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Tuesday 2 August 2011

Sarah McDermott | 10:26 UK time, Tuesday, 2 August 2011

Syrian forces are pushing towards the centre of the town of Hama as they continue an offensive in which scores of people have died. Tim Whewell will bring us the latest tonight.

Then we'll be asking how damaged President Barack Obama has been by the US debt crisis.

Anna Adams has been investigating why many young women's cervical cancer tests are going unprocessed in England.

And Lyse Doucet meets America's top military official, Admiral Mike Mullen, on his way home from what's expected to be his final visit to troops in Afghanistan and Iraq.

Join Gavin at 2230 on BBC Two.


  • Comment number 1.

    Debt deal: anger and deceit has led the US into a billionaires' coup

    The debt deal will hurt the poorest Americans, convinced by Fox News and the Tea Party to act against their own welfare.

  • Comment number 2.


    Obama appalled by Syrian Violence. He ain't seen nothin' yet - and when it comes, he won't need a TV link to see it. Just look out the window.

    The combined come-uppance of 9/11 reality, and Chilcot reality, will require a seriously big (false flag) event to eclipse up. This Autumn could be explosive - even nuclear.

    Just a chance that the current tendency to stuffing the dodgy elite, could thwart the bag guys.


  • Comment number 3.

    Re the Tea Party

    Anyone else remember this Matt Taibbi piece on the Tea Party?
    It's worth reading again.

    The Truth About the Tea Party

  • Comment number 4.

  • Comment number 5.

    '3. At 12:08 2nd Aug 2011, museV
    The Truth About the Tea Party

    Of course, one person's truth may be another's...

    Here's another share in complement (trying to avoid any 'but they're just from the wrong extreme media dismissals)....

    Some comments in reply may be of value before feeling suitably educated and informed enough. Whilst the CiF mods leave 'em up.

    These days 'off topic' seems to also mean 'not helpful to the narrative'.

    ps: I also notice, having raised the concern in the previous thread, that word 'must' being used on my behalf. As a people's jury goes, not sure the Pollys, Eds, etc are really capturing my imagination, along with my support, very much.

    But they do get a lot of air time to try.

  • Comment number 6.

    on Syria: reaction causes action. Russia will do nothing because they have a base there, and they don't care about the people or rights. America will do nothing because there is no oil, they don't have a base, and they don't care about the people or rights. Why do you THINK the 'Northern Powers' have been ARMING dictators, for decades? To help the people rise up for 'freedom and democracy'?

    events in syria and elsewhere may be shocking, but reality usually is when it breaks through the maya (माया), but don't worry - there's a new IPhone app, so all is well.

    sorry to be brutal, but at least THOSE people are alive. They are fighting for the same rights they think we have. Soon, maybe, we will be fighting for the rights they have achieved. And then we too will be alive, again, for a while.

  • Comment number 7.

    #1: and the UK voted Tory. (well, actually we didn't, but lets not nit-pick). Where exactly is the difference please?

    well posted though!

    "Just a chance that the current tendency to stuffing the dodgy elite, could thwart the bag guys.


    subtle, and open to interpretation. I had also noticed those old 2003 stories of AL QAEDA MAY ACQUIRE A DIRTY BOMB!!!!" are surfacing again. Back then, the 'hidden Govt' organised intended attack on London was prevented by an accidental whistle-blower [see documentary 'Psychic Footsoldiers'], - and of course, the ONLY beneficiaries of such an attack ARE the 'hidden Govt' (the intelligence networks and associates, BBers etc) - who are also, of course, the ones with easy access to such material! Just like Breivik's attack, it will be used to try to radicalise racism and other internal extremism - and although such a bomb would kill very few people, it would certainly be used as a rallying call for overt fascism. And no doubt some stupid patsies will be found, probably the kind of imbeciles in Islam4UK, to sugar-coat the message about "The Muslimk Enemy".

    Melanie Philips would have an orgasm. Yuck.

    - the main prevention of this, is the growing awareness that such events DO happen, which will reduce the primary impact, and make shorter the interval between act, media-spin, and the truth creeping out.

    what a terrible world, when the best prevention of terrorist attacks is a population that knows its probably their own Govt (or part of it) behind them.

    'Running the World', no [bleep]!

  • Comment number 8.

    #3: wow, i don't quite know how he managed it, but after i finished that rolling stones article, i had a great deal MORE sympathy for the tea-partyers!! :o

    he forgot one point here, that might help:

    "Of course, the fact that we're even sitting here two years after Bush talking about a GOP comeback is a profound testament to two things: One, the American voter's unmatched ability to forget what happened to him 10 seconds ago, and two, the Republican Party's incredible recuperative skill and bureaucratic ingenuity."

    added: - 3. the incredible general level of arrogance of American pseudo-liberals, aka 'the Democrats'.

