief merges with all of those before him and he simply adds to the religious confusion of the world.
But his biggest mistake was that he forgot compensate for the interference and the contamination of belief by man.
If you stand anywhere in the world; if you forget man and all of his beliefs; if you forget all the differences that exist between us, then you will find the truth.

'GOD' is a principle. In order to prove it you need to accept that subjectivity will always be a part of the scientific equation. Absolute truth can only be determined by perception beyond conceptualisation, of what just 'IS' beyond intelectual labels. Labeling thereafter becomes a mere attempt at describing the experience of absolute reality.

Religion is the scurge of humanity and rather like Javallan Neru I long for the day when human beings will give up all these imaginary beings. Religious zealots have closed minds and do not take a hostorical perspective of religion. Do they not realise that there have been many many religions before the ones we have today and they have all become obsolite. The ancients believed whatever it was they believed with as much fervour as religious people today believe whatever it is they believe, but all these religions have fallen by the wayside and humanity has gone on without all the mahem and retrabution that was promised if such a thing occured.

What a marvellous, though far too short, interview with this superb logician.

Dawkins's is certainly right about faith schools; they send children out into the world with skewed and perverted ideas of the world around them.

In response to Neil (209)

I don't see how this reasoning works. Ok so we exist and have broken odds of 1 in 10 to the power of 40000, if indeed Sir Fred Hoyle is correct. But we are not simply a combination of cards that are indistinct to any other set of cards. What is life compared to nothingness? Its a bit different from any other combination of cards. Can a combination of cards assemble a national court system to issue judgement on bad behaviour? Of course it can't. We are moral beings - we have a conscience. There are many other issues to consider as well this interesting calculation. But may I also ask you, what gives people more dignity... Evolution or Christianity?
Well evolution says we came from some sort of swamp, whereas Christianity says that we are made in the image and glory of God.

What went wrong? Man decided to disobey God's instructions so we became an enemy of God - your conscience can testify to this. But there is reconciliation to God through His Son Jesus - that is how you can find God, through Jesus.

In the intrest of fair and balanced broadcasting, the BBC should give Professor Dawkins or some other like-minded person either, a job on the heaven and earth programme or even their own show just after.

I for one will be buying his book.

Carry on the GOOD WORK Professor Richard Dawkins

In response to Neil (209)

I don't see how this reasoning works. Ok so we exist and have broken odds of 1 in 10 to the power of 40000, if indeed Sir Fred Hoyle is correct. But we are not simply a combination of cards that are indistinct to any other set of cards. What is life compared to nothingness? Its a bit different from any other combination of cards. Can a combination of cards assemble a national court system to issue judgement on bad behaviour? Of course it can't. We are moral beings - we have a conscience. There are many other issues to consider as well this interesting calculation. But may I also ask you, what gives people more dignity... Evolution or Christianity?
Well evolution says we came from some sort of swamp, whereas Christianity says that we are made in the image and glory of God.

What went wrong? Man decided to disobey God's instructions so we became an enemy of God - your conscience can testify to this. But there is reconciliation to God through His Son Jesus - that is how you can find God, through Jesus.

As a devout atheist since the age of 10, I found it most refreshing to hear such coherent arguments from Richard Dawkins.

And Man made god in His own image...

This is an opportunity for people to look at religons which are not created around GOD. I am a buddhist and I certainly do not believe that I am here to be comfortable as Sir Richard said. My aim as a buddhist is to reach NIRVANA and stop this cycle of reincarnation. what he says in the book was told 2500 years back by Buddha (an ordinary human being).I recommend Buddhism as the path to freedom.

Listening to Richard Dawkin's responses to Jeremy Paxman's incisive questions (Newsnight Friday 22 November 2006), I was confirmed in my opinion that Dawkin belongs to that group of researchers whom I once described in the British Medical Journal as "whistling in the dark to keep their scientific courage up" [Konotey-Ahulu FID. The suprascientific in clinical medicine: a challenge to Professor Know-All. BMJ 2001, Volume 323, pages 1452-1453 (http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/323/7327/1452?)] Professor Dawkin dismissed the historicity of The Lord Jesus Christ as myth. When he dates a cheque "22nd September 2006" does it worry him that the myth must really be very strong to have lasted this long to compel him to write 22.09.2006? Some myth, eh? I was once (as I said in the British Medical Journal peer-reviewed article) a staunch Darwinian Evolutionist until at London University's University College Medical School in Gower Street, I sat at the feet of arguably the greatest Darwinian Evolutionist in the world. He was an Hebrew genius called Professor JZ Young FRS, and my Professor of Anatomy in Medical School. At University College London (UCL), we were the only pre-Clinical Institution in the entire Commonwealth (if not the whole world) that had to sit a 3-hour paper in "Evolution and Metaphysics" in addition to the usual Anatomy papers, before going on to Clinical Medicine. There were no textbooks on the subject, and although JZ Young was the best selling author in the world of three classic books: 'The Invertebrates', 'The Vertebrates', and 'The Human Brain', if a student missed but one of his 15 weekly lectures on Evolution one would be hard put answering the 3-hour paper in the final pre-Clinical exam. As his lectures progressed, my faith in Darwinian Evolution mounted in leaps and bounds. Then came Lecture 8 or 9, when "J Z" was describing the difference between the brain of an adult chimpanzee, and that of a newborn human baby. Suddenly, and dramatically, "J Z" was out of his depth, and he communicated this feeling to me (and at least to the girl sitting next to me, called Shirley Knight, now a retired Surgeon). Evolution was no proven fact at all, then? He continued to mention "The Theory of Evolution" I don't know how many times. That was 1954 to 1956 when I did my Second MB at UCL. Since then, nothing has happened that lifted Evolution from Theory to Reality. In fact, the very opposite has happened. Discovery of DNA (which is information) is the nail in the coffin of Darwin's Theory of Evolution. You can give 'chance' as many billions of years as you like, useful information will never emerge. But the greatest difficulty Richard Dawkin has is to prove (first) that his brain is sharper than mine, and (secondly) that those of us who were taught by the best brains in the world and who have now revised our evaluation of Darwinian Evolution to concur with that of Cambridge University Professor Fred Hoyle FRS have suddenly gone round the bend. Writing in his chapter "The Gospel According To Darwin", you remember, Fred Hoyle made this remarkable diagnostic statement: "How has the Darwinian theory of evolution by natural selection managed, for upwards of a century, to fasten itself like a superstition on so-called enlightened opinion? Why is the theory still defended so vigorously?" Hoyle goes on, and I agree totally: "Personally, I have little doubt that scientific historians of the future will find it mysterious that a theory which could be seen to be unworkable came to be so widely believed". For sheer diagnostic acumen, I give Hoyle 'FULL MARKS!' But there will be shouts of "See what Hoyle puts in place of Evolution - Rubbish!" My answer to that, as a British trained Clinician, is this: One can be spot on regarding diagnosis, but be way out on treatment. Because the prescription for a particular condition is wrong, is not the reason to dismiss a perfectly sound diagnosis. I must pay at least one compliment to British undergraduate and postgraduate education in my days. You were taught how to think, NOT what to think. Dawkin is trying to tell us what to think. The great JZ Young FRS (Oh bless his memory!)and the host of my fantastic British teachers (London, Cambridge, Liverpool, Glasgow) did not teach me what to think. They all taught me HOW to think, and that was how I came to lose my Evolution Faith. Diagnostically, I prefer Fred Hoyle's cerebral approach to Richard Dawkin's. Incidentally, Francis Crick himself said that his theory of the origin of the genetic code "seems plausible, but as a theory it suffers from a major defect - it is too accommodating. In a loose sort of way it can explain anything" [Crick FHC. The origin of the genetic code. Journal of Molecular Biology 1968, Volume 38, pages 367-379]. So even the great Crick guesses at the origin of the genetic code that he discovered. But I must not end without alluding to what I am considered a world authority on: "The Sickle Cell Disease Patient". Indeed, I was chosen to give the Keynote Address in Philadelphia on 31st May 1972 when Linus Pauling (Double Nobel Prize Winner), Max Perutz (Nobel Prize Winner), AC Allison FRS, Hermann Lehmann FRS were honoured together with me and others for our work in Sickle Cell Disease research. Why I was chosen to give the Keynote Address at the Martin Luther King Jr Foundation Award Ceremony for outstanding contributions in Sickle Cell Disease, with Nobel Laureates sitting behind me, was perhaps because I traced the sickle gene in my forebears generation by generation, with names of sufferers from the disease in my tribe right back to 1670 AD on both mother and father side, thanks to the tribal names of the disease in Africa with phenotypic distinctions known centuries before Linus Pauling defined the molecular defect across the Atlantic in the USA. [http://www.konotey-ahulu.com/images/generation.jpg] So when I say that the fashion of using Sickle Cells in Biology and Medical Textbooks to "prove" that Darwinian Evolution took place by natural selection is a defect in clear thinking, I know what I am talking about. The fact that the Sickle Cell Trait [Norm/Ache as I have called it in Genetic Counselling (AS)] like my mother, does not die from Falciparum Cerebral Malaria in childhood, as the Norm/Norm (AA) and Ache/Ache (SS) do, to balance the polymorphism, should never be cited as proof that Natural Selection has propelled one-celled organisms in proto-antiquity to progress to the multi-organ multi-cellular reader of this message on the BBC website. Not surprising that Professor Hoyle described such thought processes as nothing short of superstition.

