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How would you change the Labour Party?

10:27 UK time, Monday, 22 November 2010

"Profound" changes to the Labour Party on the scale of Tony Blair's New Labour reforms of the mid-1990s have been promised by leader Ed Miliband. What does the future hold for the party?

In a Guardian newspaper interview, as he returned from two weeks' paternity leave, Mr Miliband warned his party that it faced a "long, hard road" ahead.

He said the aim was to turn the party into the "largest community organisation in the country". He added that Labour would review its policies and its organisation, including the rules for electing its leaders.

Does the Labour Party need reforms? How should political parties be better organised? Do you support Ed Miliband's plans?

This debate is now closed. Thank you for your comments.

Comments

Page 1 of 8

  • Comment number 1.

    will they now be known as Nu Nu Labour ! After the state of the country I wouldnt imagine anyone would vote for them no matter what they change !

  • Comment number 2.

    Disband it

  • Comment number 3.

    I'd disband it

  • Comment number 4.

    Imprison the lot for allowing Tony and Gordon to ruin us?

  • Comment number 5.

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

  • Comment number 6.

    I know it is human nature to make big changes on the heels of a defeat, but a lurch to the left is not an answer - socialism has been discredited and people have long memories. This is not about being ready for government but about being effective opposition, and this can only be fought credibly from the centre ground.

  • Comment number 7.

    Given the last two attempts at government by the Labour Party, I would outlaw it as not being conducive to good of the nation.

    Supporting Labour, voting Labour is something truly to be very, very ashamed of.

    And at no point have these witless and feckless criminals of the last government apologised for the horror they inflicted at every level and in every sphere of society.

    What a disgrace

  • Comment number 8.

    Labour could change radically, or stay the same. It will make no difference at the next election. The Condems will present them with victory. Already Labour has the support of most LibDem voters. It is only the "I always vote Tory" voter who is still supporting the coalition.

  • Comment number 9.

    I would change it back to the Labour Party as it was before Bliar corupted it and added "New". I would change it back to the time before we had career politicians and we had conviction politicians rather than politicians that ought to be convicted. Alas, I fear that its too late.

  • Comment number 10.

    I would arrest them all and have them charged with treason.

  • Comment number 11.

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

  • Comment number 12.

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

  • Comment number 13.

    How would you change the Labour Party? Oooo: it's just too tempting, isn't it?
    I'd put them into coalition with the Conservatives in an attempt to get the Lib-Dems out. Oh: they are the Conservatives, aren't they? A token working class accent here and there doesn't really fool anyone. . .

  • Comment number 14.

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

  • Comment number 15.

    Not only the labour party but i would make it a condition of being chosen as an MP that you must have lived the constituency you wish to represent for 5 years as your main residence.....

    Party politics is failing because of the hand picked parachute regiment that all parties have.

    If only they were as good at what they do as the real parachute regiment....

  • Comment number 16.

    Messages 2 & 3 got there before me!

  • Comment number 17.

    Whatever they do, they MUST beat this dreadful coalition of hypocrites at the next election, for the sake of Britain.

  • Comment number 18.

    Here's a thought, try not being like the Tory party, as much as it may distress Tory Blair.
    Get your act together the Liberals are falling apart. The coalition is not going to last.

  • Comment number 19.

    I'd scrap the whole lot & start again with people who have a little REAL life experience & are in it for the good of the country as a whole, not just their bank balances.

  • Comment number 20.

    1. Be honest that you're a faction-ridden, interests-based organisation. All your holier than thou claptrap about being the 'nice party' makes me puke.
    2. Be honest that you lot don't like competition, so try and destroy competition for those who thrive on it. Why not try and compete externally through internal cooperation instead?
    3. Be honest that you think that being white, male, middle class and heterosexual is a syndrome. It's not, it's a fairly common starting point in life for many. And the hatred in your party for that common thing is as bad as racism was for blacks in the 1950s. Get rid of it. Or disband.
    4. Be honest that there are some seriously nasty, evil, psychotic women, blacks, muslims, Jews, gays and socialists on this planet. In this country. Then you will be worthy of respect. Not saying they all are, it's saying that some are. Just like some white men are.
    5. Cut the claptrap that politicians know best. Most of you know sweet fanny adams. Because all you did in life was politicking. Get some real-life experience before you admit to knowing something about society. Then you might do something decent in politics.
    6. Cut your nannying, namby-pambying, HSE-ridden wimpishness and say: 'I don't like risk'. Lots of us enjoy managing risk. It's a thrill. Being told by a stupid left-wing politician that I can't do it makes me want to puke. Before turning me into an impotent, depressed good-for-nothing. Men are not women. And until you understand that, don't stand for office again. Please.
    7. Don't say you represent the poor if you hate aspiration. Poor people can aspire like anyone else. What you can't handle is them aspiring more than you're capable of. Think about that. And change.
    8. Don't say you represent the middle class if you hate autonomy. Middle class people expect to run their lives themselves, with a little helping hand here and there. If you want to nanny them, go represent someone else.
    9. The wealthy don't expect you to cast them all with one stone. Sure there are a few wealthy crooks, deal with them. But don't expect those who worked hard for their wealth to hand it over to bozos like you to squander it on programmes that don't cut the mustard. They'll tell you to go take a walk........
    10. Lots of people believe in God. They believe in different ways, but they are seriously narked with loony lefties telling them that God is the cause of all evil. Organised religion has caused a lot of evil, but God hasn't. Learn to address the problems at the top, rather than tarnishing the beliefs of those at the bottom. Please......
    11. The world is a big place, a bigger place than Europe. Many people think that trading with the whole world is better than being ordered to trade with Europe by unelected Eurocrats. If you're so representative of the people, represent their views on that, please.......

