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Time for Liverpool to start winning

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Phil McNulty | 08:45 UK time, Monday, 12 November 2012

At Stamford Bridge

Brendan Rodgers insists Liverpool must no longer look in the rear view mirror - but admits the road ahead to restoration may be a long one.

In among the cascade of optimistic messages that have epitomised Rodgers's short time at Anfield, the cold chill of Liverpool's current status came in one statement from the manager after the 1-1 draw at Chelsea.

"The club finished eighth last season. If we can improve on that if would be fantastic for us. That is the reality of where Liverpool is I'm afraid," said Rodgers.

This counts as expectation management on a grand scale. It is a long time since the prospect of finishing seventh would be regarded as "fantastic" at Anfield but Rodgers clearly feels this is the context in which he is working after succeeding sacked Kenny Dalglish.

Rodgers has spent much of his time praising Liverpool's players for their efforts this season and not enough time discussing victories. It is hard to paint a pretty picture of a league start that currently only contains wins over Norwich City and Reading but he tried nonetheless.

And if he was to take a backward glance over his shoulder he would see that the current Premier League placing of 13th with 12 points from 11 games is three points worse than the same position under Roy Hodgson in 2010/2011 as he was on the road to effectively being run out of town by disaffected Liverpool supporters.

Chelsea captain John Terry headed the Blues into the lead on Sunday. Photo: Getty

No-one would suggest for a moment that a similar fate will befall Rodgers. He is barely through the door and admitted Liverpool fans had been "lenient". There is genuine support for him from Liverpool's followers.

This must not disguise another reality. This points tally is not good enough for a club of Liverpool's ambition, even if Rodgers appeared to be scaling this back at Stamford Bridge. Eventually Rodgers must start winning.

Much has been made of his passing "philosophy" - although anyone could tell you this has been in the club's DNA since Bill Shankly arrived in December 1959 and not something Rodgers brought in the boot of his car as some great secret on the journey up from Swansea - and the only philosophy that actually matters is the one that wins matches.

Rodgers insists signs of development can be seen in Liverpool's side and he has a point. He is working with a squad in reduced circumstances and despite this they have proved difficult to beat. Their last two away league fixtures have brought creditable draws at Everton and on Sunday at Chelsea. Few will pick up even single points easily at either place this season.

Rodgers was also on the mark to underscore Liverpool's "great character, resilience and survival instincts" but eventually there must be more than possession coupled with a reliance on the cunning and brilliance of striker Luis Suarez. This is his top priority.

He can be well pleased with the eventual outcome at Stamford Bridge after Suarez - who else? - scored the goal to earn a draw that looked most unlikely for more than an hour. Liverpool, so poor for the first 45 minutes, even ended the game emboldened and looking for a fourth successive win at Chelsea.

Rodgers was in candid mood as he said: "The reality is we are a long way off winning the league. I'm not going to sit here and say we are up there challenging."

He added: "The club has given me brilliant support since I have come in here. The owners have brought me in and given me great security in terms of the plan going forward."

The task facing Rodgers is turning draws into victories - but for now he is very grateful to have a player of Suarez's class to turn potential defeats into draws, as he has done in the last week against Newcastle United and Chelsea.

Rodgers has shown a commendable desire to inject young blood into Liverpool's side and there is no doubt he received the rough end of the deal in August when the Anfield hierarchy showed no appetite for his desire to buy Clint Dempsey from Fulham and left him desperately short of a striker after Andy Carroll was loaned to West Ham.

But his own buy, Fabio Borini, was looking decidedly underwhelming at a reported £11m before injury, so Rodgers will need to spend wisely in January. "You need materials," said Rodgers. "Hopefully we can add one or two in January to help us in the top half of the field to try and turn draws into wins."

Much depends on his success in that period but for now he can take a measure of satisfaction from a draw at Chelsea, although this should be tempered by the knowledge that if Oscar and Juan Mata had matched finishing to the expertise of their approach play this game might have been over inside an hour.

John Terry gave Chelsea the lead before going off on a stretcher with a knee injury following an accidental collision with Suarez, who was once more Liverpool's talisman with the equaliser, albeit courtesy of a less-than-subtle shove on Ramires that was missed by referee Howard Webb.

Liverpool had stand-out performers in defender Jose Enrique and goalkeeper Brad Jones but in reality - that word again - it was Suarez alone who won them a point.
Rodgers is in the first flush of his infant Liverpool reign and no-one can carp at a point gained at Stamford Bridge but he must soon find the winning habit.

Comments

Page 1 of 13

  • Comment number 1.

    Good result for Liverpool. Disappointing one for Chelsea.

    Chelsea were profligate but for most of the game they were the ones who were more threatening.

    Liverpool's problems are the obvious lack of threat at times and that their squad is probably only average but I think they are coming along, just need reinforcements.

    Chelsea are in transition and results like this add weight to that thought.

    Very big OUCH for Terry though. Not one to be replayed umpteen times.....unless you're Sky that is!

  • Comment number 2.

    There is good potential in this Liverpool team but at the moment they are far too reliant on Suarez.

    Chelsea have looked a bit lightweight and disorganised in defence while Terry was serving his ban. Now it looks like he will be out for several months. Can the likes of Luiz and Cahill step up?

  • Comment number 3.