Dawkins heralds the beginning of the end for religion as a force to corrupt the minds of men. In these troubled times more mental effort is wasted by more people on religion than on solving our very pressing real problems. Viva Hawkins! Viva la revolucion! Hasta la victoria!

In reply to Gareth’s question (220):

“But may I also ask you, what gives people more dignity... Evolution or Christianity?
Well evolution says we came from some sort of swamp, whereas Christianity says that we are made in the image and glory of God.”

And therein lies the problem. Are we looking for the truth or something that makes us feel better about ourselves? Sorry, but I agree with Professor Dawkins that the truth is more important than being comfortable.

PS: In my original comment about Hoyle’s “pointless calculation” I only meant pointless in the context of this debate.

THANK GOD FOR PROF DAWKING! I thought I was alone in my thoughts on religion until I read your article in PROSPECT on 'GERINOIL' - now I know it's the rest of the world that's barking mad! Will Have to wait for my library to buy your book - I'm a pensioner!

Dawkins heralds the beginning of the end for religion as a force to corrupt the minds of men. In these troubled times more mental effort is wasted by more people on religion than on solving our very pressing real problems. Viva Dawkins! Viva la revolucion! Hasta la victoria!

David Hawkins Doen't No wot he is on about, so shut ya mouth.... WHO IS HE!! WHO IS HE>> WERE DID YOU FIND HIM!

What seems to be evident in several of the comments criticising Dawkins and those of us who agree with his views, is that they think he is somehow setting himself in place of 'God' and that secularists and atheists like myself see him as our 'Saviour'. They seem to be trapped in a way of thinking that there has to be a supreme being and that, us as humans, must worship that supreme being. I think Dawkins is a perfectly normal human being with flaws and faults like all of us - he is not my spiritual leader or saviour. As far as I can see, Dawkins is simply making a sober assessment that, of the various claims that have been made throughout history, by different groups of people trying to explain the world and provide meaning to our existence etc, those which rely on there being a supernatural creator cannot be proved - their 'truth' depends on placing faith in religious 'teachings' - many of which actually contradict each other on who the supreme being is and what 'his' intentions were. It's not enough to say 'look at the wonders of the world - surely there must be a divine creator behind them'. Besides, given the natural occurence of viruses and diseases such as Parkinsons, MS, Alzheimers etc. not to mention earthquakes, volcanoes, hurricanes and so on, anyone taking the view that there is a supreme creator, surely would have to agree that 'He' wasn't particularly benign towards mankind anyway - more on the side of viruses I would say if you're going to use that form of argument.

Once again Dawkins offers up a dose of intellectually lacklustre polemic that is unworthy of the scientific rigour he espouses in other areas. He claims to be an advocate of ‘truth’ but uses his public profile (justifiably deserved in his own field of expertise) to argue unqualified certainty where none exists.
For example, the ‘truth’ is that humanity’s sense of morality simply cannot be explained as a product of our genetic struggle for evolutionary advantage. Regrettably, but consistently, Dawkins fails to apply to religion - the compulsive object of his frequent scornful assault – the same academic rigour he has applied to evolution. If the portions quoted from the text of his latest diatribe are characteristic of the whole, then it seems, once again, he endeavours to bolster an argument by a cunning (yet hardly credible) choice of easy targets.
Of course it is entirely proper that religion, and those things men and women may sometimes practice or propound in its name, should be subject to an energetic critique, but then so should science! But, speaking as a person of ‘faith’, it would be just as unworthy of me to write off all knowledge gained through that discipline simply because I could point to the wickedness (or lunacy) perpetrated by some who practice it. Straw men will always fall over – whatever their name! Of course, it is right that religious convictions (however long their pedigree) should give ground to science when it gives a credible explanation of natural processes; equally, science has to admit (if it is genuinely interested in ‘truth’) that despite its huge advances it still cannot answer many questions about the nature of the universe. Science does very well when it comes to queries about “How” – but can never even attempt to explain “Why”. It is a question forever beyond its remit. And that’s the truth! So my personal plea is simple:
Dear Dr. Dawkins, don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater!
Your fellow seeker after 'truth',
David

(Not the same Michael Thompson as the earlier one!) This was an unsatisfactory interview. Why is Dawkins so obsessed with a Being who according to him does not exist? I hope that the interview is followed soon by one in which an opponent of Dawkins is allowed to criticise his work. May I suggest Alister McGrath, whose book 'Dawkins' God' rebuts many of Dawkins' arguments.

At the end of the interview with Jeremy Paxman Richard Dawkin in reply to a question posed to him replied "we were not put here to be comfortable." As he has no belief in God or creation who is he saying put us here?

Wonderful to read in Richard Dawkins eloquent text the seemingly obvious that many of us are unable to find the words to express. But how can he (and the rest of we like minded people) find the means find the means to persuade a large proportion of the world's population from killing itself in the name of its chosen "God?"

In view of the many comments above I didn't think there would be any value in adding my own. However, as an ordinary Christian with, I think, reasonable intelligence and understanding, I have decided to do so. Much of what is writtn above and in particular the excerpts from Professor Dawkin's book, has little if any bearing on my belief in God. I am English, not American, and little of what Professor Dawkin wrote about the situation in the States has any bearing on the way I or any of my Christian friends and aquaintances live and work. I wonder whether his research involved contact with what I have termed,'ordinary Christian people'. I obviously don't know the answer to that, and make no assumptions. I would just say this. My faith in God, rather than being a crutch, has been a strength in the tough situations I have faced. It is no myth, no hallucination, but something which has stood me in good stead through at least 70 year of my life. The way gets harder as one gets older, but God is my ever present help in trouble, and therefore, I do not fear, but have peace of heart and mind. I believe severe persecution might yet face Christians in our country, and I hope and pray that my faith will stand firm should that happen.

Human beings since the dawn of time have asked the question Why? I am no expert but even the earliest cave dwellers appear to have needed the reassurance of a higher order being to appeal to, to be in awe of and to appease with sacrifices.

What Richard Dawkins cannot do (unfortunately) is to replace the hope that people of religious faith have (in an afterlife, in ultimate justice), with atheism which can offer nothing except perhaps a more reasoned, rational understanding of the world we live in.

It is perhaps unfortunate, though understandable, that most human beings cannot live without this hope. It is a minority of religious zealots who follow religious faith to its extremes. There are millions of people who quietly live their lives in the pursuit of their particular religous belief. Perhaps we should not be too ready to rob people of their convictions. Having hope is what keeps many people going!

Try as I might I cannot hope. The well argued position Richard Dawkins takes chimes a chord with me. Pity those of us incapable of exercising the faith necessary to believe. It would be lovely to have hope (however, deluded that might make us)!

How sad to hear Professor Dawkins decrying the Godhead in such a way. I believe in God, Jesus and the Bible and feel that, in his search for truth, Prof Dawkins has not looked at the considerable body of archeological data that supports the Bible. What about the fact also that the prophecies have been amazingly fulfilled, eg Psalm 22 in which David portrays crucifixion which, of course, was unknown to the Jewish mind.
I cannot live without God and feel sad for the Professor, particularly as the Bible states, 'The fool has said in his heart there is no God'!
i look forward to the book he writes entitled, 'I was wrong'.
I do hope space will be given on Newsnight for the alternative viewpoint.

"I do hope space will be given on Newsnight for the alternative viewpoint"?

Exactly how many people have you seen on the television recently who have been as brave as Prof. Dawkins and stood up to put forward the viewpoint that God doesn't exist?

How many religious programmes are broadcast (on either television or radio) every week?

Now try to tell me that the balance of the media weighs in favour of secular points of view. I think not.

Thanks, Professor Dawkins - easily the most educated and well balanced argument for the non-existance of God I've heard on a serious programme - if not the only one I've ever heard!

Richard Dawkins appears to be an “educated man.”
Perhaps received a huge amount of academic training at university.
It must have cost thousands of pounds to train him.
But if he presented this book as an end of term exam paper to his university tutor for marking, his tutor would have torn him apart for this piece of writing, and FAILED him accordingly.

For example he refers to those he castigates:
Pat Robertson et al as:
Religious zealots,
Ignorant of all except biblical learning,
Christian murderers of abortion doctors
He makes no mention of the the abortion doctors murdering the babes in the womb.

Of those he likes:
He quotes Bishop John Shelby Spong, in The Sins of Scripture, who RIGHTLY observed. Those who wish to base their morality literally on the Bible have either not read it or not understood it.
And with Richard Holloway, recently retired as Bishop of Edinburgh, who describes himself as a 'recovering Christian'.
one of the most stimulating and interesting encounters I have had.

