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Tangled in the Web

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Robbo Robson | 12:13 UK time, Monday, 12 October 2009

Much like the defending on Saturday evening, the Blue Bell regulars left it to each other to find a way of watching the England match against Ukraine.

Following a lot of narked buck-passing by all and sundry, Tony Thompson organised a posse to scour the surrounding area for some sort of information technology that we night be able to plug into the telly. You've never seen so much computer hardware lugged in toa boozer before: I swear the word Amstrad appeared on more than one of them.

Cables that had apparently been cocooned in dust for a couple of decades were unwound and various ends were put in various sockets until the place looked like a particularly shoddy market stall.

Carly the barmaid's Aussie boyfriend works in IT and he eventually got it set up for us, but by that time no-one could quite commit £11.99 to watch the last 15 minutes of back-to-the-wall defending.
Ukraine-England on the internet OK computer?

Yeah I know it probably worked out at 70p each but it's the bloody principle of the thing. Besides which, Brucie had just popped on to the box in the snug to remind us that the Beeb had the highlights.

It's a joke. How can the rights to show this game be costing an arm and a leg to your average punter? Of course the internet broadcasters are claiming the whole thing was a success but as far as I can tell the total viewing figures were about half a million which is, by the standards of a national terrestrial broadcaster, tiny.

You always got the impression that when Setanta were talking up the number of subscribers they had , it had more than a touch of the angler in the pub with his hands held wide apart to demonstrate the size of the minnow he threw back that morning.

A couple of mates watched in a cinema across town and said the experience had all the atmosphere of a teetotallers' whist drive. Plus the darned thing was freezing every couple of minutes. According to them, it was less like telly and more like a really bad slide show that managed to miss out the important images.

People have accused me of not exactly being at the cutting edge of new technology - we've only just stopped toasting the bread under the top grill at our house, I've never trusted them microwave things 'cos of the laughable way they churn out a jacket spud (less a jacket and more a cheap T-shirt), and I must have broken a dozen All-in-One remote controls by throwing the disobedient bloomin' things into the street.

But for goodness sake, England matches go on national telly! Normal, proper telly! If the utter Etonian Cameron wants to be Prime Minister he could do worse than start with that. ALL ENGLAND MATCHES ON PROPER TELLY!

Any road it seems that Capello's master plan continues to thrive. His team talk must've gone summat like this:

"We've got two games ahead of us that mean nowt so we'll tell the papers that we're committed to victory and then we'll get some real howlers out of the way. Rio, I want you to play with all the speed, pace and stamina of a Twiglet, son.

"Ashley, you know when left-backs suddenly fancy themselves as ingenious ball-playing Ronaldinhos and get horribly found out. No? Well you know your missus was kind of OK in the all-girl group but is foolishly trying to sing a fancy solo next week? Now's the time for that, fella."

(Incidentally, I dunno what it is about Cheryl Cole but I fully expect loads of couch-dwelling soppy males to write in to this blog protecting the saintliness of Mrs Cole and suggesting that not only is she a fine singer she's a lovely sweet person too..)

Anyway, back to Capello: "Jame-o - don't worry we'll find a way for you to get on the park and prove your worth. Emile, remember how people laughed when McClaren recalled you? Let's make 'em laugh all over again. Stevie, how's the groin? Of course it is. We'll give you 45 - frankly it's nice that you showed up at all."

What's reassuring is that the team knuckled down really well in the second half and despite the 10 men and the lack of importance, they were up for it. Clearly Fabio's got his message across and they're all genuinely feeling the need to keep working at it.

None more than Rooney, who was once again relentless. I'm quite pleased the lad's got the more-than-handy calf strain. We need him to heed the niggles all season if we don't want another premature hobble out of the big tournaments.

I'm sure that he'll somehow get fit by Saturday, mind. It's blinking miraculous what these Big Four physios can do.
Flares light up Ukraine v EnglandFlares light up the sky in Ukraine
The throwing of flares was a bit unnecessary 'n all. The lads did well to avoid them - both on the pitch and as a post-match excuse.

In my day it was bog-roll and we were happy with that. You lobbed it on the pitch and no-one got hurt but the keeper had to do a bit of tidying while the ball was up the other end.

You'd never chuck things at your own keeper unless you were Man City fans with balloons at Bramall Lane and you had some sort of death-wish. Ahh, that was in happier times when Citeh were still a laughing stock. And Bryan Robson was the Blades' boss.

Someone said on Saturday night that he'd heard Robson was managing Tie Rack now. Apparently it's Thailand. I'm sure he'll know the difference.


Comments

  • 1. At 1:27pm on 12 Oct 2009, Stewie Griffin wrote:

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.

  • 2. At 1:33pm on 12 Oct 2009, goonersli wrote:

    Hopefully now the England are definitely going to win the world cup bandwagon can slow down a bit and take a reality check. Still a lot of improving to do if we're to beat the likes of Spain etc

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  • 3. At 1:40pm on 12 Oct 2009, richjseymour wrote:

    well robbo... i think j.d.r has finally got to you.
    a bit too much topic and not enough cliché for me!!!
    i'm sure he'll say different, mind.
    but about the t.v rights thingy... i think this should be a matter of national interest. the f.a or whoever is responsible for making england games available to be broadcast has to get it on one t.v channel or another... i don't care if it's sky, bbc, itv or any other for that matter, it should always be on t.v.
    the person responsible should be first in the dole queue for this effort.

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  • 4. At 1:42pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Novel blog Robbon - important point that about Cheryl Cole - why these girl groups think they are any good solo is beyond me. If they were good solo they wouldn't have been put in a girl group. Especially considering they ruined a perfectly good Pet Shop Boys song earlier in the year. The Loving Kind (not if she's singing we're not).

    Stewie - I got modded for that last week so iif you're not then I will somehow get my revenge.

    Also £12 for the internet!!! Prem Plus was only £5.95 - let's face it if Sky can't make Pay-per-view footie work then some nameless internet company can't - (Setanta went bust for a reason and 500,000 viewers is pathetic (get more than that for a jdrgang or Harry Potter mystery videoon YouTube).

    Also good to see Rooney & Gerrard will miss the Belarus game with samll injuries that will allow them to play at the weekend.

    The big question is for me

    WHY WON'T CAPELLO PICK DARREN BENT AHEAD OF HESKEY.

    Emile isn't exactly what they call prolific or clinical and as Defoe's out and Own isn't getting selected why not pick someone who is scoring for fun can head the ball and actually knows what scoring goals feels like as Heskey hasn't scored 1 goal this season. At all. in fact he barely even plays so what happened to the guff that Fabio talks about why Owen isn't picked as he isn't playing regularly.

    If you need to be playing every week and scoring goals then pick Darren Bent. If you don't then pick darren Bent or Michael Owen but please stop letting Heskey near an England shirt

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  • 5. At 1:44pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    #3 - the person responsible should be first in the dole queue for this effort

    ------------------------

    He is it was the boss of Setanta

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  • 6. At 1:46pm on 12 Oct 2009, richjseymour wrote:

    #4 correct on all counts

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  • 7. At 1:52pm on 12 Oct 2009, Coplandrdloyal wrote:

    First comment!
    -----------------------------------------------------------------

    So, who cares? Do you want a gold star?? Idiot

    Robbo I agree the whole internet only thing is a bad idea

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  • 8. At 1:52pm on 12 Oct 2009, King of the Air wrote:

    Good blog Robbo, but can anyone ensure that England games are actually broadcast on TV ? What I mean is can the Government force the FA of Ukraine (in this instance) to sell the rights to a TV company rather than an Internet company ? Having said that if this had been an important game a TV company would have gained the rights to it I suppose.
    Anyway regarding England I certainly hope Capello can find some way of preventing the dozy defending of Rio & Cole before we kick off in South Africa, we will definitely get found out if not.
    The other problem is Heskey - I know he fits into Capello's style of play and formation better than the other strikers but how long can we go on with a non scoring centre forward ?

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  • 9. At 2:06pm on 12 Oct 2009, Starburst_995 wrote:

    @ #1

    First comment to fall foul of the moderatirs I suspect, given the same's happened in the past few blogs.

    Ah so the Blue Bell looks decidely ... erm green by that pic.

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  • 10. At 2:08pm on 12 Oct 2009, WhitleyBayWonTheVase wrote:

    Well some of us were too busy celebrating a 0-5 away win whilst our nearest rivals drew 1-1.

    Yes, Whitley Bay now sit 2 points clear with a game in hand over Spennymoor - and behind them we another 6 point gap to Penrith on the same games as us. Twelve played, eleven won, one drawn and hurtling toward the title....okay, so I'm getting a bit carried away now.

    I saw the lowlights though and Rio seems to be suffering with his recovery time in my opinion. Its harsh for anyone to write him off now though as you don't become a crap player overnight (unless your name is Carragher whose demise still bemuses me completely).

    I don't see Heskey as a problem at all. Strategically, if the team wins and plays well then you don't need all your forwards to score. It's a team game and he clearly makes something fit that we've struggled to slot in previously.

    So, we were already through to the finals and the result didn't really matter but we still put in a sterling performance with 10 men. Who cares?

    Well, I do actually. The great teams and potential world cup winners don't let a 100% winning record go bang. We did, and if we're honest it could have been 2-0.

    I'm still not convinced of Englands credentials for anything other than a quarter final exit in South Africa. There is time to right the wrongs, but those who think we were heading to the end of a 43 year drought will hopefully be a little more realistic now.

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  • 11. At 2:12pm on 12 Oct 2009, U11846789 wrote:

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.

  • 12. At 2:13pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Good points Starfire if a little bit too on-topic - got to be concerned if no-one gets distracted by the Cheryl Cole debate as taht mey encourage they who must not be named to commit further forces to their make Robbo talk about only football crusade.

    Seriously though while I accept the Heskey argument to some extent I am worried that if the one and only chance to progress ina tight-quarter fell to Heskey then he would miss it and we'd lose on penalties (again - especially as unlike bent he is not a regular penalty taker)

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  • 13. At 2:14pm on 12 Oct 2009, couch_potato_peeler wrote:

    I agree it's too early to be streaming live Footy only on the internet. Until fast reliable broadband is a lot more widely available and the vast majority of homes have the necessary equipment it's just asking for trouble. I wouldn't risk £11.99 (or even the 'early' discounted fee) on something that might stop working halfway through, especially when I get emails from my broadband provider reminding me of their 'fair usage policy' if I've watched a lot of iPlayer that month. Apparently unlimited usage doesn't actually mean unlimited in their dictionary.

    What intrigues me is how the BBC got the highlights when ITV seems to be the England broadcaster these days. I bet one or two Beeb executives had a smile about that.

    As for Emile Heskey, he's been a great player over the years but I agree that Darren Bent is more deserving given his current form.

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  • 14. At 2:15pm on 12 Oct 2009, stanmore wrote:

    Hmmm, I doubt if Cameron cares if proper telly still exists in a decade's time, let alone working towards making England FC as a permanent fixture upon it...

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  • 15. At 2:15pm on 12 Oct 2009, Stewie Griffin wrote:

    Yes a gold star would be lovely thankyou

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  • 16. At 2:19pm on 12 Oct 2009, highlowsell wrote:

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.

  • 17. At 2:21pm on 12 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    R-o-b-b-o... Cracker mate, and could not agree more about England matches being on proper telly... this interweb malarky is a nitemare, and half a million watching an England match is far from a susccess... But at eleven ninety nine a pop, someone made some good money i would imagine... Its just not right though is it? Chap in my office summed it up nice "I like to keep my p*rn and my footy seperate"... Couldn't really argue with the bloke...

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  • 18. At 2:21pm on 12 Oct 2009, SugarDunkerton wrote:

    I cant stand Heskey.. the guy is massive and goes down more than Drogba.. If you dont believe me watch him the next time he actually gets a game somewhere... Only striker who gets plaudits for not scoring goals..!!

    Not much of a head on that pint...

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  • 19. At 2:25pm on 12 Oct 2009, brightbluesamba wrote:

    Another Good Blog. I agree all England matches should be by law be on BBC/ITV.
    And with reference to the point- Why doesnt Capello pick Darren Bent?

    He doesnt pick Darren Bent because Heskeys job in the team is to occupy defenders so Rooney has space to do some real damage. I think Heskey will lose his place to Carlton Cole when Cole realises his potential under Zola. Cole does the same job but he can score- has created some exciting moments too.

    The strikers that go to South Africa will probs be: Rooney, Heskey, Defoe, C. Cole, Walcott. Its great how the players like Cole under Capello are all playing well.

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  • 20. At 2:27pm on 12 Oct 2009, WhitleyBayWonTheVase wrote:

    On the streaming of the match online...

    I think a few people need to check facts.

    500,000 was dreadful, but the publicity in respect of how to get the match, never mind the fact it was going to be online, was absolutely appalling. It was completely under-advertised and under-sold. £12 is too much, I agree, especially for what was a bit of a non-event, but the main damage was in the marketing (or lack of it) and not the pricing.

    Then we come to those saying there is a reason Setanta went bust.

    The reason they went bust isn't because too few people wanted to pay to watch PPV events. Firstly they made a mockery of cancellations and payments. Their system was badly managed and received horrific publicity (namely Watchdog) - rightly so. That lost them a lot of subscribers.

    Secondly, they were very badly hit by the retirement of Joe Calzaghe, a man whose exploits in the ring had kept them afloat for a good while through a very large and very loyal subscriber base of boxing fans. When he announced his retirement the execs at Setanta were throwing themselves out of top floor windows.

    They signed David Haye - but the unrealistic demands from the Klitschko brothers meant that his fights never materialised in time so the PPV revenue from his fights went up in smoke; and he got wind of their financial troubles and got cold feet too. So, as they sat burning in their TV Tower he threw a firework in and said 'ta-ra'. That was the final straw.

    They also suffered because their plans to launch HD football failed - so you could watch Premiership footy in HD on Sky, but not on Setanta. You'd be surprised how many viewers being asked to pay £12+ per month took exception to that - myself included.

    But, none of the above are the primary reasons they went bust.

    That is because in February 2009 it was known that they'd only won the rights for 6 of the next seasons (this season) matches. Sky got everything else. That resulted in hoards of cancellations, understandably, once the season had finished. That is the main reason they went bang. Not because people didn't want to pay the money, but purely because Sky took on aggressive stance and outbid them.

    Over the next 4 months that followed they started to see subscriptions disappear, Calzaghe had gone and Haye looked increasingly unlikely to want to stay with them - so they didn't even have the £30m they needed to pay for their existing Premiership matches. So, the plug was pulled by the Premier League and the rest is history.

    Streaming online is good. I regularly watch boxing on it and it is often much better than the dire coverage on terrestrial TV. Plus, if you think £12.99 is a lot - how about the £15 you pay for a Sky Box Office PPV boxing event such as Hatton v Pacquiao - and then get 4 minutes of the main event for your money!

    Most of the issues with online broadcasts come from the poor connection speed of the viewer.

    One final note, don't be too quick to criticise online broadcasting - because you'll be watching a lot more of it in recent years and prices will drop when arms open to it. It wasn't too long ago that paying for Sky Sports was seen as a sin. Now, they're seen as saviours! How times change and memories fade...

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  • 21. At 2:27pm on 12 Oct 2009, awesomeMr_Burns wrote:

    My computer is in the hallway under the stairs along with the coats,shoes and shopping bags there was no way me and my mates were going to pay to watch England in those conditions.One of them had it on his iphone to say as England fans we all felt degraded is a understatment.
    Never in the history of English football has one match cost so much seen by so few!!!

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  • 22. At 2:32pm on 12 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    The internet is the devil, personally i never use it!

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  • 23. At 2:37pm on 12 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Jeez, Gotts Plenty have just sacked McParland? Will this bring Sven to the helm now?

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  • 24. At 2:38pm on 12 Oct 2009, Ginger wrote:

    #1 - Well done, but don't get cocky son!

    #7 - Chill out, he is only having a laugh.

    England on the net, no thanks. I wanted to watch the game at home on the TV with my son, watching on the laptop was never going to be worthwhile.

    Watched it in the pub via Albanian TV. The place was packed. 130 people in a pub in Derbyshire watching England playing in Ukraine via Albania.

    You couldn't make it up!

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  • 25. At 2:38pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Count yourselves lucky. You could have been watching your national team on normal TV take a 2-1 lead over the current World Champions with 3 minutes to go, and then throw it all away with comic book defending from the entire back four, instead of one scapegoat.

    At least the internet might have had the decency to crash with a minute still remaining, leaving us basking in the glory of what we thought was a great win.

    But Ireland do as Ireland always does and can't hold on to a lead. There's no wonder there's never an Irish winner at Crufts. (I really have no idea if there is but there's probably a doggie afficianado out there somewhere).

    At the end of the day though Robbo is right. Footy has no place on the internet. Once the real internet bigwigs (ie p*rn moguls) get wind of it there'll be 11 a side shagathons before we know it.

    Don't know what the pic actually looked like but if it's anything like the live streams of the Premiership that are illegally available on a Saturday (a mate told me about them, honest) it would have been rubbish. Sometimes it's so bad that you actually think one of his teammates has actually passed Nani the ball.

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  • 26. At 2:44pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    RBA - Not surprised that McPartland went - wonder if the fact he couldn't retain Campbell pplayed a part -

    Will it be Sven or Ruud Gullit or a big name - who knows but it will be interesting -

    It could be John Barnes bringing his successful passing philosophy to the lower leagues.. again

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  • 27. At 2:46pm on 12 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    I hope so Adam, i mean a billionaire team in League 2 is good... But the "Blue Square Billionaires" has a better ring to it... Will be interesting to see what happens... But they'll need a razor sharp intellect to go up against the footballing genius of Gary Waddock!

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  • 28. At 2:48pm on 12 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    ooh Robbinho, you're feeling a bit daring, eh? don't you know that one of your more socially-challenged, yet resourceful readers could track down your beloved boozer with that one, seemingly harmless photo?
    i can just picture some caffeine-fueled shut-in getting all CSI New Delhi on it right now.

    or perhaps you're clever enough to post a decoy photo of McN*mpty's pub in an attempt to dethrone the Beeb's "Chief Football Writer" (or Chief Put-to-Sleep, as the natives know him).
    if this is the case, then excellent work, you sly fox, you!

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  • 29. At 2:50pm on 12 Oct 2009, emperorpilaf wrote:

    I think that Stewiegriff seriously needs to get a life, imho 1st comment? Who cares!

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  • 30. At 2:51pm on 12 Oct 2009, toffeexile wrote:

    I live in the US and don't have cable TV, only broadband so streaming live games is nothing new to me. I also live in Nebraska which doesn't exactly get a lot of football interest, but back when i used to live in Los Angeles there were quite a few bards that would open early, charge everyone $10 at the door for the privilege of watching the game. Setanta here charges something silly like $25 for each pay-per-view game to ordinary residential punters (thankfully most are not pay-per-view, except to non subscribers to their main channel), so I've no idea what they charged the pubs. Interesting to note that pretty much every game of a premier league weekend can be seen here through 2 channels - some shown live and others delayed - no exclusive rights, they just seem to work it out between them. Neither channel is part of a base package though - oh and they also both have an on-line subscription service to watch the games online.

    Anyway, yes the England games should be available on terrestrial telly, but also online. Do not underestimate the Internet as a source for watching football, especially overseas - infact the practice means people are employed at the premierleague and FA to hunt down peer-to-peer streams and get the hosting websites to block them. Surely the easier solution is to host the streams themselves, or sell the Internet rights to games with a worldwide license. Many here would be more than willing to pay a subscription fee to BBC Worldwide to get shows from the UK, but also the live sporting events and really they should be as interested as anyone in buying up Internet rights to england games - this way the "for profit" arm of the BBC could really make a profit.

    Wonder how that betting firm is doing out of online streaming of games.

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  • 31. At 2:51pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    So that means you have identified the Blue Bell and will be visiting it then Denis

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  • 32. At 2:51pm on 12 Oct 2009, TheDeluded wrote:

    The F.A. tried to convince us that it wasn't their fault the game was not shown on terrestrial T.V.

    but it was their fault that our national sport was put out for tender in the first place. it's beyond financial value, and if the F.A. want to try and fix it then they must represent us at European (UEFA) and word (FIFA) level, putting in place the preservation of all nations' football on terrestrial television.

    this is what the F.A. must do if they want to represent, rather than make excuses to, the country. and this is what UEFA and FIFA need to champion, rather than their efforts to undermine the success of our league structures.

    forcing all nations to make national football available to all viewers benefits everybody.

    meanwhile, Rio, of all people, claiming on one hand to be down-to-earth and unspoiled by his riches and position, tried to convince people that it is ok to pay another £5-£12, on top of television licensing, extra subscriptions, and monthly broadband costs, in order to see his performance in Ukraine.

    really? is it ok? who is he to say what is ok?