    1.At 09:29 12th Nov 2012, MrBlueBurns wrote:
    Good result for Liverpool. Disappointing one for Chelsea.
    ______________________________________

    Arguably it could be the other way around.

    Liverpool had 2 very good chances to win the game at the end , Cech saved the point for Chelsea.

    Chelsea were dominant for the first 50 mins or so , but after that Liverpool improved and finished stronger.

  • Comment number 4.

    Anyway the news we've (nearly) all been waiting for is who has topped the predictions league this week. I think i'm in with a good shout.

  • Comment number 5.

    #3 repo

    You could argue that but I was looking at the game overall and how I felt afterwards. Frustration at the end was part because Liverpool might have nicked it (quiet at the back!) but a greater part was because of the chance that Mata didn't take just before half time. He was in space with time and given the way he is playing, you'd have thought 'bang' 2-0 an I don't think Liverpool would have come back.

  • Comment number 6.

    4.At 09:38 12th Nov 2012, BaggiosPonytail wrote:
    Anyway the news we've (nearly) all been waiting for is who has topped the predictions league this week. I think i'm in with a good shout.
    ___________________________________

    How many points did you get ?
    I think I got 8.... :(

  • Comment number 7.

    The problem this year is the same as last year - no decent striker. Not sure if we'll find the answer in January, but until we get at least one, or ideally two reliable finishers, these questions will continue to be asked. Glad people seem to have stopped going on about Andy Carroll - he wasn't the answer last season and he still isn't.

  • Comment number 8.

    Another good weekend to be a Manchester United fan. With Chelsea dropping more points, cracks in their armour are starting to show. I am not saying they are a poor team (on the contrary, I think they are nearly as strong as the team they had during the Mou era), I still think the depth of the United squad (hoping we finally get a fit defence) and the resilience shown by Citey will prove to be too good for them at the end of the season.
    Liverpool, once again, showing great promise but not giving these sort of performances against the so-called smaller teams. If Liverpool showed the same kind of energy and commitment they show when playing against City, United, Arsenal and Chelsea, they should be in the top six at the least.

  • Comment number 9.

    #3

    It could, but then again Chelsea could/should have been out of sight, and Liverpools equaliser could easily have been disallowed for a push. On such small margins are games sometimes won and lost, but on form and league position Chelsea will see this as two points dropped - and THAT is as good an indicator as any of where Liverpool are at the moment in terms of challenging the top 4.

  • Comment number 10.

    5.At 09:48 12th Nov 2012, MrBlueBurns wrote:
    __________________________

    It appears that Chelsea lack that killer instinct that Man Utd seem to have.

    What about Torres ?
    I think it is time to cut your losses and get in a proven goal scorer.

  • Comment number 11.

    The only way liverpool will get any points this season is if they drive too fast.

    :-)

  • Comment number 12.

    Don't really agree with the assessment. The team as a whole win the points not just one person even if they are the goal scorer. I think people need to be realistic about what managers and staff involved in clubs can do. If you're viewing Liverpool as the title challengers of the 80s then you're deluded. Currently they are a mid table club which will take time to improve; even the best managers sometimes take a few seasons even with a load of cash.

    I'm going to offer up Tony mowbray as an example here who took over Boro and delivered an average (although good when you see what Wee Gordon left) 12th place; then 7th in his second season and now currently 2nd and looking pretty good. Steve Gibson could have looked at results alone but thankfully looked at performances and how Mowbray wanted the side to play. I think Liverpool would be wise to do the same and acknowledge whilst results haven't been amazing performances have been good for the majority.

  • Comment number 13.

    Still baffled by the "new philosophy"???
    As Jamie Redknapp and Phil have pointed out there is absolutely nothing new in the idea of passing the ball and keeping possession at LFC - this has been inherent in the club for decades. It does rather seem that Brendan Rogers is creating something of a false mystique about where we are going to buy himself time when things have clearly gone backwards since last season - results do not lie!
    Rogers new signings have added very little (Joe Allen lost possession so often yesterday it was frightening) - thank god for Luis Suarez and Steven Gerrard without whom LFC would be in the relegation zone!!

  • Comment number 14.

    #10 repo

    Could just be an off day for Chelsea. The Man U result was disappointing (for me at least!) and Hernandez is in some good form right now.

    As for Torres, he was ok I thought, made some good runs but certainly isn't our best player by any means.

    I have a feeling that we won't see a new striker this season unless Torres and Falcao swap.

  • Comment number 15.

    Very big OUCH for Terry though. Not one to be replayed umpteen times.....unless you're Sky that is!

    -----------------------------------------

    Or Anton Ferdinand ;)

  • Comment number 16.

    Yes it was a mistake not to add to Liverpool's attacking options in the summer, but to be fair, they didn't get the rub on the fixture list. Rodgers started with Utd, City and Arsenal in his first five games, not the easiest of ways to ease into a new job. This was then followed by Newcastle, plus Everton and Chelsea away. Hopefully, now they are out of the way, albeit not with the best results, Liverpool can chalk up a few results against your QPRs, West hams and Wigans before it all starts again in the new year.

  • Comment number 17.

    Good result for Liverpool, despite their perceived weakness, they were able to contain the trio of Mata, Hazard and Oscar for most parts of the game but they seriously need another striker.