    That might be a way to make a political party worth something.

    But you know something: even if Labour changed to represent that, I'd only support them if the people changed too.

    Because control freaks remain control freaks.........trust me, I know. Because control freaks destroyed my life again and again and each time you think the control freak has changed its spots, they come out in spots again..........

  • Comment number 21.

    Change the parties constitution so that a moronic, sour-faced bean counter is never again allowed to run un-opposed for the leadership.

    You have to WIN elections, thats all you have to do. Just get a leader who can gloss over the fact that like all parties you are going to lie to the electorate until you are in power.

    When you do get into power, drip feed good news and bury the bad, every single day. And if someone tells you that the public thinks you are doing wrong, THEN LISTEN TO THEM!

    G Brown should never, ever, ever, ever have been put in charge of government, let alone a political party. I do not care how good a chancellour he was (the job is easy if you are a tight-wad, if you stop government departments spending money at will it always ends up with a sound economy, it's what you then spend the money on that counts. Gordon spent it on the banks - fail! He should have let N Rock go to the wall that would have given a 'positive' message).

    The Saatchi's told tatcher that opposition parties never win elections, governments lose them. So I would sit tight, complain about EVERYTHING this government does, say constently that you would never be as harsh, and in 5 years the jobs yours.






  • Comment number 22.

    I would get rid of everyone who had been to Oxford or Cambridge University.

    Those people should be in the Liberal or the Tory party anyway.

  • Comment number 23.

    Show me a political party that doesn`t re-invent itself after a defeat. They always claim to be all things to all people but end up being stuck between two stools. Look how the big society worked for Cameron. At the end of the day a political party will say what it thinks people want to hear just to get hold of power and that`s what it`s all about.

  • Comment number 24.

    I don't think it matters much what changes he makes. People have long memories, what Labour did to this country will not be forgotten in a long, long time and because of that they will not gain power at the next or subsequent election. We will have to wait for the wheel to turn when the Conservatives have been in power too long and get complacent. History shows this is what will happen.

    By the way, I'm not a supporter of any particular political party, my vote is based on policies, I have to pick what I think is best from a bad bunch!

  • Comment number 25.

    Leader of the Opposition, paternity leave?

  • Comment number 26.

    If the Labour party is ever to have influence again it needs to lose the Marxist influences which constantly bubble away under the surface.

    Love or hate Tony Blair but he was correct in going for the middle ground, the Unions and old Soviets didn't like him but he got them elected. I suspect that many of them weren't happy with this and would much rather stand by their (incorrect) principles than be pragmatic.

    Also, making David Milliband the leader would be a start, and getting rid of Balls and Cooper who will always undermine anyone who stands in their way of party domination.

  • Comment number 27.

    start by ditching the spin - oh, and bring back ugly politicians - super groomed, media trained parasites make me want to vomit.
    Have a nice day :-D

  • Comment number 28.

    Free speech is banned in the UK. Magna Carta has been destroyed. If I were to say (with the BBC censors permission) what I wanted to do to ALL politicians, not just Labourites, then I would be jailed or even executed in turn for treason.

  • Comment number 29.

    The Labour Party needs to find out what it actualy stands for and who it represents. Miliband is devoid of policy, he does'nt have any ideas on how to combat the present finanial crisis and avoids current issues by saying he's in it for the "long haul".
    What exactly does he mean by saying he wants to turn Labour into the "largest community organisation in the country"? Is there going to be some sort of Labour pioneer corp helping pensioners across the road to the Labour community soup kitchens?
    Sounds to me like he's trying to nick the Tories Big Society wheeze and wrap it up in the red flag.

  • Comment number 30.

    Shouldnt we be asking the new general secretary of Unite that?.

  • Comment number 31.

    How can anyone in their right mind believe even a 'new' or 'reformed' Labour Party after the mess they left us with last time. Tony Blair spent the 90s and beyond telling everyone Labour is new. They kept telling everyone that Brown was the prudent chancellor committed 'to sustained economic growth'.

    We had massive national debts, near financial collapse, mass immigration and a frankenstien broken society.

    Only the uneducated, scroungers, criminals, die hard Labour supporters or people who don't have a grasp of economics would vote Labour. They have been a disaster for our country.

  • Comment number 32.

    Second raters will always be second raters, even if by some miracle you get a party full of honest ones.

  • Comment number 33.

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

  • Comment number 34.

    All resign on mass and start again as "ThePeople"

    This is the only way of washing away Labours appalling performance for a decade.

    This would also trigger country wide elections and keep the "cons" on their toes if nothing else.

  • Comment number 35.

    Since we already have 2 Tory Parties, the last thing we need is a third one. However, since Labour is a reformist party, dedicated to "fixing" capitalism, it will always end up on the side of the city spivs against the working people. I see no prospect of change from Ed Milliband, except the usual noises made when in opposition. If they ever win again, which they may do one day, it will be back to dining with the bankers, as usual, and continued crises.

  • Comment number 36.

    make sure that labour politicians are labour and not wishy washy men and woman who care more about there own career than the people they are supposed to represent members should decide policy after all its the members who put them forward, to represent in the first place ,ive just read some of the other comments ,and believe this current goverment are far worse an alternative than any labour goverment ,can people not see that a majority of the financial problems ,were of the bankers making here and abroad ,the previous labour goverment did rely too much on the financial services industry ,but the conservatives were allways on about too much financial regulation, they cannot have it both ways ,we will see how people feel when the cuts begin to bite on the poor the not so poor, and the middle classes.,

  • Comment number 37.

