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Betsan Powys | 12:51 UK time, Wednesday, 31 March 2010

So there we have it - the list of the Celtic bloc's demands in return for their support if there's a hung parliament.

Why the fanfare? Because having been asked over the years why anyone would bother voting for them in a General Election they can't possibly win, Plaid and their friends north of the border find an answer this time round. Neither Alex Salmond nor Ieuan Wyn Jones can walk into Downing Street when all the votes are counted but in a hung parliament, they could pocket big concessions for Scotland and for Wales.

Bingo: a weak position turned into a coherent one, even one of relative strength argue Plaid.

A "pathetic" attempt to disguise their irrelevance, say the other parties.

Snazzy title? This being Plaid, then yes of course. "4 Wales, 4 Scotland" is the agreement signed in Westminster this morning. Colleagues up in Glasgow tell me Wales gets the first mention in the flyer they were sent too just in case you were wondering how these niceties work.

Detail? Short.

The pledges read like this: fair funding for Wales and Scotland, protecting local services and the most vulnerable, action to help the green economy and support for business growth.

The other detail, that neither Plaid nor the SNP would enter into a formal coalition. Their hope is, clearly, that they will be called upon to offer their support on a vote by vote basis. In other words if the maths dictates that that you really need our support in a vote of no confidendence, or to get your budget throught, you'll have it ... as long as we get something in return. In crude terms they've calculated that it's more profitable to work on an a la carte basis and surely a much easier political sell to their own party. Close but not too close.

Practical, grown-up politics, say Plaid.

A "sad spectacle" of a party clinging desperately to the coat-tails of the SNP, say Labour whose response is particularly vitriolic.

Note the interesting use language too. Plaid are not talking about a parliament that is 'hung', rather one that is 'balanced'. Why, I heard the party's Director of Elections Helen Mary Jones asking the other day, is the language surrounding agreements between parties so macho and unpleasant? It's all about 'getting into bed with' or 'cosying up to' another, larger party. A 'hung' parliament sounds stymied, hamstrung, not able to get on with anything. A 'balanced' one sounds quite different.

The other major parties have come up with choice words of their own: "a joke", "deluded", "separatist" to name a few.

Will either Gordon Brown or David Cameron come knocking? Haven't there been signs that Mr Cameron, in particular, would rather look to parties in Northern Ireland, or, of course, to a deal with the Lib Dems?

Remind me to buy new batteries for the office calculator.

Comments

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  • 1. At 2:17pm on 31 Mar 2010, comeoffit wrote:

    "Celtic Bloc"?

    BBC Cymru coining elitist, politico phrases that are of no relevance to the vast majority of us that live here? Well I never

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  • 2. At 2:44pm on 31 Mar 2010, John wrote:


    ... to consider any form of alliance with the nationalists would be delusional.

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  • 3. At 3:12pm on 31 Mar 2010, Benedek wrote:

    All Salmond and the Welsh Nationalists have achieved is to point out what a nightmare for the UK any hung Parliament which relied on the the nationalists would be.Their demands would make it even harder for the UK to recover. In fact it could lead to a major financial crisis as international money markets decide that whoever is in government is not serious about dealing with the deficit.In these circumstances UK budgets over the next few years would be written by the IMF. Both major parties should use today's announcement by Salmond in the marginal constituencies in England to show voters that the last thing that the UK needs is a Scottish fantasist and a country solicitor from North Wales dictating UK economic policy. It's also about time that the Labour party in Wales realised that it is part of a UK party and stopped this charade in the Bay with a group of politicians whose long term aim is to destroy the Labour Party as a political force in Wales.

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  • 4. At 3:13pm on 31 Mar 2010, lionelair wrote:

    "friends north of the border " - I didn't realise Wales had a border with Scotland Betsan. Is it somewhere around the top of Anglesey perhaps?

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  • 5. At 4:17pm on 31 Mar 2010, Freeman wrote:

    "Vote for us. We can do a DUP."
    I have to admit...that is probably the best line they could take in a General Election.

    "4 Wales, 4 Scotland"?
    There is a special circle of Hell reserved for those who use numbers as words. However I am not sure if the one politicians takes priority. ^^

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  • 6. At 5:00pm on 31 Mar 2010, Gwyrangon wrote:

    A well hung parliament is becoming more and more attractive as the SNP and Plaid set out their joint stall.