    Good comebacks from both Manchester clubs, but for United we better stop letting in goals they will slowly begin to dent our goal difference (we have conceded the most goals of the top 6 teams) 16 goals at this stage of the season and am beginning to worry Fergie doesn't know how to sort the defensive problems in the team despite his assurances.

  • Comment number 18.

    14.At 09:55 12th Nov 2012, MrBlueBurns wrote:
    The Man U result was disappointing (for me at least!)
    _______________________________

    I watched most of the game , you just knew as soon as Utd pulled one back to make it 2-1 they would go on and win.

  • Comment number 19.

    #12 The Academy

    Ha, yes, people do seem to praise Suarez as if were he not playing then Liverpool would be playing with 10 men rather than, as is the case, someone else would be there. And anyway, Suarez wasn't as good yesterday as he was against Newcastle but he was in the right place at the right time to score.

    I watched a bit of 'Boro Friday, really only to have a glance at McEachran. Some lovely touches and almost a wonder goal with that dribble. He seems sharper and quicker as well compared to when he was at Chelsea. Bodes well for 'Boro now and, hopefully, Chelsea next summer. Too early to say the next Lampard?

    #13 5TIMES

    Well, people like playing on perceptions. Rodgers only built on what he inherited at Swansea but there is a subtle shift at Liverpool.

  • Comment number 20.

    To be fair Liverpool have not been - on the whole - a good team to watch in terms of entertainment for a long time. I think Rodgers is slowly changing that.

  • Comment number 21.

    Not sure we were all watching the same game ! The reds had 65% possession in the first half, that is not Chelsea domination i'm afraid. The blues had 25 mins at the start of the 2nd half, the reds had most of the rest of the game.

    And its the same story as last season, Reds have all of the ball but just can't score enough. Until we get some strikers to support Luis this will not change.

    And as much as i dislike JT, that was a horrendous collision, hope he recovers soon.

  • Comment number 22.

    Hello everyone. I agree with MrBlueBurns. It was a disappointing game for Chelsea. They should have done better, although credit to Liverpool for not giving up. Something seemed off about Torres last night (maybe he wasn't confident or exhaustion). We really need a new striker. The only way Chelsea can get Falcao is if we offer Torres in exchange, or maybe Tibus (sp?) plus cash. That injury to Terry is also a major concern, let's hope he isn't out for too long.

    On another note, good performances by both the Manchester Clubs. They proved why they're worthy of challenging for the title!

  • Comment number 23.

    6.
    At 09:48 12th Nov 2012, repo wrote:


    4.At 09:38 12th Nov 2012, BaggiosPonytail wrote:
    Anyway the news we've (nearly) all been waiting for is who has topped the predictions league this week. I think i'm in with a good shout.
    ___________________________________

    How many points did you get ?
    I think I got 8.... :(
    _______________________

    12.

  • Comment number 24.

  • Comment number 25.

    Drastic check out the osman blog comment #119, i posted my preds, my comp crashed during the week sorry i hope you saw, im a pain...

  • Comment number 26.

    #16
    Rodgers spent £11 million on adding to Liverpool's attacking options, it's just that Borini is rubbish.

  • Comment number 27.

    23.At 10:01 12th Nov 2012, BaggiosPonytail wrote:
    How many points did you get ?
    I think I got 8.... :(
    _______________________

    12.
    ____________________________________

    You certainly are on a roll !
    I bet you cant wait for Drastic´s averages table , my guess is that you will be top.

  • Comment number 28.

    26.
    At 10:03 12th Nov 2012, Weallfollowunited wrote:

    #16
    Rodgers spent £11 million on adding to Liverpool's attacking options, it's just that Borini is rubbish.
    _________________________

    Allen is not looking that good either - £15m probably not well spent. Ironically some of their most promising talents are coming through their youth/reserve team.

  • Comment number 29.

    16.At 09:57 12th Nov 2012, STKJohnboy wrote:
    Yes it was a mistake not to add to Liverpool's attacking options in the summer, but to be fair, they didn't get the rub on the fixture list. Rodgers started with Utd, City and Arsenal in his first five games, not the easiest of ways to ease into a new job. This was then followed by Newcastle, plus Everton and Chelsea away. Hopefully, now they are out of the way, albeit not with the best results, Liverpool can chalk up a few results against your QPRs, West hams and Wigans before it all starts again in the new year.

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Not to sound arrogant or anything but Liverpool always perform well against the Top 4 or 6 sides. It's teams like Stoke, Norwich etc they fail to win ( lots of possession but no end result).

  • Comment number 30.

    #21 Dave

    The possession stat is only half the story. Sky did show the possession but they also showed where that possession was and it was mainly in Liverpool's defensive third.

    In that first half Liverpool barely got into Chelsea's defensive third whilst when Chelsea had the ball they got to Liverpool's defensive third quickly and easily.

    You can have all the possession in the world but if it's 25+ yards from the oppositions goal, what good does it do you, especially when the other team is happy letting you just pass it sideways.

  • Comment number 31.

    Another thing that is puzzling me is Robbie Fowler - he seems to be everywhere at the moment. He was on BBC final score at the weekend, last week he was on ITV 4 for Europa League and i'm sure i've seen him on Sky at some point.

  • Comment number 32.

