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Points Of View Message Board

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Nick Reynolds Nick Reynolds | 15:56 UK time, Friday, 14 November 2008

Recently my boss Jem Stone has gone to BBC radio where he's now in charge of their communities, blogs and message boards. Which means that some of the things he used to have responsibility for have fallen to Tom Van Aardt (Communities Editor, FM&T) and to me.

One of these is the Points of View message board.

Our moderators put in a lot of effort to ensure that inappropriate comments are removed from the boards.

But moderation and hosting are not the same thing. Whisky usefully explains the difference here. And (as Ångelicweeyin among others have noticed) it's fair to say that recently the level of hosting on the boards has been less than ideal.

So to "sort out these boards" both myself and Jem are now taking on a more active role hosting them. And in the next few weeks we hope to have additional hosting on the boards as well. So I hope the situation will improve.

everything_in_moderation_including_excess.jpg
Everything in moderation including excess" photo from major clanger on flickr.

Which is as good a time as any to remind you that BBC boards do have House Rules.

dna_house_rules.pngAs Jem has said here we don't close threads just because they embarrass the BBC. But offensive, abusive, or threatening personal comments about BBC staff, talent, other members of the boards or indeed anybody will be moderated. As indeed will anything likely to get someone sued.

Personally I'm more of a blogger than a message board man. But it's always good to learn. My initial sense after having rummaged around on the POV boards for a bit is that while there are some lively discussions there's also a lot of off topic chat.

Myself, Tom, Jem and Roo Reynolds (who works in BBC Television and is no relation) are currently talking about the Points of View boards and how they fit with the rest of the BBC's blogs and message boards.

So I'd like to know what you think.

Are you a regular user of the POV boards? Are they easy to use? What's good and bad about them? Does it make sense to call them "Points of View"?

How do they compare with your experience of the BBC's blogs or other BBC communities?

Do you prefer the radio messageboards or BBC News' Editors blog? Is the Strictly Come Dancing message board better?

Leave your comments and I'll will engage (and try and keep them on topic please).

Nick Reynolds is editor, BBC Internet blog but is doing other things as well

Comments

Page 1 of 3

  • Comment number 1.

    Hi Nick, and thank you for this opportunity to speak to you.

    The obvious anomoly is that the POV programme does not deal with radio, but the radio equivalent of POV, R4's Feedback, has no message board.

    And now the latest series of the POV TV show seems to have stopped paying attention to our points of view posted on the board, and seems to be less driven by the concerns we voice most often and more with matters that seem to have more to do with generating positive PR.

    Cheers

    JayInBournemouth; contributor to BBC MB's since 1996 and only put into pre-mod once for talking about rhubarb crumble in response to homophobic trolls, but I forgive you.

  • Comment number 2.

    Thank you for allowing us to comment.

    Like Jay above, I was put on pre-mod for chatting on a thread where a Host had also been contributing off-topic chat, thus giving out the clear signal that the direction of the thread (which had become about recipes) was perfectly OK.

    In addition, to make no distinction when meting out punishment between posts which are abusive, libellous, racist, homophobic or threatening, and posts which have simply strayed off-topic, seems very unfair.

    I've had a post removed for making an on-topic response but underneath an off-topic one (so both got removed). When I queried that decision, I was advised in withering tones that I'd "just have to be more careful, won't you?"

    And on another occasion a post of mine was removed for indicating a swear word through asterisks (as part of a famous and wholly relevant quotation) where someone else's post with about ten of the things was allowed to stay.

    It's this inconsistent moderation which leaves a sour taste. I always try really hard to obey house rules, but during normal board conversations you're bound to post the odd off-topic response - comments like "Thanks for the info" or "Wow!" or "I should be so lucky." If, as happened with me, another board member with a grudge decides to try and get you off the boards, he or she can probably find enough such posts to get anyone at all on pre-mod. The Hosts should be protecting members from action like this, not abetting it.

    Sorry for going on at such length, but I've been a member of Points of View for years and I've never known such shabby treatment of posters.

  • Comment number 3.

    At Plusnet, we've long engaged our customer base using forums/message boards. Quite early on though we took a very brave step to had over the moderation of those forums to the customers themselves. Working with us, they've created the rules set for running the board and work to keep the boards on topic, friendly and generally a nice place to be. Having the customers as the powers who control what can be talked about on there really help to generate a fair and impartial environment too. It's not always been easy, but our community would be no where near as strong without this.

  • Comment number 4.

    Hello Nick,

    If you're going to be hosting on POV messageboard I just wanted to say welcome, and I hope you have a good time.

    The POV board is the main part of BBC I use, so I can't really compare it with anywhere else - but I enjoy chatting about various TV programmes on there - I was especially sad to see former host Lee leave, because as I said to him he was probably the only other regular viewer of Eastenders and Doctor Who there.

    Basically, I enjoy POV as it is, and haven't come here to moan but just to wish you luck!

  • Comment number 5.

    The POV message board is the only one I use fairly frequently, and moreso when SCD is being shown.

    The other boards are hardly worth bothering with, such as digital and radio boards as the contributions are few and far between. The "official" SCD board is far to jumbled, imo. I stick to the main thread on POV for SCD where one can keep track of various postings and arguments without having to sort through heaps of different threads on the official SCD board.

    Cheers, Croydon George.

  • Comment number 6.

    Hello Nick,
    You will probably not 'see' me much as I do not post often, but I do read the posts a lot and they are very enlightening at times! I really like the PoV messageboard, in particular, and all of them in general.
    To be quoted on the tv version of PoV is a goal. I do not stand a chance myself as I complain too much about background music! Ooops! There I go again!
    The boards are very easy to use. It did take a while to get used to them, from the old blue boards, I have to say. There is just one aspect that I am sure we would all like to see added to them and that is a search facility, please. It would be very good to be able to find a topic, long gone, but which is being talked about yet again and to keep up to date.
    Thank you for the chance for us to add our views on here about the messageboards.
    Best wishes, and 'see' you on the board!

  • Comment number 7.

    It's ok but it doesn't seem to have a unified netiquette so some people treat it like a newsgroup and others like a forum and others like a bbs/blog - someone will come on most days and either complain about topgear or that they haven't set up their TV right so can't hear the voices (which of course is the BBC's problem they say)

    Others think that there should only be 1 thread for each programme (I don't agree)

    I don't think it's about adding rules and restrictions, but a suggested guide and a FAQ wouldn't go amiss.

  • Comment number 8.

    I note that some of the poor hosting issues that have dogged the 6MMB are now spilling over onto the POV boards. I hope it isn't a trend, as the 6MMMB style of hosting is all gas and brakes. Either they completely ignore the boards, never post, never respond. OR they come in like the riot police, antagonising everyone and deleting posts on the most technical/spurious of reasons. There is a happy medium - it's called having a RELATIONSHIP with your board users. Give it a go.

    We get the impression that you don't actually want real interaction with your customers. That's odd, as there are whole BBC departments devoted to this interactive agenda. What would happen to you all if we took the very heavy hint, and just went away?

  • Comment number 9.