    While I can well understand that the English parties and Unionists everywhere are becoming fearful of the possibility, I would like Benedek to explain how Labour and Conservatives can use the prospect to persuade voters in English marginals to deliver a decisive result.

    If the two parties are equally persuasive then surely we are more likely to see a hung parliament? So does Benedek expect one of them to give the other a free run in English marginals simply to avoid a hung parliament?

    I'm genuinely perplexed as to how, in a democracy, with a (relatively) free press and a secret ballot, an undesirable (to some) outcome can ever be avoided. Were it possible then we would not be living in a democracy.

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  • 7. At 6:35pm on 31 Mar 2010, Bryn_Teilo wrote:

    The SNP and Plaid finally made it into the EBC's 6 o'clock news bulletin, at 23 minutes past six, for thirty seconds, just before a longer item about Wayne Rooney followed by something about a London Olympic tower of rusty old iron. Salmond managed to get a few words in. but IWJ was ignored.

    UKIP's leader was given greater prominence in an interview much earlier in the bulletin.

    Beween them, the SNP and Plaid are contesting all the seats in Scotland and Wales. There is always the possibility that either party (or both) can get a majority of the seats in their respective nations, which would undoubtedly lead to self-determination. This fact is ignored by the BBC - deliberately, as its in the pocket of the unionists.

    It really isn't good enough. It isn't democratic. We pay our licence fees here in Wales. Its a compulsory tax. Big changes are needed in broadcasting in the UK.

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  • 8. At 6:38pm on 31 Mar 2010, TellingmewhatIknowalready wrote:

    1. Good spot,but its what BBC CYMRU in their "dreams" would love to come about in the future,and a working quietly to persuade people that us "celts" have more in common,than the "hated" english.The idea that any english politician could "survive" on the basis of more funding of hard pressed english peoples taxation,to fund the "fantasy" world of NATS is surly a joke,and a bad one to boot. The real "intention" of the NATS was always to make a nuisance of themselves to the english in the hope that they would get fed up with the union and dissolve it themselves,rather than the celts winning independence in their own regions. I've said before and re-state it that there should be full and impartial (not welsh)investigation/report into the political stances taken by BBC CYMRU and the hugely over staffing of welsh speakers in their english language political department. As an example why do BBC CYMRU always refer in morning to LONDON papers,rather than just giving their titles. It comes as an unpleasant shock to them that LONDON is our capital city,and not caerdydd which is only the administrative centre for the welsh speaking elite who are doing very well thank you!!!Come on UKIP.

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  • 9. At 7:29pm on 31 Mar 2010, Jiffy wrote:

    Re: 8

    "I've said before and re-state it that there should be full and impartial (not welsh)investigation/report into the political stances taken by BBC CYMRU and the hugely over staffing of welsh speakers in their english language political department"

    Have you been turned down for a job there or something!? Being able to speak Welsh in Wales is - believe or not - quite a valuable skill to have. Given that the BBC are in the business of communication - in both languages - being able to speak English and Welsh would be quite an advantage. Quite straight forward. No great conspiracy.

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  • 10. At 7:32pm on 31 Mar 2010, Bryn_Teilo wrote:

    #8

    London is the capital city of England and of the UK, as a nation state. It is not the capital of Wales.

    Cardiff was proclaimed the de facto capital of Wales in 1955. In that year, the Minister for Welsh Affairs Gwilym Lloyd-George commented in a Parliamentary written answer that "no formal measures are necessary to give effect to this decision". (Wiki)

    Cardiff is the youngest capital city in Europe.

    If you don't get your facts right, it undermines everything you say, including what might be valid arguments. So it pays to get things right.

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  • 11. At 01:05am on 01 Apr 2010, ThatOldChestnut wrote:

    "Being able to speak Welsh in Wales is - believe or not - quite a valuable skill to have." Actually, it rather depends where you live in Wales. Most of us never hear a word. Though I have to admit that I watch the "West news", as any news story about the WAG is always bad for my blood pressure!
    I've never understood the fuss about pushing the lingo. Certainly couldn't see the benefit. Isn't a language for communication? A tool. Let people learn it (and speak it) if they want to. Help them learn it if they want to. But please stop the arm-twisting legislation. Employ people because they are suited /qualified for the job, not because they speak Welsh. I'm getting ready to get down off my horse now!