    27.At 10:06 12th Nov 2012, repo wrote:
    23.At 10:01 12th Nov 2012, BaggiosPonytail wrote:
    How many points did you get ?
    I think I got 8.... :(
    _______________________

    12.
    ____________________________________

    You certainly are on a roll !
    I bet you cant wait for Drastic´s averages table , my guess is that you will be top.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    I think I got 14 :o

    It's 1 for correct result, 2 for correct result with one team score rightly predicted and 3 for an accurate prediction? Am I correct?

  • Comment number 33.

    #15 Weallfollowunited

    Uh, uh, the Ferdinand family has suffered enough, apparently.

    By which I assume they mean that they have to put up with Rio's 'pearls of wisdom' around the dinner table, and not just on Twitter!

  • Comment number 34.

    #31 BaggiosPonytail

    There's alot of that. Nevin get's on Channel 5, Radio 5 and Chelsea's media. Collymore on TV and Talksh-ite.

    And I think you'll find that BBC people also get on foreign TV live feeds as well.

    Surely the 'talent' pool isn't that shallow?

  • Comment number 35.

    I'm struggling to see why Rodgers seems so immune to criticism.

    All I hear is talk of his 'project' and Liverpool's new passing game but, really, do Liverpool pass the ball any better than half of the teams in the Premiership? Wigan, Fulham, West Brom and the likes pass just as much AND manage to commit more than one player in the opposition box at a time. As a neutral I'd say Liverpool are one of the least watchable teams in the premiership.

    I just think Liverpool fans are so desperate for a new dawn. You listen to phone-ins and they talk about 'dominating games' and having no luck with decisions but I just can't see it. Last weekend Liverpool were the better team in the first half against Newcastle but trailed 1-0 at the break. I heard a Liverpool fan on a phone-in describing it as 'daylight robbery' because, apparently Liverpool 'completely dominated'. No they didn't. They passed the ball sideways a lot and only managed to create one chance.

    Results have been poor and obvious mistakes have been made (both on and off the pitch) - the only plus point for Rodgers I can see is his faith in young players like Widsom and Sterling.

  • Comment number 36.

    @32 Mr Boy

    That is correct.

  • Comment number 37.

    the problem i see at liverpool is their scouting and purchasing system, look at downing, now im not naiive enough to think they bought him on the villa bin video alone but im pretty sure it helped, and 20 million for a winger of his (lets be kind now) ''talents'' is a large loss, for 10 million they could of had berba or zaha or even at 12 they could of had cazorla, then there is henderson, again i have to say why? promising yes, but so was wood gate, so is the hope that if owen stays fit he may reach 20 goals, all hopes, liverpool are now a mid table team but i hope, as a utd fan they become challengers again as id love the rivalry back...

  • Comment number 38.

    Aha, here it begins. Liverpool need to learn that sacking managers is the road to ruin. Rodgers needs to be given his full 3 years, almost irrespective of results in his 1st season, even perhaps his second.

    I expect a lot of knee-jerk reaction from most fans of other clubs, but journalists should be a little more aware of the consequences of short-termism at football clubs. Manchester United finished 11th in the league in SAF's first season, and again 11th in his 3rd (second full season in charge) and 13th the following season.

    Give the guy a break, short-term results are not important, the long term health and success of the club is. He's working with a poor squad, so he's brought lots of youth through and has to contend the fact that his sole striker has the worst chance to conversion rate in the Premier League. Yes, he's scoring lots of goals, but that's because he's getting an inordinate number of chances... which the team are creating.

    Not all doom and gloom.

  • Comment number 39.

    I take the point that with this current squad high mid-table is about the limit. That ignores though the fact that a lot of money has been spent in last few years; even if a lot came in for Torres it should still have been used sensibly and not £35m on a player that's now been shifted on. Neither does this mean everything is the last guys fault; £11m on Borini looks money not very well spent. Not a supporter of either Liverpool club but £15m on Fellaini and £5m on Jelavic look bargains in comparison.

  • Comment number 40.

    @37 zboy1989

    Yeah they do seem to pay way over the odds for British 'potential'. Allen looks massively overpriced too.

    Anyone think there will be a bid for Zaha in January - £15m?

  • Comment number 41.

    i see mr joe allen as i see xavi, in a good team like barca even allen would look good but put xavi in liverpool and he will look as average as allen. problem being they move the ball sideways not forward...

  • Comment number 42.

    33.At 10:11 12th Nov 2012, MrBlueBurns wrote:
    By which I assume they mean that they have to put up with Rio's 'pearls of wisdom'
    _________________________________

    Rio just cannot keep his nose out.I heard he backed Maclean for not wearing the shirt with the poppy.

    Maclean was just silly , he disrespected all the 50 countries that laid wreaths on sunday , and the other hunderds of other countries that remember their losses in wars.

    Even Tevez , Zabaleta , and Aguero wore the poppies , and they played just after the service ended in the Falklands.

  • Comment number 43.

    "The club finished eighth last season. If we can improve on that if would be fantastic for us. That is the reality of where Liverpool is I'm afraid," said Rodgers.

    I think Liverpool need a manager with more believe and higer ambition!!!

  • Comment number 44.