    'OK' is where nations, by default, are able to watch their national teams play at home or away, qualifier or friendly, in their millions. not in their thousands.

    (I believe that ITV has the rights to away friendlies. away qualifiers remain up for the highest bidder.)

    so before the F.A. claim that they are 'free from blame' and they are busy 'representing the nation', they should first be actually representing the nation at the top tables reserved for such representatives, in our place, and trying to change things for the better. which they are blatantly not doing.

    at ANY level.

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  • 33. At 2:51pm on 12 Oct 2009, ormrodblue76 wrote:

    The problem is if i just fancy a pint with my mates and want to watch the England match, then i'm not going to be able to walk in any old pub and watch. Imagine the world cup quarter final England V Ivory Coast live only on Internet. It will never happen. Football is a tribal thing, me and my mates are not going to sit round my Mac watching the football, and i doubt the pubs will be only charged £11.99 for the trouble. so not all the pubs will have it on.

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  • 34. At 2:51pm on 12 Oct 2009, collie21 wrote:

    what is it with blokes who want to write first comment? whats the point? Is it going to be in the Olympics in brazil or something? See who can get the first comment decathlon blogathon or what?

    As for the internet? Matches were watched on the internet for years, and I got to see England V Peru for nothing. I couldn't for the life of me find Ireland V Italy that worked though. The English match was crystal clear too. Looks like not many gave a toss

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  • 35. At 2:53pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    collie21 - given that Golf and Rugby 7's are - why not

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  • 36. At 2:55pm on 12 Oct 2009, everestbeer wrote:

    Loved the angler line, brilliant!

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  • 37. At 2:56pm on 12 Oct 2009, collie21 wrote:

    But Ireland do as Ireland always does and can't hold on to a lead. There's no wonder there's never an Irish winner at Crufts. (I really have no idea if there is but there's probably a doggie afficianado out there somewhere).

    Theres been quite a few mate. http://www.jinnybrux.com/CRUFTS-07-See-our-FOUR-Award-winners-

    The do better than the soccer team in fact...

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  • 38. At 2:56pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:

    At 2:51pm on 12 Oct 2009, collie21 wrote:

    I couldn't for the life of me find Ireland V Italy that worked though.


    ------


    To have that would have had to mean one of 2 things Collie...

    1) The Irish national broadcaster RTE would have had to be explained what the internet was and how to broadcast a football match on it. This would have taken 6-8 months of extensive re-training for their employess, during which time approx €5billion worth of punitive damages would have been paid out because of the stress they suffered.

    or

    2) Some enterprising Irish person would have had to stream the match from their television reception over their pc and a server big enough to handle it. This is simply impossible as it would involve a) work and b) leaving the pub.

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  • 39. At 2:57pm on 12 Oct 2009, Dazz wrote:

    I consider all those who paid to watch that match traitors! Traitors against the ordinary, hardworking man who was been shorn of everything by these heartless capitalists

    Why it is ludicrous some people will allow themselves to be herded like goats in this day and age. Why would you pay more for less and then end up getting nothing?

    Apparently some have more money than sense. They would have done better donating that money to NSPCC or Cancer Research and waiting patiently to watch the highlights on BBC.

    Afterall it was a match of no importance so why shell out that ridiculous figure except to encourage these guys to bleed us in future.

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  • 40. At 2:59pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Gaz surely they could have installed them on the drives and roofs that they are "repairing"

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  • 41. At 2:59pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:

    At 2:56pm on 12 Oct 2009, collie21 wrote:
    But Ireland do as Ireland always does and can't hold on to a lead. There's no wonder there's never an Irish winner at Crufts. (I really have no idea if there is but there's probably a doggie afficianado out there somewhere).

    Theres been quite a few mate. http://www.jinnybrux.com/CRUFTS-07-See-our-FOUR-Award-winners-

    The do better than the soccer team in fact...


    -----


    Probably because they don't have idiots like the FAI in charge who insist on appointing such quality managers as Brian 'Who' Kerr, Steve 'The Gaffer' Staunton and St. Michael of McCarthy.

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  • 42. At 3:00pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Adam they only repair tarmac drives, not hard drives.

    Boom boom.

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  • 43. At 3:02pm on 12 Oct 2009, RetiredNo6 wrote:

    Oh look, the Heskey bashers are out in force again - how predictable. Go and look at the records.... England win more games and score more goals when Heskey plays than when he doesn't. Is that just an unfortunate coincidence?

    As for the people lauding Bent. I like Darren Bent, but he's a one dimensional centre forward. He plays the whole game on the shoulder of the last defender. Most of his goals come from getting him in behind, into space that doesn't exist against the deeper lying defences of international football. Bent is a Premier League goalscorer, but not an international - in the Andy Cole or Ian Wright mode maybe.

    Crouch can't do the same job as Emile, because he has no pace, which allows defences to push to high and close the game down against us. The only viable alternative to Emile is Carlton Cole. As far as I'm concerned it's Rooney or Defoe, plus Heskey or Cole.

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  • 44. At 3:05pm on 12 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Afternoon all.
    I watched Saturdays match (well, tried to) on the internet totally free of charge, although it did cost me rather large chunks of hair which had been ripped out in frustration of having to reload/refresh the unstable streams. It crashed so many times that I think I must of only seen about 20mins of the first hour, fortunatly the last half hour hardly froze/crashed at all.
    Now I'm no computer genius,(I can barely type)but I know that if I go on to the 606 board I can always count on some techno nerds, aka my new bestest friends, to have found at least 5 or so links for free viewing. I agree its far from the best way of watching footy, but way better than no footy at all.

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  • 45. At 3:07pm on 12 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    At 2:51pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:
    So that means you have identified the Blue Bell and will be visiting it then Denis

    ------------------------------------------------

    that's about what we've come to expect from you, adamp.
    take a bow, you master of comedy!

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  • 46. At 3:07pm on 12 Oct 2009, collie21 wrote:

    GazUtd I take it you are Irish then? You seem well up and trials and tribs of the team.. What do you think about Trapp addmitting they lack experience and not including the likes of Carsely and Delap

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  • 47. At 3:08pm on 12 Oct 2009, TheMuppetRevolution wrote:

    Darren Bent for England.
    Hes the most in-form and in-everything else atm. I dont seem to understnad why the Media havnt hyped the fact that Capello hasnt even bothered to try him out, let alone play him.
    But thumbs up to the Beeb for securing the highlights. I only found out when old Brucie slid in a little word on Strictly. Dear Lord was it little.
    Cheryl Cole's perfomance next week should be funny aswell. Robbie Williams had a right old jump around the other night. Yh Rob', we get the message; you really enjoyed yourself.

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  • 48. At 3:09pm on 12 Oct 2009, thegreatNEb wrote:

    I think Cole did excellent, aside from that one blunder in front of goal, what was he thinking? As for the deflected own goal, should he have gone for it, or left it to James?? I'm torn, but it must have been close to a clearance.

    James is the man for the England goal in my mind. No question

    Heskey: We all praise him when England do well and try and lynch him when we don't, he doesn't score either way so whats the difference? Hes a supporting forward and works hard so thats all good, but why was left up front on his own after we dropped to 10 men???

    I forget who was on the bench, but my vote would have either have been to go 3-4-2/3-1-3-2 leaving the front virtually intact, stick Cashley and Glen on the wings (both love going forward anyway), carrick in the hole, leaving lamps/carrick/bent/whoever was on the bench in the middle, with Waz and heskey up front.

    Either way I don't like a wings/crosses game plan when we are down a man and the only striker is a blank-firing bull-dozer. btw was beckham on the bench?
    --

    As for the internet thing, its ridiculous. I live in Montreal and I saw the game on a US Cable TV channel. We even had the British commentary so it was probably the same match that was sent online for everyone at home. How silly is that.

    --

    One thing you forgot Robbo....A BIG SHOUT OUT TO SHEVA ahahahahahaha

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  • 49. At 3:15pm on 12 Oct 2009, TheDeluded wrote:

    Oh, one more thing ...

    for anyone in any other country, other than the two that are actually playing the match ... it doesn't matter how YOU receive the match.

    but the nations whose teams are playing should be able to see the match on their national television. this rule should be standard, for all nations.

    if you're watching the England team from the States, or Ireland, or anywhere else, there's no reason for that nation to televise an England match.

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  • 50. At 3:16pm on 12 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Gaz, didn't you think it was funny that a guy with the username collie knew so much about Crufts?

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  • 51. At 3:17pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Collie, yep I'm Irish. Well actually I have a Brit passport as well. But I won't go there.

    To be honest the whole Ireland national team situation is pretty unexplainable. After Saipan I was one of the majority (despite what some may tell you) who fell out with the national team some what.

    Then when trying our best to get back behind the team after St. Mick got the boot the FAI bigwigs (for bigwigs read *****les) decided to do a sort of X-Factor search in appointing the next managers. Brian Kerr wasn't that bad, well actually he was but in comparison to what followed him even chronic diahorrea wouldn't seem that bad.

    Staunton was in one way a unique football experience though. It's unheard of before or since, in my knowledge, to have appointed someone where absolutely everything was done incorrectly. And every time he opened his mouth the whole nation wanted to put their feet in there along with his.

    As for Trappatoni. Well he doesn't speaky the Engly great yet (better than Staunton though) so you don't really know whats going on. He seems to be a stubborn boy though. Won't pick Andy Reid for his own reasons and where Reid is by no means a great player he would surely do a better job than whoever that boy Rowlands that came on the other night is. (Sorry Keith).

    Add to the fact that we cannot hold on to a lead because of serious tactical lapses I suppose the jury is still out on him.

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  • 52. At 3:17pm on 12 Oct 2009, lorus59 wrote:

    I could understand a Ukraine supporter paying £11.99 to watch the game but for England ones to pay that much for a game with very little at stake its ridiculous. I would not like to have to pay that much to watch the World Cup final. I am actually surprised they even had that many paying.

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  • 53. At 3:19pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Holloway, now that you mention it, yes!

    What I also think is 'funny' is how many people are coming out of the woodwork to admit they only found out about the Beebs highlights after Brucie announced it on Strictly. Wives watching it while you just happened to be in the room I'm sure.

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  • 54. At 3:21pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Denis I see that the concept of irony still eludes you then.

    As for retiredNo6 it is not so much Heskey bashing as the win ratio with him in is good and I agree that Crouch is not suitable but I still think that Bent or Cole would be better although I would still prefer to see Michael Owen involved

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  • 55. At 3:29pm on 12 Oct 2009, tomefccam wrote:

    i am amazed darren bent has not been given a go, listen bruv since 2005 when bent started playing in PL. He has played 136 PL games 56 PL goals. Defoe - 134 PL games - 46 PL goals. So can someone please start doing some maths? Look at this guy, defoe is apparently a natural goalscorer...erm these stats suggest not. Bent offers a more all round threat. Let's bring Heskey into the equation - 135 PL games - 21 PL goals. Bent: Goal every 2.42 games. Defoe goal every 2.91 games. Heskey goal every 6.42.

    What about Crouchy I hear you say? 119 PL games - 33 PL goals. Goal ever 3.60 games.

    Tuck in Benty.

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  • 56. At 3:29pm on 12 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Gaz, you say you have 2 passports, and one of them is British... why would you ever use anything other than that fine british one, it is the finest official document on gods green earth and the envy of every all other nations...



    In honesty, i don't beleive that at all, i was just wanted to know if Ira(te)_Abu(se)'s head exploded reading it...

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  • 57. At 3:30pm on 12 Oct 2009, gopherboy wrote:

    Well said #19. I wish England would start with Carlton Cole instead of Heskey. I think he is 10x the player Heskey is. As a target man the ball seems to hit him and stick and he can hold the ball up and pass it far better than Heskey.
    Cole is also playing most of the time for West Ham unlike Heskey - I really can't see why he is being picked.
    On another note, the BBC bloggers seem to have stopped replyin to us :(

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  • 58. At 3:31pm on 12 Oct 2009, collie21 wrote:

    HollowayHolland, whats your area of expertise, leaves of a certain type perhaps? Or Dutch Café ? lol.
    GAZ I rekcon when there is no match the English Wife must control the telly. Kerr was actually decent but stubborn as well, in other words given one more chance would have qualified but but but but..... I reckon the Irish should have a go with Capello and the English with Trapp and see what happens. As for the 'telly' By 2011 that notion will be defunct and the whole of Europe at least will be completely digital

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  • 59. At 3:33pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    RBA well you see if you are born in Northern Ireland you are entitled to both. And of course depending on what side of the divide you are from you will only want one.

    Unless of course when you are getting your first one many years ago and to get an Irish one would involve hauling yourself off to Dublin. Laziness has always out-trumphed nationalism and everything else in my book.

    Now with regards to using the British one, if you go to Tanzania (and a couple of other African countries) you will have to pay the standard visa fee on entry. Usually around $50. If you have an Irish passport you don't have to pay. Apparently a few of our priests helped out there a while back.

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  • 60. At 3:34pm on 12 Oct 2009, pucko616 wrote:

    Would there be all this furore if it was a scotland, wales or northern ireland game? no, don't think so.

    why is it that the english "must" have their team on national telly, while the other home nations just have to deal with it?

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  • 61. At 3:35pm on 12 Oct 2009, United Dreamer wrote:

    RetiredNo6 - Andy Cole was forced out by the genius that wasn't, Glenn Hoddle, and a couple of rags who were terrified of Shearer or Owen being ousted from the coveted main striker role. He was never given a chance. He was not one dimensional and has the second highest assists total in the premiership. Also Darren Bent tends to get more joy from defences that play high up the pitch rather than deep lying.

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  • 62. At 3:37pm on 12 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.

  • 63. At 3:38pm on 12 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Collie, that would be dutch cafes

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  • 64. At 3:38pm on 12 Oct 2009, dodiesmith wrote:

    As soon as fire flames, whatever, were thrown on to the pitch, the game should have been cancelled. Fire is dangerous, enough said.
    Ignorant actions like this should not be tolerated.
    Does a player have to be hurt before action is taken?

    If England had not already qualified, I would have been furious.
    Shame on those so-called "fans."

    Here in Toronto I did not expect to see the game....and feel sorry for the fans who deserve better. You presented the case well,
    All the best, Robbo.

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  • 65. At 3:39pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    why is it that the english "must" have their team on national telly, while the other home nations just have to deal with it?

    ----------------------------------

    Becasue they're rubbish, we're better and there are more of us.

    #61 - Exactly that.. although Coley got his revenge by scoring the winner for Blackburn against Hoddle in the League Cup final thus depriving Glenn of ever winning a domestic trophy as a manager

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  • 66. At 3:40pm on 12 Oct 2009, Starburst_995 wrote:

    #60. Last time I looked Scotland and Wales had their own TV schedules and channels (I'm assuming Ireland does as well.)

    If they for whatever reason haven't got their national teams taking pride of place on TV as and when they play, that's their business, and their loss if they're so apathetic about their home nations not being on the TV.

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  • 67. At 3:42pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    RBA is it not the case that if you leave Aldershot you are not allowed back in. Something about the town leaders being worried that 'new ideas' might be brought back to the locals. Like bathing. Or brushing your teeth.

    I know you are trying to tempt him out of what looks like retirement. But is it really worth it? Laughing at the unfortunate will only leave you feeling unfulfilled in the long run.

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  • 68. At 3:42pm on 12 Oct 2009, United Dreamer wrote:

    "#61 - Exactly that.. although Coley got his revenge by scoring the winner for Blackburn against Hoddle in the League Cup final thus depriving Glenn of ever winning a domestic trophy as a manager"

    True - a lot of United fans took great pleasure in that one. Its a shame the interviewers weren't as clued in. The look on Hoddle's face would have been priceless.

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  • 69. At 3:43pm on 12 Oct 2009, PhilNevillesLeftFoot - AOG OUT - Justice 4 606 wrote:

    England matches should be on PROPER telly. Yes great idea I really love the idea of my license fee going on meaningless qualifying games. Come on for gods sake why would the BBC waste their resources on a meaningless match?

    As for the article - as usual its the lowest common denominator. Terrible

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  • 70. At 3:44pm on 12 Oct 2009, United Dreamer wrote:

    "Laughing at the unfortunate will only leave you feeling unfulfilled in the long run."

    Deep and maybe true, but wouldn't the forums be empty if we followed that advice?

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  • 71. At 3:45pm on 12 Oct 2009, Gilo wrote:

    "I'm sure that he'll somehow get fit by Saturday, mind. It's blinking miraculous what these Big Four physios can do."

    Nail on the head Robbo...Gerrard made it International flop #78. Wonder if he will be fit on Saturday. Would be a shame to half Liverpool into a opne man team on the weekend!!

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  • 72. At 3:49pm on 12 Oct 2009, MootSights wrote:

    The proof that technology isn't your strong point isn't when it takes you ages to set the computer up, but when you don't realise there's a thousand other internet streams and programmes showing the same match for free - and not illegally.

    I can't for the life of me understand why anyone would pay to watch a dead rubber on a computer screen.

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  • 73. At 3:52pm on 12 Oct 2009, United Dreamer wrote:

    Maybe the 500,000 that paid to view the match were Ukrainian.

    In the long run the Internet will become more prevalent as we get products that allow you to port the streaming through your TV and remotes to support it. It will happen. Its not a coincidence that broadband is being pushed to every household.

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  • 74. At 3:54pm on 12 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    "Laughing at the unfortunate will only leave you feeling unfulfilled in the long run."

    Its done me alright this far... And you could be right about the new ideas getting in to Aldershot, if my neighbours find out i'm using the internet i'll be burnt for being a witch! As it is they refer to me as "Job Man"...

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  • 75. At 3:58pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.

  • 76. At 3:59pm on 12 Oct 2009, Spitfire wrote:

    17. RBA. Are there people who still pay for p*rn?

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  • 77. At 4:01pm on 12 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Thats true Gaz, however that is one area of industry that does thrive in Alderhsot... The Army and Hookers, what a town!

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  • 78. At 4:01pm on 12 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    tough to tell with the lighting, but is that a Bass Ale?

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  • 79. At 4:02pm on 12 Oct 2009, MrBlueBurns wrote:

    I think the whole issue about the rights and coverage can be analysed from a monetary point of view.

    The ultimate question is why don't the FA buys the rights and then sell them on to a broadcaster? Why do the broadcasters do it themselves?

    The FA is responsible for the game in this country, not the BBC or any other broadcaster for that matter.

    The ability of the FA to afford the rights in the first place can be put into context by discussing the bonuses the players are on for pulling on the national shirt.

    Frankly, players should play for their country for nothing. Make that a policy then you might start to see who is loyal and who is greedy.

    Deal with that, and most of the issue simply goes away.

    (Anyway, to the extent that the broadcast platform is an issue, other 'national' sports are on pay tv and that's just a reality of modern sport. We have no divine right to see it if we're not there.)

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  • 80. At 4:03pm on 12 Oct 2009, Starburst_995 wrote:

    #76

    I was going to say that evidently some people do pay or no-one would be paying the actors/actresses do make these things, but then I remembered the legions of voyeristic people who'll freely upload videos of themselves to sites that are loose cousins of youtube.

    (Daren't actually give the names of any of these sites as I know'll the mods will be over me like a cheap suit.)

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  • 81. At 4:04pm on 12 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    I belive so, we've got as many sexhops as we do pound shops in Aldershot, and were not a big town... As for the virtual world of p0rn, even growing up i never had a PC in my room... so i know little on the subject. I old school, gimme a copy of reader wives anyday! (plus I can't use the mouse with me left hand!)

    Now how long will that stay up?

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  • 82. At 4:05pm on 12 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    Gwate Bwog Lobbo.
    It's a bit upsetting that Carly comes all the way to England from down under and brings one of her own for company. I'd have thought she'd want to experience all that England has to offer (except of course for England football games on live tele).

    Collie, will Crufts have a live webcast next year? We'll be hounding you to keep us advised of the no-cost links.