    Hi Nick.Thanks for the chance to give you some feedback from the POV posters.I have used the POV message boards for many a while now and I can honestly say that it is not nearly such an enjoyable place to post as from when I first joined.I listen to more radio than I do watch television, so I usually leave a comment on your radio board.I appreciate there has to be house rules to follow but I think some of the moderating has been rather over zealous and this has contributed to the boards becoming not only less popular than before but less pleasurable to post on.I was quite amazed, the other day, that a quite harmless thread commenting on the Talksport broadcaster Jon Gaunt was closed because it was deemed off topic and the reason given was because he had not worked for the BBC
    for a while.These kinds of threads concerning commercial radio and also tv have also ways stood in the past, so it becomes quite bewildering to posters as to where they stand and what is acceptable and what is not on the BBC message boards?The inconsistency of the moderation has in my view brought about the decline in the number of posters who now post on the POV boards.That together with the fact that people who first join then have to go through a laborious process of premoderation of so many posts before they are allowed to post straight to the boards.The reason given in the past was that the poster has to earn the ' trust ' of the Hosts/Moderators before they can be fully accepted onto the boards,which I happen to think is really condescending of the BBC.

  • Comment number 10.

    I've noticed Jem inserts lots of off topic information in his posts.

    I know what he's had for dinner, if he's on the train, if he's going to the pub etc.

    Perhaps you could have a word with him about keeping his posts on the straight and narrow.

    I'm kidding of course, it'd be ridiculous to remove posts that stray off 'topic. It'd turn the community into an extremely dull and sterile place.

  • Comment number 11.

    Hello Nick
    Welcome and good luck with the Board.
    I am, sadly, addicted to the pov board and was very upset to be put in premod along with the crumble 6 from the gay kiss thread
    .
    I am sure that you know all about that! Jay and Riverbank have already mentioned it.
    We knew we were off topic for a whole day and had some great fun talking about crumble and sprouts to get away from the sour note in the thread!

    However the comments of only a few people were hidden and others off topic, bigotted and homophobic stayed.
    Putting just afew of us into premod was unfair and inconsistent.
    Anyway that's done and dusted.

    One thing which annoys a lot of board members is where a provocative apparently first post gets past pre mod, and then the poster does a runner.
    The gay kiss threads are good examples of this. Maybe you could arrange for that to stop?
    Thanks to poster who put the link for this onto pov board. Nippie? If so another of the c*****6!
    Apologies for the length of this. Good to have someone who cares.
    666RozKing x

  • Comment number 12.

    POV seems to be just a place for total nutters these days, and I see that people are mocking it all at:

    http://ifyoulikeitsomuchwhydontyougolivethere.com/

  • Comment number 13.

    Well, I posted on what I thought was this blog, but it hasn't appeared, so I assume that as usual I have gone wrong somewhere. I'll try again.

    I read all the comments on POV and sometimes join in with a thread in which I'm interested. Some of the more popular threads are difficult to keep up with, as the two that reached 300+ when I was missing for few days.

    However, of late there appears to be a lot of bitterness about having messages pulled, or being in pre-mod for what appear to be trivial reasons. It hasn't happened to me, but most of the members who have, are normally reasonable posters, so it does seem odd. There is a great deal of discontent.

    This seems to be more since Peta left, (she was very helpful to me when I got confused...very easy when you are nearing tour eighties!!) and I was upset about Lee, and felt very sorry for him.

    I am pleased we are being given the chance to have a say, and good luck.

  • Comment number 14.

    Hi Nick

    In general the boards are good fun but should not be taken seriously because most in depth discussions usually creates an over-reaction from whoever is moderating.

    History has shown that any sensitive and contentious exchange of views relating to relevant TV programmes and their content are a waste of time.

    The most irritating aspect of all boards is the blatent lack of consistency on the part of the Mods when applying the house rules...your house rules!

    When a posting has been removed and you ask for a better explanation believing, and sometimes knowing, that the houserules have not been properly applied you never get a reply.

    Enjoy the board for what it is...a bit of fun and not to be taken seriously...which I'm sure was not the original concept.

    Yours

    Cpl Jones


  • Comment number 15.

    Hi Nick,

    I find the POV boards good fun, with some knowledgeable and engaging contributors.

    It will be good to get some regular Hosts back - Peta and Lee are much missed.

    There does seem to be some inconsistencies re removing posts; I understand why as the Mods don't get to see the posts in context. Maybe this is something the Hosts could help with?

    Welcome to the boards!

  • Comment number 16.

    i only go on the POV board these days. i used to be a regular on the old radio 2 boards where we were given our own 'coffee shop' to talk off topic so as not to keep getting modded. maybe you could consider that instead of deleting messages willy nilly for talking about crumble but leave nasty, homophobic/racist ones on?!?!

  • Comment number 17.

    I enjoy using the PoV boards, mainly the Television one. A big plus for me is getting alerted to programmes & films I'd overlooked.

    If I had to put together a wish list for the boards, number 1 by far would be a search facility. Please, please can we have something - even if it's only the ability to find threads with particular words in their title.

  • Comment number 18.

    12. Brian: Speakyourbranes lifts material from Have Your Say not the Points of View message boards. Not sure if that would shift you from your perception that the BBC forums have been taken over by "total nutters" ;)
    10. Alec Mac: Nick often has words with me about mentioning what i've had for my dinner.
    I only
    All: Inconsistencies of moderation are #1 issue that is being raised here and on the forums themselves. We intend to make changes there. Point taken.
    17.Geometry Man. Yep. A record of previous threads either by being able to use search, or perhaps with beefing up of user profiles would reduce repetition, and improve how the boards work...

    anyway. tx. keep yr feedback coming.

    I'm sure that Nick and/or Tom will be looking to write up a follow up summary post of feedback received.

  • Comment number 19.

    It is most notable how the POV messageboard has been marginalized by the POV television programme in the latest series and over the years it's been evident how the board has been manipulated by the programme too. I can give examples.

    It's good news to hear of fresh faces hosting POV, I have a few points to make. Firstly rewrite the house rules, or at least follow the rules that are there. I sometimes think the users stick to them more than the BBC does.

    I can give you many examples too of posts and threads written by decent members of the board, staying within the house rules who find their post hidden, the thread closed and then they are put into pre-moderation. Any subsequent request for information for the treatment by the BBC is dealt similarly. They get no feedback from the BBC via email either when they seek reasons for such action - my opinion is that the BBC don't have an answer to give.

    It says nothing in the house rules that you cannot talk about thread closures on the "bbc.co.uk" board but it doesn't take that long before those threads are closed themselves. What's the problem with 'talking among ourselves' if we're talking about matters pertaining to the 'bbc.co.uk' board and within house rules? It would also be considerate if a thread is to be closed for someone to say why a thread has been closed, it would therefore negate the need to start another thread requesting a reason.

    There were many good points about the boards, an interesting mix of people commenting on tv and the points raised by them. There is also a lot of fun, mainly from an off(ish) topic thread which has been allowed. You also get forewarning of interesting programmes (usually the ones not trailed ad nauseam).

    It's a shame that there has been a large exodus of people who have either been pushed or have walked away from the boards due to punitive, inconsistent moderation. I've made the point before, if the people on the board are cynical of the BBC it's because they have had dealings with the BBC who have created the cynicism in the first place.