And finally the RESPECTED journalist Muriel Gray he quotes:
“The cause of all this misery, mayhem, violence,terror and ignorance is of course religion itself.”
If Muriel Gray says it, it must be so. Is Muriel an authority on Religion?

Richard can’t have it both ways.
He portrays all those he castigates as "NUTTERS."
Ignorant of all except biblical learning.
Then as having either not read the Bible or not understood it.
It appears that Richard has either not read what HE has written or not understood it either.

People who have not read the Bible, cannot be acting because of Religion.
Also people who have misunderstood it, cannot be acting according to Religion.
And they cannot at the same time be ignorant of all, except biblical learning.
Therefore, all these NUTTERS cannot be acting because of religion.
What comes through here is they are just NUTTERS. Religion has nothing to do with their actions.
I’m afraid Richard has defeated his own agument here.
What an extremely poor academic effort. What a waste of money educating this man.

I have been following Hawkins for some time and indeed he is a rare voice of reason amongst politicians scared of disrespecting the religious, and sheepish journalists.

As an answer to "If he does not believe in God, then who are we put here by?", This person for one reason or another has ignored the most likely possibility that our existence is pure chance and devoid of a superior purpose. You couldn't have proven Hawkin's point much better; some people just NEED comfort and purpose and cannot fathom a world without it. This is why religion exists and must be kept from power.

The theory of evolution of the Coca Cola can.

Billions of years ago, a big bang produced a large rock. As the rock cooled, sweet brown liquid formed on its surface. As time passed, aluminum formed itself into a can, a lid, and a tab. Millions of years later, red and white paint fell from the sky, and formed itself into the words "Coca Cola 12 fluid ounces."

Of course, my theory is an insult to your intellect, because you know that if the Coca Cola can is made, there must be a maker. If it is designed, there must be a designer. The alternative, that it happened by chance or accident, is to move into an intellectual free zone.

The banana -- the atheist's nightmare.

Note that the banana:

1. Is shaped for human hand
2. Has non-slip surface
3. Has outward indicators of inward content:
Green-too early,
Yellow-just right,
Black-too late.
4. Has a tab for removal of wrapper
5. Is perforated on wrapper
6. Bio-degradable wrapper
7. Is shaped for human mouth
8. Has a point at top for ease of entry
9. Is pleasing to taste buds
10.Is curved towards the face to make eating process easy

To say that the banana happened by accident is even more unintelligent than to say that no one designed the Coca Cola can.

In response to Neal (225):

"And therein lies the problem. Are we looking for the truth or something that makes us feel better about ourselves? Sorry, but I agree with Professor Dawkins that the truth is more important than being comfortable."

I agree with you totally on this one Neal. Pursue the truth by all means.

in my view professor is right on many accounts but unfortunately I happen to know some parts of the world where all they have is religion and religion is the only hope and reason to live as they do not have luxury to afford this truth.they hope there would be some place at last where they can really live.

Looks like we are still blaming God for the "evil" that Men do.

To Gareth Morris,

Your banana "atheist nightmare" has long been debunked. Here are the counter-arguments (courtesy IronChariots.org):

1. The bananas that we eat today were specifically bred by humans to be a size that we like. Natural bananas are much smaller. This is a bit like Douglas Adams' analogy of a puddle thinking that the hole it's in was perfectly designed to contain the puddle.
2. The fact that a banana fits perfectly in our hand says a lot more about the evolution of hands than it does about bananas. The human hand is very versatile, able to change shape enough to hold a tiny pebble or a large basketball. Lots of the things we don't eat also fit in our hands.
3. More animals eat bananas (especially naturally occurring bananas) than just humans. Perhaps God created bananas for monkeys and humans just knew a good thing when they saw it.
4. We eat all kinds of food. The coconut is also enjoyed by humans as food yet, apart from having a non-slip surface (like almost all objects) and being pleasant to eat (like most food), it holds none of the other properties of the banana. A cow, which some might say is far more delicious than a banana, is fairly difficult to hold in the hand when in its natural form. Like many other foods, cows also require some very particular preparation before eating otherwise some nasty diseases can result. The diseases come from bacteria that theists would also say were created by God.
5. Speaking of bacteria, the number of objects in the universe that are inedible and even dangerous to humans far outweighs the number of objects that are tasty.
6. Far from being proof that the entire world is custom made for our pleasure, this seems to be a case of cherry picking certain features to find one good example.
7. Pineapple.

I'm an undecided but open minded guy and thus look forward to a full read. Sadly, despite thinking and wanting there to be more to life I can find no religion that makes any sense to me.

If anyone can offer a god who is not communication retarded, geographically challenged and whose followers preach hate and intolerance I would certainly be interested in listening.

Since the death of Bertrand Russell, who dotted the ‘i’ s and crossed the ‘t’ s for me regarding religion, I have been leaderless. Dawkins is my new god.

With all political parties now attempting to embrace green issues the first prospective PM to reject god will have my vote.

When asked by pollsters what is the greatest danger now facing the world I have recently responded with global warming or over population. But now having been made aware of the “End Timers” power in the states for me religion is vying as the greatest danger.

Dawkins book will probably not convert many believers but lets hope it will tip some agnostics over to full blown atheism.

It was indeed a pleasure to watch Professor Dawkins and Jeremy Paxton on Friday.

I would like to thank Professor Dawkins on behalf of thousands of free thinking individuals trying to find a voice in these days of fundamentalists.

It is clear that this book is as important as Professor Hawkins book on History of Time. We need a “Messiah” of common sense and logic in these days where every action is now dictated by either the “End Timers “in USA or Fundamentalists in Middle east.

I was fortunate enough to have studied and lived amongst a number of different religions and have come to same conclusions as Professor Dawkins. The current religions have access to vast amount of funds and recourses and will not release their hold on their followers and as a result will take every opportunity to fight common sense and scientific view.

Based on the history of evaluation so far it is clear that human race will develop in two directions, one with highly developed brains and the other with highly developed physical features. The sole purpose of the human race is to gather experience and have the ability to store and pass this on to future generation. A recent case of a woman in California has shown that she can recall events of every day in her live. It will be possible to repeat this by use of drugs. Next step will be transfer this to a central bank and then on to new bodies and machines! Time travel and Space will thus be possible.

I feel that Professor Dawkins should start a “Society of Free Thinkers” (SFT) which will become a force very quickly. Once again thank you BBC and Thank you Professor Dawkins it is only possible in UK.

I do not agree with the title as in fact it is a "paradigm Delusion". Any strongly held dogmatic belief is elligible for Delusion.

In Dawkins own previous book the Selfish Gene the acts of the suicide bombers are already explained i.e. these men had more genetically in common with oppressed Palestinians and Iraqis than the Invading US and UK forces. However this genetic imperitive can be subserved by extreme belief systems ergo black soldiers in the US forces and perhaps the occasional white muslim.

Newsnight 23/09/2006

In spite of all its trendy aberrations BBC still has some intellectual passion that showed in this interview.
I am like Prof. Dawkins subscribe to the atheism, yet I believe in personal god and I do not find these two are contradictory. Jeremy Paxman posed a question citing an example of climbing to a mountaintop and overwhelmed by the beauty of the surroundings and marvelling the creator of such beauty. I will have no qualm about it until someone explains to me the rationale of the perceived beauty of the surroundings. Our idea of such a creator of such beauty should always be progressive and changing. God should have element of change – with the advancement of our knowledge, our element of unknown should change. The existence of essence i.e. beauty itself could not be explained away. Plato’s idea is that intellect could take us so far, after that we have to rely on our personal experience. Some cave dwellers could have the experience of seeing the sunlight – no body could explain how the ultimate Bhodi could be achieved to attain the Nirvana (seeing the sunlight). But there it is - one could see the sunlight but what personal exercise is needed is not clear yet. So appreciation of beauty itself is not a problem, but by what means its essence could be achieved is not clear to us. Contemplation is not enough. There lies the dichotomy. Until this is resolved Atheism’s rationality will have to live with this deficiency so far the god is concerned.

Amal Basu

Hi Dawkins, You sound like a man fussed with his God - How else could you get so mad about something that doesn't exist?

It's easy to criticise religious belief if you only look at the negative aspects. Many western leaders throughout history have been church going people and have brought about fairness and freedom in our society. Many charities are religous ones and feed and help people worldwide who otherwise would not have been helped. What about Mother Theresa and others like her who have given themselves selflessly to help others. People of faith in God have had a positive effect on our society throughout history, producing much of our western values and prosperity we now take for granted.

Looking over the comments, I see the same old story. Angry at having their delusions challenged, the faithful resort to their usual tactics, all of their arguments stemming from a lack of intellectual integrity. They cite various versions of the Argument from Design or the Argument from First Cause, both of which have been demolished countless times by countless philosophers over the decades. They are willing to do all kinds of mental gymnastics, twisting and turning to justify their weird Bronze-age beliefs.