    Bring the incompetents of the last 'government' who got us into £4.8 TRILLION of debt, with £3 TRILLION of that off books, to account in court. They should NOT get away with this as OUR children and grandchildren will pay for their incompetence and corruption. I hope they NEVER get in to any position of power, ever again. But knowing the British people, they will fall for their lies again because they dont have the backbone to sort the mess out.

  • Comment number 38.

    First, get rid of Edd "the Duck" Miliband, in my opinion he's quackers.

    He is just playing to and targetting the less well off in suggesting keeping 50% tax rate for higher earners.

    Higher earners will just leave this country in droves and then there will be LESS wealthy people to subsidise Edd " the quackers duck" Miliband's unsustainable policys.

    Look at it this way, taxed at 50% then taxed at a further 20% VAT on everything you spend, amounts to 70% tax rate, & thats not including National Insurance, another form of tax.

    WHO in their right mind would just hand over 70% + of earnings so that some muppet quackers politician can play at Mr Super Fantasy Unsustainaility.

    If Edd "the quackers duck" Miliband wants to make radical changes and VASTLY improve fairness then he should simply rip up the present tax system which is ludicrous, diabolical, attrocious, an insult to inteligence, inept, wasteful and basically a totalitarianist crumb giving controlling outrage that is more wasteful than old buffalo hunters on a hunting mission.

    Quite simply, it is 1001% ILLOGICAL to employ droves and droves of people to tax low to middle income earners excessive amounts and then further employ many more droves of people to hand back large chunks of this money via tax credits and via other rebates & other means.

    The ONLY purpose of such an illogical system is to empower politicians so they can act like god and show how merciful they are to those they want to spin mercy to for electioneering purposes by deceitful manipulation of handouts of good boy doggy/donkey/sheep treats & crumbs for low to middle earners via tax rebates etc.

    UK taxation system is basically and relatively legalised mugging, then paying back some, or much of the money to those it has been mugged from.

    Monty Pythons "Dennis Moore" robbing Lupins then giving them to the poor is FUNNY, the similar UK tax system is NOT FUNNY or FIT FOR PURPOSE.

    Supposidly the government has clever people running the country and access to multitudes of experts, WHERE ARE THEY ON MATTERS THAT REALLY COUNT/MATTER!!!!

    UK tax system is a complicated abomination of stupidity which ONLY gets worse & more costly to administer/manage & more complicated with every political meddling incompetant inept touch.

  • Comment number 39.

    JezzaSW writes: "uneducated, scroungers, criminals, die hard Labour supporters or people who don't have a grasp of economics would vote Labour."

    Apart from "uneducated" that's repetition on a grand scale!

  • Comment number 40.

    Unfortunately I doubt there is much they could to to regain our trust .. they not only betrayed the poorest of us in society.. they have done something even more unforgivable. They handed power on a plate ..to the ultimate Social Vampires and Egor their faithful dwarf. God help the poor from here on in.. and God help the Labour Party.

  • Comment number 41.

    "How would you change the Labour Party"? is the HYS question.

    1) Change the Labour Party leader.
    2) - ditto -

  • Comment number 42.

    It's easy enough to pretend contrition after the fact but let's not forget;

    90 days detention
    the dodgy dossier
    Mr I'm-not-a-Catholic-oh-no-wait-suddenly-now-I-am Blair
    4300 new crimes
    DNA database
    children's database
    invading Iraq
    Brown's pension grab
    massive, unsupportable debts
    extraordinary rendition


    need I go on? Disband it and drag every minister before a court to answer for their crimes before finding them guilty.

  • Comment number 43.

    Europe will be running us soon anyway, and the British Parliament will be just like the Queen, nothing more than a tradition.

  • Comment number 44.

    As the New Labour Party was an anachronism, it should have been New Blue, and 'New' anything these days means the same old garbage rebranded, how about simply reverting to old Labour values. We need a party to expose the corruption in our ruling classes, from corporate directors through market speculators to political leadership in all parties.

    Ed Miliband has at least two years to pave the way and by that time the country will either be in such dire straits that the Coalition will be history or it will be down on its knees will Miliband and co pouring scorn all over the Condems as they are made to go the full five years. One way or another it is a classic opportunity to rid ourselves of two parties who have no right to be in UK politics, let alone government.

    However, in case you think I am a Labour supporter, I honestly do not believe our current democratic processes provide anything remotely like representation in Westminster. Unfortunately I cannot see any of the three main parties, even the Lib Dems, doing anything to change things for the better. Labour can reinvent and reform but I doubt it will.

  • Comment number 45.

    A new slogan:
    "I disagree with Nick".
    Let Cameron get on with the job of defending his Deputy PM.

  • Comment number 46.

    Reduce the amount of high earning MPs by over half.
    Make them responsible for a new wave of lower payed part time MP's that can do the work for each disctict/council.

    Provide an online payment request database where everyone can view wages, expencies, running costs and funding.

    If you want to make an open government then make it fully open, allow everyone to view what is spent and why it is been spent. ie...
    Cost of polls, research, reviews assemsments and so on..


    Oh yeah make all MP's work for the minimum wage allowing bonuses when they achieve there goals or improving sociaty for the better and fine those who hinder or add costs to it.

    Allow any MP or councillor to be removed at any time if public oppinion demands it.

    REMOVE POLITICAL AMUNITY! if you commit a crime then you pay for it like everyone else.

  • Comment number 47.