    The former hosts and some friends of the BBC were often to say that the opinions on the POV board were not representative of the overall views concerning the BBC. It was mystifying therefore, why they put so much effort into arguing the case for the BBC, is that part of the job description?

    It would be helpful to this exercise if you looked back to the BBC's behavior during the "White Season" Debacle and the "Bonekickers" Debacle - an event from which I am still in pre-mod, yet despite requests I have not had a satisfactory reason explained to me, still could be worse some were banned from that time too. I'd gladly send you my email notices sent by the BBC so you can see the content for which I was put in pre-mod.

    It wasn't the BBC's finest hour.

  • Comment number 20.

    Blogs are not for everyone, I don't particularly want to read other peoples' diaries.
    Boards usually create communities, they are many things to many people, they develop, grow and change they live. Sometimes they die, or need to be killed off for a newer baby to be born.

    Over zealous policing can be detrimental,
    latitude has to be allowed, things being "on topic" or not, should not be the only factor, but the spirit of the posts and thread.

    People have vastly different senses of humour and not everyone can get the meaning of their messages across how they intended, often it can read very differently to what the poster tried to say. we are not all journalists.

    There are far too many message boards/forums and some refining is definitely needed.
    A clear statement should be made if you want serious feedback rather than just providing a talking place.
    You could make it clearer too exactly what the BBC's role on each board is going to be, as a watcher for information, a participant, or a "couldn't care less about it" but needs a referee.
    Tightening up on multi threading might help, e.g. the sport anti sport lobbies that sprang up this summer all over POV boards.

    One plea, can we ban the use of the words licence fee from any forum, we all pay it so it adds nothing saying you are one, nor is it a justification, to any argument :) The BBC apologising to licence fee payers recently only fuelled the use of this whingy whine. it was a bad move.

    Regards
    Egg



  • Comment number 21.

    Hello Nick and Jem

    I enjoy reading/posting on POV and look at all the boards.

    I like the fact that as well as BBC programmes, we are allowed to discuss programmes on other channels.

    Threads can be interesting, heated and a good laugh. Also, as GeometryMan says, you get to find out about programmes/films that you may have missed had you not been on the board.

    I'm glad that the issue of moderation is being looked at as it is very inconsistent at the moment.

    Lack of communication is also an issue. When a post of mine has been removed and I don't understand why, I reply to the email and ask for clrification. Unfortunately, I rarely receive a response.

    This clarifiation is needed in order to try not to repeat the mistake, but the lack of communication just leads to bewilderment and people end up asking on the thread, why their post has been removed.

    In relation to posts going off topic, that's just life, it happens. A gentle reminder from the Hosts to keep the thread on topic is all that is needed.

    I'd also like to reitereate what RozKing says

    "One thing which annoys a lot of board members is where a provocative apparently first post gets past pre mod, and then the poster does a runner."

    This has been happening a lot lately and has, in my opinion, caused some disruption, disgruntlement and rudeness from normally mild-mannered posters!

    Overall, I enjoy it here (but can we have more 'smilies' please?).

    Welcome to the boards!



  • Comment number 22.

    Hello all - regarding "off topic" threads it's understandable that sometimes threads will drift off topic.

    But the POV boards are supposed to be about the BBC.

    For example I have closed this thread because it's about Virgin Media and Virgin have their own community area.

    Nick Reynolds (editor, BBC Internet blog)

  • Comment number 23.

    Hello Nick

    I'm a regular visitor to the PoV MB's and have been for almost three years. It's usual for me to log onto PoV at least five days a week.

    As you have asked for specific comments in answer to your questions, I will try to offer some positive and alternative thoughts:

    1) Are they easy to use?

    Yes, I think so. But there's always room for improvement!

    2) What's good and bad about them?

    For me, I would like to see a search facility so that you can find a specific topic of discussion; this would also help to alleviate the multiple threads we so often see.

    I like the 'your discussions' and the ability we have to delete old threads, but having to do this via 'h2g2' is a bit of a long-winded process. Perhaps this could be improved upon?

    3) Does it make sense to call them Points of View?

    I don't think so. Even in the short space of time I have been posting, the general ethos of the Boards has changed somewhat. It's evident that many posters wish to discuss programmes which are on other channels (which is permitted) and also many posters engage in lighthearted discussions (about programmes) as opposed to exchanging opinions, so perhaps bearing this in mind, a new title should be considered. Perhaps 'TV Talk' or 'On the Box' or 'Telly Tattle' or 'What You Watch' or 'Telly Addicts' ... I could go on, but I won't!!

    Thanks for giving us the opportunity to have some input.


  • Comment number 24.

    "But the POV boards are supposed to be about the BBC."

    - We appreciate that, Nick. But what I'd say is, either remove/punish/stop ALL off-topic posts, or none of them. It's distressing to find *just* your posts have gone from an off-topic thread, or *just* your thread's been zapped, when it's flanked by dozens of others all similarly off-topic. The moderation seems not just random, but positively vindictive at times.

  • Comment number 25.

    I have been told to put my comments here rather than on the message boards. I was simply saying that in "explains the difference here" it sounds like moderators when in doubt about a post refer it to a host when it would seem more logical that this were the other way round.

    I was also asked why I prefer message boards to blogs. I feel that blogs are too top down. While there is more direct connection to people in the BBC with responsibilities, they set the agenda and the framework for discussion, admittedly often on the basis of what they understand to be of public concern.

    This is too much like radio itself. Furthermore, this is not necessarily the case. I have personally received great responses to my posts on the message boards this year from Annie Nightingale and Michael Rosen.

    The message boards allow people to say what is topical to the listener and listener then speaks to listener. There is the understanding that an audience view - and I recognise that this is distinct from an individual view - is developed freely. We know that this is also heard in one way or another by BBC hosts, moderators, etc. Some of this will go further and thats useful too although most will probably not.

    And this is probably the best option in a situation where accountability by the service providers to those who by law have to pay for them is paltry. A good start would be the election by public ballot of senior managers.

    Additionally one would have viewers and listeners panels of people with no background in the industry - the service users and financiers - providing significant inputs into recommendations on standards, organisational structures, funding, salaries and a framework within which the BBC leadership approaches innovation.

    Those with old punk ethics who are now high paid and dominate the established media may well think that repeating the Sex Pistols with Bill Grundy retains their links to us or taps in with modern day youth. The fact is that momentarily the value of that period in history was that it suggested that the media we pay for would need to be responsive rather than aloof.

    Remember that this did not just apply to media types set in the 1940s but also liberal 60 types who never quite got over that fact. Those from the late 70s era have held on more rigidly.

    They cannot accept that in these less black and white times the population sees radicalism as a combination of those eras, this one, greater liberalism in some respects, greater conservatism in others, and indeed what those who fought in WW2 actually wanted - proper from-the-ground-upwards democracy.

  • Comment number 26.

    Just want to revise one bit of this for the sake of clarification. Change:

    "This is too much like radio itself. Furthermore, this is not necessarily the case. I have personally received great responses to my posts on the message boards this year from Annie Nightingale and Michael Rosen."

    to:

    "This is too much like radio itself. Furthermore, it is not necessarily the case that blogs lead to greater connection between the public and the broadcasters. I have personally received great responses to my posts on the message boards this year from Annie Nightingale and Michael Rosen."