    I only speak it in very restricted circles, as I detest the use of it as a badge of superiority. So if I'm in a genuine Welsh-speaking area I will.

    On a more personal note, it was quite funny when the "I'm more Welsh than you because I speak the lingo" brigade found-out I speak Welsh, and have understood all the snide remarks for the last two years! :-)

    Definately down off horse!

    "Given that the BBC are in the business of communication - in both languages - being able to speak English and Welsh would be quite an advantage...." If the BBC have found a large number of fluent Welsh speakers who communicate well in English too, then well done to them! Realistically, I doubt that is the case! People who are really good communicators in one language are rare, and those who communicate well in more than one language are rarer still.

    Probably we shouldn't get too hung-up about this language thing...there are thousands of well-qualified people doing the most miserable jobs for peanuts, just to get the opportunity to learn English, and those of us who can speak Welsh would do well to remember that and be glad that we can speak Welsh too. Particularly as my Dadcu said it is the language of heaven.

    P.S. Please forgive any spelling or grammer mistakes, as my first language is Welsh.

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  • 12. At 08:57am on 01 Apr 2010, alfsplace1986 wrote:

    11. ThatOldChestnut

    lin·go1   /ˈlɪŋgoʊ/ Show Spelled[ling-goh] Show IPA
    –noun,plural-goes.
    1.the language and speech, esp. the jargon, slang, or argot, of a particular field, group, or individual: gamblers' lingo.
    2.language or speech, esp. if strange or foreign.

    I am sorry but I find your comment quite confusing you state Welsh is your first language yet you refer to it as 'lingo' which is explained above as strange and foreign or slang, odd.

    There are a great many Welsh speaking individuals who are completely able to communicate fluently in more than one language. Where you get that notion from I don't know.

    What is your definition of communicating the language any way. Is it the language of the Bible in Welsh or Shakespeare and Chaucer in English. Or perhaps the American language that every body seems to speak today. Such as the word Paytriot instead of Patriot, Hi instead of hello.

    Oh dear, there is ThatOldChestnut again, On a more personal note, it was quite funny when the "I'm more Welsh than you because I speak the lingo" brigade found-out I speak Welsh, and have understood all the snide remarks for the last two years! :-).

    Though we shouldn't get hung up on it we should thank our betters and be glad we are able to speak Welsh. But only when it doesn't make us feel inferior.

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  • 13. At 09:32am on 01 Apr 2010, John wrote:



    Momentous news!

    WAG gets fishy ............

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  • 14. At 09:52am on 01 Apr 2010, alfsplace1986 wrote:

    13. Stonemason

    Momentous news!

    Horray! more powers for Wales

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  • 15. At 10:00am on 01 Apr 2010, Bryn_Teilo wrote:

    #12 re #11

    I agree with you, there is something definitely 'strange' about #11's comment.

    The style of writing reminds me of someone else who contributes to this blog, and who most definitely, by his/her own admission, doesn't speak Welsh.

    He/She can easily demonstrate his/her written skills to us in his/her 'first language' by making a contribution to Vaughan Roderick's blog using the same nickname. His/her standard of Welsh should be higher than his/her standard if English.

    I very much doubt if we will see that happening. If he/she complies, I will be the first to apologise for doubting the genuineness of the comment. I suspect it actually is an 'old chestnut'.

    #3 Benedek wrote:

    'the last thing that the UK needs is a Scottish fantasist and a country solicitor from North Wales dictating UK economic policy..'

    We aready have a couple of Scottish fantastists dictating UK economic policy. In a month or two we might have a couple highly privileged English millionaire tory toffs doing the same.

    It was a country solicitor from North Wales who created the basis for today's welfare state when Chancellor of the Exchequer - David Lloyd George

    As for nightmares, we're already in one. Its quite likely that the IMF will be called in by the autumn, as the UK's economy is in a parlous state. They've run out of ideas. Printing money hasn't worked... sterling has fallen against the dollar and the euro. Prices of imports, especially fuel, are rising. Manufacturing is declining. Infrastructure is crumbling. The recovery is fragile, if it exists at all - and you want to blame it on the SNP and Plaid. Get real, neither have had any part to play in the mess we're in.

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  • 16. At 10:12am on 01 Apr 2010, Jiffy wrote:

    Re 11: "If the BBC have found a large number of fluent Welsh speakers who communicate well in English too, then well done to them. Realistically, I doubt that is the case! People who are really good communicators in one language are rare, and those who communicate well in more than one language are rarer still. "

    I've had to re-read this sentence several times to make sure that I understand it correctly. Maybe its because my first language is Welsh and I'm struggling with the English.