The difference between people like that and somebody is more fundamental than their belief or disbelief in God. The person who has faith as the centre of his/her worldview is primarily concerned with how "nice" or "righteous" his/her beliefs are. Once they have settled on the belief, their job is then to shore it up and justify it as a fact, no matter what. Dawkins, on the other hand, is only concerned about whether his beliefs reflect the TRUTH or not. He understands that the truth is independant of what anyone chooses to believe. Trying to impose our own "truths" on reality is meaningless.

Worse - the faithful, because of their pig-headed refusal to simply think rationally and objectively (rather than resorting to the absurdity of "faith" in arbitrary beliefs) are plunging the world into a very real hell.

A long time ago, Nietzsche said... "a casual stroll through the asylum shows us that faith proves nothing".

For anyone who enjoys the God Delusion, also please give Daniel Harbour's book on thesim-atheism a try. Google "Daniel Harbour".

Matt S.

Did Professor Dawkins consider the many scientific facts in the Bible during his investigation, all of which were written thousands of years before man discovered them. It must have been a test for those folk who believed the Bible when it said the earth was round (Isaiah 40:22) and freely floated in space (Job 26:7), when science at that time and common logic adamantly maintained otherwise.

It would be unthinkable for the BBC to interview a member of a political party in such a loose way as Paxman's interview of Dawkins, without interviewing an individual from another party with similar credentials. Alister Mcgrath, theologian, scientist and Oxford Professor has thoroughly dealt with Dawkins' ideas in his book "Dawkins' God". Possibly he should be interviewed next. Dawkins'woolly thinking was revealed in his statement that Paul invented Christianity. A look at the writings of John and the other disciples shows this to be nonsense. Those who wish to lay any violence at Christ's door should read what he promoted as the second most important commandment to "love your neighbour as yourself" and take the trouble to read the parable of the good samaritan, Luke 10, v 30-37"

All children are taught some form of religious belief. Our desire to seek out a reason for existence ripens us for this indoctrination. Casting off the shackles of religious belief is arduous and leads initially to an overwhelming sense of loneliness. It is a path that only a minority are willing or able to make. With time the loneliness is replaced by an appreciation of the wonder of living and an acceptance that this is enough.

In response to Matthew Shute (255):

That won't hold water on Judgment Day.

Catholicism would agree with the Author, in so far it too does not believe there is God in the universe or in nature, more commonly known as pantheism.

It is not certain however on what intellectual grounds the author basis his main argument. Is it as a scientist? Well science does not claim to make such audicious comments about the existence of God, it is not within its remit. Is it as a philosopher; well the author does not claim to be one and certainly does not appear to have any philosophical argument for disproving the existence of God. So, is it as a historian or politician? Claiming God does not exist, because modernity has to rule out medieval antiquated thinking and his support for gay rights, hardly qualifies as proof that God does not exist. It's mere opinion based on some populist sentiment.

Catholicism teaches that natural reason can find proof for the existence of God but is very careful about the boundaries it sets in regard the fields of knowledge applied. The author's question about the existence of God, it would claim belonged to the philosophical and to metaphysical realm of knowledge.

As for "narrow" moral outlook of modern day religion insofar it excludes gay rights, etc..., Catholocism, is very methodical in the way it first establishes the groundwork for the existence of God, it then discusses what sort of Being, God is, again speaking philosophically and only after establishing various "truths" based on human reason alone, does it begin to discuss what God has revealed about Himself. To dismiss Christianity out of hand because there is no God, is simply to beg the question!

The author claims he is a believer in the truth, but it appears he has not been honest with himself and with his audience about how precisely he establishes, or on what intellectual basis, he starts his argument. If he is talking about science alone, not only is he operating outside the remit of science but is infact agreeing with traditional Catholic view that God is wholly outside nature. The God of science truly does not exist, no one ever claimed He did.

If then the author wants to argue that we cannot know anything outside the field of science, well why right the book and make such an ascertion, since his ascertion is obviously outside the field of science?

Of course, for Catholics and many other faiths and great thinkers, it is not true that we cannot know anything. This is why philosophy, metaphysics have sought intellectually and painstakingly to ponder on these great questions about God and the nature of Being.

It seems to me, the author is full of hot air, out to make a quick buck! One of the characteristics of an atheist is his/her narcissism. The belief that he/she alone loves the truth and that he/she alone believes in the truth. The egocentricism is sad to say the least all the more so if the author is genuinely serious about the intellectual basis of his ideas.

Gareth

Isaiah 40:22 says (KJV): It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in.

Two points: a circle is NOT a sphere and the heavens are NOT like a curtain.

Also, Daniel 4:11 The tree grew, and was strong, and the height thereof reached unto heaven, and the sight thereof to the end of all the earth.

Not possible if the earth was a sphere.

As for the other scientific bible 'fact' you try to convince us of:

Job 26:7 says: He stretcheth out the north over the empty place, and hangeth the earth upon nothing.

However, earlier in Job 9:6 Which shaketh the earth out of her place, and the pillars thereof tremble.
...and...
1 Samuel 2:8 The pillars of the earth are the LORD's, and he hath set the world upon them.

So, was the earth on pillars or was it floating?

A useful resource is www.skepticsannotatedbible.com.

Since I wrote 162 there have been several other emails mentioning e.g. faith schools and indoctrination of children.

Would it be possible to persuade Richard Dawkins to get to the root of this problem by becoming the new "Jamie Oliver" and championing the eradication of religious practice in our schools?

Atheism is as a much an act of faith or ‘meme’ as Theism. A hundred years ago scientists measured people’s skulls and claimed they could spot criminals or anarchists by the shape and size of their head or ear lobes. The same pseudo-science saw a liberal democracy like Sweden sterilise the mentally ill and those deemed ‘unsuitable’ for having children. Sixty years ago scientists in Auschwitz tortured people to death to establish empirical data, subsequently used by ‘proper’ British, American and Russian scientists. So, why is it Christians have to defend or excuse every absurbsity of their history and faith, whereas Dawkin side steps the crass and the deeply immoral science that scientists have peddled in the past as ‘truth’?

Dawkin’s talks about the ‘truth’, but what ‘truth’ is he talking about? In some cases a belief in God can increase the chances of the survival of your DNA, for example, by say refusing to commit suicide, or as it was noted at Auschwitz refusing to give up. At Auschwitz a strong faith, not necessarily religious, was shown to increase your survival chances. If faith gives you an empirically demonstrated advantage in survival and therefore the ability to pass on your DNA, how can Dawkin’s dismiss faith as less than a rational response to human experience of life?

Further, Dawkins admits he cannot falsify any of his claims; therefore, his claims cannot by Karl Popper’s definition be scientific. Moreover, Dawkins does not prove anyone believes in Thor or the Spaghetti monster in the way people of faith believe in God, so how can the examples cited compare with a religious belief?

Perhaps, a nice fat book contract with an American publisher is a possibly better empirical reason for Dawkin's position. After all "Well God may or may not exist……. I cannot prove it either way" is not a book title that is going to sell.

Amazing book! The more Professor Dawkins speaks, the more he shows that God does exist!

Zeno

"Also, Daniel 4:11 The tree grew, and was strong, and the height thereof reached unto heaven, and the sight thereof to the end of all the earth.... Not possible if the earth was a sphere."

Read the context - it was a dream.

"circle is NOT a sphere "

The word translated "circle" here is the Hebrew word chuwg, which is also translated "circuit" or "compass" (depending on the context). That is, it indicates something spherical, rounded, or arched, not something that is flat or square.

"Job 26:7 says: He stretcheth out the north over the empty place, and hangeth the earth upon nothing.

However, earlier in Job 9:6 Which shaketh the earth out of her place, and the pillars thereof tremble."

Is it that simple to infer from Job 9:6 that the earth is sat on literal pillars when it does indeed say a few chapters later that He hangs the earth upon nothing? Why not try reading the book of Job for yourself, and then ask yourself could its author make such a mistake?

Also check Job 38:12,14 which describes the earth as being turned as clay to a seal - an accurate analogy of the earth's rotation.

Job 28:25 tells us that there is a weight for the wind.

Job 38:16 talks about the springs of the sea.
Check out Google: "Ray Comfort" for more.

Before I was a Christian I believed in God because of nature and the beauty of mathematics. I didn't read the whole Bible before getting converted. I only read the Gospels of John and Mark. I was transformed by the power of God, and not one awakened hour goes by in which I am not conscious of God being with me. For the 24 years before my conversion I didn't give God much serious thought. Whenever I would pick up a Bible it did not make much sense to me. Read 1 Corinthians 2:14.

Can you honestly say you are innocent of lying, stealing or lusting? Those are just 3 of the 10 Commandments. Have you ever murdered? God considers hatred as murder. We are all guilty of breaking the Commandments. Listen to the voice of your conscience, and let it remind you of some of the sins of the past. God has seen every sin we have ever committed.