  • Comment number 27.

    "How do they compare with your experience of the BBC's blogs"

    I read some blogs and the comments, but I get the impression that they lack the spontaniety and the friendliness that is on the POV messageboard (and other BBC mb's).

    I also percieve blogs as being the BBC's way of "setting the agenda" or maybe I'm just being suspicious!

    After re-reading this post, I realise that one of the main factors for me about POV is, that it's FUN.

    I occasionally look on the Ouch messageboard and find it interesting and thought-provoking at times.

  • Comment number 28.

    I think trolling is the biggest problem facing the POV messageboard. Although a number of trolls have been kicked off the board in recent times, a new generation has taken their place, egged on, in many cases, by former POV members orchestrating the posts from a distance (on private messageboards).

    I think the moderation and hosting on POV need to get tougher, with a zero-tolerance attitude towards trolling.

  • Comment number 29.

    Hello Nick,

    Having looked on here several times, I prefer the POV board. I find it easier to deal with, sorry.

    I agree that it's easier for you to get opinions, and it is working, but it's not for me.

    LG

  • Comment number 30.

    Hi Nick,

    I have to say that's not a good start, already you've closed your own thread on the 'bbc.co.uk' board. I quite like the freedom to post where I like rather than being 'encouraged' - as you put it. Old BBC habits die hard I guess.

    Here's your reply on your thread, for some reason there is a problem posting links here, which isn't a problem on the boards:

    " I would like you to leave comments on the blog rather than the messageboard so that comments are all in one place, please.

    And posting multiple threads on the same topic is (I think) against the house rules! Which is why I posted on this board, as it is one of the boards that I am hosting myself.

    It would help me if you prefer message boards to blogs to leave a comment on the blog explaining why.

    In order to encourage you to leave comments on the blog rather than here I am closing this thread."

    And as I've said you can't even discuss the subject on the board which IS the subject itself.

    NippieSweetie has it spot on saying that blogs are perceived as "the BBC's way of "setting the agenda".

    Why do I prefer the board to a blog?

    A reply to a blog goes through moderation, it's not a conversation in the way it is on the boards. It just smacks of control-freakery, the interaction between the BBC and the public shouldn't be organised in the same manner as a sheep pen. Think of it this way a messageboard is one big room full of people drifting in and out chiping in where they see something of interest, a blog in one of many small impersonal rooms.

    I can see why the BBC prefer them though.

    I thought this discussion was about the POV messageboard, not about blogging. I do hope that turning POV into a series of blogs isn't on the agenda, it didn't work for 606, it destroyed any sense of community - it's a shadow of what it once was.

  • Comment number 31.

    It would be helpful to know how the Points of View programme, and the BBC in general, view the PoV message boards.

    Faye Tsar in 19. says the POV boards have been marginalised by the PoV programme. Indeed the current series has not mentioned the boards as a way of commenting - only citing mail/email/phone - and appears to be turning away from them as a source of input. Admittedly two weeks ago there were some screen shots of them and several aired remarks lifted from them, I think as a reaction to grumbles, but last weeks show was back to neither mentioning the boards nor quoting from them. Sometimes I recognise a post, but it appears in the programme as a direct communication using the author's real name.

    So are the boards just for viewers to talk to each other? Or is there some part of the Beeb, if not the PoV programme, that is taking notice of what's being said there?

  • Comment number 32.

    Faye Tsar - comments on this blog and many other BBC blogs are "reactively" moderated.

    This means the comment is usually only removed if someone requests it, after it's been published.

    Not that different from a message board.

    I like this kind of reactive moderation as it forces me to keep on top of comments and actively host the blog.

    Here's an explanationfrom the BBC's editorial guidelines.

    Nick Reynolds (editor, BBC Internet blog)

  • Comment number 33.

    I just thought I'd add to my above posts that the POV and Heroes boards are where I do the vast majority of my posting. I never frequent the blogs. This is my first time! :-)

    Also, re the TV Board being only about the BBC. That's very restrictive, and not how it's worked in the past. We like to compare programmes from different channels, and talk to POVers about programmes on other channels.

  • Comment number 34.

    Thank you Nick, for that aside.

    It's also true to say that blogs by Nick Robinson, Robert Peston, Jon Williams, Sinead Rocks, James Mallet, Helen Boaden, Richard Sambrook, Rome Hartman, Steve Herrmann, Rod McKensie, Jeremy Hillman, Roger Mosey, Su Maskell, and others, are pre-moderated.

    Reactive moderation or premoderation, I still prefer the boards to blogs.

  • Comment number 35.

    Sorry - another one for me after seeing Nick's comment about explaining why I prefer msesageboards to blogs.

    Messageboards are MUCH more accessible and user friendly, with many different threads on different topics.

    Also, viewer-led or -started conversations are often much more relevant, interesting and "out there" to me than those started by BBC employees.

    Please don't take away our messageboards!

  • Comment number 36.

    Hi Nick,

    My reaction is simple - either use it or loose it.

    The PoV threads are supposed to be about the BBC and people make (sometimes sensible) comments, but its like chucking a stone in the ocean.

    There have been many threads where a great many people complain (very sensibily) about the same thing - example taken at random - the rescheduling of Vera Britten.
    And there is no comment from Auntie.

    I appreciate the freedom to comment and have done so, but I just don't see the point of it.

    Am I missing something here ?

    As you can't even search to find out what was said previously.

    It just feels a bit tacked on.


  • Comment number 37.

    Erm blogs...........I have commented on blogs before but to people I know and am not moderated.........though I do understand why that is.

    How to chase posters away - closing down threads for no good reason. Some posters are not computer savvy and only know and have got used to the mbs, not blogs. Me personally would have let people comment on the thread because really this is unknown territory and the mbs are known to them and are easy to use.

    Plus to come in guns blazing - shutting down threads because they are off topic, but weren't before when we had two good hosts who knew how to treat us and let us not away with murder but gave us some leeway, the majority of posters know what to talk about and most know the taboos.

    But I would say we do need someone on the boards, to look at the queries, and to be able to pick up any faults and report them without having the rigmarole of emailing the CCT - also to deal with the wums/trolls etc that do frequent the boards.

    Finally welcome to the boards - I cannot promise that all will be as nice as me ;)

  • Comment number 38.



    The steps BBC follows when implementing changes.

    1. Hint at upcoming changes and requesting general user comments regarding the current services.

    2. Implement massive wholesale changes.


    And that's it. Buy the time the customers gets any details of the changes, it's after the event and too late for the BBC to react specific comments due to 'technical difficulties'. For a case study see the destruction of the very well thought out and simple to use Radio 7 page.

    Right now we're at the 'hinting' step. Here's an idea. Tell the customers that changes your planning to make BEFORE you make them, and BEFORE you've restructured and signed contracts etc.

    Openness and honesty is the way forward

  • Comment number 39.

    Scrap POV. It's populated by nutcases who use it only to push far-right political opinions and think that as a result of two other nutjobs agreeing with them that means the entire population of the UK does.

    It's a terrible way of collecting information about how users feel, is a hive of libellous and illegal material (which the users then have the audacity to bitch at when it's removed!) and serves no useful purpose.