    Although the first one he lists IS primary, the penultimate result from RayGun and GHWB's slashing of education budgets, and allowing the Murdochracy to take over the education of the American youth through 'the box'.

    But the arrogant way the author just assumes he is correct, - that sets even MY teeth on edge, and i largely agree with him. If he is an example of what 'liberal democrats' are turned into, in the FauxNews era, then that is an even bigger reason to ensure News Korp is kicked out of the UK media market altogether.

    naturally, *as ever*, the only SANE political movement is cut out of the US political debate altogether (which is always revealing in itself) - the US Green Party.

    from their site:

  • Comment number 9.

    'More later'

    Well, the source of all 'news' is alive and tweeting this PM.

    What does one reckon. The lastest NoTW grandee charged... or the Newsnight not so favourite citizen journo - - banged up?

    Accusations vs. actual sentences. Hmn.

    Maybe there can be a twitter campaign in Egypt to get him out?

    Or just send Duncan and the boys round?

  • Comment number 10.

    hey Mork,

    Just abrief comment on your post wrt the green party... they have the policies.. trouble is the media has deliberately and very sucessfully portrayed them as a bunch of baggy jumper wearing ex hippies or new age hippies with their heads in the clouds and a drug habit at university.

    That perception is solidly engrained in the public psychy to an extent that I find it hard to believe they will overcome it in their current form.

    If the green party were a business they would change their name have an image make-over and seek to 'start over' to generate a different market image of what they are and how they go about it. They would need a harder policy edge to them in certain areas as well to reinforce that they are 'serious'.

    If they did that i would join for sure, the only reason i dont is because i think if i did I would be almost instantly dismissed as being some kind of hopeless romantic instead of the pragmatist (i think) I am.

  • Comment number 11.

    #5: well written article by Toynbee, as usual, but she shoots herself in the foot.


    "On the MMR/autism dispute and GM crops the BBC gave a "false balance" between minority views and the consensus of most scientists."

    1. MMR - if there really are no problems with MMR, then allow the parents to choose the older vaccines if they want. An unbelievably obvious solution, and BECAUSE it is not offered i am deeply suspicious. Sometimes what happens *around* the science is more revealing than any study.

    2. GM crops: as already transmitted through this bog by posts from ALL parts of the political spectrum as represented here, GM has VAST problems with it - and many, many many very well respected scientists have called time on it, as well as whistle-blown on the dodgy research practices by the private biotech companies.

    2 strikes, polly. And one of them at least is very serious, with reams of hard independent scientific research and studies that are easily found with very little effort.

    as for AGM... i don't know yet. Certainly, it is obvious that some measures to 'curb' emissions are nothing more nor less than green-washed kkkorporate schemes, but it is also a fact that from the 50s onwards, the emission of carbon was flagged up by reliable scientists as being dangerous - despite many of them having their funding ended by kkkorporate interests, and their careers cut short. A few were even pushed into committing suicide by the pressure they were put under to conform and not publish those findings. Plus - who is funding the 'climate sceptic camp'? The Kochs, the Murdochs, and the KGB, to mention just a few. 'Tainted by association' may be a logical error, but by damn when its people like *them* - and their own special interests are involved... well, what to say?

    so i await and see.

    and BTW, whatever AGW:

    and i suspect this is strongly underplaying the effects, because of the *other* pollutants we are increasingly dumping into the ecosphere.


    so, perhaps Polly should be a little more careful before 'writing off' concerns by other people, in BBC science reportage, - even though that is *precisely* what the private kkkorporate media does, although usually in the opposite direction?

  • Comment number 12.


    Factoring in advances made since then Mork, David Shayler as Christ, makes sense.

    Perhaps David Icke was the one that got away.

  • Comment number 13.

    Vladimir Putin apparently said of the US & its debt crisis:

    "The country is living in debt. It is not living within its means, shifting the weight of responsibility on other countries and in a way acting as a parasite."

    Why has there been no coverage of his remarks on the BBC, especially Newsnight? Is the BBC afraid of the USA? Or are remarks from Putin or other world leaders not valid?

  • Comment number 14.