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  • 83. At 4:05pm on 12 Oct 2009, United Dreamer wrote:

    "Frankly, players should play for their country for nothing. Make that a policy then you might start to see who is loyal and who is greedy."

    It will be the FA that will rightfully seen as greedy. Although they might be able to afford a health farm for their referees although judging by Wiley's waistline we maybe should be paying them less.

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  • 84. At 4:06pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    It will probably stay up as long as the blue pill is still in your system RBA.

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  • 85. At 4:07pm on 12 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Infact i see this whole thread being removed fairly soon... which goes back to my colleagues, well thought out point.. Keep your footy and p0rn seperate...

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  • 86. At 4:08pm on 12 Oct 2009, United Dreamer wrote:

    "It will probably stay up as long as the blue pill is still in your system RBA."

    Bet you wish you took the red pill.

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  • 87. At 4:08pm on 12 Oct 2009, collie21 wrote:

    83 well in relation to what they get at club level, they do play for nothing. The greedy ones are those who cut short careers years before having to. Greedy and dumb.

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  • 88. At 4:08pm on 12 Oct 2009, jacksofbuxton wrote:

    Giles,Torres has picked up a knock as well.So that makes them a no man team.Mind you isn't that how they've started the season anyway?

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  • 89. At 4:08pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    I think that is where internet streaming comes into it's own. I read in FHM of an establishment in Prague where the ladies entertain for free as long as you agree to be filmed for internet streaming live or DVD.

    So there has to be someonme paying for it somewhere.

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  • 90. At 4:09pm on 12 Oct 2009, Spitfire wrote:

    I guess there are benefits of being mix-handed.

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  • 91. At 4:10pm on 12 Oct 2009, United Dreamer wrote:

    Adampsb are you on commission from the Czech tourist office?

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  • 92. At 4:10pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    You could always get someone to hold it for you

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  • 93. At 4:11pm on 12 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    You read that in FHM too Adam?

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  • 94. At 4:11pm on 12 Oct 2009, Toadflax wrote:

    I thought that UEFA/FIFA took a rather dim view of throwing things onto the pitch during matches, yet not a word have I seen of any offical reaction to the Ukrainian flares (sounds like the name of a dodgy 70s retro band). If this had happened at Wemberlee, England would have been docked points, forced to play behind closed doors or event kicked out of the competition. Not complaining about the result, but am somewhat mystified by the apparent inconsistency of the situation.

    The Blue Bell is a top alehouse, close to the cemetery and crematorium (no comments please) in God's Own City. Yes, God is a Smoggie,who has created an earthly paradise for his chosen people. However, we must have been a bit naughty once cos he's given us Gareth Southgate for a manager and Yorkies, Mackems and Monkey Hangers for neighbours. But I digress.

    My brother was barred out of the Blue Bell in the 1970s after putting "Little Old Wine Drinker Me" by Dean Martin on the juke box 20 times in a row. He was also barred out of the Rudds Arms in Marton (Captian Cook's local, just round the corner) for standing on a stool in the middle of the bar and playing Colonel Bogey on his trombone. How we laughed as we were hoyed into the street on that balmy Teesside evening.

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  • 95. At 4:11pm on 12 Oct 2009, Spitfire wrote:

    84. genius Gaz!



    Hope the wife is holding well.

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  • 96. At 4:11pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    It's called The Big Sister house Adam.

    A friend told me.

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  • 97. At 4:12pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    #91 - No Bouncing Czech's for me I'm afraid

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  • 98. At 4:13pm on 12 Oct 2009, United Dreamer wrote:

    Richbax it was the only flare shown from the England side all match. Maybe the fans were making some form of ironic gesture.

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  • 99. At 4:13pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    She's doing fine Spitfire, thanks for the thought.

    Back to work today. While I am on my first day of placement in a national daily newspaper. Where I am stuck at a desk doing nothing apart from post on this blog. Who says there's a decline in journalism.

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  • 100. At 4:14pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Gaz I hope your Big Sister isn't there or she'll hget told off.

    Also was your "friend" in the mirror this morning (the one on your wall not the paper)

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  • 101. At 4:14pm on 12 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    That was Joe Davis Roach gaz...

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  • 102. At 4:14pm on 12 Oct 2009, United Dreamer wrote:

    #97 - I tried to fight it but.... awesome.

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  • 103. At 4:16pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    What RBA? It was JDR who told me about The Big Sister house?

    He did mention it but he was disgusted at the repitition involved. Apparently you can get sick of the affore-mentioned jobs. Who knew!

    That and the girls were from the Northern Czech regions.

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  • 104. At 4:19pm on 12 Oct 2009, fedupwithelvs wrote:

    Online this was a failure but we will not be allowed to say that.
    Its like politicians if we disagree and say in fact that this online experiment failed we will just be told its a success shut up.

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  • 105. At 4:20pm on 12 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    gaz, i have read Joes Review of said house...

    “As felatio goes it is not of a bad standard, but some variation is what I am asking for, rather than the same tired out routine... Perhaps we could involve different characters? really use your talents...”

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  • 106. At 4:20pm on 12 Oct 2009, lammapugak wrote:

    Why must the English watch their team on national on TV? Same reason as the other wanna bees hope they get beaten.
    Course I'll be cheering and Brazil or Germany in the world cup when they play another home nation in a quarter final.

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  • 107. At 4:29pm on 12 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    I know that the Germans get coverage oh their national tv (ARD/ZDF among others) Why shouldn,t the English expect the same?

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  • 108. At 4:35pm on 12 Oct 2009, oncearedalways54 wrote:

    Robbo- some comical stuff in your blog!
    As for the match itself it was something of a non-event, as most people expected, hence the live only internet coverage (for the seriously deluded!)
    The only thing Capello might learn from this defeat is that England still don't know how to organise properly after we go down to ten men (and given our tournament history you can bet that in one match at least in SA, we will keep up this run) - also his (admittedly enforced) substitution was somewhat confusing - why Lennon?
    I thought John Terry 'went missing' at this stage (as Captain - not his overall play) and although its hard to tell from just watching highlights - the England team as a whole had the look of the proverbial 'Rabbit caught in the Headlights' for some time after Green was dismissed.
    Not what we have come to expect from the Capello team of late - will need some serious work.
    Rio and Ashley in particular had a 'bad day at the office' -even Johnson who looked very dangerous when he was 'bombing down' the right, made a 'pigs ear' of his crosses - and I lost count of the number of England free-kicks and corners which failed to beat the 'first man'- still we have till June to get it right, should'nt be too much trouble if everyone stays fit!.

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  • 109. At 4:35pm on 12 Oct 2009, dudepod45 wrote:

    Nice one, Robbo. By the way, it's pointless comparing Bent and Heskey because they're entirely different. Heskey's main job in the England team is to hold the ball up for the likes of Rooney to run on to. Bent also likes to play in the hole so if you pick Bent ahead of Heskey Capello will have to change the formation...

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  • 110. At 4:36pm on 12 Oct 2009, fedupwithelvs wrote:

    lammapugak
    Lets be honest the only team worth watching on TV is England regards the UK Its the BBC that has lost out not showing the England games another nail in the coffin of the licence fee.
    England pay the most get the least Europe is not happy with the situation.
    This would not happen in Germany and even the BBC has to obey the rules of Europe now.

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  • 111. At 4:38pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    108 - surely the solution to better crosses and better defending is to revert to the tried and trusted Neville - Beckham right hand side with Lennon as an impact sub

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  • 112. At 4:42pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Please please please, and I speak firmly with my Irish cap on here, can you all do whatever is in your power and make sure Adam's suggestion of Gary Neville starting in your World Cup 11 is made to come true.

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  • 113. At 4:44pm on 12 Oct 2009, TegsShrimpers wrote:

    I didn't bother. I didn't think it would be a good game. As soon as I saw the result I thought "yeah I was right, we've qualifed so just get the last matchesd over"
    But from this I take it England played well in the circumstances?

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  • 114. At 4:46pm on 12 Oct 2009, oncearedalways54 wrote:

    #111 adampsb - Neville and Beckham -now there's a thought!
    Spot on, but cannot see it becoming part of Mr Capello's master plan for SA- but who knows, perhaps he reads these posts??

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  • 115. At 4:48pm on 12 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    I'm pleased to see that posters on Robbo's blog have returned to meaningful comments abour soccer. For a while, certain contributors were concentrating lasciviously on shadier concerns.

    The decline began when Gaz commented on the the work of Irish priests in Africa, and collie21 provided a link to winners at Crufts .

    Speculation about the missionary position and doggy style clearly unhinged the more impressionable in our midst.

    Thankfully, that seems to be behind us.

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  • 116. At 4:48pm on 12 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Adam mate, I enjoy your posts & you always add something to the discussions, but why the totally Man Utd bias opion....Or was it a wind up?

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  • 117. At 4:49pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    #114 -0 I bet Sven's been reading these posts and is suddenly going on a "business trip" to Prague

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  • 118. At 4:50pm on 12 Oct 2009, Spitfire wrote:

    #115. Thankfully, that seems to be behind us.

    ----------------------------------------------------

    Still in doggy style then!

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  • 119. At 4:51pm on 12 Oct 2009, Spitfire wrote:

    Or could very well be spooning. Since its over 'n all.

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  • 120. At 4:51pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    #116 - several reasons -

    I'm a United fan and there is no English right back at Arsenal so no-one really more skillful than Neville,
    Johnson's rubbish and Beckham still crosses the ball better than anyone else.

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  • 121. At 4:52pm on 12 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Spitfire, you beat me to it.

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  • 122. At 4:53pm on 12 Oct 2009, Idioterna wrote:

    Basically if you want to watch the England game (or any others for that matter) live on the internt, there are hundreds that stream them (ant for example), usaully with appalling quality, but if you are prepared to wait a half hour it's just fine. Do your research and screw the terrestrial/satellite broadcasters.

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  • 123. At 4:55pm on 12 Oct 2009, Spitfire wrote:

    #121. Sorry.

    I have heard that one before.

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  • 124. At 4:55pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Now we are being asked to screw terrapins?

    Where will it all end.

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  • 125. At 4:55pm on 12 Oct 2009, collie21 wrote:

    105. At 4:20pm on 12 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    gaz, i have read Joes Review of said house...

    “As felatio goes it is not of a bad standard, but some variation is what I am asking for, rather than the same tired out routine... Perhaps we could involve different characters? really use your talents...”
    ----------------------------------------

    yep actually the guy is called Antonio Felatio he used to manage Parma, I think he will be next Irish manager after Trapp. :-) His teams are not great at getting it into the box but they certainly put their money where their mouth is :-)

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  • 126. At 4:58pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.

  • 127. At 5:00pm on 12 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Is it just me or has this blog turned it to "Carry On Robbo" either way good stuff...

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  • 128. At 5:00pm on 12 Oct 2009, collie21 wrote:

    pmsl gaz Yes Gary would be great in Defence, don't think Capello will fall it, but yer man Antonio might..

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  • 129. At 5:01pm on 12 Oct 2009, Spitfire wrote:

    #126. Think not many people can use the mouse with the left hand.

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  • 130. At 5:01pm on 12 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Adam, fair enough mate.
    But shouldn't club allegences(sp?) be put aside when it comes to the national team?

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  • 131. At 5:02pm on 12 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    125 collie21

    Younger readers would be advised to disregard the apparent connection between felatio and "putting their money where their mouth is".

    One activity is relatively harmless, whereas the other is decidedly unhygenic, and may make your teeth rattle.

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  • 132. At 5:04pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Zoot surely a man of your advanced years could take his teeth out beforehand?

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  • 133. At 5:05pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    #130 - yes to some extent but really who else is there at right back (well maybe Phil Neville or Micah Richards)

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  • 134. At 5:07pm on 12 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    I ask for succour.

    You give me "sucker".

    Whatever happened to compassion?

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  • 135. At 5:09pm on 12 Oct 2009, collie21 wrote:

    Zootmac that's the sort of passion yer man Antonio is famous for

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  • 136. At 5:10pm on 12 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    #133 Agreed there is not much choice, but with all due respect I think including the Nevilles would be a step in the wrong direction

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  • 137. At 5:10pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:

    Whatever happened to compassion?

    ----------


    It was accquired by Rupert Murdoch in 2006 and banished from view. Unless right wing politicians were caught en-flagrante, in which case it is given to them by the bucket load.

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  • 138. At 5:11pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    it became a northern stereotype and therefore wrong.

    The film Equilibrium gives the best insight I have seen to the world of JDR

    Well worth watching - unlike the prague streams which are to be joined in. Could be a new reality show though where blokes (and ladies)do their deeds, we vote and someone gets evicted from "The Big Sister House" or is that already on Channel 4?

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  • 139. At 5:13pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    #136 - what else to do then as the status quo is leaving us exposed _ Brown & Richards are really centre-backs, maybe one last hurrah for Gary Neville while Richard Eckersley at Burnley starts learning his stuff

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  • 140. At 5:13pm on 12 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    David James has been mentioned a couple of times. I thought that he was rather good against Ukraine. That, and Rooney's performance, were the highlights for me.

    Interesting to see how Argentina are holding onto qualification by a whisker. Brings home the fact that the World Cup is wide open next year, and that, despite Saturday night's hickup, England are well there.

    Think how close Australia came to winning last time. If you're there, and playing well, you're quoted.

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  • 141. At 5:13pm on 12 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Whatever happened to compassion?
    Doesn't she perform felatio on a pay per view website?

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  • 142. At 5:17pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    #141 - shocking that one...Not nearly as good as she said she was..

    Anyway off for a bit and you lot better not be smutty when I get back on (just in case my wife is reading all these posts and I get in trouble)

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  • 143. At 5:26pm on 12 Oct 2009, gosh wrote:

    Good to see you didn't pay to watch it. Anyone who is is an idiot because it will make the interent people keep putting it on the internet. If no one pays to watch it online they'll have to stop.

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  • 144. At 5:27pm on 12 Oct 2009, gosh wrote:

    Good to see you didn't pay to watch it. Anyone who did is an idiot because it will make the interent people keep putting it on the internet. If no one pays to watch it online they'll have to stop.

    Is what I meant to say

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  • 145. At 5:30pm on 12 Oct 2009, Starburst_995 wrote:

    My God ... I've been away for an hour or two and all the smut is still up lol.

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  • 146. At 5:34pm on 12 Oct 2009, waynedavid wrote:

    For those who say you cant watch it on tv but only on a small laptop screen, with most new tvs you can connect your laptop to them as I did and do not find a problem at all!
    it looked like a match that only Rooney cared about, Johnson - rubbish, Cole - ok, Terry - ok, Ferdinand - rubbish clearly should not have been playing as not match fit!

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  • 147. At 5:35pm on 12 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    144 - quite right

    i'd like to see Kentaro go bust on the back of this however there are plenty stupid people out there who will have paid for this. I fear it's just the start of such things.

    There are also, it seems, a few who think Gary Neville should be in the England team. Gary himself isn't one of them http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1218195/Gary-Neville-admits-England-days-Manchester-United-concentrates-Old-Trafford-career.html and thankfully Capello has more sense anyway.

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  • 148. At 5:36pm on 12 Oct 2009, cs15hammer wrote:

    The fuss people are making over a game being on the internet. Yes I would far prefer England to be on beeb or itv and yes they should be, but once they are not personally, i'd prefer to pay a fiver for the game i am most interested in and be able to choose them individually, rather than have to pay an expensive sky package every month to see those few games. Personally over the long term I find this approach a more inclusive way for people to be able to see the sports and games they most want to see at less of a cost.
    It wont suit everyone I know.

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  • 149. At 5:38pm on 12 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Zoot, speaking of Australia, I watched their game vs Holland (live on dutch tv) Saturday morning, and although the match was pretty uneventfull, there didn't seem to be the gulf in class between the teams that many would have expected.

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  • 150. At 5:38pm on 12 Oct 2009, Simon wrote:

    Good to see another one up in arms about the disgraceful internet match.

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  • 151. At 5:51pm on 12 Oct 2009, Wolves4CL wrote:

    #94 - Fair comment about the lack of response from FIFA at the flare-throwing. I got reprimanded by a passer-by once just for throwing money at a Ukrainian busker. I should add that he'd been playing the Godfather theme on a wheezy accordion under my office window for the best part of four hours and the money in question was rolled up in an old sock, but still, I ask you.

    Working in a pub not 10 miles from the Blue Bell in the 70s I was tempted to poison a local who played Hotel California on the juke box every 15 minutes. Looking back, the Whitbread Trophy he was drinking should have been enough on its own, judging by the dental carnage displayed by most of the punters. Happy days indeed.

    I love this blog. Correction - I think the blog's usually pretty good, but the comments section often has me in stitches. Brilliant entertainment, keep it up fellas!

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  • 152. At 6:12pm on 12 Oct 2009, frankfromyork wrote:

    Re #3

    The rights to this game belonged to the Ukraine FA not the English FA so they could sell them to whoever they like. As soon as England qualified the English TV companies did not want to know. You can bet that if England had to win or draw then Sky, BBC or ITV would have bid sufficient to get the match

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  • 153. At 6:35pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Is this a Northern Stereotype...

    http://failblog.files.wordpress.com/2009/10/epic-fail-viewing-areas.jpg

    If so, I'm moving there!

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  • 154. At 7:16pm on 12 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    Gaz, Leisure Services Division? Somebody was certainly tripping!

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  • 155. At 7:19pm on 12 Oct 2009, JoeDavisRoach wrote:

    A predictable enough theme from the Robbo factory but one than I suppose thats worth a mention. However the point was lost amidst the Northern gibberish speak and the poorly written and thought out blog. The base point had potential but the execution left plenty to be desired.

    First paragraph was standard "Robbos out of material and has to rely on the Blue Bell". It got better after than but any real point, opinion or argument that surfaced for air amidst the any roads, n alls, and nowts was drowned immediately by some pointless excursion to a poorly fitted one liner. No mention of Katie Price though unless she will be replaced by Cheryle Cole for the next couple of hundred blogs.

    Disappointing stuff Robbo.

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  • 156. At 7:24pm on 12 Oct 2009, yoponz wrote:

    Bryan Robson (or as the Blades fans called him at the end of his regime, Bryan N*bson) = t***er

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  • 157. At 7:35pm on 12 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    #155 - Would you like a hot apple pie with that?

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  • 158. At 7:37pm on 12 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    i find myself wondering: is this blog going downhill?

    perhaps i just need a break (don't start sobbing, you regulars!), but when the only thing of real interest is the pub photo, and Robbo's not around to stoke things, something ain't right.

    should games be on "proper telly" - of course...how is that even worthy of debate? next topic, please.

    if these things are going to continue to devolve into chatter about Gary Neville, pornography, and Slavic whores, then i think i'll leave you all to it (cue schoolboy comments)...

    no offense, though - it's not me, it's you

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  • 159. At 7:40pm on 12 Oct 2009, scorpiotoffeeman wrote:

    It made it much easier to steal the stream. But then again Robbo, if you couldn't even get your computer to work I'm sure you wouldn't think this was possible.

    The internet broadcast is a good thing, the signal is far easier to steal. Not a BBC type comment, they would have us believe the normal person can't access such things. well my 8 year old worked it out pretty quickly

    you shouldn't glorify technical ineptitude in this day and age.

    unless its rio 'lobbing' someone. lol

    funny article

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  • 160. At 7:45pm on 12 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    155 Joe

    A couple of blogs back, I indicated that I was attempting to launch a range of "TK Macs" - easily opening raincoats for ease of use by lecturers on the campus, named after Terence Kealey, the suggestive university don. As I said at the time, there were copyright issues because another clothing company had a similar name.

    It was all very frustrating.

    The funny thing is, I tried a relaunch, using the surname first - but was then informed that there was also a copyright issue, with the "KT price" label.

    I didn't understand why, until I read your informative posting.

    Thanks for that.


    158 Denis

    Downhill? What do you mean?

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  • 161. At 8:10pm on 12 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    Zoot, will your new Mac help supersize me?

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  • 162. At 8:11pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Zoot you should try using the sizes as a naming convention for your clothing line. Small and medium would be ok but you may have a problem with the Big Macs.

    Downhill also refers to the direction Arsenal have been going the last few years, although apparently they have been pirouetting and accomplishing some nice tucks and pikes on the way down.

    Probably why Denis is so upset.

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  • 163. At 8:17pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Denis what is wrong about chatting about Gary Neville...