    It's time these people had to pay for their own server space instead of my licence fee doing it.

    Phazer

  • Comment number 40.

    Hi, Nick, when you say you're discussing the way the POV boards should go, I'm filled with forboding.
    I suspect it means they're all going to be shut down !

    As the Today MB and the Radio 5 station board are no more, I think it would be a great pity if these boards were closed down.

    Perhaps Radio 5 could abandon moving to Salford, then the BBC would have the money to run the MBs properly !

    We definitely need a Host on the POV boards to run them properly, although I suspect no one who edits produces or is the presenter on any BBC T.V. or radio programme ever bothers to read our comments.

    I really enjoy the POV boards PLEASE don't decimate them.

  • Comment number 41.

    Hi all,hello to you Nick and the other new hosts.

    I'm not exactly the most articulate of people so I will try make this reasonably concise and understandable.

    All I would say is that yes the boards need trimming here and there,too many threads on the same subject,too many threads on other channels shows but I feel this is down to lack of hosts or moderators of recent months.There's no-one to keep things in line,give us a gentle nudge when needed and keep things on topic where appropriate.It is quite amusing at times to go off topic sometimes but when it's posters slagging each other off it's quite nasty to see.I have posted on POV about such behaviour before as it got to me so much.Again there has been no-one to step in and pull people up on such matters.If there was a host that gave them a word,then pre modded posts and they still ignored it and were removed from the boards the I for one would be happy to see such protagonists gone.I'm all for banter and having different points of view but some people will always be 'difficult'.

    I like the way the boards work.East to follow and use,a few more smileys would be nice though.I spend quite a bit of time on here on evenongs and weekends as I'm not always able to go out.There's some cracking people on here that I can 'talk' to and express the same or differing opinions,alot of fun is had on here too.Despite the hit and run posters,or trolling or wind up merchants,(delete as applicable) the POV board is great community.

    I think what is needed overall(and I know I'm repeating myself here) is mods,sensible ones mind not jack boots,that will keep the conversation flowing,on topic,friendly,fun and inviting to future users.

    Well,I hope that got my message across.All the best you yourselves on the host team and to my fellow posters. 8-)

  • Comment number 42.

    I pretty much concur with Post 41. I use the boards a lot and would hate to lose them.

  • Comment number 43.

    i can't seem to work out blogs! is the old format going to remain?!
    if not, i don't think it's fair on people like me who don't understand or can't stand the blogging format!

  • Comment number 44.

    Oh dear
    I don't know where I went wrong but when I first visited I had to log in and was told my Board name Ben 2856 and nickname RozKing were already taken so ended up being 666RozKing.
    Maybe I didn't need to sign in?
    Anyway, Nick I much prefer the boards. It takes ages navigating the blogs so I probably won't be using this blog again.
    Sorry
    Roz/Ben/666

  • Comment number 45.

    I've been a user of the PoV board for a couple of years now and have - until recently - thoroughly enjoyed it. At the present its previously good atmosphere seems to have been seriously damaged and I hope the new mod team can take steps to change this.

    I can only reiterate the comments already made regarding the wisdom of allowing offensive posts and threads to remain and yet closing others that have a reasonable connection to the BBC or are at least entertaining. As other people have mentioned, there does seem to have been a rise in one-time posters starting controversial threads, never to be seen again. The impression received by me at least is that the board is being used to stimulate knee-jerk reactions from the posters, presumably to justify some decision the BBC already plan to make, or to stir up controversery for the sake of publicity. Please don't do this.

    Personally I think it's a good idea to allow threads on ITV and C4/5 programmes to stay on the board - the recent comparisons between the Stephen Fry and Paul Merton travelogues have been interesting.

    And can I add one more voice to the plea for a search facility? It would save a lot of time and a lot of duplicate threads.

    Thank you for keeping us up to date with what is happening, and good luck!

  • Comment number 46.

    melody-jane and RozKing -

    I'd be interested to know more about why you don't like the blogs format, why you find them hard to navigate and why you prefer the message board.

    The only difference between a blog and a message board is that on a blog only the blog owner(s)can start a conversation, while on the POV boards any registered user can.

    Nick Reynolds (editor, BBC Internet blog)

  • Comment number 47.

    Nick,that's why I think most would prefer boards to blogs.The whole idea of Points Of View is that it is *our* point of view not one doled out to us at a faceless corprations behest.Some may say that it is control of us and in this modern day where everyday life is littered with controls of one form or another this one would really stick in peoples craw.It's us the viewing and listening public that want to voice *our* views.

    We are the audience.The audience that is told to phone in for votes and spend our money when it suits but if we try and stand up and voice our feelings against the BBC or it's employees we are cut down at the knees.Not that I'm against the Beeb but I should be given the right to reply on it's content if I see fit.After all it is a product that you 'sell' us and if it's defective I have the right to complain.

  • Comment number 48.

    "The only difference between a blog and a message board is that on a blog only the blog owner(s)can start a conversation, while on the POV boards any registered user can."

    - But that's a HUGE difference, Nick, and represents a much more restricted form of discourse, in several directions.

  • Comment number 49.

    "The only difference between a blog and a message board is that on a blog only the blog owner(s)can start a conversation, while on the POV boards any registered user can."

    Only , ONLY !?

    Migh not seem such a big deal if you're the one in control I suppose Nick.

    Is that the plan, Close the boards and replace them with blog comments?

    Why don't you just blog the options your thinking of to 'sort out the boards' and allow us to comment on them?

  • Comment number 50.

    To The_Phazer, Message 39 :
    Where did all that come from? Strikes me there’s only nutcase around here...

  • Comment number 51.

    That should read, ...only one nutcase around here...

  • Comment number 52.

    "I'd be interested to know more about why you don't like the blogs format, why you find them hard to navigate and why you prefer the message board."

    For one thing, we get our own Discussions page so we can easily return to threads we have contributed to. This blog, for example, does not appear on My Discussions page.

    "The only difference between a blog and a message board is that on a blog only the blog owner(s)can start a conversation, while on the POV boards any registered user can."

    That is a HUGE fundamental difference!

    If we're not allowed to start conversations then we're just passively responding to authorised POVs

    And that's not the only difference. This blog is not very easy on the eye. I have to scroll down and try to find the last message that I read.

    I got here via a link on the Television Board. I have no idea how to get here from anywhere else on the BBC site!

  • Comment number 53.

    NickReynolds (U11648404) , Yesterday

    I would like you to leave comments on the blog rather than the messageboard so that comments are all in one place, please.

    And posting multiple threads on the same topic is (I think) against the house rules! Which is why I posted on this board, as it is one of the boards that I am hosting myself.

    It would help me if you prefer message boards to blogs to leave a comment on the blog explaining why.



    It appears preferable to me to have blogs on the Meassage Board as they will be sorted into programs/headings etc rather than having them all jumbled up.

  • Comment number 54.

    I contribute to the POV messageboard on occasion, and enjoy reading the posts. Nevertheless, I'm hard-pressed to find a justification for their existence. The obvious candidates are:

    1) They provide an opportunity for BBC staff to get feedback.

    Perhaps, but there are much better tools (blogs, market research, etc) which can - and presumably are - employed to gather feedback in a more focused and less chaotic manner.