    Rogers mounting serious challenge to Wenger for the 'style over substance' title, although having seen a bit of Liverpool recently they play nothing like Swansea and are getting results their performances merit, so maybe we need to wait for them topping the stats for passes in their own half/in front of the opposition before he can get into full 'emperor's new clothes' mode

  • Comment number 45.

    Phil, I have no genuine support for Rodgers, so don't make claims as though you know what all LFC supporters like. His results are diabolical - worse than Hodgson - and I never thought LFC would have a worse manager than him, but we have. I'm sick of being told to be patient, too... we've waited two decades for a championship so why I need to give BR time beggars belief ! I agree with #13 5Times... Rodgers has only made the players pass the ball... with results that will draw us closer to relegation. 2 wins in 12 games ? How can this be looked upon as positive? Without Suarez LFC would crumble - all he needs is an injury or suspension and we are relegated. BR needs to go a.s.a.p.

  • Comment number 46.

    It was a bit of a reversal of fortunes for Liverpool.

    Chelsea should have killed the game but gave Liverpool a lifeline which they accepted.

    As for Enrique, I am puzzled why so many plaudits? He defended ok but was profligate with possession going forward.

    MrBB, the liverbird is not yet deceased ;)

  • Comment number 47.

    #30
    This is where Liverpool are struggling. Joe Allen is highly rated by some for 'always keeping posession, but constantly passing it sideways and backwards isn't going to hurt the opposition.

  • Comment number 48.

    #26
    Borini has played only 4 games this season and is now out until the new year. Do you think you can sum up what sort of player he is after such little playing time? Not only that this is his 5th team in 4 years after spells at Roma, Swansea, Chelsea and Bologna so its going to take time for him to settle in.

  • Comment number 49.

    @40 BaggiosPonytail
    i hope not i would love him to keep his feet on the ground maybe develop fully then move to united... haha we wont miss pogba then... problem is if a player shows potential then a huge clube buys them and doesnt play them where a little club plays them and they get experience and skill and develop then they should move...

  • Comment number 50.

    Liverpool has not had the easiest start to the season so I'm going to reserve judgement on Rodgers until January.

  • Comment number 51.

    @43 neo no they need a realistic manager, whom plays it and says it how it is, if he pretties it up and they still finish 7th, what happens?

  • Comment number 52.

    #42
    You could look at it though the those that fought in the war won the right for people to make their own choices in life.

  • Comment number 53.

    #37 zboy1989

    There's no point judging the Liverpool team/squad and the manager on transfer decisions made in the summer of last year or even that January nearly two years ago.

    The board seem to have taken it on the chin, the previous manager has gone and they have to use what is at their disposal, however that has been arrived at.

    As #38 GerrardTheKing says, give Rodgers his time.

    I really do not get, understand or like the mentality stoked by self appointed know nothing know it all's in the media who talk about a managers position being under threat etc. They merely create the environment in which it is apparently more palatable to sack a manager. And when it happens, they throw their arms up in mock outrage at the short termism of it all!

    Rodgers has been there five minutes and the current owners not much more. Sit back and see what develops over the course of a season, not just the hurly burly of the first couple of months.

  • Comment number 54.

    Great result for United fans :)

    Would've been even better if Spurs had held on for a point at least.

    Didn't look a decent game following it on live text - 2 goals from set pieces...surprised no-one has commented on Suarez's push on Ramires (I think?) or was it deserved because he was getting his shirt pulled?

    Strange.

  • Comment number 55.

    35
    At last! A fellow Liverpool fan who is not blinded by the media guff about BR being some kind of tactical genius.
    Anyone who saw the train crash that was "Being Liverpool" will realise this guy is seriously deluded. (I reckon one of the names in the three envelopes was Brendan Rodgers).
    Apart from the fact he is blooding the youngsters, although this has been partly forced on him, I can't see that he is making good decisions, i.e what is going on with Pepe Reina?

  • Comment number 56.

    @45 would you take the prem this year but relegation the next? or would you take 2 maybe 3 more years of building and then another 15 years or so of total domination? i know what id want...

  • Comment number 57.

    I hope Rodgers is given time at Liverpool, there are plenty of good signs, especially with such a young squad, and these are very early days with his philosophy. The contrast with this and the way Liverpool were playing under Hodgson is startling.
    As for the squad, in addition to Suarez, Liverpool do have important experience with players such as Agger & Skrtel, and need an in-form Pepe Reina back asap.

    For the match, just would like to say what a good match Howard Webb had, no controversy just well refereed.

  • Comment number 58.

    Although we have had a worse start under BR than we did with Mr hodgson, i feel that we ARE playing better football. the chances are there, in many games now we are having 10-15 chances on goal but with out the final ability to finish. I feel the players are looking to Suarez and Gerrard to do the job rather than take the opporunity themselves, This used to happen at Arsenal and Henry. the difference being tho Henry could score!! Although a striker or 2 is desperatly needed in January, maybe other players just need to step up to the plate and take responsibilty

  • Comment number 59.

    @49 zboy1989

    I certainly think he would be better staying at Palace - at least for the rest of the season.

    However, in recent times a few decent performances for a smaller team and an England call up leads to a big money transfer.

  • Comment number 60.

    Fed up hearing "I thought we were outstanding today" from Rodgers whilst still not winning a game!! not sure who's the most tedious post match him or AVB. Carragher completely shot and the once whirlwind that is the Engalnd Captain has now blown itself out - he's fading fast also - shame. Liverpool no longer a big club sadly.