    #10: the media have played a multi-edged role: right-wing propaganda outlets like alex jones have been running a koch-funded campaign to discredit energy-sustainability, and smear Green policies generally. Because of his work on 9/11, and other genuine conspiracies, and his clever conflating of the kkkorporate green-washing campaign with actual Green movements, he has had a tremendous effect. Before him, 'Green' was actually positioned as pale-blue, where it has historically sat, for a number of reasons, the word "conservative" should give it away.

    since he has repeatedly slandered Greens as "left-wing", and now even "eco-fascists",(!!!) what was (and is!) a moderately conservative movement with a few crackpots, is seen as a crack-pot movement on the far-left/right. Even otherwise sensible and rational people have fallen for this deliberate, and long-term, policy of misinformation and association.

    the second, older plank is to show them, as you said, as unworldy hippies - but that was falling apart as people began to spot the Greens on the news, and on QT, and realised the Greens were actually focussed, motivated, and VERY aware of the true issues, the problems, and realistic solutions.

    which brings us to plank 3 - complete media blank-out. Shut out of the election by the yankee ruse of scripted 'Leaders Debates', and just like UkUncut and other worries about this Govts economic insanity, even though a large % of the population either agrees with them, or at least has some affinity, they are almost never invited onto the kkkorporate, or BBC news programs, to give their perspective.

    in fact, in a way this is the greatest compliment the controllers of the UK could give them - for it expresses as nothing else quite could, just how worried those secret controllers are about potentially losing control of 'the narrative' to a group/party that actually have policies THAT WOULD WORK in putting GBLtd back on its feet again.

    do you think the Lawsons of this world would ever argue the super-wealthy should make up the shortfall in budget by paying more tax??

    the people who genuinely pull the levers of power in this country are not stupid - and very well educated. Thy know exactly how to manipulate the news, and other media, they are all connected (even if also in competition in some ways), and they know how to discredit individuals and groups through many decades of experience of so doing.

    seriously, joining or not, can you imagine now voting for any other Party? After the policies and behaviour of the other 3 choices? - (unless you're Scottish, of course! ;) )

  • Comment number 15.


    My science is home-grown Mork. I made a living by applying science that worked in my lab. and then selling the scale-up in my factory. Had I bought into some required fiction, I would have gone broke.

    I apply the same mentality to 9/11, AGW, MMR, Electric Cosmology (and weather) and THE EVIDENT MADNESS OF THE POLITICAL MIND.

    Proof of my 'pudding' is that I no longer respect the 'output' of Steve Jones, though he is way more exulted than I. Quite what is going on there remains to be uncovered.

  • Comment number 16.

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

  • Comment number 17.

    #13: muse, Putin's criticisms are true of all Imperial nations - and Russia is no exception. Ask the Chechens about "not living within its means, shifting the weight of responsibility on other countries and in a way acting as a parasite." - regarding THEIR northern neighbour, and military occupier.

    perhaps that's why news outlets are not rushing to print such hypocrisy? Its just a guess. The only interesting thing is, is that he HAS waded into US (semi) domestic policies. - And WHICH side he is clearly supporting... tea-partyers! The comment itself is not at all interesting - its implications, and the intended effects, most certainly are! No doubt this will be the tack of Russia Today, if it isn't already.

  • Comment number 18.


    "women's cervical cancer tests are going unprocessed in England." Do NewsyNighty operatives have no lives in Real England? Do they not know that MOST 'SERVICES' ARE NOW DYSFUNCTIONAL? Have they no tongues?

    Shall we also ask why Britain routinely bombs Johnnie Foreigner? Or why we need a high speed train before - say - separation of cyclists from pedestrians? Why tobacco and alcohol are still state-poisons, though unstated as such, and freely available? Why school is not admitted as institutionalising ALL, except the mad and the bad, whom it wrecks? Why more child-minding is seen as good for children and for social stability? Why we went wild for WIND energy, to the near-exclusion of tidal and wave. Etc.

    There is a choice of answers: CORRUPTION or PERVERSITY. Probably both. The cancer tests are just one small aspect. ALL SYMPTOMS lead back to the Westminster Citadel - still arrogant and unassailable; A MONUMENT TO FALSEHOOD.

    Dave is High Priest and Nick his Altar Boy. Hallelujah!

  • Comment number 19.

    he Euro game of ‘whack-a-mole’ continues...

    Italy calls emergency meeting as eurozone crisis resurfaces

    Yields on 10-year Spanish government bonds touched 6.426pc at one point, while Italy's 10-year bonds also hit highs of 6.219pc -edging closer to the 7pc levels that forced its smaller Greek and Portuguese neighbours to ask for a bail-out.

  • Comment number 20.

    Obama nil....fascist right wingers, selfish me me me's 3........take the world to the's too good for 'em

  • Comment number 21.

    #12: i made the mistake in #16 of asking in foreign: "what do you mean?".

    'paarrently, google-translate is a step too far for our fogey mods, even for humour's sake! :/

    so... what ARE you referring to? Didn't understand a word, and it did rather sound interesting?

  • Comment number 22.