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  • 164. At 8:18pm on 12 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    Zoot will know the answer to this age old question; have you got a light Mac?

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  • 165. At 8:32pm on 12 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    Gaz, you're offering up some great ideas here, you need copyright protection. It's certain that Malcom McDonald reads this blog and he'll be mentioning it to his brother Ronald. Next thing you know they'll have a Big Mac XL on the menu. Funny thing is, the new fad here is sliders, ie. three or four small burgers instead of one big one. Do they have them there yet? Maybe they're called "divers"?

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  • 166. At 8:47pm on 12 Oct 2009, Riggadon wrote:

    Tell it Robbo! Tell it!!!!

    Agreed with every word.

    What particularly made me laugh was that the pricing starts out at £4.99 for the early birds, and then jumps to a whopping £11.99 for those of us with weak constitutions and who have problems making decisions.

    Dithering over a decision is man's right, god damn it, I dont expect to be hit in the pocket for it, especially to that degree!! How on earth can they justify that change in price? I cant even think of a logical reason to do that, anyone got any idea's on it?

    Oh and make sure me message gets formatted properly, mate. Everytime I reply to a BBC blog, all the spaces get tekken out of me posts. I may have problems making decisions, but I know how to use the space-bar!!

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  • 167. At 8:56pm on 12 Oct 2009, collie21 wrote:

    Riggadon I reckon you have drinking in the space bar, the pricing follows the same method airlines have used for years.... it's rediculous but you see it's a thing called capitalism where a bunch of idiots give a load of money to spend to a bunch of idiots who in a round about way give it straight back to the first bunch of idiots who the following friday give it to second bunch of idiots again and so it continues till you retire and you are given your pension which is actually less than the bit the third bunch of idiots took of the load of money you were given in the first place, second place etc;...and they give it to you so you can go and give it back to the first bunch of idiots again.
    My solution is everything involving people should be free..

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  • 168. At 8:57pm on 12 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    look - i won't begrudge you guys your fun. i'm just not impressed by the level of play in here lately, and if i were the gaffer, i'd have us all running wind sprints 'til dark. too much chat room type stuff to sift through, too hard to get the "discussion" to change gears.

    adamp - it's only wrong when you bring up Gary freaking Neville every blog, often out of nowhere. he's about as relavent as chastity belts - how long ago did he retire? let it go, man.

    and for the last time - i love where the Arsenal are now, and i'm proud of their legacy of the last 15 years. Silverware is sooo secondary in my mind, and i know United fans can't understand that. Arsenal are known throughout the world to play the most beautiful style of football, and they will be remembered for that for ages, not because they followed an undefeated season (jealous?) with a relatively short run without trophies. Wenger has absolutely nothing left to prove, to the discerning football fan anyway.

    when discussing the legendary Holland teams of the 70s, do you say "eh, they weren't THAT good - they never won the World Cup"? please.

    on the contrary, i feel priveleged and proud to have supported Arsenal in this era.



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  • 169. At 9:03pm on 12 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Maybe McDonald's could produce a burger enhanced with Nootropics.
    They could market this, as a new range in their assortment, as brain food....
    Or simply call it the Zootmac.

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  • 170. At 9:06pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Denis I honestly can understand your perspective as Arsenal are playing excellent football and to be fair have been unlucky in losing the games they have. As for lack of trophies I don't think it is really that secondary but more a case of consoling yourself with the knowledge that you have watched a good match every time.

    I must say Wenger has unearthed a diamond in Vermaalen. As for the man Gary Neville he is relevant until we get someone better than Glenn Johnson

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  • 171. At 9:12pm on 12 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    170 You know I have a soft spot for Man U but come on, Denis is right on this, Neville is so far past his sell by date that they should give him away, hopefully to Bolton. We haven't had a Man U full back since Tony Dunne!

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  • 172. At 9:12pm on 12 Oct 2009, Riggadon wrote:

    Collie, class reply!! Made an old miserable bugger smile.

    Oh sorry, JDR's the old miserable bugger.

    Made this miserable bugger smile, anyway!

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  • 173. At 9:17pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    I've never understood this mentality from Arsenal fans.

    It's like saying you were going out with a supermodel for years but never got to do the horizontal mamba with her.

    Would you honestly feel that good about that!

    (And every time I hear about the Dutch team of the 70s it always includes how they didn't actually win anything. But then it's a British/and now Irish thing, after all Tim Henman is lauded isn't he.)

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  • 174. At 9:21pm on 12 Oct 2009, WhitleyBayWonTheVase wrote:

    I'm with Zoot on this.

    The world cup is wide open......for Spain to steam in and take it without playing to even half their potential. Brazil might cause them a few issues but other than that I can't see how they won't win it without someone crippling their squad the night before the final.

    On the subject of Argentina - even if they do qualify, don't expect to see Maradona in South Africa. At least not as the coach. The Argentine FA will be dispensing with his services once they know their fate. Rumour has it that he is a condemned coach walking and they're just waiting to announce his successor (widely tipped to be a man they're fired before!).

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  • 175. At 9:28pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    And now on top of all that is good about Whitley Bay we find out that it's a conduit to information coming out of Argentina.

    The house prices there must be through the roof.

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  • 176. At 9:33pm on 12 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Gaz, your super model analogy is amusing although not completly acurate, because we have done the "horizontal mamba" with her, just not recently.

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  • 177. At 9:39pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    But that's even worse H2H, you did it with her, you're still going out with her 4-5 years later and she hasn't let you do it again for that time.

    Ergo you must have been rubbish at it in the first place. Even though you lasted all night once.

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  • 178. At 9:41pm on 12 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    Gaz, we could probably have different views on the color a pitch should be, but this is too much!
    are you trying to tell me that the overwhelming perception, ie. the legacy, of the Cruyff and post-Cruyff Holland squad is largely negative? in other words: i say "Total Football" and you think "never amounted to much"? you're having a laugh, mate!

    it's really the classic journey/destination argument here... or if you insist on a sexual metaphor, you would be more accurate to suggest that Arsenal are like having a 4-hour tumble with a supermodel, only to be too knackered to finally "climax" (yes, i'd feel pretty alright, all-in-all!)
    but still, you'd be wrong - Arsenal have won quite a bit of your precious, precious silverware. if to you 4, 5, 6 years qualifies as an unforgiveable drought, then why don't you just go ahead and push Trotter into the Hudson River!

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  • 179. At 9:46pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Well Denis put it this way...

    Would you rather have won the Premiership for the last 3 years but not playing super fancy go nowhere football. Or would you rather be where you are now?

    Luckily for United fans we win it AND have some of the most exciting games in the season.

    And don't get stuck in extremes all the time. When you speak of 'Total Football' yes I might think of how great the Dutch looked, but at the end of the day 'Total Football' was an invented analogy because this was the only way they would be remembered, you couldn't say 'xxxxx Winners Holland' (where xxxxx is any major Championship name)

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  • 180. At 9:48pm on 12 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Ha ha, good comeback, but thats what being a fan is all about. For better or worse so to speak, or for bitter or worse as some sets of fans seem to be.(you know who you are)

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  • 181. At 9:53pm on 12 Oct 2009, Parish87 wrote:

    To be fair Cheryl Coles solo song is awesome.

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  • 182. At 10:11pm on 12 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    NOoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

    Don't let this happen, moderate him now before he infects everyone else

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  • 183. At 10:13pm on 12 Oct 2009, Al_Batch wrote:

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  • 184. At 10:29pm on 12 Oct 2009, Robbo Robson wrote:

    #47
    What are you suggesting re Mr. Williams, son? I saw X Factor and was struck by his jolliness, too. A bit jittery, but jolly. Hmmm...

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  • 185. At 10:33pm on 12 Oct 2009, Robbo Robson wrote:

    Re Strictly - well I'm out and proud on the matter... I like watching it, even if a bit of me dies every time them fellas doing the Latin stuff stick their backsides out like mooning footy fans on the coach home. That's not the way a bloke should be moving of a Saturday night.

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  • 186. At 10:34pm on 12 Oct 2009, Al_Batch wrote:

    Well I have read most of the comments here, which has consumed an hour of my time.

    I generally agree with Robbo's opinion of the match although I find them typifying English cynicism. We have a pretty good team at the moment but cannot expect 100% performance from every player every time we play.

    As for footy on the internet; I am English but live in Switzerland and watch TV on the interent all the time. The quality depends upon your connection speed, the providers speed, your PC speed and whether it is a streaming feed or a P2P. Most P2P is good as the more users the better as you are downloading and uploading at the same time.

    You can connect your PC to your TV also with an S-video cable (with a Scart adapter if required).

    There are many free legal TV sites on the internet, they will charge eventually for HD but profit while you can. I use zattoo, also for sports Justin can work well but logon 15mins before the event

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  • 187. At 10:37pm on 12 Oct 2009, Al_Batch wrote:

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.

  • 188. At 10:41pm on 12 Oct 2009, Al_Batch wrote:

    And I am gagging for a decent pint of Bass

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  • 189. At 10:41pm on 12 Oct 2009, TommyB wrote:

    I have to say I was glad to have read most of this post-watershed. The "horizontal mamba" indeed! I'd have thought that it would be more threatening when it was vertical.

    Adam, is Gary Neville paying you to work late? Although I'm usually a very reasonable LFC fan, I feel that in this case your Salfordian drivel should not go unpunished. There are a few too many verbally diarrhetic Mancs on these increasingly seedy pages, and I can't let TommyO have all the fun. I'm going to tell you a little secret now.... Glenn Johnson is actually rather good. Yes, he makes the odd mistake at the back, but in fairness he's not exactly the sole perpetrator, is he? I'm looking at you, Mr Ferdinand. Cashley was exactly the same when he started, and, let's be honest, Brazil have never been afraid of letting in a few with their attacking full-backs. It's the way of things when you are an forward thinking side. Also, Cole has Gerrard to help him by tracking back on the left. Johnson has Aaron Lennon (or whoever is la mode this week), which is hardly a reasonable situation. Now, I realise that I've left the door open somewhat there, so cue some incredibly perceptive, yet mutually exclusive, "Gerrard's rubbish" interspersed with "two man team" comments. That's ok, though. I'm not a proud man, and I won't judge any of you for being so silly.

    Now that we've sorted that out, onto Cole. Carlton that is. He's the only viable alternative to Heskey in that system, and if big Emile doesn't start getting regular first team footy, and more importantly performing well for the Villa, he will be replaced. I just think that Postman Fab is reckoning on the Candyman's experience, or maybe can't cope with the idea of picking Carlton, Joe and Ashley, then hearing a commentator say, "Cole, Cole, Cole" whilst practicing in front of a mirror, and having Andy appear up front in a vital quarter final against Brazil. The very thought makes me shudder.

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  • 190. At 10:46pm on 12 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    188 Al

    Where in Switzerland are you, and what's your pint when you're there?

    Cross-cultural, this is.

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  • 191. At 10:48pm on 12 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    Gaz - forget the invented terms "Total Football" or "Clockwork Orange" - that's nothing to do with the fact that they will be remembered far beyond the German and Argie teams who got the rub of the green in the Finals, and far beyond your current ManU squad because THEY CHANGED THE WAY PEOPLE LOOK AT AND PLAY THE GAME.

    again - you're analogy doesn't work for Arsenal, since they've won pretty recently, and without losing a single match, which you'd love to forget.
    yes, i'd rather be part of an irresistibly entertaining team like any of Wenger's - or a team that revolutionized how the game is played like Holland of that era.

    your team have played some great stuff at times AND won silverware - congrads! are all of the ManU teams that came just short completely worthless and embarrassing to you all? your whole attitude seems so cold and statistical, and well, German!

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  • 192. At 10:49pm on 12 Oct 2009, Al_Batch wrote:

    Guinness at the mo, Cafe du Cerf, Neuchâtel

    They have just put Boddingtons on draught but it tastes like my home brew.

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  • 193. At 10:50pm on 12 Oct 2009, Robbo Robson wrote:

    I've tried Swiss beer. I'm neutral on the subject.

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  • 194. At 10:54pm on 12 Oct 2009, Al_Batch wrote:

    # 193 Robbo, Feldschlossen and Cardinal beers are just fizzy coloured 5% water, No flavour.

    Unbelievably the Swiss team are top of their group!

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  • 195. At 10:57pm on 12 Oct 2009, Al_Batch wrote:

    And they are extremely happy with the Turkish performance, no more kicking matches in the tunnel

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  • 196. At 10:57pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Ze vay that I zee it iz that ze United teams that hav von ze trophies vill be remembered. Much like our great exulted leader who von so much ven he invaded....

    I've said too much.

    And no I don't forget that Arsenal went unbeaten a number of years ago (can't remember the year) but I also remember that United played the so-called Aristocrats of The Emirates off their newly manicured park oh about last April.

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  • 197. At 10:58pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Irish beer is neutral too.

    Well sometimes.

    If there's American beer that needs help we will do our best.

    Especially if it has to be transported via one of our airports.

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  • 198. At 10:58pm on 12 Oct 2009, Al_Batch wrote:

    # Ooooohhh how slow am i on your 'Neutral' comment, (Red face here)

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  • 199. At 11:02pm on 12 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    Ah. You stay in Newcastle.

    I rather like the Swiss pale beers, which are very Germanic in character. My favourite is bottled Calandabrau, which is brewed in Chur. It is the only remaining bottled beer which comes in a 58cl bottle (a pint). They all used to, because the market was dominated by British tourists, and the brewers put their beers into pint bottles to cater for it. Over the past decade, every other Swiss beer has moved to a 50cl bottle, but the bars charge the same for the smaller bottle.

    Calandabrau will go that way, eventually. Heinekin bought the brewery a couple of years ago. I'd recommend that you enjoy some large Calandabrau bottles whilst you still can.

    Great speaking French in Neuchatel: the locals speak slow, deliberate schoolboy French, unlike Paris, and you've got a fighting chance of understanding what's going on.

    Boddingtons never did travel.

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  • 200. At 11:05pm on 12 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    so you admit to having "cleansed" the memory of non-title winning seasons from the public record!

    actually, ManU's treble-winning season is the only one worthy of the Gaz seal of approval, no?

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  • 201. At 11:06pm on 12 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    Robbo - back to my original beer question please? the tasty looking pint in your photo is.....

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  • 202. At 11:08pm on 12 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    I thought that was Robbo's urine sample.

    He's not well, that lad.

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  • 203. At 11:10pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    No, when did I say that.

    I said that the teams that won the title will be remembered more than the ones that didn't.

    And that's the way it should be.

    No matter what some French person tells you.

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  • 204. At 11:11pm on 12 Oct 2009, Al_Batch wrote:

    Hmmmm Calandabrau is ok for 1 or 2 but not for a session, my local has over a hundred different beers www.cafeducerf.com the boddies in cans is ok but the draught Guinness is excellent.

    Et oui le français à Neuch est très façile.

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  • 205. At 11:15pm on 12 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    If you REALLY want beer you have to go here....


    http://www.yardhouse.com/


    Look under Menu and then Beer, all on draught. They even do tours of their plumbing. Which kind of brings back that supermodel theory of mine. If you don't tour the plumbing does it mean that you haven't sample the beer?

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  • 206. At 11:21pm on 12 Oct 2009, Al_Batch wrote:

    Looks an interesting pub but do they show UK footy?

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  • 207. At 11:57pm on 12 Oct 2009, collie21 wrote:

    Got to say in 30 years no one will talk about Arsenals last 5 years as beautiful football period......utter rubbish...
    Wenger will be fired soon if he isn't careful. It's trophies that count always has been and to steal the analogy Gaz used, Arsenal are in danger of becoming England, like your bird was once a porn star and now she is in an old folks home...still beautiful because of all the plastic surgery but not up for much......
    If you are not scoring and winning then you may as well not score in the first place folks. I refer you all to the many previous posts about one handed ness , well it smacks of trophyless.

    There is no beer in the south of france..............
    Belgian Stella is the closest I have come to good beer outside of Ireland

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  • 208. At 00:01am on 13 Oct 2009, TommyB wrote:

    Denis, Gaz... The very fact that "Total football" is a well-worn phrase, almost a cliché, is because of that beautiful, but trophy-less, Dutch side of the 70s. So I think Gaz is probably wrong in the respect that the trophy-winning sides are always more memorable because the Dutch, in recent years Arsenal, and to a certain extent Clough's Forest (a league title and 2 European cups in a two year period and a considerable number of barren seasons afterwards) are not the trophy machines like Liverpool, Man Utd, Germany, Argentina, Real Madrid, etc etc, but have certainly made a significant impact on the game. However equally, to not win trophies and be remembered is certainly a trickier business, and you must be truly outstanding to achieve such legendary status without the silverware to back it up.

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  • 209. At 00:02am on 13 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    Denis, Go on, drag me into it why don't you? First of all, the Dutch stole the total football concept from Bolton, not a lot of people know this but now you're amongst the educated few. They had spies at Burnden Park throughout the 60's and 70's. Some thought it was 'old dutch pies' they were advertising but now the truth is out.

    Secondly, each Bolton point costs about 30 quid. Only Whitley Bay spend less per point. The big four spend upwards of a half million quid per point.

    Success for us is measured only in terms of how many F.A. cups we can win per century, that's what really counts.

    Swiss beer. Ooofa, it was in the 70's that me and my two brothers were traveling from Germany, through Switzerland to France. We stopped for dinner and then hit a club, 16 quid for a bottle of beer. We got ejected all the same (not from the club, from Switzerland). It wasn't our fault mind you, we were provoked by the Germans on that occasion!

    Robbo, here's the wiring layout that Carly's chap needs to follow next time he tries to hook up the tele to the internet...

    http://www.electronichouse.com/images/uploads/ways_not_wire_system.jpg

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  • 210. At 00:08am on 13 Oct 2009, Spitfire wrote:

    And replace Wenger with whom?

    Name one person capable of single handedly building a club, not just a team, a stadium or 'some' trophies, but the lot with the budget he has.

    It hurts that Arsenal havent won anything the past 4 years but would I stop watching every single game they play? No.

    Sure it could and should have been better but you know what? That's fine by me.

    English football will be at a loss without the Frenchman.

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  • 211. At 00:08am on 13 Oct 2009, TommyB wrote:

    16 quid for a bottle of beer? Sounds like Dubai airport. And Glastonbury. Grrrr....

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  • 212. At 00:14am on 13 Oct 2009, DennyCraneWHU wrote:

    I rarely criticise accomplished bloggers such as yourself, but here we go...

    There is a danger you are becoming a parody of yourself, and a parody of a parody is, well...

    If this is criticism then it is meant as illustrative criticism.

    Perhaps you could let one of your relatives write the next few columns? Your Aunt’s boy Ted who does something financial in the City and who’s threatening the downfall of financial civilisation as we used to know it.

    Perhaps an extremely billionaire casting a purchasing eye over distressed clubs, all the time complaining about everything he surveys, except the curvaceous receptionist at PerenniallyStruggling United.

    Perhaps cameos from people you have known who could sub for you whilst stuck in the Bluebell loo, struggling with a dodgy kebab and insufficient loo paper.

    Go to it, my son.

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  • 213. At 00:15am on 13 Oct 2009, TommyB wrote:

    207

    If you're ever in Belgium, try the Delerium Tremens. Lovely drop. It's 8 or 9% if I remember right so you'll not be walking home whether you want to or not. And another bonus is that no wives, children or passers-by need fear your desire to initiate fisticuffs, unlike with the Stella.

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  • 214. At 00:18am on 13 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    211 Aye Tommy, and that was in the late 70's! Same price at the Piccadily Hotel in London for a bottle of Pilsner in 1984 (including room service fees).

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  • 215. At 00:19am on 13 Oct 2009, DennyCraneWHU wrote:

    But then again, with 212 replies, maybe it's you who's getting it right and not me.

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  • 216. At 00:23am on 13 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    In Belgium you have to go to Momignies (sp) for some Trapiste beer, mind blowing! The monks that brew the stuff purchased 50% of a failing glass factory we used to visit there, the government the other 50%. No wonder it was failing. It turned around though, all the beer bottle sales probably helped! Like a Barley wine I recall but by the pint, I shudder at the memory!

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  • 217. At 00:24am on 13 Oct 2009, TommyB wrote:

    You've stayed in the Piccadilly Hotel? All airs and graces aintcha, Mr Trotter! Glad that's inclusive of room service fees. Crikey, I nearly spilled my cocoa.