    7. At 11:17am on 22 Nov 2010, Sauron the Deciever wrote:

    Supporting Labour, voting Labour is something truly to be very, very ashamed of.

    ------------------------------------------

    I used to be a member of the Young Conservatives and have several family members who work for the party, one at a very high level and one aquaintance who is a Tory MP. I therefore know a bit about the behind the scenes activities, as a result I would never to give the modern Tory party my support. Many loyal supporters would probably feel the same.
    Both Labour and the Cons have changed over the years, perhaps Milliband will bring about some welcome changes but whether or not he will get a fair hearing from the media is a different matter. It is the aim of the right wing media to paint any supporters of the Labour party as insane almost criminal, you see the repetition of these sentiments on HYS repeated parrot fashion, but the Tory party would not stand up well to similar scrutiny.
    We need to do far more about party donations we are in great danger of losing our democracy to the power of the wealthy. Party donors are gaining far too much power, this is what has happened in the US. No party can work for the good of the majority when their hands are tied by their donors. The Labour party have the unions but this is at least democratic in that union members can opt out of the political levy. When we purchase goods from companies who support a party we have no choice as to whether or not any of our money goes as a donation. Unfortunately elections cost more and more and if we get set term parliaments electioneering will last longer and cost more. Therefore the party with the most money has a huge advantage

  • Comment number 48.

    Easy, ban it but only after it has repaid every single penny of the country's debt which it is responsible for.

  • Comment number 49.

    28 Bob its not you that should be tried for treason it is a lot of the past and present mps (notice small case they dont deserve capitals)
    regards
    justme

  • Comment number 50.

    Change the name to Class War or how about Unite - The Real Party. That way we will be in no doubt what they stand for. Oh, and try a leader who can speak coherently, that way we may understand what it is he is lying about.

  • Comment number 51.

    Red Ed and his band of commies need to clearly identify themselves as the failures they really are, open the books for the world to see that they and their loony lefties, Unions, those appologising for being British, those who would have us as all equally poor, corrupted, spied upon, over worked, over taxed till there's nothing left, admit that they'll never be trusted with the keys to the kingdom again.

    The Soviet & Eastern Blok failed, the Labour Party has done their level best to drag us down that same route - Tony B Liar succeeded in an illegal war, Gordon Brown succeeded in selling our national assets then signed us into Europe with out hesitation, consideration or consultation with we the TAXPAYERS - then he ripped off with his bent set of socialist ideals cc his old boys' networks in the Banking industries.

    They have consigned we BRITISH to the same fate as the Greeks, the Irish, the Portugese and the Spanish in their reckless financial mismanagement and incompetence. My children might pay Labour's Tax Bill by their retirement - if they're allowed to retire... and there'll be no state pension for them!

    A major change? Absolutely. Start with an admission of guilt and do time in prison... Atlee must be turning in his grave at what you've done...

  • Comment number 52.

    Oh how I agree with billyhano #8.
    Labour don't need to change very much at all. Even with the unpopularity of Gordon Brown, they were not swept aside last time. As I've said before, a chimp should have been able to get the Tories a massive majority, but they didn't get any majority at all and the majority of votes were for apparently left of centre parties.
    Now that the LibDems (or the leaders at least) have shown their true colours, all that's left is Labour and all Ed Milliband has to do, is keep it simple, keep a decent sensible stance going on rabid right-wing or rabid left-wing policies and, if possible get big bro' back in the fold.
    Should be job done.
    But I think it needs to be done quickly, as if the Tories even sniff a decent poll lead, they will dump their LibDem poodles like Cabbage Patch dolls.
    Note to Clegg - a coalition is while it suits the dominant party, not for life.

  • Comment number 53.

    In order to be effective, Labour must break away from the idea that spending money on a problem will automatically solve it. They must also understand that laws and regulations are only of use if they can be effectively enforced.

    I think the area (the only area!) where the coalition is coming up with good ideas is on Welfare. Labour's approach to welfare was just to pour more and more money into it. That didn't help people off welfare. Because of this approach, of the 3 million jobs created in the last 13 years, 80% were taken by workers from the EU and many of our social problems that existed 13 years ago still exist today.

    Their addiction to passing confusing laws and regulations caused an explosion in legal activity which filled the courts and prisons to bursting point, at huge social and economic cost to the country. Many of the people in prison today shouldn't be there and some of the people not in prison should be.

    If Ed Miliband can get Labour to think beyond just spending money and making things illegal, they could have a very positive impact on the country.

  • Comment number 54.


    This question shows total disrepect to all those who leave comments on HYS ..Do you really expect ...reasoned comments .... when new labour has caused the biggest cockup on british political history left the country in ruins .... And the followers of which ,NOW what to try and salvage a political future by Changes !!!
    Beggars believe ---CAN A LEOPARD CHANGE IT'S SPOTS ?
    ME THINKS NOT

  • Comment number 55.

    What kind of political leader takes paternity leave during a global financial/economic crisis? Is he living in a Monty Python sketch?

  • Comment number 56.

    Introducing honesty after blair and brown would go a long way. We do need a viable opposition to the people in power just to keep balance. Less blaming of tories and thatcher and more acceptance of responsibility would improve their standing.

    The labour party did some good things while in power but then went off the rails.

  • Comment number 57.

    Mr WonderfulReality is worth repeating:

    "Quite simply, it is 1001% ILLOGICAL to employ droves and droves of people to tax low to middle income earners excessive amounts and then further employ many more droves of people to hand back large chunks of this money via tax credits and via other rebates & other means.