    You seem to suggest that Welsh speakers - who can also communicate well in English - are few and far between.

    Fair play I've read a lot of tosh on this forum but that statement is up there with the best/worst of them

    dear me...

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  • 17. At 10:13am on 01 Apr 2010, TellingmewhatIknowalready wrote:

    11. I've never heard such sense from a "welsh speaker",and can only presume it has something to do with 1st. April 2010. HA HA.Never mind if I'm right you gor ALF good and proper,but plainly he's very earnest and has'nt got a sense of humour.10. Bryn and in the spirity of goodwill on this weekend thanks for the lesson. Am I to take it that LONDON is the capital of England and UK,but not Wales as we have our own capital city,that is CAERDYDD. Well I must have missed the removal of wales from UK (silly me).It's as I thought that Cardiff is the capital city of wales for the limited purposes that wales has,whereas the real CAPITAL is LONDON,wherein lives our Queen and first and only important Government,which takes the really fundamental decisions that affect the lives of all people living in this country,the UK that is!!. I am still of the opinion that the "purpose" of the BBC CYMRU announcers/commentators in referring to LONDON newspapers/olympics etc etc is to try and create an impression amongst the guillible that wales is somehow seperate from the role that LONDON has in our lives. The only thing that those type of people is the wealth that the City of London creates and passes to us so we can enjoy our current lifestyles,including cheap flights from Cardiff to the small island in north wales,for the few and not the many!!

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  • 18. At 10:53am on 01 Apr 2010, FoDafydd wrote:

    Re 17

    I don't know if you're for real, a joke or just a parody of yourself - but you are, most certainly, something else! Is the strange English that you write a deliberate ploy just to plant that seed of uncertainty in our minds?

    But as you say, it is the 1st of April!

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  • 19. At 10:58am on 01 Apr 2010, alfsplace1986 wrote:

    17. TellingmewhatIknowalready

    If that is the case then I take it gracefuly on the chin.
    Even though I have put those childish antics behind myself some years ago.

    If I have been taken in by those antics and I am regarded as a fool.
    Then all I can say in reply is 'It takes one to know one'.

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  • 20. At 11:45am on 01 Apr 2010, Ju5t1nD wrote:

    #17 Surely, the BBC refer to the Olympics as the "London Olympics" in the spirit of Accuracy. London was awarded the Olympic games, not England or Britain or any other entity. Which is why they are having to construct mountains close to the city rather than using any of the other mountains available in Britain for their mountain biking competitions, for instance.

    The same could be said of the "London" papers. They are based in or around London, as opposed to other press which is based elsewhere. it is difficult to talk of "National" press in a Nation such as Britain which comprises of smaller Nations. The difficulty is compounded by the numerical imbalance - one Nation is far greater than the others - that leads to mostly English news being included in the "London" papers, notably in devolved areas of government, and sport. I'm not sure what other epithet you would choose for the London papers, but I think you'll struggle to find one more factually accurate.

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  • 21. At 1:01pm on 01 Apr 2010, TellingmewhatIknowalready wrote:

    20. The "bid" for the olympics to be held in the UK,was put together by the British Olympic Association which is our representative in the world wide Olympics movement. They had tried several times to get games back to these shores,and according their website told that only LONDON had any chance of success. The games are based in LONDON but it is the British Olympic Association games. I take your point about London papers,however I still feel it is part of BBC CYMRU (or part of it) to seperate wales from UK. I would hazard a guess that all the major LONDON papers vastly oversell the WELSH papers as particularly the Western Mail is basically a rugby magazine,with add on bits.