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  • 218. At 00:26am on 13 Oct 2009, TommyB wrote:

    Or should that be my Delerium Tremens?

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  • 219. At 00:30am on 13 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    Yes indeed, a complete secretarial cock up on the booking front but 'dems da breaks! My boss at the time laughed at the 8 bottles of beer on the room service charges!

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  • 220. At 00:43am on 13 Oct 2009, Oskar_the_dog wrote:

    Dunno what all the fuss is about. Down here in New Zealand I watched the whole match live on Sky (via ESPN) while sitting propped up in bed having just finished breakfast enjoying a nice cuppa (Twinings English Breakfast tea, what else).

    My only complaints were the perennial ones with ESPN ... a 4.3 format which leaves half the 16.9 plasma wasted space; why they refuse to tell you who's on the subs bench before the match starts so I can mentally start replacing whoever is failing to impress on the left side this time; and commentators who will tell you anything during play except the only thing I want to know: Who is that player actually kicking the ball as we watch - especially the one who just turned the defence inside out with such artistry? - cos I could see him playing for Arsenal next season.



    So sorry you missed out guys, but there has to be some compensation for being the wrong side of the globe during the football season. Although I have to admit there's a lot to be said for enjoying my football at such a civilised hour (most games are live and I record games played during the night our time for replay with my breakfast).

    I can't remember missing an Arsenal game in years - although there are a few I wish I had! Sadly the England/Ukraine game reminded me altogether too much of the 2006 CL final when Lehmann did a Robert Green even earlier in the match and Barcelona finally ran us down after we'd led till late in the game.

    Next time you're dudded on an important game give me a call and I'll save a space next to me. especially if you're young, fit and female ;)

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  • 221. At 00:50am on 13 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    I´m in Belgium quite often & have sampled many of their beers.
    The strongest, as far as I can remember, were Bush Prestige, Black Albert and Oerbier 'Special Reserva'.
    These bad boys were all 13%. Lethel.

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  • 222. At 01:04am on 13 Oct 2009, DennyCraneWHU wrote:

    Have you noticed how alcohol strength for some people equates to masculinity?

    Well I drink a German beer called Clausthaler. Because my liver can't take it, it has zero alcohol. Beat that, lol!

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  • 223. At 01:12am on 13 Oct 2009, Bantam_Doonhamer wrote:

    I was in Bruges a couple of months ago, had a few good beers but can't remember what any of them were. I did enjoy them though. I think.

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  • 224. At 01:57am on 13 Oct 2009, NEARPOSTHEADER wrote:

    What is all the fuss about? I watched it on TV; great picture, no extra cost. I did miss Green's sending off as I had the let the water man in - he always passes by on Saturday mornings.

    Oh yeah, I live in Mexico.

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  • 225. At 02:00am on 13 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    collie21 wrote:
    Got to say in 30 years no one will talk about Arsenals last 5 years as beautiful football period......utter rubbish...
    Wenger will be fired soon if he isn't careful. It's trophies that count always has been and to steal the analogy Gaz used, Arsenal are in danger of becoming England, like your bird was once a porn star and now she is in an old folks home...still beautiful because of all the plastic surgery but not up for much......
    If you are not scoring and winning then you may as well not score in the first place folks. I refer you all to the many previous posts about one handed ness , well it smacks of trophyless.

    ----------------------------------------------------

    oh my word, what a bunch of garbage... so lame, in fact, that it damages Gaz's argument by association.

    please don't start me on Belgian beer, people - i get weak in the knees!

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  • 226. At 03:10am on 13 Oct 2009, redforever wrote:

    A photograph of a laptop outside of a pub with a pint next to it, does not prove that you are a man of the people, "Robbo".
    Whining about the advance of technology and how you havent kept up, does nothing to improve the perception that football fans are anything more than dumb hooligans.
    Its time to move on from this fake colloquial blog act, reveal yourself and go home. I'm betting you're Dick Emery.

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  • 227. At 04:10am on 13 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    222 Denny, check that label on your Clausthaler, it's the best tasting of those beers because it isn't alcohol free. It was 0.5% when I last looked. 8 bottles of that is equivalent to 1/2 a pint of 4% beer. 16 to a pint, 160 bottles to a good night out. I only tell you this because I'm worried about being offered your liver in a transplant one day.

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  • 228. At 05:34am on 13 Oct 2009, ZEUSFC wrote:

    24#

    actually i can beat you on that one... we watched an Ukraine v England, in an Aussie bar, in Cyprus, on a Korean TV, using a Japanese Satellite system, stealing a Saudi TV signal via an American ISP...

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  • 229. At 06:27am on 13 Oct 2009, Spitfire wrote:

    228. why would you need an ISP AND the satellite system of the TV?

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  • 230. At 07:31am on 13 Oct 2009, Starburst_995 wrote:

    #210 all those acheivments and you didn't mention his finest.

    Les Invincibles: They year he won the title with his team finishing unbeaten that season. One hell of a feat that was, and that's coming from a Spurs fan ;)

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  • 231. At 07:37am on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Keep this to yourselves but I am actually not fond of the taste of beer. Also cats make my eyes water and get really itchy.

    So I am the only Irishman who doesn't like beer and is allergic to pussy. If it gets out there's a chance I could be deported.

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  • 232. At 07:39am on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    #230 Starfire

    Whoever it is you are talking about probably didn't mention the invincibles because Denis talks about it on avergage every 3.7 seconds. As do most other Arsenal fans. Oh to have something so great to remember. Us United fans have to stick with our haul of Premierships and even a European Cup since then. It's hell.

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  • 233. At 08:17am on 13 Oct 2009, DennyCraneWHU wrote:

    227 Trotter,

    Thx for the advise, but Clausthaler is actually LESS than 0.5%, and some countries even allow it to be described as non-alcoholic.

    Because I am not drinking to get drunk I rarely drink more than three bottles.

    You are correct about not taking my liver, but if offered my brain, take it, but alas, not my football, which is in the liver category, lol.

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  • 234. At 08:40am on 13 Oct 2009, Starburst_995 wrote:

    You think you have it hard Gaz, all us Spurs fans have is a League cup and 5th place for two years in a row to console ourselves with haha.

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  • 235. At 09:24am on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Denis,

    If Wenger is fired then maybe Guus Hiddink may be an option for Arsenal as he instils good football and wins trophies.

    I came across this post on Paul Fletchers blog and it was so funny I have to share it with you.

    36. At 08:00am on 13 Oct 2009, The Hand Of Hidden Forces - !! WDB !! wrote:
    Those "in the know" are already making it clear that the so-called "Munto Finance" is in fact a front for individuals of a very shady nature indeed. They are speaking of half-seen forms, of hideous rasping voices, of reptilian aliens with electronical eyes and an utter disregard for human culture. *They will not laugh at our jokes*

    Those-in-the-know, however, are merely using this story to prepare earth for the "real" truth. Munto Finance, while appearing to be a corporate concern involving multiple individuals, is in fact the protrusion into this dimension of a single Cthulhoid entity of incalculable scope and unimaginable evil.

    Eriksson's entire life has been nothing but an infant's game, to prepare him to act as Its herald: his genetic blueprint was designed millennia ago, for this end alone. Sol Campbell (i.e. the "defender" of the "Sol" system) will now lead the people of Earth in a desperate resistance movement, to regain their rightful inheritance in the face of this Transdimensional Abomination. Viva Gaia! Long live the Resistance!

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  • 236. At 09:35am on 13 Oct 2009, snifferg wrote:

    I agree that in an ideal world then all England games should be on terrestrial TV but I don't agree about your comments on the internet stream - mine was fine and never jumped or froze once in the whole transmission. I could even watch it from my sofa on my 22in monitor. It was also only £11.99 on the day of the game - I got it for £4.99 earlier in the week.

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  • 237. At 09:38am on 13 Oct 2009, kenny_burns_kneecap wrote:

    #226
    Get it up ya.
    Millions without computers. Millions without broadband. Millions not computer literate. Tellies everywhere, plasmas, massive LCDs, projectors & HD bought by your average hard working bloke particularly to watch the footy. And how many women want to watch a streamed game in such low resolution where even Frank Lampard's massive rear end is encompassed by one mere pixel? Even the cctv footage of Gerrard engaged in an incredibly effective bout of 'self defense' was of better quality than the streamed England game. And he got off. You hunch alone over your sticky laptop, I'll be down the pub or inviting the lads around to watch the games on the big telly.
    Disgusted,
    Nottingham.

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  • 238. At 10:01am on 13 Oct 2009, Zidanepirouette wrote:

    Cheryl Cole was on the radio this morning, she simply couldn't grasp that there was anything wrong with singers miming on stage, and claimed that she didn't notice it when it occured. Says a lot really.

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  • 239. At 10:07am on 13 Oct 2009, blogdignag wrote:

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.

  • 240. At 10:22am on 13 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    239 blogdignag

    Well expressed. But Lily put it better.

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  • 241. At 10:22am on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    239... your post is like evolution? It starts of with "bin" reading and "my boy he play for" then it ends with "reality is merely an a priori adjunct of non-naturalistic ethics"... I know form the gist of your post, our boysclub antics are an axe for you to grind, i can understand and appreciate that, (we did take a blog on webcast football and turn it into a debate about czech bordellos)... but i just have to say if it was intended or not... Your post is brilliant.

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  • 242. At 10:31am on 13 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    Hello! What happened to blogdignag?

    And I was just about to respond to his request for a poem with "Hegel, don't bother me."

    I'll put that down as a missed opportunity.

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  • 243. At 10:32am on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    I missed it :(

    It must have been good if it brought Zoot and RBA out to reply at the same minute!

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  • 244. At 10:35am on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    I got a post removed yesterday because it had the word ********* in it. (Obviously that isn't very helpful to you, but the word is the title of the person who removes posts from here.)

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  • 245. At 10:35am on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Blogdignag - does the occasional reference to the intellectual disco masters that are the Pet Shop Boys not satisfy you?

    We could reference Noel Coward, George Orwell (in fact we have done) Edgar Allan Poe and even Charles Dickens, Wilkie Collins or Dr Who but that would detract from the main point of the blog which is: -

    Football
    Rafa/ LFC baiting
    Praise Gary Neville
    Resist all attempts by JDR and followers to turn this into a serious topic filled blog
    Name calling
    Associated non-football based amusing jokes.

    Hegels phenomology of spirit covering evolution of consciousness from sense-perception to absolute knowledge was flawed due to his argument that knowledge was only found through sense. Similar in his thoery to Schrodinger that something only existed if it was observed at first hand. Also his switching of negative to synthesis to connect the abstract to the concrete was viewed as a bit dubious although he had a good argument to support it.

    Existentialism is a more suited concept based on Sartre's lectures especially his rejection of determinism embodied in the phrase Man first of all exists, encounters himself, surges up in the world - and defines himself afterwards

    Ask yourself the question - is a teacup a teacup if you don't drink tea from it? or if there are no tea drinkers. If you drank tea using a bucket and spade would it then be a tea-bucket?

    And more importantly (if you have ever seen the film It Couldn't Happen Here) what roadside cafe serves Oysters in crushed ice with seaweed trimmings and fingerbowls, Fillet of Sole Belgique and Chateau La Tour 1942 cos I've never seen one.

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  • 246. At 10:36am on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

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  • 247. At 10:37am on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Ah man... that was a great post as well! Blogdagnabit, should be his name from now on... And yes Zoots... some good sychronised posting.

    YOu still geta shilling for each post?

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  • 248. At 10:38am on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    He boasted about retrospectively having posted a comment saying first comment and therefore the moderators having missed that have exacted some sort of cold-blooded revenge. Which is a shame as my reply won't make as much sense without his post.

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  • 249. At 10:42am on 13 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    To those of you not convinced about the merits of Clausthaler, might I recommend its polar opposite, Vladtimpaler.

    Whereas Clausthaler comfortingly goes down the back of your throat with a nice steak, and eventually emerges at the other end in the form of a log, Vladtimpaler...

    Hang on. Is that how you spell "stake"?

    Better get back to my master plan to open up a chain of philosophical bunshops, with non-naturalistic ethical ingredients, called "Hegel's Begels".

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  • 250. At 10:43am on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Like you're posts ever make any sense Adam! Well that's what Denis says anyway.

    And you are not allowed to use the 3rd word on the 2nd line of your post, that's what I got one removed for yesterday.

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  • 251. At 10:44am on 13 Oct 2009, megaforest1 wrote:

    First things first, good blog. I always read them, and enjoy them.

    The second point is then that I don't normally comment, but I would like to put an opinion of how I see things being in the future. Its been said before in some papers etc, so maybe not new news or information to some of you, but none the less I want to post it.

    Recently in our game we see multi millionaires buying up and spending money like crazy on our football teams. This is mostly in the premiership, but also in the Championship as well as also Notts County.

    The question is then, why? Is our game becoming a breeding ground for bored multi millionaires to just spend because they want to out perform their fellow rich owners clubs? Or, is there something else.
    The reason I ask is why now? People with money have been around for ages, so why the interest in football?
    Also, people with stupid amounts of money (unless born into it of course) have this money through sheer hard graft, some luck maybe but most of all determination to make more MONEY.
    And that thrill of making money does not go away. Why do people like Alan Sugar keep working when he can eaily buy a small island to retire on? The thrill of money.

    Bear with me on this, I am getting to a point topical to the blog.

    Taking my above statement/opinion into account, then think about the brading of the premiership, and the global possibilities of this being available to all home accross the world.
    The best way into peoples homes is the internet, not TV.

    My prediction is that soon in a few years, there wont be a Sky TV package as we know it. I predict the clubs will slowly break away from this, broadcasting their own pay per view games via the net for anyone accross the world to buy.
    IF this DOES happen. Just think of the money making potential here.

    Does anyone else agree with this theroy that this is all a plan towards this internet end game to rake in all the cash for the clubs individually themselves?

    The England game was a dip in the toe from the FA. If the premiership goes this way, or indeed the championship and other clubs around the world, then they will see the ££££'s from doing it themselves. Ok, England as a football team is not a global brand, but would be available to everyone.

    As a country we are squeezing the fans now. We pay for a TV licience, broadband fees, digital cable TV susbscriptions, and now we are expected to pay for individual matches too?
    Where does it end?

    I would be interested to hear if anyone else shares this view.
    This country and certainly football is losing itself and alienating the one thing that makes it so great. Us, the people and the fans.

    Personally I will never pay to watch any England game, be that on TV or internet. England (or any country for that matter) should be free on TV we already pay for, for the millions to watch, support and get behind.

    I for one feel cheated by this, and even though I am only one person, I ask all of you that this strikes a chord with to never pay for an England game online.

    One thing remains that we can control. Without the money it will not exist. They need us, the fans to provide the money and interest.

    This may sound a bit heavy, but hopefully it reflects how sad I feel toward our national game right now in a time when we should be optimistic.


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  • 252. At 10:45am on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Moderator, Moderator, Moderator!

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  • 253. At 10:45am on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    One just appeared behind me....

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  • 254. At 10:48am on 13 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    RedBlue

    Yep. Still a shilling a go. I'm thinking of changing my username to bobablogdignag.

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  • 255. At 10:50am on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Gaz - teh word shop is enough to get me moderated - shocking that is.

    As for megaforests comment if Unites switch to internet broadcasting I'm not watching it, partly out of principle but mainly cos I can't get the kids off the computer

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  • 256. At 10:50am on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Zoot I was thinking of opening a philosophical chain of Spud-u-like clones called "Plato's Pot-at-oes".

    But it would require a very 'complicated' oven.

    How about a sports wear retailer called "On Your Marx" where everything is the same price?

    Probably not good business sense.

    Ah screw it, fast food is always the way to go. So look forward to a branch of "Nietzsche's Pizzas" coming your way soon, where you are entirely responsible for whether you like the food or not.

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  • 257. At 10:52am on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Well go carefull Zoots as JDR is changing his name to "nagatblogalongtime". I would hate to get the 2 of you confused... plus robbo may inadvertantly send your commision to Joe.

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  • 258. At 11:02am on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    I think Joe is paid for average length of post and number of realted responses which explains why his posts are infrequent, very long and controversial.

    I am currently in the pay of Gary Neville, Chris Lowe and some Slavic ladies of dubious acquaintance

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  • 259. At 11:04am on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    As I have previously paid Slavic ladies of dubious acquaintance substantuail amounts of money then logic dictates Adam that I actually own you. Surely?

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  • 260. At 11:06am on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    OMG!! I have found a REAL video of JDR.

    This is not one of mine, it's actually him, it has to be, here is is complaining about people complaining. I always knew he was an xBox person! Never had him for an American though.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WomBFQQ6KqI

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  • 261. At 11:17am on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    #289 - No don't be silly - They're paying upwards not down. - Benefits package would be interesting though

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  • 262. At 11:17am on 13 Oct 2009, meartbass wrote:

    Hello troops,

    In regards to showing the england games on council telly, i agree wholeheartedly it should always be shown! Unfortunately i think it is just one of these things that happen, we've not had a Scotland game on normal telly for years, so i feel your pain. I'm not sure about Wales, but they more than likely have the same issue.

    I say revolution!!

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  • 263. At 11:20am on 13 Oct 2009, Starburst_995 wrote:

    @ 243

    Well, moderators to you too Gaz :P

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  • 264. At 11:32am on 13 Oct 2009, Zidanepirouette wrote:

    Megaforest1, nice to read a post that isn't a contiunation of the banal and boring bickering between a few people with too much time on their hands (GazUtd).

    Yes i can definitely forsee a time when the internet takes over as the main source of live top-flight football coverage in Europe. Clubs already have their own websites which stream friendlies and reserve matches, and it can't be long before the very richest clubs with the biggest fan-bases break-away from TV deals and utilise this source to increase income for themselves.

    With regards to the national team, we should consider ourselves lucky that the World Cup and Euros are on the A-list of the government's sporting events and not gone the way of test cricket. To not be able to watch live Ashes cricket this summer on terrestrial TV was an absolute disgrace. However, i believe this decision is an anomaly (the ECB pressed for exclusion of test cricket from the a-list) and that it is extremely unlikely the powers-that-be will ever let the major international football tournaments become unavailable on free-to-air television.

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  • 265. At 11:37am on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Another poster with a wrestling related name insulting me. Hmmm, interesting. And I actually like wrestling.

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  • 266. At 11:42am on 13 Oct 2009, Zidanepirouette wrote:

    Gaz, i picked on you cos i presume from your name you're a man utd fan. That was the deciding factor :-)

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  • 267. At 11:43am on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Real Madrid already do their own pay deal as do Barcelona which is why hardly anyone else ever wins the Spanish League

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  • 268. At 11:49am on 13 Oct 2009, captainlazytim wrote:

    adamspb

    I seem to pick on you, but this question:
    WHY WON'T CAPELLO PICK DARREN BENT AHEAD OF HESKEY.
    which needs a question mark, by the way, is stupid.

    Heskey is a target striker who allows Rooney and Gerrard space to play. Bent is a goalscorer, and although he may get a couple, he will hurt our best players performence in comparison to Emile.

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  • 269. At 11:56am on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    #268 - punctuation is unimportant - simply because I forgot your going down the same slippery slope of pedantism that Ira was on.

    To respond while Heskey is a good target man bent can also play that role and can score goals, he is fast, a good header of the ball, stays on his feet and contributes very well. His goals per game ration is decent. The fact that an injury pronr John Carew keeps Heskey out of the Villa side says all you need about his finishing ability. Goals win games and at the moment of Rooney misfires we've got problems

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  • 270. At 12:09pm on 13 Oct 2009, captainlazytim wrote:

    108 - surely the solution to better crosses and better defending is to revert to the tried and trusted Neville - Beckham right hand side with Lennon as an impact sub

    No criticism required.

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  • 271. At 12:15pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    because it is the truth and the truth will set you free.

    Lennon has only had 1 good game this qualifying campaign, SWP has been consistently poor, Walcott too injured which leaves DB7. As for right back givcen Johnson has looked dodgy recently why not give Red Nev the chance to prove he can still cut it at international level. At the very least it gives us a plan B if there are injuries or general loss of form

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  • 272. At 12:18pm on 13 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    269. At 11:56am on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:
    His goals per game ration is decent......
    I know you were talking about Bent, & I realise that this is of course a typo, but you have just described Heskey"s striking ability perfectly...
    "goals per game ration"...brilliant.

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  • 273. At 12:25pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    One does one's best.