    The ONLY purpose of such an illogical system is to empower politicians so they can act like god and show how merciful they are to those they want to spin mercy to for electioneering purposes by deceitful manipulation of handouts of good boy doggy/donkey/sheep treats & crumbs for low to middle earners via tax rebates etc.

    UK taxation system is basically and relatively legalised mugging, then paying back some, or much of the money to those it has been mugged from."

    Just what are we doing taking tax from ANYONE earning less than £20K?

  • Comment number 58.

    I would leave it as it is... No change is better. got no inclination to vote them anyways...

  • Comment number 59.

    How would I change the Labour Party? I wouldn't. I would abolish it and consign it to the history books with the postscript warning: They'll bankrupt the country if given the chance.

  • Comment number 60.

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

  • Comment number 61.

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

  • Comment number 62.

    Make contact with the US Tea Party movement especially with those who want to transform top down politics, control the political classes, restore freedom of speech, and support ordinary working men and women. Persuade Ed and some reasonably intelligent Labour leaders to meet with Governor Sarah Palin and prepare good relations with the future US President. For Guardian readers who cannot see the drift of politics and who see Palin and the Tea Party as 'extreme right wing' (Guardianspeak) reflect on the fact that almost every speech she makes begins with words that no English politician dare say. She says, as a warm up remark, 'Arn't you proud to be an American? Don't you love America?'. Simple hockey mum eh. Thanks to previous labour governments these remarks could not be said about England as they would be racist and offensive. See what you have lost Labour, BBC, and the Guardian. Start from there Mr Milliband.

  • Comment number 63.

    Now that we are back to 2 party politics it is essential that Labour demonstrate that they are different from the Tories - that they are the party of the welfare state - they are the party that sees the nonsense in spending billions on unusable nuclear weapons - that they do stand up for disadvantaged in our society.

    Both parties have an underlying dogma - I just find the Tories deep-seated dogma of supporting the privileged hard to swallow.

  • Comment number 64.

    Dump the Trades Unions,

    Pledge to cut the size of the public sector,

    Pledge to reduce taxation and end the war on the motorist,

    Significantly cut all overseas aid and handouts,

    Leave the EU,

    Reject the flawed "science" of man made climate change

    Look after the British people as a priority

    Banish political correctness.

    Start being honest and answer questions instead of dodging around the truth

    Sack Harriet Harman.

  • Comment number 65.

    What change would I like to see?

    A change of address (preferably overseas somewhere)

    Andy

  • Comment number 66.

    The Labour Party needs to get back to the core fundamentals of its origins and stop believing that it can "Ride the Devil" of the establishment - this was Tony Blair's big mistake, and represents a huge lost opportunity to the ordinary working people of Britain.

    There are many institutions in this country that need radical reform and this is what the Labour Party should be concentrating on. The first of these is the financial system that favours short-termism and quick profits for themselves over sutained growth in jobs and a wider prosperity for all UK citizens who are prepared to work for a living. The nationalisation of the banks was, in this regard, a huge lost opportunity and a blunder of indecisiveness for which Darling and Brown cost the Labour Party the election and foisted upon us this ridiculous coalition of the usual vested interests (Tories) and political opportunists (LibDems). The nationalisation of the banks (saving them from extinction in other words) should have come with a heavy price tag: that in return they agreed to set up the kind of long-term financing of projects which would re-encourage manufacturing in the UK. Talented people (by this I mean truly talented people such as technologists, engineers and scientists - not city bankers) don't want to take the risk of setting up in the UK because the banks won't extend them sufficient credit to invest in the long-term like they do in Germany or Japan for instance. The rescue of the banks should have ensured that this vital relationship between the supply of money and the investment of said money in to long-term manufacturing effort should have been the first condition on the rescue agreements - without it the banks have got away scot-free to go on behaving as they have always done in this country: gambling to achieve the short-term high. Unfortunately, as we have now seen, this type of approach is unsustainable in a modern industrial society.

    This investment would create a "virtuous circle" of improved job prospects for people. Real jobs with real skills (not stacking shelves, or flipping burgers) which would give people a sense of pride and worth once again. Then there would be no need for "call me Dave's" riduculous Big Society nonsense - which is all just hot air anyway!!

    Its about real people and real jobs for people. This is the only way that a society can feel its own worth, and those who have been getting away for far too long with merely feathering their own nests should be made to join in and help pay for something which is for the wider benefit of all. More real jobs with good wages and high skill levels build better communities and result in less crime.

    Its common sense, so come on Labour start committing to the people who have always supported your cause: the working man and woman who only want to the best for their families and communities. Who want a decent place to live in a decent society, and who want the best opportunities for their children to better themselves and continually improve no matter where they start in life. Is this really too much to ask?

    If Labour wants to differentiate itself from the Tories and the LibDems then it is going to have to start looking forward to a modern society where working people are going to expect these promises to be delivered. You certainly aren't going to get anything lime this from anybody else.

  • Comment number 67.

    Labour should consider supporting a raise in retirement age for companies and the government. Corporations need well-trained, experienced employees. In return, Labour must receive an improved plan for education, medical benefit, and salary\promotion evaluation.

  • Comment number 68.

    "how would you change the labour party"?

    All labour MPs and MEPs and Labour Peers to set genuine standards and have all their allowances and expenses (tax free) to be means-tested.

    The labour party demand that all union leaders take pay cuts, especially those on £90K and protected pensions of around £30K.

  • Comment number 69.

    Have them apologise for starters, then I might be more willing to listen to them.

  • Comment number 70.

    Lukethetaff idioticlly remarks: "All tory voters know full well( but I don't expect them to be honest because that's all these tories have done since being in power is lied ) that even if there was no deficit they would still cut, cut and cut again. "

    OF COURSE if there no deficit the size of the state should be diminished! It has far too much power over our lives (and incomes).