    Obama...what a terrible disappointment......

  • Comment number 23.


    In post #7 (under your name) you prompted readers to watch 'Psychic Footsoldiers'.

    My point is that after 'they' had finished with David Shayler, he was left claiming to be Jesus (as Icke did before him). I am presuming CIA and MI6 now have the drug equivalent of Nano-Thermate, and can collapse anyone ‘into their own footprint’, at will.

    Does that help?

  • Comment number 24.

    #23: "Does that help? "


    actually, there are certain psychic processes that lead to this, as uncountable numbers of Christians have found over the 2 millennia - and other religions have their own versions. I wouldn't rule out deliberate manipulation in this direction, certainly ahmainadjad and the Georgian president who invaded Ossetia are/were clearly 'under some influence', as was Ghaddafi. He had that "Russian nurse" remember, who left his side **AFTER** he had already prevented any early peace-process because of his obvious 'messianic' tendencies. He seemed to get a tad saner afterwards... coincidence, probably.

    i'll look for a good article later, i have one in mind, but it is VERY heavy reading, and as segment of the book "Mystical Qabbalah" by Dion Fortune, doesn't make as much sense without the deliberate holistic element of the whole budget.

    look up "Tiphereth". Its a universal psychological function.

  • Comment number 25.


    Scroll down to the 4 minute video clip. Can we see who is lying? Yes we can!


  • Comment number 26.

  • Comment number 27.


    I had heard we were a laughing stock - are we now hated as well?

    "If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster, and treat those two impostors just the same"

    Nuff sed.

  • Comment number 28.

    #26 eco and link

    That story really is revolutionary precipitating stuff.

    Do you really think that such a story could be made up so as to inflame the indigenous to be so enraged that they break out in mass demonstration?

    A serious question.

    What if (just as a conjecture mind), there has, throughout history, been an internationally mobile band of troopers, 'half' of whom were merchant bankers, internationalist businessmen, cosmopolitans, entrepreneurs and the other 'half' being anarchists?

    What if the job of the first group of 'shock-troopers' was to cleverly subvert existing structures via populist appeals of freedom, equal rights and improved efficiency etc., with the second group ready to move in and take over the vacated posts after a revolution.

    What if this was all the work of one nepotistic group of colonists!

    What do YOU think is behind all this nihilistic BEHAVIOUR?

  • Comment number 29.

    THE ANSWER (#28)

    The Star-Steerers are coming.

  • Comment number 30.

    #23: hannon seems to be playing politics. Not impressed with him at all on this one.

    if this indeed "harmonisation", then it has a snow-balls chance in hell of passing, which is probably why the chamber was completely empty - and allowed Hannon to play this particular (actually quite stupid) 'euro-sceptic' card.

    why will it not pass? Firstly, because if it passes for the UK, then as a "harmonisation" policy it must also pass for all the other member nations, if not immediately then sooner rather than later.


    this i will leave you the reader to work out. IF such a measure passes (and it is a shame it won't, in many ways - although Hannon sounds quite confused about its terms), then the Greeks have the perfect revenge upon the Germans and French.

    get it?

    so therefore Hannon is simply playing politics, he knows it, and presumably most other people in the EU Parliament know it, which is probably why the chamber was empty.


    ooh, it was the telegraph, quality reporting (and thinking) at its best!! (rofl!)


    btw, to take the topic seriously, it is clear that sooner or later there must indeed by some kind of process in place, for people may well move countries, and then get into serious difficulties. And that goes for emigrating Brits as well.

    the key questions are:

    1. should the host, or the 'home' country pay the cost of the benefit?
    2. should the rates of the benefit be at the level of the host, or the home nation?

    these are very crucial questions, and with no easy answer.

    for instance, if a Brit goes to Poland looking for work, then should they be eligible for benefits, would Poland or the UK pay? And should the benefits be at UK rates (they would be almost comfortable), or the much lower Polish rates?

    if the same Brit went to Sweden, same questions. Except there, benefit rates are *CONSIDERABLY* higher, and so is the cost of living - you would starve on UK benefit rates.

    clearly, if it was 'local rates', Northern Europe would be "swamped". If it was 'home' rates, Southern Europe would be "buried". The UK, i think, is somewhere around the middle in terms of rates, and one of the lowest in terms of benefit rates to cost of living. Our Govt likes its poor to BE poor, despite what the right-wing press may claim.

    the potential benefits for EU citizens to have 'benefits harmonisation' are truly stupendous, as many Brits discovered about Ireland in the 'Tiger' years, and you don't have to be any kind of genius to see why. The potential pitfalls are equally obvious however, and neither the article nor Hannon really makes any kind of serious effort to explain all this, and what the current proposals are, they are just throwing some [mud] in the hope of making vague euro-sceptic score-points.

    disappointing effort from Hannon and the Telegraph, imho!