    It is like a ration isn't it - do you think he alternates with John Terry and says I've scored 7 John your turn and won't score again until Terry is level (needs 1 more goal)

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  • 274. At 12:27pm on 13 Oct 2009, captainlazytim wrote:

    179 GazUtd

    you need to learn about about Dutch football, try Brilliant Orange, by someone Winner. Might be able to make a comment that is more informed then, eh?

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  • 275. At 12:34pm on 13 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    I've got nothing against Heskey & he does play his part.

    However, having a non scoring striker seems to me as being the equivalent of having an one armed goalkeeper.....It could work but there always apears to be something missing.

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  • 276. At 12:39pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    Football is a team game, England are Top scorers in World Cup qualifying with Heskey in the side and Fabio Capello rates him.

    The clues are all there.

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  • 277. At 12:41pm on 13 Oct 2009, Starburst_995 wrote:

    At 12:39pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyOnion wrote:

    Football is a team game, England are Top scorers in World Cup qualifying with Heskey in the side and Fabio Capello rates him.

    ------------------------------------

    Are we? :O

    *picks jaw off of the floor*

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  • 278. At 12:45pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    The clues are lso there for the question did George Mallory summit Everest before Edmund Hillary but without definitive proof we'll never know.

    I accept that in qualifying it has worked but there were a couple of very easy chances against Croatia that he missed and I think against better teams we will be found out if he can't convert those.

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  • 279. At 12:48pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    If you're relying on Heskey scoring lots of goals you're not understanding why he's in the team.

    All strikers miss chances, Heskey especially but Rooney and Owen before him score a lot more goals when he's in the team.

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  • 280. At 12:50pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    I understand why he is in the team and what he does I just think it will come unstuck in South Africa.

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  • 281. At 12:52pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    277. At 12:41pm on 13 Oct 2009, Starfire_995 wrote:

    Are we? :O

    *picks jaw off of the floor*
    ------------------------------------------

    yes

    we've scored 31, next best is Germany with 25, Spain with 23

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  • 282. At 12:53pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    280. At 12:50pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    I understand why he is in the team and what he does I just think it will come unstuck in South Africa.


    it may well do - doesn't mean Heskey isn't still the best choice

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  • 283. At 1:30pm on 13 Oct 2009, Virtual_Doctor wrote:

    You might call it "Heskey bashing" but there is a reason for it. He's no good at football - how he bacame a pro god only knows!!!

    I can't understand how anyone can can have anything good to say about him to be honest. He's a big massive bloke who is petrified of his own shadow... When a big long ball comes to him - he knocks it on for other strikers agreed - if they can catch it before it goes for a throw or a goal kick!

    Everyone i know calls him "lino" - because he spends most of his time on the floor :)

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  • 284. At 1:40pm on 13 Oct 2009, TheOriginalTony wrote:

    Capello can't tell Beckham he has to be playing in a european league to get into the squad and then pick Heskey when he's not playing at all

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  • 285. At 2:02pm on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Heskey... no, Bent.. no definately Heskey... ah, but Bent is good... what about Heskey... HeskeyBentHeskeyBentHesky!!!!!!

    Its simple.... Neither! Get Super Shots Striker (Magic) Marvin Morgan on board... He's banging them in for us this season... He can hold up players and make space for fellow strikers like Heskey, plus he can make runs, head the ball and SCORE like Bent can... Cappello you know this makes sense!

    Problem solved...

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  • 286. At 2:08pm on 13 Oct 2009, oldstafford wrote:

    RBA any candidates from Aldershot for the right back position?

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  • 287. At 2:10pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    RBA have you been listening to Goldie Lookin Chain records again? Michel Owen is a better replacement (I think he has actually made more club appearances thi sseason than Heskey as well)

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  • 288. At 2:14pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:

    274. At 12:27pm on 13 Oct 2009, captainlazytim wrote:
    179 GazUtd

    you need to learn about about Dutch football, try Brilliant Orange, by someone Winner. Might be able to make a comment that is more informed then, eh?


    ----------

    Ah the classic "I'll insult you to let you know that I know more than you" line.

    I know that the Dutch didn't win anything. That's the point. It doesn't matter how great they were (which no one is denying), they didn't win a trophy. And no matter what anyone says the point of football is to win trophies.

    And there is no way I am ever buying a book entitled 'Brilliant Orange'. I'd never be able to show my face in Northern Ireland again.

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  • 289. At 2:26pm on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Sorry Staff, no more secrets from The Rec... I’m hoping to lure Capello to a home game so don’t want to give away to much... Marvin Morgan though has become such a hero in town, that one of the lifts in the Wellington Centre (high end shopping centre) has a large picture of him on, promoting the Shots and stating “theirs only one Marvin Morgan”.

    So far I have made 27 separate “going down on Marvin Morgan”” jokes... My wife has punched me 26 times.

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  • 290. At 2:27pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    It doesn't matter how great they were (which no one is denying), they didn't win a trophy. And no matter what anyone says the point of football is to win trophies.

    ------------------------------------------

    You obviously never worked for the ILEA (Inner London Education Authority) in the 1980s as non-competitive sport was the political trendy concept then (which I promptly ignored and just kept winning at everything).

    I remember a quote by Sean Connery in the film The Rock (you need to imagine the Scottish drawl here): -

    Losers always whine about their best, Winners go home with the prom queen!

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  • 291. At 2:28pm on 13 Oct 2009, blogdignag wrote:

    Dear Mr Censor
    Blimey what was "potentially offensive or defamatory" about that! Richard Scudamore – he’s a fireman, I mean a fine man. All I said was that Leon Constantine should play in Heskeys place, as he was undoubtedly Port Vales best player in the 2007/8 season, scoring 93 goals in 18 months. Must be your innate racism coming to the fore, Mr, or Ms Censor. How could you tell that I’m black? Is this the daily Male? Am I dyslexic? Actually yes I am – as are 10 out of every 2 people in this country – and so you are also discriminating against my freedom to make stuff up, on the grounds of disadlibberty (there’s a joke in there somewhere). Let's face it facts have no place at all on this blog.
    orson Welles says it best, start of the Old Lady from Shanghai
    "If l´d known where it would end,I´d have never let anything start.
    If l´d been in my right mind, that is.
    But once l´d seen her......I was not in my right mind for quite some time."
    That’s because I’m watching the wife doing the floor like in the Hitchcock film - the Lady Varnishes. It’s the fumes.

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  • 292. At 2:28pm on 13 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    RedBlue

    I wouldn't just play Magic Marvin Morgan; I'd make him captain. Furthermore, if he had a bad game, I'd write the Sun headline: Captain Morgan's Rum.

    At 6 feet 4, and built like the proverbial s***house door, I'm not surprised that he can "hold up players and make space for fellow strikers". Emineminem is a wholehearted player who consistently puts in a shift, but there is a certain lack of... finesse?

    However, yours is a valued judgement, and, no doubt, Fabio will have taken note.

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  • 293. At 2:32pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Adam he actually said "Winners go home and **** the prom queen". Which you probably knew. But it needed saying anyway. Kind of backed up what I was saying yesterday.

    Can I just add, again as an Irishman, that Fabio should be sent to Aldershot asap. If he gets there and samples the 'local delights' that RBA was talking about yesterday then his mind most definitely won't be on the job in SA.

    Sven would have done it.

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  • 294. At 2:34pm on 13 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    290 adam

    Or Rockey Felker's immortal "Winning isn't everything, but losing isn't anything."

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  • 295. At 2:37pm on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Yeah, old magics a big guy (how do you know his height though?? Zoots are you Gary Waddock?) but he's quick with it and sharp as they come... No surpise "big" Sol wet his knickers and went running, emineminemineminem would have had him for breckers... And with a finish, you don't need finese...

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  • 296. At 2:38pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    #291 you probably got censored as your observations about hegel's theories were poorly explained and he wither didn't understand or agree.

    Obviously.. The man is a blasted existentialist.. He believes in buckets and spades (not teacups)

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  • 297. At 2:39pm on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    can i just say blogdignag... twice you have written genius posts, quality. I hope this one does not fall foul of the modsquad.

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  • 298. At 2:43pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    I'd be more worried about his posts falling foul of the Holier-Than-Thou Anti-Comedy squad RBA.

    They know who they are.

    And so do we.

    And where they live.

    Allegedly.

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  • 299. At 2:44pm on 13 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    291

    Perhaps ironically, the prime critic of Hegel (and Marx), Karl Popper, entitled his major work "The Open Society and its Enemies". Unfortunately for you, Karl Popped his clogs before he had time to move onto beeb moderators.

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  • 300. At 2:47pm on 13 Oct 2009, blogdignag wrote:

    Huh?

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  • 301. At 2:48pm on 13 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    You can say that any way you want.

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  • 302. At 2:48pm on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Gaz, regarding the Holier-Than-Thou Anti-Comedy squad, is it just me but i have noticed they always attack in 2s and 3s, never have all the naysayers come out at once? Coincidence, probably... but you never know!

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  • 303. At 2:51pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Obviously their battalions are not all in position or have been defeated. I have noticed two particular absentees recently but will not name then in case they are tempted back

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  • 304. At 2:53pm on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Blogdignag... your third post lost it i am afraid, i'm not really in to this avante garde minimalist posting...

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  • 305. At 2:55pm on 13 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    oh, silly Gaz - the fact that you're still chirping away on the matter suggests you haven't really made a good argument. you stated:

    "I know that the Dutch didn't win anything. That's the point. It doesn't matter how great they were (which no one is denying), they didn't win a trophy. And no matter what anyone says the point of football is to win trophies."

    --------------------

    1st of all, "it doesn't matter how great they were"? really?
    it doesn't matter that they revolutionized the game with their style and tactical approach? 'cos scores of students of the game beg to differ with you there. as would the Barca team that spanked y'all a few months ago.
    just one example - check out The History of Football documentary. you'll find that much more time and praise is devoted to those Dutch teams than the German and Argie teams that actually "mattered" by winning.

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  • 306. At 3:03pm on 13 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    ...and to your other assertion that "no matter what anyone says the point of football is to win trophies."

    is it? you could argue that AS A PLAYER who is being paid for results, but we're speaking from the supporters viewpoint.
    do you suppose the point of football could be to entertain? to bring people joy, a source of pride, a sense of anticipation, a feeling of community? does any of that mean anything to your robot heart?

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  • 307. At 3:08pm on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Denis, Gaz... i love nothing more than a good "big 4" debate, but from the murky depths of League 2, it is really hard to tell the difference between Arsenal and Man Utd??? Both play great football, have won trophies have huge stadiums etc... Comparing like for like a bit aren't you?

    Thats just how it looks from down here... Anyway carry on and to fuel it... Fergy will never match Wenger for results but as long as he lives Arsenes youth policy will always be second to Fergies!

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  • 308. At 3:08pm on 13 Oct 2009, Starburst_995 wrote:

    At 2:48pm on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Gaz, regarding the Holier-Than-Thou Anti-Comedy squad, is it just me but i have noticed they always attack in 2s and 3s, never have all the naysayers come out at once? Coincidence, probably... but you never know!

    ___________________________________________


    They're heavily outnumbered. It would be foolish of them to commit all of their forces at once for fear of total obliteration.

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  • 309. At 3:10pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Denis no matter how you want to dress it up, the fact of the matter is that you lot have won nothing for nearly 5 years.

    You can keep telling yourself that you're playing all this lovey-dovey stuff and that is better if you want, frankly I don't care any more.

    You never answered if you would like to swop with us for the last 3 years? And for all your so-called brilliance you were made to look like a pub team, on your own ground, only last April.

    To use your vocabulary, you were spanked.

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  • 310. At 3:11pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Entertainment, joy, pride, anticipation - great emotions felt by football fans the world over at the beginning of matches. However..

    Entertainment - achievable regardless of result
    pride - defeat if played well or close, draw if come from behind definitely if won
    Joy - possible if draw and you were losing but generally experienced by winning teams

    Anticipation - not if you're on a losing streak - this becomes dread

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  • 311. At 3:15pm on 13 Oct 2009, WhitleyBayWonTheVase wrote:

    Thought you'd all love to know I have just been overtaken by Steve Harper, of Newcastle United, on the A1 north of Newcastle.

    I was going to overtake him in return but decided it was unfair as he was no doubt used to watching things going past him.

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  • 312. At 3:18pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    David James is the same.... saw him making a dodgy turn near barnet

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  • 313. At 3:24pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    More reasons to move to Whitley. You get Wifi in your car on the motorway!

    Someone on another site I saw was calling for Harper for England. Thoughts?

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  • 314. At 3:25pm on 13 Oct 2009, oldstafford wrote:

    I heard that Heskey failed his driving test. He knocked a couple of random people down but couldn’t manage to hit the back of Annette…

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  • 315. At 3:27pm on 13 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    Didn't David James feature in Robbo's last thread, doing a turn in a dodgy barnet? What comes round...

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  • 316. At 3:29pm on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Gaz... you were on another site? I have been told by numerous sources (ira, andre, jdr, denis, captlazytwon etc...) that you never leave this one? Well someone is lying lol...

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  • 317. At 3:33pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    It was obviously a gay p*rn site that turned into a talk about footie during a brief respite RBA.

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  • 318. At 3:34pm on 13 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    did answer it yesterday Gaz, said i would swap. have you answered my "point of football" question? nah, you can only stick out your tongue and taunt "we beat you laaaast!" - pretty desperate.
    you've been spanked on the Dutch debate - they ARE more relavent in defeat than those other teams in victory, as others have confirmed.

    i'd like to hear from others, 'cos i think it's interesting to see how people view the role of our game. do others see football in binary code like Gaz - it's either a 1 or a 0, end of story?

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  • 319. At 3:35pm on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Phew... thanks for clearing that up Gaz. For a minute i thought i lived in a world where Andre was wrong about something...

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  • 320. At 3:42pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Denis I wish you would stop making stuff up.

    In case you have never been to OT it is simply not good enough for United to win, they have to entertain too.

    I really really don't care about the Dutch team of the whenever. If that's not acceptable to you then tough.

    Winning trophies is most important to me, closely followed by entertainment. Thankfully United do both.

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  • 321. At 3:45pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:



    Don't worry RBA, that will never happen. Some people are just always right.

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  • 322. At 3:48pm on 13 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    adamp wrote:
    Entertainment - achievable regardless of result
    pride - defeat if played well or close, draw if come from behind definitely if won
    Joy - possible if draw and you were losing but generally experienced by winning teams

    Anticipation - not if you're on a losing streak - this becomes dread

    -------------------------------------

    thanks amamp - we're getting a real good look into the mindset of a ManU. you took all of the positive things that football brings to people and made them all dependent on results! how depressing for you.
    note how you didn't even comment on "sense of community" - not meaningful, then?

    i'd like to think most fans are proud to support their team even when things aren't so rosy. i would've expected such a "fairweather" attitude from Chelski "supporters," but you guys too?

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  • 323. At 3:53pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Like me (irony)

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  • 324. At 3:58pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    dennis - sense of community is important but is rapidly fading due to teh way the game is priced and its commercial modelling - clubs like Burnley are an excellent example but Arsenal for example are substantially from the 80s when I lived in Holloway. I can't put my finger on why but it just doesn't feel the same as it used to - almost soulless to some extent.

    You would never have had to hand out free flags to get a better atmosphere when they played at Highbury

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  • 325. At 3:59pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Sorry to post 3 in a row but forgot other point -

    It's not that I am a fairweather fan it is just that I don't like losing therefore happiness is based on results - my support however is not

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  • 326. At 4:00pm on 13 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    Gaz sayz:
    I really really don't care about the Dutch team of the whenever. If that's not acceptable to you then tough.

    Winning trophies is most important to me, closely followed by entertainment. Thankfully United do both.

    -----------------------------------------

    i'm not asking you to become a Dutch Football afficionado - i made a greater point about winning not being nearly as memorable as a beautiful and lasting contribution to the history of the beautiful game. i'm sorry if that's over your head, but i'm glad a few people around here can appreciate that fact.

    a few final questions for you (i hope!):
    were you disgusted and ashamed when your team got thoroughly outplayed this season, yet won on a ridiculous own goal?

    why does it anger you that i'm quite pleased with where Arsenal are at the moment?

    when you put on a film, do you just have the wife wake you up to catch the end, or do you try to enjoy all of the pointless build-up?

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  • 327. At 4:03pm on 13 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    Denis

    It was one of the great tragedies in football results that that wonderful, exilerating, gloriously flowing Dutch team were beaten in the 1974 final by a rather functional, albeit efficient, German squad. Partly because of that, the achievement of a superb footballing team has always been somewhat tarnished: it never culminated in the victory which it deserved.

    I was in San Siro when Feyenoord lifted the European Cup in 1970. That moment marked the demise of Don Revie's Leeds United machine, which had been strong favourites to lift the European Cup (they were defeated home and away in the semis by Celtic) and the real emergence of Dutch foorball. Cruyff's Ajax appeared shortly afterwards. It marked the end of functional, efficient football, and the beginning of something special. We thought.

    The Dutch clubs, and most notably Ajax, stamped their reputation with victories at the highest level (three successive Europen Cup wins). The national team was even better, but didn't have the key victory which would have made its reputation immortal. The memory of that team is implanted in my mind, but, because it didn't win, it tends to be viewed retrospectively as an interesting development in football ("total football") rather than a truly legendary team. All that was required was that second goal in the first half hour of the 1974 final.

    And maybe that's the importance of winning. I really, really wish that Holland had won in 1974. But they didn't.

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  • 328. At 4:07pm on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Zoots, do you have a published autobiography, can i get it from Waterstones??? Honestly, mate what a life...

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  • 329. At 4:11pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    a few final questions for you (i hope!):
    Q) were you disgusted and ashamed when your team got thoroughly outplayed this season, yet won on a ridiculous own goal?

    A) No, I was quite pleased that we won because losing to Arsenal that early in the season would have bene disastrous

    Q) why does it anger you that i'm quite pleased with where Arsenal are at the moment?

    A) It doesn't anger me I just think Arsenal should be higher (probably because your demise has allowed Liverpool to start mounting a challenge)

    Q) when you put on a film, do you just have the wife wake you up to catch the end, or do you try to enjoy all of the pointless build-up?

    A) I enjoy watching all of a film (my wife has an annoying habit of guessing the entire plot & end after about 5 minutes)

    In short - I like entertainment a lot but like winning more

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  • 330. At 4:12pm on 13 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    Zoot - nice account... i have to say though, that Dutch people don't really view it as a tragedy like you do. those teams reputation's ARE immortal regardless of trophies, and my point was that the German and Argie teams are certainly less memorable for anyone not German or Argentinian.
    i wish they'd won, too, but i believe what they were transcends winning and losing... guess i'm in the minority on that.

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  • 331. At 4:18pm on 13 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    adamp - fair enough, but the queries were intended for Gaz, as his long history of comments has reasonably raised such issues!

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  • 332. At 4:20pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    #331 - unlike their 1990 teams who weren't even memorable for them. England should have won that tournament - blasted penalties

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  • 333. At 4:21pm on 13 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    oh, and:
    ---------------------
    (probably because your demise has allowed Liverpool to start mounting a challenge)
    ---------------------

    demise? in October? you're setting yourself up to look pretty silly in case the Gunners make up that giant chasm between us!

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  • 334. At 4:22pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:

    Q were you disgusted and ashamed when your team got thoroughly outplayed this season, yet won on a ridiculous own goal?

    A Was I ashamed we won? Don't be ridiculous. I was disgusted at the way we played, we were terrible. And how is the own goal ridiculous? It's an own goal ffs, they're all ridiculous. Don't just add adjectives to try and make yourself feel better.




    Q why does it anger you that i'm quite pleased with where Arsenal are at the moment?

    A It doesn't. You have the ability to think people are angry with you when they aren't. It's called insecurity. What does anger me is the completly ridiculous myth that is being perpetuated by Arsenal fans at the minute that somehow their team is better than everyone else because of the way they play. They aren't. And their play is nowhere near the rubbish that is being talked about them.


    Q when you put on a film, do you just have the wife wake you up to catch the end, or do you try to enjoy all of the pointless build-up?

    What kind of stupid analogy is this. It doesn't even make sense.

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  • 335. At 4:26pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    329. At 4:11pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    your demise has allowed Liverpool to start mounting a challenge



    yet more inane drivel about Liverpool from adam, when will it ever end?