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  • 22. At 1:19pm on 01 Apr 2010, Glyndo wrote:

    @10

    Can we please stop using the old "Cardiff is the youngest capital in Europe" I am sure that the people living in the capitals of Slovakia, Slovenia, Mecedonia, et al would be ammused at this completely bogus claim

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  • 23. At 2:21pm on 01 Apr 2010, Crossroads wrote:

    3. At 3:12pm on 31 Mar 2010, Benedek wrote:

    QUOTE
    All Salmond and the Welsh Nationalists have achieved is to point out what a nightmare for the UK any hung Parliament which relied on the the nationalists would be.Their demands would make it even harder for the UK to recover. In fact it could lead to a major financial crisis as international money markets decide that whoever is in government is not serious about dealing with the deficit.In these circumstances UK budgets over the next few years would be written by the IMF. Both major parties should use today's announcement by Salmond in the marginal constituencies in England to show voters that the last thing that the UK needs is a Scottish fantasist and a country solicitor from North Wales dictating UK economic policy. It's also about time that the Labour party in Wales realised that it is part of a UK party and stopped this charade in the Bay with a group of politicians whose long term aim is to destroy the Labour Party as a political force in Wales.
    END QUOTE

    What an excellent post Benedek.

    A welcome touch of realism in a morass of party organised, Plaidian activist propaganda.




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  • 24. At 3:29pm on 01 Apr 2010, CA Jones wrote:

    Re: 3

    What's wrong with "a country solicitor from North Wales dictating UK economic policy."

    After all that's what Lloyd George did as Chancellor from 1908 - 1916.

    Did a good job as well:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/historic_figures/george_david_lloyd.shtml

    You need to study your history before issuing any more pompous & fatuous put-downs Benedek.

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  • 25. At 3:45pm on 01 Apr 2010, Ju5t1nD wrote:

    #21 I won't argue about the BBC's desire (or otherwise) to drive a wedge between Wales and England (particularly London) - I'd guess there's some interesting politics to be had in the corridors of the BBC all over Britain. The London Olympics, however, even say "London" in their logo, and a brief Google search for "Olympics 2012" will pull up the website "London2012", the official website for the Olympic games. British Olympic Association it may be, but the games are the London Olympic Games.

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  • 26. At 3:58pm on 01 Apr 2010, FoDafydd wrote:

    Re 23

    More incestuous back-slapping, eh, Noa?!!

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  • 27. At 5:01pm on 01 Apr 2010, West-Wales wrote:

    The only time a weak government needs the support of minorities is when trying to force through controversial legislation.

    Remember Maastricht & the Lisbon Referendum, there are of course others.

    The record clearly shows, in Westminster, these minority groups do consider the wider interest of the people of Britain, or any part of Britain, despite the rhetoric they sell votes to satisfy narrow self interest.

    Their actions are damaging to the Democratic process.

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  • 28. At 6:59pm on 01 Apr 2010, Crossroads wrote:

    Well well...You'd have bet your last pound on it!

    Anyone remember "The Three Stooges"? Just look at the times they each made their posts...3.29pm...3.45pm...and 3.58pm.

    Poor old C A Jones, Ju5t1nD, and of course FoDai.

    Any doubts about them being controlled activists, surely gone out the window...Though you'd think with all their experience they'd make a better job of 'strategic posting'.

    Ah well lads, back to Camp Cymru X for a refresher course!

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  • 29. At 9:47pm on 01 Apr 2010, John wrote:


    Ju5t1nD, you wrote at #25...

    The London Olympics, however, even say "London" in their logo, and a brief Google search for "Olympics 2012" will pull up the website "London2012", the official website for the Olympic games. British Olympic Association it may be, but the games are the London Olympic Games.

    I am not sure what point you are making, the Olympic games are always "City" based ...

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  • 30. At 10:25pm on 01 Apr 2010, CA Jones wrote:

    Re: 28

    Didn't you realise good things come in threes..

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  • 31. At 09:16am on 02 Apr 2010, Ju5t1nD wrote:

    #29 Stonemason - the original comment claimed that the BBC were somehow at fault for referring to the Olympics as the London Olympics. My only point was that that is the correct title.

    Noah - thank you for making my day. Plaid Cymru's youth wing, eh? I wish...

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  • 32. At 11:36am on 02 Apr 2010, Nat_very_likely wrote:

    Evidently some people have not read Betsan's post too closely.

    Plaid and the SNP will not be joining a formal coalition with anyone but will vote in the Commons on an issue by issue basis.Minority government has worked well at Holyrood for the last three years with all parties managing to get policies through parliament.It's time Westminster joined the 20th century!

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  • 33. At 12:37pm on 02 Apr 2010, FoDafydd wrote:

    Re 31

    Oh, and me too!