If you are serious about rejecting the Bible and its plan of salvation then you'll have to face God on Judgment Day for failing His 10 Commandments. God does not want you to go to hell and not believing in Him is not what's going to send you there. What will send you there is the fact that you have broken His Law. If you accept Jesus as your saviour He is able to present you perfect to God Almighty, since His blood which He shed on the cross cleanses you of your sin. God then see's you as He saw Jesus when He was baptised (Mark 1:11). You become a child of God. It's not something you can earn, it is a gift of God given to anyone willing to believe.

God bless

It was a fascinating interview but I couldn't hep being left with a slightly anger at the displayed arrogance. He openly states that he wants peple to face the truth.(His version of the truth I assume) but why is it so important that people face this version of the truth? I understand why sceintists struggle with the premise of religous belief. It is all based on faith and a belief in something that can not be proven and I understand why they wish to disprove its factual basis. What I fail to understand is why they can not let those that do believe, just believe. Either those believe are right ( and this would make the scientists look silly) or they are not but need it as a emmotional crutch. If it is the latter, the only harm is if it turns to extremism and this equates to a very small minority who would be extremist in something else (politics?) if not religion. How can anyone believe that they alone know the truth? If only life was so simple.

Religion worries me. We are currently caught up in a religious war. The so-called "war on terror" is just that. We are heading towards oblivion simply because two sets of people don't agree with how to support and worship god. It's utter stupidity. Yeah, they might dress it up as a "war against the evil terrorists", but are the terrorists necessarily evil? No. They just have a wildly different view to what we in the West are used to. Richard Dawkins is absolutely correct to be trying to open people's eyes as to how dangerous religion can be, and I support him 100% in his quest.

If chapter 1 is anything to go by, this book is going to be absolutely brilliant!

BRILLIANT!

The attitude towards the myth that Pat Robertson apparently blaming Hurricane Katrina devastating New Orleans on a lesbian living there struck me as being along the lines of "yes, well...it may be made up and bunk...but it proves my point"
Which rather undermines his whole argument that religion and supposed supernatural deities are made up and bunk.

Dawkins seems so utterly (and, somewhat ironically, fanatically) obsessed with proving his point, that he misses it entirely. Religion is not about proof. It is about faith.

I am confused by Dawkins. On the one hand he draws the conclusion from science that the world is cruel, harsh, and indifferent, with no underlying morality. As he says, 'This is one of the hardest lessons for humans to learn. We cannot admit that things might be neither good nor evil, neither cruel nor kind, but simply callous - indifferent to all suffering, lacking all purpose.' On the other hand, he says that religion is evil and to be opposed. If the world is amoral, how can he make such a moral judgement?

Religion, either directly or not, has led to the main cause of death and destruction over centuries and even today. Over what? Can we prove that prophet was buried here? No, but we'll fight for it anyway.

I was brought up as a Christian, and while I believe it has helped me become a law abiding and well educated member of the public, I am now educated sufficiently to know that I am not going to believe any story which has been told, re-written, deciphered and translated many times over hundreds of years.

Hawkins is right. Wake up you lot and realise if you don't pray what difference will it make. And why is it that the people 'God' does speak to are always mental. Why doesn't God ask us to do good rather than blow something up? I wonder why.....

If were we all just a fraction as rational and civilized as Richard Dawkins the world would be a much safer place.

There's been many other books like this, but somehow this is getting some people frothing - and it's just to sell well at a popular time (obviously).

Don't believe in God? Fine, no argument. Think that Religion is the root of all evil?..Er, Atheist Stalin killed people for just being priests. Without Religion people would kill for other reasons, and have (territory, skin colour etc.)
People do wrong, and it's widely understood that mainstream religions do not endorse intolerance. If you counted extremists amidst Islam then you'd find it to be very small. And then there's the debate whether these pockets are just religious hijackers. Anyone can say they're of a religion and then kill someone.

It's dangerous to think that being without religion is somehow a cure-all, some people require the disciple of religion whether there is a God or not.
Believing or not is one thing, but thinking atheism is the best way is no different to religious fascism. And this is what turns me off about this book, it sounds stupid.

Some wrote "I think I'll write a book called 'The Dawkins Delusion'".
Well just make sure you've read and UNDERSTOOD his arguments first!

This is the book I have been waiting for all my life. Can't wait to get hold of a copy. If I could afford it, I would buy thousands, and hand them out on the streets.

Very interesting interview with Richard Dawkins well handled by Jeremy. Hope you can have future Newsnight Bookclub interviews on a Friday or before eleven so we can see them in Scotland

Oh joy, yet another academic displaying the fine art of picking the bits that further his argument (and ignoring the rest) in order to denigrate a fine old book.

The Bible has survived two millenia of translation and interpretation and hostility.
Will Professor Dawkin's book still raise interest and discussion in 4006? Somehow I doubt it.

There seems to be a fair few responses from people hoping Dawkins finds God before it's too late ! What do they mean by this ? It implies that if you don't find God then God will in some way punish you. If that is the case you have to ask if this is the kind of God that millions of people seem to waiste there whole life praying to.

As Frank Zappa said in 'Dumb All Over -

Hey, we can't really be dumb
If we're just following *God's Orders*
Hey, let's get serious...
God knows what he's doin'
He wrote this book here
An' the book says:
*He made us all to be just like Him,"
so...
If we're dumb...
Then God is dumb...
*(An' maybe even a little ugly on the side)*

Who are all these bizarre people who think Dawkins' 'put here' comment proves he is contradicting himself?

Shunning a religious belief in favour of accepting post-theist thinking is likely to have a limited appeal .
When I discuss this with people they are either indifferent or not willing to go the whole hog . Preffering to label themselves as agnostic .

Mankind won't progress until we eradicate the racial and sexual prejudices that stem from religious teachings or educate young and impressionable minds to value their lives ,instead of throwing them away in the name of a mythical being .

It's unfortunate that in the 21st Century we are still having to give religion so much attention .
I welcome the day when a religious belief is an eccentricity .

I am a firm, and informed, supporter of the theory of evolution by natural selection and do not think that it's necessary to invoke god to explain natural phenomena. That said, it would be better if Prof. Dawkins would admit that he is simply stating his own beliefs. They may be right, probable, or well founded. But, as someone employed to foster the understanding of science he must, presumably, be only too aware that a hypothesis that god does not exist, cannot be framed in such a way that it is capable of disproof, and as such, is not science. The only scientific attitude to god would have to be a very robust agnosticism. Whether or not you think there has been a lot of hatred and irrationality peddled in the name of religion, is not an argument about the central premise. Establishing that people can be irrational, that many belief systems are flawed, and that horrors have been committed in the name of religion is the easy bit, but not really the point. I'm pretty sure that theism and atheism are both just different belief systems, and not really open to a conclusive scientific debate. I feel he should be more honest, and simply state that he's made the best informed hunch that he is able to, on the evidence available. That would be a perfectly respectable position, providing he would be willing to buy into the whole package. The "whole package", be it right or wrong, is one in which subjects like beauty and morality are very difficult concepts to grapple with, though he does, when interviewed, seem to have no problem taking them on-board, in as naive and wide-eyed fashion as others take on religious beliefs.

It's so refreshing to see the BBC devoting some time and attention to atheism and humanism as worldviews. Enough of our license fee goes to funding Songs of Praise, Choral Evensong, Thought of the Day and other such guff already, thank you very much.

Religious thinking is, to my mind, the ultimate form of backwardness and human stupidity. And yet I can hardly get on the tube these days without some zealot shouting about this nonsense in an atempt to proselytise. Thank goodness for Doctor Dawkins! And thank you BBC for providing some airtime to a voice of reason amongst the insane din of those who beleive in fairy tales.

What about all the good things people do motivated by faith? For example, faith-based organisation provide 70 percent of care to HIV patients in Africa. They don't do it for money, but for reasons of faith. Not like Dawkins of course, who has been dinning out on his anti-religious obsessions for years.

Judging from the excerpts, this is yet another Dawkin book, in the now familiar mold. That is to say entertaining, clearly written, but with no actual substance.

Dawkins consistently shys away from something very obvious. That his contentions should be supported by his examples. Instead he makes a statement, starts to explain it, and then drifts off into another diatribe against religion. It's easy for the reader to forget that he never substantiated his original point.

Try this: Read chapter 7. Now, apart from the amusing stories about scripture and religious fanatics, what was his actual point? He refers to a few serious-sounding points, but these have little or nothing to do with the examples he uses. He never tries to connect them.

He _seems_ to be arguing that you can't get morality from the bible, because there is too much that is immoral in there. It's not a statement he makes, or an arguement he pursues.

It's entertaining stuff, and I'm sure there is raw material for a serious discussion there, but you won't get a coherent arguement about religion from Dawkins. It's just a rant masquerading as an arguement. Very disappointing.

Whilst I agree with almost every word the great Prof Dawkins says, he has missed one fundamental point. The majority of the world's population are just too plain stupid to be able to live without a god. Take God away from them and these dimwits will just turn to all sorts of new-age claptrap. Crystal worship anyone?