    2) They enable viewers to discuss programmes amongst themselves.

    Why is it the BBC's job to provide such a platform? There are alternatives out there, and creating an online discussion group is trivial if any niches are unfulfilled.


    3) They provide a channel for viewer complaints.

    Most of us know that they don't, and that there are official channels which should be followed.


    4) They enable a sense of community.

    Again, not Auntie's job. That community spirit can, and does, florish elsewhere on the internet.


    So it seems to me that money is being spent on hardware, software, maintenance, bandwidth and moderators to provide a service which generates a flood of anti-moderation protests and is, in any case, a service which the BBC has no real reason to provide in the first place. I realise that this will probably not be a popular opinion - sorry about that - but I'd be interested to hear any counter-arguments in support of the provision of these messageboards.

  • Comment number 55.

    Although they may not be cost effective (I honestly don't know how you'd work that out), surely getting rid of the boards would be a step backwards?

    The TV board is very well used, with lots of regular contributors. Every channel has official messageboards. The BBC has LOADS. I don't know if they intend to go down the route of having boards dedicated to individual programmes, but it seems to me that if they do do this then some fans will miss out, as it is up to the individual production staff as to whether they want to include online stuff as part of their production.

    I'm rambling!

    Basically I think a TV and Radio Board is a good and valued service. And cannot be replaced with blogs.

  • Comment number 56.

    Blah, blah, blah, "leave comments on my blog"

    This isn't Facebook, mate.

    And blogs are meant to notify you when someone replies to your comment... which this doesn't do. And you can't see whose replied to who as there's no tree structure.

    0/10.

  • Comment number 57.

    I like the POV messageboard because i have found a place where i can discuss different aspects of TV programmes... from moaning about the shabby way that Medium is treated by the BBC to commenting on Strictly to discussing films on TV, without feeling out of place!

    So keep up the good work :)

    (It would be helpfull if the multiple threads on one topic could be sorted out if that's possible?)

  • Comment number 58.

    I would really like to have pro-active hosts again. Peta and Lee are much missed.

    And a tighter check on multiple posts would be helpful.

    But having said that......

    The *last* thing I want is to have host-led posts like the 606 board. That would ruin the POV board. There is a good community on the board and to lose it would be a real shame.

    But thank you for asking for our views.

  • Comment number 59.

    "The only difference between a blog and a message board is that on a blog only the blog owner(s)can start a conversation, while on the POV boards any registered user can.

    Nick Reynolds (editor, BBC Internet blog)"

    Exactly. Why take a step backwards?

    Do you recognise this quote?

    "It should foster a 'learning curve' of interactive engagement, encouraging audiences to move from passive consumption to active participation online."

    I hope so, it's in one of your key documents!

    Returning to a sytem where the BBC sets the topics/asks the questions is a retrograde step, and disempowers those you ought to be empowering.

    Blogs are about the projection of a BBC's employee's work, interests and agenda. Not the audience's. Wrong move.

    They also rely on BBC employees having a genuine interest in audience feedback, and devoting time and energy to initiating and managing the discussion.

    Judging by the almost complete absence of producer, presenter and even Host contribution to the current boards, any blog system will fail to initiate discussions on 95% of the subjects that your board members are actually interested in.

  • Comment number 60.

    "The only difference between a blog and a message board is that on a blog only the blog owner(s)can start a conversation, while on the POV boards any registered user can.

    Nick Reynolds (editor, BBC Internet blog)"

    i'm sorry but that has to be the stupidest thing i've ever seen.

    the whole point of the POV board and others is that we can talk about what WE want to discuss NOT what YOU want us to talk about.

    Never mind Aunty, it's more like Big Brother. YOU WILL ONLY TALK ABOUT WHAT WE TELL YOU TO TALK ABOUT.

  • Comment number 61.

    I was a regular of the TV and radio board, I am much less so now.

    The content is good, and don't have any issues about moderation or pre-mod etc. However the design of the boards is abysmal and by far the worst I have seen. No search? poor layout, cluttered, klunky, no quoting, expensive to maintain and run - and of course totally dis-connected from the BBC. It is merely somewhere to chat with others - NOT the BBC. In which case it might as well not be run by the BBC. Why the POV production team don't own the board is crazy.

    Personally the only reason the content is superior to the Digital spy alternatives is the BBC brand that drives the traffic. If you wanted to slash costs merely offer the board to an independent host, licence the branding, put it on a professional design board and ensure it is consistently linked to from all BBC sites. Then it would work properly and save the BBC oodles.

  • Comment number 62.

    All I wanted to do was make comment about a particular show and its performance and have stumbled on this load of tripe. typical BBC. Look at TIMES blog system. Nothing could be simpler. Ditto ITV.com.

  • Comment number 63.

    Thanks to everyone for your comments. Do keep them coming.

    I'm planning a follow up blog post for Friday of this week.

    Nick Reynolds (editor, BBC Internet blog)

  • Comment number 64.

    "I'm planning a follow up blog post for Friday of this week."

    That would be great, Nick.

    Could you put a link to it on the messageboards, please?

    I've thought of another reason why I prefer messageboards - smileys! ;-) (And quote boxes)

  • Comment number 65.

    As a new user I agree with the following previously mentioned ideas:

    1) Create a search engine

    2) Join up multiple threads

    3) Keep the MB's

    4) I have no other complaints.

    Thanks

  • Comment number 66.

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

  • Comment number 67.

    Why a blog? The forums are an incomparably superior medium for the exchange of views on any topic.

  • Comment number 68.

    Message 54 from WombatDeath has prompted me to ask, why exactly did the BBC set up the POV messageboards in the first place? The administration and computing costs of doing it must have been considerable, so presumably there was a compelling reason. Has anything changed to make that reason, whatever it was, less valid now?

  • Comment number 69.

    As I think someone else has written a blog is more like a personal diary, with one person's view. A message board IMO is for anyone's views and a way of alerting someone to an upcoming event.

    I read the boards and have contributed to various BBC boards for over 5 years but I probably wouldn't use a blog.

  • Comment number 70.

    Conversation doesn't seem to flow on a blog, whereas it does on messageboards.

    I would also find it ironic if the POV boards were to disappear, given that they are a tool for discussing items on the medium that John Logie Baird invented!

    As the POV home page says, "Welcome to Points of View, where you can share your thoughts and pose your questions on any aspect of the BBC via our message board." To my mind, blogs don't do this as they are not generated by us, the public.

  • Comment number 71.

    Message 68:

    "Has anything changed to make that reason, whatever it was, less valid now?"

    This series of POV has been notable for JV and the POV production being unable to bring themselves to give out the address of the board that's connected to it.

    I can only think the POV Production team find it impossible to find enough bland praise for BBC's programmes on a weekly basis.

    It's notable too that long time users of the board spotted that one or two first time users made it straight to the POV programme (even one filmed piece), and haven't been seen since.

    The problem for the BBC is despite removing some long time posters who have been critical of the BBC (Or like me they are put on pre-mod for months on end, on this blog too BTW), despite manipulating the boards, the problem is that the BBC doesn't like what people on the boards are generally saying. It's just a case on 'it's my football'.