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  • 34. At 1:52pm on 04 Apr 2010, Home Rule For England wrote:

    "The other detail, that neither Plaid nor the SNP would enter into a formal coalition. Their hope is, clearly, that they will be called upon to offer their support on a vote by vote basis"

    I trust PC and the SNP won't be voting on English matters? Could be very interesting if they support say Labour on British matters but keep out of English matters. Labour could have a majority on British matters but not on English matters. Confusion will reign. Bring it on! Maybe then those English people not already convinced that the UK is past its sell by date will be convinced that England should put an end to all this nonsense by declaring independence and letting the 'Celts' get on with it!

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  • 35. At 4:15pm on 04 Apr 2010, Lyn David Thomas wrote:

    Interestingly enough in one of my favourite alternative time lines, Decades of Darkness, that is exactly how Wales and Scotland become independent... google it if you would like an interesting alternative history novel.

    Plaid Cymru and the SNP tend not to vote on English only matters, unfortunately as long as we are funded via a formula that is based on expenditure in England then there will be a reason to vote on English only matters. England is a very large state - I favour regional government for England (and I did when I lived there). But I recognise that this is an issue for the English. Self determination is what its all about.

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  • 36. At 7:06pm on 04 Apr 2010, TellingmewhatIknowalready wrote:

    34. Welcome to this "blog",but please do not assume that the NATs (who most english only welsh people despise),have any real support in this little part of UK. In the working class areas they are the only opposition to the Labour "monolith",and in the welsh speaking heartlands in rural wales they are simply a cultural party trying take turn the clock back to 1520. The vast,vast majority of ordinary welsh people are perfectly happy with being part of UK (not perfect,but what created by man is??,however our media have been infiltrated by a welsh speaking"elite",who have different agenda to the rest of us ordinary people who pay their very substantial wages,and in particular taxi expenses. I said basically what you stated some weeks ago.after discussion with english relative,and you should keep up the pressure and tell the NATS where to get off. Thanks both my children and grandchildren now live in england,as wales is moving into the third world rapidly,and without your largesse paying for public services,and also the hordes of mendicants living on "welfare",with no intention of working we'd be like CUBA without the sunshine.

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  • 37. At 08:41am on 05 Apr 2010, Lyn David Thomas wrote:

    Oh dear, Home Rule for England, if you listen to some of the people here you would believe that all the media (BBC, ITV, Welsh Papers etc) are run by Nationalists and are conspiring to make Wales independent, as are the people who run the voluntary sector (because they take Welsh Government money) and are the Labour leadership in Wales. They also think that much of the Tory Party leadership in Wales are part of this conspiracy. Paranoid delusions but it doesn't stop them coming out with this rubbish. Oh and the pollsters are in on it too... fabricating results to suggest that the Welsh public are pro devolution. In fact just about everyone other than the ordinary people (defined by themselves and their handful of mates in the pub).

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  • 38. At 1:03pm on 05 Apr 2010, alfsplace1986 wrote:

    36. TellingmewhatIknowalready

    I see you are giving your full welcoming support to 'Home Rule For England'.

    Does that mean you are sharing his/her calling for independence for Wales if England gets it.




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  • 39. At 1:09pm on 05 Apr 2010, alfsplace1986 wrote:

    36. TellingmewhatIknowalready


    Thanks both my children and grandchildren now live in england,as wales is moving into the third world rapidly,

    All thanks to the UK Government then as they control the finances Wales gets.

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  • 40. At 6:26pm on 05 Apr 2010, TellingmewhatIknowalready wrote:

    38. If England wants to vote for UDI then the Scots/Welsh could go and whistle,and if I was English and with the ingratitude of welsh/scots they'd be whistling dixie before they knew it!!. The last 13 years we've had a Scot as PM with scot as CoE,followed by Scot as PM and fellow Scot as CoE. The english who fund all of us must be mad to give the "jocks" all this power over their wealth. Unfortunately we dont even register on the horizon of the english,except for the rugby great's of 70's and Ryan Giggs who plays for MANCHESTER United.

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  • 41. At 11:11am on 06 Apr 2010, sid_ts63 wrote:

    #40 TMWWIKA, "the English who fund all of us must be mad to give the "jocks" all this power over their wealth"
    hard to tell if you are being sarcastic or not but you certainly gave this "jock " a good laugh on a very very dreich day in Scotland.

    Blair being Scottish was the first wee fib he told the electorate

    and if you believe "the ingratitude of welsh/Scot's" you have been reading too many "london papers"
    Sid

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