  • Comment number 31.

    Found myself sadly agreeing with Redwood over the EU. And only that. The majority of us voted back in the 1975 referendum to continue membership of the Common Market (as was), sold to us on the basis it would cut red tape over trading tariffs.

    Had we been told then it would actually create greater red tape in so many areas of our lives, and of the huge price for membership, as well as accepting countries - with all due respects - whose economies were totally unable to meet the 'club' fees, I think the vote would have been 'no'.

    A terrific idea on paper to unite Europe, especially after the carnage of the two world wars, but somehow it's a plan that's lost its way through too much idealism and not enough realistic management. More likely now to dis-unite Europe.

    And correct me if I'm wrong, a number of people for whom it was never intended have prospered more from the EU than the proletariat. Wonder who?

  • Comment number 32.

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

  • Comment number 33.

    #31: te cost of having well run, corruption-free governance is eternal vigilance, and the bravery to openly challenge power when it is beinng abused/abusive.

    this is as true of 'hobby groups' as it is supra-national organisations.

    "Had we been told then it would actually create greater red tape in so many areas of our lives," - atm the major intended "red tape" is to rerequire regulations over the Financial 'industries', surely of benefit, and hardly coincidental that at the same time the EU is under continuous and sustained attack.

    apart from that, and the comment about Redwood, i pretty much agree with the rest of what you say. Btw, do not so lightly shrg off the 'avoiding war' aspect, i very mch doubt, adjust for inflation, that the EU has cost the UK more in the last almost 40 years than we lost in just one of those wars. And that is just money, the cost in lives goes far beyond calculation. I'm NOT saying anything the EU does goes, but we SERIOUSLY need to think about what the alternatives offer. Western Europe has NEVER had such an extended period of pure peace, and whilst yes - the elites have carefully organised matters so they benefit most (completely different to how matters are organised within the UK of course!! rotflmao), that goes back to my first statement. We *let* it happen, it is not inevitable.

    And is it not obvious now to all, that the VERY SAME PROBLEMS exist in virtually ALL EU countries, regarding corruption and Banksters?? I'd prefer to work with the Spanish, the Greeks, the Irish, the Danes, the Poles and the Icelandic, to curb the excesses of our 'rulers', than take up arms and slaughter each other for the amusement of those very same 'rulers'.

    perhaps that's just me, and i enjoy laser-warrioring as much as anyone!! (probably paint-balling as well, but never tried it yet :'( ).

  • Comment number 34.

    #28/#29 - and you accuse ME of being on "Magic Lollipops!?!?"

    has 'shroom-season come early in your parts this year?? :/

    mods, re #32 - spoilsports!! :P

  • Comment number 35.

    shame the Ozzies don't have the same moral courage to stand up to *their* corrupt mining kkkorporates, for the benefit of the locals on THAT land. And racism is just as prevalent in India, so that is not an excuse for them.

    good for the Indian Govt, i hope they keep their nerves on this one, and don't fudge/corrupt it.
    no comment. :)

    i saw a few media stories about students turning to prostitution to pay their debts, well surely this is the next step:
    are we REALLY going to let matters reach this level? How much would Cameron pay for a heart-transplant?

    seriously, browse with Ubuntu:
    and improve your IQ score instantly!! :D

  • Comment number 36.

    10 steps backwards, but the occasional 1 step forwards:

  • Comment number 37.

    Its just an illusion ooh oohh ahhhahh..illuuuusion. And good theatre.

    Obama the Marxist has pulled another one outta the bag regardless who looks the winner or loser. (the loser will be the non-freeloading hard working tax payer, no doubt about that, and the middle class etc) The boys in Wall St must love this fella.. well they do operate him; he's a good glove puppet, and he certainly gives great speeches even if they do lack substance (think Blair for similarity) Anyhow, well done Obama, or is it Barry, I keep forgetting. If Obama was a republican -and not of African origin, would the BBC still give him an easy ride in their reporting? Answer: no.

    Or how about the way the Beeb reports on the Tea-party -you'd think they were terrorist or something when you listen to the nonsense the BBC trots out..have you noticed that?!..would they be given such a tough a ride from the mainstream media if they were democrats...errrrr no.

    Not sure if any of that makes any sense. I've just got in and its late.

  • Comment number 38.

    '13. At 17:16 2nd Aug 2011, NonEnglish wrote:
    Why has there been no coverage of his remarks on the BBC, especially Newsnight?

    Maybe some things require less coverage than others?

    '9. At 16:06 2nd Aug 2011, You wrote:
    Or just send Duncan and the boys round?