  • Comment number 61.

    I actually watch Liverpool and its terrible football at times,f we just pass it in our half its boring. If kenny was still in charge everyone would be saying he got to go, your brainwashed by the media a he has secret game. Wake up. Its the same team as last year and we gone backwards o sorry he bought allen andborini who we dont need. As for sterling we will wreck his career playing him every week. Does anyone actually understand football anymore or just watch sky

  • Comment number 62.

    The results speak for themselves: Rodgers dispensed with Carroll having said he wasn't going anywhere, lost Kuyt, Bellamy and Maxi, said LFC don't need strikers, bought Borini and plays him out of position. The team is out of the only competition it won last year, languishing in 13th place and mirroring a style of football that has been found out by Real Madrid, Chelsea and most recently Celtic. So Brendan Rodgers should just shut up.

  • Comment number 63.

    #52 Weallfollowunited

    I really don't want to stir a hornets nest, but, come on, as creditable as that point is, we all know that Remembrance Sunday is a big moment to show respect.

    Maybe, by the principle you're fostering on to Rio's Tweets, Terry was just making his own choice in life at Loftus Road that day? We all know it's ludicrous, we all know you shouldn't be brow beaten into complying but, it's the way Rio seems to make a virtue of picking at these things that is disingenuous.

    That said, let's move on shall we.

  • Comment number 64.

    on the upside for chelsa they finally managed a profit!!! a whole 1 million now they only owe the Russian mafia 899 million!

  • Comment number 65.

    54.
    At 10:25 12th Nov 2012, becks-phone-call-went-to-me wrote:

    Didn't look a decent game following it on live text - 2 goals from set pieces...surprised no-one has commented on Suarez's push on Ramires (I think?) or was it deserved because he was getting his shirt pulled?
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    I thought it was a fantastic bit of movement to create some space :)

  • Comment number 66.

    It's not necessarily a striker that Liverpool need.

    If they are to emulate the style of Barcelona then the goals need to come from everyone.

    The missing piece at the moment is penetration, and that was painfully clear in the Newcastle match.

    The good news is that when Lucas returns, players like Allen, Sahin and Gerrard will be able to play higher up the pitch and be more creative.

  • Comment number 67.

    A quick glimpse at the table confirms my suspicion that the EPL is weaker than ever. Both Manchester teams look unconvincing, and yet sit top. The 4th placed team is already 7 points behind the leaders. As for the rest, well..........
    I wonder how long before RA becomes impatient with RDM?

  • Comment number 68.

    @62
    Italy "found out" about that style of football in the Euros final in the summer. Wouldn't write it off with Barca because of a couple of freak results just yet.

  • Comment number 69.

    #48
    And how is that a good thing? Makes me think that 4 clubs have already decided he wasn't good enough.

    And he's made 11 appearances, not 4. And managed 1 goal, against some terrible Thursday Night Cup opponent. If Liverpool don't give Suarez some help they'll get nowhere.

  • Comment number 70.

    63. At 10:29 12th Nov 2012, MrBlueBurns wrote:
    #52 Weallfollowunited

    I really don't want to stir a hornets nest, but, come on, as creditable as that point is, we all know that Remembrance Sunday is a big moment to show respect.

    Maybe, by the principle you're fostering on to Rio's Tweets, Terry was just making his own choice in life at Loftus Road that day? We all know it's ludicrous, we all know you shouldn't be brow beaten into complying but, it's the way Rio seems to make a virtue of picking at these things that is disingenuous.

    That said, let's move on shall we.

    --------
    I reckon he's just planting some seeds for him to stay in the limelight after Fergie's written him off.

    Next chairman of SBL maybe?

    Seems to be of an attention-seeking prat, our Rio. I'm not sure how much longer Fergie will let it go though.

  • Comment number 71.

    Good to see real football issues on the blog instead of the useless talk of referee decisions.

  • Comment number 72.

    #64 coreynz

    It's not a question of making a profit, it's a question of not making losses.

    Arsenal make a profit and what do they do with it? Put it in the bank! Man U make a profit and what happens to it? The Glazers take 'fees'.

    At least Man U are still challenging though. What's Arsenal's excuse?

    Spurs are well placed but need top 4 because of the calibre of player you can attract and the extra income.

    Anyone else?

    Chelsea are now well placed. No loss this last year. Challenging for titles and currently sitting on two. Debt free. Playing good football. Young'ish squad.

  • Comment number 73.

    66.
    At 10:33 12th Nov 2012, dogeared wrote:

    It's not necessarily a striker that Liverpool need.

    If they are to emulate the style of Barcelona then the goals need to come from everyone.

    The missing piece at the moment is penetration, and that was painfully clear in the Newcastle match.

    The good news is that when Lucas returns, players like Allen, Sahin and Gerrard will be able to play higher up the pitch and be more creative.
    ___________________________

    So Allen would be able to pass the ball sideways 10 yards further up the pitch?

  • Comment number 74.

    The points return so far compared with Hodgson's time is fair but at least it is possible to see how this team might move forward. Under Hodgson it was pretty hard to work out what was going on! A striker or two in January need to arrive. Huntelaar would do as one of those.

  • Comment number 75.