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  • 336. At 4:28pm on 13 Oct 2009, Spitfire wrote:

    #328. Ever listen to the 'Sympathy for the Devil' by Rolling Stones?

    Its our Zoots, the song is about.

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  • 337. At 4:29pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    Denis - bit of a weird argument re the Dutch


    Is it better to win something and be forgotten or lose and be remembered?

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  • 338. At 4:31pm on 13 Oct 2009, ZEUSFC wrote:

    229#

    sorry spitfire... had to go to work!

    the landlord uses a system called "dr**mb*x" which does some naughty things to encrypted signals... don't know how legal it is here or there, and certainly i wouldn't be using it in Saudi where the signal came from, for fear of losing my hands!

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  • 339. At 4:32pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    I was talking about Arsenal not Liverpool - making the point that while Arsenal are suffering, Liverpool are challenging for the title and as I absolutely despise Liverpool Football Club as opposed to only moderate dislike of the gunners that is why I am disappointed that Wengers brand of football is not delivering ahead of Liverpool although if you play anymore games like at Stamford Bridge last week that will cease to be a concern

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  • 340. At 4:35pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    As for where will it end - when England pick a decent right-back, Rafa goes back to waiting tables in Madrid and liverpool end up in teh Blue Square Conference North

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  • 341. At 4:35pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    339. At 4:32pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    I was talking about Arsenal not Liverpool - making the point that while Arsenal are suffering, Liverpool are challenging for the title


    and in saying "your demise has allowed Liverpool to start mounting a challenge" you're linking the too, which is patently horsepoo

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  • 342. At 4:36pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    or even 'two'

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  • 343. At 4:38pm on 13 Oct 2009, blogdignag wrote:

    RBA92 you is putting too much pressure on me man! IS THERE NOWHERE I CAN ESCAPE FROM THE PRESSURE? hey man i love this blog a couple of good sayings from yer man and then this burst oil well of blather about nuttin. an we all fink we kno better and that we is funnier an why don the BBC give i a blog. i think this too. and as this is the only literature i read it needs to be improved and i beleve i can hElp you Robbo. so here's wot I fink:
    1. Robbo - only two things ruin your every blog -the jokes and the references to football -try to cut down on both, Why did the chicken walk onto the pitch? The ref called 4 a fowl. That kind of thing.
    2. as an old ninja once said to me "try deleting it all and then write it out again exactly the same, word for word to see if it's an improvement".
    4. Do not accept payment in Scottish £ notes.
    And my advice to my new pseudo-pals, fellow bloggers,
    1. get out more, if it wasnt for emmerdale you'd get no fresh air at all
    2. remember Odysseus, tied to the mast hearing the beauty of the Siren’s song. They are promising him the knowledge he wants but the bones on the beach remind him of the cost of this knowledge.
    3. stop PRESSUIRING ME MAN!

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  • 344. At 4:39pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    There is a link though as Arsenal have not been as strong Liverpool have overtaken them. If they had grown stronger then LFC depsite their improvement would have remained behind them

    Anyway teh main link is the resurgence of Manchester United and the demise of Liverpool and yes those 2 events were linked.

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  • 345. At 4:45pm on 13 Oct 2009, Penners wrote:

    Ther'll be plenty of time to experiment with Darren Bent once we find out our world cup opponents and arrange the friendlies in preparation for the tournie

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  • 346. At 4:47pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    blogdignag - for some reason your posts make me think that you look like this

    http://www.atomicnerds.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/tweek3-296x300.jpg

    I hope you take that as the compliment it is intended to be!

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  • 347. At 4:51pm on 13 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    OK blogdingdangdoo, i was harsh with my criticism of the lack lustre "huh?" which constituted your third post... But number 4 came out singing and dancing, you are a savant blog poster... I hope you are aware of your genius... And pseudo-pal? Do you mean it, don't tease me with this... I've been a pseudo acquaintance, a pseudo fellow blogger and a few time a pseudo stalker... But Pseudo Pal! Thank you...

    Looking forward ot the 5th post... I am sure it will be amazing, breath taking and well plenty of other superlatives! Without pressure thier'd be no diomands, then i'd have to be my wifes best friend and shirly bassey would have nuffin to sing aboot!

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  • 348. At 4:53pm on 13 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Re The Dutch never won anything.

    Here are some "facts" you may or may not be aware of.

    In the Dutch 1974 W.C. squad there were twin brothers, their names, René and Willy van de Kerkhof. If you translate into English their surnames they would then become René and Willy From The Graveyard.

    Now this might just seem random untill you realise that the twins were born in the Dutch city of Hellmond, this name when literarly translated becomes Hellmouth.

    So you would think that with the demonic links of The Graveyard Twins from the mouth of hell you could easily sweep aside all that was put before you, BUT.............................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

    They lost to the Germans....... Now thats scary!

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  • 349. At 4:55pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Nowhere near as scary as this H2H...

    http://italy.theoffside.com/files/2008/12/ronaldinho.jpg

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  • 350. At 4:55pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    344. At 4:39pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    There is a link though as Arsenal have not been as strong Liverpool have overtaken them. If they had grown stronger then LFC depsite their improvement would have remained behind them


    what utter gibberish

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  • 351. At 4:55pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    So that's teh lasting legacy of Dutch Football?

    Buffy The Vampire Slayer

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  • 352. At 4:58pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Although maybe you are on to something about the Dutch footballers H2H...

    http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_jW9m_4cwOAo/SE4VxV4jzkI/AAAAAAAAMlk/Pd6RlZy7550/s400/erwin+olaf+giovanbronckhorst.jpg

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  • 353. At 4:58pm on 13 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    T-Onion - why's it a weird argument? Gaz said only winning matters, so i proved that it's possible to not win and matter quite a bit like those Dutch teams still do...never said it was better or worse, just that i'm proud of Arsenal's reputation for playing the best football, which has been and still is a common global perception whether you think it's fair or not.

    Gaz - i ask the film question because your entire argument is results, results, results, and you fail to see the whole story. you started off as if Arsenal were perennial bridesmaids, when clubs like Newcastle, Villa, Spurs (ha!) would KILL to have had the success that the Gunners have had in recent years.
    you are constantly "prisoner of the moment," saying "we beat you last, ha ha" - but the war's not over, guy. it's a marathon, not a sprint or choose your favorite cliche. fact is, the Wenger/Fergie head-to-head is 18-19 or something like that...hardly worthy of your constant crowing.

    and aren't you the one to bring the stupid sex analogy into it?! something about Arsenal being the loser who doesn't sh*g his supermodel girlfiend as often as before? thanks for enlightening us with that one!

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  • 354. At 4:59pm on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Tommy I find it interesting that Liverpool fans are the only ones that think that thye have a divine right to success and that no criticism of their glorious club is allowed. But here are the facts

    Man Utd last title 2009
    Man Utd titles since 1993 - 11

    Liverpool last title 1991 (after a decade of near domination)
    makes the second point by itself

    That looks to me like a DEMISE for liverpool (and no a few cups don't make up for it just ask Tommy Docherty & Ron Atkinson) and a RESURGENCE for United.

    I am now going home as it is my daughters birthday so won't be onn

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  • 355. At 4:59pm on 13 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Gaz, that would scare the devil himself.

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  • 356. At 5:00pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    348. At 4:53pm on 13 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    They lost to the Germans....... Now thats scary!



    in 1978 they lost to the Scots.... much scarier!

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  • 357. At 5:02pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.

  • 358. At 5:03pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Denis do you actually read the posts?

    I never said winning was "All" that matters. I never said it was all about "results, results, results". I said these were the most important things. There is a big difference.

    And delude yourself all you like about your "global reputation", it simply doesn't exist. More of Arsene's brainwashing.

    And where you get that I am the prisoner of the moment I have no clue. Are you not a prisoner of the past then? Tell you what, why not add up everything Arsenal have won compared to everything United have won since a chimp first kicked a pigs bladder around the African plains thousands of years ago and see where that gets you.

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  • 359. At 5:04pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Forget the "Total Football", from now on when I think of Dutch football I am thinking of this...

    http://img229.imageshack.us/img229/8646/189197863ac230e6c71kp3.jpg

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  • 360. At 5:06pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Has anyone done their driving test in Holland? H2H I'm looking at you.

    http://lh5.ggpht.com/fisherwy/RvfVCIpBGnI/AAAAAAAAI4E/So-JcG8prQ4/Dutch+Driving+Test%5B2%5D.jpg

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  • 361. At 5:06pm on 13 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    359, Thats why I love it over here.

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  • 362. At 5:10pm on 13 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Jeez Gaz, How you do that so quick?

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  • 363. At 5:12pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Now you're just sounding like my wife!

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  • 364. At 5:14pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.

  • 365. At 6:03pm on 13 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    Denis do you actually read the posts?

    I never said winning was "All" that matters.
    ----------------------------------------------
    it's all there in the archives, Gaz. when you assert that "it doesn't matter how great they were, football is all about winning" as opposed to the list of more meaningful things i suggested football is about, you've shown your stripes.

    (your Honor, the people rest... don't be too hard on Gaz - he had a soul at one point, but gave it to Fergie in exchange for a piece of metal to be locked in a glass case... the people request a 1-year vow of silence)

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  • 366. At 6:27pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyB wrote:

    You two should get a room. All this bickering... tsk

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  • 367. At 7:11pm on 13 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    careful tommyb - you agreed he was wrong earlier, so further provocation could get you lumped in with the JDR/Andre contingent.

    and why get a room? he'd rather go all the way with some P*rn than have a bit of fun with a supermodel!

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  • 368. At 8:36pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyB wrote:

    Sir, I am part of no contingent but rather am a contingent proposition, neither necessarily true nor false, as with all opinions. I opine for the fjords, personally.

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  • 369. At 9:13pm on 13 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    kind of like: hot, dog?

    We toured Holland in the mid 70's. Won all 4 games without conceding, got familiar with Heineken and our opponents lasses. That was total football!

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  • 370. At 9:15pm on 13 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    Gaz, H2H, I'm thinking of a cycling tour of Holland next Summer. Thanks for the inspiration!

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  • 371. At 9:16pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    what's wrong with calling an idiot an idiot - that's what i want to know?

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  • 372. At 9:33pm on 13 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Trotter, (if your being serious)
    Hollands has many excellent scenic routes and is probaly the most bicycle friendly nation on earth
    Another advantage is that if you're in the south you can easily bike it down to Belgium to sample some of those lethal beers we discussed yesterday...........Only problem is trying to bike it back.

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  • 373. At 9:35pm on 13 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Tommy, how long you think thats gonna stay up?

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  • 374. At 10:29pm on 13 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    Holland also has a wonderful Trappist Ale of their own called Koningshoeven, so is Belgium even necessary (in general ;-)?

    toured Holland meself in the '02, but in a country-rock band...had my harmonica blown, but not by a pro, so it might not count!

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  • 375. At 10:36pm on 13 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    H2H why not? If that lass in Gaz's picture link could lead the pack then I'm all in favour of a leisurely 6 month bike tour of Holland.

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  • 376. At 10:47pm on 13 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Denis you're right about the ale, but Belgium can be great fun....And don't worry pro or no pro, a blo is a blo, bro.

    Trotter, if she was leading the pack 6 months might not seem like enough.

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  • 377. At 11:20pm on 13 Oct 2009, TommyB wrote:

    TommyO, you can call an idiot an idiot, and a spade a spade, but whatever you do, don't get the two mixed up, or Jim Davidson might just become your friend on facebook.

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  • 378. At 11:28pm on 13 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    H2H, you make a very good point. In fact, if she comes along, she can have the front seat on my tandem. Can you offer a translation of Denis's brew : Koningshoeven?

    TommyB always makes a good point and offers wise advice. Why anyone would ever call a soil distribution implement an idiot is beyond me and I was once one with everything.

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  • 379. At 11:51pm on 13 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Trotter, koning is king and hoeven comes from the word hoef which means need (Not to be confused with the end of a horses leg)
    So the Trappist's who were monks may have brewed that ale according to the Kingsneeds/Kingswishes- Koningshoeven.

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  • 380. At 00:05am on 14 Oct 2009, WhitleyBayWonTheVase wrote:

    Arghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

    We had 3 goals put past the normally tight Whitley Bay defence tonight!

    Disaster!

    We won 6-3.

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  • 381. At 01:02am on 14 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    WBWTV, another win? I see that RBA lost his manager today, yours could indeed be next!

    H2H, so it means it was brewed by order of the King? He must have woke up one day and said "Lads, make me some ale" and so it came to be. Fascinating.

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  • 382. At 01:19am on 14 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    RBA lost his manager, we've lost our blog writer... wait a doshbarn minute - Robbo's your new Gaffer, redblue!

    so sorry, mate :(

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  • 383. At 01:19am on 14 Oct 2009, WhitleyBayWonTheVase wrote:

    Indeed, another win.

    Thats now 13 played, 12 wins, 1 draw.

    Spennymoor (2 points behind us but played a game more) won too but the 3rd placed team (Penrith) slipped further behind. So there is now a whopping 11 point gap between top and third. This is a two horse race.

    Credit to Spennymoor though because they're desperately holding on to our coat-tails right now. They're scraping wins and not winning in anything like the impressive way we are - but it still gets them 3 points.

    We played them, at Spennymoor, in a couple of weeks time. The result of that game will be decisive (state the obvious).

    Frankly, and I'm not just saying this like any normal Chelsea, Man United, Liverpool or Arsenal fan (!)....the way The Bay are playing right now I can't see anyone touching them. The football the lads are playing is way above the Northern League Division One that we occupy.

    The goals are coming from all over the park and we were 3-0 up within 11 minutes tonight. The 3 goals we conceded came from complacency in my opinion. It was obvious that if they scored....we'd run up the other end and bang another in. And that is precisely what happened.

    Its fabulous. We've waited a long time for this sort of season but it has been coming for a while. The FA Vase victory (don't know if I have mentioned that before) has given an impetus and confidence boost that is staggering.

    I'm a little disappointed we went out to Guiseley in the FA Cup Qualifying round now, cos I reckon we could have gone all the way if we'd got past them.........see, even we talk rubbish like the rest of your Premiership boys. lol

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  • 384. At 01:34am on 14 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    RBA's going to be gutted, not only the manager, but his assistant to, pretty harsh.

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  • 385. At 01:47am on 14 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    383 Whitley, great report. Keep 'em coming. Hope Robbo's visit doesn't give your lads the Boro kiss of death!

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  • 386. At 08:47am on 14 Oct 2009, Gunner_Budgie wrote:

    358. At 5:03pm on 13 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:

    Denis do you actually read the posts?

    I never said winning was "All" that matters. I never said it was all about "results, results, results". I said these were the most important things. There is a big difference.

    And delude yourself all you like about your "global reputation", it simply doesn't exist. More of Arsene's brainwashing.

    And where you get that I am the prisoner of the moment I have no clue. Are you not a prisoner of the past then? Tell you what, why not add up everything Arsenal have won compared to everything United have won since a chimp first kicked a pigs bladder around the African plains thousands of years ago and see where that gets you.

    --------------------

    Actually, in 2000 the Inedpendent newspaper did a team of the century table (add up points for all league positions from previous century), and Arsenal came top! United were top 10 somewhere, I don't recall where though.

    However, that was 9 years ago....

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  • 387. At 09:39am on 14 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    384 H2H... Gutted does not quite go far enough! Well the Ginger Judas can do one, as even the Blue Square Special One wont be able to stop Wanderers from going down, they are massively out classed where they are... If it weren't for Southy they'd be ROCK bottom... And we are Aldershot Town, administration, riots, squaddies, and IRA bombs can't stop us moving... We are the pheonix... Rising is in our nature!

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  • 388. At 11:34am on 14 Oct 2009, Robbo Robson wrote:

    305. At 2:55pm on 13 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:
    oh, silly Gaz - the fact that you're still chirping away on the matter suggests you haven't really made a good argument. you stated:

    "I know that the Dutch didn't win anything. That's the point. It doesn't matter how great they were (which no one is denying), they didn't win a trophy. And no matter what anyone says the point of football is to win trophies."

    --------------------

    1st of all, "it doesn't matter how great they were"? really?
    it doesn't matter that they revolutionized the game with their style and tactical approach? 'cos scores of students of the game beg to differ with you there. as would the Barca team that spanked y'all a few months ago.
    just one example - check out The History of Football documentary. you'll find that much more time and praise is devoted to those Dutch teams than the German and Argie teams that actually "mattered" by winning.

    _________________________________________________________________________

    The Denis-Gaz argument - I'm on Denis's side. More biased BBC nonsense I know. Gaz, yeah the Dutch never won owt. But they got to WC and were defeated by a very fine German team plus the expert exponents of total football and bath cleaning Ajax certainly did win stuff and continue to churn our neat adaptable and intelligent footy players. Besides which, don;t even begin to tell me that a team with Cruyff and Neeskens in it were anything other than fantastic.

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  • 389. At 11:37am on 14 Oct 2009, Robbo Robson wrote:

    On the other hand Gaz, that's a fine testament to Dutch fans that you've posted. She's as excellent supporter as whatever's supporting her.

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  • 390. At 11:38am on 14 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Boobs triumph in all arguments!

    Now where did I put JDR's phone number...

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  • 391. At 11:40am on 14 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Oh crap! I just noticed that was 1 minute after Robbo. That looks bad. I swear this is the first I have ventured on here this morning. Honest. I just got back from the hospital after the beating Denis gave me last night.

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  • 392. At 12:19pm on 14 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    373. At 9:35pm on 13 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:
    Tommy, how long you think thats gonna stay up?


    until the idiot logs in and grasses me up to the Mods again, i'd guess :o)

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  • 393. At 12:26pm on 14 Oct 2009, captainlazytim wrote:

    269. At 11:56am on 13 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:
    #268 - punctuation is unimportant - simply because I forgot your going down the same slippery slope of pedantism that Ira was on.

    Vocab and punctuation may be unimportant to you, but for me it's the difference between sounding like an adult and a tweeny texter. You choose, though, i've already formed an opinion based on your invention of the word 'pendantism'. Like, Portuganese, right?

    Robbo, thanks for putting Gaz in his place about the Orange, and check out the book if you're not already familiar.

    JDR, Denis, well said.

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  • 394. At 12:28pm on 14 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    Gaz - I was expecting blogdignag to post the caption "D cup winnahs" in response to your first Dutch picture.

    Not so sure about the second picture; blond hair, shaved legs, high saddle action, and clearly, from that angle, a crack cyclist.

    Is it Chris Hoy?

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  • 395. At 12:32pm on 14 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    That would be SIR Chris Hoy to you Zoot.

    Well actually now that I think about it it probably isn't. Zoot is probably way higher up the nobility chain than a common old 'Sir'.

    "Knight of the realm? Pah, I wouldn't even get them to wipe my ****"

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  • 396. At 1:07pm on 14 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Tim it is not that it is unimportant it is just that I type very fast and lack the time to review it before I post.

    And also if I want to invent words then all I am doing is adding to the lexicon of common expression. Didn't seee you writing to Arsene rebuking him for inventing the word Old Traffordish.

    I'm off as busy

    RBA - unlucky lad but maybe you'll be able to give Waddoch the proverbial as you get Coppell in and exchange divisions

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  • 397. At 1:38pm on 14 Oct 2009, WhitleyBayWonTheVase wrote:

    I hope the massed ranks of posters and Moderators won't mind this, but I'd like to mention something rather special happening at Whitley Bay FC this weekend.

    The Bay play in blue and white striped shirts with blue shorts - normally. Think Sheffield Wednesday, but much better.

    Anyway - the lads won't be in the traditional blue and white this weekend for our home game against Chester Le Street.

    That's because the club is supporting Breast Cancer Awareness.

    So, the league topping reigning FA Vase holders will be proudly donning an all PINK STRIP this weekend. The wearing of the strip has been cleared by the Northern League and the team shirts will be auctioned off after the match to raise funds for the charity.

    Just think what could be raised if Chelsea, Manchester United, Arsenal or Liverpool were to play in all pink strips one weekend (not against each other, obviously!).

    So, watch out for the club website posting pictures next week - of a very unusual event in any clubs history, let alone that of the league topping reigning FA Vase holders (just in case you didn't know that).

    More information: http://www.whitleybayfc.com/news/?id=1007

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  • 398. At 1:59pm on 14 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    WBWTV.. Am i also right in thinking that Whitley Bay are currnetly top of thier league and the holders of the FA Vase? Correct me if i'm wrong here...