    It can all be sorted in post.

    '18. At 18:58 2nd Aug 2011, barriesingleton wrote:

    'Only asking' about sums a lot up.

    '20. At 20:29 2nd Aug 2011, stevie's too good for 'em

    From the EU to AV to so many other things, that does seem a popular view, amongst 'the people'. Maybe 'they' need a jury?

    Just my personal view, but Orwell does seem more and more prescient. Maybe he had a better 'source'?

  • Comment number 39.


    • 4. At 6:45pm on 14 Jan 2010, you wrote:

    Are we all registering the biblical terminology of Barack Obama? He has spake on the mountaintop that is called Whitehouse saying to Haiti: "You will not be FORSAKEN."

    The last person to talk biblical was Saint Tony, and a fat lot of good he did the world. And verily I say unto you, Tony was an orator - like Barack; Tony spouted rhetoric that did not bear analysis - just like Barack. Woe unto just about anyone - (but Israel). For it is become apparent that Barack has feasted greatly on the America Fruit, that makes a man feel he is someth'n else. But self-belief is devouring Saint Tony, yea even as I process the word, and may well lead him to spill his entrails on the rock called Chilcot. So, in the fullness of time, shall Obama self-combust, like a long dry twig, made flammable by his own hot air.



  • Comment number 40.

    #27 and 28 What do I think about this article and many others, I think it is to create confusion. We as a nation don't understand what's happening to us, most just want a job and get on with their lives, few analyse what's being done to them, we all moan, but can't quite comprehend.

    Creating confusion, means others do unto us what we don't see coming.

  • Comment number 41.

    #31 My feeling precisely, I thought the same as you, wouldn't it be better to part of Europe than part of the USA.

    I also voted in '72 to join in the first place, we do tend to be a bit island centric, and I liked europe.

    Now the whole thing is a complete mess, so many people pulling the strings, I never saw the EU this big either, we now seem to be about to welcome the middle east in as well. Most EU countries now fight against each other politically more than ever.

    Why don't they ever consider land mass and resources when making decisions, i.e. population growth and feeding people for a start.

  • Comment number 42.

    39. a worthy re-post Barrie. I'm impressed with your archive thing you got going there.

    Praise be Barry Obama the anointed one. I wonder if he's been to Bohemian Grove?

  • Comment number 43.

    AN 'ISLAND NATION' (#41)

    I still remember asking myself the 'Europe Question' - before voting to 'stay an island'. It only took a minute. I came to the view that we have an 'island mentality' (nowhere more than 70-odd miles from the sea?) - anyone in doubt should ask a Manxman if he wants to be "at the heart of England".

    ONLY A POLITICIAN would keep asserting that an off-shore island (that survived Hitler PRECISELY BECAUSE we are so placed) BELONGS AT THE HEART OF RAVAGED EUROPE. That is Homer Simpson thinking of a high order. But then - Major had a lot in common with Simpson.

    HomSap is not mentally configured for massive agglomerations. only aberrant, megalomaniacs seek those AND THEN ONLY TO BE IN THE ELITE.


  • Comment number 44.


    It's a hubris thing.

    I'll get me ignominy

  • Comment number 45.

  • Comment number 46.

  • Comment number 47.

    '45. At 10:58 3rd Aug 2011, kevseywevsey wrote:
    I wonder if the BBC will report this story?

    Depends. Is it in 'we, the public' interest?

    In advance of claiming to speak for folk, it may be best to ask first.

  • Comment number 48.

    can paul explain why going on strike to support a bbc ponzi pension scheme is rational? what economic theory is ponzi based on given the Met Police say anyone who knows an anarchist should report it immediately?

  • Comment number 49.

    summary of the posts since my last, above:

    the BBC is not absolutely perfect in its news coverage - unlike the other media, naturally.

    the UK should leave the EU, because that is full of foreigners.

    Barack Obama had the support of much of the US Elite, and still does - and this is *still* somehow shocking news.

    the Guardian has an idea with flaws.

    not all shocking crime in the UK is caused by white people.

    the BBC is a "monopoly" - BECAUSE its quality is far higher than its competitors, the Public watch it more, therefore we should (presumably) reduce its quality. It is shocking the Public may like media that IS NOT RACIST AND IS LIBERAL!!! Clearly this is unacceptable, and must come to an end. (I know - lets sell the BBC to News Korp, *THAT'LL sort it out!!)

    like, wow. You people have clearly moved on in the last 3 years. I wonder what kind of world you would actually create, given the chance. Presumably one Breivik would be at home in....?

    i just have to wonder WHY you continue to freely post on the web-site of an organisation you clearly hate and revile so much, and whose ethos is so clearly opposite to your own? I'm sure Islamophobe-Mailista Mel P would even set up a special blog for you, if you asked. So what gives?

    of course, i would miss you.