    I think (from experience) that the BBC already have a good idea, if not a solid plan, to change POV. It's not a question of resources, otherwise The Archers 6 boards would have been 'rationalised' ages ago.

    Look already how this situation has been dealt with. To alert posters on the POV television board, Nick Reynolds posted on the 'bbc.co.uk' board for them to come here. That thread has been closed (by Nick Reynolds) and is slipping down the board.

    That's it! It's hardly 'encouraging' a wide range of opinions from regular POV posters is it?

    This is as farcical as Chris Russell's disastrous remodelling of the 606 boards, into a pig's ear of a 606 blog.

  • Comment number 72.

    It's easy to see that the BBC are planning on shutting down the messageboards and, if they replace them at all, replace them with easily-censored blogs.

    We've all seen the way that the messageboards have been marginalised and shut down (Great Debate, 606, Film, Weather, Science etc). Not so long ago bbc.co.uk proudly had a link from the front page to 300+ messageboards, roughly a third remain.

    It seems that if the BBC can't lead, shape or censor the discussions themselves they just aren't interested.

    btw Can we have some explanation of the apparent ditching of the messageboards by the POV programme? I mean, even in the accursed Wogan-era, we had a section of thoughts from the board on the programme (even though they were, of course, shown out of context or cherry-picked to show the BBC in a positive light).

  • Comment number 73.

    Message to Nick
    You asked why I don't like blogs and find this difficult to navigate.
    Basically it's because I have to scroll through the whole lot and there is no facility to reply.
    The pov board is so much more user friendly.
    Your initial post on bbc.co.uk should have been on pov too.
    Why has your bbc.co.uk thread been closed?
    Roz/Ben/666 (That's another thing, getting in here was confusing)

  • Comment number 74.


    Maybe they are planning on shutting them down, maybe they’re not.

    Experience has shown us that it will happen without consultation with the customers. I.e. ‘Here’s what we’re planning to do, what are your thoughts?” And if they can’t manage it in the message boards, a medium specifically designed for engaging in discussion, what chances are there in other areas of the BBC.

    My guess is some radical changes are about to happen. Nick’s blog was very negative, focusing on the minority of problem posts rather than the majority on-topic polite posts. He’s presenting the boards as a problem that needs fixing, rather than an asset or a service.

  • Comment number 75.

    Faye Tsar - I'm baffled by your reaction to me closing the thread on the POV board that links to this post.

    It's easier for me if all comments are gathered together in one place i.e. on this blog, as opposed to being spread out in different places.

    RozKing - It is trickier to respond to an individual comment in a blog than on the messageboard - but it can be done (in fact I'm doing so in the form of this comment!)

    Nick Reynolds (editor, BBC Internet blog)

  • Comment number 76.

    I'm not baffled with Faye Tsar's reaction. It's what WE are used to, posting on the messageboards and not the blogs. I still wouldn't have closed it. You might have got a bigger reaction if it had been left open.

    It wouldn't have been spread out - its just that thread we would have contributed to.

    Another thing with the thread being closed, if it goes of the front page it means we cannot bump it to stay on the front page. Remember Nick we know the messageboards.

  • Comment number 77.

    re some of the comments about having to comment here rather than the messageboards - its not that different from a messageboard, apart from the fact you can't quote the messages in your message. so i'm not sure why people are complaining!

    but back on topic :)

    the boards are good, there are some interesting discussions on there.

    maybe there should be a "general" board for off topic chats and discussions to go on, that would allow people to talk about what they want to talk about without annoying anyone or clogging up the boards with things which aren't relevant to them.

    that and get rid of those people who just feel the need to complain about things without any discussion of their merits and failures...but then again we get them everywhere don't we.

  • Comment number 78.

    I contribute quite frequently to the PoV message board. I also contribute less frequently contribute to the SCD and radio boards.

    I think that more attention should be paid to threads where two, sometimes more, posters start having a private slanging match rather than keep to the subject of the thread. These posts are never modded, why?

    I've been pulled up for far less in the past.

    Also please can we be freed from the 3 minute ruling? It's so annoying. None of the other forums I belong to on the web have this "feature".

    I also feel that some of the posters who strongly disagree with another post can be at best extremely rude and at worst very bullying and intimidating. I've been on the end of some of these and it's not very pleasant! I tend not to retaliate to those people. Everyone has an opinion but there's no need to get nasty with someone who doesn't have your point of view. Just agree to disagree.

  • Comment number 79.

    Well, I've just found out where my disappearing blog went. I've just clicked on "My Comments", and I see it is in Peter Clifton's whatever. I appear to have killed that one dead, as the ones who were interested must have wondered what I was talking about, and no-one else has posted.

    I keep trying to sort out who has written what on here, and do find it difficult. It is not clear enough, and I fear you will not get the number of posts on here than on POV.

    Do you really want to kill off POV, or are we worrying unnecessarily?

    Thank you.

    Lilian's Girl

  • Comment number 80.

    Message 73
    Thanks Nick
    The chances of finding any reply are slim unless you scroll through and read everything.
    I never would have seen your reply as I only returned to see what angelictennisfan had written That was from link from Nippie's thread about this blog on pov board.
    Roz x

  • Comment number 81.

    Nick, thank you for your reply.

    It's easy to explain, the majority of traffic on the POV boards is the "Television" boards, the 'bbc.bo.uk' board has a fraction of the traffic.

    As of 1.40 pm

    bbc.co.uk board 2205 discussions
    television board 53786 discussions

    You have chosen to seek opinions on a less frequented board. You have closed the thread containing the link, meaning after a while it will slip down the board making it even less prominent.

    I can't help thinking that if I were hoping to seriously canvas the widest range of opinion about the POV boards by it's users, I would have posted a thread on the POV Television board.

    I would have thought with your undoubted experience and expertise in the internet you could manage to follow a thread on the boards as well as your own blog. It's hardly 'spread out in different places', it would be in two.

    Some questions, are the restrictions (i.e. banning and pre-mod) carried over here from the boards, and is HTML disabled on this blog? Thank you.

  • Comment number 82.

    Faye, your comments about where the post with the link was sited are spot on. I'd never have thought of looking there.

  • Comment number 83.

    Curmy - which tells an interesting story in itself.

    Faye - I've asked the Central Communities Team - who work across a lot of the boards and blogs helping with moderation issues - to look into the premodding of your account.

    They can't see any reason why you should remain in premod and have returned your account to normal status.

    If any of you have questions about your premod or banning on POV, you can contact the CCT via this form

    Whether you get premodded or banned across all services or just one or two, more or less depends what you've done. Some users might have restrictions put on their account on just one service - for example, if a perfectly friendly contributor to the Food board couldn't stay within the rules whenever they posted on Religion, we might do this.

    But in most cases, any restrictions will be applied across all the BBC services that use this software - nearly all of the blog comments, message boards and community sites like h2g2 and 606.

    Hope that helps.

    Nick Reynolds (editor, BBC Internet blog)

  • Comment number 84.

    Me again (surprise, surprise), but one of the things I've thought about is as well as having a link to the Info site (for making official complaints/comments) on the main POV homepage (under Air your views on the BBC), you could consider moving it to the far left, where FAQ's, Help with Registration etc, are. This would then link through to each page, as it does now.