    But there's no point in belabouring that (sorry), since Labour have got us into such a big mess, there is no choice but to reduce the size of the state.

  • Comment number 71.

    I would change it back to the Labour Party as it was before Bliar corupted it and added "New

    ------
    You mean when it lost every general election for 2 Decades?
    Before the most successful leader the Party has ever had made it the natural choice for floating voters?
    That will work!

    I am sure the condemns would be only too grateful as a Micheal Foot style Labour opposition is about their only chance of getting reelected!


    Please don't use the stupid transposition in Tony Blair's name as it doesn't improve you argument and gets exceptionally old.

    A politician who lies good heavens never been heard of before!

  • Comment number 72.

    55. At 12:16pm on 22 Nov 2010, The Ghosts of John Galt wrote:
    What kind of political leader takes paternity leave during a global financial/economic crisis?

    ----------------------------------
    David Cameron and he was PM not leader of the opposition

  • Comment number 73.

    Plenty of Uncle Rupert's paywall dodgers on here today I see. Nice to know the class war is being fought at both ends of the political spectrum.

    Instead of battling for the centre of ground with the Tories like two bald men fighting over a comb, Labour should understand what is was created for and who it was created to represent. Labour needs not to reinvent itself but to return to its core values. God knows we desperately need an opposition that will stand up for the common good against this hateful Conservative government.

  • Comment number 74.

    The Answer is simple, learn from Tony Blair but dont take us into dodgy foreign wars. If Blair had not we would still have a Labour government today. Iraq cost Labour over 50 seats in 2005 the other 50 were lost due to failure on the domestic front. Learn from these mistakes.

    Labour have to create a One nation party because with the current lot we have a distinct 'us and them' society. Cameron clearly has a dangerous and pathological hatred of council homes and the poor generally.

    YOU DONT HELP PEOPLE BY MAKING THEM POORER. LABOUR MUST DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS EVIL FROM CAMERON AND CLEGG.

    We have shocking waste in the private sector, with tax havens and tax avoidance bleeding the Nation. Labour must reign this in.

    We MUST have at least ONE major party that is not dominated and controlled by Murdoch the tory media and the finance barons.

    Friendship with the USA means telling them that at times we simply dont agree with your policies at home or abroad.

    You can love America and still hate some of thier policies.

    Labour have the task of taking Britain into the 21st centrury as the Coaliton attempt to take us back in time. Who will win? Im a Christain and see nothing christain about what Cameron is doing..in fact I see only gross unfairness and injustice, that is NOT the British way.

    People are suffering today. Labour must tell the fuel companies they can only put up prices by the rate of infaltion, had Brown done so he might be PM today. Labour must listen to the people not think tanks sitting in cosy academic offices or universities.

  • Comment number 75.

    Don't you love all the Tories stating how they would reform the Labour party.

    Must be a quiet day at Mill bank Towers!
    Have you got the glass back in the windows yet?

    Form the absence of Labour supporters contributing you have to assume that either
    1)They are happy as it is.
    2)They don't care.
    3)There aren't any who bother with the Right wing dominated HYS.

  • Comment number 76.

    I would like the Labour party NOT to be a right wing capitalist one which would mean that we have some deomcracy in this country. At present the main parties are all right wing and support the capitalist way of living which has been proven to not be good for us if the state of affairs we are in is anything to go by. As far as I am concerned the current government is an unelected one as we only have the choice of voting for one party.

  • Comment number 77.

    Seems there are a lot of Mail readers on here who want to have to have a one party state similar to a dodgy central American fascist state.
    NEWS FLASH! you didn't win the election, you only have power because of the suicidal political choices of the soon to be consigned to history Lib Dems.
    One crazy on here even suggests the party is dominated by Marxists! I'd seriously see a doctor about that, you are off the scale delusional.
    OK personally I'd say ditch all the Thatcher inspired love of the market. It's been disastrous ( and would have been exactly the same under the Tories )
    Bring in support for re-establishing some form of manufacturing base similar to France and Germany, relying on banking as our biggest `industry` is insanely risky.
    Invest in science and technology because that's where the new jobs are coming from (from environmental technology particularly ). Try and reduce the gap between the super rich and those at the bottom before the effects on our society become dangerous. It doesn't mean running into the arms of the unions just some more equity for those working on low wages.

  • Comment number 78.

    47. At 11:59am on 22 Nov 2010, Lucy Clake wrote:
    7. At 11:17am on 22 Nov 2010, Sauron the Deciever wrote:

    Supporting Labour, voting Labour is something truly to be very, very ashamed of.

    ------------------------------------------

    I used to be a member of the Young Conservatives and have several family members who work for the party, one at a very high level and one aquaintance who is a Tory MP. I therefore know a bit about the behind the scenes activities, as a result I would never to give the modern Tory party my support. Many loyal supporters would probably feel the same.
    Both Labour and the Cons have changed over the years, perhaps Milliband will bring about some welcome changes but whether or not he will get a fair hearing from the media is a different matter. It is the aim of the right wing media to paint any supporters of the Labour party as insane almost criminal, you see the repetition of these sentiments on HYS repeated parrot fashion, but the Tory party would not stand up well to similar scrutiny.
    We need to do far more about party donations we are in great danger of losing our democracy to the power of the wealthy. Party donors are gaining far too much power, this is what has happened in the US. No party can work for the good of the majority when their hands are tied by their donors. The Labour party have the unions but this is at least democratic in that union members can opt out of the political levy. When we purchase goods from companies who support a party we have no choice as to whether or not any of our money goes as a donation. Unfortunately elections cost more and more and if we get set term parliaments electioneering will last longer and cost more. Therefore the party with the most money has a huge advantage
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------

    I stand by my claim that anyone who has even the remotest connection to Labour should be shunned and shamed for the horror they, in their part, have brought on the rest of us.