  • Comment number 50.


    I am studying the "MISCONDUCT IN PUBLIC OFFICE" law.

    It would appear that no MP may ignore information of a serious nature, such as a law breaking Liar Flyer. More to the point, an MP commits misconduct, if they avoid engagement with a legitimate public issue, especially by unilaterally closing off contact. As for KNOWINGLY ACCRUING VOTES from a 'false instrument' - I reckon a bit of book throwing is called for. Hardly likely to awaken NewsyNighty though.


  • Comment number 51.

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

  • Comment number 52.

    '49. At 12:08 3rd Aug 2011, Mindys_Housemate -
    the BBC is not absolutely perfect in its news coverage - unlike the other media, naturally.

    like, wow. You people ...

    i just have to wonder WHY you continue to freely post on the web-site of an organisation you clearly hate and revile so much...

    Always a bit wary of responding to blog posts with terms like 'you people', but in the spirit of solidarity at the very least...

    While I care about other media as well, I am compelled to pay for the BBC. This makes me feel responsible about stuff that goes out in my (British) name, at the very least, and as a stakeholder I feel entitled to comment on the 'service' I am given, no matter what.

    Can't speak for others of course, though some would seem to feel they are more entitled to do so, and even make claims on that basis.

    Others simply use a privileged pulpit to promote what seems very personal views that don't seem their place, given the responsibility of their positions.

    @theJeremyVine - Anyone else out there been sent to prison for flinging a foam flam at a Murdoch? #IThoughtNot

    We have a Parliament that is a sorry joke, but at least is elected in some form of democracy. The legislature and legal system is equally flawed and worthy of scrutiny and critique.

    However, adding unelected £4Bpa media monoliths to the 'influences I have little control over already, and getting worse if they are given an inch' pile seems... retrograde, especially if suggested that they are allowed to conduct themselves uncritically. Putting up 'No Other Views' may have an appeal (and, often, some support by the system), but beyond the unique funding aspect, it has a poor historical precedent

    So until this thread becomes 'friends, family and members (who 'know the pitch managers') only, I think I may chip in still.

  • Comment number 53.

    BBC on strike...I missed that. They don't know they're born those BBC hacks. If it wasn't for Jeremy and the Warkster -whom I think is lovely and adorable, (Kirsty, not Jeremy) - I'd never watch BBC news ever again because its left wing and biased. But thats to be expected as thats what happens to you if you live in a bubble, you lose touch with reality. But for the rest of us in Daily Mail land. we are just angry and perplexed at the BBC propaganda...and we have to pay for it. Russia TV on the other hand is freeeeeee! get it watched.

    I give the BBC 3 more years before its break-up. Some chap I overheard said that. I think he was a Lord or something important. He had connections to Hong Kong some years I heard. I was doing a gig for some young conservatives members and this Lord fella was having a drink talking about the BBCs future and how Gavin Esler will be lucky if he'll be getting more than £10 an hour when the changes kick in at the Beeb..I caught a snippet or two. There you go, a little bit of gossip for you. And it cost you nowt.

  • Comment number 54.

    EU Question

    Thanks for airing it , many people feel there is a problem with our current relationship with the EU (Super State).

    But the Liberal Democrat do seem to misunderstand the fundamental problem , the governed have never given their consent for the politically driven evolution of the EEC to become the EU.

    As Locke wrote -

    “The legislative cannot transfer the power of making laws to any other hands: for it being but a delegated power from the people, they who have it cannot pass it over to others.
    The people alone can appoint the form of the commonwealth, which is by constituting the legislative, and appointing in whose hands that shall be.
    And when the people have said, "We will submit to rules, and be governed by laws made by such men, and in such forms", no body else can say other men shall make laws for them; nor can the people be bound by any laws, but such as are enacted by those whom they have chosen, and authorized to make laws for them.
    The power of the legislative, being derived from the people by a positive voluntary grant and institution, can be no other that what that positive grant conveyed, which being only to make laws, and not to make legislators, the legislative can have no power to transfer their authority of making laws, and place it in other hands.”

    The argument is still valid today as it was near four hundred years ago. The principal was even incorporated into the UN Charter “Peoples have the right of self determination”.

    The Liberal Democrats and their fellow travellers in other political parties , need to rethink their reluctance to seek the peoples (the governed) consent.

    Personally , however our relationship with the EU Super State turns out , I would very much like for the UK to take a more active role in the European Space Agency. What better way to foster a shared pride in all Europeans than in the further exploration and understanding of Space.