    38.At 10:17 12th Nov 2012, GerrardTheKing wrote:
    Rodgers needs to be given his full 3 years, almost irrespective of results in his 1st season, even perhaps his second.
    _______________________________________

    I agree 100% with you.

    I said in the summer that I would give Rodgers 3 seasons to prove himself. I think things are more or less on track even though Liverpool should have picked up a few more points along the way this season.

    Slowly getting rid of the dead wood , bringing on the youngsters , buying younger players , Rodgers seems to be doing all this.

    Joe Allen still needs time , he stood out at Swansea , but lets face it he would not stand out the same way if he joined any of the teams in the EPL.
    Borini does not look a good buy at the moment , but again he needs time to settle in.

  • Comment number 76.

    59.At 10:26 12th Nov 2012, BaggiosPonytail wrote:
    _____________________________________
    yes indeed, you know what i think arsenal should try get him, that way it wont be for big money!! haha but in all seriousness, i see your point, rooney, he is a prime example although united have developed him spectacularly well to fit, but my credit is mainly with everton, he was almost the full product when we got that lad, i just have a sneaky feeling that if zaha has a bad england debut maybe , at least for his devlopment it may be better and in the long run then better for us as a nation?

  • Comment number 77.

    #70 becks-phone-call-went-to-me

    Nah, I wouldn't stamp on it. The problem with some people is that start to believe their own opinions so much they start to forget the old axiom "it's better to say nothing and look a fool than to open your mouth and leave no doubt".

    I would question how much the BBC use Tweets as the basis of journalism them. Does a weekend pass without a Michael Owen tweet finding it's way into the football coverage. Is he injured again? Quelle surprise. Has he scored for Stoke yet???

  • Comment number 78.

    #63
    Don't get me wrong' i'd have worn one but if someone has a reason (I don't know what his was) for not wearing it then they shouldn't have to be forced into wearing one.

  • Comment number 79.

    75. At 10:39 12th Nov 2012, repo wrote:
    38.At 10:17 12th Nov 2012, GerrardTheKing wrote:
    Rodgers needs to be given his full 3 years, almost irrespective of results in his 1st season, even perhaps his second.
    _______________________________________

    I agree 100% with you.

    I said in the summer that I would give Rodgers 3 seasons to prove himself. I think things are more or less on track even though Liverpool should have picked up a few more points along the way this season.

    Slowly getting rid of the dead wood , bringing on the youngsters , buying younger players , Rodgers seems to be doing all this.

    Joe Allen still needs time , he stood out at Swansea , but lets face it he would not stand out the same way if he joined any of the teams in the EPL.
    Borini does not look a good buy at the moment , but again he needs time to settle in.

    -------------
    Joe Allen's a bit like Carrick. Keeps the ball moving, doesn't give it away often and is just another man in midfield. He's not the most creative from what I can see. How many assists did he get last season? Seems like him and Britton kept the ball ticking over and left it to the other 4 forwards to make the chances.

    He'd struggle in a 2 man midfield IMO.

  • Comment number 80.

    75.At 10:39 12th Nov 2012, You wrote:
    if he joined any of the teams in the EPL.

    ___________________

    Should read "top teams"....oops

  • Comment number 81.

    77.
    At 10:41 12th Nov 2012, MrBlueBurns wrote:

    Does a weekend pass without a Michael Owen tweet finding it's way into the football coverage. Is he injured again? Quelle surprise. Has he scored for Stoke yet???
    ________________________

    He was on MOTD2 last night and it looked like someone had drawn something on his face!

  • Comment number 82.

    77. At 10:41 12th Nov 2012, MrBlueBurns wrote:
    #70 becks-phone-call-went-to-me

    Nah, I wouldn't stamp on it. The problem with some people is that start to believe their own opinions so much they start to forget the old axiom "it's better to say nothing and look a fool than to open your mouth and leave no doubt".

    I would question how much the BBC use Tweets as the basis of journalism them. Does a weekend pass without a Michael Owen tweet finding it's way into the football coverage. Is he injured again? Quelle surprise. Has he scored for Stoke yet???

    ------------
    Don't get me wrong, I'm fully into freedom of speech and all that but sometimes, like you said, it is better to just keep your mouth shut. I suppose there also needs to be a bit of "toeing the company line" involved as well. It's kind of like a dress code, no?

    I really, really don't understand Twitter - it's the very definition of espionage / attention-seeking depending on what side you're on. Our society seems to have just turned into this reality TV based culture where anything anyone remotely famous says is jumped upon as the word of gospel.

  • Comment number 83.

    @55 av it

    He has had the cojones to drop Reina who has been pants so far this season.

  • Comment number 84.

    78.At 10:41 12th Nov 2012, Weallfollowunited wrote:
    Don't get me wrong' i'd have worn one but if someone has a reason (I don't know what his was) for not wearing it then they shouldn't have to be forced into wearing one.
    __________________________________

    Apparently he had his own personal reasons which seem to be misguided. His protest should be against the British goverment not the soldiers who lost their lives mainly in wars over 60 years ago.

    If Maclean felt that strongly about it why does he happily pay taxes to the British goverment every week ?

    To me , that is just hypocritical.

  • Comment number 85.

    well done hodgson though for including forster, better than the blonde kid from CITEH

  • Comment number 86.