It sounds wonderful, I can't wait to buy a copy. I have been an atheist all my adult life and have always found fervant religious belief both fascinating & appalling. Having tried many times myself, I can't see Richard's book getting through to the people that need it most, but now that even the pope has had to publically admit his fallibilty, maybe miracles can happen after all!

The problem here is that people are confusing the issues. You cannot compare science (reason and rationality) with religion (the home of the confused, the nebulous and the medieval).

So much is done in the name of religion, but the idea that science produces the same evils is utterly without perspective - science has moved on more in the last 50 years than in the last 500, due to the fact that it can be proven or unproven - religion has by and large remained unchanged for hundreds of years.

What should be the focus here is that religion is utterly un-provable. The very fact that the American extremist Anne Coulter rages against the "agents of reason" proves my point; reason is by its very nature a good thing - to say it is godless is true as there is no empirical reason to believe in a god - but to present this as evil is simply irrational.

There is no need to eradicate religion from society, as it gives support and help to so many, but to replace science with the teachings of a confused and jumbled book that could have been written any time in the last 2000 years is selfish and shortsighted in the extreme.

We should be going through a Golden Age - a global economy, higher levels of wealth and living standards in the west, and technological and scientific progress unthought of 20 years ago - but the actions of these agents of stupidity are dragging us back to the Dark Ages.

This a time when the mixture of religion and politics have become such a negative infouence upon human affairs . Dawkins insights not to mention his courage are a beacon of sanity .

I can't wait to read the whole book. I admire and totally agree with Richard Dawkins. God and all religion in the world, past and present are repressive, manmade, devisive and bloodthirsty. The current fusion of religion and politics in the United Sfgates and in theis country is shameful and destructive in the extreme.

Prseident G W Bush is not the first US president informed by god to undertake an invasion of a foreign country. Remember William McKinley and the Philippines? As someone recently quoted, those who speak to God are essentially beggars and those to whom God 'speaks' are insane.

In passing - if Bush and Blair are such committed Christians what will happen to them on Judgment Day when they face St Peter at the pearly gates? Ho hum...

If Mr Dawkins is convinced that the old testament is a random conglomeration of superstitions because it consists of many different documents, what does he say about the Messaianic prophecies? I'm a classicist and hence am familiar with the notoriously ambiguous nature of prophecy in the ancient world, and I have to say when I read the biblical prophecies I was ASTOUNDED at their precision and accuracy!

I didn't understand what he said about Christianity being invented by Paul; Paul was a zealous pharisee, firecely devoted to his Jewish faith, and nothing short of a miracle would have made him join the people he persecuted, give up his life to preach their message and reform his character as we can see from his letters. I mean, he went to his DEATH for his beliefs, as did most of the disciples. These were the closest people to Jesus, and if they HADN'T seen his miracles, his prophecies, his healing and seen him after his death, and understood that he was the Son of God why did they willingly go to their deaths fo the sake of a message they knew to be false? We need to seriously reconsider the context in which the gospels were written.

Mr Dawkins needs the God he is attacking, and for his own sake I hope he meets him soon.

Richard Dawkins - I'm praying for you x

Acrid Shark Wind

I have been an atheist all my adult life, that human knowledge is limited is an idea I find obvious and undeniable.

I find my self in agreement with pretty much everything Dawkins has ever said. And yet, he does leave me feeling uncomforable that his view of humanity is somehow incomplete. Most of this is probably just an ingrained habit of politness that restains me from critisising peoples deeply held personal beliefs, but I have also come to realise that we cannot understand people without appreciating that we have an inate desire to belive. We must understand this all too human frailty - rather than simply railing against it.

Being an atheist is not easy and even after many years I still hear the siren call of comforting certainty. The world needs people like Dawkins to remind us of our limits and to accept them.

To paraphrase the author in question.

"There are two ways in which scripture might be a source of morals or rules for living. One is by direct instruction, for example through the media (TV, radio, books, internet and the like). The other is by example: God, or some other identifiable character, might serve as - to use the contemporary jargon - a role model or icon. Both routes, if followed through religiously (the adverb is used in its metaphoric sense but with an eye to its origin), encourage a system of morals which any civilized modern person, whether religious or not, would find - I can put it no more gently - obnoxious."

Which leads me neatly to the question what kind of fundamentalism Professor Dawkins is espousing himself? My personal faith in scientific principles of observation and open-minded interpretation have been soundly shattered. Perhaps before those of different world views and cultural upbringing launch the next war of extermination they consider that like other religions science is a broad-church and our more zealous extremes do not really demonstrate the core prinicples by which we operate.

How nice to hear someone saying what I've been saying for years.

The trouble was that when I was saying it Paxman never asked to interview me.

I could have told him all that years and years ago.

Ref: Comment 277

Don't forget that God Loves You Too :o)

Well, beleiving in a god or gods is so illogical one has to remember that the only way it survives is because we have to brainwash children in order to perpetuate it.

One can realise how sensible or irrational each of these gods are by asking why is it if god was such all knowing, why then did he not produce a video of himself and some of his powers thousands of yrs ago rather than send us one guy in a beard in Israel, another from Nazareth and or one guy who lived in the desert near Mecca?

Moreover you can tell god is not all embracing by realising that each god' is strangely focused on a particulat area of the planet, and if he was all powerful he would surely have told us which version of god was his or her or it's 'genuine authentic article' one by NOW, surley?

Sadly one might as well claim one believes in fairies at the bottom of your garden, such is the paucity of evidence for each of these religion's gods.

We are getting to the point now where those of us who believe in humanity in preference to these falsehood beliefs know we will be attacked and or in many instances killed for refusing to beleive in their version of fairies at the bottom of the garden.

Religious idolatry is as dangerous as political fanaticism of the Far Left and Far Right (and many shades in between) which are not backed up by science and quality education

There is nothing wrong with believing in God, nor in any religion, yet I do not know of any religion that asks for people to be killed in it's name, apart from Satanism that is, and I'm not 100% sure of that.

So why do so many extremists want to kill in the name of their God?

If their God is omnipotent, as most seem to be, why do they need anyone's help in killing those that offend them?

Is there a God? If not, we should thank Professor Dawkins for putting the case so clearly. If there is a God, why get upset about Professor Dawkins? God will see he gets a BIG surprise!

To all those who keep posting that Prof Hawkins contradicted himself by saying 'I dont believe we were put here to be comfortable'. You are completely missing the point.

One day the universe may well be worked out. Who knows, it may turn out to be a bloke with a white beard running things afterall (it does make me laugh how the western world portrays him as 'one of us' ha ha).

His point is that the more we find out and understand, the less likely that scenario is. Sorry folks, but them's the facts.

He stands for truth and logic, and it is science that strives to understand. Religion says it has the answers already and therefore rejects all aims to uncover the truth if it differs from 'theirs'.

Thats ok for simpletons, but not for a sophisticated society.

Well done Richard Dawkins. A sensible voice in a world full of misguided looneys.

Good God. What some people will do to make a living.

The interview was a breath of fresh air.
The bible.. why would anyone take any notice let alone form a religon around a book written thousands of years ago by people who knew the world to be flat.

I am quite literally wetting my pants with laughter reading the repeated comments from various posters picking up on the "... we weren't put here to be comfortable." line.

Prof Dawkins has had a lot of practise wording things in ways that the ignorant can understand, so it is not surprising that they immediately go for the juglar while the irony passes effortlessly over their heads.

Go read some popular science books that are a little bit more up to date than a 2000+ year old text.

My question is this, were all the people born prior to the life of the Prophet Mohammed infidels because the Koran had not been written at that time and therefore they could not of lived by its doctrine?

why didnt Newsnight have someone like Prof. Alistair McGrath interview Dawkins? he is the only person to match and beat Dawkins in both a scientific and theological argument. further, since when did newsnight promote one form of extremism (nothing in any of Dawkins books can actually be described as more than a hissy fit against religion, lacking clear and qualitative argumentation) against another?
Gary

I am actually saddened to read an awful lot of people's opinions on this book, and on life in general.

Dawkins asks why God would be interested in us. Well, why wouldn't he be? How much must you hate yourself to make such a statement? I can actually feel the fear, the self-loathing and the hoplessness of many people who have commented here in that same way.

I pray for you all, because faith is not a bad thing and those who can't disassociate "faith" from "religion" are poor indeed. Religions kill, faith makes lives better.

I am dumbfounded by the number of posts on the page that illustrate that society is still full of people who believe in the tooth fairy, ghosts, Father Christmas and the monster in the cupboard. Many posts poke at Dawkins and say he should have a proper debate with a theologian. I am sure he would welcome the chance!

Well done to someone who actually has some guts to speak with clarity about such issues.

A fair amount has been written about Richard's last words in the interview. "I don't think we were put here to be comfortable". I find it amusing and consistent that the religious commentators among us jump to an asumption when reversing this statement. He is stating what he doesn't believe. It doesn't indicate what he does believe. His statement is not proof to say that he thinks we were put here to be uncomfortable or to say that we were put here at all.

Logic 101.