    I hope this was not a fig leaf airing of the issue, "Ticked that box" kinda thing.

  • Comment number 55.



    Ennobled deception and corruption are not 'made good' by 5-yearly theatricals.

    Dig deeper Junkk.

  • Comment number 56.

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

  • Comment number 57.

    ooh I bet that post at 56 was a monster post...Mod, can't you reconsider and get it posted. I may lose sleep not knowing what mindywindy had written.

    Additional to my post above. The BBC is a great media outlet, run by well meaning and hardworking folk -whom also never line their pockets or speak with an agenda, political or otherwise. The spooks have been around. A man with a white coat has given me some I'm all better now. Just watched the NN Afganistan report..and didn't laugh once. It was a serious piece of Journalism. I'm presently having a new front door fitted to my replace the one that was kicked in.

  • Comment number 58.

    yet another nail in the coffin of the pharmaceutical pseudo-health lobby:


    #57: re #56:

    no, actually just a couple of lines, regarding #51 - and i am surprised that that has also been taken off. Perhaps i replied too well? I can imagine that many Guardians of Orthodox Reality would have got hot under the collar.

    my reply to barry, in short:

    i will avoid the explanation, as surely a link to a mere wiki article on a book cannot cause offence on its own. I would hope, anyway. Its a shame that only barry and those who read it before its deletion will understand the reference now, however.

  • Comment number 59.

    #57: that's not the BBC, they use Blue-Flash.

    It was probably Tesco's home delivery service.

  • Comment number 60.

    @59 :)

  • Comment number 61.

    55. At 13:06 3rd Aug 2011, barriesingleton wrote:
    Dig deeper Junkk.

    Why not, there's a lot of it about.

    So much to do; so little time... and so few outlets.

    But meantime, as I tell my kids, across many topics, 'Even if you think it is good enough, it will never hurt to be alive to the prospect it can always be better'.

  • Comment number 62.

    But... it must have been on twitter as well, making it 'true'.

  • Comment number 63.

    #62: i thought "80" was too high a figure, ahhh well, that dang internet, eh??

    who can you trust anymore, tsk, tsk, tsk!!!


    more on #51 for barry, an old post:

  • Comment number 64.

    Funny thing, popped over to 'The Editors' to drop a comment on a few threads covering journalistic accuracy and integrity... and they have all suddenly closed.

    It's one thing to broadcast only, but it's another when broadcasting poorly too.

  • Comment number 65.

    MEA CULPA (#51)

    I made a gratuitous swipe. Only Paxman should be allowed to behave so badly.

    Good call Blogdog.

  • Comment number 66.

    #60: - "Every Little Pill Helps!" ;)


    luckily for him, he's never perused this blog, else he would realise the true perils that lie in wait in cyberspace...


    ok, this is completely off any topic, but its just very interesting: the making of beer:

    now i fancy a pint... ;D

  • Comment number 67.


    If there IS any purpose to life, we are ill equipped to find it; and highly likely to crucify anyone who claims to have done so. Since leaving the trees, we have advanced deep understanding, not one jot, but excelled in aberrant cop-outs (aka religions). Does that look like a species headed for an understanding of The Ultimate Question? (We still think digital watches are a neat idea, and have added a plethora of iJunk.)

    Only 'constructive' brain chemistry tricks us into a false positive view. We men are just Tools of Mother Nature.

    Nuff sed.

  • Comment number 68.

  • Comment number 69.

    Yet again here we are @ 1800+ and there is NO BLOG PREVIEW POSTED YET AGAIN!

    Is this a deliberate attempt to turn us off blogging around the programme? WHY doesn't anyone bother to do the basics in a timely way?

    In the south west region we are regularly treated to the London Regional News in the mornings because someone's forgotten to switch the output over to the Plymouth studio - so they broadcast to no one.... at considerable expense.

    NN failing to post the daily blog page is in the same order of c*ckup as BBC SW - get your act together!

  • Comment number 70.


    Hi Richard. I think we must accept that facile embellishment of every aspect of radio and TV output, has siphoned-off (depleted) staff from less vital areas.

    Deckchairs MUST be re-arranged in a pleasing Patten.

  • Comment number 71.

    or they wait until they know what reports they are running with? Changin' times.

  • Comment number 72.

    and still apparently no one IRL reads this blog. After all, what possible harm could possibly come from saying "i read your blog and enjoy it"? Only 2 people have done this in 3 years, extraordinary.

    the UK has serious honesty problems, - which is pretty much the basis for all the *other* problems it has. Ah well, horses to water. :/

  • Comment number 73.

    kevsev as you hate the BBC so much...why contribute as nobody believes you



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