    #81 BaggiosPonytail

    Well, his appearance last night might explain his Tweets being published on here so much - vested interest and jobs for the boys! Hardly impartial is it. Not that the BBC ever has problems with impartiality and editorial standards does it?

    Was he any good though? I'd be surprised, he strikes me as quite the little fence sitter.

  • Comment number 87.

    To pick up a point a few others have made, Joe Allen had his worst game in an LFC shirt yesterday. Against both Everton and Newcastle he didn't shine but yesterday was worse than those performances. I look forward to the return of Lucas who does the shielding role just as well as Allen and whose passing is at least as good despite not always being particularly incisive, but then again nor has Allen's.

    Overall I like what Rodgers is doing. In my opinion we are a reliable goalscorer away from being a decent team. A left back, despite Enrique's good performance yesteday, and a few wide men away from challenging for top 4. Was impressed by Suso yesterday when he came on in the centre of the park for one of the first times under BR. Certainly improved upon the performance of Sahin who is either not fitting in or suffering from that 'difficult first season' problem many foreign players seem to succumb to in the Premier League.

    I think cautious optimism is the right description for LFC fans currently. We can see that the team is in transition and lacking in obvious ways yet there are signs that the team is starting to come together and play a more coherent brand of football. Couple this with the blooding of several young players, particularly the consistently impressive Sterling, and it seems we are moving forward. Despite the indifferent start, the season should only be judged at the end. No trophies are won in November

  • Comment number 88.

    @86 MrBlueBurns

    To be honest I couldn't concentrate on anything he was saying as I was too busy chuckling at his appearance.

  • Comment number 89.

    #84 repo

    If Maclean felt that strongly about it why does he happily pay taxes to the British goverment every week ?
    -------------------------------------------------------
    'Happily'? I dare say, like many of us, they are hardly paid happily!

    Actually though, if he is southern Irish, maybe he could play the neutrality card? And maybe he can do that from the comfort of playing in a southern Irish league rather than in the English league if that's his want.

    What's that, there's more money in England, a country that is not neutral but that respects it's war dead?

  • Comment number 90.

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

  • Comment number 91.

    Possession wins you nothing. Chelsea created the better chances and they should rightfully feel they let points slip.

  • Comment number 92.

    #84
    I'm not saying he's right or wrong, just that he shouldn't be forced into it.

    To be honest though, it's a tiny event from what was a good weekend that focused on football rather than controversy so it'd be better to focus on that.

  • Comment number 93.

    I think that the real problem for LFC is the total lack of coverage in the media. Week in week out there are articles on teams like West Brom & Everton. And where are THEY in the table? And where are the Liverpool articles? I'm not a LFC fan but this is starting to seem like a conspiracy. Come on, Auntie, fair's fair!

  • Comment number 94.

    two of suarez' best goals this season/ ever have come from long balls pumped up or a cross from a set peice seems BR should have a plan b after all

  • Comment number 95.

    93.At 10:56 12th Nov 2012, None Of The Above wrote:
    __________-
    and how do you suggest that an extra article a week might help?

  • Comment number 96.

    whoops, modded.... sorry BeeB

  • Comment number 97.

    Liverpool supporters need to face up to the fact that success at Anfield is a very long way off, Rodgers has made the same mistakes as Dalgish poor buys for the money spent when you get that you really can't trust the manager anymore,Joe Allen is far to lightweight for the prem easily brushed off the ball and the same can be said for Suso and Sahin ,Liverpool are to lightweight in midfield couple that with the very poor buys Dalglish made and Liverpool are going nowhere fast i can see a 0-1 for Wigan coming on Sat and that would'nt be a shock either.As for Chelsea the wheels are already coming off the train slowly but surely and the problem is they have got a manager who is unable to motivate his players to get the result when things are not quite going right,Chelsea need to get hold of Guardiola A.S.A.P.

  • Comment number 98.

    #97 premier league fan

    Chelsea need to get hold of Guardiola A.S.A.P.
    -----------------------------------------------------------------
    Why?

  • Comment number 99.

    The ‘David Brent of football’ tag may eventually stick if Brendan Rogers continues to lavish praise on every Liverpool performance win lose or draw

    I find Brendan Rogers philosophy, spin and management speak, reminiscent of an area salesman explaining poor regional sales figures at a sales conference I attended back in the 80’s. He was sacked later that year when it became clear that he was not as good as he thought he was, and that his ‘sales pitch’ was far superior to his actual sales which were far below those of his predecessor.

    However, I don’t think he had a huge picture of himself hanging in his living room though

  • Comment number 100.

    Surely, this title could apply to CFC as well? That's 3 games without a win......

    Seems they've slipped in the title race as well. Pressure will show for RDM who so far has done no wrong when expectations were minimal.

    As for "Buck" Rodgers, well it's hypocritical that LFC fans are shouting "give him time" when he's doing a worse job than the current England Manager Roy Hodgson. RH didn't have the luxury to splurge £11m on a striker that doesn't score, Fabio "Bore"ini or another £8m on the "Anfield Ambler" Joe Allen, a player that never makes a forward pass.

    For all the "philosophy" talk, there's very little evidence on the pitch. They can dominate possession all they want, but as Celtic showed v barca, it's what you do with it that counts.

 

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