I would also recommend Alistair McGrath's book, "Dawkin's God" as balance to the discussion. McGrath is Professor of historical theology at Oxford University with a PhD in molecular biophysics so well able to debate with Dawkins. From what little I know the scientific community no longer takes Dawkins seriously. His scientific theories are so embarrassingly flawed that I'm amazed that he's got as far as he has. I understand he refuses a public debate with McGrath, I wonder why? It would only be reasonable to add McGrath's book to Newsnight's library in order to add balance.

This whole issue of God and the disputes between different religions boils down to just one sentence. "Who has got the best imaginary friend".

I believe that Professsor Dawkins really does need our prayers because where he's going he'll need all the help he can get!
Christians have always been easy targets for anyone with half baked and offensive ideas because we tend not to respond with violence. Could I suggest that the good professor now directs his campaign of enlightenment towards the world of Islam as they do claim, after all, to worship the same God?

To all the participating carthesians, i.e., the ones who believe that if the idea of god exists in our minds therefore god has to exist, I recommend an excellent book by an excellent scientist, Lewis Wolpert: "Six impossible things before breakfast: the evolutionary origins of belief".

To the ones that introduced 'Creationism' or 'Intelligent designs' to the debate, allow me to say that Science is a process depending on the power of its questions and not, like the doctrines above, on the confort of its answers.

please write the 'Dawkins Delusion' book, it will be a good read against the junk he is constantly spouting, i recommend you all read 'Dawkins God: Genes, Memes and the meaning of Life' by Alistair McGrath, a prof of theology with a PHD in science

When I look at my baby son, and see the way he learns to act and move, my heart yearns with love; and I perceive a Good Creator.

When I hear about someone's own baby being deformed or dying, then I am saddened; and perceive the evil in the world.

In contemplating the evil that robs, kills, and maims, I hope with longing that Good will prevail.

Indeed, Athiesm for all its rational argument cannot provide these: Wonder, Hope, and Love. Without these, we are left with a cruel and bleak world to scratch a meaningless existance from.

People who claim Science has disproved God have FUNDAMENTALLY misunderstood the two things i hold most dear: Science and God!

Science is a wonderful thing that allows us to understand our physical world with new eyes. However, science can never prove or disprove anything, only suggest a likely physical reality. Science can never measure a God who exists outside of our reality and cannot be defined in our terms.

I also agree however that organised religion has lead to a great deal of evil in our world... and i completely sympathise with all those who despair of what religious extremism is bringing to the world. Most of what people claim is "God-inspired" is human inspired. However, atheists attacking people for their religious beliefs is just as bad as religious people persecuting other religions or atheists.

Let's take this in context. Mr Dawkins is a well known atheist. But his problem here seems to be with religion and its interpretations and not necessary God himself (he can hardly criticise a being he does not believe in). Please bear in mind that faith should not just be based on books and religious dogma but a real experience of God. If more people read some of our religious texts properly, the world would actually be a better place to live. "Love your neighbour as yourself". I agree that religion can be dangerous. God and the love he asks us to show is not.

Dawkins defence that he was merely pursuing truth seemed to stray into bigotry when he stated that miracles were nonsense. This is contradictory with his statement that a scientist can never say God does not exist. It would have been more 'truthful' to say that he was only following the beliefs or conclusions the evidence had led him to. Certainly his position is not incontrovertable when it comes to substantive claims about ancient history, religion and sociology considering his expertise is biology. It seems that his argument is not really about truth.

I'm all for a debate about truth and the inherent evils of religion and society in general, particularly as a Christian who claims to follow the truth itself, but I don't think Dawkins contribution is ultimately very constructive.

Great! I am such a fan of the author! Great book! It should be on the summer reading lists in schools! Fantastic job!

The problem here is that people are confusing the issues. You cannot compare science (reason and rationality) with religion (the home of the confused, the nebulous and the medieval).

So much is done in the name of religion, but the idea that science produces the same evils is utterly without perspective - science has moved on more in the last 50 years than in the last 500, due to the fact that it can be proven or unproven - religion has by and large remained unchanged for hundreds of years.

What should be the focus here is that religion is utterly un-provable. The very fact that the American extremist Anne Coulter rages against the "agents of reason" proves my point; reason is by its very nature a good thing - to say it is godless is true as there is no empirical reason to believe in a god - but to present this as evil is simply irrational.

There is no need to eradicate religion from society, as it gives support and help to so many, but to replace science with the teachings of a confused and jumbled book that could have been written any time in the last 2000 years is selfish and shortsighted in the extreme.

We should be going through a Golden Age - a global economy, higher levels of wealth and living standards in the west, and technological and scientific progress unthought of 20 years ago - but the actions of these agents of stupidity are dragging us back to the Dark Ages.

People who consider scientific evidence properly (be they Einstein, Darwin or Dawkins) generally do so to establish truths. They are usually open to debate and will accept what is proven or disproven by demonstrable scientific method, recognising each new truth which is exposed, and rejecting inadequate theories. If there was any possibility of scientific method disproving that species have evolved by gradual genetic change, then by now maybe we would all be singing in church and wondering why we’d ever doubted the bible.

People who blindly accept indoctrination, whether it be from iron age texts, parents, teachers or al-qeada are taking an easy way out. They can repeat whatever the text states – even if it seems to be goobledy-gook - their case is satisfied – they don’t need to prove or disprove anything – their beliefs are true and can’t be debated – because they were written by god – it says so in the bible, Koran or whatever. This doesn’t even amount to pseudoscience. To enter into a debate with this type of viewpoint will lead inevitably to a heated argument or the hijacking and crashing or an airliner.

It is important that the scientific community present the truth to anybody who might be potentially blinded by indoctrination. That is the only way to build a cooperative rather than confrontational global community. We are often made to feel guilty for criticising peoples religious beliefs – but to not speak the truth is to appease. To turn a blind eye to indoctrination (political or religious) in the light of current scientific knowledge is to deny reality in a manner which is retrogressive.

I take my hat off to Professer Dawkins - if only the World's political leaders would show the same moral courage to stand up for what is true then maybe the World would be a safer place.

Norman
St. Gervais-les-bains
France

Dawkins confuses faith with bigotry and religion with fundamentalism; apart from that, this looks like an interesting book.

I agree with almost everything Richard Dawkins says. My one dissension is when he said that we were not put here to be comfortable. I do not think we were put here, that would mean someone or something did it.
Darwin was right, it is a matter of evolution, not some otherworldly entity making us from whatever.
Religion has been and I think will always be the cause of wars and killings. I'm not an atheist because I think they are acknowledging a God in a reverse sort of way.

I do believe that the man known as Jesus existed, however, I think he was just another wise man, like many other so called prophets.

Being both a devout follower of Science and a devout follower of Christ, I fail to see what how the one negates the other.

Nor do I see what business it is of scientists to "Disprove the existence of God".

God and science ARE compatible with one another, and it should be the decision of the individual as to whether or not he believes in either (or both).

If Professor Dawkins doesn't believe in God then fine, but why are the media making such a big deal of it all? All that will happen is Atheists will say "I told you so" and Christians (and other followers of God and/or Christ)will criticize. Essentially all the book and its hype will do is emphasise an existing disparity that has no real resolution.

Personally, I think Professor Dawkins should stick to his own turf and write another book about the "Selfish Gene" (which, by the way, I don't believe in!).

Richard Dawkins has, in my opinion, a history of reducitonism. From his ultra-Darwinian stance with regard to genes to his attacks on Religion.
Just as arguably Evolution should not be simply reduced to biological determinism (human bodies are passive entities at the mercy of self replicating genes), the violent actions of religious men and women should not simply be reduced to their religious belief. Is for example the violence of George Bush and Tony Blair reduced to their religious believes or are there other reasons - imperial and economic interests?
Why for example are there examples of suicide bombers in Palestine who did not hold any religious beliefs. Are there not environmental, psychological, economic, social factors that inform peoples actions?
Isn't much of the anti imperialism in the middle east, rather than simply a religious attitude of justice, an example of a budgeoning capitalist class seeking greater autonomy - currently being held back by foreign invasion and economic strangulation?
Although I'm horrified by for example attempts of creationists to posit their beliefs into a psuedo scientific framework - Dawkins for me always comes across as fundamentalist in his own right.
Andrew

P.S. Those who argue that evolution is just a theory on this thread. Stephen Jay Gould says Evolution is a fact - Humans did evolve from apes etc. Darwinism (eg his theory of Natural Selection) is a theory in that it is a way of explaining how evolution works. Similarly Gravity is a fact - it doesn't matter that Einstein made Newtons caluclations incorrect.