    I am no great fan of the Tories either to be honest with you.

    "It is the aim of the right wing media to paint any supporters of the Labour party as insane almost criminal,"

    I see nothing wrong with this as we have suffered through this at the hands of the Left Wing media in their aims to demonize anyone who did not toe the left wing line (what goes around, comes around). On your point as well, I was in actual fact around in the UK for the 13 years or so that we were governed by Labour so know first hand that this party of blaggards, needed no help from the right wing media to earn the reputation that have gotten themselves. Labour behaved in a treasonous fashion, dismantling parts of our democracy to suit current fad thinking and this is what we are left with. A bankrupt, socially fractured country, struggling to get back off its knees.

    Any attempt to defend Labour or their actions is to be treated with the contempt and disgust it rightly deserves and the suggestion that those attempting to defend it should seek some form of mental health assistance.

  • Comment number 79.

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

  • Comment number 80.

    But does it want to? The Labour Party exists only to serve those vested interests which fund it and whom it relies on for electorate support. So if you're not from a single interest group, ethnic minority, benefit claimant or trades union activist you're of no interest to it except to fund its crackpot schemes when the forgotton majority are forced to suffer a term of its administration either at local or national level.

  • Comment number 81.

    What if we all clubbed together and funded brain implants for them?

  • Comment number 82.

    If labour are to reform they must distance themselves from Blair's presidency and be seen as a party based on democratic principles, to which end:

    1 Cease the union block vote and have 1 member 1 vote, though Ed may disagree

    2 Chnage the emphasis of policies from support to enablement i.e. give opportunities to people but stop unconditional support

    3 Show a pride in this country, its traditions and its people - don't sell us out as Blair did to the US and EU

    4 Stop the rhetoric on rights and make people take responsibility - i.e. get rid of the minority of left wingers who drive policies which most normal people see as the "politcial correctness" and adopt policies that the common man sees as fair

    5 Have MP's who have held jobs for a minimum of a decade outside westminster and thereby have politicians who understand the reality of life

    6 Have the decency to drop the red rose as the party symbol - it represents only England and all those in England not just labour supporters

  • Comment number 83.

    "Meet the new boss, same as the old boss".... The Who got it about right in the song "won't get fooled again".
    any defeated political party undergoes a re-branding and tries to ensure the future wealth of their own backers and career-politicians by getting back into power. They then renege on all their manifesto promises and the ACTUAL running of the country continues to be in the hands of the banks and multinational companies....as it always has done and always will do...
    Labour, Conservative, Liberal are all just different signage on the facade of the same same business being run by the same management!! Oo aren't I cynical today!

  • Comment number 84.

    Along with the other two english parties. I would stick them all on desert island and forget about the lot of them.

    Non of them are any good for the well being of Cymru.

    The sooner we are out from under the colonial rule of the english, the better.

  • Comment number 85.

    64. At 12:27pm on 22 Nov 2010, NOT an AGW sheep wrote:
    Dump the Trades Unions,

    Pledge to cut the size of the public sector,

    Pledge to reduce taxation and end the war on the motorist,

    Significantly cut all overseas aid and handouts,

    Leave the EU,

    Reject the flawed "science" of man made climate change

    Look after the British people as a priority

    Banish political correctness.

    Start being honest and answer questions instead of dodging around the truth

    Sack Harriet Harman.


    ..................................................................................

    Shouldn't that be Tory policy? Certainly doesn't sound like something Labour would ever do.

    I personally think none of the main parties really cater for the English public anyway.

    The problem with Labour is that their voting base are immigrants, those reliant on the bloated public sector, those on benefits and many disgruntled people in the North,Scotland and Wales.

    They have a strong powerbase in the towns and cities but in most of England they are 2nd or 3rd.

    The party that stands up for the people of the UK with no class barriers will come out on top. I think the Conservatives are best placed to do that but if Labour move quickly you never know....

  • Comment number 86.

    Disband it. As the followers of Nu Labour have conveniently forgotten their responsibility for the war crimes of their y'know pretty straight kinda guy the rest of us should be protected from their maniac tendencies.

  • Comment number 87.

    why is it always between these 3 parties time after time they prove they worthless???

    why arent people voting UKIP? from the comments on hys previous it seems most people want what UKIP want?

    yet they will still vote for the "big" 3 honestly everybody whines about the parties and moans but do you ever vote ukip? no? then what the hell do you expect?

  • Comment number 88.

    "How would you change the Labour Party?"

    I would endeavour to teach them primary arithmetic so they understand that spending more than they have is not 'prudent' and 'sustainable' but the road to ruin.

    Three times they have been in power during my life and three times they have wrecked the economy. Just how dumb are they that they never learn the same easy lesson and how dumb are their voters that they keep on letting them do it again?

  • Comment number 89.

    3. At 11:12am on 22 Nov 2010, Matt wrote:
    I'd disband it
    -*-
    Thereby having single party rule.
    Right - but why stop there?
    Continue by banning all trade unions.
    Abolish all workers rights.
    Abolish minimum wage.
    Abolish health and safety rules.
    Reduce unemployment benefit to a minimum.
    Get rid of industrial tribunals.
    Get rid of legal aid.
    (after these have been introduced by Labour)
    And, that’s for starters…
    Now we're getting somewhere, right? Too right!