    I think thats a quality idea, and hope it raises some money for a good cause... The fact that teams like Whitley are pushing this and the "big" teams aren't, goes to show that the fantasy land of premier league football is a souless vaccuos place indeed...

    And well done for clinging on the glory of the Vase, i'm still telling people about our Setanta Shield and Conference winning season (And we won the league with the record number of points, and in the quickest ever time)

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  • 399. At 2:31pm on 14 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    how embarassing - American football, hockey and baseball teams have been sporting the shocking pink recently... don't the Hicks & Glazers have anything to say on the matter?

    sidebar: if forced to take but ONE album onto a deserted island, do you choose Hicks & Glazers, Hall & Oates, or Seals & Crofts? careful, it's trickier than it sounds (chance for redemption, Gaz ;-)

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  • 400. At 2:31pm on 14 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    WBWTV, allways enjoy reading your updates and getting a perspective on a league I admittedly know nothing about, you too RBA its nice to see there are still real fans who support their local teams in this day & age when the easy choice seems to be to jump on the "big 4" bandwagon even though many have no real affiliation with "their clubs"
    Being born & raised in Holloway (London N7) & their ground being a 5 minute walk away I naturally became an Arsenal supporter, saw every homs game, and belive me they were horrible back then. But still a real fan has to suffer, right?
    Anyway I'd like to point out that the big 4 actually donate a sizeable amount of time & money to charity, its just not allways in the news. (Arsenal supports the Great Ormond Street Hospital)
    Cheers lads, and heres looking forward to hearing more from you and your clubs adventures

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  • 401. At 2:38pm on 14 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    I think the "Big 4" should wear a special strip this weekend drawing attention to how Whitley Bay won the FA Vase.

    I think this happened recently. Something is gnawing away at the back of my mind reminding me about it.

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  • 402. At 2:39pm on 14 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Denis... Chaz & Dave mate!!!

    (i dont have to stay on the island with the album do i?)

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  • 403. At 2:42pm on 14 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Why does everyone always assume that there would be a record player on a deserted island?

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  • 404. At 2:50pm on 14 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    RBA - you've cheated!
    if you wanna play, you gotta pay (a very stiff price, in this scenario, i know!)

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  • 405. At 2:52pm on 14 Oct 2009, DenistheGenius wrote:

    did i mean STEEP price, or stiff PENALTY - i'm really not sure!

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  • 406. At 2:56pm on 14 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    H2H, why do you assume thier would not be?

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  • 407. At 3:06pm on 14 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    If there is a record player (is there even such a thing any more?) I would choose to play the lesser know classic by the Royal Navy band entitled "Screaming Alarm in D Minor".

    Very loudly.

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  • 408. At 3:09pm on 14 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Ah good choice Gaz... the Pompey anthem.

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  • 409. At 3:56pm on 14 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    Gaz, there is indeed such a thing as a record player, I know this because I had to get one just so the kids could hear the Rolf Harris version of Two Little Boys (not available on itunes). One thing leads to another and there's also a device that will record your records on to CD's which then go into itunes. What we don't have is a wind up gramaphone (or a Jack Russel) for our old 78's, that's what would be needed on the Island and no messy cable connections like modern technology. Soon though, soon!

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  • 410. At 4:12pm on 14 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Trotter, love the HMV reference, although lost on some of the younger posters I expect.
    No matter how great modern tec' gets in the music biz, cds, itunes, mp3, usb sticks whatever. None of them can get even close to the warm bassy sound of vinyl

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  • 411. At 4:15pm on 14 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    ahhhh those scratchy, jumpy, needle-sliding sounds of yesteryear!

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  • 412. At 4:17pm on 14 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    Trotter - you don't know where I can get a replacement playing rod for my Stylophone, do you? I bought my stylophone in response to Rolf's advert in 1967, but when I got it down from the attic during the summer, the rod was missing.

    I've tried keeping a wasp in a beercan in an attempt to recreate that magical stylophone sound, but it always gets p*ssed and hums "Spanish Eyes", off key.

    Anyway, the point is that you're WAY behind the times. Rolf recreates aspects of "Two Little Boys" as a guest artiste in "Stylophonia" by Two Little Boys. Honest.

    Get it on youtube.

    Don't be too appreciative towards me for all this. Did you think I would leave you cryin'?

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  • 413. At 4:18pm on 14 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    407 Gaz, play it as loud as you want, it's a deserted island.
    406 RBA assuming my assumption was wrong, where would you assume to plug it in?.....And don't say the socket.

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  • 414. At 4:25pm on 14 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    Zoot, it just so happens that I might be able to help with that. I'll look through my index of spare stylophone parts tonight when I go back to the ranks so blue. They're all in numbered tobacco tins or Church's shoe boxes. If we're out of luck I can certainly get you some replacement beer cans in a wide variety of tin plate or aluminium gauge for your listening pleasure.

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  • 415. At 4:29pm on 14 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    Zoot, a friend of mine had the same problem, he tried using a paper clip, but it just didn't didgeridoo the job....(sorry about that)

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  • 416. At 4:40pm on 14 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    i bought a stylophone for 15 bar from HMV and i can plug it in to my amp but to make it even better run it through my wah pedal... Stylophone funk is gonna be big... You heard it hear first!

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  • 417. At 5:11pm on 14 Oct 2009, Starburst_995 wrote:

    Momentarily steering back to football, Ukraine and Croatia are playing in their respective games and as things stand it'll be Ukraine for the play offs.

    'Ave it Bilic! haha.

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  • 418. At 6:05pm on 14 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    @ 417 Starfire, although some may say revenge is a dish best served cold, it can be extreamly sweet.

    However there is a downside, Croatia's failure will profit Portugal, if they win tonight, promoting them to the rank of top seeds in the play offs (Totally bogus ruling fron FIFA btw)

    Givin England's recent history who would you rather see in the finals, the whingey, diving, Ronaldo's mob, or the not so scary anymore Billic's boys?

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  • 419. At 6:13pm on 14 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    Ukraine are all but there - 3-0 now

    what we need now is for Argentina to go out tonight and then Ferguson to get hit with an enormous UEFA style ban from the FA and it will have been a decent week...


    it's nice to dream.

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  • 420. At 6:13pm on 14 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    Bang on, H2H. As things stand at the moment, with Ukraine 3-0, up and Croatia drawing 1-1, Portugal, with a home tie against Malta this evening, are BIG winners right now.

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  • 421. At 6:14pm on 14 Oct 2009, WhitleyBayWonTheVase wrote:

    Thanks for the kind comments chaps. Thanks also for reminding me we are top of the Northern League Division One and the holders of the FA Vase. I almost forgot that.

    Anyway, one thing that sprang to mind was that very few people can actually place a team in the league system once it is outside of the main divisions that the fellas on the telly give you the results for.

    So, to place Whitley Bay FC - perhaps this will help. The FA has its main leagues. That is, the Premiership, Championship, League I and League II. Below there is what everyone incorrectly calls 'non-league' football.

    They're incorrect because the FA introduced what is known as the NLS.

    That stands for National League System, not Non League System as some might think. In the NLS, which sits directly below League II, is this:

    LEVEL 5

    Conference League (Blue Square Premier)

    LEVEL 6

    Conference North (Blue Square North)
    Conference South (Blue Square South)

    LEVEL 7

    Northern Premier (Unibond Premier Division)
    Southern Premier (Zamaretto Premier Division)
    Isthmian Premier (Ryman Premier Division)

    LEVEL 8

    Unibond League Division 1 North
    Unibond League Division 1 South
    Zamaretto League Division 1 Midlands
    Zamaretto League Division 1 South and West

    LEVEL 9

    Vodkat Premier
    KoolSport Northern Counties East
    Northern League Division 1 - THIS IS WHITLEY BAY
    Toolstation Premier
    Sydenhams Wessex Premier
    Sussex County League Division 1
    FTB Futbol Hellenic Premier
    Aspire Midland Football Alliance
    Eagle Bitter United Counties Premier
    Ridgeons Premier
    Bulmers Cider Kent Premier
    Molten Spartan South Midlands Premier
    Cherry Red Records Combined Counties Premier
    Essex Senior Football League

    LEVEL 10

    Another 16 leagues in here

    LEVEL 11

    Another 46 leagues in here

    LEVEL 12

    Another 52 leagues in here

    LEVEL 13

    Another 72 leagues in here

    LEVEL 14

    Another 50+ leagues in here

    LEVEL 15

    Another 50+ leagues in here

    LEVEL 16

    Another 40+ leagues in here

    LEVEL 17

    Another 40+ leagues in here

    LEVEL 18

    Another 20+ leagues in here

    LEVEL 19

    Around 15 leagues in here

    LEVEL 20

    Less than 10 league sin here

    LEVEL 21

    Around 10 leagues in here

    LEVEL 22

    Bristol Downs Football League Division 2

    LEVEL 23

    Bristol Downs Football League Division 3

    LEVEL 24

    Bristol Downs Football League Division 4


    Now, remember how all you 'real' league fans see the FA Trophy, FA Vase etc and can never understand what clubs play in those competitions?

    Well entry is based on the level you play in.

    The FA Cup is for Level 1-10 clubs (we play a qualifying round, being a LEVEL 9 team, but we got knocked out in the first stage this year).

    The League Cup is only for Levels 1-4

    The League Trophy is for Levels 3-4, and occasionally Level 5 too

    The FA Trophy is for Levels 5-8 (so if we got promoted, we'd not be able to play in the Vase any more as we are at the top level of our cup competition)

    The Conference League Cup is for Levels 5-6

    The FA Vase (did you know we...) is for Levels 9-11

    The FA NLS Cup is for Level 11


    Each league has its own promotion and relegation arrangements, but the very sad thing is that very few below level 7 ever go up if they win their league; that is because of two things. Most people think it is because the grounds won't meet the next level of expectation and that is part of the reason. However, the main one is that players get taken by clubs - usually 1 or 2 levels above.

    They see a team at Level 9 win the Vase and top their league - and all us Bay supporters know what will happen soon.

    That said, it isn't a whinge. We love the game and we enjoy watching the likes of Rooney, Lampard, Gerrard, Walcott etc strutting their stuff on the big stage - so the reality it that it is the way the world of football goes and without the big boys we'd not exist.

    There you have it - a glimpse into the NLS and our world.




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  • 422. At 6:17pm on 14 Oct 2009, TommyO wrote:

    my God, it's tempting to report that as spam

    ;o)

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  • 423. At 6:20pm on 14 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    Correction. Ukraine are 6-0 up. They might win.

    WBWTV: highly informative stuff. I assume that the Seahorses' lyricists are well on the way with "Whitley in Pink", to the tune of the Scaffold classic, in preparation for Saturday? We'll all drink a drink a drink to that.

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  • 424. At 6:25pm on 14 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    Thanks Whitley, that's the most informative bit of reporting I've read on the BBC since they did a piece on the White Horse Cup Final.

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  • 425. At 6:25pm on 14 Oct 2009, Zootmac wrote:

    Tommy - have you heard that Dostoevsky's "The Idiot" has been deleted as a web book by the moderators?

    Belorussian, Dostoevsky was. Wonder what the fans will read after tonight's game.

    Probably that other great 19th century Russian writer, Warren Peace.

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  • 426. At 6:26pm on 14 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    WBWTV, cheers for that, I feel you have well & truly schooled us in the ways of the NLS. All the best for the rest of the season.

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  • 427. At 6:39pm on 14 Oct 2009, Holloway2Holland wrote:

    427 Zoot, it took a while for the penny to drop for that Whitley in pink, ha ha. That tunes going to be in my head all night now.

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  • 428. At 6:49pm on 14 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    WBWTV - What's the chances that will be moderated and then musyeriously appear as a well researched BBC info page in a couple of weeks!

    You should seriously try to sell them that as a piece for the website, it's better than most of the stuff they have.

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  • 429. At 7:16pm on 14 Oct 2009, WhitleyBayWonTheVase wrote:

    Songs aren't really the thing of Hillheads.

    That said, there have been a few tunes of late. Nothing to compete with the likes of West Ham etc, but enough to raise a smile mainly because the singing is so crap and lasts about 30 seconds at most.

    Thinking about it....the BBC would do well to use that league information for a page under Football. At least Tranmere fans could see how far they could plummet.

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  • 430. At 7:29pm on 14 Oct 2009, Starburst_995 wrote:

    @ 417 Starfire, although some may say revenge is a dish best served cold, it can be extreamly sweet.

    However there is a downside, Croatia's failure will profit Portugal, if they win tonight, promoting them to the rank of top seeds in the play offs (Totally bogus ruling fron FIFA btw)

    Givin England's recent history who would you rather see in the finals, the whingey, diving, Ronaldo's mob, or the not so scary anymore Billic's boys?

    ______________________________________________

    I'm enjoying my very sweet revenge. Does that answer your question? ;)

    Seriously though, Portugal, as you've pointed out need to win to get to the playoffs (never know, Malta might do the unthinkablethere) then they've got to win that match before we need to worry about them.

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  • 431. At 00:52am on 15 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    Whitley's post just epitomises the brilliance of Robbo's blog. He inspires all sorts of deep, meaningful dialogue and indeed such interesting topics as the whole football league structure get broached. It can be a true education at times. Nowhere else I tell you, nowhere!

    RBA, how are we feeling about this Dodd bloke, what's the official line from the man on the terrace (or in the stand)?

    Wall to wall footie on tele here, all corners of the globe represented.

    Johnson proves again what a liability he is defensively. Blimey, I don't want to sign Adam's petition to bring back Neville but seriously folks, is there another option somewhere? A very dull performance, brightened by a bit of class from Beckham and some industry from Crouch. Good job it was free!

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  • 432. At 09:17am on 15 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    Well Trotter mate, my manager is a lifelong Southy fan (the poor man) and he assures me that this is the best possible move that could ever happen to a club... I do not share his optimism. But we have a fantastic group of lads and all Doddy will need to do is keep the momentum going, plus he was caretaker at Southy a couple of years back and done so-so at Eastleigh, time will tell I suppose... My biggest fear is Waddock coming back in January and pinching our best players...

    WBWTV... A great read mate, and having followed the Mighty Shots from the very bottom to the dizzy heights of League 2 I can assure all the BIG club supporters that down in the roots of the FA is where the beautiful game is really played...

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  • 433. At 09:29am on 15 Oct 2009, redpreacherman wrote:

    Now that he's fit and playing again at right back why not give Micah Richards another go?

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  • 434. At 10:34am on 15 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:

    433. At 09:29am on 15 Oct 2009, redpreacherman wrote:
    Now that he's fit and playing again at right back why not give Micah Richards another go?


    -----


    Because he's poo!

    Although putting my Irish cap on again... yes please, give him a go. And Gary Neville. Both of them, at the same time. Please.

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  • 435. At 11:10am on 15 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    RPM... I have to agree with Gaz (his first sentiment, not the mean Irish bit... what did we ever do to you....... oh yeah, all that bad stuff... sorry)

    A couple of seasons back the partnership him and Dunne had was amazing and he was asking serious questions about a place in the England team.. that was when he was, what, 19-20 years old? Trouble is he has not blossomed in to the player he looked like he was going to... Injury problems aside, he just doesnt cut the mustard. (Chris Charles if you are reading, after the good "fit as a butchers dog" debate last week, could i ask you to look in to "cut the mustard" with tomorrows ROTW please???)

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  • 436. At 11:34am on 15 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Anyone read Phil's England squad blog -

    He would leave Beckham, Hargreaves (if fit) and Foster at home in favour of..
    SWP, Carrick and Paul Robinson - might as well pick Steve Harper if he is going to resort to that

    And yes you've guseed it my obligatory (and commissioned)mention of Sir Gary Neville the Scouse basher

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  • 437. At 11:40am on 15 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    Please please please don't leave Foster at home. His family would be in serious trouble, what with all the objects that he would drop on their feet an stuff.

    Bring him, let him drop a speculative shot from some North Korean. That would be much better.

    And how McNulty could leave a fit Hargreaves behind in favour of Stupid Waste of a Player or Carrick is beyond me. But then most things McNulty says are beyond and semblance of sense.

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  • 438. At 11:49am on 15 Oct 2009, adampsb wrote:

    Has anyone wondered if McNulty is really Steven Howard from The Sun in disguise as they both hate Beckham, both love SWP and both have this bizarre idea that Barry and Carrick are better than Hargreaves..

    It would explain a lot of things

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  • 439. At 11:58am on 15 Oct 2009, RedBlueArmy92 wrote:

    You could be on to something Adam, but my concern with Hargreaves is its been like 18 months since he played first team football, thier were those stories in the summer that he could have already played his last competitive match... All a bit worrying. However it is better than my big concern about Carrick and Barry, which is that they aren't very good...

    And surely Joey Cole is gonna come back and be huge for Chelsea this year... He is a joy to watch and i would feel disapointed if he isn't featured in the England squad...

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  • 440. At 12:04pm on 15 Oct 2009, TrotterUSA wrote:

    Good morning lads, first frost of the year here, brass monkey weather. I saw McN's blog last night at a time no-one had commented. I got most of the way through realizing how pathetically predictable it all was.

    Obviously written long before last night's match with the introduction added after the match. Beckham is the only first class seat reservation we should have, leave him behind at our peril. It also makes me chuckle these days to read the - I'm the chief sports bla bla bla and I get to cover and comment on all the big games etc etc preamble - that's why he was at the Reebok for Bolton v Stoke!

    Hargreaves has a lot to do to make it, if he comes back at this best he's an automatic choice but what are the chances of that after such an injury and long lay-off?

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  • 441. At 12:10pm on 15 Oct 2009, Spitfire wrote:

    I find it slightly amusing and mainly disturbing that people are discussing McNulty's (allegedly serious) blog on Robbo's (supposedly funny) blog.

    WWJD*
















    * What would JDR do?



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  • 442. At 12:13pm on 15 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.

  • 443. At 12:25pm on 15 Oct 2009, GazUtd wrote:


    WHAT!!

    What was wrong with that??

    I'm trying again with one word removed as it's the only possible thing that I think can have been wrong! Unless it was classed as racist, if it was then we are all in serious trouble.

    Here's what I said...



    Here are my two England teams.

    Firstly is my team that as an Irishman and speaking for the rest of the world that I would like to see (ie the one that will be useless)...

    Keeper - Any of Foster / Robinson / James, don't care as their all rubbish.

    Full Backs - Gary Neville and Glenn Johnson. PLEASE!! (You can have bridge if you want, he's almost as rubbish)

    Centre Backs - Rio if he's in one of his moods. Otherwise Lescott and Wes Brown

    Midfield - A middle four of SWP, St. Steven, Carrick and Barry will do nicely. Nicely for everyone else.

    Forwards - Crouch and Heskey! Woo! Brilliant. No goals, not even a header won!!


    Team 2 - The one you should pick if you want to be in with a realistic chance (which you won't be, but still, it's nice to dream)

    Keeper - Steve Harper. Controversial I know but look at your options, they are all rubbish and Harper plays for the Geordies so plenty of practice and he worked with Shay Given for years which is bound to have helped him.

    Full Backs - A. Cole (disgusts me to pick him for anything) and Wes Brown. Yes I know I said Brown should be in the rubbish centre back 11 but that's cos he's rubbish at centre back. He's actually useful enough at right back.

    Centre Backs - Rio as long as he's not in one of his moods and Terry. But here is probably your strongest position as either Cahill or Upson could fill in.

    Midfield - Beckham (come on he may be a pain in the proverbial but you all know deep down that he is your best option on the right), Lampard (you have to hand it to him), Hargreaves if fit because he is absolutely fantastic when playing at the top of his game and Aaron Lennon (been mightily impressed with him recently)

    Forwards - Rooney (anyone who thinks otherwise is clinically insane) and I would actually put Walcott with him with Defoe as understudy.

    So there you go. Not that any of it matters. Cos you're not going to win. I hope! ;)

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  • 444. At 12:45pm on 15 Oct 2009, captainlazytim wrote:

    Try discussing McN*umpty on his own blog, see where that gets you!

    Adam, I've decided that not even you could really be serious about the GNev issue.

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  • 445. At 1:13pm on 15 Oct 2009, oldstafford wrote:

    I’d rather have my Gran (RIP) at full back than Gladys or Brown …she’d still be quicker than the both of them ...and she’s good in the box.

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