    This may make it easier for users to make official complaints/comments if they so wish, as I've noticed lately that several posters are asking things like "Do the BBC listen to what people are saying on these boards?" Well, in all likeliehood no, because it's not an official complaint/comment.

    I also found it difficult finding an email address for the CCT when I was recently on pre-mod. I thought I would use the Contact Us button and it took me to Contacting Us, which I didn't think was appropriate for my query. I'll maybe add Nick's link above to my favourites, just in case I need it again!

  • Comment number 85.

    Sorry, meant to ask you Nick, just what IS the plan for the POV boards?

    Post 72 states: "It's easy to see that the BBC are planning on shutting down the messageboards and, if they replace them at all, replace them with easily-censored blogs.

    We've all seen the way that the messageboards have been marginalised and shut down (Great Debate, 606, Film, Weather, Science etc)."

    Is this going to be the case, as a lot of users are speculating?

    Thanks

  • Comment number 86.

    Hi Nick,

    thank you for looking into my account, it's appreciated.

    My question about the scope of the pre-mod and banning was prompted by regular posters I know who were banned at the same time (around July this year) as I was pre-modded. They would have liked (and have attempted) to contribute to this debate but still remain barred many months on.

  • Comment number 87.

    Nick - is this initiative connected to the service review of bbc.co.uk, which found some failings and deficiencies in feedback and interactivity?

    If it is, could I suggest that you adopt a more structured approach to your consultation, ie:

    Define the problem a bit better for us, than just the need to "sort out these boards"

    Define the consultation process you are asking us to engage in

    Do some thinking about the business process of which boards/blogs form a part. What are the outcomes the bbc and users seek? What processes do the BBC need to go through to make those outcomes happen? What are the roles within that process? What decisions/actions are required to make the process work? What information is needed to make those decisions/cations possible?

    Then we can identify what sort of information needs to go into the system, and then, and only then, can we have a sensible discussion about whether blogs are better than boards, as a means of capturing and using information.

    Otherwise, it just looks like a technical innovation to meet a non-technical problem, and we all know what a waste of time they can be.

    Apologies if you've already done all this, it's just not apparent from anything I've seen here, or in hosts' posts on the boards.

  • Comment number 88.

    NippleSweetie - at the moment I have no plan other than to try and increase the level of hosting on the boards.

    I am talking, listening and thinking.

    Fist_of_Onan - it's not connected to the service licence review.

    This is an informal conversation, not a formal consultation. But you make some good points which I will return to in future blog posts.

    What outcome do you seek? What do you want the boards to do?

    Nick Reynolds (editor, BBC Internet blog)

  • Comment number 89.

    The one thing I dread Nick, is Host lead discussions on the POV boards.

    Or just a blog run by the Host.

    That's what they did on the Today boards, and then said because of the lack of input from the Posters , they were going to close the boards.

    It's a slow death by a thousand cuts !

  • Comment number 90.

    Why do you dread a blog run by the Host?

    Most blogs in general (and some BBC ones) are run by one person.

    Nick Reynolds (editor, BBC Internet blog)

  • Comment number 91.

    I think that’s the key, Nick.

    We don’t WANT a blog. We LIKE the boards.

    We like to be able to start our own conversations, rather than having topics dictated to us by BBC employees.

    Does that make sense?

  • Comment number 92.

    "What outcome do you seek? What do you want the boards to do?"

    I'd like the boards to stay as they are except with much more visible host-presence, and more even-handed, transparent moderation done by those who see the posts in context rather than in isolation.

  • Comment number 93.

    Surely you are getting the message here?
    people don't want a blog, despite you liking them, people want a message baord for all the reasons above -despite the BBC's MBs being poorer than professionally designed ones.

    I agree that "ownership: of a blog is desireable, but that can equally apply to MBs. I would have thought the first thing the BBC would do is to cull all non-broadcast MBs, and then allocate a webpage and associated board to each programme, hosted by producers. Plus a generic TV board.

    Blogs don't work for me

    Can you state that the MB are safe in your hands? What is your remit?

  • Comment number 94.

    Why do you dread a blog run by the Host?

    Most blogs in general (and some BBC ones) are run by one person.

    Nick Reynolds (editor, BBC Internet blog)


    I dread a blog Nick, because the person running it decided the subjects we can talk about, and you're not going to start a conversation critical of anything in the BBC are you ?

  • Comment number 95.

    Hi Nick,

    The POV board is the only one I use and I've been adding my four-penny-worth for a couple of years now.

    I'm afraid I don't Blog. The boards and the 'regulars' who post on it are much more friendly although it could do with an up-date (search facility, more smilies, spelling check).

    There is a rumour on the board that you are going to close it down, I would appreciate your clarification on this point.

    Thanks,
    vicrus

  • Comment number 96.

    Vicrus, I asked Nick

    "just what IS the plan for the POV boards?

    Post 72 states: "It's easy to see that the BBC are planning on shutting down the messageboards and, if they replace them at all, replace them with easily-censored blogs.

    We've all seen the way that the messageboards have been marginalised and shut down (Great Debate, 606, Film, Weather, Science etc)."

    Is this going to be the case, as a lot of users are speculating?"

    His response was

    "NippleSweetie - at the moment I have no plan other than to try and increase the level of hosting on the boards.

    I am talking, listening and thinking."

    (I can't remember the blog numbers though, but I've just noticed he's got my name wrong - it's okay Nick, you're not the first and won't be the last!)

  • Comment number 97.

    Hi

    I was a regular poster for a few years but have only posted once in the last couple of months.
    I simply lost faith in the running of the board.
    I was put in pre-mod during the "Bonekickers Debacle" for disruptive posting on the Bonekickers Board despite never even registrering on it let alone posting there.
    Running of the POV Board is inconsistent, chaotic and the House Rules are irrelevant because they are imposed at the random whim of goodness knows who. Maybe it will improve but I have severe doubts there is the will to allow even moderate or constructive criticism of The Mighty Monolith.
    And...why these very matters cannot be discussed on bbc.co.uk baffles me as it supposed to be where one can discuss bbc content, search and messageboards??
    Rick P

  • Comment number 98.

    NippieSweetie - my apologies for getting your name wrong. Blame my failing eye sight.

    Curmy - I do both allow and even encourage comments and conversations (like this one!) which are critical of the BBC and also link to critical blog posts elsewhere through the Internet blog's delicious links.

    Nick Reynolds (editor, BBC Internet blog)

  • Comment number 99.

    I'm reading all this with interest, and keeping up with where I left off by using a post-it note stuck nearby with the last post number on it. I can only link to here from a link in the PoV thread, so thanks to the person who put it in recently, and I did not have to search back for it.

    I have not read of one person who wants the blog and to stop the messageboards.

    Nick, how long are you leaving this blog here for our input? Will anything we say help you to see how we feel about this?

    Does it really matter what we say, or how many *ways* we say it, or how many *times* we say it?

    Do surveys really make any difference?

    I have the feeling we are going to have the changes anyway, so all this blogging questionnaire business will be worthless.

    Comments please...

  • Comment number 100.

    That's good to know Nick , thanks , but I still prefer Message Boards to blogs !

 

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