Lets hope others will be more forthcoming, with being more assertive in their own believes if given the chance. It's terribly brainwashing bringing up children to enforce them into your own believes. How many of your 'god believers' can honestly say that you let your children exlore all theories of god/jesus and our planet, and stand by their differ opinion to yours. My children have been on their school bus whereby fellow students have learned that my kids do not go to church, and their reaction is of 'how alien', "what do you mean you don't go to church?" This says it all to me.... they children have been brought up in a family that have not been open minded.... have not let the children make their own opinions.... or encouraged their child to explore the different reglions that are out there. It should be acceptable to debate this issue within your family, and to accept the childs differ opinion. I also find that because families enforce their children to follow their parents relion, these families are quite often the ones that are the most judgemental, unforgiving, delusional characters. I did go to my friends church with my young children to give them some exposure of different relions, but when the pastor quotes "non believers are evil" I'm like 'RELION IS NOTHING OTHER THAN BRAINWASHING'. This god thing is destructive to our future.

I've read the excerpts from the book and will be listening to the interview later. I'll probably go and buy the book too. However, I've been most struck by the reaction of those people who believe in a god (small "g" intentional) Their reactions range from anger to pity for us committed non-believers. Also, the concern of one contributor that a fatwa might be put on the author really saddens me. It saddens me because we know that this sort of thing happens.

The fact that so many people still cling on to faith as a moral insurance policy saddens me too. It also angers me that religion is still used as a method of opression and control.

Dawkins has raised a point that has been screaming to be heard above the histeria of the religious & politically correct.

I agree with those who say that if it wasn't religion that is so divisive it would be something else, such as colour, social status, etc. Unfortunately, it seems that religion is currently the main reason for divisions and intolerance in the world today. I consider the major, if the not the only, important problems to be addressed to be education and up-bringing.

Here in Europe, as across the world, we have many instances of divisions in society due to superficial, or even contrived, differences, but better education and integration soon reveals that we are all the same and that there's no reason to be at each other's throats. One particular example that I find amusing, though admittedly it's mainly fueled by alcohol, is the nationalistic behaviour between English (not British) and Germain so-called football supporters - a little research into anglo-saxon history proves that the English (whoever they are) are in fact decended in part from the German invaders after the Romans left (not to mention Norwegian vikings, Danish vikings, the Italians obviously, and of course Duke William's Danish-French vikings).

So what's the point I'm making? I've said it already: education. Education, which yields proof, which one hopes leads to understanding, which in turn allows for civilized living. We have a long way to go, though, as humanity is still so obviously immature. But better education that concentrates on what we have in common, and that which is real and provable, can only be for the better for humans and, indeed, all other life on this planet.

Dorkins says that we can never disprove god, and at the same time says that Science disproves it. He also believes anyone who thinks differently is stupid. We need to respect those who think differently to us, and not call them “stupid” or say they are deluded.
There are hundreds of better books by atheists and agnostics, I would not recommend this one.

I am amazed at the number of people who think we would be any better off without religion. I personally think things would be much worse.

He quotes extremists, and gives the impression that everyone who has faith is dangerous. It's like saying that all atheists are evil and intolerant because of Hitler, Stalin, and all the others who wanted to stamp out religion.
Arguments based on extreame example can be very week indeed.

Faith can be real, and isn't necessarily science but along side it.
Science is the "hows?" of life and faith is the "whys?"

I find the arguments of Richard Dorkins full of contradiction, confusion, and even writen with hatred in places- which I actually find quite worrying.

This sounds rather like All in the Mind: A Farewell to God by Ludovic Kennedy, another book questioning our unquestioning beliefs in Christianity as a nation.

For a European, Dawkins' views are so orthodox that they would be downright boring if they were not expressed in such a vigorous and amusing style. Dawkins' book is secular Europe "preaching" to the rest of the world.

The secularity of Europe is in my view linked to the breakdown of society here. Religion is one of the kinds of glue that holds a society together and gives it identity. Europeans are increasingly asocial and nihilistic while those elsewhere have stronger societies but with a tendency for the social glue to be too strong and spill over into bigotry and fanaticism. As a European I prefer our way, but I can see the attractions of the other way.

In this context, I think Dawkins gets it wrong about the motivations of the British suicide bombers. In my view, it is not going to heaven that motivated them. They did not read the Koran all alone then become terrorists. Rather, they were persuaded by preachers that they belonged to a specific community (the worldwide Islamic community) and that that community was at war with all other communities (Christian and secular). In their view, sacrificing themselves, their families and the UK Islamic community for the interest of the perceived good of the worldwide Islamic community was worthwhile. I doubt that the text of the Koran had much to do with it.

Great book, but it should have been written in a simpler language without long words. Then perhaps the dim-witted and misguided people who feel the need for religion to fulfil their lives might just understand it!

Up the page a bit, Han wrote this: "I was really saddened to hear the interview with Richard Dawkins. I am a Christian, and cannot see how people can look at the mountains, rivers and even at the human body and not see God at work in things so complex."

Would this be the same God that built this planet on tectonic plates and caused the deaths of 200,000 people a couple of years ago?

Professor Richard Dawkins is a Human Being 10,000 years ahead of his time. His work is for the logical people of modern times who are fed up of all the divisive thinking of followers of fall 3 Major Religions in our World today.
The Principles, or the Bases of all 3 Religions are in no doubt noble, honest,'holy', and reverent,but unfortunately they were designed for Earthly People as some Social,Ethical,and Spiritual framework had had to be put in place
in order to create a Civil,Fair,Decent Societies to which all Humankind can belong,and within which all Humankind can Survive in harmony between each of these varying societies. But,for the past 2,500 years,from Judaism to Islam,people followed these Religions and twisted their Principles using Political Idiologies in order to control the 'thinking' of their own People.
Moses,Jesus,and Mohamad were HONOURABLE thinkers with most profound HONOURABLE intentions.It is their followers that twisted and turned these Religious Principles to divide our World,and not to Unite our World. And,when from impirical evidence,I,now at 61 years of age,have come to the conclusions that Professor Richard Dawkins has expressed so eloquently and coherently in his latest book. I was born a Muslim,but since I read all of Arthur C. Clarke's works from "2002 Space Odyssey" to his Finalworks on the same theme,"3001 The Final Odyssey",I became aware of 'logical' thinking as 'spiritual' thinking had left me confused;Conflicts between,Jews,Christians,and Muslims, where People always referred to their Religion for justification of their 'divisive' Political stance whenever there was a conflict,always sent me on a wild goose chase looking for that 'needle-in-the-haystack' principle that we call the 'Brotherhood of Man', and which principle each Prophet had advocated.Of course,only recently,or in the past decate or so,I searched for the 'Brotherhood of Man' principle in : BOSNIA,KROACIA,MIDDLE EAST,INDONESIA,SUDAN,ETC. AND couldn't find a single evidence to prove to me that God did exist and that he moderated his People's thinking when dealing with one another.All I can hear now are slogans:"Imperialist America","Muslim Terrorists","Evil Zionit Regime",etc.,just to name a few of the accusations that each Major Religion,and in the name of their God,seem to hurle at one another.At this Juncture,I find myself standing on the side of 'LOGIC',and totally divorced from Human-interpretation of 'Spiritualism'. Hence,if I was to be given the real choice between the belief of Richard Dawkins' work,and the combined works of the 3 Major Religions,I will , without any hesitation, embrace the principles of a Richard Dawkins, THE FOURTH MAJOR RELIGION.

Z M TOURMOCHE

Some of the most closed and murderous societies are those that chose to reject any belief in any God - Russia, China and North. Freedom and democracy and progress can be traced back to groups of people who chose the path of faith.

I'm amazed by the extracts I've read of this book and amazed at the majority of the comments on this message board too. This book demonstrates GCSE-level understanding couched in educated terms. It is far removed from a scholarly, measured, reasonable approach to the subject. Dawkins rants his own opinions with absolutely no attempt to make a coherant argument or produce intelligent evidence. He relies on the extreme fringes of Christinaity and Islam to back up his position - he completely ignores the majority of religious people who live law-abiding and loving lives.

Blind atheism is surely no better than blind faith, Richard.

Finally, someone with a grain of sense and not ashamed to speak about it.

He puts all my feelings about this subject into perfect logical understanding. I would not be clever enough to stand up against the God People and argue these points in such a rational and calm way without getting emotianally clogged up.

Love it.

AMB

Richard Dawkins should be commended. It is refreshing to see the reasoned views held by many presented in such an articulate and considered manner. People such as this, who believe that this life is the only one we can count on, should have more influence in government, rather than people who think that we can sacrifice everything and have another go. His Channel 4 programme was superb and I was saddened by the complete lack of advertising in the breaks - surely us interested parties, religious or not, are a market worth targeting? Or is this an obvious example of the threatening intolerance held by some religious groups?

I would go further than Dawkins in saying that people who believe in god are ignorant beyond all logical comprehension. To all those responding with pity or anger to his entirely intelligent and reasonable propositions: Don't pity atheists, we are the real future of decent humanity. I for one pity the fact that you have willingly exchanged your intellectual freedom for repellant dogma.
I also believe that atheists are inherrently better people than theists because I treat people with respect and kindness DESPITE the fact that I know any malfeasance would go unpunished. Your "virtue" is only achieved through the fear or bribery of some sort of afterlife or supernatural slap on the wrist. You have my sympathies!