  • Comment number 90.

    I wish some of the Tory commentators on here would grow up and learn to engage in proper debate.

    No wonder the country is in a mess when its been run by this idiotic public schoolboy mentatlity for so long.

  • Comment number 91.

    The Labour Party must seek to complement not imitate the Tory Party. The Tory party looks after the interests of the better off, so the Labour Party must look after the rest. All of its policies must be tested by asking the question "Will this policy really help the less well off?"

    Finance is a key problem for a left wing party. Only the very rich can afford to donate large sums to political parties and human nature being what it is, they mainly support right wing parties. The problem of party funding must be tackled. If it is not, the poor will continue to be difficult to represent.

    Money from trade unions leaves Labour open to attack as a pawn of trade union barons who, since they have from time to time, to organise industrial action on behalf of their members, are easy targets for the press. The Labour Party should link itself directly with political levy payers by making them individual members, who happen to pay their membership fees via the agency of a trade union. The special position of unions and other associated organistions as such, should be eliminated, particularly block votes and reserved seats on the NEC.

    These changes would open the way for a low limit on individual donations, more like 500 GBP per annum, rather than the 50000 GBP recommended by Hayden Phillips, and donations from companies and other organisations should be banned, although allowing them to pass on money donated in small amounts by individuals specifically for political purposes.

    The limits on party expenditure should also be extended. The ban on political advertising on radio or TV should be extended to other forms of commercial advertising, in order to provide a more level playing field for the less well funded. The requirement for a reasonable political balance should also be extended to the press, since bias amounts to a donation in kind to the favoured party, and it would be inconsistent to allow this while banning other corporate donations.

  • Comment number 92.

    Frankly I am bored stiff with the Labour party and wouldn't mind if Ed Milliband took permanent leave.The party seems full of armchair Socialists who, whilst wringing their hands about the poor and needy' are living in luxury at the taxpayers expense. All politicians need to consider their links to the real workers before telling us what to do.I wish they would work together and drop Party politics point scoring for a while.

  • Comment number 93.

    post 57 on 22 Nov - 'MellorSJ'

    Fair points. Direct and indirect taxation, in England, is too high.

    If you are employed and under PAYE then you will pay full wack of direct taxation and possibly more.

    On top of that you will also pay high fuel costs, plus VAT. If you are a shift worker, for example a nurse, you will rely heavily on your old car to get you to work and home on time and safely.

  • Comment number 94.

    52. At 12:08pm on 22 Nov 2010, pragmatickev wrote:
    Oh how I agree with billyhano #8.
    Labour don't need to change very much at all. Even with the unpopularity of Gordon Brown, they were not swept aside last time. As I've said before, a chimp should have been able to get the Tories a massive majority, but they didn't get any majority at all and the majority of votes were for apparently left of centre parties.
    Now that the LibDems (or the leaders at least) have shown their true colours, all that's left is Labour and all Ed Milliband has to do, is keep it simple, keep a decent sensible stance going on rabid right-wing or rabid left-wing policies and, if possible get big bro' back in the fold.
    Should be job done.
    But I think it needs to be done quickly, as if the Tories even sniff a decent poll lead, they will dump their LibDem poodles like Cabbage Patch dolls.
    Note to Clegg - a coalition is while it suits the dominant party, not for life.

    .......................................................................................

    I would actually disagree with you. The problem for the Tories is that they are seen as the party of the rich. They need to remould themselves as the party of tradition, no class barriers,protecting UK interests.

    Policies like raising tuition fees are foolish and many including Tory supporters like myself disagree with them.

    A lot of people believe in common sense policies like reducing red tape for police and useful public sectors, getting rid of quangos which waste money and life sentence meaning life sentence.

    A lot of Labour's supporters are fickle. They vote Labour because of their hatred of Thatcher which is irrational. Labour has bought a lot of support with their reliance on immigrants flooding in, benefit claimants and making the public sector bloated.

    It's no surprise that the places with the highest amount of public sector jobs are predominantly Labour.

    Labour needs to actually stand up for the working class man.

    The Conservatives need to stand up for British people of all class.

  • Comment number 95.

    72. At 12:34pm on 22 Nov 2010, Lucy Clake wrote:
    55. At 12:16pm on 22 Nov 2010, The Ghosts of John Galt wrote:
    What kind of political leader takes paternity leave during a global financial/economic crisis?

    ----------------------------------
    David Cameron and he was PM not leader of the opposition
    ----------------------------------

    Mmmm - Now what does that tell you about our political cliques?

  • Comment number 96.

    Disband it.

    They represent and care about no one but themselves.

  • Comment number 97.

    The Labour party died in the 1970's, all that's left is a rotting carcass and the only decent thing to do now is to bury the damn thing so that we can be free from its foul smell and ungodly presence.

  • Comment number 98.

    I'd get rid of Blair, Straw, Blunkett, and all the other nutters who were crawling to Dubya's orders, taking their eyes off The City bankers and financiers to do whatever they wanted in the money market.

  • Comment number 99.

    Not sure what you would do with Labour except keep them under the radar for enough years for people to forget what a disaster they were in office and for any living reminders of their period of tenure to retire gracefully, but crucially, with as little fuss as possible.

    They don't need to perform their duty as the official opposition while the newsroom staff at Portland Place are making such a superb job of it, so keeping out of the public eye for a few years can only be good for them.

  • Comment number 100.

    Get back to being a LABOUR party for working people and stop trying to be Thatcherite Tories, constantly pandering to the multi-nationals and the gutter press

 

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